Latest / The Elevator Careers Podcast / Working with Phoenix Modular Elevator | Chuck Tyler, Part 2

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Working with Phoenix Modular Elevator | Chuck Tyler, Part 2 · The Elevator Careers Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Uh my pitch to the industry is um, you know, again, there's more than one way to skin a cat.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, I'm not asking, I'm not asking for for everybody to look at modular as the only way to go.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_01: Um I'm just looking for opportunities to introduce the product and and to share the benefits, um, to talk about the product.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, we're here if we can support you and your uh in your business.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: Hello, and welcome to the Elevator Careers Podcast, sponsored by the Allred Group.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_00: I am your host, Matt Allred.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_00: In this podcast, we talk to the people whose lives and careers are dedicated to the vertical transportation industry, to inform and share lessons learned, building upon the foundation of those who have gone before to inspire the next generation of elevator careers.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: This is part two.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_00: Today we are talking about Phoenix Modular Elevator with Chuck Tyler, Director of Operations and Business Development.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: Phoenix Modular has been in business for 15 years and primarily serves North America.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_00: They are growing rapidly in an innovative side of the industry.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_00: Phoenix Modular is able to pre-manufacture and ship their product, cutting down site impact and installation by 75%.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_00: They have an innovative product and approach that is driving healthy growth and industry change.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_00: Chuck, welcome to the show.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_01: Good to see you again, Matt.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: Likewise, likewise.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, we we said at the end of the last episode that we're gonna talk a little bit more about Phoenix Modular and your experience there now.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: And and it looks like you're standing right there in the shop.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_00: But I guess before we jump into the shop, how did you how did you get, I guess, affiliated with with Phoenix?
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I'll just tell a quick story.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: So um I mentioned before I, you know, worked my way through uh helperhood and through corporate America and kind of got up to the top of uh you know construction, running the construction department for Tyson, and um it took a toll on the life, traveling and so on and so forth.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_01: And um uh I went through a divorce and took an opportunity to to leave and and and do something different.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I I went to work for an independent elevator company and just had a great time.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_01: It was uh it was an amazing experience, you know, the entrepreneurial, really getting back down in the weeds again, getting back to my passion.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_01: And I was having such a great time.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_01: Then COVID hit.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and when COVID hit, the owner of that company decided it was a good time to sell.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_01: And um so that happened, and and I I was looking for an opportunity, and I didn't want to go back to working for a major again, the same old thing.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: So I had a great opportunity to go to work for Vantage, um, um, working on freight doors, mostly in New York City.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_01: I think you and I met around that time.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I really liked working on the vendor side.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: I I got to get involved in the NAEC and and and I talked about earlier, my networking exploded.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: Now I didn't just know the people at Tyson, I knew people all throughout the industry, which you know really is a nice thing when you need to go look for an opportunity out there.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_01: So um Vantage was chucking along, everything was going just fine, but it just again wasn't exactly what I wanted.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: And um, I have a friend of mine that introduced me to the owner of um of Phoenix Modular, Allison, and her and I got uh the opportunity to sit down and talk.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, they this she's an amazing lady who bought Phoenix Modular 15 years ago out of bankruptcy.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_01: It was originally infinite access, started back in the 90s.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_01: So Allison comes from a background, not not an elevator background, she's a MBA and she comes from Alcoa.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um has done a heck of a job building the company.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but when I when her and I got talking, it she felt like it was a really good time to bring somebody in with some elevator experience.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so here I am.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_01: And uh now I'm now I'm in the uh world of modular elevators, building them, laying on their side and um, you know, looking at the business from a different perspective, a different point of view.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, tell tell us a little bit about modular elevators.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if all of our listeners even know what that is or uh or how that you know how those work, but uh I I found several people that are uh in my conversations that are like, what what what is that?
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_00: You know, can you answer that question?
