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Growing Up as Part of the Winans Family - Deborah Joy Winans | Born To The Game Podcast · Born To The Game Podcast

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Speaker 1: But even my granddaddy, who, as I said, was my guy.
0:04
Speaker 1: I remember telling them that I was gonna I was
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Speaker 1: going to college and I was gonna major in theater.
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Speaker 1: And my granddaddy said theater. He said, ain't that Broadway?
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Speaker 1: I said, yeah, Granddaddy, he said, well, my Bible say
0:20
Speaker 1: the way to God is youre going to hell on
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Speaker 1: broad time? This is gone to the games me in
0:30
Speaker 1: every beating rhyme, the passion and peach were running on us,
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Speaker 1: and this time last time. But say rendas time when
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Speaker 1: along on to the game, carrying in the plane goes
0:43
Speaker 1: off the path. But it's any day were riding proclane.
0:48
Speaker 1: It's just going to the game. Let us be exported.
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Speaker 1: Welcome to Born to the Game. Produced by Archimedia Group
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Speaker 1: and collaboration with Inflection Network and distributed through iHeartMedia. This
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Speaker 1: is a space where the children and families of iconic athletes, entertainers,
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Speaker 1: and cultural figures share the truth behind legacy, not just
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Speaker 1: what their families did, but who they were and how
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Speaker 1: that legacy continues. Today's guest comes from one of the
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Speaker 1: most influential families in gospel history, the Winans family. Her
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Speaker 1: grandfather David Glenn Pop Winans helped lay the foundation for
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Speaker 1: a legacy that would shape gospel music for generations, and
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Speaker 1: her father, Carven Winans, has played a pivotal role in
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Speaker 1: carrying that legacy forward. But today's conversation is about identity,
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Speaker 1: choice and finding your own voice. Please welcome Deva Joye,
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Speaker 1: oh God, Hi, I'm so happy. I know really, thank you.
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Speaker 2: Thank you. Yeah, I do love.
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Speaker 1: And I walked in the road. Good. Yes, you're back
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Speaker 1: on the couch. But now we're interviewing you. Yeah, I know,
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Speaker 1: it's interesting. It's different, right, yeah, yeah, Iyah, were talking
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Speaker 1: about your stuff. We don't talk about it. I have it.
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Speaker 1: But let's start off with just talking about the Winans family,
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Speaker 1: just dynasty. So your family has shaped gospel music for generations.
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Speaker 1: Before we get into your journey, can you take us back.
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Speaker 1: What is the Winans family story from your perspective? Ooh ooh.
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Speaker 1: The Winans family story from my perspective, A lot of music,
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Speaker 1: a lot of church we were in church twenty four
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Speaker 1: to seven almost, and a lot of faith, a lot
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Speaker 1: of just living what we heard. That's what I got
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Speaker 1: to see. I got to see my grandparents, my parents,
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Speaker 1: my aunts, my uncles living what they were talking about
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Speaker 1: and so that is my perspective, being in church, enjoying
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Speaker 1: each other, singing songs and being kind to people outside
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Speaker 1: of church, not just saying we gotta love the Lord
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Speaker 1: and love people, but actually seeing them love people. Actually,
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Speaker 1: my uncle Marvin would always say that ministry means people
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Speaker 1: and people don't care how much you know until they
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Speaker 1: know how much you care. And seeing them show people
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Speaker 1: that they care and really changing lives. That's what I
3:44
Speaker 1: knew it to be growing up. And even as I
3:48
Speaker 1: got older, people would come to me and find out
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Speaker 1: who I am and just say how this song touched
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Speaker 1: their life or save their life, or this message or
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Speaker 1: this sermon really shifted them into the person they're meant
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Speaker 1: to be. And every time I'm kind of taken aback,
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Speaker 1: I'm like, wow, God really did some things through them.
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Speaker 1: So yeah, I think that for me, that's what it
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Speaker 1: was growing up. Were there any stories that were passed
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Speaker 1: down about your grandfather? Oh? Yeah, So my granddaddy was
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Speaker 1: my guy. My granddaddy was my guy, and we would
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Speaker 1: we would go to breakfast. He'd be like, hey, jo
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Speaker 1: a baby, you want to go to breakfast tomorrow? Like yeah, yeah, granddaddy.
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Speaker 1: He would pull up at six am and call me, Oh,
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Speaker 1: you don't want to go to breakfast. You ain't up yet.
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Speaker 1: Granddaddy's sick. But hold on, let me throw something on.
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Speaker 1: I'm coming, I'm coming. He would do that all the time,
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Speaker 1: and he would just tell us about his father who
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Speaker 1: denied him initially, and so he was he was David
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Speaker 1: Glenn for a long time. That was his mother's last name.
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Speaker 1: So your grandfather was David Glenn. He was David Glenn.
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Speaker 1: He wouldn't take he didn't have his father's last name
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Speaker 1: because his father denied him. Wow. And years into being
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Speaker 1: married to my grandma, I want to say, maybe the
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Speaker 1: first four kids had been born, Uncle David, Uncle Ronald,
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Speaker 1: and then my dad and my uncle Marvin, the twins.
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Speaker 1: I feel like it was them. Maybe one more had
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Speaker 1: been born and they were all born Glenn. And my
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Speaker 1: grandfather said that he was told, if you honor your
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Speaker 1: father and change your last name, God will bless it,
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Speaker 1: and he will bless your children and your children's children.
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Speaker 1: And he did. He changed his name to Winans. All
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Speaker 1: the kids he had changed to Winans, and God has
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Speaker 1: blessed and blessed and blessed generations.
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Speaker 3: Generations, singers, an entire family of singers.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, and when did that start? The singing is well,
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Speaker 1: I guess how did that? Growing up in the home? Yeah,
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Speaker 1: where everybody? Yeah, what is that like? That was my
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Speaker 1: That was my granddad, my grandma because they both my
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Speaker 1: granddad was in a quartet. My grandmother was a singer.
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Speaker 1: And so them being singers and then having all these kids,
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Speaker 1: they had a lot of kids, Yes, boy straight and
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Speaker 1: then three girls. Okay, so ten total under pop whining. Yes, okay.
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Speaker 1: My grandma and granddad had ten kids, seven boys straight
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Speaker 1: and then three girls. And that was the thing that
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Speaker 1: they did. So they were always having them sing in
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Speaker 1: the house, teaching them how to harmonize. That was just
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Speaker 1: it was a gift. And so they were singing all
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Speaker 1: the time, singing at home, singing at church. And then
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Speaker 1: I think the first group that was my dad, uncle Marvin,
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Speaker 1: uncle Ronald, and then another guy, Howard Smith, who wasn't
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Speaker 1: in the family. They were called the testimonial singers. And
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Speaker 1: then eventually Howard left and then my uncle Mike got
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Speaker 1: in the group and they became the Whinings. But it's
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Speaker 1: just they came from singing. That was all My granddad
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Speaker 1: and my grandma knew church, singing and loving God, and
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Speaker 1: so that's what they brought into the family. That that
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Speaker 1: was the home life. So for you, when was that
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Speaker 1: moment you realized that your family's dynasty had such a
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Speaker 1: huge impact on gospel and the church. Was there a
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Speaker 1: specific moment or memory? Yeah, yeah, oh yeah, I was
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Speaker 1: fully grown. Was I probably moved out to la for
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Speaker 1: grad school at that point. I moved here in two
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Speaker 1: thousand and six, And I think you you have to
7:51
Speaker 1: get older to understand what impact really means. Yeah, and
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Speaker 1: to meet people who really are like, my life changed
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Speaker 1: because of tomorrow, because of the question is because of
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Speaker 1: ain't no need to worry. It's just like, oh you're
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Speaker 1: for real. Like it shifted your whole perspective, It shifted
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Speaker 1: the way you moved, You gave your life to God.
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Speaker 1: It's that's incredible. So I was, I was fully grown, honey.
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Speaker 1: I was twenty three twenty four when I realized it
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Speaker 1: wasn't just I like your music, it was you changed
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Speaker 1: my life and that that's major. And that made me
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Speaker 1: always want to be careful of what I do where
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Speaker 1: I placed myself because I didn't work for this name.
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Speaker 1: I didn't work for it, and I don't want to
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Speaker 1: damage it or diminish it. I want to honor what
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Speaker 1: God has done with it. Still be me, be who
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Speaker 1: I'm called to be, but honor it in the best
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Speaker 1: way possible because that's impacting lives, is what I believe
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Speaker 1: God has called us to do, and so I didn't
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Speaker 1: get it until I got older.
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Speaker 2: And there is an assignment. There's an assignment and a.
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Speaker 1: Duty to it.
