Latest / The Speak Life Podcast / Is Revival Happening in Asbury? || Robert Cunningham and Glen Scrivener || SLP448

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Is Revival Happening in Asbury? || Robert Cunningham and Glen Scrivener || SLP448 · The Speak Life Podcast

• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: Hello and welcome to the Speak Life Podcast, episode 448.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_01: My name is Thomas Thurrogood, media producer at Speak Life, and today it is my great privilege to bring you this conversation that Glenn Scrivener had with Robert Cunningham, who is the director of Christ for Kentucky.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_01: And he recently visited Asbury University Chapel, where some interesting things have been happening, and I will leave Glenn and Robert to explain what's been going on.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_07: Hi, I'm Glenn from Speak Life.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_07: We want to see all things with Jesus at the center.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_07: Today we're talking about what's being called the Asbury Revival with someone who has been there.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_07: Last week, Wednesday Chapel at Asbury University, a Christian college in Kentucky, began as ever with some sung worship.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_07: They read from Scripture as normal, they're working their way through Romans at the moment.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_07: The preacher came forward as normal.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_07: It was the most unprepossessing delivery.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_05: Hey y'all.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_05: My name's Zach.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_07: And I'm back.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_07: He spoke on the last 13 verses of Romans 12.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_05: 13 verses.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_05: How are you guys feeling?
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_07: And he brought home the impossibility of living out this law of love.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_04: You cannot love until you are loved by Jesus.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_07: And so what's the solution?
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_07: I guess we need to experience and know the love of God for ourselves.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_07: That's what he preached, and that's what he prayed about.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_04: Jesus do a new thing in our midst.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_04: Revive us by your love.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_07: The chapel was then meant to end, but everyone seemed to stay and to continue to worship and to pray and to hear from Scripture and to study Scripture and to confess their sins and bring words of testimony.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_07: As hours stretched on into days, even the local news stations started to take note.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_07: And for a week classes were cancelled, and for many weeks on, lives were touched in the most astonishing way.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_03: But just a taste of how indescribable God is, how magnificent He is, how loving He is, how full of grace He is.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_03: Something that you wouldn't toy with, mock.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_03: Um it was almost like you wanted to be as near as you could, but you didn't dare get too near.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_07: From Asbury, 2,000 witnessing teams went to 130 campuses all over America, and it was a major catalyzing influence on the Jesus movement.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_07: It changed the lives of so many people.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_00: I found myself.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_00: It's hard to describe, but caught up, swept away, uh immersed in.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: Suddenly Jesus was a reality.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_00: He was the uh uh mega reality uh uh redefining everything else.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_00: He was not one reality among others.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: Suddenly he I was his presence, his immediacy, his power.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_07: People have been praying earnestly for decades for this kind of thing to happen again.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_07: And this week there has been something of an awakening.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_07: How should we think of that?
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_07: Well, I'm gonna speak to Robert Cunningham, who is a a proud Kentuckian, he's a PCA pastor, and he has founded a ministry called Christ for Kentucky.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_07: Robert has been to Asbury, he's experienced it firsthand, and he wrote online very movingly about the orderly openness of this particular move of the spirits.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_07: That Twitter thread has gone viral and he has since taken it down.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_07: We're gonna ask him why did he take it down?
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_07: What did he experience when he went to Asbury, and how should we think about these things together?
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_07: So we've got Robert on the line.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_07: Uh Robert, why don't you introduce yourself to us?
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_06: Like you said, I'm a native Kentucky and from Kentucky, Lexton, Kentucky, for those familiar with the area.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_06: It's a central Kentucky bluegrass region.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_06: Really born and raised, been here all my life, ministered here all my life.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_06: Um I pastored uh a Presbyterian church in the States, the Presbyterian tradition, you've got the Presbyterian USA Church and the Presbyterian PCA Church.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_06: I was ordained and ministered at a PCA church, which is the more uh conservative uh branch of Presbyterianism, holding on to the historic uh faith in that way.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_06: Uh I pastored a church, Tays Creek Presbyterian Church in Lexington, Kentucky, for 16, 17 years, nearly 17 years.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_06: And then very recently, as in a few months ago, uh felt led to resign from my position of pastoral leadership there and form a new organization called Christ for Kentucky, which is um basically an organization devoted to public theology, but also public strategy localized, uh focused on the state of Kentucky.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_06: So now I'm the director of Christ for Kentucky.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_06: Asbury is 20, 25 minutes down the road.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_06: My wife is a graduate of Asbury's seminary.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_06: She got her counseling degree there.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_06: Uh very familiar with the both the university and the school of many friends there.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_06: Um it's from the Wesleyan uh tradition, um, but a huge fan.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_06: It's a it's a significant Christian institution in our state and really in our country uh broadly.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_06: So um very familiar with it, and yeah, uh just kind of start catching wind of what was going on down the road.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_07: Because there's some history with Asbury and on their websites, uh going back to 1905, they sort of document uh about ten or twelve incidents of they what they would call revival or renewal or that or that kind of thing.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_07: And and perhaps most most famously in 1970, right.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_07: Um something that was very much caught up in in the Jesus movement.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_07: So how how aware were you before this of Asbury's history here?
