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You Got Burked | William Burke & William Hare · Beheaded

• 0:04
  SPEAKER_00: Hello and welcome to Beheaded.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to season two, episode 11.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Megan Moore and I'm Elizabeth Black.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_00: The wine is atrocious tonight.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: I have to start with saying that.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_00: Megan's been having a tough time with Sauve Blanc lately.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_01: What the heck?
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_01: I thought I liked Sauvignon Blanc.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: I think I think you do too.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_01: I do, at least in the summer with like fish and lighter fare.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's really sweet.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_00: So if I'm like choking every single time I take a sip, I'm still gonna drink it.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not a wuss.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_01: So you had one over the weekend that was from New Zealand, which is usually New Zealand New Zealand Sauve Blanc.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: She can't go wrong.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_01: What happened to the grapes this year?
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_01: This is a Napa Valley one, and it also sucks.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: They're just really sweet.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_01: It's almost like a oaky Chardonnay taste, and I don't like that shit.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um they were kind of cheap.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but we always get cheap wine.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_00: But not like cheap of the cheap.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_00: That's like, I don't know, like a$9 bottle.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: Like where on the shelf did you reach?
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, always the middle.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_00: We've talked about this.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_00: Always get the middle.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_00: Why?
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like a middle bottle.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_00: You don't go to the top, you don't go to the bottom.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: You go to the middle.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: Right wherever I live.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, anyways, I just had to get that.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: That was like the first thing I had to get off my chest.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's not very good.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: I won't keep complaining about it.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_00: I'll drink it, I'll suck it up, buttercup.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's called Fluid Enappa.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: If you want to know, it's awful.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_00: Don't drink it.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: What year is that?
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: 2019.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: I was saying maybe all the grapes from 2020 were cursed, but those really haven't been fermented yet.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think I've seen a 2020 bottle yet, but I guarantee you they're probably.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_00: Ooh, I wonder if wine sales are gonna go down when all of the like middle shelf rack are all 2020 bottles of wine.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: People just avoid it like the plague.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: They're like, no, thanks.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_00: I'll pass on the top.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_01: We actually kind of had a bad joke in between us because again, we were trying to like think of a place to go earlier this year in terms of our trips.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_01: And we were like, oh my gosh, let's go to wine country, like, let's go to Napa.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I think one of us was just like, I think it's gone.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: Terrible joke.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_00: So didn't that get burned down with the rest of 2020?
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_00: Terrible joke.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's still there.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: We're terrible humans.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: How are you doing tonight?
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_01: I'm feeling good, actually.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: I had a long run this evening.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_01: Uh works good, feeling good.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_01: Good.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: Feeling good too.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like things are just like looking up in general.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_01: I guess because Disney World's around the corner.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_00: So you you're hearing a new little like in our voice.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: We're like, oh yeah, things are great.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone's go meet Mickey Mouse.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_01: I busted out all my old Disney clothes because again, I went to college in LA and I had a Disneyland pass when I lived there.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_01: So I went all the time and got all the merch, all the shirts, and so many shirts.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: Brought out all my stuff from like basically 2000, I don't know, eight to like 2012.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I just like let Megan look at all of it.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_01: And she's like, This is nice.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, I know.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_00: Some are kind of old.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: Some are a little fashionable.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: The one you're wearing right now is really cute.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's like Bambi's got like this crunched up, like angry face.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's like angry Bambi and he's got a little cute little face.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: Why is he so angry on that shirt?
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_01: He's maybe he's learning how to ice skate and he's not okay.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_01: Oh.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_01: He's unwell.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_01: Oh.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, so I might bring a few back for our trip.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_01: I think a few are are worthy of the trip.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_01: Not all.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um we had a very relaxing weekend.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: We went on a nice hike.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_00: Well, most of it was nice.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_00: He was nice.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: Steve at first.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_00: A little bit at first.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I have a fear.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: Irrational, I get it.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: Snakes.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: I do not do snakes.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna start making a list.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, roller coasters, snakes.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: You're starting to figure out who we are.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like a very cautious person.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: And Elizabeth is is bat shit crazy.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not bat shit.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_01: I am I have a healthy Wait, we're not supposed to say crazy.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, sorry.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: Don't say crazy trigger words.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_01: Apparently, there's trigger words now in society.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_01: You can't say crazy.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_01: You can't say crazy.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_01: She's a risk taker.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: That sounds much better.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: I just have a healthy, like I guess, need for adrenaline.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: And we're walking on the trails and you know, we're in Arizona.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_00: We were hiking what's called Tom's Thumb, which is like not a difficult hike.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's about a two-mile hike there and a two-mile hike back.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_01: And like steep.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_01: It is steep.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_01: Steep at first, but then you know, it's it eases off.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I was struggling, but most people weren't.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_01: So I would say it wasn't that hard.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_01: Megan was like, I feel so weak.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_01: She's like, What's wrong with me?
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, honestly, these people hike all the time.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like you can't do it.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_01: There are some serious people.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, we're casual hikers.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_00: So I just had like my Adidases.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and we're walking on the trail, and it's beautiful, it's gorgeous weather.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: And these teenage boys were like, Watch out, there's a rattlesnake up there.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, Oh, I'm not okay with that.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_00: But I was like, really?
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: And they're like, Yeah.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_01: But no further explanation.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_01: They didn't tell us where, like, where to look for it.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_01: They were just like, hey, yep, there's a snake.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, we're we're sure.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_01: And we're like, okay.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_01: And so I told Megan, I was like, dude, don't worry about it.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, either like I was ready to turn around, like, yeah, Megan.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: It was the very end of the hike, too.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_00: She goes, I'm done.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_00: And the the hike is to Tom's thumb, which is like this really cool, like rock structure you're supposed to get to.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: And then you sit up top and you can see like all of the valley and all of Arizona.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like a goal that you're working towards.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_00: And we were about, I want to say less than half of a mile.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: Like probably probably like a five minutes away.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, nope, I'm done.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_01: No explanation, no discussion.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: She just goes, I can't, nope, I'm done.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_00: Turning around, turning around.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_00: And the thing is, I was like, first of all, and I didn't believe these kids because they were not, and you were trying to convince me they're just messing with us.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_00: But not no, because rattlesnakes are obviously very prevalent in Arizona.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's a thing.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I've been here for 10 years and I've never actually seen one until this weekend.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_00: Until this height.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: Because they were not joking.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_00: So then we continue walking, and another couple walks past a very mature-looking, a responsible couple who would not be just messing with us.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: That's what I believed in.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_00: And they were like, Oh, did you hear watch out for the rattlesnake?
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, Okay, Elizabeth, we've got two people now.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_00: And they gave more details.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_00: They're like, Yep, it's up right around the left, just watch out.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: I was totally expecting it to be like on the path.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: And it wasn't.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_00: It was off in a bush.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't rattling or anything, but who's up there taking pictures of it?
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't want to look at it.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_01: I was not okay with it.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_01: Well, okay, to be fair, like I didn't know where it was.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_01: And there was a lady there who's like super knowledgeable, and she again was a lady that had the sticks and the hat and like older, you know, just very experienced, you could tell on the trails.
• 6:24
  SPEAKER_01: And so she's like, Oh, she's like, Are you guys want to see the snake?
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_01: And Megan's like, Nope.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: And Megan just keeps walking.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, it'd be such a good point.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: She's like, you know, we probably pass like 10 to 20 snakes on the way up.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: You just don't know they're there.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: They're just hiding.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm like, well, yeah, I want to see the snake.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: And so she's like showing me, and it's in this like windy.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: You never showed me your pictures.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I don't know where my phone is.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: Fine.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_00: Show it to me later.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_00: I really want to see it.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, I will show you.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_00: So I can have anxiety and not sleep all night.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_01: No, but it's like it's like curled up and it's inside this bush, which is like this bush looks like a snake.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's got like just these woven branches and kind of thorny looking.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_01: So it was actually really hard to see.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, who saw this in the first who's the first person?
