Latest / The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast / #228: Dan West-Lane CC/OnTrack and Field

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#228: Dan West-Lane CC/OnTrack and Field · The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast

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  Track and field world. You were now tuned in to a home
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  servant, Mike Cunningham, for another extraordinary message
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  for Gill. Athletics connections.
• 0:20
  We welcome to the show with the go to appreciate the coach, the
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  ones you point people most every season leads.
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  A voice of reason. Speak in the growth.
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  You got to prep before you carry the load.
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  It's coffee to the soul for those of us to stay on the go.
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  Proper handoff. To stay in the zone which you're
• 0:35
  packing for the road. There's more than one way to the
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  go. Take notes.
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  That's paying. You're told.
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  It ain't practice. If your purpose ain't clear, it
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  can't happen to you. Listen, both is You can't mentor
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  without a mentor of years of experience.
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  You can reinvent those years. Every plan's got to stand to
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  deliver up to and the price sacrifice can you give up you.
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  It's a choice and to fight, not a win or lose.
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  It's not a ploy, but a device that y'all can make more moves.
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  It's not about how to. It's all about why you don't
• 1:01
  know till you know who you are inside. 6,000,000 waist to tie
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  choose none. So be all for us.
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  Finish line. The work ain't done so we learn
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  from the experts. But y'all got to put in the
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  legwork guilt. Athletics is the network.
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  It's all about connections put together for the profession.
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  To every track coach could be blessed.
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  You're back right here on the Gill Athletics Connections
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  podcast. I am so, so happy that you
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  pressed play on today's episode. I'm humbled to be your host,
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  Mike Cunningham, the National Business Development Manager
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  here at Gill Athletics, and you have pressed play on the
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  Connections podcast, where we uplift and honor coaches from
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  around the world. It's really quite fantastic from
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  the coaches we've had here on the show in the past, and today
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  is no different. We're going to give you this is
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  going to be probably, I'm going to go.
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  I'm going to try to predict this the most eclectic.
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  Interview that we've had on the show our guest today has done.
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  I don't know if it all is the right response, but has
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  certainly done a lot. When we talk about the unsung
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  heroes of track and field, many people you know, we obviously
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  know the athletes and they're amazing and of course we know
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  the coaches and love them and that's what our entire show here
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  is to uplift and honor them. There are other people out there
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  from manufacturers like us, like Gill Athletics, our dealer
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  network that's out there, people who make equipment.
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  Sell equipment, coach, masters, athletes, all of that and more
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  is what's going to be in today's guest.
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  So let's get to it. Help me welcome from Lane
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  Community College and our great friends and partners at on track
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  and field out in California. Help me welcome the wise, the
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  wonderful Mr. Dan W Dan. How are you Sir?
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  I'm good. Good morning.
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  Thank you. It is morning.
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  That's right. Thanks for for joining us here
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  today, man. I'm, I'm super excited.
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  You know you and I have known each other.
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  I probably met you fairly early in my career here, cuz you know,
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  I remember going out to Oregon for Olympic trials and that's
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  probably actually when I when I first met you and I've just now
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  known you as Mr. Oregon since that day.
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  Yeah, yeah, It's been a it's been quite quite a run,
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  actually, with my association with Gil.
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  Absolutely. We, we appreciate it.
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  That's why we wanted to have you on the show, not only because
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  everything I just described coaching, manufacturing
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  dealership, the masters athlete that that is one big ball of Dan
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  W You have so many different roles and fun passions that you
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  have, and I'm so excited to be able to explore those today.
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  Yeah, it's going to be fun. Well, you know Dan, typically my
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  first question for a coach on the podcast here is somewhere in
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  your life coaching had to change in your mind.
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  It had to go from something that was done to you, Dan, go throw
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  this, go jump this etcetera to oh wait a minute, like I could
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  be the coach. I could actually.
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  That could be a career for me. Let's I'm I'm going to change it
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  up for you here a little bit. Talk to us.
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  Where does track and field start for you?
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  Well, when I was so my my dad was parents were musicians and
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  not military, but they still moved.
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  We moved all over the place and so when I started 5th grade we
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  moved to Powers OR. And that's a little town not
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  very far from Cruise Bay, where famous Prefontaine came from.
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  So track was kind of happening and it was an exciting because
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  it was a real backward community, meaning way away from
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  everything and we. Moved to this cool house right
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  above a river to look down and see salmon swimming.
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  It was about 50 feet down to the river.
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  Clear this pool right down below and split level home and
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  exploring. We were out just outside the
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  town. It's really exciting it, but at
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  Christmas it started to rain. Snow melted, the river came all
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  the way up to the house and big huge old growth dug fir were
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  bumping into the house from the flood.
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  So we had to move right away and we went into town and we
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  actually moved into the worst house we'd ever lived in or ever
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  did live in. It's almost a shack, but the
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  cool thing was there was an alley right behind it and their
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  side of alley was an open lot. And then that lot was a pile of
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  sawdust 2 two by fours with nails in them for standards and
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  a a wooden box and a steel vaulting pole just laying there,
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  just laying there. Just like, yeah.
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  Just and I later, I have later found out that Marty Stellar
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  built that for the kids. So kids just vaulted.
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  So I just started pole vaulting with the kids.
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  Did you have any idea what vaulting was before?
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  No, nothing. No, I've never heard of it.
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  Had no concept, but that's what the kids were doing.
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  And so I started vaulting and at Power's track started at 6th
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  grade and I was in the 5th grade.
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  So I kept asking the coach, You know?
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  Can I do, can I do track can I do this.
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  And he said not until you're in the 6th grade and I kept bugging
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  him until finally he said Dan if you clear 6 feet you can you can
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  go to this big there was a county meet in in cruise Bay and
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  so every night and then I finally cleared 6 feet.
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  So he let me go and I have you know that's why I have no memory
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  of myself at that meet. But what my memory is, is this
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  big kid. You know, probably an eighth
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  grader, right? It's a monster guy.
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  And he came run down the runway and the bar seemed like it was a
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  Mile High, 10 or 11 feet, maybe 12 maybe.
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  And he had a bamboo pole and it bent a little bit and he swung
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  up and flew over that bar and that was it.
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  So from that time on, it's, it's been poleful for me.
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  So track. I've learned to love track and
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  I've coached other events, but for me it's always been.
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  The pole vault, obviously. So I've I've vaulted since that
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  day every year. I've cleared A crossbar now 58
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  years in a row. I've cleared A crossbar every
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  year for 58 years and so that that just started my love affair
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  with the vault and and unfortunately, well, fortunately
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  for me, I had bad facilities and bad coaches when I had them all
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  the way through college. And I never, I never really
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  accomplished in the vault world what I wanted to.
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  But he gave me this drive to make sure that that especially
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  the not knowing what to do through high school and college.
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  And I can elaborate later, but just to answer the question that
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  that drove me to want to become a coach so no other kid would
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  ever have to go through what I did both.
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  Technically training, but also facilities and equipment, you
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  know, all those things kept me from jumping what I thought I
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  could have jumped, you know, So that's kind of what got me into
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  coaching. You can call it fate,
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  serendipity, luck. But that that river coming up to
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  your house? Cuz if not now, now a guy like
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  you might have still found the vault somewhere, but.
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  It's quite possible that if that doesn't happen and you guys are
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  living in an idyllic area and it's beautiful and you become a
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  woodsman, a park Ranger or something, because where you're
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  at. But instead that happens, it
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  forces you to move. And then lo and behold, there is
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  this. I got the.
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  What is it If you build it, they will come.
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  You know I got the the Iowa cornfield baseball feel like you
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  look over and you're like, what did you know I could just see
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  you kind of like this little you know, kid 5th grader curiosity
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  of like well why is why are those poles staying in there?
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  What's that box? What's that pie?
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  I don't get this. And then you see the first kid
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  do it and you're like, oh wait a minute, well that looks fun.
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  You know, every little kid, I think every little kid would
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  love football too. That they were introduced to at
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  that age and then that becomes a lifetime for you of.
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  Of career and passion, both as athlete coach equipment.
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  I mean that that really, you know, my favorite comic books
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  were always the origin stories. That origin story for you dad is
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  quite amazing. Yeah, you know.
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  And then ride along in there after college.
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  I thought I was going to be I. It's funny you just mentioned,
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  but I thought I was going to be a fisheries biologist.
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  I was in Fish Wildlife. So I I I went to Wyoming to work
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  in a hatchery for a couple of years.
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  And then come back and get my master's and become a biologist
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  and while and I was in a pretty remote area of Wyoming.
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  Pinedale actually I was in in Daniel I was at the Daniel Fish
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  actually but it's kind of southeast of of Jackson and I
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  found out that maybe fishers biology wasn't as cool as I
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  thought it was going to be kind of have to do politically what
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  the state you don't really do the many studies so and.
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  The first year I helped out the high school, the Vaulters a
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  little bit, but that next year I'm sure just there for two a
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  year and 3/4 that next year I it was pretty lonely place and I
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  was, I mean I had to be on the hatchery a lot.
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  I wasn't really that happy and I got in a car accident, pretty
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  severe and matter of fact. I came around the corner and
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  there was just somebody there, and I whacked into him.
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  For a moment I thought, this is it, I'm done, right?
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  And that just kind of woke me up, like, hey, you know, this
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  could happen any moment. Maybe I should do what I want to
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  do. And so I contacted my senior
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  year in college. I got it.
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  We finally, I finally got my first time I ever had actually
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  had a coach, Rob Stark. And although he didn't know
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  anything about the pole vault, he was a great, great coach,
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  great man. And I called him up and I said,
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  Rob, can I come back and coach for you?
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  So that summer I started training while I was still the
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  hatchery for the to do a decathlon.
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  And I thought if I had a coach I should do some of the other
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  events. So I built some hurdles and
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  around the hatchery grounds I was.
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  He sent me a a shot in the desk and a javelin, and he lent me
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  those and I I just. Realized that track just called
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  me back, but it kind of took that car act and kind of wake me
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  up. And so I went back to work on my
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  master's and start coaching it in Montana State.
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  So it was those kind of two random things because I was
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  going off kind of in a different direction.
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  I thought my I thought I thought vaulting maybe was done after
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  college like most people do, but it just kept calling me back.
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  I just couldn't leave it alone. Yeah, that's interesting.
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  You know, some of us have a literal car wreck and hopefully
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  the most of us, because I would don't want to end that for
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  anybody have that metaphysical car wreck of like, hey, what?
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  You know, life is short at the end of the day I I should be
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  doing something that I'm happy. And obviously you weren't very
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  happy with the the, the fish, you know, wildlife biologist
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  type. Thing that that will kill
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  telling my son, I'm pretty sure that's what my son is going to
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  go into. He loves fish and fishing like
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  no one. Yeah.
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  And I love fish the. Actual hatchery was not much
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  fun. If I had to put him in a
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  profession now like, Oh yeah, you're park Ranger.
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  You're doing something like that.
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  Yeah. In that.
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  In that world. Yeah.
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  So I'm I'm so glad that the the car crashed, car accident
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  actually didn't do anything physically to you like, you
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  know, loss of life and you know, something catastrophic for that.
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  But you were still, you mentioned you've cleared A
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  crossbar every year for 58 years, but you so you were still
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  even through that time frame though you were still getting
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  out there and in Vaulton with or without support.
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  Right, right. Yeah, yeah, The I checked in
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  with the high school coach that first year and asked if I could
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  come and help the Vaulters. I only vaulted a couple times,
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  but I did vault the clear clear 13-6.
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  At the, which was a big bar and that, you know, so I helped the
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  kids out, you know, at the high school level.
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  And then that next summer I started, like I said, I started
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  training and actually went up to back to Bozeman.
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  I was from Montana State and competed in my first, my first
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  of nine Decathlons. I started doing those after
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  college, but I never really trained.
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  It's funny after that, I never really trained for the
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  decathlon. But yeah, it's you know.
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  The vault was such an integral part and you know, every time we
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  moved growing up. So I was in in the 6th and 7th
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  grade in one place. Then also I was in 8th, 9th and
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  10th in Columbus, Mt. But then I was in three more
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  high schools, so I was in four high schools.
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  So I had just kind of learned to find a way.
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  No matter what the situation to to vault and that, that's the
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  what was the one constant for me.
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  Did you have at each of these high schools?
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  So now I went to the same high school but before high school,
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  so K through eight. I went to like 20 different
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  schools. I'm used to being the the new
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  guy everywhere, right? And you have to quickly find out
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  when you're the new guy. When you go to 4 high schools,
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  you have to quickly find out who's my tribe and who's not my
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  tribe. You know who you are.
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  Like, all right, I like track. I like vaulting.
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  So how do I figure out where those people are and do is that?
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  And even available at at this high school.
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  Did you have vaulting like you said you found a way?
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  I respect that, but was there already a vaulting program at
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  each one of those places, or did you have to, like, make it
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  yourself on some of them? Well, there was not much
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  vaulting at any of those high schools, Okay.
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  So my my freshman year there was a 15 foot 180 pole, one pole.
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  15180 K and I'm five, three, £120.00, that's a little cut.
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  So I stepped so I stepped pulled right sophomore you're all set
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  in this community guy had never coached.
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  Matter of fact he had bad arm from polio.
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  Bruce and he just wanted to help me and and he talked to head
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  coach and you get me get this a 12 foot 120.
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  How tiny is that but all of a sudden?
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  And he he he, he did some research.
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  There wasn't much, you know, no Internet back then.
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  Obviously, no videos, even very few books.
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  But he found a book that had some drawings of of secret
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  vaulting. So he we kind of figured out.
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  And also I was bending a pole, a sophomore jump, 10-6.
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  I had the best jump in the district.
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  I was the only fiberglass vaulter.
