Latest / Reclaiming Consciousness / Bewitched - Breaking the Spell After Spiritual Mentoring Goes Wrong - Jia's Story

Transcript

Bewitched - Breaking the Spell After Spiritual Mentoring Goes Wrong - Jia's Story · Reclaiming Consciousness

• 0:03
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to Reclaiming Consciousness.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Elise Cassine, trauma and breathwork expert, and creator of the Metamorphosis Method, the only methodology bridging the gap between spiritual healing and clinical trauma work.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: For many years, our consciousness has been hijacked by societal and cultural programming, religion, the media, and familial and ancestral trauma.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_01: In this podcast, you'll discover my unique perspective on trauma healing and how it is the gateway to fully reclaiming your consciousness.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: You'll hear stories and teachings that expand your mind as you discover how every relationship challenge, business block, or limiting pattern is an invitation to reclaim the parts of your consciousness you unknowingly gave away.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: Get ready to go deep.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: Now let's dive in.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_01: Hi everyone, welcome back to the show.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_01: So we are on episode three of our Bewitch series.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I just want to say, you guys, I am like so happy with the response.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_01: And it just like makes me overwhelmingly happy because so many of you have been reaching out, saying how much this resonates with you, saying how you had the same experience.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_01: You thought it was just you that were putting words to something you felt.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, whether or not you worked with this coach, because I know some of you have, or you had a similar experience with a coach, or you just had an experience with somebody in your life.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: I just think this conversation is so important and I'm loving it.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I just wanted to remind all of you guys that Robin and I are going to be doing an episode recap every Monday on Instagram live.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_01: I will announce the time, just check my stories.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: But if you can't join us live, then you can just DM me whatever question you have, or if there's something you wanted us to address in the recap, or if there's something you wanted us to expand on, just send me in a DM or just join the live and you can ask your questions on the live.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: But we really want to bring you all into the conversation because I just think this conversation is so important.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I just love this so much.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_01: So this week you're gonna hear from Gia and her story is really incredible because you know, she came in to work with Betty kind of more towards the end.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_01: It was right before this big retreat.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_01: And her story is gonna blow your mind.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_01: It was like it's a lot.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: So just buckle up, and I know you're gonna really enjoy this episode.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_01: I can't wait to hear your thoughts, your questions, your comments, because Gia is an incredible human being and she tells her story so eloquently, and she has a lot of insights to share as well.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_01: Just a couple of quick things.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_01: We have the bonuses on the mothership.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: $2,500 in bonuses, you guys, ending tomorrow.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_01: So when you join the mothership, which is my 12-month membership mastermind, which includes all of my programs, trainings, masterclasses, everything I do basically, other than the certification, you are included in it when you join the mothership.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_01: And you get access to exclusive things that I do only for the space.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm doing a mastermind called Zone of Genius in April, where I work with you very closely to help you uncover and develop your own unique zone of genius and have the ability and confidence to take action on it in the world.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_01: And that is something I usually charge about$4,000 for.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_01: It's yours absolutely for free when you join the mothership.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I do at least two of those experiences a year and also just a lot of really deep support throughout the year.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_01: And the ladies who are in it right now, they just continue to blow my mind every day with what they're creating and the changes that are happening in their lives.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_01: So this is a great time to join the mothership because you get a private breathwork session with me, which is like something I never really offer.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: So to have me and you in a breath work session, you will walk away completely changed.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: And then we have a private trauma clearing roadmap session where I pinpoint your core wound and literally create a roadmap for you to navigate, dissolving it, moving forward in your life.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: And then you also get an extra month when you join.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_01: So you can either have your last month for free or we can spread your 12 payments over 13 months so that your payment is less.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_01: So this is such an amazing time to join.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's normally$555 a month.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: But if you did want to spread your payments over 13 months, it's then 513 a month.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_01: And for what you're getting, it's insane the value because you get so much digital content that you can binge every single day that you will have hours and hours of your time filled up by all the digital content.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_01: And then you also, like I said, have access to everything I teach live.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_01: Plus, you get a group coaching call once a month.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_01: You get a group breath work session once a month, live breath work session taught by me or one of my Metamorphosis Method certified breathwork facilitators.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_01: And we have a telegram chat where you get coaching and advice from me daily, Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, Friday.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: So, like this is a full proximity, all access path to being in my world and creating the permanent transformation that you know you desire and deserve over 12 months.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_01: Because I have to say, if you really want the real thing, committing to this work long term is the way to go.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_01: All of my clients who've committed to this work long term are the ones who create the most significant permanent transformation and the results they really desire in their businesses, their careers, and their relationships.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: So we'll link that below.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_01: Please reach out if you're interested.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_01: Also, for those of you who are currently in the metamorphosis, uh, you can apply what you paid for the metamorphosis to joining the mothership.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_01: Definitely don't sleep on that opportunity.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_01: Reach out to me, we can chat, and I'm so excited for you to hear this episode with Gia.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_01: Hi, everyone, and welcome back to this special episode.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_01: So today, Robin and I are here, and we are speaking with Gia.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm really excited to have Gia here.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: Gia, I'm just very excited to see you.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_01: But we are gonna be talking about Gia's experience with the coach, Betty, that we've been talking about.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_01: And Gia is here to share her story, her perspective, her experience.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_01: And she's an incredible woman, human being, and all of the things.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_01: But I'm just really excited to have her here, Gia.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much for such a warm introduction, I'm gonna say.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_02: And thank you so much for having me on the show.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_02: I can't wait to dive deep into my experience with Betty at both sites and locations.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_02: So let's get rolling.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_01: Let's do it.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_01: So maybe we can just start from the beginning.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_01: What was your beginning experience with her?
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_01: And how did you get into this world?
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_02: Right from the start, when I went to Santa Fe with the entire group in the beginning, I was very naive, very, very naive.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_02: I had actually done a Goshic Record course through one of her consultants.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_02: I signed up for her newsletter because I wanted to keep tab of who this person was.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_02: I'd never heard of her before until I learned the Akashic Records.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_02: And the manual was of hers.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_02: So I started just following her on her newsletter, weekly newsletter stuff.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_02: And literally two weeks later, she posts this thing about doing a retreat in Santa Fe.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_02: And at that time, I was like, screw it, I have nothing to lose.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_02: I just left my corporate job.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_02: I'm excited.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_02: I learned the Akashic Records.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_02: I would love to go on this retreat and have this experience.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_02: I thought girls' trip.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna be honest, I was so naive.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, yay, girls' trip, we'll go meditate in the mountains, we'll sink to trees, la la la la la.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_02: Like I was that naive.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_02: And behold, she puts us in that Facebook group all together, everyone that's gonna be attending their retreat and stuff.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_02: And I see your name, I see Robin's name, I see multiple other powerful women who's I've been following on social media, I've read their books, like I'm super I'm fangirling at this little point.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_02: And I get shook in my core a little bit.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, wait, what kind of retreat is this?
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_02: Why are all these like spiritual leaders that are highly acknowledged in their field attending this?
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_02: So she must be someone because she's their mentor.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_02: So immediately that kind of brought me in like on a very high trust level.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_02: Because without doing further research or questioning things, I think I just assumed, oh, all these successful people are a part of her community and she's their mentor.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_02: So she's the reason why they're successful.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_02: I think I just put those dots together and connected them and just thought, yeah, I'll be successful too.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_02: Not doing again the research or further questioning.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_02: I end up in Santa Fe and everything there went down.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_02: And again, I'm still very naive.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_02: When we walk into that room, I remember, you know, she's speaking about being a walk-in.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't know what that term even was.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_02: I had to come back home that night and Google it because I had never heard of it.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_02: But I'm standing there and I'm looking at a room full of brilliant women.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, okay, it's just me.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not at their level.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm just not understanding what's going on.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_02: It's real, like it's happening.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_02: Like I can see it, I can sense it, I can feel a vibration rising in my body.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_02: So this is all real.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_02: Again, went home super naive and just believed everything I saw.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I have a question for you.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_00: When you were in Santa Fe from just from day to day, what was it just objectively like for you?
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_00: I love how you talked about how you that's part of social influence, isn't it?
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: To look around at who's following who's with the leader and make assumptions.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: So that's one piece.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: But for you day to day, what was it like to be with all of us and to be part of that experience and say at that time?
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, still till this time, it was life-changing.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_02: Because first of all, I had never seen women support women like that.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_02: I had never seen people being so selfless before with each other.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_02: We were all like sharing water bottles at this point, like we're just being ourselves weird.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_02: And I had never been in a room where you were allowed to be wacky and weird, right?
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_02: Where I was like, oh, like I already know what you're gonna say.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_02: And it was like, oh yeah, that's you're telepathically communicating to us.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, oh, these people get me.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_02: So I think I felt very comfortable and I felt like this was a community because I felt so seen and understood the way I've never had in my life.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_02: So I took everything very seriously that was happening there.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_02: On the day-to-day as well, being in that experience and being a part of the larger group, in my brain, I kept feeling.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_02: I think these are the words.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_02: If I want to really make this 3D, like I found family, sisterhood, like I found woman I can relate to, I can be myself with.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_02: So I felt very welcomed and warm.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_02: And on the day-to-day, I was always very, very excited to come see everybody, be with everybody.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_02: But it was also very interesting at the same time because I could see everyone being supportive of each other, everyone trying to look after each other and all of that.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_02: But now when I look back with the awareness I have now, Betty was taking full advantage of our kind hearts and how giving we were.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_02: And she was that taker element.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_02: She kept taking from us all the time.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_02: Can you give an example of that?
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_02: Like I've acknowledged now and I've come back that because you know, I went down a spiral.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, oh my gosh, why did this have to happen to Gia?
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_02: Poor me.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_02: Like I was sabotaged.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_02: I'd had that whole inner dialogue come out, right?
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_02: After the truth was exposed.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_02: But when I go back and look at Santa Fe, she was making everyone else work in the room and she wasn't doing anything herself.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_02: I remember her, like Elise would be like, oh, I got this download.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_02: And she would try to compete almost.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I got this too.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, me too.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_02: And she really wanted to be that chosen person.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_02: Like, she's the walk-in, and we're all there to serve her.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_02: I remember just her pointing at people.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_02: Like she'd make us sit in a circle and point at people and be like, Oh, yeah, like, what are you getting on this?
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_02: What are you getting on this?
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_02: What are you getting on this?
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, now I look back, I'm like, we were doing all that so-called channeling.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_02: She wasn't doing anything.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_02: She just wanted us to serve her, pamper her, like a cult leader, pretty much, right?
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_02: Like, she's the savior, she's the ideal person and so forth.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_02: She wasn't getting no downloads, she wasn't holding the highest frequency, she wasn't doing anything at all.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I just think I, in the comfort of being held and seen and understood so deeply, and her being the host of the retreat, I just assumed once again that it's all her.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_02: I forgot to look around the room and be like, wait, but this information came from so and so, and this information came from so and so.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_02: No information came from her.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_01: So I just want to like interject because I think what you're saying is important.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I think, like, first of all, even though like I get what you're saying, and I I have felt that way too so much.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_01: It's a lot of making everyone else kind of work, but at the same time, it still was all about her, everything being oriented towards her.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_01: But also, and I think in your defense and everybody's defense, like when you go into a situation and you feel so good and like you feel so held and you feel so seen and so supported, that feeling is not wrong because we're all there and we all are supporting her and each other, right?