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_00: But then everyone on the trail knew about this snake.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_01: Which I guess is nice that there's that sense of camaraderie where people like tell you.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_01: Because you don't know if maybe it does start to feel threatened and then it wants to come out.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: And there's like also a lot of dogs on the trail, like lots of little dogs.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_01: But it was just coiled up and it wasn't rattling or anything.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_01: And she, this woman like knew a lot about snakes.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_01: And she was like, Well, you know, there's three different species of rattlesnake in uh Arizona, and this one, I think she called it a western mountain rattlesnake or something.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_01: And it was funny because I was like, ooh, and I'm like, you know, just kind of getting up, not close, but a safe distance to take pictures, and Megan's like 20 yards away.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_01: I was all the way up at Tom's thumb at that point.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_00: I said, And the lady was all of a sudden a spurt of energy, I just sprinted to the top.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_01: Megan was at the summit, and but the lady tells me she's like, Well, well, don't poke it.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, I'm not gonna fucking poke the snake.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_01: A rattlesnake of all things.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like sitting here taking pictures.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_01: She's like, she's like, well, don't go up to it.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like, don't poke it.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, I'm not gonna poke the snake.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: What?
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: You know what?
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: I was thinking the same thing.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm glad I wasn't the only one witnessing this.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, I have I have again a need for adrenaline.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not gonna go up and just freak out a rattlesnake.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: So that was lovely.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_00: And then we had friends over, like neighbor friends, outside patio, neighbor friends.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_01: We finally have our patio set up.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_01: Well, Megan's patio, I call it mine because I'm here all the time.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: But uh I'm like, oh yeah, my patio.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_01: But no, uh, we had one neighbor come over last week, um, Barry and Gary, who we mentioned before.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_00: We mentioned them a couple weeks ago.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_00: First of all, I thought it was Barry and Carrie.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: We did.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like a jerk.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_00: It's Barry and Gary, which I'm actually glad about.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_00: That makes more sense.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: Gary's a better name for a man.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: Good.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: I'm glad you're they're so sweet though.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_00: They're like the nicest couple.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and they came over with an apple pie, literally.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_00: Very like great etiquette and just old fashioned just makes me want to step up my game.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_00: So we just did like apps and cheese and yeah.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_01: They even the next day had a directly written thank you note delivered to our dwarf that was like, Thank you so much for the first time.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_01: I told you to return the pie dish.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you gotta return that pie dish.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_01: But we had such a lovely time with them.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_01: That we you know, they we let them tour the house and uh we got a tour of their tour, but it's really nice.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_00: And then we met another neighbor of Megan's.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: Just in passing.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: But it turned into a fun evening.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_00: He came over and my husband was out, like he broke up in a cigar or something.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_01: He smokes his own sausage, so he brought all this stuff over.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_01: Very interesting guy.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he was an ex-MLB player, Major League Baseball, if you don't know.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_01: And he was just a super interesting guy.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he actually was a pitcher in the 80s, like fascinating stories.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_01: He's who I want to be when I grow up because he's like, Yeah, I own a bunch of property in Arizona and I have several boats, and I'm like, mm-mm.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_01: That's what I want in my future.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_01: Not, you know, I I I get and eventually want to just have this mass property.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_01: Every time you're gonna drink, you're just gonna be like.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: Sorry, if you hear me like making noises, it's I'm still I I'm perched.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_00: I need to.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but yeah, no, it was a lovely weekend.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_00: And oh, and we saw um we had Brandy Night, because we mentioned when we had brandy, we do have to theme all of our movies.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: We can't just watch a movie, we have to theme it.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I feel like maybe and maybe COVID has like fueled this, but I feel like Megan and I try really hard to, and as you guys know, we like to theme things.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: We have to have like special nights where we're like, okay, we're not just gonna like hang out and like watch Netflix together.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: We're like, let's watch this movie with this drink and this snack.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_01: Like, we like to make it an event.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, we're gonna be able to do it.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: And we even got dressed up.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah, we wore nice dresses.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, by ourselves in my living room.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we we mentioned last episode that we were having brandy, and we again we made it an event.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_01: Like, we got dressed up, I wore these really long elaborate earrings, which I felt like.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I remember the earrings.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: Remember the earrings?
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'm glad you noticed.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and uh, like I physically went out and bought brandy glasses and brought them over, and we had brandy, which we never tried brandy before.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_01: We like it's one of those things that you always see in movies.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_01: We're like, Would you like brandy?
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, brandy glass.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_01: And we, you know, we're whiskey girls, we're bourbon girls, and we're like, we've never had brandy.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_01: So we just got brandy, and it I guess it's like a sweeter type of whiskey.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's made in um I liked it.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, what's the is it port wine barrels or something?
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_01: But it adds a little bit of like sweetness to it.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um so we enjoyed it and we watched Rebecca, the old 1940 Alfred Hitchcock Rebecca.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so it made like an old black and white Hitchcock movie.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: And we ate um like stout pies.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: Stout pie.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because again, we we try to pretend like we're British.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: So we had like little stout pies and brandy and old-fashioned black and white movies.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_01: It was really fun.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, and uh it was funny because that night again we like wanted to have this whole evening, and I guess the same day Jake was scheduled for oral surgery.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I forgot about it.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_01: Here, like Megan and I are in like these elaborate dresses, like it's Oscar night, like having brandy and brandy glasses and watching this doing as we do.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_00: Like Hitchcock movie, and Jake's just on the couch in like his sweats, and he's just every two minutes is like, oh he had like emergency root canal.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_00: It was like an infected situation, it was so bad.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: I felt like tooth pain is really bad.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: I need more eyes.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_00: I'm dying.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_01: We're like, I'm sorry, you're ruining this blender.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: We were trying to watch this.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: No, I felt so bad for him.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_00: And like tooth pain is something like you don't joke about, and it was it was pretty bad.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and he starts sending me like all of like his insurance information.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: Like Charlie thought it was his last day.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_00: It was time to go to Earth, right?
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: He wasn't fooling around, but yeah, he's fine now.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: He's great.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_00: I swear he's uh he's a real person.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's I feel I feel like you and I have just such a strong bond.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: I have to remind remind the listeners that there is a third wheel.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: There's a third wheel in the situation.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um, that sounded weird.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: That sounds worse.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_00: He's the third wheel.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_00: Move over, Jake.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um so last week we spoke of the story of Half Hang It Maggie.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, who is in Edinburgh, a Scottish lad.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: We las.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_00: Lass.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_00: Lass.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and we kind of have a similar story, but not really.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_00: But it really was like a cool segue, yeah.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_01: Again, we we did intentionally like uh lead one into the other, but this is also in Edinburgh.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_01: It's a little bit after Half Hanget, so Half Hang It Maggie was in like 1720s, right?
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I'm looking at my 1700s for sure.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_00: I don't even remember.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, she died in 1723.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: 23.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_01: So about a hundred years later.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's about a hundred years later, but it is in Edinburgh, and it involves two men who because they had kind of fallen into I don't know, I guess bad company.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_01: Bad business.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: Bad business, um, slash a little bit, you know, just desperate situations.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_00: Depends on how you look at it.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, they decided to be serial killers together, uh, commit murders together, um, but for the sole purpose of selling the bodies uh, you know, the people that they murdered to science.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_01: Basically going to the local university and saying, hey, we have a body, you probably need it for a dissection.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: And the surgeons slash professors asked no questions and we're like, great, if you have any more, feel free to come by again.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_01: So this is the story of William Burke and uh William Hare.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_01: The Williams's.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_01: The Williams's William and William Burke and Hare.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_01: Burke and Hare.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_01: Ooh, which quick plug, they don't pay us to do this ad, but like I I looked for just, you know, Burke and Hare to do research before this.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_01: There's a really cool shop called Burke and Hare that sell like candles and other like home goods, and it's all very like dark packaging, kind of gothic and like occult looking.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um look it up if you're interested in that, because they sell some really cool stuff.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_01: I think I might be a shopper of there soon.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_01: Uh there's Doody and Burke.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: There's very different Oregon's and Burke.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yes.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_00: Which is the dark ma the dark magic store from Harry Potter and he practice the dark arts.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: And now we have Burke and Hare.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: Alright, so this is the early 1800s in Edinburgh again, just like the last episode.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and at the time, Edinburgh was one of the leading European centers for anatomy, like modern anatomy as we know it.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: Because science.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_01: You know, for science.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_01: They because science.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_01: Back in like kind of prior to this era, dissection was really like frowned upon, you know, by by everyone in society because they were like, why would you want to cut a person open to see how they operate?
