Latest / Two Ts In A Pod with Teddi Mellencamp and Tamra Judge / The Grieving Process

Transcript

The Grieving Process · Two Ts In A Pod with Teddi Mellencamp and Tamra Judge

0:02
Speaker 1: This is Teddy Teapot. Hi guys, welcome back to Teddy
0:15
Speaker 1: te Pod. Um. I'm gonna start this week. I have
0:20
Speaker 1: to kind of dedicate this teapod to like our little dog, Klisi. Um.
0:28
Speaker 1: It's crazy because I have to kind of get in
0:30
Speaker 1: the right mindset to even talk about what's happened the
0:33
Speaker 1: past couple of weeks. But UM, this week's podcast, we're
0:38
Speaker 1: going to talk about grief and how we process grief,
0:42
Speaker 1: how we talk to our kids about grief. Um. And
0:45
Speaker 1: I realized that I'm talking about a pet and so
0:48
Speaker 1: many others are talking about a person. But I think
0:53
Speaker 1: that there's a lot to talk about here and none
0:56
Speaker 1: of us know how to process it. So I figured
0:59
Speaker 1: I'd start by just telling my story for those of
1:02
Speaker 1: you who don't know. Um, my kids and I have
1:10
Speaker 1: we have a family dog. Her name was Kalisi. Um.
1:13
Speaker 1: We loved her so very much. We still do. And
1:17
Speaker 1: last maybe it was like two weeks ago, my husband,
1:22
Speaker 1: kids and I were heading to Orange County for my
1:24
Speaker 1: stepdaughter's birthday party. And you know, we have a dog,
1:28
Speaker 1: and we were thinking what's the best thing for the dog,
1:31
Speaker 1: Probably not to ride in the car with us, you know,
1:34
Speaker 1: an hour and a half in traffic, try to figure
1:36
Speaker 1: out what to do with her during the party. Blah
1:38
Speaker 1: blah blah, you know, like all of those things that
1:39
Speaker 1: you think about when you have a loved one. And
1:42
Speaker 1: she had been to this doggie daycare place before, and
1:46
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, she could have a fun play day.
1:48
Speaker 1: Blah blah blah. The kids and I pack her up,
1:52
Speaker 1: drop her off. We see the people there, we see
1:56
Speaker 1: the other little doggies. It's not, you know, they're not
1:58
Speaker 1: like locked up in crates. It's say, if you know,
2:00
Speaker 1: we think everything's great. And right around the time we're
2:04
Speaker 1: pulling into Orange County, pulling into my stepdaughter's birthday, I
2:08
Speaker 1: get a hysterical phone call um from the woman who
2:13
Speaker 1: owns the facility. I can't even make out what she's saying,
2:19
Speaker 1: but I know it's her phone number, so i'm I
2:23
Speaker 1: can hear that she's saying. I'm at the vet, so
2:25
Speaker 1: I say, can you please put the vet on? I
2:28
Speaker 1: talked to the vet and they say that Clissy's not breathing.
2:34
Speaker 1: She's going to need to go on life support and
2:37
Speaker 1: they don't know what happened to her. Um. So so
2:43
Speaker 1: many things happen when you're in that moment, like, the
2:47
Speaker 1: first thing is, holy crap, we're walking into my stepdaughter's
2:51
Speaker 1: birthday party and I'm about to have to fake this
2:55
Speaker 1: right now. Number two is you're dog gonna make it?
2:59
Speaker 1: Number three? What this is all my fault? I should
3:02
Speaker 1: have never dropped her off at this place. I should
3:04
Speaker 1: have figured something else out. Number four, what am I
3:09
Speaker 1: going to tell my kids? They know where she is,
3:12
Speaker 1: you know, because when I was little and something happened
3:16
Speaker 1: to your family petish, all of a sudden they were gone,
3:19
Speaker 1: and then miraculously they you know, I don't remember even
3:23
Speaker 1: what happened, but my kids knew where our dog was
3:26
Speaker 1: because they were with me when we dropped her off.
3:30
Speaker 1: So I figured out how to numb myself throughout the
3:35
Speaker 1: birthday party, waiting for Vets to call, waiting for more information, um,
3:43
Speaker 1: you know, trying to have the best time possible, praying
3:46
Speaker 1: and hoping she was gonna be okay, you know, messaging
3:48
Speaker 1: the vet, messaging the woman, trying to figure out details.
3:52
Speaker 1: I can't get really any details. Long story short, what
3:56
Speaker 1: they think happened is she either had brain or final
4:00
Speaker 1: injury from a fall and she passed away. So that night,
4:08
Speaker 1: you know, I asked, can I come in? They said,
4:10
Speaker 1: there's no point. You can't touch her, you can't talk
4:12
Speaker 1: to her. She's like in a you know, and like
4:15
Speaker 1: a it's not a box, but she's like in you know,
4:19
Speaker 1: on life support. That there's nothing you can do, and
4:21
Speaker 1: she's not responsive. She won't hear you, she won't know
4:24
Speaker 1: that you're there. And uh so then I just had
4:28
Speaker 1: to wait and uh then three in the morning, the
4:32
Speaker 1: vet called and they said, yeah, she's um, she passed.
4:38
Speaker 1: Oh first before that, they sent a message if she
4:41
Speaker 1: starts to pass, do you want to do? Um? Do
4:44
Speaker 1: you want us to do life altering measures to resuscitate her?
