Latest / The Overland Journal Podcast / Planning Remote Overland Expeditions in Namibia: Logistics, Training, and Vehicle Prep with Land Rover

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Planning Remote Overland Expeditions in Namibia: Logistics, Training, and Vehicle Prep with Land Rover · The Overland Journal Podcast

0:00
Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the Overland Journal podcast. I'm your host,
0:03
Speaker 1: Scott Brady, and I am here in beautiful northern Namibia
0:08
Speaker 1: and we're near the town of a Puoh and I
0:11
Speaker 1: just spent the last few days with the land Rover
0:13
Speaker 1: team evaluating the new Defender, and I'm here with two
0:17
Speaker 1: very interesting folks, people that I think can really shed
0:20
Speaker 1: some insights into overland travel, especially in remote locations like this.
0:25
Speaker 1: We have David Sneith, who is the expedition leader for
0:29
Speaker 1: this particular trip, and Emma Easter, who handles a lot
0:33
Speaker 1: of the logistics for this kind of expedition, and they're
0:36
Speaker 1: going to talk about what they've learned, the lessons that
0:39
Speaker 1: they've learned along the way from these kinds of expeditions. Now,
0:43
Speaker 1: both of them are extremely experienced. Imagine having a full
0:47
Speaker 1: time job of introducing others too new vehicles as they
0:51
Speaker 1: come to market, and in particular land Rover, who has
0:54
Speaker 1: this storied history of exploring the world with their vehicles,
0:58
Speaker 1: and they've always done it this way. They've always been
1:00
Speaker 1: very well planned in their logistics, and I think that
1:04
Speaker 1: there's a lot of lessons that we can take away
1:06
Speaker 1: from that. So thank you both Emma and David for
1:09
Speaker 1: being on the podcast today.
1:11
Speaker 2: Good to see it.
1:12
Speaker 1: Absolutely So, David, you have had a long history with
1:16
Speaker 1: land Rover.
1:16
Speaker 3: How long have you been working land Rover?
1:18
Speaker 2: Over forty years?
1:20
Speaker 1: That's fantastics, fantastic and I think that alone says so
1:23
Speaker 1: much about the organization that you can maintain a passion
1:26
Speaker 1: for a brand like that for so long.
1:28
Speaker 2: Yes, it's been an extraordinary experience throughout it. Obviously it
1:33
Speaker 2: has its highs and lows, but yeah, it gets into
1:37
Speaker 2: your skin. It's a passion.
1:39
Speaker 3: No, I can see that.
1:40
Speaker 1: And we were having a conversation before the podcast started,
1:43
Speaker 1: and your career included you being an engineer on multiple
1:48
Speaker 1: so I.
1:49
Speaker 2: Was an apprentice and then became an engineer, worked in
1:52
Speaker 2: engineering for twenty two twenty three years, and moved.
1:56
Speaker 3: On its marketing and you got your child the hardware.
2:00
Speaker 1: You started with P thirty eight, which would have been
2:03
Speaker 1: a challenging thing, and then you helped design the Mark
2:06
Speaker 1: three range Rover, which I think was one of the
2:08
Speaker 1: best range rovers ever built for both that combination of
2:12
Speaker 1: capability and luxury.
2:13
Speaker 2: Yes, it was a transformation in the range Rover brand,
2:17
Speaker 2: and I suppose my key role was to maintain its
2:20
Speaker 2: ability to cover some of the difficult terrain as well
2:24
Speaker 2: as improving the on road to performance.
2:27
Speaker 3: So yeah, it was shocking to see.
2:28
Speaker 1: I mean it for a luxury suv to start to
2:31
Speaker 1: see locking room differentials. And if I recall the first
2:35
Speaker 1: the early Mark three range rovers had exceptional articulation and
2:40
Speaker 1: wheel travel which was unheard of in the class.
2:43
Speaker 2: Yes, that was the real first introduction of independent suspension
2:47
Speaker 2: with the air suspension combination and such things as cross
2:51
Speaker 2: link valves between the front axle and the rear axle
2:54
Speaker 2: as in side to side sure really gave us that
2:57
Speaker 2: to capability.
2:59
Speaker 3: And that would this forced articulation, so as.
3:02
Speaker 1: The one wheel was compressing, it was forcing air pressure
3:07
Speaker 1: into the downward wheel.
3:08
Speaker 2: So yes, I mean basically the way it worked was
3:10
Speaker 2: at a certain speed, the link valve would open, which
3:13
Speaker 2: would allow the air bag on the side of the
3:16
Speaker 2: car that was being pushed up into the wheel arched
3:18
Speaker 2: to go further because the air had some move to go,
3:21
Speaker 2: and that pushed the air into the spring on the
3:23
Speaker 2: opposite side of the axle, which meant that you always
3:27
Speaker 2: had contact with the ground with your times.
3:29
Speaker 3: And that makes sense.
3:29
Speaker 1: And then at a certain speed you wouldn't want that
3:31
Speaker 1: to happen because you'd get a lot of body roll,
3:34
Speaker 1: forced body roll.
3:35
Speaker 2: Force bud out of the vehicle. Because obviously the breadth
3:37
Speaker 2: of capability or the dynamics was key to us as well.
3:42
Speaker 1: Yeah, what an interesting vehicle and what a series of
3:45
Speaker 1: interesting vehicles you both have worked on. And Emma, you've
3:48
Speaker 1: been with Landover, you said, for about four years now,
3:51
Speaker 1: and you are you're handling a lot of logistics in planning.
3:55
Speaker 1: So give the listener a scope of what is involved
3:58
Speaker 1: for you with planning an expedition into northern Namibia in
4:01
Speaker 1: the middle of nowhere.
4:03
Speaker 4: Well, we do roll it right back to eighteen twelve
4:07
Speaker 4: months where we look at the car, what attributes do
4:10
Speaker 4: we want to show all of that, We work with
4:12
Speaker 4: our engineering team, our product team, and then we look
4:16
Speaker 4: at the location and what road routes we want to
4:19
Speaker 4: do and what location is going to suit the car.
