Latest / Brewsers / Brewsers #398- Alexander Marzec

Transcript

Brewsers #398- Alexander Marzec · Brewsers

• 0:20
  Speaker 1: Welcome to Bruisers, a podcast about beer, coffee, booze, and Bruisers.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: I am your host, Ray John, and today we talk
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: to Alexander Marzik. We talk about the cannabis industry, what
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: the future looks like, and so much more. Alexander has
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: been in the cannabis industry for so many years. He's
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: seen so many ups and downs when it comes to
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: this industry, and you don't want to hear from me,
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: you want to hear from him. So without further ado,
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: here is Alexander Marzik.
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: Welcome to Bruisers.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: I would like to welcome to the show Alexander Marzik.
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: How are you doing today, sir?
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: Doing great, sir. Thanks for having me.
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: Thanks for being here. So for those listening, kind of
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: paint us a word picture. Where are you at and
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: what's going on around you?
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so like I was saying before, I'm in my
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: man cave basement office, grow room, all around, you know, uh, uh,
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: make makeshift laboratory, I guess. Laboratory of the mind.
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: There you go. Well, let's go all the way back
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: in time. What is your earliest memory of cannabis?
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: Uh, so my earliest memories of cannabis, um, you know,
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: surround times with, uh, with my brother. Um, you know,
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: my brother's, uh, seven years older than I am. So, uh,
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: you know, he and his friends hit high school, um,
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: And I was still, you know, a young guy, but,
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: you know, I was kind of the brother that could
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: hang out and not tell mom and dad about it. So,
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: you know, I remember, you know, driving around in the
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: back of Suburbans in, you know, actually I grew up
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: mostly in San Antonio in Texas. So, you know, remember
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: times driving around in the back of cars and smoking,
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: you know, hanging out in the street, playing basketball or,
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: you know, tackle football in the street like we used
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: to in the early 90s. You know, but then for me,
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: you know, the kind of the bigger catalyst to that
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: is around the same time, you know, D.A.R.E. happened, right? And,
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: you know, when I came into D.A.R.E., you know, it
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: basically said, well, you know, doing this is going to
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: kill you, you know? And it's like, well, I've already done.
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: It and I'm not dead.
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: So, you know, that was kind of what led me
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: down a long path of, you know, asking questions, trying
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: to learn more, you know, not necessarily trusting what authority
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: had to say. So, yeah.
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: No, I mean, It's so funny because I see the D.A.R.E.
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: people now and I ask them about weed and they
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: don't even talk about weed anymore.
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: They don't even talk about weed anymore.
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: It's fucking hilarious to me.
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: It's crazy. It's crazy.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: Well, I think it's because we have realized now, especially
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: at this point, that it's not the problem. It's not
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: the gateway drug. Alcohol, if anything, is the gateway drug.
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: If we're talking about gateway drugs, that's the one.
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, I've said that and, you know, at
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: a lot of times in my career and, you know,
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: I think that you know, one of the reasons why
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: I got into, you know, even selling cannabis at a
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: small scale, you know, when I was younger is that
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: I always wanted to make sure that me and all
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: my friends had good stuff, right? And, you know, I
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: think that that's what eventually, you know, parlayed into, you know,
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: wanting to, you know, originally the thought of wanting to
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: make medicine when I saw how, you know, cannabis was
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: potentially healing people or being used to you know, treat
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: people during the early nineties, uh, you know, up into
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: the two thousands. Um, you know, so that's, that's really
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: kind of what, um, inspired me to, to go down
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: this path all those years ago. Yeah.
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: What was the deciding factor for you for, well, I
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: guess for, right. For people who don't know, walk us
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: through what you do right now in the world.
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So, so right now I'm, I'm a cannabis consultant.
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: I advise, I run a, uh, an advisory firm. Uh, I,
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: advise on, uh, you know, all aspects of cannabis operations, uh,
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: from seed to sale. Um, and, uh, you know, I've
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: been in the legal side of cannabis since 2013, uh,
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: late 2013, early 2014. Um, you know, before that I've,
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: I've been either in, you know, uh, direct cannabis production or,
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: you know, working within the culture, uh, you know, for
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: over 25 years. Um, I did a long stint managing
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: a chain of head shops back in Texas a long,
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: long time ago, another lifetime ago, you know, before I
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: struck out on, you know, being in the legal cannabis business.
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: But yeah, so, you know, I have a long storied tenure.
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: I've worked for small scale businesses, large scale businesses, startups,
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: multi-state operators, publicly traded businesses. cannabis companies I've, I've, I've
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: worked for, um, you know, the gamut.
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: So how did, what was, I mean, like you said,
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: you initially got in clearly when it was not legal in,
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: in almost anywhere here in America, unfortunately, what was your
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: kind of step into it when it came to, Oh shit,
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: I can actually like work for a legal place that
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: does this. Like, this is so bizarre to me.
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So, um, you know, I mean, I grew up,
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: you know, uh, uh, like I said before, you know,
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: trying to, uh, make money at it. Um, you, you know, uh, uh,
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: make sure people were having a great time with it, but,
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: you know, also, uh, you know, uh, turn it into
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: a craft. Uh, you know, I, I learned to grow
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: at a young age while I was still in high school. Um,
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: you know, got, got to see a lot of the
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: ins and outs of that. Um, like I said, ended
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: up working for, um, a, um, um, A chain of
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: head shops where I got access to a lot of
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: books and information that aren't just out there in the
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: public library at the time. So I wanted to be
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: the person that knew more about cannabis than anybody else
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: I knew, basically. I went to college for a short
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: time for anthropology, focusing on ethnobotany, which is the study
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: of plants and the evolution of plants and man alongside
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: each other. Um, and so, you know, plants have always been, um, um,
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: you know, fascinating to me. I've, I've always, uh, you know,
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: grown different things here or there, whether it's, you know,
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: veggies or, uh, um, you know, cannabis, I got into,
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: you know, mushroom growing, uh, for a time. Um, you know,
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: and that's, that's kind of what, um, you know, led
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: me on this, this journey, you know, I, I, I
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: kind of got into a situation in Texas and, and
• 7:33
  Speaker 2: needed to, to move on. Um, and, uh, you know,
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: I found myself driving, um, you know, coast to coast
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: living in a truck, um, and, um, you know, found,
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: found my, uh, you know, my current wife, my, my,
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: my life partner, um, and, uh, you know, through all
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: that and then landed in, uh, Denver, uh, had been
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: to Colorado before, but the laws of being able to
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: work in the legal business in Colorado were a little
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: strenuous at the time. You had to live there for
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: a couple of years, filed a couple of tax returns,
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: that kind of stuff. So when I first went to Colorado,
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: I wasn't able to take up residence and get a
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: job in cannabis. But then I found myself there at
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: the end of 2013, beginning of 2014. The recreational market
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: opened up and they changed the rules on, you know,
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: people being able to be in the legal side of things. So,
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: you know, I got a what they called a med
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: badge at the time. It's a, you know, a worker's
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: badge for the state of Colorado and, you know, went
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: to work as a bud tender to get my foot
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: in the door.
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: Even though I had been working, you know, with cannabis
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: and in and out of the culture for a long time,
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: I still had to do what everybody else does when
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: they're getting into things. Previously, before all that, you didn't
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: take pictures of the work that you did.
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: You didn't show anybody that wasn't cool.
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: Right, right. That was a one-way ticket to going to jail. Um,
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: you know, when, when you come out of the, the,
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: the darkness and into the light, right, you have to, um,
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: you know, put in that time and put in that effort. Um,
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: you know, so, uh, you know, going from a guy who,
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: you know, uh, lived in the back of a truck, um, all,
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: all the way to, you know, being a bud tender, um, to, uh,
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: being a partner in a startup cannabis business. to running
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: some of the biggest installations for some of the biggest
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: cannabis companies in the world in the span of about
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: 13 years.
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: That's wild.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: It's definitely been a very wild ride for sure.