4:48
Speaker 1: And I said, you know, I want you to do
4:50
Speaker 1: whatever you would do for your dog. You know, I
4:53
Speaker 1: don't want to put her in more pain, but of
4:56
Speaker 1: course I want her to live. So just you do
4:59
Speaker 1: you know what I truy, you know, I'm trusting in
5:01
Speaker 1: the pet. And so at three am they caught me
5:04
Speaker 1: and like we're in the stage now where like my
5:06
Speaker 1: son sleeps in the same room as me and my husband,
5:10
Speaker 1: and you know, the girls are in the room next door,
5:12
Speaker 1: and I don't know what to do. I don't know
5:18
Speaker 1: how I'm going to tell the kids. I just started sobbing.
5:20
Speaker 1: My husband is looking at me, and you know, I'm
5:23
Speaker 1: also emotional. I'm six and a half months pregnant. I'm
5:27
Speaker 1: not trying to make this about me. But I really
5:28
Speaker 1: didn't know how to process this or even tell the kids.
5:33
Speaker 1: So I started doing research online and how do you
5:39
Speaker 1: tell your children when a loved one or a pet
5:43
Speaker 1: or something passes away. I ended up finding this like
5:48
Speaker 1: book about it, and I learned some of the key
5:50
Speaker 1: things to do, and they said, you know, number one,
5:54
Speaker 1: don't say that the don't lie to your kids. Number two,
5:59
Speaker 1: don't say that your dog passed away randomly, because then
6:03
Speaker 1: your children will fear just passing away randomly. Um, don't
6:07
Speaker 1: say that your dog passed away or died in its sleep,
6:12
Speaker 1: because then your kids will be scared to go to sleep.
6:15
Speaker 1: And um. So I was like, okay, you know, now
6:18
Speaker 1: I have the tools now. And then all of a sudden,
6:20
Speaker 1: in your mind, You're like, well, maybe I should wait
6:22
Speaker 1: throughout the weekend. Maybe I don't need to really tell
6:24
Speaker 1: them yet, maybe I could just fake it. And then
6:26
Speaker 1: I was like, I just can't. And so the next morning,
6:30
Speaker 1: when the kids wake up. We told them, and they
6:33
Speaker 1: all had very different reactions. Um Slate immediately started crying
6:41
Speaker 1: and she had anger. She was mad at the place
6:45
Speaker 1: I know how to take care of her. How could
6:47
Speaker 1: this happen? How could this happen? Why would she do that?
6:51
Speaker 1: Um Bella was quiet, not really asking anything. And then
6:57
Speaker 1: Cruise was very you know, like he's too little, Like
7:01
Speaker 1: he almost made a joke where he was like, well,
7:03
Speaker 1: you know, Santa's got work to do, you know, Like
7:05
Speaker 1: it's just so crazy how kids process it differently. So
7:09
Speaker 1: we've spent the last week or so going through this
7:15
Speaker 1: where sometimes we're crying, sometimes we're laughing, sometimes we're looking
7:18
Speaker 1: at pictures and like remembering the good times. And then
7:22
Speaker 1: sometimes I'm just numbing it because I am doing so
7:27
Speaker 1: many things right now and I don't want I don't
7:29
Speaker 1: want to bring my energy onto the kids or I also,
7:33
Speaker 1: you know, I realized that I'm having to go to
7:35
Speaker 1: work and do things like that and I can't bring
7:38
Speaker 1: my sadness into it. But I also know I have
7:42
Speaker 1: to be vulnerable and grieve. But you know what, I
7:44
Speaker 1: don't really know how. So we're going to bring um
7:50
Speaker 1: David Kessler on in a bit to kind of go
7:54
Speaker 1: through the grieving process and give us some advice, because
7:58
Speaker 1: I know there are so many of us going through
8:01
Speaker 1: the holidays where maybe you're grieving a loved one, or
8:04
Speaker 1: maybe somebody is sick, or you're not sure how to
8:08
Speaker 1: talk to your kids about their grandparents passing or whatever
8:12
Speaker 1: it may be. There's so many different topics on this point.
8:15
Speaker 1: And you know, I did a something on my Instagram
8:19
Speaker 1: and it just blew up with questions. So I really
8:22
Speaker 1: just want to get his take on everything. So we're
8:24
Speaker 1: gonna take a little break and then come back with him. Hi.
8:36
Speaker 1: So now we're on with David Kessler. He is the
8:39
Speaker 1: author of five best selling books, one of them being
8:42
Speaker 1: The Needs of Dying, and his services have been used
8:46
Speaker 1: by Elizabeth Taylor, Carrie Fisher, Jamie Lee Curtis, among many others.
8:51
Speaker 1: And we are so grateful to have you here today
8:54
Speaker 1: because we need some help around here on Teddy Teapot.
8:58
Speaker 1: I'm glad to be with you. Thank you so much.
9:02
Speaker 1: So um, I just recently shared a story about how
9:07
Speaker 1: we just lost our family pet and kind of a
9:11
Speaker 1: more we weren't ready for it, you know, like it
9:15
Speaker 1: was just a random occurrence and accident that happened, and
9:19
Speaker 1: why the dog was in somebody else's care and we
9:22
Speaker 1: weren't able to say goodbye. And we're kind of going
9:25
Speaker 1: through the where we're crying, then all of a sudden
9:28
Speaker 1: we're laughing, then we're numb, then we're not talking about it,
9:31
Speaker 1: then we're talking about it NonStop. Do we get a
9:33
Speaker 1: new dog? So that's kind of where we are um
9:37
Speaker 1: and then I also have a lot of listener questions
9:40
Speaker 1: about grief as well, So I was kind of curious,
9:44
Speaker 1: since you're professional for loss in regards to anyone, what
9:49
Speaker 1: do you think the best way to tell your kids is? Well,
9:53
Speaker 1: I think honesty and simplicity is the best way. I
9:58
Speaker 1: think the kids know and we're not telling the truth.
