Latest / Imagine If with Doone Roisin | Health, Wealth & Wisdom for Women (formerly Female Startup Club Podcast) / The cereal brand breaking all the rules, with OffLimits Founder Emily Elyse Miller

Transcript

The cereal brand breaking all the rules, with OffLimits Founder Emily Elyse Miller · Imagine If with Doone Roisin | Health, Wealth & Wisdom for Women (formerly Female Startup Club Podcast)

• 0:00
  This is Emily Elise Miller for Female Startup Club. Hey everyone, and welcome back to another episode of the Female Startup Club podcast. I'm your host, Doon Roshin, and joining me in this episode is Emily Elise Miller, founder of the rule-breaking serial brand, Off Limits.
• 0:25
  Off Limits is a counterculture cereal brand featuring out-of-the-box flavors and relatable cartoon characters. Off Limits currently offers two flavors and characters that are both gluten-free and plant-based. Dash is the first ever cereal brand character that's female, bringing equal parts intelligentsia, coffee, and cacao, turning milk to cold brew. And Zombie is infused with adaptogens to maxi-relax with out-of-this-world vanilla, pandan, and ashwagandha flavors.
• 0:55
  In this episode, you'll hear how Emily turned her love of art and design into a serial brand, how collaborations are a driving force behind the brand, and how to pitch ideas and partnerships. This is Emily for Female Startup Club. Emily, hi, hello, and welcome to the Female Startup Club podcast. Hi, thanks for having me. I'm so excited to get started. Could you introduce yourself and what your business is? What?
• 1:24
  Yeah, my name is Emily and I started a really cheeky, bold cereal brand called Off Limits. I love the branding and the look and all the things that you have around this brand, but I want to go back to life before the cereal brand. You are a self-confessed breakfast addict and you've been doing lots of different things in the space. Can you talk me through the path that led you towards breakfast and creating an any time of the day cereal brand?
• 1:55
  Yeah, it's really funny. I mean, my career really is breakfast and it has been for the past decade. So
• 2:01
  I grew up in the hospitality world, so I always stayed very close to food, but went to school for fashion design because I was always kind of flipping back and forth between food, art, design, that kind of thing. And in school, got really into trend forecasting and ended up in the trend forecasting and editorial space. But they needed more people who could write about food, especially as food culture was on the up like 10 years ago when all these chefs were really starting to take the stage.
• 2:30
  And I obviously very willingly took on those pieces and started traveling all over the world, writing for different outlets and started a series called Breakfast Club, where I would invite about 30 or so creatives in each city, work with chefs in each city, often the ones that I was featuring for Astori. And thankfully, they are incredible chefs and either had a tasting menu restaurant or typically were closed during the morning. So it was perfect for them to open up in the morning
• 3:00
  honestly prepare like a family meal like they would for their staff, but for breakfast. And it was typically family style serving. And all these creative people kind of got to be in this space that wasn't typically open in the morning. And there was no pressure to post on social media. It was really just
• 3:18
  Let's all connect. Let's have real creative conversations with people who are inspiring in each of these cities. So it became this really incredible series that I hosted around the world. And that got me a cookbook deal with Fiden. And I spent the next three years researching, developing and writing a 380 recipe cookbook about breakfast.
• 3:39
  So we featured over 80 countries. So I had at least 100 people who I've met in my travels, aunts and uncles of friends who I got in touch with to talk about breakfast and make sure all of the recipes were truly things that people eat in the morning in those countries. So.
• 3:56
  That was a really rewarding project. And after that, I wanted to kind of escape the freelance grind a little bit and work on something and be really, really focused that combined both art and food. And that's kind of how I started thinking about Off Limit. That's so interesting. What a cool story and experience to go all over the world doing that. It's so out of the box, I guess you would say.
• 4:23
  What makes Off Limits different to other cereal brands that you can find in the supermarket?
• 4:30
  Well, the whole team is creative. So I think for business in general, I am really pushing to champion a lot more creative founders. Having been in art classes, design school, everything, my whole career, all they do even in college is teach you how to work for other people. But if you're in business school, you're taught how to be financially independent. You're taught how to understand what's happening in the market and like find the gap in the market.
• 4:55
  And that is kind of the difference between the two. Like, I really want to empower more creative entrepreneurs to not work for other people and start their own thing. So that was a lot of the motivation behind everything as well.