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  Everybody else was still stiff bowl vaulting, straight poll and
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  I made $0.10 and I was like, man, I was on top of the world.
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  I was the guy, you know, $0.10. But as you can imagine pretty
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  quickly that was not a big enough poll.
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  I went through it there, there wasn't the next poll, so that
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  the rest of the season went very poorly and really bumed me out
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  and we moved and. We, the school had one pole, a
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  15 foot like 170 and then still too big for me, right?
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  And and that school didn't even have a track.
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  They just put a box in the grass.
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  I ran on the grass, 33 burlap bags of foam and I jumped in
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  six. That year as a junior really
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  bummed me out because I was thinking I was going to improve.
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  I remember one day I grabbed the top of that pole and tried to
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  bend it. And got rejected back out on the
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  grass. So I stiff pulled, you know.
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  And then senior year I went to another school and they they
• 17:29
  bought me a 12 foot, 140, damn 12 foot poles, you know, So I
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  jumped 11/6 on that. But then they wouldn't get me
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  the next. I went through it.
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  So I was stuck, you know, And they they did finally buy me a
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  14140. It's a big jump, but it came the
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  day of the of the divisional meet.
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  And they said you would jump on it.
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  And they didn't tell me what to do, Change my step, change my
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  hand hole. And I know I did.
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  And I thought, you know, that's the end of my, that's the end of
• 17:58
  my career. Very disappointed.
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  I went to Montana State and I just called me back.
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  So I walked on and the coach kind of looked at me like,
• 18:09
  really? But he, he was such a really
• 18:12
  cool guy, horrible coach, an alcoholic.
• 18:15
  Serious. We drank.
• 18:17
  We drank on track trips. We were the Bad News Bears of
• 18:22
  the Track World and but that first year I had a bunch of guys
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  to jump with three other guys. First time ever, right?
• 18:30
  First time ever? Yeah, yeah.
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  And I improved up to 13. I was made 13-6.
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  I was starting to think, man, I can make this work.
• 18:39
  We did have to jump into a Cloud 9.
• 18:42
  Oh yeah, the old school. Yeah, the big pillow.
• 18:44
  Big bag, that and it had already been.
• 18:47
  It was already illegal to use those and because they were so
• 18:51
  dangerous, that's what we jumped into.
• 18:54
  But unfortunately my sophomore year everybody had quit.
• 18:58
  So I was by myself faulting and the same with my junior year.
• 19:02
  A freshman guy came in and that helped a little bit.
• 19:05
  So, and then finally, like I said, my senior year I actually
• 19:07
  got the first time I ever had a coach, so we had actual
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  training. And he knew I needed to do a
• 19:13
  couple of things. Some other things happened in
• 19:15
  there. But so I I I ended up jumping
• 19:17
  14-8. But I should have been, you
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  know, I really should have been a 16 to 17 footballs with that.
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  I mean I know that now as a coach, but I was doing
• 19:25
  everything wrong. There's some other stories in
• 19:28
  there about that but but just a touch.
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  So those I just kept working because I had to vault.
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  I just had to vault. I mean, there's there was no
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  question. I had to vault, but I didn't
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  know what I was doing. And I was very frustrated by not
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  knowing what Why can't I jump with these other guys, you know?
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  It's amazing. I like, I think I'm tracking
• 19:51
  with you that yeah, you could have maybe should have been a
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  1516, who knows, you know, with proper equipment, proper
• 19:56
  coaching, especially in this event, the pole vault.
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  However, the other side of that, I'm like, wow, I'm amazed that
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  you became a 14-8 vaulter with all of this against you as well.
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  You know one pole a year and. You know, no, no pole vault pit,
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  no coaching. I mean, it's kind of like I see
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  both sides. I'm like, wow, what could have
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  been? But it's like, holy cow, you
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  made the absolute best of it as well with what was the the cards
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  that were dealt to you. That's quite amazing.
• 20:21
  Well, thanks. Yeah.
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  I think that's what's propelled me to become a Masters Vaulter,
• 20:25
  obviously, right? You know, when I went back to
• 20:29
  Montana State, it took me probably five or six.
• 20:32
  I coached there for eight years at Montana State and probably
• 20:36
  the 1st 5. Was just me with, with learning
• 20:39
  how to become a coach, studying right, going to clinics,
• 20:43
  reading, there's became more materials.
• 20:46
  This was in the 80, this was in 80 till 87.
• 20:48
  I coached at Montana State, but I had to fix all my bad habits.
• 20:53
  I was doing everything wrong and I had to learn how to bowl.
• 20:55
  So doing that, having to transfer that late in life,
• 21:00
  right, so that, you know, I'm 22 to 30.
• 21:04
  I I'm trying to learn how to pull ball.
• 21:06
  Correctly. So I had to learn a lot of
• 21:09
  drills. I had to learn a lot of
• 21:11
  processes of how do you turn yourself into a good technician
• 21:16
  when you've done everything really wrong.
• 21:18
  And so, and I did, you know, so when I was 32, the last year at
• 21:24
  Montana State in 87, I jumped 15-5.
• 21:29
  OK, so I hung in there and I always wanted to jump 16,
• 21:32
  obviously. But life does get in the way as
• 21:34
  you get older and coaching and all those other things.
• 21:37
  But but I learned how to vault. I still had a couple of
• 21:41
  technical flaws. I thought that I later I learned
• 21:45
  later when I came out here to Eugene.
• 21:47
  But the point I'm trying to make is that that really helped me in
• 21:50
  coaching because I learned from myself.
• 21:55
  And how hard it is to change. So I understand that.
• 21:58
  See what I'm saying and and the tricks and what you've got to do
• 22:02
  to become somebody that plants horribly or way under those kind
• 22:06
  of technical issues that can really stop you.
• 22:09
  I get those every year with incoming freshmen.
• 22:13
  They haven't been coached correctly in high school.
• 22:15
  So I I have a step up on what does it take, you know, plus
• 22:20
  since I, I, I, I train with my Athens.
• 22:25
  Nobody does that much, hardly anybody.
• 22:27
  So I vault and train, becoming less and less as I get old.
• 22:31
  But my parents were musicians that that taught private
• 22:35
  lessons, my dad, Trump player, my mom and piano.
• 22:38
  So I grew up listening to them. No, it's like this.
• 22:41
  And they would play it correctly.
• 22:43
  So for me, that's what started. I I'm old enough now.
• 22:47
  I don't really show things correctly, but but by working
• 22:50
  out with the athletes, to me it's like it's cheating.
• 22:54
  Because then they'll do anything for you with them, you know.
• 22:58
  So I've just always done that. So that's kind of the synthesis
• 23:02
  of of how I came through that what what you pointed out which
• 23:05
  is right frustrating thing that in some ways I'm thankful for
• 23:12
  some ways obviously I wish I had had.
• 23:15
  I wish I'd had a Dan W coaching me.
• 23:17
  Exactly, yes. But it it's what taught me how
• 23:20
  to be a the coach that I whatever whatever kind of coach
• 23:24
  I am today that's what helped me get through so so put a pin in
• 23:28
  that working out with the athletes So I do want to ask you
• 23:30
  about that but what I'm curious about something that you said
• 23:32
  resonated with me about the lack of coaches that you had going
• 23:36
  through high school and college career.
• 23:40
  Some very well meaning coaches. I'm sure they just didn't know
• 23:43
  how to coach the fall and then obviously you know we talked
• 23:45
  about a coach drinking. There's no well meaning there at
• 23:48
  all. So that was that's a that's a
• 23:50
  that's a person who wasn't cut out to be a coach that you know
• 23:52
  that's that's the person not the profession there.
• 23:55
  But that resonated with me. Same in high school.
• 23:58
  I didn't compete collegiately but I competed in high school
• 24:00
  and I had two sets of coaches freshmen through junior year.
• 24:03
  Then we got all new coaching staff my senior year.
• 24:05
  Love them both. Dennis Anderson was the coach my
• 24:08
  first few years love him. He was a shot putter for my alma
• 24:10
  mater Troy State. So love him but and he knew
• 24:14
  through. He knew throws he didn't know.
• 24:16
  Running, sprinting, hurtling nothing like that.
• 24:19
  And then John Grass, who actually was who just retired as
• 24:23
  the head coach of Jacksonville State football, took him to the
• 24:26
  national title. He was amazing.
• 24:28
  He was our football coach as well.
• 24:29
  Obviously he, you know again coach is better than what Coach
• 24:34
  Anderson did. But still was not how you train
• 24:37
  a sprinter. Heard that.
• 24:38
  You know the events that I was in, right?
• 24:40
  But I loved him to death. Like still John Grass is when I
• 24:43
  see him Once every five years I hug him.
• 24:45
  I love him to death. Coach Anderson, I haven't seen a
• 24:47
  long time love him Death very, very well.
• 24:48
  Many people that you know also had, you know, they taught and
• 24:51
  they coached football and to your point that mine was in the
• 24:54
  90s, there still wasn't a lot of great coaching education.
• 24:57
  It readily available out there. So I don't know even if they
• 25:00
  wanted to be better coaches that there was a lot of resources for
• 25:03
  them. I say all that to say.
• 25:04
  I also when I decided to get into coaching was like I will
• 25:08
  not let that happen to my athletes.
• 25:09
  Like they're not going to be, they're not going to not reach
• 25:12
  their potential because of me. It's going to be because of
• 25:14
  other things, their their choices, right.
• 25:16
  So I really dug deep into coaching education formally as
• 25:20
  far as like us, ATF and such, and also coach, peer-to-peer
• 25:25
  education. You know, I was always, you
• 25:26
  know, I was that nerd when I was talking to a fellow coach.
• 25:29
  Well, what do you do here? Why did you do that?
• 25:30
  You know, I was always, so here's what we do.
• 25:32
  What do you think about that? What did you do?
• 25:34
  How was your when you went back into coaching?
• 25:36
  You're at Montana State and again you're talking about
• 25:38
  you're in the 80s here, still not a lot of great resources.
• 25:41
  First of all, not a lot of great resources at all.
• 25:44
  And then the ones that were out there were still extremely hard
• 25:47
  to get to campus clinics, videos, again, no YouTube,
• 25:51
  etcetera, No, no real magazines, you know, track and field news,
• 25:54
  of course, and track journal or track coach, what they used to
• 25:57
  call it, But there's just not a lot of resources.
• 25:59
  How did you externalize that internal feeling of like, okay?
• 26:04
  I didn't get great coaching. Well, I'm going to be the best
• 26:07
  coach that I can be. How did you externalize that?
• 26:09
  How did you do that? Well, I was fortunate.
• 26:12
  There was a great track clinic every year in Washington Ken
• 26:16
  Shannon put on. So I was, and we and with Rob
• 26:21
  Stark, who was the head coach my senior year, and then he was, he
• 26:25
  was my head coach through that whole time of Montana State and
• 26:29
  we went as a staff. And and actually Montana still
• 26:32
  has a great coaching clinic in the summers, adults and and so
• 26:37
  we went to that and they would have outside speakers.
• 26:42
  I think at one point we had an assistant women's assistant and
• 26:49
  she had a friend. Robert Pillard, who was at the
• 26:55
  time with one of the top, had been one of the top vaulters.
• 26:59
  One of the few, earliest, maybe the the first black guy to be a
• 27:04
  national international class. Walter and they were friends and
• 27:07
  she talked him into coming to do a clinic on the vault and some
• 27:11
  other things. So I learned a lot there.
• 27:15
  There was some. There's a little bit more
• 27:19
  literature, obviously. And I studied the I had to study
• 27:24
  the other I was the jumps coach so I had to coach.
• 27:27
  I jumped on jump a triple jump. So there was a lot and a lot of
• 27:30
  carry over obviously with approach work and spreading.
• 27:32
  So I there was that literature but you know one of the biggest
• 27:36
  things was I got fortunate. I had a couple of really good
• 27:38
  athletes. So I learned from there pretty
• 27:42
  quickly some stuff and watched what they were doing and kind of
• 27:46
  kind of follow through with that, you know before that what
• 27:50
  interestingly. So one of the mistakes I made
• 27:55
  and I try to help athletes, I I was pretty shy when I was
• 27:59
  vaulting. Wasn't sure I belonged in a
• 28:03
  certain sense. So I I didn't talk.
• 28:06
  It wasn't I didn't want to. I was just afraid to talk to
• 28:08
  their vultures. And so I encourage my guys,
• 28:12
  always and gals now to, you know, to interact with other
• 28:17
  vultures. Because you can learn a lot from
• 28:22
  and and especially, you know I always have a big group, so I I
• 28:25
  want them to not coach each other but help each other out.
• 28:30
  But when you're around other vultures assemble, be aware of
• 28:33
  that. It happens but if you're aware
• 28:35
  of it, it happens quicker. So you know I I think I learned
• 28:39
  that from coaching some some better athletes.
• 28:41
  You know, and I I looking back at my vault career, I was afraid
• 28:45
  to talk to anybody. So at meets and that would have
• 28:49
  been my one chance to, you know, but a thing happened once, a
• 28:52
  little Side Story here that it's kind of interesting after my
• 28:56
  junior year, it's the last year that my bad coach was the head
• 29:01
  coach and big skies were going to be in a U and so a very
• 29:06
  limited squad and I had jumped the best.
• 29:09
  I had been jumping, but I didn't make that team OK.
• 29:13
  To go and that broke my heart. I was just really depressed.
• 29:17
  I wasn't jumping as well as I wanted to and the last meet was
• 29:22
  kind of a last chance qualifier. But I knew I wasn't going to get
• 29:25
  to go when I was vaulting it. And this guy James Talley from
• 29:31
  Idaho State, he was a 15616 foot guy, way better vaulting than
• 29:35
  me. He walked up to me at the end of
• 29:37
  the meet. He says why do you take off so
• 29:39
  far under? And I said, what do you mean?
