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TN Matters - Brushy Mtn · Tennessee Matters

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: It's Tennessee Matters on the Tennessee Radio Network.
• 0:08
  Speaker 2: Welcome to Tennessee Matters. I'm John Clark on the Tennessee
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  Speaker 2: Radio Network. Brushy Mountain State Penitentiary was a maximum security
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  Speaker 2: prison in Morgan County, Tennessee, operated by the Tennessee Department
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  Speaker 2: of Correction. It was established in 1896 and operated until 2009.
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  Speaker 2: Beginning in 2018, the site has been transformed into a
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  Speaker 2: tourist destination, offering tours, events, concerts. And even a ghost
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  Speaker 2: hunt now and then. Since it's Halloween weekend, we're going
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  Speaker 2: to talk about the ghost. Now with Pete Waddington and
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  Speaker 2: Jamie Brock, whose family owns Brushy Mountain. Tell me first
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  Speaker 2: of all about the history of Brushy Mountain and the penitentiary.
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  Speaker 3: The history.
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  Speaker 4: Well, it comes off the back of the Cold Creek
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  Speaker 4: War that was fought here in this area.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: They were bringing inmates in, taking coal miners' jobs here,
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  Speaker 4: and they literally broke out a little civil war here.
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  Speaker 4: So to end that, they approached the family to do
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  Speaker 4: this to end that.
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  Speaker 2: Okay.
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  Speaker 3: And so we put it in a lease.
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  Speaker 4: Agreement for, like, I don't know, 99 years or something.
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  Speaker 4: It's funny because it says they gave them $ 20 and
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  Speaker 4: a hollowed rifle.
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  Speaker 5: For that yeah so pretty funny but anyway they wanted
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  Speaker 5: the coal there was it was really rich coal in
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  Speaker 5: this mountain and so they mined it around the clock
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  Speaker 5: every 12 hours they would shift change these inmates.
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  Speaker 4: And they had a quota to get every day if
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  Speaker 4: they didn't meet that day's quota they were.
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  Speaker 2: Whipped oh my gosh really Yeah, a lot of.
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  Speaker 4: Them were actually beat to death. Even as late as
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  Speaker 4: the mid-50s, we're finding where in the ledgers here that
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  Speaker 4: 75% of them was crippled from being whipped so bad.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, my goodness. And your family had a lease on
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  Speaker 2: this with them?
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  Speaker 4: Well, yeah.
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  Speaker 2: So you leased it out to somebody else, and then
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  Speaker 2: when the lease ended, you took it back over? Is
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  Speaker 2: that how it happened?
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, you trust your government. Yeah. Do you trust your ghost?
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  Speaker 2: So they leased land, and they built a prison on here,
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  Speaker 2: and then all these things happened.
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  Speaker 1: Really?
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  Speaker 4: Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: I'll let you keep going.
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  Speaker 4: They actually built the prison.
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  Speaker 2: Okay.
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  Speaker 4: So, yeah.
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  Speaker 2: So you knew there was going to be one day
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  Speaker 2: they don't have a prison anymore, and you don't have
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  Speaker 2: land back. Is that what it was?
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  Speaker 4: No. Okay. I never dreamed people would stroll into town
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  Speaker 4: and be doing this one day.
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  Speaker 3: We really didn't know what was going to happen. We
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  Speaker 3: kind of just kicked back and just waited.
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  Speaker 4: You know, they talked about bringing Guantanamo Bay here at
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  Speaker 4: one time. But, you know, so, but no, we liked
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  Speaker 4: Pete's vision and what he had going on. And we
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  Speaker 4: just got on board with him and rode the trains.
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  Speaker 2: Now, when did it stop being a prison? When did
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  Speaker 2: they get all the inmates out of there? And did
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  Speaker 2: they put them in other prisons or things like that?
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  Speaker 3: Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: They moved them out in 2009.
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  Speaker 2: Really? Not that long ago, actually?
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  Speaker 4: No.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: No.
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  Speaker 2: And Pete, you came in then and said, I got
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: an idea. You said, how'd it happen?
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  Speaker 3: John, that's what happened.
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  Speaker 1: We rolled in here on a benefit motorcycle ride.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: And it was just sitting here empty for about four years.
