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The Child's Journey with Kelly Anne Manuel · WriterCon

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This week on the writer con podcast. The one piece of advice that I
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would offer is not to ignore the seed. So I like to say,
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did a sequoia know that it was going to be a gigantic sequoia when it
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was just a baby seed? Likely not. I mean, maybe it had
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some idea, but I don't really think so. So what I like to
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say is, if you get some sort of hit, some sort of idea,
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something that might not seem important, go ahead and jot it down.
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You know, I constantly do that in my iPhone, in my notes right
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because it could be the start of something. So I say, don't ignore
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that, don't say oh, that's nothing. If you feel it and you
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get the hit and make a note, and then I like to say,
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go back and water it and see what it might grow into, maybe a
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giant sequoia. Welcome to writer Coon, a gathering place for writers to share
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their knowledge about writing and the writing world. Your hosts are William Bernhardt,
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best selling novelist and author of The Red Sneaker books on writing, and Laura
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Bernhardt, award winning author the Wantland Files book series. Hey there, writers,
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thanks for joining me and my superstar author wife, Laura and our Superstar
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sound engineer Jesse Ulrich. One of our news stories today actually relates to the
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Hugos and science fiction, and speaking of Jesse is our science fiction expert.
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And you just got back from the Star Trek cruise right I did. It
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was great, Listen, It's always great. It's imagine being on a cruise
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ship, which if you don't like cruse ships, I understand, but imagine
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everyone on that cruise ship has the same sort of central interest as you,
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and you're going to spend an entire week with those people talking about the things
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you love the most. And it's great. I love it. So you
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can talk about things sudden they understand it. Do you all greet each other
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with the vulcan if you can? I actually can't do the vulcan greeting,
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which is that I can't. Me and Zachary quinto two people who can't do
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it. From Shatner. Remember did you see Free Enterprise? They wired his
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fingers together. Yes, so we can do this. I will tell you
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in rabbinical school. To help rabbis do that, they do tape their fingers
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together until they're able to do it. That's what I've learned. So maybe
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one day for the next starter cruise, I'll tape my fingers together so I
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can actually do it very nice. Yeah I can't. I can't so,
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but yes, a lot of people do gree each other with that and love
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to cling on phrases and whatnot. I would have to study up. Okay,
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So that was a fun cruise, but much more importantly, of course,
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in April, you're joining us for the Writer cun Cruise. Yes,
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we'll have fewer actors, but I like writers better anyway. Are you looking
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forward to that one? I am. That one is certainly a little slightly
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more relaxing for me than the Star Trek Cruise, but again that I do,
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but I do get like some of them. I do get some of
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the mornings free because I'm not in the writing sessions. So but like the
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thing I like about the Star Trek Crewise especially, and this relates to the
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Writer con Cruise, is I like hearing from creatives, not necessarily actors so
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much, but the people who do the writing and the producing, the creative
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parts of it, and so spending time with people who are trying to create
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something is very energizing for me, So I agree. How about you,
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Lara, have you started packing your bag yet? I actually have? Is
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that embarrassing to admit it? Yes, I'm already. No, I'm already
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thinking about what I want to take. I'm already dreaming of the tropics and
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checking trying to decide which bathing suit I'll take and which of my Hawaiian shirts
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I want to take, and just I'm super excited to go. I can't
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wait to be on the ocean in my room with you and working with a
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great group of people. I spent I don't know, six seven hours writing
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today. I'm a little emotionally drained, but I gets very recharged when I
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am working with other authors, So I'm going to be very ready for that.
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The balcony in the room, you know, with the ocean that seems
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endless to me, that's like the best writing environment on earth. So I
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will say for one of my favorite parts of the writer con Cruise last year
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was just the last night when the ships were sailing through trying to avoid a
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thunderstorm, and you could see the thunderstorm, just the lightning from your balcony,
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and like you would hear oohs and ohs from other parts of the ship,
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and it was just It was a magical moment until you started thinking about
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what happened if a ship got struck by lightning, which then required me researching
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it. It's fine, they had lightning rods. It's okay. But it
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was beautiful to see a storm with like nothing arounding it, surrounding except you
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and the other sh If you could see it was really magical and certainly creative.
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That would be very cool. I get distracted by nature, but I
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love the nature bathing. It's very very good for me. Yeah. Well,
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our interview today is with Kelly and Manuel, a children's book author who
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has made a huge splash. So don't stop listening just because you aren't writing
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children's books, because she has done something amazing you need to hear about.
