Latest / Motherhood Uncut / Motherhood and Sexuality | Motherhood Uncut Podcast | Season 1 Episode 11

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Motherhood and Sexuality | Motherhood Uncut Podcast | Season 1 Episode 11 · Motherhood Uncut

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Motherhood Uncut podcast, where Deb Rubin and I, Kate Krickke, show up weekly to jump in to those conversations that we know have to be happening about motherhood.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_00: We are coming fully to you, uncut, with our own stories and challenges and successes in motherhood, as well as bringing to you some data and research and clinical anecdotes and all kinds of stuff so that we can all help each other get unstuck.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_00: We are not meant to mother alone.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_00: So pull up a chair.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_00: Come join us in these conversations.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_00: We are so glad you're here.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_00: O-N-E-C-L-O-C-K dot C O.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: Wake up better with the one clock.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: Did you know that the first 30 minutes of your day will set you up for the rest of the day?
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_00: Literally, if you're waking up to some sort of a jarring alarm and your nervous system goes into fight and flight within the first few moments of being awake, you will be paying for that for the rest of your day.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: If you wake up to the one clock, which was designed using sleep and wake science, you're gonna wake up in the manner where your nervous system adjusts in a slow, steady way that keeps you calm and grounded from the get-go.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_00: You're gonna be more prepared for the rest of your day.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_00: O-N-E-C-L-O-C-K dot-co-wake up better with the alarm clock.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_00: Start taking better care of yourself first thing in the morning.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_00: You guys, I also am just so excited about this free virtual workshop that I have coming up on October 22nd from 10 till noon Mountain Standard Time.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: And yes, I did say free, free workshop.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: We are gonna set you up with all kinds of easy and accessible tools and strategies to start feeling really great.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_00: I want you to leave this workshop feeling like you have the tools and the strategies and the pathway to real health and wellness, both physically as well as mentally.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_00: I want you to be able to be the kind of mom you want to be to your kids, for your kids.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_00: And this workshop is gonna set you up for that.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: So come join me October 22nd, 10 till noon.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_00: If you can't make it live, sign up anyway, and we will send you the recording.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: Go on over to my website, katKripke.com.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: I really hope I see you there.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_00: You will not regret it.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_00: We are actually gonna all leave that workshop feeling more alive and excited and joyful and ready to thrive.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: So come on over.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: All right, you guys.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_00: Enjoy the show.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: This is a good one.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: Hi, Deb.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: Hi, Kate.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: It's podcast day.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, it is.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_00: We've got a juicy subject today.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: Could you introduce this exciting subject to our listeners?
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, would you will you start with reading the letter?
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yes.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: Of course.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_00: We've got a really good letter today.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_00: We did.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_00: We got a note today, and this is also let me start with a reminder to all of you listeners that we love getting questions from you.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_00: And in fact, this particular podcast today, we received several questions about over the last bit of time.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so if you have a question, we you too could be the recipient of a podcast just for you.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, here's the question.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: We love it.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: This question is from Jackie, who lives at upstate New York.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_00: I have a small child and a preteen.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: My oh, my sex life.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: See, I already stuttered on that first word.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: My sex life has really changed.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: I know sex is supposedly really good for you, but I'm not having any.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_00: My marriage feels solid, but I feel like I should be wanting to have sex more.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes I worry that I'm disappointing my partner.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: Is this normal?
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: And I think part of the reason we picked this question is because it hits on so many things that you and I have talked about.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: And that a number of other questions included about what the heck does it mean to feel a lack of sexuality in motherhood?