10:02
Speaker 1: And part of the problem is is they feel it,
10:05
Speaker 1: and kids think it might be something they did wrong.
10:09
Speaker 1: So I don't believe in giving too much information, but
10:13
Speaker 1: I think in you know, whatever your beliefs are, whether
10:17
Speaker 1: you believe your dog went to heaven, grandpa went to heaven,
10:21
Speaker 1: or they died, whatever it may be, to tell them
10:24
Speaker 1: the truth. I mean they understand this Sesame street other
10:27
Speaker 1: you know, every Disney movie has a death in it,
10:30
Speaker 1: So kids get the concept. And do you think that
10:34
Speaker 1: grief can pop up at any time, like even years
10:37
Speaker 1: down the road, or is there like a standard protocol
10:41
Speaker 1: for how long someone grieves. I know that sounds crazy,
10:44
Speaker 1: but I mean, I'm curious for myself. Well, people think
10:48
Speaker 1: there's some timeline in grief and there isn't. But the
10:51
Speaker 1: reality is grief changes. So first of all, I want
10:55
Speaker 1: to just ask you, what's your dog's name. Her name's
10:58
Speaker 1: Galici Gleasie Calisi, Calisi, because I don't want to talk
11:03
Speaker 1: about her as a loss. She's more than a loss.
11:06
Speaker 1: My rule on pet law says, if the love is real,
11:09
Speaker 1: the grief is real. So when we talk about loss,
11:14
Speaker 1: you're always going to remember her, You're always going to
11:18
Speaker 1: love her, but in time, hopefully you'll grieve her with
11:22
Speaker 1: more love than pain. Right now, it's all pain, but
11:27
Speaker 1: in time that will change and be different. But you're
11:31
Speaker 1: never going to forget her. You're never going to get
11:33
Speaker 1: over her. And at some point you'll all know whether
11:38
Speaker 1: it's time for a new dog and when that is.
11:40
Speaker 1: And there's no there's no hard rule on any of this.
11:43
Speaker 1: You know, you have to figure out what's right for
11:45
Speaker 1: you and what's right for your best friend or your
11:48
Speaker 1: neighbor might be completely different for you. Yeah, and then
11:53
Speaker 1: if when it comes to loss and you start to
11:55
Speaker 1: feel like almost anger or you like for me or
12:00
Speaker 1: the kids, like we are we're trying to process through
12:04
Speaker 1: the anger if this happened in somebody else's care, like,
12:08
Speaker 1: we don't want to be angry. We want to practice forgiveness,
12:11
Speaker 1: and but how do you move through that? Well, it's
12:15
Speaker 1: interesting because our generation is one of the first generations
12:19
Speaker 1: that we have feelings on feelings. We have anger, but
12:22
Speaker 1: then we feel like we shouldn't be angry. We're sad,
12:25
Speaker 1: but we shouldn't be sad. The reality is, if you're angry,
12:30
Speaker 1: be angry, find healthy ways to get that out. You know,
12:35
Speaker 1: have a two minutes scream in honor of your anger.
12:39
Speaker 1: You know, go have a run in honor of your anger,
12:43
Speaker 1: because you have to get that anger out. You can't
12:45
Speaker 1: go to forgiveness too quick, you know. The new book
12:49
Speaker 1: that I have is called Finding Meaning, And people want
12:51
Speaker 1: to sometimes skip the anger and skip the pain and
12:55
Speaker 1: just go to the we're done with it. But you
12:58
Speaker 1: can't go right to forgiveness. You've got to let the
13:01
Speaker 1: anger out and then how do you get past the guilt?
13:05
Speaker 1: Like for for us, I'm you know, why did I
13:09
Speaker 1: why did I drop her off? There? This is my fault.
13:12
Speaker 1: I could have figured something else out, you know, it
13:15
Speaker 1: was my responsibility. You know, I'm taking putting the bloom,
13:19
Speaker 1: you know, I mean they're angry at her. I'm taking
13:21
Speaker 1: all the blame, putting it all myself. So, first of all,
13:24
Speaker 1: we can't fathom that death occurs. So we want to
13:30
Speaker 1: something so uncontrollable like death. We want to blame ourselves
13:36
Speaker 1: or the other person, and we flip fall back and
13:39
Speaker 1: forth between both, and the reality is you, I'm sure
13:45
Speaker 1: you dropping her off. You did not know this was
13:48
Speaker 1: going to happen. And had you known, you wouldn't have. So,
13:54
Speaker 1: you know, we blame ourselves for information we didn't have.
13:58
Speaker 1: No one could have known she was going to die. Yeah,
14:04
Speaker 1: and so you were taking care of her, thank you? Right?
14:10
Speaker 1: Is that isn't that true? Could you like you didn't know?
14:13
Speaker 1: You were like you know, doing something that you know
14:17
Speaker 1: she was about to die. And it's so strange we
14:21
Speaker 1: have this way that we blame ourselves for dropping our
14:25
Speaker 1: pet off or for going to lunch, and then our
14:27
Speaker 1: husband gets killed in a car accident, or we let
14:31
Speaker 1: our kids out to play and something horrible happened to them.
14:35
Speaker 1: We can't understand that death happens, and so the reality
14:41
Speaker 1: is it does, and it's heartbreaking, and our body and
14:47
Speaker 1: soul and psyche are built to take a number of
14:50
Speaker 1: hits this lifetime. And part of your work for your
14:54
Speaker 1: kids is to model grief is sad, Grief is anger,
15:01
Speaker 1: Grief is painful, and grief is also living on and
15:05
Speaker 1: finding ways to honor your dog, honor our loved ones.
