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Self-Forgiveness in Recovery: Why You Can't Afford to Hate Yourself Sober · Recovering Out Loud

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The day I stopped trying to forgive myself was the day I
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actually started. This is another one of those
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great dichotomies in addiction recovery, where the less I try
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to control the outcomes, the less I try to manipulate the
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circumstances around me and do God's job instead of God's work,
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or the universe's job instead of the universe's work.
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The better my life gets, the more I'm able to experience that
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sense of ease and comfort that I used to experience with drinking
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and drugs, the more I start to be OK in my own skin.
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It is the great irony of recovery.
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The less I do, the less I try to put my fingerprints on
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everything, the better my life ends up getting.
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The more peace I experience, the more quiet I experienced.
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At the end of the day, human beings myself for sure.
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But I will argue that all human beings, especially addicts and
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Alcoholics, all we want is peace.
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Just Peace of Mind, peace just quiet.
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Because the most beautiful experience to feel in addiction
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recovery is that ease and comfort.
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That peace without, with no strings attached.
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When I drank, it was ease and comfort for a minute, and then
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it went away. And then I if I had one problem,
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now I had two problems, and many more problems sub in sequence
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after one after another. I spent the first year of my
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sobriety the second time around convinced that if I just felt
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bad enough about what I did, if I beat myself up enough, I would
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never do it again. If I just made myself really
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realize how much of a piece of crap I really was in act of
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addiction, I would change and I would feel better and I would
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accept who I was and I would move on from my past.
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But that doesn't work. Spoiler alert here, Shame is not
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a recovery program Today. The difference between regret
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that heals you and regret that buries you and why most of us in
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recovery are doing it backwards. Forgiveness is a tough one.
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It's it's one of those things where resentment is like
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drinking poison and hoping the other person dies.
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If I don't forgive somebody, I'm the only one suffering.
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Nobody else is thinking about it but me.
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I'm the only one that's drinking that poison and hoping that
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person dies. I'm gonna get, I'm planning and
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prodding. I'm gonna get that mother
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effort. I'm gonna turn the tables and
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I'm gonna serve justice as if I'm the one that is capable of
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serving justice and making sure that things go right.
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When at the end of the day, it's just me trying to control the
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outcomes and B in control of the universe, Sheriff of the
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universe, if I, if you will, forgiveness is not for me.
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Forgiveness is not for you. Forgiveness is for the other
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person. When we forgive people and
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ourselves included, when we forgive the, the, the power
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experienced after that true forgiveness.
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And I don't mean going up to somebody and saying, hey, I
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forgive you, but just letting it go, surrendering the resentment,
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asking for help, talking about it, getting through it, working
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through it, journaling, therapy, whatever it looks like for you.
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When we accept the fact that I can let this person off the
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hook, I can. It's not even about letting off
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the hook. That's the wrong terminology.
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It's it's the, the problem with forgiveness I find a lot of the
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time is that it ego takes over. And when ego takes over, it's me
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versus you and or it's me versus me.
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I need to win here. I need to beat myself up because
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I deserve it. I need to come out ahead.
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It's not about that. When we involve ego, there's
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nothing good that comes with that because now it's US versus
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them. It's becomes a competition and I
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want to be right and I want to win.
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I want to make that person suffer because they need to pay
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the consequences. As if, again, I am some sort of
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sheriff of the universe. I'm the police of society.
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I'm the policeman of good and bad justice.
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Welcome back or welcome to Recovering Out Loud podcast.
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I'm your host, Anthony. I'm an addict and an alcoholic.
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Been in recovery since 2015. Had a relapse at about 7 1/2
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years sober. Came back in in January of 25.
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I'm now almost a year and a half sober again today, by the grace
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of God and the grace of my recovery community, I shouldn't
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be here. Let's be honest, I should be
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dead. I should be in jail.
