Latest / UFOS & PARANORMAL WITH PRESTON DENNETT / THE TOP TWENTY UFO ENCOUNTERS IN NEW MEXICO PART TWO

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THE TOP TWENTY UFO ENCOUNTERS IN NEW MEXICO PART TWO · UFOS & PARANORMAL WITH PRESTON DENNETT

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hello everyone, my name is Preston Dennett and welcome to
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: another episode of UFOs and the Paranormal. This is actually
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: part two of a two-part episode I call The Top
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: 20 UFO Encounters in New Mexico. Last week's episode covered
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: cases number 20 all the way to case number 11
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: and now we're going to do the top 10 countdown
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: of the very best cases from New Mexico. So let's
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: just get started because this is a big episode. And
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: for case number 10, I chose the UFO abduction of
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: Sergeant Charles Moody. This is considered a classic case. I
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: like it because it's one of the first cases of
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: an onboard UFO experience that really preceded the sort of
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: flood of abduction reports in the 1980s. This occurred on
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: August 13, 1975, to Sergeant Charles Moody, a great witness.
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: He was a United States Air Force flight mechanic who
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: worked at Holloman Air Force Base, so a trained observer.
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: And he had decided on August 13, 1975, to go
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: outside and watch the Perseid meteor showers, which were very
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: active that evening. He left his home in Alamogordo and
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: drove outside of town to watch the meteor shower. And
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: after seeing several shooting stars, he was shocked to see
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: one of these apparent shooting stars swoop down, drop out
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: of the sky in front of him, and come to
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: a complete stop. And at this point, it landed. As
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: Sergeant Charles Moody said in a later interview, and I quote,
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: I observed a dull metallic object that seemed to just
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: drop out of the sky and start to hover with
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: a wobbling motion approximately 100 feet in front of me.
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: Sergeant Moody went to his car, tried to start the car,
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: but the engine mysteriously died. The object approached closely, and
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: Sergeant Charles Moody could hear this high-pitched whining sound coming
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: from the craft. Looking up, he saw oddly shaped windows
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: behind which he could see two or three human-looking forms.
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: And as Sergeant Charles Moody says, and I quote, at
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: this time the high-pitched sound stopped and a feeling of
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: numbness came over my body. The fear that I had
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: before left me and I felt a very peaceful calmness.
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: The object lifted very fast. It made no sound. And
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: after the object departed... Sergeant Moody's car started easily, and
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: he drove home, but looking at his watch, he was
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: shocked to see that it was now 2.45 a.m. It
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: was one hour and 25 minutes later than it should
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: have been, so he had over an hour of missing time.
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: Not only that, he was suffering from lower back pain,
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: and a strange rash appeared on his lower body. So
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: he was concerned and he contacted APRO, the Aerial Phenomenon
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: Research Organization. And two of the main investigators, which included
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: Jim Lorenzen and Colonel Wendell C. Stevens, agreed to investigate.
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: And they interviewed him about the incident. Sergeant Charles Moody
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: was very concerned about He wanted to be anonymous. He
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: did not want the Air Force to hear about this.
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: But apparently they did because they did something which actually
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: Jim Lorenzen predicted that would happen if they did find out.
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: They transferred Sergeant Charles Moody overseas. But before he left,
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: Sergeant Moody wrote a long letter to Jim Lorenzen explaining
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: that his memory of the incident is had returned naturally
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: over the past few weeks and he now consciously recalled
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: almost everything that had occurred and that he had actually
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: been taken on board this craft. According to Sergeant Moody,
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: after this craft hovered in front of him and actually
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: landed on the road, two men dressed in tight-fitting suits
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: approached his car. Sergeant Moody attempted to shoot at them
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: with his revolver, but he suddenly felt powerless as these
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: two figures pulled him out of the car, and dragged
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: him into the craft. As Sergeant Charles Moody says, and
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: I quote, the beings were about five feet tall and
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: very much like us, except their heads were larger and
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: had no hair. The ears were very small, the eyes
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: a little larger than ours, a small nose, and the
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: mouth had very thin lips. I would say that their
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: weight was maybe between 110 to 130 pounds. There was speech,
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: but their lips did not move. So they actually communicated
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: to him telepathically. According to Moody, these beings were dressed
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: in featureless black skin-tight suits, except for one of the
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: figures whose suit was silver-white. Sergeant Moody was taken into
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: a room where one of the figures, who Sergeant Moody
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: perceived to be the leader, placed a rod-looking device around
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: his body. And as Moody says, this being told him that, quote,
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: there had been a scuffle when they first made contact
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  Speaker 1: with me and he only wanted to correct any misplacement
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: that might have happened. So basically what they were doing
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: was healing him of the back injury that had occurred
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: during his abductions. These beings were highly telepathic and answered
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: all of Sergeant Moody's questions as he formulated them in
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: his mind. As Sergeant Moody says, I was thinking to myself,
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: if only I could see the drive unit of the craft,
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: how wonderful that would be. The elder or leader put
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: his hand on my shoulder and said to follow him.
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  Speaker 1: He went to a small room that had no fixtures
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  Speaker 1: and was dimly lit. The floor seemed to give way
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  Speaker 1: like an elevator. I guess we went down six feet
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: and what I saw then was a room about 25
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: feet across and in the center was what looked like
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: a huge carbon rod going through the roof of the room.
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: and around the rod were three of what looked like
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: holes covered with glass. Inside the glass-covered holes, or balls,
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: were what looked like large crystals with two rods, one
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: on each side of the crystal. One rod came to
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: a ball-like top, the other came to a T-type top.
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  Speaker 1: I was told that this was their drive unit, and
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: I could understand it if I tried. The beings told
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: Sergeant Moody that this craft was just a small observation
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: craft and that a much larger craft was hovering about
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  Speaker 1: 400 miles above the Earth. Moody asked if he could
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: see the main craft, and they told him no, that
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: time was too short. They told him that limited contact
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: with humans would be made in the future, but only
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: over a gradual period of time. They also told him
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: that they were very concerned about the radiation tests being conducted.
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: And they told him that radar interferes with their ability
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  Speaker 1: to navigate. They also told him that there were currently
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: several different alien races working together around Earth. And they
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: also told him that he would not remember what happened
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: on that evening, but that his memory would return over
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: a period of time. And the contact ended when they
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: told him that they could find him whenever they wanted
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: and that they would quote, see me again. Another interesting
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: facet to this case is Moody said that this craft
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: was not that large but when he went inside it
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: appeared to be much larger on the inside than the
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: outside and he couldn't believe there was two levels to
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: it because it just did not appear that large. This
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: is a feature that does turn up in many cases.
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  Speaker 1: This did turn out to be, as far as we know,
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  Speaker 1: Sergeant Moody's final contact. He kind of disappeared from the
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: public eye. To this day, no one has been able
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: to track him down and talk to him about this case.
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: But nevertheless, his case was published and did cause quite
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: a bit of attention among investigators, not only Jim Coral
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: or Renzin, but others. Certainly Timothy Goode and Richard Hall
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: have all looked into this case and believe it to
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  Speaker 1: be genuine. It's an absolutely astonishing early case that preceded
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: the large flood of reports that would come forth in
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: the next few decades. And that's why I wanted to
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: include it here and gave it spot number 10 on
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  Speaker 1: this list. And now we move to case number 9.
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  Speaker 1: For case number 9, I chose... the UFO wave of
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: November 1957. I actually did another video on this wave
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: of sightings, which really encompassed a larger area than just
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: New Mexico. In fact, it was largely centered in Texas,
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: but really went all across the United States and the world.
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  Speaker 1: But it's such an important case, such a dramatic case,
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  Speaker 1: that I felt it deserved a spot on this list,
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  Speaker 1: so I thought I would just cover it again. And this, again,
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: occurred in November of 1957. But the first indication of
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: this wave occurred when Miss Ella Louise Fortune was driving
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  Speaker 1: by Holloman Air Force Base on October 16, 1957. Mind you,
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  Speaker 1: this is just 12 days after the launch of Sputnik,
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: Earth's first artificially launched satellite. And at 1 p.m. that afternoon,
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: Ella Fortune was driving along White Sands when she saw
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: a large cigar-shaped white glowing object scooting across the sky,
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: and she quickly snapped a very clear photograph of this
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  Speaker 1: object and this was how it all began. It was
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: just a week later when a huge wave of sightings
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: occurred and what's amazing about these sightings is many of
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  Speaker 1: them involved electromagnetic interference and stopped cars across New Mexico,
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  Speaker 1: Texas and many other areas. This was a clear display
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  Speaker 1: clear show of technological ability and I think a way
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: of letting earthlings know what the ETs can do at
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: any rate on November 3rd at about 3 a.m. Corporal
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  Speaker 1: Glenn H. Toy and PFC officer James Wilbanks were on
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  Speaker 1: army jeep patrol at White Sands when they saw quote
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  Speaker 1: a very bright light high in the sky was egg-shaped
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  Speaker 1: and 100 yards in diameter, and descended to about 100
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  Speaker 1: feet above the old atomic bunker used in the first
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: atomic explosions. And after a few moments, that light blinked out.
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  Speaker 1: A few minutes later, it flared up again, becoming, quote,
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  Speaker 1: nearly as bright as the sun. It then descended towards
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: the ground at an angle and disappeared. And as Glenn
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: Toy says, it looked like a completely controlled landing. A
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: search party was sent out, but they found no landing traces.
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: This is Bill Haggard. Public information officer, White Sands Proving Ground,
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  Speaker 2: New Mexico. Three young military policemen who spotted a mysterious
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  Speaker 2: object over White Sands Proving Ground Sunday. Creating a light,
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  Speaker 2: and what they saw... Looked like a landing and take-off
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  Speaker 2: of some controlled object from outer space. In open session
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  Speaker 2: here with the public information and intelligence officials, the U.S.
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  Speaker 2: has pieced together a startling tale of what appeared to
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: be movements of a controlled device. The soldiers said they
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: had not talked with each other about what they saw
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: until after both reports had been turned in to the
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  Speaker 2: Provo Marshal's office. This day is further that prior to
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: the sighting of the object, they read no newspaper accounts
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: or heard anything about Mr. Arctis Cuthwaite. The use emphasized
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: that the object looked as bright as the sky, bright
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: as the sun rather, but it did not light the
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: sky around it. The Corporal Gren H. Toy, who with
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: his buddy PFC James Wilbanks, saw the object first about
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  Speaker 2: 3 a.m.
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  Speaker 3: Sunday.
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  Speaker 2: He told of noticing a mysterious small sky. The object
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: came down very slowly to about 50 yards from the ground,
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: the corporal said. It stayed up there for three minutes,
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: just giving off a brilliant reddish light. Then it came
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: to the ground fairly fast, about a 45 degree angle,
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: and the light went out quickly. This was about two
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: or three miles away from me. It looked like a
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: completely controlled landing. Woodrow Banks had been on a three-day pass,
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: not present at the interview. His pass had.
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: Been approved some days previously.
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: And it was just 11 hours later.
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: At almost 2 p.m., still on November 3rd, when a
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: test pilot was flying from Texas to Roswell, New Mexico,
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: and landed at Holloman Air Force Base and told base
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: operations that he had just encountered a large oblong glowing
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: object which had passed over his aircraft. It moved so
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: quickly it left only what appeared to be a streak
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: of light. Four hours later, 6 p.m., military police at
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: White Sands made a second sighting of a brilliant vermilion-covered
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: object about 300 feet in diameter, right over the atomic range.
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: And at the same time, a resident in Deming, New Mexico,
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: claimed to see a strange glowing object overhead. Two hours later,
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: 8 p.m., November 3rd, another officer, Forrest R. Oaks, and
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: Officer Barlow were on a two-man Army jeep patrol at
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: White Sands when they saw a glowing object hovering above
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: the test base. directly over the old atomic bunker. According
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: to Forest Oaks, this object was, quote, 200 or 300
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: feet long and very bright. It was two miles away
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: when this object ascended at a 45-degree angle. Lights pulsated
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: on and off. It moved slowly, sometimes stopping, but continually
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: ascended upwards until it had the appearance of a bright star. Finally,
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: it became a pinpoint of light. But the soldiers believed
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: that they had witnessed a controlled landing and ascent. And
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: here I'll just play a short portion of audio tape
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: in which they describe this sighting.
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: The other two MPs are Specialist 3rd Class Richard Oakes
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: and Specialist 3rd Class Henry Burrow. spotted what appeared to
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: be the same object some 17 hours later, about 8 p.m. Sunday,
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: when they were on patrol together in the jeep. They
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: say they first noticed the object hovering motionless about 50
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: yards from the ground, and then saw it rise slowly
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: into the sky and stop again. It got so far up, finally,
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: it looked like a star. Then all of a sudden,
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: we didn't see it anymore. I know it couldn't have
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: been an aircraft, said Marlow, because it remained motionless for
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: several minutes. The second patrol also sawed out it from
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: about two miles in about the same area. The patrols
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: possibly were about a mile apart. Uh, the terrain at
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: the northern.
• 17:16
  Speaker 3: End of the northern tip.
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: Of the range, 90 miles north of, uh, like that,
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: Pruitt Ground Headquarters, uh, is near the focus using the
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: first atomic bomb explosion in 1945. Uh, the terrain is.
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: Uh, flat desert land.
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: It's possible to see clearly at several miles. I think,
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: I think they're confident.
• 17:38
  Speaker 4: You just heard a report by the public information officer
• 17:40
  Speaker 4: at White Sands, New Mexico, on a sighting by two
• 17:43
  Speaker 4: soldiers on Sunday morning.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: Of an unidentified flying object.
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: It was around the same time of this same sighting
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: when another guy was driving through Roswell. He saw a UFO.
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: His car lights dimmed and then went out. But it
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: was the next day, November 4th, 1957, at 1.10 p.m.,
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: that a very famous incident occurred. And this is when
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: the military started to get really concerned because all of
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: these car stalling incidents, this appeared to be something that
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: hadn't happened before, certainly not to this magnitude. And on
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: that afternoon, 1.10 p.m., November 4th, 1957, James Stokes, who
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: was a good witness, he worked at Holloman Air Force Base,
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: He was a high-altitude missile engineer and a Navy veteran,
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: and he was driving along the proving grounds when his
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: car radio failed. Seconds later, his engine stalled, he rolled
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: to a stop, and ten other cars next to him
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: all failed. Some of the drivers got outside of their
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: car and were pointing and looking at this object to
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: the northeast. At this point, James Stokes looked up and
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: saw a glowing, pearlescent, egg-shaped object of huge proportions, he
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: estimates 300 to 500 feet, and it had no visible
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: portholes or external features, but it started performing incredible maneuvers.
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: It passed overhead twice, sending down a strong wave of heat,
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: performed several dives and sharp turns before darting off at,
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: he estimates, 2,500 miles per hour. And as he says,
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: and I'll just quote him directly, I saw a brilliant
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: egg-shaped object making a shallow dive across the sky, then
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: it turned and made a pass at the highway and
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: crossed it not more than two miles ahead. Then it
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: moved away towards White Sands Proving Grounds, and as it passed,
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: I could feel a kind of heat wave, like radiation
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: from a giant sun lamp. There was no sound and
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: no visible portholes. When I got back to my car
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: and checked the engine, I found it intact, but the
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: battery was steaming. Another witness, Alan Baker, who also worked
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: at White Sands Proving Grounds, And Mr. Duncan, a resident
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: of Las Cruces, said that when the object appeared, he
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: was able to take photographs of it with his camera.
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: And as it maneuvered, the low-level clouds would dissipate. And
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: after the object departed, all the vehicles started up normally
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: and they left the scene. It was then that Sergeant
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: James Stokes discovered that his face had been sunburned by
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: the object. This was what provided the Inspiration for the
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: scene in Close Encounters of the Third Kind when Richard
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: Dreyfuss was burned by a UFO, got a sunburn. And
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: Sergeant James Stokes reported his sighting to his military superior
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: at Holloman Air Force Base, who told him that it
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: was all right to go public if he wanted. He
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: was given a physical examination by base doctors. and later
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: did provide an interview to Coral and Jim Lorenzen, but
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: he's now seemed reticent to discuss the sighting and suggested
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: that he perhaps saw, quote, some kind of atmospheric phenomena.
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: Coral and Jim Lorenzen believed by this point he had
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: been pressured by his superiors to cover up what happened.
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: As Coral Lorenzen says, it was generally agreed that later
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: Stokes had changed his story somewhat after his interview with
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: military authorities. They met with him again two months after
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: the incident. By this point, his case had been widely
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: printed in newspapers and in some cases had been viciously
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: attacked as a hoax. And James Stokes was really upset
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: by the accusations of the hoax and said that if
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: he ever again saw anything out of the ordinary, he
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: wouldn't tell anyone. He did give a taped interview on
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: KALG radio and said that what he saw was definitely
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: a solid object, but refused to elaborate and said only,
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: I just hope we're ready for what it is. Interestingly,
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: Air Force Public Information Officer Lieutenant Colonel John McCurdy did
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: reveal that he questioned Stokes extensively and was convinced that
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: James Stokes had in fact had a genuine sighting. And
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: Coral Lorenzen learned of additional witnesses to the event, one
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: who was an officer at Holloman Air Force Base who
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: declined to come forward. Another was a nurse at the
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: local hospital who said that she knew of a couple
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: who were on the highway near Oro Grand during the
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: time of the sighting, but they also refused to come
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: forward for fear of ridicule. But they did say that
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: this was definitely a real flying object and not a, quote,
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: natural phenomenon, as some of the newspapers were reporting. So
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: I would like to play a small portion of an
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: audio tape which describes the sighting by James Stokes.
• 23:17
  Speaker 5: Reports keep coming in of a mysterious, brilliant object being
• 23:21
  Speaker 5: sighted in areas of New Mexico and Texas. The latest
• 23:26
  Speaker 5: report is from James Stokes, an engineer from the Air
• 23:30
  Speaker 5: Force Missile Development Center at Holloman Air Force Base in Alamogordo,
• 23:35
  Speaker 5: New Mexico. He has told of seeing a brilliant colored
• 23:39
  Speaker 5: egg-shaped object yesterday. And he's quoted as saying some force
• 23:44
  Speaker 5: emanating from it stalled 10 cars on an isolated desert
• 23:49
  Speaker 5: road between White Sands Proving Grounds and Alamogordo. Stokes also
• 23:56
  Speaker 5: told Terry Clark, the news director of a radio station
• 23:58
  Speaker 5: in Alamogordo, that as the object passed in a shallow
• 24:03
  Speaker 5: dive across the sky, he could feel a kind of
• 24:06
  Speaker 5: a heat wave, like radiation from a giant sun lamp.
• 24:10
  Speaker 5: But he said he heard no sound. Earlier reports in
• 24:14
  Speaker 5: recent days told of a big ball of fire spotted
• 24:17
  Speaker 5: over much of West Texas. The Air Force is investigating.