15:10
Speaker 1: It will take time, but you know, we just can
15:14
Speaker 1: only stay present with whatever feelings we have. Do you
15:17
Speaker 1: think there's a way to process grief before it even happens, Well,
15:23
Speaker 1: we do. We have what we call um anticipatory grief,
15:28
Speaker 1: like when your loved one has Alzheimer's or cancer or something,
15:32
Speaker 1: or your dog. Does we anticipated or we think, you know,
15:35
Speaker 1: someday our parents will die. So we do have that
15:38
Speaker 1: grief that we process a little before someone dies, but
15:42
Speaker 1: we still have grief afterwards. And I know, like in
15:46
Speaker 1: my past, I whenever I would feel sadness or grief,
15:51
Speaker 1: I would, you know, turn to food for comfort. Right?
15:56
Speaker 1: Is this a common thing when it comes to grief
15:59
Speaker 1: and how do people work on that when that starts
16:03
Speaker 1: to happen. Well, like anything, you know, at first, first
16:08
Speaker 1: of all, you know, food is comfort, so we all
16:11
Speaker 1: go to that. We want to bring food to someone's house.
16:14
Speaker 1: So you just want to know that. You know, when
16:17
Speaker 1: things happen early on, you probably are going to turn
16:20
Speaker 1: to food. It's not a good permanent strategy to deal
16:24
Speaker 1: with grief, so we want to make sure at a
16:27
Speaker 1: certain point we feel those feelings. It's interesting in this
16:31
Speaker 1: new book, when I was doing research finding meaning I
16:35
Speaker 1: read and I had no idea about this. I read
16:38
Speaker 1: about how buffaloes when a storm is coming, the buffaloes
16:44
Speaker 1: run into the storm, and because they run into the storm,
16:49
Speaker 1: they minimize their time. And the hard part where the opposite.
16:55
Speaker 1: When grief comes, we run from it and we are
16:59
Speaker 1: like dealing with it for a longer period of time.
17:03
Speaker 1: So I think, you know, we don't know how to
17:06
Speaker 1: do what our great grandparents did and just how to
17:09
Speaker 1: sit with these feelings. You know, we're such a productive,
17:13
Speaker 1: get on with it society that when laws comes there
17:17
Speaker 1: is nothing to do. We just have to be Yeah,
17:21
Speaker 1: that makes sense. I'm gonna go into some listener questions, here,
17:25
Speaker 1: do you mind if I just do some rapid fire
17:28
Speaker 1: and you just said'd be great? Okay, great, So I'm
17:30
Speaker 1: let's start with how can my husband and I help
17:32
Speaker 1: each other cope with losing our grandparents? Ah? Well, first
17:37
Speaker 1: of all, just knowing your grief is going to be different.
17:42
Speaker 1: No two people have the same grief, so it may
17:47
Speaker 1: feel like one of you is doing better, one of
17:50
Speaker 1: you is moving forward faster, and just know that's normal.
17:54
Speaker 1: And our job is to honor our grief and not
17:57
Speaker 1: compare it to one another. That's a good point. Um
18:02
Speaker 1: is grief psychological? My body, so this person said, is
18:07
Speaker 1: the grief psychological? My body knows anniversaries without my brain
18:10
Speaker 1: identifying the day. Absolutely. I do retreats with a man
18:15
Speaker 1: named Paul Denniston. Paul does what's called grief yoga. People
18:19
Speaker 1: can find out about him at grief yoga dot com
18:22
Speaker 1: and it's interesting. He talks about grief gets stuck in
18:25
Speaker 1: our body, and just like your listener knows, it's so true.
18:29
Speaker 1: Even if you happen to forget the day, your body remembers.
18:33
Speaker 1: So grief is in our heart, it's in our mind,
18:37
Speaker 1: and it's in our body. Our mind works against us.
18:41
Speaker 1: Our mind tells us that's our fault. Our heart knows
18:44
Speaker 1: what to do. Our body will sometimes store the grief.
18:48
Speaker 1: So your listener is very attuned to their body that
18:51
Speaker 1: they know that. So what are some of the things
18:53
Speaker 1: they do when they're starting to feel it or they're
18:55
Speaker 1: starting to feel that pain and they're not sure why,
18:58
Speaker 1: but then they identify it how it's the next step.
19:01
Speaker 1: So the next step is your body needs motion. Go,
19:04
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, I'm really missing my husband, my wife,
19:08
Speaker 1: my pet, whoever it may be. I'm going to go
19:11
Speaker 1: take a walk and feel this pain, or I'm going
19:15
Speaker 1: to go to a yoga class and feel it, or
19:17
Speaker 1: I'm going to take a run. But you need motion,
19:20
Speaker 1: so it doesn't have to be a lot of motion,
19:23
Speaker 1: but just a little. Yeah, that's truthfully. That's one of
19:27
Speaker 1: the biggest thing that also helps me with anxiety as well,
19:31
Speaker 1: is if you know, really feeling anxious, I'm like, I
19:34
Speaker 1: have to go on a walk, i have to get
19:36
Speaker 1: on the bike, I have to move because when I
19:38
Speaker 1: just sit in my feelings, it gets so much worse
19:41
Speaker 1: and almost feels like debilitating. Right of course, Um, okay,
19:46
Speaker 1: how does someone deal? How does someone heal from losing
19:50
Speaker 1: their whole family so all of a sudden they're alone. Well,
19:56
Speaker 1: it's it's tragic. And people have losses in so many
19:59
Speaker 1: different ways. And by the way, I tend to think,
20:02
Speaker 1: it's always a death of something. A divorce is the
20:04
Speaker 1: death of a marriage, A breakup is the death of
20:08
Speaker 1: that relationship. A job loss is the death of that
20:11
Speaker 1: work relationship. So and estrangement. People are estrange from their family.