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: What uh so i had a thought well what okay
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: so let's start with right now as of we're recording
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: this it is august 31st what is now the cannabis
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: laws in we'll start obviously texas is so backwards but
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: we'll start nationwide and.
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: Then Well, I mean, things are things are changing. You know,
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: you have rescheduling, you know, coming down for at least medical.
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: It's very nebulous still, though. You know, a lot of
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: companies are very hesitant. You know, they're not exactly sure
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: what's what's going to happen.
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: So you have companies that are, you know, splitting off
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: their their medical from their recreational companies. um, you know,
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: due to some of the language surrounding, um, applying for
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: a federal, uh, medical license, um, as well as you
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: have some companies that are doubling down on, on, um,
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: you know, purchasing other companies, whether they're, you know, I'll
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: be at medical or recreational. So, um, you know, it's,
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: it's kind of a, um, it's kind of all over
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: the place, really. Um, you know, obviously you have places
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: like Texas where, um, you know, when, when I was
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: growing up, if you told a cop, it was THCA hemp,
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: you're still going to jail. You know, there's no, you know, and,
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: and that whole entire market, I think, you know, really, um,
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: you know, really took me by surprise in 2018 when
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: people decided they were going to, you know, set up
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: multimillion dollar cannabis businesses on a, on a loophole. Um,
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: you know, I, I think that that's a really crazy thing. Um,
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: you know, and it's kind of in the same realm as, um,
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: you know, the, the research chemical or, uh, you know, uh, uh,
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: you know, back when, I guess, like when, uh, um, um,
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: you know, the, what the plant food or bath salts or, um, uh,
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: you know, the K2, the spice era, you know, um,
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: that was kind of when I made the exit from, uh,
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: you know, the, the, the head shop business, right. Which
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: is where that kind of lives right now, that in
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: the gas station. Um, and, um, you know, for me,
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: I wasn't, you know, interested in being a part of
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: businesses that wanted to, you know, use loopholes to, to
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: make profits. Right. Um, so, you know, I think that there's,
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: you know, kind of this, uh, nationwide debate right now,
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: you know, as to, to what's going to happen with, um,
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: THCA hemp and, and just the hemp, you know, business
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: in general. Um, you know, which is, uh, you know,
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: fortunate for, you know, depending on which way it goes,
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: it could be fortunate for, for people in hemp. It
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: could be fortunate for, uh, people in cannabis. Um, but
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: you know, I think that there's in the end, the
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: end of that conversation is going to be winners and losers. Right. Um,
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: you know, I think that there's been a lot of
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: small to midsize, um, you know, cannabis companies, uh, that
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: are legal that, you know, have, have done their due diligence.
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: They've put up the money, they've gotten the licenses. they've
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: done everything that they're supposed to do. And then now
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: you have, you know, people in other States that, you know,
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: don't really have to get registered. You know, there's a
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: lot of gray area there. Um, you know, even with
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: the testing, even if you are registered and you're working through, uh, the, the,
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: you know, USDA or the, the, um, uh, the ag, um, organization, um,
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: you know, there's, there's, um, you're testing your cannabis at
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: week five, just so that you can meet these arbitrary
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: testing numbers of being below 0.3% THC. And really, I
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: guess maybe for people listening who don't really fully understand
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: what I'm talking about, in the 2018 Farm Bill, the
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: language for the decarboxylation or activation of THCA into its
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: psychoactive form, THC, you know, that that equation was left
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: out of the farm bill. Right. So before all federal
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: law stated that, you know, you had to be below
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: a certain amount of THC by weight. But, you know,
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: that that was done using an equation that would convert
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: THCA to THC. So since that got left out, people
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: thought that they created a loophole saying, oh, well, cannabis
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: is legal now or or, you know, THCA doesn't count. Um,
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: you know, none of that product that's, that's reaching the
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: customer is, um, compliant, um, at, at the point of sale. Right. Um,
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: you know, outside of maybe, you know, Delta eight, or
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: you could argue Delta eight, you could argue, you know,
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: some of these other cannabinoids that are made, uh, by
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: converting CBD into other THC molecules. Um, and, um, But,
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: you know, at least with the THCA market, I mean,
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: you're basically setting your customer up for failure. You know,
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: you have states where, you know, you can go to
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: the gas station and you can buy a THCA hemp joint.
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: And then you go down the street and get stopped
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: by the police. And they're like, hey, this is weed.
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: You know, you're going to jail.
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because they don't know the difference.
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: Right. Well, they don't know the difference, nor do they care.
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: And really, there is no difference. You know, at least
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: when it comes to the THCA hemp, there is no difference.
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: You know, and so, you know, certain states like, say, Texas,
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: you know, Texas, you know, when they pass their hemp
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: bill and, you know, started with the CBD medical there
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: in Texas, they changed the law. So the onus of proving,
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: you know, whether it's hemp or cannabis is on the
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: jurisdiction where the bust happens.
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: So. Um, you know, and, and maybe there's certain, you know,
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: cities that want to test the product, you know, say
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: Dallas or, you know, the big metropolitan cities, right. The
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: big metropolitan areas where they got the money to do that.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: But the, the, the small counties of Texas, they're not
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: going to have the money to test every single bag
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: of cannabis that they, uh, that they bust. Right. So, um,
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: you know, there was even, even before the THCA craze,
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: you know, there was, was kind of a lull in, um,
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: you know, prosecutions in, in cannabis within Texas. You know, it,
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: it sort of became a place where even though it
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: was highly illegal, you know, the, if you got pulled over,
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: the cop would still let you throw your bag out and,
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: and nothing would happen, you know? Right. You know, at
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: least in the, in the, the metropolitan areas. But, you know, I,
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: I think that, that, you know, I went from, and
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: cause I don't really go back to Texas a lot. So,
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: you know, I, I went from, from knowing and living
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: that to, you know, you know, being away for so
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: long that then I hear a news story that there's,
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: you know, a shootout at a THCA dispensary in San Antonio, Texas.
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: And I'm like, what? Yeah. There's a dispensary. They let
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: people get away with this stuff? Like, what's going on here?
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: You know, this is crazy.
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: This isn't Texas. This is another channel. Right.
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: This is not the Texas I know, you know? So... Um,
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: you know, it definitely has, has been interesting watching, you know,
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: the market there from afar, um, you know, and, and
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: kind of seeing how it's progressed and, and now, you know, that,
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: that it's, you know, kind of come to a head
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: where you have different aspects of, of, you know, the
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: Texas party, um, you know, kind of fighting back and
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: forth over it and, and, you know, who are they
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: going to side with, whether that's the business owners or
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: the veterans or, um, or, or the, you know.
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: The, the, um, The medicinal side of things or even
• 17:44
  Speaker 3: the strong religious demographic in the state because they obviously
• 17:49
  Speaker 3: don't want it.
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: Well, they claim they don't want it, but in actuality,
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: they really do.
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: Well, everybody in Texas consumes. I think that if Texas
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: were to legalize, it would probably be the largest buying
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: market in the country.
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: Oh, without a doubt. Also, like, what are we doing
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: with West Texas anyway? Like, if we're going to build
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: these data centers, why don't we build actual grow homes?
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: Makes no sense. And then you could also grow vegetables
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: and everything else in there.
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: Everything else there, right. I mean, there's so much of
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: Texas that's underutilized because it's just owned by, you know,
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: old families and old companies and stuff like that. And
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: they just, you know, hang on to it and let it,
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: you know, let it gain value, I guess. I don't know.
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: Right. But it's so amazing what we have seen when
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: it comes to so many states that are medicinal, which
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: is helping so many different people. And then obviously the
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: ones that are completely recreational, they have different rulings. But again,
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: we don't have a federal kind of guideline for all this.
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: So everyone's trying to figure it out themselves.