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_06: Very.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_06: You know, the Wesleyan tradition, and I think something maybe we can learn from their tradition in my tradition, in the reformed world, um there they they are not only open to the significance of revival within the Christian mission and project, uh they pray for it.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_06: They know they they long for it, they labor for it.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_06: Um you know, I've talked to some friends in that tradition who'd say maybe a fault is there might be an idolatry of that, but there is an openness to it, and um, and so yeah, there's there's a significant one that took place in 1970, and to this day, uh I uh on a regular basis, I will meet people who would say I was converted through the 70 revival, my life was changed, uh, repentance, um, called into ministry missions and whatnot.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_06: So its after effects are still being felt um even now.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_06: And honestly, they've been praying for something similar to happen for very long, for decades, uh, for something similar to happen.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_06: And you know, it's yet to be seen if what's transpiring down the road is going to be something similar, but uh it certainly feels like something is emerging that that is unique.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_06: When did you first hear that something was happening?
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_06: Um I have one of our elders is um one of the elders at our church is a is is an administrator at Asbury.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_06: He's in an um he's in the athletics department, but also serves in in several roles.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_06: And uh just got a text that, hey, something's going on here.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_06: Well, you know what?
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_06: It's really funny.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_06: So this took place on it, this began at a chapel service on Wednesday.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_06: I was actually invited to be at that chapel service um and by the guy who ended up speaking.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_06: I was invited to be there and wasn't able to make it, and um and so I wasn't there and revival broke out, and I told my wife, I don't necessarily know what that means about me.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_06: But I am I am friends with a person who spoke at chapel.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_06: Um Zach?
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_06: Uh yeah, Zach.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_06: Yes, yes, yeah.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_06: Zach, Zach, um dear, dear brother.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_06: And and I can get into we can talk about Zach and some of the reasons why I'm I'm encouraged by this simply because of him, his character, his humility, and whatnot.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_06: But he invited me to come.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_06: I couldn't.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_06: Um he delivered the chapel message that ended up um leading to all of this.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_06: So I don't know what that says about me.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_06: When we went and visited, I told my wife, if this thing shuts down when I arrive, I'm really gonna have to rethink things, my calling, and perhaps even my salvation.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_07: But um a friend of mine is going there tomorrow, yeah, Thursday.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_07: And he yeah, he's he's worried the same that yeah, he'll forever be known as the as the spirit quencher.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_06: Right, exactly, exactly.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_06: So but but I had an I have an elder who's there involved, I have friends that are there involved, and I just started getting texts um of hey, something's going on.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_06: This chapel service didn't stop, and they're going, um, you know, they went through the night and it's still going.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_06: I got I started getting these messages on the Thursday last week.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_07: I I went and tuned into that that Wednesday chapel service.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_07: And I was I was really struck by how sort of unprepossessing and informal and casual, you know.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_07: I think uh Zach Zach began his his uh talk by saying, I'm Zach and I'm back.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_06: Very Monday.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_06: One of one of the reasons, and and one of the things I talked about on Twitter and the thread that I've since deleted, and we could talk about why if you want to.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_06: But I I one of the things that I do think this feels different is I don't know if you have this in the United Kingdom, but in the States, we even have like revival meeting this weekend, you know, on Friday.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_06: And like planning revivals, you know.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_06: And and then we have of course in the States we have these big conferences, you know, passion conferences and things like that.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_06: That um I would, you know, I don't want to be a cynic that's saying is trying to manufacture revival.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_06: But one of the things that makes this feel different to me is it was a it was a arguably routine mundane chapel service where Zach spoke, I think it was Romans 12 and talked about the markings of true love.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_06: And I think he ended that by saying, I hope this is like an itchy sweater.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_06: Uh which which is which is a good way to put it, that that you're you're not able to get rid of this until you are overwhelmed with God's love and in that way are able to love as Romans commands us to love.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_06: And then it just lingered.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_07: He did a real law gospel, didn't he?
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_07: Like he was preaching on the end of Romans 12, and he says it's 13 verses and 30 commandments.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_07: How do you guys feel about that?
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_07: And he he's kind of laid laid the law down, and then the the sweet solution of Christ and his love to us in all our law-breaking lovelessness.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_07: And so he did he did a beautiful law gospel kind of thing at the in a very casual, unprepossessing way.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_07: Because as I clicked on the link and sort of listened to, okay, here's here's the the sermon that sparked all this.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_07: Right.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_07: I was kind of expecting like Leonard Ravenhill or something.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_07: Like s someone with a real sense of sort of holy seriousness.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_07: Um whereas what what it was was was it was very personal and personable.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_07: And he got and he got serious about God's law, and he got serious, even more serious about seeking God's love in the midst of that.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_07: And he prayed for it, and he prayed for the Spirit and prayed for revival.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_07: And then and then what happened?
