Latest / Wired To Hunt Podcast / Ep. 307: Becoming a “Freestyle Deer Hunter” with Jesse Coots

Transcript

Ep. 307: Becoming a “Freestyle Deer Hunter” with Jesse Coots · Wired To Hunt Podcast

• 0:02
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your home for
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: deer hunting news, stories and strategies, and now your host,
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: Mark Kenyon. Welcome to the wire to Hunt podcast. I'm
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: your host, Mark Kenyan, and this episode number three and seven,
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: and today on the show, I'm joined by New York
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: bow hunter Jesse Coots to discuss the importance of being
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: what he calls a freestyle hunter when targeting big old bucks. Okay,
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, brought to you
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: by on X, and I gotta apologize to you guys
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: here in advance for my voice. I am dealing with
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: a bit of a cold here. But I did have
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: a great guest on it that I chatted with before
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: I got my cold, so the rest of the interview
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: is gonna sound better. My guest today is Jesse Boots,
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: and you might remember him from episode number two hundred.
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: This was years ago now, in which we had a
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: panel of some of the very best d I Y
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: deer hunters on the podcast answer a series of frequently
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: asked questions and Jesse was one of those guests. And
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: after speaking with him, I realized that there was just
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: a lot more we needed to cover. I wanted to
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: dive deep into what he was really focused on. He
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: is just a very, very successful d I y bow hunter,
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  Speaker 1: and he's done it in a lot of different places.
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  Speaker 1: He's done in the East Coast, He's done in the Midwest,
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: out on the plains, in the Rocky Mountain West, all
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: over the place. So today I wanted to dive deep
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: into how he targets big Old Bucks and how those
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: tactics changed from one area to the next. It's a
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: really interesting conversation. He's got a lot to share. But
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: before we get into that, I do want to just
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: take a second to kind of, I guess properly set
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: expectations here or kind of lay just a foundational thing
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: to just keep in mind throughout this conversation, because in
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: this chat, you're gonna hear that Jesse is really very
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: focused on chasing big Bucks. That's what Jesse's personal goals
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: revolve around, and many other hunters too. But I do
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: just want to make it clear that it doesn't have
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: to be that way for everyone. Right, we have a
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: lot of different listeners out there, and I know that
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  Speaker 1: some of you are out there wanting to kill a
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  Speaker 1: big buck. Some of you want to kill an old buck.
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  Speaker 1: Some of you want to kill any buck, and others
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  Speaker 1: are just trying to get your first dear at all,
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: any dear. And I want to say at the outset
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  Speaker 1: that you know, every one of those goals is good
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  Speaker 1: and admirable and and and they're each awesome. We need
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: to hunt for our own reasons and with our own
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: goals and expectations. So don't let me or Dan or
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: Jesse or anyone else out there you've ever heard in
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: the podcast or that you encounter entailor life. Don't let
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: any of those folks make you feel like you need
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: to do something like what they're doing. We each need
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: to hunt our own hunt. You know, this has been
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: particularly on my mind the last couple of days because
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: on my first hunt here in Michigan, I was after
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  Speaker 1: that four and a half year old buck I'm calling
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: trans I was telling you guys about its last week,
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: I wrote radio. I saw him on October one, then
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  Speaker 1: on the second I went in for the kill. Now
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  Speaker 1: I didn't end up seeing him that night, but I
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: did see another really really nice buck. It's this deer
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  Speaker 1: I've seen a bunch this summer and early fall. I've
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  Speaker 1: been calling him the Big nine, and he was just
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  Speaker 1: a gorgeous deer. He's right in that D thirty class
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  Speaker 1: type size and with I don't know minutes left a daylight.
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  Speaker 1: He shows up on that very first hunt for me
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  Speaker 1: in Michigan and he's standing there at ten yards broadside
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  Speaker 1: for like fifteen minutes, and I haven't dead to rights.
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  Speaker 1: I could take a shot easily at any point, and
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  Speaker 1: I have to make this decision. What do I do?
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  Speaker 1: This would probably be I'm pretty sure it would be
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  Speaker 1: the second biggest buck I would have ever killed in
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  Speaker 1: Michigan from an aisler standpoint, if I were to take him.
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  Speaker 1: But after looking at pictures of him and video of
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  Speaker 1: him in the preseason and then seeing him in person,
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  Speaker 1: it was just clear to me he was not a
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  Speaker 1: four and a half yeld deer. He was a three
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  Speaker 1: and a half year old, but a four and a
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  Speaker 1: half year old bucker older was my goal for this
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  Speaker 1: season on this specific property. I know there's a chance
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  Speaker 1: to kill mature deer here. I know there's a chance
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  Speaker 1: for these deer to make it another year, possibly at least,
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  Speaker 1: So that was what I wanted to do. I wanted
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  Speaker 1: to kill four and a half year old and and
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  Speaker 1: really wanted that dear to be trained. The deer I
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  Speaker 1: have some history with, so that being the case, I
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  Speaker 1: decided to know what this dear I'm watching right here.
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  Speaker 1: He is an awesome deer. Here's a beautiful deer, and
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  Speaker 1: I just like to watch him tonight and the rest
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  Speaker 1: of the year, hopefully and maybe he'll make it, maybe not,
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: but I want to keep hunting. And that was that
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  Speaker 1: was pretty awesome. It was such a cool encounter and
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  Speaker 1: experience to just get to sit there and watch this
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  Speaker 1: great deer up close and not feel at all pressure
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  Speaker 1: like I have to shoot this deer because it's a
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  Speaker 1: big deer and it would be, you know, people really
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  Speaker 1: excited about it. I didn't feel that pressure. I just
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  Speaker 1: enjoyed the hunt for what it was and I end
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  Speaker 1: void my decision and I'm one glad I did that.
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  Speaker 1: But it was interesting. I shared this on social media
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  Speaker 1: after the hunt, and I was surprised by how many
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  Speaker 1: people attacked it, people saying I was jaded or a
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  Speaker 1: trophy hunting asshole, or crazy or stupid or whatever it was.
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  Speaker 1: And I was like, man, I'm the one hunting here.
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  Speaker 1: If it's a decision that makes me happy, Why the
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  Speaker 1: hell should you care? Why should you be critiquing me
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  Speaker 1: for what I do? And and I'm sure everybody else
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  Speaker 1: out there has experienced something like this in your own
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  Speaker 1: personal lives. Maybe it's because you passed on a deer.
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  Speaker 1: Maybe it's because you shot a deer that somebody thought
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  Speaker 1: you shouldn't have. And I'm just here to tell you
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  Speaker 1: that that's b s. We just we just don't need
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  Speaker 1: to take it. You know. In my case, yeah, I
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  Speaker 1: might not end up killing the old buck that I'm after.
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  Speaker 1: I might have blown my only chance at a really
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  Speaker 1: good Michigan buck, But that's okay with me. I personally
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  Speaker 1: want something different out of my season this year. That's
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  Speaker 1: a personal decision. I'm a percent happy with it. At
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  Speaker 1: my point in my hunting journey, I don't need to
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  Speaker 1: shoot the first year I see, or the first buck
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: or the first nice buck. I want to push myself.
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  Speaker 1: I want to extend my season. I want to see
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  Speaker 1: what might happen along the way, what I might learn.
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  Speaker 1: Um And we all have that same right in whichever
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  Speaker 1: way you want to go with it. We each get
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  Speaker 1: to choose what kind of season we want, what kind
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  Speaker 1: of goals, what kind of experience. What deer will pull
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  Speaker 1: the trigger on or what dear will pass, that's up
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  Speaker 1: to you, that's up to me. So just remember that
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  Speaker 1: if it makes you happy, as long as it's legal,
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  Speaker 1: do it. Don't let anyone's Monday morning quarterbacking impact how
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: you feel about your decisions or the decisions you make.
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  Speaker 1: And then remember to give everyone the same grace too.
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  Speaker 1: That's my I don't know my Thursday morning lecture for you,
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  Speaker 1: it's on my mind. I just want to make sure
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: everyone feels comfortable hunting their own hunt. With that all said,
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: as we get into our conversation to tay with Jesse,
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  Speaker 1: you are going to hear about his aggressive personal goals
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  Speaker 1: to try and kill Big Bucks. And even if that
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  Speaker 1: doesn't match with your mindset or your goals, think about
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  Speaker 1: the process he outlines and how that might be applicable
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  Speaker 1: to your own goals. Because the cool thing is that
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  Speaker 1: something that will work for big old Bucks, it will
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  Speaker 1: also work for younger Bucks. And if it works for
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  Speaker 1: younger Bucks, it will also work for does very often.
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  Speaker 1: If it works on you know, public land, it's also
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  Speaker 1: gonna work on private land. So you can find ways
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  Speaker 1: to make this stuff applicable. To your own situation. So
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  Speaker 1: I think we can all learn something from this one.
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  Speaker 1: And Jesse is a no nonsense kind of guy. He
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  Speaker 1: he just calls it like he sees it, So be
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  Speaker 1: prepared for that and be prepared to learn some interesting
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  Speaker 1: new ideas. All right, we are here with a repeat guest,
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  Speaker 1: Mr Jesse Coots. Welcome back to the show. Jesse, thanks
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: for having to be here. Hey, I'm really excited to
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: have you. Um. You know, when you were on last time,
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: it was our two episode and we did this big
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: roundtable with with a group of different people, and that
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  Speaker 1: was the first time we got to chat. Our mutual
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: friend Andy had had kind of brought me u or
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: brought you to my attention, introduced us. So after that chat,
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  Speaker 1: I just got to thinking that you had such an
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  Speaker 1: interesting perspective, like a very no bullshit perspective that I appreciated. Um,
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  Speaker 1: And so ever since i've wanted, I've kind of had
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  Speaker 1: on my back burn. I gotta get Jesse back on.
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  Speaker 1: I gotta get Jesse back on because it just seemed
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  Speaker 1: like so much more we could cover. Well, finally we're
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: doing it. So I appreciate you making the time in
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: in the midst of hunting season to to do this.
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  Speaker 1: Cool dude, Well, thanks for the kind of word you Uh,
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  Speaker 1: I appreciate it. You kind of staffed your decks with
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: that last uh, that last group Joe and Andy. Um,
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  Speaker 1: I mean I think those guys could they could literally
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: mumble out just thought processes and you would do well
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: if you could just keep having people like that on
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  Speaker 1: the show. Yeah, they said things that I've tried to
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: uh point out to people, and they started off the
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: top of their head, and it's like, yeah, these guys
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  Speaker 1: get it. So yeah, I'm honored to be a to
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: any conversation with those caliber guys. They really got it. Well,
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: you're the you're the star attraction now today and I'm
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: confident we're gonna get in some really interesting stuff too.
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  Speaker 1: And and as we're kind of talking about, you know,
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  Speaker 1: you mentioned Andy and Joe and how they've really got
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: it figured out. Um, you obviously come to things with
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: your own perspective too. And one of the things that
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: I've taken from doing this podcast for oh, I don't
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: know five plus years now and talking to hundreds of different,
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: really really good deer hunters across the country is that
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: everyone's got a different way this skin the cat. Like
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: there's no one way to be a good deer hunter.
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  Speaker 1: There's many, many different ways, and oftentimes they're wildly I'm
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: almost opposite, Like one guy might be really good doing X,
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: and then one guy might be really good doing why,
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: which is like completely against what X was, but still
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: they managed to get it done. But what I think
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: is interesting about you based off of that conversation we had,
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: and then also, um, some stuff I read about you
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: a while back. Correct me if I'm wrong here, but
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: you describe yourself as a free style hunter, so you're
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: not devoted to like, you don't have a way you
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: like to do kind of a little bit of everything.
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  Speaker 1: Is that? Is that still true? And if so, why
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  Speaker 1: why do you like that diverse approach? Yeah, you hit
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: the nail on the head. Uh, you're a pretty adverbant guy. Uh.
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: In general to pick up on how, um, so many
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: different guys have so many different techniques and and and
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: reasons for it. And when you had mentioned that you
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: want to do this podcast, I thought about some things. Um,
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: you know, just in my mindset what I've been strong
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: at and I thought, you know, I got to make
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: sure to be clear when I when I say anything,
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: um that this is my opinion and this is strictly
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: stuff that has worked for me because I'll listen to
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: someone else or I don't really sounds bad and I
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: don't really listen to podcast and I don't really watch TV. Um,
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: but I have not amount I'll touch a TV show
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: and I'll just do like this guy's a clown, you know.
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: And I have all respect in the world for pcenty
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: guys in uh, but I'll think of myself to the
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: clown like this is this is a joke. Anybody my
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: wife gets killed a gagger buckere like this is stupid. However,
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: the point that he his technique is working for him
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: in his situation, and uh, I think that's one thing
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: that screws a lot of guys, especially guys that um
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: not the thing. I don't want to use the term
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: jump on the band like the guys want to cure
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: all or you know, they just they want somebody to
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: tell him do this this mission, You're gonna kill big deer.
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: And I'm here to tell you, like, do not any
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: anything I give you. Uh, this is this is a
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: style that works in this area or that area, and truthfully,
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: the way I hunt in my home state is completely
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: different than the way I hunt when I go to Ohio.
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: And then when I go from Ohio to Illinois, that
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: style is actually different. Um. And when I go to Kansas,
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: it's different than all three of them are in the
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: same with North Dakota. So um, I think that's why
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  Speaker 1: I love that, like I love the change of things
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: and and figuring. I love puzzles, I love playing chess.
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: It's fun and to figure that out. So if you
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: if you get stuck in the mindst that, Okay, I've
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: got the buck roller and I've got these huge antlers. Um,
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna do the buck roller and smash these antlers
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: together and this hardwoods and I'm gonna have bucks running in. Well,
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: he's act to ensure that you're in the same circumstances
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: that that guy on TV is in. And if if
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: you are, and you might call in a gag or buck,
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: but if you're not, you're probably gonna scare every three
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: in a hand year old out of the woods. So um,
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: So you're exactly right. And I've been extremely um, I
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: don't know successful in the fact that it seems like
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: every state I go to Um, I just run into people.
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: And uh, I have always had a knack for running
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: into like really good, really good dudes. And uh most
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: of these good dudes have turned out to be killers.
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: And uh I've made friends via you know, both site
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: and archery talk and stuff like that years ago. I
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: probably haven't been on a social media page in ten years.