• 29:43
  See, nobody did ever even said. He said, well, you're a foot and
• 29:45
  a half hundred, there's no way you can jump.
• 29:48
  Your foot should get to meet your top hand.
• 29:50
  I go, really? He said.
• 29:55
  That's a big deal, man. I don't know how you jump as
• 29:57
  high as you jump. So I went back and talked to
• 30:00
  head coach and he this is what he always said.
• 30:04
  Well, Dan, you just got to do your own thing.
• 30:08
  Well, my own thing wasn't working right, so I.
• 30:12
  I was. I said well, I'm done.
• 30:14
  I'm, I'm done. I thought, I'm done.
• 30:18
  So a couple weeks later just track it over for the in school.
• 30:21
  I thought, you know, right. Bovault called me back.
• 30:25
  So I asked him, can I take a poll in a crosswalk home with
• 30:28
  me. He said he didn't care.
• 30:30
  Sure. So we lived.
• 30:32
  My dad lived in Belfry, which is just outside the Yellowstone
• 30:36
  Park in in Montana. He was.
• 30:39
  He was living on a ranch farm. Renting the house.
• 30:44
  So there was this, this big huge 10 foot, you know, 50 foot long,
• 30:48
  10 foot high pile of silage, right.
• 30:51
  Chopped up corn. And so I built a little wood box
• 30:56
  right at the base of that. I had a doubt.
• 30:59
  I made myself a path to the sagebrush.
• 31:03
  There was a little irrigation canal, so I built a little
• 31:05
  bridge to run over, went out and got two logical Pines and made
• 31:11
  them the standards. And I could smooth out the dirt.
• 31:16
  And as it turned out, the bridge became a check mark for me.
• 31:21
  So I I knew where I had to step on the bridge so I could take
• 31:25
  off correctly. And that started and all of a
• 31:28
  sudden I got my step out and so you know, I was jumping 12 feet.
• 31:34
  It was a small pole, so I only had to fall 2 feet into the
• 31:37
  silence because it was 10 feet high.
• 31:39
  And so I vaulted that summer. By myself and I smoothed out the
• 31:43
  dirt and I slowly got and all of a sudden I got my step on and it
• 31:46
  was like oh this is this is easy this is great.
• 31:51
  So that kind of that kept me vaulting my senior year.
• 31:55
  But it it gave me that that was kind of one of those
• 31:57
  breakthrough aha moments of how important doing something
• 32:00
  correctly was and and so that just kind of that's kind of
• 32:06
  sensitive why I was a coach and and how I learned how to coach.
• 32:11
  We we like to demonize today in 2023 that everybody has a cell
• 32:15
  phone and social media but listening to you tell that story
• 32:21
  and and I have to create the video in my head you you had the
• 32:24
  video in your head. You did it right.
• 32:26
  I I sit there and go Oh my gosh Dan if you could have had
• 32:29
  pictures from that day from videos from that.
• 32:32
  I mean that's like that's amazing right.
• 32:35
  And that's what I love about cell phones and social media.
• 32:38
  Like, we have that today. Like the other day, this high
• 32:41
  school gal, she's teaching either I don't know if she's
• 32:44
  teaching herself or she has someone helping her, but she's
• 32:46
  learning the hammer, right. And so, you know, she threw it
• 32:48
  like 40 feet or something like that.
• 32:50
  But she was, I think she's a fairly accomplished javelin
• 32:52
  thrower, actually. And and she was like, you know,
• 32:54
  I'm starting to feel the turns a little bit, you know?
• 32:56
  And I was like, hey, I commented on it and I was like, bookmark
• 33:01
  this tweet. But, you know, keep this video
• 33:03
  because in 4 to 8 year, I don't know what year she is in high
• 33:06
  school. But, you know, in some amount of
• 33:07
  year, like you're going to be decent at it at least.
• 33:10
  I mean, who knows? She may go on to be an Olympian
• 33:12
  in it, for crying out loud. But I bet you because she's
• 33:14
  starting early, she's going to be pretty decent.
• 33:17
  And it'll be so cool to see, you know, the video of today today
• 33:21
  being 2029 of her throwing 180 feet.
• 33:24
  I don't know. And then right after that show
• 33:27
  earlier, the first time she threw and she threw 40.
• 33:28
  Like, that's amazing. So I mean for that what you're
• 33:31
  describing there, you know through the bushes and you know
• 33:34
  you had to build a little bridge that's amazing and that becomes
• 33:38
  your midpoint essentially. Like I would love to see that
• 33:42
  video man that is quite amazing. And really you know the
• 33:46
  definition of I will not nothing stop me like I I will figure
• 33:50
  things out one way or nor the other.
• 33:52
  I will figure it out. I love it.
• 33:54
  You you know you answered one of my questions.
• 33:55
  I was going to ask you, I remember for my own coach in
• 33:58
  education and you you nailed it with the aha moment.
• 34:01
  One of the first clinics I went to was Marshall Goss, then the
• 34:04
  head coach at Indiana University.
• 34:05
  And he was talking about hurdles and had a coach hurdlers and
• 34:09
  spacing and height of the hurdles.
• 34:10
  And it was like this, Aha, like this light turned on where I was
• 34:15
  like, oh, like there's an actual way to coach her, not just set
• 34:19
  them up and say go. And it was like, oh, wait a
• 34:22
  minute. I bet that's like, for every
• 34:23
  event, I bet there's like, actually progressions and
• 34:26
  teaching and things like, oh, man.
• 34:27
  So for you to have that aha moment of like, oh, I'm under, I
• 34:31
  didn't even know what under meant.
• 34:32
  That's just this is the way I did it.
• 34:34
  You're telling me this is wrong. Oh, wait a minute.
• 34:36
  Well, that means there's might be other things that I'm doing
• 34:39
  wrong and I should should learn. So I told you that.
• 34:42
  Can I? Yeah, can I?
• 34:43
  Just real quick. So the other aha moment, my
• 34:46
  other quick story is that. So we'll just you might ask
• 34:51
  this, but just a quick synopsis. I left Montana State because I
• 34:54
  got married and they weren't going to pay me anymore and I I
• 34:57
  couldn't survive. So I went to work for Ampro,
• 35:00
  which was Portapete Catapult for one year.
• 35:02
  You talk about that later. But I couldn't.
• 35:05
  Southern California wasn't for me.
• 35:06
  So my wife and I just said, where are we going?
• 35:08
  So we came to Eugene, just came. There were no jobs.
• 35:11
  And I I just forced my way. So I became coach at Lane for
• 35:15
  three years. And then Andre Czinski left
• 35:20
  Oregon. He was the vault coach, the Nike
• 35:23
  coach. So I just walked in to build
• 35:24
  diligence, said you need to hire me as your vault coach.
• 35:27
  And he said okay. So I coached at Oregon from
• 35:31
  909091. Through 96.
• 35:35
  And then some other things happened.
• 35:36
  But the the other major thing that happened to me was in 93,
• 35:41
  Sergey Bukka jumped at the Brie. He came a week early.
• 35:45
  So I got to watch him train okay.
• 35:48
  And so I'm, you know, I'm becoming a better coach, I feel
• 35:51
  like. But I, I, I know there's things
• 35:54
  I'm not quite following through with, you know.
• 35:57
  And so here's Sergey Bukka, who arguably best ever.
• 36:01
  Right, 35 world records at the time.
• 36:05
  OK. I was about to say today you
• 36:06
  have to have maybe a different discussion.
• 36:08
  At the time, but for sure up until today. 3535 world records
• 36:12
  is 35 world records. All right, Dan, we're going to
• 36:13
  have to get into this discussion now.
• 36:15
  OK, yeah, but it's the vault where you could set it 1/4 inch
• 36:18
  at a time. I know I'm not.
• 36:20
  I'm not taking, I'm not taking away his greatness.
• 36:23
  Up until today, certainly Buca was the best alter and and by
• 36:28
  the way, #2 is not a bad place because the guy who's doing it
• 36:31
  now, I. Think #1.
• 36:33
  And I don't think he's getting enough credit for what he's
• 36:35
  doing today. Mondo, like, I know he's getting
• 36:37
  a lot of credit, but you know, we're still talking about Noah
• 36:39
  Lyles and and by the way, Noah Lyles should also be talked
• 36:42
  about and Sydney and etcetera and nothing.
• 36:45
  I mean, they're doing amazing, but no one's as dominant as
• 36:48
  Mondo is right now. And I would, I would have that
• 36:52
  discussion and believe it absolutely.
• 36:54
  But you know, but even if you can do the same thing again,
• 36:57
  even if it's one centimeter, you do it again and again and again.
• 37:00
  Certainly that's right. Great point.
• 37:01
  So at the time, but one of his great attributes was his plant
• 37:05
  and take off. You know, certainly Buca was as
• 37:09
  good a technician at that point and everybody thought it was way
• 37:13
  faster. But now we see Mondo's even
• 37:15
  faster. So I mean, you know, there's all
• 37:16
  those, but that was a fact. And so here's here's the best
• 37:21
  guy in the world doing walking plant drills.
• 37:27
  You've never seen that before. With and without a pole doing
• 37:30
  drills that high school kids are passed focused to the Max doing
• 37:39
  walking. And I went, oh, so that's the
• 37:42
  secret. Not not just doing them, but
• 37:46
  having the discipline to focus on that basic thing where
• 37:53
  everything else comes from in the vault and and.
• 37:56
  You know, and I've been lucky enough to to be around some
• 37:59
  national international class American vultures.
• 38:03
  They would no more have done something at that time.
• 38:06
  They would no more have done it something like that.
• 38:08
  They they were way past that, you know, And I.
• 38:12
  So all of a sudden I realized, so that's a story that every kid
• 38:16
  gets that I coach and and I drive them crazy because we do
• 38:22
  those same kind of drills and I am on them.
• 38:27
  That everything has to be perfect at that level.
• 38:31
  And then I'm way less perfectionist when they vault,
• 38:37
  you know, because you got to give some people some room.
• 38:39
  The point in pain is, I learned that that's the secret is, can
• 38:45
  you be disciplined enough to not just do the basics, but to do
• 38:49
  them correctly, to do the fundamentals at a really high
• 38:52
  level. At a high level and and focused
• 38:55
  so that that just changed my whole world view of oh so that's
• 38:59
  that's what I if I want to be that coach I want to be that I
• 39:01
  gotta start doing that So. So I'm going to ask you to put a
• 39:05
  penance on the we're going to keep a pen because I want to
• 39:08
  know why Eugene. You guys just up and so you're
• 39:12
  down in Southern California working for Ampro.
• 39:15
  I know you've lived in Oregon before but you're really a
• 39:17
  Montana guy at this point. That's where a lot of your
• 39:19
  fundamental years had been going.
• 39:21
  Why did you just pick Eugene? Well a couple reasons.
• 39:27
  My wife had been born and and spent a couple years on the
• 39:31
  Northwest but she had lived almost for her entire life in in
• 39:34
  Bozeman and Spring. So she had kind of an affinity
• 39:39
  for the North Northwest and and we had come out when I coached
• 39:43
  at Montana State spring break. We had come out to Eugene for
• 39:48
  the for the preview meet that they had.
• 39:53
  A lot of times on our own with one or two athletes I'd come out
• 39:58
  and and seen Hayward Field right and I didn't like snow, never
• 40:04
  did like snow and I just felt like I just had I just always
• 40:11
  had a great feeling in Eugene OR you know and it was it wasn't
• 40:15
  quite tracked down then. So this is this is this is the
• 40:20
  early 80s, but still. You know, right.
• 40:23
  It was still the trials in 80 had been at Hayward.
• 40:27
  That was the last time until for quite a few years they weren't
• 40:30
  there, right. You know that was the the
• 40:33
  Olympics. That didn't happen for us, but
• 40:34
  the trials were there. So I mean there was that, but we
• 40:38
  were down in California and and had no options.
• 40:41
  We just said where do we want to live And we both thought, well
• 40:45
  Eugene's and a little aside when I the first year I coached
• 40:51
  Montana State there was this great guy that was an athlete
• 40:55
  for us that threw shot and disc by the name of Lance deal.
• 40:59
  So I I I never coached Lance but I was one of the coaches for
• 41:03
  Lance OK and so Lance and and Nancy were living in Eugene so
• 41:10
  and Chris had a friend actually that was living in Eugene so we
• 41:12
  thought you know at least we know somebody there.
• 41:15
  So we just packed up and move to move to Eugene.
• 41:21
  Lovely found a way to. We found jobs.
• 41:25
  We just found a way to make it here.
• 41:27
  Love. Love Lance.
• 41:28
  Deal. He's a guilt podcast alum and my
• 41:30
  favorite trivia question about Lance.
• 41:33
  And instead of asking us a question, I'll just say it.
• 41:35
  I was blown away. I visited Montana State.
• 41:37
  I don't know, probably 10 years ago.
• 41:38
  I'm sure. I've told you you, Dan, the
• 41:40
  story and I go and they have the records, books.
• 41:44
  You are the record boards. And I go to look at the hammer
• 41:47
  cuz I'm thinking, oh of course Lance Steel holds the school
• 41:49
  record. I mean come on.
• 41:51
  No. In fact when I interviewed him,
• 41:53
  I looked it up on my phone while we were interviewing.
• 41:56
  I think he's like 4th, 5th or 6th he's down, but like he's not
• 42:00
  #2 even like he's down. In fact he owns the Discus
• 42:03
  school record though, which I found quite amazing but just was
• 42:07
  amazed that he did not own. The state, the school record
• 42:10
  for, you know, the event. He goes on and wins a medal.
• 42:12
  American record. I mean, that's just phenomenal.
• 42:15
  It's just phenomenal. So you've been to Eugene.