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Speaker 3: We talk a lot about that on the on the
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Speaker 3: show because we have all these kids that are carrying
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Speaker 3: on a duty that they didn't ask for. Yes, but
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Speaker 3: you still have to do it, like you said in
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Speaker 3: your way with grace, Yeah, which is hard. It's hard
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Speaker 3: when you come from such a big legacy and people
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Speaker 3: look at you and expect you to be just like them,
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Speaker 3: or sound just like them, or act just like them,
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Speaker 3: and when you don't, it's it's a thing, you know.
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Speaker 1: The Whinings came first, which were four of the brothers,
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Speaker 1: but then B B and CC came and their challenges
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Speaker 1: were monumental because Lost without You, addictive Love, all those
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Speaker 1: songs about you, look it's a jam. But those things
10:02
Speaker 1: passed over and the people in church were like, this
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Speaker 1: isn't gospel, this is not of God. Y'all going to hell?
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Speaker 1: Like the sound is one sound, And so they had
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Speaker 1: to stand strong and what they were doing and what
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Speaker 1: they believed and and the path that God had them on.
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Speaker 1: It sounded a little different than their brothers, but it
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Speaker 1: was still the same guy.
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Speaker 3: And if anybody's going to heaven, and that's one person,
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Speaker 3: I know she's going.
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Speaker 1: Jesus, She's going.
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Speaker 2: Okay.
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Speaker 1: So how did your dad, Carvin shape the way faith
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Speaker 1: and music showed up in your household? Oh? My dad
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Speaker 1: and my mom. I really believe that they tried to
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Speaker 1: just walk it out in front of us, the good
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Speaker 1: part and the hard part. You know, you realize as
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Speaker 1: you get older, everyone like they do their best. And
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Speaker 1: music I think my dad was very much so. He
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Speaker 1: didn't want us to feel forced to be into it.
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Speaker 1: I never wanted to sing. That was never my thing.
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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that was never my band. Okay. So my dad,
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Speaker 1: my two older brothers, Carvin and Wan, and then my
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Speaker 1: two cousins, Marvin Winan's Junior and Mike Winans Junior. They
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Speaker 1: became a group called Winan's Face Two, had an incredible album,
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Speaker 1: got nominated for a Grammy and then kind of went
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Speaker 1: their separate ways. But my dad helped them develop their
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Speaker 1: sound once they decided they wanted to sing, but he
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Speaker 1: never pushed us. And that was just never a desire
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Speaker 1: for me. I'm always wanted to be an actor, and
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Speaker 1: so that's what I did. I was the first one
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Speaker 1: in my family to get a BFA bachelor's degree. So
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Speaker 1: I got my BFA at Wayne State. I went to
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Speaker 1: Moscow Art Theater School in Russia for a month to study,
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Speaker 1: and then I moved to LA to get my MFA
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Speaker 1: and acting. I'm the only one with the masters in
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Speaker 1: my family, and I just that was the path that
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Speaker 1: I wanted to be on. That was what I chose,
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Speaker 1: and they have always been supportive of that. They're just like,
12:15
Speaker 1: whatever got is giving you to do, do that. So
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Speaker 1: there is this stereotype about being a church kid. Did
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Speaker 1: that apply to you? I didn't let it, Okay, I
12:27
Speaker 1: just didn't let it. I think it's easy to get
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Speaker 1: sucked into it. But and I don't really know where
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Speaker 1: this kind of came from. But even my granddaddy, who
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Speaker 1: as I said, was my guy, I remember telling them
12:43
Speaker 1: that I was gonna I was gone to college. And
12:47
Speaker 1: I was going to major in theater, and my granddaddy
12:51
Speaker 1: said theater. He said, ain't that Broadway? I said, yeah, Granddaddy,
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Speaker 1: he said, well, my Bible say the way to God
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Speaker 1: is that? So that's so interesting, though, how do you
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Speaker 1: navigate that space? Because the Winings family is deep rooted
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Speaker 1: in the church and you want to pursue the arts,
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Speaker 1: and there is sometimes conflict in the two. Are you
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Speaker 1: how do you navigate this is your guy? I knew
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Speaker 1: that you're not following God's past. Girl. I laughed so
13:25
Speaker 1: hard because I just, first of all, my granddad was
13:27
Speaker 1: funny to me, and so I just laughed. And then
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Speaker 1: my grandma was sitting there. She said, honey, if you
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Speaker 1: keep yourself and you know what you're doing, God will
13:35
Speaker 1: bless you. I was like, thank you, Grandma. So it's
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Speaker 1: just a I knew what I was meant to do.
13:44
Speaker 1: I just I knew it. I knew it. I knew it.
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Speaker 1: It was in my bones. I was never not going
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Speaker 1: to be an actor. It was there was too much
13:51
Speaker 1: of a passion and a dream and a gift inside.
13:55
Speaker 1: I couldn't deny that. So it's just like, Okay, well
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Speaker 1: I know who I am and I know that God
14:00
Speaker 1: gave me this, so I just got to wait for
14:02
Speaker 1: God to show them. It's not about me having to
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Speaker 1: show them and then wait for their approval. I can't
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Speaker 1: live my life for them. Actress in the Whining Absolutely dynasty, Okay, yeah,
14:14
Speaker 1: so everybody else strictly in the church, oh yeah, gospel
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Speaker 1: in the church, singing or yeah singing. Wow. Yeah, but
14:23
Speaker 1: that just wasn't my love. So it's kind of like
14:27
Speaker 1: you broke off from what was your tradition and your
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Speaker 1: family to pursue acting. Wow. It was scary. Yeah. I
14:36
Speaker 1: was going to ask like, how did that make you feel?
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Speaker 1: Did you doubt yourself? Did you feel like I never
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Speaker 1: doubt yourself. I didn't doubt myself. I just I've always
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Speaker 1: been a family girl, and I wanted their support and
14:50
Speaker 1: for a minute I kind of lived for it and
14:54
Speaker 1: was hoping and praying that they would get on the bandwagon.
14:57
Speaker 1: What about your dad? Was he on? Or oh? My
14:59
Speaker 1: parents on? Okay? Good, My parents were fully on. They well,
15:03
Speaker 1: when I first time I was going to major in theater,
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Speaker 1: my mom said, well, joy, honey, you know you talk
15:09
Speaker 1: so well. Maybe you should be like a broadcaster or
15:12
Speaker 1: you right, Well, maybe a journalist US said, I don't
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Speaker 1: want So what is it about the arts that people
15:20
Speaker 1: who are intertwined in the church community don't agree with? Well,
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Speaker 1: I think there are myriad things. I think for my mom,
15:27
Speaker 1: it wasn't not agreeing with the arts. But my mom
15:31
Speaker 1: is educated, and she wanted me, if you're going to
15:34
Speaker 1: go to school, do something that like the arts felt
15:39
Speaker 1: like a you can fall back maybe if you can
15:41
Speaker 1: try to. You need to have something that is very
15:45
Speaker 1: stable and firm. I think that was her thing. But
15:50
Speaker 1: then they came to see my first show at Wayne
15:52
Speaker 1: State and they were like, oh, yeah, this is what
15:55
Speaker 1: you do. We understand that this they were calling on
15:57
Speaker 1: the Bandwell, but I think for the church in particular,
16:02
Speaker 1: a lot of how we grew up, the arts feel
16:08
Speaker 1: very carnal. They feel like, oh, y'all just out here
16:13
Speaker 1: trying to find ways to do things you shouldn't be doing,
16:15
Speaker 1: and that's not what it is. And I think that
16:24
Speaker 1: what is the point of light sitting around light? Light
16:28
Speaker 1: is meant to go into the world. It is meant
16:30
Speaker 1: to light up the darker places. And God gives gifts
16:36
Speaker 1: without repentance to everybody, and God gave all kinds so
16:42
Speaker 1: even I say, like, you know, when we're struggling with
16:46
Speaker 1: whatever it is, maybe there are mental challenges that we're
16:50
Speaker 1: struggling with. You give everything to God. Put it on
16:53
Speaker 1: the altar. Lord, this is what I'm going through, and
16:56
Speaker 1: I know you can help me. God has also blessed
16:58
Speaker 1: people that are therapists that you can talk to, that
17:02
Speaker 1: are that are here, that are tangible, that will help
17:05
Speaker 1: you through, that can be anointed to help you through
17:07
Speaker 1: and move to the next phase, next step in your
17:10
Speaker 1: in your walk. So I just I firmly believe that
17:15
Speaker 1: we are in all places, and we are meant to
17:17
Speaker 1: be in all places. It's not just about being in
17:20
Speaker 1: front of the camera. A lot of times whenever I'm
17:23
Speaker 1: shooting wherever I'm working, I am meant to be a
17:25
Speaker 1: light wherever I am, which is not just in the absolute.
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Speaker 1: That's what it is.
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Speaker 2: And I think also, I think it's it's unknown.