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She has written and published thirty one books at the same time in the same
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book launch. That's like one book for every day of the month. I
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guess in four different series we will talk to this remarkable writer. But first
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the news. Well, we're right back to science fiction, so Jesse jump
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in anytime. Talking about World Con and the Hugos and the huge controversy going
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on there. This is not the first time the Hugos have been controversial,
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and we'll talk about why. But this is another example of a story that
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I held back on until I actually had some information about not just what happened
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but why. You may have already seen news reports alleging that the Hugo Awards
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haven't handed out last year at the World Science Fiction Convention in Chengdu, China,
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were rigged. Just in case you don't know, there are two major
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science fiction awards. One's the Nebula, which is based which is voted on
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by members of the organization, mostly writers, and the Hugo Awards, which
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are voted on by fans, supposedly in attendance at World com this year.
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Now, most science fiction conventions are kind of of fan run and amateur,
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but as they get bigger, there are some exceptions, like the big comic
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cons you probably heard about in San Diego or in New York, and there
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are some fan convictions that kind of outgrew the scale of volunteers and the started
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chains and whatnot. But Chinese fandom, though strong, is apparently a different
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thing, and from what I've read, I get the impression that the convention
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committee didn't realize there was this thing called the World con Constitution which sets out
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rules for what they're supposed to do, nominating and voting and so forth,
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And before long they apparently attracted the attention of the local Communist Party in the
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middle of an authoritatium authoritarian clampdown that's been intensifying in China for several years,
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and perhaps the organizers. Here's what we know. First, they arbitrarily disqualified
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a couple of very popular books by authors because they thought the books might might
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offend the local Communist Party if they won, or worse, the author showed
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up and gave an acceptance speech. The most glaring oversight was by the author
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R. F. Kwang, a book called Babel. I think you've got
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a graphic for this Jesse. It's Babel on the necessity of violence and arcane
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history of the Oxford Translators Revolution. This is a best selling, highly acclaimed
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work. It's already won the Nebula Award. It's also won the Locus Award
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for Best Fantasy Novel, and that's also a major award. So first,
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problem books being disqualified for no legit reason. Second, they dragged their heels
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on releasing vote counts, which has made everything else more suspicious. And when
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they were released. After the awards were handed out, there were discrepancies in
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the vote count, which has just led to an increase in feeling amongst fans
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that this thing was basically rigged. What do you think, Jesse, you're
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expert in this field. I mean so like one of the I can't remember
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which scandal it was, but like rare, like Neil Gaiman was disqualified for
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one of these awards, and like, here's the thing. A lot of
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people live in China. Yeah, China is a world power. I get
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from a business perspective, not wanting to upset them. But again, just
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like what we're dealing here with the goblin butts, like literature and creativity should
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not be restrained. You should be allowed to criticize your government. That's one
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of my Well, if I had like a list of like five ideals,
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one of them is like, like, governments that punish people for criticizing them
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are not government you want to be living under. And we should not just
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because we're afraid to not make some money. We shouldn't be scared of upsetting
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China. We shouldn't be scared of setting anyone. I should probably have explained
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that the world gone is not always in China, it moves every year.
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Various committees and different cities actually vote or bid. It's like a bidding war,
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and China won. Go ahead. Yeah, the Olympic Olympics. That's
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exactly right. And you know, whatever else was going on with books,
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and this is what I was waiting for. It's since been relieved that been
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revealed that investment deals valued at over one billion dollars were signed of the eighty
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first World Science Fiction Convention in cheng Dao. So it was a major commercial
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enterprise for someone, although obviously not the authors who didn't win because their books
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were disqualified or How does that make you feel about these people being in jarge
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of the Hugo Awards. Not great. I just feel like they were the
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leading question, as lawyers say, in over their heads a little bit.
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I'm kind of trying to trying to be gentle about this. I absolutely agree
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with Jesse, but we are living somewhere where it's okay for us to say
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that and we can behave in a certain way. And it sounds like they
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got a little over their heads there and they probably did the best they could.
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It just feels like a bad situation all around. Well, particularly harmful
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for writers like the author of Babel, who you know, let's face it,
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Ajar would have won this except that he wasn't nominated, you know who,
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to have a Triple Award winner like that, the you know, the
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Triple Crown of science fiction, those opportunities aren't going to come very often.
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And this is just very sad. Well, and it makes us then it
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devalues the award in some way because now when we look back, will forever
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be saying, but that person should have won, that would have won.
