Latest / Abbey the Podcast Lady / Treating Your Podcast Like a Business Starting From Day One with Virginia Elder

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Treating Your Podcast Like a Business Starting From Day One with Virginia Elder · Abbey the Podcast Lady

0:04
Hello, and welcome to another episode of Abby
0:07
the Podcast Lady. I have another special guest
0:10
on today, courtesy of Podmatch. We have Virginia
0:12
Elder with us. Hello, and thanks for having me,
0:16
Abby. I am so excited to have you. I love the
0:19
topic that we're covering, but I love that we
0:20
are women in business doing something very similar
0:24
because I feel like it's kind of hard to find
0:26
other people doing what we are doing in the podcast
0:28
space, which is managing, editing, producing
0:31
podcasts for other people. Yes, I am always excited
0:35
when I see another woman in the tech space in
0:38
general, which I don't really... consider us
0:41
techie but like it very much is a male -dominated
0:46
field here so i always get excited when i see
0:48
another lady whether it's like a conference or
0:51
whatever i'm like ooh i'm gonna pick you out
0:53
yeah you're doing what i'm doing and there's
0:56
very few of us so we got to stick together so
0:58
what was your journey how did you get into doing
1:00
this so our journey started with our own financial
1:05
situation and you'll be able to connect the dots
1:09
in a minute in my story but I turned to financial
1:12
podcasts for help I was driving back and forth
1:15
to work full -time in the audit field at that
1:19
time and I would binge these financial folks
1:23
who I felt like were my friends and were helping
1:27
me even though they weren't intentionally guiding
1:30
me with their advice. But you know, that's kind
1:32
of the magic of the podcast spaces that the listeners
1:35
really latch on to you when you serve them and
1:39
answer their questions that they didn't know
1:41
they had like over and over and over. Shortly
1:43
thereafter, I ended up wanting to help others
1:48
accomplish what i had we paid off our debt ended
1:52
up debt free from eighty thousand dollars in
1:55
debt in three and a half years thanks to financial
1:58
podcast wow congratulations on that a huge accomplishment
2:02
thank you it was and it felt like it but like
2:06
i said you know i had those podcasters in my
2:07
back pocket guiding me so when things got really
2:11
tough i was definitely like in the app like searching
2:14
for their next episode and things like that all
2:17
these male voices were helping me through this
2:20
so why don't i become this woman who's helping
2:25
other moms like in my exact situation get through
2:28
what i just did so i went to a conference it's
2:32
a financial content creator event and that's
2:37
where those podcasters were so I was instantly
2:40
starstruck right but in the background I had
2:43
launched my own show on this like financial narrative
2:47
to help other moms and at that conference some
2:50
female financial advisors came up to me and said
2:54
we're looking for someone to launch our show
2:56
we think you're the right fit i was like what
2:59
like that just was not the intention slowly but
3:03
surely you know i continue to make contacts in
3:06
the space my background in finance definitely
3:09
helps and i just enjoy the content still i'm
3:13
always learning and then now that's what i do
3:16
full time is produce financial podcasts for others
3:21
and it's shifted i do have my own show it is
3:25
not a financial show it is now a show about podcasting
3:28
but that was the baby step in right and so now
3:33
i just look at it like you know my entire purpose
3:36
was not to be the financial podcaster it was
3:39
to amplify those voices that helped me so much
3:43
so that's how it happened we have very similar
3:49
trajectories of Starting a podcast, that podcast
3:52
kind of shifts into something else. My very first
3:55
podcast was called The Small Town Tourist, and
3:57
it was just about highlighting fun things happening
3:59
in small towns. That is not what I cover anymore
4:02
because people found me and it evolved into me,
4:05
like you said, helping amplify those voices of
4:07
people who want to get their story out into the
4:09
world. And I don't know about for you, but for
4:11
me, it feels so good to help. Like I have a very
4:14
specific set of skills and being able to put
4:16
them to work for other people feels so good.
4:19
I agree. So we are going to get into the topic
4:21
today of starting your podcast and treating it
4:24
like a business from the very start instead of
4:26
making that an afterthought. So I would love
4:29
to hear from you kind of like an example. Say
4:32
I'm someone who comes to you and says, I want
4:34
to start a financial podcast. Lead me on like,
4:37
where do you take them from there? Because I'm
4:39
sure there's a lot of people who come up to you
4:40
with that phrase. I know I get that constantly.