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Speaker 3: It's because typically people are in the church, they are
17:38
Speaker 3: to you grew up in the church, yes, of course,
17:40
Speaker 3: so I mean so. And again my parents were supportive
17:44
Speaker 3: as well of my career as far as far as
17:46
Speaker 3: being a theater major as well. But I think what
17:49
Speaker 3: I learned was and I was told I was going
17:51
Speaker 3: to Hell as well, and I could not minister. I
17:55
Speaker 3: could not do things because of my of what I
17:57
Speaker 3: chose or what God chose me to do. Yeah, but
18:00
Speaker 3: what I learned was because they it was unknown, they
18:02
Speaker 3: didn't understand, and they also didn't understand real evangelism because
18:06
Speaker 3: I'm going where.
18:07
Speaker 1: You will never go.
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Speaker 3: You went to Russia, you all the places that you go,
18:11
Speaker 3: you were like where you were, and it's like you're
18:13
Speaker 3: not even thinking about the concept of spreading the gospel,
18:18
Speaker 3: spreading God's love all these things. And if you're never
18:21
Speaker 3: at a movie set, what if somebody just it has
18:24
Speaker 3: a brush with me and changes their life because.
18:27
Speaker 2: Of my attitude how I treat them.
18:29
Speaker 3: So if you don't know that, then you're going to
18:32
Speaker 3: say it's wrong because you're not like me, and I
18:35
Speaker 3: don't understand what you're doing. And that's why he gave
18:38
Speaker 3: the gift to you. And it wasn't a group chat.
18:42
Speaker 3: He gave it to you.
18:44
Speaker 1: To do what you needed to do.
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Speaker 2: So it is it's really and the church has to
18:48
Speaker 2: do better.
18:49
Speaker 1: We do.
18:50
Speaker 3: We have to do better on how we foster our
18:53
Speaker 3: kids and what we tell them and that we're correct,
18:57
Speaker 3: and that we're rightly divining and telling them you know
19:00
Speaker 3: how and how to live, you know absolutely and what
19:04
Speaker 3: God has given you.
19:05
Speaker 1: Absolutely absolutely, and allowing them to walk with confidence be
19:09
Speaker 1: bold in that, absolutely absolutely. So you gotta yeah, it's
19:14
Speaker 1: we just we have to understand that we are not God.
19:19
Speaker 1: I got to heave in head nowhere near it. My
19:23
Speaker 1: responsibility is just to love my neighbor, not cause harm,
19:28
Speaker 1: spread joy. That's my sole purpose in life. So that's
19:32
Speaker 1: what's what's one memory or story that makes you smile
19:37
Speaker 1: when you think back on just your your dad, your
19:39
Speaker 1: wineing's family dynamic, your one moment, Yeah, that still makes
19:49
Speaker 1: you smile. So as I've said, my granddad, it was
20:00
Speaker 1: my guy. He was funny to me when he got sick.
20:06
Speaker 1: He got sick in two thousand and eight. I was
20:08
Speaker 1: in my last year of grad school. So September two
20:12
Speaker 1: thousand and eight, they were saying he wasn't gonna make it,
20:15
Speaker 1: and so I went home and he started getting better.
20:20
Speaker 1: And as he got better. Of course, just family has
20:25
Speaker 1: a lot to do. They're you know, they're out singing,
20:27
Speaker 1: they're out doing you know whatever whatever. So as they
20:30
Speaker 1: dispersed to do what they need to do. I just stayed.
20:33
Speaker 1: My grandmother really wanted somebody to be able to stay
20:36
Speaker 1: at the hospital with him, so I would stay there
20:38
Speaker 1: through the night, and then she would come in the
20:40
Speaker 1: morning and I would go back to her house and
20:41
Speaker 1: I would sleep a little, take a shower, and come back.
20:45
Speaker 1: And I did that for months so much so like
20:48
Speaker 1: I thought, I was keeping up with my teachers here
20:51
Speaker 1: in grad school. When I finally came back, they were like, yeah, no,
20:54
Speaker 1: you're going have to pre all this stuff. Anyway, it
21:04
Speaker 1: was time well spent. My granddad ended up passing in
21:09
Speaker 1: April two thousand and nine. But there was one moment
21:13
Speaker 1: where my Auntie Angie came in town and if I
21:16
Speaker 1: asked him a couple of things, he would just he
21:19
Speaker 1: would respond, but he would just be real low key.
21:23
Speaker 1: And so I kept saying, you come to my graduation, granddaddy.
21:25
Speaker 1: I'm graduating with my masters. I'm the first whinings with
21:28
Speaker 1: a masters. And he'd be like, yeah, joy, baby, I'm coming.
21:33
Speaker 1: But the third time I asked him that, he said, now,
21:35
Speaker 1: if you ask me again, I'm gonna have to take it.
21:38
Speaker 1: Laying in the bed the girl halfway with his eyes open,
21:41
Speaker 1: and I laughed so hard. I said, oh, my Granddaddy's
21:45
Speaker 1: still in there. And then me and Auntie Angie were there.
21:49
Speaker 1: It was maybe about three in the morning or so,
21:53
Speaker 1: and he woke up and he kept saying, joy Baby,
21:56
Speaker 1: Joy baby. So I woke up, and she woke up,
21:58
Speaker 1: and I went over to him. He said, and he
22:01
Speaker 1: grabbed my hand and he said, I wouldn't have made
22:05
Speaker 1: it this far without you, and I love you. I
22:09
Speaker 1: love you so much. That was That was my guy.
22:13
Speaker 1: And so that's a moment that I will never forget.
22:16
Speaker 1: Thank you because he meant so much to me. And
22:23
Speaker 1: to know that he still felt proud of me, and
22:25
Speaker 1: to know that he knew I was there for him,
22:31
Speaker 1: that makes me smile all the time. What part of
22:34
Speaker 1: him still just lives within you today? My faith, my
22:38
Speaker 1: faith wouldn't be what it is without him. It would not.
22:42
Speaker 1: And what's the best piece of advice he's ever given? You?
22:47
Speaker 1: Call on Jesus. And it was one time, I'm telling
22:55
Speaker 1: y'all is so funny. I was. I believe it. Yeah,
23:00
Speaker 1: that I was getting ready to go to college. He said,
23:02
Speaker 1: not joy baby. Somebody go to bothering you, some man
23:06
Speaker 1: trying to chase you. And I said all right, and
23:16
Speaker 1: he said I'm serious. He said, call on him like
23:18
Speaker 1: you're crazy, and they'll think you crazy. And look, just
23:23
Speaker 1: based off of that story, I understand. I understand why
23:27
Speaker 1: the family is as dynamic as it is. I understand
23:31
Speaker 1: because it started with him. Yeah, it started with him.
23:34
Speaker 1: He was the foundation for your entire family. And I
23:37
Speaker 1: could just tell, like he's rooted and just just so
23:41
Speaker 1: much wisdom, light and enjoy that he was able to
23:46
Speaker 1: pass down not to just his children, but even his
23:49
Speaker 1: children's children. And you guys still have such just this
23:52
Speaker 1: huge just admiration and appreciation for who he is. And
23:58
Speaker 1: you guys are able to just carry it on, Yeah,
24:00
Speaker 1: through your work, through your arts, through how you interact
24:04
Speaker 1: with people. And it's beautiful just even now seeing you
24:07
Speaker 1: move to tears off of a beautiful story, just showing
24:11
Speaker 1: you how impactful he is and your family is. Oh, yeah, incredible. Yeah.
24:18
Speaker 1: Him and my grandmother were were and are. Because my
24:23
Speaker 1: grandma is eighty nine, she'll be ninety less. Yes, she's
24:27
Speaker 1: my matron of honor. She's my girl. Oh that's a girl.
24:32
Speaker 1: She I really learned how to pray from her. My
24:37
Speaker 1: parents would make us go to six am prayer. I
24:39
Speaker 1: was like, y'o, this is not why are we doing this?
24:41
Speaker 1: Why are you making your children? But do you understand now?
24:47
Speaker 1: And I used to go and sit next to my grandma.
24:50
Speaker 1: I would get on my knees, but she would be
24:52
Speaker 1: sitting in the pew, so I would just get next
24:54
Speaker 1: to her and get on my knees and I would
24:56
Speaker 1: listen to her and understanding that I can pray to
25:01
Speaker 1: God just talking like this. And I would just listen
25:05
Speaker 1: to her and be like, oh, man, well I know
25:07
Speaker 1: she's safe. And that's what she's saying. You don't have
25:10
Speaker 1: to be all these big words. It don't have to
25:12
Speaker 1: be perfect. And she would just say, thank you, and
25:17
Speaker 1: you are wonderful and Lord, you've kept us and I'm grateful.
25:23
Speaker 1: Thank you for my children, thank you for my grandchildren.
25:26
Speaker 1: Thank you for leading and guiding every step. And I
25:29
Speaker 1: was like, oh, okay, I can do that. Yeah, I
25:34
Speaker 1: can do that. They gave you a blanket of covering
25:36
Speaker 1: that you didn't realize, oh girl, and you just don't
25:39
Speaker 1: know it until you get older, you get out in
25:41
Speaker 1: the world and you realize, oh, you realize that his
25:45
Speaker 1: prayers are still sustaining you absolutely they're still.