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: So such a good question.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: I just want to say, Jackie, thank you, and yes, normal.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_01: We're just gonna start there.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_01: I want to start also by saying that anytime we're talking about sex, um, both Kate and I talk about that this is around sexuality and intimacy rather than intercourse.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_01: And I want to also be clear that this is this can be a really heavy topic.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: It can be incredibly activating for most of us.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um it can bring up inadequacy and competition and all these things that actually really are not sexy and kind of defeat our feminist perspective of how we want to walk through the world as united and connected women.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but it also is pretty impossible to talk about sex and not acknowledge that trauma comes with sex.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_01: And whether that's a little trauma or a big trauma, most women have experienced some kind of sexual trauma in their journey thus far.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_01: So what I'm gonna ask our listeners to do right now is to really practice radical personal responsibility, meaning as you're listening, um, pay attention, keep your feet on the floor, really focus on your breath, and notice if you're getting activated in any way that's making it hard to listen, and that's information to gather about yourself.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_01: And if you are getting to a place where you actually the conversation is too triggering, that's really good information that maybe it's time to do some trauma work.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um but for the nature of this podcast, we are not going to be talking about trauma.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_00: No, and I also actually can I just mention one thing because this came up, I just thought of this while you were talking, is that trauma, as we've I think we've said this in other podcasts, but big T and Little T trauma, as you mentioned, can look at ways that we don't necessarily even associate with trauma.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_00: So for instance, if I was raised in a family that was sort of judgmental and critical of sex and sexuality and desire of sex and sex and sexuality, that that might mean that sex in general is a trauma trigger for me in the way I relate to myself and my own body and people around me.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_00: So, really, what you're saying is important for us all to remember all the time, which is that with any topic, and sex is a particularly triggering topic for folks, we all come to the table with backstories and beliefs and opinions and experiences that formulate how we respond physiologically to certain conversations.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_01: And that is where you know our favorite like topic of mindfulness of paying attention to what's happening in the present moment without judgment gives us information of how we can tend to ourselves.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_00: I might also just take a moment and then we'll I want you to dive in a little bit to help our listeners understand where you and I come at this from because we're quite different in how we sit in our bodies around the topic of sex and sexuality, right?
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: You have all this experience working around issues and questions around sex and sexuality with your clients and your couples therapy, and and you have worked with Planned Parenthood for a long time.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: I won't give your whole bio here, you can say more if you want, but you know, you're really committed to sex positivity.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel a little more prudish in my body, right?
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_00: That even when I begin to think about my own relationship to my own sexuality, it doesn't always come easily for me.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm hoping that our listeners who are on either side of those two spectrums, and probably I'm not that far on that spectrum, but you know what I mean.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_00: Listeners coming from all different angles will find some place to relate in this conversation because we kind of we sit as a united team here in the things that we think are really important within the idea of sexuality and sex, but that we sort of come at those things from different previous experiences.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, thank you for saying that.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, sex wasn't always easy for me to talk about.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_01: Totally like so to our listeners.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_01: I was a um comprehensive sexuality educator through Planned Parenthood in my 20s, and I was always really interested in learning about sex and relationships and connection and intimacy, but it wasn't until I started talking about the vulva every day.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_01: See, that's what I mean.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_01: She can say that word so easily.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_01: It just rolls off my tongue.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_01: But it was from years and years of practice and you know, like trying not to giggle when people would ask me about anal.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I mean, I had to like learn how to do that.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_01: So I just acknowledge that this is something that there's room for and everyone on the spectrum.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_01: You know, the other thing that's worth acknowledging is that the more we talk about anything, we get more comfortable talking about it.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: And it's especially with sex.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_01: This is actually a little fun fact that there's research that backs up that people that talk about sex more enjoy sex more.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: That's so interesting.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_01: I believe it.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_01: So maybe after this podcast, it's an invitation to just talk about it.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: It's just it's just sex.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I know I don't want to say it's just sex because it's complex and all the things that we've been talking about, but it's a natural human experience, and we are sexual beings from the moment we are born until the moment we die.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_01: And the journey of I love the language of being sexually liberated is a non-linear healing journey that is forever changing.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: So love that.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: So let's bring it into motherhood.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: I know, but I let's also bring it to motherhood and then circle back to Jackie's question, which we'll Jackie.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: We're coming back to you in a minute.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: And actually, Jackie's question is about motherhood.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: Of course.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: So what's your question again?
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: So, Jackie, so so you first let's bring it back to motherhood, and then we'll circle back to Jackie's question.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I think well, the reason we want to, obviously, we have moms who are listening to our podcast, but but our connection and relationship with our sexuality and our sense of intimacy or desire shifts when we become mothers.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: That's right.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: And so let's set the tone, let's set the stage for our listeners around that.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_00: Do you want to speak to that a little bit?
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_01: So I think what we as mothers have to really have compassion for ourselves and each other about is that we have we are different people once we become mothers.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_01: God, that's true.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_01: We are so different, and our brains are different, and our bodies are different.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_01: And so you know, when I think about the early stages of parenting, it is so important to remember that these are often some of the hardest times of being in partnership and that this is one of the hardest times of adjusting to a new body and a new brain.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_01: So I like to really give all parents out there so much wiggle room and permission to not want to be touched, to not want to have sex, to be tired, to feel uncomfortable, to know that your energy of your brain is going in a very different place, like keeping a human being alive, and that none of that is very sexy.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like it's okay.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_01: I just want to start there that it's okay to take uh intercourse, sex, even physical touch off the table for a little while.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: But what's not okay is removing intimacy with self and partner.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_00: And so And say more about that.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_00: Why to say why that's not okay?
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_00: That was a really clear statement that you made.