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, I mean I think they took his exhortation seriously to say, you know, linger until you wrestle with this law, love dynamic, um, and and and and uh are overwhelmed with God's love, and then are equipped to love in the way that you have received God's love.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_06: So yeah, I it even even that that you pointed out, and it's interesting you pointed out I don't know if you're familiar with uh Richard Lovelace's scholarship on on revival and renewal and dynamics and spiritual life and whatnot, but he he talking about how that has to be central to revival.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_06: Um you do have to be overwhelmed with the holiness, you know, just justification by faith alone, um dynamic is central to um spiritual renewal.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_06: And and it was born out of um Zach's an incredible man, and he's a he's a gifted Christian leader, but you know, it wasn't Tim Keller on campus, you know.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_06: And I I think that's compelling.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_07: And another thing that was compelling to me is I then went and clicked on the next chapel service that was available on the website to to view.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_07: And the next person just picked up from Romans and started with Romans chapter 13.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_07: Yep.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_07: And I thought, oh, praise God for that.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_07: The people people are not then gonna okay, I'm just gonna do a topical thing on what's happening now.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_07: It's it's yeah, scripture, scripture is front and center in this.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_06: 100%.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, yeah, it really is.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_06: And I can say that I can say that from personal experience and from talking to the leadership team that is really trying to uh keep that central.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_07: What what do you think are the challenges now?
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_07: So so if you're the Asbury kind of president and and if you're on the staff, the faculty, like how how are they adjusting to the fact that well students aren't showing up in class, they're they're showing up in chapel?
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, well, to their credit, they're they they they have an openness to what the Lord is doing.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_06: Um but the sense I get in talking to the folks on the ground, and particularly that core leadership team.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_06: If if your listeners want to know how do I pray for this, I would say pray for that team.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_06: There is there is really there's a group that's a core group that immediately identify, hey, something special is going on here.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_06: We don't really necessarily know what it's up to.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_06: But in that group, there there are scholars.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_06: There's a guy who wrote his PhD on revival who I deeply, deeply respect and admire.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_06: They're pastors, they're gifted administrators, and they are really doing everything.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_06: I mean, they're exhausting themselves literally 24 hours to steward this well and to do this well.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_06: Um concerns, you know, I I think I think uh I think they of course welcome and celebrate anybody wanting to come and experience it.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_06: Don't blame uh don't blame people for wanting to come and and and witness it and experience it.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_06: Um but you know, you you want to be careful with um this remaining, you know, for the for the student body, uh, which is where the real awakening is happening, students, um, the nominal being awakened, the the unconverted being converted, uh fresh repentance among the student body.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_06: So I think this localized focus is important to them.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_06: Um I think I think there is concern as this has grown, and this is part of the reason why I deleted my my Twitter thread that went viral.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_06: I I think there is concern that um as this has gone viral on social media, it's interesting to have this awakening in the age of social media.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_06: Um there's concern of, you know, would there be would would there be some who would maybe want to come to town and co-opt this or exploit this for a brand or whatnot?
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_06: Um you know, I think I I think one thing they they are um they are very, very committed to is that this would remain um humble.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_06: Um it would be a demonstration of the power of God and not the skill of of you know musicians or preachers or or whatnot, um the fidelity of this moment, I suppose you could say.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_06: Uh they this is what they this is what they said that that their theme is that what they're continually coming back to is their theme is is radical humility, purity, and hunger.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_06: And um, and I think that they are just fighting with everything they can to keep that spirit about it as as people flood into Wilmore, Kentucky, of all places.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_06: Um I I think that's some concern, but I think they've done a good job of honestly maintaining that.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_06: I really do.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_06: I think they're welcoming any and everybody, but um, even the talk online of revival, they're actually not using that language.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_06: It's been interesting to see the language that's taking place on the ground versus the language that's transpiring um online because they're even saying we're not even really comfortable with the language revival, honestly.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_06: We want God to name what's taking place here.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_06: Uh we don't want to um you know, we don't we don't want to preempt this or control this or uh figure it out.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_06: Uh I wish I could remember the the quote.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_06: It was something it was something along the lines of we don't want to um manage this moment, we want to cherish this moment or something like that.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_06: Right, right, right.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_06: So there are there are a lot of concerns, but they're laboring hard to continue to do this to do this well.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_07: Now you've mentioned your Twitter thread a couple of times.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_07: So uh you went is it on Saturday to to see things?
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_06: I went I went after I went after our uh s worship service.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_06: Um our family went down there um after church on Sunday.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_06: Okay.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_07: Uh and what did you discover when you were there?
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, so uh uh and partly just a little background on me.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_06: I mean, I already told you I'm from the Reformed Presbyterian tradition.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_06: Um the church I pastored for for 16 years, it's your I mean, big steeple, high liturgy, priest in a robe, organ choir, uh, whatever you imagine um when you think of uh Presbyterians, we probably fit that stereotype, and probably what you picture is not a picture of revival.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_06: Um that combined with um I I am I'm a little bit of a theological thought leader in our state uh who who admittedly values uh thoughtfulness, theological precision, these types of things.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_06: So when all this started taking off, I was getting messages within our community and really all around kind of the reformed evangelical world saying, hey, what's going on?
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_06: Is this for real?