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: But those little connections I made, um like, blossomed into
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: great friendships along with other friends from them. And the
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: interesting thing is when you hunt, um, like, if you're
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: gonna ask me how I scout my home state, I
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: can nail it. And then when you say, but there's
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: a big difference and how I'm gonna scout out of state, um,
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: And guys need to decide for that, and not only
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: out of state, but what state. And then you know,
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: like for instance, when you hunt Kansas, I mean you
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: can go to eastern Kansas. It's completely different than western Kansas. UM,
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: so you've got to be able to be there first,
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: you know. And I always try I love analogy, so
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: it's you know, if you're wrestling against the guy who's
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: a phenomenal takedown technician, UM, you do better figure out
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: how to be good on the mat. Quick, because as
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: soon as he takes you to the mat, you're gonna
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: have to reverse him and work not let him stand up,
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: you know what I mean. And it's the same. It's
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: the same with uh. You know, if you're hunting high pressure,
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: White tells you better learn where everyone else is hunting,
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: and you better learn to be deadly on your your entrance,
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: in your escape and not let the deer know that
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: you're there. Um where you know, and you can't call
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: some of these guys call like maniacs. But when you
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: go to a place like Kansas where there just is
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: no deer, um, I'm sorry, Western kans where the deer
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: population is extremely low, it's opposite. Then here the bucks
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: that are there, you need to be very vocal. They
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: are looking for fights, you know, they're literally looking for
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: other deers. So everything everything changes. So I would totally
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: consider myself a freestyle hunter. There's guys that that are
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: phenomenal decoyers, um, and I would never decoy in my
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: home state. Very few places I would decoy. However, I
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: actually shot a deer last year on a decoy in Kansas. Juff.
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: It's just ridiculously deadly that that Garrett Rowe from Heads
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: Up Decoy makes those and it's almost like cheating, unbelievable,
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: and but that's that's a technique that would not work here. Like,
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: you know, but you have to be able to decipher
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: you're you know, the style and what works. So having
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: connections from different places and then just listening to them
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: is important. So then how do you, though, determine which
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: styles work in your area? Like I gotta imagine if
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: I were to put myself in the shoes of somebody
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: just even listening to the to this podcast over the years,
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: they've heard all these different guys and now they're hearing you. Um,
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: how like what's your mindset when you start getting new
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: ideas from people and then you need to go home
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: and say, Okay, will that work here? Will this work here? Well?
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: This thing? Like do you actively take these ideas in
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: your head and you say, Okay, I think there's a chance,
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: but I just don't know if it will work here.
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: So I'm gonna do it for two hunts this year,
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: or I'm gonna try it once on a swing for
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: the fences with this crazy idea here and we're gonna
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: find out, you know, can this work in New York
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: or No. What's just like the way you think through
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: the filter of how do I how do I see
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: what makes sense for where I'm at versus what's some
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: other guy kind of thing? Sure? So, um, you know,
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: if you're if you're twenty years old, I think it's
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: going to be difficult for you to process someone's input.
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: And I think that's where you struggle a lot because
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: really you've only been hunting for eight or ten years. Um,
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: you don't have a lot of history with hunting. If
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: I'm forty two now and when someone tells me, um,
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: a style or this has been working a lot for me.
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: It's just for instance, Um, the decoy thing that that
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: my buddy Matt turned me on to Travis turned me
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: on too. I got a bunch of great friends I've
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: made over the last fifteen years bow hunt in Kansas,
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: and um, I'm getting advice from not good bow hunters,
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: but like high end, upper echelon. No joke, Like, they're
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: not telling me this to stroke their ego. They're literally
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: being like, listen, dude, this is what you need to
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: do when you get down in those Yucca plants. You know,
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: if somebody like that gives you advice, like I stopped
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: talking and I literally try and absorb everything that he's
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: saying and try and really put it into my mind.
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: And with that being said, I can also think about
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: situations I've been in the past and think, like, you
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: know what, He's right. I remember stalking this one buck
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: and that buck. Actually, and this is true, I was
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: stalking a buck and belly trawling into a buck and
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: I was within bow range, but I wanted to get
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: this yucca plant a little closer. And another deer came
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: over the hill and thought I was a deer and
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: literally started posturing towards me. And if I had had
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: a decoy to just stick up, like, I didn't want
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: to shoot the one that caught me. I want to
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: shoot the bed in one. And you know, when he
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: made these comments about how deadly these decoys are, it's like, yeah,
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: he's right. I'm gonna go out on a limb and
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: get one of Garrett's decoys and you know, do exactly
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: what he said. And he's right. You can literally if
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: you're if you set it up right, um, if you
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: do it, well, it's it's just it's really amazing. It's
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: a blast. I mean, if your board. Just go to Kansas,
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: even if you don't have a tag and just go
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: out on walk in hunting area with a with a
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: decoy and decoy. Dear. It's uh, it's ridiculous. I mean,
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: I hate breathing people, but know that I hate for
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: people to know that secret. But I don't know. It's
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: it's so much fun. But don't don't try and do
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: that in Ohio. Like you're not going to do that
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: in a hard woods and you're just not gonna get
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: away with that in certain places. Um. But but that's
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: how I would and not. It's just like life. You
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: can't be afraid to fail. If somebody gives you great
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: advice and says, listen, you're a very talented welders. Um,
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: set aside forty dollars and start your own business. You
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: have with the takes, do this, there's some this. If
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: that guy is a self made multimillionaire who's very successful,
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: I would take his advice and I would quit my
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: job and start doing it. So you know, if you're
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: talking to some guy at the grocery store that's smoking
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: a cigarette and he's got Walmart camel on, um, you know,
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: and he's telling you how he killed this hundred and
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: fifty deer. Well, I've great in my opinion, you got
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: lucky in so but I still listen to a story.
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: If it's if it's his first big buck, you know
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: that's it. But if he's killing him every year like that,
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: I might listen to him. But chances are he's a clown.
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: So you know, if if if a high end guy
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: is giving you advice, um, you know you gotta you
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: gotta listen to it and then think in your own mind,
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: like could I have used you know, how it does
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: it work in the past? And um, I think I'm
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: probably really outside of the box and a lot of
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: my hunting stuff because um, I've hunted a lot. I've
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: hunted a lot of different states, and every state is
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: really can be a different style. And then you know,
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: hunting pressure changes it. At the time of the season
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: changes it. Um, the lay of the ground changes it.
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: And you know it's just the amount of fear that
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: are there changing. So many things change it. And when
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: you start weighing in all these different variables, it changes
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: your style and it makes you a more you know,
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: a killer, I mean, and you could probably bounce that
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: off somebody like like a I mean, he's killing a
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: great deer and elk and stuff in numerous different states
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: and you don't mean to, but when you're doing that,
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: you know, it's it's literally like cross training. You know,
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: it's you're just becoming you know, more adaptable. And then
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: you put it like things I've done out West, I've
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: I've put the work here that I never did. You know,
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: twenty years ago, I carried junk binoculars like on a
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: strap around my neck. You know, it literally looked like
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: a like a a Little League player going out with
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: his fleets on his neck. It was a complete joke.
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: And you know, the first couple of times I hunted
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: out West, um, I was like, man, I gotta change
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: my my optics and change how I do this. And
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: then I hunted with a really elite guy, Matt Schienberg,
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: and he, uh, his his glassing was just to all
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: we did and it was so much fun and it
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: was like this is that was an Arizona But still
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: the idea I write down, I was like, I am
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: going to become a master of optics and a master
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: of asking. And you know, I don't care where you
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: hunt if you are not really using your optics a lot.
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: You're you know, you're really missing them, You're missing some stuff.
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: So you know that's just stuff you'll learn. But uh
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: but yeah, somebody gives you a good pointer, yeah, you know,
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: I try it. And there's just oddball things, um that
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: that come up. Like, for instance, one time I was
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: hunting this spot here and I was after a good
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: buck and I knew I needed to stay away from
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: him to really pin down where it was going to be.
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: And I was so pissed because it was windy, and uh,
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, this isn't the middle of nowhere,
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: but I don't know where this cardboard box blows into
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: this um elfelfa field and I was just like, oh
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: my gosh, like this one is like I can't get
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: down and move this box because it's getting to be
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: prime time and the stupid boxes in the middle of
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: the field, and every year that came out of that
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: thicket walked to that box and sniffed it and like inspected,
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: including the buck I wanted to kill. And I was like,
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: you've got You've got to be kidding me. So I
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: literally got down and got out of there, you know,
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: at dark, and then went back the next day at noon,
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: grabbed that box and I got it out of there,
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: and I put a white five gallon tail there, so
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: I wanted to change it, and um, I shot that buck,
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: you know. And the crazy thing is some dude, um
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: Zeke Feiffer or something. I think that's his name, and
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: excuse me for botching his name. Like two years later, yeah, yeah, exactly,
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: like two years later wrote an article about putting a
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: five gallon tail out and I smiled and thought, that
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: kid is so on, that is so spot Um he
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: wrote an article like he had to have had the
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: same experience that it was a wonderful article. And had
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: I not had that experience, I would have been like,
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: that's the dumbest Do not do that. Do not put
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: a man made oil, you know. I literally put a
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: fifteen forty reteller t that I filled my deson up
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: with oil barrel out there, and every year came to
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: it and was curious with it. And I didn't shoot
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: that deer like he wasn't like on it on it,
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: but he went around it, which pushed him closer to me.
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: I smoked him. It's just those odd things that you
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: you have to be observant and when you notice something.
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: I mean a lot of people, including myself, would be
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: pissed about that cardboard box. Instead I was pissed about it,
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: but I observed that, hey, this is a cause and
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: effect of this, and maybe I can use this by
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: a technique I used very often. I don't really hunt
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: elsa fields, um so, but it worked. It was just
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: amazing for that. So well, it's interesting, you know, as
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: you're as you're talking through all this, it makes me
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: think of one of the kind of things I preach
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: all the time, which is just go and put yourself
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: in new experiences. Like there's almost no easier way to
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: become a better hunter than to just force yourself out
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: of your comfort zone. I mean, so many people I
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: think get stuck in like I always hunt this farm
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: every year. Is where I hunt in my home state,
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: is where I live. Um it's my spot. That's where
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: I hunt. And they just do that year after year
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: after year after year, and they wonder why, you know,
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: things aren't changing, why they're not having a different level
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: of success, why they've stagnated. But I think if you simply,
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: without anything else, just force yourself to go new places
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: and then based off what you just said, I'll add
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: to that hunt with new people, hunt new states and
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: new places and go out there with some new people
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: ever once in a while, and then do what you
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: just said. Listen, actually listen process what they say. That
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: right there, I think can just take you leaps and
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: bounds because you have to. Then every time you go
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: somewhere new, every time you're in that new situation, you're
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: forced to play that game of chess in a new way.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: If you're doing it in the same farm every day
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: all the time, it's you're not you're not growing. Like
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: the only way to and I'm preaching the quiet here,
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: I realized, but the only way to get like stronger muscles, right,
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: you gotta tear them down a little bit. You have
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: to stress them enough to actual muscle fibers start to
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: start to break just a little, and then they grow
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: back stronger. Like the same thing is the case with
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: the hunter. You need to stress yourself, put yourself a
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: new challenging situations might break you down at first, but
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: then you figure it out and you become better. I mean,
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: that's basically what we're saying right that. I'm You're like,
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: that's a you're an impressive dude to pick up on that.
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: That is hundred and like to keep. My whole life changed.
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: When I was like twenty, I was a killer, just
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: a flat out killer, not a big buck killer. Just
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: a killer. Like we were poor, we needed meat. Like
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: I just killed everything in my pay if I had
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: a tag, things were getting killed. But I wanted to
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: kill big deer like I was good at shooting. Just
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: just getting things killed. That that's it. I was not
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: a big buck killer. And when I was about twenty,
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: it was just frustrating because I would find big buck sign.
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: I would you know, bump big deer. I knew there
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: was a big deer in the area, and there was
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: a tree I can walk I know right the tree
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: I was sitting in. And I was sitting in this
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: tree you one day. It was a beautiful fall day,
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: and exactly what you just said was happening to me.
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: I was sitting on my spot that my father had
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: showed me where the hunt. He had showed me how
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: we walk in, where to sit. I was doing the
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: same rigamarole. And I was thinking to myself, Man, I
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: am doing everything how everyone is telling me to do it.
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: You know, I'm doing exactly what my dad said. I'm
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: doing exactly what John says, I'm doing exactly what Tom says,
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: like and I am just getting like average results. And
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: then I thought I literally luckily for me, which sounds bad.
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: I had a falling out with my dad, like literally
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: then like that's when we kind of parted ways, and
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: I started to question everything my father had ever, uh
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: you know, told me about you know, ever taught me.
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: Not that he was a bad guy or anything, but
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: I just questioned everything. And I remember sitting there thinking like,
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: you know what, my dad is not a very good hunter.
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: He's a gun hunter. He's killed one deer with a
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: bow and arrow, Like, why am I taking advice from
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: this guy? And then I thought John is not a
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: very good hunter. He's a gun hunter. Like I started
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: thinking like all these guys that are giving me all
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: this advice, like I'm not protecting anything myself. I'm just
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: doing what people tell me to do. It. I sat
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: in this tree and I literally thought, like I bumped
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: the deer every time here. I know they're a deer here,
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: Why am I bumping them? And then it's like it's
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: a morning hunt. Why did I just walk through that
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: whole field that they're eating in to get in here,
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: and my my wind is blowing into the bedding grounds.
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: And I remember sitting there and I thought this is stupid,
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: and I had I was in a junk climber. I
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: climbed down the tree, put it on my bat. It
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: was prime time, and I thought, I've already ruined this
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: fro getting out of here. And I walked out of there.
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: And this was before the internet, and I literally drew
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: a map in my mind of what that woods and
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: what that. I still have the map what that looked like,
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: and drew in the fields and then figured out that
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: I needed to attack this obviously from the down wind side.
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: I was attacking with the wind in my back. So
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: I went in that night and I sat in a
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: hedgerow and just glass in a place I've never sat,
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: and I couldn't believe the deer that trickled out of
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: the stickt and why they trickled out everywhere except for
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: the spot I was this morning that morning. So I
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: reevaluated that and attacked that wood the next day from
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: the down wind side. And I only went in just
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: a little bit, and uh, the deer I saw, I mean,
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: I then I was in the deer that had no
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: idea I was there. And I could tell these deer
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: were a little spooky. They were looking up to where
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: I had always sat. I was only a hundred yards
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: difference in this wood, but um they knew. They were
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: actually hugging the down wind side of the woods to
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: check and see if I was there, and right down
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: I was like, I got it, Like I'm this is
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: I learned something. I now I'm a student and I
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: was so excited to have figured this out on my own.
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: And I literally said to myself, I'm throwing like I
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: am deleting my memory of anything anyone has ever told me.