4:43
All the time. All the time. Well, one of my first
4:46
questions is about their business. And, you know,
4:52
okay, you have this financial idea for a show.
4:56
So what is it exactly that you help clients do
4:59
in your business? Like, literally, tell me your
5:01
services, your packages, your prices. Who are
5:04
your top four clients? Why are they your favorite?
5:08
What type of people? What age? What life? situation
5:12
are they in you know i just ask a whole bunch
5:15
of questions about their business and their ideal
5:17
clients first then we get to okay so how does
5:23
your financial podcast idea or these couple of
5:27
topic ideas help more people like that And so
5:32
we're diving into the details about the business
5:36
and mission and vision and who you help and all
5:38
of those things all the way down to like your
5:40
packages and price points and trying to ensure
5:44
that your topic idea and your content that you
5:48
would create in this podcast is going to naturally
5:51
support more people that you would want to do
5:55
business with. I don't want you to attract a
5:59
bunch of Joe Schmoes if... who you really want
6:02
to do business with is a bunch of Sally's. Right.
6:06
So that is the very first step is making sure
6:10
that what you're designing supports who you actually
6:14
want to support and that those people are also
6:20
going to be able to do business with you. If
6:23
that is not your ideal client, then why are we
6:26
attracting those people? I think that is such
6:28
a solid place to start. I literally had two discovery
6:31
calls yesterday with people who I asked them
6:34
a similar question. I'm like, who think you're
6:36
talking to with your topics? And they're like,
6:39
well, I don't know. I'm like, well, we need to
6:41
nail that down before we move any further. Yeah.
6:44
Kind of the core of the design of the show. Exactly.
6:49
That's a great place to start. And when it comes
6:52
to... designing that ideal client do you have
6:55
like a process you walk them through do you have
6:57
like a way to figure out who that person is the
7:00
sally versus the joe schmo so a lot of times
7:03
it has to do with just really honing in on who's
7:07
your ideal client or who and if you know the
7:10
ideal client the ica thing like gets so muddy
7:13
and we've heard a million times about your client
7:15
avatar and like all of these like weird terms
7:18
like an avatar what what is that so I like to
7:23
unpack like who are you working with or who have
7:26
you worked with who was an absolute joy, right?
7:31
Like they never once sent you a snarky email.
7:34
They were cheery and happy. They booked calendar
7:38
appointments when you asked them to. They did
7:41
their homework. They filled out the form completely.
7:44
Like the person who can truly follow directions
7:47
and jive with your business well who doesn't
7:51
give you a weird feeling or anything like that
7:53
and who are they how old are they what's their
7:56
life situation what happened in their life that
7:59
made them seek out your services how many kids
8:03
do they have all of these things and i'm not
8:06
diving into the like client avatar description
8:09
so much as like you know we need to come up with
8:13
their picture online tape them to your screen
8:18
so that you're always talking to them. Like I,
8:21
I can't, I can't deal with that. It gets a little
8:24
weird, but it helps so much. So to say, you know
8:27
what? I worked with this guy named John and his
8:30
business was at this level and he did this type
8:36
of service and he lived on the East coast and
8:40
he. was a grandpa and he did this i mean whatever
8:44
and you just unpack who john was and why he was
8:49
such a joy to work with and we simply say okay
8:52
like what other types of things would you say
8:57
to help john like what are some topics let's
9:01
brainstorm and so it starts with really nailing
9:04
down that person and why they were a joy and
9:07
then picking apart like what happened in their
9:10
life that made them come to you for their services
9:12
and then moving on from there. Before we started
9:16
recording, you had mentioned that your production,
9:20
your podcast management, you really get into
9:22
the strategy of things. And I would love to hear
9:25
all about that because that's something that
9:27
I would love to get into, but my client load
9:30
just, I work with a lot of creatives. So they're
9:33
kind of hard to wrangle sometimes. But I would
9:35
love to hear how you're taking that approach,
9:36
especially working with mainly financial people
9:38
who are a little more strategy leaning. Yeah,
9:42
for sure. So that is both a blessing and a challenge
9:45
in this financial space of helping financial
9:48
professionals with their show. A lot of times
9:50
the focus is on ROI of the show, which means
9:54
they want to produce a show that has a direct
9:58
impact in their business. And a lot of times
10:01
the conversation goes toward like, How can I
10:04
get three clients in the next three months? And
10:07
it's very specific, right? And I have to pull
10:10
it back down and say, like, back it up for a
10:14
sec. Let's talk about topics and content that
10:19
those ideal clients have questions about. What
10:23
are they typing into Google? What are they asking
10:26
their friends about? What are they going to call
10:29
their best friend and say, oh my gosh, this thing
10:31
is happening. I don't know what to do, blah,
10:33
blah. Like what are those conversations and how
10:36
do we create content that helps them solve those
10:40
problems and allude to your services, right?