• 24:23
  Speaker 4: And now the news from the United States. The Air
• 24:26
  Speaker 4: Force apparently is convinced that an electronics engineer actually saw
• 24:32
  Speaker 4: an unidentified flying object over the New Mexico desert. The engineer,
• 24:36
  Speaker 4: who works at the Air Force's White Sands Missile Proving Grounds,
• 24:39
  Speaker 4: said the egg-shaped object with rings around it was spotted
• 24:42
  Speaker 4: at the same time as his car and ten others
• 24:45
  Speaker 4: were mysteriously stalled Monday. A spokesman said the Air Force
• 24:49
  Speaker 4: is trying to locate other motorists whose cars are said
• 24:52
  Speaker 4: by stokes to have.
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: Stalled so it was just six hours later when uh
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: on november 4th there was another sighting miss van fleet
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: observed a gold-colored object larger than the full moon hovering
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: over the sky a few hours later 10 45 p.m
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: kirtland air force base tracked what appears to be the
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: same object on radar controllers on duty at the airport
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: tower at kirtland in albuquerque observed this object, and according
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: to a Blue Book report on the case, one of
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: the controllers saw, quote, a white light traveling east between
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: 150 to 200 miles per hour at an altitude of
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: approximately 1,500 feet. The controller called the radar station, which
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: confirmed that the object was on radar and that this
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: object moved across the east end of runway 26 in
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: a southwesterly direction and began a steep descent. And one
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: of the controllers was actually able to observe this object
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: through binoculars and said that it was shaped like an, quote,
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: automobile on end. This case, of course, did reach the
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: attention of Project Blue Book officers. And as the report
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: on this case reads, this was estimated to be 15
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: to 18 feet high. One white light was observed to
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: the lower side of the object. The object slowed to
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: an estimated speed of 50 miles per hour. and disappeared
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: behind the fence at Drumhead, a restricted area which is
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: brilliantly floodlighted. This is approximately one half mile from the
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: control tower, and at this point the object reappeared, moving
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: eastward at an altitude of 200 to 300 feet, and
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: one of the controllers now wondered if this might be
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: a helicopter in distress. And according to the Blue Book
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: report on this particular sighting, and I quote, Although completely
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: cooperative and willing to answer any questions, both sources appeared
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: to be slightly embarrassed that they could not identify or
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: offer an explanation of the object, which they are unshakably
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: convinced they saw. And meanwhile, unknown to either of the controllers,
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: the radar operator was also watching this object as it
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: slowed down, reversed course, and orbited over Kirtland Air Force Base.
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: This object then took off towards the northwest and disappeared
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: from the radar scopes. The whole sighting lasted about five minutes. However,
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: this radar technician told Blue Book investigators that 20 minutes
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: after the sighting, the object reappeared over the outer marker
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: approximately four miles south of the north-south runway and then
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: flew at a high rate of speed about a mile
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: south of the east-west runway where it made an abrupt
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: turn and fell into formation with a C-46 aircraft that
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: followed the plane for a half mile for the next
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: 14 miles. And at this point, the radar scope showed
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: that the object turned to the north, hovered for one
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: and a half minutes, and faded from the scope. So
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: he tracked this object for about 20 minutes. And J.
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: Allen Hynek looked into this case, and he was shocked
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: by Blue Book's conclusions. which were typically confusing and contradictory.
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: The officers of Blue Book concluded that the object, quote,
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: may possibly have been an unidentified aircraft, possibly confused by
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: the runways at Kirtland Air Force Base. The reasons for
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: this opinion are, one, the observers are considered competent and
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: reliable sources, and the opinion of this interviewer, They actually
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: saw an object they could not identify, and two, the
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: object was tracked on a radar scope by a competent operator,
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: and three, the object does not meet identification criteria for
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: any other phenomenon. So Hynek was exasperated by this sighting,
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: and as Hynek says, and I quote, that is, the
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: observers were reliable, the radar operator was competent, and the
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: object couldn't be identified, therefore it was an airplane. In
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: the face of such reasoning, one might well ask whether
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: it would ever be possible to discover the existence of
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: new empirical phenomena in any area of human experience. What
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: indeed can one say of a radar visual case like this?
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: The basic agreement of the radar and visual reports and
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: the competence of the three observers, in my opinion, rule
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: out questions of mirages, false returns on radar, etc. Something
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: quite definitely was there. If it was an ordinary aircraft,
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: one might ask how it was that the two visual
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: observers with a total of 23 years of control tower
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: experience could jointly not have been able to recognize it
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: when visibility conditions were good, even if there were no
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: radar confirmation of the slow and fast motions of the
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: object or indeed just the presence of an unknown object,
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: this question would still have to be answered. So again,
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: an amazing case, but we have to move on because
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: there are many other cases to cover on this amazing wave. 4.24 a.m.,
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: November 5, 1957, Don Clark, an electronics and radar technician
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: employed at Holloman as a civilian contractor, was at his
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: home in Alamogordo when he saw an orange-red cigar-shaped object
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: hover at 15 degrees in the western sky. He wanted
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: to take a photograph, but it disappeared real quickly. Five
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: minutes later, Lyman Brown Jr. was in his home in Alamogordo,
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: and he saw apparently the same object as it darted
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: off over the Sacramento Mountains. Fifteen minutes later, 7.45 p.m.,
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: a bus driver by the name of Delbert Boyd observed
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: a mysterious light southwest of Albuquerque. November 5th, 8.30 p.m.,
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: a gentleman in Hobbs, New Mexico, said his car engine
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: and headlights failed when a UFO swooped down over his car.
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: Another vehicle reported the same thing. Next day, November 6th,
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: There was a car stalling incident which occurred to two witnesses.
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: This was at 1.15 a.m. Santa Fe residents J. Martinez
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: and A. Gallegos were driving their car when they saw
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: an egg-shaped object with, quote, red, green, and yellow lights.
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: It approached them at a low altitude, moved slowly directly
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: over their car, illuminated the entire area, and at the
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: same time emitted a loud humming noise. And as soon
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: as it was overhead, their car engine suddenly died and
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: their clock and wristwatches also ceased to function. And on
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: that same evening, apparently at the same time, two residents
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: from Santa Fe told police that they saw, quote, a
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: huge ball of fire traveling overhead in Santa Fe. And
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: seven hours later, now it's November 7th, this is at 9.20 a.m.,
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: 20 miles from the encounter where James Stokes saw his UFO, Mr.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: and Ms. Trent Lindsey and their son Byron were driving
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: on Highway 54 when Byron noticed that the speedometer on
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: their 1954 Mercury was behaving strangely. It was weaving erratically
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: back and forth, traveling from 60 miles to 110 miles
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: per hour, and they were discussing the problem when they
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: looked up and saw a UFO. They could not identify
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: what it was, but it looked like an object that
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: had highly polished metal with sharply defined edges, no visible
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: means of proportion. And as they watched, it arced in
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: a trajectory of high altitude towards the Oregon mountains. Two
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: days later, November 9th at 7.20 p.m., a Tularosa resident
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: A college student and several others observed a large, brilliant,
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: fast-moving light approach their car on Highway 54, causing the
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: vehicle's lighting system to fail. And as it flew over
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: the car, it accelerated at a high rate of speed
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: off into the distance. And at the same time as
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: this sighting, investigators Jim and Coral Lorenzen were traveling east
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: on Highway 380. This is about 10 miles from Carrioso.
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: when they spotted a UFO, which they described as a
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: bright light silhouetted against the mountains to the east, and
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: it moved erratically until it moved off into the distance.
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: So the Air Force was apparently dismayed that many of
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: their employees were talking freely with the media about their sightings,
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: and they put forth a bulletin that was addressed to
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: all military and civilian officers on the base. And according
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: to this bulletin, and I quote, it was titled, unidentified
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: flying objects. On November 7, six airmen claimed that they
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: sighted an unidentified flying object and did not report this
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: to proper base authorities. They did, however, give this information
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: to the local press. Request that each member of the
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: military and civilian employed at this center refrain from any
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: public statement on political, diplomatic, legislative, or scientific matters or
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: any controversial subjects such as UFOs without first contacting the
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: Center Information Services Officer. This request is in accordance with
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: AFR 190-6. Disciplinary action may be taken against the offender. Signed,
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: Lieutenant Colonel McCurdy. Coral Lorenzen was upset about this regulation
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: because it, quote, restricts individuals at Air Force installations in
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: relating the details of UFO sightings and, quote, that this
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: regulation is a violation of the constitutional rights of civilians
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: and should be challenged. So that, in a nutshell, if
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: you will, is the incredible wave of November 1957. It's
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: quite a case, quite a series of events, caused concern
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: at high levels of government, And that's why I wanted
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: to include it here. And now we move to case
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: number eight. And for case number eight, I chose astronomer
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: Clyde Tombaugh sees a UFO. Clyde Tombaugh is, of course,
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: world famous. In 1930, he stunned the world with his
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: discovery of the planet Pluto, which has now been relegated
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: to a planetoid universe. in 2007. But the discovery of
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: Pluto electrified the world and it earned Clyde Tombaugh a
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: permanent place as a hero in the field of astronomy.
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: And it was 19 years later on August 20th, 1949
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: that Clyde Tombaugh went public with his own sighting of
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: a UFO. Unfortunately it failed to generate the kind of
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: publicity the discovery of Pluto did But it's definitely an
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: amazing sighting. It was 10.45 p.m. Clyde Tombaugh, his wife
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: and mother-in-law were in the backyard of their home in
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: Las Cruces. It was a very clear night and all
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: the stars were easily visible when suddenly the three observers
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: saw something they couldn't identify. Flying overhead in a strange
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: geometric formation were six to eight blue-green rectangular-shaped lights. They
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: were at low altitude and moved quickly and silently from
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: the northwest to the southeast. It became clear to Clyde
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: Tombaugh that the lights were attached to a single object,
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: which appeared to have a half-dozen windows or portholes along
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: the front and side, each of which emitted a bright light.
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: Clyde Tombaugh concluded instantly that these were neither meteors nor
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: conventional aircraft, but was clearly an unknown solid object. He
• 37:36
  Speaker 1: wrote an official report to the Air Force, which stated
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: in part, and I quote, The remarkably sudden ascent convinced
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: me it was an absolutely novel airborne device. I have
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: done thousands of hours of night sky watching, but never
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: saw a sight so strange as this.
• 38:01
  Speaker 6: Well, of the three different types of objects that I
• 38:04
  Speaker 6: have seen, I would say the most extraordinary one was
• 38:08
  Speaker 6: one I saw in 1949 in August in Las Cruces
• 38:12
  Speaker 6: from my backyard. On that particular evening, my wife and
• 38:16
  Speaker 6: her mother and I were enjoying the cool air, and
• 38:20
  Speaker 6: I was admiring the beautiful transparent sky with the stars,
• 38:25
  Speaker 6: and I happened to be looking overhead, and suddenly I
• 38:28
  Speaker 6: spied a strange group of lights moving.
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: And I said, look.
• 38:36
  Speaker 6: And they thought immediately. And then I would say they
• 38:40
  Speaker 6: were visible for about three seconds of time. And they
• 38:45
  Speaker 6: disappeared at a height of about 35 degrees above the
• 38:47
  Speaker 6: south-southeastern horizon.
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: No sound.
• 38:51
  Speaker 6: And they seemed to kind.
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: Of pale out.
• 38:54
  Speaker 6: The rectangles of feeble light seemed to foreshorten into slits.
• 39:00
  Speaker 6: And I've never seen a rocket before or since. And
• 39:03
  Speaker 6: I'm very much puzzled as to what this thing was.
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: He also wrote a report to NICAP, the National Investigative
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: Committee for Aerial Phenomena, which said, and I quote, As
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: I have said before, I was so unprepared for such
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: a strange sight that I was really petrified with astonishment. Consequently,
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: some of the details I might have noted were missed.
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: Clyde was always very vocal. about this sighting, and on
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: February 13, 1954, he gave a talk to the Astronomical
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: Society at Las Cruces, surprising the audience by predicting that
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: he believed there would be an increase in UFO sightings.
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: Three years later, he wrote a letter to researcher Leonard
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: Stringfield in which he revealed that this was not his
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: only sighting and that he had, in fact, seen, quote,
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: three objects within the past seven years which defied any
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: explanation of known phenomenon such as Venus, atmospheric optics, meteors,
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: or planes. He wrote that he had also seen on
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: other occasions objects unexplained green fireballs over New Mexico. And
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: he closed his letter saying, and I quote, I think
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: that several reputable scientists are being unscientific in refusing to
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: entertain the possibility of extraterrestrial origin and nature. So yes,
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: astronomers do see UFOs. As we have seen, Robert Shaldek
• 40:44
  Speaker 1: and Clyde Tambaugh both made this list here. quite an
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: amazing sighting and deserves to be much more well-known. And
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: now we move to case number seven. And for case
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: number seven I chose a cluster of cases, a phenomenon
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: we now know as cattle mutilations. New Mexico has been
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: particularly hard hit by cattle mutilations and there's no way
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: I can cover the entirety of the events in a
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: video of this size. So I'm just going to briefly
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: go through, as briefly as I can, some of these
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: amazing cases. This phenomenon really got a lot of publicity
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: in the mid-1970s when Linda Moulton Howe's award-winning documentary film,
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: A Strange Harvest, which was actually from 1980, was really
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: the first in-depth look at this mystery. Years later, we're
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: still no closer to solving it. It first appeared primarily
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: in New Mexico and Colorado, which is not surprising considering
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: that these states are the leaders in cattle farming. And many,
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: many researchers have looked into this. However, and it does
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: involve many different species of animals, though it does appear
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: that cattle are the primary target. And in a typical case,
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: a cow or a bull is found dead with eyes, tongue, rectum,
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: and sex organs removed, apparently surgically, with a laser-like object,
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: and no blood is spilled on the scene. Typically, there
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: is no evidence of any struggle, and predators will not
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: approach the carcass. In some cases, mutilations are directly associated
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: with UFO activity. In many others, they are associated with
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: unmarked black helicopters. leading to a lot of speculation that
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: our own government is responsible. As researcher Lawrence Fawcett and
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: Barry Greenwood, authors of the UFO cover-up, also titled Clear Intent,
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: they write, The connection between helicopters, UFOs, and mutilations is
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: becoming more distinct. But what is the ultimate purpose behind
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: this seemingly incongruous association? Skeptics say that this is predators,
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: natural causes, satanic cult activity. This is ridiculous. It no
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: way accounts for the many, many cases. But New Mexico
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: is one of the hardest hit areas and escalated to
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: the point where these types of events could no longer
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: be ignored. In the year of 1975, there were dozens
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: of these cases. One occurred on October 21st when residents
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: of Union County observed five unmarked helicopters buzzing a herd
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: of cattle at the Kennan Ranch near Seneca. And on
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: November 2nd, 1975, residents of two ranches in Quay County
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: watched a helicopter flashing colored lights and sending down beams
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: of white light to the ground. Over the next two weeks,
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: 30 unidentified helicopters were seen over Union and Quay counties,
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: at which time four cattle mutilations were reported. The FAA
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: started to receive a flood of complaints, and they launched
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: an official investigation. However, the results of this investigation were
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: never revealed, and the FAA has subsequently denied the existence
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: of any such investigations. Around the same time, the New
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: Mexico Livestock Board investigated the mutilations and they concluded that
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: it was possible involvement of clandestine satanic groups. But the
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: 70s is when this really escalated. May 13, 1976, a
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: mutilated cow was found near Pot Mountain. On June 13,
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: a state police officer from Dulce, Gabe Valdez, was called
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: to the scene of another mutilation And he soon became
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: one of the lead investigators because within a year he
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: was called to investigate more than 30 similar cases in
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: the Dulse area. And he became an expert. In 1978,
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: he was informed that some mutilated cows were being marked
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: by an unknown substance which would fluoresce under ultraviolet light,
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: a black light. And on July 5th, 1978... Valdez and
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: a cattle rancher by the name of Manuel Gomez put
• 45:33
  Speaker 1: Gomez's cattle through an ultraviolet light, and five of Gomez's
• 45:39
  Speaker 1: cattle were found to have a fluorescent substance on their necks, ears,
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: and legs. And they had this substance analyzed, and it
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: showed a high proportion of magnesium and potassium levels, 70
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: times above normal. So this was an ongoing phenomena from
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: 1975 to 1980. Gomez lost over 50 head of cattle,
• 46:05
  Speaker 1: the most recorded on any single ranch. But many ranches
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: suffered badly. In 1978, rancher Naber Montoya of Trusas lost
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: a cow to a mutilation. Also in 1978, Taos News
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: article by Phil Bateman described UFO sightings in Ranchitos that
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: were tied to an epidemic of mysterious animal deaths. In 1979,
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: three racehorses near Mulga were mutilated. Two months later in April,
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: Dulse experienced a wave of low-level sightings, and soon afterwards,
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: several mutilations were discovered nearby. It was a result of
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: this particular incident and other cases that Then-New Mexico Senator
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: Harrison Schmidt, a former astronaut, called for a multi-state mutilation
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: conference in Albuquerque. And on April 20, 1979, Senator Schmidt
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: and New Mexico U.S. Attorney R.E. Thompson held a public hearing,
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: and more than 200 people attended. Schmidt opened saying that
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: the mutilations are real, they're taking place, they're criminal acts,
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: they're causing a great deal of damage, but we don't
• 47:26
  Speaker 1: know who's doing it. And he wanted official help, such
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: as the FBI. There were 11 other speakers, and finally
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: this did result in an official investigation to investigate the reports,
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: but the report did not come to any official conclusion
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: as to what was causing this. So ultimately, it was
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: kind of a bust. And meanwhile, the mutilations continued. In 1979,
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: Carlos Miranda, a tribal police officer from the Bureau of
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: Indian Affairs, responded to a call and found two dead
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: heifers in Santa Clara. There was a cover-up of these events,
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: according to him, and the FBI launched an investigation known
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: as Operation Animal Mutilation, OAM, and the OAM report said
• 48:32
  Speaker 1: that by 1979, more than 10,000 head of cattle had
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: been mysteriously mutilated and that New Mexico was unusually hard
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: hit And since 1975 alone, more than 100 cases have
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: been reported. And they're often accompanied by strange sightings of
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: helicopters and or UFOs. So these mutilations continued through 1988, 89, 1990.
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: There was another case in 1996. I mean, it just
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: kept going on and on, over and over. all through
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: the nineteen nineties there was a whole wave of sightings
• 49:19
  Speaker 1: One particularly frightening incident occurred to Larry Gardia, who was
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: hunting in Lujan Canyon when he came upon a herd
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: of cows and came upon a mutilation, heard a strange
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: sound like a welder's torch from the forest, and all
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: of a sudden one of the cows in the herd
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: floated up into the air, over the fence, towards this herd,
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: towards the source of the sound, rather. And at the
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: same time, he saw another cow floating down out of
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: the sky and landing in the pasture. And he quickly
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: took his rifle and fired at the source of this noise,
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: at which point it immediately stopped. And he called the
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: sheriff to report this incident. And they did find that
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: these cows had been mutilated. One researcher who looked into
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: this was Gail Stalin, a researcher from Albuquerque. She investigated
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: many cases firsthand and is certain that it's not the
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: work of satanic cults. She says, for you to walk
• 50:28
  Speaker 1: up to a cow that size and kill it, you'd
• 50:30
  Speaker 1: have to slit its throat. You'd have blood all over
• 50:33
  Speaker 1: the place. If it is confirmed that it is laser cuts,
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: the equipment they'd have to use is fairly good sized.