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: And I am only going to put into play things
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: that I know are facts. And right now I know
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: the way that I attack the woods entrance and escape
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: is very important because I just learned this today. You
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: know when I shot my first, Um, I shot out
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: my first pope and young buck that year, and I
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: shot a pope and young buck in my home state
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: every year since that except or last year. Is the
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: first year in my life I didn't shoot a a
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: deer in this state just from laziness. But I mean,
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: it just turns down to if you, if you, you
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: gotta think for yourself. So anything I say on this
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: podcast today, you know, take it with a grain of salt.
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: Think about what I say, but don't take it for gold.
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: You know, don't don't think like, oh, he said this,
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: I gotta do that. You gotta put it into play,
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: and you gotta think about like is this going to
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: work in my block? Can I attack this from the
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: down wind? Um? Can I get away with attacking from
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: the upland or you know, you gotta put these own
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: things in the play. And once I started doing that,
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: I really like, I really don't watch TV show, Like
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: I don't watch any hunting shows. They you know, I've
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: enjoyed them, Um, I've probably watched them fifteen years ago.
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: And then it was like, this is just hindering me,
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: Like this doesn't even do any good. I wouldn't tell
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: anybody like don't watch those. But anything I've learned is
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: literally from actual experience or from other people's you know,
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: friends that are killers, um, And they said, you know,
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: they've given me pointers about things that have worked for them,
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: and I've I've put it into play, and it's like
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: and some of the stuff people have told me it's
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: like I disagree with Like it's like, no, I'm not,
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: it's not it does not work. But um, other people
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: who have told me stuff and it's like this sounds
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: absurd and and it's um it works for their area.
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: My body, Matt palm kust won't go ahead. I would
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: like to hear what you're inst about, Matt. Ll So, Matt, Um,
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: I drew a mule deer tag one time and I was,
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: you know, my goal was it was a big news
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: to me, is a big mule. You know, I don't
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: come from the older country. And you know, Matt's extremely
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: tom cool and he's like yeah, you know, and he
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: I don't want him to be like, you know, hunt
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: here here, you know, I just um, I'm just going hunt.
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: And I love that and he's great and the fact
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: that you know, he'll tell me what kind of terrain
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: to look for whatever. And anyways, I found a couple
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: of gagger bucks. You know, two of them were they
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: were big. I mean two of them were had to
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: have grossed over two hundred. So I was pretty tickled.
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: The problem for me was, um, they were on and
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: off um public you know, walk in hunting area. But anyways,
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: this one evening in particular, I glassed this buck up
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: that I was looking for, and he was finally on
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: this public but it was literally like a quarter section
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: which is a hundred what is it a hundred six acres,
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: which seems like a ton, but that is not much.
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: That's like a little tiny. It's nothing like they are
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: on and off the quarter section and sack and and
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: this buck was in the middle, and it's all like crp,
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: that's that's up to your chest. And I had a
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: flip phone and I called Matt and like, dude, this
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: book is and he was hugh he did with a
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: big buck. I'm like, dude, this buck is in the
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: middle of this field. I'm like I'm losing light. I'm like, man,
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: I go you know, I was just kind of taking
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: his brain, like I don't even know what to do.
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: And Maths like do they have a dough with him?
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: And I'm like, yeah, I think he does. Like he
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: hasn't left a spot, and Math's like, man, you don't
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: have much light. He's like, um, I'm like I have
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: no cover. He's like just literally he goes just run
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: right at him. He goes try and hold your bowl
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: up or something like its antlers. He's like, just run
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: at him. He's like he if he sees you, he's
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: gonna get on alert. But if that dough doesn't see you,
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: if she stays there, he's staying. He's like, literally run
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: up to that here and shoot him. And his advice
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: was something, you know, something to that effect. And I
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: was like, dude, I cannot. I cannot run up to
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: this deer and shoot him. And he's like, all right, well,
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: he's like that's what I would do. He's like, that's
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: first of all. He's like, you don't have much choice.
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: And definitely, I'm pretty sure that buck is going to
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: stay there. And I'm like, all right, I'm going for it.
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: Through it. You're right. I mean, he's not coming back
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: on this public land anytime soon, I don't think. And uh,
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: I put my boat, you know. I put my phone
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: down and grabbed my boat and just sprinted and I closed,
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: you know, I closed a lot of distance fast and
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: just ran it this dear and I got within sixty
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: yards of him, and I literally just ran out of
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: light and didn't have it. I was going up this
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: hill on him and just didn't have enough elevation. But
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: that Buck stood there. I could have shot him in
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: the back, you know, but I couldn't get an arrow
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: into his vitals. If I had, you know, probably a recurve,
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: I could have locked an arcing shot. But the point
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: is like I would have never done that, Like, there's
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: no way I would have gotten within sixty years yards
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: of that dear Um. But his experience in his terrain
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: and his type of ground, um, and in that exact
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: setting that worked, and like in in I would I
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: don't know figure that out. So that kid really advanced
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: me um a lot, just with that tip, you know.
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: And and then you throw in his tip and and
• 34:11
  Speaker 1: Travis's tip and Garrett Rose tip of using that decoy,
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: and it's like, man, those guys advanced me just with
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: those two tips, using that decoy. And how do you
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: use it? Um? It would take a fellow five or
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: six years of just stumbling, just accidentally learning this. So
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: when you can pick up those tips from killers like
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: those guys, I mean, they saved me, you know, they
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: put me on a different level fast and um being
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: open to their ideas. Uh, it just it makes it deadly. Yeah,
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: And and it sounds like again it's it's finding the
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: right things that work for specific places. So so those
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: tactics worked really great in that wide open country, it
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: wouldn't work in New York. Let's take like an example period.
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: I'd like to get your perspective on how to hunt
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: a certain time frame and then how that would be
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: different in New York versus Ohio, versus Kansas or something
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: like that. Um So I remember hearing you talk about
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: I can't remember if we talked about this or if
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: this was something you told Andy Andy told me. Um,
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: but the fact that you really like, especially in New
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: York hunting kind of early early or into the October lull,
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: like that time period, you really focus on trying to
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: get it done in New York and then you travel
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: elsewhere across the state. Um So when this podcast airs,
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: it's going to be right about middle of October, right
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: in that ballpark. So people right now are thinking, how
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: do I get on a buck between like the tenth
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: and the twentie or something like that. So when you're
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: thinking of that time frame for you, UM, maybe let's
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: first talk New York because it sounds like you're focused
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: in New York quite a bit at that time. How
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: are you approaching your hunt's trying to get a big
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: mature buck on the ground at that time of year. Yeah. So, Um,
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: first of all, I don't I don't believe in October
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: law at all. Like, it's not these deer do not.
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: These deer are eating, walking, pooping. There's no laws. Uh,
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: there's a ton of crops up and the weather is changing,
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: the crops are changing. That's there is no law. I've
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: got so many great deer in the law that people
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: talk about. It's a lull of of knowledge, is all
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: it is. Deer are still living in the woods. They're
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: still there. You know, there's thousands of acres of corn up,
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: you know, all they can't find them. Yeah, it's because
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: all the soybeans went from green to brown. They're not
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: eating soybeans now. They're you know, they're eating the corn
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: all day and they're they're in the lf delfa at night.
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: You know. There there is no law. But so when
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: I attack, and I think I have a an extreme
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: advantage over a lot of guys in big buck states,
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: and the fact that I don't live in a big
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: buck state. Um, I live in a state that could
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: be a mega state if our politics were different. But um,
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: I live in a state that if you work hard,
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: you can kill a hundred deer. Um, your average guy
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: here is probably thrilled to kill like a hundred hundred
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: and tennant deers. So it's a big advantage for me
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: and the fact that I don't get stressed out over um,
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: there's not a hundred deer, Like I've got to get
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: this deer killed before I go Ohio or Kansas the Illinois.
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: I literally will you know, I find a hundred thirty
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: deer and it's like, yeah, that's good enough. I'm killing
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: them because it's only gonna get so big here, Like
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: I'm not, you know, it's fine to leave where my
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: friends at Ohio and Kansas in Illinois, I mean they're
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: literally they're like, yeah, I got a hundred seventy in
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: in this blockwoods and you know, there's a one ninety
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: six over here, and I mean, these poor guys they
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: can't go anywhere because how can you leave that? But
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: that's a big advantage. It's a big advantage for me.
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: It was like it doesn't matter, Um, I personally think
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: everybody should kill like if I'm a white tailer, I mean,
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: I love the elk and mulet these but um, I
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: mean a white tails are really what I know, and
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: it's you should really kill a big white tail in
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: your home states. It's it's really easy if you sit
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: down and figure out you know, the certain there's certain
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: etiquette that you have to have. UM in my style
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: where I live. UM, I personally think it's easy if
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: you talk to other people and I think it's difficult.
• 38:14
  Speaker 1: But we have a very big where I live. It's
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: it's all agriculture, UM, big crop fields where you know
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: your average field is probably uh hundred fifty acres and
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: then your average woods is trobe of like fifty to
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: seventy acres. UM. Would that be insaide? In my opinion,
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: it's great because it's it's so easy. You can pick
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: these deer up all summer. UM, you can glass them.
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: You can find big deer if you're just smart about it.
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: You've you've got to scout them. UM. And scouting, in
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: my opinion, is not walking through the woods, you know,
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: looking for deer tracks. All you're doing is screwing everything up,
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: Like stay out of the woods, use good optics, get
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: a I thought, get a good head, get a good paramunoculars.
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: They don't have to be super expensive. But the more
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: money you can spend on optics, you'll have them forever
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: and they'll be good. Um, find whatever your piece of
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: ground is. And like what you were saying earlier, if
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: you're hunting Grandma's and you've been hunting it forever, yes,
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: that's nice that you have that, but Uncle Tom still
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: hunts it, and your dad hunts it, and your cousin
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: Tony hunts it. Like they shoot everything that moves, there's
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: probably not big deer there. So if you really want
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: to kill big deer, you have to hunt where big
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: deer are. Um. If you're not seeing big deer on
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: grandma Grandpa's like leaves, go somewhere else and start finding
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: big deer. Um to get permission on places and scout
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: the scout daylights out of them. Uh. And that's that's
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: all I do. I mean, it's really my style has changed.
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: When I was twenty years old or one, it was
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: almost obscene how much all I did was worked and
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: scout for deer, and at dark I took girls out.
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: That was it. Like, that's that's all my life. Yeah,
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: it's a great I lived an amazing life. Um, And
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: if you're serious, and once like I think in my mindset,
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: like I I I, everything is black and white for me.
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: There isn't much gray area in life. And if I
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: do something that I'm either all in or I have
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: no interest in it. And hunting has been that way
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: for me. And um, I really went went from a knucklehead,
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: like just an average blowhard that you know it was
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: happy to even get a shot at a ninety here too.
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: You know, two years later I wouldn't shoot anything under
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: one thirty, which on our state is like you know,
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: that's like the equipment a shooting at one sixty or
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: one seventy and Kansas and that that came from knowledge
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: and when I when I realized, you know, how to
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: attack things and this and that I realized like, man,
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: I'm doing something already that people aren't doing. And then
• 40:56
  Speaker 1: when I started scouting, and I started realizing, like man,
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: I saw more good dear that first year I actually
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: scouted than I had ever seen in a lifetime. And
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: you hear these people talk like, oh, these dear ghosts.
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: No they're not. They're not ghosts. They're literally, and in
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: a respectful way, they're dumb animals like human beings are
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: smart we are smart. Animals are dumb, So like, mentally,
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: get that, uh, get that out of your head that
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: they're going to outsmart you. Deer have wonderful senses. They
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: have great vision, they have great hearing, and they have
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: great noses. Like, don't don't give them a reason to
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: smell you, see you, or hear you. They're not gonna
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: outthink you. They're literally getting hit in the road. They're
• 41:37
  Speaker 1: not smart. So once I realized like that that they're
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: very habitual, um, I learned their habits, and then I
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: learned how to keep myself out of their instincts. And
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: it's it's pretty easy. Um So in my home state,
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: that's how I do it. I glass them up and
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: I'll be like, I try and find like three or
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: four good areas that I can hunt. Um. When I
• 42:01
  Speaker 1: was a kid, I would literally leave every morning at
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: sun up if I was at work. I worked hard
• 42:07
  Speaker 1: so that my bosses could not complain when I was like,
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna go look for deer for a half an hour.
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: I know not everybody could do that, but I literally
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: was a maniac when I'm working, so that they were
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: so happy with me that they couldn't fire me. And
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: I would go look for deer at sun up and
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: glass and then I would go back to work and
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: work like a maniac and then get out of work.
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: And if we went to a graduation party or a
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: wedding in the evening, when it came prying time, I
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: would literally be like, Hey, I gotta go. I am
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: gonna go look for deer. I'm gonna go look for
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: deer for this last forty five minutes. And I know
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: that my wife was is wonderful and she'd just be like, yep,
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: you know whatever, this is what he does. And a
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: lot of times I would just slip away from the
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: wedding go look for big deer, even if it was
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: two hours from my house. It's like, man, there might
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: be a big deer here. And that's the mindset, Like
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: if you're not that little, you know that first half
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: hour a light, in that last half hour at light,
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: I mean that's when you're getting most of your information.
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: If you don't have a lot of time to scout
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: and stuff, just you have to make time. You know.
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: It's kind of like exercising people. You can teach people
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: like oh you if you do this this and this
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: and eat this, you know you're gonna be in great shape. Yeah, well,
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: people still have to do it, like you have to
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: actually do that. And it's the same with with scouting
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: and killing big deer. You know, you can, you have
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: you can tell people all the information they want, but
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: they have you actually have to apply it. And one
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: of the things with scouting and killing big deer, if
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: you're gonna kill big deer, you have to you have
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: to hunt where big deer are. And the hunt with
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: where big deer are, you have to learn where big
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: deer are, and you got to scout them. So you
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: got to put in the legwork and scout and not
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: just sticking cameras all over the place, like actually go
• 43:38
  Speaker 1: out and visually see them and know that, Okay, he
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: stepped out of here, he stepped out on this edge.
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: The wind is doing this. Ah, this is why he
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: came from there. And oh, you know what, he keeps
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: looking behind him. Why is he looking behind him? You know,
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: I'm ready to go, man, This one buck keeps looking
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: behind him in the woods. Sit there and after sunset
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: you see a gagger step out, and it's like, that's
• 43:59
  Speaker 1: why he kept looking behind him. And even though you
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: know so I mean, it's those little things. It's like
• 44:04
  Speaker 1: you got to put in that effort. And um, you
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: know I get luck all the time. People always like, oh,
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: you're so lucky, and it's like, I'm irish, but I
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: don't believe in law. This isn't this a luck. This
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: is a little bit of thought process and a little
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: bit of effort and then a little bit of execution.