• 42:17
  Okay. That makes sense.
• 42:18
  Okay. I thought it was like this, you
• 42:19
  know, throw a dart. All right, We're going to go to
• 42:21
  Eugene because they vault there. And I'm a vaulter.
• 42:23
  So that's where I'm going. So the the second part of that
• 42:26
  story that Dan, that just was like, I got to hear more about
• 42:29
  this. You said you walked into Bill
• 42:31
  Dellinger. Now come on, if you're going to
• 42:33
  make a Mount Rushmore of college track and field coaches.
• 42:36
  A lot of people are going to have him on the Mount Rushmore.
• 42:39
  This is a big time coach and you just walked in as often as like
• 42:42
  hey, you need to hire me as your Volt coach.
• 42:44
  Well, not quite in those words but almost So I've been coaching
• 42:50
  at Lane and it had some success with some kids and and Jay
• 42:56
  Szynski had, did you know, a great coach obviously.
• 43:01
  But he was more focused on his. His group had more post
• 43:05
  collegians, Olympic athletes. So now he kind of colds their
• 43:11
  funding for him. So I'm Jay quit coaching and I
• 43:14
  mean, there was a big gap there and it's the fault you need
• 43:17
  somebody that's, you know, So I just, I just thought, you know,
• 43:20
  it was a little scary, a little intimidating.
• 43:22
  But, you know, and there's nothing like being kind of
• 43:24
  young, you know. Right.
• 43:26
  So you just don't know. So I just thought, you know
• 43:28
  what? I'm you know I'm just going to
• 43:31
  walk in there and tell him that you know I'm I'm I'm his guy and
• 43:38
  and it he he's yeah let's go let's go And you know and you
• 43:43
  know he's I'd say Rob Stark is my was my first mentor but
• 43:49
  certainly Bill Dillinger was an important mentor for me because
• 43:53
  you know some people criticize Bill and I don't think they
• 43:55
  quite understood him and he was a little he kind of got left
• 43:58
  behind with the way track is now he was still too old school.
• 44:03
  He just he had learned from Bowerman and he just recruiting
• 44:07
  wasn't what they did and and it was not really what you should
• 44:11
  do. OK, people should want to come
• 44:13
  to your school and then you coach him.
• 44:15
  But all all the all the little nuances that he had that made
• 44:18
  him such a great coach, I really, really listened to.
• 44:23
  He was not a micromanager at all.
• 44:24
  He let me coach and if I had questions he'd help me out.
• 44:28
  To means one of the best coaches obviously I've ever got there.
• 44:32
  Not just, I mean not just because of his position, but the
• 44:37
  coach that he was and the person.
• 44:39
  And we got along great. It's funny, a lot of people
• 44:41
  thought he hated the vault because he used to get really
• 44:45
  mad at Andre because Andre would not focus the training or his
• 44:49
  guys for the PAC 12 championship or even NC double A's.
• 44:55
  He was always trying to focused and for summer meets because
• 44:58
  that's how he had always coached and that drove.
• 45:02
  So there was a lot of no heights at PAC 12.
• 45:05
  So Bill was, but Bill loved the vote and he he had actually
• 45:11
  wanted to. He wished he had been a vaulter.
• 45:14
  He was a gymnast in high school along with the distance runner,
• 45:17
  so. So we got along great.
• 45:19
  He loved it and I think he liked my passion, my energy level.
• 45:23
  So those years were great coaching with him and I feel
• 45:27
  like I really learned a lot. That's cool.
• 45:29
  Were you still practicing with the athletes at Oregon as well?
• 45:34
  So I'm curious about that because I've had this thoughts
• 45:38
  philosophy of that topic, but it's usually typically born
• 45:43
  around distance runners and coaches with a distance coach
• 45:46
  running with their athletes both in maybe they're more casual,
• 45:49
  long run and even in workout, you know, repeat.
• 45:53
  One case whatever. And I've always and I can
• 45:56
  remember having this discussion back when I was a high school
• 45:58
  coach. This is back in 9495 long long
• 46:01
  or 9596 long long time ago. And and I'm sure you know we're,
• 46:05
  we're all just kind of a mash up of other people.
• 46:08
  You know you talk about Dillinger and other coaches you
• 46:10
  know people speak into you and you know things that resonate
• 46:13
  with you kind of you carry on. So I'm sure I heard this from
• 46:16
  someone else. But I remember I've always had
• 46:18
  this philosophy of like, oh, you can never win as a coach who
• 46:20
  competes or who practices with your athletes.
• 46:22
  Cuz on one hand, if you're beating them, it's a little
• 46:26
  demoralizing for them that here's this, you know, no matter
• 46:28
  what your actual age is, you're older than.
• 46:30
  So here's this old guy beating me, you know, whether you're 25
• 46:33
  years old or you're straight out of college, still like, oh man,
• 46:35
  this guy's past his prime. I'm supposed to.
• 46:36
  I'm trying to get where he is or she is.
• 46:39
  And they're beating me. So there's a demoralizing
• 46:40
  effect. And then if and when they
• 46:43
  remember it's all kind of in distance running land for me.
• 46:46
  When they go on to start beating you in long runs or repeats,
• 46:50
  there's like a, you know, the thought was for in my head was
• 46:53
  always that, well, there's a loss of respect.
• 46:54
  Like, well, you know, how can you coach me?
• 46:57
  I'm beating you. You know, I'm physically be like
• 46:58
  not just, you know, it's not just on paper that I could beat
• 47:01
  you like it. Here it is.
• 47:01
  We're actually doing it. Now, having said all that, when
• 47:04
  you were describing. Not competing.
• 47:08
  When you describe practicing with your athletes as a vaulter
• 47:12
  that I didn't get the same like normally if a distance, if you
• 47:16
  were a distance coaching told me that I'd be like, I don't know
• 47:18
  don't know if I agree with you on that one there coach Dan.
• 47:20
  But when you sit with Vaulter, I was like you know vaulting's
• 47:23
  different not only because it's a different event, it's a
• 47:25
  different culture. I I.
• 47:28
  And that possibly could work out.
• 47:29
  Obviously it has, you know through your career.
• 47:31
  But that that was resonated with me.
• 47:33
  You never had any issues. The ones that kind of described
• 47:36
  in my head of distance world you never had those issues of
• 47:38
  disrespective like oh man, Dan, you're jumping coach.
• 47:41
  W, you're jumping 13 feet. I'm a 15 foot vaulter.
• 47:44
  Just get out of here. You never had any issues with
• 47:46
  that? No.
• 47:47
  No. I think you know, as in most
• 47:50
  things in life is how you approach it.
• 47:53
  So I I talked with my athletes and I'm real honest with them
• 47:57
  and so we set it out from the beginning correctly and I
• 48:02
  believe that one of the mistakes that coaches make is some
• 48:06
  coaches their self worth becomes their athletes success.
• 48:14
  So their ego gets in the way. So I tell my athletes that's not
• 48:20
  going to happen with me. My my self worth is my own
• 48:23
  vaulting. I'm here to help you.
• 48:25
  I'm your coach. I want you to be the best you
• 48:27
  can be. I get my own self worth so and
• 48:32
  and so we started out that way. So I'm just training and you
• 48:35
  know and there are still actually it's funny there's a
• 48:38
  couple of exercises since I'm an old wise guy I know how to do
• 48:41
  them correctly. I still beat some athletes on a
• 48:43
  couple of testing things, strength, balance kind of
• 48:47
  things. But I never come at it as I'm
• 48:51
  beating you. I just, I'm doing it.
• 48:54
  I'm doing it. So you know it.
• 48:55
  It's how you present it. You know, if there are role,
• 48:59
  there are people that like to brag and set it up as a
• 49:02
  competition. And if you come out of that way,
• 49:04
  then what you're saying absolutely.
• 49:06
  But if it's. I just love the pole vault, I'm
• 49:09
  working out, you know, we're going to move the pit.
• 49:13
  I move the pit with them. I mean, we are a team, so I'm
• 49:17
  part of that team. I'm the coach that we're part of
• 49:20
  that team so that's that's how I think I've gotten it through.
• 49:22
  And and the kids, they kind of course now for the last 10
• 49:26
  years, right? I'm just this crazy old guy.
• 49:31
  Right, Yeah, right. At some age, you get there,
• 49:33
  right? Yeah.
• 49:34
  You know, So now that's not even.
• 49:36
  But the fact that I even do it, you know, they're just like,
• 49:39
  yeah, hey, you know, coach, you know, and I do what I do less, a
• 49:45
  little bit less all the time. There's some things can't quite
• 49:47
  do. I don't want to hold them up,
• 49:49
  but I used to Sprint with, you know, I'm not the fastest guy,
• 49:52
  but I used, I mean, but I still do almost all the workouts.
• 49:55
  So it is a balance and you know, they're they're first, my
• 50:02
  training is second always. So I keep that perspective if it
• 50:07
  and that's where a lot of people lose it to their training is
• 50:11
  more important than their coaching.
• 50:13
  So that if you do that then you've lost it.
• 50:15
  The kids know that. So you know I'm just doing it
• 50:19
  with them. So I've just found this this
• 50:21
  place where it worked for me. I don't know if it would work
• 50:23
  for everybody. I've been fortunate that every
• 50:25
  head coach I've ever had, there's been a couple that kind
• 50:28
  of didn't want me to do it. But I had explained to him that
• 50:31
  that's what's not going to happen.
• 50:34
  I was, that's the way I do it. So and the vault is specializing
• 50:37
  upright that people are desperate to have a vault coach
• 50:40
  so they probably going to be do almost anything.
• 50:42
  Yeah, you do have, if you're a vault coach and especially if
• 50:44
  you're a good vault coach, you've got some upper hands out
• 50:46
  there, that's for sure. I I found it interesting when
• 50:49
  you talked about, you know, coaches who find their self
• 50:52
  worth their identity in what their athletes are doing.
• 50:58
  Because earlier you had mentioned about like having your
• 51:00
  athletes talk to other vaulter, you know, good vaulters and that
• 51:04
  even you had some at one point were like, oh man, I'm not I'm a
• 51:08
  paraphrase this in my words. So correct me if if I'm.
• 51:12
  Miss speaking here a little bit like oh I'm not worthy enough to
• 51:16
  talk to this 18th. I'm.
• 51:17
  I'm a 12 foot vaulter and I've seen that it.
• 51:20
  What's interesting, I had that a little bit as well, but I'll see
• 51:24
  that with when we have. You know, we, we try to have at
• 51:27
  least one teammate here at Gil who's a vault specialist, right.
• 51:31
  And even like you know, one who just was here and now works for
• 51:34
  Anheuser Busch of all companies. He's amazing.
• 51:36
  We love him. In fact, he was on the the Gil
• 51:38
  podcast River. Morrow River was, you know, he
• 51:40
  was an OK vaulter. I mean first of all I never
• 51:42
  vaulted. So you're amazing if you put any
• 51:45
  stinking bar in my book, but but you know he wasn't a national
• 51:48
  qualifier or anything like that. But he was a good solid, you
• 51:52
  know, mid, major, whatever you want to call it that Coastal
• 51:54
  Carolina. But he and I would have talks
• 51:56
  and I was like, hey, yeah, you know, let me introduce you to
• 51:58
  Jeff Hartway. You know, Jeff's good friend of
• 52:00
  mine. He's like, oh, I don't, I don't
• 52:02
  know, man. That guy jumped 6 meters and
• 52:05
  American record holder. I was like, yeah, it's just Jeff
• 52:07
  bro. Like I know he he jumped really
• 52:09
  high. I get that.
• 52:10
  But you know what? He's just, I mean he's a he's a
• 52:12
  normal person. That's something he did really
• 52:14
  well. But like he has a lot of other
• 52:15
  things that who he is, you know, he's, you know he's a father and
• 52:19
  he's a friend and he's a reptile you know breeder.
• 52:21
  Like he's that's not his identity.
• 52:24
  Just like it's not your identity.
• 52:25
  That you were. I can't remember what Rivers PR
• 52:27
  was but it's like that's that doesn't that doesn't jive man
• 52:30
  like you. You know you have passion for
• 52:32
  the vault so you should be able to talk to the Brad walkers, the
• 52:37
  Derrick Miles, Toby Stephen. You know those are they're
• 52:39
  people first that happen to do something really amazing but
• 52:42
  they're people first. So I love that kind of reminder
• 52:46
  of like that's not your identity who you are.
• 52:48
  Your PR while is extremely important.
• 52:49
  No one's a bigger fan of PR's than I am.
• 52:52
  That's not your identity. That just happens to be what you
• 52:54
  have done in that specific event.
• 52:56
  Up to this point, yeah, you know there's quite a few events in
• 52:59
  track and field that are like that.
• 53:01
  But certainly the pole vault humbles you pretty quickly.
• 53:05
  And you know, if if you, if you're authentic and and you
• 53:10
  give it your best shot, you run down there and you plant the
• 53:12
  pull and bend and get upside down, then you have everybody's
• 53:17
  respect the ball, whether you're a 10 foot vaulter or a 20 foot
• 53:21
  vaulter. And and if, if you don't have
• 53:25
  any errors about you or if you're not defensive, if you're
• 53:28
  just there, then you're accepted.
• 53:30
  And that that is a beautiful thing about the vault.
• 53:31
  And obviously in vault we are a pretty closeknit community.
• 53:35
  So you can be a part of that community, which was a lesson I
• 53:38
  learned along the way too. But oh, I can't be a part of
• 53:41
  this, you know. Right.
• 53:43
  One time at the summit I was vaulting and you know, I must
• 53:48
  have been 40 by 2045 and 50 in that time frame.
• 53:54
  And I was getting myself pumped up to jump 14 feet.
• 53:58
  It's a good jump for my age group.