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: Right. Well, and not only that, but they're trying to,
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: it's sort of like a trifecta where they're trying to
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: do what they have to do to make the product
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: and then, you know, hear and take in and digest
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: the regulation that's coming from the state and then also
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: listen to how their lawyer interprets that information that's coming
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: from the state to decide what path to walk and
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: exactly where to put every dollar and where to put
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: their product, what states to be in.
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: So, I mean, we talked about you've done this for
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: over 25 years. What are some things that you see
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: that you've seen along the way that you think that
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: there's a really big glimmer of hope somewhere in the future? Because, again,
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: we're all in somewhat of a gray area when we
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: don't know what states are going to be, let's say,
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: recreational or completely not or what the government does on it.
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: whole because, you know, Trump is a little hot-tempered sometimes.
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: Who knows?
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: Right. But at the same time, you know, it's a
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: hot-button issue. It's an issue that, you know, more people
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: care about today than ever have, you know. And you
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: see that in a lot of different metrics, not just polling, right. Um,
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: you know, people, uh, um, you know, polling with their
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: dollar answering with their dollar, right. You know, um, you
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: see the, the drop in, in, uh, alcohol sales, you know,
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: year over year, you know, comparatively to the gain in,
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: in cannabis sales year over year. Um, you know, I,
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: I think that, um, um, the biggest, you know, the
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: biggest thing I think is, is that, you know, more
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: people have access today than ever before.
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: And that's a, that's a win.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: It's in Target. Like that's insane. It is.
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: And, you know, I, all those years ago, you know,
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: I thought about, you know, making, you know, I thought
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: about and did, you know, make Rick Simpson oil, make
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: products that, you know, not only help people with their health, but,
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: you know, made people happy. Right. And I think that
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: that's really inevitably what, making a product and having a brand,
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: you know, really is, whether that's cannabis or alcohol or,
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: you know, soda, right? And so, you know, in that,
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: I think that, you know, the genie's out of the bottle.
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: It's not going anywhere. And not only that, but you
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: see that because, you know, the European markets and or,
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: you know, we call them the EU GMP markets, which
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: is basically EU, Thailand, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia. Those
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: markets are broadening faster than ever before. They're happening, which
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: is amazing. And not only that, but they are actually using... uh,
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: you know, GMP, EU GMP, uh, for, for those of
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: you who don't know, good manufacturer practices, um, you know,
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: typically used in the creation of, of pharmaceuticals, but also
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: things like, uh, beverage and, and, you know, tobacco, stuff
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: like that. Um, and you know, what that is, is
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: basically a framework of safety, right. Where, um, you know,
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: a lot of, um, States, especially the early ones, you know, Colorado, Washington,
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: You know, the regulators didn't know what these companies were
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: doing at all. You know, they had no idea and
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: they had no, you know, even though they were trying
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: to regulate it, you know, without being on the inside,
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: without being a, you know, a cannabis insider, a person
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: who develops cannabis products and all those types of things
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: all those many years ago. You know, there's no way
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: for them to really understand how to regulate. Right.
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: They know how to bust them. They don't know how
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: to grow them.
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: Exactly. Right. And so, you know, within that, you know,
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: a lot of states took a real hands off approach
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: when it came to, you know, business standards, health, health
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: and safety, you know, workers rights, you know, just stuff
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: like that. You know, and and so, you know, I
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: think that that all of those things, I mean, the
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: fact that, you know, when I was coming up, you
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: had to pay someone. 10 to 20 to 30 grand
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: sometimes to get them to teach you how to grow
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: cannabis or to make an extract, to make hash, to
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: make BHO. Nowadays, I have been in a position where
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: I pay people an hourly wage and give them a
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: full benefits package to be able to come and learn
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: how you know, starting at an entry level and to
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: build a career, right, that they can not only, you know,
• 23:47
  Speaker 2: grow in, you know, the location where they're at, but potentially,
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: you know, take that to other states and now to
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: other countries, you know, to be able to be subject
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: matter experts and consultants and operators, you know, in other
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: states and other countries. I mean, it's so big now.
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: You know, it's, it's, and it gets bigger every day.
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: And that's, that's the thing about cannabis that I think
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: I really love is that it's always changed. It's never
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: a dull moment. There's always a new puzzle to figure out.
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: There's always a new regulation that you have to deal
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: with or, or a new product that somebody is coming
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: out with a new way to make a product, a
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: new strain, all of these things. It's, it's always something new.
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: You know, you don't, uh, you go, you go to
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: a plumber's convention and I'm sure you see the same, uh,
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: you know, P traps that you saw the last year
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: and the year before that and the year before that.
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 24:46
  Speaker 2: But, um, you know, you go to a cannabis convention,
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: you're probably going to see something you've never seen before. Um,
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: you know, and, and that's pretty cool, you know, and,
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: and I think that all of that, and I know
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: that was kind of, this has kind of been a
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: long winded, uh, you know, way to answer your question. Right.
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: But it's a podcast. That's what we're here for.
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: Right. Right. You know, I, I think that, um, And
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: eventually what that's going to lead to and how this
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: ties back to your world is that cannabis right now
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: is sort of in the Anheuser-Busch, Coors kind of realm
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: of the 1970s, early 80s, right? Before Sam Adams. Right.
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: you know, before micro distilleries, before, you know, the brewery craze, right? And,
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: you know, I think that, you know, if there are
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: enough people with a love of the plant that prevail
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: long enough and are able to, you know, keep doing
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: things alongside, you know, these big now multinational corporations, you know,
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: who drive cannabis on the legal level, Um, you know,
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: I think that there's going to be, uh, a, um,
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: you know, sort of a, um, a dynasty moment, sort
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: of like what, like I said, Sam Adams kind of
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: created with the craft craft brew industry. Um, you know,
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: and I think that, that the next, you know, phase
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: over the next, you know, five to 20 years is
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: going to be, um, you know, larger, um, you know,
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: these bigger companies, um, picking up, not even necessarily picking
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: up brands, but picking up the informational knowledge and background
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: of some of these, you know, smaller, more boutique or
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: even black market, you know, people who are on the internet,
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: growers on the internet, growers with these niche markets. I mean,
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: right now you're seeing a flight from, you know, big
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: giant influencers to micro influencers, right? Mm-hmm. And so, you know,
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: a lot of that I think is going to translate
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: into cannabis eventually. And so, you know, you'll have big
• 27:04
  Speaker 2: companies that have, you know, multi-sectional, you know, production facilities
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: that allow, you know, this grower with this brand has
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: these three rooms and this grower with this brand has
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: these three rooms, you know, and it'll, you know, these
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: smaller brands will be able to take center stage because
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: that's really what I think, you know, people want out of,
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: out of marketing in today's culture.
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, I mean, you talked about it with craft beer.
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: We're seeing actual craft beer breweries here in Texas make
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: their own THC drinks. I'm seeing it in other states
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: as well. And I think that's phenomenal. And again, I
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: do think you're right because there is still, I mean,
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: you can go to different countries like you were talking
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: about and just have like completely different, like experience, like
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: an all inclusive where that's, you know, you smoke on
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: a regular basis or, or, Like I know they have
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: little ones in Colorado. You can do the same where
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: like you're, you know, being driven around the city and
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: you're on a bus or whatever it is. And then, so, uh,
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: the experience things is what we need. And I mean,
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: even in LA, I went to a fantastic lounge out there. The, um,
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: with the WeHo, that place is amazing and you could
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: just hang out, smoke, and it's just like the most
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: beautiful places. So yeah, no, for sure. People are going
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: to have more of that as well. And then obviously
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: the liquor company, the whole industry, isn't learning how to
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: pivot and be like, oh, well, why aren't we also,
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: you know, having cannabis drinks?
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: Because you can't just.
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: Focus on what you've been doing forever, which is liquor. Okay.
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: If you're seeing the numbers drop, a little thing called pivot.
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: I think that's as a business.
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: It's not a hard process. Yes.
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: Also, if you're growing your hops and everything else, you
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: could also grow some weed.
