Latest / Integrate This! Ed Tech Podcast / Dr. Nadine Ebri: Long-Division Rap, Building an App, and Starting a Ripple Effect

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Dr. Nadine Ebri: Long-Division Rap, Building an App, and Starting a Ripple Effect · Integrate This! Ed Tech Podcast

0:00
Welcome to Integrate This, your go -to EdTech
0:03
podcast where curiosity meets classroom innovation.
0:07
Join your hosts, David Berner and Jeremy Mikla,
0:09
as we explore the rapidly evolving world of educational
0:12
technology. From game -changing tools to insightful
0:15
conversations with today's top EdTech voices,
0:18
we're here to help educators stay informed, inspired,
0:21
and ready to innovate. So tune in, level up,
0:25
and let's integrate this. Hey, welcome back to
0:28
the Integrate This EdTech podcast. I'm David
0:31
Berner, joined by co -host Jeremy Mickla. And
0:33
today we have a special guest with us, Dr. Nadine
0:36
Ebre. Very excited to have Nadine with us. Nadine
0:40
was a Duval Teacher of the Year finalist earlier
0:43
in her career and now is the CEO of Ebre Education
0:47
and also recently is one of 60 Presidential Leadership
0:52
Scholars of 2026. Nadine, we're happy to have
0:57
you here on the podcast. Thank you for having
0:59
me. I'm happy to be here. All right. So if you
1:03
can just give us a little brief introduction
1:06
to who you are, your story, the things that you've
1:09
done so far in your career. Where did you get
1:13
started in education and how did you get to where
1:17
you got to today? Yes, so I never imagined that
1:23
I would ever become a teacher. Actually, that
1:25
was one of the professions that I said I would
1:26
never go into. But when I graduated and I was
1:31
looking at majors, I just felt led to go into
1:33
teaching. I knew there was something there for
1:36
me and I knew I had to do it. Growing up, I wasn't
1:39
the best student. I actually got into a lot of
1:40
trouble. I was always in the dean's office. I
1:42
was best friends with the principal because they
1:44
saw me all the time. I always felt misunderstood
1:48
as a student. And so when I became a teacher,
1:50
I always said that I would become the teacher
1:52
that I never had. And so I never had a teacher
1:55
like me. And so when I went into the classroom,
1:58
instead of having students mold and fit into
2:01
whatever environment that I created, I started
2:03
off the school year by asking them a simple question.
2:06
How do you want to learn? And whatever they said,
2:09
I would sit and I would write down and then I
2:11
would pin it. behind my desk so that I can reference
2:15
it throughout the year. And so however students
2:17
wanted to learn, that's how I taught because
2:19
I believe that the classroom was for them, not
2:21
for me. And I know as educators, it's easy to
2:25
teach the way that we were taught rather than
2:28
asking students a simple question, how do you
2:30
want to learn? And that one question opened so
2:36
many doors for my students and also for myself.
2:40
I didn't realize. a lot about the educational
2:45
system until a lot of my students' videos, we
2:48
started to even, we even started to record some
2:50
videos of their educational process. And as their
2:53
video started to go viral, people were like,
2:56
this is the classroom that I would want my kids
2:58
in. And parents started sending their kids into
3:01
my class. And so I realized, okay, this isn't
3:04
normal. This is very unconventional. And so I
3:06
just believe that we can really rethink what
3:10
education looks like. School can be fun for students.
3:13
students are so creative when they're in kindergarten.
3:15
And I don't believe that that should go away
3:17
by the time that they're in fifth and sixth grade
3:20
when it's like their light continues to dim as
3:23
they get older rather than to shine even brighter.
3:25
And so I just believe that we should really rethink
3:29
how we taught students. And that's what I did
3:31
as an educator. After teaching, I became a technology
3:34
specialist. And so I would I worked for a grant
3:38
called Ultra, which stands for utilizing and
3:40
leveraging technology to re -event accessibility,
3:44
and it's showing teachers how to use the technology
3:47
that they had at their fingertips. Many of them
3:49
didn't know all the cool ways they could use.
