Latest / NO FILTER / Episode 11_ Stay Gold(M4A_128K)

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Episode 11_ Stay Gold(M4A_128K) · NO FILTER

0:09
Speaker 1: So you don't really know when you learned about the
0:11
Speaker 1: free Birds.
0:12
Speaker 2: Not mate, I don't remember, because I don't remember Brian
0:15
Speaker 2: ever saying anything about it about the free Birds.
0:18
Speaker 3: Yeah, if Brian Bowling really was killed because of his
0:23
Speaker 3: membership in the Freed Bird Gang, then the obvious people
0:27
Speaker 3: to talk to to find out more about what happened
0:30
Speaker 3: to him would be the other members.
0:32
Speaker 4: Of the Freebirds.
0:33
Speaker 5: That's easier said than done, though, because there's no agreement
0:37
Speaker 5: on who the members of the gang had been. Brian's
0:42
Speaker 5: sister and brother in law told us that before Brian died,
0:45
Speaker 5: they hadn't even known he'd been in a gang.
0:50
Speaker 1: Who all was in this.
0:52
Speaker 2: Quick gang, a little gang or whatever they called it,
0:55
Speaker 2: We don't know. We really don't you ever talk about.
0:59
Speaker 6: Like being in a gang.
1:03
Speaker 5: Kenneth told us that Brian hadn't mentioned the Freebirds and
1:06
Speaker 5: he didn't know about it until after Brian's death, But
1:09
Speaker 5: Amanda said she thought the Freebirds had been a group
1:12
Speaker 5: of neighborhood kids.
1:15
Speaker 7: Which kids Brian, Tommy, James Archer, Josh Andy.
1:25
Speaker 8: Yeah, that was the only ones.
1:28
Speaker 4: To add new Mote.
1:34
Speaker 1: Hi, my name is Susan Simpson. I'm an attorney and podcaster,
1:38
Speaker 1: and previously I hosted the Undisclosed podcast.
1:41
Speaker 6: Hi, I'm just Into Davis and I'm a true crime
1:44
Speaker 6: TV producer. Last year, Susan and I decided to team
1:48
Speaker 6: up and reinvestigate the murder of Brian Bowler. Along with
1:52
Speaker 6: Kevin Fitzpatrick, president of Red Marble Media, we decided to
1:56
Speaker 6: launch Proof. You can listen to Proof like you would
1:59
Speaker 6: any podcast, and you can follow us everywhere with the
2:02
Speaker 6: handle at Proofcrime pod and on our website proofcrimepod dot com.
2:09
Speaker 6: Thanks for listening and welcome to Proof.
2:18
Speaker 5: In addition to Brian, Josh Slash, Cain and Lee, a
2:23
Speaker 5: manna named Tommy Hyde and James Archer as the other
2:26
Speaker 5: members of the Freebirds, the prosecution has a different theory
2:30
Speaker 5: though they didn't believe Tommy or James or Freebirds at all. Instead,
2:36
Speaker 5: documents from the police file showed that investigators thought the
2:39
Speaker 5: Freebirds had consisted of five boys, Brian himself plus the
2:44
Speaker 5: four boys who had stolen the safe from Cain's father.
2:48
Speaker 5: A few pages of notes list the gang members and
2:50
Speaker 5: their possible gang names. The members were Cain gang nickname
2:56
Speaker 5: Devil I, Brian nicknamed Joker, Lee Clark nicknamed Spick, Pete
3:02
Speaker 5: Jordan nickname the Italian, and Joseph Wilkins, nicknamed Slick. These
3:09
Speaker 5: last two gang members, Pete Jordan and Joseph Wilkins, were
3:12
Speaker 5: not called as witnesses at trial. In fact, there's no
3:16
Speaker 5: record that investigators ever tried to speak to either of them.
3:20
Speaker 5: So we went to speak to Pete Jordan and asked
3:23
Speaker 5: him about the free Birds.
3:25
Speaker 1: He never heard of the gang, ever heard of Freebirds.
3:28
Speaker 5: And he's one of the ones who was listed as
3:30
Speaker 5: one of the gang members, and he's like, there was
3:32
Speaker 5: no gang and he didn't know what the free Birds
3:35
Speaker 5: were until Dallas Battle told him he was a gang member.
3:40
Speaker 5: It turns out that Pete Jordan had been interviewed. There's
3:44
Speaker 5: no record of it, but Pete told us that during
3:46
Speaker 5: the investigation, Dallas Battle had picked him up, taken him
3:50
Speaker 5: in for questioning, and told him he wanted to know
3:53
Speaker 5: more about this gang he was a member of. Pete's
3:56
Speaker 5: response had been gang.
3:59
Speaker 4: What gang.
4:03
Speaker 1: What's interesting to me is he says he never felt
4:05
Speaker 1: like he was being accused of being involved in the murder.
4:08
Speaker 1: Battle was trying to find out he was in a
4:12
Speaker 1: gang member or whatever. But Battle was not approaching him
4:14
Speaker 1: as a murderer. He never felt like he was considered
4:17
Speaker 1: a suspect. But in reality, if this whole theory of
4:20
Speaker 1: what happened to Brian is true, he would have at
4:23
Speaker 1: least had knowledge of the murder. He'd have been one
4:24
Speaker 1: of the four involved.
4:27
Speaker 5: Pete Jordan was one of the four boys who stole
4:29
Speaker 5: a safe from Kane's father, But the only evidence these
4:33
Speaker 5: four boys were in a gang together came from Debbie Kelly,
4:37
Speaker 5: who said she saw all four of their names in
4:39
Speaker 5: a gang notebook. But the idea that these four boys
4:43
Speaker 5: would be in a gang together doesn't make much sense.
4:47
Speaker 1: He also wasn't even that close like that. This was
4:50
Speaker 1: not a tight knit group, so it's not like a
4:52
Speaker 1: band of friends that like to hang out. At the time,
4:55
Speaker 1: he was friends with Lee. He met Joseph Wilkins like once.
4:59
Speaker 1: Maybe he knew Kane and kind of didn't like him,
5:03
Speaker 1: kind of wondered why Lean's away was hanging out with him,
5:05
Speaker 1: and he'd met Brian a couple of times.
5:07
Speaker 9: These weren't people who had basically like pledged their lives
5:11
Speaker 9: to each other like.
5:12
Speaker 10: You do in an actual gang.
5:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, this wasn't like a stand by me, Crow.
5:16
Speaker 6: It wasn't even a friend group that hung out all
5:18
Speaker 6: the time, and.
5:19
Speaker 1: It wasn't like the gang informally.
5:23
Speaker 5: Although the only other alleged gang member that Pete Jordan
5:26
Speaker 5: had been friends with was Lee Clark, Sergeant Battle seems
5:30
Speaker 5: to have believed that he was one of the Free Birds. Strangely, though,
5:34
Speaker 5: there's no indication that Battle believed that Pete had been
5:37
Speaker 5: involved in Brian's murder.
5:39
Speaker 1: But if Battle had believed his own theory about the
5:43
Speaker 1: safe theft knarking by Brian being the motive for the murder, well,
5:48
Speaker 1: we have four boys who would have been involved and
5:50
Speaker 1: wanted to do the murder, and he's one of them.
5:52
Speaker 1: And yet Battle apparently has no doubts that he's not
5:55
Speaker 1: part of it. So the gang theory was just for show. Battle,
6:00
Speaker 1: It was just for a way to make his gig
6:02
Speaker 1: one thousand feet.
6:06
Speaker 5: The evidence that Brian, Lee, and Kane were in a
6:09
Speaker 5: gang together is based entirely on the testimony of Debbie Kelly,
6:14
Speaker 5: who said she'd seen their names written in.
6:16
Speaker 4: The Freebird's gang rule book.