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  Speaker 1: And us taxpayers, Tennessee taxpayers were paying upkeep on the prison,
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  Speaker 1: the electric bill. It had to do with the, I
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  Speaker 1: think it had to do with the historic commission to
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  Speaker 1: maintain the property. And that, that term was ending and
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  Speaker 1: there was an opportunity of an empty prison sitting here. So, um, So, yeah,
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  Speaker 1: I left that motorcycle ride to benefit and went to
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  Speaker 1: Nashville the next week and met the Department of Corrections. Wow.
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  Speaker 3: And, you know, that's where it started.
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  Speaker 4: Wow.
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  Speaker 2: So now you have paranormal tours. And, Jamie, you do
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  Speaker 2: those paranormal tours?
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  Speaker 4: I do.
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  Speaker 2: Tell me about it.
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  Speaker 4: I started coming in, as soon as it closed down,
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  Speaker 4: I started coming in here and ghost hunting it. I
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  Speaker 4: knew a lot of the The history that we, it was,
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  Speaker 4: I should say, when the lease agreement happened, it was
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  Speaker 4: wrote in that lease agreement, family could always work here,
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  Speaker 4: no questions asked. And the state of Tennessee did honor that.
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  Speaker 4: So I always had family here and just happened that
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  Speaker 4: some of them still had keys to it. So we
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  Speaker 4: came in and started ghost hunting it. And, you know,
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  Speaker 4: then when Pete came along with this vision, he offered us,
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  Speaker 4: you know, to do the ghost hunts when they got open.
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  Speaker 4: And so, you know, that's how that all started.
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  Speaker 2: Now, you have overnight ghost hunts or regular walking tours?
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  Speaker 2: Tell us about the ghost hunts. And I want to
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  Speaker 2: hear about the ghosts, of course. We do both.
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  Speaker 3: We brought back the flashlight tours this year.
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  Speaker 4: So we're doing the.
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  Speaker 4: Flashlight tours are about two two and a half hours
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  Speaker 4: long um and that's where we do walk you through
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  Speaker 4: and we're walking you know telling you some um ghost
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  Speaker 4: stories and the history in each area um and then
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  Speaker 4: we do a four hour tour and a uh an
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  Speaker 4: all night what we call an all-nighter And those are
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  Speaker 4: private tours. You know, we will go out with the
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  Speaker 4: groups if they want us to, but most of them
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  Speaker 4: want to go out on their own, but eventually come
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  Speaker 4: back in wanting, you know, us to help them out.
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  Speaker 4: But then we also do a public all-night tour where
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  Speaker 4: you can buy a ticket and be in with the public.
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  Speaker 2: What do you do on the all-night tours? Like when
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  Speaker 2: you go out there, you're going to be there all night.
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  Speaker 2: You're going to be ghost hunting. What happens?
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  Speaker 4: What we normally do is we will walk them out,
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  Speaker 4: walk them through the prison, tell them what's what. And,
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  Speaker 4: you know, they bring equipment and or we'll give them
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  Speaker 4: some and then they will let them go out and
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  Speaker 4: experiment for their self. and see what they can get.
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  Speaker 4: If they're having a hard time, we'll help them out.
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  Speaker 2: Do you see ghosts? Or do you hear ghosts? What
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  Speaker 2: do you do? Which do you do? I've been on
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  Speaker 2: ghost tours, but I've never seen a ghost or heard
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  Speaker 2: a ghost. You need to come to Brushy Mountain. I
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  Speaker 2: need to come there. I do. I do, yes. What
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  Speaker 2: do you see?
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  Speaker 4: You don't always see them, but now we do see
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  Speaker 4: a lot here. And you do hear... a whole lot,
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  Speaker 4: disembodied voices, footsteps, doors being slammed, you know, hand dryers
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  Speaker 4: going off, no one there. But we also have some
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  Speaker 4: boxes on the wall that would be, what would those
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  Speaker 4: things be called? Those little boxes.
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  Speaker 2: Spirit boxes?
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  Speaker 4: No, these were boxes used during the prison.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, okay.
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  Speaker 4: Okay.
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  Speaker 3: From floor to floor, they just push a button.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, intercom. Thank you. I couldn't.
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  Speaker 3: It wouldn't come to me.