10:44
So that in a nutshell is the strategy piece,
10:47
but people aren't always so forthcoming with
10:50
details, right? So it really helps, obviously,
10:53
to have that conversation about who's that client
10:56
or few clients that absolutely are joyous to
10:59
work with. We kind of revert back to like, what
11:04
services are you offering? What packages are
11:07
you offering? How affordable is this for that
11:10
ideal client? Is this supposed to be affordable
11:12
or is this supposed to be a stretch for them
11:15
in something that they really have to like? muster
11:18
up the guts to commit to right and then I'm literally
11:22
walking through as if I were a business strategist
11:26
or like as if I was their ideal client I go to
11:31
their website and say okay well where's the button
11:33
where do I click how do I join what do I do like
11:37
what would draw me to this service and if those
11:41
steps aren't super obvious that's their homework
11:45
And then we're able to design the content, the
11:49
calls to action in the show and things like that.
11:53
But if your ideal client goes to your website
11:56
and they have to scroll down or navigate some
11:59
wacky menu or it's hard to even figure out how
12:02
to join your newsletter or. You're talking about
12:06
some freebie thing to download, but there's no
12:09
pop -up. It's not obvious. Like there's so many
12:11
barriers. People are not going to hunt and dig
12:14
and try to do business with you. They're going
12:18
to like give you about five seconds on your webpage
12:21
and then go, I don't know. I guess that's not
12:24
the right person for me. And they're out. So
12:28
we have to really hone in on like, what is the
12:31
five second? Easy click, easy access. You're
12:37
in at least to an email list. And that's how
12:43
we start to figure out, okay, once they have
12:46
joined your business's ecosystem, typically through
12:49
some type of free offer. PDF, free video, whatever
12:55
it is, then we lead them to your services. Because
12:58
most listeners, unless they've been listening
13:01
to you for like five years, they are not going
13:04
to just first time doing business with you sign
13:07
up for like a $2 ,000 thing. It's just not going
13:09
to happen. There has to be some easy wins and
13:12
some nurturing along the way. And it is a long
13:15
game. It is a challenge. And that's why this
13:18
strategy is required because you're not going
13:21
to start a podcast from zero and have three clients
13:24
in three months at a $3 ,000 price point. It's
13:27
just not going to happen. So we have to like
13:29
back it up, do the homework, make it obvious,
13:34
make it simple, accessible and clear. And then
13:38
that's where we start to see the traction. I
13:40
feel like that's a really, really great takeaway.
13:43
Like you need to make it obvious if your website
13:45
is a disaster to navigate. And if people get
13:49
to your homepage and they don't know where to
13:50
go next, like red flag. Yeah. Like I don't remember
13:54
the last time. Actually, I do remember the last
13:55
time that I actually like went and poked around
13:57
a website and hunted for something. And it was
13:59
for VIP tickets to go see my favorite band in
14:02
concert. That's the only way you're getting me
14:04
to poke around someone's website to really get
14:06
something. Put it right in front of my face.
14:08
Make it easy. Yeah, absolutely. And you think
14:12
about your average general public consumer who's
14:16
not website savvy, who's not podcast tech savvy,
14:20
who doesn't know how to navigate the back end
14:22
of YouTube, right? Like things have to be, I
14:27
mean, you literally want to be able to say on
14:30
your call to action and your intro of your show,
14:33
you know, click the yellow button at the top
14:35
of my website and you'll be in. Right. Like something
14:39
so simple that they literally cannot miss it.
14:42
They cannot mess it up. You have to make it foolproof.
14:45
If your kid can do it, then that ideal client
14:49
can probably do it. That's a really great, like
14:52
if the kid can do it, so can your client. So
14:56
let's kind of have like a, which came first,
14:59
chicken or the egg situation here. Would you
15:01
recommend someone has those strategies, that
15:04
first initial? one or two funnels email list
15:07
in place first or should they start their podcast
15:10
first which one of those should happen and in
15:13
what order yeah absolutely okay so a brand new
15:17
business owner I do want them to start creating
15:21
content right away. Unfortunately for me and
15:23
you, Abby, this might be the DIY podcaster, right?