20:17
Speaker 1: So if you find yourself alone, obviously you want to
20:21
Speaker 1: feel whatever feelings are coming up. And we have to
20:24
Speaker 1: know it's up to us to build connections again with
20:28
Speaker 1: other people with love ones. And for some people in grief,
20:32
Speaker 1: like I have online classes with groups, sometimes it might
20:36
Speaker 1: be just connecting with other people who are in the
20:38
Speaker 1: same place at us at first. Yeah, because I know
20:42
Speaker 1: sometimes when when you're grieving or when you're struggling, the
20:45
Speaker 1: hardest thing in the world is to talk to somebody,
20:47
Speaker 1: especially talk to somebody you don't know and open up.
20:50
Speaker 1: And you know, sometimes you're in such a almost like
20:53
Speaker 1: negative headspace. The thought of building a new relationship is
20:57
Speaker 1: like no, thank you, right, And that's why sometimes you
21:01
Speaker 1: have to start with someone who's in the same place
21:03
Speaker 1: as you may be dealing with the same type of loss.
21:07
Speaker 1: And then I have somebody's asking there's three years into
21:11
Speaker 1: losing their parents and they're still not doing well. What
21:14
Speaker 1: do I do? Gosh, I'd love to know what not
21:17
Speaker 1: doing well? It looks like three years is still somewhat
21:21
Speaker 1: early in grief. I mean, I think of early grief
21:24
Speaker 1: as the first two years. So are they still missing them?
21:28
Speaker 1: Because you're going to miss them forever? You know, people
21:30
Speaker 1: ask me how long am I going to miss my spouse,
21:33
Speaker 1: my child, my parents, And my response is always how
21:37
Speaker 1: long are they going to be dead? Because if your
21:40
Speaker 1: loved one is going to be dead a long time,
21:42
Speaker 1: you're going to miss them a long time. You're always
21:45
Speaker 1: going to love them. Hopefully, in time the pain will
21:49
Speaker 1: change and you'll find ways to find meaning. The book
21:53
Speaker 1: is really about helping people with that sixth stage of
21:56
Speaker 1: grief to find that meaning. And this is hard work,
22:00
Speaker 1: this is not easy. You know, what are the six
22:03
Speaker 1: stages of Greece? So the first stage is denial. These
22:07
Speaker 1: were done by Kubler Ross, my co author, Denial, anger, bargaining, depression,
22:12
Speaker 1: and acceptance, And Elizabeth would have told you they're not linear,
22:17
Speaker 1: they're not a map for grief. You don't have to
22:19
Speaker 1: do them in order. I wrote this new book, Finding
22:22
Speaker 1: Meaning the Sixth Stage because I believe we're a generation
22:26
Speaker 1: that doesn't want to just stop at acceptance. You don't
22:30
Speaker 1: want to accept the loss of your family. You don't
22:32
Speaker 1: want to just accept the loss of your beloved pet.
22:35
Speaker 1: You want to make meaning. We want to make their
22:38
Speaker 1: life meaningful. We want to remember them and honor them
22:42
Speaker 1: in ways. And people sometimes here meaning and they think,
22:45
Speaker 1: are you talking about meaning in the death. No, there's
22:48
Speaker 1: no meaning in how your loved one died, but there's
22:52
Speaker 1: meaning in how you remember them. You know, when a
22:56
Speaker 1: loved one dies, when a pet dies, a part of
23:00
Speaker 1: us dies with them, but a part of them lives
23:03
Speaker 1: on in us. And how can we honor some of
23:07
Speaker 1: those memories, those traits, those qualities, So saying that, you know,
23:13
Speaker 1: we're going into the holidays, so how do you honor
23:16
Speaker 1: a loved one, and you know, without making it depressing,
23:21
Speaker 1: like how are you honoring their presence and doing your
23:24
Speaker 1: well holiday traditions or whatever it is, but without bringing
23:29
Speaker 1: I'm not bringing it down. But what is there a
23:31
Speaker 1: happy medium? Well, first of all, death is a downer.
23:36
Speaker 1: I mean that we're not going to make it a
23:38
Speaker 1: ha ha happy death. But the reality is people often
23:43
Speaker 1: believe if I go to that support group, if I
23:46
Speaker 1: go to that therapy, if I see the counselor if
23:48
Speaker 1: I go here, I'm going to be sad. The truth
23:51
Speaker 1: is the sadness is in us. So you know, as
23:55
Speaker 1: we approach these holidays, they are going to be triggering.
23:59
Speaker 1: They are going to be sad. For a lot of people,
24:02
Speaker 1: this might be the first holiday without their loved one.
24:05
Speaker 1: And sometimes I say to people early on, you have
24:08
Speaker 1: to make peace with this holiday is going to suck.
24:11
Speaker 1: You're just going to have to make peace with that.
24:13
Speaker 1: You know, you can't have a spouse, a parent eye
24:18
Speaker 1: months before the holidays and you always do the holidays
24:21
Speaker 1: with them and it's just fine. It is going to suck,
24:24
Speaker 1: and I think we have to let that be okay
24:27
Speaker 1: for a while, right. And another thing, if if somebody
24:31
Speaker 1: has lost a child, right and they're feeling alone and
24:36
Speaker 1: they're not sure how to grieve the child because nobody's relating.