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  Speaker 4: So we've got an intercom throughout the prison that don't
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  Speaker 4: even have wiring to them anymore, but you'll still hear
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  Speaker 4: sometimes like voices.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, my gosh. Now, who are the ghosts? Do you
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  Speaker 2: have an idea who they are?
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  Speaker 4: I think a lot of them are old, old souls.
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  Speaker 4: I think in the very beginning of Brushy, there was
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  Speaker 4: a lot of what I, I don't know, I guess wrongdoing.
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  Speaker 4: We had criminals in here, but they wanted this coal
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  Speaker 4: so bad that what we're finding is a lot of
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  Speaker 4: them were brought in here. They were between the ages
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  Speaker 4: of 17 and 25. They were healthy, able-bodied men. And
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  Speaker 4: they were put in these coal mines and worked pretty hard.
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  Speaker 4: And their crimes were things like cussing, drinking, dancing. I've
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  Speaker 4: got several death certs for men that was in here
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  Speaker 4: for dancing.
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  Speaker 2: For dancing? This is way back when. This is way
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  Speaker 2: back then. Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah. This was over years.
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  Speaker 2: Now, did they... get out when it came or did
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  Speaker 2: they stay too long or what happened back then when
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  Speaker 2: they came for if you're in prison for dancing you're
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  Speaker 2: only in there you hope a couple of days i've.
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  Speaker 4: Got some uh uh newspaper articles on that uh that's
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  Speaker 4: uh was actually, I think, wrote out of Chicago, and
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  Speaker 4: they were writing about the inmates here at that time,
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  Speaker 4: and they said, you know, they weren't criminals when they
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  Speaker 4: went in, but they were when they came out.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, gosh.
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  Speaker 4: Oh, goodness. But, yeah, I don't know.
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  Speaker 3: I think that quite a lot of them are.
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  Speaker 4: They're just.
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  Speaker 3: old souls.
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  Speaker 2: Have you ever been like some of the people that
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  Speaker 2: have been there in 2005 or something like that, somewhere
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  Speaker 2: in there, they don't seem to appear. People way back
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  Speaker 2: in the early part of the 20th century, right? I
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  Speaker 2: didn't go to 20th. Is it people that are, like,
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  Speaker 2: in the early part of the 20th century, maybe? 1910,
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  Speaker 2: 11th century?
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. You know, like, I've found where we
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  Speaker 4: even had a 10-year-old in here. A 10-year-old?
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  Speaker 3: Oh, my gosh.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, his name was Charlie Cobb. I can't find where
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  Speaker 4: he was released. I think he may be among the dead. But, yeah,
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  Speaker 4: he was the youngest that we found. And then I
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  Speaker 4: found where... They had what they called the Children of Brushy,
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  Speaker 4: and they were 13 and under.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, my gosh. Children stayed in there.
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  Speaker 4: Wow. Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: Now, the prison then, I guess back then, it's not
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  Speaker 2: like it looks like now. Have they added to it
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  Speaker 2: since then, you say?
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  Speaker 4: Well, the original structure was wooden.
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  Speaker 2: Okay.
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  Speaker 4: And so they stayed in a wooden structure for a
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  Speaker 4: while as they built what's there now.
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  Speaker 3: Uh-huh. And, yeah, I mean, it pretty much looks the same.
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  Speaker 4: You know, it hasn't changed a whole lot. Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: Do you take ghost tours all over the prison, the
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  Speaker 2: outer buildings around there, whatever, just the main building?
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  Speaker 4: No, we go into other buildings and through the property.
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  Speaker 4: Because we get activity outside on the grounds also, not just.
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  Speaker 2: Inside the prison.
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  Speaker 4: Really?
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  Speaker 2: What type of activity do you get out there?
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  Speaker 4: Oh, we get apparitions. You'll see.
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  Speaker 5: Ghosts.
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  Speaker 3: You'll hear them again.
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  Speaker 4: They throw things and sometimes you may even hear singing.
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  Speaker 4: They used to do like a funeral service and they
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  Speaker 4: would harmonize and sing in the while taking them to
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  Speaker 4: the cemetery here and sometimes it's just kind of like
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  Speaker 4: it's on a loop here here.
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  Speaker 2: Is it always at night when these things happen no.
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  Speaker 4: No you can get it during the.