4:22
Speaker 4: So we do you know, we talk amongst ourselves and
4:24
Speaker 4: then we do some desktop research about the countries and
4:28
Speaker 4: political state and everything like that, and then a few
4:31
Speaker 4: of us narrow it down do you know where where's
4:35
Speaker 4: going to be the best, and then we go out
4:36
Speaker 4: on our refus and actually see the places. David looks
4:39
Speaker 4: at the road routes, he finds something good. We look
4:42
Speaker 4: at the venues, we look at airports. Can we get
4:44
Speaker 4: people in out easily? Like all the finite details, because
4:48
Speaker 4: if we can't get people into the country easily, then yeah,
4:51
Speaker 4: you're not going to have an event.
4:52
Speaker 1: It was so impressive to watch how well everything ran.
4:57
Speaker 1: In fact, yesterday morning, David, you said we're going to
4:59
Speaker 1: get into camp around six thirty and I looked at
5:03
Speaker 1: my watch and we arrived at six thirty two. Now,
5:06
Speaker 1: it's not that we were on this purely scripted adventure.
5:09
Speaker 3: Yesterday.
5:10
Speaker 1: We went down towards the Skeleton Coast, we went up
5:13
Speaker 1: a river basin, we had vehicles that were stuck, we
5:16
Speaker 1: were doing winching and kinetic recoveries, we were stopping for
5:20
Speaker 1: photo shoots, and we still arrived within two minutes of
5:24
Speaker 1: your estimation.
5:25
Speaker 2: Which I'm sure that that doesn't happen every time.
5:27
Speaker 1: But what it does show me is that there is
5:30
Speaker 1: a lot of intention behind that, and I think that
5:33
Speaker 1: that's something that we can all learn as travelers. We
5:35
Speaker 1: want to allow for serendipity, we want to allow for
5:38
Speaker 1: experiences and adventures to occur. But the more that we
5:42
Speaker 1: plan things, a better likelihood we have that we don't
5:44
Speaker 1: end up with that cascade of events where people start
5:47
Speaker 1: to get tired and they start to make poor judgments.
5:50
Speaker 1: What are some of the things that you have found, David,
5:53
Speaker 1: in planning these trips that allows you to make sure
5:56
Speaker 1: that people aren't being overtaxed, the vehicle isn't being overtaxed, etc.
6:02
Speaker 2: For me, that there are three things. One is preparation.
6:05
Speaker 2: It's all down to preparation. So it's people preparation and
6:08
Speaker 2: vocal preparation. If you look at people, have they had
6:12
Speaker 2: the right training, have they got the do they fit
6:15
Speaker 2: into the team? For me, you've got to have a
6:17
Speaker 2: very tight team to be able to deliver this with
6:19
Speaker 2: the intensity that we are here. We all need to
6:23
Speaker 2: help each other. So there is no such thing as
6:26
Speaker 2: I haven't quite finished yet. Everybody won't sit down until
6:29
Speaker 2: everybody's finished. So you know, Emma has explained that she's
6:34
Speaker 2: looking after logistics. So when we did lunch for you yesterday,
6:38
Speaker 2: we weren't just sat there waiting to do the next
6:40
Speaker 2: bit of driving. We were helping Emma do what she's
6:44
Speaker 2: trying to do and then vice versa. So that's key.
6:47
Speaker 2: So people prep has Emma Emma went and who hasn't
6:51
Speaker 2: had a lot of experience in driving these conditions, So
6:53
Speaker 2: we sent her down to Listner to allow her to
6:56
Speaker 2: get experienced in the cars before she comes.
6:58
Speaker 3: Sure, how was that experience? Am I going through Easterner training?
7:03
Speaker 4: Well, it was epic, it was amazing, But then you
7:06
Speaker 4: come somewhere like this and it But what we've got
7:10
Speaker 4: at Asner is an amazing experience. But nothing from driving
7:14
Speaker 4: on sand to the mudge we experience these last couple
7:17
Speaker 4: of days.
7:18
Speaker 2: It's just been great.
7:20
Speaker 4: And I've been sent out with an instructor here and
7:22
Speaker 4: just learning everything has just been fantastic.
7:25
Speaker 2: That I've got skills for life now with my driving.
7:28
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's one thing that I think land Rover has
7:29
Speaker 1: always done an acceptable job of is how do you
7:33
Speaker 1: train up people to be able to do these kinds
7:35
Speaker 1: of expeditions. And I think back to the Camel Trophy
7:39
Speaker 1: and how much land Rover was involved with that. How
7:41
Speaker 1: much were you involved with the Camel Trophy.
7:44
Speaker 2: I was buried in engineering when that was going on.
7:47
Speaker 2: So I just touched the end of Freelander in the
7:51
Speaker 2: Patagonia expedition. Yeah, I was buried in Munich working.
7:56
Speaker 3: In the range rover.
7:58
Speaker 2: But then I got involved in the sort of suppose
8:00
Speaker 2: the son or cousin of as in g FOS and
8:05
Speaker 2: did all of those because I've moved into running land
8:07
Speaker 2: rover experienced things.
8:08
Speaker 1: So oh that would be what an experience that would
8:11
Speaker 1: have been. Because so you did Bolivia and all of those.
8:13
Speaker 2: Yeah, they were just phenomenal experiences, and then we did
8:18
Speaker 2: We've done other programs since then. You know, We've done Argentina,
8:22
Speaker 2: We've Discovery three, we Iceland back in two thousand and
8:26
Speaker 2: five and it's snowed, you know, it's sure. Yeah, we've
8:29
Speaker 2: had some epic experiences, epic and that's all learning as well. Yeah,
8:34
Speaker 2: it certainly is.