6:18
Speaker 5: She also said that, according to this notebook, the Freebird
6:22
Speaker 5: gang was bound by a set of rules, including rule
6:25
Speaker 5: number one, always stick up for your brother and rule
6:29
Speaker 5: number two. If a brother narks to the police, kill him.
6:33
Speaker 5: But Debbie Kelly's testimony doesn't prove that Brian was killed
6:37
Speaker 5: because he broke rule number two. To prove that, the
6:40
Speaker 5: prosecution had relied on the weed Eagle note that was
6:43
Speaker 5: recovered from Brian's casket after he was exhumed. It's a
6:47
Speaker 5: drawing of an eagle carrying a bag of weed, flying
6:50
Speaker 5: below a banner that says freebirds, and in the corner
6:54
Speaker 5: of the eagle's flag is the word narks, circled and
6:57
Speaker 5: crossed out.
6:59
Speaker 4: The weed Eagle is not signed.
7:01
Speaker 5: There's nothing on the note itself to prove who wrote it,
7:04
Speaker 5: but at trial the prosecution told the jury that it
7:07
Speaker 5: came from a gang member named Joseph Wilkins.
7:11
Speaker 1: The person we have not talked to and really need to.
7:14
Speaker 1: It's the same person the place apparently never bothered to
7:16
Speaker 1: talk to either. Joseph Wilkins.
7:19
Speaker 5: He's the one who drew the freeburn hair note that
7:23
Speaker 5: they pulled out of the casket.
7:24
Speaker 1: And he's the one who wrote Nark saw it If
7:27
Speaker 1: it was indeed one of the boys who wrote it,
7:30
Speaker 1: Like how they use that note as evidenced against Liam
7:32
Speaker 1: came in the first place, Like you don't out saying
7:34
Speaker 1: who came from without talking to the boy who drew it,
7:37
Speaker 1: and while admitting that neither came nor Leey drew it
7:41
Speaker 1: or put it in the casket. And yet they use
7:44
Speaker 1: that as proof that this was like a narc.
7:47
Speaker 11: Or benge shooting machine to suggests that that kid had
7:50
Speaker 11: complete awareness of this so called hit.
7:55
Speaker 1: And even the judge of trial at one point espressed
7:57
Speaker 1: a surprise when the prosecutor's like, yeah, I would have
8:00
Speaker 1: talked to him, just like wait, no one talked to
8:02
Speaker 1: the guide'er this note. Well, that's strange carry on.
8:07
Speaker 5: At another point during the trial, the judge had also
8:11
Speaker 5: asked the prosecutor if the boy who had drawn the
8:14
Speaker 5: weed eagle note was going to testify. No, the prosecutor
8:18
Speaker 5: told him that person will not be called as a witness.
8:23
Speaker 5: The judge asked, wouldn't he be pretty important if this
8:27
Speaker 5: is supposed to be the symbol of a group and
8:29
Speaker 5: he's the one who made it.
8:31
Speaker 4: Well, let me evaluate that.
8:33
Speaker 5: The prosecutor replied, And the prosecutor is right. It's the
8:37
Speaker 5: prosecutor's job to decide who should be called as a witness,
8:40
Speaker 5: not the judges, but the judge had a point. Joseph
8:45
Speaker 5: Wilkins is pretty important to the case. And it's not
8:48
Speaker 5: just because of the weed Eagle note. According to the
8:51
Speaker 5: testimony of Debbie Kelly the Gang Rule Book, that she'd
8:54
Speaker 5: found that the story residence had actually belonged to Joseph Wilkins.
8:59
Speaker 6: So why did no one talk to him?
9:09
Speaker 1: Everyone in this case, the investigator is the prosecutor of
9:12
Speaker 1: the defense, basically just assumed that Joseph Wilkins really had
9:16
Speaker 1: drawn the weed Eagle note. There's nothing to prove though,
9:19
Speaker 1: that's really the case. No one ever actually asked him
9:22
Speaker 1: if he did. But assuming he did write the note,
9:25
Speaker 1: there's the second question. He was never asked either. Did
9:29
Speaker 1: he draw the no nark symbol that's on the corner
9:31
Speaker 1: of the weat Eagle's flag. I spent a number of
9:34
Speaker 1: months trying to get in touch with Joseph Wilkins, but
9:36
Speaker 1: without success, and Lee Clark hadn't been able to tell
9:39
Speaker 1: me how I might track him down. How well do
9:42
Speaker 1: you know Joseph?
9:43
Speaker 12: Uh? Not too? Will? I think I'm made him? Who
9:46
Speaker 12: were three occasion? He was more again Brandan it was
9:50
Speaker 12: mine the most hanging out idea what he was one.
9:52
Speaker 12: We actually show that state.
9:54
Speaker 1: Lee hadn't even wanted Joseph to be involved in the
9:56
Speaker 1: safe theft in the first place.
10:00
Speaker 12: She'd gotten into it because he was there with Kane,
10:02
Speaker 12: and I'm told Kine, are you sure, yeah, man, yeah, yeah, yeah,
10:08
Speaker 12: I know him. I go on you well, lest he didn't,
10:09
Speaker 12: let's go.
10:12
Speaker 1: That night, Cain and Joseph were both charged with theft
10:15
Speaker 1: for stealing the safe. A few days later, Lee and
10:18
Speaker 1: p Jordan were also arrested. Lee says it was obvious
10:22
Speaker 1: to him that either Joseph or Kane must have told
10:24
Speaker 1: the police what had happened, but he wasn't sure which
10:27
Speaker 1: one of them it had been.
10:29
Speaker 12: Can't. Being my lifelong friend, I'm choosing to believe him
10:32
Speaker 12: when he's telling me, Hey, look, I didn't do it. Man. Well,
10:37
Speaker 12: Kane told me that when he kept telling me over
10:39
Speaker 12: and over again he didn't do it. I was convinced
10:41
Speaker 12: that Joseph was to want to tow you.
10:43
Speaker 1: At trial, Lee learned that both Kane and Joseph had
10:46
Speaker 1: talked to the police. Both of them had fully confessed
10:49
Speaker 1: to their roles in the safe theft and named the
10:52
Speaker 1: other participants, which makes it even stranger that Joseph Wilkins
10:55
Speaker 1: would have written narcs in the note lefting Bran's casket.
10:59
Speaker 1: Why would Josh have been complaining about Brian supposedly talking
11:02
Speaker 1: to the police when he'd already gone ahead and confessed
11:04
Speaker 1: to everything himself. We asked Amanda if she knew of
11:08
Speaker 1: Brian and Joseph ever having problems with one another.
11:12
Speaker 7: Never, because you know, to me, he was just like
11:17
Speaker 7: a little loner to hisself. You know, I never really
11:22
Speaker 7: seen him hang out with anybody.
11:25
Speaker 1: The people I talked to you who knew he described as
11:27
Speaker 1: kind of like an artsy kid.
11:28
Speaker 8: Yeah.
11:29
Speaker 1: Yeah, Do you know why Joseph Wilkins would have written
11:32
Speaker 1: a message about narks?
11:34
Speaker 7: Not really, because you know, I never thought he I mean,
11:38
Speaker 7: I knew that he was friends with Josh and everybody,
11:44
Speaker 7: but I didn't know that they hung out like that.
11:47
Speaker 1: Amanda wasn't aware of any problems between Brian and Joseph,
11:51
Speaker 1: and in fact, she wasn't even aware they've been friends.
11:54
Speaker 7: I remember the Joonzi because him and Brian were the
11:59
Speaker 7: same age. I mean, I knew each other, but that
12:02
Speaker 7: was THEO that.
12:03
Speaker 12: I knew of.
12:04
Speaker 1: So to your knowledge was Joseph Wilkins, one of the
12:06
Speaker 1: free birds.
12:09
Speaker 7: I had heard that afterwards, you know, the one that
12:14
Speaker 7: would probably give you more inside about the free birds,
12:17
Speaker 7: would they.