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_01: So that's not wrong.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_01: So this is where, and Robin and I have been talking about this, the nuance comes in because it's hard to just say this was bad because there were a lot of really good things about it.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's not like she's just like this evil person that you somehow got drawn into.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_01: There's good things and there's reasons why.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_01: So that's like the nuance of the conversation that makes it so much harder to process.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_02: I agree.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like she was so good at giving people delusional level of confidence.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_02: That's the best way I can think of it.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_02: She made you delusionally think that you were all of this.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_02: She gave you even like a new name, a new identity, and really tried to go deep and deep into that and awaken your gifts and activate you.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_02: And these are the grids, and this is where you come from and so forth.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_02: It made you delusional.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_02: It made you think, like, yeah, I'm invincible and everything's gonna be okay.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_02: And to your point, it did serve in a really odd sense.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_02: It did because it gave enough confidence.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_02: Well, in my experience, it gave me enough confidence to level up and move away from things because I was just so delusional in my confidence, right?
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_02: I just thought this is great.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_02: Like I'm channeling this, I'm doing this.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, it's gonna be fine, it's gonna be fine.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_02: And it was fine.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_02: Because again, this person did have a lot of spiritual law knowledge, and universe delivers who we are, right?
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_02: If we keep telling ourselves, convincing ourselves that all our body and our vibration that I am this, I am this, you become that.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_02: It's universal law.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_02: So I think she had that understanding, which did serve to a certain level, right?
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, she was great at bringing people together.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_02: So you networked a lot, you met amazing women a lot, right?
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_02: You built a community out of the community.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_02: So good did come out, but I have to say, she was really, really good at pumping up the ego and getting you really delusional about confidence to really attain certain goals in life.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_01: So, can you give an example, like from your experience of how she gave you that like delusional confidence so people know what you're talking about?
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, she honestly, I don't know what her issue was, or maybe she had a childhood trauma.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not sure, but she did not like women being in romantic relationships.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_02: And this has nothing to do with business, by the way.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_02: Like, she's presenting herself as a business coach, but she wants to talk about everyone's like boyfriend, husband, partner, family, like deep relationship stuff.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_02: Even as I remember, 90% of my conversations in her one-on-one container would be relationship-based.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_02: They were not even business-based.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_02: And she's like, Oh, your relationship is leaking in your business.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_02: So she really convinced me of things and she really tried to sabotage my relationships.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: And I would be freaking out, my core would be shaken.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_02: And in Santa Fe, both of you were present there actually.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_02: You saw my epic meltdown.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_02: She really broke me into pieces and made me vulnerable for that.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: Can you tell us about that moment?
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_00: Because to me, that was the question I was gonna ask is when did you experience or recognize that you were being subjected to some unethical psychological practices?
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that this really illustrates it for me.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: But I would love to hear from you what was your experience like with that?
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: It feels like it was a turning point for you.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_02: It was.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_02: I think again, when I went to Santa Fe, I was super naive.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_02: Like she had bought my trust and loyalty right off the bat because I saw the community.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_02: I forgot who she was, and I went basis of that.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_02: So when we're sitting on top of that hill, and she literally tells me life-breaking news, this is not the person you're supposed to be with.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_02: And I didn't ask anything.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_02: We were just sitting on a hill, minding our business, and she literally and I truly believe when she had her walk-in experience, I was her first target because it was the next morning.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_02: And she, like, I was sitting right across her, and she just pointed right at me, unprovoked, and said, Oh, your partner is running towards you.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_02: And I was very confused.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, I don't understand.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_02: I'm with someone that I love and I'm going to be getting married to this individual soon.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_02: And she said, No, he's not your partner.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_02: And again, I was so deep in with my trust and loyalty.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_02: I had an epic breakdown on that mountain, and I believed her, and she made me so vulnerable.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_02: And she brought even more of my trust in.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_02: She took me to the side after, started feeding me like honey and like telling me all these things, like it's okay.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_02: And she started giving me information, like, because I thought she was psychic, right?
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_02: Intuitive and all of that.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_02: And she's like, Oh, don't worry about it.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_02: Your new partner is coming, he's right around the corner, and he's this and he's that, and started like painting a whole new image for me.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_02: Again, I didn't ask her.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_02: I was broken.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_02: I was just bawling, sobbing.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, Oh my god, what's going on?
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_02: How is this possible?
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_02: I was a mess.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_02: And she took full advantage of that vulnerability of mine in my mess to plant even further seeds.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_02: And she gave me that again, that delusional confidence.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_02: No, no, no, don't look at this paint.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_02: This is your past.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_02: Let go, let go.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_02: It's not serving you.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_02: Look here.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_02: This is your future.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_02: And she would paint this beautiful delusional picture and have you fully lean into that picture, but it was just an illusion, it never existed.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_02: So, again, talking about delusional stuff too.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_02: She was planting a lot of seeds in my head that was making me feel crazy, even with the business.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_02: I honestly, now I look back, yeah, I changed my business name and I offered new things.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_02: I added stuff, but I never practiced like her.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_02: I actually never did any of her copies.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_02: I never took any business advice from her.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like that's exactly why I still have my clients and I still have a business because I didn't listen to her business advice.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know what it was, it would just fly over my head.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh, she had me so looped around in chaos energy about my relationships.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_02: And it wasn't just romantic, it was a relationship to myself as well.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_02: You're not being who you're meant to be, you're not enough.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_02: She always kept me in lack mentality, but using words like, oh, abundance.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_02: If you do this, this will make you more abundant.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_02: And if you do this, this is a way to be a millionaire, this is a way to be a billionaire and this and that.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_02: But she imprinted and planted seeds of pure lack in me.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_02: You're not there yet because you're doing this.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_02: But I'm not judging you.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_02: How is that not judgment?
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_02: That is pure judgment.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_01: I just want to say, and Robin, I'd like your take on this, just based on the conversations that Robin and I have had already on the podcast.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_01: I think anyone who's listening will be able to draw the parallels between everything Gia has shared so far and everything we've shared.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: Especially around the creating a divide between you and the people closest to you, which is like a classic tactic.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_01: And then also planting seeds of you're not enough, or you'll get there when you change this thing that literally has no answer or no way to change.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_01: Let me ask you this: when she told you you needed to change something, did she ever show you how to do that or walk you through what that process was?
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_02: No, she just would say stuff and be like, oh, no, I'm not responsible.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want, I don't take responsibility.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I'm not your mother.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: And that to me was like the thing that causes crazy making because then you're like chasing your tail, trying to figure out, like, oh, how do I change this thing that literally has no answer?
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_01: And to me, that was one of the most unethical, harmful things to do to somebody.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_00: I want to go back to the hillside where she revealed that your partner was not your partner and the wail that came up from your core and reflect that in that moment that was a trauma response.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: And then what happened on the other side of that was a trauma bond that was formed as she was comforting you and so on.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_00: But the divisiveness of that is something that we can pay attention to in the themes that are emerging as we do these interviews.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_00: Because it's one thing to say that maybe your partner isn't the right partner for you if you've got a long time experience with somebody, or if you want to have a heart-to-heart conversation with somebody about something that might be deeply affecting your life.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_00: On the other hand, with something like that, the way that it came out for me was like out of the blue.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_00: And now knowing she didn't know you beforehand, this is the first time she would have met you.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_00: And to do so in a public forum as well is the other piece for me that has that tinge of ethics involved as well.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_00: So those are a couple of things that I wanted to reflect back.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_01: I just wanted to say, too, in the energy of just the parallels and the patterns in Santa Fe, I watched her do that to two other people, one around her relationship and the other one around where she was supposed to live, which were extremely destabilizing for both people.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_01: And the other piece of this that I think is very important that you said, Gia, is that you didn't ask.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_01: You came into this in a relationship engaged, and you weren't asking if this was the right person for you.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_01: This was not a problem in your life that you needed support with or that you were asking to solve.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: And that to me is where the real problem comes in.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_01: Because as a practitioner, as a trauma expert, if someone's not bringing forward a problem, then you're not going to put that out there as a problem unless you're seeing how it somehow reflects something else or whatever.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_01: But that's a whole other thing.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's the part that really is big for me is the fact that you did not ask and now you're being totally thrown in this direction that is extremely destabilizing to you.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like she, I don't know how to put this in exact words, but I feel like when she would do things like that, like just plant seeds out of nowhere and make you go crazy because you're not understanding, you can't comprehend it.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_02: It's very random, it's not even relevant to you.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_02: It's completely off topic or whatever.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_02: She would throw it on you, literally throw it at you, and then again be like, I'm not responsible.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_02: Because information came through me, I'm not responsible.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_02: And it's like you've made a major investment in this person.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_02: You've given them trust, loyalty, your money, everything.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_02: So now, how do you argue?
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_02: How do you talk back?
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_02: What do you say?
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_02: Like for me, that was a big thing.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_02: Like sometimes my head would go, W T H, what is this?
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_02: But then I didn't have I don't know what it was.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_02: I was I had given up so much of my sovereignty to this person.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't have the power in me to be like, but wait, hold on.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_02: What about A, B, and C, or what about this?
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_02: Or I disagree.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I for some reason felt like I couldn't do that.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_02: I just she had bought such of my trust.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_02: And even with the responsibility thing, she would gaslight you back.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_02: If you asked her a question, she'd be like, Oh, but you didn't do your research.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_02: Why are you coming to me?
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_02: You're gaslighting me, but she'd actually be gaslighting you in those questions.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_02: So she never answered a question.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_01: I want to talk about for a moment, because this is another pattern, is not feeling like you could say anything back.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_01: And and Gia, just like from knowing you from the time that I do, you do not strike me as the type of person that's afraid to speak her mind.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_01: That's not the type of person you are.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: So for someone like you to feel like you weren't able to speak your mind, like what do you feel like happened for you, other than you saying, you know, you gave her your trust and everything, but what was that like for you?
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: And did you think about speaking your mind, or was it something that just was completely just blocked and you felt like you couldn't do it?
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_02: I felt really blocked, if I'm if I'm being really frank.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like the reason why I felt like that and I didn't want to leave her was because I just felt like number one, she'd tell you that you're doing things wrong and take time.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_02: So you want to stick with the plan, also.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_02: But I also felt like she had convinced me so deeply that I was so different from everyone around me and from my family and friends, and I couldn't relate to anybody outside of her circle.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_02: So she had convinced me so deeply of that.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_02: And I just felt like, oh, if I leave, like, where will I go?
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_02: Who will understand me?
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_02: What's gonna happen?
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I've made so many changes already in my life.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_02: How am I gonna go back?
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_02: Like, how am I gonna explain this to family and friends?