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_06: I would really love your thoughts on this.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_06: And um so I I wasn't gonna speak on it unless I absolutely went and observed.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_06: So I went and um and and checked it out, and I just I just kind of honestly just so I could have something to point people to, I just wrote out some observations I had of why I felt like this is really legitimate and powerful.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_06: And um those thoughts um uh for whatever reason tended to uh validate that for a lot of folks in our world.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_06: So some people outside our world don't need that validation, but folks in our world felt like they needed somebody like me to speak to it.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_06: And so and so that kind of that kind of took off.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_06: And and you know, what I observed was, again, I already said this, uh it didn't feel like it was manufactured and certainly not planned, uh just kind of organically emerged from a seemingly routine chapel service, which I thought was really compelling.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_06: It fits with the spirit blows where he wishes, you don't know where he's coming from or where he's going.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_06: I was impressed by the reverence and solemnity, honestly, weightiness that was taking place.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_06: Um, it felt very much, you know, when God does visit in unique ways, it it doesn't necessarily lead to excitement.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_06: It leads to you're on holy ground, you might want to take your shoes off kind of disposition.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_06: I experienced that very weighty, combined with this peculiar joy in the fear of the Lord kind of thing.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_06: I wept.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_06: I mean, people were weeping, I was weeping.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_06: Um a lot of scripture, a lot of prayer, um, a lot of Jesus glorified.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_06: I think that's a mark of awakening, revival, whatever language you want to use, is that the spirit loves to make Jesus famous and and and it was very Christ-centered.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_06: Um I didn't I didn't experience um some of the stuff that I've critiqued about American evangelicalism in the past, the emotional manipulation, and maybe in some contexts, even um I don't know, emotional harm.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_06: I don't know.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_06: Um I didn't experience any of that.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_06: I mean, a lot of the singing was a cappella.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_06: Um if there was if there was instrumentation, it was very unassuming, very soft.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_06: It was just the voices of God's people.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_06: Um, a lot of repentance, a lot of conversion um taking place, testimonies of that.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_06: So it just it just felt different, is all I can say.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_06: And so I just share those thoughts, you know, saying, hey, here's the here's a local reform commercial.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_06: Validating was going on down the road, and you know, it just took off.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_07: It it very much did take off.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_07: Do you do you think part of why it took off was okay, well, here's a PCA guy.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_07: Not the person you'd expect to be going to this.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_07: And and reassuring a whole bunch of people who are like when when they hear awakening or revival, they think, oh, are people barking like dogs?
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_07: Is there gold dust?
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_07: Are there feathers coming down from the ceiling?
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_07: And you're able to say, I I loved you just a phrase, something like that there was a an orderly freedom to it or something like that.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, that's the language I gave it.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_06: There was an orderly openness.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_06: Right.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_06: So you definitely had You definitely had moments of, hey, if anybody wants to come up and share, let's share.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_06: But the lady, the the the folks who were leading it said, just so you know, we want to hear what's on your heart.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_06: Well, first of all, they invited them up and said, If there's a scripture on your heart, come read it.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_06: And just read the scripture.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_06: And then they would say, This is the word of the Lord, and then everybody respond would respond, we believe it's true.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_06: But then they did have moments of testimony where people, hey, what's going on?
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_06: And they said, just so you know, we're gonna we're gonna keep these.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_06: I wish I could remember the acronym she gave, but it's basically like brief, all about Jesus, you know, um not not your you know, not your platform and stuff like that.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_06: And they even said, you know, we're gonna hand you the mic, uh, but but don't be offended if we tap you on the shoulder and say, hey, it's it's it's time to move on to the next person who wants to speak.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_06: So there was definitely this freedom to, we want to be sensitive to what the spirit is doing here, but there was an orderliness to it.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_06: It certainly was not, you know, chaotic, some of the stuff that that folks like us would be uncomfortable with the notion of revival and and whatnot.
• 23:56
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• 24:00
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• 24:04
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• 24:11
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• 24:16
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• 24:21
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• 24:36
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• 25:08
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• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: Back to the podcast.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_07: So the the thread was very popular in lots of senses and and and went viral.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_07: Um there was also sort of pushback.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_07: What what were others saying?
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_06: You know, uh in our day and age of of uh you know, racial tensions are s are are obviously on the forefront of all things in America right now, and I think that's a good tension for us to live in.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_06: But you know, of course, there was um where sure sure looks like a nice white middle class gathering to me.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_06: You know, this can't be revival if there's not diversity represented.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_06: Um, you know, comments like that, you know, Wilmore is I think 85% white, maybe five percent African American.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_06: Um and and I I responded, I said, you know what, there I I appreciate your concern, and I think a lot of is this revival?
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_06: I don't know, but we will know if it flows off, flows out into all forms of justice, including racial justice and those types of things.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_06: Um, you know, I had you know, I had some PCA folks reach out to me and were critical of some things I said.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_06: Um, you know, the pushback wasn't too overwhelming.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_06: I was actually more concerned that I was unwittingly adding to some of the problematic things that Asbury themselves were concerned about.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_06: Um and and it and it is that, like I said already, that what's taking place is very different than what's taking place online.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_06: Even this desire to can we call this revival, can we call this revival?