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: Like I'm just putting the pieces together. And you know,
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: I look at my circle of friends and if you
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: like you, I'm sure if you look at my phone
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: for the last month with a dead elk that are
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: laying on the ground, it's unbelievable. And now and you know,
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: come white tail season, Uh, it's gonna be my phone
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: just blows up. And when I really think about the
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: guys that I converse with, um, we all think differently
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: but exactly the same. I know that's odd, but like
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: they have the exact same mindset and we can they
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: really have it, and and the not of nobody's a
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: trade of work. Like none of these guys are lazy.
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: They're all putting in that little bit of effort. And
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: you know, you can kill a good deer every three
• 45:07
  Speaker 1: or four years anybody can do that, but I mean
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: I struggle to not. I don't know which one I'm
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: gonna kill, you know, And those guys are the same way, like, well,
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: I can't. I don't want to kill this and I
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: don't want to kill that one. And um, that's the
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: problem you have when you when you actually figure things out.
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: It's like I just passed up a hundred deer in
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: New York. I mean, that's stupid. I shouldn't have done that.
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: But that's there's a good problem to have, you know.
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: Let's let's get two brass tacks. Then let's continue down
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: with this example. So, so it's mid October and you're
• 45:39
  Speaker 1: getting out every night you can if you're not hunting,
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: and your glass and you're scouting. You did that in
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: the summer. Now it sounds like you're still going to
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: do that at times during the season. Let's say you
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: spot a gagger, you spot the buck you want to shoot.
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: He steps out into a field some kind of food source,
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: and you spot him last life. So now I want
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: to know what's going through your head, and then what's
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: your stunt? Like, how did do you just go right
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: and set up right where you saw him step out,
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: what are you thinking about? And then and then what
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: happens if he doesn't show up that night? What do
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: you do the second day? And it's interesting as I'm
• 46:11
  Speaker 1: reading this out, as saying this to you, this is
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: exactly this scenario that happened to me over the last
• 46:16
  Speaker 1: three days, Like exactly on October one, I glassed an
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: area I saw the buck I wanted to get a
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: shot at. He came out the next day. I moved
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: in and tried to hunt where I saw him the
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: second day. Because I didn't see him that night, I
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: went back in for one more hunt in that spot,
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: and I thought, with the wind direction we had, it
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: would actually be better for him, a little bit riskier
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: for me. But I decided, you know what, that might
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: actually be what he needs to to come back out again,
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: because this is a closer wind to what he moved
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: on when I saw him two days ago. So I
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: tried one more hunt. It didn't work out. Now it's today.
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: Now I'm making a new decision. I'm changing things up
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: and take one more stab at him, but in a
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: different kind of way. Um, I'm curious, though, what what's
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: your mindset? How do you approach that you spot a
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: big buck. Now what do you do over the next
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: couple of days to try to move in on him? Right?
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: So you know, again, if that's in my home state,
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: I'm probably going to be hunting a piece of ground
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: that I know extremely well. That that I know, um,
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: how they travel in that woods and and where they
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: bed and all that. And if you have that knowledge,
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: now you're one step up. Uh And and truthfully, I
• 47:26
  Speaker 1: I really I like to kill my dear and for
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: a year, for other than before I had kids, I
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: killed them all, like my New York dear, Like the
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: first day or two, that's when you need to kill
• 47:37
  Speaker 1: deer because everybody else isn't in the woods screwing it up.
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: But say it's it's this time. We're in your scenario,
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: in your situation, and you see a good buck. There's
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: a reason he's there. Um. And I would also take
• 47:50
  Speaker 1: into account what other deer are with him, and if
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: I've seen him with those other deer, if he's still
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: running in a bit of a bachelor group, if he
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: singled himself off, I mean, if he's in a bachelor group,
• 48:01
  Speaker 1: and you you know, just for instance, um, I kill
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: a real wide buck, you're I don't know ten or
• 48:07
  Speaker 1: twelve years ago, and uh, he was with two deer
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: two bucks all the time, like these same two bucks.
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: And then these two bucks would show up. Um it
• 48:15
  Speaker 1: was almost like he used them as a guard. Like
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: these two little thing bets would just go everywhere, and
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: I pretty much patterned to those deer. He would always
• 48:22
  Speaker 1: show up behind him. It might be ten that's behind them,
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: but he would be there. And I killed this deer.
• 48:27
  Speaker 1: He actually came out into a bit of a it's
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: just a grown up field and it's like a CRP field.
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: And I saw these two small bucks and anyways, that
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: buck staged up and he never moved from that corner.
• 48:41
  Speaker 1: But I only I was in a sputting observation stand
• 48:44
  Speaker 1: I wasn't even trying to kill anything. And I saw
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: those little bucks, and I paid attention to what those
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: little deer did. And those little deer did everything that
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: the rest of the deer do when they go the
• 48:54
  Speaker 1: way they went, So I knew where they were gonna
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: go gonna go and where they were gonna feed. And
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: there was there was a steel that's a different piece
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: of property, and I thought they're gonna go over into
• 49:04
  Speaker 1: these these um sleybeans and probably eat soybeans in this
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: hidden field and uh in the dark. And then they're
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: either going to bed in that woods across the street,
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: which they tend to. Um. So I kind of watched
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: what those other deer were doing, and whatever the two
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: smallest bucks did, I figured that buck is gonna follow suit.
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: And I killed him the following morning because they did
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: just that. I figured they're either going to bed across
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: that road, which he did. Um, they went over and
• 49:31
  Speaker 1: eight sleybeans, and I went out and glass them. Um
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: literally a sun up, I'm glassing these deer. They're coming
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: down this little draw. But anyways, glassed them and I
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: knew what stand to get in and I spooked deer
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: that were in the woods, but I didn't spook the
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: deer that I wanted to kill. Um. And so in
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: that circumstance, it's kind of a tough one. But paying
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: attention to all not just that deer, but like the
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: cause and effect and where he might go as there
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: other food sources. Is he going to stay here? Now
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: there's another geer I killed one time. Um, he was
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: your typical like h like an old man, like you know,
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: he's like all of us. He's like, I'm getting like,
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: I like people and stuff, but I would just as
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: soon stay at home on a Friday night and have
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: four or five beers by myself. And you know, like, no,
• 50:19
  Speaker 1: I don't want to go to the bars, and I
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: don't want to be around a ton of people. If
• 50:23
  Speaker 1: I do, it's like a small group. And I think
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: Big Bucks of that way. Um, you don't want to
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: dick They don't want to dick around with all these
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: little morons. They literally want to push them away and
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: were they just want to walk alone. They want to
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: go to their own spot. And when I see a
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: big Buck that is private. Man, he's killable. Like I
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: like that, Um, because there's less you know, where all
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: the other deer are gonna go. He's not gonna go there,
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: and you can kind of figure out where the next
• 50:47
  Speaker 1: best spot is. So um, you know, there's so much
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: that that comes into play. I think I should just
• 50:52
  Speaker 1: come out there and get a Michigan tag and try
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: and kill this thing for you. He's point, we'll do
• 50:59
  Speaker 1: it together. I'm gonna try to get done tonights before
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: you can get out here. But if not, I'll give
• 51:04
  Speaker 1: you a yeah, Well we'll we'll we'll both shoot on three, right,
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: and you just shoot on two. You But but yeah,
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: so you know, you'd have to have some history with
• 51:15
  Speaker 1: a deer to really be able to know him that.
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's just a deer. You know. If I'm
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: chasing a deer in my home state, um, I probably
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: know him really well. Like I'm already gonna know. Like
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: if he's in this field and he's gonna be here
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: at dark and he hasn't moved off this field that dark,
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: he's probably happy here and he's gonna he's gotta bed here.
• 51:34
  Speaker 1: He's gonna bed in this field, eat all night, and
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: get up and walk into this little thicket. But if
• 51:38
  Speaker 1: at sun uh, if that, you know, half an hour
• 51:41
  Speaker 1: before dark, he's already out of that field in two
• 51:44
  Speaker 1: fields over, I mean, good, who knows where he's gonna be.
• 51:47
  Speaker 1: You gotta figure out, um, you know, you gotta figure
• 51:50
  Speaker 1: out where he's gonna bed over there is he gonna
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: come back? But if he's hanging out in that in
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: that pocket, he might be there in the night. I
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: would hunt a good you know, I would figure out
• 51:58
  Speaker 1: how going in that woods in the morning. But that
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: would come down to having really intimate knowledge, um all
• 52:06
  Speaker 1: of that. I think it's harder to kill one on
• 52:08
  Speaker 1: a morning front when you have seen him in the evening,
• 52:13
  Speaker 1: because now he's got ten twelve hours to cover ground
• 52:16
  Speaker 1: and dick around, who knows where he's gonna be. But
• 52:18
  Speaker 1: when you can put one to bed and you watch
• 52:19
  Speaker 1: him walk into a thicket, that's when you can really
• 52:23
  Speaker 1: cheat in on them. And that's when you have to
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: know the bedding grounds, know the other gear nowhere, everything beds,
• 52:30
  Speaker 1: and that's when you gotta be risky and and take chances.
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: And uh um, that's I love killing him that way,
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: you know, putting them the bag and then' and I'll
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: literally call my wife and like I cannot get the
• 52:42
  Speaker 1: kids off the school bus. I just the buck I'm after. Literally,
• 52:45
  Speaker 1: I glass him this morning. He's in he's in the
• 52:48
  Speaker 1: pines and when he comes out of there, the wind
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: is going to be a southwest wind and I'm going
• 52:52
  Speaker 1: to drill him right here. I'm killing this deer to night.
• 52:54
  Speaker 1: I would say it's like chance. I like, my knaves
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: are sharp, the urn owners hooked up on like silling
• 53:01
  Speaker 1: this deer and uh and she she'll be like, yeah,
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: he said he's gonna kill that tonight. But I don't
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: say that very often. I mean, normally I don't go
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: for the throats. But if you have that scenario and
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: you bet him up, that's the way to kill him.
• 53:13
  Speaker 1: So if I were you, I would really try and
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: pinwheel where he is um and sit tight on him
• 53:21
  Speaker 1: and then slip in and and cut his throat on
• 53:24
  Speaker 1: an evening hunt, because they get him to follow him
• 53:28
  Speaker 1: up on a morning is tough. They just they can
• 53:30
  Speaker 1: cover so much ground. Yeah, and unfortunately in this case,
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: I do know the deer pretty well. I watched him
• 53:35
  Speaker 1: a lot last year, passed on him last year. I've
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: got a pretty darn good idea of the general zone
• 53:41
  Speaker 1: he's betting in most of the time. Um, So tonight
• 53:44
  Speaker 1: I'm kind of doing in the first two nights because
• 53:46
  Speaker 1: I saw him moving daylight out to this food source
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: that I originally didn't think he would come out too.
• 53:51
  Speaker 1: But I saw him. I was like, I'll take a
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: couple of easy shots. It's low impact starting the outside,
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: and now today I'm gonna push in deeper and go
• 53:59
  Speaker 1: inside closer to where I think he he will be betted.
• 54:02
  Speaker 1: So we'll see how it goes. Um. We have to.
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: That's cool, that's smart. I always tell people cheat their
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: way in and some guys don't get it. But um,
• 54:11
  Speaker 1: when you when I try not to break up a
• 54:14
  Speaker 1: you know, go into a woods very much. I'm really
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: trying to hunt on the property of them. But when
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: you do, a lot of times I'll go ten feet
• 54:20
  Speaker 1: into it woods, like when I'm when I'm trying to
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: sneak in on one like that unless I really know
• 54:25
  Speaker 1: it well, but especially on morning hunt, like I just
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: tiptoe into the woods ten feet hanging stand um, and
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: then if I'm not seeing what I want to, I'll
• 54:32
  Speaker 1: go thirty more yards in. And that's smart. Like I
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: it's a lot of work, and a lot of guys
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: don't want to do that. They want to and they
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: want to chomp in there and be heard of it.
• 54:40
  Speaker 1: But you know, the more information you get on that deer,
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: that's that's what what's gonna kill him. Yeah, Now, how
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: would this be or would this be any different if
• 54:50
  Speaker 1: you were hunting in Ohio or Kansas, um or how
• 54:54
  Speaker 1: how would your state your strategy start differing when you
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: went to one of these different states. As we're you know,
• 54:59
  Speaker 1: somewhere in October yeah. So, um, when you're hunting your
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: home state, you know the ground extremely well and you
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: know who Kennan can't be on the ground, or you know,
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: you know like okay, man, I gotta go for a
• 55:13
  Speaker 1: throat because everybody's in here, or hey, this is a
• 55:16
  Speaker 1: little pocket that I know, nobody's hunting here. I got time.
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: When you go out of state, um, I I pretty
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: much just walk in or public land. UM. I do
• 55:25
  Speaker 1: have a couple of places over the years I've gotten,
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: especially in Kansas, that are just that are great private pieces. Um.
• 55:31
  Speaker 1: But they pretty much almost give anybody permission anything. But
• 55:36
  Speaker 1: you know, there's a different there's a different aggressiveness that
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: I admittedly turned on when UM I hunt out of state,
• 55:45
  Speaker 1: and UM, I wouldn't call it a desperation, but my
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: hunting style has really changed. I think everybody changes, and
• 55:51
  Speaker 1: I should probably touch based on that. When you were
• 55:53
  Speaker 1: talking about scouting, Like when I was a kid, I
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: scouted like a maniac, and really for the past fifteen years,
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: I've scouted really hard. I'll know where there's six or
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: seven shooters. Um. Now they have kids in in a
• 56:04
  Speaker 1: business and soccer practices of the kids and all this stuff.
• 56:07
  Speaker 1: Like that's out the window. I really mean, I do
• 56:11
  Speaker 1: not scout like a meniac anymore. But I don't have to.
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: I know I know where a good deer is going
• 56:16
  Speaker 1: to be, and I know that all I gotta do
• 56:18
  Speaker 1: is glass them up, and I know the ground, like
• 56:19
  Speaker 1: I know how I'm going to kill him. Really not
• 56:21
  Speaker 1: that hard here to get them killed anymore. I've gotten
• 56:25
  Speaker 1: extremely aggressive. I used to wait and be patient. I'm
• 56:29
  Speaker 1: gonna try and get this dear. I hope he comes here,
• 56:32
  Speaker 1: and you know this is a good area I'm gonna
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: I used to just kill him a patients and now
• 56:37
  Speaker 1: I'm literally like, yeah, I can't let it. I can't.
• 56:39
  Speaker 1: You know, today's face Friday. I can't hut again until Wednesday.