• 54:00
  And Toby walked by and got all pumped up with me, Toby
• 54:04
  Stevenson, So, you know, those things happen.
• 54:07
  That's cool. So yeah, yeah.
• 54:09
  Yeah, and at the end of the day, if you're a vaulter, you end
• 54:13
  like your whole career, you end as a failure, you lose every
• 54:17
  you, You're unsuccessfully for 99.9% vaulters, you're ending on
• 54:22
  failure. So it's a little different ball
• 54:24
  game just for that alone. So you are at Oregon for, I
• 54:29
  think you said six, 7-8 years from around there or what?
• 54:32
  What? Why I leave?
• 54:33
  What happened, NCAA I had a really good vault to Jeremy
• 54:39
  Williams and he jumped 17-8 at Washington State, getting ready
• 54:46
  to jump 18. He was at the Catholic somewhat
• 54:49
  too, but mostly Volter. And after that meet Bill called
• 54:53
  me and said, Dan, I hate to tell you this, but there's a rule I
• 54:56
  wasn't aware of and you know the rules on volunteer coaches have
• 55:00
  changed. And that was the year where we
• 55:05
  were a split program. Men only.
• 55:08
  So you get 3 volunteer coaches across country and indoor and
• 55:12
  outdoor, but you could only, you could only travel with the
• 55:17
  season that you were designated for.
• 55:20
  So I was the indoor coach. So that means we got busted.
• 55:23
  I couldn't travel and I thought, what?
• 55:27
  I'm volunteering and now I can't even go to the meets.
• 55:29
  Yeah, this seems really dumb. Yeah, I'm not doing that.
• 55:32
  I'm not doing. I'm not you know.
• 55:33
  And Jeremy went to the pack. He got second at at PAC Twelve's
• 55:38
  down in Tempe. But he made some mistakes going
• 55:41
  to polls. Right.
• 55:42
  And then he went to Nationals and and Bob Fraley told me, man,
• 55:45
  it's too bad you weren't there because Jeremy really needed
• 55:47
  you. It was a little swirly wind and
• 55:49
  you know he, he had a chance to have been you know 18-4 and
• 55:54
  placed been an All American. And I just thought, you know
• 55:58
  it's bad enough you're not paying me now you're not going
• 56:00
  to let me go to meet. So I'm.
• 56:01
  I'm done with this. So I just coached some high
• 56:06
  schools and opened people and mastered people for a few years,
• 56:10
  the end of the 90s and then in 2000 another one of my really
• 56:15
  good friends and a guy that helped mentor me.
• 56:18
  But Grady O'Connor was funny. He had actually been an athlete
• 56:22
  at at Oregon, football player near me, hurdler, but he was the
• 56:27
  the head coach at Lane Community College and Grady at that time
• 56:30
  in 2000, he said, he said, Dan, you got to come out and I need a
• 56:33
  ball coach and you can come one day a week, two days a week,
• 56:37
  whatever you want. I've seen so many.
• 56:39
  So that's when I started back because I had coached at Lane
• 56:43
  from 88 to 91 for a couple of years.
• 56:45
  I coached both at Lane and at U of O and then realized that that
• 56:50
  maybe there was an NCAA violation potential there.
• 56:53
  So I quit coaching at Lane. So in 2000, I started coaching
• 56:57
  at Lane again, and I've been there ever since.
• 57:02
  That had to be like a dagger in your heart, you know.
• 57:05
  Again, Fraley, one of The Pioneers of of pole vaulting for
• 57:09
  us in this era to say, hey Dan, boy, it too bad you couldn't
• 57:13
  have been there. He really could have used you.
• 57:15
  And through no fault of your own, it's not like you chose a
• 57:18
  different event or, you know, to not go that.
• 57:20
  I mean, that's like devastation for coach.
• 57:24
  Yeah, yeah, You know, and it's, I mean, it's pretty exciting to
• 57:29
  be. It was pretty exciting to be at
• 57:31
  Oregon you know and and I inherited a British Walter when
• 57:36
  I first started. So Mike Edwards and he improved
• 57:40
  enough that his sponsor brought me.
• 57:44
  So I I got to coach Mike at the 91 World Championships and Tokyo
• 57:50
  and at the Barcelona Olympics. So I got to coach at the
• 57:52
  Olympics and and it was he did pretty good at Tokyo and did
• 57:57
  horrible. That's a whole other story but
• 58:00
  but I did that level and I coached and once again for me
• 58:04
  you know trying to always bounce keep my ego it's it's certainly
• 58:09
  great to coach great athletes and be in that spotlight and and
• 58:15
  it it it's it's one of the best experiences of my life.
• 58:18
  But but that's not why I coach and if if I have somebody.
• 58:23
  Just a couple of years ago I had a a little gal little girl she's
• 58:27
  an eighth footballer and I let her walk on because I know her
• 58:30
  coach from high school and she it was it was a nightmare until
• 58:34
  finally she figured some things out and she jumped her last meet
• 58:38
  she jumped 10 feet for her that was and I never thought that was
• 58:42
  going to happen a little 5 foot and just and and so for me
• 58:46
  that's as important as sitting in the stands and being an
• 58:49
  Olympic coach. So at that point that the amount
• 58:54
  of politics and pressure that there is at Oregon even back
• 58:57
  then but now especially that's it's not worth it to me.
• 59:01
  So you know a lot of people actually my athletes asked me
• 59:05
  why do you coach at Lane Community College.
• 59:06
  Right. Well you know there's a a number
• 59:10
  of reasons. One of the big reasons is
• 59:11
  because I can there's no recruiting violations so high
• 59:15
  school kids can come and jump with me.
• 59:16
  I can help. Coach calls me up.
• 59:19
  I I can't, can't. I don't know what's going on
• 59:21
  here. Then coming with me, there's no
• 59:25
  restriction on how many vultures I can have, right?
• 59:27
  It's a little tough to get kids to the junior college sometimes,
• 59:30
  but I'm free. I'm free.
• 59:32
  I get to help kids and develop them and hopefully send them off
• 59:36
  to a four year school if that's what they want to do.
• 59:38
  Some of them, they just want to jump a little bit more and then
• 59:41
  there's done with school, you know, there's all those
• 59:43
  different. But I get to just coach with no
• 59:45
  politics and and we're fortunately we have great
• 59:49
  facilities and I've been in long enough I have enough holes So
• 59:53
  those things that we talked about I have a good facility I
• 59:56
  have equipment and and I've got kids I don't have for two years
• 1:00:01
  which is hard sometimes. Sometimes it's good you should
• 1:00:04
  move a lot but so it's a perfect situation no pressure of that
• 1:00:10
  and and not I mean there's still pressure to compete well but
• 1:00:14
  right you know right now the. I mean, being in Oregon is a
• 1:00:17
  that's a tough gig, right? Now, yeah, yeah, that's
• 1:00:20
  interesting that that picture of the 180 of, you know, growing up
• 1:00:24
  with no facilities and no polls and no coaching and now you know
• 1:00:28
  Lane, arguably one of the top facilities and some of it's
• 1:00:33
  because of proximity of Eugene with Olympic trials and
• 1:00:37
  Prefontaines and stuff, you guys.
• 1:00:39
  Are the, you know, dedicated practice track for a lot of the
• 1:00:42
  athletes coming in from other countries and other places in
• 1:00:44
  the United States. That's quite amazing where you
• 1:00:47
  started to where you are, my friend.
• 1:00:51
  Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
• 1:00:52
  You know, I'm a former junior college coach myself from in the
• 1:00:56
  Kansas World Kansas Jayhawk Conference.
• 1:00:59
  There's my understanding maybe it's four, there's several
• 1:01:04
  different. Groups of junior college, you
• 1:01:06
  have the California, they have their own North and South
• 1:01:09
  California system. You have the NJCAAI think there
• 1:01:12
  is a Division Three that's probably still under NJCA kind
• 1:01:15
  of up in the north and then you have this Northwest.
• 1:01:18
  I've never really understood it. Can you just talk to us about
• 1:01:21
  this Northwest junior college system that Lane Community
• 1:01:24
  College is in? Well, I think it was originally
• 1:01:28
  they they broke it up into three.
• 1:01:30
  You're right there's three and the reason was just cost saving
• 1:01:34
  measures. OK.
• 1:01:35
  So they that's what they decide. So there's three national meets
• 1:01:38
  there's California, there's the Northwest athletic in WAC and
• 1:01:43
  then there's the rest of the country which seems kind of
• 1:01:45
  strange to me but but but there's enough schools in
• 1:01:48
  California obviously and the in WAC is is Washington, Idaho,
• 1:01:55
  Oregon Really that's it that's it that so.
• 1:01:59
  So we have our own championship meet.
• 1:02:01
  So there's and each each of those three, the top three
• 1:02:05
  placers are all Americans. So there's nine all Americans
• 1:02:08
  each year and and three national champions.
• 1:02:11
  So. So we have, you know, as in
• 1:02:15
  track, we go to meets all over the place.
• 1:02:18
  But we have our championship meet.
• 1:02:20
  We have, we have a regional meeting in Oregon right before
• 1:02:24
  in wax that is a championship meet, just the Oregon schools.
• 1:02:28
  But that's just the thing that we do ourselves.
• 1:02:32
  It's not. But yeah, it's it's a it seems
• 1:02:35
  kind of strange and it would be nice if there was one national
• 1:02:38
  meet maybe. But you know, finances being
• 1:02:41
  what they are, so that's why they've done that.
• 1:02:43
  To your knowledge, have they ever talked about the simulating
• 1:02:45
  into the NJCAA? Because I get travel and and
• 1:02:49
  budget. Come on, you know, you and I, we
• 1:02:51
  get budgets better maybe than anybody.
• 1:02:54
  But you know, New York is still coming to wherever the NJCAA and
• 1:02:58
  Florida wherever. I'm not sure why they've done it
• 1:03:01
  that way, but that's that was the rash now.
• 1:03:03
  That's interesting. And so, yeah, that's just the
• 1:03:05
  way it is now, so. And you're under your own
• 1:03:07
  separate rule book there? Well, it's our conference.
• 1:03:12
  I mean all junior colleges, the rule book, mostly we follow the
• 1:03:17
  NCAA rule book, but we also have some of our own and maybe each
• 1:03:23
  conference, I think each conference has their own.
• 1:03:26
  I mean for a while we couldn't recruit outside of.
• 1:03:30
  We had to only recruit from states that were adjacent to the
• 1:03:35
  in whack. Yeah, that's what I wanted.
• 1:03:36
  Yeah but now they kind of loosen that they're it's evolving like
• 1:03:41
  all conferences are and now they just passed the thing where the
• 1:03:45
  kid can transfer one time without that's been a that's
• 1:03:49
  been a thing where you had to get released from your school
• 1:03:52
  but now you can just transfer. So you know it's slowly, it kind
• 1:03:55
  of evolves along like what what the rest of the what Division
• 1:03:59
  One things but but basically you know we we only have few
• 1:04:03
  waivers, we don't have full rights scholarships that's an
• 1:04:07
  ANWAC thing and school thing. So you know, there are some kind
• 1:04:11
  of conference things that we have to follow.
• 1:04:15
  The junior college, whether you're in California, Oregon or
• 1:04:19
  middle of Kansas, you know it's really special to me again,
• 1:04:23
  partly because I'm so glad that I at least spent one year there
• 1:04:26
  coaching. You know, I respect high school
• 1:04:29
  coaches. It's a unbelievable job what you
• 1:04:31
  do getting kids that have never done any events most of the time
• 1:04:34
  and creating teams out of that and helping them go on to be
• 1:04:38
  recruited by two year and four year institutions.
• 1:04:41
  And it's amazing what four year college coaches on every level,
• 1:04:44
  NEIA division, three, etcetera, what they do going out and
• 1:04:48
  trying to find the best high schoolers they can to come into
• 1:04:51
  their their their four year institution.
• 1:04:54
  A junior college coach is doing both.
• 1:04:56
  You are routinely looking for what high schoolers can you
• 1:04:59
  bring to your team and what sophomores can you help move on
• 1:05:03
  to the next route. And so that NJI say the NJCA
• 1:05:07
  because that's the meet, I go to the junior college national
• 1:05:09
  meet. It's really special to me.
• 1:05:11
  These are kids that are, you know, for lack of better terms,
• 1:05:15
  you know, misfits needed second tries, third tries, four tries.
• 1:05:18
  No one wanted them. They weren't good enough at the
• 1:05:20
  time to go for year, etcetera. And they just needed someone to
• 1:05:24
  believe in them in the middle of Kansas or the middle outside of
• 1:05:28
  Eugene. It's it's really like when I see
• 1:05:31
  the national meat, when I see the the meat that you guys host
• 1:05:34
  there and I look at the results and I'm just like, wow, man,
• 1:05:37
  these kids. Like someone believed in them.
• 1:05:58
  Exactly. They believed in themselves too.
• 1:05:41
  By the way, to your point about some kids just want to vault for
• 1:05:43
  a couple more years and they end up becoming really stinking
• 1:05:45
  good, it's that's a different, I don't know, man, that's just a
• 1:05:49
  difference to me. It's just it's much more
• 1:05:51
  heartfelt. I watch these, these meets and
• 1:05:53
  I'm just like, oh man, like bravo to you.
• 1:05:55
  You didn't give up and someone didn't give up on you.
• 1:05:59
  It's it's a it is a really. I feel.
• 1:06:03
  Obviously I'm biased, but it's important place for kids to land
• 1:06:08
  for an awful lot of kids. You know, obviously we have a
• 1:06:11
  lot of kids that academically aren't ready and we can help
• 1:06:15
  them with that. And we have an awful lot of kids
• 1:06:18
  that athletically aren't ready and and a lot of times because
• 1:06:21
  you know, especially in the vault, you know, I get kids that
• 1:06:25
  all the time. I got a girl coming in this
• 1:06:27
  year. She had one pole.