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_06: Is this revival?
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_06: They're not asking those questions.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_06: They really not it's it's fascinating.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_06: Um, a passage that the the passage that they themselves are returning to over and over again is John 9, um, when you know Jesus heals a blind man, the Pharisees bring him in to for this Inquisition, they're going back and forth trying to make sense of what's going on, and it and he finally throws his hands up in the air and says, Look, I don't know if he is who he says he is.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_06: I know I was blind and now I see.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_06: And that's kind of been a theme of we don't really know.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_06: I mean, revivals, honestly, revivals are determined not with uh with foresight, but more in reflection.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_06: Like, you don't we will know I I said this to one of the leaders today, and they said, yes, that's exactly what we're saying.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_06: That really the the notion of revival is determined not in the days ahead, but in the decades to come.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_06: And we will see, is there does this overflow into a social reordering of justice and mercy?
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_06: Are we going to be hearing stories for years to come of conversions and repentance and restoration and these types of things?
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_06: And that's yet to be seen.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_06: So they're really trying not to define this and allow God to define it themselves.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_06: They don't want to label it.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_06: Again, they said we don't want to measure this, we want to cherish this.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_06: And so the online dialogue is very different than dialogue that's taking place, and I felt like I unwittingly um was contributing to the viral nature of this without trying to and then honestly, I I'm I'm so happy to have this conversation with you.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_06: I'm gonna rec record my pod my thoughts on my podcast.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_06: I'm going to maybe do a couple more of these conversations.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_06: But I was uncomfortable immediately be being positioned as um a leader of this when I was a casual observer for an hour.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_06: I mean, I just didn't feel like I was right to represent Asbury and what's taking place there.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_06: And so I just I kind of just bowed out of the conversation.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_07: Yes, yes.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_07: But I I think, you know, but perhaps God has placed you as as a kind of a translator of what's going on at Asbury to to a different constituency in in some senses.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_07: Um I I I say that because I I want to experience Jesus in every way I can experience Jesus.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_07: And and partly this is, you know, being a part of the reformed world, I have an allergic reaction to uh revivalism.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_07: And I I always go back to um so when Wesley I mean Wesley very famously, 24th of May 1738, his heart was strangely warmed in Aldersgate in London.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_07: Um and I always remind people, did you know that eight months later Wesley was convinced he was not a Christian?
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_07: And he he wrote in his journal that as surely as I believe that Jesus is the Christ, I also believe I am not a Christian.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_07: And he was always sort of going in and out, and and uh Arn Arnold Dalimore in his in his um uh biography of Whitfield uh says about uh Wesley and um and Charles Wesley that um he feared that they were seeking faith rather than seeking Christ.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_07: And by that he meant an an experience of Christ rather than Christ.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_07: Is there a danger there?
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_07: And I I don't want that to be in any way kind of the last word because I th I think there's there's an answering word from our Wesleyan friends that can challenge us in an appropriate way.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_07: But but first of all, let's let's push the challenge in that direction and say, is there a danger that we search for an experience rather than search for Christ Himself?
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_06: Uh yeah, a hundred percent.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_06: And and I think that's why it mattered to so many people that I was validating this um because I I I have I have been an open critic of that dynamic within um not just in the reform, uh within American evangelicalism as a whole.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_06: Americans are addicted to mountaintop experiences.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_06: Um and we we we've been discipled by a culture of just uh gluttonous on stimulation and instant gratification and more and more and more and more, and I think we don't we only we appreciate how much we have brought that into our Christianity, and uh we are we are the stereotypical folks in Mount of Transfiguration that say, let's camp out here, and Jesus says, actually, we're gonna go down.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_06: And the reason I go down because I gotta I gotta go to the cross.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_06: And um so I celebrate the mountaintop experience.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_06: I I I'm giving myself a hard time as a reformed curmudgeon.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_06: I actually in the PCA I'm I'm I'm I push the bounds of the deficiency of intellectualism, and and I'm a big Augustan guy that I think we're changed when our desires are captured.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_06: I I'm a I'm big on all that.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_06: Um but at the end of the day, the the the Christian life is not um it's it it's a cross, it's not a carnival.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_06: It's it's it's a mundane journey.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_06: It's funny.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_06: I I I called my uh the guy who's my former associate pastor, who's now um kind of the default leader of our church right now as they're going through a transition.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_06: I said, Have you been down to Asbury yet?
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_06: Um and he said, No, I I went to church on Sunday, I heard the word preached, I took communion, I feel very revived.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_06: And and and and and I laughed and I said, Man, amen.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_06: Like I don't think, I don't know about your world.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_06: I'm I'm a little bit familiar with the world.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_06: I've done I've done some work over the United Kingdom, but certainly in America, we are we are addicted to excitement and grand experiences, and we expect that we impose that upon our Christianity wrongly.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_06: And they themselves, again, with the leadership team on the ground, one of the reasons why they're so leery of this revival talk is they think in their tradition there is a little bit of have we made an idol of revivalism?