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like, that sounds gruesome, that sounds, you know, anti-religious, like that doesn't sound like something we should be doing.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_01: I guess if you were to think of like a modern equivalent, it's like people being uncomfortable with like AI technology or robots or things.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_00: You're like, no, no, you're kind of like Well, it's kind of like Down and Abbey, too, when they start to get all the modern technology and I was afraid of everything.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you're afraid of everything.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_00: I'm afraid of everything now.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, I was afraid of airpods.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: Well, and air paws I didn't like for about two years.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: That's true.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_01: My side note, my mom's actually super weird about that.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: Like, she has her Fitbit to track her steps, but then she immediately takes it off when she's at rest because she's like, I don't want to get like, you know.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: Radioaction.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like radioactivity from my wrist.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, whoa.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_01: So anyway, we all know these things exist, whatever.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_01: So back in the day, dissection was frowned upon until about the early 1800s when there were different areas in Europe that started practicing kind of what we know as modern anatomy, where it was a little more, I guess, elevated as a science and it was a little more taken seriously in the scientific community.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_01: So in Edinburgh in the early 1800s, there's this very big demand for cadavers.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_01: So by Scottish law, it actually had to be a body that was either for a person who died in prison, who committed suicide, or like an orphan who had no family to claim them, essentially.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_00: But like real so this is kind of where it ties in with half-hanging Maggie, because if you listen to that episode, as you should have, as if you were if you if you were a good studious listener, executionado.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_00: Executionado.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, she so after she was executed, her family was fighting over the body with all the scientists and the doctors, all these young scholars and the students, because really they could only dissect on.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, like how often is a suicide gonna happen around town?
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe, I don't know.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: They had a lot of things to worry about back then, but also, you know, any type of execution, they had the rights to be able to try and get the body unless the family in that situation was fighting for it.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: So I mean, but again, like rare and few.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's not like I think executions were not as popular as they were maybe like 1500s.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like 1800s, they kind of cooled it down a little bit.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_01: And these cities weren't as big as they are today, they were smaller towns, you know.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: So again, like these deaths were rare, you know, death that had no family or were a prisoner, you know, or were extra rare, you know, and these professors and people that wanted to dissect bodies like had high demand, they were like, we're gonna need to dissect a body every day to teach our students.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like, we can't just have one every few months to show up.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, that's a good point.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_00: I read that one of the doctors that we're gonna get into, um, you'll learn his name.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: Two dissections a day.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, two dissections a day.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_01: So they're going through these bodies fast.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_01: And they want them fresh, you know.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_01: They don't want a fresh body.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_01: They want a fresh body.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_01: Because think about it, like if you're dissecting in front of a class, you don't want some dirty, dusty, old, decrepit thing in front of you.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_01: And rotting and smelling.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like you know, and they didn't have modern techniques for keeping things fresh.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_01: So the fresher the better in this day, which is kind of gross to think about.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: And they paid differently dependent on the freshness.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: So if it was in the in the summertime, it only paid about seven to eight pounds a body.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because you know, obviously they they had to use it quicker and it couldn't be as fresh, but in the winter you could get up to ten pounds a body because it was a little bit more preserved, a little bit more frozen.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_01: So, because of this demand, body snatching became common.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_01: And body snatching, if you don't know exactly what that is, because yeah, I think we've heard of different things like invasion of the body snatchers, which means people are possessed.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_01: But in this context, body snatching is like the removal of corpses from their burial sites.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_01: So another name for people who did that were resurrection men.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_01: So you were either a body snatcher or resurrection man, but basically all you did was you know exhume human remains and you're like illegally.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: Illegally, because you really can't disturb the grave.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_01: But there's also kind of a loophole in the law because technically the body didn't belong to anyone, so you weren't allowed to like steal like jewels and things that were buried because that was considered robbery.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_01: But if you stole the body itself, like that didn't belong to anyone.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: This was the trick.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_00: They weren't allowed to actually dig into the grave because that was considered trespassing.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: They cannot steal any goods from the grave, that was considered stealing.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_00: But if you could somehow get through the grave without trespassing and take the body, I guess.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: So really it wasn't like there's really no way to make it legal.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_01: Kind of like Half Hang It Maggie, where they then had to change the law to like hang until dead.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: This was also a thing where they didn't technically say you can't just remove the body.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_01: So there was a weird loophole around this time.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and that's why, again, that with the demand of the bodies, like body snatching just became super, super commonplace, really.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_01: And it got to the point where people, like families who wanted to protect their dead, they had to um be basically hire guards, they had to erect like watchtowers, and they created these things called mort safes.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_01: Mort safes.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: A mort safe is a basically like an iron cage, it almost looks like a gibbet if you remember from the Captain Cook episode.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: It looks like William Kidd.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: I like what you were called.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um I might have previewed a future one.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_01: We're sorry about that.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_01: William Kidd, thank you for the correction.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_01: But it basically looks like a givet where they like stick this iron cage over the grave to be like bolted down into the ground, like, okay, please don't steal.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um well, even better, the government really like kind of turned a blind eye to a lot of it as well.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_00: So the families were getting really upset and starting to like protest this whole situation.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: And government was just kind of like, yeah, yeah, because selfishly they're like, actually, but Edinburgh's doing really well in like medical and anatomy, and like they need the bodies, so we're advancing in science for the sake of you and your family members.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so we're gonna introduce a character right now called Dr.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_01: Knox.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_01: So, Dr.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_01: Knox um in about 1825 became a fellow at the Royal College of Surgeons in Edinburgh, um, and so he lectured on anatomy.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_01: And again, he was the person we were referring to earlier that had two dissections a day.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_01: Fresher the better.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_01: His lessons were so popular they drew over like 400 different students at a time.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and he really elevated the science of anatomy.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_01: Like Edinburgh was already a leader in anatomy, and he elevated it even further with the you know the frequency of his lectures and how popular his lectures were.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_01: So, I mean, he's riding this wave high of like modern anatomy in Edinburgh.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_01: So you have Dr.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_01: Knox on the one hand, and then you have two other characters, William Burke and William Hare, who kind come into the picture.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_01: So a little bit of background on each of them before we get into how they connect together.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_01: But William Burke was born in Ireland in 1792.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_01: He and his brother served for the British Army for a time as teenagers and then he briefly got married in County Mayo.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_01: But he left his wife and family and moved to Scotland basically to just be a laborer on, I think it was called the Union Canal.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_01: So came over to work on the Union Canal and eventually got settled there, found a new wife.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: Her name was Helen.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_01: And they both moved to Edinburgh in about 1827.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_01: So two years after Knox comes to Edinburgh.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_01: Helen McDougall.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_01: McDougal McDougal very Scottish name.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: Again me and my accents that I didn't practice.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry I'll rehearse next time.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_01: No, but so they they were um essentially hawkers at the time.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_01: They sold secondhand goods.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_01: He was a cobbler for a bit.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_01: So they're just trying find you know to find ways to make money fast.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like let's just buy things and sell them to you know for for higher prices.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: Like let me just make some shoes really quick.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like they were just trying to find not making a lot of money though because I read as a cobbler kind of putting things into perspective as we get into how much they were making with the bodies as a cobbler he was making about a pound a week.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_01: A pound a week.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_01: A pound a week.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_01: Keep that log that in your head for later when you know how much they're gonna make on bodies.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: So that's Burke's story.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_01: And then at around the same time William Hare is coming into the picture.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_01: So he was born in Londonderry or New Newry um and his age is a little unclear because he wasn't he wasn't middle class like Burke.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_01: He didn't have as much status um but he was born either between 1792 and 1804 again a little unclear.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_01: But he mid moved to Edinburgh as well just like Knox and just like Burr in the 1820s.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_01: So page turn um so he was a coal man's assistant and then he ended up lodging in this house with this man and wife who ran the house but the man I think his name was I guess you pronounce it Logue but he ended up dying and so his wife Margaret who helped him run this house ended up just kind of taking hair as a husband.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_01: So it was unclear if they were officially married or not but they essentially lived as man and wife now running this inn or this house for lodgers that were just kind of coming in and out of town.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_01: But he was a little more rough around the edges than Burke.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_01: He was illiterate he was quarrelsome he was violent and Margaret again the woman who had had run this house before he came along was like this Irish immigrant who was just very kind of stoic and hard featured.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_01: So together they were kind of a gruesome pair.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_01: They were both like kind of a I don't know dowdy angry couple I guess you want to say who loved drink.