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But I am and I'm grateful for that and I thank God every
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single day when I wake up and when I go to bed because this is
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all bonus time for me, man. I didn't think I'd make it this
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far. I didn't think I'd make it out
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of a lot of the scrapes that I put myself into.
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But I'm here today to tell the story and offer my experience.
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I'm not talking down from the spiritual hilltop again.
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I'm not better or worse than any of you, but I am here to share
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my experience with the hopes that one person gets something
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out of it because that's what was done to me.
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When somebody else shares their experience, I benefit from it.
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And so that is my hope with all these episodes in today's on
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self forgiveness because let's face it, shame is a huge part of
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addiction. It keeps a lot of people stuck.
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Guilt and shame, mainly shame. Forgiveness is that powerful
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tool that a lot of us don't want to use because again, we're
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going to look foolish. We're going to lose the fight,
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They're going to win. I'm going to let them off the
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hook. It's all bullshit.
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I'm going to let myself off the hook.
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Let's talk about it. So I want to do a quick check
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in. Where are you today?
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What's been on your mind all week?
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For me, I would say my biggest struggle, my unmanageability
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today in this past week has been patience.
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The lack of patience, the inability to accept life on
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life's terms. This the current circumstances.
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It can't be this way. I should be that getting more
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money. I should be doing this.
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I should be doing more I bet, but but should and would and
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could have should should You should remove should from your
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vocabulary. Expectations are nothing but
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premeditated resentments. And resentments as we know, like
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I said, are poison and no one else is thinking about it except
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for me and you. Let that shit go.
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I'm in the middle of it right now.
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So I'm going through something where again, I'm not getting the
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results I think I should be getting should.
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Again, I'm not getting the results that I think I deserve.
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Things are moving very slow. I thought that I would be better
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off at this point in, in a, in sobriety and recovery.
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And when I say better off, I mean from a financial
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standpoint, from an emotional standpoint.
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When I struggle, sometimes I think to myself, man, I, you
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know, I should be, I should know better than this.
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This is I have the tools to deal with this.
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Why am I not dealing with it? Why does it keep coming back?
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These thoughts listen, it's out of my control.
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What I do know for without a shadow of a doubt is this too
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shall pass. Everything is temporary,
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everything comes and everything goes in life.
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Everything just not in my time. And that's the big realization
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here is I need to accept the current nature of the situation.
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Doesn't mean I need to be a doormat and do nothing about it.
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I need to accept what is going on in life and then look for
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solutions. I don't sit in the problem.
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I do sit in the problem, but I try not to sit in the problem.
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I focus on solutions. The only way I can come up with
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the solutions is if my mind is quiet, if I'm at ease, if I am
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undisturbed. So how do I do that?
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I pray, I ask for help, I ask God to remove the fear, to
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remove the financial insecurity, to remove the resentment.
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Because when I'm quiet, the creativity comes and I'm able to
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solve any problem. Maybe not right in this instant.
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Maybe a lot of the time is do nothing.
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A lot of the time is just be patient, do the next right
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thing. You need to stop worrying and
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just let it happen. Trust the process.
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That's the answer a lot of the time.
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I find every person in recovery that you talk to is carrying
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something they haven't put down. Self forgiveness is the work.
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Nobody markets because nobody wants to buy it.
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But it's the work. It's the small moments.
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I always talk about this. It's the moments you don't see
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on social media. The in between the going to the
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recovery meetings, the journaling, the praying, the
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helping other people. Those aren't flashy sexy
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moments. So we don't romanticize them on
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social media. We don't post that stuff because
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it's boring and it's unfun and maybe we should be posting it
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more. That is how recovery is built.
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Not in the winds. It's built in the tough moments
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where I am trudging the road to happy destiny.
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I am just in the trench getting after it, doing the do things
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that I don't feel like doing. Why self forgiveness is the
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hardest step, the hierarchy of forgiveness most people don't
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see. Forgiving others is hard, but
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it's socially encouraged. Being forgiven by others is
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humbling but available through amends.