24:41
Speaker 1: I know that you said that you can join support groups,
24:44
Speaker 1: but if they're not even into to that place yet,
24:46
Speaker 1: what is something they can be doing because nobody understands
24:50
Speaker 1: they're just well isolating themselves. Even more then sometimes it
24:54
Speaker 1: might be just connecting with their own pains. So, for
24:57
Speaker 1: example this book, part of the story in this book
25:00
Speaker 1: is also the story I have two kids and my
25:03
Speaker 1: younger son died, so I relate to that unfortunately. So
25:08
Speaker 1: along with my book, I have an online class that's
25:10
Speaker 1: completely free for anyone who gets the book. Your listeners
25:14
Speaker 1: can find out about that at six stage dot com
25:17
Speaker 1: s I x T H stage dot com or just
25:20
Speaker 1: go to my site grief dot com. Because sometimes it's
25:25
Speaker 1: to just honor that pain, and the pain of losing
25:28
Speaker 1: a child is horrendous, So until that person is ready
25:32
Speaker 1: to connect with others, it might be just to feel
25:35
Speaker 1: their own pain. Right, And how do you explain so
25:40
Speaker 1: if if you have kids and you know another child
25:45
Speaker 1: classes away, or if grandpa grandma passes away, Right, how
25:49
Speaker 1: do you explain that to your kids? And I know
25:54
Speaker 1: you said earlier to be honest and not too much information,
25:58
Speaker 1: and don't use euphemisms, don't say you know dad's gone
26:01
Speaker 1: on a long trip or Grandpa has gone on a
26:03
Speaker 1: long sleep, but to actually say the word they died.
26:08
Speaker 1: And you know what died means as different ages. It
26:11
Speaker 1: may mean you know they've gone to heaven. They left
26:14
Speaker 1: their body here, their spirit or sold is now in
26:18
Speaker 1: heaven or the afterlife or whatever you believe. And you
26:22
Speaker 1: know their body doesn't need to eat, drink anymore, and
26:26
Speaker 1: you know they're they're no longer in our life, but
26:29
Speaker 1: they're in our heart. And do you think that you
26:33
Speaker 1: bring young kids to a funeral? Absolutely? What age does
26:37
Speaker 1: that start? Is that always? I believe if you're old
26:40
Speaker 1: enough to love, you're old enough to grieve. And so
26:44
Speaker 1: I'll tell you bringing kids to a funeral makes us uncomfortable,
26:50
Speaker 1: but not them uncomfortable. I mean, kids find all that
26:54
Speaker 1: really interesting. But we project all our fears and as
26:59
Speaker 1: a parent, I know I don't want my kids to
27:01
Speaker 1: experience sadness, so we think we want to keep them
27:04
Speaker 1: away from it. But the reality is all our kids
27:08
Speaker 1: are going to deal with laws sometimes and it's our
27:11
Speaker 1: place as our parents to teach them about loss. So
27:15
Speaker 1: how would you how would you describe it to kids
27:18
Speaker 1: that you're going to a funeral? Like? What is so great?
27:22
Speaker 1: A question? Great? You've got good questions to think, So
27:27
Speaker 1: I would say something like do you remember how we
27:30
Speaker 1: went to Grandpa's house last year for his birthday? We
27:34
Speaker 1: all sat around and we gave him a cake and
27:38
Speaker 1: we sang Happy birthday. Happy birthday is another way we
27:42
Speaker 1: say I love you. Now we're going to gather one
27:46
Speaker 1: last time for Grandpa, and we called that gathering the
27:50
Speaker 1: last one, a funeral, and we're going to say goodbye,
27:54
Speaker 1: because goodbye is another way we say I love you.
27:58
Speaker 1: I love that so and I truly never would have
28:01
Speaker 1: thought about it like that. So I am so grateful
28:04
Speaker 1: for that. And on that note of of close family
28:09
Speaker 1: members dying, what if it's a suicide, how do you
28:11
Speaker 1: explain suicide to kids? How do you explain suicide to
28:15
Speaker 1: other family members? Right, So, the science around this has changed,
28:20
Speaker 1: and we haven't kept up with it. Our culture hasn't
28:23
Speaker 1: kept up with it. The science shows us now that addiction,
28:28
Speaker 1: mental illness, death by suicide are real illnesses that occur
28:34
Speaker 1: in our mind. They're not a choice. No one chooses
28:38
Speaker 1: to be suicidal or chooses to be addicted. And so
28:42
Speaker 1: when I explain it to kids, I might say, do
28:45
Speaker 1: you know how you can die from something in your body?