• 5:11
  Hmm. Something that I noticed when I was going through your brand and going through the website was that it really felt like a cereal brand almost just for adults versus a cereal brand typically that's designed for young kids. And that came through in like the flavors, having something that was for chill with adaptogens and something that was for sort of upbeat with coffee and things like that. How did you come up with those recipes and what was that inspiration like? Yeah.
• 5:39
  Yeah, it's funny. It was kind of unintentional with the adult placement. When we started kind of getting that feedback, I was like, oh, because we have coffee in our cereal. Like, of course, like that flavor isn't for kids. But I really hope that Off Limits and the characters can be role models for kids. So new flavors we're coming out with, new characters we're coming out with, everything is kid-friendly.
• 6:01
  Even adaptogens are okay for kids. I would just say, you know, coffee, which Dash is kind of like the early bird work hustle character, but also deals with social anxiety or like just anxiety in general because of the pressure to succeed. She needs a cereal that can keep her up and like going and inspired and working. So all of her flavors will be caffeinated essentially. So I would say maybe that's the only character that isn't kid friendly, but moving forward, all of them will be.
• 6:31
  But the inspiration for the characters is the kind of extreme personalities that creative people have. Sometimes individually, sometimes like in a day, you can go through all of these different emotional cycles. But each of the characters...
• 6:47
  inspire the flavor. And that's how we came on that. For anyone listening, do you want to go a little bit deeper into the mascot or the characters that you're bringing to life and how that relates to other cereal brands? Because cereal brands have characters, right? Yeah. So some cereal brands have characters. I think a lot of the motivation for Off Limits 2 was just that it wasn't fair that we had to choose between Kellogg's or Kashi. And
• 7:14
  Kellogg's and all those brands are fun. They're delicious cereals. They have really fun characters, colors, stories, things like that. And it's what we grew up with. So there's also that added nostalgia to it. But then the only other option, if you want to be healthy, is no characters, no colors.
• 7:31
  No, like anything fun and like the flavor is not there. You kind of feel like you're eating something healthy. The brand is actually called Off Limits because sugary cereals were off limits to me growing up. I mean, for a variety of reasons, that's why it's called Off Limits. But that was one that like was the original tie.
• 7:49
  So honestly, like I selfishly am creating this because I never got to enjoy all the fun characters and flavors growing up while still having a healthy cereal that my mom would approve of. So that's exactly where I hope to sit. Like I want to just have a better panel and like be a step up than some of the nostalgic brands that we grew up with. And then from a storytelling perspective, I feel like
• 8:14
  These are mega brands. I mean, Honey Bunches of Oats alone does like 500 million in sales. So having these platforms that are just not being used in any kind of social impact driven way, especially when you have something character driven that relates to young people, you have this insane opportunity and honestly, a responsibility to be championing important conversations. And it's been decades, none of these brands are doing that. So
• 8:42
  I was like, okay, cool. We're going to have the first female serial mascot, which is Dash. And honestly, we were building the characters and didn't even realize Dash was the only female mascot until halfway through. So that was really important for us. And each of these characters have something very modern and intentional about them to start conversations.
• 9:03
  That's so interesting. I didn't realize that there wasn't any other female characters in serial. That's crazy and so bizarre.
• 9:12
  Yeah. You know, there's like Barbie cereal or Powerpuff Girls cereal, but there is no female cereal mascot from a major brand that has come out, which is so wild. So wild. Yeah. Yeah. Seems really like simple and like, oh, cereal mascots like don't have a gender, whatever, blah, blah, blah. But it does like it subconsciously means something to own a gender, to start the conversation about these important issues that like brands typically don't want to tackle.
• 9:40
  Another reason why we're called off limits. Totally. That's so interesting. So how do you start a serial brand? What does one do? What are the key steps to getting started? Oh, man. Well, don't launch in 2020 is probably good advice.
• 9:59
  Um, I had been developing the brand for about a year and a half. I mean, you have to start with some kind of flavor development, like just a true understanding of flavor, how cereal is made. Um, there's a reason why you don't see a lot of cereal startups, but then you see like 500 beauty brands, 500 beverage brands, like
• 10:17
  Cereal is really difficult and the minimum order quantities for even starting are really capital intensive. So it's a commitment and it definitely requires being fully invested in the space and long term growth because this is not like a short term gains kind of product to create because you really start seeing profitability down the line when it comes to bulk ingredients and things like that.