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When you don't have a fair fight, he missed, Yes, that author
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missed out on winning. But now how does the person who did win it
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feel. I wouldn't feel good about that. I would think that I wasn't
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the rightful person. It just tarnishes the entire award. Yeah, I agree,
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Okay, News story number two. This has got a good headline.
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Reading is sexy. We're saying that for decades. Well yeah, yeah,
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me too. But sometimes I've had trouble convincing others. But now it's in
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the Guardian, so it must be true. Just yeah, you've already got
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that article up there. So about a week or so ago, the twenty
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two year old model. That's who you're looking at if you're seeing the YouTube
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version. KaiA Gerber launched her own book club called Library Science. She's also
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on the cover of British Vogue right now with her supermodel mom, who by
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the way, is Cindy Crawford. And she's describing this Library Science thing as
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quote a platform for sharing books, featuring new writers, hosting conversations with artists
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we admire, and continuing to build a community of people who are as excited
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about literature as I am. Books have always been the great love of my
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life. Reading is so sexy. Where was she when I was a teenager?
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I mean, we live in a world where we know book sales for
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young people are up, and perhaps most interestingly, it's paper sales that are
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booming, not digital. Is it possible then, that gen Z can do
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for paper books what it's already done for vinyl records, you know, not
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only bring them back, but make them. You know, last year,
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for the first time, vinyl records sold better than CDs did. And I
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should watch that. Yeah. Yeah, And Gerber's not alone. Another twenty
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eight year old model, Kindled Jenner, maybe a familiar name to some of
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you is now the unofficial face of the New litt Girls Club. When she
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was pictured on a yacht off the Cote DuJour reading a book and fyi,
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her body was covered with green posted notes. Okay, Jesse, can we
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take this seriously? And you know, I'm not dissing models at all,
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but this is not really what you expect typically fashion models to be doing.
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Why do we have people who, you know, their job is looking good
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and modeling clothes and whatnot, and now they're you know, wanting to be
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taken seriously as literary people. What do you think? Well, I think
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it's part of a larger trend that's kind of like, looking back on it
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kind of makes sense where for the generation that grew up in our sort of
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oversaturated information bomb bast constant awareness of what everyone is doing, society would would
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want to slow down and do things that are more personal and slower, like,
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for example, reading a physical book and listening to a vinyl record.
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Like, it makes sense that people would come back to a thing that is
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much more engrossing and forces you to separate yourself from the greater outside world.
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So I'm I think this is great, like buy more books, right,
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Well, and if it comes at a time and when book sales are increasing
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amongst young people, their target audience, whether they're talking about books or clothes
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or anything else, maybe this is time. I mean, maybe there's going
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to be more marketing to book readers. Wouldn't that be sweet? Laura?
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Let me ask you this. Most of these models, in fact, everyone
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I saw when I was preparing this, they're all reading books by other female
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authors. Some of them are romanticy, some are more nonfiction or on the
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literary side. Do you think that's significant? I think that works in with
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the statistics that we've seen. I think they are younger, young women,
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and I do think that romance and romanticy and women's fiction is big with that
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demographic. Romanticy especially makes sense to me. These are these are the kids
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who grew up with Harry Potter books very much enjoyed having magic and creatures and
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fantastical elements in their books. So now combining it with romance and moving into
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new adult it just makes sense. I think that's in my mind, that
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was a natural progression there. It makes sense to me that they're enjoying those
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And then, of course we've heard that the older generation seems to veer more
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towards mysteries and thrillers still, but this is this is a Colleen Hoover era
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and it makes absolute sense to me. I just like the headline, reading
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is so sexy. That should be in our t shirts at writer Con this
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year, don't you think? Keep on that reading, maybe with you know,
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a photograph of several of you know, gorgeous models reading books or something,
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or maybe just regular people, because you know, read being as sexy
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you don't have to dress for it, right, that's the good thing,
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all right, Jesse, cue up that music and let's talk to Kelly n
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Manuel. Kelly Anne, welcome to the podcast. Hello, thank you for
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having me. Oh, thank you for joining us. Okay, traditional first
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question. If you could offer writers one piece of advice, what would it
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be? Gosh, the one piece of advice that I would offer is not
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to ignore the seed. So I like to say, did a sequoia know
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that it was going to be a gigantic sequoia when it was just a baby
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seed? Nice? Likely not? I mean, maybe it had some idea,
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but I don't really think so. So what I like to say is,
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if you get some sort of hit, some sort of idea, something
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that might not seem important, go ahead and jot it down. You know,
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I constantly do that in my iPhone, in my notes, right because
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it could be the start of something. So I say, don't ignore that,
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don't say oh, that's nothing. If you feel it and you get
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the hit, make a note, and then I like to say, go
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back and water it and see what it might grow into, maybe a giant
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sequoia. Nice. Okay, tell us about this amazing book launch. You're
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doing thirty one books, children's books, but still thirty one in four different
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series. I said that, like, I don't think children's books are really
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books. All I'm saying is that they're shorter. But they are. They
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are shorter, they are, and four different series. How did this all
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happen? Well, you know, I call myself an uncom I'm an author
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because I wasn't writing at all, and I only started writing in early spring
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of twenty twenty two. So I started writing early spring and I had well,
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in fourteen days, I had twenty seven of the books ready to go.