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And listen, not everyone's going to forgive you, by the way.
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You could go make amends and live a better life and tell
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those people that you're doing better and people don't want to
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hear it. You've heard them too too much.
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And that's OK. It's not my job again to serve
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justice in the world. It's not my job to get people to
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forgive me because then I'm controlling again and I'm acting
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like the the actor that Shakespeare talks about.
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I'm trying to control, I'm trying.
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I'm the actor. I'm trying to control the
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lights, I'm trying to control the camera, I'm trying to
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control the stage. Everybody on the stage.
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If everyone would just stay put, the world would be happy.
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If everyone just followed my script, the world would be a
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better place. Alcoholism, right?
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Alcoholic thinking. I need to feel OK by controlling
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the future, controlling the outcomes.
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So we have forgiving others, being forgiven by others, and
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then the third one, which is forgiving yourself.
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Almost nobody tells you how and most of us are terrified of it.
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How do I even do that? It sounds very woo woo to me.
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The fear underneath it. If I forgive myself, I'll do it
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again. I'll let myself off the hook.
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I'm going to repeat the behavior.
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We treat self punishment like an insurance policy.
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The trap. Shame doesn't keep you sober.
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Shame is actually one of the strongest predictors of relapse.
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June 10. Kent Tangany and colleagues have
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spent decades showing that shame proneness versus guilt proneness
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is linked to substance misuse, not protection from it.
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Shame is a powerful emotion. It's a powerful feeling.
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You know what makes that go away?
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Just keep drinking. I'll just drink.
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I don't want to think about this.
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I don't want to think about how I've screwed my life up.
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I don't want to think about all the people I've hurt.
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I need to drink because it works until it doesn't.
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The reframe we're building toward here, forgiving yourself,
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is not letting yourself off the hook.
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It's getting off the hook so you can actually do the work.
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I'm going to get myself off the hook so that I can change, I can
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repair, I can recover, I can amend, I can grow, I can evolve.
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I can do the work one step at a time.
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Storyblock one, the things I couldn't forgive myself for.
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OK, so for one, for me, one specific moment where I really
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had a hard time forgiving myself was blowing all that money.
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I'm going to talk about money again because this is a
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prevalent issue in my life. It's a huge cause of disturbance
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for me and I want to work through it.
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Hopefully you can get something out of this.
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But essentially, I, for a long time, I'm still working through
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it, clearly could not forgive myself for blowing all that
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money on hotels, Airbnbs, drugs, partying.
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I look back now and I'm still paying the price for it.
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It's painful and I wish it would just go away.
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But it it wouldn't, I have to pay the consequences of my
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action. I need to also let myself get
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off the hook, forgive myself, give myself permission to heal,
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to move on from it. Because it already happened and
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I can't control what already happened.
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I can control how I react to that circumstance.
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It's done, it happened, I can't change it.
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How am I going to respond? Am I going to sit in my shit and
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worry about it all day and cry and complain on the podcast?
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Or am I going to work through it?
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Am I going to ask for help? Am I going to put pen to paper
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and budget and change my life? Do the hard things, the unsexy
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actions and routines and those small moments every day.
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And it's not about being perfect.
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It's about progress, not perfection.
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I'm better than I was yesterday. That's it.
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So if I walk through that moment in present tense, what was I
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telling myself? What was the lie?
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What was the chaser to that lie? What was the limiting belief
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here? The lie?
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What story am I spinning myself with?
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This one is I'll never get out of it.
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That's a good one. I'm going to lose my house.
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I'm going to get, I'm going to be broke.
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This is never going to end. That's another lie and belief.
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Those coupled together are dangerous because if I keep
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repeating that to myself, I am now creating a new belief, a new
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identity for myself that I don't deserve good things.
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That's another lie too. There it is.
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I don't deserve to be out of debt.