12:17
Speaker 1: Tom I'd already looked for Tommy, but without success, and
12:22
Speaker 1: I asked Amanda if she knew where we could find
12:24
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12:30
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12:33
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12:34
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12:42
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12:43
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12:45
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12:47
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14:07
Speaker 1: Tommy Hyde was not a witness at leasing Kan's trial,
14:10
Speaker 1: but he is one of the major reasons that many
14:12
Speaker 1: of Brian's friends and family believe that Lee and Keane
14:15
Speaker 1: murdered Brian. What has Tommy told you about all this?
14:23
Speaker 7: He's just now getting to where he's comfortable with talking
14:27
Speaker 7: about what happened with Brian, because that really, it really
14:29
Speaker 7: messed him up to and whenever they did that to
14:33
Speaker 7: him in the graveyard two, that really messed him up.
14:36
Speaker 7: That's why I believe Tommy did do what he did
14:40
Speaker 7: out of seft defense. That's why he is where he
14:42
Speaker 7: is right now, is out of self defense because of
14:44
Speaker 7: what happened when he was a kid, what happened with death.
14:47
Speaker 1: But we were told he was just killing a friend
14:49
Speaker 1: of his.
14:51
Speaker 7: Yeah, well they wasn't like friend friends, but I mean
14:54
Speaker 7: they were hanging out together at one.
14:55
Speaker 1: Point, and I think the police ever talked to Tommy.
15:01
Speaker 8: I don't think they did. They did either.
15:06
Speaker 1: Tommy, Brian and Kin were all neighbors. They all lived
15:08
Speaker 1: in trailers that bordered the Pleasant Hope Cemetery, and Amanda
15:12
Speaker 1: told us that the three boys had been close friends,
15:14
Speaker 1: like three peas in a pod. She said, Lee had
15:18
Speaker 1: not been part of this trio. For one thing, he
15:21
Speaker 1: lived over in Lyndale, not Silver Creek. And for another,
15:24
Speaker 1: Tommy hadn't Likedly.
15:27
Speaker 7: They didn't like Tommy either, from what I always understood,
15:31
Speaker 7: they had gotten into it up there.
15:34
Speaker 8: And you know, I don't know boys or so unpredictable.
15:40
Speaker 1: Those who knew them remember that long before Brian's death.
15:43
Speaker 1: Tommy Hyde and Lee Clark had a mutual dislike for
15:45
Speaker 1: one another, but when they were younger, they'd often found
15:49
Speaker 1: themselves hanging out together anyway, because they've both been close
15:52
Speaker 1: with Kine and Amanda and Kidd had told us that
15:54
Speaker 1: they thought Tommy Hyde, plus another boy who lived nearby
15:57
Speaker 1: named James Archer, had been the other member. Is it
16:00
Speaker 1: the free Birds? I finally got a chance to speak
16:03
Speaker 1: with both of them, So the free Birds I've the
16:08
Speaker 1: I talked to James Archer. He did not know about
16:10
Speaker 1: the free Birds.
16:14
Speaker 2: I know that.
16:16
Speaker 1: Tommy is the only person I've spoken to who has
16:19
Speaker 1: heard about the free Birds. He said he wasn't really
16:22
Speaker 1: part of it because he'd moved away, but he said
16:25
Speaker 1: he'd heard about it. I wasn't able to record my
16:28
Speaker 1: conversation with Tommy Hyde, but after the first time I
16:30
Speaker 1: spoke to him, I called to Senda with an update.
16:33
Speaker 14: The way he told it, it was not really a
16:35
Speaker 14: thing the group.
16:36
Speaker 1: They talked about being in a group or something.
16:38
Speaker 14: It was not not really that serious either way, right anyway,
16:42
Speaker 14: his his lineup for the for the free Birds was
16:46
Speaker 14: basically the three of them who lived right there near
16:49
Speaker 14: the cemetery.
16:50
Speaker 12: Hue, which doesn't really makes that.
16:54
Speaker 4: No, it doesn't make sense.
16:57
Speaker 14: I also mentioned the uh, the NOE book, the gang notebook.
17:01
Speaker 15: Yeah, and his reaction was, see, that's something that Floyd
17:06
Speaker 15: count would just make up that they have to go
17:08
Speaker 15: to a jury trial.
17:09
Speaker 12: Wow.
17:10
Speaker 1: He did not believe that the gang book was real.
17:13
Speaker 12: And I told him that.
17:14
Speaker 14: One of the gang rules was like.
17:16
Speaker 15: A brother shall not do drugs, and.
17:17
Speaker 1: He's like, if there had been a gang.
17:20
Speaker 12: And we had a role book, that would not have
17:21
Speaker 12: been a rule.
17:23
Speaker 1: Tommy told me that it had been very shortly after
17:25
Speaker 1: Brian's death that he began to suspect Lee Clark might
17:28
Speaker 1: have been responsible. Tommy mentioned it seems like he thought
17:32
Speaker 1: it was Lee pretty early on.
17:34
Speaker 7: Now he probably did, well, I guess Tommy, did you know?
17:37
Speaker 7: That might have been Tommy's first I.
17:40
Speaker 2: May may have been Tommy that had told us that, Josh,
17:43
Speaker 2: you didn't know it without Lady say so, you know,
17:46
Speaker 2: without lady may right there, And might sure have I
17:49
Speaker 2: don't know.
17:50
Speaker 1: Amanda and Kenneth told us that it made sense to
17:52
Speaker 1: them that Tommy would suspect Lee of being behind Brian's.
17:55
Speaker 7: Death because Brian and Lee had already gotten into it
18:01
Speaker 7: about in the graveyard.
18:03
Speaker 8: I think up in the graveyard.
18:05
Speaker 7: I don't know they they had jumped on Tommy or something.
18:10
Speaker 1: What do you mean, jumped on Tommy?
18:13
Speaker 8: I had heard that they had put guns to both
18:15
Speaker 8: of them's head before this.
18:17
Speaker 1: Wait, who put guns to who's.
18:21
Speaker 8: Brian's and Tommy's.
18:23
Speaker 1: Josh put a gun to Brian and Tommy's head.
18:26
Speaker 8: And that's what I heard.
18:28
Speaker 4: That's what we heard. But Lee was there too, Why Tommy.
18:33
Speaker 2: They were just they just threatened me and supposedly he
18:37
Speaker 2: told me that they put the gun up to his
18:40
Speaker 2: head and pulled the trigger, but it was empty. You know,
18:44
Speaker 2: so that.
18:45
Speaker 1: Tom told you. Yeah, the story about Lee and Kane
18:49
Speaker 1: firing empty guns that Brian and Tommy did not come
18:52
Speaker 1: up a trial. In fact, Tommy didn't tell anyone about
18:55
Speaker 1: this until many years after Brian's die But to Brian's family,
18:58
Speaker 1: it's an important piece of evidence that points at Lee's
19:01
Speaker 1: and Kayne's guilt. When I finally spoke to Tommy, he
19:04
Speaker 1: told me about an incident that occurred at the house
19:06
Speaker 1: of an older neighbor where the boys sometimes hung out.
19:09
Speaker 1: I updated Jacinda on what Tommy had said.
19:12
Speaker 15: Well, johns were empty I guess, so, like they go
19:15
Speaker 15: up a breakforce size house, both Josh and.
19:18
Speaker 10: Lee have a gun.
19:19
Speaker 12: They each pull a gun.
19:20
Speaker 14: I mean, details are pretty vague, but Josh and Lee
19:24
Speaker 14: both pull a gun and point in the back of
19:26
Speaker 14: the head of Brian and Tommy and then like they
19:30
Speaker 14: apparently pull the triggers, but a gun downloaded.