3:51
We were in a Microsoft district, all of the Microsoft
3:53
products that they had access to. They also didn't
3:56
know some of the products that they had access
3:58
to. They didn't know that they had access to
4:00
Minecraft education, that it was bundled within
4:02
their Microsoft 365 licenses. So I would show
4:07
them, hey, there's a new way that you can teach
4:10
your kids, and you've had access to this for
4:12
years. And so I would go into the classroom showing
4:15
educators how to do this. And also, I started
4:19
up a Minecraft lab. information officer at that
4:22
time, he had this bright idea. And that's also
4:25
one of the reasons why they brought me in as
4:27
well from the classroom to start up this Minecraft
4:29
lab. And so I would do field trips for students
4:31
all throughout our district, working with the
4:34
students and also working with the teachers,
4:36
showing them how they can use Minecraft to learn
4:38
how to code, learn about cybersecurity, and eventually
4:41
artificial intelligence, how they can learn these
4:43
complex topics in a way that was fun, in a way
4:46
that was innovative, in a way that didn't feel
4:48
intimidating, even when they made the made mistakes
4:52
they didn't really mind. And so I just became
4:54
so intrigued to the point that I even did my
4:56
dissertation focusing on Minecraft and then eventually
4:59
went on to work for the game as their global
5:01
education community manager. And so last year
5:04
I ventured out to focus on every education full
5:07
time. And so I realized there was just a lot
5:10
of changes happening. We started to see a lot
5:12
of competition between tech companies. And even
5:17
though they're winning, educational systems are
5:20
actually losing because it was harder it's it's
5:23
been very hard for educational systems to keep
5:25
up with these rapid advancements with technology
5:28
and they're not done yet like these advancements
5:31
have not stopped even if we put halts on them
5:34
inside our inside of education they're not these
5:38
companies are not stopping. And so I realized
5:41
that we needed some type of middleman to really
5:44
train districts to work with teachers, to work
5:46
with students on not just how to use these tools,
5:50
but how to figure out how to use these tools
5:53
in ways that are ethical and responsible, that
5:58
don't take away the voice in human judgment of
6:02
humans. And so showing them how to use these
6:04
ways. these tools in a way that's effective and
6:07
responsible in a way that just doesn't feel like
6:10
we're speaking to robots. We heard about the
6:15
AI death cycle where you have like the teacher
6:18
who uses AI to create the assignment and then
6:21
student uses AI to do it and then the teacher
6:23
uses AI to grade it. Like I just wanted them
6:25
to get out of this cycle and they needed many
6:28
schools and districts needed somebody to like
6:31
just support them in how to do that. Yeah, and
6:36
as you kind of I mean your your last six years
6:40
or so has been I mean all those different shifts
6:43
right you go and so can you talk a little bit
6:46
about What it what it was like taking that leap
6:49
from did it just happen naturally to go from
6:52
you know You were doing your stuff in the classroom
6:54
You got involved with minecraft education, and
6:58
then you got into in started every education
7:01
so was that like Did that feel natural or was
7:05
it like a little like this is going to take a
7:07
leap. This is something that I, you know, not
7:10
sure how I was going to go. How did you feel
7:12
about that? Yeah. So, man, this I would say it
7:19
felt natural, but it was also scary. It's it's
7:22
always a little scary taking a leap and venturing
7:25
into something into the unknown. But the work.
7:28
or the heart of the work has always been the
7:30
same, like working with educators. And so it
7:33
just went from working with educators in my district
7:35
to working with educators globally. And so it
7:38
was a big jump, but it also helped me because
7:41
I realized, wow, this looks different in different
7:44
countries. You started to see also some similarities,
7:47
things that we were experiencing here in America
7:50
that people were also experiencing in Australia
7:54
and in Nigeria and all of these other countries.
7:57
And so it was nice to see certain issues that
8:03
are consistent across education, but also to
8:06
realize, okay, we're not alone. This is actually
8:08
something that we need to address and attack.
8:12
And also certain things that... we're all learning
8:16
together as well. And so, and then also places
8:19
that are a little bit ahead that we could learn
8:21
from. And so I started to see like all of these
8:23
different like nuances and things happening in
8:25
different countries and cities. And it was just
8:28
a beautiful thing to see how big the world is,
8:31
but also how small it is as well. Nadine, I'm
8:36
thinking back here just to some of the days when
8:38
I was still in the classroom as well. I really
8:42
loved your message of asking students, you know,
8:47
how they want to learn. But I'm thinking back
8:50
to moments where I was gathering with maybe teachers
8:54
during a team meeting or maybe it was like a
8:56
PLC time or even maybe even in the lunchroom
8:59
and invariably conversations come around to students.