• 10:41
  And we also choose to use like a lot of organic ingredients, plant-based ingredients. We work with Intelligentsia Coffee on Dash cereal. So like really good quality beans and like smaller suppliers whenever possible. I'm looking into upcycled ingredients and like all of these different other sustainability efforts that we can be not only challenging ourselves to implement, but the cereal industry at scale too. So that's what I'm really excited about for the next six months.
• 11:10
  Mm, that's so interesting. Are you able to share a little bit about the kind of capital you needed to get started or the kind of minimum orders you needed and how you went about financing the brand in the very beginning?
• 11:24
  Yeah. So, I mean, I don't come from money. My family was able to help out a little bit. I had saved money, not a lot. I had to raise like that was literally the only option to get this brand off of the ground. And I didn't go to business school. I had literally been writing a cookbook for the past three years before that. So, yeah.
• 11:43
  My financial literacy was like of an art student. And I just read, I read a lot of books. I talked to tons of other founders and I spent about a year just educating myself in the space. And it's really hard for me to ask for money. And that's kind of a hump that you have to just get over. And once I really started asking my network, I would get introduced to one venture fund, which was maybe like series A, like way later stage for us.
• 12:12
  But then they would really like what we're doing. So they introduced us to early stage funds. And it just like I've only taken warm intros because I feel like that's the best way to really get an authentic shot at like working with these people. So it's been a really interesting, very, very draining, very difficult process, especially as a female founder.
• 12:35
  the statistics are real. Like the bias is real, whether people want to admit it or not. Of course, there's tons of success stories, but it's really difficult. So prepare yourself for that. Be okay with rejection. It's not a big deal. None of this stuff is personal at all. And never feel like you
• 12:55
  I always like walking into these meetings on the same level as anyone in there. Like we have something valuable, like we're a brand that's going to be worth a lot of money and they have capital that they need to deploy. So there's a mutual relationship. It should never feel like one person has the up over the other person. Totally. And I really like that thing you said there a moment ago about getting warm intro leads versus just the cold email approach. So it just makes everything that little bit simpler.
• 13:26
  Which is really hard too. And that is exactly why the statistics are not in the favor of female founders, especially of BIPOC founders and
• 13:37
  And that's why you need to kind of get over asking for money because there is one person in your network who probably has experience with this or knows some investor or has started a business before and can help you out in that. Those are the things that you should not be afraid to like not warm intro and just go for because a lot of founders know how hard it is and will be happy to help. Totally. Totally.
• 14:03
  I want to switch gears and talk about the marketing side of things. I know you mentioned, obviously, it's been hard that you launched during 2020. It's been a shit year for everyone. But what was your go-to-market strategy and how did you start finding your initial customers and fans of the brand?
• 14:20
  It was really hard. Pre-COVID, we had a pre-launch cereal tasting event at Shepard Ferry's Subliminal Gallery in L.A. Shepard Ferry and his studio number one team created the cereal mascots, all from like kind of prior relationships. And they were really excited about what we were building and wanted to kind of take on the identity of these like wild personalities that we had been developing. Yeah.
• 14:44
  So we had this art show where we got about 25 different artists to submit work and all the proceeds went to support school art programs. So while people were trying the cereal and like hanging out, they got to kind of shop this art for social impact.
• 14:59
  And we still are having tons of art initiatives in that way. So starting in April, I believe we're donating a portion of the proceeds of each box to support school art programs because the goal was that we would continue having gallery events and that's what would fund it. But obviously the world is very different.
• 15:16
  And for that event, the gallery, I mean, I have to just, you know, give it to the gallery, like Subliminal is pretty iconic in L.A. And also with us launching and no one had tried the cereal, we were doing some hype in our network. We ended up getting like a thousand person wait list, which was amazing. Yeah.
• 15:32
  And from my Breakfast Club series, from the book, from other projects I've done, we had a really substantial email list that we were launching already. So that was very helpful. But everything, just kept getting pushed back after that. So it became more and more complicated to navigate how to launch a brand during a time when we should not be peddling a product. And that's exactly how we all felt, especially during the BLM protests. Like,
• 15:57
  We had like protest stations set up and we were handing out sunscreen and water and we had mini cereal boxes that we hadn't activated in any way yet. And we were just kind of feeding people with everything that we had available. And yeah.