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: Well, and the story tells itself. I mean, you know,
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: hops is the closest relative to cannabis. So, I mean,
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: the story really tells itself. I mean, the myrcene involved there,
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: the crossover is.
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: Why the plants look so very similar.
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry?
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: That's why those plants look very similar and smell very similar.
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, 100%. 100%, you know. What's interesting, you know, about
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: the beverage market is that I, you know, for... for
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: the last 10 years, you know, you, you've been hearing
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: a lot of talk of, um, you know, final package
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: goods are, are going to take over flour, right. Uh, in,
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: in the cannabis market. And, um, you know, I even
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: probably earlier on in my career, even I thought that
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: because I was, you know, so into concentrates into dabs,
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: you know, all the all the different, you know, forms
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: of dab culture, dabs and dab culture, you know, but
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: it never really materialized. I mean, you know, 70 percent
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: of the market is still flower. Yeah. You know, that's
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: what people know. That's what people love. You know, the
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: people who are everyday consumers. Right.
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: You're going to have, you know, a large, you know,
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: like the largest growing demographic of cannabis, you know, new
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: cannabis consumers are people who have never tried it simply
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: because it was illegal.
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: Exactly. And but but, you know, just because that person
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: tries it doesn't mean they're going to become a weekly
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: user or a monthly user or, or a daily user, right.
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: They may try it once and say, Hey, it's not
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: for me. You know what I mean? So, um, you know,
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: I think that that's really what has slowed, you know, that,
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: that thought, um, you know, from really coming to fruition. But,
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: you know, I think with beverages, because, um, you know,
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: as opposed to, you know, dabs or vape pens or,
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: or even edibles, you know, everybody, uh, drinks to, um, Well,
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: I mean, I don't, cause I don't really drink alcohol,
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: but everybody drinks to have a good time. Right. You
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: know what I mean? Like, right. So, you know, and
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: I think that, that, you know, that's why, you know,
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: a cannabis beverage is more universal to a broader audience,
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: you know, than, than any other form factor that, you know, has,
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: has come to the table in the last 10, you know, 10, 15,
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: 20 years of, of legalization and it's, and it's different forms. Um, So, yeah,
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: I mean, I think that, you know, the drinks is
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: probably the only thing that I see on the coming
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: horizon that could, you know, dethrone flour, you know, and
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: I still think that that's a long ways off. I do.
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: So I will say this about flour. I love flour.
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: It is my favorite way. But I have a lot
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: of friends that they don't like the harshness or the
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: smell or whatever. So they love the beverages better. Right. Again,
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: it's just a nice little– they don't do too much
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: unless maybe it's a Saturday night or whatever and they're
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: just hanging out at home. And so maybe they'll do
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: a 10 milligram or 25. Who knows?
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: Right, right. Well, and I think that, like I said,
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: the drinks I think are more approachable. Yes. And people
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: are associated. I'm going to drink something and I'm going
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: to get inebriated. You know what I mean?
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: Where it's like, you're not getting a hangover the next
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: day either.
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: Right. Right. Too. Um, but at the same time, I mean, it's,
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: I think it's, it's still different, you know, in, uh,
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: you know, because a lot of, of cannabis is ritual, right? Yes. Um,
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: you know, and, and we don't necessarily get.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: That pipe or the way they roll their joints or right.
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: Right. And, and just in the same way that, Oh,
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: I'm going to watch my football and I'm going to
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: drink my beer, you know, that in itself is a ritual. Right. Um, and,
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: and so I think that, that, You know, having the
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: the the drink in the can, I think, is is
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: more ritualistic for the American consumer population, which is why
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: I think it hits better than, say, gummies or a
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: brownie or, you know, even all the other edibles that
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: are out there in the market. You know what I mean?
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: I think that, you know, the drink is really the
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: hands down winner, you know, simply simply because of that,
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: you know, the American pastime of football and drink a beer. Right.
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: I think the edible, I don't know if it's a problem,
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: but like, so right now in, I think it's five
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: or six States, Target has started bringing in the THC drinks. And,
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: but the thing is, if you had the edibles, where
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: would you put it?
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: So like you would have to, I don't know, you'd
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: have to put it somewhere where obviously kids aren't going
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: to be like, Oh, I can get this.
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: Right. No, exactly. And, and, you know, that's actually one
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: of the reasons why I've always, you know, once I
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: saw the model and that it was working and that
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: it wasn't just some kind of a trap to catch
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: a bunch of people growing weed so you could throw
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: them in jail, you know, that's why I jumped into legalization,
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean? Because, you know, the thing is,
• 33:45
  Speaker 2: I mean, I started with cannabis very young. I mean,
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: was that a good decision? Who knows? You know what
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: I mean? Like, I don't know if we'll ever know,
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean?
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: Like, um it seemed to work out well for you
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: so far so far so.
• 33:57
  Speaker 2: Far i mean as with everything in life i mean
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: there's ups and downs right you know what i mean
• 34:00
  Speaker 2: uh um you know i've never lost a job over
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: cannabis i've never you know what i mean like been
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: in a bad position or you know done all these
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: other things that you know people do with other substances
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: but you know at the same time i mean uh
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: um i you know i have two children of my
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: own now you know what i mean i'm i'm i
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: don't necessarily think that that cannabis is for everyone right
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: you know what i mean like Just as alcohol isn't
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: for everyone. I mean, I decided at a very, very
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: early age, you know, that the feeling of alcohol wasn't
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: for me. You know, but does that mean that I
• 34:33
  Speaker 2: don't appreciate it? No. I mean, I enjoy craft brew,
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: especially homebrew. You know, I used to hang out at
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: the homebrew store in Texas for other reasons. But, you know,
• 34:44
  Speaker 2: having a nice, you know, half a pint of a
• 34:48
  Speaker 2: homemade IPA is, you know, phenomenal.
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: It's amazing.
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: I'm glad you brought up your kids. I have been
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: curious about having this conversation with somebody in the industry
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: because I think that, so we know that your brain
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: isn't fully formed until you're 25. However, we also allow,
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: you know, people to drink at 21 and then obviously
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: serve in the armed forces at 18, even though, you know,
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: bring the drinking age down to there. But at the
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: same time, where would we put cannabis whenever we do? Like,
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: I think it is 21 now. But is that the
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: right age?
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: Right. You know, I mean, I'm kind of a thought,
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: and this is kind of what I was, I guess
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: what I was leading up to is that, you know,
• 35:33
  Speaker 2: I think that, you know, for a long time, I've
• 35:37
  Speaker 2: always thought that we should, you know, decriminalize, not only decriminalize,
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: but legalize all drugs. And, you know, have... you know,
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: basically sort of like driver's tests, right? You have to
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: be able to, you know, go to a facility, take
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: the drug under supervision, do it responsibly, you know, and
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: then maybe you get a license to, you know, use
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: the drug, right? You know, I think that the reality is,
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: is that if you want to keep, you know, people
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: are going to use drugs regardless of what, what happens, right?
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: You know, not that many people actually, you know, in
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: the grand scheme of things, you know, actually do get addicted.
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: People are going to try it. They're going to move
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: on from it.
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: You know, heroin and cocaine are a little meth and crack,
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: a little different, but.
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: A little different, but there are lots of people who,
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: you know, are functional, you know, functional users of those drugs.
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: You know what I mean? And, you know, and it
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: hasn't ruined their life. I mean, now, granted, they're typically
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: people who are wealthy and, you know what I mean,
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: have the funds to maintain a lifestyle, right? I mean, because,
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: you know, typically the thing that, you know, and this
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: is what they teach in harm reduction is that, you know,
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: it's the lifestyle that kills people, not the drug, right?
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: I mean, I think that that's changed a little bit
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: now with the fentanyl. uh, epidemic and, and, you know,
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: some of the.
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: Other, you know, offshoots of that.
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: Right. But, but at the same time, I mean, that
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: started out as, as a legal drug, you know what
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: I mean? Like, um, you know, these problem drugs aren't,
• 37:10
  Speaker 2: aren't coming, you.