28:48
Speaker 1: Your heart is not working right, your kidneys aren't working right,
28:52
Speaker 1: your lungs aren't working right. You can also die from
28:56
Speaker 1: illnesses in your mind. And an illness in our mind
29:00
Speaker 1: is called an addiction, it's called suicidal thoughts, it's called
29:04
Speaker 1: mental illness or being mentally compromised. And we have to
29:09
Speaker 1: help people understand that these are real illnesses that get
29:15
Speaker 1: progressively worse, and people die from them even if they
29:19
Speaker 1: get treatment sometimes, and we always have so much blame
29:25
Speaker 1: around addiction and death by suicide, And I often think
29:29
Speaker 1: of what we call the three CS for family members
29:33
Speaker 1: to realize you didn't cause it, you couldn't control it,
29:38
Speaker 1: and you couldn't cure it. Right. So i've when it
29:44
Speaker 1: comes to somebody who is sick or somebody who's in
29:49
Speaker 1: the hospital. I remember when I was younger and my
29:51
Speaker 1: grandmother was dying. She was sick in the hospital, and
29:56
Speaker 1: I remember going in to see her, but I don't
29:59
Speaker 1: remember really why we were there, Like I didn't know
30:02
Speaker 1: that she was dying, right, So how would you go
30:07
Speaker 1: about explaining to your kids or to your loved ones
30:11
Speaker 1: that somebody is dying but they're not dead yet, And
30:14
Speaker 1: how do you how do you talk to the person
30:18
Speaker 1: who's sick without right. So first of all, we always
30:22
Speaker 1: want to start with the death of a person with
30:24
Speaker 1: a child, but I think it's important that we begin
30:27
Speaker 1: to just point out to our children, look how the
30:30
Speaker 1: leaves change. For every spring, there's a summer. Every summer
30:35
Speaker 1: there's a fall, every fall there's a winter. You know,
30:39
Speaker 1: every flower that blooms dies, every plant that grows dies.
30:45
Speaker 1: Our pets, unfortunately and time, will die, and so will we.
30:50
Speaker 1: And we don't have control over that. But we have
30:54
Speaker 1: control over how much love and how much fun and
30:58
Speaker 1: how much care and how it's life we have while
31:01
Speaker 1: we're here. So let's appreciate that flower while it's blooming.
31:06
Speaker 1: Let's appreciate those brown leaves that are getting older. And
31:11
Speaker 1: so I think we have to start with all that
31:13
Speaker 1: stuff with our kids. And then when we go to
31:17
Speaker 1: the hospital, we can go you know, the reality is
31:21
Speaker 1: is that you know, Grandma is going to be dying soon.
31:25
Speaker 1: And what we can do while we're there is we
31:28
Speaker 1: can rub lotion on Grandma's hand. We can talk to
31:31
Speaker 1: Grandma about some fun times we had with her, and
31:35
Speaker 1: begin to teach them how to reminisce and how to
31:39
Speaker 1: tell someone you love them and appreciate them. And what
31:42
Speaker 1: if you're a parent and your child is sick, like
31:45
Speaker 1: your child has pediatric cancer, and you're going to visit
31:48
Speaker 1: them every day, is it best to just be strong
31:50
Speaker 1: and happy every day or should you show your emotions?
31:54
Speaker 1: Like well, I'll tell you I actually started at Children's
31:57
Speaker 1: hospital in Los Angeles and I worked in the cancer
32:01
Speaker 1: unit there, and I can tell you the kids like
32:04
Speaker 1: knew they were dying, and the kids could talk about
32:07
Speaker 1: it more than their parents could. You know, the parents,
32:12
Speaker 1: of course, it's just so heartbreaking to have a child dying,
32:16
Speaker 1: so it's going to be harder for the parent to
32:19
Speaker 1: talk about it. That's why it's good, Like you know,
32:22
Speaker 1: in children's hospitals, they have child life specialists and social
32:26
Speaker 1: workers and people who are good at helping us with
32:29
Speaker 1: those conversations so that we don't have to figure those
32:33
Speaker 1: out right. And then for somebody who said they lost
32:39
Speaker 1: the love of their life and they think they will
32:41
Speaker 1: never love again, what are your thoughts on that? Well,
32:46
Speaker 1: so here's the thing. So let's first start with breakups
32:49
Speaker 1: and divorce. With breakups and divorce, part of the problem
32:53
Speaker 1: is we grieve the person who's leaving us. Are divorcing us.
32:58
Speaker 1: But the second part is we grieve the the idea
33:03
Speaker 1: that they were the one and we think we've lost
33:06
Speaker 1: the one. And I have to remind people because I
33:09
Speaker 1: do retreats also on breakups and divorce and betrayal. We
33:13
Speaker 1: have to remind people the one is not the person
33:17
Speaker 1: who leaves you. That's not your one. So but we're
33:22
Speaker 1: grieving because we think they are the one, and you
33:26
Speaker 1: have to grieve the person. And the other thing is
33:29
Speaker 1: I think we have lots of people in our lives.
33:32
Speaker 1: I'm not a believer that there's one soul mate. I
33:35
Speaker 1: mean I think sometimes there might be someone who we're
33:39
Speaker 1: supposed to be within our twenties and someone else were
33:42
Speaker 1: within our thirties and forties and fifties. I mean, life changes,
33:46
Speaker 1: you know. I think we're different than our grandparents that
33:49
Speaker 1: like every relationship was for life, no matter what right.
33:55
Speaker 1: And also what we see often happen in breakups is
34:00
Speaker 1: one person will send a text message or something saying
34:03
Speaker 1: if you don't call me back, I'm going to kill myself,
34:06
Speaker 1: or if you don't get back together with me, I'm
34:08
Speaker 1: going to end my life. What are some ways to
34:13
Speaker 1: handle when that happens if you're in a toxic relationship,
34:16
Speaker 1: and if you're in a toxic relationship like that, it's
34:19
Speaker 1: really so challenging. And what I'm going to say is
34:23
Speaker 1: so hard to do. You have two text back, I'm
34:28
Speaker 1: not equipped for this. Here is the number to the
34:32
Speaker 1: suicide hotline. I wish you well, I I want you
34:38
Speaker 1: to be happy. I want you to have a great life.