• 50:40
  Speaker 1: That's why I think the cows are removed. Another researcher
• 50:46
  Speaker 1: was Santa Fe-based researcher David Perkins, and he charted the
• 50:51
  Speaker 1: locations of more than a dozen mutilations that had taken
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: place in New Mexico over the last 16 months since 1994,
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: and he found that the majority of these cases occurred
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: in the area of Eagle Nest, which is where, according
• 51:07
  Speaker 1: to Perkins, nuclear fallout from a May 1955 Nevada atomic
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: test had landed. and he speculates that the purpose of
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: the mutilations might be to measure the effects of atomic
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: pollution on the local animal population. At any rate, these
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: mutilations occurred all through the 1990s. Gabe Valdez continued to
• 51:33
  Speaker 1: investigate these unusual animal deaths, and many other investigators looked
• 51:41
  Speaker 1: into it as well. One researcher was John Paternoster, and
• 51:50
  Speaker 1: he researched several cases, and he said that he believes
• 51:57
  Speaker 1: most of these cases are going unreported because farmers and
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: ranchers are very reluctant to report them and don't want
• 52:05
  Speaker 1: to be viewed as crackpots or UFO believers. Timothy Goode,
• 52:12
  Speaker 1: An excellent researcher interviewed some of these ranchers. He interviewed
• 52:16
  Speaker 1: a guy from a ranch near Taos who had experienced
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: a large number of mutilations. So many, many investigators have
• 52:27
  Speaker 1: looked into this. And while cattle seem to be the
• 52:30
  Speaker 1: main target, many other animals have been reported mutilated, such
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: as in November of 1988, a rare case involving a
• 52:38
  Speaker 1: small piglet was discovered near the Tulpa River Reservoir. And
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: it hasn't stopped. This continued on into the 2000s. Near 2000,
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: there were several cases. 2003, 2007. It's just going on
• 52:57
  Speaker 1: and on. And John Paternauster is convinced that these mutilations
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: are not being caused by Satanists or scavengers. He says
• 53:08
  Speaker 1: there's got to be a different explanation. And he says,
• 53:13
  Speaker 1: perhaps it's something we can't even comprehend. Researcher Gabe Valdez says,
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: whoever it is, they're coming down by the air. I
• 53:21
  Speaker 1: don't know who they are, but whatever's behind it, it's
• 53:24
  Speaker 1: something big. Richard Dolan looked into it, and he says,
• 53:28
  Speaker 1: the theory is that mutilations are occurring as part of
• 53:32
  Speaker 1: a covert random sampling of cattle to test for excessive
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: levels of radiation contaminations. The area of northern New Mexico,
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: which was the hotspot of mutilation activity during the 1990s,
• 53:44
  Speaker 1: happens to be downwind from the nuclear test site in Nevada,
• 53:48
  Speaker 1: possesses several active uranium mines, was the scene of many
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: nuclear detonations in past decades, and also has two major
• 53:59
  Speaker 1: nuclear research laboratories, and over the years an estimated 1,000
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: kilotons of radioactive dust fell on New Mexico, Nevada, and Colorado.
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: And researcher David Perkins agrees. He says when mutilations first
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: became popular in the late 1970s, he conducted a statistical
• 54:21
  Speaker 1: study and found that many of these were downwind of
• 54:25
  Speaker 1: nuclear power plants, nuclear weapons labs, nuclear test sites, and
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: military bases. and that others were reported near uranium mining operations,
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: such as in Grant and Hidalgo counties, and near the
• 54:42
  Speaker 1: site of underground nuclear detonations in the 1960s. He's also
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: discovered that mutilation events formed a tight ring around Los
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: Alamos National Labs, including Sandoval, Santa Fe, and Rio Arriba counties.
• 54:59
  Speaker 1: He isn't sure who is responsible. As he says, my
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: theory is that the government doesn't know any more than us,
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: but he thinks that they might know some, and he's
• 55:12
  Speaker 1: now leaning towards military. As he says, right now, I'm
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: leaning toward the military secret operation theory. I see all
• 55:20
  Speaker 1: kinds of lights zooming around here, but I don't know
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: what they are. Lawrence Fawcett and Barry Greenwood agree. They
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: say it may take some time before the pieces fall together,
• 55:31
  Speaker 1: but ultimately we believe that the government will have to
• 55:34
  Speaker 1: admit to deep involvement in this aspect of the, quote,
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: UFO mystery. So yeah, animal mutilations is definitely a huge problem.
• 55:45
  Speaker 1: It's still ongoing. It doesn't receive as much publicity as
• 55:49
  Speaker 1: it used to. but it's definitely one of the big
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: events that is still taking place in New Mexico, and
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: that's why I wanted to include it on this list.
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: And now we get to case number six, which I chose,
• 56:02
  Speaker 1: Project Twinkle. And this is a series of mysterious green
• 56:07
  Speaker 1: fireballs that descended on a particular area of New Mexico
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: throughout 1948 and 1949. these are enormous green fireballs like
• 56:21
  Speaker 1: meteorites which showered down on the landscape and in a
• 56:24
  Speaker 1: few cases actually struck the earth. However, in every single case,
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: there was no physical evidence that could be found of
• 56:31
  Speaker 1: their existence. They were first assumed to be natural meteorological phenomena,
• 56:37
  Speaker 1: but as their numbers increased, it became clear that these
• 56:39
  Speaker 1: were not normal fireballs. First of all, they were bright green.
• 56:44
  Speaker 1: They were far too numerous. They were totally silent. They
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: left no evidence of their passing. And while meteors, unlike meteors,
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: these things often traveled in a nearly horizontal path at
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: an altitude of 40,000 to 60,000 feet. And there was
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: also the question of why they never appeared before 1948
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: and seemed centered almost exclusively over New Mexico. At any rate,
• 57:11
  Speaker 1: from 1948 through April of 1949, at least 39 reports
• 57:17
  Speaker 1: of these green fireballs came to the attention of officials
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: at the Air Materiel Command. For example, on December 5th,
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: an Air Force pilot flying a C-47 at 18,000 feet
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: over Albuquerque saw a huge green fireball fly upward and
• 57:35
  Speaker 1: level off on a horizontal trajectory. And seven minutes later,
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: another pilot saw an orange fireball approach in a horizontal trajectory.
• 57:45
  Speaker 1: It turned green in color, then darted to the side
• 57:48
  Speaker 1: and fell to the ground. And before long, these fireballs
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: were coming down in huge numbers. Captain Edward Ruppelt of
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: Project Blue Book wrote, and I quote, Everyone, including intelligence
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: officers at Kirtland Air Force Base, Air Defense Command people, Dr.
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: Lincoln LaPaz and some of the most distinguished scientists at
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: Los Alamos had seen at least one. So many of
• 58:14
  Speaker 1: these were over Los Alamos. For example, on the 5th, 8th, 11th, 12th, 13th, 14th, 20th,
• 58:23
  Speaker 1: and 25th of December 1949, witnesses saw these green fireballs.
• 58:29
  Speaker 1: And these included special agents of the United States Air Force,
• 58:33
  Speaker 1: the Office of Special Investigations, airline pilots, Los Alamos security inspectors, scientists,
• 58:41
  Speaker 1: and military officers of virtually all ranks. All these witnesses,
• 58:47
  Speaker 1: the Pentagon actually called, quote, observers whose reliabilities are not questioned. Dr.
• 58:55
  Speaker 1: Lincoln LaPaz, who is a professional astronomer, had a sighting
• 58:59
  Speaker 1: on December 12, 1948. He and others watched as a
• 59:03
  Speaker 1: green fireball which was four times brighter in magnitude than Venus,
• 59:09
  Speaker 1: flew on a horrid trajectory at low altitude for at
• 59:13
  Speaker 1: least eight miles directly over Los Alamos. J. Allen Hynek
• 59:19
  Speaker 1: was consulted about this problem, and he interviewed several leading
• 59:23
  Speaker 1: astronomers and found that most of these astronomers had no
• 59:27
  Speaker 1: idea about these fireballs' anomalous features. And according to... I mean,
• 59:33
  Speaker 1: he pointed to Lincoln-Lapaz as the best source of information
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: on this subject. And according to Hynek, and I quote,
• 59:40
  Speaker 1: it appears that the green fireballs can be characterized by
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: being extremely bright, most of them lighting up the sky
• 59:48
  Speaker 1: in the daytime, estimated magnitude... minus 12, which is extremely bright.
• 59:57
  Speaker 1: They appear to come in bunches. No noise is associated
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: with them despite their brightness. They leave no trails or trains.
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: If these data are correct, that is, if this many
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 1: objects are actually seen, all extremely bright, all having this
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 1: particular green color, all exhibiting no noise, all showing a
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 1: preferential direction, all being homogenous in light intensity, all snapping
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 1: out very quickly, and all leaving no trails, then we
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: can say with assurance that these were not astronomical objects.
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 1: In the first place, any object as bright as this
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 1: should have been reported from all over the world. If
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 1: the Earth in its orbit encountered, for some strange reason,
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 1: a group of large meteors, There is no reason that
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 1: they should all show up in New Mexico. If the
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 1: data as reported by La Paz are correct, then we
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 1: do have a strange phenomenon here indeed. So these sightings
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 1: continued throughout 1949. Officials from Kirtland Air Force Base contacted
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 1: Washington and organized an investigation Lincoln LaPaz triangulated the path
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: of these objects, estimated their speed at anywhere between 25,000
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 1: to 50,000 miles per hour. There was no reports of
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 1: any sonic boom, and he assured the AFOSI, Office of
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: Special Investigations, that the objects were, quote, surely artificial. And
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 1: these weren't always green. Some of these fireballs were different colors, red, yellow, orange.
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 1: On one occasion, a fireball approached within 500 feet of
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 1: an airport, dropped to an elevation of 200 feet, and
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 1: then exploded with a shower of reddish spray. According to
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 1: Donald Kehoe, famed UFO researcher, it was feared that this
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 1: might be some kind of gas, but it caused no
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 1: ill effects. This was repeated on three nights at the
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 1: same time and locations. proving the red spray of the
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 1: UFOs were under precise control. The incidents were confirmed in
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 1: the Air Force Project Grudge report, which is the precursor
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 1: of Project Blue Book, but had no opinions as to
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: the purpose. But by this time, of course, Air Force
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: officials were becoming increasingly concerned. These objects were appearing over
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 1: sensitive atomic installations like Los Alamos, Sandia Labs, Kirtland Air
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 1: Force Base, And on February 16th, 1949, a secret meeting
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: with Dr. Edward Teller, the primary inventor of the atomic bomb,
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 1: and Dr. Lincoln LaPaz, who was the director of the
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 1: Institute of Meteorotics at the University of New Mexico. This
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 1: meeting was held at Los Alamos Scientific Labs to study
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: the phenomena. And after studying the reports, they concluded that
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 1: these fireballs were artificial constructions perhaps some sort of controlled missiles,
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 1: but he was absolutely opposed to the meteor theory. Astronomer
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 1: Clyde Tombaugh agreed with Lincoln-Lapaz and said that these were
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 1: not meteors. So, at this point, the Air Force Office
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 1: of Special Investigations at Kirtland Air Force Base issued a
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 1: list of fireball reports to Air Force Headquarters which gave
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 1: the common characteristics of these sightings, which included green color, green-white, bright-green, yellow-green,
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 1: or blue-green, horizontal path with sometimes minor variation, speed less
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 1: than that of a meteor but more than any other
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 1: type of known aircraft, no sound associated with observation, and
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 1: no persistent trail or dust cloud, Finally, a period of
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 1: visibility from one to three seconds. And it was in
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 1: August of 1949 that Kirtland Air Force Base finally got
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 1: the investigation they had been asking for, and the United
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 1: States Air Force created a special study we now know
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 1: as Project Twinkle. And they brought in a theodolite camera,
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 1: which allowed them to track these objects and triangulate their size, speed,
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 1: and altitude. On September 20, 1950, more than 100 witnesses
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 1: across Idaho and New Mexico saw one of these objects,
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 1: though Project Twinkle failed to capture it. From November 9
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 1: to November 20, the green fireballs were reported on 11
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 1: consecutive evenings. and the objects were witnessed by military personnel
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 1: and astronomers. However, Project Twinkle was unable to capture any
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: of the objects on their instruments. However, by this time,
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 1: they had logged more than 150 sightings. And Edward Ruppelt
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 1: called Project Twinkle, quote, a bust, and it was dissolved
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 1: on December 27, 1950. He said it was badly organized,
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 1: pitifully funded, and never tracked a single fireball. In 1955,
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 1: researcher Leonard Stringfield spoke with Captain Robert C. White and
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: inquired about these green fireballs. Captain White replied, They do exist.
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: That's why thousands of dollars were spent on investigating them.
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 1: The project files have never been declassified. The Air Force
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 1: thinks the fireballs are astronomical phenomena. Stringfield, of course, disagreed
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: and quoted Dr. LaPaz, who said, they are not any
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 1: kind of meteor I have ever heard of, and said simply,
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 1: we cannot explain them. So these continued to appear all
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 1: throughout the 1950s, but by the end of the decade,
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 1: they slowed down. Scientists did find unusually high levels of
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 1: copper in the atmosphere where these green fireballs were, and
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 1: the It's speculated perhaps this was an unknown cloud of asteroids,
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 1: but this failed to explain why New Mexico was the
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 1: only location where these were being seen. And there was
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 1: at least one contactee who was told that these fireballs
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 1: were intentionally generated by the ETs and sent to this
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 1: area in order to reverse the atmospheric damage that atomic
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: testing had caused. So every now and then these fireballs
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 1: continued to appear and eventually they stopped. By the late
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 1: 1950s it was pretty much over. But this wave of
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 1: green fireballs has never been explained despite the existence of
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 1: Project Twinkle and remains a unique and fascinating era of
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 1: UFO history over New Mexico, And that's why I wanted
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 1: to include it here. And now we get to the
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 1: top five cases. And for case number five, I chose
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 1: the invasion of White Sands Air Force Base. And this
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 1: really began on May 15, 1947, when a V-2 rocket
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 1: was launched at White Sands. It went 40 miles high
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 1: when suddenly another target appeared. The V-2 veered off its
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 1: path and crashed in two minutes. And a team headed
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 1: by Lieutenant Colonel Harold R. Turner, the commanding officer, told
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 1: intelligence investigators that the missiles crashed because of this UFO.
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 1: And the Office of Scientific Research and Development had a
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 1: board of highly placed scientists put together to study it.
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 1: And it was headed by Vannevar Bush, who as we
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 1: now know is part of MJ-12. It was just a
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 1: short time later, one month later, June 29, 1947, three
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 1: naval scientists, Dr. Zohn, Curtis Rockwood, and John Koch, prepared
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 1: for a test involving a captured German V-2 rocket, and
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 1: they saw a silver disc.
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 3: Dr.
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 1: Zohn reported it to Army intelligence and told them it
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 1: was not a balloon. And from this point on, White
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 1: Sands was visited constantly. April 6, 1949, scientists observed several
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 1: objects over the base using a theodolite. This is, again,
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 1: a telescope with a protractor. It rotates vertically and horizontally
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: and is used for rocket launches. Two weeks later, April 24th, 1949,
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: another UFO was observed using a theodolite. At the time,
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 1: they were launching a Skyhook weather balloon when this UFO
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 1: showed up. Commander Robert McLaughlin of the base was supervising.
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 1: Charles B. Moore was watching this balloon when he noticed
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 1: the theodolite operator wasn't observing the balloon anymore and began
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 1: berating him, but the operator said, but I've got it
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 1: right here. So Charles B. Moore took over the Theodolite
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: and observed the UFO for about 60 seconds and estimates
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 1: it was 40 feet wide, 100 feet long, with solid
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 1: edges and moving at about 2,200 miles per hour. Project
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 1: Blue Book was called in, including J. Allen Hynek.
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 7: And as J.
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 1: Allen Hynek says, Charles Moore was disgusted with the Air
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 1: Forces and my lack of attention to this sighting. Who
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 1: can blame him? It was typical of the Air Force's
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 1: practice of spending a great deal of overkill effort pinning
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 1: down cases for which there seemed to me an immediate
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 1: logical explanation in sight and devoting only modest follow-up to
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: a case that was truly baffling. Nevertheless, they labeled this
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 1: case unexplained. It caused waves in high circles, and Dr.
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 1: Vannevar Bush's group came to investigate. It was leaked to newspapers,
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 1: which the Air Force seemed to be more concerned about
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 1: than the study of the objects itself. And it was
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 1: then that Commander Robert McLaughlin actually went public. And as
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 1: he says, flying disks have nothing to do with any
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 1: experiments carried on by American scientists or, for that matter,
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 1: by anyone on Earth. These things are real. They come
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 1: from another planet. where creatures are far ahead of us
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 1: in science. I have heard it said that they are
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 1: spaceships from Mars, which have been attracted to the Earth
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 1: by our atomic bomb explosions and fascinated by what they
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 1: saw have continued to keep an eye on us. He
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 1: told True Magazine, I am convinced it was a flying
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 1: saucer and further that these disks are space aliens from
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 1: another planet operated by animate intelligent beings. So he just
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 1: went right out and said it. They're aliens. And the
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 1: sightings just continued. On April 27, 1949, four U.S. Army
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 1: personnel were stationed near Los Alamos when they observed a
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 1: tiny object described as a four-inch diameter light with a
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 1: metallic cone attached to the rear fly directly towards them.
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 1: They estimate it moved at 70 miles per hour at
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 1: a height of only seven feet. and it was in
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 1: view for just a matter of seconds before disappearing to
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 1: the southwest. And there are some reports that White Sands
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 1: actually shot down one of these objects. On May 29, 1947,
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 1: at White Sands Proving Ground, according to researcher and former
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 1: Republican state representative John Kistner, radar technicians at White Sands
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 1: observed one or more unidentified radar targets hovering to the
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 1: southwest of White White Sands Proving Grounds launch row. And
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 1: at 7.15 p.m., one surface-to-air missile with a 674-pound atomic
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 1: warhead was fired at one of the radar targets. Five
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 1: minutes later, the warhead exploded at an elevation of 60,000 feet.
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 1: And meanwhile, witnesses in Las Cruces saw this rocket climb
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 1: into the sky, move towards two star-like objects, and explode.
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 1: Following this explosion, this target was tracked on radar moving south,
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 1: and 10 minutes later, it impacted the Earth 30 miles
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 1: to the south outside of the town of Juarez, New Mexico.
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 1: Officials attempted to go to Mexico and retrieve the object. However,
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 1: the town of Juarez at this point had been closed
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 1: off by Mexican military officials. who refused to allow anybody
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 1: inside the area. And according to John Kistner, whatever had
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 1: crashed had been largely vaporized upon impact. So sightings continued
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 1: throughout May and June of 1949. Two more V-2 rockets
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 1: were launched at this time, and both provoked sightings. And
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 1: according to Commander McLaughlin, and I quote, Many times I
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 1: have seen flying disks following and overtaking missiles in flight
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 1: at the experimental base at White Sands, where, as is known,
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 1: the first American atom bomb was tried out. And sightings
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 1: continued through 1950. April 27, 1950, a missile launch at
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 1: Holloman Air Force Base fell to the earth when four
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 1: unknowns swooped down and bombed. were viewed on a theodolite.