19:33
Speaker 1: Tommy told me that he believes that Bryan was killed
19:36
Speaker 1: not because of anything having to do with the safe theft,
19:38
Speaker 1: but in order to prevent Brian from telling anyone about
19:41
Speaker 1: the dry firing incident. But what Tommy couldn't explain to
19:44
Speaker 1: me is why Lee and Kane might have done this
19:47
Speaker 1: in the first place. From what Tommy had described, this
19:50
Speaker 1: all just happened out of the blue. I told Lee
19:53
Speaker 1: what I learned and asked him if he remembered the
19:55
Speaker 1: incident that Tommy was describing. He said he was over
20:00
Speaker 1: and Brian were over at Brent Forsleith's house and that
20:04
Speaker 1: you and Josh showed up and pulled guns on Brian
20:08
Speaker 1: and uh Tommy.
20:10
Speaker 12: Holl right, Okay, Well, let me go ahead and clear
20:13
Speaker 12: by this story right here for you. And he wants
20:15
Speaker 12: to tell it laffers and don't want to tell it right,
20:17
Speaker 12: I'll go ahead and tell you real trip to the matter.
20:19
Speaker 1: All right.
20:19
Speaker 12: We was at a party at Brent Foresy's house one night, Me, Kane, Tommy, Brian,
20:24
Speaker 12: which all little for Trump. Well, get up there. Brent
20:27
Speaker 12: Forshaus got a lot of guns at his house, and
20:30
Speaker 12: he leaves his guns laying around on tables up there,
20:33
Speaker 12: just like you. Just free to pick one up. Well,
20:36
Speaker 12: just luckily he's got that. And if I ain't mistaken,
20:39
Speaker 12: I think it was a nine millimeter. He had a
20:41
Speaker 12: sitting on the coffee table over. Brian was so drunk
20:43
Speaker 12: Bryan couldn't walk. And Tommy he decided that he ain't
20:47
Speaker 12: drunk too. Tommy gets stupid when he drank us up.
20:50
Speaker 12: Some of the rat picks that gun up. It starts
20:52
Speaker 12: hoisting it. Brian starts clicking, and the pors it a
20:55
Speaker 12: cane starts clicking, and the pointed the men started clicking.
20:57
Speaker 12: I mean, that ain't cool. You don't bought no gun,
20:59
Speaker 12: and nobody clicked. I don't care if it's unloaded or not.
21:01
Speaker 12: I did. He taught me all the time when I
21:04
Speaker 12: was growing up with a little bitty boy, they taught
21:06
Speaker 12: me the most dangerous gun in the world is an
21:09
Speaker 12: unloaded gun. They should not say unloaded gun because you
21:12
Speaker 12: assume it's unloaded. Well, when he turned it around there
21:15
Speaker 12: clicked it to me. I done had enough for that
21:17
Speaker 12: shit right there. I want to over grabbing Druggy out
21:20
Speaker 12: in the yard and I DDT him in the ant
21:21
Speaker 12: bed out there and lift him in that ant bed.
21:23
Speaker 12: All right?
21:23
Speaker 1: First off, what was that last thing?
21:26
Speaker 10: Now?
21:26
Speaker 1: You dt him in an anthad a DDT.
21:29
Speaker 12: You know what a DDT is, don't you. No, it's
21:32
Speaker 12: a wrestling movie. You lock ahead in and slam them
21:35
Speaker 12: into the ground. I slammed the face person that ant bed.
21:37
Speaker 1: That was not part of the story I got from
21:39
Speaker 1: Tommy Hyde.
21:40
Speaker 12: Yeah, he lifted all that out. He didn't tell it
21:43
Speaker 12: to you straight.
21:45
Speaker 1: Since there aren't any records for the dry firing incident,
21:48
Speaker 1: we're left with Tommy's word versus Lee's word about what
21:50
Speaker 1: really happened. But there are a few things that Tommy
21:54
Speaker 1: says that don't quite add up. First, Tommy told me
21:58
Speaker 1: that this all occurred not long before Brian's death, maybe
22:01
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks at most, But Li said that
22:04
Speaker 1: it had been much further back in time than that,
22:06
Speaker 1: maybe even as much as a year before Brian's death,
22:10
Speaker 1: and that would make more sense because Brian had been
22:12
Speaker 1: on house arrest for a couple of months before the shooting.
22:15
Speaker 1: He wouldn't have been hanging out at night at other
22:17
Speaker 1: people's houses in that time period. And then that's what
22:20
Speaker 1: Tommy said when I talked to him for the second
22:22
Speaker 1: time after hearing from Lee. I told Tommy what Lee
22:26
Speaker 1: had said about the two of them fighting at Brent's house,
22:28
Speaker 1: because Lee had been upset about Tommy dry firing the
22:31
Speaker 1: gun at him, and Tommy insisted that this isn't how
22:33
Speaker 1: things had gone down that night that Brian and I
22:37
Speaker 1: were at Brent Forsyth's house. He told me we were
22:39
Speaker 1: really drunk. Lean Kine showed up and shoved me out
22:42
Speaker 1: the door. I stumbled down the porch steps, and I
22:45
Speaker 1: remember landing on my chin. I still remember the ants
22:48
Speaker 1: crawling on my head. I hadn't told Tommy what Lee
22:52
Speaker 1: had said about ddteing him into a nant bed, but
22:55
Speaker 1: that part of Tommy's story at least matches up perfectly
22:58
Speaker 1: with what Lee had told me. What makes me the
23:03
Speaker 1: most skeptical of Tommy's story, though, is that there's nothing
23:06
Speaker 1: else to corroborate it even when it seems like there
23:09
Speaker 1: should be.
23:10
Speaker 14: But the fact pig one brainfores I did not tell
23:13
Speaker 14: us the story and it was at his house too.
23:16
Speaker 14: Brian apparently never mentioned it to anyone else, and third,
23:21
Speaker 14: Tommy Hide never mentioned it to anyone else. Tommy said
23:24
Speaker 14: he was never talked to by the police. Because Tommy
23:26
Speaker 14: did say he eventually.
23:27
Speaker 12: Told Devor Bowling about it.
23:29
Speaker 5: But that's it.
23:30
Speaker 1: I'm like, why would Debra not have told the police
23:33
Speaker 1: about that?
23:34
Speaker 14: I would know when to interviewed Tommy Hyde about it.
23:38
Speaker 1: The first time I spoke to Tommy, he told me
23:40
Speaker 1: that investigators had never talked to him about this case.
23:44
Speaker 1: But I asked him why he hadn't told anyone else
23:46
Speaker 1: about the dry firing incident. I can't say I don't
23:49
Speaker 1: know he told me. But now, knowing what I do
23:52
Speaker 1: about life, oh yeah, of course I'd say something. But
23:55
Speaker 1: back then, well, he just hadn't. Later on, though, so
24:00
Speaker 1: Tommy mentioned something else that surprised me. There was a
24:05
Speaker 1: water tower that's some graffiti on it. Did you ever
24:08
Speaker 1: hear about that? I think it was up in Lyndale.
24:11
Speaker 1: On The graffiti says tea birds not free birds. But
24:17
Speaker 1: apparently they must have thought it was related, because Tommy
24:20
Speaker 1: was saying that David Stewart took him up there to
24:23
Speaker 1: look at it. If Lee and Kane really did shove
24:26
Speaker 1: Brian and Tommy to the ground and really did fire
24:28
Speaker 1: empty guns at the back of their heads, then there's
24:31
Speaker 1: no apparent reason why Tommy would not have told mestigators
24:34
Speaker 1: about it. Tommy hadn't like lead to begin with. He'd
24:37
Speaker 1: already been going around telling people that he thought Lee
24:40
Speaker 1: was involved in Brian's death, and according to Tommy, he
24:43
Speaker 1: actually did talk to the police about this case. So
24:47
Speaker 1: why did he wait until years after Lee's and Kine's
24:49
Speaker 1: conviction to tell anyone about the dry firing incident? Look,
24:56
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24:59
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26:38
Speaker 1: Before talking to Tommy Hyde, I hadn't heard from anyone
26:41
Speaker 1: in this case who said they had first hand knowledge
26:43
Speaker 1: about the freebirds. I had begun to wonder if the
26:46
Speaker 1: freebirds had even been a thing at all. But later on,
26:49
Speaker 1: when Kane finally called me, I got the chance to
26:52
Speaker 1: ask him something I'd wanted to ask for a very
26:54
Speaker 1: long time. Okay, I've been wondering what were the free birds.