8:35
Speaker 1: And that that kind of leads me on to the
8:37
Speaker 1: idea of land Rover has always prided themselves on doing
8:41
Speaker 1: these expeditions with essentially stock vehicles, but you do need
8:45
Speaker 1: to upfit them in a way that makes them more safe,
8:48
Speaker 1: potentially more capable, but also we're better suited for the
8:52
Speaker 1: conditions in some ways. I noticed that there were some
8:56
Speaker 1: vehicle accessories that were added land Rover accessories, some non
8:59
Speaker 1: land or accessories. Tell me about how you normally look
9:02
Speaker 1: at how to upfit or prepare these cars for these
9:06
Speaker 1: remote expeditions.
9:08
Speaker 2: Well, once you've understood the base car, the base product,
9:11
Speaker 2: and you've understood the accessories, you then have to look
9:14
Speaker 2: about where you're going. And you know, if you're in
9:19
Speaker 2: mainland Europe, you wouldn't need to carry an extra spare wheel,
9:22
Speaker 2: for example, because you could have a depot where you
9:25
Speaker 2: could get them from. But here we're out from a Pooh,
9:28
Speaker 2: which is the last sort of center of logistics that
9:33
Speaker 2: you've got, and we're out for three days and we're
9:35
Speaker 2: going to we're covering over six hundred and eighty kilometers
9:39
Speaker 2: in pretty arduous conditions. And if you need a spare wheel,
9:42
Speaker 2: somebody can't run one out to you. You've need to
9:44
Speaker 2: take everything with you. So you look at the base car,
9:47
Speaker 2: you look at the accessories that you can get, and
9:49
Speaker 2: then you think, well, what else do I need? So
9:51
Speaker 2: we took, for example, the roof rack, We took the
9:54
Speaker 2: standard roof rack and then said, right, we've got to
9:57
Speaker 2: fit an extra spare wheel up there. A lot of
9:59
Speaker 2: people use straps. I don't like straps because they wear
10:03
Speaker 2: out quite quickly. Especially with the conditions that we're in.
10:07
Speaker 2: So we developed in house an extra wheel quick release mechanism.
10:12
Speaker 2: Quite good goes on the cars. We put highlift jacks
10:14
Speaker 2: on because some of the rivers that were going through
10:17
Speaker 2: they're very, very boggy, as you saw yesterday. And to
10:20
Speaker 2: be able to lift a car out when you can't
10:21
Speaker 2: winch it because it's sucked in that that's really important.
10:25
Speaker 1: And how would you I noticed that there were there
10:28
Speaker 1: were lunets on the rear of the vehicle rear recovery points.
10:31
Speaker 1: I would easily accept the claw of a high lift.
10:34
Speaker 1: How would you lift the front of the vehicle with
10:36
Speaker 1: a high lift on a Monocoq I don't like using.
10:40
Speaker 2: I mean highlift jacks, as should know, are lethal bits
10:43
Speaker 2: of equipment and experienced hands and so what we have
10:47
Speaker 2: we have the wheel lifts through the spokes, so it's
10:50
Speaker 2: pushing on the top of the rim and I suppose
10:53
Speaker 2: not the last resort, but yeah, you've got to be
10:56
Speaker 2: really stuck to be wanting to use one of those.
10:58
Speaker 1: And I noticed that yesterday when we were doing vehicle recoveries,
11:02
Speaker 1: you guys brought along a long recovery rope. Now it
11:05
Speaker 1: looked like it was. It was a dynamic rope, but
11:10
Speaker 1: it wasn't a kinetic energy rope.
11:12
Speaker 2: Correct kinetic energy ropes, and we do have them for
11:16
Speaker 2: the deep sound again can be you have to respect
11:21
Speaker 2: them with a great deal of respect. Yeah.
11:22
Speaker 3: They are less precise for sure.
11:24
Speaker 2: Yeah. And so therefore we have three sizes of rope.
11:27
Speaker 2: We have a meter short short one five meter and
11:30
Speaker 2: then ten meters. So you saw us use our ten meters.
11:34
Speaker 2: And there's a certain amount of giving those ropes, sure,
11:38
Speaker 2: and that allows for delicate removal.
11:42
Speaker 1: Sure, And I saw that with the one vehicle, the
11:44
Speaker 1: vehicle that you did yesterday.
11:45
Speaker 3: That was great.
11:46
Speaker 2: Yeah. So I mean it's you know, yesterday we used
11:48
Speaker 2: the front recovery point, which is sort of sixty five
11:51
Speaker 2: killing newtont capacity, so it can take a snatch. But
11:54
Speaker 2: why do that because you know there's a lot of
11:57
Speaker 2: mass flying around. Sure, and of course you guys are
12:01
Speaker 2: very keen to watch what's going on. So I've got
12:03
Speaker 2: to manage the safety of all of those situations.
12:06
Speaker 1: And you guys did a great job of that. You
12:07
Speaker 1: had good hand signals, very clear communication. All of the
12:12
Speaker 1: spotting was also very excellent as well. You know, roll
12:15
Speaker 1: down the windows, listen to the verbal commands. You guys
12:18
Speaker 1: had very clear hand signals. In addition, and then on
12:22
Speaker 1: the winching recovery, I also noticed that you guys were
12:26
Speaker 1: working in concert on that as well, and you had
12:29
Speaker 1: an external operator of the winch controller as opposed to
12:33
Speaker 1: the driver or the other vehicle. What was some of
12:35
Speaker 1: the motivation behind that strategy.