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: Like if I think that deer is somewhere, I'm gonna
• 56:45
  Speaker 1: kill him. And I have a great confidence in the
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: fact that now I'm either going to kill him or
• 56:51
  Speaker 1: oh well, I blew them out of here. I have
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: I don't know how many raps, I mean, they're I
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: have antlers every I have tons of good kills into
• 56:59
  Speaker 1: my belt, so if I blow one out of there,
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: I don't really care, Whereas I would almost make myself
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: throw up if I if I blew a big buck out.
• 57:09
  Speaker 1: So I really think hunting with that mindset like not caring,
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: Like I like not that I don't care, but it's
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: not gonna be the end of my life. This is
• 57:18
  Speaker 1: not going to be a big blemish in my hunting career.
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: If I bump this bucker or if he runs over
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: and somebody else kills him, it doesn't hurt me anymore.
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: It's no big deal. And all that's done has made
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: me even more deadly because now I'm like, yep, I
• 57:32
  Speaker 1: don't care if this I got a good feeling about it.
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: I'm going after this dear. He's in trouble. And when
• 57:36
  Speaker 1: you go into it with that attitude, it's kind of
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: like truthully, it's like killing deer or anything in life
• 57:41
  Speaker 1: that it's kind of like dating girls. One time I
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: was at a bar when I wasn't illegal to drink,
• 57:45
  Speaker 1: and these two beautiful girls came in and all the
• 57:47
  Speaker 1: guys in the bar, my buddies, like, man, we're like
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: a nobody went and talk to them, and I made
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: a joke. I'm like, I'm gonna go just flirt them
• 57:54
  Speaker 1: up and tell him I'm gorgeous. And I just want
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: to flirted with these girls and talk to him. And
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: you know, it was way over my head with these
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: two beautiful women. I think I was like eighteen, I
• 58:02
  Speaker 1: shouldn't even been in a bar, and nobody talks to
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: these girls because they're so hot. You know. There, I
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: did something that you know, I was aggressive about it.
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: I just learned them to talk to him. And in
• 58:14
  Speaker 1: eighteen I learned like, yeah, nobody's talking to these beautiful women.
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: And truthfully, I've always dated beautiful women because I don't
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: think anybody's talking to him there and people are inconfident
• 58:23
  Speaker 1: to go talk to him. And killing deer is the
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: same way. If I know where there's a big deer,
• 58:27
  Speaker 1: even trouble, I'm gonna go kill them. And and other
• 58:29
  Speaker 1: people tip toe around it or they you know their
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: their tactics are weak and have a good have know
• 58:34
  Speaker 1: what you're gonna say to these pretty girls and freaking
• 58:36
  Speaker 1: go for it. And the same thing with a deer.
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: You know what the wind is, and I have some
• 58:41
  Speaker 1: balls and go in there and and uh and get
• 58:43
  Speaker 1: them killed, you know, do it with do it with
• 58:46
  Speaker 1: some uh conviction and some confidence and some some evidence
• 58:50
  Speaker 1: to back up your what you're doing and it works.
• 58:53
  Speaker 1: I mean, I really thought my hunting career was kind
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: of gonna go downhill because they wasn't spending the time
• 58:58
  Speaker 1: that I used to. Dude, it's easier for me to
• 59:01
  Speaker 1: kill deer now than it ever has been because I
• 59:02
  Speaker 1: just don't care. I mean I do caresh saying that
• 59:05
  Speaker 1: in a sarcastic way, like I don't if I don't
• 59:08
  Speaker 1: kill ader this year, and I don't, I have piles
• 59:12
  Speaker 1: of them, it doesn't matter. I want, Yeah, I want
• 59:15
  Speaker 1: to kill one, but I don't really matter. And that
• 59:19
  Speaker 1: takes the edge off. So so what are the what
• 59:23
  Speaker 1: are the things that you are doing when you say
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: like you know, I don't care, so I'm going to
• 59:27
  Speaker 1: be aggressive because you don't have the time, You're gonna
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: just go for it. Like, what's an example of something
• 59:33
  Speaker 1: you're doing now that you would call the aggressive going
• 59:36
  Speaker 1: for the throat kind of move, you know? For I
• 59:38
  Speaker 1: might think in my head, it's like, well, like what
• 59:40
  Speaker 1: I was what I'm doing tonight. I know that I'm
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: gonna I'm pushing in much farther into the property than
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: I usually would early, and I know that the wind direction,
• 59:48
  Speaker 1: like some deer will win me, like it's inevitable some
• 59:51
  Speaker 1: deer gonna win me. But I believe that based off
• 59:53
  Speaker 1: everything I know about this deer, based of all the history,
• 59:56
  Speaker 1: I think there's a damn good chance that he'll use
• 59:58
  Speaker 1: this wind in a certain way which will put him
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: buy me. And either it's gonna be I'm gonna kill him,
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 1: or you know, I want to blow some deer and
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: maybe he'll do something different and maybe he'll he'll win
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 1: me too. But I've got a good feeling I'm going
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 1: into the kill zone. UM, high risk, high reward kind
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 1: of situation, Like what are those situations for you? Now
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: you're doing this kind of thing? What does that look like? Yeah,
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 1: and that's the right add a team to have. UM.
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 1: I always say like high risk, high reward, and I'm
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 1: a dent behind that. However, I pad my bets extremely well,
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 1: Like you know, I will go into a a spot
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 1: and and say, oh, you know, I mean, you're gonna
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 1: kill them. But truthfully, I already know so much about
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 1: this deer and so much about this area, like I'm
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 1: probably gonna kill him, Like I don't think, you know,
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 1: I'm trying to be cool and say, oh, it doesn't
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: matter I'm gonna you know, high risk, high reward. Um,
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 1: it is a high risk, but it's extremely well calculated risk.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 1: Like I wouldn't make that risk if the wind was bad,
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 1: I'd be like, no, I can't go after the steers tonight.
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 1: Uh And you get that too, and uh, like I
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 1: don't want to preach to people like, yeah, go in
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: and go after him, Like, if everything's perfect, definitely go
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: in and go after him. Um. You know, when those
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 1: two girls walk in the bar, if they have two
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 1: dudes with them, do not go over and say the
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 1: things that you were going to stay here that wait
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 1: till the girls are alone and then say it. It's
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 1: the same thing with the deer. So yeah, I killed them.
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 1: I killed I had a guy show me a picture
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 1: of a drop time buck. This was quite a while ago,
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 1: I don't know, seven or eight years ago, and I
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 1: had I had glassed the deer. He's a really nice
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: I think he was four and a half, which for
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 1: us is um, I mean that's a dinosaur around here.
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: People they just don't live to that age. And he
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: was he was actually he was a good deer. Uh.
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 1: He I wanted him to live another year and he
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 1: was living in this pocket that not a lot of
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 1: people had permission on, and um, I was not going
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 1: to kill him. And this dude shows me the picture
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 1: of this deer and he has permission on this ground
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 1: and I'm like, oh yeah, you know that's great. And
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 1: he's like, I'm gonna kill this year and I thought, man,
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 1: so it sounds d but it's like, screw it. I'm
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 1: gonna like is this if this deer shows up where
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 1: I think he is, this kid, this guy's gonna blow
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 1: him out of this would And of course, so I
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 1: go and I just laughed. And of course that deer
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 1: showed up that you know, the finally the first evening,
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 1: I looked for him because this guy blew him out.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 1: So it's like, I'm gonna put this deer to sleep,
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 1: you know, I'm gonna I watched him that whole evening.
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: In the morning, I went in and put that deer
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: to sleep, just like we were talking. And it's like
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 1: I'm killing this deer, Like this deer knows that all
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 1: the pressure everybody came into the woods. It was the
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: opening day. I think I killed him the second day
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: and that was the thing. It's like, I'm killing this
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 1: deer and I hung a stand for him, which that's
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 1: I don't like hanging stands, Like, uh, I'm always amazed
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: how guys will hang stands in July, you know, and
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 1: they're all proud that they got all their stands trimmed
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 1: and everything. And it's like, okay, that's great for the rut,
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 1: like if you put it in a gray rut spot.
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 1: But like they're hanging these off the wall stands, and
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: it's like, man, you guys must know more than me,
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 1: because it seems like a lot of times like this,
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 1: a block will happen to come out like just out
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 1: of half it, he'll come out this trail and this,
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 1: you know, this would be the perfect tree. And so
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 1: a lot of times I'll hang a stand for a
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 1: deer and it sucks because you're you're screwing up the
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 1: you know, you're sweating, you're hanging a stand quick. But
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 1: if you're efficient about it doesn't have the perfect you
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 1: don't have any shooting leanes trim but um, that's when
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 1: you know. That's when you're going for his throat. But
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 1: I would only do that with that knowledge and information,
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 1: and I figured, you know what I mean, they're gonna
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 1: kill this deer um or blow them out of here,
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 1: and you know, I I killed him. So that and
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: that was work. That was great, But it also came
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 1: down I knew the deer, I knew his escape patterns,
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 1: and I knew where he was living. He was going
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 1: back between these two woods. And I figured once these
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 1: guys hit this wood, this guy was hunting him, that
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 1: buddy of hunting them. I mean, they were all going
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 1: to try and kill this deer. We all went in
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 1: there and completely blew this deer out of the woods.
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 1: And once they did that, they pushed him over to
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 1: actually they can hunt where I killed them too. But um,
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 1: they pushed him over there and I killed them. But
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 1: it came with knowledge. It wasn't like um, you know,
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 1: and I didn't have to stand there. If I wouldn't
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 1: have taken that risk, I wouldn't have that opportunity. There's
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 1: there's a there's a million there. There's a million other
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 1: stories that I went for deer and blew them out.
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 1: So I don't want you to think that every time
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 1: I go for him, I get them. But it's I
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 1: would say, it's really poice seven. At the time of
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 1: the time, if I decide, like I'm I'm I'm gonna
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 1: go for I'm gonna push the envelope. Um, I'm gonna
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 1: get this deer. You you get them, but it comes
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 1: with a calculated risk. There's knowledge behind it. And I'm
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 1: not just gonna go sit in my lucky stand. And
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 1: if I don't have a reason, like it's I don't know.
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 1: Our season has been open. We just stay of the
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 1: fourth Since our fourth day, I haven't even been hunting yet,
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 1: um because I haven't found anything worth shooting. I'm not
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 1: hunting deer or I'm I want to hunt a deer. Um.
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 1: And when I go sit like, there's if I'm sitting
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 1: in a tree stands, there's like I'm after something. Otherwise
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 1: I'm just sitting in what I always call observation stands.
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 1: They're skyscrapers. They're really high, and usually they're in spots
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 1: that I can see three or four different either fields
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: or travel corridors or something, and I'm, you know, I'm
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 1: getting education. And then once I realized like, oh man,
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 1: this is the place, you know, I gotta get in there.
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 1: He's gonna bed. Then I slip in and go for those.
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 1: And I think a lot of guys are like that. Like,
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 1: I don't think you see that on the TV shows
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 1: and stuff because they can't do that on the TV
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 1: show you know there, and they don't have to. They're hunting,
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 1: you know, mega beautiful river bottoms and stuff. And I
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 1: hate them that for that, But we don't hate them
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 1: for that. But if I was a multi millionaire, I
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: would buy Beautiful all my buddies. Yeah, And we always
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 1: always say that. People will be like, oh, I hate
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: that show is ridiculous, and it's like, yeah, it was ridiculous.
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 1: But if I was a multi millionaire, I would actually
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: own a beautiful river about But I enjoy watching run
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: past Me. But yeah, but that's why they don't see
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 1: that on most TV shows. They can't. You can't hunt
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: that way. One of these one of these aggressive moves
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 1: of sorts. One of the things that I hear from
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 1: so many of the best deer hunters out there is
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 1: trying to hunt a buck when he has the wind
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 1: in his favor to a degree, And we kind of
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 1: we talked about wind a little bit last time on
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 1: on our last podcast conversation a couple of years ago.
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 1: But I want to dive into this just a little
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 1: bit further because it's something that I'm trying to implement
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 1: myself more and more. You know, early on, I was
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 1: always obsessed with the wind, but always obsessed with how
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 1: do I hunt so that the there's the very least
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 1: chance of any deer winding me. I need the wind
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 1: as safe as possible. I was always obsessing over that.
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: But then you start seeing more and more. And this
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 1: is not a rule, um, but it seems like maybe
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 1: more often than not, these bucks that get old and
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 1: big are typically smart about how they move around on
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 1: a landscape, and they like to not again not saying
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 1: they always do, but it seems like a lot of
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 1: times they like to have the wind or use the
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: wind in some way. So maybe that means they're moving
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 1: into the wind or quartering to the wind, or the winds,
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 1: you know, coming across their face as they head into
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 1: a food source or when they go into bed. That
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 1: seems to be something that I'm trying to pay attention
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 1: to more, and a lot of other guys are too.
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 1: So this is all to say, as I'm thinking about
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 1: when you want to when you want to hunt a spot,
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 1: you want to try to find a way that the
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 1: wind is seemingly that the deer would want to approach
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 1: this area because he thinks that he's able to smell
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 1: it's ahead of him. But also somehow just cut the
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 1: corner of it with your wind so that he doesn't
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 1: wind you even though he thinks he's getting into an
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 1: area safely. And so I'm trying to do Yeah, so
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 1: it's okay. So one more thing, though, I'm just gonna
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 1: add one more addendum to this, one little thing, and
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 1: then I want to hear your thoughts. So that sounds
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 1: really good. But every time I ever try it, it
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 1: always seems way easier said than done, because you get
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 1: a addicted wind of let's say, west southwest wind or whatever.
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 1: And if if it stays and it really is west southwest,
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 1: or if it really is west whatever I want, if
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 1: it's really west, and I set up just perfectly cutting
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 1: the angle, and I know the buckwell, and I think
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 1: he's gonna come from just here, it'll be fine. But
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 1: then so many times you get what they call west wind,
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 1: but it's west southwest for five minutes, and it's west
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 1: northwest for ten minutes, and then's due north for thirty seconds,
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 1: and then it's west for the rest of the time.
• 1:08:26
  Speaker 1: It's always moving around. You can never get it just
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 1: seems like to me it's so hard to get a
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 1: perfectly consistent as forecasted wind. So how do you if
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 1: this is something you do, how do you think about
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 1: cutting the corner on a deer being aggressive, but then
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 1: also knowing like man, mother nature is finicky and it's
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 1: never quite as you expect, right right, yeah, and those
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 1: are with all of that, um there, you know I'm
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 1: not I'm not very sandy. I'm the and all the
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 1: apps with the winds and all that jazz. Um. I
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 1: literally go out and check the wind. I have. I
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 1: love aviation, so I have a wind sock, and I
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 1: watched the windsock. I watched the tree leaves. And you
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 1: can't bank on what whatever you know, whatever the phone
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 1: tells you it's going to be. It is amazing how
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: accurate it is. But that's where it comes down to
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 1: hunting your home ground. You've got to know that. Okay,
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 1: when I stepped outside of my house, there's a big
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 1: woods here, that wind is actually gonna show me southwest. Um.