• 16:10
  Then we launched in July to pretty defiant press. I think we wanted to have a real conversation and not just be another brand that is launching. It's a really hard year for everyone. So I think a lot of our tone was like, brands that exist currently in this space are not taking it upon themselves to be responsible or at least like extremely visibly responsible in the way that they are communicating to younger generations. So we'll happily take their place
• 16:40
  and hopefully are setting ourselves up to be one of the next legacy brands. Like we get to choose that. So I want to be supporting brands like Starface, like brands who are actively destigmatizing acne and like making it just so fun and bright. And honestly, I kind of wait until I get a pimple now so that I can put my star sticker on it. And that's insane. Like that's the kind of voice and vibe that we want to bring to the cereal space. Mm, yeah, I really love that.
• 17:09
  Yeah, like it's honestly just been we've tried three million things like you just have to be ready to pivot so many times. Sometimes people will get it right, right out the bat. But like we have a lot of education. It's like our characters. There's a lot going on. We were telling a lot of stories. So really, I think if I could do it over, if I have advice for everyone, it would be to just focus on one story. Yeah.
• 17:32
  go super hard with it, but that's just, it's not really in my nature. Want to try all the things. I totally get that. Yeah. What have you found that's been your biggest driver for growth so far? What's really working for you guys in finding the people who love the brand?
• 17:49
  Um, our mini boxes are great. I mean, we hand packed our mini boxes. So it was really a test. And we had hundreds of retailers reach out to us during COVID, like this was fall, to have these mini boxes. Like I think the single serve sealed aspect of them made it really approachable and obviously great for any kind of
• 18:09
  bodega style provisions type setups that restaurants were having to shift into grocery stores doing delivery like that kind of thing so that's been really successful for us and we plan to do a lot more in that space.
• 18:21
  And honestly, just being real, like our communication, I think we've gotten a lot of really good responses from our email marketing because we kind of are just being silly about it. And I mean, our characters do our customer service. So if you email us with a problem, it's like immediately decused because like Dash or Zombie will respond to you. Oh, I love that. Yeah, it's fun. And like, I mean, Zombie will literally respond. And it's so funny because Zombie is like the lazy, chill character.
• 18:51
  Sometimes he doesn't say the right things. And then Dash will have to follow up and be like, I'm so sorry. Oh my God, I love that. I'm going to email your customer service. Yeah. And like, we just get a lot of DMs. Like people are DMing the characters. It's cool. So that part has been really fun. That's so cool. I love that.
• 19:11
  You mentioned earlier you worked with Shepard Fairey on creating the characters. And for anyone who doesn't know, Shepard Fairey is a high profile artist. He's also a founder. Are you able to give some insight on how a partnership like that comes about and what kind of cost founders are looking at to work with a studio like their studio?
• 19:32
  I mean, I highly suggest Studio No. 1. That's kind of his creative agency. They are just really rebellious and fun, but just have this very keen understanding of design. So it's not just like street art vibe. It's like very, very polished, beautiful stuff, but with that kind of edge to it. So that's why they felt like such a good fit to work with for the characters.
• 19:56
  Um, honestly, that came about in a super organic way as well. Like I go to LA a lot and I would go to the coffee shop across from their studio all the time and they did all the art for the coffee shop. So I would tag them when I posted pictures about it and we just like became friends on Instagram and then started talking about, um, that was like breakfast club days. Like this was way before cereal even happened. We talked about doing this kind of gallery series to support school
• 20:22
  all these kind of other things even before the cereal started. And then I was like, I'm starting a cereal brand. And they were like, that checks out, what can we do? So it's just been this really amazing relationship. I've known the team there for three years now. And then Pentagram was really similar, which is insane that we get to work with Pentagram at a rate we can actually afford as a startup.
• 20:47
  the partner Astrid Stavro at the UK office designed my cookbook and we just stayed in touch. And that was a fighting thing. I mean, they selected her and they work with Pentagram a lot on their books. And Astrid and I just got along really well. And now she's an advisor. And I told her about the cereal project and she was like, I have to do this. So everything just came really organically. And because I knew I wasn't coming in with like,
• 21:13
  a ton of financial background or like a team with a crazy financial background, business background, I had to like really, really show up when it came to the marketing, the design, everything. So I was walking into these investor meetings with like some of the most elite creative agencies and artists on the planet. And it's funny because even that didn't get us where we needed to go. It was really crazy. So raising...