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 1: Officers determined that these objects were 30 feet in diameter.
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 1: On May 29, 1950, officers at White Sand tracked another
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 1: unknown object at two separate theodolite stations and actually took
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 1: camera footage of the object. Strangely, this case was never
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 1: reported to Blue Buck. An even more impressive case took
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 1: place just a few months, or actually one month, later,
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 1: July 1950, and is one of many UFO incidents that
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 1: the Air Force attempted unsuccessfully to censor. In this case,
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 1: the witness was an electronics engineer who worked at the base,
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 1: and over the past several months he had seen, quote,
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 1: high groups of shiny objects, end quote, over the base.
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 1: And he had already accepted that there was something going
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 1: on here involving UFOs, and one witness day in July,
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 1: he was eating lunch in his office when the telephone
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 1: rang and it was a nearby radar station phoning to
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 1: say that an aerial object was being sighted over the
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 1: base and could he view it on a theodolite. So
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 1: they went to their station and quickly located the object
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 1: with a theodolite and according to Cora Lorenzen, who interviewed
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 1: this officer, the object was cigar-shaped, metallic, and iridescent. meaning
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 1: it glowed. They could see fins extruding from this object
• 1:16:01
  Speaker 1: and portholes as well. And after they located it on
• 1:16:05
  Speaker 1: the theodolite, it maneuvered around, dropped, stopped short, moved forward,
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 1: turned on its side, doing all these extreme maneuvers. The
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 1: officer alerted other nearby radar stations. However, when he got
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 1: back to the theodolite, this object was gone. They turned
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 1: over the film they had taken and two days later
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 1: they were called in by an unidentified lieutenant and were
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 1: basically told not to talk about it. According to Cora Lorenzen,
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 1: they were asked over and over again if they had
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 1: taken pictures and to describe over and over the object
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 1: they had observed. The two men were asked if they
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 1: could identify the film of the object they had photographed.
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 1: One of the men became quite angry about the questioning,
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 1: telling the officer that he had seen what he had reported,
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 1: had photographed the object, and was convinced the object was
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 1: some sort of vehicle from outer space. And he was
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 1: shown a film of 14 frames on a projector, and
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 1: these frames showed a blurred ellipsoid with a dark center,
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 1: but no details, and they were told by their superiors to, quote,
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 1: forget the whole incident. Another incident occurred in 1951, July 14th,
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 1: when a fast-moving object was seen again over White Sands.
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 1: It was hovering near a B-29, caught on radar, observed
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 1: visually through binoculars, and was photographed at about 200 feet
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 1: of elevation on a 35mm moving camera, which showed this
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 1: object clearly. And there was other reports of UFO crashes.
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 1: According to researcher Todd Zetschel, an anonymous Army helicopter pilot
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 1: was an aide to an Air Force general who told
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 1: him that a crashed saucer of an ovoid shape, about
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 1: 18 by 30 feet, was recovered along with four four-foot-tall bodies.
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 1: And it was retrieved near White Sands in 1953, then
• 1:18:21
  Speaker 1: shipped off to Langley. And according to the witness, this
• 1:18:25
  Speaker 1: craft was found in near perfect condition with the doors open,
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 1: though all the occupants were dead. They were reportedly hairless,
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 1: but otherwise looked very much human looking. And in 1977,
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 1: researcher Richard Hall spoke to the lieutenant colonel who confirmed
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 1: this incident. and said that he had actually seen the
• 1:18:46
  Speaker 1: four bodies at Langley Air Force Base and was told
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 1: that they were recovered from a crash in 1953 near
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 1: White Sands. So many, many cases. I mean, I can
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 1: go on and on. There was a case in 1956
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 1: in September of when numerous witnesses observed a disc-shaped object
• 1:19:10
  Speaker 1: with a dome on top land on the highway within
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 1: the White Sands Proving Grounds just 12 miles east of
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 1: Holloman Air Force Base right alongside Highway 70 and as
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 1: it landed the engines of all the cars rolled to
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 1: a stop and other witnesses on the base also observed
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 1: this object and Other people on the base, personnel who
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 1: observed this object, were all brought together in a hangar
• 1:19:42
  Speaker 1: and sworn to secrecy. And this order came not from
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 1: the Air Force, but from the CIA, who told them
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 1: that the origin of the UFOs was unknown. There was
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 1: another landing on November 3, 1957. This was, of course,
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 1: during that huge wave of sightings. I also already covered that.
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 1: But many, many other sightings. May 15, 1964, two UFOs
• 1:20:11
  Speaker 1: were tracked on surveillance radar and on the radars of
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 1: other stations. And these objects performed very precise maneuvers. They
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 1: were described as brown-colored and football-shaped and were flying so
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 1: low that they actually disappeared behind the site of buildings.
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 1: Researcher Frank Edwards says that in May of 1965, officials
• 1:20:40
  Speaker 1: at Holloman Air Force Base, which guards White Sands Missile Range,
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 1: reported that their radar had tracked UFOs for two days.
• 1:20:47
  Speaker 1: June of 1967, Edward Beatty, an engineer with 850 rocket launches,
• 1:20:55
  Speaker 1: was overseeing a launch at White Sands when one of
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 1: the officers saw an object circling over the launch pad
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 1: And as Edward Beatty says, we saw the rocket rising
• 1:21:07
  Speaker 1: from the launch pad and the quarter inch disc was
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 1: pacing alongside the rocket going straight up. All of us
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 1: saw this. And I know we did not possess an
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 1: aircraft at that time that could fly straight up and
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 1: pace that rocket. I can't explain it. Ralph and Judy
• 1:21:24
  Speaker 1: Bloom looked into this activity and they heard from an
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 1: officer that there was graffiti written on the wall of
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 1: bathroom wall at White Sands, which said, and I quote,
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 1: I saw a disc up in the air, a silver
• 1:21:40
  Speaker 1: disc that wasn't there. Two more weren't there again today. Oh,
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 1: how I wish they'd go away. So this continues all
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 1: the way to modern times. I mean, on July 7th, 1997,
• 1:21:53
  Speaker 1: a gentleman was driving his car along White Sands Missile Range,
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 1: had just reached the curve at Launch Complex 32 when
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 1: he saw an orange ball of fire floating alongside the mountain.
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 1: And as it got closer, this object suddenly turned white,
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 1: turned directly towards him, and approached until it was less
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 1: than a block away. And then it began to descend,
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 1: came within 15 feet of the ground. He said it
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 1: was about the size of a VW Beetle, shaped like
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 1: a kind of a light bulb. It stopped in mid-air
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 1: and stayed still in one place. It was extremely bright.
• 1:22:33
  Speaker 1: And as he's watching it, it suddenly became extinguished. A
• 1:22:38
  Speaker 1: few moments later, it lit up again. He flashed his
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 1: headlights at it, and the object reacted by moving slowly away.
• 1:22:47
  Speaker 1: It joined two other identical-looking objects, and then all three
• 1:22:50
  Speaker 1: lights moved off and disappeared. So yeah, White Sands is
• 1:22:55
  Speaker 1: a UFO magnet. And the complex of events that have
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 1: happened there unrival any other Air Force Base except for
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 1: perhaps Edwards maybe or Area 51. It's definitely an area
• 1:23:11
  Speaker 1: that is known for high levels of UFO activity and
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 1: that's why I wanted to include it on this list.
• 1:23:18
  Speaker 1: And now we're at the top four and for case
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 1: number four I chose the Aztec UFO crash. This is
• 1:23:26
  Speaker 1: perhaps one of the most controversial UFO crashes It's been
• 1:23:30
  Speaker 1: summarily dismissed by many researchers as a hoax, unintentionally perpetrated
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 1: by UFO author Frank Scully, who was the first to
• 1:23:39
  Speaker 1: mention UFO crashes in his book, Inside the Flying Saucers. However,
• 1:23:44
  Speaker 1: today many researchers are taking the Aztec crash very seriously,
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 1: and that Scully was in fact the victim of a
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 1: debunking campaign. As Leonard Stringfield writes, some researchers have never
• 1:23:57
  Speaker 1: given up and believe that Scully was the victim of
• 1:24:00
  Speaker 1: official counteraction and that his smeared book was actually true.
• 1:24:06
  Speaker 1: Stringfield was, of course, a pioneer of UFO crash retrievals,
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 1: and he wrote that the backlash from the publication of
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 1: Scully's book actually slowed down the progress of research into
• 1:24:19
  Speaker 1: crash retrievals. As he says, at that time, active researchers,
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 1: including myself, did little more than scoff. We thought we
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 1: had good reason. Our collective scoffing was the result of
• 1:24:32
  Speaker 1: an alleged grand hoax. Here I refer to the book
• 1:24:35
  Speaker 1: Behind the Flying Saucers by Frank Scully. With the book's
• 1:24:41
  Speaker 1: subsequent exposure as a hoax, which got a lot of publicity,
• 1:24:45
  Speaker 1: it became unfashionable to write or talk about crashed UFOs
• 1:24:49
  Speaker 1: and their alleged fraud. little men. But now he's changed
• 1:24:54
  Speaker 1: his tune and he says, we now must take a
• 1:24:58
  Speaker 1: new and honest look at old rumors and we must
• 1:25:01
  Speaker 1: also take a new look at the possibility of a
• 1:25:03
  Speaker 1: grand official cover-up and why. Researcher Timothy Good is one
• 1:25:08
  Speaker 1: of many people who are taking a new look at
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 1: the Aztec crash and as Timothy Good writes, according to
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 1: a number of sources, the most important case involving the
• 1:25:18
  Speaker 1: recovery of an alien craft took place outside the little
• 1:25:22
  Speaker 1: town of Aztec, New Mexico, in 1948. A great deal
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 1: of technical and other intelligence resulted from this recovery, intelligence
• 1:25:32
  Speaker 1: which gave the Americans a giant leap forward in technology
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 1: and weaponry unparalleled in human history. Researcher Linda Moulton Howe
• 1:25:43
  Speaker 1: is also convinced, and she writes, I have interviewed some
• 1:25:46
  Speaker 1: of the people who are still alive who saw it
• 1:25:49
  Speaker 1: in March of 1949. Aztec is a very important piece
• 1:25:53
  Speaker 1: because of the technology received there. According to Mrs. Frank Scully,
• 1:25:59
  Speaker 1: she said that both she and her husband were visited
• 1:26:02
  Speaker 1: by Captain Edward Ruppelt, who said that Scully's book was
• 1:26:07
  Speaker 1: actually a huge pain in the ass for the Air Force.
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 1: And he said, and I quote, confidentially of all the
• 1:26:15
  Speaker 1: books that have been published about flying saucers, Your book
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 1: was the one that gave us the most headaches because
• 1:26:21
  Speaker 1: it was closest to the truth. So the Aztec crash
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 1: really began on March 8, 1950, when Silas Newton, an
• 1:26:30
  Speaker 1: alleged Texas oil millionaire, gave a public lecture at the
• 1:26:35
  Speaker 1: University of Denver talking about this UFO crash. He said
• 1:26:40
  Speaker 1: that his friend, quote, Dr. G, who was actually an
• 1:26:44
  Speaker 1: amalgam of several other scientists, were brought in to study
• 1:26:49
  Speaker 1: this UFO, this Aztec UFO, and its occupants. And Scully's
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 1: book was actually one of the first UFO books published
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 1: in the U.S., if not the first. And Scully claimed that, again, Dr.
• 1:27:05
  Speaker 1: G was not one person, but a combination of several scientists.
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 1: And they informed him that this craft had been found
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 1: outside of Aztec on February 13th. 1948. Some researchers say
• 1:27:21
  Speaker 1: March of 48 or even 49. There's some controversy about
• 1:27:26
  Speaker 1: the date. But again, this craft was almost completely intact
• 1:27:30
  Speaker 1: except for a small hole in one of the portholes.
• 1:27:34
  Speaker 1: It was exactly 99.99 feet in diameter. It was composed
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 1: of metal so light that only a few men could
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 1: lift the entire craft. They were not able to find
• 1:27:46
  Speaker 1: any way to enter the craft, and it took them
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 1: several days to open it, which was finally achieved by
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 1: sticking a stick through this tiny pencil-sized hole in one
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 1: of the portholes, which turned a latch and opened the door,
• 1:28:01
  Speaker 1: and inside they found some 16 small ETs, all dead, apparently,
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 1: from explosive decompression. They found hieroglyphic hieroglyphic type writings, small wafers,
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 1: which were apparently food. The craft was able to be
• 1:28:20
  Speaker 1: dismantled into separate parts and carted away for study. And
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 1: this was the story Frank Scully told. And this story
• 1:28:30
  Speaker 1: remained uninvestigated and debunked for years until really investigators started
• 1:28:39
  Speaker 1: to look into it, such as Leonard Stringfield and really
• 1:28:43
  Speaker 1: researcher William Steinman, who wrote the book UFO Crash at
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 1: Aztec and basically built a very convincing case that the
• 1:28:53
  Speaker 1: whole affair with Dr. Gebauer and Silas Newton and their
• 1:28:59
  Speaker 1: subsequent arrest as hoaxers was actually a debunking disinformation campaign.
• 1:29:06
  Speaker 1: And he was able to locate new witnesses to the
• 1:29:10
  Speaker 1: Aztec crash. More recently, Scott and Suzanne Ramsey have published
• 1:29:17
  Speaker 1: another book on the Aztec incident called The Aztec Incident.
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 1: And this case is now known seriously considered to be
• 1:29:26
  Speaker 1: an actual UFO crash retrieval event. It was supposedly, allegedly
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 1: reported in the Farmington Daily Times, but no one has
• 1:29:37
  Speaker 1: been able to locate this article. One witness is Bill Devlin,
• 1:29:44
  Speaker 1: who's come forward, and he befriended a soldier and got
• 1:29:49
  Speaker 1: to talking about UFOs, and the soldier revealed that he
• 1:29:51
  Speaker 1: had personally been involved in this crash incident, and said
• 1:29:56
  Speaker 1: that he was one of three drivers who delivered the
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 1: remains of this saucer from Aztec to Fort Riley. And
• 1:30:04
  Speaker 1: he confirmed that there were 16 bodies, all dressed alike
• 1:30:07
  Speaker 1: in tight jumpsuits. He said they had yellowish skin, human-like features,
• 1:30:12
  Speaker 1: and a light peach fuzz on their skin. Another witness
• 1:30:18
  Speaker 1: is Chuck Oldham, who said, knew a former military officer
• 1:30:24
  Speaker 1: with a very high security clearance and this officer said
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 1: he was on base when he stumbled upon a file
• 1:30:35
  Speaker 1: which described the Aztec case in detail and even included photographs.
• 1:30:40
  Speaker 1: He described one of the photos and I quote, there
• 1:30:44
  Speaker 1: was a perfect intact circular shaped craft and it was
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 1: lying somewhat tilted to one side on the ground in
• 1:30:51
  Speaker 1: the desert. There did not appear to be a crater
• 1:30:54
  Speaker 1: or ground disturbance that would indicate a crash, but I
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 1: couldn't tell for sure. The material of which the craft
• 1:30:59
  Speaker 1: was composed was metallic and resembled brushed aluminum. According to
• 1:31:05
  Speaker 1: Scott and Suzanne Ramsey, the first people actually to discover
• 1:31:08
  Speaker 1: this craft was a group of firemen, and shortly after,
• 1:31:13
  Speaker 1: the military arrived and escorted all civilians off the scene.
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 1: and opened the craft, dismantled it, and carted it away.
• 1:31:26
  Speaker 1: So this is a very strange event, and according to
• 1:31:31
  Speaker 1: the reports on it, it's made of an unknown metal
• 1:31:35
  Speaker 1: that was impervious to diamond drills, acetylene torches, and at
• 1:31:41
  Speaker 1: a very, very difficult time, as I mentioned earlier, gaining
• 1:31:47
  Speaker 1: entrance into this So, yeah, it's a controversial case, but
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 1: it certainly had an impact on the UFO field, and
• 1:31:55
  Speaker 1: that's why I included it here. And now we get
• 1:31:58
  Speaker 1: to the top three. And for case number three, I
• 1:32:03
  Speaker 1: chose the Farmington UFO display. This has got to be
• 1:32:08
  Speaker 1: one of the most unusual UFO incidents in recorded U.S.
• 1:32:11
  Speaker 3: History.
• 1:32:12
  Speaker 1: It occurred on March 17, 1950 over the small town
• 1:32:15
  Speaker 1: of Farmington. which then had a population of somewhere between 4,000
• 1:32:20
  Speaker 1: to 6,000 residents. And early on the morning of March 17th,
• 1:32:25
  Speaker 1: around 10 a.m., St. Patrick's Day, more than 1,000 witnesses
• 1:32:30
  Speaker 1: in Farmington observed an enormous group of hundreds of saucer-shaped
• 1:32:37
  Speaker 1: objects maneuvering above the town, performing fantastic loops, dives, turns, accelerations,
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 1: and decelerations, and other fantastic maneuvers. Panic ensued as the
• 1:32:50
  Speaker 1: population of the town poured out into the streets and
• 1:32:56
  Speaker 1: watched this display, which went on for two hours. It was,
• 1:32:59
  Speaker 1: in fact, photographed. The level of activity was described by
• 1:33:07
  Speaker 1: some of these as an invasion. Citizens throughout Farmington saw this.
• 1:33:13
  Speaker 1: Not only citizens, but several city officials, including the mayor,
• 1:33:17
  Speaker 1: members of the highway patrol, the local newspaper staff, pilots.
• 1:33:22
  Speaker 1: And of course, they reported to the local press. And
• 1:33:28
  Speaker 1: the Farmington Daily Times wrote an article about it, about
• 1:33:33
  Speaker 1: this huge saucer armada. And the story was quickly picked
• 1:33:38
  Speaker 1: up by other newspapers. the LA Times printed an article
• 1:33:43
  Speaker 1: and many other newspapers reported this and all these objects
• 1:33:48
  Speaker 1: were described as being sort of silvery objects some had
• 1:33:55
  Speaker 1: like a red hue or were silver in color and
• 1:34:02
  Speaker 1: one appeared to be very large and nobody could explain
• 1:34:06
  Speaker 1: what these were The editor of the Farmington Times was
• 1:34:12
  Speaker 1: Walt Rogel, and he said that at least 85% of
• 1:34:18
  Speaker 1: the town's population of 6,000 residents saw this object. The
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 1: Denver Post had a headline, New Mexico Town Shore Saucer
• 1:34:29
  Speaker 1: Mass Flight Seen, and gave the testimony of some 50
• 1:34:34
  Speaker 1: witnesses who had seen this. So this was a big,
• 1:34:39
  Speaker 1: big event. There was a lot of people looking into it.