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Twenty seven books in fourteen days. Now they all rhyme, they're all
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nursery rhymes. So I like to reference Hans Christian Anderson as somebody to give
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you an idea of how the books go. They rhyme very much like an
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inch worm or a thumbelina. And so yeah, I had twenty seven books
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in fourteen days, and I even curated all the art for all of them
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in those days. And then I had the entire thirty one within the next
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week and I just started writing then. So I said, what am I
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going to do. I've got to publish. And I did hybrid self publishing,
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so within six months of writing the books, I had all thirty one
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published in six months. Now tell me, I'm jumping in here, but
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tell me what you mean by hybrid self publishing, because people use hybrid in
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several different ways. Very fair. So I went through Balboa Press. With
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Balboa Press, you do go through content review, so you don't just get
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to publish whatever you want. They have to accept your book, so you
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know you're the thing is you're funding it, right, you're funding your book
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to be published, but they have to approve the content, so it's not
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just complete self publishing. And then they create the ISBNs and then they put
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it out through their channels to disperse the books, right, and so that's
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how that's why I did it. Really, there was no other option the
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time, or even really still, So I wrote all these books, and
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I'm like, how what do I do? How do I get these out
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into the world? And you know, I just followed my intuition. I
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did homework online. I found hay House. You know, I was always
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fascinated by Louise hay so that was sort of my lead in. And then
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of course they published out of Bloomington, Indiana, and I went to IU.
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I went to Indiana University, so I saw all these things that sort
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of hits, and I just went for it. And my first book was
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published in time to go to the ALA, to the conference in DC that
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year, and I met one of the people from the company and I said,
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look, I have thirty more. I would like some. I'd like
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to talk to you about not paying. Yeah. I don't know that they
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believed me, but I said, I have thirty more, but I'd like
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to not pay what I paid to publish one. So I tried to just
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at least negotiate a little bit of a better price point, and then by
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the I submitted all the materials in July for all the other thirty books,
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and the hardest part of that was the synopsis. Is So I spend a
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lot because children's books, to me are very important as far as what can
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a parent, caregiver, teacher, librarian, whoever's interacting with the book and
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the child. The synopsis to me is very important. So I spent a
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lot of time in July creating the synopsis his for the thirty the thirty books.
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Then everything was published in August and September, and then I turned them
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onto audio and video m hm and video. What do you mean by that?
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Vimeo? Yeah, so the book vimeo. I'm sorry, I got
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you. You can get the video book and the book you can read through
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it and the words pop up and it's it's just really cool. And you're
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even at the Golden Globes is here promoting your work? Right that, Oh
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my gosh, my PR company is just fantastic. Right, So you write
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thirty one books, but nobody knows you, nobody knows me. Right,
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So I hired the Black Chateau Enterprises and started with them about it, right,
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Yes, yes, that's how I'm getting to speak with YouTube. So
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I hired them and we started a year ago. And so this in October,
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I got an email saying, Hey, there's this gift DPA Gifting Suite
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for the pre Golden Globes is the name of the event, and we'd like
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to invite you to come if you'd like to come. I was like,
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would I like to come? So what what you do is you have to
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the book has to be approved by the lady that's in charge, and it's
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her company, the DPA Gifting Suite. So I did The Catcher Dream one
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of my books that's a boundaries, so I feel it's a very impactful book.
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So I took The Catcher Dream and I gave it to the people at
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the top of their creative game. You know, these are people who are
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in the industry, whether they're producers, whether they're buying the products to be
25:19
on ted Lasso, whether they're the actors in like the movie Air I met
25:25
the actor that played Michael Jordan, whether they're cast members from Jury Duty.