• 21:36
  has been painful, but thankfully I love everyone on our cap table now. So it was all worth it. That's super important. Super important. So where is the business today and what does the future look like for you guys over say the next 12 months?
• 21:54
  So we are kind of at this place where because of MOQs, we couldn't produce that much cereal to start with. So we have been just kind of like testing flavors, learning, listening. And in April, May-ish, like I haven't announced this yet, but we're launching two new flavors, two new characters who are maybe even more insane.
• 22:15
  And then kind of like some fun updates to the current characters and flavors. But I can't really talk about them yet, but it's going to be really fun. We'll probably make this announcement soon so you can be the first to hear about it. So we've had a partnership with Network, the Streetwear Drop app. And we launched our first collaborated cereal toy with Tom Studio, which is a UK-based streetwear brand. And we made these really cool upcycled basketball bags.
• 22:43
  and drop them on network exclusively. They sold out in five minutes. It was insane. I couldn't believe it. And we were so excited. So now we're like trying to do all of this other fun stuff. And the next thing we're doing, I believe it'll launch on March 9th on network is a custom art box. So it's going to be a limited edition signed off limits zombie box that's fully redesigned by a really iconic street artist.
• 23:10
  and contemporary artists. So we're kind of working on this whole artist series. We have just like really fun collaborations coming up in the next few months. And then over the next six months or so, yeah, focus on flavor, focus on more collaborative things and hopefully showing up in more premium retail locations with our minis.
• 23:31
  Oh my gosh, I'm so excited. Please come have some setups in London, have some pop-ups here. That would be so fun when the world goes back to normal. Oh my gosh, that all sounds so exciting. Congrats. How cool. What advice do you have for women who have a big idea and want to start their own business?
• 23:54
  Um, this question is always so hard because I feel like it's so personalized to what people's current situation are or is, but my advice is just to go for it. Like if you're unhappy with what you're doing or you have this idea, other people will probably feel the same way and want it too. So I think the best advice I have is to start with one product and like stay really focused, make sure you like very much understand what you're doing and
• 24:20
  truly like do not get distracted by glossy brands or things that seem really successful and cool and amazing. And like, Oh, this brand is getting so much press, like blah, blah, blah. This isn't happening to me. Why? Like, no, like,
• 24:35
  Once you get into it and you start talking to other founders, it's all kind of smoke and mirrors. I mean, even for me, it was really surprising. I knew there was stuff going on behind the scenes, but people just are too afraid to kind of talk about it. And visibly from a business perspective, a lot of people are afraid to talk about the hard times as well. But things are really hard, especially after last year's.
• 24:57
  It's just like social media. It's like influencers. There's some magic to it. And you have to just kind of go into it understanding that. And then you're good. Because I mean, it's incredible. I would highly suggest starting your own thing. But just don't compare yourself. Because that's like comparing yourself to a photo of Kendall Jenner. If you just see what everything is face value. Totally. It's almost like switching it off. Like being able to like leave it there. Keep going. Focus on your own thing. Focus on what you're doing.
• 25:27
  Exactly. Amazing. We are up to the six quick questions part of the episode. I ask every woman on the show the same questions. Question number one is what's your why? Why do you do what you do?
• 25:42
  I didn't have anybody to look up to in this space growing up. Like there were not a lot of creative founders. And like I said, going to art school, I feel like I was told constantly that I needed to be working for somebody else. So, I mean, I'm doing this for myself. Like I want to prove that you can do this and be successful without having an MBA.
• 26:03
  Love that. And so important that, you know, there are role models who have followed a different path versus the cookie cutter, go to business school, launch a startup. Exactly. Question number two is what's been the number one marketing moment that's made your business pop? Yeah.
• 26:20
  So I don't know if this was the number one thing. I've probably talked about a few of them already. But one of the most quick turnaround and like fun ones that we did was, I mean, I spend way too much time on TikTok. So when NYU students were coming back to school, there was like this whole issue with their quarantine because they all had to quarantine in the dorms for like two weeks. And NYU completely messed up their food schedule.
• 26:45
  Like these kids were like posting TikToks of their vegan meal that had like steak on it. And they would get their entire meals for the day at like 6pm. Like it was just so, so dysfunctional. And it became this thing on TikTok. Yeah.