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: Day during the day oh wow is it always like
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  Speaker 2: certain things like always have this always happens at this
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  Speaker 2: certain area this certain things.
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  Speaker 4: Happen no we get different things A lot of the,
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  Speaker 4: now some of the ghosts, they do stay in their
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  Speaker 4: area just like they would when it was open. You know,
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  Speaker 4: they just.
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  Speaker 3: Had certain areas that they could be in.
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  Speaker 4: And they tend to do that a lot. But then
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  Speaker 4: a lot of it is just, you know, kind of random.
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  Speaker 4: It's all over.
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  Speaker 2: Have you ever tried to like pinpoint who someone might be,
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: like someone's name? You have, really? How have you done that?
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  Speaker 3: Well, we use, we've used spirit boxes.
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  Speaker 4: We've used dowsing rods. Dowsing rods would go like through
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  Speaker 4: the alphabet and they would spell their name using those or,
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  Speaker 4: you know, we've got.
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  Speaker 3: Inmate numbers from them.
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  Speaker 4: We also do audio recording here and we've caught several
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  Speaker 4: things like that.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, wow. Boy, I'd like to hear some of that.
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  Speaker 2: That was great. Now, do they gather around the cemetery
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  Speaker 2: at all? Is there a cemetery there too?
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  Speaker 4: Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: Is it marked, marked everything? Do they gather around?
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  Speaker 4: There's over a thousand graves marked back right now. And
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: there's a whole lot more than that to be marked back.
• 14:02
  Speaker 4: But right now that's where we're at. Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: Do you talk to the families of these guys? families
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  Speaker 2: can give you sometimes.
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  Speaker 3: We've got a few that come through yeah but not a.
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  Speaker 4: Whole lot um you know um but and i try
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  Speaker 4: to be respectful on that you know if they're really
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  Speaker 4: old um you know in the beginning i don't care
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  Speaker 4: to talk to you know about them but if they're
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  Speaker 4: they died in recent years i try to be a
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  Speaker 4: little more respectful about releasing names and stuff.
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  Speaker 2: Like that right Do you ever, have you ever had
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  Speaker 2: prisoners who were there come back now that it's a
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  Speaker 2: tourist attraction?
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  Speaker 4: Yes, all the time.
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  Speaker 2: Do they really? They come back and tell you stories
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: about the mountain?
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  Speaker 3: Oh, yes.
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  Speaker 2: Really? Yes. Tell us some of those stories. Who were
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: the prisoners?
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  Speaker 4: Well, we had George that was actually a poor guy here. And,
• 15:01
  Speaker 4: you know, he's got a... Bushel Fowler stories, but it
• 15:05
  Speaker 4: started with him telling me about his cell. There was
• 15:11
  Speaker 4: a shooting that happened here where these inmates sought out
• 15:16
  Speaker 4: of their cells and went over and took four guards
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  Speaker 4: hostage and started shooting the black men. It was some
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: racial tensions that was happening here, but they hid the
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: gun in George's cell and you know, he told us
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  Speaker 4: about that when he first came on the property and
• 15:36
  Speaker 4: showed us where it was and different things. So, um,
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  Speaker 4: but yeah, no, we, we've had several, uh, one that
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: came back that, um, he was, he was almost 90
• 15:51
  Speaker 4: and he, he was talking about mining the coal when
• 15:54
  Speaker 4: he was here. Um, And some of the things they
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: used to do, he asked me where the pools were.
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: I wasn't clear on what he was talking about on that,
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  Speaker 4: but he said they used to have holes where they
• 16:08
  Speaker 4: would stand them in these holes and fill them up
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  Speaker 4: to their chin with water, ice cold water and freeze
• 16:17
  Speaker 4: them as a form of punishment. Wow. Wow.
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  Speaker 2: Now he was, he was, what was he in for?
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: did you find out i don't ask.
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  Speaker 3: That if they give it to me i don't.
• 16:32
  Speaker 4: Care to to you know but i i typically won't ask.
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  Speaker 2: Them have you taken them on that guys have been
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  Speaker 2: there have they gone on ghost tours with you.
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  Speaker 3: No one has.