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: Know what I mean?
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: Like, uh, they're not coming from the field, you know, they're,
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: they're coming from the, the pharmaceutical manufacturer, right? Yeah. They're
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: coming from the lab. I mean, even, you know, when
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: you look at what's going on in the in the
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: Kratom world right now and the 708 and all that
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: kind of stuff, you know, speaking of drinks, you know, there's,
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: you know, so again, I think that the easiest way
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: to keep it out of the hands of people who
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: shouldn't have it is to legalize it, tax it and
• 37:41
  Speaker 2: regulate it. Um, you know, I mean, I, I think
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: that that's the same thing with, with most, uh, you know,
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: things that we have problems with and how we've solved
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: a lot of problems in this country, you know, look
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: at seatbelts, look at, you know, look at, look at
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: car insurance, um, you know, look at, at 10 year
• 37:59
  Speaker 2: minimums on, you know, drunk driving accidents, you know what
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: I mean? A lot of those things have, have, have
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: made changes in our society.
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 38:07
  Speaker 2: Um, and so, you know, I think in the overall,
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: you know, we as a society have to step up
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: and say, you know, Hey, this is, if we see
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: this as a problem, this is how we're going to
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: fix it. Right. And, you know, not to say that
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: I have, you know, every answer, but you know, I mean,
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: I think that again, if you, you know, you look
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: at States like Colorado where, you know, they've had, you know, cannabis,
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: you know, so some form of cannabis access for quite
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: some time, you know, you see rates of teenagers, you know,
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: going down, right. Rates of teenage use going down. You know,
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: and I think that that's important. You know, like you're saying, people's,
• 38:46
  Speaker 2: you know, people's brains aren't fully formed until 25. So
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: I think, you know, people should have the opportunity to
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: let that happen, you know, and to not, you know,
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: maybe have something, you know, could change their life for
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: the better, but also, you know, could change their life
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: for the worse. I mean, you see stories with everything,
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: you know, that are both good and bad.
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: Well, we also need more treatment therapies and obviously more Funding, obviously,
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: on the other end as well.
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: Exactly. And you see a lot of, I think that
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: the real problem with a lot of that stuff is that, again,
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: you look at California and different states that have tried
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: a lot of harm reduction, and it hasn't really worked.
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: because it wasn't really set up in the same way
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: that it was in countries like Portugal or the Northern
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: EU countries. I think that those European models You know,
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: worked there because they were supported, you know, and it
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: wasn't just a nonprofit money grab like it has been
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: in a lot of areas in the U.S.
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: Well, I mean, it says right there it's the U.S.
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: The U.S. is usually what kind of cash grab can
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: we get?
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: Cash grab can we get, right. How much money can
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: we make and how fast can we do it? Right. Yeah, no,
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: for sure.
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: Long history of that. Well, so what do you see
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: around the world, uh, cannabis wise that you are, uh,
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: there's really kind of peaking your interest right now.
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: Well, you know, to tell you the truth, it's like
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: I was talking before, it's this, this EU GMP, uh, standardization, um,
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: you know, and basically the ability to, um, you know,
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: grow cannabis in a country like Columbia or South Africa, uh,
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: and then ship it to a country like the UK, Germany, um, uh,
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: you know, Netherlands, um, uh, Australia, New Zealand, um, you know, uh, that's,
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: you know, actually where I've, I've focused more in my
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: consulting business, um, is these emerging markets where, you know,
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: people either a, um, you know, are just coming to
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: it or, you know, have a, you know, very traditional
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: background in it, but are, are, you know, coming to the, uh,
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: the broader legal market.
• 41:07
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: Right. Um, and, you know, again, as we were saying earlier,
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: I think, you know, more people who have access, uh,
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: you know, the better, um, you know, I think, uh,
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: America pretty much anywhere in America, you know, you can, uh,
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: you can, you know, find cannabis in one form or another, but,
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: you know, that's not necessarily the case in, in other countries. Um, so,
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: you know, I think that, that, uh, uh, it all
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: starts with cannabis as a medicine, right? You know, that's
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: how it happened here in the US. You know, people
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: see the benefits that it has, you know, for people
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: who need it as medicine. They see that they're not
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: going crazy. They're not having all these issues that, you know,
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: everybody always said you would have if you consume cannabis.
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: And so then that opens up to you know adult
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: use recreational markets eventually um and so you know i
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: think you know more access is you know better access
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: um as long as it's you know and also that
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: it's it's regulated access because i mean i think that
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: there's you know uh tons of you know unscrupulous bad
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: actors in you know in the business right and and
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: always has been so um you know i mean there's
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: you know, a lot going on, you know, that we
• 42:30
  Speaker 2: didn't even touch on in, in, in the THCA market that,
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: you know, a lot of that product when it's flower,
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: you have no idea where it comes from. You have
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: no idea who grew it. You know, yeah, maybe it
• 42:40
  Speaker 2: passed a USDA test at week five for potency, you know,
• 42:46
  Speaker 2: but you have no idea what they sprayed on it afterwards.
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: You know, you have no idea, you know, and, and
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: for the most part, you know, no matter what the
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: pesticides are, you know, most growers today, they, you know,
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: if they're, if they're doing that, you know, they understand
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: that there's an amount that they can, they can spray
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: on there and it's not going to show up when
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: you test the flower. It may show up down the
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: line when you, you know, extract the flower and then you,
• 43:10
  Speaker 2: you know, you test the extract or, you know, you
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: test the edible. But, you know, so, so there's, you know, there's,
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: There's so much more access to cannabis right now. But
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: at the same time, it's just as much the Wild
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: West as it used to be if you're not going
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: through regulated markets. And to tell you the truth, even
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: some regulated markets in the state can be not so great. Yeah.
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: I mean, I've seen that with liquor for however many
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: decades now. Of course, there are some regulations, but there's
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: always wiggle room here and there. And so, of course,
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: that's what's going to happen with a completely, quote unquote,
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: illegal plant that there's going to be so much more oh,
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: there's no actual, you know, like you said, we're not
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: testing this. We're not, you know, there's no standards like
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: you see in the wine industry or even the agave
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: or whatever it is.
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: Right. Yeah. Well, and that's true because, I mean, you
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: see so many areas for adulteration, you know, especially in liquor,
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: you know, I mean, you hear about you know, different
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: tequila companies that are putting in, you know, sweeteners. Oh yeah.
• 44:15
  Speaker 1: That's why they say additive free. It's like, no, it
• 44:17
  Speaker 1: shouldn't have been that way from the beginning. What are
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: we doing?
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: Exactly. Right. You know, and, and you know, there's, there's,
• 44:22
  Speaker 2: you know, pretty famous bourbons and whiskeys out there that,
• 44:26
  Speaker 2: you know, test positive for glycol and stuff like that pretty,
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: pretty often, you know what I mean? So, you know,
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: just because you you're the number one sold product in
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: the market doesn't mean that you're selling a good product,
• 44:38
  Speaker 2: you know? And I think that, That really kind of
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: goes to what you were just mentioning with the wine industry.
• 44:46
  Speaker 2: And I think that that's eventually where the cannabis business
• 44:50
  Speaker 2: will go to terroir and these other measures of quality, right?
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: Well, I mean, for us, normally it's like, oh, is
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: it Oregon? Great. Is it California? Great. That's for the
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: most part what people want. especially here in Texas, we're like,
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: oh yeah, it's gotta be good stuff. It's from, it's not.
• 45:07
  Speaker 2: It's not from the hill countries. Right. Right. So, and that's,
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: it's kind of interesting too, because, you know, me living
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: in New York now, I mean, there's a huge wine.
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: I live right in the middle of a huge wine
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: growing area here. I mean, it's, you know, upstate, I,
• 45:23
  Speaker 2: you know, live in the Finger Lakes area.
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: So, Oh, there's a lot of great wine, especially the
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: ice wine coming out of there. Like good, sweet dessert wine.