• 1:06:29
  In high school she had one pole. Dan the Dan was special and she
• 1:06:35
  didn't jump very high and she's going to walk on and we'll see,
• 1:06:39
  you know, somebody that you know.
• 1:06:42
  Morgan Fossen, she walked on to my program because she was not a
• 1:06:48
  good high school vulter and I wasn't sure that I even wanted
• 1:06:52
  her to walk on. So that's how I mean she was a
• 1:06:54
  10 foot one time 10 foot vulter wasn't been in the pole much and
• 1:07:00
  had no idea what she was doing. So okay you can walk on you know
• 1:07:05
  and we'll see and then all of a sudden she's somebody that I
• 1:07:09
  just wow one of the best people I've ever coached personalized.
• 1:07:13
  And she developed all of a sudden she's a 12/6 school
• 1:07:16
  record holder and and then goes on and it it was she had some
• 1:07:20
  struggles in Eastern Washington. But to end up being a second
• 1:07:25
  team Allamerican jump 13-9. I mean that's that's a success
• 1:07:29
  story you. Know 100% helped her, helped her
• 1:07:32
  along the way find out who Morgan really was.
• 1:07:36
  So and you know the cool thing about junior college is just the
• 1:07:39
  reality. The first two years in college
• 1:07:42
  you're going to take the same classes.
• 1:07:44
  So nobody, nobody gets behind by going to a junior college, you
• 1:07:48
  know and every once in a while I get, I mean I talked to some
• 1:07:51
  kids that could go to a four year in the coming just because
• 1:07:56
  they want to They want to jump with me and be a part of our
• 1:07:58
  program. But most of the time there's a
• 1:08:01
  reason why kids and and we lose a lot of kids.
• 1:08:05
  I mean there's a reason. So that that's a frustrating
• 1:08:08
  part. A lot of kids decide they don't
• 1:08:10
  want to go to school. They flunk out.
• 1:08:14
  And pretty much you have to decide you don't want to go to
• 1:08:16
  school to flunk out of junior college.
• 1:08:17
  You know, you have to work at it basically, you know, But that
• 1:08:20
  happens all the time. Some kids decide they don't want
• 1:08:23
  to be an athlete anymore. And like I said, you know, we,
• 1:08:27
  we end up sending kids. You know, we've got some kids at
• 1:08:30
  Oregon. You know, I've sent kids to
• 1:08:33
  Washington. You know, a lot of the Big Sky
• 1:08:35
  schools for sure. I've looked contacts there.
• 1:08:38
  So that is a fun part trying to help them, get them ready, send
• 1:08:41
  them off. And and the kids that just
• 1:08:44
  wanted to jump, you know, hopefully they jump to PR and
• 1:08:47
  they're happy, you know. And so many kids that are trying
• 1:08:50
  to decide if they want to stay or not, I tell them, well, you
• 1:08:52
  know someday you're going to be 4550 years old.
• 1:08:56
  You can look back and ask yourself, why did I quit that?
• 1:09:01
  What could I have done? I said, so here's your you got
• 1:09:03
  the rest of your life to work. Here's your chance to find out
• 1:09:06
  how you can vote. You know, don't give it up,
• 1:09:09
  don't give it up, hang in there with it.
• 1:09:11
  But a lot of kids just, they get parental pressures, societal
• 1:09:16
  pressures and they decide they they have to work.
• 1:09:19
  They they don't. They don't hang in there, which
• 1:09:21
  I think is unfortunate for them. They got they they'll realize
• 1:09:24
  down the road, we all, we all have to work at some point.
• 1:09:27
  Why not take advantage of that college experience?
• 1:09:30
  Yeah, say not. Not much is important. 18 to 22
• 1:09:32
  year olds, meaning not much you can do is going to affect 45th.
• 1:09:36
  I mean that's 20 years from now. You got a lot of time to make
• 1:09:38
  mistakes and still make things happen.
• 1:09:40
  I didn't find my career here until I was 30, for crying out
• 1:09:43
  loud. So yeah, you know the the story
• 1:09:45
  about Morgan. And I'm sure other sports
• 1:09:47
  probably say the same thing, but you know that it always makes me
• 1:09:50
  think of like man, what could the records be?
• 1:09:52
  The world records, the school records, etc.
• 1:09:55
  If, I mean we're already the number one participated sport on
• 1:09:57
  high school and collegiate level.
• 1:09:58
  So we certainly have our number of at bats if you will.
• 1:10:02
  And I wonder, like you know, for the famous side of it, like man,
• 1:10:05
  what if LeBron James had been a long jumper or a high jumper?
• 1:10:08
  Like there's so many amazing athletes in other sports and
• 1:10:10
  there's so many amazing athletes just walking the streets that
• 1:10:13
  never even tried or wanted to try pole vaulting, high jumping,
• 1:10:17
  hammer throwing. It's like man, there's you know,
• 1:10:20
  you know there's some 22 foot pole vaulter just walking around
• 1:10:23
  that never. Didn't know what the pole vault
• 1:10:25
  was. Was a, you know, it was a chess
• 1:10:27
  player in high school. I don't know.
• 1:10:27
  But it's like, man, if we could figure out how to get everybody
• 1:10:30
  at least try the sport. I just know there's some
• 1:10:32
  athletes that we have just missed just because they're not.
• 1:10:34
  They're not in the sport, not in the sport.
• 1:10:37
  So you know here at Gill Athletics you know we're
• 1:10:39
  manufacturers so we we make the equipment that is out there.
• 1:10:43
  So pits and hurdles and poles and discus is.
• 1:10:47
  I mean it's quite amazing. I always tell people it's kind
• 1:10:49
  of like Willy Wonka's Chocolate Factory right across that wall
• 1:10:52
  right over there. It's quite amazing what the men
• 1:10:53
  and women do back there. I'm, I'm at all.
• 1:10:55
  It's like black magic to me. We bring in this stick of steel,
• 1:10:58
  cut it, Weld it, paint it, voila, there's a pole vault
• 1:11:01
  standard. That's it boggles my mind.
• 1:11:03
  I'm just not a a handy guy. And then we have this.
• 1:11:07
  Great, great partnership with companies around the country and
• 1:11:10
  the company that you work for, Dan, and work for as long as
• 1:11:13
  I've known you on track and field first with the great Ron
• 1:11:17
  Morris. And we, you know we're going to
• 1:11:18
  have to have a story of Ron's story here because you know, you
• 1:11:21
  don't get to become a gold medalist in the pole vault and
• 1:11:24
  have a vaulter on the show without, you know, talking about
• 1:11:26
  that. And now Steve owns it.
• 1:11:29
  Steve Ringle there doing a great job you guys have.
• 1:11:33
  They're at on track, have represented and served coaches
• 1:11:36
  around the country. I was thinking of it California,
• 1:11:38
  but I got to remind myself, first of all, you're not in
• 1:11:40
  California. You serve lots of coaches and on
• 1:11:42
  track as a very national company doing a great job representing
• 1:11:45
  Guild equipment to high school and college coaches around the
• 1:11:47
  country, How did that start? How did you get on with Ron
• 1:11:51
  Morris at on track? Well, you want the short version
• 1:11:56
  or the long version? You know our average length is
• 1:11:59
  an hour and 45, and we're only at the hour and 10.
• 1:12:01
  Mark, my friend, we got plenty of time.
• 1:12:03
  You tell the story how you want to tell the story.
• 1:12:05
  I'm I think I am a little unique in in my position as an outside
• 1:12:10
  sales guy so, so it took a pretty strange path to get me
• 1:12:16
  where I am at today. So it it starts, it really
• 1:12:20
  starts in 1987. I have all in 85.
• 1:12:25
  I got married and I had two stepsons.
• 1:12:27
  So all of a sudden I have a family, OK?
• 1:12:29
  And up until that point, not being paid a lot wasn't that big
• 1:12:34
  of an issue for me. Looking back, maybe it should
• 1:12:37
  have been, but, but I was making $8000 a year.
• 1:12:41
  And so I go into the athletic director and I say, hey man, you
• 1:12:43
  know, is this going to change? Because I I can't, I can't
• 1:12:48
  survive. And he said I don't see a change
• 1:12:50
  in it. So I go, well I got to do
• 1:12:52
  something different and luckily I knew Jan Johnson and he knew
• 1:12:56
  the people at Ampro. So I called them up and said
• 1:13:01
  hey, you should hire me and they flew me down.
• 1:13:05
  So all of a sudden I was the pole guy for Catapult and
• 1:13:09
  Portland. It was Ampro in Anaheim and
• 1:13:12
  luckily Jim barrier had been one of the original engineers with
• 1:13:20
  her Jinx invented the modern fiberglass and and Jim was in
• 1:13:27
  the aerospace at the time and but he he was a composite
• 1:13:33
  engineer. So Jim taught me the engineering
• 1:13:37
  and the design principles behind the balding pole and very
• 1:13:43
  quickly saw what Catapult was doing wrong, what we needed to
• 1:13:46
  do to fix that. So we fixed the pole and and I I
• 1:13:51
  got to market it. I was part of the R&D but mostly
• 1:13:56
  he taught me everything about composites, fire class and and
• 1:14:03
  what makes a pole work the way it's supposed to work or not
• 1:14:06
  work. And and I'm a good student.
• 1:14:10
  I really understood what he was doing.
• 1:14:11
  And we actually got Dave Kenworthy on the pole and he
• 1:14:15
  went indoors. Everything was just going, man,
• 1:14:17
  this is like, wow, you know, we had an ad campaign going.
• 1:14:21
  I was really excited. And then all of a sudden it just
• 1:14:24
  got cut off and I found out that the owner was spending his money
• 1:14:27
  on an $8000 golf cart. And I didn't like California.
• 1:14:31
  So I I left. I just told him I left,
• 1:14:34
  actually, I told him, I told him, I told him I'm going to
• 1:14:36
  leave in the fall. So I'll give you some.
• 1:14:39
  This was in in in May, the end of May.
• 1:14:43
  He's some time to bring something and I can train him,
• 1:14:45
  he said. No, you're fired that day.
• 1:14:48
  So we all of a sudden we were just out in the cold in in in
• 1:14:52
  Anaheim going home. Oh, I guess I should have kept
• 1:14:54
  my mouth shut. He likes that.
• 1:14:56
  So, so we came up to Eugene, found some other things to do.
• 1:15:00
  But when I started coaching for Bill Dillinger, he talked Dick,
• 1:15:06
  Hell and Javelin to hiring me for Oregon track equipment.
• 1:15:13
  Knew nothing about javelins or discus.
• 1:15:16
  Started as just a grunt labor guy.
• 1:15:19
  But by three or four years I was running.
• 1:15:22
  Dick did not want to have to do that.
• 1:15:24
  So I was actually Ron Johnson. I was supposed to be running it,
• 1:15:27
  but Ron really didn't want to do anything.
• 1:15:28
  So I was running working traffic women.
• 1:15:31
  I built all the disks and and. And pause right there for a
• 1:15:35
  second because we have to give some historical context to this
• 1:15:39
  just here a little bit. Our average listener here is 35
• 1:15:45
  to 40 years old. So you just named first of all
• 1:15:49
  go back to Ampro. You named Herb Jinx, the
• 1:15:53
  godfather of fiberglass vaulting poles.
• 1:15:55
  That fair to say you you know as a vaulters.
• 1:15:59
  We, you know I've heard now your story and obviously you know it
• 1:16:02
  feels like if I were to to cut your arm you would bleed
• 1:16:05
  vaulting poles. I mean that's or maybe shards of
• 1:16:09
  fiberglass. There you go.
• 1:16:12
  So you have to be thinking a little bit like a kid in a candy
• 1:16:16
  store when you're there working on vaulting poles.
• 1:16:19
  I mean, you came through, you started with a steel in your
• 1:16:21
  back alley, you saw bamboo and you see the progression of
• 1:16:25
  fiberglass and you're in the muck of it, in the middle of it,
• 1:16:29
  learning it, fixing it, Mark, I mean that's.
• 1:16:34
  Outside of being a full time coach, that seemed like that was
• 1:16:36
  maybe a dream job at that. Oh absolutely.
• 1:16:38
  Yeah. Yeah, very, very exciting.
• 1:16:40
  And then? That goes SA little bit.
• 1:16:42
  But now you go to Oregon track equipment OTE Oregon track
• 1:16:45
  equipment and you're working with Dick Held.
• 1:16:48
  Come on, legend. Ron Johnson.
• 1:16:52
  Come on legend. I mean Bill Dellinger, the
• 1:16:56
  owner. I mean that's.
• 1:16:57
  Yeah, you're you're in a really special time with really special
• 1:17:01
  people in regards to specifically the equipment side
• 1:17:04
  of track and field, which we all know how intensive your track
• 1:17:09
  and field is. Absolutely.
• 1:17:10
  You know, and the javelin is such a special implement
• 1:17:13
  aerodynamic, even though they changed the rules and not as
• 1:17:15
  much as it was, but the things that Dick invented and did.
• 1:17:19
  And you know, once again, I was a good student and I learned
• 1:17:23
  everything that Dick wanted to teach me about not just the
• 1:17:28
  process but why we were doing it.
• 1:17:31
  Why the, you know, and the OTE comp still has a world record,
• 1:17:36
  you know, even though everybody wants to throw carbons.
• 1:17:38
  But the what he did to make that javelin, the best javelin that's
• 1:17:42
  ever been new rule And the old rules, he had the world record
• 1:17:46
  with the old rule javelin too. So there was specific things
• 1:17:49
  that he did to make a javelin fly far and he was he was a
• 1:17:52
  genius. Absolutely.