25:48
Speaker 3: Living my past to say that, you know, prayers last
25:51
Speaker 3: for generation. Oh yeah, oh yeah, so it's once it's prayed,
25:54
Speaker 3: it's there.
25:55
Speaker 2: Oh, it's gonna hover, it's complete.
25:58
Speaker 1: Yeah.
25:58
Speaker 3: And so do you feel even like as you're growing
26:01
Speaker 3: up through this family, that his vision you're a grandfather's
26:07
Speaker 3: vision for you has been completed, that whatever he prayed
26:11
Speaker 3: for you, that it is happening and it is working.
26:14
Speaker 1: Absolutely. I think his biggest prayer is that his family
26:20
Speaker 1: knows God and loves God and then teaches their children
26:25
Speaker 1: to know God and love God. That that is his legacy.
26:31
Speaker 1: And so for me, absolutely, I love God. I was
26:37
Speaker 1: blessed to have a spouse, find a spouse that also
26:41
Speaker 1: loves God. And so now we have a child who God.
26:48
Speaker 1: You ain't got no choice but to love God. You know.
26:52
Speaker 1: I was going through some things last week and it's
26:55
Speaker 1: a bit of a struggle. My son he is born.
26:59
Speaker 1: He came over, he's it. Do you want me to
27:01
Speaker 1: pray for you? Mom? I said, yes, I do. It's working,
27:04
Speaker 1: And he said, okay, Lord Jesus, Mommy wants to feel better. Amen,
27:12
Speaker 1: help her and Jesus name, Amen, do you feel better
27:19
Speaker 1: about my two year old. We're teaching him, we're getting there.
27:24
Speaker 1: But I say, what's our nighttime prayer? He goes, Jesus,
27:27
Speaker 1: I love you. Amen, Amen, that period.
27:31
Speaker 2: That's it.
27:31
Speaker 1: That's it. That is a great night. Yeah, that's what
27:35
Speaker 1: it is. So it's you know, that is his prayers
27:38
Speaker 1: absolutely continuously coming to fruition. Yes, yeah, yeah, okay, ver
27:46
Speaker 1: I get that. Then let's go into your storytelling, acting
27:48
Speaker 1: and how we got into this. Okay, so when did
27:51
Speaker 1: you realize acting and storytelling where you're calling and how
27:55
Speaker 1: old were you when you first started acting, and what
27:59
Speaker 1: was your first gig? Oh, so I was. I was
28:02
Speaker 1: a kid. My parents, especially my mom, used to take
28:08
Speaker 1: us to the movies all the time, so we would
28:11
Speaker 1: do double features all to say, oh yeah baby, my
28:16
Speaker 1: grandparents would be on my daddy's tail like too many movies. Okay,
28:22
Speaker 1: can we pause. I didn't grow up in the church
28:24
Speaker 1: like you. Two days? So what were the rules like
28:27
Speaker 1: what was considered doublish? Skirt had to be? The skirt
28:33
Speaker 1: had to be. And my grandmother saw my dress, now
28:37
Speaker 1: she wouldn't.
28:38
Speaker 3: Have she wasn give me a little not sure would
28:45
Speaker 3: sure would?
28:45
Speaker 1: Baby? No? Absolutely, makeup.
28:51
Speaker 2: It's about about makeup.
28:54
Speaker 1: Not not too much, not too much. Jezebel, I did
28:59
Speaker 1: hear about the red lipstick growing up, Like, I didn't
29:03
Speaker 1: grow up in the church the way that you guys did.
29:04
Speaker 1: But my mom still no red lipstick. She was she
29:08
Speaker 1: was serious about that. But the movies, because it's because
29:12
Speaker 1: what are you going to see. There's people gonna be story,
29:15
Speaker 1: people gonna because people gonna be doing too much. Your
29:18
Speaker 1: kids don't need to see all that. It was like
29:21
Speaker 1: kids Disney movie or something that was age appropriate. Was
29:25
Speaker 1: that not It's not that it was bad, but they
29:29
Speaker 1: also you just got to look at the time my
29:31
Speaker 1: grandparents did. That's true the movie, that's true. And so
29:34
Speaker 1: then that's that's just what they know. And they're they're
29:37
Speaker 1: trying to protect what you're being exposed to. I understand.
29:39
Speaker 1: So even my dad and then they couldn't listen to
29:43
Speaker 1: secular music and so but generation okay got a little
29:53
Speaker 1: bit more loose, you know what I mean. And my
29:56
Speaker 1: dad and my mom my mom didn't grow up like that.
30:01
Speaker 1: My mama liked the movies, right, She's like, I'm gonna
30:03
Speaker 1: go to my corn yeah, and do you see like
30:09
Speaker 1: double features every weekend? I loved it and I was
30:12
Speaker 1: just mesmerized by the screen as just I was just like, oh,
30:15
Speaker 1: I want to do that since I was little, and
30:20
Speaker 1: I think the first time I really talked about it
30:23
Speaker 1: was when I was going to graduate from high school
30:26
Speaker 1: and go to college and I wanted to major in theater.
30:29
Speaker 1: And my whole family was like, huh, what do you
30:32
Speaker 1: what do you mean? What kind of theater? You don't
30:35
Speaker 1: You ain't never done a theater? Yeah, but I know
30:37
Speaker 1: I can do it. And they were like, yeah, so like,
30:41
Speaker 1: why don't we look at some other options. Let's see
30:45
Speaker 1: what maybe we should like look at that. And I
30:49
Speaker 1: was like, yeah, no, it's okay. But then they saw
30:53
Speaker 1: my first show, which was Hospice by Pearl Click. Yeah,
31:00
Speaker 1: she's wonderful. It's a two woman show. Okay, so you
31:03
Speaker 1: couldn't help the Can we still watch it? Can you
31:05
Speaker 1: still pull it up today? Or no? Oh probably not.
31:07
Speaker 1: This was in theater, this okay, this was at school,
31:11
Speaker 1: and they were just their minds were blown, and they said, oh, okay,
31:19
Speaker 1: so yep, my mom came to every single show. I
31:23
Speaker 1: did every single show, and that's that's how I knew.
31:28
Speaker 1: That was the first thing, that was the first piece
31:30
Speaker 1: of theater I did, and I did a lot of
31:32
Speaker 1: theater at Wayne State, and my mom came to every show.
31:36
Speaker 1: And they recently just honored me, oh, for all of
31:42
Speaker 1: my work that I've done outside of school. So I
31:45
Speaker 1: just went back. This is what twenty twenty two years later,
31:50
Speaker 1: the theater department honored me for all of my work.
31:53
Speaker 1: They had a big program back in October. I just
32:00
Speaker 1: was like, oh my god, this is crazy, this is
32:03
Speaker 1: really wild. So yeah, that's when I knew I was young.
32:09
Speaker 1: I pushed through. I said, this is what when you
32:12
Speaker 1: started acting? When I actually started? Uh? When did I
32:17
Speaker 1: start at Wayne State? Eighteen? Shout out to Wayne State eighteen?
32:21
Speaker 2: And what was it about Wayne State's program?
32:22
Speaker 3: Because that's a big thing when you're when you're picking
32:25
Speaker 3: majoring in theater, like it's a very.
32:27
Speaker 1: So I didn't realize that they had such a great program.
32:31
Speaker 1: I just knew I didn't want to leave home, gotcha,
32:33
Speaker 1: And Wayne State was about fifteen minutes from my home,
32:37
Speaker 1: so I didn't even move out of my house. I
32:39
Speaker 1: lived at home all of undergrad. I was a family girl.
32:43
Speaker 1: I would like leave rehearsal and call my dad and
32:46
Speaker 1: be like, hey, let's go to the movies, or see
32:49
Speaker 1: what my mom was doing, or hang out with my brothers.
32:52
Speaker 1: I was a family girl. I like, that's what it was.