15:27
Because the brand new business, let's just be
15:29
real, is probably not making enough money to
15:32
afford outsourcing production, right? But I want
15:35
them to start building an audience, even if the
15:40
call to action is to follow me on LinkedIn or
15:43
DM me or whatever, which as we know, That does
15:47
not truly get someone into your business's ecosystem.
15:51
You're not capturing an email. So you're getting
15:54
them to like you, to trust you, to follow you,
15:58
to connect with you on another platform, but
16:01
there's still work to be done. So while you're
16:04
DIYing your show, early business days, having
16:08
your website built, maybe it's also a DIY website,
16:11
some template off of Squarespace, whatever. But
16:14
keep in mind, okay, the point is I'm building
16:20
a simple lead magnet that people will click on
16:24
so I can capture their email. And as soon as
16:27
I have that done, I can start talking about it
16:30
in my show. And I can announce like, hey, everybody,
16:32
I've been working on this in the background and
16:35
it's finally ready for you. Use that. Build hype.
16:38
Make it exciting. It is exciting for you because
16:41
you worked on it in the background all this time.
16:43
And if someone's been listening to all, however
16:47
many of your episodes, they're going to be excited
16:49
to see what you've been working on. So use that.
16:52
Recognize that once you've captured their email.
16:56
Now you need to serve them with emails. So you
16:59
can do this in a couple ways without getting
17:01
overwhelmed is just through repurposing your
17:05
podcast content. If you're producing a once a
17:08
month show, let's say it's like a really slow
17:10
go, right? You're DIYing, you're building your
17:12
website. Now we got to email people. What in
17:15
the world? You know, upload your recordings into
17:22
one of these AI platforms, help it craft an email
17:27
that sounds like you wrote it, and let that be
17:31
your newsletter where you're sharing about the
17:34
podcast content, but at least you're serving
17:36
these new email subscribers with something, right?
17:41
You build and build and build. One day you can
17:43
have your lead magnet redone. You can have a
17:46
professional draft your email sequence so that
17:48
it's something more formal. Eventually you can
17:52
outsource podcast production, right? Like we're
17:54
building, okay? You don't just... go from zero
17:58
to hero first day on the job for someone who
18:01
has a more mature business i am under the impression
18:05
that you know you've been in business for a while
18:07
you have a list of people that you've networked
18:12
with that you've done business with that you've
18:14
met at conferences fellow people online that
18:18
do the same thing as you you have a list of contacts
18:21
and Those people can be your initial folks that
18:28
you reach out to to say, hey, I'm launching a
18:30
podcast. You can poll them and ask them what
18:35
they would like to hear. There's so many things
18:37
you can do with that list. With this business
18:40
that's been around, and I'm assuming you have
18:43
this list already. That's where I would more
18:47
of want kind of the structure and the background
18:50
to be set up before you start podcasting. Most
18:54
small businesses start their content creation
18:57
journey with social media, right? And so I just
19:01
talked to someone earlier today where that's
19:03
what they've been doing and they're frustrated.
19:06
They don't feel like they're getting the traction.
19:08
And so they're recognizing that. All this work
19:12
that they're doing to come up with topics for
19:15
reels, those could be full podcast episodes.
19:19
And then the reels can be cut out of them. And
19:22
this is someone who has a business, has plenty
19:26
of clients, has the back end set up for email
19:30
subscribers, a sequence, all of these things.
19:33
That's the more mature. business perspective,
19:36
they probably even had a professional set up
19:39
those things for them. And now she's not going
19:43
to DIY her show. She is looking to outsource
19:46
immediately. She does not want to be doing all
19:49
of this herself. Those are two different scenarios,
19:51
two different answers, depending on where someone
19:55
is at in their business journey. But I always
19:58
just kind of default and say, you know what?