• 12:13
  unknown: Okay.
• 12:13
  unknown: Okay.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: So let's talk about self at first, because our relationship with ourselves are changing drastically as we enter, you know, the mother archetype.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_01: It is like such a powerful transition.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_01: And so one thing that I really love to explore is how as mothers, whether it's you're a new mother or you've been parenting for a very long time, how do you really start to get curious with yourself about who you are now, what your body's like, how you talk to your body, how you touch your body, how you treat your body, um ways that you I I think every listener should answer this question.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_01: What makes you feel sexy today?
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_00: You know what?
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_00: You're such a big thing that comes up that you are alluding to right now, I think, Deb, is that there needs to be a time as mothers in which we reclaim our bodies back as being ours.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_00: Because our bodies really become in many ways the the the sole purpose of them, at least for some people longer than others, is to birth and then provide nutrition and and comfort another human.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think one of the things we hear all the time in both of our work with mothers is that idea of being quote unquote touched out.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: Or that idea of like, I cannot give, I cannot give one more moment.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, I think this taps into something that we probably will not take time to address today.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_00: But, you know, there is both giving and receiving in sensuality and sexuality and intimacy.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_00: And as mothers, I think we actually forget how to receive because we're so used to giving all the time.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_00: So when I hear you talk about that sort of re-establishment with like what makes me feel sexy as a mother, it's like, wait a second, bring my body.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_00: I want to bring my body back to me for a minute.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_00: Do I even have a body?
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_00: Do I even have a body?
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_00: Because I don't recognize it or what's been for other use of another little human.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_01: And even if a woman's body didn't go through pregnancy and pregnant to your point, that be women are being touched and grabbed and needed and pet and licked and kissed all these things.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_01: That so to your point, like everything else we talk about, it takes some level of discipline to make time for tending to your body.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and maybe even before the discipline of taking time to tend, it takes curiosity and awareness of what is happening in my body.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: You know.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: What do I even feel?
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_00: What do I even feel?
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: And what do I even want?
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, you know?
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_01: That is actually a really important thing.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_01: What do I even want?
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: Because one thing that I think as we become sexually liberated women, we if it is not a yes, then it is a no.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_01: Say more about that.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_01: I think that is really confusing.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_01: This this might go in a direction that we weren't thinking it would, but we'll pull it back if we need to.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_01: You know, when someone's in a partnership where there are mismatched libidos and there is a one person has more needs than a or different needs than another, this can get to be very tricky territory.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, I've heard people in the field say, like, well, sometimes you just gotta take one for the team, you know, and I think that that is actually actually really d being disloyal to one's body if they're feeling a strong no, or if they're not feeling they might not be feeling a fuck yes, but if there, but that if there is a no, that has to be honored a hundred percent because then we are actually not listening, we are not validating our body's wisdom.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_01: Now, right now I'm speaking to people that are in consensual relationships, okay?
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_01: Where so just to acknowledge that, that at times if there is more intimacy and connection happening in a relationship, and someone might not be like a hard, strong yes, but there could be some convincing, that is a wonderful form of foreplay.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_01: That can be a really playful way to be like, you know what, try and turn me on.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like, let's play with that.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_01: So these are not hardcore black and white lines, and of course, it all has to come from a place of feeling safe and in a trusted partnership.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_01: But I do think that in the especially when there's a when a woman's body is saying no, we have to listen to that.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and back to what we just said a moment ago, as mothers, we actually sometimes with our children will keep saying yes, even if we want to know, like if our toddler wants to get up on our lap, right?
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_00: Or if our kids are pawing us all the time, right?
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think if most of us as mothers said no every time we didn't want to be touched, we would be pushing our children away.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: Great point.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: So we can't always say, or we choose to not always say no with our little people, all the more reason when it comes to a a you know, a mate, adulting, an adulting relationship that we know we can say no.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_00: I love that you just said mate.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_00: That's an old-fashioned word.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know why that makes me think.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, okay.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_01: So you're saying pick and choose.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like when we can't, we're we're let we are letting our children often touch us in a way that maybe we don't want to because we're soothing them.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: Because it's our literally our job to take care of our children.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: No, it's our job to do what we need to care for a partnership or a relationship with our mate.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_00: But we do not need to meet every need of our partners the same way we may feel like our job is to meet our needs of our children.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: I guess that's just what I'm saying.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, to pull it back, because you're right, we could go in a million different directions.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_00: I think what we're doing right now is talking about how sex and sexuality show up differently in motherhood.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so sometimes we don't want to be touched.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right?