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: That's good stuff.
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. Well, and you have the University of Rochester
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: that's making new strains of wine grapes all the time.
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: And they're testing those here in the area. I mean,
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: it's pretty interesting. There's a lot to it. And I
• 45:44
  Speaker 2: think that eventually cannabis will mature into that market in
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: the same way. I mean, one of the things I
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: say about cannabis right now is that there really isn't
• 45:54
  Speaker 2: much middle ground yeah um you know it's you you're
• 45:59
  Speaker 2: either the highest the highest quality at the highest price
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: or you're the you know the the middest quality at
• 46:06
  Speaker 2: the lowest price you know you know what i mean
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: like um there's there's really only two buyers in the
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: cannabis market right now you know And maybe that'll one
• 46:15
  Speaker 2: day mature like it has in the alcohol space by
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: broadening the market and bringing down costs and overhead. A
• 46:26
  Speaker 2: lot of that has to do with the tax structure
• 46:29
  Speaker 2: of cannabis. So hopefully with this rescheduling, that'll change.
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: That's hope. Well, I mean, it actually has to happen.
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: I mean, he said it multiple times, but hopefully then
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: the action will happen afterwards.
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: Right. Yeah.
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: Now, I mean, tell us about the old guard cannabis advisors,
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: because you kind of mentioned it multiple times, but for
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: people who don't know, how do you tell us about that?
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So that's, you know, my, my consulting operation, you know, basically,
• 47:01
  Speaker 2: you know, people contact me with, you know, help with,
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: you know, operational issues, operational, you pain points, um, within their, uh,
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: within their system or, or, um, you know, to help them, uh,
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: design facilities before they get into, uh, you know, a situation, uh,
• 47:25
  Speaker 2: where they need my help. Right. Um, so yeah, so,
• 47:29
  Speaker 2: you know, I, I have, you know, basically been in
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: cannabis operations, uh, full time for the last 10 years. Um,
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: and so, you know, now I'm, uh, you know, just
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: recently taking a step back and, and broadening, uh, my
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: consulting firm to reach out in, into, uh, the international
• 47:47
  Speaker 2: market and, and anybody else who, uh, you know, needs
• 47:50
  Speaker 2: my help. Right. Um, you know, with that, I've also been, um,
• 47:54
  Speaker 2: you know, getting into, um, a lot of, um, um,
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: efficiency right um because that's what operations is all about
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: right but you know i i think that that now
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: even more so than ever with the rise of ai
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: um you know there's um all these new ways of
• 48:15
  Speaker 2: being efficient um and so you know i think that
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: um i really strive to um kind of bring that in, right. And,
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: and make some of that my own. Um, and so,
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: you know, in that I've been, uh, you know, building a,
• 48:33
  Speaker 2: an app that, you know, backends to my consulting business, um,
• 48:37
  Speaker 2: that basically, you know, helps through, you know, evaluation and
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: consultation of a, of a a business from basically from
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: seed to sale. Wow. And so, you know, I've been learning,
• 48:48
  Speaker 2: you know, coding and vibe coding. How's that going? You know,
• 48:52
  Speaker 2: all of the above. It's great.
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: It's great.
• 48:54
  Speaker 2: You know, I've actually, you know, delved really deep. I've
• 48:57
  Speaker 2: built my own local AI server. Oh, wow. Awesome. So,
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: you know, trying not to just, you know, put it
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: all out there on the environment, you know, trying to,
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: you know, bring it back in and, you know, do
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: some of that stuff locally and invest in tools, right?
• 49:15
  Speaker 2: You know, to help streamline efficiencies and processes uh, across
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: the board. So, um, you know, basically with old guard, I, um,
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: you know, offer, uh, monthly engagements, um, so that, you know,
• 49:27
  Speaker 2: people can, um, you know, bring me their, bring me
• 49:30
  Speaker 2: their problems, um, and, you know, have me evaluate and, uh,
• 49:35
  Speaker 2: you know, give them the direction out of, uh, that quagmire,
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: you know, because it's a, it's a very hard business
• 49:40
  Speaker 2: to be in.
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: Um, you know, uh, the, I think the biggest issue
• 49:44
  Speaker 2: in the industry is under capitalization right now. Um, and
• 49:48
  Speaker 2: has been for, for a long time. Uh, you know,
• 49:50
  Speaker 2: people get into it thinking that they're going to get
• 49:53
  Speaker 2: a license and they're going to, um, build a growth
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: space and they're going to grow some cannabis and they're.
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: Going to put it in a bag and they're going
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: to sell it. Right.
• 50:02
  Speaker 2: And they're going to make Millions of dollars overnight. And I,
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: you know, I, what I like to tell people is,
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: is that if you don't have at least three to
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: five years of operating capital from, from the moment your
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: facility is ready to go, not even breaking ground, but
• 50:17
  Speaker 2: the moment your facility is ready to go, then you,
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: you probably should invest someplace else.
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: It's, you know, even if it's on a small scale
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: and probably the smaller, the harder it is, you know,
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: when you're a big business, you have economies of scale,
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: you have, you know, a lot of different things that
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: play in your favor that you just don't have as
• 50:37
  Speaker 2: a small business. So that's why, you know, with Old Guard,
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: I try to focus in on, you know, small to
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: midsize cannabis companies that are struggling with, you know, all
• 50:51
  Speaker 2: kinds of issues that then, you know, hurt revenue, right?
• 50:54
  Speaker 2: Which hurts paying their employees, right? Which is what keeps
• 50:57
  Speaker 2: everything going. Um, you know, you, you can't, uh, and
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: even with AI, I mean, you can't automate, uh, your
• 51:04
  Speaker 2: way out of, uh, growing a plant like this, uh,
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: at least not on the quality level.
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: You know, there's also, you need a bud tender. Like
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: you need someone to like help guide somebody in the
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: right direction. Right. Especially if people have never done it
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: for the first time. So like, or they're trying to
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: figure out what they do and don't like. So they are,
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: those are people are incredibly important. You, you can't have
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: a robot do that. 100%. 100%.
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: And, you know, that also goes to not only the
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: butt tenders, but, you know, one of the things that,
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: that was different for me when I came to New
• 51:38
  Speaker 2: York was, you know, as a medical business in New York,
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: as a medical dispensary, you have to have a, licensed
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: pharmacist on shift at all times to dispense cannabis. And,
• 51:51
  Speaker 2: you know, that was the first I had ever seen
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: anything like that. You know, previously in other states, it's,
• 51:55
  Speaker 2: you know, you go see a doctor, they give you
• 51:56
  Speaker 2: a recommendation, and then you never talk to that guy again,
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: you know, and you're probably not even talking to the doctor.
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: You're talking to, you know, his assistant, you know, and
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: he's somewhere off in Florida, you know, on the beach somewhere,
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: you know.
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: Making money off of scripts.
• 52:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. You know, and, you know, so so I
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: think that you're right, you know, that human interaction is there.
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: I mean, I also will say that, you know, I
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: think online sales are really picking up in cannabis as well. So,
• 52:24
  Speaker 2: you know, I think that that's a function of people,
• 52:28
  Speaker 2: you know, you know, gaining knowledge about the plan and
• 52:34
  Speaker 2: about the product itself. You know, I think that, you know,
• 52:39
  Speaker 2: for a long time, you know, the knowledge gap, which
• 52:44
  Speaker 2: there still is a very large knowledge gap to the consumer. But,
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: you know, I see that, you know, that gap shortening
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: and shortening every day, you know.
• 52:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I was going to ask, like, where do you,
• 52:57
  Speaker 1: where do you kind of get your news and from
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: where do you kind of, because obviously you're so well-informed
• 53:01
  Speaker 1: and you do help so many people when it comes
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: to business side, but there are a lot of people that,
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: you know, obviously they, you know, they'll follow whatever's happening
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: in the alcohol world or obviously sports world or wherever.