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so at Phoenix Modular Elevator, we uh we build a shaft.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um you can see them behind me here.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: Uh we build a shaft out of four by four tube steel, and um in that shaft is uh it's it's built for the size of the elevator.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um once it gets built, the shaft gets built, we move it down and the shaft gets the we we install the rails in the shaft.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then the the hoist wig gets drywalled both inside and outside.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_01: So um it's a completed hoistway with rails.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then we move it down to the next section where we go through a LEC mech, which is our electrical and mechanical section, and there we put all of the uh electrical piping, wiring, um, switches, um pit lights, um, lights up the hoistway, all the wiring and fixtures.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then from there it moves into the um finishing station.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we have a separate area where the cabs are built.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_01: Cabs are built upright, standard, um, you know, built on the car sling, um, completely finished, doors hung, operators set up, and then that cab is laid down and stabbed into the hoistway.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um, if it's a single section hoistway, um, it ships as one unit.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um, if it's a multi-section, which we do up to three uh three separate sections.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: You're saying stack them.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_00: So so I'm I'm that's what I'm hearing, correct?
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: You stack them on top of each other.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_00: So how high can you go then total?
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: So with a typical typically with a single unit, you're kind of the what limits you is trucking, right?
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um, how how long of a truck you can get.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: So standard is around 54 feet.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_01: You can get a truck that'll take a 54 footer without doing anything special, flagging, or anything like that.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_01: So our braking point is around that 50 foot overall hoist weight.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: So that's including the pit and the overhead.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so does that anything three, four stop?
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_00: What is that?
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, yeah, you can get up to a you can get a short three-stop in a single section.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you figure, figure your overhead's gonna be 13 feet, your your your pit's gonna be four feet, and then you know your travel between there.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: So um, you know, it gives you you can get you can get 20 something feet.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_01: So you can get a couple stops in there without any problem uh and get a three-stop.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: And then you can stack three of those.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: So so nine stories.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_01: So we've done uh the biggest job that we've done is um UCSD, which is uh four nine-stop traction cars, um, about 125 foot of travel.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_01: So um though those those were three, three step, three separate towers stacked together.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um there was four of them.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: Uh it became a two across from two and a parking garage.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_01: And um the project was basically when we were setting the units, they were uh they were pouring concrete on the top parking garage floor.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_01: Um, they were able to open it with traditional elevators, you know, when they were able to give the hoist ways, it just wouldn't have been possible for them to be able to complete it.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_01: So um the modular solution really helped them in that in that regard.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_01: These actually went inside the core of the building, they're not on the exterior.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_00: Gotcha.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_00: What's what's the advantage to modular?
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, obviously you're you're building them beforehand, you're in a controlled environment, you're you're uh kind of queuing everything up, drop it in with a crane.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_00: What are what are some of the biggest advantages to this type of construction?
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_01: So uh first off, I'll say that modular um elevators is not a one size fits all.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's not going to replace um any elevator in any situation.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's but but it but it when it fits the application, it's a really great option.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_01: And and I look at it from a lot of different perspectives.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_01: So when we look at the installation piece of it, um we talked about that fear of that the the lack of fear of heights, and you know, um unfortunately in this industry, there's a lot of falls.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um and and in our system, the rails are never carried over their head, there's no hoisting.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_01: Our our hoistways, our our elevators are built laying on their sides.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we have a rotator, so the the hoistway is actually rotated so that you carry the rails in, you never have to carry them, lift them over, you carry them in and set them onto the brackets.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_00: You don't have to hook them to the ceiling, essentially.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_01: No, no.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_01: So we again we we can spin the shaft so that the drywall can be done.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_01: Nobody ever has to stand on top of the shaft, under the shaft.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: You can do it at a regular working height.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um, same thing with the door frames.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: There's, you know, when you're installing the door frames, there's no no fear of dropping something down the shaft.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um so so so the safety mechanism of of of just being able to not have that those same challenges.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we also have a very controlled space, so we don't have to worry about somebody working above us uh or working below us.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_01: We we control our, you know, we we're in a factory environment, so we have a controlled workspace.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_01: We also have quality controls that that I really think are fantastic because we don't have to go out there once a week to look at the job to check how the how the installation's going, or or or even once every couple of days.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_01: We come out and walk the floor for quality daily, all day long.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_01: We have a quality person on the floor checking as we go, double checking, triple checking, making sure that the tolerances that we have are are held.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_01: So quality is a huge piece of it.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: So we have safety, we have quality, and then we have the job site aspect.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_01: And and in a lot of situations, if the job site's tight, or if there's a time constraint or um a weather constraint, we can eliminate those issues by uh prefabbing the elevator in our factory, wrapping it, securing it, shipping it to the job site, and hoistening into the into into place um you know within a matter of an hour or so.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um now, once it's hoisted in place, obviously you still have to go in and do your final adjusting and so on and so forth, right?