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  Speaker 4: Asked uh to go on a ghost hunt with me
• 16:49
  Speaker 4: uh he had a He had a lover, actually, that
• 16:54
  Speaker 4: was murdered here that he wanted to come, and he's
• 16:58
  Speaker 4: one that we did get. But he wants to do
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  Speaker 4: a ghost hunt. I just don't know how I feel
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  Speaker 4: about it.
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: That would be cool.
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  Speaker 3: I don't know how I feel about it.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, man. Have you had training in being a ghost hunter?
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  Speaker 3: I've done it for years.
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  Speaker 4: I've always seen things. Um, it's just something that's been
• 17:27
  Speaker 4: a part of my life, you know, always, um, I've
• 17:30
  Speaker 4: lived in a house that was haunted.
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: And, you know, so I've always had that.
• 17:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Um, I don't know. It's just more of a curiosity.
• 17:41
  Speaker 4: I just, you know, I want to know what's going on. Um, but, um, But, yeah, no,
• 17:49
  Speaker 4: we travel around. We go to other locations and do it. But,
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: I mean, right now, I don't get to do that
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: as much. We've been pretty busy. Yeah.
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: Now, have you ever been on a ghost hunt there
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: in the prison, and all of a sudden you see
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: an apparition, like, there he is. He's right there, right
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: in front of me. Oh, my gosh, there's a ghost, everybody.
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: There's a ghost. Have you ever been like that?
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  Speaker 4: You know, usually when we see ghosts, they're so clear
• 18:21
  Speaker 4: that we don't realize that that's what we're looking at
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  Speaker 4: until it walks through the wall or it vanishes. When
• 18:33
  Speaker 4: they present themselves, they're really clear. And honestly, you can't tell.
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  Speaker 4: I followed one through a hallway, the main hallway of
• 18:41
  Speaker 4: the prison once, thinking it was the guy that it
• 18:46
  Speaker 4: had been rented and I thought it was the guy
• 18:49
  Speaker 4: that had rented it. And I followed him down the
• 18:52
  Speaker 4: hallway and I was texting while I was walking, but
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: kind of looking over the end of my phone to
• 18:58
  Speaker 4: make sure I didn't step on his heels. And when
• 19:01
  Speaker 4: I got in, I laid my phone down to turn
• 19:03
  Speaker 4: around and talk to him and he wasn't there. Oh
• 19:06
  Speaker 4: my gosh. You know, it's, um, uh, you know, and
• 19:10
  Speaker 4: I followed him, you know, into the room, but, um,
• 19:16
  Speaker 4: I've actually, I've seen one in that same hallway, thought
• 19:19
  Speaker 4: it was Pete. I spoke to him. He didn't speak
• 19:22
  Speaker 4: back and I was on a ladder. I came off
• 19:25
  Speaker 4: the ladder and walked toward him. And when I did,
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: he turned and went through the wall.
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh.
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: And we had.
• 19:33
  Speaker 4: We had an employee that morning. He quit his job.
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: Good night. I guess you have to have people there
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: 24 seven pretty much to, for security reasons too. So
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: they probably see things at night too.
• 19:48
  Speaker 4: Yeah. they do, but they don't like, you know, they
• 19:52
  Speaker 4: don't push their luck too much.
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: They don't like it.
• 19:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: And now when you go on a tour, you say
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: you do go all through all the prison buildings and
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: so forth right in the area, including the main prison, too.
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: Uh-huh.
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: Okay. So what do they do? If someone wants to
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: go on a ghost hunt with you, should they call
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: you or email you? Go on your website? What should
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: they do to get started?
• 20:20
  Speaker 4: TourBrushy.com. Okay. And there's a link there, Paranormal Tours.
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: They just go there and go to the calendar and.
• 20:29
  Speaker 4: Pick a date.
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: All right.
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: And now, Pete, you have other things at Brushy Mountain
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: State Penitentiary, too. Talk about those, your restaurants and your
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: events and things like that.
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: Yeah, in order to.
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: Make this thing work, John, we had to bring in
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: some more components. You know, if we're going to get
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: people off the interstate 40 minutes, a prison tour probably
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: wasn't going to be enough. So we added the warden's table,
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: which is a smokehouse restaurant. We added a gift shop
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: with T-shirts and, of course, our distillery.
• 21:08
  Speaker 4: So we saw a lot of moonshine.