• 53:13
  Speaker 1: They don't know where to look for cannabis news, because
• 53:16
  Speaker 1: obviously most of the major news outlets aren't doing that
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: much coverage when it comes to.
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah. You know, I think that, you know, a lot
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: of it goes to social media. I mean, I think
• 53:28
  Speaker 2: that cannabis was basically built off the back of Instagram
• 53:32
  Speaker 2: and then Facebook and now LinkedIn.
• 53:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 53:36
  Speaker 2: You know, I think if you want real cannabis information without,
• 53:44
  Speaker 2: you know, if you want it from a scientific aspect
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: and from a business aspect, probably the best place to
• 53:49
  Speaker 2: go is LinkedIn. You know, if you don't necessarily want
• 53:54
  Speaker 2: all the extra clutter and kind of bravado that comes
• 53:58
  Speaker 2: with the cannabis space on Instagram, you know, I think
• 54:03
  Speaker 2: LinkedIn is definitely a place to go. Facebook to an extent,
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: you know, I think that there are, you know, definitely
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: still some good groups out there and stuff like that,
• 54:14
  Speaker 2: but As far as cannabis news, what I.
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: What's easiest for me is, you know, through LinkedIn and
• 54:24
  Speaker 2: Instagram and, and, um, you know, these different social medias,
• 54:28
  Speaker 2: you know, there's all these people who are like, you know, uh,
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: comment down below and I'll send you my, you know,
• 54:33
  Speaker 2: daily newsletter. Right. Um, and so, you know, I get
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: a ton of those. I get a ton of my
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: sign up for every single one of them. I see,
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean? Because I, I want to
• 54:45
  Speaker 2: know as much as I can. Right. And then, Um,
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: you know, like I said, I got the local AI, so,
• 54:49
  Speaker 2: you know, I have the local AI basically scan my email,
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: pull out all, all the stories, present that to me
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: every day. Um, you know, with it, with a daily update, um, and,
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: you know, kind of go from there. So, you know, I,
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: I basically get, you know, at least my cannabis knowledge, uh,
• 55:08
  Speaker 2: and information from, uh, you know, probably about a 10,
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: you know, daily or, or weekly newsletters. Um, that send
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: by email.
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 55:20
  Speaker 2: Nice. Okay. Yeah.
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: I know there's a lot of people out there that, again,
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: want to know what's going on with the industry, but
• 55:26
  Speaker 1: they just don't know where to go.
• 55:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, and again, I'd say that's LinkedIn. I mean,
• 55:30
  Speaker 2: I think that if you're outside looking in, you know,
• 55:34
  Speaker 2: LinkedIn or even, you know, especially if you want to
• 55:37
  Speaker 2: learn how to grow and stuff like that, I'd say YouTube.
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, there's a lot of really good accounts,
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: I think, especially from the home growers. uh, perspective, um,
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: that are, are on YouTube. And I think that, you know,
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: the effort that it really takes to have a YouTube, um, as,
• 55:55
  Speaker 2: as well as have an Instagram, you know what I mean? I,
• 55:58
  Speaker 2: I think kind of puts, uh, a lot of the
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: guys who are doing stuff on YouTube head and shoulders
• 56:02
  Speaker 2: above the guys who are only on Instagram.
• 56:05
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 56:05
  Speaker 2: Um, you know, I, I think that, you know, in
• 56:08
  Speaker 2: today's society, you know, you, to be a brand, you
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: got to put yourself out there and, um, um you
• 56:14
  Speaker 2: know be be you know out on these platforms um
• 56:18
  Speaker 2: and you got to do it with your face you
• 56:20
  Speaker 2: know uh um you know it can't just be a
• 56:22
  Speaker 2: logo anymore i did that for a long time i
• 56:24
  Speaker 2: i think i probably fell victim to to some of
• 56:27
  Speaker 2: that wanting to to stay in the shadows you know and.
• 56:29
  Speaker 1: I'm still fighting it i'm still fighting it real hard.
• 56:32
  Speaker 2: Well you live in texas you live in texas you
• 56:35
  Speaker 2: gotta you gotta stay you know you gotta stay somewhat
• 56:38
  Speaker 2: incognito that's.
• 56:39
  Speaker 1: True you know There's a good group of people down
• 56:44
  Speaker 1: here that obviously have been working really hard and gone
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: to the Capitol on multiple occasions. We're doing what we
• 56:52
  Speaker 1: can down here in Texas.
• 56:53
  Speaker 2: Wonderful. I used to go march on the Capitol in Austin.
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: I used to go and hold signs over the bridges
• 57:00
  Speaker 2: over 35 in Austin. Yeah. We used to do all that.
• 57:03
  Speaker 2: Go march with normal and Um, I mean, that was
• 57:13
  Speaker 2: 20 years ago now, but.
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: Um, they're still marching.
• 57:19
  Speaker 2: Good. Good. I mean, I'm, I'm glad they're out there,
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: you know, and, um, you know, I think that's why
• 57:24
  Speaker 2: I've been trying to strive so hard to legitimize the,
• 57:28
  Speaker 2: you know, legal industry so that, you know, uh, something actually,
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: you know, happens with all of this and, and all
• 57:36
  Speaker 2: those times that, that people marched isn't, you know, isn't
• 57:39
  Speaker 2: in vain, you know, I mean, um, You know, and
• 57:42
  Speaker 2: that's not to say that we're, you know, anywhere near
• 57:45
  Speaker 2: where the industry should be.
• 57:47
  Speaker 1: Oh, obviously. We should be light years ahead.
• 57:49
  Speaker 2: Right. But at least we're where we're at right now. Exactly.
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: You know, and we've made progress.
• 57:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah. No, I love that. I love going to, I mean,
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: my brother lives in Canada where they legalized it a
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: long time ago.
• 58:01
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: And there are absolutely beautiful places up there. And then
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: I love visiting other recreational states. So, you know, we'll
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: take what we can get down here in Texas for now.
• 58:11
  Speaker 2: Right. I understand that feeling. I was there for 20
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: some odd years. Yeah.
• 58:18
  Speaker 1: Well, it's better than nothing. Yeah. Well, I have a
• 58:21
  Speaker 1: segment on my show. I call it the five count.
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: It's just five random questions. Okay. What song do you
• 58:26
  Speaker 1: car karaoke to?
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: Car karaoke to? Well, you know, when I do go
• 58:33
  Speaker 2: to karaoke, I don't know if I car karaoke, but
• 58:36
  Speaker 2: when I do go to karaoke... You know, I have
• 58:43
  Speaker 2: been known to do Pinball Wizard from The Who. Nice.
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: And then if I get up and do that, then
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: I always have to do one for Texas. And I
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: do Family Tradition.
• 58:57
  Speaker 1: Okay. That's a fantastic zone.
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That's always a great one for for karaoke. Everybody
• 59:02
  Speaker 2: always joins in and yeah, they know that in between
• 59:05
  Speaker 2: has a great time. Yeah.
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So number two, if you were a pro wrestler
• 59:11
  Speaker 1: or MMA fighter, what would your name be?
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: You know, it'd have to be probably some, you know,
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: some kind of cannabis strain, you know what I mean?
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: Whether that's like the, the blue dream or, you know, the, the, the, the,
• 59:26
  Speaker 2: you know, the OG Kush or something like that. It'd be,
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: it'd probably be.
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: Something like, I love that. The weed wrestlers are one
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: of my, or some of my favorite wrestlers right now.
• 59:33
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah. They, I, you know, I, I don't really
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: dabble in that realm. So I'll have to check that out.
• 59:38
  Speaker 1: Go to a, where you're sitting, you're in upstate New York.
• 59:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 59:43
  Speaker 1: There is, there's great wrestling up there. I forget which company,
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: but go to a, go to a live show. That's usually,
• 59:48
  Speaker 1: you know, about 200 people. It's the best time you
• 59:51
  Speaker 1: ever have.
• 59:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I used to go to live shows down in
• 59:53
  Speaker 2: San Antonio.