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 1: But when I get down uh where I want to hunt,
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 1: four miles from here, there's a big rolling hill and
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 1: then there's a hill that comes up heavy on the east,
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 1: and it seems like when the wind hits that, no
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 1: matter what the southwest wind is at home, it seems
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 1: to blow out of the south more because it swirls
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 1: off that. So it's funny how wherever you are the
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: wind is going to be dictated to the by the surrounding.
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 1: The corn will change it. So if there's corn up,
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 1: like I like hunting fields, would edges with the corn up, Um,
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 1: I can't. I can't hunt some of this stuff. When
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 1: the corn comes off, it changes the wind. So being
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 1: a being a wind geek is extremely important and having
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 1: balls and saying, uh this, I know this deer is
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 1: gonna be better knowing the ground and knowing like he's
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 1: gonna be better here. This is how he's gonna come out. Um.
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 1: And I know that all these little bucks are over here,
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 1: so I know that this buck is not gonna want
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 1: to deal with them. He's gonna cut this edge. I'm
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 1: going for it. Now, you're gonna spook all those little
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 1: bucks good. I don't want them there anywhere, like I don't.
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 1: I don't want to deal with them. And there's other
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 1: times it's like, man, once the deer get past me,
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 1: they're going to spook. Um, I'm okay with that one time,
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: Like I will do that, just just that time. I'm
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 1: going to kill him, and I'll kill a lot of
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 1: deer where it's like, man, I add every day that
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 1: walks out, they spook and I like try and spook,
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 1: but I'm literally like shaking my hand like fun, like
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 1: you know, yeah, and I want them to like leave
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 1: and go far enough. Wait that buck doesn't see them
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 1: standing there. And uh, there was one spot in particular
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 1: that I feel two good deer coming out of this
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 1: corner and it's literally that it's like every deer that
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 1: came out, and I'm I'm almost like anxious, like sick
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 1: to my stomach that I'm spooking these deer until that
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 1: buck comes out and you can see him chewing his
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 1: cut and it's like, yes, he has no deer has
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 1: no idea. I get done, and you almost get this arrogance.
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 1: I get giddy. I'm literally like he had this deer
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 1: is done, Like I got it. You are I never
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 1: say I got it until I got but it's like, yeah,
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 1: you're not getting out of your lives. It's just like
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 1: a miracle Um. But that comes with hunting, not just
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 1: hunting for a long time, but hunting that area for
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 1: a long time, and hunting having tons of experience and
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 1: and screwing things up. But when you screw it up,
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 1: figure out why you screwed it up and what went
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 1: wrong there, and put it in your put it in
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 1: your little book of knowledge for next time, and you
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 1: get enough of those little note it's the odds are
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 1: in your favor, um. But taking those chances is good,
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 1: but it has to be calculated. I feel bad, like,
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 1: now a bunch of people are going to run out,
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 1: and I know you have a huge podcast following. I'm
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 1: afraid like a bunch of guys are gonna screw up
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 1: their ground and hate me. Calculation balancing. There's there's certain
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 1: times to go for the home run, and then there's
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 1: a whole bunch of other times where it's better to
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 1: be safe, Scout glass um. And so so you're right,
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 1: it definitely comes down to making those calculated decisions. Now,
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 1: I guess with that in mind, what are the things
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 1: going on in your head that help you determine should
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 1: I go for the home run or should I play
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 1: it safe? Like is it I gotta believe it's probably
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 1: a mix of what you saw, like the intel you
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 1: have is maybe a mix of what are the conditions,
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 1: And then maybe it's a mixture of like how much
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 1: time do I have or what's the hunting pressure? Uh?
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 1: Is that right? Are there other things? Yeah? You're on.
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 1: I mean, at this point in my life, it's like,
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 1: all right, can I you know, if I see a
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 1: good like if I see a big one, I am
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 1: going to be extremely aggressive on that deer because I
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 1: don't you know, you used to hunt. I mean I
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 1: would literally hunt every day of the hunting season, you know,
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 1: years ago. Um, I enjoy it. I just can't do
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 1: that anymore. And now I look at it. It's like, man,
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 1: I think about how much time I would rather take
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 1: two days off work and hunt like a maniac once
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 1: I find a big one and do as much research
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 1: and kill him in two days than to take two
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 1: weeks off like a lot of you guys take two
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 1: or three weeks off to hunt their home state. And
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 1: it's like that's ridiculous, Like you should really be able
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 1: to get this deer killed. I would rather go a
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 1: hundred and ten percent for a little bit of time
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 1: to get him killed than to go mediocre. Uh pace
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 1: and uh and and that has a lot to do
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 1: with it. Like, you know, if I think he's in
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 1: a killable spot, I'm definitely going for it. However, there's
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 1: been you know, Joe had made a phenomenal comment in
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 1: that previous episode. It was an episode two or something
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 1: that you had done um about and I won't I'll
• 1:13:59
  Speaker 1: screw it up, I won't build a quota. But he
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 1: had made a comment that really struck home with me.
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 1: And he's like he made a comment about there's a
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 1: there's a spot in his woods or there's there'll be
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 1: a spot in the woods that it just has all
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 1: this great sign there's trails everywhere and there's well up
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 1: scrapes and it's it's just perfect if I could just
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 1: get down in there. But I know that's an unhuntable spot.
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 1: Like you, it's never right there. The entrance and escape
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 1: is wrong. The wind switches all the time, and they're
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 1: all you're gonna do is ruin it. Yes, learn that,
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 1: learn that discipline that this isn't unhunt Like there are
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 1: spots that you don't try and hunt that don't even
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 1: put a camera in there. You're just screwing it up.
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 1: Stay out of that. It might only be a hundred
• 1:14:40
  Speaker 1: yard radius. Um, nothing is right in there, like you.
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 1: You can't you can't attack them in there. Let don't
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 1: let them know that you're in the area. Stay out
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 1: of that and just hunt the periphery and in and
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 1: do it right, and you're gonna kill stuff. But people
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 1: don't do that. They see all this sign and they're like, all,
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 1: my god, I'm planting to stand in here, and it's like, uh,
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 1: you just literally ruined this would But the only pid
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 1: thing for somebody like me is once I see that stand,
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 1: I know good. This guy just blew all that. He's
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 1: going to blow these deer out of here. I'm gonna
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 1: hunt the escape routes and people literally funnel deer for
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 1: me in all these places I hunt because not that
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 1: they're stupid, but they're they're not paying attention to the
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 1: cause and effect of what they're doing. So go ruin
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 1: the best spot in the woods and then they come.
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 1: Then they come to me on the escape routes and
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 1: it's like perfect, and you drill them. Um, so knowing
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 1: when to go for it, I mean it's kind of
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 1: like you know when a poker player knows when to
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 1: make a bluff. I mean, you just gotta know it,
• 1:15:43
  Speaker 1: and it comes from experience, and you gotta go out
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 1: there and whatever you do every night, Like I remember
• 1:15:48
  Speaker 1: right making notes because I think Dwight Chu or somebody had,
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 1: you know, said that, like he I don't know if
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 1: it was Dwight, but somebody had written. They wrote down
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 1: like everything every day's hunt. And I did that for
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 1: like a year, and then I was like, I've never
• 1:16:01
  Speaker 1: went back and read any of those notes, but I
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 1: can remember every hunt pretty much, every wind direction and
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 1: every I can tell you every deer I've ever shot,
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 1: how part of the distance was. Like you can't get
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 1: that stuff out of your mind. And when you have
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 1: all that recollection, um, it's just knowledge. But don't be
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 1: afraid to look back on it in your mind and
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 1: be like, yeah, I don't remember, you know, I remember
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 1: hunting this and I could never get away with getting
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 1: in here. Well take that into account, like that should
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 1: teach you something like every time I go in here,
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 1: I blowed your out and I've never killed a deer
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 1: in here. Stay out of there. There are thoughts like
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 1: that that you can't hunt. And when Joe made that comment.
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: It was like, yeah, this dude the killer. He knows,
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 1: he knows to stay out of that, and he knows
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 1: to just let them feel comfortable and let their guard down,
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 1: and they're gonna get killed. And you know, like I
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 1: I like the idea that deer are these smart old
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 1: deer and all this stuff. They're not animals. They have
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 1: great instincts and are very habitual. Um, a buck is
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 1: definitely gonna put his nose in the wind, I think.
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 1: And he's definitely good. He's I mean a lot. How
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 1: many times have you seen a good buck step into
• 1:17:10
  Speaker 1: a field but not quite into it. He's still got
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 1: you know, all the briers and brush standing right in
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 1: front of him, and he just stands out for forty
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 1: five minutes and it's like, dude, step out. He's just
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 1: that's his habit. He's just that's what. He's a lazy buck.
• 1:17:25
  Speaker 1: And I think he's gotten old because he happens to
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 1: not like to go out into the field until it's start.
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 1: He's not smart, he just that's his habit and that
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 1: habit has gotten mold. So once you figure that, okay,
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 1: he's gonna come out here, just you figure out how
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 1: to beat his system, and that's it seems to work.
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 1: You know, it's just the thought process. A random comment
• 1:17:50
  Speaker 1: you made a little back a little while back ago.
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 1: I just want to get a little more information on
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 1: before we move forward. You were talking about wind and
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 1: how different local things on your property might change is
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 1: wind and you've got to know how they all these
• 1:18:01
  Speaker 1: things impact it. You said that standing corn changes the
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 1: wind for you, and when the corn comes out that
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 1: changes things again. How do you see standing corn or
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 1: corn fields getting cleared change the wind direction. Uh, It's
• 1:18:18
  Speaker 1: it's not like I could put a science behind it
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 1: and say, oh, you know, when the corn is up,
• 1:18:21
  Speaker 1: it it definitely guddens the wind. Or when the corn
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 1: is up, you know there's this one spot it has
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 1: this nice rolling hill and um, there's a certain spot
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 1: down on this hedgerow that whether there's corn or not
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 1: there there doesn't seem to ever be any wind. It's
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 1: like this little dead zone. When the corn is up,
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 1: that spot is huge, like it's a hundred yards You
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 1: get a hundred yards in there, but when the corn
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 1: is off, there's like this twenty yard pocket that it
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 1: just always seems to be dead and just paying attention
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 1: as I'm walking places like and the wind was just
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 1: beating me in the back and now it's extremely dead here.
• 1:18:57
  Speaker 1: I've taken the time to walk back up a hill
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 1: before and then they're like, yeah, the wind is still
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 1: blowing hard right here, and then walk back down and
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 1: it's like it's not blowing hard here. But just observing
• 1:19:07
  Speaker 1: those little things. Um, there's just different places that I
• 1:19:10
  Speaker 1: can't explain why it is, but that's how it is.
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 1: And and I've been observant to know, like the winds
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 1: is going to do this in this spot when it's
• 1:19:20
  Speaker 1: when it's doing this when it's a north wind up here, Um,
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 1: it's gonna be a northwest wind in this spot. And
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 1: that's a That's actually another thing that I'm a maniac
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 1: for his odd winds. Man, if I get an east wind,
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 1: something is gonna die. Like today it was actually an
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 1: east wind. I have to go check out check the
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 1: window now, but um it was an east wind. Uh
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 1: here And may east winds driving wild because there's so
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 1: many spots that I can't hunt because I really need
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 1: I set everything up for a southwest wind. But man,
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 1: when you get an east wind, especially when a deer
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 1: in my opinion, beds with the southwest wind when he
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 1: goes in and definitely does put his nose um in
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 1: the wind, and then all of a sudden the wind
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 1: changed up. He still wants to go out to where
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 1: he had planned on going. And if the wind is
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 1: it his back and he hasn't been pressured bad, he's
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 1: gonna walk out there. He's still smelling the wind all
• 1:20:11
  Speaker 1: around him. He's gonna use his eyes and his hearing
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 1: to make sure that everything ahead of him is okay.
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 1: He's gonna feel very confident that he's gonna be able
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 1: to see everything and hear everything, and he's gonna be
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 1: able to smell everything behind them. So they walk with her.
• 1:20:25
  Speaker 1: In my opinion, somebody out there is gonna be like, oh,
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 1: this guy is stupid. They don't walk with their you
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 1: know knows not in the wind. But I'm here to
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 1: tell you they walk with her, knows with the wind
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 1: that they're back. Um. They have wonderful ice fight in
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 1: wonderful vision. Um. And if I can catch an odd
• 1:20:40
  Speaker 1: wind like that, something's gonna If there's a big one,
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna that's a great hunting odd wind like And
• 1:20:46
  Speaker 1: when you hang stand sets if I have a good
• 1:20:49
  Speaker 1: thicket or something, um, and I know, like, okay, they
• 1:20:53
  Speaker 1: tend to come out here, they tend to come out there.
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 1: If I'm pin a deer down, I'll hang a southwest
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 1: stand for him. But if I can sneak in there
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 1: and hanging east wind stands, oh man, I will hang
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 1: on east wind stand and if the soon as the
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 1: wind changes on in that stand. And that's what I'm
• 1:21:07
  Speaker 1: actually hoping to get lucky, um and and have a
• 1:21:11
  Speaker 1: good betting area exposed to me from an angle that
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 1: I usually can't get in on. And that's so exciting.
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 1: I get giddy. It's like, man, when there's an east wind,
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 1: that's why say, oh my god, I can I cannot wait.
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 1: I hope this doesn't change. Um. But the disciplined level
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 1: is when you get in that east wind stand and
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 1: you're in early and everything is good, and then that
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 1: wind switches and it starts blowing into the bedding grounds,
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 1: get out, like, don't be that guy that just sits
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 1: there and then let's just scent blow in there for
• 1:21:40
  Speaker 1: the next two hours. Just know that the gig is
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 1: up and get out and recircle and use that night
• 1:21:46
  Speaker 1: is a is a scouting tool and see what happens,
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 1: because a lot of guys just sit there and it's like, Nope,
• 1:21:52
  Speaker 1: the gig is up, get out. And I've done it too.
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 1: I've sat there and then it's like, ah, I screwed
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 1: this up. I should have left that. Yeah. Yeah, So
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 1: you mentioned that you know, lots of times a buck
• 1:22:04
  Speaker 1: will like to use the wind, but on occasion they
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 1: will walk with the wind to their backs to get
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 1: in certain spots. And you've talked about that lots of times.
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 1: There might be a big old buck that hangs up
• 1:22:13
  Speaker 1: at the edge of the field. Um, there's certain things
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 1: you've seen over and over over your years of chasing
• 1:22:18
  Speaker 1: the biggest holdest bucks around. Are there any other Now?