19:59
Like there are no rules to this. and you do it
20:04
how you do it for it to be sustainable for you
20:07
because business podcasting any kind of content
20:12
creation it is all a game and it is a long game
20:16
it is like monopoly it is not cards okay so we
20:20
got to design something that we can do for a
20:22
long period of time we are kindred spirits if
20:26
i've said it once i've said it a thousand times
20:28
people will ask me well What's the right thing
20:31
to do for my podcast? The answer is what's sustainable
20:34
for you where you're going to feel good about
20:36
putting out the amount of content you're putting
20:38
out and not feel burnt out or feel like it's
20:41
a burden. That's the right answer to everything
20:44
when it comes to podcasting. It's not going to
20:46
help you if you spend, let's even just put like
20:49
a wild price tag, right? Like you spend 20 grand
20:52
and you do 10 episodes in burnout. How did that
20:57
help you? It did not a waste of money at that
20:59
point. But if you spent 20 grand and that got
21:02
you a year's worth of episodes, okay, we're talking
21:07
now. That's a massive library of content for
21:11
an ideal client to discover. And that's what
21:13
we want. Exactly. Yeah. And I don't know about
21:17
you, but I look at my podcast clients like they're
21:19
my children. And I'm like, I just want you guys
21:22
to succeed and I want everything to be perfect.
21:24
And I'm so proud. I literally just sent them
21:25
a Thanksgiving email. I said, I'm so proud of
21:27
each and every one of you. And like, let me know
21:30
how I can help along this journey because that's
21:32
what I'm here to do. I'm here to help you be
21:34
successful in anything that involves your podcast.
21:38
A hundred percent. It feels funny to like tell
21:41
other adults that you're so proud of them, like
21:44
their children. So I'm always like. Well, what
21:48
should I say? Because I am actually like so proud
21:51
of them. Yeah. I'm like, this is weird. I know
21:55
I'm emailing you that I'm proud of you. And I
21:57
love you all. But I do. I love you all. You're
21:59
doing great. I felt like that mom in Mean Girls.
22:01
Like, you're doing great, sweetie. Yeah. I would
22:04
love to talk just briefly about I saw some of
22:07
your offerings and your podcast production services.
22:11
And one really stuck out to me, especially for
22:13
my audience of beginner podcasters. And that
22:15
is your... package to help them launch their
22:17
podcast so can you give me a little more information
22:20
on what that would entail if someone came to
22:22
you looking for help with that package yeah for
22:25
sure thank you i do not do quick launches so
22:31
if you come to me saying like I want to launch
22:34
my podcast in 15 days. I'm going to say, sorry,
22:36
sorry about your bad luck. Because again, going
22:39
back to all of the strategy conversation that
22:42
we've had, I'm going to require a minimum of
22:45
60 days before we launch your podcast, because
22:48
there is so much importance on the messaging
22:54
and the strategy and creating the sustainable
22:57
thing that we've been talking about. And we need
23:01
time to have that conversation, to go through
23:04
your guest list, to structure your show, to decide
23:08
the frequency of how often you're going to publish
23:12
based on your lifestyle. on top of the other
23:16
like back -end design stuff right like we need
23:18
time to have a recorded conversation give me
23:21
all of your beautiful ideas and aspirations and
23:24
then have my branding expert actually put visuals
23:27
to that for you to see the visuals and say i
23:30
like this i don't like that i like you know joe's
23:34
podcast cover that i found over here can we use
23:36
some inspiration from his and for us to have
23:39
a very consistent feedback loop through that
23:42
60 day period we get to know each other real
23:45
fast okay and that's super important because
23:50
if i'm behind the scenes making editing decisions
23:54
on what was a mistake and what was funny and
23:57
what we should keep in and writing your show
24:00
notes as if you wrote them and titling your episodes
24:03
as if you came up with that title i need to know
24:07
you on a deep level right so that is super important.
24:13
It's a 60 day launch period. And within that,
24:16
we are also designing your intro, your outro,
24:20
your trailer, your first few episodes. And my
24:24
goal for you is that when launch day comes, not
24:30
only do multiple pieces of content drop so that
24:34
you're instantly bingeable, but that you are
24:37
so dang proud of this work that you did. You
24:41
are in no way not going to share about this,
24:46
right? And furthermore, we've equipped you with
24:51
various clips and quote cards or whatever you
24:56
wanted to be able to share confidently. And that's
25:00
the biggest thing because out of hundreds of
25:02
podcasters who are polled, We just don't talk
25:06
about our own show enough. Yes, we're proud of
25:09
our work, but then we don't want to be braggy
25:11
and we don't want to sound salesy or like try
25:15
to, I don't know, be annoying. And so we just
25:18
don't talk about our thing. And what I want on
25:23
launch date is for you to not shut up about your
25:25
thing. I love that. So yeah, it's intense. It's
25:31
fun. it's exciting because you're seeing the
25:34
pieces get done and you're able to provide feedback
25:37
as we're producing them but yeah that 60 day
25:41
launch period is one of my favorite things to
25:44
do there's so much excitement in it my whole
25:47
body feels like it's like on fire i'm so excited
25:49
because every day brings a new element that needs
25:53
approval or needs to be made or there's a decision
25:55
happening or someone's eyes are lighting up because
25:58
they're seeing their podcast art for the first
26:00
time. There's no better feeling than launching
26:03
podcasts. It's so fun. I agree. It is so great.