• 1:17:55
  And so to work with him and to learn that was was really you
• 1:17:59
  know it was it was a great opportunity some hard times
• 1:18:02
  because we were a little tiny company trying to make it but
• 1:18:06
  but I you know the discus was really I really love the discus
• 1:18:10
  building the discus fixing some things you know and and our
• 1:18:14
  discus won the Olympics in 96 Riedel threw it.
• 1:18:20
  So that was a big deal for us, you know, and and and you know,
• 1:18:23
  and of course at the time, Puskas was the top channel
• 1:18:27
  thrower and he would send in javelins to us and we would
• 1:18:30
  rework them every year to make them just barely legal.
• 1:18:34
  So they fly. And those are the javelins that
• 1:18:36
  Celeste would borrow to step all his records with.
• 1:18:41
  We're we're Tom's javelin. So, so to be a part of that was
• 1:18:44
  really pretty amazing. But we weren't making it.
• 1:18:47
  We were. We didn't have the backing,
• 1:18:49
  financial backing and and the hurdle great.
• 1:18:52
  You know we had the automatic hurdle and it was a Craftsman.
• 1:18:55
  We were a little Craftsman shop, right.
• 1:18:58
  But it it was almost costing as much as we were selling stuff
• 1:19:02
  for. So we were so luckily this crazy
• 1:19:04
  company who you know, and I don't know if you know this, but
• 1:19:08
  in 901990 I worked for Gil. Really.
• 1:19:13
  I didn't know that part. No, because 91, actually,
• 1:19:17
  because I coached Dave Hodge for a fall before he came left.
• 1:19:24
  I had a connection. I called him up once again.
• 1:19:26
  I There's a theme there said you need to.
• 1:19:28
  Hire me. You need to hire me.
• 1:19:30
  But but so they tried it but you know at the time there was no
• 1:19:33
  Internet. So having somebody work offside
• 1:19:38
  it just didn't work. I I I tried they tried We just
• 1:19:43
  gonna make it work. There's just no way you know so
• 1:19:46
  I I had that connection and so luckily Gil bought OTE and you
• 1:19:51
  know you brought all the the the Gil Javelins out and all the
• 1:19:54
  discus stuff and and so from 9899 right in there till 2004 I
• 1:20:03
  ran the plant at here in Eugene and and actually you know I'm I
• 1:20:10
  miss those days those may that may have been my funnest time in
• 1:20:13
  my professional career because I was still coaching.
• 1:20:16
  But I was also running the plant, building Javelins and
• 1:20:20
  discs, getting to do the, the R&D stuff.
• 1:20:25
  You know I was actually able to be part of the R&D behind the FX
• 1:20:28
  volume poles and with the flex chart changes and going down to
• 1:20:34
  the Olympic training center with the javelins and discs really
• 1:20:39
  trying to do those kinds of thing interactive to improve the
• 1:20:41
  product So that was that was incredible so but things change
• 1:20:46
  and you guys needed to consolidate and I certainly
• 1:20:49
  understand that and being up after my experience with Ampro
• 1:20:55
  trying to live in California I know myself and and while I had
• 1:21:00
  some great offers and it's probably the hardest decision of
• 1:21:02
  my life to I just no way I was going to make it in Illinois I'm
• 1:21:07
  I'm I'm a West Coast mountain fly fishing kind of guy and I
• 1:21:11
  would have I would have failed and I knew that so I I stayed
• 1:21:15
  here so all of a sudden now I don't have to I got to figure
• 1:21:18
  out what to do so I I've got on board with first to finish.
• 1:21:22
  Is that right? Year and a half as an outside
• 1:21:25
  guy? And it was not.
• 1:21:29
  They were trying to figure it out.
• 1:21:30
  It was not a great marriage. And then they decided they
• 1:21:32
  didn't want any outside people at all.
• 1:21:34
  So they got rid of all of us within six months.
• 1:21:37
  So once again I was sitting here with with trying to figure out
• 1:21:42
  what the hell am I going to do. And that first time when first
• 1:21:45
  the finish hired me, after you know Gil had left, you guys had
• 1:21:51
  left. I contacted Ron and he he almost
• 1:21:56
  pulled the trigger, but he wasn't Ron Morris was on track.
• 1:21:59
  He and I worked with Ron. Clear back with the in my ampro
• 1:22:03
  days is when I I. Was wondering if there was a
• 1:22:05
  connection. I met him and then you know OGE
• 1:22:08
  days we sold to Ron stuff we so. But he wasn't ready.
• 1:22:13
  He wasn't ready to make that commitment.
• 1:22:16
  It just seemed too much for him to do because he's a pretty
• 1:22:18
  small shock. But after first to finish
• 1:22:23
  decided that and I was I called him back up and he said you know
• 1:22:26
  what then I missed it the first time.
• 1:22:27
  I'm not going to miss it this time so so he said we'll figure
• 1:22:31
  out a way to make it work and and so that was in 2007.
• 1:22:34
  OK. So and you know I it went really
• 1:22:39
  well and and you know obviously Ron's one of the best guys on
• 1:22:43
  the planet and he does have great stories but great
• 1:22:47
  integrity. So it was fun to be a part and
• 1:22:50
  since I had manufactured and I still coached and I still
• 1:22:53
  jumping he thought you know so I never really want to be a
• 1:22:56
  salesman necessarily that was goal of mine.
• 1:23:00
  But I I look at it as I'm just helping my buddies out get what
• 1:23:05
  they need tracking equipment. So that was going on fine until
• 1:23:09
  until the the pandemic and COVID just was more than wrong to hand
• 1:23:15
  you know and being that he's you know in his 80s much so
• 1:23:20
  basically OTE shut down and I you know so once again what what
• 1:23:24
  the hell am I going to do And luckily Steve Ringgold who is
• 1:23:27
  great guy and energetic and smart but on track back and so
• 1:23:34
  I'm selling equipment again. You know, first of all I would
• 1:23:38
  wonder in a in a different universe if Steve didn't bring
• 1:23:42
  you back would you have said Steve's smart.
• 1:23:44
  He was obviously very smart. You're like he's very smart.
• 1:23:47
  He kept me on. He brought me on.
• 1:23:49
  He's very intelligent man. And you know Steve, we love you.
• 1:23:52
  We, you know, we you'd be intelligent no matter what.
• 1:23:54
  We get it. We get it.
• 1:23:56
  What what's it like? Again, I just think about this.
• 1:23:59
  You know, cut you open and Fiberglass comes out and you're
• 1:24:02
  working with Ron Morris, who? You know, I I was impressed the
• 1:24:07
  very first time I ever met Ron because you mentioned 80 years
• 1:24:11
  old, you know, at his age and stage he was with it, buddy.
• 1:24:15
  I mean you would if if you didn't know, if you were only
• 1:24:18
  like on the phone or something with him, you might not have
• 1:24:20
  known he was 80 years old. I mean, he was very involved in
• 1:24:23
  the business that he owned, very involved in vaulting.
• 1:24:27
  I mean, he was really good. What was it like working for?
• 1:24:30
  I mean a gold Med? I mean, Vault has been your life
• 1:24:33
  since 5th grade and here you are working for a gold medalist in
• 1:24:36
  the vault. Well, and he's so, I think and
• 1:24:39
  and so. Great description of him by the
• 1:24:42
  way. Yes, nailed it.
• 1:24:43
  A lot of people talk to talk but he he he get he cares about
• 1:24:47
  track and field so it really it was about getting equipment to
• 1:24:53
  athletes and coaches to help him out you know and and of course
• 1:24:58
  he he was also a tough nut because you know he some of the
• 1:25:03
  things that he did you know I mean he had the high school
• 1:25:06
  record at one time the national high school record on on bamboo
• 1:25:12
  jumped 13 three or 613 somewhere in there and then to get on to
• 1:25:20
  steal in college you know and and get to the Olympics he
• 1:25:25
  jumped 15-8 and most of the guys in the steel back in that era
• 1:25:31
  were big guys big shrunk because you had to be and he wasn't so
• 1:25:36
  he was a great technician so he learned how to vault really
• 1:25:38
  well. OK and you know he's got great
• 1:25:40
  stories about bad pits talk about bad pits landing not just
• 1:25:44
  in sawdus but in sand sometimes jumping 14 feet landing in a in
• 1:25:49
  a basically a long jump hit. I mean just incredible but then
• 1:25:55
  everybody quit when fiberglass came because and except so there
• 1:26:00
  was a a new batch of young guys that had started on steel but
• 1:26:03
  all the all the guys that have been jumping still and he didn't
• 1:26:07
  he kept jumping so 15/8 was right at the world record.
• 1:26:11
  He had shots at the world record and then he jumped 16, six and a
• 1:26:15
  little bit on on glass. So and and probably the most
• 1:26:18
  amazing thing about him. I'm just telling the stories
• 1:26:21
  because it says who he is. He never know Heiden in his
• 1:26:25
  whole career. I'm.
• 1:26:27
  I don't know anybody. No, everybody.
• 1:26:31
  Yeah, he never know Heiden. And so you know that just kind
• 1:26:35
  of that's who Ron Morris was. And you know, he coached for a
• 1:26:39
  while, but he wasn't. That wasn't his passion, you
• 1:26:45
  know, And I think finding the equipment side of it to help
• 1:26:49
  people was really the side that really worked for him to help
• 1:26:52
  everything out. But you know, genuine, genuine
• 1:26:55
  guy. He loved to tell stories, He
• 1:26:57
  loved to hear my stories. So we got along great.
• 1:27:00
  We got along. I can imagine.
• 1:27:02
  I can imagine. Oh man, that's awesome.
• 1:27:04
  Well, we're so happy. You know, Ron did an amazing job
• 1:27:08
  building on track and field. And you know a company like
• 1:27:11
  that, you know, you start having legacy, you start having roots.
• 1:27:15
  Into the sport of track and field on track is is very
• 1:27:17
  important for track and field. And so as Ron, you know during
• 1:27:21
  COVID and you know trying to sell the the business, you know
• 1:27:25
  there was a little bit of touch and go of like is this the end
• 1:27:28
  of on track And it was like oh man, that's not right, it's not
• 1:27:31
  right for Ron's legacy to be honest with you.
• 1:27:33
  And so it was very happy when Steve Ringold, you know came
• 1:27:36
  along, purchased it and and again you know obviously was
• 1:27:38
  very intelligent by keeping you going on there as well.
• 1:27:42
  So what's it been like? You know, I don't.
• 1:27:45
  Not a lot of people know what we do.
• 1:27:47
  You know what what you do? Serving approaches with track
• 1:27:50
  and field equipment, You know, and let me say it here loud and
• 1:27:53
  clear, everything you see in our catalog.
• 1:27:56
  And West and on track sells that.
• 1:27:58
  It's not a they only sell this or that or whatnot that they are
• 1:28:01
  full line. They're one of our great, great
• 1:28:03
  partners out there. What's it like?
• 1:28:05
  You didn't grow up wanting to be a salesman.
• 1:28:07
  You weren't a salesman, You were a plant manager, You were a
• 1:28:10
  javelin builder, you were a pole vault pole builder.
• 1:28:14
  What's it like transitioning to sales?
• 1:28:16
  And I think, and you're probably going to say it again when you
• 1:28:20
  talk about helping my buddies get equipment, at the end of the
• 1:28:22
  day, what our job is, is to serve others.
• 1:28:25
  What's that been like? Switching that role into being a
• 1:28:28
  servant for other coaches to help them not grow up the way
• 1:28:31
  you grew up with one pole and no pit and things like that.
• 1:28:35
  But yeah, you say that's exactly it, you know, and and it's
• 1:28:40
  there's a balance there. There's some challenges, right,
• 1:28:42
  because we all have budgets and and so you know some equipment
• 1:28:50
  doesn't really matter. Some equipment matters a lot,
• 1:28:54
  the quality, the level and and the higher the quality, the more
• 1:28:58
  you're going to pay for it. So there's always that balance
• 1:29:01
  of what's the best thing for that part of your program.
• 1:29:05
  You know, high school kids don't need to throw the best javelin
• 1:29:10
  that was ever built. They don't need to pay $1000 to
• 1:29:13
  throw the jab. What you want javelin that's
• 1:29:15
  going to last. You want to javelin that that's
• 1:29:18
  legal. So if you just bring in,
• 1:29:23
  there's, I don't say any names, but you bring in certain
• 1:29:25
  Javelins, they may not be legal And so you know even if you pay
• 1:29:30
  200 bucks, 300 bucks for Javelin, you expect it to be
• 1:29:33
  legal. That's right.
• 1:29:35
  So if there's that balance, there's there's a lot of
• 1:29:40
  challenges being in and on track because you know with the
• 1:29:45
  Internet and with larger entities out there that can beat
• 1:29:49
  you on price and and coaches want the best price obviously
• 1:29:53
  because they they have a very limited budget.
• 1:29:55
  So you're trying to find that balance, you know, all the time
• 1:29:59
  of making sure you match the quality and the workmanship of
• 1:30:04
  the product to what that coach needs, you know?
• 1:30:07
  And and sometimes it works out great.
• 1:30:10
  Sometimes it's real frustrating because you get beat just
• 1:30:12
  because of price. Sometimes you got a great
• 1:30:15
  customer and then all of a sudden that coach moves on and
• 1:30:17
  you lose and you got to convince somebody and they, they don't
• 1:30:22
  believe you and they buy some lesser quality equipment and
• 1:30:26
  they're like, man, why did I do that?
• 1:30:27
  You see them in a show and they go, hi, man, I really messed
• 1:30:29
  that up. I shouldn't have bought that.
• 1:30:31
  It's not working out for me. But by the time they're ready to
• 1:30:34
  buy that again, they're gone. So you go through it.
• 1:30:36
  So there there's all those challenges but you know luck.