12:37
Speaker 2: I think when you're using a vehicle to recover another
12:41
Speaker 2: vehicle in the instance that we had yesterday, it is
12:44
Speaker 2: far better because you're making sure that you're paying the
12:46
Speaker 2: rope in a neat fashion, because you're able to with
12:49
Speaker 2: the winch installation you've got. It is sort of inside
12:52
Speaker 2: a post box because it's a covered winch. It's not
12:55
Speaker 2: quite as easy. And if you've got the people, then
12:58
Speaker 2: you should use them. And every recovery for me is
13:00
Speaker 2: a training opportunity to make sure so you know, for example,
13:03
Speaker 2: Emma who's never winched in before and probably wouldn't in
13:07
Speaker 2: the office as it, she's been sat in the vehicle
13:10
Speaker 2: and she's been helping us with that, you know, putting
13:12
Speaker 2: your foot in the brake, keeping the engine RPM up
13:15
Speaker 2: to make sure that battery isn't being depleted. Always learning
13:18
Speaker 2: always learning. And I think you saw the recovery yesterday
13:21
Speaker 2: where the car was completely bogged. It was in very
13:25
Speaker 2: glopy soil, sand gravel, and you've got to communicate with
13:31
Speaker 2: the driver that's trying to drive the vehicle. It's being
13:35
Speaker 2: extracted out at the same time, so it's key to
13:37
Speaker 2: have as many good communication.
13:39
Speaker 1: Yeah, I saw that, and they both went off without
13:41
Speaker 1: a hitch, and you guys made a couple of corrections
13:43
Speaker 1: along the way to allow the vehicle to get pulled out,
13:46
Speaker 1: which was really neat, really neat to see. And it
13:49
Speaker 1: looks like you guys had a couple other accessories. You
13:51
Speaker 1: had the the high lift and you had some look
13:55
Speaker 1: like rotal packs for additional fuel. Yes, that's right, Yes,
13:58
Speaker 1: yes they are because we were right at the limits
14:00
Speaker 1: of the range of the gasoline cars. The diesels had
14:02
Speaker 1: no trouble with the route, but towards the.
14:05
Speaker 2: Deep sand, especially when you're sand mode, people are driving
14:09
Speaker 2: those cars enthusiastically, as you saw in the river. The
14:12
Speaker 2: only fuel station that we've got on this whole trip
14:15
Speaker 2: is here in a Pooh Sure, so I have to
14:17
Speaker 2: have fuel dumps as we call them, at our overnight stops,
14:22
Speaker 2: and some of the journeys that we're doing are beyond
14:26
Speaker 2: the normal and there isn't fuel station, so we have
14:28
Speaker 2: to carry everything with us.
14:31
Speaker 1: And I saw that you guys also had some recovery
14:33
Speaker 1: boards on the rack as well.
14:36
Speaker 3: Have you started to use those more regularly?
14:38
Speaker 2: Yes, especially in sands on the wreckies, you know, when
14:41
Speaker 2: you've really got yourself and one other vehicle, not eight vehicle. Sure,
14:45
Speaker 2: and they work fantastically and they work both in mud
14:48
Speaker 2: and sand. And yeah, you can use them for many
14:51
Speaker 2: many things.
14:52
Speaker 1: And has that been a relatively recent addition or has
14:55
Speaker 1: land Rover always used them, But they would just use
14:57
Speaker 1: the Marsden matting before.
14:59
Speaker 2: Tended historic to use the aluminum sound ladder's share a bolt,
15:02
Speaker 2: which are not particularly good for providing grit and you know,
15:07
Speaker 2: they have their purpose. But these new lightweight ones are fantastic. Yeah.
15:12
Speaker 3: I think they work really well.
15:14
Speaker 2: They're easy to extract from the sand when the car
15:16
Speaker 2: sort of buried them. Yeah, Yeah, they work really well.
15:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so cool those for those that are listening
15:22
Speaker 1: to get the noises you can hear in the background.
15:24
Speaker 1: We've got some guinea fowl that's moving through the camp
15:27
Speaker 1: now and other bird life it's just really it's very
15:31
Speaker 1: cool to be in this location, this part of back.
15:34
Speaker 1: We've get a local cat just walking. Buy this is
15:37
Speaker 1: a beautiful part of the world. What inspires you because
15:41
Speaker 1: it looks like you're definitely trying to test the vehicle,
15:43
Speaker 1: But what are some of the characteristics that you're looking
15:46
Speaker 1: for when you're planning a route.
15:48
Speaker 2: For me, it has to be a journey. I'm sort
15:51
Speaker 2: of almost a little obsessive with it's going to be
15:53
Speaker 2: a journey doing loops out of places with no purpose.
15:57
Speaker 2: So I look at the attributes of the vehicle, what
16:00
Speaker 2: we're trying to show, and then I go and find
16:03
Speaker 2: and keep searching till I find the routes that suit
16:05
Speaker 2: those attributes. So it's I mean, very difficult here to
16:09
Speaker 2: talk about on road because we've got no sealed surface.
16:13
Speaker 2: We've got about two kilometers that's it, and that which
16:16
Speaker 2: I loved. Yeah, So I don't think guys really believe
16:19
Speaker 2: me in the briefing when I said, as soon as
16:20
Speaker 2: we go past the traffic lights, that's it for three days,
16:22
Speaker 2: no time acting. But and it's about finding key features
16:29
Speaker 2: on that journey that test the vehicle out and allow
16:32
Speaker 2: you to test it in a real environment. I mean,
16:35
Speaker 2: I could build anything anywhere, but that wouldn't be authentic.
16:38
Speaker 2: So everything is authentic. Part of the journey is to
16:41
Speaker 2: see the views, the vistas, the people, wildlife, and you
16:47
Speaker 2: do that by going to remote places, because if you're
16:50
Speaker 2: on a what I call a tourist trial, sure then
16:53
Speaker 2: you don't get quite the same experience. And so a
16:57
Speaker 2: Puoh is really the sort of most northerly place the
17:00
Speaker 2: people come to. Very few people that go where we're
17:04
Speaker 2: taking you.
17:05
Speaker 3: Guys, no question.