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_00: You we also said this other thing right before we started recording, which is that many mothers, mother, mother, mother mothers, are are uh giving out energy, like at a heightened state of nervous system, amygdala response all day long.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: And when we get in bed, what do we want to do?
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: Sleep.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: Shut the f off.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right?
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_00: And good sex or at least engage sex, whatever sexual intimacy requires a turning on.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes we're like, I've been on all day.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: I cannot turn on.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: I do not want to be on anymore.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_01: The other thing with the amygdala, which is like, you know, it's our emotional response system, and it's also telling us if we're in danger or not.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: There's so many parts of this brain that because we are highly attuned, you're you know, listening for a crying baby or like keeping your nose somewhat awake.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_01: So if the house is burning down, I mean it's unconscious, but if your teenager is coming home, yes, waiting for a phone call.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, that when that amygdala is overactivated, it is actually really hard to relax in order to feel deep pleasure.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: So that's a tricky one.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: That is a really tricky one.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_01: So I want to digress for one sec around relationship with self and sex sexual relationships.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_00: You're not digressing, you're coming back because a question you asked five minutes ago is what makes you feel sexy.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: So now we're let's come back to that.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, and then we'll come back to partnership.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: But um, so yeah, I want I would love our listeners to actually take a piece of paper and a pen and write down that question, maybe pause the podcast.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: What makes me feel sexy today?
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_01: And it it's a really important question because it might feel really different than it did five, ten, two years ago.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: So I think it's a really great place to start, and to your point, it opens up the gateway of curiosity.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and when we are exploring what makes us feel sexy, then we actually can do practices to enhance that.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_01: Which we're gonna get into in kind of some of our tips at the end.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but I love acknowledging the word today because our bodies, like we're saying, are so different, but so are our brains.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's just such an important thing to play with of being right where you're at.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I have a I have a devil's advocate question for you, based on certainly people I know well that probably I work with or friends, or I'm not gonna throw anyone under the business, but I'd be good.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_00: What what and it's definitely not me that I'm speaking up now.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: Um what if someone what if someone's comment or response to that was I don't feel sexy?
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_01: Great question.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_01: So I would actually change the word sexy and invite the word sensual.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_01: What okay?
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_01: That's defined by what?
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_01: I actually think what that to go into the feeling of sexy is waking up where your senses come to life.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_01: So this is where we start to acknowledge certain smells that give you a strong yes.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_01: That's also your brain and body's way of actually paying attention to what feels like a yes.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe it's time to, you know, upgrade your underwear.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like, give that shit some upgrade.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like, it just needs a little redo.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_01: And what might have been sexy at one point, maybe now, is like cotton and soft.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_01: Totally.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_01: And st or different colors turn you on.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_01: Totally.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_01: You know, what and what visually stimulates you?
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it might be something like I so I guess the real question is what makes you feel sexy, but what lights you up?
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I love that reframe.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think that, but I want to bring in the word sexy because I want us to like remember and empower ourselves that when we are lit up and creative and alive, that's sexy.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: That is sexy.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_00: I actually love the idea that creativity and sex drive come from the same place.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_00: They're essentially the same thing, right?
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: We can't, meaning, you know, we I think most of us can relate to a moment where suddenly we have some create creative hit.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: Like it could be anything, anything that our brain just like has this ton of ideas all of a sudden, right?
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like a it's a full body yes to your point.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_00: It feels good and we're like in flow and we like feel good about ourselves, and we we're like, I'm gonna create badass shit, right?
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_00: Totally.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_00: I kind of think that's the same experience that we have when we're turned on.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, absolutely.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_00: So, to your point, you know, when we get those questions, or if you're someone who's like, what makes me feel sexy today?
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_00: I definitely have no part of me that feels sexy today.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_00: The question is, what turns you on or lights you up as far as your sensual or literally senses experience goes?
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_00: And start there.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_01: Love it.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_01: The other thing to add on that is that all wakes up a sense of pleasure.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_01: And God, I love that word.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: Me too, and it is so important, and it's so important to remember that we are worthy of pleasure.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_01: Find ways where we get pleasure.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, I think it is really important for a woman to give herself pleasure, to learn how to touch her body in a way that feels good.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_01: But if we want to take baby steps, find places that you enjoy the taste of food.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_01: Slow down when you're eating an orange and feel the senses of how it squirts in your mouth.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_01: And sorry.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_00: That was so good.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_00: I was waiting to see if you caught that.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_00: Definitely feel the pleasure of battle orange squirting in your mouth.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, moving on.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, but they they go, we're in practice right now, right?