34:41
Speaker 1: Please help yourself call this number right And because the
34:47
Speaker 1: reality is sometimes it's a manipulation, sometimes it's not, and
34:52
Speaker 1: you really need a professional to sort that out. But
34:55
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously, if you're up to it, call that person,
35:00
Speaker 1: text that person, But if you feel like you know
35:04
Speaker 1: at some point you're not equipped for it, you just
35:08
Speaker 1: have to be honest that I don't know how to
35:11
Speaker 1: do this, but I want you to get care. I
35:14
Speaker 1: want you to be happy. I care about you. Please
35:17
Speaker 1: call this line to get some help or two a
35:20
Speaker 1: three way conversation with them on the suicide hotline, because
35:25
Speaker 1: you want to be there for them, you want to care,
35:28
Speaker 1: but you also don't want to deal with something you
35:31
Speaker 1: don't know how to deal with. And sometimes it's a
35:33
Speaker 1: repeated thing and you almost get like a scab to
35:37
Speaker 1: it because every tile And that's the thing I mean,
35:40
Speaker 1: you know, suicide is such a serious thing. Uh, it
35:44
Speaker 1: is not a great idea when people use it for
35:47
Speaker 1: manipulation in a relationship. Because we want to make sure
35:52
Speaker 1: everyone who's having suicidal thoughts gets care and love and
35:56
Speaker 1: knows they are needed and uh and want to here.
36:00
Speaker 1: And that's why we have to be careful not to
36:03
Speaker 1: make those confusing messages. What is your personal experience with
36:08
Speaker 1: grief and how did you get past it? You know,
36:12
Speaker 1: I don't know that I get past and I think
36:14
Speaker 1: you learned to live with it. And uh, you know, look,
36:17
Speaker 1: I grew up with a mother who died when I
36:19
Speaker 1: was thirteen and there was a mass shooting at the time.
36:22
Speaker 1: And you know, I've had a child it's died. I've
36:25
Speaker 1: had relationships that have gone sour, like most of us do.
36:29
Speaker 1: I mean, at a certain point in life, stuff goes wrong.
36:33
Speaker 1: And yet you realize everyone in this life gets something.
36:38
Speaker 1: You know, I had a son who died, but someone
36:41
Speaker 1: else got raped, someone else got assaulted, someone else's house
36:45
Speaker 1: burned down. Everyone gets something. Our job is to find
36:49
Speaker 1: healing in our something, whatever it may be. And part
36:54
Speaker 1: of writing this book is actually my healing. And I
36:57
Speaker 1: hope to people who read this new book find meaning,
37:00
Speaker 1: they're going to find, you know, healing in it, reading
37:03
Speaker 1: it the way I did in writing it. And do
37:07
Speaker 1: you think do you have any kind of like closing
37:10
Speaker 1: comments or anything you could say to our listeners who
37:14
Speaker 1: are listening to this right now feeling emotional, feeling lost
37:18
Speaker 1: and wanting to connect. Sure, you are not grieving wrong.
37:24
Speaker 1: Your body knows how to do this, Your soul knows
37:27
Speaker 1: how to do this. So honor what you're feeling. Let
37:30
Speaker 1: go of all your should's if you're judging yourself that
37:34
Speaker 1: you should be over it, or a family members telling
37:37
Speaker 1: you to move on, to let go of all that
37:40
Speaker 1: and really honor what you're feeling. I hope that people
37:43
Speaker 1: will connect with me on social media my handles or
37:47
Speaker 1: I am David Kessler. They can find me on Instagram
37:50
Speaker 1: and Facebook under I am David Kessler. And to you know,
37:55
Speaker 1: check out the book Finding Meaning the Sixth Stage. I
37:58
Speaker 1: do lots of retreats around loved ones dying or breakups, divorce.
38:04
Speaker 1: You can find them at grief dot com. Just look
38:06
Speaker 1: under events and know that you're not alone. You are
38:10
Speaker 1: not alone, and we can be here for each other.
38:13
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for today. I truly appreciate it. Oh,
38:17
Speaker 1: thank you for doing this. I really appreciate it too. Okay,
38:20
Speaker 1: tux In take care, and before you guys go, a
38:28
Speaker 1: big thank you to Tokaya Organica. The rapidly expanding fresh, casual,
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39:00
Speaker 1: fifty dollar gift card you buy for someone on your
39:03
Speaker 1: holiday shopping list, you'll receive a ten dollar bonus gift
39:06
Speaker 1: card for yourself. Visit Tokaya Organica dot com to find
39:09
Speaker 1: your nearest location. So I think in closing, there's no
39:17
Speaker 1: right way or wrong way to grieve, you know, we
39:21
Speaker 1: just have to feel our emotions, be honest with ourselves
39:25
Speaker 1: and know that we're not alone. And if we remember
39:28
Speaker 1: those things, it's going to make some days easier, and
39:32
Speaker 1: you know what, some days it's not, but that's okay.
39:36
Speaker 1: So I, you know, I hope that this podcast was
39:41
Speaker 1: able to give you some tools but also just remind
39:44
Speaker 1: you that you are supported and there are people that
39:47
Speaker 1: you can talk to. So you can either reach out
39:50
Speaker 1: to David Kessler um David Kessler dot org. He has
39:53
Speaker 1: a lot of different ways that you can join a community,
39:57
Speaker 1: or you, of course are welcome to email us at
39:59
Speaker 1: Teddy T at I heart radio dot com or through
40:02
Speaker 1: Teddy T Podcast on Instagram. We love your questions, we
40:07
Speaker 1: want to get them answered. We feel you, we hear you,
40:10
Speaker 1: and we're there for you. Thanks guys, thanks for listening.
40:14
Speaker 1: Subscribe to Teddy T pot on I Heart Radio or
40:17
Speaker 1: wherever you listen to podcasts.