27:00
Speaker 12: Here's a concept, because it's a concept, you know, a
27:03
Speaker 12: concept where you're as free as AMRD you know what
27:05
Speaker 12: I mean.
27:07
Speaker 1: Free Birds was not a band, It was not a click,
27:10
Speaker 1: not a gang. According to Kane, freebirds was a concept.
27:14
Speaker 1: He explained to me how this concept had come about.
27:19
Speaker 12: It was just basically, Okay, well, I remember one day
27:22
Speaker 12: me and Lee were walking by my house around the
27:25
Speaker 12: cemetery up there, and a little bird lands on the
27:28
Speaker 12: cup of his land, and well look at that land.
27:32
Speaker 12: When we were like like twelve thirty years old. Even
27:35
Speaker 12: that's u's new.
27:36
Speaker 10: We're free as birds man.
27:38
Speaker 12: That's where all they got started. That's all it was.
27:48
Speaker 1: The Next time I spoke to Lee, I asked, if
27:50
Speaker 1: you remember the time he'd been hanging out with Cain
27:52
Speaker 1: and a bird had landed on him.
27:55
Speaker 12: Oh yeah, when we got in the yond out there,
27:57
Speaker 12: you had a bird land on me out there one time.
27:59
Speaker 12: I think we bought eleven years old and I was
28:01
Speaker 12: standing there and had come down that landed on my foot.
28:03
Speaker 12: Matter of fact, way, I thought we should listen to
28:05
Speaker 12: that song Lennard Skinner when that stuff happened.
28:08
Speaker 1: I told Lee what Cain remembered about him saying all
28:11
Speaker 1: those years ago were free as birds man, and how
28:14
Speaker 1: Caine said this had been the origin of the concept
28:16
Speaker 1: of free birds. Lee had been surprised.
28:20
Speaker 12: Origin of freight birds. I remember that man saved, but
28:24
Speaker 12: I don't remember it being no origin and no freight birds. Now, love,
28:27
Speaker 12: we started calling ourselves the gang or freight birds and
28:29
Speaker 12: no stuff like that. But we were young kids when
28:32
Speaker 12: that happened. Hell we not. We couldn't have been the
28:34
Speaker 12: more than to eleven, no more twelve.
28:36
Speaker 1: Lee had heard Kane talk about free birds. He thought
28:39
Speaker 1: it was primarily the name of one of Kin's garage
28:41
Speaker 1: bands or something like that, And over the years he'd
28:44
Speaker 1: quiz Kene about whether or not there's been a gang,
28:47
Speaker 1: but Cane always insisted there was no such thing. But
28:50
Speaker 1: Lee said he had never asked Kean how the phrase
28:52
Speaker 1: free bird had come to be in the first place.
28:56
Speaker 12: He must have shared this concept with his buddy and
28:59
Speaker 12: Joseph as up they cood shared idea what Tommy too
29:02
Speaker 12: tell me live next door to him, and Tommy being
29:04
Speaker 12: Tommy would expund it into something it wouldn't.
29:08
Speaker 5: There's no evidence that before Brian's death, Cain and his
29:11
Speaker 5: friends in Silver Creek had actually called themselves the free Birds,
29:16
Speaker 5: but Lee says he wouldn't have known about it even
29:19
Speaker 5: if that was something that was going on.
29:22
Speaker 12: It's got lots before all that. I was going out
29:25
Speaker 12: there all the time, I mean, help me and Shelley
29:29
Speaker 12: were so proud up with each other. I mean I
29:30
Speaker 12: was already ever seeing him anymore. But I don't know.
29:33
Speaker 12: There's that time frame BOTOA, I mean six nine months.
29:36
Speaker 12: It might have been longer than that.
29:38
Speaker 5: In nineteen ninety six, Lee didn't have much time for
29:41
Speaker 5: hanging out in Silver Creek. He'd already dropped out of school,
29:45
Speaker 5: started living with his girlfriend Shelley, and had to get
29:48
Speaker 5: a job because he was now responsible for his own
29:51
Speaker 5: living expenses. He and Kan weren't around each other much,
29:55
Speaker 5: and Kane told Susan the same thing.
29:58
Speaker 12: Yeah, I mean really wa hang out much. I was
30:00
Speaker 12: really heating he got it with that girl whatever, and
30:04
Speaker 12: he was working most of the time, and I was
30:07
Speaker 12: from a skull, so not a lot, be honest with you.
30:16
Speaker 1: That brings us back to the only tangible evidence of
30:18
Speaker 1: the free Birds existence, the weed Eagle note. Someone did
30:23
Speaker 1: write a farewell note to Brian and drew an eagle
30:25
Speaker 1: carrying a banner that says free Birds, and they stuck
30:28
Speaker 1: the piece of paper into Brian's casket. So was this
30:31
Speaker 1: note a reference to Brian's affiliation with a gang. The
30:35
Speaker 1: only person who can answer that question is the boy
30:37
Speaker 1: who supposedly wrote the note in the first place, Joseph Wilkins.
30:42
Speaker 1: While investigating this case, I'd tried reaching out to him
30:45
Speaker 1: several times, but I never got through. I wasn't even
30:48
Speaker 1: sure if I'd managed to contact him at all. It
30:51
Speaker 1: turns out I had, though. That's how he got my
30:53
Speaker 1: phone number. When he finally decided to give me a call.
30:58
Speaker 9: I still had it saved, been looking at it for
31:01
Speaker 9: almost three months, debating whether or not I'm going to
31:04
Speaker 9: call you.
31:05
Speaker 10: Back or not.
31:07
Speaker 1: I'm glad you did. I've wondered a lot about your
31:12
Speaker 1: name comes up a lot of trial in this case,
31:13
Speaker 1: and it kind of blew me away when I found
31:15
Speaker 1: out they never even talked to you.
31:17
Speaker 9: Yeah, they didn't give a crap what I had to say.
31:21
Speaker 9: I was a fifteen year old kid. No one listens
31:23
Speaker 9: to a fifteen year old kid. I sat here in
31:31
Speaker 9: a debated whether or not I should call you back.
31:34
Speaker 10: And.
31:37
Speaker 9: I guess sometimes I feel guilt, but I could have
31:40
Speaker 9: done something.
31:41
Speaker 12: You know.
31:44
Speaker 1: Joseph told me that, aside from Cain, he hadn't really
31:47
Speaker 1: been friends with any of the other alleged Freebird members,
31:50
Speaker 1: and some of them he hadn't even known at all.
31:53
Speaker 1: But Cain and him have been close, and he'd never
31:55
Speaker 1: thought that Cain could have been capable of murder.
31:59
Speaker 10: I mean, our girlfriends dumped this around the same time.
32:03
Speaker 12: I mean we, uh, you know, we held.
32:06
Speaker 10: Each other and credit each other's arms, and you know
32:08
Speaker 10: that doesn't seem like someone that was they were doing.
32:10
Speaker 1: But he's going to accuse the hun, did you ever
32:14
Speaker 1: hear anyone talk about a gang or gang membership?
32:16
Speaker 10: There was never any gang.
32:18
Speaker 5: You know.
32:18
Speaker 10: They think they ended up making this whole narrative that
32:22
Speaker 10: there was a gang when there wasn't.
32:25
Speaker 1: I asked Joseph about the incident that started everything, the
32:28
Speaker 1: theft of the safe from Kane's dad. He told me
32:32
Speaker 1: that that day he'd been hanging out with Cain when
32:34
Speaker 1: Pete and Lee had come over.