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_01: Oh they were big drinkers.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_01: Big drinkers I I read that on a lot of articles they just kept mentioning how much how much they drank but it comes into play later when we talk about how they got to their victims.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: So both of these couples again so at this point Helen and Burke and then Margaret and Hare they both all kind of meet when they're working the harvest um together a town over and so when they all get back to Edinburgh basically Hare convinced Burke he's like you know what we have this lodging house that me and Margaret run.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_01: Come over and like you should just live with us.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_01: So they had a grand old time together.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_01: They all moved in this house and they were known for hard drinking and just rowdy behavior.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_00: They just became again they were very fun people but very kind of violent and aggressive people at well which I guess we're we can all say that when we're drinking I did read some things though how Burke was kind of like youthful funny and religious which I thought was really interesting.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_01: They said he was like never seen yeah never seen without his Bible he went to the local church you know regularly oh yeah give me some more shiny wine oh what happened we have this uh black skull sorry I was really animated by that that just broke oh no please it's like a cool skull okay I can save it we can glue that we can gorilla glue that we can gorilla glue anything we'd like thanks for the top you off a little bit love it um but yeah so he was like known as being just like very boisterous and fun and youthful yeah he was a little more fun of the two where and then hair hair was again like he just angry angry drunk violent illiterate right not not as much of a like fella you want to be around exactly um so then comes this weird era from November 20s or sorry not the 20s November 1820s yeah the 20s of the 1820s so in the 20s of the 1800s um november 1827 to like November 1828 there's this series of stuff that happens real fast between these guys so the first thing is that November 29th 1827 there's this lodger in the house named Donald and he dies of something called dropsy and dropsy if you look it up it's essentially like a buildup of fluid in your body's tissue um so he died of natural causes and they didn't really know what to do with him because Hare who again runs the inn with his wife was so pissed because this guy drops dead and he owed him rent.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: Four pounds four pounds of rent and he was like what the hell like this guy money this is yeah like four weeks of money as a cobbler like I can't just have this guy's debt on my hands.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: So they were like upset this guy just died on their watch, didn't know what to do with him.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_01: So him and Bert get together and they just you know go over their options and they're like oh let's give this to the local university like I bet some anatomists are gonna pay for this you know to to dissect and be a cadaver.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_01: So they take him over to um the the university and they kind of ask around they were actually looking for this professor called Monroe um Professor Munro and instead one of the like junior associates or whatever was like you know there's this other guy Knox who we mentioned before and they're like take him to Knox he'll know what to do with him so Knox gladly accepts this body um and uh he he paid I believe it was seven pounds and ten shillings for the body and he's like oh thank you and one of his assistants says you know if you've got more bodies we'd be happy to see you again so they're kind of implying like hey we're gonna ask you very little questions as long as you get us bodies we are happy to pay um and uh if you're curious too like how they got away with just hiding this body um they filled the guy's uh coffin with a bunch of bark and they sealed it so when the like local parish came around to be like oh you they're your lodger Donald he died right like let's make sure to bury him they're like here's this coffin and they just gave him a coffin full of bark and when meanwhile yeah are like dealing his body pretty good exactly so that worked out pretty well right and then they get another lodger who is getting very feverish and he named Joseph named Joseph and he he didn't die naturally but supposedly in the confession Hare was saying you know my wife and I really didn't want this man who could be he had infectious it could have been COVID we could the COVID had the plague he had something he had the coffee but they were like we this is really bad we don't want someone this feverish and this sick living in our house and we have other lodgers in here.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_00: So they kind of put their brains together and they're like you know remember the Donald guy we we did pretty well with him.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_01: We made a lot of good money off of him right oh and to be clear about that money um so the seven shillings they split it almost half and half hare got more because he was out the money from the lodging yeah so hare got I believe it was like four plus four plus pounds yeah you know and and um Burt got a little bit less he got like three and a half yeah he got like three pounds five shillings or something like that.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um so they now this is kind of when they've their first murder really call it what it is call it what you want yeah all right so their plan of attack literally is suffocation because at the time very little could they do to prove that somebody died from suffocation especially if he's already feverish and he's sick well must be natural causes.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um and it ends up working pretty well because Burke can hold him down with his body weight and I they either used a pillow or just their hands.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_00: But um they suffocate him.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah they we think they got him a little drunk first to make sure that he was again kind of out of it and not as you know strong as he would otherwise been even though he was ill.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_01: And it's really funny because after this incident and throughout a few more that they do of similar it's called birking literally like first meme I guess of the modern world is called birking and birking literally means you get someone drunk and you suffocate them.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah it okay this sounds terrible.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah not a bad way to go out if you were completely plastered like they would I think this was kind of a courtesy of them.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_00: They would get their victims so drunk that they didn't know what was going on and they passed out and they would suffocate them while they were passed out.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_01: I felt I'm 105 like it could be it could have been a lot more violent.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_01: Burk me.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_01: Burk me at 105 please 105 I'm gonna live really long.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_00: My family lives long I told you they think I'm gonna be alive to do that shoot.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: You'll be 104 I don't know my great uncle lived till he was 107.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_00: See we got really long bloodlines got good jeans exactly it's about avocados and wine oh man you're gonna you and I are gonna be alive a little bit of dark chocolate.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah I'm gonna get into another preservation technique as we go through these murders because I found out something that I think is really valuable to our health.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_01: Does it have to do with whiskey?
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yes okay we'll get to it out it I know.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_00: So not predictable so they go back to their good old friend Dr.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_00: Knox who mind you his assistants would say like we hope we can see you again and bring us more business if you ever just happen to come across a body that's in a handwritten card the next day and said thank you so much for your body thank you for the body we can't wait for the next time please come again and so they did.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_00: And they got 10 pounds for Joseph which is pretty good.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's a winter ram that that is I mean you split it that's more than a month's worth of what he was doing before.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah so they're they're rolling in the dough um we could probably go through every single victim here but I'm gonna shorten this for everybody.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_00: So over the span of 10 months there were 16 murders.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: Of those there were 12 women two handicapped men and then two like normal dudes it's sad that they like targeted the handicapped people but yeah so basically again there was men young and old women there was one boy who had a really gruesome death apparently when they looked his grandmother yeah it was him and his grandmother the grandmother I think they just burked.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_01: The boy they couldn't burk because he couldn't just feed him a bunch of alcohol couldn't get him drunk first I hate to say it's like terrible to say because it's a kid but I think what they did is like they held him up high and they literally like broke him over their knee.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like they broke his back I didn't know that.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah really gruesome but so that's how they kill this boy and that and that's like a turning point like it's one thing to like we had this dead person around hair definitely did it crazy fucker.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_00: One of the other victims her name was Abigail Simpson she was a salt seller so she would sell her salt yeah um so there there were women and when they when they brought Abigail to Dr.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_00: Knox he said something along the lines of like oh the bodies were so or or I'm sorry a witness said this of his impression of of taking on the bodies they said that the bodies were just so fresh he didn't ask any questions.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_00: So they are bringing him these bodies that sometimes are still worn because they had just killed them that night and they take them straight over to Dr.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_00: Knox and he's willingly taking them and he's pretty much also turning a blind eye.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_00: He's like I know you guys are doing something sketchy.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_00: This body is still hot is still warm they are freshly dead.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_01: And they did ask some questions I guess in their defense you know I I think um the I guess the biggest question was when was when a local prostitute was killed named Mary Patterson.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_01: They also called them girls of the town um but they brought the the body over and like until this point it had been people were like oh they just died at our inn and we brought them to you like oh they had fever they had this they had that but when like they brought this young prostitute people were like oh shit like we know her like we've seen this they've all done business with her as well business with this girl but no one asked I mean they they did to be like they're like okay so she recognized her for sure she died and they were like yeah we you know she was dead in the street found her we just came across her finding a penny on the road like oh look there's a body there's 10 pounds right there and this is interesting and this brings me back to my earlier point but I guess to preserve to preserve um Mary the prostitute they like put her in a vat of whiskey for three months to preserve her body which like now that I'm thinking Imagine if that was half hanging at Mag Maggie half hanging whiskey for so long.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_00: She's like she wakes up in pure whiskey she just drank her way out.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_01: Slowly just if I were half hang at Maggie and I was in a vat of whiskey I would just slowly drink my way out until I fully emerged as this ultra powerful being and drunk and very drunk.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_01: But it leads to me you know leads me to think well I guess whiskey just preserves your body I think it's good for you right an argument can be made that it's very healthy to have whiskey every day.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna go with so also with um what's her name Mark Mary Patterson Margaret Yeah Mary Patterson.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_00: So that that one is I'm actually glad you're bringing up her murder out of all of them.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah because this one did um turn some heads because supposedly there was two prostitutes over there.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_00: And uh the other one's name is Jane Brown I think.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah that sounds right yeah so they go off in a room together and her friend prostitute leaves or whatever and takes off yeah she takes off and the wife is like so in a fury because she's she's just assuming you know it's an affair and well she's a prostitute and they're in a room together.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_00: So they get into a big fight over this and a big brawl so much so fact that he actually throws a glass at his wife's face and cuts her right like upper eyebrow.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_00: But it was memorable enough where the prostitute friend remembered all of this and was like very specific in the details like well yeah the husband and wife were there and it was actually the wife who was getting her so drunk.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_00: So the the wife were involved in this because they would get the whiskey they would get the victims drunk.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_01: And they like drinking themselves so if you're a woman it's easier to drink with another woman versus just have another have another drinking with men you're a little suspicious but if you're drinking with women you're like oh safe space this girl's just feeding me drinks they would get them comfortable get them all toasty get them really liquored up.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_01: So people think that these things were staged especially with the prostitute where like she barges in and yells like oh you're having an affair they think that might have been all staged so that it felt more natural like the way the series of events happened but of course they tell her prostitute friend I don't know why I say prostitute friend sorry her friend she is a friend and she is a prostitute.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_00: You may call her that was just her courier at the time they told her friend because she's like hey where'd my friend Mary go?