17:06
Speaker 1: In fact, Venzel's Pass that we did a few days
17:10
Speaker 1: ago is considered a serious destination for overland travelers. People
17:16
Speaker 1: will come from around the world to have the opportunity
17:19
Speaker 1: to go experience that. And it was quite technical, and
17:22
Speaker 1: it certainly showcased the vehicle, and we could see by
17:25
Speaker 1: the carcasses of other cars at the bottom.
17:27
Speaker 3: Of the hill there that there were people that people
17:30
Speaker 3: that didn't go.
17:31
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, either the vehicle wasn't suitable for it or
17:34
Speaker 1: the driver wasn't suitable for it. And that's a that's
17:36
Speaker 1: a reminder of where we were so remote that if
17:40
Speaker 1: we had had any really serious incident, that would be
17:42
Speaker 1: quite a bit to get somebody out.
17:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's part of the planning that we put
17:47
Speaker 2: into it. So Lee, our medic is traveling with us
17:50
Speaker 2: all times and he's you know, looking after everything the
17:54
Speaker 2: well being people had, people of feeling. If there are
17:56
Speaker 2: any incident, bites, all that type is sure, but also
17:59
Speaker 2: if something untoward was to take place, then we're on
18:02
Speaker 2: a first point. Yeah. Sure.
18:04
Speaker 4: The communication as well, So you've got your phones that
18:08
Speaker 4: reach out anywhere you are that can call help, get
18:11
Speaker 4: a helicopter and it.
18:12
Speaker 1: Needs be And Emma, how do you interact with both
18:16
Speaker 1: like the first the medical teams, because it looks like
18:19
Speaker 1: you very much are focusing on wellness and the overall
18:23
Speaker 1: health of the group as well.
18:25
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's important to make sure everyone's you know, drinking
18:27
Speaker 4: enough water, not too tired, Like three days driving is
18:31
Speaker 4: a lot. Driver changes regularly for people eating and we've
18:36
Speaker 4: got Lee from a medical you've got a bite or
18:39
Speaker 4: anything like that, whereas I'm a bit more the other side.
18:42
Speaker 4: Are you know, people talking to each other, getting out,
18:44
Speaker 4: stretching their legs. Yeah, so there's not an accident and
18:48
Speaker 4: everyone's looked after.
18:50
Speaker 1: And that is a good indicator. The one you just
18:52
Speaker 1: mentioned are people talking to each other. I noticed that
18:56
Speaker 1: as people become more insular and they become more quiet,
18:58
Speaker 1: that usually as an indication of something else that's happening systemic,
19:02
Speaker 1: either within the group or within that individual. Once they
19:05
Speaker 1: start to be they stop smiling, they stop communicating and
19:09
Speaker 1: talking with others. They might be getting dehydrated, they might
19:12
Speaker 1: be getting exhausted. And is that what you guys are
19:15
Speaker 1: looking for.
19:16
Speaker 3: When you're here?
19:16
Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's quite nice on that long stretch we
19:19
Speaker 4: did like yesterday, but everyone is feeling a bit tired,
19:21
Speaker 4: but we're all talking to each other and saying, cow's
19:23
Speaker 4: in the road, sure, watch out this turn it and
19:27
Speaker 4: it's nice. People are having to ticket the radio and
19:29
Speaker 4: you know that's smart thinking, and so.
19:31
Speaker 2: They don't get tired. Yeah, because some of the trips
19:35
Speaker 2: in a similar way like this, everything was on me
19:38
Speaker 2: for communication, right, and you know that's fine. But I
19:43
Speaker 2: did find that that didn't bring the younger members of
19:46
Speaker 2: the team on in their skill set because it's all
19:49
Speaker 2: a learning opportunities. Emma's explained, sure, and so we've all
19:52
Speaker 2: got a role. So Alex is orator, so he's giving
19:56
Speaker 2: you all the facts. Yeah, and that allows me to
20:01
Speaker 2: concentrate on navigation and making sure Like for example, in
20:05
Speaker 2: Skeleton Coast, we had the warden and they are very
20:09
Speaker 2: concerned about what we're doing and where you're going, where
20:12
Speaker 2: we're going, and so there's a constant communication with her
20:15
Speaker 2: as she's in our car with us, and I'm feeding
20:18
Speaker 2: that out to the instructors to say, right, watch out
20:20
Speaker 2: for this, do that, And that allows Alex to talk
20:23
Speaker 2: about the stuff that's going on and I'm sort of
20:25
Speaker 2: managing the ship in the background.
20:27
Speaker 1: Oh so, and you guys did such a great job.
20:32
Speaker 1: What are some things that in addition to this particular trip, David, like,
20:36
Speaker 1: for example, around G four, what were some additional considerations
20:40
Speaker 1: that you had for the vehicles and those environments.
20:43
Speaker 2: I think it's really ensuring that you understand the environments
20:46
Speaker 2: you're going into before you specify the vehicle, because obviously
20:49
Speaker 2: we're a global car manufacturer. So do you want right
20:52
Speaker 2: hand drive? Do you want left hand drive? What features
20:55
Speaker 2: do you want on the car? You know? Do you
20:57
Speaker 2: want air conditioning? Do you not want air conditioning? Do
20:59
Speaker 2: you want pet do you want diesel? As well as
21:02
Speaker 2: the sort of basic off road features. Do you need
21:05
Speaker 2: a roof rack? So you can put your kaya kond,
21:07
Speaker 2: do you want to bike on? Do you need recovery points?
21:11
Speaker 2: Do you need a towbar? All of those things that
21:13
Speaker 2: you're going through the spec list their key to getting
21:16
Speaker 2: right in the first place.
21:17
Speaker 1: In all of the trips that you've done, what was
21:20
Speaker 1: your favorite trip that you've done for a land Robert
21:23
Speaker 1: in this regard.