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_01: Of bringing pleasure back into our lives.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my god, that's funny.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I want to also let's talk about body image because it's another podcast in itself, obviously.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: But this is a big one.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_01: It is, I'm curious, you know, what what your experiences of women working with women that are feeling really uncomfortable in their skin, and how to translate that to feeling more sensual or connected or sexy or even naked.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's such a good question.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_00: And especially here at the Postpartum Wellness Center, it's a little different in my coaching and consulting work because some of those, most of those mothers are not brand new moms, so they're a little more used to their bodies at that point.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_00: But gosh, our bodies change after having a baby.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: And to your point, we often don't recognize ourselves, and sometimes we don't recognize ourselves for years and years and years.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_00: But there is the amount of times I have heard a mother discuss, and I can relate to this personally, right?
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: That idea of like, I can't stand looking at my body in the mirror.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_00: How can I tolerate having someone else look at it right now?
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_00: How can I both give and receive that kind of intimacy?
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_00: It can feel so impossible for someone who feels really badly about themselves within their own skin.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't know what the answer to that.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I don't let me say that differently.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know that it's possible to fully give yourself over to sexual touch and pleasure while you're feeling that critical about yourself.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_00: I'm curious to know if you have a different thought about that.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_00: But I think that the this is where the self-pleasure is so important, coming back to yourself.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_00: And when I've heard you talk about this before, Deb, yes, we can talk about masturbation, and I think we may maybe we'll get into that today.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_00: But as I've heard you talk about it, it's even just tickling your own arm, right?
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_00: Or putting, you said this earlier before a podcast, taking some time to massage cream after a shower into our bodies.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_00: That's right, that's right.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_01: I think that it's those are the ways we find um practice skills to reconnect with our bodies as they are today.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_00: As they are today.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_01: And even if we haven't, if you haven't just had a baby, like we're aging.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, exactly.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like and literally they change every week.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_01: I'm finding that my body looks different every week these days.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, oh, what's gonna happen today?
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: And so, and so that's where that critical mind kind of creeps in that neat can often be quieted when we are doing some kind of behavior that is around self-love.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_01: So, what we were saying before is like this idea of putting lotion on your skin.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I would say, like, take it to the next level with intentionality of like, you know, maybe you bring your phone into the bathroom and you turn on music that you love.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I always go to music, and maybe you dim the lights because the star the harsh lights, like that's not fun.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and then you actually like rub the moisturizer into your body and you play with different levels of pressure and touch, and you're just starting to have a relationship with your skin and your body in a different way that is actually um it's it's communicating.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_01: What were you gonna say?
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: Sensual, yes, it's set it's provide it's giving and receiving to yourself.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, nice, yes, right?
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_00: I just had an image of hair brushing, right?
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's like how often we're just like running a brush through our hair, but what is it like to really brush out your hair in that very caring, giving and receiving way?
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_00: It feels good even just talking about it right now.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_00: It's like my nervous system settles.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, well, I think what's actually happening is oxy we're releasing oxytocin because just the thought of pleasure releases oxytocin.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_01: And oxytocin is the cuddle hormone, which makes you want to be close to someone, it makes you want to laugh even.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_01: I just read today that release of oxytocin makes your skin better.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_01: It gets rid of rashes.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_00: That's amazing.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, let's let's dip our toe into masturbation for a moment.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_00: And or because of less to benefit the benefits of orgasm.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_00: But this podcast, if we've said several times, is not necessarily covering sex and sexuality and intimacy with a partner.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_00: Today we're just talking about turning that flame back on.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: Beautiful, right?
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: But let's talk about orgasm because this is fascinating to me.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_01: So one thing I really I am all like in support of orgasm, but I'm also just as equally in support of the process and being less goal-oriented.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_01: And so when I'm thinking about masturbation, whether it's someone that's been doing it for a long time or they are really out of practice, I love to think of it as coming back with beginner's mind.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, and so just like anything else in our life, exercise, creative movement, time with friends, we have to carve out time.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so again, carving out time is saying, this is a this is a value for me that I am going to connect with my body in a different way.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_01: And then we have to set us up for success.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_01: So that's when I go back to like, what do you need in your space to feel like you can get curious, exploratory, loud if you need to?
