Latest / SHULCHAN ARUCH YOMI: Own the Halacha in 25 minutes a day! / Yoreh De’ah 177:5-7. Interest: Business Dealings, Investor and Managing Partner

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Yoreh De’ah 177:5-7. Interest: Business Dealings, Investor and Managing Partner · SHULCHAN ARUCH YOMI: Own the Halacha in 25 minutes a day!

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  Here we go. OK, we're continuing to help us
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  Rebus kuf einzine we are see if hey keshu no telstar al hayla
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  capikadon shibiado. So what happens the give the
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  investor is giving there? There's a partnership over here.
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  It's not a show to us. We're not calling it where you
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  the each one invested, 1 invested.
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  You have an investing partner and a managing partner and the
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  investing partner is going to take profits from his picadon
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  portion, right? That half.
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  So he's going to get half Picadon, Shibiado, Harehu, all
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  of Kashomer Sakhar. So they want the managing
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  partner. What is considered a Schomer?
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  The managing partner is generating OK OK OK OK, OK OK.
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  I think you're right. So the managing partner is
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  taking his right whatever the whatever salary he makes for it.
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  OK, Mutter Litaine Iska the market seat scar.
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  Well, the heat not velahatnot shaloyd Asik ella badavar ploni.
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  So it's he's allowed. They're allowed to make this
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  agreement that the agreement is he's going to follow the rules,
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  don't do certain things with this investment.
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  And if he doesn't, and if he doesn't follows the way he's
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  supposed to, he doesn't do what he's going to do.
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  So then all of the Arcarius, all of the responsibility is going
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  to be on the, the managing partner.
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  The managing partners accept, right?
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  The investors willing to risk 50% of his investment if the
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  managing partner manages it correctly, the way he thinks.
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  So. So he doesn't want him to do
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  anything that's dangerous with his money irresponsible.
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  So if he does or doesn't do it what the agreement was so then
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  he takes all responsibility. So that's OK Any kind of
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  agreement that they make between them a condition they agree.
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  I want I want you to protect my money so keep it under the
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  ground. So then IM Sheena and if he does
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  something different, he doesn't follow their agreement.
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  I mean he's seed kolahem sidda macabre and everything gets
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  lost. Someone steals everything.
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  So then all the loss goes only to the to the managing partner
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  Veem hirviya hula emza. But when it comes to profit,
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  they share it 5050. That was their agreement.
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  That's OK, have said, even though this is that famous
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  clause or principle in Ribis which becomes a problem.
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  Usually it's a Durabanan issue, but it's so now the investing
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  partner has very little to risk or not almost nothing to risk or
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  nothing repeat. This is not Ribis.
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  Why? Because the original agreement
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  was set up to be done correctly and it was all done Derek Heter
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  and he wasn't supposed to change and everything should have
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  worked out just nicely. But the fact that he changed
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  something and went against the agreement, so then that changed
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  everything. But the Exim loan or the Exim
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  investment, There is nothing wrong with it.
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  I got a mucho le macabel, a module Macabre chenot la
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  Katrilla below. I'm mean under Havoc A Gaza and
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  Beka 1 second. They can plan, they can do this,
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  and then Macabre changes his mind.
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  Right, right. In right, that wasn't what that
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  they agreed to and that wasn't what he was supposed to do.
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  But he can do it la catrilla and he's not called the ghazalan.
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  If he does it, however, let's keep reading.
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  Mihu inshina the amarilla atsmi ani OSA the lobator at isca Javi
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  ke ghazalan. But if he's doing it for himself
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  and not because of the agreement, Javi ke ghazalan
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  umash ASA ASA and whatever he does, he does it for himself to
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  benefit. So therefore I'm doing I'm, I'm
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  ignoring all the conditions. I'm just, I'm just going to.
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  Take. The money and OK you know what,
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  I'm fuzzy on this one, sorry. They set up rules if.
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  You don't follow the rules, then you get these.
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  Bounds right? So that's mutter or not mutter
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  that's. Fine, that was.
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  Fine. So when is it not OK?
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  OK, OK, OK, OK. So right.
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  So the taz says it clearly. That's right.
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  Yeah, I knew this all earlier, but OK, So the taz points,
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  what's the difference? Depends on your kavana.
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  If your kavana is to take the money and run and use it as a
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  loan, and you're using this tonight to get out of it, you're
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  a goslin and that's usser to do it works, but it's usser to do
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  1. Is that Mutterla Khatkila is if
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  you're doing this so that you share the profits and you want
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  to give the investor 50% of your profit, you just think you know
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  better. And therefore, if you do it, if
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  you doing this for the two of you and you're both trying to
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  you just, you know, you're atypical whatever and you want
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  to do it your way. So then you we're not calling
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  you a Gosselin. In other words, it's smutter for
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  you to do it. You're going to share the
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  profits and but you're going to take all the risk.