21:26
Speaker 2: I think all of them are favorites, and we've got
21:32
Speaker 2: some very fond memories. Is you heard Nick and I
21:34
Speaker 2: looking at dinner last night from having to push that
21:38
Speaker 2: little bit further beyond the edge of what you would
21:41
Speaker 2: consider a normal office job to be to make sure
21:43
Speaker 2: that we get your home because we don't know what's
21:45
Speaker 2: going to happen out there. Sure, so two days before
21:48
Speaker 2: you came here, massive massive biblical roots and that just
21:53
Speaker 2: took all the routes out of the river that we
21:55
Speaker 2: drove yesterday. It's that river we were driving yesterday in November,
21:59
Speaker 2: had grass, little odd pulls to drive through, and you
22:03
Speaker 2: saw how epic it was yesterday.
22:05
Speaker 3: It was impressive.
22:06
Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's me just sort of reading the ground.
22:10
Speaker 2: It's sort of hard there. It's software and occasionally you
22:13
Speaker 2: get it wrong, but that creates this fantastic invention that
22:17
Speaker 2: we've been on.
22:18
Speaker 1: Yeah, you guys were doing one hundred percent dead reckoning
22:21
Speaker 1: through that whatever.
22:22
Speaker 2: There was no definable route through there, No, And it
22:25
Speaker 2: changes every day. Sure, that's the key thing. And Matt,
22:30
Speaker 2: who's with me, hasn't done as much as we've done.
22:33
Speaker 2: And so I've got him driving, and so I suppose
22:35
Speaker 2: in a way I'm instructing him sure as we go along,
22:38
Speaker 2: because that builds the confidence. And it's like Emma is
22:41
Speaker 2: driving herself. Yes, okay, I've got the tick to go
22:44
Speaker 2: to Easterner, but actually she's learning every day.
22:46
Speaker 1: She's explained well, one of the things I noticed, Emma
22:49
Speaker 1: was that you did a great job with break modulation,
22:51
Speaker 1: very smooth.
22:52
Speaker 3: You were you were, You did a great job.
22:54
Speaker 1: And that shows that the company has invested in your
22:57
Speaker 1: driving skills, which will just mean true expeditions for you.
23:01
Speaker 4: That's the third time I'd come down that pass. Third
23:04
Speaker 4: time nearly, man David over, But every time, and I
23:10
Speaker 4: just grow in confidence every time, and you just you
23:12
Speaker 4: can feel the car and you just builds and builds
23:15
Speaker 4: and builds. It's a great feeling. And he gets the
23:18
Speaker 4: bottom as well.
23:19
Speaker 2: I mean this new vehicle, the defender has a character,
23:23
Speaker 2: and for me, if a car's got a character, it
23:26
Speaker 2: just makes me come alive. Yeah, you just you feel
23:30
Speaker 2: the passion and that it's infectious and it infects our
23:33
Speaker 2: core team that takes you out, but it's infected all
23:37
Speaker 2: of the journalists that have been on this trip with us.
23:40
Speaker 2: And when you arrive you're all a bit jet legged
23:42
Speaker 2: from the travel one. That's why I designed it was
23:45
Speaker 2: only four hours to get you dialed into the car
23:48
Speaker 2: and getting.
23:48
Speaker 4: To know the room and know each other as well,
23:51
Speaker 4: which is quite important for you guys to yourself.
23:53
Speaker 2: So you might have met your colleague, but yeah, we
23:56
Speaker 2: don't know who to put you in when you.
23:59
Speaker 1: Are. No, it was everything was great. You guys did
24:03
Speaker 1: a good job of curating the people that were there.
24:06
Speaker 1: They were all party souls and they all they all
24:09
Speaker 1: love being in a bush camp. And there was no
24:11
Speaker 1: there was no complaints that I heard. It seemed like
24:13
Speaker 1: everybody was. Everybody was very very happy.
24:16
Speaker 2: And there's no point in putting out your your best
24:19
Speaker 2: opportunity for excitement on the first day, Yeah, because then
24:22
Speaker 2: you've got two days of what's coming next on a
24:25
Speaker 2: bit sort of finished now. So I like to get
24:28
Speaker 2: it to slowly build all the way through and even
24:32
Speaker 2: that trip back from Cessfontaine back up to a per
24:35
Speaker 2: so fun Tonoon. So you know, it is a long
24:38
Speaker 2: way on those dusty roads, but as it's the communication
24:42
Speaker 2: across the car with the coms and it makes it fun,
24:45
Speaker 2: makes it fun. It's a two hour rally drive. I
24:48
Speaker 2: don't know what you're talking.
24:50
Speaker 1: It was fantastic, no complaints at all. I mean it
24:55
Speaker 1: was wonderful.
24:56
Speaker 2: And do you push on to allow the more enthusiastic
24:59
Speaker 2: capable driver, But I've got to take the whole convoy
25:02
Speaker 2: with me, so yeah, it was. It was great, which
25:06
Speaker 2: like relief when you come in.
25:10
Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure.
25:11
Speaker 1: Now you have since you've been with land Over for
25:14
Speaker 1: forty years, you've probably owned a lot of lander Over yourself.
25:17
Speaker 1: Do you have any idea how many land Rovers you've
25:20
Speaker 1: personally owned?
25:22
Speaker 2: Obviously, hopefully my wife's not listening. They were all three.
25:28
Speaker 2: Let's go with that. She calls it my orphanage. So
25:32
Speaker 2: they find me, they find me, So, I mean it's
25:35
Speaker 2: probably over over forty. I should think over the full
25:38
Speaker 2: length of my career, but currently it's only eight.
25:42
Speaker 3: How many what are the land Rovers you have now.
25:45
Speaker 2: Three series ones, Series two, Series three, Defender ninety two
25:51
Speaker 2: Range rivers, a three door an LSC three door beautiful.
25:54
Speaker 5: What year is your three door? My three doors seventy two.
25:57
Speaker 5: Oh cheez, Yeah, you're of my Brewer. And then I
26:01
Speaker 5: also have a TVR. Everything's got a V eight in it.
