Latest / 3 and Out with John Middlekauff / Ken Rideout's story, Will Lamar crash out, Could McDonald call offensive plays

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Ken Rideout's story, Will Lamar crash out, Could McDonald call offensive plays · 3 and Out with John Middlekauff

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: The volume.
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: What is going on Everybody, John Middlecoff three and now podcast.
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: Hopefully everyone is doing well out there in the real world,
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: enjoying yourself, because I know we are. Today we have
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: a big show. I met this guy at the super Bowl.
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: His name is Ken ride Out. He's got an incredible story.
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: He's from Boston. He sounds like he's Buddy's with Whitey Bulger.
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: He worked in finance like a Wolf of Wall Street,
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: became like a drug addict, turned his life around. Now
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: is the top ultra marathon or in the world according
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: to the Wall Street Journal. He's just he's a fascinating individual.
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: He's he's my type entertainment. So he came on the show.
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: We'll talk. We'll just talk his story because it's it's
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: pretty interesting. It's really interesting. He's got a book coming out.
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: I met him at the super Bowl party, and we
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: wills do a little mailbag at John Midcoff at John
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: Middlecoff as the Instagram will fire in those dms after
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: we talked to Ken and the game. This will probably
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: be the last podcast for the rest of this week
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: and all of next week as I try to be
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: a little bit of a family man for a little
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: while and decompress after the long season, and then we
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: will be back the week of the twenty third in
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: Indianapolis for a couple of days podcast and see who
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: we can talk to, rub some elbows with some people,
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: and that will be the game plan. So I will
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: also I'll be on the Herd with Coward this Friday
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: the thirteenth and Monday the sixteenth, So I might need
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: to get a tan before I go on television. I'm
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: pretty pale right now, but it might be a little
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: too little too late. That's the game plan. So we'll
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: be chilling for next ten days. Then we'll then we'll
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: hit it hard leading into the combine, free agent see
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: and the rest of the off season. But other than that,
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: you guys know the drill. If you listen on Collins feed,
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: make sure you subscribe to three and Out. We are
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: on Netflix every single day. Make sure you subscribe to
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: the alerts on Netflix. Appreciate all you guys that have
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: watched and checked it out and giving us some feedback.
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: So we'll just keep chopping wood. But let's dive into
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: the interview. Okay, here are a couple of days after the
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: Super Bowl with a man from Boston, who I met
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: at the Volume super Bowl party. Jamie Horowitz introduced us,
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: and I said, this is my type, guy Ken right out,
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: who some considered the fastest marathon runner over fifty just
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: written in the Wall Street Journal. He has a book
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: coming out the other side of Hard here in about
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: a month on March tenth. You can buy it wherever
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: you know you purchase your books. I'm more of an
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: audio book guy, so I will fire that thing down
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: on my iPhone, big patriot, guy, Ken, have you recovered
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: from the Super Bowl loss?
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: That was a tough one, man. I was happy that
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: they got there, considering they only had four wins last year,
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: but definitely mixed emotions. I can handle the lost, humiliating fact,
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: the humiliating way in which they lost definitely made it
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: a bit more painful for sure. But good run for
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: the boys.
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: So I didn't know that much about your story, and
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: Jamie introduced us, and reading and watching some interviews with you,
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: you got a fascinating story. I mean, you know this,
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: You've talked about it. I guess let's just start when
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: you were young. You're now into ultra marathons or ultra marathons,
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: having a lot of successful gut dive in you ran
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: in Mongolia, I definitely want to hear about that. But
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: you were a young guy in Boston who kind of
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: took off in the finance world. I guess kind of
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: let's start from your youth, kind of a rough childhood
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: to you know, playing some college football, right to go
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: into New York City to all of a sudden making
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: a lot of money as a young guy. It just
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: kind of took off fast for you.
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, very fast, but you know, it was like the
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: longest overnight success in history. I grew up in Summerville,
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: like very much a blue collar, like a hard scrabble
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: town like for context. When I got out of high school,
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: my first job was as a guard in prison outside
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: of Boston, and my stepfather had already been an inmate
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: there and my younger brother would eventually be a prisoner
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: there multiple times. And after I played I played ice
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: hockey and football in college. And then when I got
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: out of school and moved to New York, was working
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: in a pharmaceutical sales job and was training at a
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: local gym playing men's league pickup hockey, and I met
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: a guy who was at the Chelsea Piers Men's Hockey
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: League who was a trader at commodities trader named Mike Peltier,
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: who unfortunately died in nine to eleven. And he was
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: a commodities trader and he's like, hey, we need a
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: junior trader. And I had seen all these kids at
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: the gym where I was working out who were like
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: making a shitload of money. Sorry, can we swear on
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: this show? Heck yeah, okay, and I'll try to keep
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: it to a minimum so my kids can latch. And
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: I was like, man, these guys seem like idiots, but
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: they're all making tons of money and I'm like broke
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: as a joke. So anyway, when this guy said they
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: had a role. They were looking for a junior trader
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: on this trading desk, I was like, hell, yeah, I'll
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: do that. And long story short, I started there in about,
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: you know, two months in. They were basically hazing me.
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: If anyone's worked on a trading desk, it's very much
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: like being on a sports team, and the older guys,
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: the experienced guys, are like hazing the junior guys. And
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: one day I just had had enough of it, and
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: I slapped the guy across his face. Which it was
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: crazy to me that they were even trying to haze
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: him bully me. I like box for the New York
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: Athletic Club at the time. I practically had a black
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: guy for like three straight years. I worked in a
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: No one would have described me as a pushover. I mean,
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: I didn't think of myself as a tough guy, but
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: I certainly wasn't someone that was getting picked on regularly.
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: And yeah, this guy was hazy, like just giving me
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: tons of shit, and eventually I just had enough and
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: slapped the shit out of him. And they, needless to say,
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: they fired me on the spot. But when some of
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: the senior traders at Enron heard that story, they called
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: me up. And this was a Thursday. By Monday I
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: had a job making twice as I was making forty grand.
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: By Monday, I had a job making eighty grand on
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: a competing trading desk, which I didn't even know we
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: had competitors at the time. That's how naive I was.
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: And then very quickly I was making hundreds of thousand dollars.
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: I got hired to run this commodity sales and trading
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: desk in London for Caunter Fitzgerald moved to London. Right
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: before I moved, I had an ankle surgery, got some percocet,
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: and for the next ten years I was basically high
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: on opioids twenty four to seven and just weren't living
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: as a functioning drug addict and behaving like an absolute loser.
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: But in my heart I was like, man, I'm not
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: a loser, but I'm behaving like a loser. So then
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: eventually I got married my wife and I adopted a
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: daughter from Ethiopia. Right before we went together, I was like,
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: I gotta get sober once and for all. And it's
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: a long story, it's all outlined in the book. But
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: I got sober, hillacious like two weeks of my life,
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: and then started running and started doing triathlons. Initially I
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: did the Ironman in Hawaii three times, and I started
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: running and showing up to running races and like everything else,
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: like with the finance stuff, I was looking around at
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: the other people running and just being like, dude, I
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: can smash everyone here if I just trained hard, and
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: I did. I started training super hard. I moved to
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: la in twenty and sixteen, was living in the Pacific Palisades,
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: which is where I met Horoist, who just happens to
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: be from Boston as well. And I was training up
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: in the mountains. There I met Reggie Miller. He was
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: always right. We were the only two people out in
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: the mountain in the trails. Every morning I'd see him.
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: He'd be riding his mountain bike. I'd be running. We'd
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: be side by side going up these steep trails and
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: we just talk and struck up a friendship. He wrote
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: a beautiful blurb for my book. Then I won the
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: Malibu Half Marathon a couple of years in a row,
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: and then in twenty twenty, I did the Pasadena Half
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: Marathon and like eight thousand people finished in the Rose
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: Bowl on KTLA live on TV, and I won. I
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: beat everyone nine thousand people. So I'm running into the
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: Rose Bowl and I'm like literally like, holy shit, I'm
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: gonna fucking win this race. And after that things I
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: started to get some attention. And then a few months later,
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: the day before I turned fifty, I won the Myrtle
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: Beach Marathon, the whole thing. I ran two thirty there
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: and yeah, and then I won four of the six
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: world marathon majors. I won Boston, New York, Chicago, and Tokyo,
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: and I got second in Berlin and London and in Chicago.
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: In twenty three was the World Championships for age group.
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: So I beat everyone in the world over fifty.
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: I want to circle back to some of the beginning.
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: But to me, Reggie Miller, he looks the exact same
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: physically as he did when he was playing MJ in
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: the Eastern Conference Final. I mean, as he has a
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: game to pound his skin, he looks fantastic. I think
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: I googled it because he was on TV calling like
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: the NBA finals or the Conference finals a couple of
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: years ago. I'm like, he's got to be the best
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: looking like fifty seven year old in like the history
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: of America. He looks fantastic for his age.
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: Let me tell you now that you saying that guy
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: is cardio freak. He's like winning races on his mountain bikes,
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: and if you know anything about race and a mountain bike,
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: it's super super technical, but you also need to be
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: incredibly fit. He would be out there grinding like I thought.