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like comes over the next morning and of course she's dead at this point and already being dissected.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_00: She left with the client yeah they're like oh she met someone and they just ran off together into the night and Jay's like okay makes sense oh Mary that Mary I'm due eventually um so that was one of the of the 16 women or I'm sorry 12 women 12 women yeah um and then also you can talk about this guy oh yes so another guy we need to talk about is James Wilson James Wilson was 18 years old he was the town well they called him Daft Jamie well they called him a children entertainer as well because he performed on the streets and kids really liked him and they called him yeah Daft Jamie because he was mentally challenged yeah which I think was so rare back then and of course like it was nothing but like ridicule and people didn't know how to handle it.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_00: But for even somebody to live up until 18 living like this so in early 18 but he made a living out of it because again he was entertaining and he played a comedian yeah um but he so he was mentally handicapped.
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_00: He was also physically handicapped his feet were disabled so that he had deformed yeah they were deformed so he had like a very prominent limp to about him and um so he of course goes to the lodge unfortunately it's like a very Sweeney Todd thing.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_00: Like whatever ends up in this lodge is dead um and they murder him and they bring his body over to Dr.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_00: Knox and they are starting to dissect him and and people not only did they hear whispers on the street that hey we haven't seen Daft Jamie around Daft Jamie is missing.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_00: Right um they recognize of course it's him yeah and this comes up in trial because just coincidentally um they have like a queue like now they're they're like overwhelmed in in bodies and they're they've got a whole queue of bodies assembly line.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah they've got a queue of bodies to get through and that's why they're starting to like soak them in whiskey because they have to keep them preserved long enough.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_00: And for whatever reason well which we know the reason they bump James up to the front of the line and they dissect him like instantly the next day.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_01: Well and like before they even do a public dissection like in front of students they cut off his head and they cut off his legs to kind of or at least his feet yeah yeah to be like oh this is just a regular torso we have here but there's no head and there's no legs.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_01: Those would have been the identifying doctors so yeah so again so they identified Mary the prostitute like the students did of course um and then they identify uh James and so they're slowly like okay people are getting suspicious yeah and these aren't these aren't suicides or executiones right there's something more going on why they all died exactly so the very last thing that happens the last victim of the 16 was this lady called either Marjorie or Margaret depending on the source um but Margaret Doherty and so she's this middle-aged Irish woman so she's the last one that they burk get her drunk and then suffocate her I love that she went for the drinking too she's like okay sure I'll get sauce whiskey yeah um so so she has some drinks she gets suffocated she dies they stash her in this like spare bedroom and they literally had like a bed of straw that they just kind of threw her on.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_01: But there's these other people there named Anne and James Gray so they were the ones who were there kind of they saw her when she was alive and then the next day they were inquiring about her because she was just gone.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_01: She had disappeared so they were the ones to actually find her body in this spare room on this pile of straw and they're like okay this isn't okay.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_01: There's obviously been in the last year all of these random disappearances slash murders so now we're actually finding a body so they went straight to the police and it's um said that I think it was Helen the wife she she tried to bribe them.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_01: She like stopped them on their way to the police and she's like okay let's talk about this guys yeah you've found the body but I I'm sure for maybe 10 pounds which is a lot of money it's the price of a body they're like for 10 pounds how about we don't involve the police here and they refused they refused the bribe and said I'm sorry no like we're gonna take this straight away to the police.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_01: So they went to the police in that time not Knox um but Burk yeah Burke and hare still managed to take away the body to Knox.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_01: Get their monies for us right so they're like oh crap they're onto us let's at least get our last payment so they take it to Knox.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_01: Well and they're getting rid of the body too and getting rid of the body so by the time the police get there all they find is like bloody clothes which is interesting if you're Burk I was confused by that.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah she was suffocated and drunk why was there blood?
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_01: And the whole point of burking is to leave minimal marks on the body because they're being dissected also you're not gonna like I don't know stab it to death.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_01: Are they that dumb to just leave her bloody clothes laying exactly that's so strange.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_01: But apparently that's the evidence that they found was they found her her bloody clothes and then they went to Knox's straight away because they're like I think we understand what's happening.
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_01: So they went to Knox's um like surgery room dissecting room whatever you want to call it and they found her body and the Greys were with them.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_01: So Ann and James came with them and they identified the body like yes this is the woman that we saw.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_01: So at this point they have enough evidence to you know take Hare and Burke into custody and what does Hare do right away as soon as he's like abducted by the police I don't know what does he do Elizabeth I literally is like okay we did it yes totally totally admit full guilt but you know what I will tell you everything you want to know every detail of every murder if you give me immunity and we just blame it on birth friends till the end friends till the end you know this can go down in a recording I will back you up thank you okay I I would back you up I won't egregiously lie about things but you'll be elusive but I will I'll be like um like should we put this on record?
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just kidding I don't know maybe this is bad to have on record maybe we'll edit that part out unless I F up again and upload the unedited version of things.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_01: I would also have your I would not be the hair in this situation.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_00: Friends to the end okay um so this is like really lovely I think their trial starts on Christmas Eve.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_00: Like such a beautiful time and like they're Irish right they're Scottish they're like very Catholic and very like it's a very beautiful season it's a very lovely day.
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_00: 10 a.m so the court was so full an hour before the trial even started they were at Max Capital And people are trying to squeeze their way.
• 44:02
  SPEAKER_00: And this is like, again, the hot topic of the town.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_00: Finally, there are 16 murders these guys are confessing to.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, also, really quick side note.
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_00: I read a little cute thing too, how um Burke, I think it was Burke, went back home to go visit his family, and his dad was like, Yeah, like you're looking pretty spiffy here, like new jacket, new top hat.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, Oh, this Mrs.
• 44:25
  SPEAKER_00: Bobblering must be going really.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so he was actually, I think, on part of the witnesses because they were like, Oh, because he they had to have known his son was like coming into money.
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_01: That's why note to word of the wise note to our listeners: if you ever just do something that creates you a lot of money really fast, be subtle about it.