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I don't deserve good things. I don't deserve a good life
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because I beat myself up and I did this all to myself and it's
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my fault and poor me. Self pity, another lie, another
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thing I could not forgive myself for for a long time was
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relapsing. After 7 1/2 years, I really beat
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myself up to the point where I was so embarrassed, so ashamed
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to come back. And that's what kept me sick,
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kept me sick for a long time. The inability to accept the
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nature of reality ties in here. Again, this happened, I relapsed
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and I was in denial. I couldn't admit it because
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don't you know this can't be happening?
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I can't fathom the fact that I made a mistake big enough to
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change my entire life where I knew better, I knew better and I
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still did it anyways. I have to work through that.
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I've worked through it a lot. The past is the past.
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It's happened. How do I forgive myself and move
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on? Well, it takes time, and time
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takes time and work, and no one likes to hear that, but it's
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true. I have to continue to do the
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recovery work. And what I find is with a
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connection with my power, higher power, the universe, the sun,
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the water, whatever you want to call it.
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My connection with a greater purpose will Get Me Out of that.
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But I still need to do the work and in therapy and journaling.
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What is the belief here again? What is the negative belief?
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What is the limiting belief in all of this?
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That I don't deserve healing, I don't deserve good things.
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I don't deserve to be forgiven. Teaching Block 1, Guilt versus
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shame. The distinction that changes
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everything. The single most useful
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distinction I've ever heard in recovery emotions.
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Guilt is about behavior. Shame is about identity.
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So guilt is I did something bad. Shame is I'm a bad person for
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doing that thing. I'm bad.
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This isn't my line. This is Brene Brown's work, but
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built on decades of research. And Brame Brown frames it simply
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Guilt equals I did something bad.
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Shame equals I am bad. Why This matters in recovery.
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Guilt is a working signal. It points at behavior.
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I made a mistake. I'm human.
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It motivates repair and dissolves when you make it
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right, when you make amends, when you own up to it, when you
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take responsibility. Shame is a closed loop.
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It tells you the problem is you. You can't make amends for being
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yourself, so it's tied closely to your identity.
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So two different versions here. I'll give you an example.
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Guilt version. I lied to someone.
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This is just hypothetical. I lied to someone who loved me.
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I owe them honesty and a different version of me, which
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leads to a men's change. Peace.
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The shame version of that. I'm a liar.
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I'm a piece of garbage, I always have been.
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Leads to drinking again because what's the point anyways?
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I'm inherently bad. There's no coming back from
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this. I am inherently bad, might as
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well drink. I'm a mess up.
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I'm a screw up. What's the point?
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The cruel joke. Most of us were raised on shame
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as a discipline tool. We confuse it with conscience.
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We think it's keeping us honest. It's not.
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It's keeping us sick. So here's how you can test it
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for yourself. Am I telling myself I did
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something wrong? Or am I telling myself I am
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something wrong? The second sentence is a relapse
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risk, full stop. So this is more than just
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philosophy, it's it's science. So the work of Tanganyi shows
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guilt prone people tend toward repair behavior.
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Shame prone people tend toward avoidance, denial, externalizing
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blame. So victim mentality and
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substance use. Same harm, two different
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emotional responses, 2 completely different recovery
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outcomes. Storyblock 2.
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The relapse reckoning, as you know, I had 7 1/2 years and I
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went back out. I remember exactly the day it
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happened. It was a long process.
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It didn't happen overnight. Relapse never does.
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It happened in the weeks, months leading up to that day.
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The aftermath wasn't the drinking of that.
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The aftermath was the math. I just threw away 7 1/2 years.
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That story I told myself in my head and I was in denial for a
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long time too. I told myself I wasn't in a
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relapse when Foley was abusing ADHD medication and buying it
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online. The shame voice is you of all
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people. You were the one telling other
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people how to do this. You were in recovery a a member
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of recovery and now you go and do this.
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Way to go pal. The thing I had to learn the
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hard way was if I couldn't forgive myself for the relapse I
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was going to stay relapsed. And I did for a long time.