• 1:30:40
  Luckily for me once again I I I've hooked up with the guy
• 1:30:44
  Steve that that you know and everybody says it but you you
• 1:30:49
  you actually walk the walk and I just talk it and quality taking
• 1:30:53
  care of people is it's really important you know and and
• 1:30:58
  there's a lot of BS out there you can say a lot of things to
• 1:31:03
  people you know but but the I think you know when the rubber
• 1:31:07
  meets the road if if you take care of your customer if you
• 1:31:10
  give them actual you know good information.
• 1:31:14
  You know a lot of coaches call up and they go I got this kid
• 1:31:18
  he's jumping 13 feet we got to get him on 15 foot poles.
• 1:31:21
  Well you know that's not the right thing it's not the right
• 1:31:24
  thing for the kid and and so can you help the guy understand that
• 1:31:29
  convince him help teach him. So that's a fun thing to do
• 1:31:32
  right. And like the javelin and some
• 1:31:36
  somebody wants a a 90% rimweight disc because they they read that
• 1:31:41
  somebody threw that real far. You know and your kids run 100
• 1:31:43
  feet. Well that's not going to work
• 1:31:45
  for your kid and you explain why.
• 1:31:48
  I've got the background to not just be ask them but to tell
• 1:31:51
  them exactly why and get the right discus that not only can
• 1:31:54
  they afford but the kid will have more success with so.
• 1:31:57
  So if you can find those kinds of things, you know, be
• 1:31:59
  innovative, you know, work with people that care, that really do
• 1:32:03
  care and try to do it the right way.
• 1:32:05
  And luckily I've landed there once again, you know, on track
• 1:32:08
  could have gone in a lot of different directions and I've
• 1:32:11
  been around long enough that I wouldn't put up with being with
• 1:32:14
  a company that that didn't do that, you know.
• 1:32:17
  So it's still a challenge because pricing is so important,
• 1:32:22
  you know, and and the the Internet makes it harder, but
• 1:32:27
  there's still a place out there for people you know.
• 1:32:30
  And if you're a distance coach and you're great, the best
• 1:32:34
  distance coach in the world, but you never coach the ball, how
• 1:32:38
  are you going to know what what pole do I really need?
• 1:32:41
  I've got my kid. He's doing this.
• 1:32:42
  I what do I go to? What's the next pole?
• 1:32:45
  You know? And it's it's not just automatic
• 1:32:48
  because maybe the kids 5 feet, 6 inches tall, maybe 6-4 and
• 1:32:53
  that's going to influence what poll you really should go to,
• 1:32:56
  you know, So as an example, so you know, you're just trying to
• 1:32:59
  help those things out and then you, you got to follow up
• 1:33:01
  because things don't go right in this world, right.
• 1:33:06
  Things get broken and shipping, things get shipped wrong from
• 1:33:10
  you guys, from us. Those problems happen.
• 1:33:14
  And you know, and so if you're up front, well, that's my
• 1:33:17
  mistake. That's on me.
• 1:33:18
  We'll fix it. You fix it and then you can
• 1:33:22
  build that reputation and take care of some coaches and pretty
• 1:33:26
  soon that you build that salesman referral list that that
• 1:33:31
  you need. And then so people come back to
• 1:33:33
  to say, hey, you know, Dan's my man, He's going to take care of
• 1:33:36
  me. I don't care what it costs.
• 1:33:38
  And then you get all the new guys.
• 1:33:40
  You got to convince him of that. So it's it's it's a good
• 1:33:42
  challenge. It's a fun challenge.
• 1:33:44
  But like you said, I mean you you said it exactly the way for
• 1:33:47
  me, it really is helping, helping the sport, helping kids.
• 1:33:52
  You know, just like I said, I've got a girl coming in from a a
• 1:33:56
  good, good high school, but they don't care about the vault.
• 1:34:01
  So she had one pole, the vaulter.
• 1:34:04
  One pole. I mean, what can you?
• 1:34:06
  You can't be a vaulter which is 1 pole.
• 1:34:09
  It's either too big or too small eventually.
• 1:34:12
  You can't be a good vaulter. You're still a vaulter.
• 1:34:15
  That's the. So you know what?
• 1:34:16
  For me, if I had known that, I would like to, you know, I'd
• 1:34:19
  like to try to help that coach say no, you need, you need to
• 1:34:24
  build. If you want to have Walters, you
• 1:34:25
  need to build that up a little bit.
• 1:34:26
  Here's what you got to do. Here's the series to help you.
• 1:34:29
  So. So that's kind of what it's been
• 1:34:30
  like that. Does that answer your question?
• 1:34:31
  Absolutely, Yeah. And you know what?
• 1:34:33
  What really struck me there, Dan?
• 1:34:35
  You know, I'm speaking to the coaches who are listening right
• 1:34:38
  now. You know, I, we have a dealer
• 1:34:42
  network built out. So I talked to the salespeople
• 1:34:45
  all across this country. What Dan just said, there's
• 1:34:48
  really important, if you're looking for who to purchase
• 1:34:53
  track and field equipment from, find you a sales professional.
• 1:34:57
  That's different than a salesman, by the way.
• 1:34:59
  The salesman conjures up the used car salesman, the snake oil
• 1:35:02
  salesman. A sales professional serves
• 1:35:05
  their customers. Find you a sales professional
• 1:35:08
  that will try to talk you out of buying something.
• 1:35:11
  That's that's key to me. When I hear a sales professional
• 1:35:14
  like Dan say that, my ears perk up and it's like, Oh yeah, this
• 1:35:18
  is a person you can trust because the person who doesn't
• 1:35:21
  have your best interest at heart says, oh, you want that 90% room
• 1:35:24
  weight discus for your 100 foot thrower.
• 1:35:26
  Sure you want your money. Have you ever heard that?
• 1:35:29
  Your money. What is your money?
• 1:35:31
  And we know how limited and how important that money is to you,
• 1:35:35
  whether you're a mom buying that for your kids, or your own
• 1:35:37
  personal money, or your coach taking it out of your budget
• 1:35:40
  that they don't give you enough of.
• 1:35:43
  Find you a sales professional that will try to talk you out of
• 1:35:46
  something like, hey, I'd rather you take that.
• 1:35:48
  Listen, I'm just going to make up numbers.
• 1:35:49
  Instead of, you know, paying 708 hundred, whatever that discus
• 1:35:52
  might be, I'd rather you buy five $100 discuses that are in
• 1:35:58
  this room weight. And now you're getting more reps
• 1:36:00
  for that kid and that person's going to go from 100 to 110
• 1:36:03
  hundred 2000. And you know what?
• 1:36:04
  When they get to 180, a 190 maybe, maybe, maybe they need to
• 1:36:08
  throw that. But guess what?
• 1:36:10
  Not everybody needs to throw that either, by the way.
• 1:36:12
  Find that person, and that's the person that's going to sell you
• 1:36:16
  your big ticket items, your pole vault pits, your hurts, your
• 1:36:18
  hurdles, your cages with an honest and fair deal.
• 1:36:23
  They're going to. They got your best interest at
• 1:36:25
  heart. They're not trying to get every
• 1:36:26
  single dollar out of your budget.
• 1:36:27
  They're there to help you make your budget work for you.
• 1:36:31
  Anytime you hear a sales professional say that, your ears
• 1:36:34
  should perk up and be like, oh, I should at least.
• 1:36:36
  Talk to this person. Like this person is some
• 1:36:37
  trustworthy person. The salesman, the saleswoman
• 1:36:40
  that just says, hey, it's your money.
• 1:36:42
  You want that? Sure, I'll sell it to you.
• 1:36:45
  They got their, their best interest at heart at that point.
• 1:36:48
  And so, Dan, I just appreciate the way you conduct business.
• 1:36:52
  It makes it when you know when you know, my whole world is in
• 1:36:55
  the ecosystem of coaches. So I have coaches all the time.
• 1:36:57
  Well, who should I buy from? Where should I get this?
• 1:36:59
  Etcetera. It's always.
• 1:37:01
  Comforting. It's a it's a rolodex of people
• 1:37:04
  like yourself that it's like, oh hey, you want to know?
• 1:37:06
  First of all, Dan, you have such an amazing background in the
• 1:37:09
  manufacturing side of it. You have a whole different
• 1:37:12
  education and experience level that you know 99.9% of all sales
• 1:37:17
  people in our world in the track and field equipment world aren't
• 1:37:19
  ever going to be able to touch. So I just love you know be able
• 1:37:22
  to give a coach to you to work with because it's like oh you've
• 1:37:24
  got you know, heck and like you know you and I have talked to
• 1:37:26
  javelins before. It's like Oh yeah, you are light
• 1:37:29
  years ahead of me my friend. And I know decent amount because
• 1:37:31
  it happens right across that door.
• 1:37:32
  But you've had your hands in the mug doing it, that's you know
• 1:37:35
  you can't pay for that education.
• 1:37:37
  But then to know that even against your best interest and
• 1:37:43
  selling that $900 discus versus the selling you know $100 discus
• 1:37:48
  that you will do that for your? Coaches for your clients, for
• 1:37:52
  your customers. That is what builds and that's
• 1:37:56
  why you've built the reputation that you've built today.
• 1:37:59
  Those people who have worked with you.
• 1:38:00
  I've talked to a lot of those coaches before and they're like,
• 1:38:03
  yeah, yeah, Dan's the man. That's who I go to.
• 1:38:05
  That's my guy. I don't have to worry about a
• 1:38:07
  lot of things because I have Dan on my team, on my staff almost,
• 1:38:11
  if you will. Dan's my equipment manager, if
• 1:38:13
  you will. That is just what makes life a
• 1:38:15
  lot easier, only for myself, ourselves here as a
• 1:38:19
  manufacturer, having you represent Gill Athletics
• 1:38:21
  equipment out there, but also as coaches out there, it's just
• 1:38:25
  you've got so much going on. Coach recruiting, coaching,
• 1:38:29
  paperwork, NIL transfer portal, etcetera.
• 1:38:34
  It's at your own lives. You have your own family.
• 1:38:37
  Families and passions and charities.
• 1:38:39
  Here's a way to have some comfort in your decisions.
• 1:38:44
  Like I said, it's almost like he's on your staff here.
• 1:38:46
  So Dan, I'm just so thankful for that posture that you have in
• 1:38:50
  your salesmanship. Then you're a true sales
• 1:38:52
  professional out there. Thank you.
• 1:38:53
  Thank you. Appreciate that, man.
• 1:38:55
  Cool. Dan man we went around the world
• 1:38:58
  we we we learned something How important is it to go to someone
• 1:39:02
  like hey man you need to hire me like I I love that some bumption
• 1:39:05
  there if you will and I love that because if you don't all
• 1:39:09
  you know sometimes people don't know they should be hiring you
• 1:39:11
  So I love that that never fight attitude I love love love that
• 1:39:16
  thank goodness it the snow melted and it rained and that
• 1:39:20
  river flooded because. It seemed very picturesque
• 1:39:25
  before that. And you're saying you're looking
• 1:39:26
  down, you see salmon swimming? Come on, who doesn't want that?
• 1:39:29
  Thank goodness you had to move. And there was this crazy 2 by 4
• 1:39:33
  with a steel pole sitting in your alley.
• 1:39:36
  Man, cuz I think for sometimes my wife isn't sure.
• 1:39:39
  Yeah, I bet, I bet, I bet. But I do wonder sometimes, you
• 1:39:43
  know, obviously that was kind of a catalyst to build this amazing
• 1:39:46
  career in life that you've had up to this point.
• 1:39:48
  What's awesome is that life and career is continuing on, my
• 1:39:51
  friend. Today's not the end by any
• 1:39:52
  means. Means you have many, many years
• 1:39:53
  ahead of you serving coaches around the country.
• 1:39:56
  But I think a guy like you, I think you were put on this earth
• 1:39:59
  for the vault in some form or fashion whether it's coaching,
• 1:40:01
  manufacturing, selling, etcetera.
• 1:40:03
  I think even if you would have stayed in that crazy you know,
• 1:40:08
  Forest River area and maybe even if that high school didn't have
• 1:40:12
  vaulting, I think you still, I think vaulting still would have
• 1:40:15
  found you whether you would have seen it on TV1 day as a 24 year
• 1:40:18
  old like oh man, that's kind of a cool event.
• 1:40:19
  I should just try that. I think, I think it was no
• 1:40:22
  stopping you and the vault coming together and it's made
• 1:40:26
  for a great life with some great adventures and some great people
• 1:40:30
  that you've had in your network, in your circle, and you have
• 1:40:33
  become one of those great people for other people, man.
• 1:40:35
  So I'm just so grateful and so thankful for what you have done,
• 1:40:38
  what you continue to do now and what you will do here in the
• 1:40:41
  next few years, as well as you continue on in your career.
• 1:40:45
  Well, thank you man. I appreciate that means a lot to
• 1:40:46
  me. Absolutely.
• 1:40:47
  And thank you for being here, man.
• 1:40:49
  I told you this would be a fun one.
• 1:40:50
  We'd have a kind of a mash up of a whole bunch of things and I'm
• 1:40:53
  willing to bet there's at least 20 more stories still hidden
• 1:40:55
  back there I wasn't able to pull out.
• 1:40:57
  We might have to revisit this one day and do it all over
• 1:41:00
  again, but so grateful that you would join us here on the Guild
• 1:41:03
  Connections podcast as we uplifted on our coaches from
• 1:41:05
  around the country, including coaches like this that have
• 1:41:09
  what? Just a unique background, Man, I
• 1:41:11
  love it. Especially as a manufacturer at
• 1:41:12
  heart. I just absolutely love it.
• 1:41:14
  So thanks for being here. Check us out next week, We'll do
• 1:41:16
  it all over again. Have a great week, everybody.