• 1:34:45
  Speaker 1: According to Walt Rogel, these objects actually came back. There
• 1:34:49
  Speaker 1: was two incidents and came back over three days. And
• 1:34:57
  Speaker 1: as he says, on each of the three days, their
• 1:34:59
  Speaker 1: arrival was reported between 11 a.m. and noon, and fully
• 1:35:04
  Speaker 1: half of this town's population is certain today that it
• 1:35:08
  Speaker 1: saw spaceships or some strange aircraft, hundreds of them zooming
• 1:35:12
  Speaker 1: through the skies. Whatever they were, they caused a sensation
• 1:35:16
  Speaker 1: in this community, which lies only 110 air miles northwest
• 1:35:21
  Speaker 1: of the huge Los Alamos atomic installation. Some of these
• 1:35:26
  Speaker 1: objects were estimated at moving at about 1,000 miles per hour,
• 1:35:31
  Speaker 1: and some believe that their size was about twice that of.
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 3: A B-29 bomber.
• 1:35:38
  Speaker 8: The greatest exhibition of magnetic flight that has ever happened
• 1:35:45
  Speaker 8: in this universe, insofar as we know, came on the
• 1:35:50
  Speaker 8: second day of the memorable day at Farmington.
• 1:35:55
  Speaker 3: New Mexico, when there the sky was filled with flying saucers.
• 1:36:02
  Speaker 8: The editor of the local paper selected some dozen reliable
• 1:36:07
  Speaker 8: businessmen of that city, and on the second day, hoping
• 1:36:13
  Speaker 8: for the return of the.
• 1:36:15
  Speaker 3: Visitors of the previous day.
• 1:36:17
  Speaker 8: Were amazed when suddenly at 11 a.m. in the morning,
• 1:36:21
  Speaker 8: the sky was again filled with these strange, sickly visitors
• 1:36:28
  Speaker 8: from another world. These gentlemen, calm although excited, beyond anything
• 1:36:37
  Speaker 8: that had ever happened to them, undertook to estimate and
• 1:36:43
  Speaker 8: count the ships that swarmed the air for nearly an.
• 1:36:48
  Speaker 3: Hour that day. And they reported.
• 1:36:53
  Speaker 9: That, in their judgment.
• 1:36:57
  Speaker 8: There was between four and five hundred ships that had
• 1:37:03
  Speaker 8: flown into The vision of the people of that northern
• 1:37:10
  Speaker 8: New Mexico town from another planet.
• 1:37:16
  Speaker 3: From another world.
• 1:37:18
  Speaker 1: The Air Force was of course contacted and refused at
• 1:37:21
  Speaker 1: first to release any statement, but newspaper reporters started really
• 1:37:27
  Speaker 1: criticizing the Air Force's handling of the situation and basically
• 1:37:34
  Speaker 1: said that the Air Force was calling the population idiots
• 1:37:39
  Speaker 1: for believing that these were UFOs and that Air Force
• 1:37:42
  Speaker 1: were the ones who were idiots. So this was definitely
• 1:37:48
  Speaker 1: causing all kinds of controversy. There were some reports that
• 1:37:52
  Speaker 1: this weren't flying saucers at all, but some sort of
• 1:37:56
  Speaker 1: cotton or fluff that was flying over the town that
• 1:37:59
  Speaker 1: merely looked like UFOs. One witness, Orville Ricketts, who was
• 1:38:06
  Speaker 1: the editor of the Farmington Daily News, said it was
• 1:38:09
  Speaker 1: not cotton, fluff balls, or anything like it that day.
• 1:38:12
  Speaker 1: The wind was very still. And he collected the names
• 1:38:16
  Speaker 1: of at least 50 witnesses who observed these objects. And
• 1:38:23
  Speaker 1: the vast majority of them believed that these were some
• 1:38:26
  Speaker 1: sort of craft. And they were putting on some sort
• 1:38:31
  Speaker 1: of weird display as one Farmington resident John Bloomfield said
• 1:38:36
  Speaker 1: they appeared to be coming at each other head on
• 1:38:39
  Speaker 1: and at the last second one would appear at right
• 1:38:41
  Speaker 1: angles upward the other at right angles downward one vehicle
• 1:38:44
  Speaker 1: would pass another and immediately the one to the rear
• 1:38:47
  Speaker 1: would take the lead All I know is that I
• 1:38:50
  Speaker 1: saw something up there in the sky that I never
• 1:38:52
  Speaker 1: saw before. Another resident was Marlo Webb and is absolutely
• 1:38:59
  Speaker 1: convinced that these were strange craft. Another resident said he
• 1:39:04
  Speaker 1: watched the objects through a theodolite and measured their speed
• 1:39:08
  Speaker 1: at 1,000 miles per hour. Another resident was Captain Clayton J. Boddy.
• 1:39:17
  Speaker 1: And he watched this display with a group of five
• 1:39:20
  Speaker 1: businessmen and agreed that they saw more than 100 of
• 1:39:24
  Speaker 1: these silver-colored, disc-shaped objects. They contacted the Air Force, who
• 1:39:29
  Speaker 1: denied anything and said it didn't happen. And so many, many,
• 1:39:36
  Speaker 1: many people saw this. And they came for a short while,
• 1:39:42
  Speaker 1: maybe anywhere from 10 minutes to an hour, according to
• 1:39:46
  Speaker 1: different reports by witnesses. But many people saw this. Another
• 1:39:54
  Speaker 1: witness was Johnny Eaton. He said, I've never seen anything
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 1: like it in my life. And he was actually approached
• 1:40:02
  Speaker 1: the next day by military officials who interviewed him and
• 1:40:06
  Speaker 1: told him it was balloons. But there were at least
• 1:40:11
  Speaker 1: two waves of sightings. And after these sightings occurred, the
• 1:40:17
  Speaker 1: Air Force was contacted and asked for an explanation, and
• 1:40:20
  Speaker 1: their only explanation was, there's nothing to it. And later,
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 1: Major Edward Ruppelt also tried to debunk the sighting, say
• 1:40:33
  Speaker 1: that it was perhaps a skyhook balloon, which had shattered
• 1:40:37
  Speaker 1: into thousands of little pieces, which the witnesses don't agree with.
• 1:40:43
  Speaker 1: Whatever the explanation, this Farmington UFO display remains unparalleled in
• 1:40:49
  Speaker 1: UFO history, and it actually took place on what some
• 1:40:53
  Speaker 1: people believe is the one-year anniversary of the alleged UFO
• 1:40:57
  Speaker 1: crash at Aztec, and that perhaps the ETs were acknowledging
• 1:41:02
  Speaker 1: the date of the Aztec crash and were sort of
• 1:41:05
  Speaker 1: memorializing it. At any rate, it's a very well-known and
• 1:41:10
  Speaker 1: highly unusual incident. which everyone should know about, and that's
• 1:41:14
  Speaker 1: why I gave it the number three spot. And now
• 1:41:18
  Speaker 1: we get to the number two case, which I chose,
• 1:41:22
  Speaker 1: the Socorro UFO landing. This is one of the most famous,
• 1:41:27
  Speaker 1: well-verified UFO landings in all of UFO history. It occurred
• 1:41:32
  Speaker 1: outside of the small town of Socorro, New Mexico, on
• 1:41:36
  Speaker 1: April 24, 1964. Unknown to many, there was several sightings
• 1:41:43
  Speaker 1: immediately prior to this event. Around 5 p.m. before this landing,
• 1:41:50
  Speaker 1: two witnesses, Paul Keyes and Larry Kratzer, were about a
• 1:41:55
  Speaker 1: mile southwest of Socorro when they saw a strange object
• 1:42:00
  Speaker 1: hovering over the ground. It was shiny and reflective. And
• 1:42:10
  Speaker 1: One of the witnesses said it had a strange red
• 1:42:12
  Speaker 1: marking on the right side, and he wondered if it
• 1:42:15
  Speaker 1: was perhaps some sort of secret aircraft. And it was
• 1:42:19
  Speaker 1: just a short time later when another witness, Opal Grinder,
• 1:42:25
  Speaker 1: who was a gas station attendant at the Socorro gas station,
• 1:42:30
  Speaker 1: said that he was assisting a customer when the customer
• 1:42:34
  Speaker 1: explained that he had seen a strange egg-shaped craft fly
• 1:42:37
  Speaker 1: overhead as he was traveling northward on Highway 85, and
• 1:42:44
  Speaker 1: it disappeared behind a mesa, and he saw a speeding
• 1:42:48
  Speaker 1: police car race by, which is probably Lani Zamora. Because
• 1:42:55
  Speaker 1: at this exact time, Socorro police officer Lani Zamora was
• 1:42:59
  Speaker 1: in pursuit of a speeding motorist when he heard a
• 1:43:02
  Speaker 1: loud roaring sound, looked towards the source of the noise
• 1:43:06
  Speaker 1: and saw a bright flaming object land behind a small
• 1:43:11
  Speaker 1: hill near the location of a dynamite shack. He thought
• 1:43:15
  Speaker 1: at first the shack had exploded and he drove to
• 1:43:18
  Speaker 1: the top of the hill and to his shock, small
• 1:43:20
  Speaker 1: this shiny type object landed next to the road and
• 1:43:24
  Speaker 1: he saw two short figures standing next to it and
• 1:43:28
  Speaker 1: they appeared to be working on the object. He first
• 1:43:31
  Speaker 1: thought perhaps it was an auto accident and radioed headquarters
• 1:43:34
  Speaker 1: that there was, in fact, an auto accident. But as
• 1:43:38
  Speaker 1: he approached to within 100 feet, he realized that this
• 1:43:42
  Speaker 1: was no auto accident. As he says, it looked at
• 1:43:45
  Speaker 1: first like a car upside down. I thought some kids
• 1:43:49
  Speaker 1: might have turned it over. I saw two people in
• 1:43:51
  Speaker 1: white coveralls very close to the object. One of these
• 1:43:55
  Speaker 1: persons seemed to turn and look straight at my car
• 1:43:58
  Speaker 1: and seemed startled. seemed to quickly jump somewhat. At this
• 1:44:02
  Speaker 1: time I began moving my car towards them quickly with
• 1:44:06
  Speaker 1: the idea to help. The object was like aluminum, was
• 1:44:09
  Speaker 1: whitish against the mesa background, not chrome, seemed oval in shape,
• 1:44:15
  Speaker 1: and I at first glance took it to be an
• 1:44:17
  Speaker 1: overturned white car. The car appeared turned up, like standing
• 1:44:22
  Speaker 1: on the radiator or trunk at this first glance. The
• 1:44:26
  Speaker 1: only time I saw these two persons was when I
• 1:44:29
  Speaker 1: had stopped for possibly two seconds or so to glance
• 1:44:31
  Speaker 1: at this object. These persons appeared normal in shape, but
• 1:44:36
  Speaker 1: possibly they were small adults or large kids. So he
• 1:44:40
  Speaker 1: drove closer. He lost sight of the object behind a
• 1:44:43
  Speaker 1: hill for just a few seconds, but as he crested
• 1:44:46
  Speaker 1: the hill, the figures were no longer visible. The craft
• 1:44:50
  Speaker 1: was sitting on landing gear, and at this point he
• 1:44:52
  Speaker 1: heard loud thumping sounds followed by a loud roar. and
• 1:44:56
  Speaker 1: this craft rose upward emitting a blast of flame. He
• 1:45:01
  Speaker 1: jumped behind his car for protection and says that this
• 1:45:06
  Speaker 1: object rose upward, went right over the dynamite shack, the
• 1:45:11
  Speaker 1: flame became extinguished, a loud whining sound replaced the loud
• 1:45:16
  Speaker 1: roaring sound, and the craft flew away in a bobbing
• 1:45:19
  Speaker 1: motion at low altitude. And at this point he could
• 1:45:23
  Speaker 1: see this red-colored arrow-like symbol He says it was about
• 1:45:28
  Speaker 1: two feet wide on the side of this object, and
• 1:45:31
  Speaker 1: it was moments later that State Police Officer Sergeant Sam
• 1:45:35
  Speaker 1: Chavez arrived, and both he and Lonnie Zamora approached the
• 1:45:41
  Speaker 1: place where this object had landed and found landing traces,
• 1:45:44
  Speaker 1: four deep indentations on the earth and a burnt mesquite
• 1:45:48
  Speaker 1: bush and charred grass. Furthermore, the rock where the craft
• 1:45:53
  Speaker 1: had sat also appeared to be melted, and fused. And
• 1:45:59
  Speaker 1: according to Ann Druffle, William Moore, and other UFO researchers,
• 1:46:05
  Speaker 1: military personnel showed up within 45 minutes. And it turned
• 1:46:12
  Speaker 1: out that Lonnie Zamora knew Dr. Lincoln LaPaz and told
• 1:46:18
  Speaker 1: him about the sighting, so the Air Force showed up
• 1:46:21
  Speaker 1: as well. Jayon Hynek came to the scene. He measured
• 1:46:26
  Speaker 1: the landing marks. He was somewhat skeptical at this point
• 1:46:31
  Speaker 1: of UFOs, but after investigating this particular case, came away
• 1:46:37
  Speaker 1: absolutely baffled and said it was, quote, one of the
• 1:46:41
  Speaker 1: Air Force's major UFO sightings in the history of the
• 1:46:45
  Speaker 1: Air Force's consideration of this subject. This was not far
• 1:46:49
  Speaker 1: from the local Socorro Airport, and Hynek was surprised that
• 1:46:53
  Speaker 1: it did not appear on airport radar though Jim and
• 1:46:57
  Speaker 1: Coral Lorenzen found out later that the Socorro Airport radar
• 1:47:01
  Speaker 1: tower was not functioning at this time. And the Air
• 1:47:07
  Speaker 1: Force did show up. Captain Richard T. Holder was accompanied
• 1:47:12
  Speaker 1: actually by an FBI agent by the name of D.
• 1:47:15
  Speaker 1: Arthur Burns, and together they investigated it, but the FBI
• 1:47:22
  Speaker 1: agent insisted that they get no publicity. They interviewed Lonnie
• 1:47:27
  Speaker 1: Zamora firsthand, and Lonnie Zamora told him that he thought
• 1:47:32
  Speaker 1: it might be a secret government aircraft. And the Air
• 1:47:39
  Speaker 1: Force captain, Captain Richard T. Holder, wondered if Lonnie Zamora
• 1:47:44
  Speaker 1: was the victim of a hoax. But it's clear from
• 1:47:48
  Speaker 1: declassified documents on this case that FBI agent D. Arthur
• 1:47:55
  Speaker 1: Burns took this case very seriously. Researcher William Moore used
• 1:48:02
  Speaker 1: the Freedom of Information Act to obtain the written report
• 1:48:06
  Speaker 1: on this case. And the report says that Burns examined
• 1:48:10
  Speaker 1: these landing traces and that Zamora was, quote, well-regarded, industrious,
• 1:48:16
  Speaker 1: and conscientious, and not given to fantasy. So these landing
• 1:48:22
  Speaker 1: traces are among the best in UFO history. However, unknown
• 1:48:26
  Speaker 1: to many, these landing traces actually did include metal fragments.
• 1:48:30
  Speaker 1: This craft landed in a volcanic rock, and the holes
• 1:48:34
  Speaker 1: made by the craft's landing gear, there were metal streaks
• 1:48:38
  Speaker 1: left by the craft. Stanton Friedman and Dr. James McDonald
• 1:48:44
  Speaker 1: interviewed a scientist by the name of Mary Mays, who
• 1:48:48
  Speaker 1: was at that time at the New Mexico University studying
• 1:48:55
  Speaker 1: in radiation biology. And she says that she was approached
• 1:48:59
  Speaker 1: by the university to investigate the landing traces. She visited
• 1:49:04
  Speaker 1: the site, confirmed the melted sand and the burning vegetation.
• 1:49:08
  Speaker 1: She took samples which she studied in a lab and
• 1:49:11
  Speaker 1: found no evidence of organic substances. She found no evidence
• 1:49:19
  Speaker 1: of radiation. The plants were scorched, and there were also
• 1:49:22
  Speaker 1: two organic substances, which she was unable to identify. After
• 1:49:28
  Speaker 1: her investigation, she was ordered to turn in her report,
• 1:49:32
  Speaker 1: all her samples, and to, quote, keep quiet about the case. J.
• 1:49:37
  Speaker 1: Allen Hynek says, and I quote, the Socorro case was
• 1:49:40
  Speaker 1: basically a single witness sighting, although several other more distant
• 1:49:45
  Speaker 1: witnesses to the object were reported, but the witness was
• 1:49:49
  Speaker 1: a policeman whose character and record were unimpeachable. Physical traces
• 1:49:55
  Speaker 1: were left on the ground, and as I personally observed,
• 1:49:58
  Speaker 1: some of the greasewood bushes in the vicinity had been charged.
• 1:50:02
  Speaker 1: Even Major Quintanilla, then head of Project Blue Book, was
• 1:50:05
  Speaker 1: convinced that an actual physical craft had been present. Maybe
• 1:50:10
  Speaker 1: there is a simple explanation for the Socorro incident, but
• 1:50:13
  Speaker 1: having made a complete study of the events, I do
• 1:50:15
  Speaker 1: not think so. It is my opinion that a real
• 1:50:18
  Speaker 1: physical event occurred on the outskirts of Socorro that afternoon
• 1:50:23
  Speaker 1: of April 24, 1964. Later, Major Quintanilla tried to explain
• 1:50:30
  Speaker 1: away the incident as a test flight of a secret
• 1:50:32
  Speaker 1: lunar module. However, the Socorro incident became the only case
• 1:50:37
  Speaker 1: involving occupants that Blue Book officials labeled unidentified and became
• 1:50:44
  Speaker 1: Blue Book case number 8766. And at this time, there
• 1:50:50
  Speaker 1: were so many landings in the area that Jim and
• 1:50:53
  Speaker 1: Coral Lorenzen wondered if the ETs were on some kind
• 1:50:56
  Speaker 1: of agenda. As they write, the Socorro case had been
• 1:51:00
  Speaker 1: preceded by some unexplained and in some cases terrifying incidents
• 1:51:04
  Speaker 1: around the White Sands Proving Grounds, Holloman Air Force Base,
• 1:51:09
  Speaker 1: integrated range. We hypothesized that this was an intelligence operation
• 1:51:14
  Speaker 1: of some port. The military cases, the few that we
• 1:51:18
  Speaker 1: were able to obtain, were not naturally publicized. We conjectured
• 1:51:23
  Speaker 1: that if the objects were, as we thought, interplanetary, They
• 1:51:27
  Speaker 1: may have been attempting to find out if military organizations
• 1:51:30
  Speaker 1: tended to withhold information on cases taking place within the
• 1:51:34
  Speaker 1: confines of military installations.
• 1:51:41
  Speaker 7: This is Walter Schroed, your roving reporter at KSRC Radio.
• 1:51:46
  Speaker 9: In Socorro, New Mexico.
• 1:51:47
  Speaker 3: We have with us this afternoon Mr. Lonnie Zamora, the
• 1:51:51
  Speaker 3: Socorro patrolman that, while.
• 1:51:52
  Speaker 7: Chasing a car, found himself in an area about two
• 1:51:55
  Speaker 7: miles west of Socorro and one mile east of KSRC
• 1:51:59
  Speaker 7: radio station, at which time he reports he came upon
• 1:52:02
  Speaker 7: an unidentified object resting on four legs, that as he
• 1:52:06
  Speaker 7: drew closer, the object took off with a loud roar
• 1:52:09
  Speaker 7: scouting blue-red flame and.
• 1:52:11
  Speaker 3: Disappeared in the sky.