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_02: There was a lot of stuff, but I think truly, like my answer is that she had convinced me that I was so unique and so different, and I would not be able to relate to anybody else.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_02: And a lot of people in my life had to go because of that.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_02: So the isolation, a completely isolating me away from my loved ones.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_00: Again, another pattern that we have seen, I was reflecting that when we get a bunch of people who are highly open to experiences from a psychological perspective, personality-wise, and then we get them in a place out of time, in other words, a place that's different from any place you've ever been, and we form bonds and we calibrate to each other, and then there's a crisis that shows up.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_00: It could be the crisis of somebody external.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_00: Remember in my episode, I talked about how one of the first things I wrote down when I got to Santa Fe was beware of the charlatans and the frauds.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: And that was something that immediately came forward in a triangulation.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_00: It was us against them, it was us against him in that particular circumstance.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_00: And so then we have this heightened arousal of fear, worry, concern, fighting for something different than what anyone else in our circles can relate to.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_00: And now we have this sort of insulated group of people who rely on each other.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_00: So we're already in an altered state of consciousness anyway.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_00: And then we have these heightened situations that create the conditions for us to even be more suggestible, more appliable in our consciousness.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_00: And that's when consciousness gets hijacked.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_00: And GF, you know, and you and I, I think we should do an episode of our Croatia trip because you and I had a lot of experiences there.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_00: But I think that when you're in that situation for an extended period of time, it becomes very easy to stay there and to make sense of things given the circumstances.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not until you step away from it and you come back into your, I'll say, normal state of consciousness that you can start looking and seeing what even happened.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's what we're trying to do here is figure out what happened, why it happened, and how can we prevent it from happening to ourselves again, but for other people as well.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I think the part about like convincing you that you were so different, I think that that is such a powerful manipulation tactic because for most of us, we did feel like we were different and we felt ostracized or isolated in certain ways throughout our whole lives because of that.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_01: So her saying that really kind of like played into a wound and also giving you a way to heal that wound, but it was in this like very manipulative way that was actually not going to serve you.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_01: So it's it's like she played on this like soft spot or this wound within you to manipulate you into stay on the roller coaster ride with her.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_00: I want to say, too, that we are quite different.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_00: Psychologically, I've tested a lot of us with my personality profile.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_00: And statistically, we are quite unique.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_00: That group was quite unique in terms of openness to experience and the capacity to alter consciousness.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_00: It is a group of spiritually intelligent leaders, and also there was consciousness hijacking going on that we were not aware of, primarily because we're benevolent, kind, helpful people who want to do good work in the world.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that those are mitigating factors that we have to consider.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_00: So, for people who are listening, it's we can't look at this and say, why didn't you say something then?
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_00: Or why did you stay in it?
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_00: There are a lot of pieces to this puzzle, and there are a lot of layers that we're unpacking.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_00: And at least back to your point at the beginning, not all of it was bad.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_00: One of the gifts of being in this community was you guys for me.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's just unfortunate that, as I said, it's it can be expensive to have your consciousness hijacked.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_01: So I would like to keep like going with the trajectory of for you.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_01: Is there anything else you want to share about that retreat in Santa Fe?
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_01: And then also what changes did you make in your life after?
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_01: What started to happen for you after that?
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think of course I came back, I revamped my entire website and everything because she had given me a whole new identity and a whole new name, which is true.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, I am connected to the water element, but I'm still a Gia.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_02: But she, of course, tried to disassociate us from ourselves so she could do what she wanted to do.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_02: But I think the changes I made after Santa Fe and the year up to going to Croatia was I was so manipulated in her tactics and her ways.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_02: I did let go a lot of people.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_02: I did because I felt like, oh yeah, okay.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_02: And sure, it wasn't again to our point earlier, we had made it wasn't all bad.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_02: There were things in my 3D that needed a clear up, needed a renewal, needed refreshing, which took place.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_02: Like me and my partner were still together.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_02: And if that's not evidence of him being my partner, then who is?
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_02: Like after going through this whole renewal process with me, that's what I've been calling it now, because we went together for eight years now.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, there were things that were in love, things are wonderful, a little nitty-gritty stuff, whatever that needs a bit of a cleanup, regular relationship.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_02: But I think following from that, the biggest change I made was people, like my relationships and even relationship with myself.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_02: I remember every time I wanted to tune in or connect, I wouldn't call on Gia.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_02: I would call on agua.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_02: I would call in her inverted sense of water.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_02: And we all know this.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, mother agua is a word for sure.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_02: Agua is this beautiful Spanish word for water, and there's nothing wrong with that, but it's mother ocean.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_02: And she had inverted that connection for me too.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_02: So I was meditating, I was tuning, I was doing a lot of things with water, I changed my entire business, I changed my appearance, I had changed my routine, I had changed the way I spoke, and I was basically channeling from her inverted portals because I didn't have the correct information of my ability and I was given a completely wrong name of things.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_02: And this is very difficult for me to say because I publicly put myself out there and I was still connecting to my clients, and I'm so grateful that again, I took none of her business advice.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_02: So none of that leaked into my business or my clients' lives.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_02: My clients are thriving, they're doing great.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_02: And every day I'm very thankful for that because, like I said, I changed my appearance.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_02: I stopped cutting my hair.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_02: I just thought it would have to look like the ocean because she would convince me of that.
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_02: Wavy hair, like you have to look more like Mother Agua, this and that, and so forth.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_02: And I believed her.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_02: So I made a lot of changes there.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_02: I made a lot of changes with people, my business, all of it.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_02: And like I'm saying, it wasn't all bad, but it was heavily controlled, it was heavily influenced.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_02: I wasn't being myself.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_02: So there was that element, and like I said, I'm very grateful that she did give me the gift of my connection to water and being able to channel from mother ocean and the seas and so forth and all of that, but she inverted that too.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_00: She gave me a whole wrong name for it.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_00: How is it inverted?
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_00: I was going to say, because I've known you, Gia, and you and I have had so many precious to me experiences.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_00: And so, can you dive a little?
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: Do you like how I just did that?
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_00: Dive a little deeper into this.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_00: From your perspective, how do you make sense of that when you were talking about the inverted portals and that kind of thing?
• 36:28
  SPEAKER_02: So, what I realized is after the whole awakening process in the year of 2024, after Croatia coming back and disconnecting completely and getting back in my body and bringing my identity back as Gia and being Ken to Gia's body.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_02: Now, when I tune in to the energetics of water, even I do use the term mother agua still, because agua is still a word, right?
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_02: Just in Spanish.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_02: So I still use that.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_02: But the energy flow and the information is completely different.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_00: That's what I was looking for because my experience of you with Mother Agua is quite pure.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I just want to share that as well, because I didn't experience you as having distorted energy.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_00: But to your point about it being heavily controlled or influenced by a leader's perspective on you and that kind of thing, I think that that is the thing that stands out for me.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_00: Does that make sense, Elise?
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, I think that what you said about feeling like you had this whole other like identity or something, that's the thing that I feel like is the most important highlight because it's, oh, because she tells you that you're like this thing, then all of a sudden you have to take on that role.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I totally agree with you about the business stuff.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_01: I did not listen to pretty much any of her business advice because it, none of it resonated with me.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I thought it was kind of like like it felt felt like it was from an old person.
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know how to describe it.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not trying to be rude, it just that's how it felt.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_01: I totally get that.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_01: But I think again, what we're seeing is like taking like the seed of what was true for you, right?
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_01: And then inverting it or manipulating it to kind of like have control over you, or you you give your power away to how she sees it, which I started to see more and more and more as we came out of that retreat and like how things progressed after that.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, and maybe we can move into the next experience, unless there's anything else you want to say.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_02: No, I think I'm good with Santa Fe.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: Bye-bye, Santa Fe.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_00: Bye-bye.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_00: So flash forward to summer of 2024, there's an announcement for a new retreat.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_00: This time it's in Croatia.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_00: So tell me about your decision making with regard to that trip.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_02: When you had announced that you would like to interview me on the podcast and and so forth, I I had to really sit down and think about the entire experience all over again.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_02: From a fresh eyes and perspective, of course, because now I'm not like my nervous system is relaxed.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_02: Now it's not hijacked when I first had to reflect on it.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_02: And then I realized I never wanted to go, and I told her I'm not going because I was in her groups.
• 39:22
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't remember.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_02: She had so that's the other thing too.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_02: When you signed up with her, she made sure to put you in every goddamn group.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_01: It was the most confusing thing ever.
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how many fucking groups?
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like, sorry, I just once I get started on my like rants, like I can't.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_02: I just okay, I'm gonna No, I think it's great because I just look back and I'm like, why was I so invested?
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_02: Like she was really grabbing my attention and energy all the time.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, this group is having a live meeting now, this group is that, and they'd be hours long, hours long talking about like grabbing attention and resource and energy.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my goodness, she knew how to do that for sure.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_02: But so anyway, she put you in all these groups, right?
• 40:05
  SPEAKER_02: So we're having a group call and whatever.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember the day before this call, I sat with one of my friends who's a part of this beautiful community, and she also went to Croatia with us.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, I saw Betty's advertisement, and I just think I'm not gonna go because in that price, I can backpack Europe in that price.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_02: Like I'm gonna expand my wealth.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_02: And my friend was like, That's great, that's amazing, what a great idea.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_02: You should totally go for it.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_02: And then the next day I get on the call, and before getting on the call, I did this meditation just to relax myself.
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_02: And and I'd opened my agashic records, and some force of energy had come through the agashics, and it was a big figure, a big energy.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember I couldn't fully see it, like I couldn't make eye contact with it almost.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_02: And I just thought, what is this?
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, okay, whatever, it's probably one of my guides.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_02: I don't need to explore this.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_02: I closed my records.
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_02: That being never left.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_02: And throughout the day, I would feel it around me all the time.
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_02: I asked its name, I I try to communicate, it would not.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm just like, okay, whatever.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_02: We'll just Palisanto my house, and this is right.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_02: I just kind of avoided it.
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_02: What was the energy of that?
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_02: It was very masculine, it was very big, it was very tall, it was a dark figure, and I could only see it from the corners of my eyes.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_02: I could never directly see it, and it would whisper things to me.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I got in a really like heated argument with my parents over silly stuff.
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_02: It was over dinner, it was very, very silly.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember just feeling that big, like massive, like pulse of energy come through of that being behind my literally my right shoulder.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_02: I could feel it standing there.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_02: And it said, Oh, your contract with your parents is over.
• 42:01
  SPEAKER_02: This relationship's done.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember I kept ignoring it because I'm like, I don't know if I'm making this up.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if this is actual being.
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I don't know what the what is going on.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_02: So I just kept using crystals and a bunch of sage and clearing myself out because I'm like, I don't know what this is.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_02: However, on that call, the group called, like a day or two later, again the call, and she immediately looks at me and she goes, Gia, what's going on with you?
• 42:28
  SPEAKER_02: So, of course, I trust her.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_02: She's my spiritual mentor.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_02: I tell her about this very spiritual, odd experience I'm having.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, I opened the records, a being came through, I can't get rid of it.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_02: What the heck is this?
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_02: If you can pick up on this.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_02: And she said, Oh, this is a divine deity from the water is calling you to Croatia.
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_02: Give me a fucking break.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_02: That's a manipulation.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_02: And I looked at her and I went, Oh my gosh, I have to go.
• 42:59
  SPEAKER_02: I'm from the water, of course.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_02: Like she knew I would say yes to that.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_02: I would never because I felt responsible.
• 43:05
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, yeah, like I'm the guardian of the water.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_02: Of course I'm the we all are guardians of the water.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_02: But I'm like, oh my gosh, sure.
• 43:10
  SPEAKER_02: And she's like, Oh, I need someone to fly in with.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_02: I can't fly alone.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_02: And we can go together because we live like in the same city.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_02: And she said that I have a special offer for you.
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna boxer you later.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I got excited and she gave me like a price, like a very low discounted price to go with her.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_02: And she was gonna cover my flights and cover my stay and whatever it was, my meals.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_02: And why would I say no to that?