32:56
Speaker 1: So I was at school, and I was at home,
32:57
Speaker 1: and I was at church. That's it. So you're stepping
33:00
Speaker 1: into your own voice, and this is your lane. This
33:04
Speaker 1: is something that you're still doing. Obviously, what fears and
33:08
Speaker 1: challenges did you face as you're navigating, just stepping away
33:13
Speaker 1: from the whine ins and you know, acting and the
33:17
Speaker 1: entertainment and the arts is your career. I think the
33:25
Speaker 1: I don't know if there were fears, but I think
33:26
Speaker 1: the challenges are always. No. I chose an industry where
33:35
Speaker 1: I have to audition and you have to say whether
33:40
Speaker 1: or not do you think I'm good enough? I know
33:43
Speaker 1: I'm good enough, but I have to wait on you
33:45
Speaker 1: to say, oh I see her talent, Oh she looks
33:50
Speaker 1: the part, or she acts the part, or she constantly
33:54
Speaker 1: waiting for somebody else to approve what I know I
33:58
Speaker 1: can do and who I am. That was very challenging
34:02
Speaker 1: for me. What about your faith? My faith is the
34:06
Speaker 1: thing that has always kept me and sustained me. Because
34:10
Speaker 1: I realize there are going to be knows. But I
34:14
Speaker 1: think with my faith understanding this is what God has
34:17
Speaker 1: called me to do. Well, if that's to know, that
34:20
Speaker 1: means you got something else coming? God, what you got
34:23
Speaker 1: because I'm doing what I'm supposed to do. So now
34:26
Speaker 1: you do what you gotta do. Because to me, we
34:29
Speaker 1: always say, oh God did this, or God did that,
34:32
Speaker 1: or God's going to work it out. But faith without
34:34
Speaker 1: works is dead. So my work is stay disciplined, make
34:38
Speaker 1: sure I'm constantly expanding my gift. Make sure I'm constantly
34:46
Speaker 1: working on me. Make sure I am doing the things
34:50
Speaker 1: I need to do so that I can step back
34:52
Speaker 1: and say, all right, God, not sign for you to
34:55
Speaker 1: show up. I remember sitting it was it was twenty fifteen,
35:00
Speaker 1: it was June, and I had just come back from
35:03
Speaker 1: New York from one of my really close girlfriend's weddings,
35:08
Speaker 1: and I was sitting in I think Tea was in
35:15
Speaker 1: the bed still super early, and I woke up and
35:18
Speaker 1: I couldn't go back to sleep, so I went out
35:19
Speaker 1: on our couch and I was just praying. I said, God,
35:23
Speaker 1: I've done what I need to do. I need you
35:27
Speaker 1: to show up. If this is what you have for
35:29
Speaker 1: me to do, I need you to open the doors
35:31
Speaker 1: that was my prayer. Two days later, I was talking
35:35
Speaker 1: to Oprah Winfrey on the phone because Greenleaf had just
35:39
Speaker 1: come across her desk and she could not get me
35:42
Speaker 1: out of her head for a particular role, and so
35:45
Speaker 1: she wanted my information so she could send it to
35:48
Speaker 1: casting so that I could get my audition and I
35:50
Speaker 1: could go in there and she could open the door
35:52
Speaker 1: for me as wide as she possibly can, and I
35:55
Speaker 1: go in and knock it out as only you whinings do.
36:00
Speaker 1: I was sitting there like Jesus, I didn't know. I
36:08
Speaker 1: guess so to me, my faith is doing the work
36:14
Speaker 1: and then trusting God is going to do his part.
36:17
Speaker 1: So we have to talk about we can't just breathe
36:19
Speaker 1: past green.
36:22
Speaker 2: You can't.
36:23
Speaker 1: We can't breathe Charity. I want to. I want to
36:26
Speaker 1: say that. I mean, I have a complete trying. We're trying,
36:32
Speaker 1: not the fangirl, but.
36:34
Speaker 2: But Greenleaf is I mean it's notable. I mean it's
36:38
Speaker 2: on Netflix. When I tell you my mother.
36:41
Speaker 1: And my mother in law upstairs, Yeah, she's up her
36:47
Speaker 1: whole body back.
36:49
Speaker 3: But we have to talk about the process of green
36:51
Speaker 3: leave cast, just the just preparing for it. Yeah, and Charity,
36:57
Speaker 3: do you have any similarities to change life.
37:01
Speaker 1: You know, that's a loaded question. That's so that's we
37:09
Speaker 1: have to go. Yeah, I have to go there. Man.
37:12
Speaker 1: It was a process. That's literally what happened. My My
37:16
Speaker 1: uncle called me and said, uh, girl, guess who just
37:19
Speaker 1: called me? I was like, who this is? Uncle Biby?
37:21
Speaker 1: Is Uncle Bibe that he he knows he's my favorite girl,
37:25
Speaker 1: He said, girl, guess who just called me? Because we
37:27
Speaker 1: had done he did a musical called Born for This
37:30
Speaker 1: the bb Wining Story, and we were in the phase
37:33
Speaker 1: of workshops, and so we did one final workshop in
37:35
Speaker 1: New York in March of twenty fifteen, and we knew
37:39
Speaker 1: after that workshop we were going to actually do a
37:42
Speaker 1: production of it in twenty sixteen in Atlanta. So at
37:48
Speaker 1: that workshop, Oprah came Gaale came Miss cisly Tyson. So
37:58
Speaker 1: I was just like, what is that? A y'all? We're
38:00
Speaker 1: in like a rehearsal room, a rehearsal room in New York.
38:03
Speaker 1: Were you ever starstruck at any point? I mean, growing
38:07
Speaker 1: up in this with your family, But it's like some
38:10
Speaker 1: I just was. I was always in awe, in awe,
38:16
Speaker 1: and we're just in a like a little dirty rehearsal room.
38:20
Speaker 1: But it was dirty. It was dirty, it was but
38:27
Speaker 1: it was a rehearsal. But it was a really fun cast.
38:34
Speaker 1: My brother and I were playing BB and CC and
38:38
Speaker 1: it was just it was a really great time. And
38:40
Speaker 1: so when he called me two months later, he said, girl,
38:45
Speaker 1: you will not guess who just called me. I said, oh,
38:47
Speaker 1: he said, oh, bros like oh did she love the play?
38:49
Speaker 1: And he was like yeah, but she called because she
38:51
Speaker 1: wants you to email her because she has some pro
38:55
Speaker 1: I said, what do you what? So then that happened.
38:59
Speaker 1: I sent her my headshot and resume. She asked me
39:02
Speaker 1: for my phone number. I gave her that. She called
39:04
Speaker 1: told me what she could, and then maybe two weeks later,
39:08
Speaker 1: I had an audition, and then after that audition, I
39:13
Speaker 1: had a callback and this was my first. I've never
39:19
Speaker 1: been a series regular. I had never been a guest star,
39:21
Speaker 1: a co star, none of that stuff. And so before
39:27
Speaker 1: my callback, they sent over a deal because they're like,
39:30
Speaker 1: if they like you, you know, they want to have
39:31
Speaker 1: the deal already done. And I was like, this is crazy.
39:35
Speaker 1: I haven't never been this far before. You got to
39:36
Speaker 1: ask my husband because he's my attorney. And so when
39:40
Speaker 1: we got the dal I was like, yes, this is great,
39:42
Speaker 1: I'll sign it. He said, well, as your husband, I'm
39:44
Speaker 1: happy for you. We're going to go ahead and give
39:49
Speaker 1: them a spot. And I was like, but wait, just
39:52
Speaker 1: sign it.
39:55
Speaker 3: Explained to people because people don't most people don't know
39:59
Speaker 3: the the brevity of a series regular versus a co star.
40:03
Speaker 2: People don't know the verbiage.
40:04
Speaker 1: But why it's a big deal to get a series
40:07
Speaker 1: regular like that, Oh, it's a series regular that first
40:10
Speaker 1: of all, that just means a job for a minute.
40:13
Speaker 1: It's all episodes produced, so you're gonna be in every
40:18
Speaker 1: episode and you are a part of the telling of
40:22
Speaker 1: the story as a whole. And so I didn't I
40:27
Speaker 1: didn't fully understand everything at that point. I was just like, okay, cool.
40:31
Speaker 1: And when it hit me was when after the deal
40:36
Speaker 1: was done, did the call back. The next day, they
40:38
Speaker 1: called me, told me I got it. I was at
40:40
Speaker 1: my brother, my sister in law, and my niece and
40:44
Speaker 1: I were leaving Trader Joe's on Vine and Sunset. We
40:48
Speaker 1: had just walked out and they called me and told
40:51
Speaker 1: me I got it, y'all. I was in the middle
40:54
Speaker 1: of the street and my niece came over and hugged me.
41:02
Speaker 1: She's fifteen now. My baby is fifteen now, but she
41:07
Speaker 1: came over and hugged me. And my brother's like, you
41:09
Speaker 1: got us. And then I called Tee and Tee was
41:13
Speaker 1: coming from his workout. He came around the corner. It
41:18
Speaker 1: was so crazy, it was such a moment. It was
41:22
Speaker 1: the best. And then went to Atlanta and we had
41:26
Speaker 1: the cast dinner. And so I'm meeting Keith David for
41:32
Speaker 1: the first time. I'm meeting Wynn Whitfields.
41:36
Speaker 4: I'm meeting Merle Dandridge, Greg Allen Williams, Lemon Rucker, Lamon
41:42
Speaker 4: played my brother, Ty White, who played my husband for
41:46
Speaker 4: the first two seasons.