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_01: So that might mean making sure that nobody's around, making sure there's a lock on your door, making sure that you know you can just really let go.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_01: Because I'm gonna dive back into orgasm.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_01: In order to orgasm, we have to fully let go.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_01: And and so again, that's that's one way, but this is more the process.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_01: So and then going back to senses, set up the room and the lighting that you want.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_01: You know, maybe you want to be naked, maybe you want to take a shower first.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe a lot.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of research that backs up that when a woman feels freshly clean, she feels sexier.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_00: Interesting.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um, that's just an interesting thing.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_01: I can buy into that fact.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, then and may and maybe you bring music in, and maybe, and sometimes people want to bring in different textures, like maybe there's you know, a really yummy cashmere blanket that you want to wrap yourself up in.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_01: And then we work with the most important sex organ there is, which is our brain.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I was not expecting you to say that.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I was because I we've talked about this so much, but say more.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so and then you have to say clitoris.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_00: Oh because that is your favorite word.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_00: That is my favorite.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_01: I think there should be a national clitoris day.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_01: I think besides the point.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe we should vote on that.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that we have to wake up our brain, and that is so important to, you know, start to think of what gets you aroused.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_01: I think there's so much power in erotic books, erotic movies that are helpful, that are not like um, you know, what's the word?
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like harshing out on women and making like all the negative things around porn.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: But there can be some beautiful erotic videos.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um and then let your and let your mind wander.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_01: Fantasy is an amazing tool.
• 32:12
  unknown: Yes.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_00: I I got a question.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_00: One of the questions we received had to do with it was someone who was feeling, I'm just gonna paraphrase because it's not written it's not in front of me, but she was feeling really shameful because she was noticing herself find other heterosexual women, finding other men very attractive and fantasizing about those other men in her when she was having sex with her husband or and or um masturbating.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm and so I'm wondering if you could speak to that.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_01: That's such a big topic.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_01: I know, and I but just like yeah, well, one thing I'll say is that it's so normal.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's it's so so normal.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_00: That's what I wanted to get across.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_01: I think with masturbation, yes, use anything you can use.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I want to like throw that out there.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_01: With when you're having sex with a partner and you bring someone else in in your mind, I think it's just important to pay attention if you're if it's an avoidance on some level.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_01: Great.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_00: And and to be clear from this But it's normal email.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_00: It did not sound that this person was feeling so much, it did not sound like an avoidant technique, yeah, and yet there was shame involved.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I just I appreciate you reiterating what I had said to her in response.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, good.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_00: Normal.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, normal, normal, and fantasy is a safe behavior.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's like no one's getting hurt in fantasy.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um okay.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_01: So, okay, so we understand masturbation, it's like create the time, make the space, make it successful.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_01: I think sound is essential.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_01: And this is a place that many women often have a really hard time practicing.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_01: How do you let your breathing get really loud?
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_01: How do you let yourself moan?
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, this is actually, and and it enhances orgasm oftentimes when we let our voices go.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_01: And it's such a metaphor of women having a voice.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my goodness, like let like let's be proud of our voice.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_00: Don't you think in general, sex, not just intercourse, but sex in general or our willingness to allow ourselves to go there is such a metaphor for so many things in life.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_00: Can you say more?
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think that the times in my own life and the times that I've worked with people, what hinders really pleasurable, satisfying, connecting sex is tightness and desire for control and rigidity, to name a few.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_00: And uh again, I'll speak for myself.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_00: The moments that I have been willing to let go of control in my own life outside of the bedroom, so to speak, right?
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_00: And and give myself permission to be less rigid in life.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_00: And to give myself permission to, here's this word again, be more creative and be more playful, then I have better sex.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like they're inherently interconnected, in quote unquote, in the bedroom and out of the bedroom.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, absolutely.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_01: And what I hear you saying is let's not take ourselves so seriously.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_01: Dang it.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_01: I yes, please.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_01: Because, and actually, there's another research, of course.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_01: I can't quote where I get it, but that's just me.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_01: But that some of the people that enjoy sex the most know how to laugh, especially in the act.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's like there might be a funny noise that happens.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_01: There might be like an awkward moment of positioning.
• 35:52
  SPEAKER_01: There, like you might get all wrapped up in the sheets.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, there's when we can bring humor into any of it, whether you're masturbating, whether you're having actual intercourse, whether you're just touching your partner or touching yourself, like all of that is it, it's like we have to just not take it so seriously.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_00: Well, and embrace messiness and get over our need for perfection.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my god.
• 36:15
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I I I have some really uncomfortable memories earlier, you know, in my before I was married, about wanting to appear as perfect in bed.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_00: That sucks.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_01: Not at all fun.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_01: Not fun.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's like a performance, which is actually the other piece.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_01: And this might be a separate podcast, but like, how do we move away from any performance mentality?
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um, because it really just gets in the way of actual connection.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I think we have said this already, but it just is worth saying one more time.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_00: I think there is a way in which, as women, this is a generalization, but as women in general, we're better at giving than receiving.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_00: And that there's a way in which practicing receiving a willingness to receive outside of the bedroom allows us to receive in the bedroom.