• 43:37
  SPEAKER_02: So I got on board.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_01: That's funny because I had a similar experience, not a similar experience, but when it came to the Santa Fe retreat, I didn't want to go.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I said I wasn't gonna go, and I got a different version of manipulated into going.
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_00: So here we go with another pattern, another parallel.
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_00: I remember getting the information about.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_00: About the Croatia retreat and having a dual experience of knowing that I was going, but also not wanting to go.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_00: And in fact, I remember I had to, there's a whole lot of disruption in how I even got my flights, and there was all of this wobbliness.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_00: And then I was talking to other people who were saying the same thing.
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_00: And there we went off to Croatia.
• 44:25
  SPEAKER_01: So then can you take us through that experience of going with her?
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_01: And then what are some of the things that happened while you were there?
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_01: Because I know this was a big moment in the trajectory of this whole thing for you.
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know what tactics or spell casting she knows or is aware of, or whatever is happening there, like spiritually, I'm speaking about, because I'm very comfortable in flights.
• 44:55
  SPEAKER_02: I go to sleep on flights, no problem.
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_02: I don't care, whatever it is.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_02: She had already started to make me paranoid on the plane.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_02: What was she saying?
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_02: We got on our flight.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_02: She had booked like the premium cabin or whatever it was to go in because she needs to relax.
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm very grateful.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_02: I'm very grateful.
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_02: I've never flown, like I've always gone economy, and I was so grateful.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, oh my gosh, I kept thanking her for the experience.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, I can't believe like I manifested this.
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you, thank you.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_02: And she's all no, no problem, sweetheart.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_02: We're on the flight, and it's a direct flight.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_02: And it was about, I think, 10 and a half hours long.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_02: She didn't let me sleep.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_02: There's another pattern.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_02: Sleep deprivation.
• 45:39
  SPEAKER_00: What was she doing for 10 and a half hours that created the conditions for you not to be able to sleep?
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_02: She kept sharing old stories between her and why she doesn't take men clients anymore.
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_02: And she kept asking me about my real estate profile.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_02: She would ask me about my relationship with my partner.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_02: She just kept asking me really personal deep questions.
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_02: She was asking me, like, oh, where are you gonna move now?
• 46:02
  SPEAKER_02: You have to leave your house.
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_02: It's not for you.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_02: And even like the people on the flight, right?
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_02: She was so mean and rude with them.
• 46:11
  SPEAKER_02: And she had already started to cause paranoia.
• 46:14
  SPEAKER_02: Like she went to the bathroom, came back, and she was like, Oh, look at that woman.
• 46:18
  SPEAKER_02: Look how she's standing.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh, she's like blocking the way.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_02: She has no self-awareness, this and that.
• 46:24
  SPEAKER_02: Like she was gossiping about people on the flight that were just being normal people.
• 46:28
  SPEAKER_02: Like this woman was getting up in the aisles to stretch.
• 46:31
  SPEAKER_02: It's normal.
• 46:32
  SPEAKER_02: People do that, right?
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_02: And she was like, Oh, look, see, like people are so weird, this and that.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_02: Like she was making me judge people with her and adding a sense of paranoia.
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, look at this guy.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_02: He looks like, you know, this and that and whatever.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_02: And she gossiped so much on the flight, like, even about her own community members.
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_02: She's like, Oh, do you talk to so and so?
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_02: What is your relationship with this?
• 46:59
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, see, I knew her.
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_02: I don't like her.
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_02: She she's one of them, she's one of this, and one of that.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_02: She was like labeling people like ridiculous names.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_02: And she was telling me to unfriend them and block them, which I did not do.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_02: And I had Wi-Fi on the flight, but I just pretended like I couldn't connect.
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, oh, I'm so tired.
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know what's going on with my phone.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_02: I just totally brushed her off.
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_02: Because why would I block and delete these people?
• 47:25
  SPEAKER_02: They've done nothing bad to me.
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_02: And again, she's doing all of this, and I'm thinking, I'm not doing that.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_02: My brain's active, but she didn't let me sleep.
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_02: So by the time we landed, I was a little dysfunctional.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you were sleep-deprived.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_02: And she continued to feed all this nonsense to me about people and labels, and it was making me paranoid.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_00: I want to hop forward to meeting you guys on the rooftop that first night.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_00: Do you remember that?
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_00: Because Elise, this is where we left off on my podcast, and I don't know where this is gonna go, but I remember meeting you two up there and her seeing that drone over on the side of the building and being absolutely convinced that it was penetrating her, watching her there for her.
• 48:13
  SPEAKER_00: So, what do you remember about that moment and anything around that time?
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_02: I remember thinking they're shooting a commercial.
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_02: It's for the commercial.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_02: And I said that a couple of times, like, oh yeah, there were models here, like they're they're advertising their rooftop bar and stuff, right?
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_02: And every time I would say that, she would override it.
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_02: Like, no, no, no.
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, see, they're watching us or spying us, look at the red eyes on the draw.
• 48:35
  SPEAKER_02: It's not eyes, they're damn lights.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_02: But she would she would be like, look at the red, like red eye dragon, look at the red eyes, they're spying on us, they're doing this and penetrating.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_02: And all I remember is again, she was trying to cause paranoia.
• 48:49
  SPEAKER_02: And she would literally look at me or you or anyone else that was present there and to be like, Oh, tell it to go away.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_02: Like she wanted us to use our abilities and make it go away because it was disturbing her, it was an interference energy, how she labeled it.
• 49:05
  SPEAKER_02: But she was causing paranoia.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_02: That's what she was doing.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_02: She was like, or being watched.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_01: This is like the thing.
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_01: I know I said this before in the other shows.
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not saying that like evil doesn't exist in this world because we know that it does.
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not saying that people can't use drones to watch people or for nefarious reasons.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_01: However, what she's doing is again crazy making, because you guys clearly see there's a commercial being shot there, which is a very obvious reason for there to be a drone.
• 49:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yet she is giving you this other story that you're being watched, which I think then set the scene as I've heard it for the entire thing to create more and more paranoia that some kind of mysterious enemy is out to get all of you, which ended up making everyone completely insane.
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_00: Listen, as a therapist, I can't say that we were insane, but it definitely altered consciousness.
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_01: You feel like you're spinning out and going crazy, not like you're actually insane, but you it makes you feel that way.
• 50:12
  SPEAKER_00: For sure.
• 50:13
  SPEAKER_00: Gia, I'm glad to hear this part of the story because I didn't know going what happened on the flight, but now it helps me make sense that this high level of paranoia, generating paranoia among the community, was starting all the way on the flight, even before the retreat had started.
• 50:32
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_02: And I would love to add that her partner is a very simple and lovely man.
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_02: And he drove us to the airport together, and he's just being himself, very simple, very sweet, very helpful.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_02: He took, he didn't let me carry my own luggage.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_02: He kissed her goodbye.
• 50:49
  SPEAKER_02: He was super sweet.
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_02: He's like, Call me when you get there, please.
• 50:52
  SPEAKER_02: So I know you're safe, have a great flight.
• 50:54
  SPEAKER_02: I love you, I miss you, I can't wait to see you.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_02: That whole thing, right?
• 50:58
  SPEAKER_02: It was it was beautiful.
• 50:59
  SPEAKER_02: That was heartwarming.
• 51:00
  SPEAKER_02: And as we're walking to the airport, I said to her, I'm like, oh my God, he he's really sweet.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_02: He loves you so much.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_02: You're so blessed to have this person in your life.
• 51:09
  SPEAKER_02: She goes, Oh, he doesn't know what's coming for him.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna have to leave him.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, Oh, I'm sorry to hear that.
• 51:17
  SPEAKER_02: Again, like my brain, I was like, What?
• 51:20
  SPEAKER_02: Why?
• 51:21
  SPEAKER_02: He totally aligns with you.
• 51:24
  SPEAKER_02: You want to do this, he's allowing you.
• 51:26
  SPEAKER_02: You guys seem to be on the same page.
• 51:27
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I don't, I just my human brain really struggled at that point because all I felt was love and care for her coming out of him.
• 51:37
  SPEAKER_00: And she was like, No.
• 51:38
  SPEAKER_00: So you felt love and care coming out of him.
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_00: Let's contrast that.
• 51:41
  SPEAKER_00: What was coming out of her?
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_00: Judgment, hate.
• 51:45
  SPEAKER_02: It was very like, oh, he's not enough for me.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_02: I'm doing better, like, very like in her ego, very in her ego.
• 51:53
  SPEAKER_00: So objectively, Gia, over the course of those days that you were in Croatia, what happened just from an objective sitting around talking to Elisa and me?
• 52:05
  SPEAKER_00: What happened down?
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_02: This is how I've been explaining it to myself and like to family and friends.
• 52:13
  SPEAKER_02: There was a psychotic breakdown that happened from her end, her part.
• 52:18
  SPEAKER_02: She had a psychotic meltdown.
• 52:20
  SPEAKER_02: She really convinced herself of her like her stories, and then just tried to implement them onto us and imprint them.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_02: And they were happening.
• 52:30
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna say for me for sure, I was totally convinced because again, you're not sleeping, you're not eating, right?
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_02: Your nervous system's completely hijacked, you're dissociated, you want to feel safe, you want to feel comforted.
• 52:43
  SPEAKER_02: And she's the she's telling you she's the only person that knows the truth.
• 52:47
  SPEAKER_02: I know what's going on, I know the truth.
• 52:50
  SPEAKER_02: Look at them closely.
• 52:51
  SPEAKER_02: Do you see them under their masks?
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_02: Can you see them?
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_02: Look at how their body is, how this is, they're after us.
• 52:57
  SPEAKER_02: All these names that she was giving people, and it didn't stop at strangers.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_02: She started labeling our family members.
• 53:03
  SPEAKER_02: And I do feel like she didn't realize that she crossed the line there because people got very uncomfortable and people started to question her truth.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_02: Because if she's coming up to you and saying, Oh, your husband is this and this, or your mom and dad, you're like, What?
• 53:17
  SPEAKER_02: I grew up with these people, I know these people.
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_01: Can I just ask, did anybody push back on her during the time that you were there?
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna say yes, but it was done very silently because they didn't voice it and say, No, I disagree with you, but they had their faces on, like, what the fuck is going on here?
• 53:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm gonna say it was about two of them that while we were there present, they caught on really quickly.
• 53:46
  SPEAKER_02: And they were newer to the community.
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_02: They I think they met her in person for the first time.
• 53:50
  SPEAKER_02: I think they were six months in or something, but they didn't say anything because, and now they later on told me because I was like, Why did you guys tell me that this is not what it looks like?
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_02: And they were like, we were so scared that the entire group would turn on us because everyone was so under her spell.
• 54:07
  SPEAKER_02: So we were scared to say something and then be a target and possibly be at risk for life.
• 54:13
  SPEAKER_02: So, like, we thought it was better to just let this play out, and we were relieved that everyone was gonna go home and be safe, and then we would see how things are working out.
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_02: And if you guys come to your own conclusion or we should break the ice or what that was going to be, but two people that were present there, they did pick up very quickly that she is pure bullshit.
• 54:34
  SPEAKER_01: And then can you explain what happened with everyone deciding to go home early?
• 54:39
  SPEAKER_01: So it was supposed to be 10 days, and everyone went home after five.
• 54:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's right.