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: I was like, people were looking at me like I
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: was crazy. And when I saw him one day, I'm
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: like Hey, what's up, Champ? And he had seen me
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: a million times and we just hit it off and
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: I asked him to write it. I mean I felt
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: like an ass ask I hate asking people for anything,
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: but asking him to write a quote. He was like, Oh,
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: be my honor. He wrote the most incredible quote from
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: my book. Use He's just not only does he like
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: look like he's seventeen years old, he's the nicest guy
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: I've ever met. Just couldn't be kinder.
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: I I've never been I've actually never been to Boston,
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: but I lived in Philly for a couple of years,
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: and I think there's some parallels of there's like a
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: toughness and a character to you guys that grow up there.
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: And I think we were talking about this before you
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: hopped on. There are so many successful people definitely in
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: what we do you know of there's like this toughness
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: that you guys have grown up in that area. But
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: there's also like an eq like a feel for people
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: that you know when you talk. For some I'm from California,
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: you sound like a guy that I hear in the movies,
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: right that that accent, it's very it's very distinct. It's
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: like you know, Whitey Bulger meets with Wahlberg. It's just
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: but there's like you can throw you guys in a
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: room and you could hang with like you worked at
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: a prison, but you could also hang with these guys
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: that are CEOs, multi millionaires. Is that just something developed
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: where you kind of especially maybe it's different now that
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: I'm sure that area has changed, but when you're growing
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: the seventies the eighties, it's just a it's a tough area,
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: and it just what do you think is about the
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: general in Boston that developed so many people that go
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: on to be successful in the real world.
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: You know, that's a good question. I think of my
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: own story more as a survival story than someone who's thriving.
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: I was just like trying to figure shit out. It's
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: like I think a lot of times you meet. I
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: had a boxing match with the New York Athletic Club
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: one time, and I was on one side of the curtain,
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: woman up and the other guy was on the other
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: side with his coach, and he was like, don't let
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: that guy's accent intimidate you. And I'm thinking to myself,
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: my accent is intimidating someone like I have. I was
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: oblivious to that someone would think that that sounds tough,
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: that I sounded tough, because in my heart, I'm like
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: like everyone else, I'm scared of everything. I'm scared before
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: a race. I just like I tell my kids. One
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: of my sons playing baseball, and every time they throw
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: the pitch, he's like, he's like ten, he steps out
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: of the batter's box, and I go, buddy, every time
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: the guy throws the ball, you step it out of
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: the box. It looks like you're scared, and he goes
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: I am, And I was like, oh, okay, everyone's scared, dude.
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: You just have to learn how to do this shit
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: while you're scared. And I think that if I've done
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: anything well, it's learned to do things scared. But about
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: your question from Boston, I just feel like when you're
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: in like a kind of economically depressed area, and I
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: didn't know any friends that were rich or that were
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: doing really well, that didn't constantly think about money, that
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: the parents weren't always like, you know, thinking about money
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: and trying to make money. People are so insecure, they're
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: constant like razzing and bullshit, and you just learn to
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: get a thick skin quick, because if you don't, you
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: won't survive. Sometimes even with my own kids, I'll be
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: teasing them, and my wife's like, I think you're a
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: little too hard on them. And it's because everyone else
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: there around is so soft that I've got to like
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: adjust my own behavior to kind of match the people
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: that I'm around now. But it's like after you condition
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: like that, and especially working in a prison, man, there
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: is not a single nice thing happened in prison. Every
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: single person in there is trying to beat you twenty
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: four to seven, and you're only there eight hours a day.
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: So you learn very quickly to like read people or
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: you're going to have a bad expences. And so I
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: don't know, I don't think of myself as having any
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: special skills butt it, but I certainly have a higher
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: emotional intelligence than intellect.
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: You worked in prison when you were in college.
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: I started there the few days after I graduated high school.
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: I probably looked like I was thirteen years old.
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: Were you You know, you talk about your son stepping
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: out of the bat. I did the same. I was never
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: very in baseball, But I mean, did you go in
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: there a little nervous? I mean, was that one of
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: those situations. Did you go on slivel on a daily basis?
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: Was it like a maximum security prison?
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, there was sections of it. There were maximum security
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: and others that there were lower It's like any prison.
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: There's different facilities within the institution. You know. I was
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: probably a little bit nervous, but when you grow up
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: with these people, like I knew half the people there.
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: Like the first day I walked in, this giant guy
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: from the projects right now where I lived, Barry Hills,
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: like a big Irish gangster, like a killer, was in
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: there for smashing someone in the head with the claw
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: end of a hammer. He comes running over, grabs me
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: like in a fireman's carry like a child, and is
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: running around with me in the ball field. I'm like
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: in a prison guard uniform and I'm like, brother, put
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: me down. The only thing I cared about. I'm like, dude,
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: the other guards are looking at me. They're gonna like
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: I don't want them to think like I'm this type
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: with the inmates. Come to find out, like Mickey Ward
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: the Fighter was a guard with me there, and his
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: brother Dicky Ecklin was an inmate. Like all of the
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: guards were like one one mistake away from being inmates themselves.
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: This wasn't like, you know, the highest form of law enforcement.
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: Matter of fact, it would have been the lowest.
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: When you grew up in Boston, kind of the mob
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: probably eighties nineties was kind of coming to an end still,
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: probably when you were young, still ripping and kind of
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: came to an end.
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: It was very much in full effect. Like Howie Winsor
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: lives right near me. That where the whole winter Hill
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: Gang hung out at the garage on Marshall Street. My
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: cousin lived right across the street from there. They were
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: like they were like my siblings, like we spent all
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: the time, but they were those guys were always around.
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: But it was like, you know, it's like any mob
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: movie you see, like from a kid's perspective. They were
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: just older guys that were there. They're like, you know,
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: give you a shit all the time. They were like
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: we were oblivious to like the violence that was going
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: on too. We got older, obviously, and then and then
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: it was starting to calm down when I was like
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: in my twenties and then started like when I was
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: start when I went to college, I did coke for
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: the first time, and then for like five years. My friends,
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: my Boston friends, and I were just on a tear
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: of like go out drink to coke when I moved
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: to New York. As a matter of fact, I said
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: to that kid Peltier, who got me the first job.
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: We were out one night. I said, Dude, I've been
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: here for like a few months. I've not seen one
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: single fight in a bar. Not one. If I went
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: out with my friends in Boston, it would be a
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: very rare occasion that there wasn't a fight either with
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: either with the guys I was with, I wasn't like
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: a huge troublemaker, but some of the people I was
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: with were Half of them ended up being inmates in
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: that same prison. But it was just an aggressive, like
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: an aggressive place. And I'm just glad my kids aren't
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: living in that environment I was in a I went
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: to the like kind of impatient mental health place a
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: few years ago just because I wanted to like be
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: happier than I was. And when I was telling the woman,
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: she was like, oh, childhood trauma. I'm like, I don't
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: have any trauma. I just think I should be happier.
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: And I started telling her, like my childhood and She
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: was like, well, what would you say if any of
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: your children have to go through any of this? And
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: I was like, are you crazy? They could never survive this?
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: And she was like, what do you think made you special?
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: You just said you're like just as scared as everyone else.
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: And I was like, I don't know. I kind of
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: put things into perspective for me that like, yeah, maybe
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: it was a little ft up, but when you go
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: into it, you don't know any different.
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: Now, you don't. You just grow up the way you
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: grow up. You don't control anything. And you know, I
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: was I just had a baby. So when I'm doing
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: when i'm when I'm taking some duties and she's sleeping, Yeah,
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: you just have TV on the background. I threw on
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: Wolf of Wall Street a couple weeks ago, and I've
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: thought about this for a long time. How can people
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: and you got into finance right in the nineties and
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: it feels like therug the drug culture in Wall Street
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: just raging? How can you function in work? And is
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: it as you know that movie? Obviously Hollywood eyes it,
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: but it's fair to say, listen to your story and
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: watching some of your talks about it, like it was
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: you weren't alone in what was going on? How do
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: you function? Like, how do you go to meetings? How
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: do you land deals? I mean, how was everyone doing that?
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: Wolf of Wall Street was like they were covering retail client.
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: They were calling like mom and pops. I was like
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: an institutional trader, so we were trading with like banks
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: and initially like Enron and Big Utilities. I never told
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: anyone I was doing drugs, so in my mind I
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: was dad. People probably just thought that I was a
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: little crazy and aggressive. But to me, you know, I
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: would take like percasts Viking in fenting and just feel good.
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: I mean, I'm sure people were probably like, this guy's
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: a fucking weirdo. But to me, I was like on
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: cloud nine. I was just happy as can be. And
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: then of course I would get high in the morning,
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: take them again at lunchtime, and then after dinner, you know,
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: like thirty forty percosets a day. And man, it was
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: New York. It was less obvious when I went to London.