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Shame is the fuel for the next drink period.
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Teaching block 2 what self forgiveness actually is and
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isn't what it isn't. So self forgiveness is not
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letting yourself off the hook. You stay on the hook of repair.
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You get off the hook of identity.
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It's not forgetting you remember exactly.
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That's how you don't repeat it. It's not a feeling that arrives
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1 morning. It's a practice you do over and
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over and over until one day you notice you're not flinching
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anymore. It's not saying I was sick.
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It wasn't me, it was you. A version of you owning that is
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the door. Self forgiveness is a decision
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repeated, not a destination. Separating the ACT from the
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identity I did harm does not equal I am harm.
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Making amends, including the amends you owe yourself.
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Step based recovery traditions have long hold held the amends
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process is incomplete if you skip yourself, you can't pour
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from an empty container and you can't keep drinking from a
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poisoned. 1 Self compassion is these three things working
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together ready self kindness instead of self judgement. 2
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common humanity recognizing suffering and failure are a part
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of being human, not proof you're uniquely broken.
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And three, mindfulness, holding painful feelings without
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exaggerating or suppressing them.
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Why does this matter for us? Addiction culture and a lot of
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recovery culture can run on self flagellation.
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So I'm beating myself over the head with a 2 by 4.
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Self compassion sounds soft. The research says it's actually
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the strongest predictor of follow through on hard change.
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Self punishment is not accountability.
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Self punishment is the avoidance of accountability.
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Because while you're hating yourself, you're not actually
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doing the repair. Forgiving yourself is not the
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reward for doing the work, it's the prerequisite.
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Self forgiveness practice. So not a worksheet way of
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living. Take what you need, leave what
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you don't like. Name So one.
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I'm going to name these out. There's five of them.
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Name the specific behavior, not the identity.
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Out loud or on paper. I like to do it on paper.
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I did blank, not I am blank. Watch the language.
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Language police it gently. Words are important.
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Look at how you're talking yourself.
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The most important conversation you have every day is the one
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you have with yourself. 2 Make the amends you can make direct
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where possible, living amends where not possible.
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The harm you did to yourself counts.
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Write Write yourself a letter you owe yourself.
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Forgive yourself in a letter. We did that in treatment.
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Very powerful stuff. Three, find one other human
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being who knows the worst thing. So your biggest secret shame
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dies in the light. It does not die in your head.
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The reason we stay stuck is because we keep the story
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private. I always talk about this
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secrets. You're only as sick as your
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secrets. Go and tell somebody you trust,
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Tell them what you're going through #4 notice the relapse of
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the mind, the emotional relapse, your emotional sobriety.
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How was your emotional sobriety today?
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Every time you catch yourself running the highlight reel of
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your worst memories, that's not accountability, that's a
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craving. Or AI wouldn't even say a
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craving. That's a obsession of the mind.
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Treat it like one. Call someone, move your body,
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don't sit in it. Go outside for a walk 5.
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Do the next right thing. And if you can't do that, do the
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next thing right. Make your bed, brush your teeth,
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make dinner, go to the gym, go for a walk.
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This is the oldest line in recovery for a reason.
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Self forgiveness is built in the present, not negotiated about
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the past. Once again, the day I stopped
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trying to forgive myself was the day I actually started.
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Because I stopped treating. Because I stopped treating it
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like a feeling I needed to earn and started treating it like a
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practice I needed to do action against my contrary to my best
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thinking. That is sobriety man.
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That is recovery. I am taking daily action
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contrary to my better best thinking, my best beliefs.
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I don't really know why I'm doing this, but I'm going to do
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it anyways because that guy is doing it and it's working for
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him. He's happy, he's sober, he's
22:24
peaceful. I want that.
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So I got to do what he did to get that.
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Simple. Not easy.
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If you've done something you don't think you can come back
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from, I promise you the way back is not through more self hatred
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or self flatulence. Flatulence or beating yourself
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up, or anger or resentment or punishment or discipline.