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  So if that's what you want to do, go ahead.
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  So that's what they're a must is you're allowed to do.
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  That is if you're you're, you're trying to to do it for yourself
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  and you don't care about your partner.
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  It's a subtle difference, I guess.
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  OK, yeah, today I'm noting Kilashim you told if I'm in a
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  circled circle, Shilo yeh Micra shilakiya picadon bikak the
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  azhavika gazan. OK, the kola reva Shiloh.
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  So the Rama says you can end up with a little bit of a problem
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  over here. Make sure you have in mind that
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  you're mohel him if he does a little bit with what he wants,
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  because if he's goes against the rules a little bit, then it can
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  turn out the guy turns into a goslin, which is bad for him.
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  But then OK, goslin. But there it's also it's bad for
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  him, but it's also bad for you because then he could decide not
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  to give you all the profits. So you're not really a goslin.
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  I think if you're going to give him all the profits maybe OK,
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  it's already in exactly, but that's what it seems like to me.
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  So therefore to avoid him from stealing your profits or to
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  avoid him from being like the Goslin, just give him some
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  wiggle room and then and so therefore it'll be OK.
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  And if the Minog is not to be mock beat 100% on every penny or
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  every whatever dollar, I don't know how much whatever the minog
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  is, which I'm assuming there's some wiggle room built in
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  nowadays. So then miss Tamaki Ilu hits
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  Nudami and it's as if he made the The Tonight.
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  So we know in business things are a little bit, you know, also
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  like save for Koshimish. But but it could be you can have
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  a few minutes as an employee to yourself to throughout the day.
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  That's probably the accepted whatever's accepted.
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  OK, let's go on to Vav. Yeah, abusing time, using money,
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  right. I know, but the same the same
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  exactly. OK, let's go on to Vav matan ma
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  otla iska. You gave money for a business,
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  Lamar Katzitzhar vikatzatz badavar badavaria dua.
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  So initially it starts out to be an iska, or it's supposed to be
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  5050, right? But then here's the difference
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  from the normal iskatz badavaria dua a filu in kola khayut Allah
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  notain azur. But then they agreed Khatzatb de
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  vaya dua means they they say, let's say we're going to assume
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  this is our prophet. And then he says, now I'm
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  guaranteeing you this prophet. So then it looks like ribis and
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  so therefore it's us. So he's guaranteeing to pay a
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  profit. In other words, Eve he's getting
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  and he's going to, he pays for the chance.
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  I don't know, all right, to make more profit.
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  That's why the guy would do it. He's willing to tell him like
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  this, We were going to do 5050 and then he says, you know what,
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  I'm going to pay you X amount. And then they might make more
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  and might make less. And so they're, they're gambling
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  the two of them. And so the, the guy, the
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  investor knows he doesn't have to worry so much.
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  He's going to make X amount, but the other guy might make twice
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  as much as he's going to make. So that's the risk that so
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  that's, that's, that's what's going on.
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  You know, Tain is the investor like, like Omalva, but he's not
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  Omalva. This is a business, this is an
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  ISCA. So so once anytime you guarantee
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  a certain, anytime you guarantee a profit, then that already
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  becomes a problem of Revis. So it's it's he's taking.
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  The whole list. Certain companies could imagine
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  taking the. Whole list you just said that
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  he's perhaps the way to do it and get the current, but does he
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  mean that the? Business fails, he still has to
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  pay or if they paid less than the the 50% would have been, he
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  still has to pay whatever they agreed on.
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  Once you agree on a price that's guaranteed, it's going to be US
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  profit. So.
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  So what does it mean customs are going to do have the is a
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  guaranteed profit that if the the gold mine just gets lost,
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  then Macabo has to make the difference to to the nose.
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  No, no, no, that price says that's what I'm trying to work
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  out. Incorrect.
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  But if the. Business does succeed.
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  He gives him more. Where's the?
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  Cousins without. Reidua, the cousins without
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  Reidua means, let's say they, they, he invests $100, right?
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  And they're expecting that they're each going to make $10
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  out of it. All right, So they say, you know
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  what, take $10. I'm guaranteeing you $10
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  profits. No matter what happens, I'm
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  guaranteeing to pay you $10 profit, and the other one might
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  make $20 in addition, or you might make $5 or zero.
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  What I got right? What happens to the principal?
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  What? Happens.
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  It doesn't make. Even you mean they lose money?
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  What happens? If you let's say you get.
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  All money. You call it that's there's no
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  profit, So what? Happens.