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_02: I remember that night, like when we made the decision to fly out of there, my body was shaking uncontrollably.
• 54:52
  SPEAKER_02: I couldn't stop shaking, and I wasn't allowed to show that.
• 54:56
  SPEAKER_02: I wasn't allowed to say that because she had given me, oh, you have the commander energy, Gia.
• 55:03
  SPEAKER_02: You're strong, you're the warrior.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_02: So now you can't show vulnerability, you can't show you're scared.
• 55:09
  SPEAKER_02: And she wanted me and I think three other members that were there to protect her, to guard her, to escort her to the bathrooms, to escort her to her room and guard because she needed protection because people were after her and we had these abilities and we could see things and do things, and we were her bodyguards pretty much.
• 55:27
  SPEAKER_02: And I really feel like she was harnessing a lot of our energy too.
• 55:31
  SPEAKER_02: She 100% was, because why keep us so close?
• 55:35
  SPEAKER_02: You're telling me you couldn't find anyone else to fly in with.
• 55:39
  SPEAKER_02: Why, Gia?
• 55:40
  SPEAKER_02: Why are you honing into Robin?
• 55:42
  SPEAKER_02: Why are you speaking to Elise?
• 55:44
  SPEAKER_02: Like she was definitely trying to harness parts of our abilities and gifts for sure because she has none.
• 55:49
  SPEAKER_02: And to keep whatever she's hosting alive in her because it's feeding off of this light.
• 55:55
  SPEAKER_02: But I feel like that night when we all decided to leave, for me, I just knew I couldn't do this anymore because my nervous system, and I literally I remember this inner voice coming out and going, your nervous system's hijacked, hijacked, not dysregulated.
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_02: It said, it's hijacked, go home.
• 56:15
  SPEAKER_02: She wanted me to go on an extra journey with her because she told everybody she could not go home because there's a so I don't even know what she said.
• 56:25
  SPEAKER_02: She said so many names.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_02: I can't even recall.
• 56:28
  SPEAKER_00: She was afraid that of what was going to meet her at customs.
• 56:33
  SPEAKER_00: That's what she was afraid of.
• 56:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_00: So that that was the rationale for please come with me.
• 56:40
  SPEAKER_00: She didn't even say please, let's be honest.
• 56:42
  SPEAKER_00: But it was more just this expectation that there would be those of us around who had abilities who would be there for her to help her.
• 56:50
  SPEAKER_00: And again, out of the for me, I had been in her spaces for literally years, and I was concerned about her, just from a person-to-person level.
• 57:02
  SPEAKER_00: And also there were those layers of consciousness hijacking and altered consciousness and lack of sleep and lack of access to food and water and all of those things that create the conditions to just go along with it.
• 57:15
  SPEAKER_00: What was waiting for her?
• 57:17
  SPEAKER_01: Was that ever clear?
• 57:19
  SPEAKER_01: Or is that just supposed to be this, like again, mysterious like enemy or something that is out to get her?
• 57:25
  SPEAKER_02: She was so paranoid.
• 57:28
  SPEAKER_02: She literally thought, to Robin's point, like she needs someone at customs.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_02: She thought the military was after her or something.
• 57:35
  SPEAKER_02: And she had convinced herself that they had been watching her since the day she was born because they want her powers.
• 57:42
  SPEAKER_02: That's the story that she gave to herself and then articulated to us, right?
• 57:48
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, the military's been watching her, she's always been spied on.
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_02: And if she goes home, who knows what they're gonna do to her?
• 57:54
  SPEAKER_02: That was her like story that she had convinced herself of.
• 57:59
  SPEAKER_02: And again, she kept saying that she knew the truth, and everything that was happening around us was just an illusion.
• 58:05
  SPEAKER_02: And we couldn't believe anything if there was no evidence or things like that.
• 58:09
  SPEAKER_02: So the paranoia level, too, amongst us was very, very high because of that.
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_02: And we just for me, I felt, oh, I should stay connected to her and so forth because she knows the truth and she can save me.
• 58:21
  SPEAKER_02: And because she had built us up to that level of convincing us that she can provide safety.
• 58:27
  SPEAKER_00: I've been using the word psychodrama for this because there's a whole storyline here that could make a really good like children's adventure book like Percy Jackson or Harry Potter, truly.
• 58:42
  SPEAKER_00: And while I was there, Gia, you might have had this too, but because I'm a writer, I'm just like I'm watching this play out in the physical.
• 58:51
  SPEAKER_00: But meanwhile, in my brain, I'm writing this whole story from the mythology and the imagination part of it.
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's quite fascinating when we look at it that from that perspective.
• 59:03
  SPEAKER_00: However, when we get to psychological safety, when we get to ethics, when we get to just how you treat another human being, those were the things that I think, in the in the midst of the heightened awareness of differences and being paranoid about everyone is out to get you and those kinds of things that got lost in the storyline.
• 59:27
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 59:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's a keep thing.
• 59:29
  SPEAKER_02: She was telling stories.
• 59:31
  SPEAKER_02: They're just stories that she was telling herself and then projecting them onto like the group and convincing us.
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_02: And I can't speak for the group, but I was totally buying it because I haven't eaten, I'm so sleepy, I'm tired.
• 59:43
  SPEAKER_02: Clearly, I'm special and unique.
• 59:45
  SPEAKER_02: So I can't go to my family and relate with them and go to my partner and relate with them because she had convinced me of that too.
• 59:51
  SPEAKER_02: So I felt isolated.
• 59:53
  SPEAKER_02: I felt if I don't stay connected with this community and her, I'm done.
• 59:57
  SPEAKER_02: I might die out there.
• 59:59
  SPEAKER_02: So when you got on the plane to go home, what shifted?
• 1:00:03
  SPEAKER_02: I took the flight back with one of the girls that was there, and I flew in home with her actually.
• 1:00:10
  SPEAKER_02: It was so funny because we had a connecting flight.
• 1:00:12
  SPEAKER_02: We couldn't get a direct one.
• 1:00:14
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember as soon as I landed, I took a sigh of breath.
• 1:00:18
  SPEAKER_02: Like I immediately felt like I could sleep here.
• 1:00:20
  SPEAKER_02: And a big bus went by, and there was a like an advertisement on the bus, and it said, now you are free.
• 1:00:27
  SPEAKER_02: And that's how my guides talked to me.
• 1:00:29
  SPEAKER_02: They talked to me through like billboard, signs, magazine, movies, music, and numbers, like entertainment stuff.
• 1:00:34
  SPEAKER_02: And I just thought, oh, okay, I'm safe, I'm fine.
• 1:00:37
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember sleeping in a very long time, very comfortably, and feeling safe and guarded.
• 1:00:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I think what shifted for me was because I came home, I slept.
• 1:00:50
  SPEAKER_02: I slept, I rested, I ate, my nervous system was able to regulate.
• 1:00:55
  SPEAKER_02: I had much more clarity.
• 1:00:57
  SPEAKER_02: And I had a week of that.
• 1:00:59
  SPEAKER_02: And I met my partner, and he was deeply concerned for me.
• 1:01:03
  SPEAKER_02: And I really regret not listening to him.
• 1:01:06
  SPEAKER_02: I still apologize to him sometimes here and there.
• 1:01:08
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, I'm so sorry.
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know where my brain went.
• 1:01:11
  SPEAKER_02: I lost my mind.
• 1:01:12
  SPEAKER_02: I'm so sorry for all the secondhand trauma you have because of me, because it was traumatic for my partner as well.
• 1:01:18
  SPEAKER_02: He witnessed all of it, right?
• 1:01:19
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember him.
• 1:01:21
  SPEAKER_02: He was he was driving me back to my parents' house, and he said, gee, I think you're in a cult.
• 1:01:26
  SPEAKER_02: He goes, please listen to me.
• 1:01:28
  SPEAKER_02: He goes, Why can't this woman take herself to a damn airport?
• 1:01:31
  SPEAKER_02: He goes, Is she does she not have legs?
• 1:01:33
  SPEAKER_02: I don't understand.
• 1:01:33
  SPEAKER_02: Is she handicapped?
• 1:01:35
  SPEAKER_02: Like he was like, What's what are the physical disabilities here?
• 1:01:38
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, Oh, she's not disabled, she's just not here, she's not in her body, she has someone else in her body.
• 1:01:42
  SPEAKER_02: And he's like, What the heck are you saying?
• 1:01:44
  SPEAKER_02: So I had reality checks, even though I was not listening to them, but they were still being told to me.
• 1:01:50
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like a part of me was kind of like, Wait, okay.
• 1:01:54
  SPEAKER_02: And he even said to me, He goes, Gia, I want you to go see a psychiatrist because I want you to get checked out to see if you're bipolar.
• 1:02:01
  SPEAKER_02: And he didn't say this in a way like, oh, you're crazy.
• 1:02:04
  SPEAKER_02: He meant like he was so worried for me because he's like, It's been a year.
• 1:02:08
  SPEAKER_02: I've been watching you, you're not acting like yourself.
• 1:02:10
  SPEAKER_02: He goes, Why is your voice changing?
• 1:02:12
  SPEAKER_02: It's creeping the shit out of me.
• 1:02:14
  SPEAKER_02: Everything is really weird about you.
• 1:02:15
  SPEAKER_02: You need to go see a professional for this, and you need to leave this cult.
• 1:02:20
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, Oh, okay, I'll see, I'll see.
• 1:02:23
  SPEAKER_02: I come home, I open my phone, and on WhatsApp, I have 12 messages from her.
• 1:02:28
  SPEAKER_02: She wouldn't let go.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_02: Every hour, she was sending me a voice note to update me on what's happening, how things are going, and how she's on the run and whatever, right?
• 1:02:37
  SPEAKER_02: Crazy stories again.
• 1:02:39
  SPEAKER_02: She wouldn't let me connect to my present reality.
• 1:02:42
  SPEAKER_02: She was trying to keep me hooked into her nonsense.
• 1:02:46
  SPEAKER_02: Even like my parents, I remember coming home and they looked at me and they said, What's wrong, Gia?
• 1:02:52
  SPEAKER_02: What happened?
• 1:02:54
  SPEAKER_02: Like people were very deeply concerned about me.
• 1:02:58
  SPEAKER_02: And I, again, to a certain level, I feel like even though I wasn't listening at that time either, I was very like, no, you don't know the truth, my God.
• 1:03:05
  SPEAKER_02: I was freaking out.
• 1:03:07
  SPEAKER_02: That reality checks helped me because I did start to question then.
• 1:03:12
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, Yeah, like, why are there only 12 people chosen on the planet?
• 1:03:16
  SPEAKER_02: The planet's huge.
• 1:03:17
  SPEAKER_02: I did have those like questions.
• 1:03:19
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, there can't be just 12.
• 1:03:20
  SPEAKER_02: There has to be a lot more of us.
• 1:03:22
  SPEAKER_02: I started to kind of do that, but again, every hour she was feeding me nonsense through WhatsApp.
• 1:03:28
  SPEAKER_02: And then following a week later, she's like, Oh, come to this place and fly me back.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_00: This place where I had been with her for the week, trying to figure out how to assist her in getting back home and that kind of thing.
• 1:03:44
  SPEAKER_00: So by that time, you'd had a week out, and then she reached out to you and said, Please come.
• 1:03:50
  SPEAKER_00: So you came.
• 1:03:50
  SPEAKER_00: Thank God.