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_06: And if the church is dependent, if if the church of the centuries has been dependent upon um revivals and awakenings, we we wouldn't have gotten very far.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_06: Um the reality of it is in between these these moments that God just sees fit to visit us with his presence in unique ways, there's generations of mundane faithfulness uh to the Lord, uh going to church, being fed by the means of grace, fighting their sin, walking with Jesus, struggling the path of the cruciform path, and that is the normative way the Christian projects has advanced throughout history.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_07: It's i I I was always struck by that when when Rodney Stark came out with his Rise of Christianity, um, must be twenty-five years ago now, and and just saying, actually, the the way that we went from the upper room in the Book of Acts to, you know, 312 AD, and Constantine kind of sees which ways the wind is blowing and kind of throws his lot in with Christianity.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_07: Uh the way we went from kind of like 120 people to about 30 million was just the compound interest of 3.4% growth per annum, year on year, year on year, year on year.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_07: When you say when you say that, you see people's shoulders drop a little bit in Christian ministry, right?
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_07: Right.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_07: Ah, okay.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_07: And then your friends comment about, you know, the Lord's Day, the Word and Sacraments, week by week.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_07: Um but the scriptures also have mountaintop moments, don't they?
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_07: And three t three times a year the Israelites would, you know, go to Jerusalem and and have those have those festivals.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_07: Um and and perhaps the the the pushback coming in the other other direction is it's not a process, is it?
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_07: No.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_07: You know, it's not it's not a conveyor belt to glory.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_07: It's actually tasting and saying the Lord is good.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_07: It's actually knowing and loving Jesus and keeping in step with his spirits.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_07: Um and and I think that that is what has certain certainly touched my heart and what I've seen from Asbury.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_07: I'm I'm like, I do I do want that.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_06: Yes, yes, that's that's yeah, I took my family for a reason.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_06: I wanted I have four boys, I wanted them to experience what isn't a normal experience on the Lord's Day Um in our church.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_06: Um and and I'm okay with that.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_06: I think a steady diet of meat and vegetables is a good thing, but man, it's great when you get that that that amazing state dinner with a fine glass of wine moment.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_06: Um, but yeah, I think the pushback that we need to learn from these brothers out brothers and sisters outside of our tradition is um, you know, in the same way we would say, hey, revivals, we don't want to manufacture this.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_06: The spirit is sovereign and and blows where he wills, they should easily turn around and say, okay, well, are you open to him blowing in a unique way that makes you uncomfortable?
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_06: And and and I want to say, yes, I'm open to that as well.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_06: I'm open I I am open to the spirit's work in that way.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_07: And what would you say to the um so there are students there, and obviously uh like how could this not have um a large impact on them?
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_07: And we'll we'll see whether the impact is in the order of decades or whether it's just in the order of of of weeks.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_07: But what what would you be saying if you were like a a campus pastor there at Asbury?
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_07: Um, how would you be counseling them to kind of process what's going on?
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_06: Lean lean into this moment, enjoy this moment, savor this moment, and um it's interesting, one encouraging story.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_06: I I won't go into great detail just because I don't have permission to share the story, but you know, a college student who was at Asbury and um and um uh I I maybe not a Christian, but certainly not, you know, a vibrant faith, you know, walking with Jesus type of thing.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_06: And and the student was there and and singing and worshiping, and a mentor of his noticed, went up and said, Um, hey, what's going on?
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_06: And the student said, It's a very telling, it's a very telling sentence that I think does speak to the uniqueness of the moment.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_06: The student said, I'm not sure what I believe, but I want to know God and and then and then and then and then uh turned and said, So where do I start?
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_06: And then this wise mentor said, How about we start from the beginning?
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_06: And and and I think that's the spirit of it.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_06: Hey, let's let's savor this.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_06: I don't know how long this is gonna be, but let's let's not be ashamed of this moment, let's visit this moment, and then let's realize that this that this moment lasts by yielding a lifelong discipleship journey with the Savior.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_06: Not constantly trying to uh get back to that moment, but appreciating that moment and then letting that fuel a lifetime of mundane faithfulness to the Lord.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_07: That's beautiful.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_07: That's beautiful.
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_07: And I love that.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_07: I want to meet God.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_07: Um and and I guess that and and that is the goal, whether it's Asbury once in a generation, or whether it's Sunday by Sunday.
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_07: I'm always struck by in in um 1 Corinthians chapter 14, and he talks about you know the there are these inquirers, these outsiders who are coming in.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_07: And you know, and Paul says, uh translate your tongues so that it's understandable.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_07: And at and at that point, those who are into orderliness say, Yes and amen.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_07: Let's make everything explicable.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_07: Let's explain things, which is you know, in Latin to kind of flatten them out.
• 38:53
  SPEAKER_07: But then Paul goes on to say, so that they will fall down and say, God is really among you.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_07: And I and I think we're always falling off either side of that horse.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_07: We're all always either it's totally incomprehensible, but but it's freaky and maybe God's here.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_07: Or it's completely explicable.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_07: Um but what what we leave with is understanding rather than an encounter with Christ.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_07: And and I think again what people were resonating with with you making this thread about Asbury is that just that hunger for we we want to unite both, don't we?