22:45
No discipline's a good one, but you don't need to beat yourself
22:47
up. You've tried that already.
22:50
It didn't work. That's why you're here.
22:53
We need help. I need help every day.
22:55
I need help. I still don't want to do the
22:56
things that I need to do to do things.
22:58
It's painful, it's uncomfortable.
23:00
It's work. But I know I'm going to get the
23:02
results at the end of the day if I just keep doing it one step at
23:05
a time. You are not the worst thing you
23:08
did. You are what you do next, your
23:12
motive. Just keep moving.
23:14
Do the next right thing. Just keep going.
23:17
The worst thing you can do is give up and say it's not going
23:19
to work and then sit in your house all day and think about
23:23
yourself. Get moving, do the action or
23:26
suffer the consequences. Realistically, at the end of the
23:29
day, that's really what I suffer the consequences all the time
23:32
when I don't do the things I should.
23:33
I ought to be doing the recovery.
23:36
Do things that helped me in the beginning.
23:38
They don't change today. They're the same things.
23:41
It looks a lot different, but the principles are the same, the
23:45
actions are the same. I just got to keep going, and so
23:48
do you. And if you're going through it
23:50
right now, this too shall pass. Have faith.
23:53
Know that it's going to get better if I just stay on the
23:57
course. Par for the course on the path.
23:59
Keep doing the next right thing. It's going to work out.
24:02
I know that deep in my heart and I have to keep reminding myself
24:04
of that because a lot of the time it doesn't feel like it's
24:07
going to work out and it feels like this pain is going to last
24:09
forever and it feels like I'm never going to overcome this and
24:12
never get out of this. Trust me, I have many, many
24:16
experiences where I got through it and I'm sure you do too.
24:19
Think about all the times you've gotten through hard things just
24:22
because it doesn't look the way it looks now, just because
24:26
you're you're saying to yourself, Oh no, but this is
24:27
bigger. This is harder than that thing I
24:29
went through before. No, it's not.
24:31
The only reason you think that is because your perception
24:33
looking back on it, it looks easy.
24:35
Now I'll give you an example. Running 3 marathons.
24:38
I never thought I could run a marathon when I did it.
24:42
I believe that could do it. But I, throughout that process,
24:45
I, I, there was times where I did, I believe that could not do
24:48
it. I believe that it was too hard,
24:49
too far, too much work, and then I did it.
24:53
I can translate that experience and listen, you don't have to
24:56
have run a marathon. I'm sure I know for a fact you
24:59
have an experience in your life that you've gone through that
25:02
you didn't think you could get through.
25:03
Use that experience. Put it in the cookie jar.
25:05
As David Goggins says, save all your hardest experiences, all
25:10
your hardest trials and tribulations, all your hardest
25:13
adversity. Put them in the cookie jar.
25:15
You got through them because you're here today.
25:18
Use that going forward. I can do anything if I put my
25:21
mind to it. If I submit the outcome, if I
25:25
just do the work in the beginning and turn over the
25:28
results up to the universe, I'm going to get the results.
25:31
Not in my time and not the way I think I'm going to get them, but
25:34
I will get them. And I will find that at the end
25:38
of the day, what I needed and what I wanted were the exact
25:42
same thing. I think I need the car.
25:44
I think I need the bigger paycheck.
25:46
I think I need the bigger house right now, but I don't.
25:50
I just want those things because I want to to believe that that's
25:54
what will make me happy and comfortable when what I need and
25:57
what I want are at the same level playing field.
25:59
My life is good today. Try harder to bring those into
26:04
conjunction with each other, into agreement with each other.
26:08
What I need and what I want. Those need to be the same for me
26:12
today. It's simple, not easy.
26:14
And if no one's told you this yet, I love you recovering out
26:18
loud. Follow like, subscribe, please
26:21
rate the podcast. I love every single one of you.
26:23
Thank you so much for being here today.