• 1:03:51
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for coming, by the way.
• 1:03:53
  SPEAKER_01: Can I just ask one thing as you're telling this?
• 1:03:56
  SPEAKER_01: Can you just say, like, when she asked you to come, like what happened for you in that moment?
• 1:04:02
  SPEAKER_01: Because I'm sure it was a struggle.
• 1:04:04
  SPEAKER_02: It was because my partner was against it.
• 1:04:07
  SPEAKER_02: I had done so much damage to him as well, emotionally, because again, him witnessing this, right?
• 1:04:13
  SPEAKER_02: And we're trying to rekindle and reconnect, and I'm a mess and whatever it is, right?
• 1:04:18
  SPEAKER_02: A bunch of stuff going on.
• 1:04:20
  SPEAKER_02: And I tell him that I'm gonna be flying to a certain place to go get her.
• 1:04:23
  SPEAKER_02: And again, he's like, Why aren't you listening to me?
• 1:04:26
  SPEAKER_02: He's like, give me a break.
• 1:04:28
  SPEAKER_02: I'm telling you the truth that this person is trying to ruin your life.
• 1:04:34
  SPEAKER_02: Again, I'm gonna ask you the same question I asked you before, Gia.
• 1:04:37
  SPEAKER_02: What disability does she have that she can't board a flight on her own?
• 1:04:41
  SPEAKER_02: And he just kept asking me those questions and I fought him.
• 1:04:45
  SPEAKER_02: And also, I realized now when every time you bought something from her, like a package offering her service, or she wanted me to go to Croatia with her, and now, like this, she would give you so many gifts.
• 1:04:58
  SPEAKER_02: She would pay for stuff, or I'm gonna give you an extra program you can be a part of.
• 1:05:03
  SPEAKER_02: She'd really loop you in, even to where she said, come pick me up from this place.
• 1:05:08
  SPEAKER_02: She's like, Come, it'll be so much fun.
• 1:05:11
  SPEAKER_02: You mean Robin will go see, you know, this site, and we'll go see this site and we'll have fun.
• 1:05:17
  SPEAKER_02: I just thought, oh, another girl's trip for free.
• 1:05:20
  SPEAKER_02: Cause she offered to pay for my flight and my stay and so forth.
• 1:05:24
  SPEAKER_02: So I again, once again, under the spell casting, I'm gonna say, ignored my poor partner, got on the flight, and went for the weekend.
• 1:05:34
  SPEAKER_02: And oh boy.
• 1:05:36
  SPEAKER_02: So I had a week away from her, even though on WhatsApp she was keeping me hooked in.
• 1:05:40
  SPEAKER_02: I remember landing.
• 1:05:42
  SPEAKER_02: I couldn't look her in the eye.
• 1:05:43
  SPEAKER_02: I was scared of her.
• 1:05:45
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know what happened to me.
• 1:05:47
  SPEAKER_02: I was scared of her.
• 1:05:48
  SPEAKER_02: I wasn't looking her in the eyes.
• 1:05:50
  SPEAKER_02: Her body felt so cold when she hugged me, too.
• 1:05:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I just thought, who is this?
• 1:05:56
  SPEAKER_02: Where am I?
• 1:05:57
  SPEAKER_02: Like I kind of felt confused.
• 1:05:59
  SPEAKER_02: And that night.
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_02: Again, she kept taking my relationship and still convincing me that this is not my partner.
• 1:06:07
  SPEAKER_02: And how I'm behaving as a woman is wrong.
• 1:06:10
  SPEAKER_02: She just kept going on it, pointing, and I couldn't look her in the eye.
• 1:06:14
  SPEAKER_02: I was so scared of her.
• 1:06:15
  SPEAKER_02: And I kept looking down.
• 1:06:17
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, hmm-I was just going, hmm, whatever.
• 1:06:20
  SPEAKER_02: Then I went to go sleep in like those pull-out couches in the living room areas of the hotels.
• 1:06:25
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't sleep all night because I felt like she was jumping on me the entire night, and I could hear laughter.
• 1:06:32
  SPEAKER_02: Like she was like someone was mocking me and jumping on me the entire night.
• 1:06:36
  SPEAKER_02: I remember praying.
• 1:06:38
  SPEAKER_02: After a very long time, I called in God.
• 1:06:41
  SPEAKER_02: I said, I don't know if this is her or what this is.
• 1:06:45
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not sure.
• 1:06:46
  SPEAKER_02: Get it away from me.
• 1:06:47
  SPEAKER_02: I barely slept, woke up next morning.
• 1:06:49
  SPEAKER_02: We were going to go see horses.
• 1:06:51
  SPEAKER_02: Went to the horses, incredible beings.
• 1:06:55
  SPEAKER_02: Even though we were not so aware of what was going on exactly.
• 1:06:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, talk about having a hard lesson, by the way.
• 1:07:02
  SPEAKER_02: Like I was told repetitively what was going on.
• 1:07:04
  SPEAKER_02: I just kept ignoring it.
• 1:07:05
  SPEAKER_02: What were you told was going on?
• 1:07:07
  SPEAKER_02: Like my partner kept telling me.
• 1:07:09
  SPEAKER_02: Like, yeah, remember, even when I was in her containers after Santa Fe, and I would listen to her like voice notes that she would send me on Facebook or whatever.
• 1:07:16
  SPEAKER_02: And he'd be like, Don't play these voice notes near me, Gia.
• 1:07:20
  SPEAKER_02: He goes, I don't like her voice.
• 1:07:21
  SPEAKER_02: She sounds like a narcissist.
• 1:07:23
  SPEAKER_02: He goes, Don't play that shit near me.
• 1:07:25
  SPEAKER_02: He'd always say that to me.
• 1:07:27
  SPEAKER_02: And I just like, oh, you don't know.
• 1:07:28
  SPEAKER_02: You're not special.
• 1:07:29
  SPEAKER_02: You're not unique.
• 1:07:30
  SPEAKER_02: You're not chosen.
• 1:07:31
  SPEAKER_02: She convinced me of that, right?
• 1:07:34
  SPEAKER_02: Now I laugh about this stuff, but it was it was hard for my partner to see me like that.
• 1:07:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:07:39
  SPEAKER_02: So going back, we were at the horses, and I remember there was a point where she's obviously acting like she's so intuitive.
• 1:07:46
  SPEAKER_02: She knows the horses.
• 1:07:47
  SPEAKER_02: The horses love her and like she's telling us all this stuff, whatever.
• 1:07:51
  SPEAKER_02: We all know Robin's a horse person.
• 1:07:53
  SPEAKER_02: Like, just call that out right now.
• 1:07:55
  SPEAKER_02: We all know Robin is a horse person, okay?
• 1:07:58
  SPEAKER_02: But she was totally trying to always take the thunder away from Robin.
• 1:08:03
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna say that for sure, because I noticed that the entire trip.
• 1:08:07
  SPEAKER_02: Even in Santa Fe, I noticed that.
• 1:08:09
  SPEAKER_02: She would either put Robin to work or try to outshine her in a certain way.
• 1:08:13
  SPEAKER_02: So she was competing with Robin, and I feel like she was competing with a lot of us actually, because she wanted to outshine us.
• 1:08:19
  SPEAKER_02: So in horses field, of course, like she has to be the best, like she's the know it all, whatever.
• 1:08:24
  SPEAKER_02: There came a point where we met a herd, I think it was a Spanish herd, ancient Spanish herd.
• 1:08:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I looked and she was standing in the middle, and the horses had gone into a meditative state, and they'd made a circle around Betty.
• 1:08:39
  SPEAKER_02: The horses had pushed Robin to the other corner, and they had built like a wall around her.
• 1:08:44
  SPEAKER_02: And Robin's, of course, braiding their mane, having fun with them.
• 1:08:48
  SPEAKER_02: I noticed I was on the other side in the other corner, and the horses had built a wall around me, too.
• 1:08:54
  SPEAKER_02: They were trying to protect me and Robin from her.
• 1:08:58
  SPEAKER_02: And they were giving us messages and things, which, again, at that time we could not perceive well, but now I understand them very clearly what they were trying to tell me.
• 1:09:06
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember coming home that night, and all I could feel were the horses around me shielding me the entire night from her.
• 1:09:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I slept like a baby that night because inside I was scared.
• 1:09:18
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, I don't want to sleep.
• 1:09:19
  SPEAKER_02: What if she's gonna come jumping on me?
• 1:09:22
  SPEAKER_02: It was weird.
• 1:09:23
  SPEAKER_02: I came home, she wouldn't stop.
• 1:09:26
  SPEAKER_02: Like I bought her home, she wouldn't stop.
• 1:09:28
  SPEAKER_02: She carried that same paranoia, judgment, behavior.
• 1:09:32
  SPEAKER_02: She just kept judging people, gossiping, whatever it was.
• 1:09:35
  SPEAKER_02: Every hour she was sending me updates on WhatsApp.
• 1:09:38
  SPEAKER_00: So you left, you flew back, she's still paranoid.
• 1:09:42
  SPEAKER_00: Then what happens when you land and you're I land, and her husband comes, picks her up.
• 1:09:47
  SPEAKER_02: My parents are there to pick me up.
• 1:09:49
  SPEAKER_02: And again, very lovely man.
• 1:09:51
  SPEAKER_02: He bought her a really beautiful bouquet of roses, and he bought her a bag of favorite chips, all of that beautiful stuff.
• 1:09:58
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a sucker for those things.
• 1:09:59
  SPEAKER_02: That's love to me.
• 1:10:00
  SPEAKER_02: You you show deep care like that.
• 1:10:02
  SPEAKER_02: And she came home after a very long time.
• 1:10:05
  SPEAKER_02: He hugged her, he was squeezing her very tightly, like, oh, I missed you, I loved you.
• 1:10:10
  SPEAKER_02: And she has her hands just up in the air.
• 1:10:13
  SPEAKER_02: Like she's not even embracing him back.
• 1:10:16
  SPEAKER_02: And she's making faces like, oh my god, they're suffocating me, let me go.
• 1:10:20
  SPEAKER_02: My parents hugged me, I hugged them back, whatever.
• 1:10:22
  SPEAKER_02: And they took me to a really bomb Indian restaurant because they're like, You're so skinny, we're worried about you.
• 1:10:27
  SPEAKER_02: Please eat something.
• 1:10:29
  SPEAKER_02: Because when we were in Croatia, I lost eight pounds in five days because of the all that hyperactivity of everything.
• 1:10:38
  SPEAKER_02: Came home, whatever, and it continued for another week.
• 1:10:41
  SPEAKER_02: She made groups of us on WhatsApp and she wouldn't stop pumping information out of her stories.
• 1:10:48
  SPEAKER_02: Every hour update, oh, this is happening, that's happening.
• 1:10:51
  SPEAKER_02: Every hour was a different story.
• 1:10:53
  SPEAKER_02: She wasn't letting us regulate and digest information, and she was boom, boom, boom, just going at it back and back.
• 1:11:00
  SPEAKER_01: Can you give an example of what she was saying, just so people can like understand?
• 1:11:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I can imagine, but for somebody that can't, what was one of these messages?
• 1:11:10
  SPEAKER_02: Honestly, I can't even remember fully because she would literally message me and be like, Oh, give me an update on your relationship, give me an update on your parents, what's happening?