26:05
Speaker 2: That's the one requirement, that's the one recording that's nice.
26:08
Speaker 1: Now, So in all of those years, what would you
26:12
Speaker 1: say is your favorite your personal favorite land robbery If
26:15
Speaker 1: for some reason you had that you could only own one,
26:18
Speaker 1: let's exclude the current models, just to make it easier
26:21
Speaker 1: for you.
26:21
Speaker 2: That makes it a lot easier. Yeah, I think for
26:24
Speaker 2: all around capability, comfort, usability, look feel has to be
26:31
Speaker 2: my three door Classic Rangervere.
26:32
Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree with you.
26:33
Speaker 2: I mean, I love my series trucks, but that you know,
26:37
Speaker 2: I know my wife and children would be quite happy
26:40
Speaker 2: to go on a massive journey in it because it's comfortable,
26:44
Speaker 2: it's roomy, it takes everything.
26:47
Speaker 3: And they're beautiful.
26:48
Speaker 2: Yeah. And I remember when they first came out. I
26:51
Speaker 2: was at school and a parent had bought one and
26:55
Speaker 2: they brought it to the sort of end of term
26:58
Speaker 2: cricket match and they had a pick counter back, and
27:00
Speaker 2: that it was a blue one, and that's just ingrained
27:03
Speaker 2: in my brain. That blue was beautiful too. So I've
27:07
Speaker 2: always always wanted one, and as soon as I could
27:09
Speaker 2: afford one, I thought one. I mean, it was a nail,
27:11
Speaker 2: but it was.
27:13
Speaker 3: And then you restored it yourself.
27:15
Speaker 2: No, not really. We carried on and went on, you know,
27:19
Speaker 2: did boys things with it. Sure it didn't survive that long,
27:23
Speaker 2: but I knew I had to get another. Oh okay, so
27:25
Speaker 2: that's what you have, the current one. Yeah, probably about
27:28
Speaker 2: twelve years. Isn't it good for you? That's wonderful. And Emma,
27:31
Speaker 2: what's your favorite land Rover? Our current range? Ranger is
27:34
Speaker 2: for you?
27:35
Speaker 3: Like the Rains, which motor? And that one?
27:38
Speaker 4: Really it's going to be yeah, right, Yeah, it's just
27:46
Speaker 4: a good looking car.
27:48
Speaker 2: Yeah.
27:48
Speaker 3: And the older land Rovers which ones are your favorites?
27:52
Speaker 4: Oh? You know, probably the same. So they just just
27:56
Speaker 4: great cars. And I haven't driven a lot of the
27:58
Speaker 4: older Range that we've done. We've got our Classic Center.
28:03
Speaker 2: We did a drive for the seventieth anniversary which we
28:07
Speaker 2: were given the opportunity to go into both classic and
28:12
Speaker 2: heritage and get out. It was like a sort of
28:14
Speaker 2: dream list and we put all this together and we
28:16
Speaker 2: did a drive for a number of journeys around Solihull
28:20
Speaker 2: and stuff. And I think it's really important to take
28:25
Speaker 2: our new intake into the business through that lineage. So
28:30
Speaker 2: we have grads that come and have placement from engineering
28:33
Speaker 2: with us, which is an old contact, and they come
28:35
Speaker 2: into our department and they've never done anything like that before.
28:38
Speaker 2: It's a whole whole another world to them. But that's
28:41
Speaker 2: you know, once they've got the head round it, that
28:44
Speaker 2: we've left them with an experience for life and they're
28:46
Speaker 2: taking that back into engineering and that's all being fed
28:49
Speaker 2: back into the new carts.
28:50
Speaker 1: And you've been with Leno for so long that how
28:54
Speaker 1: do you feel that connection still to the past. Do
28:57
Speaker 1: you feel that throughout the organization that knowledgement of the past.
29:01
Speaker 1: It sure seems like that land Rover respects so much
29:04
Speaker 1: of its heritage.
29:06
Speaker 2: Yes, I think you have to be very careful with
29:08
Speaker 2: it because you have to move on and if we're
29:12
Speaker 2: entrenched in the past, then we wouldn't be alive if
29:16
Speaker 2: that's the right to st today, So you've got to
29:18
Speaker 2: be cognizant of what happened in the past.
29:22
Speaker 1: It wouldn't even be legal to sell as as one
29:25
Speaker 1: Discovery or a Series one land Rover today.
29:28
Speaker 3: It wouldn't even pass any of the safety requirements.
29:31
Speaker 2: But also you'd be ignorant if you didn't look back
29:33
Speaker 2: at some of the excellent innovation that's taken place and
29:38
Speaker 2: re evolve that into what you see today parked outside.
29:42
Speaker 3: Ye.
29:44
Speaker 2: Lots of learning, sure and passion has gone into that
29:47
Speaker 2: new car, which is why it's got this character.
29:49
Speaker 1: And what kind of advice would you give someone that
29:52
Speaker 1: was just about they just recently bought a land Rover
29:55
Speaker 1: and they want to go do a significant trip like this?
29:58
Speaker 1: What kind of advice would you give them? What would
30:00
Speaker 1: be the first thing that you would tell someone if
30:02
Speaker 1: they came to you and said, David, I just bought
30:04
Speaker 1: a new Defender and I want to go to Namibia.
30:06
Speaker 1: What would be the first piece of advice.
30:09
Speaker 2: You'd give them? Research? Read. You can't just walk into
30:14
Speaker 2: a shop, buy it and go and do it. So
30:17
Speaker 2: it's about preparation. So research preparation, and that's preparation of
30:23
Speaker 2: vehicle and people. As we talked about earlier in this podcast.
30:26
Speaker 3: Yeah, get some get some training, et cetera, and.