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: I mean, I was in bad shape, but the people
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: there were even worse. There were people go into the bathroom,
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: come out cocaine all over their nose, and guys will
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: work because I ran the whole Commanderies trading desk. There
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: was like thirty or forty guys that work for me.
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: They come back to the desk and I'm like, dude,
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: did you even look in the mirror? You have coke
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: all over your face. And they were like, oh, sorry, sorry, boss.
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: I'd come in in the morning, there'd be someone sleeping
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: under the trading desk. It was. It was complete chaos madness.
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: Is it just the culture of finance? They just kind
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: of went hand in hand and safe to say, especially.
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: I think a lot of the same shit goes on today.
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: It's just like maybe I think that there's such like
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: a health and wellness kick too that you get one
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: extreme or the other. You get the guys that are
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: like overweight doing coke, and then you get the like
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: hardcore like fitness finance bros that are super into health
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: and wellness. You know, you probably get much more of
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: those high performers that like Goldman and Morgan Stanley, JP Morgan,
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: like the big banks, and then you've got those like
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: kind of shitty second third tier Yankee banks like where
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: I worked at Credit Agricult not as bad, but like
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: some of those third tier banks you never heard of.
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: You get some real fucking lunatics in they're all blacked out.
• 19:25
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  Speaker 2: New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee, Virginia. So when was there a
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: moment in your career where you went, I probably can't
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: do this anymore, but you were probably doing well financially,
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: which is always like the push and pull. It's like, well,
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: I'm living the American dream. Look at me, but internally
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: my life is just if people knew what was really
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: going on when the doors were shut, no one's looking.
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: They would be like, what is going on with this guy? Yes,
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: when was the moment? Like, was there was there a
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: specific day, Was there a specific you know, drug use point.
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: So I always stayed super like. I always exercised and
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: was fit, so I never looked a mess. And I
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: mean and when I moved to London, I was making
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: millions of dollars. I had a brand new Push straight
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: from the Push factory. I had a whole entire like
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: three story house in that right in the middle of
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: London in Kensington, with a garage like it was unhurt
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: like crazy, unheard of. The top floor, the whole floor
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: was glass. You could look down into the into the
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: living room from the bedroom upstairs.
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: It was ones this time.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I mean, dude, less than a year before
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: I was making forty grand. They couldn't even afford to
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: pay all my student loans and everything else. And now
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: I have like money to burn. I was flying on
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: the Concord back and forth from London to New York,
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: ten thousand each way. This is in like two thousand
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: and then. And then I met my wife and for
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: a long time I was just hid everything from her,
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: and she had never done drugs in her life. Grew
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: up on a farm in New Jersey, when to Vanderbilt
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: was like just perfect family. Everything was like she was
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: totally square, had no idea, and then eventually she kind
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: of figured out. But when we were going to it,
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: when we got matched with my daughter in Ethiopian and
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: we were gonna go travel to Ethiopia, and we had
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: like a month to get ready, I went to an
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: outpatient detox where they give you like medicine to help
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: with the withdrawals, so I would have like riddling to
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: stay awake, xannex to go to sleep, and I mean
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: I was sick, like real sick, and I woke up
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: to go to the bathroom one night, like three nights
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: into it. And by the way, once I got to
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: seven days clean without the drugs, they could give me
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: this shot called vivatrol, which would block the opioid receptors
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: in your brain, so you couldn't get high for a
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: month even if you tried. So in my mind, I'm like,
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: if I can just get to seven days, I don't
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: even have to tell her why I'm so sick, and
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: I'll be clear, and then I can go to Ethiopia
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: and then I'll have some time, some sobriety, and I'll
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: be good. Like three or four days into it, I
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: got up to take a leak, blacked out in the bathroom,
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: fell down, smashed my head, woke up my wife. It
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: is like, what the f what is going on? And
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: I this is like a big pivotal moment in the
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: book too, because I'm like looking at her and then
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: we lived in like a stunning, like brand new glass
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: high rise on the like forty fifth floor in Manhattan.
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: Then I'm laying on the floor just so disgusted with
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: myself because, like I said, I never thought of myself
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: as such a piece of shit loser, but that's what
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: I was. And I'm looking at her, and I'm looking
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: at the balcony, and I'm like, I'm either gonna tell
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: her the truth or jump off that balcony, and I
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: just I just like came clean with everything. I'm like,
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: I'm a fucking junkie. I'm whacked out, I'm in withdrawals.
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: And it was horrible. Sorry, it gets me, uh, it
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: gets me choked up talking about it because, like I said,
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: I don't think of myself as a piece of shit,
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: but I was behaving like a weakling and a pussy
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: and it just came to a head and that was
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: the last time that I like really got that fucking
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: whacked out.
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: But being honest with her probably the best thing you
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: ever did. Then you were able to pivot into Yeah, and.
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: Then once I told her the truth, and then instead
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: of like being completely enraged with me, she just helped
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: me through it and like, you know, became like the
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: fucking police, and I put her in a terrible position.
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: And it's been terrible because then like a few months ago,
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: she was diagnosed with cancer. So it's been it's been
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: a rollercoaster, man, for sure. How's always been stuck, stuck
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: with me, no matter how much crazy shit I've done.
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: How's she doing, Yeah, she's great.
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: She's cancer free now and ready for a reconstructive surgery.
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: So there are silver lining. You'll end up with nice
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: new boobs and no cancer. You'll come out of it
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: like a cancer survivor with a new set of cans.
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: Everybody wins.
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, my mom beat breast cancer in the early two thousands, so,
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: I mean, these doctors now are pretty amazing with that stuff.
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: It's been unbelievable. I mean, from the minute they diagnosed
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: her until they did the surgery, it was like it
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: felt like a whirlwind. It was like you know when
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: something like you never think something like that's gonna happen
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: to you. We would always say to each other like,
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: can you I'm so so lucky. The kids are healthy,
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: We're lucky. We live in Nashville, and everything that we
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: always talked about is happening. And then she gets cancer
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: and it was like, you know someone when you hear
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: someone gets cancer and they're fifty, I'm like, oh my god,
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: it's a death sentence was screwed. And we have four
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: little kids, and the doctors were amazing. They we went
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: in for the first appointment. They're like, all right, here's
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: what we're gonna do. You're gonna do this appointment, then
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: go for surgery. Then they're gonna do this, then you'll
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: get the reconstruction. It'll be great. And that's exactly what happened.
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: Wow, damn, that's well. I'm glad she's doing well. When
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: you before you pivoted to the Ultra Marathon, did you
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: have to remove yourself from finance, like remove yourself from
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: the culture to get sober.
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: Were you able to kind of do both, dude. When
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: I was going through that week of with Darles, that's
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: when I started like this tradition of running, or this
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: habit of running ten miles every day. It was part
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: penance for putting myself in this position, in part like
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: I want to expedite this process of getting the drugs
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: out of my system. I'm just gonna run. And you know,
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: there would be days where I'm like, I'm gonna drop
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: that I feel so terrible, but I'm gonna keep running.
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: I'm like, you know, it was like thirty degrees outside,
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: but I'm like drenched in sweat and shorts and a
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: T shirt because my body is just in complete chaos
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: after ten years of abuse. But once I got, once
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: I got and I just kept working. I never told anyone.
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: I mean, I'm sure the people that worked with me
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: are hearing like these stories now and are like, I
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: knew something was wrong with that bag, but uh yeah.
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: And then and then from there I started. I was
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: running so much that my knees would bother me. I
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: got a bike. Soon as I rode the bike a
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: few times, Like within a couple of years, I was
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: racing on a team with Lance Armstrong, training with the
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: best athletes in the world and just crushing. Like the
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: cycling scene. A guy from a guy from my office
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: was like talking about you know, cyclists like runners and
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: anything else, like they getting like golfers whatever, and they
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: can be such dorks and they're like, Oh, I'm the
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: best cyclist. I'm so good at this. I showed up
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: one time with a sleeveless T shirt and shorts. I
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: had a bike for like two weeks to kick the
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: shit out of all of them, and I'm like, Wow,
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: I'm either really good at cycling or you guys suck.
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: How can I be like you guys have like the
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: full like clown suit on and I have shorts and
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: a T shirt. Eventually I would be completely dressed like
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: a clown too, in like full light club.
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: But what so, when did you realize that the ultra marathon, Like,
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: I'm this isn't just going to be what I do
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: every day. I'm going to be competitive in this. How
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: did that kind of get going?
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: Well? Good question. So I was doing the triathlon. I
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: did a few triathlons, you know, got trounced a couple times,
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: and was like, how are these guys beating me? Like
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: these guys shouldn't be able to beat me in anything.
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: So I started really training hard and I started to
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: win like small races all around Manhattan, and then I
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: was like, well, what's the best triathlon in the world.
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: Like everything else that I've done, I'm like, well, if
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: I've got this car, what's the best car. So I
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: did the same thing, and someone was like, oh, the
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: Ironman in Hawaii, but you got to really train for that.