• 1:11:20
  SPEAKER_02: Are you feeling safe in your home?
• 1:11:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I'd I'd be like, Yeah.
• 1:11:23
  SPEAKER_02: And that's the other thing, too.
• 1:11:25
  SPEAKER_02: When I came back home, I was like, no one's watching me.
• 1:11:28
  SPEAKER_02: What is she saying?
• 1:11:29
  SPEAKER_02: No one's following me.
• 1:11:30
  SPEAKER_02: I don't have cars up my ass.
• 1:11:32
  SPEAKER_02: Like, nothing is going on here.
• 1:11:34
  SPEAKER_02: Like the things she was saying.
• 1:11:35
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I don't get it.
• 1:11:36
  SPEAKER_02: So she'd be like, Are you safe?
• 1:11:37
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, this happened today in my backyard.
• 1:11:39
  SPEAKER_02: No one ever comes to my property.
• 1:11:41
  SPEAKER_02: It's really remote.
• 1:11:42
  SPEAKER_02: But today, randomly, two women are walking there.
• 1:11:44
  SPEAKER_02: So I sent my husband outside to go yell at them.
• 1:11:47
  SPEAKER_02: They're watching me.
• 1:11:48
  SPEAKER_02: Like, she was just crazy.
• 1:11:50
  SPEAKER_02: Like stories of that kind of a line, and they would change every hour.
• 1:11:55
  SPEAKER_02: Then she'd be like, Oh, my mom called me, and I had to tell my mom that I'm not participating in this and that, like, too much, way too much stimulation.
• 1:12:03
  SPEAKER_02: And she always wanted, again, from Santa Fe, she wanted other people to channel for her.
• 1:12:09
  SPEAKER_02: So she was voice noting people that stuff too.
• 1:12:12
  SPEAKER_00: Can you talk about that for you?
• 1:12:14
  SPEAKER_00: Because I think this is another pattern to illustrate something about her asking you to channel some things about something that ended up online.
• 1:12:24
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 1:12:24
  SPEAKER_02: She wanted me to channel like universal laws, divine orders, and all these things.
• 1:12:30
  SPEAKER_02: They do exist.
• 1:12:31
  SPEAKER_02: We live in a world where there's laws and orders and whatever.
• 1:12:34
  SPEAKER_02: I would channel.
• 1:12:36
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, I'm streaming light consciousness.
• 1:12:39
  SPEAKER_02: She can't do that.
• 1:12:41
  SPEAKER_02: So she needs people like me and the community she's built for that.
• 1:12:45
  SPEAKER_02: I would channel for her.
• 1:12:47
  SPEAKER_02: And even on the flight back, she kept making me channel.
• 1:12:49
  SPEAKER_02: And her biggest thing that she made me channel was money.
• 1:12:53
  SPEAKER_02: Gia, how can I make more money?
• 1:12:55
  SPEAKER_02: Gia, can you channel my business plan?
• 1:12:57
  SPEAKER_02: Gia, can you channel?
• 1:12:58
  SPEAKER_02: Can you open the gates of money for me, of wealth?
• 1:13:01
  SPEAKER_01: Wait, I'm I'm just getting clear now.
• 1:13:03
  SPEAKER_01: Who's paying who here?
• 1:13:05
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 1:13:05
  SPEAKER_02: Bingo, there you go.
• 1:13:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because I channel water.
• 1:13:09
  SPEAKER_02: Water is abundance, it's infinite, it's everything, it's a luxurious, it's obulence, all of it.
• 1:13:16
  SPEAKER_02: And she used that to her benefit.
• 1:13:18
  SPEAKER_02: And I would, like an idiot, I would channel the whole flight back, actually.
• 1:13:22
  SPEAKER_02: She kept making me channel her new business plan, all of this and that.
• 1:13:25
  SPEAKER_02: She just kept making me channel money and business stuff for her.
• 1:13:29
  SPEAKER_02: And I also realized, damn, I'm good at this.
• 1:13:31
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe I should be doing this business too.
• 1:13:33
  SPEAKER_02: I had that thought come up too.
• 1:13:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so that's happening.
• 1:13:36
  SPEAKER_02: And then I realized after like I woke up, the hypnosis came off, I'm gonna say.
• 1:13:41
  SPEAKER_02: I went back on her Facebook, and all the stuff she was posting was everything I had channeled.
• 1:13:49
  SPEAKER_02: Those were all my words, and then I made connections.
• 1:13:52
  SPEAKER_02: Every time she posted about the sun, it came from Robin.
• 1:13:56
  SPEAKER_02: Or anytime she posted about the body, it came from so-and-so.
• 1:13:59
  SPEAKER_02: She was posting copies and selling offerings based on what other people were channeling.
• 1:14:06
  SPEAKER_02: So she was basically stealing our work and our information and our sacred information, I'm gonna say, that we'd shared with her in confidence, whatever.
• 1:14:14
  SPEAKER_02: And she was making it public.
• 1:14:16
  SPEAKER_02: Talking about hijacking consciousness and abilities and sabotaging, manipulating, the whole thing was there for that.
• 1:14:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we've touched on that too.
• 1:14:26
  SPEAKER_00: So we know that that's a pattern.
• 1:14:28
  SPEAKER_00: So, Gia, as you sit here now, what have been some of the long-term effects of this experience that you've had over the last couple of years?
• 1:14:36
  SPEAKER_02: I've just learned the power of consent, self-autonomy, and sovereignty.
• 1:14:42
  SPEAKER_02: Doesn't matter who's channeling what, even that word channel now, I take it very lightly.
• 1:14:47
  SPEAKER_02: Because I'm like, okay, that's great.
• 1:14:49
  SPEAKER_02: That's information that you are accessing.
• 1:14:51
  SPEAKER_02: That's your truth.
• 1:14:52
  SPEAKER_02: Congratulations.
• 1:14:54
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't have to be mine type of energy.
• 1:14:56
  SPEAKER_02: That's how I flow.
• 1:14:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's perspective.
• 1:14:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 1:14:59
  SPEAKER_02: Bingo, there you go.
• 1:15:00
  SPEAKER_02: I think the long-term stuff for me is stay in your body, Gia.
• 1:15:04
  SPEAKER_02: Never ditch yourself.
• 1:15:06
  SPEAKER_02: Because I ditched myself.
• 1:15:07
  SPEAKER_02: That's exactly what's just chaos and mess happened.
• 1:15:10
  SPEAKER_02: I forgot me.
• 1:15:11
  SPEAKER_02: I forgot to listen to myself.
• 1:15:13
  SPEAKER_02: I had suppressed my own sovereignty, self-autonomy, my own intuition on many levels, not all levels, but many levels.
• 1:15:21
  SPEAKER_02: And I had allowed a stranger to come in and dictate my life.
• 1:15:25
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm very guarded now as a result.
• 1:15:30
  SPEAKER_01: For you, what was the point where you were like, I'm done?
• 1:15:34
  SPEAKER_01: And how did that happen for you?
• 1:15:36
  SPEAKER_02: We landed back, we're home.
• 1:15:38
  SPEAKER_02: She's still continuing her WhatsApp nonsense, whatever.
• 1:15:41
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm trying to be normal now.
• 1:15:43
  SPEAKER_02: Cause I'm like, you know what?
• 1:15:44
  SPEAKER_02: Whatever happened, happened.
• 1:15:45
  SPEAKER_02: Let me try to like just relax my nervous system because I can't have my nervous system hijacked like that ever again.
• 1:15:51
  SPEAKER_02: I couldn't let it relax.
• 1:15:53
  SPEAKER_02: I had like chronic fatigue.
• 1:15:56
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember I looked up in the air.
• 1:15:59
  SPEAKER_02: Once again, I remembered God.
• 1:16:01
  SPEAKER_02: I said, God, I'm so tired.
• 1:16:04
  SPEAKER_02: This is not normal.
• 1:16:06
  SPEAKER_02: Can you please tell me and show me all the truth about Betty now?
• 1:16:10
  SPEAKER_02: I asked for it.
• 1:16:12
  SPEAKER_02: I went to sleep.
• 1:16:13
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't check my WhatsApp because I was so exhausted.
• 1:16:17
  SPEAKER_02: Like my adrenals were done.
• 1:16:19
  SPEAKER_02: The next morning I woke up and I had a voice note from one of the members that joined us in our retreat in Croatia.
• 1:16:26
  SPEAKER_02: And it was a 20-minute voice note.
• 1:16:29
  SPEAKER_02: And she had woken up and realized the truth.
• 1:16:33
  SPEAKER_02: And she had told me everything.
• 1:16:34
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember her, she was falling on that voice note.
• 1:16:37
  SPEAKER_02: And she said to me, gee, I want you to listen to me from your heart.
• 1:16:42
  SPEAKER_02: That's how she started it.
• 1:16:43
  SPEAKER_02: She goes, Go into your heart and really ask yourself, Do you feel like she is a true spiritual person?
• 1:16:51
  SPEAKER_02: If that's a being of light.
• 1:16:53
  SPEAKER_02: And she went on and exposed all this truth about her in that, about her doing all this, harnessing her energy, hijacking consciousness, stealing her channeling abilities, and posting about them like they're hers, everything.
• 1:17:08
  SPEAKER_02: She goes, make the connections.
• 1:17:09
  SPEAKER_02: And all I remember is I physically felt a tick in the back of my neck, like something unlocked.
• 1:17:17
  SPEAKER_02: And I started falling because I had realized how much I had sabotaged my life being in her world.
• 1:17:26
  SPEAKER_02: And I was so grateful in that moment at the same time that I'm alive.
• 1:17:30
  SPEAKER_02: And my biggest thing, again, I don't know, for some reason, right away, I was like, thank God my clients are safe.
• 1:17:35
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know why again.
• 1:17:36
  SPEAKER_02: Like I was like, thank God my clients are safe.
• 1:17:40
  SPEAKER_02: There was something there that was divinely just protecting my business and clients, that nothing leaked through there.
• 1:17:45
  SPEAKER_02: I said, Thank God I'm alive.
• 1:17:47
  SPEAKER_02: And thank God this was a short journey, not a long journey for me.
• 1:17:51
  SPEAKER_02: Because I'd only been in her community for about 14 months.
• 1:17:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I balled my eyes out.
• 1:17:57
  SPEAKER_02: And I ran to my partner and I said, Oh my God, you're right.
• 1:18:01
  SPEAKER_02: I was in a cult and I've been taking advantage of.
• 1:18:04
  SPEAKER_02: Help me.
• 1:18:04
  SPEAKER_02: And he's like, I'm not helping you.
• 1:18:05
  SPEAKER_02: Like it was all, you know, he was like, I was right.
• 1:18:08
  SPEAKER_02: You woman never listened.
• 1:18:10
  SPEAKER_02: Like it was like a whole thing.
• 1:18:12
  SPEAKER_02: But that was the other thing, too.
• 1:18:14
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, I have to get my man back.
• 1:18:15
  SPEAKER_02: And then, you know, I ran back and then whatever.
• 1:18:18
  SPEAKER_02: But of course, he's been super supportive and helpful and understanding, right?
• 1:18:22
  SPEAKER_02: That things were out of my control at certain levels.
• 1:18:25
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember then I was like, I can't leave these women behind.
• 1:18:30
  SPEAKER_02: I have to tell people the truth.