30:29
Speaker 2: Go and talk to a number of people don't go
30:31
Speaker 2: to one perceived expert because they've got their own view
30:35
Speaker 2: and their own experiences. But if you look at the
30:38
Speaker 2: breadth of experience across the right, there are many people
30:41
Speaker 2: that love to talk about things, but you've got to
30:45
Speaker 2: see people that have actually delivered.
30:47
Speaker 3: And they've done it. Yeah, that they've done it.
30:49
Speaker 1: And how about you, Emma, what what advice would you
30:51
Speaker 1: give to someone that was planning their first trip from
30:55
Speaker 1: the things that you've learned with land Rover? What would
30:58
Speaker 1: you what advice would you give people around planning and logistics.
31:01
Speaker 4: I'd say preparation again is absolutely key. But you can plan, plan, plan,
31:07
Speaker 4: and things can still not go the way you want
31:11
Speaker 4: want it to go. I mean, this Africa, things are
31:16
Speaker 4: going to come out not work quite how you think
31:18
Speaker 4: in your head. So I think it's all about saying
31:20
Speaker 4: pretty calm, not flapping or stressing. And I think that's
31:25
Speaker 4: one of the key things I've learned to just keep
31:27
Speaker 4: my cool and problem solve where you can things things
31:33
Speaker 4: aren't going to go. Always to how you jump there
31:36
Speaker 4: and be yeah, staying calm, problem solved, speaking to the team.
31:41
Speaker 4: I mean, we've got so many years of experience here
31:44
Speaker 4: and I'm learning every day from the guys i'm here with,
31:47
Speaker 4: So yeah, just keep equal.
31:49
Speaker 2: Yeah that makes sense.
31:51
Speaker 1: I mean we have to plan so that way we
31:54
Speaker 1: don't invite too many problems. But once we start the trip,
31:57
Speaker 1: we have to just kind of let the rest of
31:59
Speaker 1: it go and take it as it comes, or else
32:01
Speaker 1: we become so obsessed with sticking to a plan or
32:04
Speaker 1: a certain outcome that we forget to start.
32:06
Speaker 4: And you forget to enjoy it if you're thinking, oh,
32:09
Speaker 4: we're we're late, or you know, we didn't go this way.
32:13
Speaker 4: It's not always going to be perfect, but you never
32:16
Speaker 4: know what you might find on the way doing something
32:17
Speaker 4: else that could be even better.
32:20
Speaker 1: Like stopping in that little village and interacting with the
32:23
Speaker 1: locals and buying some bracelets. And I mean there were
32:26
Speaker 1: beautiful people and that if we hadn't stopped, we would
32:30
Speaker 1: have missed that rich moment.
32:32
Speaker 2: But that's part of the journey. So when I ran
32:34
Speaker 2: into that place on my Rekis, I thought, this is beautiful. Yeah,
32:40
Speaker 2: and a lot of people didn't want to stop because
32:43
Speaker 2: I'm concerned about interacting, and so you've got to encourage
32:47
Speaker 2: people to do that. To be brave and step outside
32:49
Speaker 2: their comfort because then their journey becomes even richer.
32:54
Speaker 3: Yeah, those memories.
32:55
Speaker 2: And I think the key thing about coming to places
32:58
Speaker 2: like Africa, and it's the same wherever you is. You've
33:00
Speaker 2: got to respect the local culture and it's all about
33:03
Speaker 2: people connections, and so I spend a lot of time
33:07
Speaker 2: getting to know the local processes and talking to key
33:13
Speaker 2: players to make sure that what we're trying to do
33:17
Speaker 2: is acceptable to them from a culture point of view.
33:20
Speaker 2: Because you know, big company like Landrover coming into town. Yes, okay,
33:24
Speaker 2: we're putting a lot of income in back in because
33:27
Speaker 2: that's very important to us as well. But when we leave,
33:30
Speaker 2: we want them to invite us back. That's a key,
33:33
Speaker 2: key thing for.
33:34
Speaker 1: Me and you and we all want them to have
33:37
Speaker 1: as positive of an experience as we have. And I
33:40
Speaker 1: think as tourists oftentimes they can get this idea that
33:43
Speaker 1: they're and they don't recognize it, but they're really taking
33:46
Speaker 1: a lot and they're not giving.
33:48
Speaker 2: As much back.
33:49
Speaker 3: So stopping and shaking someone then.
33:51
Speaker 4: Saying the other night, but you know, to speak to
33:54
Speaker 4: these people because they want they wanted to talk interact
33:57
Speaker 4: with you.
33:58
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was really it was really neat just to
34:00
Speaker 1: stop and shake their hand and smile and interact with them,
34:05
Speaker 1: ask them how their day is and things like.
34:07
Speaker 2: That that rechildless.
34:09
Speaker 3: Yeah, we did that.
34:10
Speaker 2: I met those other guys in the gorge and they
34:14
Speaker 2: were just blown away. They loved it. What do you
34:18
Speaker 2: guys do? You could have build relationships you do because
34:23
Speaker 2: you then are able to get a lot more ask
34:26
Speaker 2: the because they sort of relax and they tell you
34:28
Speaker 2: about things, which then make it a richer experience for
34:31
Speaker 2: us as well.
34:32
Speaker 3: Yeah, so agree.
34:33
Speaker 1: David and Emma, thank you both so much for the time.
34:36
Speaker 1: I admire so much what you both do, and I
34:40
Speaker 1: was able to experience firsthand the results of your professionalism
34:44
Speaker 1: and your skills and many of the not only the
34:48
Speaker 1: vehicles you've talked about, David, but the other trips like
34:51
Speaker 1: G four and everything else were so formative to my
34:54
Speaker 1: passion not only for land rover but for vehicle based
34:57
Speaker 1: travel that I think you and all of those that
35:00
Speaker 1: have come before you that have done so much to
35:02
Speaker 1: inspire those of us that want to go see the world.
35:05
Speaker 3: So thank you both for your time this morning.
35:07
Speaker 2: It's a great pleasure.
35:08
Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you