41:48
Speaker 1: I'm meeting these people the first time. And Lamon I
41:53
Speaker 1: remember sitting across from him and he asked me, Hey, so,
41:56
Speaker 1: who's your agent. I didn't have an agent, the Lord
42:00
Speaker 1: because truly, because I said, oh, I don't have one,
42:05
Speaker 1: and he said, how you get this? Yeah? And I
42:10
Speaker 1: said oh. He said, oh, we're gonna talk later. And
42:14
Speaker 1: that was when I knew, oh, this doesn't happen. This
42:18
Speaker 1: is not And I said, Lord, I don't know what
42:22
Speaker 1: you're doing, but I thank you. Yes, it doesn't happen
42:25
Speaker 1: like that. That's not the traditional journey. But I'm not
42:30
Speaker 1: the traditional girl, and I don't serve a job that
42:34
Speaker 1: is above and beyond. I didn't put God in the box.
42:38
Speaker 1: So why do I have to get things the way
42:40
Speaker 1: that you think I should get that?
42:42
Speaker 3: So your family, remember, remember the conversation when you told
42:45
Speaker 3: them I want to be I want to go act,
42:47
Speaker 3: and I want to do this, and then this happens.
42:49
Speaker 2: What is their response after you get this.
42:51
Speaker 1: Huge show trying to give me a trouble.
42:53
Speaker 2: I am right right here. I'm boring.
42:59
Speaker 1: I love the wine and family. I had some that
43:01
Speaker 1: were very happy for me. Uncle Beebe was very happy
43:04
Speaker 1: for me. Uncle Beebe was there for me every step
43:07
Speaker 1: of the way. About your father, my dad was happy,
43:12
Speaker 1: My dad was happy, my mom certainly, my brothers absolutely.
43:20
Speaker 1: You don't have to say you don't have to say
43:22
Speaker 1: names the others. You know, just in reading the summary
43:28
Speaker 1: of what Greenleaf was going to be, they didn't like it.
43:34
Speaker 1: Felt like I needed to not do it. I thought
43:38
Speaker 1: that it was just deploy to make the church look bad.
43:43
Speaker 1: And that made me sad for a second because I thought,
43:47
Speaker 1: you know, I'm the next generation. Yeah, I have always
43:54
Speaker 1: said what it is I want to do. I've always
43:57
Speaker 1: also proclaimed my faith the very boldly, very loudly. I
44:02
Speaker 1: have trusted God in every step of the process. And
44:08
Speaker 1: now because of what the show is or what you
44:12
Speaker 1: think it's going to be, it's still not good enough.
44:16
Speaker 1: It made me very sad. So what is your response,
44:20
Speaker 1: I guess, go back into that moment when you're expressing
44:24
Speaker 1: joy and have this grand opportunity and you're met with resistance.
44:30
Speaker 1: What is your response to that resistance? Verbally? What have
44:34
Speaker 1: you said in that moment to your family members who
44:37
Speaker 1: try to say eh oh, I said nothing, Okay, I
44:41
Speaker 1: said nothing, no response. Because also the thing about getting older,
44:46
Speaker 1: which praise God, hopefully as you get older you're a
44:49
Speaker 1: little bit more wisdom. And I learned when I just
44:52
Speaker 1: if I don't have the right response and I don't
44:54
Speaker 1: want to be disrespectful, I just shut up until I'm
44:58
Speaker 1: able to be respect and so that's what I did.
45:03
Speaker 1: My husband got the brunt of it. I would tell
45:05
Speaker 1: I tell him everything. I'm just like, this is ridiculous,
45:08
Speaker 1: Like I don't understand when it's something going to be
45:10
Speaker 1: good enough? And then I said, why am I still
45:13
Speaker 1: living for their approval. So all of that started, and
45:18
Speaker 1: I said, Oh, it's not about living for them, it's
45:22
Speaker 1: not their journey. It's not I was like, you know what, Lord,
45:26
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. I'm sorry for trying to make sure other
45:29
Speaker 1: people are happy.
45:31
Speaker 2: You give you this huge blessing. You're good, So what's
45:35
Speaker 2: your good?
45:36
Speaker 1: So I'm good? So what advice would you give to
45:39
Speaker 1: someone else who's in a similar position, grew up in
45:43
Speaker 1: the church or just grew up with family members who
45:45
Speaker 1: may not understand your vision and your dream. What advice
45:50
Speaker 1: would you give to someone else. It's not for anybody
45:52
Speaker 1: else to understand but you and keep going. So let
45:55
Speaker 1: that go and trust that whatever is meant to be
45:58
Speaker 1: revealed to them will be in due time. It's not
46:03
Speaker 1: about them. Did you get the vision? Are you good with? It?
46:08
Speaker 1: Is God showing you what you need to do, then
46:10
Speaker 1: you do it.
46:11
Speaker 3: During the filming of Greenly, did you ever feel conviction
46:15
Speaker 3: or any like when you're working in the scenes, or
46:19
Speaker 3: were there ever a time where you ask them to
46:21
Speaker 3: change things in order for you to play the role authentically?
46:25
Speaker 3: You clear absolutely, I'm an actor.
46:31
Speaker 1: I am an actor. That is what I is, that
46:34
Speaker 1: is what I love. I want the challenge to become
46:38
Speaker 1: something that's not me. That's that's that's what I do,
46:42
Speaker 1: and I do it very well. Period. So I'm no.
46:46
Speaker 1: I I have my boundaries, which I've discussed with my
46:51
Speaker 1: husband before we even got married. So yeah, and it's
46:56
Speaker 1: not up for anybody else's period debate. I know who
47:01
Speaker 1: I am, I know what I'm doing, and if I
47:04
Speaker 1: do feel bad about something, then it's like, oh, Okay.
47:07
Speaker 1: What I realized is we're gonna make mistakes and we're
47:09
Speaker 1: gonna fall. It's about learning, getting back up and keep going.
47:14
Speaker 1: So I'm I'm okay with that. I'm good with that.
47:18
Speaker 1: And at some point everybody else had to realize I'm grown, yes,
47:22
Speaker 1: and I have a whole I'm not twelve.
47:24
Speaker 2: You have a husband.
47:25
Speaker 1: I got a whole husband. But I'm somebody mama. That
47:29
Speaker 1: part if you don't get off my back.
47:32
Speaker 3: But you're not doing anything leg let's just be honest.
47:37
Speaker 1: They were watching, they were watching. But also here's the thing.
47:40
Speaker 1: It started conversation. Green Leaf didn't make church bad. We
47:45
Speaker 1: have made the church look bad, and so now it's
47:48
Speaker 1: about answering for those things that we have done. Ain't
47:51
Speaker 1: nobody pulling this out of thin air.
47:53
Speaker 2: They're getting a story from somewhere.
47:55
Speaker 1: And so how do we answer for that and how
47:57
Speaker 1: do we do better? We talked about I mean that's
48:00
Speaker 1: what I mean, Like the church.
48:01
Speaker 3: Has to do better in fostering our youth and to
48:05
Speaker 3: be coming into themselves.
48:07
Speaker 1: Yeah, the Lord in Christ like we have we have
48:09
Speaker 1: to do it.
48:09
Speaker 2: Yeah, or else they why be in it?
48:12
Speaker 1: Why be?
48:12
Speaker 3: Why be in it in the first place? If I can't be, yeah,
48:15
Speaker 3: I'm created to be. So that's a that's a huge topic.
48:17
Speaker 3: And you are the perfect person ever you get the chance, seriously,
48:22
Speaker 3: because a lot of people struggle, kids struggle with they
48:26
Speaker 3: want to do right for God, but they have this
48:28
Speaker 3: un you know, untraditional way of being. You know what
48:33
Speaker 3: they want to do and it might not be I'm
48:35
Speaker 3: not I don't want to be a minister.
48:37
Speaker 2: I want to do it this way or so. I
48:40
Speaker 2: love this conversation.
48:41
Speaker 1: It is a deep one. And the way that you
48:44
Speaker 1: know that that's what you're doing wherever you are. I
48:47
Speaker 1: think people are like, well, you took that job, and
48:49
Speaker 1: that's not a good job for you to be a light.
48:51
Speaker 1: That's not true. Any job you should be being a light.
48:54
Speaker 1: Whatever you're doing, you should be being alike. Wherever you go,
48:57
Speaker 1: you should be being a light. And one of my
49:00
Speaker 1: favorite moments while working was this young lady, Tiffany, who
49:07
Speaker 1: worked behind the scenes. She was in sound. Tiffany was
49:11
Speaker 1: in sound. I believe we were cool. We weren't like
49:15
Speaker 1: the best of friends, but I was cool with everybody.
49:17
Speaker 1: And she just randomly came to me one day and said, hey,
49:21
Speaker 1: miss Joy, do you mind praying for me? You chose
49:25
Speaker 1: me to pray for you. That's why I'm here. That
49:29
Speaker 1: is why I'm here. God's love, God's presence is being
49:33
Speaker 1: reflected wherever I am. And you saw that, and you
49:37
Speaker 1: needed a moment and I got you. Absolutely, I'm aware
49:42
Speaker 1: I'm supposed to be doing what I'm supposed to do.