• 1:52:13
  Speaker 7: A great number of cars and Socorro people have gathered
• 1:52:15
  Speaker 7: here in front of the studios of KSRC to catch.
• 1:52:19
  Speaker 3: A glimpse of Mr. Zamora as he arrived and welcome
• 1:52:22
  Speaker 3: him with their car horn.
• 1:52:24
  Speaker 9: Mr.
• 1:52:24
  Speaker 3: Zamora?
• 1:52:25
  Speaker 7: After coming upon this object, just what did happen?
• 1:52:28
  Speaker 9: I went up that little road for about half a mile,
• 1:52:33
  Speaker 9: I guess.
• 1:52:34
  Speaker 10: I came up to this little parking deal there on
• 1:52:39
  Speaker 10: the side.
• 1:52:39
  Speaker 9: Of the road, and I, for a glance out the.
• 1:52:42
  Speaker 10: Window, looked to my left and seen this white object
• 1:52:49
  Speaker 10: on the ground.
• 1:52:49
  Speaker 9: So I thought it might be a car that had
• 1:52:54
  Speaker 9: Turned over.
• 1:52:55
  Speaker 10: So I was the real big Harry going out there
• 1:52:59
  Speaker 10: to investigate. Thought maybe somebody would be hurt. That time
• 1:53:04
  Speaker 10: I saw this white egg shaped looking object.
• 1:53:10
  Speaker 9: It looked something like an egg to me? Yeah, from
• 1:53:13
  Speaker 9: the distance I was it looked like an egg to me.
• 1:53:16
  Speaker 7: About the size of a car I think someone said.
• 1:53:19
  Speaker 10: Yes sir, it looked like a cart had turned over.
• 1:53:21
  Speaker 10: That's what I said, the size of a cart.
• 1:53:25
  Speaker 7: And did it have any kind of markings on it
• 1:53:27
  Speaker 7: of any kind that you noticed?
• 1:53:29
  Speaker 9: Yes, it did. Not from that far I.
• 1:53:35
  Speaker 3: Didn't see the markings.
• 1:53:36
  Speaker 9: When I went up closer to it, I did see
• 1:53:39
  Speaker 9: the markings.
• 1:53:40
  Speaker 7: And someone said that the markings that you saw was
• 1:53:44
  Speaker 7: an upside-down.
• 1:53:45
  Speaker 3: V with three lines running through it.
• 1:53:48
  Speaker 10: No, sir, I couldn't tell you that because they still...
• 1:53:52
  Speaker 10: We want you to say nothing about the markings.
• 1:53:53
  Speaker 7: They don't want you to say anything about the markings.
• 1:53:56
  Speaker 3: All right, we won't question you on that. And if
• 1:53:58
  Speaker 3: we run into an area that.
• 1:53:59
  Speaker 7: They don't want you to talk about, we can just
• 1:54:01
  Speaker 7: say so. And this happened about 5.30 Friday afternoon. It
• 1:54:06
  Speaker 7: happened about 5.50, about 10 minutes to 6. About 10
• 1:54:08
  Speaker 7: minutes to 6. And you did place a call in
• 1:54:13
  Speaker 7: to Sergeant Chavis of the state police to.
• 1:54:15
  Speaker 9: Come on out and help you with the investigation. As
• 1:54:17
  Speaker 9: soon as I saw this object, I didn't know what
• 1:54:20
  Speaker 9: it was.
• 1:54:22
  Speaker 10: I played the call to Arden Chavez from the state police.
• 1:54:26
  Speaker 9: Told him he would come out there and help me
• 1:54:28
  Speaker 9: on this. He said, yes, I'll be right there in
• 1:54:32
  Speaker 9: about a few minutes.
• 1:54:33
  Speaker 3: And he arrived just.
• 1:54:35
  Speaker 7: About two or three minutes after the object had taken
• 1:54:38
  Speaker 7: off and left.
• 1:54:40
  Speaker 9: Well, the object was still about.
• 1:54:44
  Speaker 3: a.
• 1:54:44
  Speaker 9: Couple of months up there when he arrived.
• 1:54:47
  Speaker 7: That's the direction it went, but that was over the
• 1:54:50
  Speaker 7: top of the mountain, and we've heard several reports that
• 1:54:53
  Speaker 7: it flew low, like it was dragging something, and.
• 1:54:57
  Speaker 9: We've heard some... It was very low to the ground.
• 1:55:00
  Speaker 10: At the time I was seeing it, it was very
• 1:55:02
  Speaker 10: low to the ground, up to the perlite.
• 1:55:05
  Speaker 9: Mill there, and then it started to gain altitude.
• 1:55:08
  Speaker 7: Now, also, it was reported to me that When you
• 1:55:11
  Speaker 7: first drove up into this area and sighted this object,
• 1:55:16
  Speaker 7: the motors were running and they were going, or some
• 1:55:20
  Speaker 7: such sound as that.
• 1:55:22
  Speaker 3: Is that correct?
• 1:55:24
  Speaker 10: I couldn't say because it happened so fast.
• 1:55:28
  Speaker 3: I started running, though. Well, I don't blame you. I
• 1:55:32
  Speaker 3: thought something had even scared me yet.
• 1:55:35
  Speaker 7: Now, you did say that you saw two what appeared
• 1:55:38
  Speaker 7: to be people dressed in white uniforms with.
• 1:55:40
  Speaker 3: Did they have helmets on, like spacemen or anything? No, sir.
• 1:55:43
  Speaker 10: I wouldn't say they were people. I just saw something white, white-colored.
• 1:55:49
  Speaker 10: That's what I could say.
• 1:55:50
  Speaker 7: Just like there was something in white color, all right.
• 1:55:53
  Speaker 7: But you couldn't identify them as actually being a human being.
• 1:55:56
  Speaker 3: In you and I are.
• 1:55:57
  Speaker 9: No, sir.
• 1:55:58
  Speaker 2: No, sir.
• 1:55:59
  Speaker 3: Uh, and, uh, but that is, you didn't know where
• 1:56:03
  Speaker 3: they turned and saw you or what then?
• 1:56:05
  Speaker 9: Well, uh, to my, I would say that this, this
• 1:56:12
  Speaker 9: white object turned and saw me.
• 1:56:15
  Speaker 3: Were there two of them?
• 1:56:16
  Speaker 9: I would say there were two because one was from
• 1:56:19
  Speaker 9: France and the other was from the United States.
• 1:56:21
  Speaker 7: Did you have a chance to, to notice what kind
• 1:56:25
  Speaker 7: of a doorway they had to this, uh, This object.
• 1:56:28
  Speaker 3: Was flying out.
• 1:56:29
  Speaker 9: Didn't notice any doors, no.
• 1:56:32
  Speaker 7: And when it took off, it made a loud.
• 1:56:38
  Speaker 3: Loud roaring sound. Is that right?
• 1:56:41
  Speaker 9: Yes, sir.
• 1:56:42
  Speaker 3: It did.
• 1:56:43
  Speaker 9: Very loud noise, roar sound.
• 1:56:46
  Speaker 7: And then after it got up in the air about
• 1:56:47
  Speaker 7: 20 feet, well, the sound seemed to disappear?
• 1:56:50
  Speaker 9: The sound was disappeared.
• 1:56:52
  Speaker 7: It was very, very quiet. You could hear a pin
• 1:56:54
  Speaker 7: drop there. And now the markings that are left on
• 1:56:59
  Speaker 7: the ground, now the reports that I have.
• 1:57:01
  Speaker 3: Had, and I haven't had a chance to go and
• 1:57:03
  Speaker 3: take a look in the winds.
• 1:57:04
  Speaker 7: Yet, to probably spoil a lot of that anyway, was
• 1:57:07
  Speaker 7: that there were deep indentations in the ground, approximately 10
• 1:57:12
  Speaker 7: inches wide and 6 to 8 inches deep, about 15
• 1:57:16
  Speaker 7: feet apart. Is that a correct report?
• 1:57:20
  Speaker 9: Well, I would say it was about 19 feet.
• 1:57:23
  Speaker 2: Apart, approximately.
• 1:57:26
  Speaker 3: Of the prints. Uh-huh. And were there any other prints like.
• 1:57:30
  Speaker 7: Footprints around the area right after the takeoff.
• 1:57:34
  Speaker 3: Or when you were making the investigation?
• 1:57:36
  Speaker 10: There were some prints, but I wouldn't know if they
• 1:57:39
  Speaker 10: were footprints or anything, just prints, I would say.
• 1:57:44
  Speaker 7: You couldn't identify them as actually being a footprint? In
• 1:57:46
  Speaker 7: cases like maybe somebody might have walked there or something.
• 1:57:50
  Speaker 9: Might have walked there?
• 1:57:51
  Speaker 10: Somebody walked around there because there was When I got there,
• 1:57:54
  Speaker 10: there was nobody around there yet.
• 1:57:57
  Speaker 3: Now, there was, according to a report on one of
• 1:58:00
  Speaker 3: the news.
• 1:58:01
  Speaker 7: The television stations in Albuquerque claimed that they had a
• 1:58:04
  Speaker 7: call just about 5.30 in Albuquerque of a signing of
• 1:58:10
  Speaker 7: of a flying object flying in this direction.
• 1:58:12
  Speaker 3: Did you hear anything about that?
• 1:58:14
  Speaker 7: Which, if that'd be true, means that someone in Albuquerque
• 1:58:19
  Speaker 7: saw this object flying in this direction just prior to
• 1:58:21
  Speaker 7: your sighting it, which collaborates the fact that there was
• 1:58:27
  Speaker 7: something here. Now, it's the feeling, I get the feeling,
• 1:58:30
  Speaker 7: at least Lonnie, as with the people that I've talked
• 1:58:32
  Speaker 7: to when they were out in the area, that they
• 1:58:35
  Speaker 7: are quite sure that something landed there and something took
• 1:58:38
  Speaker 7: off from this spot because of not only.
• 1:58:40
  Speaker 9: The imprints that it left in the ground, but the.
• 1:58:43
  Speaker 7: Fires that it started and the method of which the
• 1:58:48
  Speaker 7: fire or the power, whatever it was using, kind of
• 1:58:51
  Speaker 7: spread itself as it took off.
• 1:58:53
  Speaker 3: Is that right? Right.
• 1:58:55
  Speaker 9: No, that was something not there because I see this.
• 1:58:59
  Speaker 3: And what.
• 1:59:01
  Speaker 7: Was your immediate reaction as soon as you realized that
• 1:59:04
  Speaker 7: this thing might be an object from outer space? Well,
• 1:59:08
  Speaker 7: I didn't think it would be an object from outer
• 1:59:11
  Speaker 7: space because I don't believe in things like that in
• 1:59:16
  Speaker 7: outer space. Well, it was something that you'd never seen before.
• 1:59:21
  Speaker 7: It was enough to scare you to run in the
• 1:59:23
  Speaker 7: other direction.
• 1:59:24
  Speaker 10: Well, what scared me was the loud noise and the
• 1:59:27
  Speaker 10: flame that it had under it.
• 1:59:30
  Speaker 3: It had a large flame as it took off. Was
• 1:59:33
  Speaker 3: it a yellow flame?
• 1:59:34
  Speaker 9: It was a blueish-orange flame. I thought this object was
• 1:59:39
  Speaker 9: going to blow up, so I started running back.
• 1:59:42
  Speaker 7: And did you notice whether these arms that it was
• 1:59:45
  Speaker 7: sitting on retracted back into the object as it flew.
• 1:59:49
  Speaker 9: Away or not?
• 1:59:50
  Speaker 3: In that time.
• 1:59:53
  Speaker 7: If I'd just run in the other drag line at
• 1:59:54
  Speaker 7: that time, I would have done too. Are there any
• 1:59:57
  Speaker 7: other things about this fighting that you think our listening
• 2:00:01
  Speaker 7: audience might be.
• 2:00:02
  Speaker 3: Interested in or something that you'd be allowed to tell us? No,
• 2:00:06
  Speaker 3: there's so much thought.
• 2:00:09
  Speaker 7: Uh-huh.
• 2:00:09
  Speaker 1: And, uh.
• 2:00:11
  Speaker 3: Did it disappear into the high sky after it got
• 2:00:14
  Speaker 3: all the way around the Perlite? Or did it just disappear?
• 2:00:18
  Speaker 10: It flew low to the Perlite mine. Then from there on,
• 2:00:22
  Speaker 10: it just so fast that you could barely breathe.
• 2:00:26
  Speaker 3: It happened to.
• 2:00:27
  Speaker 10: Be paying attention to what you were looking at to
• 2:00:30
  Speaker 10: see what it was doing.
• 2:00:32
  Speaker 2: Uh-huh.
• 2:00:33
  Speaker 3: Well, do you think we're going to get any more
• 2:00:36
  Speaker 3: of them around here? Oh, no.
• 2:00:38
  Speaker 7: Not immediately, but Well, it was quite an interesting experience,
• 2:00:42
  Speaker 7: I'm sure, and it has caused an awful lot of comment.
• 2:00:48
  Speaker 3: Did the investigators that were called in make any comments
• 2:00:52
  Speaker 3: at all in one.
• 2:00:53
  Speaker 7: Direction or the other, with the exception that they do
• 2:00:57
  Speaker 7: not have any such objects in this area?
• 2:01:00
  Speaker 9: Oh, they're still puzzled themselves, yes.
• 2:01:03
  Speaker 3: And there's been no report on the samplings they took
• 2:01:06
  Speaker 3: of the.
• 2:01:07
  Speaker 7: area around there from the burning brush and the area
• 2:01:10
  Speaker 7: that the.
• 2:01:11
  Speaker 3: Blast hit the ground. But if I give them a
• 2:01:13
  Speaker 3: clue as to what kind of power was.
• 2:01:15
  Speaker 9: Being used on this... No, sir, no. Uh-huh.
• 2:01:19
  Speaker 7: Well, uh, I think I just about covered it here. Uh,
• 2:01:22
  Speaker 7: let's see, uh, it wasn't dragging anything. We had a
• 2:01:26
  Speaker 7: report that, uh, it was dragging something.
• 2:01:29
  Speaker 3: As it ran.
• 2:01:29
  Speaker 10: No, I wouldn't say it was dragging nothing.
• 2:01:31
  Speaker 3: Just blowing from the ground.
• 2:01:34
  Speaker 7: And, uh, You can't think of anything else, then, about
• 2:01:38
  Speaker 7: the sighting of this flying object that our visiting audience might.
• 2:01:42
  Speaker 3: Be interested in.
• 2:01:43
  Speaker 9: No, not at all. Say no.
• 2:01:47
  Speaker 3: Well, Lonnie, I'm sure you've been getting.
• 2:01:49
  Speaker 7: An awful lot of questions and a lot of inquiry,
• 2:01:51
  Speaker 7: and I imagine you're beginning to get a little tired
• 2:01:53
  Speaker 7: of it, actually, for so many people calling and asking
• 2:01:55
  Speaker 7: you about it. Maybe this will be one way to
• 2:01:58
  Speaker 7: keep too many people from, I mean, you have to
• 2:02:00
  Speaker 7: go through the story over and over again.
• 2:02:02
  Speaker 3: Well, it's been a real pleasure talking to you, Mr.
• 2:02:04
  Speaker 3: Lonnie DeMoine. This is the gentleman, the support patrolman.
• 2:02:09
  Speaker 7: That Friday at around 10 minutes to 6, come up
• 2:02:13
  Speaker 7: on an object, a flying object, an unidentified flying object,
• 2:02:17
  Speaker 7: as the government prefers to call them.
• 2:02:20
  Speaker 10: Excuse me, Walter. I've got some military people at the service.
• 2:02:25
  Speaker 10: I was going to talk to me now.
• 2:02:27
  Speaker 9: Maybe they're from the UFOs.
• 2:02:30
  Speaker 3: What you have is the military.
• 2:02:31
  Speaker 7: People that are here from UFO to talk to you
• 2:02:33
  Speaker 7: right now and to ask you some.
• 2:02:34
  Speaker 3: More questions about this. And they have not in any
• 2:02:37
  Speaker 3: way tried to indicate that they.
• 2:02:39
  Speaker 9: Didn't want us to cover this type of maneuver. Well, sir,
• 2:02:43
  Speaker 9: I just don't know if I'm going to come here
• 2:02:45
  Speaker 9: and talk to you on the regular basis.
• 2:02:47
  Speaker 3: Well, that's fine. And we would be interested in knowing.
• 2:02:51
  Speaker 7: What they think about it, if they will allow it.
• 2:02:55
  Speaker 3: And after you get through talking to them, if you
• 2:02:57
  Speaker 3: would call us back here at the SRC. and to
• 2:03:00
  Speaker 3: give us some of the information that they might.
• 2:03:01
  Speaker 7: Allow you to let us broadcast.
• 2:03:05
  Speaker 2: All right.
• 2:03:06
  Speaker 3: And, Mr.
• 2:03:07
  Speaker 7: Zamora, I hope that you don't come upon any more
• 2:03:10
  Speaker 7: of these objects, unless we find out exactly.
• 2:03:15
  Speaker 3: What they are.
• 2:03:16
  Speaker 9: So it's been a pleasure, Mr.
• 2:03:17
  Speaker 3: Zamora, having you in our studios, and we want to
• 2:03:20
  Speaker 3: thank you, and I know our listeners thank.
• 2:03:22
  Speaker 7: You, and this is expressed by the great number of.
• 2:03:25
  Speaker 3: Cars that are out here in front of our studios
• 2:03:27
  Speaker 3: just to get a glimpse of uh.
• 2:03:30
  Speaker 9: uh.