9:04
And I'm not saying in like a negative kind of
9:07
way, but I'm saying in like, I really want to
9:10
find a way to get across to this student to engage
9:14
them more fully in the learning that's taking
9:15
place there. And I feel like I'm losing them
9:18
and it's coming from this place of looking for
9:21
ideas from other adults on where that should
9:24
come from. How do adults go from adult teachers
9:29
go from saying, hey, I know what might work best
9:32
for that student. You should try this to that
9:35
point where you're asking the students themselves.
9:38
Yeah, I mean, student choice is important. It
9:41
goes beyond choice boards, right? I know a lot
9:44
of times people are like, yeah, let's just use
9:45
choice boards, like where you create all the
9:48
choices and then students get to select which
9:50
one of your choices that they get to choose.
9:53
But it goes beyond that, but it also takes additional
9:56
effort as well. And so it's important to just
10:01
ask students how they want to learn. So my students,
10:04
they received, and I'm not trying to brag, But
10:07
you know what, I am going to own this. That year,
10:12
and this was the first year I asked them this
10:13
question, 80 % of the fives, the level fives,
10:17
and this is during the FSA, 80 % of the fives
10:20
on our entire grade level came from my class
10:25
for reading. And so in this, I was teaching at
10:29
one of the bottom 100 schools in the state of
10:32
Florida. That's like one of the lowest scoring
10:35
schools in the state of Florida. And so I believe
10:38
that all students can learn. I know we always
10:39
say that, oh, all students can learn, but do
10:41
we actually really believe it? All students can
10:44
learn if we teach in a way that they actually
10:46
want to learn. And so a lot of times we try to
10:50
fit students into this. to assimilate into our
10:55
classroom practices and how things have always
10:57
been done, these archaic practices, and when
11:00
they don't learn, we blame it on them. And really,
11:03
if my students ever didn't learn, I always took
11:05
accountability for it, which I think all of us
11:08
as educators should, because it's like, I'm not
11:10
doing something right. And I have always been
11:12
the active student who's all over the place.
11:15
I actually got expelled. My husband said, stop
11:17
telling people this, but I did. I got expelled
11:20
from school. I was somebody who got... who got
11:23
in trouble all the time. But I always felt like
11:26
I was just misunderstood as a student. And I
11:28
wasn't bad, I was bored. I was brilliant, but
11:31
bored. And I always, whenever I saw students
11:35
who would act up in my class and they would always
11:37
give me kids from other classes, whoever got.
11:40
kicked out of other classes. I'm like, OK, just
11:42
bring it to me. It's fine. But I just knew that
11:44
they were just bored. Like if they like to jump
11:46
and move around, then that means that I need
11:49
to restructure how I'm teaching. And so I remember
11:52
even with. One of the times when I asked students,
11:57
like, how do you want to learn? They said, we
11:58
want to do more singing and dancing and rapping.
12:00
And so that's what we incorporated. I remember
12:03
one time I was standing in front of the board,
12:04
and this is when I taught fourth grade, and I
12:06
was going through the steps of a long division
12:08
problem. And so I said, OK, divide, multiply,
12:11
and subtract, bring it on down, and bring it
12:13
on back. And I just kept repeating it over and
12:15
over and over. And then one student, he was actually
12:17
a student who had gotten kicked out of a class
12:20
before I told the principal put him in my class
12:22
and this was actually his second year with me
12:24
and so as I'm going through those steps the students
12:27
are speeding on the desk as I'm talking but he's
12:30
beating to the rhythm that I'm saying this divide
12:33
multiply and subtract bring it on down and bring
12:35
it on back that one moment I in that one moment
12:39
I could have said hey stop banging on the desk
12:42
Anthony what are you doing right I could have
12:44
just responded like how many teachers would but
12:47
I didn't. I let him, and you know what that ended
12:50
off with? It ended off with students going to
12:53
the board one by one, singing, dancing, flipping.