49:44
Speaker 1: I don't know what y'all doing, but I ain't got
49:46
Speaker 1: time to figure it out, worried about what I gotta do.
49:48
Speaker 1: Do you believe your name was strategically chosen? Absolutely? Absolutely?
49:56
Speaker 1: Absolutely I am. It is part of my calling to
50:00
Speaker 1: to bring joy of the Lord wherever I go and
50:04
Speaker 1: and shift the atmosphere in some sort of way. Yeah,
50:10
Speaker 1: all right, let's play a little game, okay, miss Joy
50:13
Speaker 1: and Tamara a game. I'm gonna do this or that, okay,
50:17
Speaker 1: quickly asking you first and then smara, okay, all right, ready,
50:21
Speaker 1: all ready to go, all right, quiet time or worship music. Worship,
50:26
Speaker 1: definitely worship, worship music or hip hop at the gym,
50:31
Speaker 1: oh Man. But I was walking up running canyon once
50:41
Speaker 1: and things was getting a little shaken, and call on
50:45
Speaker 1: the law and turn on guy from you as I
50:48
Speaker 1: was making the last time, you had to turn on worship.
50:52
Speaker 1: But gym music. But if we're taking it and we
51:00
Speaker 1: take the gym outside and we start hating, thats all right?
51:05
Speaker 1: Hip hop okay. Journaling or praying, praying. I'm so not
51:10
Speaker 1: good at journaling.
51:11
Speaker 3: I like your journal but like sometimes my journaling is
51:14
Speaker 3: like a it is a prayer prayer, but you like
51:17
Speaker 3: to write it.
51:18
Speaker 1: I like to write.
51:19
Speaker 2: Yes, a prayer writer, okay.
51:21
Speaker 1: I love a prayer writer. Yes, I'm just a prayer
51:24
Speaker 1: prayer Okay. I love it. Early mornings or late nights.
51:30
Speaker 1: You know what it used to be late nights. It's
51:32
Speaker 1: early mornings. Now it's early mornings. I will get up
51:36
Speaker 1: before my baby so I can have some peace, but
51:39
Speaker 1: then I'll be sleepy, so I go to bed. But
51:41
Speaker 1: you know that's how they say it should be get
51:43
Speaker 1: up early and then go to bed early. That's where
51:46
Speaker 1: I'm at.
51:47
Speaker 2: I have never been a morning person. I don't know.
51:50
Speaker 1: I don't know what's gonna happen. Don't go before a
51:56
Speaker 1: don't call her, just don't. Also, don't call me, you said, okay,
52:04
Speaker 1: all right, look yeah amen, okay, glam or natural? Okay?
52:12
Speaker 1: So I love getting cute to find natural like no
52:20
Speaker 1: makeup and maybe just my scare and lip gloss. So
52:24
Speaker 1: I like to keep a lash done. Okay, So if
52:26
Speaker 1: I keep my lashes non, I ain't put known, not
52:30
Speaker 1: a stitch of makeup. Okay. Now I'm not bare face.
52:36
Speaker 2: I will be bare face.
52:37
Speaker 1: I'm bare face.
52:38
Speaker 3: I don't like to have at least mass scar, at
52:41
Speaker 3: least mascara, and my and my eyebrows like I have
52:44
Speaker 3: my eyebrows on.
52:45
Speaker 1: I respect it. Chef or chauffeur. I don't know mine. Chef.
52:54
Speaker 1: I like to eat and I don't like to okay,
52:58
Speaker 1: the chef it is. But I like driving from Detroit.
53:02
Speaker 1: I like that I know how to drive. I don't
53:03
Speaker 1: want to drive drive, do you yes, baby, I tell
53:08
Speaker 1: you it's it's the bosses move. I want to in
53:12
Speaker 1: the hill and they're like, you drove this? Sure? Did
53:14
Speaker 1: I find.
53:18
Speaker 2: Drive a car on a stick in this in January?
53:20
Speaker 1: Baby? You you have no idea what I've been holding back.
53:23
Speaker 3: That's what I'm saying, Like we may need a part too, literally,
53:28
Speaker 3: how to drive on a stick in January. I'm from Indiana,
53:30
Speaker 3: so oh yeah, and you know that's how I learned
53:33
Speaker 3: how to drive.
53:33
Speaker 2: But I don't want to drive.
53:37
Speaker 1: Planning or going with the flow. I go with the
53:40
Speaker 1: flow definitely going okay, fashionably uncomfortable or comfortably unfashionable, fashionably uncomfortable, Okay,
53:50
Speaker 1: we're gonna be cute. That part. I might have to
53:53
Speaker 1: hold it in. And you know what I'm saying that part,
53:56
Speaker 1: I'm gonna through it. I'm suffering through it. Uh huh.
53:59
Speaker 1: I got a little bit. I got a two year old.
54:02
Speaker 1: What that means baggy? Baggy? And you can still be
54:10
Speaker 1: she said, she said, no excuse fashionably uncomfortable. Okay, when
54:18
Speaker 1: they go low? Are we going high or low? It
54:22
Speaker 1: depends on the situation, like are we taking it to
54:27
Speaker 1: It depends on the situation. That's the and and you know,
54:30
Speaker 1: and and that's why he's still working on me. That
54:33
Speaker 1: part I'm gonna work on podcast.
54:36
Speaker 2: I get it.
54:37
Speaker 1: But sometimes but if I'm still working right now, Michelle
54:41
Speaker 1: was in here, what will we say, ladies, we are
54:43
Speaker 1: working on trying, and I think we're gonna we're gonna
54:47
Speaker 1: hand out. She's gonna give us a She's gonna wanna
54:49
Speaker 1: tell her I'm still becoming that part, that part, and
54:53
Speaker 1: she's gonna say. You know what, women, last one, speak
54:58
Speaker 1: your mind or keep it to yourself. Mm hmm, depends
55:04
Speaker 1: on the situation. A lot of times I will keep
55:08
Speaker 1: it to myself when I realize I'm dealing with a fool.
55:12
Speaker 1: You ain't gonna We're not gonna waste yeah, yeah, yeah.
55:18
Speaker 3: Ok, yeah, I am Doris's granddaughter in the Marland.
55:27
Speaker 2: I'm letting it out. It's coming out. How it's gonna come.
55:30
Speaker 1: Out to you? And if I apologize later, I will,
55:33
Speaker 1: I will. I will repent later and understand this, understand
55:36
Speaker 1: but I can't. But I can't. I can't that. So
55:45
Speaker 1: every episode we ask our guests to bring a legacy object,
55:48
Speaker 1: something that represents your family, You're just where you're going,
55:52
Speaker 1: who you are. What did you bring today? So today
55:56
Speaker 1: I'm broad this is actually so it's a Bible. Clearly,
56:07
Speaker 1: this is my husband's late father's Bible. Wow, and this
56:13
Speaker 1: is so, this was his cloth he died. It'll be
56:21
Speaker 1: two years in July. It'll be two years in July.
56:27
Speaker 1: But as I said, we both come from church. His
56:30
Speaker 1: dad was a pastor. This is the foundation of my life.
56:35
Speaker 1: It is the foundation of our lives and my my legacy.
56:43
Speaker 1: When you asked me that, I was like, I don't
56:44
Speaker 1: have anything tangible because my legacy is faith. That is
56:48
Speaker 1: the thing that has been passed down. I believe when
56:52
Speaker 1: it feels like there's nothing to believe in some way, somehow,
56:55
Speaker 1: I always I keep getting back up because I have faith.
56:59
Speaker 1: And that is a thing that I am pushing to
57:04
Speaker 1: my son. That is the thing that made me start
57:07
Speaker 1: choosing joy, because I realized in my early thirties that's
57:12
Speaker 1: a choice. You can choose joy. It's a struggle some
57:18
Speaker 1: days to choose it, but it's within your power. You
57:23
Speaker 1: can do it. And so how do we do it?
57:26
Speaker 1: How do we do it when it's great? How do
57:27
Speaker 1: we do it when it's not great? Faith? Faith? I
57:32
Speaker 1: have the faith to keep choosing joy every day in
57:36
Speaker 1: the midst of the hardships. That's my mother is going
57:41
Speaker 1: through Alzheimer's right now, and when I was messed up
57:45
Speaker 1: for a couple of weeks, I couldn't go see her.
57:48
Speaker 1: And I just got to go see her this past Saturday,
57:51
Speaker 1: and I just played some of Auntie Ceci's music and
57:54
Speaker 1: danced with her. And she didn't know my name, she
58:00
Speaker 1: knows her daughter, and she wanted to dance with me.