• 2:03:54
  Speaker 1: Zamora was overwhelmed with interviews, and many people tried to
• 2:03:59
  Speaker 1: interview them. By 2003, he was still being contacted, but
• 2:04:03
  Speaker 1: declined to being interviewed anymore, saying simply, I just don't
• 2:04:08
  Speaker 1: talk about it anymore. But there are still other witnesses
• 2:04:12
  Speaker 1: coming forth. Recently, Sally Hagler, a Socorro Chamber of Commerce volunteer,
• 2:04:19
  Speaker 1: told researchers that that she saw the same object between
• 2:04:23
  Speaker 1: her home on Lopez Road and the M Mountain. And
• 2:04:26
  Speaker 1: according to her, she was interviewed by J. Allen Hynek,
• 2:04:30
  Speaker 1: who told her that about, quote, 400 other witnesses had
• 2:04:36
  Speaker 1: also seen the same phenomena along the mountain. So yeah,
• 2:04:41
  Speaker 1: this is an amazing case and probably the single best
• 2:04:45
  Speaker 1: verified case of a UFO landing in history. And that's
• 2:04:51
  Speaker 1: why I gave it the number two spot. And now
• 2:04:55
  Speaker 1: we get to the number one case, which I'm sure
• 2:04:58
  Speaker 1: you can already guess what it is. And that would
• 2:05:01
  Speaker 1: be the Roswell UFO crash. Of all the UFO crashes
• 2:05:07
  Speaker 1: in history, this is the best verified. It's probably the
• 2:05:11
  Speaker 1: single most famous UFO incident of all times. And several
• 2:05:16
  Speaker 1: hundred testimonies now support that something very strange crashed here
• 2:05:21
  Speaker 1: in Roswell in 1947. And the first person to actually
• 2:05:28
  Speaker 1: investigate this was researcher Stanton Friedman, who interviewed one of
• 2:05:34
  Speaker 1: the witnesses, an intelligence officer by the name of Jesse Marcel,
• 2:05:38
  Speaker 1: who was stationed at Roswell in 1947 and was a
• 2:05:42
  Speaker 1: first-hand witness. And after receiving Marcel's report, Stanton Friedman sought
• 2:05:49
  Speaker 1: out other witnesses He contacted other researchers to assist in
• 2:05:53
  Speaker 1: the investigation. In the first book on the case, The
• 2:05:57
  Speaker 1: Roswell Incident was written by William Moore and Charles Burlist,
• 2:06:03
  Speaker 1: based largely on Stanton Friedman's research. This opened the floodgates,
• 2:06:10
  Speaker 1: and since then there have been well over 50 5-0
• 2:06:15
  Speaker 1: books published on this case. Many other researchers converged to
• 2:06:20
  Speaker 1: investigate it, researchers such as Captain Kevin Randall, Don Schmidt,
• 2:06:28
  Speaker 1: Tom Carey, and many, many others. And before long, hundreds
• 2:06:36
  Speaker 1: of additional witnesses were located covering virtually every aspect of
• 2:06:41
  Speaker 1: this incident. Researchers have interviewed everybody who was involved, from
• 2:06:46
  Speaker 1: the radar operators who first saw the craft on radar
• 2:06:50
  Speaker 1: the rancher who discovered the wreckage, people who actually saw
• 2:06:54
  Speaker 1: this object coming down, officers who were called to the scene,
• 2:06:58
  Speaker 1: the soldiers who guarded it, the pilots who flew the wreckage,
• 2:07:03
  Speaker 1: the people who examined the bodies, the scientists who attempted
• 2:07:06
  Speaker 1: to study the craft, and so on. And today this
• 2:07:09
  Speaker 1: craft has been so thoroughly researched that it has become
• 2:07:15
  Speaker 1: the granddaddy of all UFO cases. Even the Air Force
• 2:07:21
  Speaker 1: wrote a book on it, and in their book, they
• 2:07:24
  Speaker 1: dismissed this incident and called it the Secret Mogul Weather Balloon,
• 2:07:30
  Speaker 1: which they said had dummies attached to it. This is
• 2:07:35
  Speaker 1: a theory that pretty much all researchers have dismissed as
• 2:07:39
  Speaker 1: absurd and inadequate. The Air Force was not using dummies
• 2:07:43
  Speaker 1: at this time. It's an absolutely absurd explanation. But what
• 2:07:48
  Speaker 1: makes this crash different from every other crash retrieval is
• 2:07:52
  Speaker 1: that researchers have been able to record the details of
• 2:07:55
  Speaker 1: this event from start to finish. Most UFO crash retrievals
• 2:08:00
  Speaker 1: cases rely on a small handful of witnesses or even
• 2:08:03
  Speaker 1: one witness, but no, this case involves hundreds and we
• 2:08:08
  Speaker 1: now have a fairly complete picture of what happened on
• 2:08:12
  Speaker 1: that fateful evening in the first week of July 1947.
• 2:08:18
  Speaker 1: The exact date of the crash is a matter of
• 2:08:21
  Speaker 1: some controversy. Some say July 2nd, some say July 4th,
• 2:08:25
  Speaker 1: some say July 7th. It was clearly in the first
• 2:08:28
  Speaker 1: week of July. At any rate, on the evening of
• 2:08:32
  Speaker 1: this alleged crash, there was a severe lightning storm over
• 2:08:35
  Speaker 1: Roswell and a large metallic craft, apparently disc-shaped, was piloted
• 2:08:42
  Speaker 1: by four short humanoid beings This craft somehow became disabled.
• 2:08:47
  Speaker 1: Whether it was struck by lightning or if radar interfered
• 2:08:51
  Speaker 1: with it is unknown for sure. But this craft was
• 2:08:56
  Speaker 1: unable to remain aloft. It fell downward and crashed onto
• 2:08:59
  Speaker 1: the ground in a ranch north of Roswell, created a
• 2:09:03
  Speaker 1: long gouge in the earth, took off again, traveled a
• 2:09:08
  Speaker 1: few miles, and landed on the neighboring sheep ranch owned
• 2:09:12
  Speaker 1: by Mack Brazel. After a few moments, it took off again,
• 2:09:16
  Speaker 1: leaving an area of ground burned and fused by high temperatures,
• 2:09:21
  Speaker 1: traveled a short distance when it malfunctioned again, crashed to
• 2:09:25
  Speaker 1: the ground violently, exploding and disintegrating what appears to be
• 2:09:29
  Speaker 1: the outer shell of the craft. It bounced several times,
• 2:09:34
  Speaker 1: digging a shallow gouge into the earth and showering considerable
• 2:09:38
  Speaker 1: debris along a quarter mile. Brazel heard this explosion and
• 2:09:43
  Speaker 1: decided he was going to check it the next morning.
• 2:09:46
  Speaker 1: The craft apparently took off again, flew over the nearby
• 2:09:49
  Speaker 1: Capitan Mountains. Another rancher says he actually watched it crash
• 2:09:54
  Speaker 1: down on the hilltop, sheared off the tops of the
• 2:09:57
  Speaker 1: trees and scattering more debris before taking off again. And
• 2:10:01
  Speaker 1: other witnesses said they watched it fly over the mountains
• 2:10:05
  Speaker 1: and that it was reportedly being accompanied by two other craft.
• 2:10:08
  Speaker 1: By this time it had apparently lost all control and
• 2:10:11
  Speaker 1: appeared to be on fire. It lost altitude as it
• 2:10:14
  Speaker 1: crossed over the mountains and impacted onto the desert floor.
• 2:10:20
  Speaker 1: Two witnesses were William Woody and his father who were
• 2:10:23
  Speaker 1: driving through Roswell when they saw this object fly overhead
• 2:10:26
  Speaker 1: and crash into the distance. They tried to drive to
• 2:10:30
  Speaker 1: it but were turned away by a military cordon blocking
• 2:10:33
  Speaker 1: the road, a roadblock. And it was at this time
• 2:10:37
  Speaker 1: that the group of archaeologists or geologists apparently saw this
• 2:10:44
  Speaker 1: crash and thought it was an aircraft accident. And when
• 2:10:48
  Speaker 1: daylight arrived, they hiked to the location and saw that
• 2:10:52
  Speaker 1: this was in fact a UFO. Also, another couple of
• 2:10:58
  Speaker 1: witnesses who allegedly saw this were Jim Ragsdale and his girlfriend,
• 2:11:02
  Speaker 1: Trudy Truelove, who were camping in the area when they
• 2:11:06
  Speaker 1: came upon this object on the desert floor and they
• 2:11:11
  Speaker 1: also assumed it was a normal aircraft until the military
• 2:11:13
  Speaker 1: showed up. Sheriff George Wilcox received a call about an
• 2:11:18
  Speaker 1: aircraft accident at his station so he phoned Dan Dwyer
• 2:11:22
  Speaker 1: at the local fire department and informed him of the
• 2:11:25
  Speaker 1: location and Dan Dwyer drove off to locate it. Meanwhile
• 2:11:30
  Speaker 1: radar operators at Roswell had been tracking this object and
• 2:11:35
  Speaker 1: watched as it disappeared off the screen. One of them
• 2:11:38
  Speaker 1: was Steve McKenzie, and he was part of a small
• 2:11:42
  Speaker 1: group of officers who were dispatched to locate the craft.
• 2:11:46
  Speaker 1: Supposedly the archaeologists arrived first. One witness who also claimed
• 2:11:54
  Speaker 1: that he was there is a prospector by the name
• 2:11:56
  Speaker 1: of Barney Barnett. He's a controversial witness, but Stanton Friedman
• 2:12:02
  Speaker 1: was convinced of his authenticity. Jim Ragsdale and Trudy Truelove
• 2:12:07
  Speaker 1: were hiking to the location and they saw the military arrive,
• 2:12:12
  Speaker 1: so they retreated and watched this whole retrieval from a
• 2:12:17
  Speaker 1: hidden vantage. And the Roswell officers first on the scene
• 2:12:23
  Speaker 1: acted quickly. All non-military personnel were ushered off the scene
• 2:12:29
  Speaker 1: and ordered to remain silent. A perimeter was set up,
• 2:12:33
  Speaker 1: roadblocks were put up, MPs were placed around and made
• 2:12:37
  Speaker 1: to stand guard. Others were ordered to start picking up
• 2:12:42
  Speaker 1: loose debris. Fireman Dan Dwyer arrived around this time, and
• 2:12:48
  Speaker 1: somehow he got past the perimeter, but it wasn't long
• 2:12:53
  Speaker 1: before he was also ushered away, but not before he
• 2:12:56
  Speaker 1: saw the craft and the bodies. And meanwhile, photographic experts
• 2:13:00
  Speaker 1: were being brought in. Everything was photographed. The craft and
• 2:13:04
  Speaker 1: the bodies were taken and recovered and taken back to
• 2:13:08
  Speaker 1: the base, and the entire area was completely cleaned of
• 2:13:12
  Speaker 1: any debris. And it was apparently around this time that
• 2:13:16
  Speaker 1: the local mortician, who we now know as Glenn Dennis,
• 2:13:20
  Speaker 1: received a call from the base asking how to preserve bodies,
• 2:13:25
  Speaker 1: and he drove out to the base to see if
• 2:13:26
  Speaker 1: he could help. Meanwhile, rancher Mac Brazel woke the next
• 2:13:32
  Speaker 1: morning and was exploring his property when he came upon
• 2:13:35
  Speaker 1: the now famous Roswell debris field. And he said it
• 2:13:40
  Speaker 1: was covering a large portion of his land. And he
• 2:13:45
  Speaker 1: was pretty upset about it because it was going to
• 2:13:47
  Speaker 1: take him a long time to clean up. He said
• 2:13:50
  Speaker 1: the debris consisted of three main types, a thin foil
• 2:13:54
  Speaker 1: type material, apparently metallic, but it could not be torn
• 2:13:58
  Speaker 1: or burned. And it always resumed its original shape. The
• 2:14:04
  Speaker 1: second type of debris was what we now know as
• 2:14:07
  Speaker 1: the I-beams, which were very light, like balsa wood, but
• 2:14:11
  Speaker 1: had pastel purple hieroglyphic-like symbols on them and could not
• 2:14:18
  Speaker 1: be broken, burned, or dented. And also among the debris
• 2:14:22
  Speaker 1: was strange wire-like filaments, like fiber optics. So he realized
• 2:14:29
  Speaker 1: this was very unusual. He's seen weather balloons before. This
• 2:14:33
  Speaker 1: was nothing like that. And he brought it to his neighbors,
• 2:14:37
  Speaker 1: the proctors, and they talked about the possibility that this
• 2:14:41
  Speaker 1: was from a flying saucer because many of them had
• 2:14:44
  Speaker 1: been seen in the area recently. And Mack Brazel tried
• 2:14:52
  Speaker 1: to get them to go to the debris field, but
• 2:14:54
  Speaker 1: they declined. Meanwhile, another rancher, Mack Brazel's neighbor, went into
• 2:15:02
  Speaker 1: his field and found a huge gouge in a flattened area,
• 2:15:06
  Speaker 1: and he didn't think much of it, not knowing about
• 2:15:09
  Speaker 1: all the events that were taking place around him. By
• 2:15:12
  Speaker 1: this time, the bodies had been taken to the base,
• 2:15:15
  Speaker 1: along with the craft and mortician Glenn Dennis. He was
• 2:15:19
  Speaker 1: able to gain access to the base hospital and spoke
• 2:15:23
  Speaker 1: with a nurse, a who was shocked to see him
• 2:15:27
  Speaker 1: there and told him to leave and that he was
• 2:15:29
  Speaker 1: in danger. And at this point, military police intercepted him
• 2:15:34
  Speaker 1: and threatened him with death if he revealed anything that
• 2:15:38
  Speaker 1: he had seen. So it was the next morning, July 6th, allegedly,
• 2:15:44
  Speaker 1: that Mack Brazel collected some of the debris and drove
• 2:15:47
  Speaker 1: it over to the local Roswell Sheriff's Station, which was
• 2:15:51
  Speaker 1: about 75 miles away. Sheriff George Wilcox was impressed there
• 2:15:55
  Speaker 1: by this debris and called the base. And this was
• 2:15:58
  Speaker 1: when intelligence officer Major Jesse Marcel was sent to investigate.
• 2:16:05
  Speaker 1: And at the same time, Sheriff Wilcox sent two deputies
• 2:16:09
  Speaker 1: to the ranch to view the wreckage. They couldn't find it.
• 2:16:13
  Speaker 1: This is a pretty large area. But they did come
• 2:16:16
  Speaker 1: upon a circular area on the ranch where it appeared
• 2:16:20
  Speaker 1: that the sand itself had been melted because of extremely
• 2:16:23
  Speaker 1: high temperatures. So around this time, the local radio station
• 2:16:30
  Speaker 1: called and reporter Frank Joyce interviewed Mack Brazel over the telephone.
• 2:16:36
  Speaker 1: Brazel told all about this debris field. Major Marcel arrived
• 2:16:41
  Speaker 1: at the police station and was impressed by what Mack
• 2:16:46
  Speaker 1: Brazel had found, took some of the wreckage back to
• 2:16:49
  Speaker 1: the base and showed it to his superior, Colonel Blanchard,
• 2:16:53
  Speaker 1: who was also impressed and ordered Marcel and a counterintelligence agent,
• 2:16:59
  Speaker 1: Sheridan Cavett, to go investigate. So it was quickly clear
• 2:17:03
  Speaker 1: to them that this was not a conventional aircraft or
• 2:17:06
  Speaker 1: any weather balloon. They collected as much material as they
• 2:17:10
  Speaker 1: could from the debris field and returned back to the base.
• 2:17:15
  Speaker 1: Marcel stopped quickly at his home, showed his wife and
• 2:17:19
  Speaker 1: his son, Jesse Marcel Jr., the debris, which had not
• 2:17:24
  Speaker 1: yet been classified or identified, so technically he wasn't breaking
• 2:17:28
  Speaker 1: any rules, and he told his son that he thought
• 2:17:32
  Speaker 1: this was from a flying saucer. And the next morning,
• 2:17:36
  Speaker 1: July 8th, Colonel Blanchard examined the wreckage and held a
• 2:17:40
  Speaker 1: meeting among officers. He ordered the ranch, Mack Brazel's ranch,
• 2:17:44
  Speaker 1: to be cordoned off, the roads blockaded, and once he
• 2:17:48
  Speaker 1: got to the actual ranch in site he got a
• 2:17:51
  Speaker 1: group of MPs to guard it facing outwards and like
• 2:17:56
  Speaker 1: the other crash site other officers came in and began
• 2:18:01
  Speaker 1: to gather the debris and earlier that day Colonel Blanchard
• 2:18:10
  Speaker 1: had actually ordered the base's public information officer, Walter Hout,
• 2:18:16
  Speaker 1: to issue the now famous Roswell press release, telling the
• 2:18:19
  Speaker 1: entire world that the army had done the unbelievable, recovered
• 2:18:23
  Speaker 1: an actual flying saucer. And this press release we now
• 2:18:27
  Speaker 1: know is world famous. It was subsequently retracted the next day.
• 2:18:33
  Speaker 7: Too bad.
• 2:18:34
  Speaker 1: It would be a very different world. But By this point,
• 2:18:38
  Speaker 1: Walter Hout contacted the local radio station, gave them the
• 2:18:42
  Speaker 1: press release. It appeared in the Roswell Daily Record, and
• 2:18:46
  Speaker 1: it went off like an atom bomb, generating interest from
• 2:18:49
  Speaker 1: across the world. Meanwhile, Mac Brazel was taking refuge in
• 2:18:55
  Speaker 1: the house of Walt Whitmore, who was a reporter for
• 2:18:58
  Speaker 1: KGFL in Roswell. And Walt Whitmore interviewed Brazel and was
• 2:19:04
  Speaker 1: going to air the interview. Unfortunately, before he had the
• 2:19:08
  Speaker 1: opportunity to do so, he was contacted by government officials
• 2:19:11
  Speaker 1: who told him that he was not to broadcast the interview. However,
• 2:19:16
  Speaker 1: some radio shows were talking about it because, according to
• 2:19:21
  Speaker 1: a report by a British officer, Major Huey Green, he
• 2:19:25
  Speaker 1: was driving through New Mexico at this time and was
• 2:19:28
  Speaker 1: shocked to hear several radio stations talking about this crash
• 2:19:32
  Speaker 1: of a flying saucer, and all of the stations were
• 2:19:34
  Speaker 1: buzzing about it, and details of the story were developing
• 2:19:38
  Speaker 1: as he drove along the highway. So after leaving Walt
• 2:19:42
  Speaker 1: Whitmer's house, Mack Brazel reported to the base where he
• 2:19:45
  Speaker 1: was held incommunicado for at least three days where he
• 2:19:50
  Speaker 1: was questioned by Air Force officers and told not to
• 2:19:54
  Speaker 1: go public with the story. Whitmer was contacted and told
• 2:20:01
  Speaker 1: not to air the interview about Mack Brazel. and instead
• 2:20:05
  Speaker 1: Mack Brazel came and gave a seriously watered-down version that
• 2:20:10
  Speaker 1: had no mention of any flying saucer. The rest of
• 2:20:14
  Speaker 1: the debris was gathered, and a press conference was held
• 2:20:19
  Speaker 1: saying that it was not a flying saucer at all,
• 2:20:21
  Speaker 1: but was actually a secret weather balloon. Meanwhile, the mortician,
• 2:20:27
  Speaker 1: Glenn Dennis, contacted the nurse, and she described the bodies
• 2:20:30
  Speaker 1: in detail, drew sketches for him, so that they were
• 2:20:35
  Speaker 1: very slender beings with oversized heads. And she was allegedly
• 2:20:40
  Speaker 1: killed in a plane crash a few weeks later, and
• 2:20:43
  Speaker 1: her identity has never been verified. But as more wreckage
• 2:20:47
  Speaker 1: began to come to the base, excitement mounted. According to
• 2:20:52
  Speaker 1: researcher Ruben Anaya, he and Senator Joseph Montoya, who was
• 2:20:57
  Speaker 1: then New Mexico's lieutenant governor, were both present on the
• 2:21:02
  Speaker 1: base at the time of the incident, And according to Anaya,
• 2:21:06
  Speaker 1: the Lieutenant Governor Montoya was, quote, very, very scared and
• 2:21:13
  Speaker 1: said that he had seen, quote, four little men and
• 2:21:17
  Speaker 1: described them very much like the nurse did, said that
• 2:21:21
  Speaker 1: they were wearing tight-fitting one-piece jumpsuits and told Anaya, quote,
• 2:21:26
  Speaker 1: I tell you, they are not from this world. Montoya
• 2:21:30
  Speaker 1: has made no comment regarding Anaya's revelations so more witnesses
• 2:21:38
  Speaker 1: July 7th Lydia Sleppy who was an administrator at the
• 2:21:42
  Speaker 1: KOAT radio in Albuquerque uh says that local reporter Johnny
• 2:21:48
  Speaker 1: McBoyle called their station to reveal the Roswell crash and
• 2:21:53
  Speaker 1: McBoyle said he'd been to the site seen the craft
• 2:21:56
  Speaker 1: which was all crumpled and he was sending his report
• 2:21:59
  Speaker 1: through the teletype when the machine stopped and uh He
• 2:22:07
  Speaker 1: returned to the phone. The teletype now said, stop communication immediately.