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_01: But but that that installation time is reduced down from you know a couple of weeks to a couple of days because we're able to accomplish a majority of the installation um, you know, in our controlled environment.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and and you said that uh obviously it's not gonna, you know, replace every kind of elevator.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's there's still gonna be traditional elevators being built.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: What would you say are some of the areas, some of the um applications that would be most likely to say, hey, that would work for us.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: That's that's a good solution.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: So uh two and three and four-stop hydras are are are really where we we excel, I think.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_01: It's uh, you know, an addition situation where they're adding an elevator on.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: Again, uh a fantastic situation.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_01: Um where space is a re where space can be an issue.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: We have you know, we can help with that solution by adding the elevator.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so so it really truly is a site-by-site look at it.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but our elevator will fit in any building, again, with limitations with travel and so on.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_01: We're not going to go and put one of these in in a high-rise building in downtown Manhattan.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't make sense, right?
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but in most applications and and in lower rise buildings, 10 floors and under, we can provide a solution that in many cases um can aid the job and the schedule of the project.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_00: Well, and you talked about the the difference between having an elevator up and running in say a day versus a few weeks.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: And uh it feels like you have a lot more flexibility maybe with with schedules, with you know, if you're dealing with GCs and and other contractors, you kind of got a an opportunity to to build it, drop it in, get out of the way.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I could see some advantages, some big advantages in there.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_01: And then that's the that's the whole key to it, is is when you know, when you take an elevator and you deliver it to the job site, and it takes up a lot of um real estate on the project, right?
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_01: Even a two-stop, three-stop hell elevator will take up, you know, a 40 by 40 um space on the job site.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: And in many cases, there's not 40 by 40 space to store all this equipment.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_01: Whereas when my elevator comes, we set it in, all the elevator equipment's already in the hoistway, right?
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: So you're not taking up that valuable space that's needed for all the other trades to be able to complete their work.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um and in many cases, you know, the elevator is one of the one of the things that holds up the turnover of the elevat of the project because things got to get finished so that the all the other finishes, you know, can kind of follow along.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that's where you know we can provide a benefit is you know, we set the elevator and and essentially once the fire alarm wires are there and um and all the power's hooked up, it's just a matter of coming in and hooking that stuff up, making a few adjustments, and and we're ready to rock and roll.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_00: It almost sounds like plug and play, right?
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_00: To to borrow that.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_01: Plug and play.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: We're not quite there, but we're working towards it every day, yes, sir.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, compared to uh, I guess a a longer you know time to build it, it it's uh certainly a a difference.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um what what what would you say about the uh the potential?
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it it feels like this is not not new, but maybe hasn't really hit mainstream like it uh like it could.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, do you do you see much potential or do you feel like hey, we've kind of you know maxed out with with what we're doing?
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_01: No, I believe that there's a uh I believe there's a a huge opportunity for us to grow, um to grow our customer base, to to let it be known more what we do.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, that's part of the part of my challenge here at Phoenix is uh you know growing who we are as an organization and um you know getting us out there.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_01: I think people that understand what we do and and and can see the benefit overall.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_01: The problem is if you get a price for a traditional elevator quote and we bid the same job, um, it's not apples to apples, right?
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_01: Because your traditional elevator quote is an elevator that somebody's going to install in that shaft.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_01: I'm providing an elevator that's already installed in a shaft and the shaft it comes with.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_01: So um that's the challenge that I see is educating that you have to factor in the entire cost of the elevator, shaft included, not just the elevator, right?
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's a lot of concrete to to build a shaft, right?
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_00: And if you don't have to worry about building a shaft, I mean, and granted, I guess depending on how the engineers uh, you know, maybe you need the concrete for the shaft to hold up the building.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_00: So you got to take that into account as well, right?