• 1:22:22
  Speaker 1: I know these aren't rules, there's nothing like, if there's
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 1: anything that's true about big mature bucks that they're all different,
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 1: But are there any other high level trends that you've
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 1: kind of seen over the years as far as what
• 1:22:34
  Speaker 1: makes them mature buck different than a young buck, as
• 1:22:37
  Speaker 1: far as their behavior, what they do any other like
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 1: key things you're always thinking about and mature bucks probably
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 1: gonna do this, mature bucks probably going to do that.
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 1: That helped guide you you know a couple of things.
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 1: For instance, learn they're not. I mean I would say
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 1: these big bucks are nocturnal and this and that. Um,
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 1: I think they're I think they are observant things that,
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 1: um they don't like to be bothered. And I think
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 1: that's the big thing that in our we like instant gratification,
• 1:23:07
  Speaker 1: especially with these trail cameras and stuff. And I think
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 1: this supplies to like my home state and some of
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 1: these high pressure states more than it would um in
• 1:23:19
  Speaker 1: other states. Um going in and out of the woods
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 1: and screwing them up and driving your four wheeler, um,
• 1:23:26
  Speaker 1: putting checking your trail cameras, uh even every two weeks.
• 1:23:30
  Speaker 1: It's like, dude, just stay out of there. Like I
• 1:23:32
  Speaker 1: literally don't put trail cameras in any I don't really
• 1:23:36
  Speaker 1: run them too much, but if I do, I literally
• 1:23:39
  Speaker 1: I don't put them on food sources too much. Like
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 1: I try and put them, um like where they might
• 1:23:43
  Speaker 1: cross the road just to see what's in there, because
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 1: I don't want to screw They know that you're in there,
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 1: like they if you walk into my house with buddy boots,
• 1:23:50
  Speaker 1: like I'm gonna know, like Jesus, these aren't my boot
• 1:23:52
  Speaker 1: tracks like somebody's in my house, and I'm pretty sure
• 1:23:56
  Speaker 1: when you go walking through their stuff and keep checking stuff,
• 1:24:00
  Speaker 1: like they're onto that and I've noticed, you know, I'll
• 1:24:03
  Speaker 1: get a picture of a of a dough profile broadside
• 1:24:07
  Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden it's looking at the camera,
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden it's noses on the camera,
• 1:24:11
  Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden it's walking away, and
• 1:24:13
  Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, that that they knew that that cameras
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 1: They're like, I'm not a big fan of that type
• 1:24:19
  Speaker 1: of stuff. So that's something I don't know. It's find
• 1:24:22
  Speaker 1: a little trick to killing big bucks. But the other
• 1:24:25
  Speaker 1: thing I was gonna say is, um, I can't believe
• 1:24:28
  Speaker 1: how many people like if if you have the day
• 1:24:31
  Speaker 1: off and you have the day to hunt and it
• 1:24:32
  Speaker 1: is hard, but especially during the rut, like do not
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 1: do not go home? Like hunt all if you're in
• 1:24:41
  Speaker 1: a good spot and the wind is good and you
• 1:24:42
  Speaker 1: are out to hunt, especially if it's the rut and
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 1: you're in a big buck state. Um, I've shot a
• 1:24:49
  Speaker 1: lot of good deer between eleven and one o'clock. Um,
• 1:24:52
  Speaker 1: they're on their feet, especially if they're not pressured or
• 1:24:55
  Speaker 1: they're chasing dose. But um, I can't believe there's a
• 1:24:58
  Speaker 1: there's actually a swayeping feel by my house and we
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 1: will see deer at noon. Um, I'll just pop around
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 1: in this corner and there's this kind of hidden little
• 1:25:07
  Speaker 1: draw and there's there's just doze out there. There'll be
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 1: ten does out there in the middle of the day.
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 1: Hell and people, a lot of times it's like nine o'clock.
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 1: I'm getting out of my stand and it's like, you
• 1:25:17
  Speaker 1: might want to sit there till eleven. I would at
• 1:25:18
  Speaker 1: least push a little bit harder um in in Uh, like,
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 1: stay off your phone. I'm kind of bad about it too,
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 1: but I know people, it's like, you gotta be kidding me.
• 1:25:30
  Speaker 1: There's this one spot I hunt and it's a it's
• 1:25:32
  Speaker 1: a hedgerow, and then there's this two huge fields behind it,
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 1: and there's a drainage ditch, and then there's another hedgerow.
• 1:25:38
  Speaker 1: And I've glass this one guy that hunts a young guy.
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 1: He hunts this far hedgerow and uh, I glasped. I
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 1: don't know how many deer come out of his headrow
• 1:25:47
  Speaker 1: hed his freaking head down in his phone. They all
• 1:25:50
  Speaker 1: went behind him. I watched it was gun season. I
• 1:25:52
  Speaker 1: know his kid would have shot everything that moved. He
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 1: never saw any of those, dude, they couldn't have been
• 1:25:57
  Speaker 1: thirty yards behind him, but he was on his phone
• 1:25:59
  Speaker 1: the whole If I would have had a camera, I
• 1:26:01
  Speaker 1: would have loved to have recorded that. But you know,
• 1:26:05
  Speaker 1: is there a work like stay focused on your job
• 1:26:07
  Speaker 1: like work if you're hunting, Like stay focused on the
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 1: task at hand, and like I get on my phone
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 1: every now and there, text guys or something, but man
• 1:26:17
  Speaker 1: like focus on the task at hand. Yeah, that's that's key,
• 1:26:21
  Speaker 1: and it's easy these days. There's so many opportunities for
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 1: distraction with us phones in your pockets. So that's good.
• 1:26:28
  Speaker 1: It's definitely good reminder. I've been I was biting the
• 1:26:30
  Speaker 1: ass on that one once, So I know what you're saying,
• 1:26:34
  Speaker 1: ye big buck tips. I mean, that's it's tough to say, like, oh,
• 1:26:40
  Speaker 1: you know, look for this. But you know one thing
• 1:26:42
  Speaker 1: you could do is pay attention to how the crops
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 1: change and how the deer changed to um like guys.
• 1:26:50
  Speaker 1: You know, guys are uh literally a place I hut.
• 1:26:54
  Speaker 1: Somebody had a go and heat sent wick out already,
• 1:26:59
  Speaker 1: and it's kind of like, what are you doing? You
• 1:27:01
  Speaker 1: know what? I hate to be rude, but it's like
• 1:27:04
  Speaker 1: that this is not you're gonna kill an immature deer
• 1:27:07
  Speaker 1: off that it's oddly curious of what this is. And yeah,
• 1:27:10
  Speaker 1: I think you're gonna tip the deer off that. Okay,
• 1:27:12
  Speaker 1: some idiots you're already putting sentwis up, so that would
• 1:27:15
  Speaker 1: be a big buck tip, Like don't do that. Yeah, yeah,
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 1: that makes sense. One kind of off the wall not
• 1:27:22
  Speaker 1: off the wall topic, but we're kind of pivoting from
• 1:27:25
  Speaker 1: what we've been talking about here. We've talked a lot about,
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 1: you know, how to know when to go in for
• 1:27:29
  Speaker 1: the kill, how to find him, how to glass him up,
• 1:27:31
  Speaker 1: how to determine how mature buck's gonna behave versus them
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 1: mature buck. Um. Doing all this stuff, killing a big
• 1:27:39
  Speaker 1: mature buck every year, all of this takes a lot
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 1: of energy. It takes a lot of time. I think
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 1: for a lot of us we can obsess over it. Um,
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 1: how do you think about that side of your life,
• 1:27:53
  Speaker 1: being a successful hunter and then balancing your family, because
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 1: I know you've got a family, You've got daughters, Um,
• 1:28:01
  Speaker 1: how do you manage those things and try to keep
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 1: it in balance or or make it all work somehow. Yeah,
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 1: that's an extremely important Um, that's extremely important point. Uh,
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 1: in a huge point. And that's the point that I've
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 1: excelled at extremely well. Anywhere I go, people are like, man,
• 1:28:20
  Speaker 1: what you know, what does your wife say? Um? And
• 1:28:24
  Speaker 1: my first of all, don't ever date somebody that is
• 1:28:27
  Speaker 1: not in the hunting. It's not gonna work. Steps number one.
• 1:28:30
  Speaker 1: If your girlfriend is complaining, like, just move on, she's
• 1:28:34
  Speaker 1: never gonna be happy. And and just get it over with.
• 1:28:38
  Speaker 1: But that's a that's a fact, Like you're if your
• 1:28:42
  Speaker 1: girlfriend is not like something that you're passionate about, like
• 1:28:44
  Speaker 1: it's just get it over with. Get There's tons of
• 1:28:47
  Speaker 1: cool chicks out there, Um, Mary, a good woman would
• 1:28:50
  Speaker 1: be step one. And uh, that's the biggest step. But
• 1:28:54
  Speaker 1: that's a great point because I have personally, especially when
• 1:28:58
  Speaker 1: my kids were little, pushed envelope of ringing myself out
• 1:29:02
  Speaker 1: like mentally, physically, financially, um where it's not even fun
• 1:29:08
  Speaker 1: and I haven't I've set myself up for failure. One
• 1:29:10
  Speaker 1: year in Kansas, I think it might have been the
• 1:29:12
  Speaker 1: first year, kind of a second year at hunt in Kansas. Um,
• 1:29:16
  Speaker 1: you know it was a big deal to me to
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 1: make this work financially, my business that I had just
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 1: started with tying. I don't know if I had actually
• 1:29:23
  Speaker 1: started my business. I was broke. Um. We had a
• 1:29:27
  Speaker 1: brand new baby at home. This tag I don't know
• 1:29:31
  Speaker 1: how much the tags were then six bucks or something.
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 1: I mean, six hundred bucks might as well have been
• 1:29:35
  Speaker 1: like ten grands. Me it was. It was everything to me. Um.
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 1: The whole trip was exhausting. Um. I was after I
• 1:29:43
  Speaker 1: found a really good book and I just wore myself out.
• 1:29:48
  Speaker 1: And I knew that when I got home, like um,
• 1:29:52
  Speaker 1: money was going to be tight. And my wife never complained,
• 1:29:56
  Speaker 1: but she was struggling at home trying to take care
• 1:29:59
  Speaker 1: of the baby and try that you cannot do like
• 1:30:02
  Speaker 1: I was not ready and I did. I actually missed
• 1:30:04
  Speaker 1: that deer, but dear that I finally got a shot at. Um.
• 1:30:08
  Speaker 1: I got screwed on that dear so many times, but
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 1: by other people, but I ended up getting a shot
• 1:30:13
  Speaker 1: at this dear. And it was so desperate for me
• 1:30:16
  Speaker 1: to kill this deer and accomplish the goal that I
• 1:30:19
  Speaker 1: just I botched something that I'm really like, I'm really
• 1:30:23
  Speaker 1: good at killing things, like I'm really, I understand when
• 1:30:25
  Speaker 1: to move, how to move, when to take a shot,
• 1:30:27
  Speaker 1: when not to shoot. And I did something like the
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 1: killing part is never a problem problem for me, and
• 1:30:33
  Speaker 1: I botched it and it came down to not having
• 1:30:35
  Speaker 1: my home life perfect. Um, when you leave for if
• 1:30:41
  Speaker 1: you're leaving for a hunt or a punting season is coming,
• 1:30:43
  Speaker 1: you got to work like a maniac and have money
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 1: banked so that the heat bill isn't a problem. But
• 1:30:50
  Speaker 1: the money isn't a problem. You've got a bank. What
• 1:30:53
  Speaker 1: if you have three thousand dollars a month and build
• 1:30:56
  Speaker 1: make sure you have six thousand dollars set aside or whatever.
• 1:30:58
  Speaker 1: It might only be five, but mentally be okay that
• 1:31:03
  Speaker 1: I'm going hunting and it doesn't matter. M Make sure
• 1:31:06
  Speaker 1: you have your crap around the house picked up, make
• 1:31:07
  Speaker 1: sure they law in his mode. Make sure your wife
• 1:31:11
  Speaker 1: is in a good mood and she's happy, and she's
• 1:31:13
  Speaker 1: okay that you're going away. Try and I try, And
• 1:31:16
  Speaker 1: I always say this, like, I try and set up
• 1:31:18
  Speaker 1: the babysitters and make sure the kids are taken care
• 1:31:20
  Speaker 1: of and they've got rides from here to there. My
• 1:31:22
  Speaker 1: wife truthfully kind of does that, but I make sure
• 1:31:24
  Speaker 1: that she's got it done, you know, because when you
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 1: call home and she's like, this is not this is
• 1:31:30
  Speaker 1: a pain in the ass, and I've got to figure
• 1:31:32
  Speaker 1: out how to get you know, cricket to this practice
• 1:31:35
  Speaker 1: and our other daughter to that practice. It takes away
• 1:31:39
  Speaker 1: from your thought process, that's what's important. And a lot
• 1:31:42
  Speaker 1: of guys take that for granted, including myself. I did
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 1: that that hunt and that hut like broke me. I
• 1:31:48
  Speaker 1: hated hunting a three piste just it wasn't I failed,
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 1: and I don't like sailing. And I remember after that
• 1:31:55
  Speaker 1: thinking like I'm not gonna put myself in that situation,
• 1:31:57
  Speaker 1: like if I can't. I didn't go the next year
• 1:31:59
  Speaker 1: because I couldn't have word too and I just worked
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 1: like a maniac. And now when I go hunting, I
• 1:32:06
  Speaker 1: got If the money isn't set aside and my wife
• 1:32:08
  Speaker 1: isn't happy and things aren't taken care of, I don't
• 1:32:11
  Speaker 1: need to go. And it's a good feeling because like
• 1:32:13
  Speaker 1: I have, like I have more good animals killed than
• 1:32:17
  Speaker 1: probably anybody deserves to have in a lifetime already. So
• 1:32:20
  Speaker 1: I could hang up my hat from hunting and have
• 1:32:23
  Speaker 1: a just a phenomenal do it yourself career. People will
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 1: be like, Wow, that's amazing. So if I don't get one,
• 1:32:30
  Speaker 1: it's not a big deal. But the pressure is off,
• 1:32:32
  Speaker 1: and it's really good to take the pressure off yourself.
• 1:32:35
  Speaker 1: I don't like killing big stuff. I don't want to
• 1:32:37
  Speaker 1: go somewhere and not kill something. But if I don't,
• 1:32:40
  Speaker 1: it's not a big like I'm not I'm not worried
• 1:32:42
  Speaker 1: about it. I really enjoy the It sounds corny, but
• 1:32:45
  Speaker 1: I enjoyed the journey now, you know, when I was younger,
• 1:32:49
  Speaker 1: it was more of the destination. I had to show success.