• 27:01
  I don't know how I got on that side of TikTok, but I was just like, oh my God, these kids are like in it right now. So literally within 24 hours, we made these snack packs of cereal and toys and everything. And our social media manager somehow got on the group chat for all of the NYU students who were coming in because she just started like DMing people. And she really like did some stealth investigating there. So this was all her.
• 27:28
  Um, the team is really small. We're just three people and we like spent three hours in Washington Square Park packing up bags and then going to each of the dorms, like delivering them individually to all the kids. Obviously, like guards took them up like it was really like COVID safe, but it was just so funny that we ended up doing that. So then all the kids started posting about off limits and it was good. Oh my God, that is so cool. I love that kind of stuff. So grassroots, epic marketing. Yeah.
• 27:56
  Question number three is where do you hang out to get smarter? What are you reading or listening to that everyone else should know about? Yeah.
• 28:07
  I'm trying to think. Like I am trying to navigate Discord and like be part of different Discord communities now because I feel like there's a lot of interesting things happening there. I have like a text group with other female founders and I feel like that's extremely helpful. Like I prefer a lot more individual connection, but also Offlimits is part of Science Inc. They're our lead investors and we're part of their incubator as well. So like we work a lot with their incubator and like,
• 28:37
  the other science brands. Like they have Liquid Death and Liquid Death Water has like a really similar trajectory to us as far as just being insane in their marketing and branding and everything. So they've been really helpful.
• 28:51
  Other founders, I think is my number one resource. I think if you're starting out, it definitely is worth reaching out to some of your favorites. And even if you can't get ahold of the founder, just like people on the team to pick their brain or listening to podcasts like yours. I did so much of that when I was learning, reading books on raising money, all of that kind of stuff. And then I think my favorite book is The War of Art by Steven Pressfield, which is kind of like,
• 29:20
  motivate yourself stop blaming it on you being like a tortured artist and all of this like artists are good because they're consistent and they work hard for it so it's kind of just a reminder when you get in those like little depressive phases to just like get it together and be consistent amazing I'm gonna link that in the show notes for anyone listening who wants to check it out
• 29:43
  Question number four is how do you win the day? What are your AM or PM rituals that keep you feeling happy and motivated and successful? Coffee is 100%. Like to the point where I look forward to it and that's the only thing that gets me out of bed.
• 30:02
  It would be a lie if I said I get up early every morning and like do my morning routine and all of that kind of stuff. I feel really good when I do those things. But to be realistic about it, it wavers all the time. And it's like a constant challenge for me because it's like, OK, I know when I get up at 6 a.m. or I do like X, Y and Z things, I'm going to have a good day and I feel better. But then for some reason, still completely reject that and go on TikTok for two hours.
• 30:28
  So being really normal and like kind to myself, I think has been more what I try and do daily than the actual physical things that make me feel better. I really feel that one. I'm like so guilty of that. And yeah, can take a self beating for it for sure. Lol. Question number five is if you only had a thousand dollars left in the business bank account, where would you spend it?
• 30:56
  Probably on a collaboration. Nice. Because I think that would introduce us to a new audience. It would allow us to do something unique and maybe like charge a little bit more for it. And then I would take the extra and like continue that process. But that's just where my brain goes immediately. I might not be. Love that though.
• 31:21
  I'm going to digress for a second before I ask you the last question. When you're doing these kinds of collaborations that you were speaking about, how do you go about it? Is it just a cold outreach or are you kind of leveraging your network? What's the kind of go-to for collabs?
• 31:36
  Um, it's a combination. I mean, I have this dream collaboration list in my phone that I just kind of look at all the time. And like, whenever I'm talking to people, I'm like, Oh, yeah, we would be perfect to like work with for this thing. Like my obsession right now is mischief. And like, I've been obsessed with them from day one. And I think our brands match really well. So every time I talk to someone, I'm like, Oh, mischief, oh, mischief. And then it ends up happening eventually.
• 32:00
  So I think telling yourself and like keeping a few really strong, ideal people in mind is important because like when you put it out there enough, like it's going to come back at some point.
• 32:11
  And I guess like as far as maneuvering contracts and stuff, it's difficult. Like you're dealing with artists, you're dealing with brands, you're dealing with all these different kind of creative types of collaborations. And my best advice would be to truly understand who you're talking to and like what's in it for them. It's like when I did my Breakfast Club series, I had written about chefs, restaurants, everything for so long that like I really understood the industry and I understood the culture.