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_07: The orderliness and the openness.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, I think what's interesting about that thread is you talk about pushback, and there's a little bit, but I th what I notice the most is a lot of folks who are coming from maybe more intellectual Christian traditions, this long.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_06: I think I think why my thoughts resonate so deeply is because I I I'm I'm like that, I'm one of these thinkers, and then saying, Oh, I hope this is true, oh I want this to be true.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_06: This is man, wouldn't this be great if this was the real thing?
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_06: I think people are longing uh for this, and and and not just hoping it's true there, but I think that that offering this glimmer of hope of can this be done where I find myself?
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_06: And that would be a little bit of my critique of people flooding Dasbury, um, you know, to get in on the anointing is yeah, you know, come on, it's it's great.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_06: Come and see it, come and worship the Lord, great.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_06: But really, let this encourage you to pray and labor for revival where God finds you.
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_06: Um and and and that's happening, by the way.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_06: That that's one of the other markers that I think is encouraging.
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_06: When I talked to them this morning, they said, you know, we've heard from three or four colleges that are seeing some of this, some of this emerge where they find themselves.
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_06: We we've talked to some missionaries in some unreached lands who felt inspired by this and have noticed doors that have been shut for years opening.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_06: Um that I think that encourages them more than everybody come to Wilmore, Kentucky and and and visit us, you know.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_07: I don't even know how to put this into my theology.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_07: Um and you know, I maybe that means my theology needs to adjust, I don't know.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_07: But uh in 1970, um there were kind of ambassadors that went uh out from Asbury and went to a whole bunch of different Christian colleges, etc.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_07: And uh I've heard Ray Outland talk about you know, there were people coming from Asbury to Wheaton College where he was.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_07: Right.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_07: And somehow he he didn't say they brought the revival fire, that wasn't his language, but that's often the language that some people use.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_07: Certainly was the y language people used in the nineties about the the Toronto blessing, people bringing back the fire from one place to another place.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_07: I I don't think I have a theology for how that is possible or doable.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_07: But how how I mean how how do you process A, the historical thing in the 70s and B how it might be of any benefit to people beyond Kentucky.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, I I don't know how to process it, my my thinking in theology too.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_06: Like i i is it is it appropriate for those who got to experience what's taking place here to go to other places as agents of revival?
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_06: I don't know how that fits.
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_06: I think I think if I'm gonna be honest, I I I I think I think maybe this just serves, especially in our age of so social media.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_06: I think this probably just needs to serve for folks in contexts like yours.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_06: I mean, um the the apples to apples comparison between the United Kingdom and and America are very unfair.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_06: I mean the I mean, you know, Kentucky is is not the United Kingdom.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_06: You you truly are post-Christian secularization stuff.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_06: And I'm familiar with your work.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_06: I know that there's cracks in the secular, and and you know, I I love how you're constantly championing that.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_06: But but the reality of it is is you know, I think what's taking place here, I think probably its greatest fruit would be a glimmer of hope.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_06: Of I was talking, I mentioned to you before we started recording my my buddy Andy Longwee, who serves at um London City Press uh in London, which I'm a huge fan of him and his leadership in that church.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_06: Um but he had talked about I I said, Man, I'm I'm noticing in the UK, like I'm getting a lot of people reaching out to me, and and there's a lot of intrigue over this.
• 43:37
  SPEAKER_06: And he said, I honestly just think that there's some people who are saying, Could this happen here?
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_06: Like, is this like could the Lord do this?
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_06: And I would just say, uh yes, obviously.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_06: Um we are not without hope in that.
• 43:51
  SPEAKER_06: Um, but I would also say, you know, the most compelling story I heard was um from a from a lady who her and her husband are from.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_06: From Malaysia and they felt called years ago to uh pick up and move to Kentucky to pray for revival.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_06: And they've been for years.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_06: I mean, it's become a community thing.
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_06: They see them walking around Asbury's campus and whatnot with eyes and hands lifted to the heavens, begging for revival.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_06: Long story short, they had to end up leaving to move to New York City, and the wife was discouraged and saying, Lord never answered.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_06: And her husband said, No, he's going to answer our prayers.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_06: They came back to visit for the first time last Tuesday and Wednesday this happened.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_06: Wow.
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_06: And yeah, yeah.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_06: So I mean, there are testimonies like that everywhere.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_06: That's what I'm saying.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_06: Like, this feels legit.
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_06: So, but I would but the point I was trying to make there is boy, I I think God likes it when we wear him out as a persistent widow in prayer, begging.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_06: Um, begging for revival.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_06: And not, and and don't do the don't do the American thing, you know, revive our nation.
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_06: You know, the Christian, the way we web things with the nation and Christian nationalism debate stuff going on here.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_06: We're obsessed with, you know, if our nation will just humble itself and seek the Lord, he's gonna revive our nation.
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_06: Avoid that talk and just say a situation that feels hopeless to us is not hopeless.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_06: It can happen, and it can it comes through wearing God out in prayer for his visit.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_07: It's a great word.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_07: It's a great word.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_07: In a minute, I'm gonna ask you to pray for us if that's all right, Robert.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_07: That would be a great way to finish.