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: It's not easy to qualify. And I was like for
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: some people maybe, and I just I did a couple
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: of races, qualified at the Ironman in New York City,
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: did that, and then when we had our fourth kid,
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: we have three biological boys. When we moved to la
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: in in January of sixteen, my wife was like, enough
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: with this triathlon bullshit. Because I was riding my bike
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: for like eight hours, I was on a Saturday running
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: for three hours on Sunday. It was way too much
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: and it was super selfish, and so I just transitioned
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: to running. And that's really when I started running, like
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: very quickly. Started to get a lot of attention from
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: brands in particular, so I had like a partnership for
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: years with Rebok they didn't have any runners except me,
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: and like Shack well there are two athletes, and it
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: was just crazy. It was like it almost happened overnight.
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: And quickly I transitioned out of finance. I was working
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: for an asset manager in LA raising a bunch of money,
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: and once I raised some money for this asset manager,
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: I realized I can do this on my own, and
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: I did. As an independent placement AH, I raised money
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: for a ton of different venture funds, private equity funds,
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: as well as private brands like private placements and investments
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: into health and wellness startups. And through that, in the running,
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: I started to get these brand partnerships via social media
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: that I didn't even know was a thing. And I
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: had done so many of them in the and I
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: had worked closely with the on the finance side that
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: they started asking me who else they should be working with.
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: And just quickly I started representing some of the best
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: and biggest scientists, doctors and thought leaders in the health
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: and wellness space. So like Andrew Huberman, if you know
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: the human Yeah, it's one of my really good friends.
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: We've done some things together. I raise money for this guy,
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: David Sinclair in Boston. He wrote a book called Lifespan
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: one of the top longevity scientists in the world. So
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: we have a whole roster people that ride out dark
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: group that I manage all their brand deals, and me
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: and the people that I work with, and this whole
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: running thing. It took on a life of its own
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: and it was like, you know, it's like when people
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: tell you, like, do something that you love and you'll
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: never work a day in your life. Again, that's the truth.
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: If you can figure out a way to get paid
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: to do the things that you love doing, not that
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: I love running every day, it can be just as
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: hard for me as it is for everyone else. Just
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: hopefully if you do it enough you get faster. But
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: it's been like a dream come true getting paid to
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: like run and represent health and wellness brands. Crazy to
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: think of where I was, you know, fifteen years ago.
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: Did you run ten miles legitimately every day? Like you
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: never take it?
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: And I log every single mile is logged on Strava
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: on the I don't know if you know that app Strava, Yeah,
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: I know. Every single run I've done since twenty thirteen
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: is there. I've averaged like four thousand miles a year
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: for the past five years, which is ten point six
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: miles a day, every single day with no days off.
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: Would all be outside.
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: Ninety nine point nine percent.
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: So when I run into you at the Super Bowl,
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: are you just going for a Bay Area run that morning?
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: No matter, because I'm sure you're traveling for work and stuff.
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: What do you what do you do? What about the
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: weather if it's freezing every.
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: Day, every day, fucking tornado, hurricane, snowstorm every single.
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: Day because it ain't warm where you live. No, So
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: what did you do during the snowstorm or the ice storm?
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: I show you. I'll show you a picture that will
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: like perfectly summarize what that snowstorm was like. Here, give
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: me one second, you're gonna like this.
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: Someone was telling me a story that they lived there,
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: and they said the thing, Oh my god.
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: Fifteen miles flooring rain and snow and like ten degrees outside.
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: I thought that one of the coldest runs you've ever
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: been on.
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: No, I've been on some cold ones, man, I've been.
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: I've run everywhere in the world. I've run almost in
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: every single country, like well most of them, on every continent.
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: I've run in some cold places like we take the
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: kids skiing. I run ten miles up the side of
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: the mountain and Aspen I've been. I've run down some
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: really cold ones, like well below zero, this happened here.
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So what would you say is a more I
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: know you ran a race in Mongolia? Yeah, would you
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: say the peak of the hottest place in the world
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: or a freezing cold below zero run? What's one's more difficult?
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: Miles? The heat is miles harder than the cold within
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: within reason, I mean, if it's fucking minus fifty, I
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: don't know, Like, but running in the heat, your body
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: uses about eighty percent of the energy it's burning. Is
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: trying to cool your body down, just like a car engine.
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: If the engine can't be cooled, it's going to overheat
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: and stop working. And when it's real hot, like my
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: any runner that you look at, their best times will
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: always be run when it's slightly colder outside. So like
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: my fastest times will run when it was like forty
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: degrees and I had on like shorts in a tank top.
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: That's the ideal running condition. You would say forty fifty degrees.
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: For sure, Like about forty mid forties is ideal, Like
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: you want to be you want to be freezing cold
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: at the beginning because by the end you're not going
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: to be cold. But yeah, the race in Mongolia. About
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: a month before the race start started, I think it
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: was in twenty twenty three. But a month before the race,
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: a guy from this guy Scott Derue, who was the
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: CEO at Equinox, he's now the CEO at iron Man.
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: He's a friend and he called me and said he's
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: running this race called the Gobi March across the Gobi
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: Desert in Mongolia. Asked if I would join if for
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: some advice, and I was like, oh, wow, this race
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: sounds interesting. I had never run an ultra, I never
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: run with a backpack. I grew up in the city.
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: I had never been camping in my life. And I
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: was like, dude, that ray sounds interesting. I'll bet you
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: I could smash everyone, just kind of clown and run.
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: And he was like, come on, sign up. I'll get
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: Equinox to sponsor you. So he did. They When I
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: wrote the race director, it was sold out for like
• 34:19
  Speaker 1: well over a year and she was like, yeah, we'll
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: clump your entry. And I showed up there. So for
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: a month I tried a bunch of different backpacks, put
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: like towels and bottled water inside the backpack. In June
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: in Nashville, I would finish and be down like ten
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: pounds from a twenty mile run with this weighted twenty
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: pound backpack, because that's how much weight I was carrying.
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: Because it was self supporting, meaning you had to carry
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: everything you needed except water, and they would provide a tent,
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: so I had my backpack, a change of clothes. You
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: had to have mandatory certain safety items like a whistle
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: of you know, one of those aluminum blanket things like
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: just some safety bullshit, you know, and stuff for them,
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: and then your food. So for a week, so I'm
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: burning like ten thousand calories a day, but I only
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: had twenty five hundred calories spaced out per day. And
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: of course, you know, after three days I probably ate
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: most of the food. But what I had planned on
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: and I did. I had never done this race, so
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: I wasn't sure how it would work, but I assumed
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: people would be dropping out and I'd be able to
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: scavenge for stuff and just survive, which is what happened.
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: And first day I got the shit kicked out of me,
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: and I was like, oh my god. I finished fourth,
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: and I was like, oh my god. In my mind,
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: I'm like I'm killing everyone. And now I'm like, I'm
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: like twelve minutes down after the first day, which was
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: twenty one miles. The next day was twenty eight miles,
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: and it's a long story, but I won that stage
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: by like ten minutes, so I was still two minutes down.
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: But with a few miles ago, I fell down the
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: bat the strap on my backpack ripped off and I
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: busted my arm open. So I'm bleeding everywhere and my
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: bag is ripped, and I'm thinking, like, oh my god,
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: no one's gonna believe my bag really ripped. They're going
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: to think I like quit on this race. So I,
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: like Jerry, rigged it together for the third day. It
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: ripped again the third day, but after the third day
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: a woman dropped out and she let me take her backpack.
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: So I had this ill fitting backpack that like friggin
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: rubbed my whole body raw, like I had just chafing everywhere.
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: And on the fourth day it was fifty miles, I
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: was down by about eight minutes and with the leader
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: a Swiss guy. This adventure race a really strong athlete,
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: and it was just him and I together fifty miles
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: and thirty five miles in he started to fall apart
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: and he was like, man, I gotta walk for a minute.
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: And you know, we're alone and we're in the desert.
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: So I'm like, all right, I'll walk with you for
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: a minute. You know, we're racing, but I still like,
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: we're all like, it's dangerous. It's fifty mile a day,
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: We've been out already for like seven hours, and it's hot.
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: So then he's out of water. So I'm giving them.
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: We could get water every like five to ten miles,
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: but you know, you could take as much as you want,
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: but you have to carry it so you know you've
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: got just enough to get to the next station. So
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: I'm giving in my water, you know, hoping that he
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: doesn't like frigging pass out. And eventually First Aid came by.
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: But once they came by, the trucks and they gave
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: it and like, you know, started like taking care of them.
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: I took off and I beat everyone that day by
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: ninety minutes, and then there was only two more stages
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: and I just went on to win the whole thing,
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: and so I ended up winning the whole race by
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: ninety minutes, and that race has been called the toughest
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: race in the world. But yeah, that was the first
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: time I ever ran more than a marathon. And it
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: was basically like the equivalent of a marathon every day
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: for five days with a fifty mile or mixed in.
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: What type heat are we talking about?
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: You know, we get up to like one hundred during
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: the day and not like crazy like crazy heat, but
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: hard enough for someone to die. Someone did die. Yeah,
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: they had to like be taken out with a camel.
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: So do you run the whole thing on one pair
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: of shoes or do you bring multiple pair of shoes?