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So, Eddie, this was incredible And to give them the book and tell
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them about my journey. What shocked me the most was they congratulated me when
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here they are at the top of their game being nominated and they were telling
25:48
me congratulations. I can't tell you what that did for me as an author,
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the validation that came. It's nice, very cool. Chts materials describe
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my view as an eternal optimist who is the good kind of contagious. Did
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you talk to us about that? A little bit that has to do with
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my personality. I have what I consider to be a light and a light
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energy about me, and that's what comes through in my stories. And what
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I do is I write from my inner child to children. I do not
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write as an adult to a child. And I believe that my light energy,
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my optimism, the resilience that I have gained, and the coping skills
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I've gained from fifty five years on the planet where a lot of things have
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occurred, have all kind of bundled together into making me this uncommon author with
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a very unique voice that I believe children respond to. Because of everything I've
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just said, you've also said, let's keep going on that. You've also
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said you didn't set out to write children's books, but then you happily took
27:07
that path when it came your way. So are you saying are you saying
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you started writing books by accident or what does that mean? Exactly. That
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would be hard to do well. While that means that I did a lot
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of work on myself, and at some point early that spring of twenty twenty
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two, I started to literally hear poetry in my head. I would hear
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the poetry and I started to write the poetry. Then I realized that poetry
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was meant to be converted to nursery rhyme format for children. It was this.
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It was I call it like a Field of Dreams type of story,
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you know, where Kevin Costner's character is like getting all these ideas that are
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a little bit odd and what I would now, I would say those were
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intuitive hits. Back when that movie was made, I didn't even know what
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that was. So what happened was I just heard the poetry. I knew
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I was meant to get it in the hands of children in a nursery rhyme
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format. It literally just happened, just sort of like his character in Field
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of Dreams. And then I would get ideas and hits, and I would
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take those steps, you know, like finding a publishing company, going to
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the ala, having that meeting that happenstance meeting, and everything has just enrolled
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in that format. So no, I did not. I did not set
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out to write the books. I say that I heard some sort of collective
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childhood call and I answered it, and it drew you to the children's books.
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That's interesting. Do you think you'll move on to something for more mature
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readers or do you feel like you are in your lane and that you will
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stay there. I'm glad you asked. I'm curating my contemporary poetry collection as
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well, okay, and I have at least i'd say seventy poems that are
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pretty close I think to being ready to be published. So I'm doing both
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because what I would love so my books are a layer of support for children,
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whether to encourage outdoor play or whether to help them with grief and loss
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and endings. So what the goal would be Grow up with my poetry and
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my nursery rhymes, and then age up into my contemporary poetry, so that
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you have support from me your entire life. You kind of touched on this
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before, Kelly Anne, but I read an interview where you were talking about
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meeting the child where they are in their journey. What does that mean?
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Okay, that means that I write in a way that will the child would
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resonate on some level, no matter where they are in their learning, or
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their family life, or their situation. So, for example, I wrote
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a book called The Loss Total. I flipped titles, so I had a
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devastating fire. The fire was coined a total loss. Okay, so the
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Lost Total. It's about a visit from the Lost Total who made me feel
30:26
empty, sad, and awful. That book is about loss and grief.
30:30
Now, for one child, that could be losing their tee ball game,
30:34
That could be getting a bad grade on a report card. For another child,
30:40
that a loss could be the death of say a grandparent, or a
30:45
divorce, or a parent going to serve in the military could feel like a
30:51
lost total. So the book covers different layers of endings and loss. But
31:00
whatever the child is at in their life, the book will meet them there
31:06
and give them a layer of some port and maybe some verbiage and some self
31:10
talk that can be helpful. I don't know if that answers your question.
31:15
No, it does. We have a lot of aspiring writers in our audience.
31:22
Can you tell us what a typical writing day looks like for you?
31:26
Maybe discuss your process a little bit. Yeah, that's funny. Because I
31:32
just write when I'm inspired. So like one of my books is called the
31:37
Boots Rain instead of Rain Boots, and I was inspired to write that when
31:42
I was putting on my boots to walk my dog in the rain, and
31:47
I thought, what if the boots fell down from the sky instead of being
31:49
on my feet? Right, And so the poem came and I'm typing it
31:55
in the phone as I'm walking the dog. That's where I talk about not
31:59
a ignoring the seed or the spark or the moment of inspiration, because you
32:04
may be making coffee or folding laundry or taking a child to a doctor appointment
32:09
and you get a hit. Note the hit. That's how I write.