• 45:34
  SPEAKER_07: But um uh can you let people uh know what you're up to and and Christ for Kentucky and uh and how they can uh get get a hold of you online?
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, so um uh in in many ways, um part of the philosophy of what I've formed, Christ for Kentucky, is is um I'd love your prayers um you know from afar and whatnot, but I think the way forward um in a in a in a in a post-Christian world that is moving more globally and and and nationally actually is a form of localism.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_06: Uh I I'm Wendell Berry is a Kentucky.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_06: I don't know if you're familiar with Wendellberry's Rodney.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_06: He's a Kentuckian, we get to claim his own.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_06: He is a big critic of um he is a big critic of national, even global um Christian thought and activism because it he's he argues it requires a form of generalization and simplification that doesn't actually get anything done.
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_06: And um and I would agree with that.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_06: I think Kentucky is its own thing, very different than you know, just Illinois right next to us, or certainly New York, California.
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_06: So what we've done, our mission is public theology and strategy for the common good of the commonwealth.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_06: We're combining three things that I think are necessary to see true change.
• 46:53
  SPEAKER_06: You do have to have have robust public thought, which I'm calling public theology, the discipline of applying the Christian worldview to the public square, combined with strategy, strategic implementations, not just ideas out there in the ether to tickle the ears of content consumers, but actual strategic implementation with some of the leaders in the state, and unashamedly focused on the common good of our Commonwealth of Kentucky.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_06: And so a localized, real focused approach to uh the Christian mission and project.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_06: Um so you can find all of our stuff um at Christ for Kentucky or Christforky.org.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_06: All of that's on there.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_06: And then I'm I'm on Twitter at Robert at Robert.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_06: Um it's new because I changed it.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_06: Robert C number four KY at Robert C4KY.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_06: And you can check out all our stuff there.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_07: Uh well, all the very best for that.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_07: It's an exciting project.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_07: But uh Robert, could you pray for us, for all of us, that we might seek the Lord and and know him for ourselves?
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_06: I would love to.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_06: I would love to.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_06: Let's go to him.
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_06: Father, we don't know what you're stirring uh down the road.
• 48:04
  SPEAKER_06: It does seem unique.
• 48:07
  SPEAKER_06: It does seem powerful.
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_06: Most of all, we see that in lives being changed.
• 48:14
  SPEAKER_06: Um the wayward coming home, the nominal being stirred, the lost being found, the hardened repenting.
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_06: Or we're seeing that, and and it's it's there even more than the experience that we celebrate.
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_06: Um we don't know.
• 48:33
  SPEAKER_06: We don't know what you're doing, and honestly, it's not our business, no.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_06: You don't you don't owe us control and you don't owe us clarity.
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_06: Uh you're in control and things are clear to you.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_06: And so we just want to, with open hands, uh trust you with the work that you are doing here in Kentucky and its ripple effect throughout our community and into the world.
• 48:58
  SPEAKER_06: But I do pray, uh, particularly from my brothers and sisters, my friends over the United Kingdom, I do pray that they would see uh in this a hope that you are on the throne, you are not scared of what scares us.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_06: You are um you are sovereign, but not just sovereign, you are good.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_06: You are gracious, you love to have mercy.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_06: Lord, that we are a tiny sliver and a grand arc of redemption that will be accomplished and and and this this all will be transformed into new heavens and new earth.
• 49:38
  SPEAKER_06: And in light of that certainty, encourage us in this moment.
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_06: I pray for Glenn and his ministry, and it's important work there, but even over here, we're recipients of that.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_06: I pray that you would bless him and sustain him and give him your grace and favor.
• 49:57
  SPEAKER_06: I pray for the church um all of its uh forms in the United Kingdom, that you would revive it and uh and that you would uh we dare pray, yes, Lord, we do pray for revival there in a place that for so long has been champions of your truth, your beauty, your goodness.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_06: We'd love to see that happen again.
• 50:23
  SPEAKER_06: Um and so we pray for it.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_06: We pray that there would be a fresh awakening um in the United Kingdom um for Christ's glory, but for the good of their neighbors.
• 50:34
  SPEAKER_06: Um you would visit them and yet have mercy again.
• 50:39
  SPEAKER_06: We love you, Jesus.
• 50:40
  SPEAKER_06: We call you Lord, Holy Spirit.
• 50:42
  SPEAKER_06: We open ourselves up to whatever work you are doing in this world and in our lives.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_06: We pray for your glory.
• 50:49
  SPEAKER_06: Amen.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_07: Amen.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_07: Amen.
• 50:52
  SPEAKER_07: Robert Cunningham, thank you so much.
• 50:54
  SPEAKER_06: It's been an honor, buddy.
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_06: Thank you.
• 51:02
  SPEAKER_01: Well, there we go.
• 51:03
  SPEAKER_01: I hope you found that conversation helpful.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_01: We will be back next week for more conversations and reactions that get to the heart, um, engaging with the news and culture from a Christian perspective.
• 51:16
  SPEAKER_01: So we look forward to seeing you soon.
• 51:19
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• 51:23
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• 51:27
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that's all from me.
• 51:29
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks for listening.