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: I no, No, I wore one pair of shoes.
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: And then like shorts and shirts and stuff. Are you
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: going through new stuff every day?
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: No? I had I had one extra of everything. So
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: for the first four days I wore the same one.
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: So when we get back and they and you know,
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: the race organizer was like, listen, don't waste the water
• 37:59
  Speaker 1: taking shot hours or washing your clothes because we only
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: have so much close after the second day, I'm like,
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: fuck all this, give me that bottle of water. And
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: I started like washing my clothes inside the one of
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: the water bottles that I had, and then I had
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: an Italian guy hold the water over my head while
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: I tried to take a shower. So after four days,
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: I shit canned one set of clothes, wore the next set,
• 38:18
  Speaker 1: and I had like three pairs of socks that I
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: tried to space out. But once I wore them, I
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: like my bag was getting lighter because the food was
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: going down. Yeah, clothes were going down, but you know,
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: you had to have certain things like a raincoat, a
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: down jacket, gloves, hat because it would get cold. That's
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: the other thing. It would get hot during the day,
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: but it'd be freezing at night.
• 38:38
  Speaker 2: And you're just in a tent. It's not like you
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: got much with you food tent.
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: One day, when we're standing at the day before the
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: fifty mile stage, I get into the thing and there's
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: only a few you know, cause one of the luxuries
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: of finish at first did you get there and you
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: can get all your shit set up before anyone else
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: gets back, so you can take the best spot. And
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: I'm standing there and all of a sudden, like a
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: big squall comes through and I look outside of the
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: tent and the tent is like rattling. I look out
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: and like three or four of the tents get picked
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: up and like chucked out into the desert like a
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: half a mile, Like they just launched into the air,
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: and I was like, holy shit. So obviously I got
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: out of the tent and went and stood near the trucks,
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: hoping that my tents wouldn't fly away. But you it
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: was like that every day, just crazy shit every single day.
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: Once you're done, I mean, you say you run ten
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: mile's day, do you take a couple of days off
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: to like recover your body after a situation like that.
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: I usually do like active recovery, meaning like the best
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: way to recover from that stuff is to jog a
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: little bit the next day. So that race finished on Saturday.
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: I flew home on a Sunday. So before I went
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: and got on this like seventeen hour flight, I just
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: jogged around in ulan Batar in the capital of Mongolia
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: for like three or four miles for.
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: The lactic acid doesn't build up and then you wouldn't
• 39:46
  Speaker 2: be able to move.
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: It sounds crazy, but it definitely helps if you don't.
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: I mean, even the marathon winners they'll run after the
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: marathon's over, they'll jog to cool down. They'll run the
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: next day. Not hard, just super easy. But you just
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: got to like keep the body mo well.
• 40:01
  Speaker 2: I think obviously everything you just said serves as an
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: inspirational story for anyone you know, going through their own
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: personal demons. You know, because if you are going through
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: your personal demons, especially through addiction, if you put the
• 40:12
  Speaker 2: addiction to the right place, you really can get going
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: in the right direction, whether that's working out or you know,
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: some semblance of a healthy lifestyle. And you know, you know,
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: your book, the Other Side of Hard you said, that
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: comes out March tenth. You can order anywhere books are sold.
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, here it is March tenth. Everything he wants on
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: the other side, I heard, and I wrote the book
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: really for anyone that's like thinking of making a change
• 40:37
  Speaker 1: in their life, whether you're trying to get sober, thinking
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: about a career change, taking on some physical challenges, starting
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: a family. This book will to tell you exactly how
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: I did all of that. And as you can see
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: looking at me, I've got no special skill sets. I
• 40:52
  Speaker 1: have no natural talent, but I do have incredible willpower
• 40:56
  Speaker 1: and grit, and that's really all you need. We live
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: in the greatest country on earth. You can do anything
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: you want here.
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: Where'd you run this morning?
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: Just here in Nashville, run my normal route. And now
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: I've been here for like four or five years. So
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: every morning when I run, it's literally like I feel
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: like the local celebrity. Every single car as they're driving
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: the kids to school beep. And I coached the local
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: high school cross country team. I helped coach them. I
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: was like the assistant coach, and the girls won the
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: state title, went to the nationals. They were unbelievabley just
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: destroyed everybody. And so like everyone when I'm riding, now,
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: all the cars the coach can coach can and that time,
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: it's the happiest time of my life. Now, like the
• 41:33
  Speaker 1: happiest part of my day is like outrunning what used
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: to be like a suffer fest and now I'm like,
• 41:37
  Speaker 1: it's become a massive source of pride.
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: That's awesome. You probably got You got a smile on
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: your face too, because that ice storms long gone. You
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: probably got the weather.
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: Oh, the eye was crazy because it pissed down rain
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: for like twenty four hours and then it was like
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: no shit, like fifteen degrees so all the trees frozen.
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: They all like tons of trees with down. Lots of
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: people in Nashville lost power. It was it was no joke.
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: I never been in a storm like that in Boston.
• 42:01
  Speaker 1: A ton of snow you can handle, but when everything
• 42:03
  Speaker 1: was covered in ice, it was like literally the trees
• 42:06
  Speaker 1: were like all bent over and I was like, oh,
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: I don't want to spend money replacing trees.
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah. At the volume party, Bob, who is is one
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: of the main sales guys that I heart, was telling
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: he's born and raised in Chicago and has lived in
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: Nashville forever. I said, how did that storm compare or
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: to anything that you grew up with? He said, it
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: ain't even close. This ice storm was by far the
• 42:27
  Speaker 2: craziest thing you'd ever seen because of what you said,
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: the weight on these trees, it was. He's like, I
• 42:32
  Speaker 2: pulled up to a stoplight the day after. I just
• 42:35
  Speaker 2: went through it because I was afraid these trees were
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: they were just coming down. So it as a runner,
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: you're running these areas, you had to be pretty careful
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: where you had on a swivel kind of when you're
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: moving right.
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: That was one of the days that I didn't run outside.
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: Was the day after that storm. I couldn't get out
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: of my driveway. When I tell you, everything was coated
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: in ice, and not like a little like maybe there's
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: a spot here spot. I'm talking like a quarter inch
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: of ice on everything, the cars, the fucking power lines,
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: and then device was falling down off the powerl lines.
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: And then when I could get outside and the sun
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: came out, it was like ten degrees. So there was
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: one main road in front of my house. The only
• 43:07
  Speaker 1: good thing is there were no cars out because it
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: would be very hard to get your car out of
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: the driveway. So I was just running up and down
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: in the middle of this like huge street and there
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: was no one there, like a car every twenty or
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: thirty minutes. So I ran back and forth on this
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: like three mile strip. I'm sure my neighbors were like
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: thought I was crazy, but I was out there getting
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: it done.
• 43:27
  Speaker 2: Well. Can I appreciate you coming on? You're an inspiration.
• 43:29
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna go put my running shoes on and go
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: for a little jogga around the neighborhood. So I really
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: appreciate you. And your story is, like I said, very inspirational.
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: And keep crushing and good luck in your next race.
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: Well, thank you for having me. I really appreciate it.
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: And thanks to our man Jamie Horowitz for connecting us. Sincerely, Man,
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: I appreciate you sharing your platform with me. I know
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: that it's not a decision that you make lightly and
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: I can't thank you enough. And I will get your
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: address from Jamie and we'll be happy to send you
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: a signed copy of the book. And I hope that
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: you enjoy it. And I appreciate you allowing me to
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: share my story with your life.
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: No problem. My my wife and I got married in Nashville,
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: so I absolutely love that place. And if I'm ever
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: out there, I'll get your get your contact information, we'll leave.
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: Yep, you've got a place to stave you ever come to. Now,
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: thank your golf. You're in luck because I'm the worst
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: golfer in the world, on a cool course and always
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: happy to get embarrassed myself with friends.
• 44:24
  Speaker 2: Okay, talk to you soon, man.
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: Have a great day, you guys.
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: Okay, let's dive into the mailbag at John Middlecoff at
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: John middlecoff Is the Instagram. Fire into those d ms
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: and get your questions answered here on the show. Let's
• 44:53
  Speaker 2: start with Nick huge Fan Daily Listener. Why isn't the
• 44:57
  Speaker 2: O eight Steelers defense views as one of the best
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: defenses of the two thousands. They showed their stats at
• 45:02
  Speaker 2: the Super Bowl and it seemed amazing. Similar to Lob
• 45:05
  Speaker 2: and the Ravens, I think sometimes teams just get lost.
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: I think anyone that knows the best dealer teams, you know,
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: with Tomlin and that Cower kind of run that their
• 45:15
  Speaker 2: defenses were elite. I mean when Tomlin first got there
• 45:18
  Speaker 2: and they had like James Harrison, Woodley, Paul Lamalou, I
• 45:23
  Speaker 2: think I Taylor was one of the corners. Brett keesl
• 45:29
  Speaker 2: was at the defensive lineman. To do with the big
• 45:31
  Speaker 2: beard that they were Casey Hampton, was he on the
• 45:34
  Speaker 2: team that they were awesome? James Harrison was a monster.