32:37
Speaker 9: They showed up and well, He's like, hey, let's steal
32:40
Speaker 9: your dad. Say, let's go get spot.
32:42
Speaker 1: Joseph was ultimately convinced to go along with the plan,
32:45
Speaker 1: but he'd been reluctant. He thought that when the safe
32:47
Speaker 1: turned up missing, it was going to be pretty obvious
32:50
Speaker 1: who had taken it.
32:53
Speaker 9: M yeah, I haven't told Josh that. I was like,
32:58
Speaker 9: there's no way to play with this. No one seemed
33:03
Speaker 9: to care.
33:03
Speaker 1: I guess y'all took it somewhere and beat it open.
33:07
Speaker 9: Yeah, and uh, it broke open, and you know, they
33:10
Speaker 9: found thirty two dollars in the safe and.
33:14
Speaker 10: Leave pretty much said let's go get some pot.
33:16
Speaker 5: So the boys did buy some pot with the stolen money.
33:21
Speaker 5: Very shortly after that, though, Cain Lee and Joseph were
33:24
Speaker 5: all picked up by the police and driven down to
33:26
Speaker 5: the station to be interrogated.
33:29
Speaker 9: Yeah, they all put us individually in rooms and played
33:34
Speaker 9: good cop back off with us. And I played stupid
33:38
Speaker 9: as long as I possibly could.
33:40
Speaker 10: But you know, I didn't really have a solid story
33:44
Speaker 10: or anything like that.
33:45
Speaker 9: And you know, I told him I went to a
33:47
Speaker 9: Bigley Wiggily and put out a unemployment application, and he
33:51
Speaker 9: acted like he called the manager there and see the cameras,
33:55
Speaker 9: and I was like, oh.
33:57
Speaker 1: So that was your alibi, was the Glee Wigley.
34:01
Speaker 10: Yeah, that's what I said it. I didn't want to
34:04
Speaker 10: get in trouble, but I told him, I mean, you know,
34:08
Speaker 10: everything that happened.
34:09
Speaker 9: And you know Josh did too, because he told me
34:12
Speaker 9: that he did.
34:14
Speaker 5: After Joseph gave his statement to the police admitting to
34:17
Speaker 5: the safe theft and telling the police who all had
34:19
Speaker 5: been involved. Both Joseph and Kane had been charged with
34:23
Speaker 5: the theft, but only Kane got booked into jail.
34:29
Speaker 9: They were taking him to jail, and because I was fifteen,
34:32
Speaker 9: they let me go home with my mom, and you know,
34:35
Speaker 9: I told him to stay gold and that was the
34:37
Speaker 9: last thing I said to him. Yeah, that was the
34:41
Speaker 9: line from The Outsiders.
34:43
Speaker 1: The Outsiders is a famous coming of age novel by S. C. Hinton,
34:47
Speaker 1: and telling me about what had happened back in nineteen
34:49
Speaker 1: ninety six, Joseph had described a couple of times when
34:52
Speaker 1: his fifteen year old self had quoted the book, which
34:55
Speaker 1: kind of fit the image I already had in my
34:57
Speaker 1: head of what Joseph had been like back in high school,
35:00
Speaker 1: done what I'd heard from people who had known him then.
35:03
Speaker 16: Well, a lot of people in my high school have
35:05
Speaker 16: taught that I was a because I was a little different,
35:09
Speaker 16: and I didn't really fit into the heard of everybody
35:14
Speaker 16: else in the way society was, and I was just
35:17
Speaker 16: a little bit more I guess liberal, or maybe just
35:19
Speaker 16: a little bit different.
35:24
Speaker 1: Joseph's classmates had described him to me as a lonely
35:26
Speaker 1: kid who had won awards for his art and did
35:28
Speaker 1: okay in school. But nothing I heard about Joseph seemed
35:31
Speaker 1: to fit with what the state claimed at trial that
35:34
Speaker 1: after Brian's death, he'd written a note to subtly brag
35:37
Speaker 1: about how he'd been murdered for narking, and then placed
35:39
Speaker 1: it in the casket as a sort of signature to
35:41
Speaker 1: celebrate the gang's achievement in killing him. Were you at
35:46
Speaker 1: Brian's general, yes, did you put something in his casket?
35:51
Speaker 12: Did?
35:53
Speaker 1: Joseph confirmed that he had drawn the weed Eagle note
35:56
Speaker 1: with its freebirds banner and the note below saying that
35:59
Speaker 1: Brian will be missed and that they'd see him at
36:01
Speaker 1: the Crossroads, a reference to the rap song by Bone
36:04
Speaker 1: Thugs and Harmony, which had been one of Brian's favorite
36:07
Speaker 1: I asked him why this had been the drawing and
36:09
Speaker 1: the message that he'd chosen to place in Brian's casket.
36:12
Speaker 9: I wanted something nice to put in there, to kind
36:15
Speaker 9: of represent all of those guys that we were all
36:18
Speaker 9: friends with, and you know, people that couldn't be there,
36:23
Speaker 9: like Josh, because I didn't want to go you go
36:25
Speaker 9: out and say, you know, I want to put this
36:27
Speaker 9: in there for Josh or anything like that, because everybody
36:32
Speaker 9: was taking that has to do with it or whatever.
36:37
Speaker 9: So I wanted something nice and still kind of respectful,
36:41
Speaker 9: but kind of represent what we did and you guys.
36:50
Speaker 1: Joseph said he hadn't wanted to put anything offensive in
36:53
Speaker 1: the casket, but he'd also want the message to be
36:55
Speaker 1: a genuine expression of the friendship that he and Kane
36:58
Speaker 1: had had with Brian, which had often involved smoking weed
37:01
Speaker 1: and listening to music. This note, though, had been the
37:04
Speaker 1: state's proof that Brian was killed for talking to the
37:07
Speaker 1: police because of what was written in the corner of
37:09
Speaker 1: the eagles flag. I texted Joseph a picture of the
37:13
Speaker 1: image and asked him about it. Have you seen what's
37:16
Speaker 1: on the flag? Yes, there's a little symple says narks
37:22
Speaker 1: and it's crossed out right. Did you do that?
37:26
Speaker 9: I don't remember ever doing that because that word wasn't
37:29
Speaker 9: a part of my vocabulary.
37:31
Speaker 10: I never heard anybody in our group with a circle
37:35
Speaker 10: of friends ever used that word. We never really talked
37:38
Speaker 10: about that kind of souff. We never talked about, you know,
37:41
Speaker 10: people ratting on each other or anything like that. So
37:44
Speaker 10: we never were used that word. So that's the reason
37:47
Speaker 10: why I think I didn't write that.
37:49
Speaker 1: Do you have anything what might have happened there?
37:54
Speaker 9: I wouldn't know because I drew the picture and I
37:57
Speaker 9: stick it.
37:57
Speaker 10: In and that was last I saw.
38:00
Speaker 1: Besides, Joseph told me, even if nark had been a
38:03
Speaker 1: word he'd actually used, he still don't have had no
38:05
Speaker 1: reason to apply it to Brian.
38:08
Speaker 9: I said, everybody knew that that's safe was still on,
38:10
Speaker 9: and everybody knew that we had something to do with it.
38:12
Speaker 9: And so I don't know why Brian knowing anything on
38:16
Speaker 9: us or me knowing anything on anybody else or anything
38:19
Speaker 9: like that was a thing.
38:22
Speaker 1: Joseph said that if investigators had ever asked him about
38:24
Speaker 1: the note, he'd have told them what he told me,
38:27
Speaker 1: But they never did. Did anyone ever try to question
38:30
Speaker 1: you in this case? You know, a trial, they say
38:36
Speaker 1: that you wrote this note, that you wrote the NARKS thing.
38:39
Speaker 10: I wasn't allowed.
38:40
Speaker 9: I was told that I'm on a need to know
38:43
Speaker 9: basis and they'll let you know if they do. And
38:46
Speaker 9: they never asked me anything about anything.