26:07
Well, we're kind of coming to the end here. We
26:09
both have super busy days getting ready for this
26:11
upcoming holiday weekend. For context, we're
26:13
recording this before Thanksgiving. But I would
26:16
love just a quick synopsis of your own show.
26:19
Tell everyone about your own podcast that you
26:21
do. Yeah, thank you. Because you got to brag
26:23
about it. Yeah, we don't talk about it enough.
26:27
My show is called Podcasting for Financial Professionals.
26:32
And there is a hint there in that title. So you'll
26:36
clearly my title of my show is targeted at exactly
26:41
to my ideal client. So if you can take that and
26:46
do the same thing. That would be very clear for
26:49
anyone who might discover your show. So yes,
26:52
all kinds of financial professionals, whether
26:54
they be a CPA or a bookkeeper or money coach
26:57
or certified financial planner, that is my target
27:02
audience. And those are the folks that I help
27:04
podcast. So all kinds of tips around podcasting.
27:08
There are interviews and solo instructional episodes
27:12
from me. And right now we are doing every other
27:16
week drops and i'm considering maybe in 2026
27:21
i might go back to weekly but again you know
27:24
i'm doing the same thing y 'all are doing i'm
27:27
doing what i want there's no rules right so what
27:30
fits my budget my plan my time and i'm making
27:35
it sustainable for myself i love that okay one
27:39
final question before we tell everyone where
27:40
they can find you What is a podcast that you've
27:43
been listening to lately that you've been loving
27:45
that isn't your own? Okay, so these days I don't
27:50
have that much time for just like fun enjoyment
27:53
podcasts, but I do have a client who I have just
27:58
absolutely become obsessed with and her show
28:01
is called Money Skills for Therapists. Clearly
28:04
she helps therapists with their financial practice.
28:11
finances. And I love her show because not just
28:15
that any business owner can listen and get like
28:17
financial guidance and ideas, but obviously since
28:22
she speaks with and to therapists and she's an
28:25
ex -therapist herself, there's this like soothing,
28:29
healing, calming aspect to her show that is just,
28:34
oh, like I just can't get enough of it. and you
28:39
know financial advice or you know whoever guest
28:43
aside i just love her tone and delivery so if
28:47
you are a business owner or a therapist or if
28:51
like money skills for your business would be
28:53
of any help i highly recommend her show just
28:56
because it's like oh like so calming perfect
29:00
i'll be sure to get a link for that in the show
29:01
notes as well because that does sound like i
29:03
could use a little bit of calm in the chaos right
29:05
now i'm not gonna lie yes Yes, absolutely. Well,
29:09
Virginia, this has been so amazing. As I mentioned
29:12
multiple times, it's so great to meet someone
29:15
and chat with someone who's doing something very
29:17
similar to what I'm doing. There needs to be
29:19
more of us in the world. And I'm so glad that
29:21
we've been in contact now. And hopefully we stay
29:24
in contact and we can do this again sometime.
29:27
Absolutely. Thank you for having me, Abby. Where
29:29
can everyone find you online to work with you,
29:32
follow along, learn more about you, all that
29:34
great stuff? Yeah. So the show is at podcastingforfinancialprofessionals
29:40
.com. The YouTube handle is podcastingforfinancialpros,
29:46
like professionals was too long for YouTube.
29:51
Dang YouTube. The business address is podcastabundance
29:56
.com. And there are a bunch of freebies and resources
29:58
there as well. awesome well thank you so much
30:02
if you guys are interested in working with virginia
30:04
definitely check her out because she obviously
30:06
knows what she's doing and she'll take great
30:08
care of you thank you abby