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: Philly seemed like a really crazy place to work. What
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: this also asked another question, what are some of the
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: craziest things that happened when you work there? What does
• 45:48
  Speaker 2: Big Dom do? He was at the Senior Bowl. I
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: had multiple people reach out, like, what is Big Dom
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: doing at the Senior Bowl? Guys? He travels with Sirianni
• 45:57
  Speaker 2: and Howie, Like he's bodyguard meets. You know, he's a
• 46:03
  Speaker 2: part of the personnel department in terms of he's doing
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: research on these guys, you know when they're talking character,
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: especially off the field, major question marks. He's a big
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: part of that. So James Pierce when you find out
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: after the fact, like he gets in trouble, he got
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: all the details that keep coming out. It looks bad
• 46:23
  Speaker 2: that he was off draft boards. Well, when you have
• 46:26
  Speaker 2: guys who are like should this guy or should this
• 46:28
  Speaker 2: guy not be on draft boards? Dom is working the
• 46:32
  Speaker 2: photes like I mean, he just knows people, they know him,
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: and he's an elite information accumulator. He also does stuff
• 46:42
  Speaker 2: with their players. Like it's hard to really describe his role.
• 46:46
  Speaker 2: I'm sure some of you if you work in certain
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: companies you have an individual it's like, what does he do?
• 46:51
  Speaker 2: He kind of just does everything. You know, he's he's
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: a different version of this. But remember, uh, pink stripes.
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: What was Ernie Adams for Belichick? It's like, well, what
• 47:01
  Speaker 2: did he do a little bit of everything? He was
• 47:03
  Speaker 2: just always around. And again Ernie was more from like
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: a schematic game plan standpoint. The dude that Vrabel has
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: stretch they call him who's just kind of behind the
• 47:13
  Speaker 2: scenes doing shit. All these teams have a guy that
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: just do some things that no one can really put
• 47:20
  Speaker 2: their finger on. It's like, I know what the GM does,
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: I know what the scouts do, I know the coaches do.
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: What's this guy do stuff that's important and the team knows.
• 47:28
  Speaker 2: So it's I think part of working in football in
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: the NFL, especially in certain cities, just an intense environment.
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: You know, you're working long hours. It's a public job.
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: Not I mean, no one knew who I was when
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: I was there, but just people talking about you, turn
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: on the radio. It's just a really really intense environment.
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: That was awesome that I got to experience it. But
• 47:53
  Speaker 2: I've never looked back since I got in this career,
• 47:56
  Speaker 2: so I'm glad I did. It helped catapult me to
• 47:59
  Speaker 2: where I'm at. But nothing like I'm trying to think
• 48:02
  Speaker 2: of crazy things that happened. It's just a crazy daily
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: lot of a lot of edginess, a lot of people
• 48:09
  Speaker 2: mad at each other, a lot of tired people. It's
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: just people are on edge. We didn't by the time
• 48:13
  Speaker 2: I got there. Michael Vick's first year when he almost
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: won the MVP and then the next couple of years
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: weren't good. So it's not like I'm a super Bowl
• 48:22
  Speaker 2: champion or anything. My friends are a lot of people
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: I work with, are hey, John, When do you think
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: Lamar falls off a cliff like Russell Wilson. We saw
• 48:31
  Speaker 2: this year how he's not as mobile and he's not
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: as good mobile quarterbacks never can convert into quarterbacks from
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: the pocket. I'm hammering the Ravens under wins next year.
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: That's not true. Steve Young did. Steve Young turned into
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: a very accurate pocket passer. I think Lamar as a passer,
• 48:52
  Speaker 2: consistent passer from the pocket is way better than Russell
• 48:54
  Speaker 2: Wilson was. Obviously, his scrambling was more dynamic and their
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: playmaking was both elite. To me, Lamar Jackson is the
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: higher level version of Russell Wilson, right, I mean Russell
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: Wilson like didn't win. I don't think he ever got
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: an MVP vote. So I think Lamar. I think these
• 49:13
  Speaker 2: next couple of years are pretty critical, Like he's not
• 49:15
  Speaker 2: gonna be running around at thirty six like he's able
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: to do now in theory. Now, this year was banged up.
• 49:20
  Speaker 2: Are these injuries gonna last you? Know he took that.
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: I don't want to say it was innocuous, because in football,
• 49:26
  Speaker 2: even when you get hit it doesn't look as bad.
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: It still probably hurts. The hit he hurt on his
• 49:30
  Speaker 2: got hit in the back, and you just gotta he's
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: got to be much more. I think he's always been
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: pretty instinctive when he runs and not take big hits.
• 49:39
  Speaker 2: But sometimes they run him between the tackles, like I
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: think we're kind of scrapping that, Like, no more taking
• 49:44
  Speaker 2: unnecessary hits with this guy. But I don't see a
• 49:47
  Speaker 2: precipitous just one day he's just falling off a cliff.
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: I think it would probably be more gradual, and injuries
• 49:53
  Speaker 2: would play a bigger role. But if he's healthy like
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: Russell was, I think he would be a good player,
• 49:58
  Speaker 2: excellent player. You saw that play in that technically was
• 50:02
  Speaker 2: a playoff game. Then Againsteelers Week eighteen, Sunday Night Football.
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: He made some incredible plays in that game. I mean
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: incredible plays. I got scolded for quote unquote babysitting my
• 50:15
  Speaker 2: own kids. Now they're eight and six. In your case,
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: they are a baby, and they sit, so keep saying,
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: keep saying it. I agree. My babysit every morning. My
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: role in my home, like my tasks, we consider my mahomes.
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: I say, it's my mahomes to grab the trash or whatever,
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: because years ago we tried to I was like joking
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: with her, like we all have roles in the home,
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: Like you do stuff better than me. I do stuff
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: better than her. And I think what the Chiefs game
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: was on. It's like there's certain things the Chiefs depend
• 50:49
  Speaker 2: on mahomes to do. So when I have to do something,
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: you know, like my roles in the home, which you know,
• 50:57
  Speaker 2: pay the mortgage, that's my mahomes, take out the trash,
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: my majomes. Carrie take care, babysit my child usually early
• 51:05
  Speaker 2: in the morning because she stays up late, from like
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: six to ten to eleven over the last couple weeks.
• 51:12
  Speaker 2: And uh, no, big deal, just doing what a father
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: should do. Half serious question, do you think Mike McDonald
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: If Mike McDonald said to himself, I'm done hiring offensive coordinators,
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna call the offensive plays, he could make the
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: transition successful. No, he's He's gotten his doctorate in football
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: on the defensive side of the ball. Going back to
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: Georgia through the Ravens. He's a defensive coach and he's
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: calling the defensive plays, so you could not call the
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: offense in the defensive plays. I think he'd be the
• 51:48
  Speaker 2: first to say too, like they hire Kubiak, they run
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: that offense. Kubiak knows that offense fifty times better than
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: he does. I'm sure Mike learned it and had a
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: pretty good understanding of it, but I don't think it
• 52:04
  Speaker 2: would be feasible. I don't. I've heard players. You know,
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: there are certain coaches that probably could, But you couldn't
• 52:11
  Speaker 2: call the offense and defensive side of the ball and
• 52:14
  Speaker 2: manage the game. I just don't think you have the
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: mental capacity stamina to do it over a seventeen week
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: season to game plan. How do you go to both
• 52:23
  Speaker 2: meetings to game plan If you're calling the offense and
• 52:25
  Speaker 2: the defense, it'd be a lot. I don't even know
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: if he'd capable of it from a schematic standpoint, an
• 52:32
  Speaker 2: understanding standpoint, but from a functionality standpoint, I think it'd
• 52:37
  Speaker 2: be impossible. Do you see the Rams moving off Puka?
• 52:41
  Speaker 2: There seems to be some red flags with his recent
• 52:44
  Speaker 2: off the field antics, and the Rams may get ahead
• 52:47
  Speaker 2: of it by before paying top dollar for him, can
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: use the thirteenth pick in the draft to replace him.
• 52:55
  Speaker 2: To think that you can find a player in the
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: draft seventy five percent as good as him, I think
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: any GM or scout would tell you that's you are
• 53:06
  Speaker 2: keeping your fingers crossed and kind of pits into the wind. Well,
• 53:09
  Speaker 2: this could be a nightmare. So are there some things
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: that you go, yeah, come on, Pooka, Are are you
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: mature enough to handle this? Or are you a guy
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: that we go all in on? I mean at the
• 53:20
  Speaker 2: super Bowl when I was talking to Justin Jefferson, you know,
• 53:23
  Speaker 2: I follow Justin Jefferson from AFAR. He's just a positive, upbeat,
• 53:28
  Speaker 2: high level energy guy you just feel pretty good of.
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: Like this is a high level cat. You don't really
• 53:32
  Speaker 2: have to worry about him. You know. Part of the
• 53:35
  Speaker 2: thing with Pookah is like, yeah, he's a young player
• 53:37
  Speaker 2: into startom about to get big money. But here's the key.