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: Our whiskey's rolling out the door. We've got a vodka.
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: And then recently, last year, we opened a second restaurant
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: called Paroli's. It's outside the gate. 57 RV sites. Different menu.
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: It's more pizza, that kind of stuff. We've got 25
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: cabins going up over.
• 21:31
  Speaker 4: The hill right now.
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: And then, of course, we do our concerts, mainly country concerts.
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: I don't know who we had here this year. We've
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: had Clint Black up here.
• 21:45
  Speaker 4: We just had Aaron Lewis.
• 21:47
  Speaker 3: Oh, wow.
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: Zannie Johnson's coming back for the eighth time. So, yeah,
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: we have a good time with that. Our capacity is 5,000 people,
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: and we sell out most of the time.
• 21:59
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 21:59
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: And you're in a valley there, too. There's mountains all
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: around you. It's beautiful up there. It really is.
• 22:07
  Speaker 4: It is.
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: You know, Frozen Head State Park is a 30,000-acre park
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: that surrounds us on three sides, and it's all protected land.
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: We are literally in a bowl. And then across the road,
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: there's one mountain my neighbor owns. But beyond that, there's 70,000
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: acres of off-road parks. It's called Windrop. And so essentially,
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: we just sit in this little bowl just surrounded by
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: the mountain.
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: And now to find out about you, you should go
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: to your website, right?
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: Everything you know about us is at tourbrusher.com.
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: It really is a great website. You can hear the
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: history of it, the tours, the food, everything, even the concerts,
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: everything about it. You can do a great job with
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: the website. Thank you very much for doing that.
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: I'll let my partner know that.
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: He does a good job with it.
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: I would like to mention, John, we were fortunate enough
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: to have former guards and inmates for the first eight
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: years we were here that actually either served time or
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: worked the prison itself. And those sellers were getting up
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: in age. So last year in November, we got everywhere
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: and we recorded at different spots in the prison their
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: stories to capture them for a lifetime. And we worked
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: with a company, Tormade, out of Canada, They do a
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: lot of the museums.
• 23:40
  Speaker 3: They do the Biltmore, that kind of stuff.
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: And fantastic people. And then we used the company iCube
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: and Cookville to do the content and the videos. So
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: now you walk around and there's 25 stops. And you
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: stop and you look down at your handheld. It looks
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: like an Android. And you've got your own earpiece. And
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: you can hear the stories, look at the guys. And then,
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: of course, you finish up at the museum, and then
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: we've got a 25-minute little short movie in there that's fantastic.
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: And we put that together 10 years ago with some
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: of the older fellas. Oh, man. Most of it, which
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: have all passed away, unfortunately.
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: Do you have– and Jamie will know this, I guess. Jamie,
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: what about the people that used to work there? Do
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: they have ghosts come to the place? Do you have
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: ghosts of people that work there?
• 24:30
  Speaker 4: We do have one– Well, we've got actually a couple.
• 24:35
  Speaker 4: There was a guard that was killed in a guard
• 24:38
  Speaker 4: tower that we got stuff from. And then there was
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: a guard that died near the entrance that we think
• 24:49
  Speaker 4: we're getting. There was also a guard out of my
• 24:53
  Speaker 4: family that was, he was a ruthless old man. He
• 25:00
  Speaker 4: shot a lot of them. But what his mistake was,
• 25:04
  Speaker 4: he shot a brother, and there was two brothers here
• 25:08
  Speaker 4: at the same time, and he killed one of them.
• 25:12
  Speaker 4: The other one got on his work crew as they
• 25:15
  Speaker 4: were building the wall and chopped his head off with
• 25:18
  Speaker 4: a shovel.
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: Oh, my gosh.
• 25:20
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 25:21
  Speaker 4: So he's actually buried in our cemetery. He's the only
• 25:24
  Speaker 4: guard that I know for sure that's here.
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: About what year was that?
• 25:29
  Speaker 4: Oh, that was early. That was like 19... I couldn't
• 25:35
  Speaker 4: give you an exact date, but it was early, early 1900s.
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: I want to say it was around 1920.
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: Who were some of the famous prisoners that were there
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: that people would know?
• 25:48
  Speaker 4: Well, James Earl Ray.
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a big one.