• 32:35
  difficulties of running a restaurant and being a chef. So I knew how to reach out respectfully and like come up with like an ask that was reasonable. And I think that is where a lot of people miss is, you know, when influencer culture really started to take off, all these people would just blindly be reaching out for free meals, but not really demonstrating what their true value is to people. So it really upset a lot of chefs the way that people would reach out. And obviously, it's the same for artists. It's the same for anything like
• 33:03
  understand who you're reaching out to and why it's actually a collaboration and not just good for you. Totally. That's so true. Great piece of advice there. And last question, question number six is how do you deal with failure? What's your mindset and approach to it?
• 33:21
  Embrace it. Like, it's not always easy. Like, don't get me wrong. But man, like hundreds of rejection emails to the point where I wanted to post all of my rejection emails to like Forbes or something and say like what it's really like to start a business. And out of those hundreds, like one or two people might invest and you still might not be done after that. So that is more of the realistic view of rejection as a founder.
• 33:50
  And yeah, there was one email that like really hit hard to the point where it was just like weirdly insulting, like unnecessarily insulting. So we were about to do the gallery show and I like mocked up a piece of art based on the words of it. So I basically like used art as therapy to work through it.
• 34:09
  Some of the ridiculous things that people say to you. But with Breakfast Club, with everything I've done, especially freelancing, I mean, you reach out to a million people. It took me a year to start the first Breakfast Club event because so many chefs and restaurants said no because they couldn't understand or see the value in it. And then once one person said yes, it led to like 40 events. Wow. Wow.
• 34:30
  Just got to keep on that grind. Keep on hustling. Yeah. I heard something recently about, um, it was this guy who works in sales and he was talking about in his day, you know, when he's doing the cold calling, selling, whatever it is, I don't know what it was. Um, instead of like, you know, having that goal for how many yeses he's going to get, his goal was how many no's can I get? So he would be like, my goal is like 50 no's. And then, you know, you're not like suffering every day because you're hitting the goal. You're getting that no. And you're like,
• 35:00
  yeah I thought that was kind of cool I think it like failure needs to be normalized like that's the only way that you learn like I don't trust anyone who gets it right the first time because then when something does go wrong which of course it will the stakes are going to be so much higher you might not know how to handle it it's get it over with like just learn that it's part of life and that's how you're gonna be better in every possible way
• 35:26
  Amen. Emily, thank you so much for taking the time to be on the podcast today and for sharing your story and your really, really cool company. I just love it so much. And I'm going to be staying tuned for your really cool collabs coming out soon. Thank you. Yeah, it was so nice chatting with you. Thanks for having me.
• 35:48
  Hey, it's June here. Thanks for listening to this amazing episode of the Female Startup Club podcast. If you're a fan of the show and want even more of the good stuff, I'd recommend checking out femalestartupclub.com where you can subscribe to our free newsletter. We send it out weekly covering female founder business news, insights and learnings in D2C, and interesting business resources.
• 36:13
  And if you're a founder building an e-commerce brand, you can join our private network of entrepreneurs called Hype Club at femalestartupclub.com forward slash Hype Club. We have guests from the show joining us for intimate Ask Me Anythings, expert workshops, and a group of totally amazing, like-minded women building the future of D2C brands.
• 36:35
  As always, please do subscribe, rate and review the show and post your favorite episodes to Instagram stories. I am beyond grateful when you do that. Thank you.
• 36:52
  Hey, it's June here. Thanks for listening to this amazing episode of the Female Startup Club podcast. If you're a fan of the show and want even more of the good stuff, I'd recommend checking out femalestartupclub.com where you can subscribe to our free newsletter. We send it out weekly covering female founder business news, insights and learnings in D2C, and interesting business resources.
• 37:16
  And if you're a founder building an e-commerce brand, you can join our private network of entrepreneurs called Hype Club at femalestartupclub.com forward slash Hype Club. We have guests from the show joining us for intimate Ask Me Anythings, expert workshops, and a group of totally amazing, like-minded women building the future of D2C brands.
• 37:39
  As always, please do subscribe, rate and review the show and post your favorite episodes to Instagram stories. I am beyond grateful when you do that.