38:49
Speaker 1: And who is they like? The investigators?
38:52
Speaker 10: Yep?
38:53
Speaker 1: Did they They they were in touch with you, but
38:55
Speaker 1: they never try to question you.
38:57
Speaker 10: Nope. They knew where I lived, they knew my phone
39:00
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39:04
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40:45
Speaker 1: There's no record of Sergeant Battle trying to talk to
40:47
Speaker 1: Joseph after Brian's death, but to be fair, during much
40:50
Speaker 1: of the investigation, Joseph also hadn't been in Floyd County.
40:54
Speaker 1: Shortly after Brian's death, Joseph's parents had pulled him out
40:57
Speaker 1: of school and sent him to live with relative several
41:00
Speaker 1: hours away, but he returned to Rome the next summer.
41:04
Speaker 1: He has been living in Floyd County when Lea Kane
41:06
Speaker 1: went on trial, and Joseph had wondered if there was
41:10
Speaker 1: something he should have been doing to set the record straight.
41:17
Speaker 9: I tried to talk to a few sheriff's deputies. I
41:21
Speaker 9: talked to the lawyer that I had the whole safe incident.
41:26
Speaker 9: I talked to my parents. I was trying to talk
41:28
Speaker 9: to everybody possibly kind of the time, and they all
41:31
Speaker 9: told me to live them alone.
41:34
Speaker 1: So your attorney knew about this as well, and he
41:38
Speaker 1: advised you that, like, this is not something you want
41:40
Speaker 1: to get involved.
41:41
Speaker 10: In, or yeah, I think yeah, I'm pretty sure he
41:44
Speaker 10: told me that. I was just like, you know, I
41:46
Speaker 10: don't think this is right. What you know, is there
41:48
Speaker 10: something I can do? And he said I would just.
41:51
Speaker 9: Just stay out of it and let you know things
41:55
Speaker 9: has come out and the way that they're supposed to,
41:57
Speaker 9: or forget what he said, but he just based to tell.
42:00
Speaker 10: Me to leave it alone.
42:03
Speaker 1: What did you think when you heard they're convicted?
42:06
Speaker 10: It broke my heart.
42:09
Speaker 9: I knew they didn't have anything to do with I
42:11
Speaker 9: never I thought that they were guilty at all.
42:18
Speaker 1: Do you think Brian was playing Russian Roulette?
42:21
Speaker 10: Yes, because he would do crazy things like that.
42:35
Speaker 1: One interpretation of what happened here is that investigators just
42:38
Speaker 1: screwed up. They failed to interview a crucial witness, and
42:41
Speaker 1: because of that, they didn't realize that they'd gotten off
42:44
Speaker 1: track with their theory about the wead Eagle note being
42:46
Speaker 1: proof of a gang murder conspiracy. But I think that
42:49
Speaker 1: interpretation is the wrong one. I think the story of
42:53
Speaker 1: Joseph Wilkin's role in this case is much more complicated
42:55
Speaker 1: whether he knows it or not, because after speaking to
42:59
Speaker 1: Joe's I'd realized that Sergeant Battle's failure to interview him
43:03
Speaker 1: and the Brian Bowling case had been even more bizarre
43:05
Speaker 1: than I'd realized. When I asked Joseph about Lee Clark,
43:19
Speaker 1: he said that they'd hung out on maybe two occasions.
43:22
Speaker 1: The second time had been when they all stole that
43:24
Speaker 1: safe and got arrested, but the first time had been
43:26
Speaker 1: a random day sometime before that, when he and Liam
43:29
Speaker 1: Kane had driven around and smoked pot together.
43:34
Speaker 9: The night that we stuck out of the house and
43:37
Speaker 9: ended up smoking a joint running around. He ended up
43:39
Speaker 9: getting pulled over that night, and it just smokes. I
43:46
Speaker 9: figure we were all going to go to jail, so
43:49
Speaker 9: but luckily we were able to go home. But the
43:51
Speaker 9: very next day, Sergeant Battle he ended up calling the
43:57
Speaker 9: house trying to get in touch with my mouth my
43:59
Speaker 9: mom there, and she wasn't there at the time, so
44:03
Speaker 9: but he told me who he was, and I knew
44:05
Speaker 9: exactly what he was doing.
44:07
Speaker 1: Well, what was he doing, I'm.
44:10
Speaker 10: Guessing he was because he had such a thing against Lee.
44:15
Speaker 9: That anyone hanging out with Lee, I guess he was
44:19
Speaker 9: calling and letting all the parents know that you know,
44:23
Speaker 9: we're hanging around someone that you know it's getting in
44:25
Speaker 9: trouble a lot.
44:29
Speaker 1: So before Brian's death, Sergeant Battle had known exactly how
44:32
Speaker 1: to find Joseph. And sure, maybe Battle hadn't been able
44:36
Speaker 1: to interview Joseph after Brian's death because his parents had
44:39
Speaker 1: sent him out of town, but Joseph had returned to
44:42
Speaker 1: Rome the following summer. In fact, he and Kane had
44:46
Speaker 1: ended up getting summer jobs together at the same fast
44:48
Speaker 1: food joint.
44:49
Speaker 9: There was a part where I was driving us to
44:52
Speaker 9: Bow Jngles to go to work, and I was told
44:54
Speaker 9: I should probably stay away until all this blows over.
45:00
Speaker 1: Who told you that?
45:01
Speaker 9: My parents they were just like you should probably just
45:03
Speaker 9: stay away from them. And I actually I heard Sergeant
45:05
Speaker 9: Battles tell me once that they followed us to bow
45:08
Speaker 9: Jangles one morning one morning, and that's how they know
45:11
Speaker 9: that we were still hanging out with each other.
45:13
Speaker 10: They followed you the boat Jangles, that's what That's what
45:16
Speaker 10: he said.
45:18
Speaker 1: I had asked Kin about how often he'd seen Joseph
45:20
Speaker 1: after Brian's death, and he had remembered the same thing
45:23
Speaker 1: that Joseph had. He told me that while you were
45:27
Speaker 1: like that summer, while you're still out on bond, that
45:30
Speaker 1: y'all hung out several times.
45:32
Speaker 12: Oh we were, we were working together and at the
45:36
Speaker 12: boat Jangles. That's what he said. And I think if
45:41
Speaker 12: I were knew a Campy and Dallas Ball or somebody
45:43
Speaker 12: about out about it and totally could do it no more.
45:47
Speaker 12: I ren't remember murmured back on how they went, but
45:50
Speaker 12: it was right there.
45:52
Speaker 1: That was interesting because clearly Dallas Battle could have found
45:55
Speaker 1: Wilkins if you wanted to. We have no records of
46:05
Speaker 1: the police speaking to Joseph Wilkins, but that doesn't mean
46:08
Speaker 1: they never did. And from what Joseph's mother remembers, it
46:12
Speaker 1: seems like Joseph may have been in contact with the
46:14
Speaker 1: police very shortly after Brian's death. I'd ended up speaking
46:18
Speaker 1: to his mom once when I'd been trying to reach him,
46:21
Speaker 1: and afterwards I told j Senda about how she told
46:23
Speaker 1: me a confusing story about how the week after the shooting,
46:27
Speaker 1: the police have been called a Pepperrell High School because
46:29
Speaker 1: of something happening to do with Joseph and his connection
46:31
Speaker 1: to the case. And She's like, but there should be
46:34
Speaker 1: police reports because there was an incident in the school there.
46:37
Speaker 5: You know what, there was a newspaper article about that.
46:40
Speaker 5: Oh really, but what there's a newspaper article about a
46:45
Speaker 5: threat at the school. I'm gonna have to look at
46:48
Speaker 5: I'll look forward again. It's in our files. But the
46:52
Speaker 5: police it was. I think the police came and they
46:55
Speaker 5: said it was unfounded or didn't amount to anything.