• 59:55
  Speaker 1: Oh, those are the loot.
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah. crazy yeah i used to go to the backyard
• 59:59
  Speaker 2: wands and the luchadors and uh all all of it
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 2: we used to go um and have a good time
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 2: and and there's some wild crazy times for sure oh.
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah if anybody's never been to a lucha show go
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 1: go immediately look it up yeah for sure number three
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: what are you nerding out on right now.
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 2: Um i mean probably like i was saying before ai
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 2: i mean i i built uh you know i built
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: two computers in the last like two months you know
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 2: what i mean like uh uh, yeah, just off of
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 2: buying parts off of a marketplace. So, um, you know,
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 2: it really doesn't, uh, you know, if you, uh, um,
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 2: strategize and get into it, I mean, you can build
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 2: a local AI pretty, pretty easily. Um, and it can do,
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 2: you know, quite a, quite a bit of stuff. It
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 2: may take a little bit longer than your chat GPT
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 2: and your cloud to respond to you. Um, but, um,
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 2: you know, and it's also hard right now too, just
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 2: because of the price of, um, components.
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 1: And stuff like that.
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 2: Um, yeah. So, you know, Ram and, and, and, you know, uh,
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 2: hard drives, SSD, hard drives. Um, but, um, you know,
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 2: I mean, that's kind of the, the fun too, cause you,
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 2: you know, you can look on marketplace, you can look on,
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 2: on Amazon, you know, it's kind of like a hunt,
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 2: you know, you gotta find the right parts and then
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 2: put them all together, which is, you know, kind of, um,
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 2: I think why I got into extraction, because running extraction
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 2: machines is kind of like that. It's a bunch of
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 2: parts and knobs and dials and that kind of stuff.
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 2: You know what I mean? So that's probably what I've
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 2: been learning on that. And I'm doing a.
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 2: Home grow. I haven't, you know, because I've been in
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 2: the business for so long and responsible for so many plants,
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 2: I haven't done a home grow in a long time.
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 2: And so I got a, I got a small home
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 2: grow right now that I'm doing with living organic no-till soil.
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 2: So it's been kind of a new, not a new
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 2: technique to me, but it's not necessarily something that's used
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 2: on a large scale. Right. So not something I've, I've
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 2: really had a lot of experience with. So that's been
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 2: really cool. And I've been having a lot of fun
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 2: learning about that and, you know, really getting, getting back
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 2: down in with the plants, you know.
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 1: I love that. Number four, who or what inspires you?
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 2: You know, I'd have to say my family, my kids,
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: you know, I mean, they, they're, that's, that's why I
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 2: get up and do everything that I do. You know, I,
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 2: you know, for, for me, they're, you know, they're the
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 2: next generation, they're the future. And so, you know, And
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 2: my wonderful wife who, you know, brought them into this world. So,
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 2: you know, that's, that's, I'd say they're my biggest inspiration
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 2: to get up and do the things I do.
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 1: How old are your kids now?
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 2: My son's about to turn nine and my, my daughter
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 2: just turned 11.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 1: So that's awesome.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 1: And number five, what would you tell your 17 year
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 1: old self?
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 2: Well, probably a lot of things, but I mean, yeah, Uh,
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 2: you know, I get a lot of, you know, people
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 2: in sort of the, you know, 17 to 25, uh,
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 2: demographic that, you know, they ask me what, you know,
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 2: what should they do to get into cannabis? So, you know,
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 2: should they go to school? Should they, you know, what,
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 2: what should they just grow some, some cannabis or, or whatever?
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 2: And I say, you know, I think that in today's
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 2: day and age, you know, if you want to do
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 2: something that you're passionate about and you want to do
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 2: something that you love, it's, it's probably best to, to,
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: run that kind of a business. Right. Um, and so
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 2: to be able to do that, I, I tell, um, you,
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 2: you know, younger college age people to, um, to go
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 2: to college and to, to get a business degree. Um,
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 2: because if you get a business degree, you can find
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 2: a rich guy out there to pay you to do
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 2: what you love to do. So, you know, so the,
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 2: the businesses is the language of, uh, of this country and,
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 2: and of the, you know, of, of the world. Right. So, um,
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 2: you know, I think having a business degree, um, you know,
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 2: opens your horizons to a lot more, uh, than, you know,
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 2: a specialized, uh, degree. Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: Know how the money flows.
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 2: Um, because I mean, you can always, you can, can
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 2: always learn as much as you need to know about cannabis. Um,
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 2: you know, um, I guess it's probably easier to learn
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 2: more about cannabis from the point of view of being
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 2: the owner of a business, you know, rather than being
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 2: the guy at the bottom. Now, that being said, there's
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 2: probably a disparity in that in today's market, but that's
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 2: a conversation for another time.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm curious about that because you have so many like, oh,
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 1: this brewer or this, you know, whiskey maker or winemaker, like,
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 1: if they touched it, it's gold. So I imagine that
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 1: is also the same thing in the cannabis industry.
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 2: Very much so.
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 1: Like, yeah. Oh my God. This girl even looked at
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 1: your stuff.
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 2: Like, right. Well, and, and it even goes into, you know, Oh, this,
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 2: this guy's got a store that does a million dollars.
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 2: I want my, you know, a million dollars a month.
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 2: I want my product in his store. That, that, that,
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 2: you know, CEO is successful. So, you know, I need
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 2: to be like them to be successful, which is, You know,
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 2: that's sort of the trap with, you know, modern marketing
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 2: and social media today is because you never really know
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 2: how successful someone is.
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 1: True.
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 2: You know, so it's a minefield out there in business,
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 2: you know, and you have to watch where you step,
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 2: for sure.
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 1: Well, and also, you know, dabble in law as well,
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 1: so that way you.
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so that way you don't get in trouble.
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know how all these papers and laws and
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 1: the small details underneath actually mean.
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 2: Have a good insurance policy.
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: They're all racket, really.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, they are. But, you know, the one time
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 2: you need them, right?
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 1: Exactly. Then you're happy to have them. Well, if anybody
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 1: wanted to find out more about you, follow you online,
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 1: support you in any way, how can they do so? Yeah.
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 2: So, I mean, you can follow me, Alexander Marzek, M-A-R-Z-E-C,
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 2: on LinkedIn. I'm also on Facebook. I'm on Instagram from
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 2: time to time as a hash maker named Alex 2.0. And,
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 2: you know, you can find my website, oldguardcannabis.com. And then
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 2: the website for the app is resinops.com.
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 1: There we go. Alexander, I've loved this conversation. And yes,
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 1: I would love to have you back when we have
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 1: better cannabis news in the future. Yeah, yeah. Anytime.
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 2: Anytime. It was great talking with you.
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Alexander, for being on the show. Again,
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 1: as you can tell, this man is very knowledgeable. obviously
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 1: go on LinkedIn and find out who to follow when
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 1: it comes to the cannabis industry. So you can get
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 1: as much news as possible, know what's going on and
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 1: know what's legal, not legal. Talk to your local politicians
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 1: because we have some elections coming up and we definitely
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 1: want people who are going to be seeing the future,
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 1: which is cannabis and the future is green. And we
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 1: definitely need to be obviously helping that little plant do
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 1: as much as it can. So Why are you doing
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: all that? Make sure to go follow us on social media.
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 1: It is BruisersPod, that is B-R-E-W-S-E-R-S-P-O-D, on the Instagram, the threads,
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 1: and the Twitter. If you'd like to send us an email,
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 1: it is BruisersPod at gmail.com. If you'd like to follow
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 1: me directly, it is RodyJohn, that is R-O-D-I-E-J-O-N. RodyJohn is
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 1: the name on the Twitter and on untapped. In case
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 1: you want to find out what I'm drinking, maybe we
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 1: can have a beer together. If you want to follow
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 1: me on the threads or the Instagram, it is OfficialRodyJohn.
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 1: So until next time, make sure to enjoy life, drink local,
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 1: and cheers.