• 37:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't know that there's such a thing as pleasurable sex if we're not willing to receive.
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_00: I think whether it's from ourself or another human.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, and so there are ways in which we can get caught up in that desire to be quote unquote good in bed, you know, to perform well, to your point, to give well in bed, and not understand the powerful point of receiving and what a gift it is to our partners to allow them to give to us and for us to receive.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_00: And that's can be a mind shift for people.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_01: Huge mind shift.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it it comes back to how do we communicate?
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_01: How do we ask for what we need?
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_01: And how do we even know what we need unless we're exploring ourselves?
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, this is where again I go back to masturbation of like learning what you know.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes like the left side of your labia is more sensitive.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_01: That changes all the time.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes it's the right, sometimes it's the top of your clitoris, sometimes it's underneath.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, I mean, there's so much I have to say about the clitoris, but we don't have time.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_01: But it is really all about the clitoris.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's just like it's so such this beautiful, powerful organ that has so much information.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_01: And and if we are not learning and relearning and exploring ourselves, then we can't actually communicate what we want.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_00: And it's also okay not to know.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_00: If if a partner says, What do you want?
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_00: It is okay to say, I don't know.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_00: Let's let's figure it out.
• 38:53
  SPEAKER_00: Let's figure out.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_00: Because I think there can be shame in not knowing.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, thank you for saying that.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_00: I really want more of us to be willing to say, I don't know, and to not have the not knowing create a sense of panic for us.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_00: That's this beginner's mind thank you.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_01: We go in with like our body's a new roadmap, and we're really learning how to reread it.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um I'm gonna re-circle back to Jackie's question.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna read it again.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_00: My guess is we've answered it for her without intentionally, but let's see if we missed anything.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_00: Jackie says, I have a small child and a preteen, which I also think, by the way, is interesting because that's a big difference in ages for this mom.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um my sex life has really changed.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_00: I know sex is supposedly really good for you, but I'm not having any.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_00: My marriage feels solid, but I feel like I should be wanting to have sex more.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_00: So, what did we miss for Jackie?
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like the importance of sex.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I think we're talking about how important it's to understand and reconnect, but there actually is so many health benefits um of orgasm of and of just having sex.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_00: Well, and a healthy partnership includes intimacy and sexuality.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_00: That can look a million different ways, but that is part of what makes a healthy relationship a healthy relationship.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_00: Would would you agree?
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_01: 100%.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_01: And I would also say it's actually the thing that separates you from all your other relationships.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_01: That is such an important thing to respect and value.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so she so let's break this up for just a moment.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_00: She said, My marriage feels solid, so that's interesting, right?
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_00: It's not, this isn't a big conf conflicting marriage.
• 40:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, sounds like, but I feel like I should be wanting to have sex more.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_00: So I hear her saying she doesn't want to have sex, and maybe that's where some of the stuff we just talked about, the self-pleasure, the reinviting that part of her body to get it more alive again would be helpful.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely that might I hear her saying I want to want to have more sex, right?
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_00: But I hear that that might be a way to engage in that.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_00: Does that sound right to you?
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_01: That sounds very right.
• 40:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I it makes me want to touch on one really important thing, and that is we have to understand that foreplay looks really different right now.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_01: And so for women, so often we we need physical foreplay, but we also need emotional foreplay.
• 41:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, ma'am.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_01: That is what actually gets us to wanting to be connect connected to wanting more sex.
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's another question, maybe to sit and ask yourself like not only what turns me on, what lights me up, what makes me feel sexy, but what what kind of foreplay do I want?
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_01: And a common answer I hear is like someone doing the dishes for me, right?
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_01: That is like some really good foreplay.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_01: Or maybe it's about waking up the brain throughout the day with like a sexy text, or you know, it might be booking the babysitter.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, the partner being the one to find the babysitter.
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_00: Beautiful, right?
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_01: Love that.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I mean, there's so many ways that a couple and an individual can really start to explore what do I need to get to a place of feeling aroused.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, this is another bigger conversation, but it is important to remember that oftentimes women need more external and emotional stimulation to get to a physical arousal.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_01: And sometimes with men, they want the and I'm being very gender-y right now, I know that, but there's research that backs all this up that men often want the physical connection in order to feel more of an emotional connection.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_01: And this is where it can be really tricky.
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_01: But it's like, okay, we can work with tricky, like let's just work with that.
• 42:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, totally.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, quite a bit.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_00: So we're I think we answered Jackie's question.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, before we wrap up, I think I want to mention one other thing, which is its own podcast, but it does feel really important to bring it back in.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_00: We almost we do this almost every podcast, which is just modeling, right?