32:15
So sometimes it'll be an event, you know, like the fire was a
32:20
total loss, and that the loss total came right, So it can be
32:23
something I've experienced. And then some of more of my contemporary poetry can be
32:30
tied to current events or historic events that I either see a movie about or
32:36
read about, and I'll get a hit and I'll be like, I want
32:39
to write a poem, you know, like aberfam, the horrible incident in
32:45
England where there was a mine. I don't know if you're familiar with Aberfam.
32:51
It was where a mine there was like a landslide due to a mine,
32:55
and it devastated a town. And I got a poem for Aberfam for
33:01
the because unfortunately there was a school at the base of that where that accident
33:07
was, and I got a poem for that town and for the children that
33:14
were lost. So it can be an event, it can be something historic,
33:17
or it can be something current, and I get it, I get
33:21
the hit and I just write. So it's it's really hard for me to
33:23
describe really any kind of ritual because for me it's extremely spontaneous. Well,
33:35
Kelly and I normally wrap things up by asking about what you're working on next.
33:39
Of course you already mentioned the poetry book. What else or talk more
33:44
about that? What's on the horizon for you? Well, gosh, I
33:46
mean, I have so many more nursery rhymes to add to the all all
33:50
the four series that that's that's a given. I'm working on the contemporary poetry.
33:55
I also paint. I love to paint, so that's another creative outlet
34:00
for me, you know. And one day I wonder, oh, could
34:04
the painting go from hobby to gallery? So I would say, I just
34:07
am having a creative burst and it's coming out in all kinds of ways.
34:15
Whether it's the contemporary poetry, whether it's the children's books, whether it's the
34:20
painting, whether it's photography. I am kind of on creative fire. Fantastic,
34:29
Hey, thanks so much for being on the podcast. Thanks for having
34:32
me. You guys are fantastic and I was a little intimidated by your resumes,
34:37
so thank you for being so calm and because foll those books by,
34:42
that's what it is. I just appreciate you having me. It's our pleasure.
34:47
We brought a lot of sun You've brought a lot of sunshine into everybody's
34:52
life today. Thanks so much, and talk to you again soon, I
34:54
hope. Okay, bye by just a few parting words. Laura tell us
35:07
more about the writer con cruise because it is not too late yet to register,
35:13
but it will be soon. Laura, let me think, what have
35:16
we not talked about yet? Have we talked about who else is coming with
35:20
us? We had Lauren Smith on last week. That's true. We talked
35:24
about Lauren. Lauren is coming and I'm super excited she's joining us. Laurel
35:30
is going to be returning and she'll be with us. I love Laurel Thomas.
35:36
She is a darling and she's hey. She may be soft spoken,
35:40
but that is a powerful woman with words of wisdom to share with us.
35:46
We are also adding this year Tamra Grantham, who will be speaking on fantasy
35:51
and romanticy. We will have RJ. R. J. Johnson who's going
35:58
to be there speaking about SI fiction. Else maybe Jesse Jessie will be there
36:07
keeping things. That's the reason to come on its own right, and he's
36:14
I've been told I'm the life of the party. That's what you told me.
36:16
I can't. We had so much fun when we had game night last
36:21
year and I still have Yeah, yeah, that was excellent memories, fun
36:28
times you were riot during game night. That was also. There's some teaching
36:31
and stuff on this thing. Yes, of course, I don't always always
36:37
shift over to the fun stuff. Now I'll be teaching. So we'll meet
36:39
every morning. We will have some really in depth instruction. We're going to
36:45
base that on wherever you are in your writing, So we are going to
36:47
ask you what do you need from us, and we're going to make sure
36:52
that you get it. Will tailor those morning sessions to meet your needs.
36:55
We will link you up with whoever you need to meet with. Individually,
37:00
you'll get one on one instruction from pretty much any or all of the instructors
37:05
and presenters who are going to be there. Catherine SAMs is coming. What
37:08
other crews can you go on where you get to speak with an agent,
37:12
somebody who might even consider picking up your work and representing it, or might
37:16
be able to connect you with someone else who can. Right and just every
37:22
single person with us on the cruise, unless they don't want to, we'll
37:27
have a chance to speak one on one and pitch or just talk to Catherine,
37:30
who is a very prominent agent, or any of us or me.
37:36
Well, that's true too, you're a very prominent superstar writer. I think
37:42
I said that at the opening, So silly, that makes it true?
37:45
All right, everybody, thanks so much for joining us today. Until next
37:51
time, you keep writing, and remember you cannot fail if you refuse to
37:55
quit. See you next time. Spent by Fast the fas Dan spent