• 2:22:12
  Speaker 1: And McBoyle told Sleppy, forget about it. You never heard it.
• 2:22:16
  Speaker 1: You're not supposed to know. Don't talk about it to anyone.
• 2:22:19
  Speaker 1: At this point, many of the civilian witnesses who were
• 2:22:23
  Speaker 1: involved in this were threatened to remain silent. And as
• 2:22:27
  Speaker 1: Kevin Randall says, quote, if nothing extraordinary happened at Roswell,
• 2:22:33
  Speaker 1: Why the extraordinary efforts to keep it secret? Researcher Stanton
• 2:22:37
  Speaker 1: Friedman agrees. He says the UFO crashes in New Mexico
• 2:22:42
  Speaker 1: launched the U.S. government on a long-term, elaborate, highly sophisticated
• 2:22:47
  Speaker 1: campaign of concealment and disinformation that has yet to be relaxed. Reportedly,
• 2:22:53
  Speaker 1: one of the ETs did survive this crash and was
• 2:22:56
  Speaker 1: able to communicate with humans and told a history that's
• 2:22:59
  Speaker 1: very different from what we officially believe. And then more
• 2:23:06
  Speaker 1: revelations continued to come for years and years afterwards, such
• 2:23:10
  Speaker 1: as that by Colonel Philip Corso, who claims that he
• 2:23:16
  Speaker 1: was charged with reverse engineering wreckage from this craft. He
• 2:23:21
  Speaker 1: said that he viewed one of the bodies, and he
• 2:23:25
  Speaker 1: said that he fed the Roswell debris to various scientists
• 2:23:30
  Speaker 1: and used it to develop such technologies as night vision
• 2:23:35
  Speaker 1: Kevlar the integrated circuit lasers and more and over the
• 2:23:41
  Speaker 1: next two years Bill Brazel Mac Brazel's son continued to
• 2:23:45
  Speaker 1: find bits of wreckage more than a dozen pieces until
• 2:23:51
  Speaker 1: one day the military showed up he had been bragging
• 2:23:54
  Speaker 1: about it and forced him to hand it over So
• 2:23:58
  Speaker 1: this story has taken decades to unfold. It shows no
• 2:24:02
  Speaker 1: sign of stopping. The number of living witnesses is becoming
• 2:24:07
  Speaker 1: smaller and smaller each day. But to close this story off,
• 2:24:11
  Speaker 1: I would like to quote a few of the witnesses
• 2:24:14
  Speaker 1: and what they say about this particular incident. Here's what
• 2:24:19
  Speaker 1: Loretta Proctor said. She's the one who saw a piece
• 2:24:24
  Speaker 1: of the wreckage. As she says, Mac Brazel did bring
• 2:24:29
  Speaker 1: a little piece, a little sliver of wood-looking stuff up,
• 2:24:34
  Speaker 1: but you couldn't burn it or you couldn't cut it
• 2:24:36
  Speaker 1: or anything. I guess it was just a little sliver
• 2:24:39
  Speaker 1: of it about the size of a pencil and about
• 2:24:41
  Speaker 1: three or four inches long. It was kind of a
• 2:24:43
  Speaker 1: brownish tan. It looked like plastic, of course. There wasn't
• 2:24:47
  Speaker 1: any plastic then, but that was kind of what it
• 2:24:50
  Speaker 1: looked like. According to Bill Brazel, the son of Mac Brazel,
• 2:24:57
  Speaker 1: He handled some of the wreckage, and as he says,
• 2:25:00
  Speaker 1: it weighed almost nothing. These were like balsa wood in weight,
• 2:25:04
  Speaker 1: but a bit darker and much harder. There were also
• 2:25:07
  Speaker 1: several bits of metallic-like substance, something on the order of tinfoil,
• 2:25:11
  Speaker 1: except the stuff wouldn't tear and was actually a bit
• 2:25:14
  Speaker 1: darker in color than tinfoil, more like lead foil, except
• 2:25:18
  Speaker 1: very thin and extremely light weight. The odd thing about
• 2:25:21
  Speaker 1: this foil was that you could wrinkle it and lay
• 2:25:24
  Speaker 1: it back down and it immediately resumed its original shape.
• 2:25:29
  Speaker 1: Bessie Brazel, the daughter of Mac Brazel, was 12 years old.
• 2:25:34
  Speaker 1: She viewed the wreckage and she said, quote, so much
• 2:25:37
  Speaker 1: debris scattered over the pasture land. There was what appeared
• 2:25:42
  Speaker 1: to be pieces of heavily waxed paper and a sort
• 2:25:44
  Speaker 1: of aluminum-like foil. Some of these pieces had something like
• 2:25:48
  Speaker 1: numbers and lettering on them. like pastel flowers or designs.
• 2:25:52
  Speaker 1: It was all very light in weight, but there sure
• 2:25:56
  Speaker 1: was a lot of it. We were told not to
• 2:25:58
  Speaker 1: talk about this at all. Back in those days, when
• 2:26:01
  Speaker 1: the military told you not to talk about something, it
• 2:26:04
  Speaker 1: wasn't discussed. Intelligence Officer Major Jesse Marcel was the one
• 2:26:11
  Speaker 1: who viewed the wreckage debris on Brazel's ranch, and he says, quote,
• 2:26:17
  Speaker 1: I saw a lot of wreckage, but no complete machines.
• 2:26:20
  Speaker 1: was definitely not a weather or tracking device, nor was
• 2:26:24
  Speaker 1: it any plane or missile. What it was, we didn't know.
• 2:26:27
  Speaker 1: We just picked up fragments. It was something I had
• 2:26:30
  Speaker 1: never seen before or since, for that matter. I didn't
• 2:26:34
  Speaker 1: know what it was, but it certainly wasn't anything built
• 2:26:36
  Speaker 1: by us, and it certainly wasn't any weather balloon. Jesse
• 2:26:41
  Speaker 1: Marcel Jr. handled the wreckage, and he says, the material
• 2:26:45
  Speaker 1: was foil-like stuff, very thin metallic-like, but not metal. and
• 2:26:49
  Speaker 1: very tough. There was also some structural material too, beams
• 2:26:53
  Speaker 1: and so on. Imprinted along the edge of some of
• 2:26:56
  Speaker 1: the beam remnants, there were hieroglyphic type characters. Jim Ragsdale,
• 2:27:02
  Speaker 1: who viewed the wreckage from a distance, the actual craft, said, quote,
• 2:27:06
  Speaker 1: you could still see where it hit. One part was
• 2:27:09
  Speaker 1: buried in the ground and part of it was sticking
• 2:27:11
  Speaker 1: out of the ground. And he also saw wreckage which
• 2:27:15
  Speaker 1: looked like foil and as he says, You could take
• 2:27:17
  Speaker 1: that stuff and wad it up, and it would straighten
• 2:27:19
  Speaker 1: itself out. He saw the aliens, and he says, they
• 2:27:23
  Speaker 1: looked like bodies. They weren't very long, four or five
• 2:27:27
  Speaker 1: feet long at the most. Another witness was Sergeant Robert Robbins.
• 2:27:34
  Speaker 1: He was stationed at the base as an aircraft sheet
• 2:27:37
  Speaker 1: metal repairman, and according to his witness, Ann, he told
• 2:27:41
  Speaker 1: her that he was on the second site and saw
• 2:27:44
  Speaker 1: the craft and the bodies. And he said this object
• 2:27:49
  Speaker 1: looked like two saucers put together, that it had portholes
• 2:27:53
  Speaker 1: around the perimeter, and that the entities had large pear-shaped
• 2:27:56
  Speaker 1: heads with large black eyes, no apparent nose or mouth,
• 2:28:00
  Speaker 1: and brownish skin and one was still alive. And he
• 2:28:06
  Speaker 1: told all of this to his wife, saying, well, I
• 2:28:11
  Speaker 1: guess you might as well know it's going to be
• 2:28:13
  Speaker 1: in all the papers, a UFO crash outside of Roswell.
• 2:28:19
  Speaker 1: Another witness was Steve McKenzie, who was at the radar
• 2:28:22
  Speaker 1: station and watched this disappear from the scopes and was
• 2:28:26
  Speaker 1: sent to investigate. And as he says, We were all
• 2:28:30
  Speaker 1: smoking cigarettes and talking about how the hell we were
• 2:28:32
  Speaker 1: going to handle this thing. We were all concerned and
• 2:28:36
  Speaker 1: a little scared. He described the bodies as being slender,
• 2:28:40
  Speaker 1: five feet tall, with large heads, large eyes. He saw
• 2:28:44
  Speaker 1: two dead bodies laying on the ground, two inside the craft,
• 2:28:48
  Speaker 1: and one was alive sitting nearby. As he says, that's
• 2:28:52
  Speaker 1: the one I cannot forget. It had this damned serene
• 2:28:56
  Speaker 1: look on its face. like it was at peace with
• 2:28:59
  Speaker 1: the world. And he says the bodies were quickly recovered.
• 2:29:03
  Speaker 1: A special group came in and put all the bodies
• 2:29:06
  Speaker 1: in body bags. Another witness was Easley, who was a
• 2:29:11
  Speaker 1: member of the 509th Bomb Group. He was sent to
• 2:29:14
  Speaker 1: the second site where the craft was, and he helped
• 2:29:17
  Speaker 1: set up the perimeter guard around the craft and ordered
• 2:29:20
  Speaker 1: a second group of MPs to pick up the loose wreckage.
• 2:29:23
  Speaker 1: And as he says, the second group of MPs scanned
• 2:29:27
  Speaker 1: quite a large area looking for debris, was loaded onto
• 2:29:30
  Speaker 1: a truck and onto a plane, and it took off.
• 2:29:33
  Speaker 1: Whatever they found was just odds and ends. And he
• 2:29:38
  Speaker 1: saw professional photographers who were recording everything. So there are
• 2:29:44
  Speaker 1: photos of this. Another was Frankie Rowe, who is the
• 2:29:49
  Speaker 1: daughter of Dan Dwyer. and whose father actually was on
• 2:29:54
  Speaker 1: the site itself. And as Frankie Rose says, according to
• 2:29:57
  Speaker 1: her dad, there were apparently three people in the craft
• 2:30:01
  Speaker 1: because he saw two body bags and he saw one
• 2:30:03
  Speaker 1: live person, a very small being about the size of
• 2:30:07
  Speaker 1: a 10-year-old child. He saw it walking. He didn't think
• 2:30:11
  Speaker 1: it suffered any injuries. And she says that her entire
• 2:30:15
  Speaker 1: family was threatened with physical violence. and was told that
• 2:30:19
  Speaker 1: they would be, quote, disappear into the desert if they
• 2:30:22
  Speaker 1: revealed what they had seen. She was held alone and
• 2:30:28
  Speaker 1: told by an officer that they were going to take
• 2:30:31
  Speaker 1: mother away, and they were going to take daddy away
• 2:30:35
  Speaker 1: if she spoke about it. So she didn't. Another witness
• 2:30:40
  Speaker 1: was Major Louis Rickett, and he said, he was one
• 2:30:45
  Speaker 1: of our a counterintelligence officer who visited both sites, apparently
• 2:30:49
  Speaker 1: of a high degree of secrecy, and he said, quote,
• 2:30:55
  Speaker 1: there was a slightly curved piece of metal, real light.
• 2:30:58
  Speaker 1: It was about 6 inches by 12 or 14 inches,
• 2:31:01
  Speaker 1: very light. I crouched down and tried to snap it.
• 2:31:04
  Speaker 1: My boss laughed and said, smart guy, he's trying to
• 2:31:07
  Speaker 1: do what we couldn't do. I asked, what in the
• 2:31:10
  Speaker 1: hell is this made out of? It didn't feel like plastic,
• 2:31:13
  Speaker 1: and I never saw a piece of metal this thin
• 2:31:15
  Speaker 1: that you couldn't break. Another witness was Major Huey Green,
• 2:31:21
  Speaker 1: and he said, as I mentioned earlier, and I'll quote,
• 2:31:25
  Speaker 1: as I drove through New Mexico from east to west,
• 2:31:27
  Speaker 1: I kept hearing these reports about a downed saucer on
• 2:31:30
  Speaker 1: the local stations. As I came within the radius of
• 2:31:33
  Speaker 1: each one of the radio stations I was listening to,
• 2:31:37
  Speaker 1: were so on edge that they kept interrupting the regular
• 2:31:41
  Speaker 1: broadcasts to give the latest developments. I am certain that
• 2:31:46
  Speaker 1: one of the news broadcasts commented on the fact that
• 2:31:49
  Speaker 1: the sheriff and his men were proceeding towards the field
• 2:31:51
  Speaker 1: of the crash within sight of the wreckage. Glenn Dennis says,
• 2:31:58
  Speaker 1: and I quote, What I saw reminded me of the
• 2:32:01
  Speaker 1: front part of a canoe, about three feet long and
• 2:32:04
  Speaker 1: lying up against the side. There were inscriptions on a
• 2:32:08
  Speaker 1: border around a part of it. It reminded me of
• 2:32:10
  Speaker 1: Egyptian inscriptions. Robert Shirky, who was an assistant group operations officer,
• 2:32:20
  Speaker 1: set up the flight plan that transported the wreckage, and
• 2:32:23
  Speaker 1: as he says, I saw pieces of metal from the craft.
• 2:32:27
  Speaker 1: I saw the I-beam with strange markings on it. Those
• 2:32:30
  Speaker 1: of us who were involved immediately knew we'd better keep
• 2:32:32
  Speaker 1: our mouths shut. He later wrote a book about it
• 2:32:36
  Speaker 1: called Roswell, 1947. I was there. Another witness was Captain
• 2:32:42
  Speaker 1: Pappy Anderson. And according to his wife and his children,
• 2:32:50
  Speaker 1: he was involved in transporting the wreckage. And he told
• 2:32:54
  Speaker 1: them that the ETs who piloted the craft were little
• 2:32:56
  Speaker 1: people with exceptionally large heads. He told his wife, and
• 2:33:01
  Speaker 1: I quote, I've been dying to tell you for years,
• 2:33:04
  Speaker 1: but couldn't. It was top secret. He refused to discuss
• 2:33:08
  Speaker 1: the wreckage itself, saying only it was strange. So there
• 2:33:14
  Speaker 1: are many other witnesses. Colonel Thomas Jefferson DuBose, who said
• 2:33:19
  Speaker 1: that he saw the container holding the wreckage. And as
• 2:33:27
  Speaker 1: he says, I only saw the container, and the container
• 2:33:29
  Speaker 1: was a plastic bag that I would say weighed 15
• 2:33:31
  Speaker 1: to 20 pounds. It was sealed. The only way to
• 2:33:34
  Speaker 1: get into it was to cut it. Another witness was
• 2:33:39
  Speaker 1: Sergeant Robert Smith. He was ordered to load the wreckage
• 2:33:42
  Speaker 1: onto the aircraft to ship it out to other locations.
• 2:33:46
  Speaker 1: And he talked to other officers who were on the
• 2:33:50
  Speaker 1: scene and helped clean it up and actually held some
• 2:33:56
  Speaker 1: of the wreckage. Brigadier General Arthur Exon was stationed at Wright-Patterson,
• 2:34:03
  Speaker 1: and he was there when the Roswell debris came in,
• 2:34:05
  Speaker 1: and he confirmed that this material was tested. And he says, quote,
• 2:34:11
  Speaker 1: Everything from chemical analysis, stress tests, flexing. It was brought
• 2:34:15
  Speaker 1: into our material evaluation labs. I don't know how it arrived,
• 2:34:19
  Speaker 1: but the boys who tested it said it was very unusual.
• 2:34:22
  Speaker 1: Parts could be easily ripped or changed. There were other
• 2:34:25
  Speaker 1: parts of it that were very thin but awfully strong
• 2:34:30
  Speaker 1: and couldn't be dented with heavy hammers. It was flexible
• 2:34:33
  Speaker 1: to a degree. And then, of course, there's Colonel Corso, who...
• 2:34:39
  Speaker 1: His book, The Day After Roswell, describes this event in detail.
• 2:34:45
  Speaker 1: Researcher Gray Barker said he interviewed a gentleman by the
• 2:34:49
  Speaker 1: name of Nicholas von Poppen, who was taken to photograph
• 2:34:54
  Speaker 1: the metal of this craft. And, I mean, the number
• 2:34:59
  Speaker 1: of witnesses goes on and on. I could be here
• 2:35:01
  Speaker 1: all day talking to you about it. The first book,
• 2:35:04
  Speaker 1: The Roswell Incident, was published in 1980. But since then, yeah,
• 2:35:06
  Speaker 1: as I've mentioned earlier, there have been many, many books
• 2:35:13
  Speaker 1: about this craft. This story continues to unfold with weird
• 2:35:17
  Speaker 1: developments such as the alien autopsy footage, which again was
• 2:35:22
  Speaker 1: debunked and is very controversial. Representative Stephen H. Schiff of
• 2:35:30
  Speaker 1: New Mexico tried to get information on this case in 1993.
• 2:35:33
  Speaker 1: He was stonewalled at every turn. And it was just
• 2:35:39
  Speaker 1: a few years later, in 1998, he died of an
• 2:35:43
  Speaker 1: aggressive skin cancer. So the case is still unfolding. I
• 2:35:49
  Speaker 1: know it's somewhat of a dead horse, but this case
• 2:35:53
  Speaker 1: is not going to go away. It's the single biggest
• 2:35:57
  Speaker 1: case in the world. And there are stories continuing to
• 2:36:01
  Speaker 1: come out about it to this day. And I think
• 2:36:07
  Speaker 1: at some point we will see this craft in a museum.
• 2:36:10
  Speaker 1: I certainly hope so. We all deserve to see it.
• 2:36:14
  Speaker 1: We all know what happened here. It wasn't a mogul balloon.
• 2:36:19
  Speaker 1: It was a flying saucer with ETs from elsewhere. And
• 2:36:25
  Speaker 1: we all deserve to see it. So that's my list
• 2:36:28
  Speaker 1: of the top 20 cases in New Mexico. I know
• 2:36:31
  Speaker 1: this has been a long presentation. Thank you very much
• 2:36:35
  Speaker 1: for watching. I really appreciate it. I did cover these
• 2:36:39
  Speaker 1: cases and many others in my book, UFOs Over New Mexico,
• 2:36:45
  Speaker 1: Comprehensive History of Extraterrestrial Encounters in the Land of Enchantment.
• 2:36:56
  Speaker 1: If you'd like to learn more about these cases and others,
• 2:36:58
  Speaker 1: please check out my book. Once again, thanks for listening.
• 2:37:03
  Speaker 1: I really appreciate it. Until next time, keep having fun.