• 1:18:32
  SPEAKER_02: So I picked up the phone, I connected with one of them, and then it became a domino effect.
• 1:18:38
  SPEAKER_01: I heard from Robin at one point, and I remember this feeling of, oh my God, like it's over.
• 1:18:43
  SPEAKER_01: Because obviously I had left a while before that, and I was processing and I still felt so afraid to talk about it.
• 1:18:52
  SPEAKER_01: But then it was like this moment where I was like, oh my God, thank God it's over.
• 1:18:56
  SPEAKER_01: And everybody like knows it was like such a relief.
• 1:19:01
  SPEAKER_00: I just know that I had intended full awareness and I sure as shit got full awareness.
• 1:19:07
  SPEAKER_00: And it didn't come in the form that I expected.
• 1:19:10
  SPEAKER_00: And it came at a cost, for sure.
• 1:19:13
  SPEAKER_00: And Gia, listening to your story, there's so many, I have so many emotions and feelings that come up, and how grateful I am for you sharing your story from your heart and from your perspective.
• 1:19:25
  SPEAKER_00: It just is such a gift for me to hear that again.
• 1:19:29
  SPEAKER_00: So thank you.
• 1:19:30
  SPEAKER_00: Oh no, you're most welcome.
• 1:19:32
  SPEAKER_02: And thank you so much for allowing me to share my story because, like both you said earlier, it's so important to prevent this from happening to anyone else, right?
• 1:19:42
  SPEAKER_02: To having people hear the other dark side of unfortunately of the spirit, I'm gonna call it spiritual industry.
• 1:19:49
  SPEAKER_02: There are people that are trying to take advantage of you, trying to sabotage you, manipulate you for their own good.
• 1:19:54
  SPEAKER_02: They don't care for your good.
• 1:19:56
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's really good to have this awareness and have open dialogue about these experiences and also understand that nothing can ever be greater than you for yourself.
• 1:20:10
  SPEAKER_02: You know your truth, you're your biggest coach, you know how to navigate yourself.
• 1:20:15
  SPEAKER_02: You don't need to outsource anything.
• 1:20:17
  SPEAKER_02: No one knows more than you, no one's greater than you.
• 1:20:19
  SPEAKER_02: To understand that as well is very, very important.
• 1:20:22
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you so much for allowing me here to come on.
• 1:20:27
  SPEAKER_02: And I try to add a little bit of jokes in it now, sometimes, right?
• 1:20:31
  SPEAKER_02: Because now it's become a joke, right?
• 1:20:33
  SPEAKER_02: Like I'm gonna definitely share this story with my grandkids one day.
• 1:20:37
  SPEAKER_02: Once upon a time, grandma was hijacked by an entity, and that's gonna be it's just gonna be all like shits and giggles now, right?
• 1:20:46
  SPEAKER_02: But it was definitely a very, very hard lesson to learn, came at a major cost for sure, but better now than never.
• 1:20:55
  SPEAKER_02: So super grateful.
• 1:20:57
  SPEAKER_02: And again, thank you so much for allowing me to even fully authentically express myself and my experience and my perspective on this.
• 1:21:04
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 1:21:05
  SPEAKER_01: And I definitely had some back and forth about this for sure.
• 1:21:09
  SPEAKER_01: I think because one of the ethical things for me is so much of I don't like to talk about other people.
• 1:21:17
  SPEAKER_01: That's like a thing for me, you know, and I think that's something that really held me back for so long.
• 1:21:23
  SPEAKER_01: And then Robin and I had a lot of conversations about the idea of ethics and what that means.
• 1:21:30
  SPEAKER_01: I felt like I was in this push-pull or fight within myself of is it more ethical to not talk about anybody and let other people have their own opinions and make their own decisions?
• 1:21:43
  SPEAKER_01: Or is it more ethical to let someone know that they could potentially be harmed by someone who harmed me and who's harmed other people?
• 1:21:51
  SPEAKER_01: And ultimately I decided that I had to tell people because that to me felt like the more ethical thing to do, but I very much struggled with it.
• 1:22:03
  SPEAKER_01: And now after I've talked to people about it, I even I had a conversation with my podcast producer about it.
• 1:22:08
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, this is what I'm gonna do.
• 1:22:09
  SPEAKER_01: And he's like, I actually think that's very admirable as a leader for you to do that, you know?
• 1:22:14
  SPEAKER_01: And it is something that it's not easy to come on here and share these things.
• 1:22:20
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't easy for me.
• 1:22:21
  SPEAKER_01: I know it wasn't easy for Robin.
• 1:22:23
  SPEAKER_01: I know it's not easy for you because it's it's a vulnerable thing.
• 1:22:27
  SPEAKER_01: But I do think it's really, really important for people to understand that this can happen, it did happen, but this is not the only place it happens.
• 1:22:37
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you for sharing.
• 1:22:39
  SPEAKER_00: I think that we're in unique positions as leaders to move through the fear of retaliation, the fear of getting into trouble, and to signal that if there's something that you feel that any of us feel we've been violated in some way and we're afraid to share it, we're afraid to talk about it, those are the very things that need to be brought into the light, brought into the sun, because it's only in the light that we can transform it and that we can look at it from a new perspective and so on.
• 1:23:14
  SPEAKER_00: And so, what I had to overcome, and Gia, I'd love to hear from you as well on this, but what I had to overcome is just that like, shit, if I say this, if I talk about this, what are the effects?
• 1:23:26
  SPEAKER_00: What's gonna happen?
• 1:23:27
  SPEAKER_00: And we don't know, but my intention is benevolence, my intention is to do no harm.
• 1:23:34
  SPEAKER_00: My intention for the work that we're doing here, Elise, with the podcast episodes is really to shed light on something we're not the only ones that this has happened to.
• 1:23:44
  SPEAKER_00: And also, as I've continued to say, is if it can happen to us, it can happen to anybody.
• 1:23:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I 100% agree with everything you've said, Robin, and Elise, as well.
• 1:23:53
  SPEAKER_02: I think for me, it was very difficult to come here because she really sabotaged my personal life.
• 1:24:00
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't my business life, it wasn't like, oh, my social media was like hacked or whatever.
• 1:24:06
  SPEAKER_02: No, it was very personal for me.
• 1:24:09
  SPEAKER_02: She came for the people I loved the most.
• 1:24:13
  SPEAKER_02: And she really manipulated me in a very disgusting, low-grade way.
• 1:24:19
  SPEAKER_02: And again, like we would never think that someone's manipulating us that way because we don't have that ideology or that mindset.
• 1:24:26
  SPEAKER_02: I wasn't even aware that someone could think like this until it happened to me.
• 1:24:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that's where we sometimes think because we just assume, oh no, we're everyone's good here.
• 1:24:36
  SPEAKER_02: We're all good because we're good.
• 1:24:38
  SPEAKER_02: And it's not the same case in everyone's mind.
• 1:24:41
  SPEAKER_02: Everyone's brain operates a different way, they have different motives and intentions, and it's very important to understand what their intentions are for what they are doing and why they're doing it.
• 1:24:51
  SPEAKER_02: And I think for me, that was the most difficult part for me to come and share here is because I don't want to disrespect, dishonor, or harm like my loved ones, right?
• 1:25:01
  SPEAKER_02: Like my partner, I don't want to harm him or dishonor him anyway when I when I speak about this, because he's a major part of this.
• 1:25:09
  SPEAKER_02: Even though he didn't attend anything, he witnessed everything.
• 1:25:14
  SPEAKER_02: He's been through a lot with me in this.
• 1:25:16
  SPEAKER_02: And he unfortunately there were heavy impacts on him about this, right?
• 1:25:20
  SPEAKER_02: So I think that was the most difficult part for me.
• 1:25:23
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't want to come here and just dishonor anybody, like even the members that joined us in these retreats.
• 1:25:29
  SPEAKER_02: I hope I did justice to them as well and they could relate in some way.
• 1:25:33
  SPEAKER_02: And when it comes to being a leader and calling out bullshit and calling out stuff that is not tolerable and calling out stuff that's very unethical, I have zero issues doing that.
• 1:25:45
  SPEAKER_02: I'm one of those people where I'm just like, okay, if you're gonna get butthurt about this, we can talk about it on the side, but this is what I'm gonna speak about.
• 1:25:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like that's the kind of attitude we all need to have when it comes to speaking up about ethicals and all this stuff.
• 1:26:00
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't even think about that, I'll be honest with you.
• 1:26:01
  SPEAKER_02: I just thought, damn, taking this woman down because she's crazy and she ruined my life.
• 1:26:08
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't want this to ever happen to anybody else.
• 1:26:10
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, having the awareness that this exists, that this can happen, it's a possibility.
• 1:26:16
  SPEAKER_02: So I have zero issues coming here and discussing these things.
• 1:26:19
  SPEAKER_02: But my biggest thing was just, you know, my personal relationships and the people in my personal lives.
• 1:26:23
  SPEAKER_02: And if they were to tune in, how would they feel knowing that Gia was Gia had lost her mind for like 12 months and is finally back online?
• 1:26:32
  SPEAKER_02: So I think that was my biggest concern, to be honest.
• 1:26:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that makes sense.
• 1:26:38
  SPEAKER_01: But sadly, I think like for me, one of the things I've always realized is that like your partner really does know you the best.
• 1:26:45
  SPEAKER_01: And sometimes they do have to tell you the hard truths that you might not want to hear.
• 1:26:49
  SPEAKER_01: I learned that lesson over and over and over again.
• 1:26:52
  SPEAKER_01: So I've just started listening to him, sadly.
• 1:26:55
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, Robin, is there anything else you want to share or Gia before we wrap up here?
• 1:27:01
  SPEAKER_00: I just think that the greatest lesson that is coming out of this is discernment and that and refinement.
• 1:27:09
  SPEAKER_00: I think that we are all works in progress.
• 1:27:14
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the other patterns that I've seen coming out of these interviews is that there is some self-blame going on and there is some calling ourselves crazy and things like that.
• 1:27:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I want, I really want that to not be the case because, again, there are so many different layers to this.
• 1:27:32
  SPEAKER_00: And Gia, I did not perceive you as losing your mind over the last year.
• 1:27:36
  SPEAKER_00: I did not.
• 1:27:37
  SPEAKER_00: And so I want to just say that because we can be very self-deprecating about this experience.
• 1:27:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that if we are gentle with ourselves, then it invites other people to be gentle with themselves as they explore these issues.
• 1:27:51
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Robin.
• 1:27:52
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Gia.
• 1:27:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, this is incredible.
• 1:27:55
  SPEAKER_01: I think a lot of people are gonna get a lot out of it.
• 1:27:58
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you all.
• 1:28:00
  SPEAKER_01: And we will see you guys next time.
• 1:28:04
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for being here.
• 1:28:06
  SPEAKER_01: Don't forget to follow the show on Apple or Spotify.
• 1:28:09
  SPEAKER_01: Leave a review and share the show with your friends who you know are yearning for this type of content.
• 1:28:13
  SPEAKER_01: When you leave a review, send us a screenshot and we'll send you a$250 credit that you can apply to joining anything new in my world.
• 1:28:21
  SPEAKER_01: You can stay connected with me by following me on Instagram at elise underscore breeds.
• 1:28:26
  SPEAKER_01: Make sure you download my Clear Trauma Cheat Sheet at Elise Breeds.com.
• 1:28:30
  SPEAKER_01: See you next time.