58:04
Speaker 1: And it was so sad because she couldn't get all
58:09
Speaker 1: her words together, but she knew Jesus. And I was like,
58:16
Speaker 1: oh God, my faith and wayfriend, I know what you
58:19
Speaker 1: can do. There's always a miracle around the corner. I
58:23
Speaker 1: still believe. I see where we are, but I still
58:27
Speaker 1: have faith to believe, and I'm still going to try
58:29
Speaker 1: to find joy in this moment where my mom is
58:33
Speaker 1: only seventy two, she can't put a sentence together, she
58:39
Speaker 1: can't remember my name, but she knows I'm hers. So
58:43
Speaker 1: I gotta find the joy in the moment, and I
58:46
Speaker 1: gotta keep my faith going. That's my life, that's my foundation,
58:51
Speaker 1: that is my legacy. And you exude that you are joy.
58:58
Speaker 1: We just met you.
59:00
Speaker 2: I feel like when I tell you, we feel like
59:03
Speaker 2: we feel like.
59:07
Speaker 1: Talk to and your energy that's we we feel it,
59:14
Speaker 1: we see it. You are joy, which is why I
59:16
Speaker 1: actually earlier Joy must have been a strategic yeah to
59:21
Speaker 1: name you that, Yeah, that's who fits you perfect. My
59:25
Speaker 1: mom My mom is Deborah, and so she wanted to
59:28
Speaker 1: name me Deborah, and then it was joy in money
59:33
Speaker 1: whinings and money means faith. So you carry it beautifully
59:41
Speaker 1: and we're living in times where just we we need it. Ye,
59:46
Speaker 1: people need it in their day to days because a
59:48
Speaker 1: lot of people just don't have it. And you naturally
59:52
Speaker 1: light up a room and so your future is so bright.
59:55
Speaker 1: And again, just meeting you and having this conversation already
1:00:00
Speaker 1: has just filled my spirit. I know Tamar as well.
1:00:03
Speaker 1: So you are a joy and you're so wonderful and
1:00:07
Speaker 1: you're choosing choosing joy and a podcast.
1:00:12
Speaker 2: Yes, choosing joy.
1:00:14
Speaker 3: So give us that how you went from choosing joy
1:00:18
Speaker 3: in the moment, joy to the masses.
1:00:22
Speaker 1: So I don't think of myself as someone that should
1:00:26
Speaker 1: just be talking all the time, because I just get
1:00:29
Speaker 1: tired of talking. But I had a friend of mine
1:00:32
Speaker 1: who I had done a podcast before, and I had
1:00:36
Speaker 1: a co host and it was lovely. But then a
1:00:39
Speaker 1: friend of mine was like, you should doo another one.
1:00:41
Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, girl and I are doing that
1:00:43
Speaker 1: and she kept saying it and she was like, oh,
1:00:45
Speaker 1: maybe it should be like a green Leaf rewatch podcast
1:00:48
Speaker 1: and I was like and my husband was like, no,
1:00:52
Speaker 1: that's a little too narrow. You know, we need something
1:00:55
Speaker 1: a little more open. And I said, choosing joy and
1:01:03
Speaker 1: he was like, yeah. I said, I think that can
1:01:05
Speaker 1: be the podcast. But I also think that that's that's life.
1:01:11
Speaker 1: And I would love to just talk to people about
1:01:16
Speaker 1: how they do that, because I think it's different for
1:01:18
Speaker 1: everybody and what does that look like for you? And
1:01:23
Speaker 1: what are the moments where you've had to do it? Yeah,
1:01:25
Speaker 1: and it ain't been easy and did you do it
1:01:28
Speaker 1: or did you not? Because we also have those days
1:01:31
Speaker 1: where we just you know what, by joy? And then
1:01:35
Speaker 1: for me, it's also how do I choose me? Where
1:01:39
Speaker 1: are the days where I have to put everybody else
1:01:42
Speaker 1: to the side and choose myself because I need it
1:01:45
Speaker 1: because I can't keep pouring from an empty cup? So
1:01:48
Speaker 1: how do you do that? And I think it's hard
1:01:51
Speaker 1: for women, especially Black women. It's hard for us to
1:01:54
Speaker 1: choose us because we have so much going and we
1:01:57
Speaker 1: have so much we it's so many people we need
1:01:58
Speaker 1: to take care of. We didn't have the space to
1:02:02
Speaker 1: the way the podcast is presenting a space, Yeah, women
1:02:05
Speaker 1: to feel safe to talk about choosing themselves and choosing joy.
1:02:10
Speaker 1: We didn't have that. It wasn't in our culture black women.
1:02:15
Speaker 1: It's a foreign idea. Very yeah, and it's okay. It's
1:02:20
Speaker 1: not selfish. No, it doesn't mean that we're not living
1:02:23
Speaker 1: and we don't care. It is necessary. So that's beautiful.
1:02:28
Speaker 1: It took me a minute to get there, so I'm
1:02:32
Speaker 1: trying to show other young women that you can get
1:02:35
Speaker 1: there sooner. Yeah.
1:02:36
Speaker 2: So the audience about how would we hear it Choosing joy?
1:02:42
Speaker 1: You can find Choosing Joy on I Heart or any
1:02:46
Speaker 1: other place that you listen to podcasts. It's available everywhere,
1:02:50
Speaker 1: and I hope you choose joy. I know I am
1:02:58
Speaker 1: choosing joy. One more question for you before we leave,
1:03:01
Speaker 1: because we have to go. What's one thing you would
1:03:03
Speaker 1: say to your dad and pop? Mm, thank you for
1:03:15
Speaker 1: the legacy of holiness. Thank you for the legacy of
1:03:21
Speaker 1: loving God, trusting God as my savior. That's the only
1:03:31
Speaker 1: way I make it through this life. That's the only
1:03:33
Speaker 1: way I am where I am because of what my grandfather,
1:03:39
Speaker 1: my grandmother, my dad, and my mom instilled in me
1:03:42
Speaker 1: all those years ago. It's not the music, it's not
1:03:48
Speaker 1: the industry. It's not getting to go to all these
1:03:52
Speaker 1: places that you know, the typical ten fifteen year old
1:03:57
Speaker 1: doesn't get to go to the legacy of knowing God,
1:04:01
Speaker 1: loving God, and believing God to steer my life for
1:04:08
Speaker 1: his glory. Thank you for that, and you're carrying the legacy.
1:04:15
Speaker 1: Said well, we have one more surprise for you before
1:04:18
Speaker 1: you leave. We want to show you something like what
1:04:29
Speaker 1: is that? That's my daddy, that's your daddy's press play.
1:04:37
Speaker 5: I want to say that I'm so proud of my
1:04:40
Speaker 5: daughter Joy and what she's been able to accomplish thus
1:04:44
Speaker 5: far in her acting career. And I really don't think
1:04:48
Speaker 5: she scratched his surface yet. But what's so funny.
1:04:52
Speaker 2: When she was.
1:04:53
Speaker 5: Growing up, I didn't have a clue of what her
1:04:57
Speaker 5: gift would be, and all of a sudden she caught
1:05:00
Speaker 5: this acting bug. And when I went to see her
1:05:04
Speaker 5: for the first time in her one woman show at
1:05:07
Speaker 5: Wayne State, I was blown away, and I knew that
1:05:12
Speaker 5: this would be her calling and something that she would
1:05:17
Speaker 5: be great at. So Joy, keep up the great work.
1:05:24
Speaker 5: I love you so very much, and God bless you.
1:05:31
Speaker 1: That's your dad's dad, that's your daddy, and we're so
1:05:39
Speaker 1: proud of you too. And we have been fans of
1:05:42
Speaker 1: yours before we even met you. And honey, you are
1:05:45
Speaker 1: a star. You are such a joy. Thank you so
1:05:49
Speaker 1: much for just even taking the time to talk with us.
1:05:54
Speaker 1: This has been I mean, I just feel like I
1:05:57
Speaker 1: feel so right right. Yes, I feel like you have
1:06:05
Speaker 1: and it's been heavy for me as well in my
1:06:08
Speaker 1: life and you have filled my Thank you, thank you,
1:06:12
Speaker 1: thank you, thank you for having me. I'm truly, truly
1:06:15
Speaker 1: yeah to be here. I appreciate y'all. Y'all are doing
1:06:19
Speaker 1: it all are beautiful inside and out, and I'm very
1:06:24
Speaker 1: grateful that I got to be here. Thank you so much.
1:06:27
Speaker 1: We got to have you back myself there. We got
1:06:37
Speaker 1: a little snugly and I like we could just we
1:06:43
Speaker 1: can get this for hours. Yeah yeah, yeah, thank you
1:06:47
Speaker 1: so much. Joy, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you,
1:06:51
Speaker 1: thank you. Okay, well, thank you guys for tuning into
1:06:55
Speaker 1: today's episode of Born to the Game. I'm your host, Mariyah,
1:06:59
Speaker 1: and please make sure to like, follow, subscribe, share, and
1:07:03
Speaker 1: we'll see you next time, thank you,