• 44:44
  SPEAKER_01: Subtle.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_01: Like buy something nice and discreet that no one will know.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_01: Jaguar right away.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_01: Don't get a jaguar.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like don't buy people get jaguars anymore.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_00: Teslas.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_01: Jaguar.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_00: Jaguar.
• 44:55
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know what you get these days, but be subtle.
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like hide a lot under the mattress, invest some in the stock market, maybe buy a house nobody knows about, but don't just like show up in your finest attire everywhere.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_01: That's gotta be graduate.
• 45:07
  SPEAKER_00: Like national treasure.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_00: That's what they do.
• 45:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_01: Bad move.
• 45:11
  SPEAKER_01: That's key.
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_01: You gotta you gotta be discreet about it.
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_01: If you build it up over time, like the course of two, three years, no one will ask questions.
• 45:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, oh wow, she just, you know, over time got really stylish.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_01: If you do it overnight, people are gonna be suspicious.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_01: Don't do it.
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_00: And then you have to lie about an inheritance, like the great aunt that died and left me millions.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, okay, so there were supposed to be 55 um witnesses.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_00: Did you know that?
• 45:37
  SPEAKER_01: I did not know that in the witness.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_00: 55 witnesses.
• 45:39
  SPEAKER_00: There was a lot.
• 45:40
  SPEAKER_00: They they were not very clean about their tracks.
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but here's the thing.
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_01: 55 people raised their hands, like, yep, I've seen them.
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_00: But here's the thing: they had they had a big issue because so yes, they confessed to 16 different murders, but they didn't like how Burke was getting tried for all of these murders, just as like one, even though they were all unique incidences with unique scenarios and unique whatever.
• 46:03
  SPEAKER_00: And then Hare was getting only a few he was being tried for, and they went back and forth for hours about this of how they were even going to try them.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_00: But what it came down to was there were three murders that they had the most evidence on.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_00: It was um Mary Patterson, Mary Patterson, James Wilson, and the last one Margaret, Margaret, Margaret Daugherty.
• 46:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 46:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um so those were the three that they like, okay, regardless of everybody else, like let's get down to to business on these three.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, they kind of did a like I I really like this because I feel like this is real, like, law effort once.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_00: Like, before we've heard of these trials where they go into it just knowing the outcome.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's all treason.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_00: It's all a court.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you say treason.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_00: Witchcraft.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_00: Witchcraft treason, it's all just an a courtesy to even have the trial, but they already know what's gonna happen right.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_00: For this one, it was actually like real based on real evidence.
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they actually tried here.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um so considering how like proper they were being with all of this, they were very thoughtful of even who was being tried.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_00: After, even though the wife was arrested, they decided she didn't have like enough participation besides getting them drunk, maybe, but like there wasn't enough to prove that she was actually the one murdering them.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_01: Well, both both wives were taken in.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_01: And so Hare's wife, because he again had this diplomatic immunity all of a sudden, like he was the one that was like, I'm gonna offer you all the information.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_01: His wife was exempt from then on because she couldn't testify against her husband and he couldn't testify against her.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_01: So that caused her, uh, who uh her name was also Margaret.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_01: So Margaret, the stoic Irish woman, she got off because her husband, again, offered all this information for immunity.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_00: I remember what I was gonna say now.
• 47:51
  SPEAKER_00: It was related to this.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_00: So part of the reason how they got to that, also what I was saying of how they're finally doing things in like a legally like right, righteous way of doing it.
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, they tried something new, which is very common nowadays, is surpriser.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_00: They separate all of the good people.
• 48:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like in movies where they put everyone in a room where they coordinated everybody and they interrogated all of them, and then they all of their stories were just a little bit different.
• 48:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 48:19
  SPEAKER_00: And when comparing those stories, like nothing made sense.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_00: Enough to cause it.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_00: But they narrowed it down to like, okay, it's Burke and Hare.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_00: Hare was like very like, like you said, like he was like, it was all Burke.
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_00: I was just here.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_01: And I'll just give you all the information.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um and so so Helen and and Burke at this point are the two that are like, okay, we're looking at you now.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you guys are the the main culprits here.
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_00: But no, you're right.
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_00: So the wives kind of get off.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_00: They only find Burke guilty of all of this stuff.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_00: Of all of all four of them participated, especially Hare.
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_01: And it's ironic because he was the one that again was a little bit higher class, like at some point, you know, he was becoming a Presbyterian, had the Bible with him all the time.
• 49:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like of all people, probably the the nicest person, which again, nice guys finished last, I guess.
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's the moral.
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_00: The trial went into the next morning, so it is now Christmas Day.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_00: Where they read off their sentences.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_00: It only took them a couple hours to deliberate, but Christmas Day, Burke is found guilty.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_00: Do you want to share his sentence?
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's not that gr gruesome, but it's just ironic.
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_01: So they they say, okay, you're gonna be sentenced to hanging until dead because we know that from how to do it.
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_01: Edinburgh, we've been there, done that.
• 49:37
  SPEAKER_01: Edinburgh's like, we're gonna be very clear here.
• 49:39
  SPEAKER_01: You're hanged until dead, and then your body is going to be dissected.
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_01: Your but got your body's gonna be donated to science.
• 49:47
  SPEAKER_01: Publicly.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_01: Publicly.
• 49:49
  SPEAKER_01: So so he knows right away, like oh, again, like our segment, punishment fits the crime.
• 49:55
  SPEAKER_01: This is this is literally punishment fits the crime.
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_01: So his body, no questions asked, is gonna have to be dissected um by Professor Monroe, the guy who they originally tried to approach before Knox, um, in the anatomy theater at the old college.
• 50:09
  SPEAKER_01: So he's like, all right, that's fair.
• 50:12
  SPEAKER_00: It's not terrible.
• 50:13
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I think it'd be worse.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like, okay, if this had been 400 years earlier, they would have been dissected but alive.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's called William Wallace.
• 50:23
  SPEAKER_00: They would have done that live.
• 50:25
  SPEAKER_00: That would have been like a disembowelment.
• 50:27
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, but a drawing cuttering.
• 50:30
  SPEAKER_00: Simple hanging and then take the body down and do the dissection.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 50:34
  SPEAKER_00: Which are science by doctors.
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 50:36
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you know, if you have a donor sticker on your license plate, they do the same thing.
• 50:40
  SPEAKER_00: It was still students watching, though.
• 50:41
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't like the whole town was fine.
• 50:43
  SPEAKER_01: Oh no.
• 50:43
  SPEAKER_00: Although, so his execution was January 28th, 1829.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_00: There was at least 25,000 people there ready to watch it.
• 50:52
  SPEAKER_00: 25,000?
• 50:54
  SPEAKER_00: That's a lot.
• 50:54
  SPEAKER_00: That's a lot.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and there were some like small riots breaking out.
• 51:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like it was really like Well, and people were upset that only Burke was the one that was sentenced.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_01: You know, because all these people knew the story, and the newspapers at the time were blowing a lot of these stories out of proportion.
• 51:12
  SPEAKER_01: So at that point, like anyone that disappeared in the last year, they were like, it was because of them.
• 51:17
  SPEAKER_01: So not only were these 16 murders that were already confessed in the the mix, but people started believing that anyone that had left town or disappeared or died in the last year were their victims.
• 51:27
  SPEAKER_01: So people were rioting.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_01: They're like, okay, yeah, you got Burke, but we need hair on there, we need Helen on there, we need Margaret on there.
• 51:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so it was actually really hard for the other three, besides Burke, to like get out of the situation.
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_01: Like, yes, Burke was hanged, but the rest of them, like, their stories kind of died off after this point because you couldn't find them.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like, they tried to escape quietly.
• 51:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we don't think any of them were murdered.
• 51:51
  SPEAKER_00: They even had police protection.
• 51:52
  SPEAKER_00: They had police protection to get out of town.
• 51:54
  SPEAKER_00: The two wives who were trying to leave, both of them separately were almost like mobbed by riots who recognized them and wanted to kill them.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_00: And they had like, it was almost like witness protection program.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_00: Like they had the police had them like hiding.
• 52:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they like planned.
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_01: They're like, okay, the the riot, the mob's gonna come here, you're gonna go out the back window and go to this point.