• 25:51
  Speaker 4: That's a big one. Tony Robertson, that's the one that
• 25:54
  Speaker 4: the football player that came through here.
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah.
• 25:58
  Speaker 4: And Big John Tate, who was up to fight my
• 26:02
  Speaker 4: Pomodoro League, he came through here. One of the guys
• 26:08
  Speaker 4: that was with the Mansons, but I can't remember his name,
• 26:13
  Speaker 4: he was in here. I'll have to look that back
• 26:15
  Speaker 4: up because I forgot his name. But he came through.
• 26:18
  Speaker 4: We've had several.
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: Are any of them on Ghost now? Then you find
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: them on a tour?
• 26:25
  Speaker 5: Sure.
• 26:26
  Speaker 4: We get things coming through that claims to be James R. Ray.
• 26:31
  Speaker 4: He didn't die here, but, you know, he always said
• 26:34
  Speaker 4: this was home to him. So we do get things
• 26:39
  Speaker 4: in and around his cell. One of the funny, one
• 26:44
  Speaker 4: of my favorites, I should say, that we get here
• 26:48
  Speaker 4: is Geronimo, our deer.
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: We get that. You'll hear... what sounds.
• 26:55
  Speaker 4: Like hooves running on the ground, and we'd get things
• 27:00
  Speaker 4: that sound like a deer blowing.
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I read about that story about how the deer
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: came to the prison. Tell that story real quick.
• 27:08
  Speaker 4: He fell over the wall. There's a natural wall.
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: The mountain is.
• 27:14
  Speaker 4: One of the walls here. And so he fell over
• 27:18
  Speaker 4: that natural wall, and his inmates nursed him back to health.
• 27:24
  Speaker 4: And he had a cell here for a while. He
• 27:27
  Speaker 4: liked to eat cigarettes. He was just one of the boys,
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: I guess.
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: Okay. How long did he stay there?
• 27:37
  Speaker 4: You know, I don't.
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: Really know exactly how many years he was here. They
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: shut it down.
• 27:43
  Speaker 4: In the 70s and took him down to Nashville.
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 27:49
  Speaker 4: And during that time... they took Geronimo with them because
• 27:58
  Speaker 4: they knew these men would riot if they didn't. So
• 28:01
  Speaker 4: they took him down there, and those inmates ended up
• 28:05
  Speaker 4: killing him.
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: Oh, man. Oh, gosh.
• 28:08
  Speaker 4: You see what.
• 28:09
  Speaker 3: Happens in Nashville all the time.
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: You see what happens?
• 28:12
  Speaker 4: Yes, right.
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: You say, stay out of there, right? Well, that's why
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: I got out of there. That's right. I got out
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: of there and got to a haunted prison. Well, I
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: appreciate you guys coming on today and talking about this
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: and being Halloween. It's a great time to talk about
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: haunted stuff, but it looks like a wonderful prison. I
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: haven't been able to get up there yet, but I'm
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: going to try to get up there one day. Now,
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: where exactly are you, Pete? Where exactly is the prison?
• 28:35
  Speaker 4: So we're in Morgan County.
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: The easiest way to tell you is about 20 minutes
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: west of Oak Ridge, about 45 minutes west of downtown Knoxville.
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: We're right up in the start of that place.
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: Well, I would encourage people to go there, take a
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: ghost tour, and do it all. It looks like a
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: great place. I've seen all the pictures and all. I've
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: seen the pictures of your food, too, and the food
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: looks really good, too. I want to say that. I
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: hope so. I hope so. Well, I hope you guys–
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: I wish you guys well. I think it's great that
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: you're taking to prison and you're keeping it going. I
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: think it's important to keep things as part of our history.
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: And I like what you guys are doing. Thank you
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: so much for coming on today. I appreciate it.
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: Well, we appreciate you thinking about us.
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: Have a good one.
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: That's Jamie Brock at Pete Waddington with the historic Brushy
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: Mountain State Penitentiary. You can find out more about that
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: at tourbrushy.com, tourbrushy.com. Brushy Mountain, happy Halloween. If you have
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: questions or comments on today's program, you can email me,
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: johnclark at iharm. Thanks for listening. I'll talk to you
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: next week right here on your favorite local radio station
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: on Tennessee Matters.