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_01: Well, we have our our system, we we are we can tie into shear walls and stuff like that.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_01: So our elevator can be provided for support, so on moder buildings and so on and so forth.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_01: So there's there's options in that regard for sure.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_01: We do twin posts and ground jacks, uh, we do MRLs.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, we have uh we have a full line of products, and and in most cases, uh again, we're not gonna go into a you know a hundred-story building in Manhattan, but in most cases, you know, 10 floors and under, we can find an application and uh you know if if if schedule, if if if job um compactness and things like that are are an issue, then you know, in a lot of cases we can we can help with that.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: Who who are you say are are some of the early adopters?
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, who are some of the customers that uh maybe it's you know, general contractors or developers are that are looking at this going, hey, I I can, you know, I want more of those.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: So uh a lot of uh a lot of our units ship to California.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um it's a it's the modular industry out there for schools and such has been going on for some time.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, they they they've accepted it and and it's pretty standard in that in that market.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um we've we've you know we've developed some some great relationships with directly with um with general contractors.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um we we we do self-perform.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_01: We have licensed mechanics in uh in 15, 16 states now.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_01: So um in those states we self-perform in the areas that we aren't licensed, we have partners that do our our installations.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um so I'm I might have got off track there.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'm lost my track.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_01: No, no, you're good.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just curious, yeah, who who uh who you see as kind of your primary uh customers or as far as demand.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um because I could I mean I'm yeah, go ahead.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_01: I I think that from my perspective, I think that this product is a is a great thing to have in your sales bag if you're if you're a traditional elevator company, right?
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_01: Because if if somebody wants to add an elevator to the side of a building, I'm a perfect resource.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: And and we will, by the way, happily build a hoist way and ship it without the elevator pre-installed.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: So we do shell um the ModR hoistway without the elevator in it, if uh if it's uh if the application requires that.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I think I'm hearing you say that that if I'm uh uh an independent elevator contractor, and uh, and maybe I don't do a lot of new installation, but but I have an opportunity, I could I could buy it from you, I could buy just the hoist way, I could buy the uh I could buy the uh you know the the whole package and do some installation uh you know that kind of work.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_00: Is that correct?
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, thank you.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_01: That's exactly right.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_01: So we do we we we do have uh marketing literature on just providing the hoist way drywalled, um, and and and and then it the elevator can be installed in the hoist way um, you know, by the traditional elevator company.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: I mean that that sounds like a huge opportunity there because as long I mean I've been you know recruiting in the elevator industry for 12, 13, whatever, 14 years maybe, and and it seems like the you know, new elevators are kind of always the domain of the of the majors, the OEMs at least, that they you know, they manufacture them, they can we could say give it away, right?
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: But they can sell it at a low cost.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: And and if I'm gonna try to buy it and then install it, it's prohibitive.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_00: And yet you've got a product there that uh like I I'm just curious how how competitive would that be if I if uh you know Matt's elevator company here in in Georgia wants to you know install one of those.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_00: Is it competitive compared to the major OEMs?
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_01: So again, I I think that any independent elevator company, material-wise, is gonna always have a hard time competing with the OEMs.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, as you mentioned, uh they they basically they're not looking to make a lot of money on the front end of that job.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_01: They you're looking to get it on service for the long term, and that's their that's their business model.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_01: We are not a our our primary business for the modular side is doesn't involve the service aspect.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_01: So we're not in this business to service the elevator.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_01: So I think where I see a big benefit to the elevator companies is if you're a small independent, mid-size independent company that does service and modernizations, but really you don't dabble in um NI because you don't have the resources.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but you have a customer that needs a two-stop or a three-stop, um, you know, we can provide that to you, ship it out to the ship it out, set it for you, get it all, get it all taken care of.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: You can do the final adjustments, turn it over to your customer, and then convert it to a maintenance contract for the next 20 years.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_01: So I think there's the benefit to to the to the elevator companies.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, and again, um, you know, maybe the maybe not every company is gonna go that route, but for for those companies that aren't looking to keep a construction department busy, but have customers that require the the product, you know, that we're we're certainly here for them.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: Uh we work a lot, we work a lot with general contractors directly.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I'll be a hundred percent honest with you.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_01: Some of the big guys don't have the greatest reputations on how they work with uh, you know, the change orders and some of the things that uh that that happen in the in in the process of the job.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_01: So we've uh we've had some really good luck in developing those relationships and and and working directly with the general contractors, um, you know, and providing the product.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_01: So I think there's multiple different um opportunities to to to sell the product.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: So tell me, you you mentioned that you don't do the service.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: Do you partner with somebody or how do you uh I mean, is it just up to the customer who they have serviced their equipment, or you just kind of you don't you don't even get involved there?