• 52:16
  SPEAKER_00: And like go to the English border.
• 52:19
  SPEAKER_00: We never heard about hair again.
• 52:21
  SPEAKER_00: No, hair disappears.
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_00: And that's how you gotta do it.
• 52:25
  SPEAKER_00: You just disappear.
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_00: No, I'm we talked about this.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_00: That's how you gotta do it.
• 52:29
  SPEAKER_00: You just gotta leave.
• 52:31
  SPEAKER_00: Don't make a scene like leave without a trace.
• 52:34
  SPEAKER_01: Quietly leave town, change your name, change your haircut, dye your hair, change your clothes, get a dog, get a different dog, everything.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, do whatever you can do to be different because you got off.
• 52:47
  SPEAKER_01: You got off.
• 52:48
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I wait, really quick, I want to like mention this Edinburgh rhyme.
• 52:52
  SPEAKER_01: They have this really cool Scottish rhyme.
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_01: I think do you have it written down?
• 52:55
  SPEAKER_00: I do.
• 52:56
  SPEAKER_00: I saw it written down, it's um on my device here.
• 53:00
  SPEAKER_01: So, as we mentioned, like the the newspapers made a whole thing of all of this circus going on, and people really hated these four.
• 53:08
  SPEAKER_01: And Nox, so I would say five.
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but so there's this really funny like Scottish rhyme where people mention like who's who had what role.
• 53:17
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know the password to my laptop, hold on.
• 53:19
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna take one second.
• 53:21
  SPEAKER_01: Alright.
• 53:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um so the rhyme is Burke's the butcher, Hare's the thief, Nox the boy that buys the beef.
• 53:29
  SPEAKER_01: I like it.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_01: Isn't that funny?
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_01: So this was like again circulating in newspapers because people had all these funny political cartoons at this point of like, oh, like Nox is just this evil guy who's actually pulling the strings.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_01: These two are just dummies doing his dirty work.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_00: I actually saw one political cartoon where it was Nox, but he didn't look like Nox, he was like this weird demon, but he was supposed to be knocked.
• 53:50
  SPEAKER_00: Nox like furry with horns.
• 53:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and there was like a garden of heads, and like the head was like growing and he was out with like his gardening snippers like ready to like.
• 53:59
  SPEAKER_00: I did see that one.
• 54:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and it was like you should post that.
• 54:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's just like this like weirdly.
• 54:05
  SPEAKER_00: I don't ask questions, I just take the heads.
• 54:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he's like, I just grow these body parts for science.
• 54:10
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 54:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and and the there was one more kind of really morbid, well, I guess two more morbid things that happened.
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_01: Only two out of this whole story?
• 54:19
  SPEAKER_01: Probably more.
• 54:20
  SPEAKER_01: No, but at at the end, after he um he being Burke was dissected, I so Professor Monroe, who was the guy that was told that he was going to dissect the um him publicly at the old college, um, he got this quill and he dipped the quill in Burke's blood and he wrote this line.
• 54:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I I don't know the exact words, but it was basically.
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_00: Do you want to say the exact words of what he said?
• 54:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um yes.
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so it says Monroe dipped his quill pen into Burke's blood and wrote, This is written with the blood of William Burke, who was hanged at Edinburgh.
• 54:58
  SPEAKER_00: This blood was taken from his head.
• 55:00
  SPEAKER_00: Ooh, that's so specific.
• 55:02
  SPEAKER_00: What a statement.
• 55:03
  SPEAKER_00: This this blood was taken from his head.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_01: Taken from his head.
• 55:06
  SPEAKER_01: I read that and I like me and Megan were both researching together, and I just go, ooh.
• 55:10
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, well, that's that's kind of a little unnecessary.
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, so they had this this whole thing that was signed.
• 55:18
  SPEAKER_01: So he got off innocent.
• 55:19
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, Knox got off innocent.
• 55:20
  SPEAKER_01: So he got off as innocent, but his career was pretty tarnished.
• 55:24
  SPEAKER_01: Down the tanker.
• 55:25
  SPEAKER_01: Because again, you have to consider that at this time he was one of the leading um, you know, doctors, doctors scientists.
• 55:33
  SPEAKER_00: Ananemon, ananin.
• 55:35
  SPEAKER_00: An animatonist.
• 55:37
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I'll say it.
• 55:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean kind of uh anatomist.
• 55:40
  SPEAKER_00: An anatomist.
• 55:41
  SPEAKER_01: Anatomist.
• 55:41
  SPEAKER_01: So that was my only flubber on a word this whole episode.
• 55:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's pretty good, actually.
• 55:46
  SPEAKER_01: And then better.
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_01: We said Edinburgh correctly, I think, throughout the whole episode, which is which is a win.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_01: I've learned.
• 55:51
  SPEAKER_01: So um anyway, so he was one of the leading, I'm gonna say it wrong now because I have it in my head.
• 55:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's damn it.
• 55:57
  SPEAKER_01: Anamon is HU.
• 56:00
  SPEAKER_01: I had it right.
• 56:01
  SPEAKER_01: He was one of the leading scientists of the body.
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_01: He was a doctor.
• 56:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, up to this point, and you know, was again holding these like two dissections a day, had this room full of students, and he kind of fell off the mat because, again, the general public hated him, thinking that he was this like dark, scary creature pulling all the scre those the strings in this operation.
• 56:23
  SPEAKER_01: So they were like, okay, like we don't like this guy.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_01: So he like ended as a fellow at the college.
• 56:29
  SPEAKER_01: He moved to another city where he like lived kind of a quiet life as a doctor/slash scientist, but he never reached the same level of fame or like notoriety that he had before because people didn't want to see him, they hated him, they were mad that he wasn't on you know the the gallows with Burke.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_00: I get it.
• 56:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, I get it.
• 56:46
  SPEAKER_00: So he faded away, the wives faded away, hair faded, no one knows what happened.
• 56:50
  SPEAKER_00: No one knows what happened to him.
• 56:51
  SPEAKER_00: But what happened?
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I'll say so.
• 56:54
  SPEAKER_00: Burke, as we know, so his body is now owned by science.
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 57:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's on display still.
• 57:01
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not kidding you.
• 57:02
  SPEAKER_00: To this day, you can go and look at him.
• 57:05
  SPEAKER_00: We gotta add it on a stop now.
• 57:07
  SPEAKER_00: He's at the anatomical museum of the Edinburgh Medical School.
• 57:11
  SPEAKER_00: Edinburgh.
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_00: Edinburgh.
• 57:13
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so his death mask is someplace else.
• 57:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, along with a book.
• 57:18
  SPEAKER_00: Mmm, this is cool.
• 57:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's a book, a pocketbook that is bound in his skin.
• 57:27
  SPEAKER_00: So they removed his skin, they tanned it, they turned him into a book.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_00: Which reminds me of the book.
• 57:33
  SPEAKER_00: Burke the book.
• 57:34
  SPEAKER_00: Burke is now a book.
• 57:36
  SPEAKER_01: Ew.
• 57:36
  SPEAKER_01: It reminds me of uh one of our first episodes.
• 57:39
  SPEAKER_01: I think it was our Salem episode of The Witches, uh, and we're talking about Hocus Pocus.
• 57:43
  SPEAKER_01: But in Hocus Pocus, the movie, the spell book they have is made out of human flesh, which is And what is the candle made out of?
• 57:50
  SPEAKER_01: The hat the fat of a hangman.
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_01: The fat of a hanged man.
• 57:53
  SPEAKER_01: But it's like gross that to think that that's actually real.
• 57:56
  SPEAKER_01: Because as a kid, you watch those movies and you're like, ah, that's not real.
• 57:59
  SPEAKER_01: They can't do that.
• 57:59
  SPEAKER_01: No one books out of skin.
• 58:02
  SPEAKER_01: Actually, there's a pub made out of skin, and now there's a book made out of skin.
• 58:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's a I wonder if there's anything written in that book.
• 58:09
  SPEAKER_01: Ooh, that's a good question.
• 58:10
  SPEAKER_00: I wonder how much it costs.
• 58:12
  SPEAKER_01: Can we buy skin books on the market?
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_01: eBay?
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_01: eBay.
• 58:15
  SPEAKER_01: Like we were gonna buy the Romanoff cup on eBay.