• 53:41
  Speaker 2: He is elite. So if you can pay him and
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: get three more years of this version in which you've
• 53:49
  Speaker 2: got the last couple of years, you don't really have
• 53:50
  Speaker 2: a choice. Now would I entertain trading him? Like what
• 53:54
  Speaker 2: can you get? He's not good enough where you don't
• 53:57
  Speaker 2: have a conversation, right, But what is the conversation? Would
• 54:01
  Speaker 2: someone trade me two first round picks for Puka Nicola
• 54:04
  Speaker 2: and anyone that would be willing to do that? Like
• 54:06
  Speaker 2: where are they drafting? Is that like the Bills or something?
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: So I'm getting two picks in the mid twenties. Would
• 54:11
  Speaker 2: I trade two picks in the mid twenties for this guy?
• 54:13
  Speaker 2: How do I replace that? If I draft player X
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: at thirteen? Is this guy ready to roll as a rookie?
• 54:21
  Speaker 2: Because not everyone is. I mean Devonte Adams, he'd be
• 54:25
  Speaker 2: the first tell you his first year and a half
• 54:26
  Speaker 2: are really really difficult. So I think I think it's
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: easy to say this, but he's so good it's very
• 54:35
  Speaker 2: rare that you just don't see a team extend that guy. Hey, listen,
• 54:38
  Speaker 2: He's got some things that clearly the Rams wish he
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: wouldn't have done, but it's nothing that egregious. I wouldn't
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: compare him to James Pierce mail back. Question. If an
• 54:51
  Speaker 2: entire NFL coaching staff took over an eighth grade team
• 54:55
  Speaker 2: and had a full offseason to train them, do you
• 54:58
  Speaker 2: think they could dominate against high sch varsity teams? Since
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: NFL coaches are much more advanced strategically, could their schemes
• 55:05
  Speaker 2: in preparation help eighth graders overcome the obvious size dispanage.
• 55:11
  Speaker 2: I think my immediate answer if it's a capable high
• 55:14
  Speaker 2: school team, not like the worst high school team in America,
• 55:17
  Speaker 2: but just a good high school team, you know, you
• 55:20
  Speaker 2: just pick an Air Scottsdale, Arizona, Sacramento, California. I think
• 55:25
  Speaker 2: there would be no way because look at the super Bowl.
• 55:31
  Speaker 2: At the end of the day, what defines football the
• 55:35
  Speaker 2: line of scrimmage. So even if I had one eighth
• 55:38
  Speaker 2: grader that maybe is so exceptional he could be like
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: a varsity wide receiver, I would not have the offensive
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: or defensive line and to block them. So if you
• 55:47
  Speaker 2: have a bunch of kids that are eighteen versus a
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: bunch of kids that are thirteen, is that the age
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: r in eighth grade thirteen or fourteen. It's you know
• 55:54
  Speaker 2: in boys' most you know kind of hit puberty right
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: around that age, so you really grow fourteen to fifteen,
• 56:01
  Speaker 2: huge gap from fifteen to eighteen. It's not like girls
• 56:04
  Speaker 2: who some of them hit him eleven, twelve, thirteen years old,
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: So you'd be getting a lot of really underdeveloped boys
• 56:11
  Speaker 2: against every boy in a high school varsity team that's
• 56:14
  Speaker 2: starting would have hit puberty and be just way stronger.
• 56:18
  Speaker 2: So you could scheme up a player or two right
• 56:22
  Speaker 2: and make some cool plays, but you wouldn't be able
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: to block them. I don't think he'd be able to
• 56:27
  Speaker 2: run it on them. That would be the problem question
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: for the back. I didn't expect the recency bias to
• 56:34
  Speaker 2: hit so hard. But in what world is Sam Darnald
• 56:37
  Speaker 2: actually being taken over Jalen hurts. They threw for the
• 56:40
  Speaker 2: same amount of TVs in the regular season, and Donald
• 56:42
  Speaker 2: threw twice as many picks as Jalen. Jalen also had
• 56:45
  Speaker 2: eight rushing touchdowns. Take into consideration Jalen's playoff record versus Donald.
• 56:51
  Speaker 2: I think it's more like looking forward. You give me
• 56:54
  Speaker 2: Jalen's interceptions. Well, he dinks and dunks a lot of
• 56:58
  Speaker 2: the game, like Jalen. We have to agree, and he
• 57:02
  Speaker 2: you know, you give eight rushing touchdowns, how many of
• 57:04
  Speaker 2: those are toush pushes at Atlanta scrimmage because his rushing
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: willingness is clearly gone. Because I don't think like the
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: offensive coordinator, let's just stop calling runs for Jalen, Clearly
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: he doesn't want to run anymore, which I don't blame him.
• 57:17
  Speaker 2: I'm I got a big contract, I probably want another one,
• 57:20
  Speaker 2: so I don't want to get injured run around. I
• 57:23
  Speaker 2: want to pass. He's not a great passer. We have
• 57:27
  Speaker 2: to acknowledge that. Like you watch Jalen play, he's a
• 57:30
  Speaker 2: pretty frustrating player now, so Sam, But I think if
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: you said the next five years, if the Eagles could choose,
• 57:37
  Speaker 2: if Jalen's not gonna run anymore, you give me the
• 57:39
  Speaker 2: rushing touchdowns to me, will he keep running? If you
• 57:43
  Speaker 2: told me Jalen is going to be a dual threat,
• 57:45
  Speaker 2: he's a good player, but he's no longer a dual
• 57:48
  Speaker 2: threat because they don't call any design runs. So I
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: think watching Jalen this year was he was a player
• 57:58
  Speaker 2: that most people in the NFL would go That's that's
• 58:00
  Speaker 2: a scary trend because its not like he had nobody
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: to throw it. And I know everyone thinks the offensive
• 58:05
  Speaker 2: coordinator is the village idiot. Maybe he is right. I
• 58:07
  Speaker 2: haven't seen he got hired anywhere, but hell, he might
• 58:10
  Speaker 2: be living off that money, which I wouldn't blame him.
• 58:13
  Speaker 2: Said it all the time. Will you pay me a
• 58:14
  Speaker 2: million dollars to do nothing? You think I'm gonna works America?
• 58:18
  Speaker 1: Baby. Uh.
• 58:20
  Speaker 2: But Sam's season, like the totality of the season was
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: not nearly as dominant as he was last year. But
• 58:29
  Speaker 2: in the playoffs he was really good. He was just
• 58:31
  Speaker 2: incomplete ConTroll. Didn't turn the ball over. I mean the
• 58:35
  Speaker 2: game he played against Matt Stafford was elite. The uh
• 58:39
  Speaker 2: he didn't have to do much against the forty nine ers,
• 58:42
  Speaker 2: I mean the super Bowl super Bowl, he was okay.
• 58:47
  Speaker 2: I think it's more about, like, is Jalen getting better?
• 58:50
  Speaker 2: And if he's not getting any better, if he's not
• 58:52
  Speaker 2: gonna be willing to run, what type player is he
• 58:55
  Speaker 2: going to be moving forward? Like does he want to
• 58:58
  Speaker 2: do the Russell Wilson. I'm not scrambling around anymore. I
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: want to play like Brady. That was Russell's thing. I'm
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: a pocket quarterback. They're like, okay, Chap, you're a pocket
• 59:07
  Speaker 2: quarterback now, and then it did not go well. Like Jalen,
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: you're a playmaker. I don't know why anyone's offended by
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: that anymore. You shouldn't be offended, Like you're a game manager.
• 59:16
  Speaker 2: Alex Smith made like two hundred million dollars being a
• 59:18
  Speaker 2: game manager. Jimmy Garoppolo made a ton of money being
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: a game man. Being a game manager is fine. Everyone's like,
• 59:23
  Speaker 2: can't be a game manager, what's wrong with that? Can't
• 59:26
  Speaker 2: be a dual threat quarterback? Well, if you're a dual
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: threat quarterback like Jalen, who's pretty good at avoiding hits,
• 59:31
  Speaker 2: like that's a that's a powerful attribute to half. But
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: he doesn't want to run anymore. To me, if Jalen
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: does not want to run anymore, I'm out on him
• 59:40
  Speaker 2: as a player. Not that he sucks and it's gonna
• 59:42
  Speaker 2: be out of the league, but I think there's gonna
• 59:45
  Speaker 2: be a lot more of what we witness this year
• 59:46
  Speaker 2: than like him turning it around and being some elite.
• 59:49
  Speaker 2: I was gonna say pro Bowl guy, but you know
• 59:51
  Speaker 2: what I mean, Pro Bowl like a high end starter.
• 59:54
  Speaker 2: But I hear you. I mean, I think we're probably
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: overreacting to Darnold winning the Super Bowl. But he's clear
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 2: solid player now, and I think that's what Jalen is.