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_01: No, no, no.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_01: So we have a network of uh service providers that we've developed over the years.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_01: So when we um when we sell the job, we include the the the NIM just like a traditional elevator company would.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_01: Um and that's we we just um we work with our our partners in in in all of those markets to take the service.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um so that's uh you know that's that's a good benefit for them as well, right?
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_01: Is uh again you're taking the service without the risk of the of the construction losses and such.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's awesome.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: You you talked a little bit about uh change orders and and one one thing I've uh found intriguing is uh people to get bonuses for change orders.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_00: And and you know, I'm not worked in the in the field, right?
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_00: But but my brain starts immediately saying Is that not an incentive to withhold information or not be fully honest about what's going in?
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just I'm just asking the question.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, if if if I'm getting enticed to have somebody have a change order, then I'm also enticed not to maybe give them all the information so they need more change orders.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: Am I making it up?
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_01: So I think we can all I think that's one of those uh those slippery slopes, Matt.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, the change order incentive program I was around when it was developed, it wasn't developed for that purpose.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it was developed because the guys were just going out there and doing it and not worrying about it because it wasn't benefiting them personally.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_01: So we've they figured if they gave them a little incentive to to go look for those change orders, right?
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_01: That they would, you know, they would keep their eyes open for it.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that was a good idea because you shouldn't do things for free.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, however, I do think that you know there's certain individuals that are gonna take advantage of whatever opportunities they may have.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: And and when that happens, you, you know, it can be taken advantage of.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_01: I will tell you that my owner Allison, one of her main business core values is we are not a change order company.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: The price that we give you when we sell the elevator, we're gonna do everything within our power.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_01: We see it as a failure to pull a change order.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_01: So we decentrify ourselves for change orders.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and we take away incentives for change orders.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_01: So if we can't get it right on the front end, then we're not gonna reward our people for having to charge our customers extra at the backside.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um, now that doesn't include, obviously, if they want to change uh, you know, finishes or or you know, sizes or making a glass elevator or something like that.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_01: Those are those are all reasonable, perfectly good change orders, but change orders for reinspections, change orders for mobilizations, change orders for um, you know, thing storage and things like that, we really try not to uh we we try to manage those to a place where um we eliminate them.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it it does feel to me like it would be more um, you know, just just being thorough, right?
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_00: Let's ask all of the pertinence questions.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, again, if somebody wants to change out the you know, the wood paneling or something, well, that's their prerogative.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_00: But but let's do our very best to make sure we've answered every single question, get everything figured out, drop it in, walk away, be done.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_00: Everybody's happy.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_00: Seems like an efficient.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_01: That should be our that should be our goal on every job.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_01: And if you can do that and not have to charge change orders and you can provide a quality product on time, I believe that you can grow your business.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what I'm trying to do at Phoenix Modular Elevator, just exactly that.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_00: So what would you say?
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, is it uh I don't know what would what would you say about this?
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, you know, we talked about an opportunity.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_00: It sounds like it's a uh a huge uh paradigm shift in maybe how things are done, and certainly within a certain, you know, height of of elevators, but what's what's your pitch to the industry?
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_01: Uh my pitch to the industry is um, you know, again, there's more than one way to skin a cat.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, I'm not asking, I'm not asking for for everybody to look at modular as the only way to go.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I'm just looking for opportunities to introduce the product and and to share the benefits, um, to talk about the product.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, we're here if we can support you and your uh in your business.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: Perfect.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: Perfect.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: Chuck, thank you so much for being with me today.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_00: It's uh it's always a pleasure and I appreciate your time.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, Matt, I always love talking to you and uh thank you for the opportunity to uh to chat a little bit and introduce myself and my company.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_01: I appreciate it.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_00: You bet.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: Good luck to you, Zoe.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: Keep building your business.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_00: All right, thank you, sir.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for listening to the Elevator Careers Podcast, sponsored by the Allred Group, a leader in elevator industry recruiting.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_00: Please visit our YouTube channel at Elevator Careers or check us out online at elevatorcareers.net.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_00: Please like and subscribe.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_00: And until next time, stay safe.