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  So he still has to pay the $10.00 but cuts that's the from
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  his pocket. Pay from his pocket, correct.
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  That's why it's Ribis. That's it.
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  Yeah, it's not guaranteed. So that's why it's only
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  investing. You mean on the principle
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  itself? He's also being responsible for
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  that. OK.
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  So OK, so let's go on the Yesh Omri.
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  Never guarantee profit and then you're safe.
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  Once you guarantee it's a problem.
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  Haggah viyesh omrim the E makaba Allah of kolak rayut amater the
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  kol ribis de rabanan. OK go on notain biska oshari bhi
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  terbanan ABBA beribit suitsa lo mahani imamaba makaba Allah.
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  OK, So what are we saying here? That he says it's there is an
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  opinion and says it's mutter because it is an Iska, even if
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  he accepts upon himself all the arcarias of the principle,
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  right? Whenever it's talking about
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  ribis, there are abundant like in this case there is an opinion
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  that says you're allowed to take all the responsibility that's in
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  it. That's right, that's in conflict
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  with the Shokanar about Berevi suitsa.
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  Then for sure that's LO mehane imalva makaba Allah call
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  akhayas. IM lo makaba Allah call akhayas
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  once they share responsibility, rakt Satan afila biderabanan
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  asur even if it's partial. So then even when it's the ribis
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  Derabanan Kiswara, Kiswara is us.
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  So what comes out? So then that's a big problem
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  there, Amma says. But when it comes.
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  To register a bond, it's on. My focus.
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  As to whether they're taking on. The the right according to the
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  Shulkhan ara. Once you guarantee profit, then
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  that's that's then the whole thing becomes aser.
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  That's what I add right? It doesn't matter who takes
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  responsibility once you guarantee profit according to
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  the Shalkhanar 100% answer OK, in most in maybe they're
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  abundant, right? Depending on the situation, it
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  doesn't matter, right? Even even it doesn't matter who
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  takes all the responsibility. Sorry, it's the Shokano akhrais
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  al enossei and I got confused. Exactly.
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  Doesn't matter who takes responsibility on the principle
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  once you're guaranteed something of profit.
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  Even so, you're going to even if everything goes sour, but you're
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  still going to pay him that $10. In that case, it's still us.
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  According to the Roma, the ICAR is the akhrais and so therefore
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  if all the responsibility is on the note Tain on the investor,
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  so then it becomes mother, right, right, right.
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  OK, so I think that was clear. I got confused between call
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  akhayas and who OK, so but according to the Ramaf, the note
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  Tain takes all the akhayas that saves you at least with Revista
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  robana like in a case of ISA. So that's that's the mahogas.
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  OK, So as long as so then you can guarantee profit.
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  If the akhayas is all on the investor, you pay profit, you're
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  guaranteeing profit, but not guaranteeing the principal.
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  OK, OK. Zain, I'm noting more of the
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  Caveril market sees scar shena time shalosh vishuv nimahu.
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  So they make an agreement, he's going to he gives them money for
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  the investment, right? They're going to share
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  everything. It's a 2-3 year investment
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  venture. Vishuv nimahuvasu kitsva binayam
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  and they said you know what this is taking too long.
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  Let's get our money out. Let's make our profit quickly.
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  Whatever it is, it is Taylor Koch Lashana gives him a year.
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  IM hello VE hotsi hamaot bietsi OTA vinatan reva have Rebus.
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  So if he used the money for his own usage, so then and so then
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  and then he gives a profit. So then that could be ribis,
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  that is ribis aval imayamit Asik vaholek upara me rabak sherviko
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  and ekasim. But if as they're going along
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  they're he's just paying his Mehta Mehta.
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  So then Kevan de MI Kara la bitarat isura Atta liyade so
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  that everything was generated through the mutter ESCA.
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  There's no problem. IM khetzi Rabak Sherviko Amos
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  Allah lamasionata. No what?
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  Even if it comes out, he's paying.
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  Him from the profits that that it generated so then but
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  otherwise staying at saying you guys could be home if he ends up
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  getting what they agreed to just a little bit early or.
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  Something like that, right? If they're.
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  Actually just splitting profits here.
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  Right, as long as it's going along.
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  So what's the case that becomes user?
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  Oh boy, I had a he used it for something else out of the asset.
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  No, he's paying the profits out of out of.
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  Out of the money, not out of the profits he's paying.
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  He's paying the the so-called profits you know from the first
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  year. The guaranteed amount from the
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  money that should have been generating profits indicated out
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  of the actual profits is no problem.
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  You mean from his own profits? No, I'm.
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  I'm. Going to stop here and I'll just
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  recap next time.