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_00: And I know you and I both have daughters, and we feel really strongly about raising those girls in what has now been tagged as sex positive home, right?
• 43:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm reminded of that through this conversation, right?
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's like really wanting my daughters to feel good about themselves in their bodies, to know how to bring themselves pleasure, to know that it's okay to desire sex and pleasure and intimacy and whatever it is that once they hit a certain age.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we have that's why I want to go into a whole other podcast at some point about this, because lots of lots of questions about what that looks like.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_00: But but I'm just reminded, like with anything, you know, when we reconnect with ourselves as mothers, we're modeling something so important to our children, whether they're boys or girls, right?
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I know this topic didn't really, this podcast didn't cover the topic of talking with our children about sex and how to create a sex-positive home, but there is that little thread there that I just want to Say, and again, I started this way, but I'm not sure I grew up in a sex positive home.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I had I was not shamed.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_00: I there was no one in my home that said you shouldn't want to have sex, but there was no conversation around pleasure and sexuality and sexuality between me and my mother.
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_00: None.
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_01: So that's the avoidance of the topic only leads leaves a child with unanswered questions.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_01: Then we make up story.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_00: So maybe we could do another part to that at some point, but that felt important to mention.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so glad you mentioned that because actually I do think that the sex positive home is essential right now.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_01: And it's actually, as moms, it's our responsibility to step out of our comfort zone to create sex positive.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_00: And it starts with us.
• 44:47
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's what I'm saying.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_00: I am if I'm a mother who's feeling shame about my own body and my own sexuality and sensuality, how am I going to create a sex positive home?
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_00: That's right.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_00: I can't do it.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_00: So it has to start here.
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_00: It has to come back to us first.
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_01: As with most things.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_01: That is here, here.
• 45:07
  SPEAKER_01: I just I think the last piece, too, and I didn't say this on some of the tips, but is I think it's really important to look at your vulva.
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, I had a I was wondering if you were gonna bring that up.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_01: Do you want to say a little bit about that?
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_01: Well, for one, I refer to that area, that whole area is a vulva.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_01: The vagina, this is just basic anatomy, is really only the inside of the vagina.
• 45:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's the vaginal opening, the vaginal canal.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_01: Then there's the labia and the outer labia, and but the whole thing is called a vulva.
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's just really, really important to look at it, check it out.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's important to like have your kiddos look at their body parts, all of them, and to start to, and as moms, we can recognize what are the stories we're telling ourselves and how do we notice that voice and tell it to step aside at times to bring in a more inclusive voice and a more accepting voice of where we're at now and get curious, see what happens.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_01: So it's kind of a funny place to end.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_00: Well, no, I think it's a perfect place to end because it kind of brings us back to how we started, and again, I'll just sort of do a really quick summary because really what we're talking about today is reigniting a desire for quote unquote sex, which doesn't mean intercourse, right?
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_00: It can mean a million different things, but but but turning back on that desire for intimacy and sensuality and sexuality, right?
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, and I think all those tips and all of our examples had to do with being curious and exploring, right?
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_00: Understanding our own bodies, yeah, both the the um, you know, the what they look like, back to how you ended today, what you just said, but also how we feel, yeah, right.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then being open to that question, what do I want and need, even if we don't have the answer, and to recognizing that starting simple with that sort of general coming back to self, we've been giving of ourselves over and over and over as mothers to other people and opening up the invitation to receive back, to be willing to receive.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_00: Once we are kind of turned back on, so to speak, from that, then the next part actually might be easier.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting, right?
• 47:39
  SPEAKER_00: Like, how how do I find time to have sex with my partner?
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_00: Or what does that look like with my partner?
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_00: Once we're turned on, once that part of our body is turned back on and lit up, those other questions are probably easier for us to manage, you know?
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, beautiful.
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_00: Wow, this was fun.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_00: This was fun.
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, just thank you, listeners.
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_01: And of course, we're just like skimming the surface here.
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_01: This is such an important conversation.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_01: So have this conversation with each other, with your friends, like really keep it going because it gives us permission to heal.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_00: We also just sang in closing our hearings from so many of you that this podcast is helpful and making you laugh and giving you strategies and ideas.
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_00: And we just ask from the bottom of our hearts that if this feels like a podcast that you think someone else would enjoy, please share it.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_00: We would love more mothers to have access to this.
• 48:35
  SPEAKER_00: And if you're up for subscribing and writing review, that would be awesome too.
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_00: We all love a little reflection.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_00: We sure do.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_00: All right, thank you.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_00: See you next time.
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_00: Hi, Kate.
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_00: Bye, Deb.