47:00
Speaker 1: We have no police reports from this incident. They must
47:03
Speaker 1: be among the records that have been lost. But the
47:06
Speaker 1: newspaper shows that the police came to Josephs High School
47:08
Speaker 1: the Wednesday after Brian's death to unspecified tensions that had
47:11
Speaker 1: risen in the wake of the shooting. The news articles
47:14
Speaker 1: also note that their were quote wild and Atlantis Schumer's
47:17
Speaker 1: going around town about Brian's death. So we don't know
47:21
Speaker 1: exactly why the police went to Pepperle High School that day,
47:24
Speaker 1: other than that had something to do with Joseph. According
47:26
Speaker 1: to his mother, Joseph told me that he does not
47:29
Speaker 1: recall the police coming to the high school, but he
47:32
Speaker 1: does remember something happening that caused concern for his well being.
47:35
Speaker 1: In the wake of Brian's death.
47:40
Speaker 10: Somebody asked me if I need protection or something, and I.
47:42
Speaker 1: Was like, I don't know, was that at school?
47:44
Speaker 10: For asked maybe the Ghaness counselor maybe I'm not really sure.
47:49
Speaker 10: It happened pretty quick this whole time, Cream, and.
47:55
Speaker 9: You know, next thing I know, I'm getting off another
47:59
Speaker 9: school to you for my safety, and.
48:05
Speaker 10: You know, the next thing I know, I'm there and
48:08
Speaker 10: still kind of confused on what was going on at
48:10
Speaker 10: the time.
48:18
Speaker 1: So where did investigators come up with the idea that Lee, Caine, Brian,
48:22
Speaker 1: and Joseph had all been in a gang together and
48:25
Speaker 1: lived by gang rules that included the oddly idealistic command
48:28
Speaker 1: to always stick up for your brother. Well, I've wondered,
48:32
Speaker 1: but there's one possibility I don't roll out, because although
48:36
Speaker 1: the records are missing, it does seem like investigators knew
48:39
Speaker 1: about Joseph Wilkins very early on in this case, and
48:42
Speaker 1: based on their presence at the high school, if they
48:44
Speaker 1: didn't speak to him themselves, they had at least spoken
48:47
Speaker 1: to someone who had. And the investigator's story about the
48:50
Speaker 1: Freebird gang, well, it doesn't sound like something that would
48:54
Speaker 1: happen in real life, which the prosecutor himself fully omitted
48:57
Speaker 1: in closing arguments after just describing how Lee and Kane
49:01
Speaker 1: had killed Brian because of their membership in the Freebird Gang.
49:04
Speaker 1: He told the jury. Now, that may sound stranger than fiction,
49:08
Speaker 1: but sometimes truth is stranger than fiction. But sometimes fiction
49:12
Speaker 1: is just fiction. And this story about the Freebird Gang
49:16
Speaker 1: and their book of rules doesn't sound like something that
49:18
Speaker 1: would happen in reality, but it does kind of sound
49:21
Speaker 1: like something that might have been said by a fifteen
49:23
Speaker 1: year old boy who likes to quote Essie Hinton's The Outsiders,
49:27
Speaker 1: a novel about a bunch of teenage boys who joined
49:29
Speaker 1: a gang whose first rule is when you're a gang,
49:32
Speaker 1: you stick up with members and Mickwig Brothers.
49:43
Speaker 5: At trial, there was another piece of evidence that the
49:46
Speaker 5: prosecution relied on to prove that a gang had existed.
49:50
Speaker 5: Twenty five years later, on Brian's brother in law, Kenneth,
49:55
Speaker 5: does not remember Brian telling him about the Freebirds. As
49:58
Speaker 5: you can imagine, five years later, it's hard to remember
50:02
Speaker 5: all the details, but at trial, Kenneth testified that Brian
50:06
Speaker 5: had once casually mentioned to him, Hey, I'm in.
50:10
Speaker 4: A gang called the Freebirds. The other members of the
50:13
Speaker 4: gang are.
50:13
Speaker 5: Lee Kin, Joseph Wilkins, and Tommy Hyde. This was the
50:19
Speaker 5: prosecution's strongest evidence that Brian had been in a gang,
50:23
Speaker 5: and it was one of the things that Lee Clark
50:25
Speaker 5: raised in his appeal, arguing that the trial court had
50:29
Speaker 5: made an error in allowing it into evidence. Once again,
50:33
Speaker 5: the Supreme Court of Georgia agreed with Lee.
50:40
Speaker 11: At trial, the victim's brother in law testified that Brian
50:43
Speaker 11: had told him that Brian and appellants were quote, in
50:46
Speaker 11: a gang called freebirds end quote. It is undisputed that
50:50
Speaker 11: the witness's testimony as to what Brian purportedly had said
50:53
Speaker 11: was hearsay, the admission of which is limited to specified
50:57
Speaker 11: cases of necessity. In the case at the trial court
51:01
Speaker 11: made no inquiry or finding concerning to particularize guarantees of
51:05
Speaker 11: trustworthiness necessary for the admission of the hearsay. However, the
51:09
Speaker 11: erroneous admission of the hearsay amounted to harmless error, since
51:12
Speaker 11: establishing Brian's membership in the gang with repellants was admitted
51:16
Speaker 11: through the testimony of the party hostess.
51:24
Speaker 5: In its decision denying Lie's appeal, the Supreme Court of
51:27
Speaker 5: Georgia concluded that, just like with the evidence about the
51:31
Speaker 5: gang rule book, Kenneth's testimony about the Freebirds had been
51:35
Speaker 5: mistakenly admitted, but once again, just like with the gang
51:40
Speaker 5: rule book, the court concluded that this error had been harmless.
51:45
Speaker 5: Although the jury should never have heard any of the
51:48
Speaker 5: prosecution's other evidence about the Freed Bird Gang, the court
51:52
Speaker 5: held that these mistakes didn't affect the jury's verdict because
51:57
Speaker 5: Angela Bruce, the party hostess, testified that Lee and Kane
52:01
Speaker 5: had confessed to killing Brian because he was trying to
52:05
Speaker 5: leave the Freebird Gang, and she, according to the court,
52:09
Speaker 5: was enough to support the jury's verdict, but was letting
52:14
Speaker 5: the jury convict Lee and Kane based on what Angela
52:17
Speaker 5: Bruce had to say, really a harmless error.
52:20
Speaker 4: Next time on proof?
52:27
Speaker 10: Did she go to court and testify?
52:29
Speaker 12: She did?
52:30
Speaker 16: Did she testify in court specifically about the pillow yep
52:34
Speaker 16: over the.
52:35
Speaker 17: Head because I promised you one that cop made her lie?
52:42
Speaker 4: What did she write about?
52:44
Speaker 17: I think it was Dallas Battles had her tied up,
52:46
Speaker 17: maybe count her with something and told her, Hey, you're.
52:50
Speaker 12: Gonna do this for me and I'm gonna.
52:52
Speaker 10: Let you go.
52:53
Speaker 1: They didn't have like that many witnesses to talk to
52:56
Speaker 1: and they's like never bothered to talk to someone else's
52:58
Speaker 1: an important party.
52:59
Speaker 4: I don't think it was a matter of not bothering.
53:01
Speaker 4: They were selective.
53:03
Speaker 1: Well, we talked to Angel Broops.
53:05
Speaker 6: We found her too.
53:08
Speaker 18: You know, there's a lot of things that was said,
53:10
Speaker 18: and I know I didn't say.
53:20
Speaker 5: You've been listening to Proof a podcast by Red Marble Media.
53:24
Speaker 5: We'll be back next Monday for episode twelve. Send us
53:27
Speaker 5: your questions at proofcrimepodat gmail dot com. We'll respond during
53:32
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53:37
Speaker 5: our executive producer. Our logo was designed by Drew Hosski
53:41
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53:45
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53:49
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54:00
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54:04
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54:06
Speaker 4: That's all for this week. Thanks for listening.