• 1:32:52
  Speaker 1: And having a good wife and a stable, happy kid
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 1: makes me mean that's huge. Like if my kids are
• 1:33:03
  Speaker 1: on the phone, I mean, in a couple of times,
• 1:33:05
  Speaker 1: they've been like Daddy, come home. You know, especially Elconi,
• 1:33:07
  Speaker 1: They're like come home. And it's like, oh, you're breaking
• 1:33:10
  Speaker 1: my heart. But I'm not afraid to tell them either. Listen,
• 1:33:12
  Speaker 1: Daddy works hard. I work hard for you, and this
• 1:33:15
  Speaker 1: is a big I love this stuff. I want you
• 1:33:18
  Speaker 1: to be proud of me, and I wants you to
• 1:33:20
  Speaker 1: cheer for me. I don't want to hear you just crying.
• 1:33:21
  Speaker 1: You're a good kid, and I do everything I can
• 1:33:24
  Speaker 1: do to make you happy. This makes me happy. And someday,
• 1:33:27
  Speaker 1: when you're old enough, you were coming with me. Okay,
• 1:33:29
  Speaker 1: so be happy for me. Don't be crying on the phone.
• 1:33:32
  Speaker 1: Tell me you're proud of me, and tell me to
• 1:33:33
  Speaker 1: kill big things. And my girl kids will be like, Daddy,
• 1:33:36
  Speaker 1: you kill a big one, you know, and they're great.
• 1:33:38
  Speaker 1: And now they're old enough that that they don't even
• 1:33:41
  Speaker 1: need that speech, like they're they're cheering for me, and uh,
• 1:33:44
  Speaker 1: that is just that's the best. You know, that that's
• 1:33:48
  Speaker 1: how it has to be. But it always wasn't always
• 1:33:49
  Speaker 1: that way. You know. I strung myself out like anybody.
• 1:33:52
  Speaker 1: So when you get your ducks in a row, um,
• 1:33:55
  Speaker 1: that's huge. If your girlfriend is complaining or you know,
• 1:33:58
  Speaker 1: if you have a girlfriend and she's bitching and complaining
• 1:34:00
  Speaker 1: about that, I would literally just say, look, here's the deal,
• 1:34:02
  Speaker 1: something I really care about. If there's something you really
• 1:34:04
  Speaker 1: care about, I will support you and help you do it.
• 1:34:07
  Speaker 1: But don't bring me down complaining about something I'm passionate about.
• 1:34:11
  Speaker 1: It's never gonna change. So get that out of the
• 1:34:14
  Speaker 1: way before you go dating somebody, no matter what it is.
• 1:34:17
  Speaker 1: If you're in the cars or whatever, like somebody's complaining
• 1:34:20
  Speaker 1: about something you love, like you might want to change directions. Yeah, yeah,
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 1: that's that's some wise, some wise words to have at
• 1:34:26
  Speaker 1: the front end of the relationship. I'm gonna end up.
• 1:34:29
  Speaker 1: Everybody's gonna end the over pressure in their deer because
• 1:34:31
  Speaker 1: they're gonna go for the deer's throw and they're gonn
• 1:34:33
  Speaker 1: end up breaking up with your girlfriends. Podcast, so contact
• 1:34:38
  Speaker 1: you're putting together, we're gonna we're gonna title this one
• 1:34:41
  Speaker 1: the home record with Jesse Coots. Yeah, yeah, that could
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 1: be true. However, the funny thing is I call at
• 1:34:52
  Speaker 1: the big animals and I have a wonderful family life.
• 1:34:54
  Speaker 1: So there again, it works for me, it might for you.
• 1:34:57
  Speaker 1: This is what works for me. Yeah, all my buddies here,
• 1:35:03
  Speaker 1: this this is they're gonna be like a shocker. So
• 1:35:09
  Speaker 1: so we gotta wrap this one up, Jesse, because I
• 1:35:11
  Speaker 1: need to go run a couple of errands for my
• 1:35:13
  Speaker 1: family and then run out into the woods. Um, do
• 1:35:16
  Speaker 1: you have any final last uh, any final last words
• 1:35:20
  Speaker 1: or things you want to share with the folks before
• 1:35:22
  Speaker 1: we sign off here? Yeah, you know, so we didn't.
• 1:35:26
  Speaker 1: I didn't get a big itinerary shoot from me. And
• 1:35:28
  Speaker 1: I wasn't sure. I sat down before and I'm like,
• 1:35:30
  Speaker 1: what are the important things to me that if you
• 1:35:33
  Speaker 1: want to um, if you want to kill big deer
• 1:35:36
  Speaker 1: and I were a couple of things down and we
• 1:35:37
  Speaker 1: didn't touch base on and one of the things I
• 1:35:39
  Speaker 1: was gonna say, if you want to kill big deer,
• 1:35:41
  Speaker 1: like we had said, you gotta hunt where big deer are, um.
• 1:35:44
  Speaker 1: And once you're hunting where big deer are, do not
• 1:35:46
  Speaker 1: shoot little deer. You will never kill big deer. Even
• 1:35:49
  Speaker 1: if you're like, wow, I didn't get one this year,
• 1:35:51
  Speaker 1: Stop shooting little deer. If you shoot little dear, be
• 1:35:54
  Speaker 1: happy that you're shooting little dear. Don't cry that you're
• 1:35:57
  Speaker 1: not shooting big deer. And I think the biggest tip
• 1:36:03
  Speaker 1: a guy could have if he, especially a young guy,
• 1:36:06
  Speaker 1: well anybody, if you really want to get good at
• 1:36:09
  Speaker 1: hunting and killing big deer, you have to learn to
• 1:36:12
  Speaker 1: be a killer. UM. I think you should start out.
• 1:36:16
  Speaker 1: I mean, while I was a kid, I was very
• 1:36:17
  Speaker 1: fortunate that my parents weren't around much. UM. I had
• 1:36:21
  Speaker 1: BB guns and bow and arrows and flame shots. Sparrows
• 1:36:24
  Speaker 1: were not safe. Woodchuck's, I mean, the neighbor's horse farm
• 1:36:28
  Speaker 1: paid me to shoot every woodchuck. Um. I learned how
• 1:36:31
  Speaker 1: to sneak up on stuff, I learned how to move.
• 1:36:34
  Speaker 1: Being a killer is probably the biggest asset you can have. UM.
• 1:36:41
  Speaker 1: And if you know, a lot of guys are like, oh,
• 1:36:43
  Speaker 1: you know what, I've shot tender with the bow, and
• 1:36:45
  Speaker 1: it's like that is not that's great, but you need
• 1:36:50
  Speaker 1: to kill tenderer tend dough a year with the bow.
• 1:36:52
  Speaker 1: And there were years where I would get uh in
• 1:36:55
  Speaker 1: my home state has liberal freaking dough tags and I
• 1:36:58
  Speaker 1: got tons of dote and just shot the daylights out
• 1:37:01
  Speaker 1: of him for fifteen years. After I killed ten deer
• 1:37:04
  Speaker 1: a year, and and then you hunt other states. I mean,
• 1:37:07
  Speaker 1: by the time I was done, I was killing fifteen
• 1:37:09
  Speaker 1: or twenty deer a year with a bow. That makes
• 1:37:11
  Speaker 1: you so confident and so good at hunting, um that
• 1:37:16
  Speaker 1: when the pressure of a big buck is on, this
• 1:37:18
  Speaker 1: is something you've done two hundred times, Like this is
• 1:37:20
  Speaker 1: not a big deal. I'm got to flipping arrows to
• 1:37:22
  Speaker 1: his bucks chest. And when he gets to this pocket,
• 1:37:24
  Speaker 1: I know when to move and when not to move.
• 1:37:26
  Speaker 1: And if he gets through that pocket, I don't care
• 1:37:28
  Speaker 1: because I know I'm going to shoot him quarter in
• 1:37:29
  Speaker 1: away when he gets the bat pocket. Whereas when you
• 1:37:32
  Speaker 1: don't have that experience on your belt, everything's a panics.
• 1:37:35
  Speaker 1: So if you really want to be a a good hunter, um,
• 1:37:39
  Speaker 1: hunt wood chucks with the bow and arrow, hunt rabbits
• 1:37:41
  Speaker 1: with the bow and arrow, shoot as many does, don't
• 1:37:44
  Speaker 1: shoot and even gun season, I shoot him with the
• 1:37:46
  Speaker 1: bow and arrow. Um, just become proficient with the bow
• 1:37:50
  Speaker 1: and arrow and shoot everything that moves. Meanwhile, drive past
• 1:37:54
  Speaker 1: a horse passer and look at horses. It sounds morbid,
• 1:37:57
  Speaker 1: but I literally look at every angle and figure out
• 1:37:59
  Speaker 1: how it's shoot that force. And you have to have
• 1:38:01
  Speaker 1: that mindset. And it sounds evil, but like everything is
• 1:38:04
  Speaker 1: a target and you're not thinking that way, you're you're
• 1:38:07
  Speaker 1: out of the groove. And uh, if you can get
• 1:38:10
  Speaker 1: nuisance permits, or you can get if your state allows
• 1:38:13
  Speaker 1: transferable dotags, get as many doughtegs as you can. And
• 1:38:17
  Speaker 1: before you try and really kill big bucks, like kill
• 1:38:21
  Speaker 1: everything in your path. Learn to be a good hunter
• 1:38:25
  Speaker 1: and hunt and kill everything. And I really think you
• 1:38:28
  Speaker 1: should become I cut all my own deer. Um. I
• 1:38:31
  Speaker 1: know a deer's body inside and out. I know if
• 1:38:34
  Speaker 1: I hit him here exactly what organ is there and
• 1:38:37
  Speaker 1: what tendon is there, and what the cause and effectives.
• 1:38:40
  Speaker 1: I think that stuff really matters. It matters to me.
• 1:38:44
  Speaker 1: It's helped me a ton um for it will be
• 1:38:46
  Speaker 1: some of my my other tips is be a murderer,
• 1:38:50
  Speaker 1: be a killer. I know it's it's not correct to
• 1:38:52
  Speaker 1: say that you should harvest deer, but I don't harvest them.
• 1:38:55
  Speaker 1: I kill things like that's I kill things and I
• 1:38:59
  Speaker 1: butcher it, and I put it in my freeer and
• 1:39:00
  Speaker 1: I feed my family. I I've over seen anything. I'm
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 1: killing deer, uh. And I think to be a proficient
• 1:39:06
  Speaker 1: big buck killer you have to learn how to kill everything.
• 1:39:11
  Speaker 1: That's what you're saying. That was my pointer on that.
• 1:39:14
  Speaker 1: But but I could go on all day, and I
• 1:39:16
  Speaker 1: really appreciate you having me on them. I'm honored to
• 1:39:19
  Speaker 1: be on. I vote. I'm not really a podcast guy,
• 1:39:21
  Speaker 1: but I've heard so many good things since I was
• 1:39:23
  Speaker 1: on your last time. I had no idea what a
• 1:39:25
  Speaker 1: wonderful uh podcast this is and how highly people think
• 1:39:30
  Speaker 1: of you and your podcast across the country. So I'm
• 1:39:33
  Speaker 1: honored to be on it and be a part of it. Well,
• 1:39:35
  Speaker 1: thank you Jesse. I I really appreciate it too, and
• 1:39:38
  Speaker 1: I think, uh, you share a lot of things that
• 1:39:40
  Speaker 1: will help folks, and you don't mince words, and yeah,
• 1:39:45
  Speaker 1: a few people might not like that, but I think
• 1:39:46
  Speaker 1: a lot of people will appreciate one from you too,
• 1:39:48
  Speaker 1: and that's a that's a cool thing. So thank you
• 1:39:51
  Speaker 1: for that, and good luck with the rest of your
• 1:39:55
  Speaker 1: two thousand hunting season. You got it, my friend. Thank you,
• 1:39:58
  Speaker 1: and keep in touch. I'm sure we'll, uh, we'll catch
• 1:40:01
  Speaker 1: up again. I'll call you a night after I shoot
• 1:40:03
  Speaker 1: that big one. All right, I'm looking forward to my friend.
• 1:40:07
  Speaker 1: And if you don't shoot him, call me and tell
• 1:40:09
  Speaker 1: me where he wasn't. We were literally hash this out,
• 1:40:13
  Speaker 1: and that's what's cool about having a great hunting circle on.
• 1:40:16
  Speaker 1: I've called friends and my dude, this buck is doing this,
• 1:40:18
  Speaker 1: this and this, and every year cyber six people call
• 1:40:21
  Speaker 1: me and be like, hey, I'm gonna send you a
• 1:40:22
  Speaker 1: topograph of Matt. This is where that bucket is. Like
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 1: what should I do? That's fun. It's a lot of fun.
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah exactly, Yeah, yeah, for sure, dude, we'll bust of luck.
• 1:40:32
  Speaker 1: Keep it, keep it touch my friend, and call me anytime. Thanks. Jesse.
• 1:40:36
  Speaker 1: All right, that's gonna do it for us today. I
• 1:40:38
  Speaker 1: hope you enjoyed this one. You can foul along with
• 1:40:43
  Speaker 1: all of our future episodes by subscribing to this podcast.
• 1:40:46
  Speaker 1: Make sure you are also subscribed to the meat Eater
• 1:40:48
  Speaker 1: YouTube channel. You're gonna see our new videos over there.
• 1:40:51
  Speaker 1: We just dropped this week a new episode of the
• 1:40:54
  Speaker 1: Back forty video series, so check that out to see
• 1:40:57
  Speaker 1: the progress for making on that property. If you're not also,
• 1:41:00
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna keep on hitting me up with some subscription
• 1:41:02
  Speaker 1: ideas here. If you're not subscribed for white Tail Weekly,
• 1:41:05
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• 1:41:07
  Speaker 1: get updates on all of our new white Tail content
• 1:41:09
  Speaker 1: coming out from the team there. Make sure you had
• 1:41:12
  Speaker 1: to v meat eater dot com to do that as well.
• 1:41:15
  Speaker 1: That will also give you an opportunity you'll find out
• 1:41:17
  Speaker 1: how to win a hunt with Steve and I on
• 1:41:19
  Speaker 1: the Back forty. So lots of cool stuff coming up.
• 1:41:22
  Speaker 1: You can find it all over the media to your
• 1:41:23
  Speaker 1: website and until next time, good luck out there hunting.
• 1:41:27
  Speaker 1: Stay tuned for a lot more interesting stuff from us here,
• 1:41:30
  Speaker 1: and stay wired to hunt