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 2: Jalen's a solid player. They have their good days, they
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 2: have their bad days, but I think we have to acknowledge,
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 2: like Jalen Ain's some superstar quarterback. As I heard Browns fan,
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 2: I have a hard time listening to you and Colin
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 2: occasionally take jabs at Cleveland for letting Stefanski walk whoa, whoa,
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 2: you're you're this is one of the only lone soldiers
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 2: out there that go is the Fanski good. Me and
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 2: Colin are not on quite on the same page on
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 2: that one. I've watched every game of theirs since he
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 2: became the coach. During his last two seasons, the offense
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 2: has been atrocious. I know he want Coach of the
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: Year before, but I feel like that's an award for
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 2: doing better than expected. You're right, not actually accomplishing anything
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 2: like making a deep playoff run. Also, since winning Coach
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 2: of the Year in twenty three, the team's offensive trajectory
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 2: has been downward, and he's supposed to be an offensive
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 2: minded coach. However, the offense looks stale and uncreative. I'm
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 2: with you, I think he's a little overrated because if
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 2: you're an offensive mastermind, you kind of figure it out.
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: And you watched the last couple of years, specifically this year,
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 2: it couldn't have been any worse. They were unwatchable and like, okay,
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 2: hand the ball off to quich John Jenkins, like anyone
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 2: called those plays? Can you scheme up some pass places?
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 2: Can you get some guys? And he could not do it.
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 2: He was awful offense. You know, Patola gets crushed in Philly.
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 2: Stefanski was worse this year. Now you'd be like, well,
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 2: they had way more talent. I'm just talking about when
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 2: you watch him, like, does anyone have any clue what's
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 2: going on? No wonder jib Schwartz was pissed. We're a
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 2: defensive team. And this is why I always said about Stefanski.
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 2: They've had awesome defenses with shorts over the course of
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 2: the last three or four years, definitely the last couple.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: And it's like Kevin Stefanski, there is a decent chance
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 2: this thing flames out in Atlanta, like gets ugly. So
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 2: I'm with you. I think maybe he's solid, but I
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 2: think he's talked about like in the upper echelon of
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 2: offensive lines, and I just I don't know, man, I
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 2: don't see it. Long time, first time wondering who you
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: think would win the Eagles of last year versus the
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 2: Seahawks this year would be a great matchup to see
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 2: the Eagles offense for Seattle's defense. But I do think
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: that the Eagles defense would make Darnld stress. I would
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 2: give the Eagles a slight edge. If Jalen is gonna
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 2: play like he played in the Super Bowl, they would
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 2: be in pretty good shape. The Eagles last year, by
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 2: the end of the season, were really humming. They were
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 2: more complete team than Seattle. Like Seattle offensively, Let's face it,
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 2: like this is I'm not no shade that Patriot team.
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 2: I mean, give me a break good team most years,
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: probably like an eleven win ten win team, and probably
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 2: one and done in the playoffs, especially if their quarterbacks
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 2: gonna be banged up and that guy's air left tackle.
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 2: But they win seventeen games, they're in.
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 1: The super Bowl.
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 2: That's like, I don't know, their offensive line sucks. How
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 2: many teams that offensive line is not good to make
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 2: the Super Bowl pretty rare. So I think Seattle it
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 2: would have been more difficult for the Eagles to just
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 2: get loose on the ground. But Saquon was just like
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 2: kind of in his Hall of Fame season era. I mean,
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 2: he was he was a man amongst boys. And then
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 2: the receivers were Humming. Jalen was playing well and defensively well.
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 2: Who was the best Patriot defensive lineman? Milton Williams. He
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 2: was like the third or fourth best defensive lineman on
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: the Eagles. So from a from a defensive lion standpoint,
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 2: they had Jalen, Jordan Davis, Brandon Graham. They had Sweat
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 2: who's now on the Cardinals in his big time Milton Williams.
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 2: Their defensive line was unreal, Zach Bond. They had the
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 2: two young rookie corners. I'd probably give the that Eagles
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 2: team was stacked. I'd give the Eagles a slight edge,
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 2: but that would be a really good game question for
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 2: the mailbag. Understand the question is gonna feel reductive, but
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 2: wanted to get your opinion. Mike McDonald clearly is a
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 2: phenomenal head coach and now joins a pretty elite group
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 2: of Super Bowl winning head coaches. However, there have been
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 2: some notable coaches who have won a Super Bowl, but
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 2: we don't see a very we don't see as very elite.
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 2: Who do you think is the worst coach to win
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 2: a Super Bowl? Sirianni Arians Peterson come to mind. I
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 2: would say Arian's a good coach. I mean Arians didn't
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 2: become a head coach till later in life. Arians pretty
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 2: clearly is a high end coach. If Bruce Arians was
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 2: like fifty five right now and available, he would have
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 2: had he would had ten coaching offers. I would give
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 2: Sirianni the I don't know Sirianni and I know Doug.
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 2: I like Doug. I think Sirianni's proven to be a
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 2: better coach than Doug. I mean Doug was kind of
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 2: all over the map, and Doug had some weird loyalties
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 2: to coaches like Sirianni throw you over the Titanic the
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 2: blink of an eye. So I would say that Doug
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 2: one's a pretty big outliar. Brian Billick feels like a
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 2: pretty big outliar. Barry Switzer was handed that Cowboys team.
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 2: You watch some of the players talk about him. I
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 2: don't think he was great. Who's won recently, Andy Belichick, McCarthy,
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 2: Tomlin Harbaugh. I mean, all these guys were listening are
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 2: better than Doug Peterson. So I would say, no, I
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 2: like Doug, but I'd probably choose him. I would say
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 2: if Dan Quinn had won that Patriots Super Bowl, he'd
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 2: be near the top two. Someone else asked me a question.
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 2: I don't usually read emails, but this was kind of
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 2: an interesting one. We'll end on this. Longtime listener, love
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 2: the show. This is from Rob. They always show coaches
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 2: up in their boxes. I was wondering how many coaches
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 2: are up there and what does each of them do?
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 2: How do people actually and how people actually and how
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 2: many people does it actually take to call a play? Thanks, Well,
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 2: there's only one guy calling the play, so if the
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 2: coordinator's up in the box, he's obviously the guy calling
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 2: the play. He typically has one of his henchmen, a
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 2: ligne if he's a defense If I'm Fangio, maybe my
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 2: dB coach, maybe my linebacker coach, maybe my assistant defensive
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 2: line coach, a guy like that sitting right next to
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 2: me with binoculars telling me the personnel. So it's like, hey,
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 2: three wide receivers, one back, one tight end, four wide receivers,
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 2: one tight end, no backs, you know, telling you that,
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 2: so then I can react. Then you have usually like
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 2: an intern quality control coach, someone under that world, taking notes,
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 2: jotting down each play call, jotting down tendencies whatever. Specifically
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 2: that coordinator likes. Let's face it, these coaching staffs are
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 2: probably oversaturated right now. I mean you go to just
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 2: a random NFL or college team, they have a million coaches.
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 2: They have like two position coaches per position. It's like
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 2: linebacker coach sistant linebacker coach, dB coach, assistant dB coach,
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 2: safety's coach, assistant safety's coach, D line coach assistant D
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 2: line coach, pass rush specialists. So what can all these
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 2: guys be doing on game day? In the box? You typically,
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 2: as a play caller, you have a guy telling them personnel,
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 2: which then helps them dictate to their play call. They
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 2: are usually talking to one of the other main defensive
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 2: or offensive coaches that is on the sideline, right if
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 2: your fangio, maybe your linebacker coach or D line coaches
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 2: on the sideline, you're communicating with them vice the same
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 2: thing with offensive coordinator, usually their O line coaches on
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 2: the sideline, maybe their quarterback coach is next to them
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 2: or on the side, and you're constantly communicating. But you're
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 2: the guy calling the plays unless you're head coach. Says, hey, whoever,
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 2: coach Williams. Let's if I'm the head coach of CEO type,
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 2: let's run the ball here. I don't tell you which
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 2: run to call, but hey, I want to run the
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 2: ball here, so that guy will start calling run places.
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 2: Or hey, let's you know that some of those shots
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 2: we worked on in practice, let's pull the trigger here.
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 2: I think a lot of that's going on with head
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 2: coaches in communication with the play callers. But I bet
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 2: there's some decent amount of guys up in the box
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 2: that aren't really doing that much, aren't, you know, from
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 2: taking notes to maybe they focus on a position group
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 2: like watch the defensive line, watch the coverages, you know,
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 2: taking notes of what coverages they're getting with certain looks
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 2: that that surely is going on, but it's probably jumped
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 2: the shark a little bit. With how many people are
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 2: are coaching on a staff. You know, I don't think
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 2: you need three coaches, but I'm not sure you need thirty.
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 2: And some of these staffs are have a lot of guys.
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 2: I mean, if I owned a team, you'd be so rich,
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 2: wouldn't spend that much time thinking about it, but there
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 2: would be times where what are all these people doing?
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 2: And where guys get mad. It's like our D line
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 2: sucks and we got four guys coaching the defensive line.
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 2: We got as many coaches as we do starters. How's
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 2: this possible? How are we not better in those units?
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 2: So I think that gets discussed sometimes as well, But
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 2: good question, and I will talk to everyone in about
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 2: ten days. Audios, see you later.
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 1: The volume