• 58:18
  SPEAKER_01: I want a I want a skin book.
• 58:19
  SPEAKER_01: We want a skin book.
• 58:20
  SPEAKER_01: If you have a skin book, you send it to us.
• 58:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um, anywho, I think that's about it.
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_01: That's everything.
• 58:29
  SPEAKER_00: So let's go visit him.
• 58:30
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna go visit him on our tour, our grandiose tour that we have planned.
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_00: Death mask and skin is at the surgeon's museum.
• 58:38
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 58:39
  SPEAKER_00: Surgeon's Hall Museum.
• 58:40
  SPEAKER_00: Cool.
• 58:41
  SPEAKER_00: Skeleton is at the another, so he got all separated.
• 58:44
  SPEAKER_01: We will go all these places and have a drink hang at Maggie.
• 58:49
  SPEAKER_00: One day.
• 58:50
  SPEAKER_01: After COVID, I gotta use all my miles.
• 58:51
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay, okay.
• 58:52
  SPEAKER_00: Before we wrap up, I know we're running out of time here.
• 58:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um kind of a kind of a a quitter quote.
• 58:59
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, we have a quick quitter quo segment.
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's a quick one.
• 59:01
  SPEAKER_00: Just a very quick quitter quo.
• 59:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 59:04
  SPEAKER_00: Say that three times fast.
• 59:05
  SPEAKER_00: I have a question.
• 59:06
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 59:07
  SPEAKER_00: I really think about these.
• 59:09
  SPEAKER_00: I know you do.
• 59:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's a like, which one would you do?
• 59:12
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, quitter quo is a this or that.
• 59:14
  SPEAKER_00: Would you rather?
• 59:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 59:16
  SPEAKER_00: Would you rather have your body dissected by medical students and doctors?
• 59:22
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 59:22
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, maybe not the students, but the doctors.
• 59:24
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, let me see what the professors.
• 59:26
  SPEAKER_00: The professionals, the professors.
• 59:28
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, not the interns, the unpaid interns, gotcha.
• 59:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um, they dissect your body and they find some amazing like medical anomaly.
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_00: Some new theory, some like how to be a big 107.
• 59:42
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 59:49
  SPEAKER_01: That still looks like I'm 23, and they're like, How is this girl 107?
• 59:53
  SPEAKER_01: That okay, yes.
• 59:54
  SPEAKER_00: That sounds like so they dissect you, they have a great discovery, they kind of have your name as a part of that.
• 1:00:00
  SPEAKER_00: But um, your remains are like totally destroyed and thrown out and put down a garbage disposal because it's just like so they're like, they dissected me so much there's nothing left.
• 1:00:09
  SPEAKER_01: There's nothing left.
• 1:00:10
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 1:00:10
  SPEAKER_00: Or um your body is like in that that exhibit of called bodies, where they basically preserve you and you're on display for the next hundred years and you're in a museum, and everyone can walk by and see and be like, whoa, look at that person from 2020, she survived COVID.
• 1:00:31
  SPEAKER_00: And this is what a COVID survivor looks like.
• 1:00:34
  SPEAKER_00: Look at her with her pajamas and her work from home gear.
• 1:00:37
  SPEAKER_00: She's got Starbucks in hand.
• 1:00:40
  SPEAKER_00: Anyways, but nobody knows who you are.
• 1:00:42
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, so it's completely anonymous.
• 1:00:45
  SPEAKER_00: Completely anonymous.
• 1:00:46
  SPEAKER_00: They actually forgot your name, they don't know who you are.
• 1:00:48
  SPEAKER_00: But I'm just like a preserved look how you are, and you're preserved in a museum and you're just traveling around the world and exhibits in exhibits as like the 2020 survivor.
• 1:01:01
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I think I'm gonna go with the first one.
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_01: I think I would like to have my body contribute to some sort of medical breakthrough that influences the lives of tons of people.
• 1:01:11
  SPEAKER_01: And I get to kind of keep my name in the process.
• 1:01:13
  SPEAKER_01: We're like, oh, this is the Elizabeth.
• 1:01:15
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure there's pictures of your face somewhere, whatever you want to call it in the future.
• 1:01:20
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and yeah, I I think I would like the first one.
• 1:01:23
  SPEAKER_01: Even if my body's completely 100% gone, eventually all of our bodies are gonna be gone, no matter how much you preserve them.
• 1:01:28
  SPEAKER_01: But even if you're preserved, eventually, like in 2,000, 3,000 years, it's gonna be gone.
• 1:01:33
  SPEAKER_01: They can't preserve that much, right?
• 1:01:35
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 1:01:36
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just saying, given everything I know about modern science, I'd rather have my body go towards some sort of amazing miracle.
• 1:01:44
  SPEAKER_01: And maybe me have some sort of my name be attributed to it.
• 1:01:48
  SPEAKER_01: No, actually, Megan pointed this out.
• 1:01:50
  SPEAKER_01: She goes, You're a person who's really obsessed with your name.
• 1:01:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, Yeah, I am.
• 1:01:54
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh.
• 1:01:55
  SPEAKER_00: If she sees she can like look at a license plate and be like, okay, if you already move the X and the Y, and then you take out the seven and you move that one over there, and then it basically says E L B A, which is like L black without some of the letters in it.
• 1:02:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I'll be like, what the fuck?
• 1:02:11
  SPEAKER_01: I am, I'm totally weird.
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_01: All your mugs have your name on it.
• 1:02:15
  SPEAKER_01: I heard it's a guy thing to always want to put your name on things, but I'm sorry, it's a me thing.
• 1:02:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like I love I love anything monogrammed and initialed.
• 1:02:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like I would I don't know.
• 1:02:24
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 1:02:25
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry, E B.
• 1:02:26
  SPEAKER_01: E B on everything.
• 1:02:27
  SPEAKER_01: I I'm gonna get my license plate actually probably soon.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_00: You could also get the new happy headed dot podcast license plate frame to put around your.
• 1:02:40
  SPEAKER_01: I like that.
• 1:02:41
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, okay, I same question to you though.
• 1:02:44
  SPEAKER_01: Would you which one would you do?
• 1:02:45
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I kind of want to be different than you, so like you don't have a stubborn-do the same thing.
• 1:02:51
  SPEAKER_00: But I'd rather have my name like go down with science, right?
• 1:02:54
  SPEAKER_00: And like a bigger cause of people.
• 1:02:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think.
• 1:02:56
  SPEAKER_00: Rather than just like being a mannequin on display.
• 1:02:59
  SPEAKER_01: But you're like Lucy, right?
• 1:03:00
  SPEAKER_01: Lucy's the old, what is she, uh not a cave woman.
• 1:03:05
  SPEAKER_00: What's Lucy?
• 1:03:06
  SPEAKER_00: That's the right term.
• 1:03:07
  SPEAKER_00: What I know.
• 1:03:07
  SPEAKER_00: I know what you mean.
• 1:03:08
  SPEAKER_00: Uh animal.
• 1:03:09
  SPEAKER_00: I know uh uh uh hermaph not hermaphrodite.
• 1:03:11
  SPEAKER_00: Homo sapiens.
• 1:03:14
  SPEAKER_01: She's not the first hermaphrodite.
• 1:03:17
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 1:03:17
  SPEAKER_01: No, no, it's her with an H I meant to say Homo sapiens.
• 1:03:20
  SPEAKER_01: I meant to say Homo sapien.
• 1:03:22
  SPEAKER_01: Known Homo sapien.
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_01: But we don't know anything about her.
• 1:03:24
  SPEAKER_01: We just know that we don't even know that that's not even her name.
• 1:03:28
  SPEAKER_01: I doubt she was called Lucy.
• 1:03:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, well, good to know.
• 1:03:32
  SPEAKER_00: Anyways, um Elizabeth Black Eevee.
• 1:03:38
  SPEAKER_01: Eevee, can you say all the things?
• 1:03:39
  SPEAKER_01: Can you just say all my nicknames and acronyms and all El Black O El Black El Negra?
• 1:03:45
  SPEAKER_01: El Negra.
• 1:03:46
  SPEAKER_00: Uh any final words?
• 1:03:48
  SPEAKER_01: Not today.