12:56
I remember sitting back, smiling, and I took
13:00
a little video clip, and I just had it, and I
13:03
was watching it on my phone when I went back
13:05
home that day, and I was smiling. I was like,
13:06
oh my gosh, and I asked both of their parents,
13:09
because I actually had both of them as Facebook
13:10
friends, and I said, is it okay? There were two
13:12
kids in that video that I caught, and I was like,
13:14
is it okay if I upload this to Facebook? And
13:17
they were like, sure, can we post it as well?
13:19
I was like, absolutely. That video ended off
13:21
with 20 million views, 20 million views. They
13:25
got calls of people like Waka Flocka was posting
13:29
it and just like all of these celebrities. So
13:31
my students, like over the next few weeks, they
13:33
were all over the news. Even The Ellen Show called
13:35
them their producers. They end up making it on.
13:39
But they were like, oh, my gosh. And this was
13:41
like around the time of I can't remember. It
13:43
was before TikTok. I forgot what. that platform
13:46
was where the kids would try to go viral. They're
13:49
like binds. Yeah. Yeah. They're like to the bind.
13:52
Right. And so this is around the time where kids
13:55
were constantly trying to go viral. I mean, they
13:58
still are. I mean, this influencer age. But I
14:00
mean, I, I guess. But They were like, oh my gosh,
14:04
this is what we did and we went viral for something
14:07
educational and we're posting dance videos every
14:09
day. Nobody's watching them. And so they realized
14:12
how important it was. And so it was just such
14:15
a small moment. But the crazy thing is afterwards
14:18
I posted it on on YouTube and it has like a million
14:21
views on YouTube. But educators are still using
14:24
that video. If you go to YouTube and you search
14:26
long division rap like it'll be one of the first
14:29
ones that pop that pops up. But teachers are
14:31
still using that. to teach long division. Teachers
14:35
are still saying, oh, wait, you're the one who
14:37
created that video? I used that in my fourth
14:39
grade math class to teach kids how to do long
14:41
division. Because any fourth grade teacher knows
14:44
long division is one of the hardest things to
14:46
teach because it has so many steps. And if you
14:49
mess up on one step, your whole answer is wrong.
14:52
And so just one little moment can transform education
14:57
not just for for one class, but even going beyond
15:02
our class as well. And so it's so important just
15:04
to allow kids to bring their entire selves into
15:07
every space they walk into. Us as teachers, like
15:10
we can bring ourselves into every space that
15:12
we walk into, my quirky, unconventional, like
15:16
sometimes sarcastic self, right? And they can
15:20
come into class not feeling like they have to
15:22
hide who they are to fit into whatever environment
15:24
I create. So by the way, that video now has 20
15:28
million and one views because I went back and
15:31
watched that again just before you came on to
15:34
record with us today. And it absolutely is fabulous.
15:38
brings a smile to your face. If you've ever been
15:42
an educator, just seeing how those kids engage
15:45
with the content that you're working on, and
15:48
they really just internalize it. And you can
15:51
tell that's just something that carries over
15:53
into other parts of their learning as well. But
15:56
what about, you know, when you ask students a
15:58
question like, how do you want to learn? I mean,
16:02
some teachers got to be scared of what kids might
16:04
say. What's some of the scarier things that you're
16:09
like, yeah, maybe let's put this one on the back
16:12
burner for now and see if there's another way
16:14
that maybe I can get to you instead. You know
16:18
the crazy thing is, I never got an answer that
16:21
was just scary. The students actually gave me
16:23
ideas that I didn't even think of. There were
16:26
some that I just didn't have the capacity to
16:29
do. Like, for example, they said we want to go
16:30
on field trips like everybody. I'm like, yeah,
16:32
we're not doing that. But I did try to take them
16:36
on as many field trips as possible if it aligned
16:38
with the. with the actual curriculum. And so
16:41
there were certain things that I didn't necessarily
16:42
have capacity or the bandwidth to do, but all
16:45
of the answers were really good. Like some of
16:47
them were like, we want to be an actor and we
16:49
want to do acting. And so I remember teaching
16:51
like history lessons and even reading where they
16:54
would act out the books as they had it in their
16:57
hands. And so every time each person would get
17:00
a character, some people would just sit in the
17:02
audience and just follow along. And so I would
17:05
have my extra students, the ones who just never
17:07
sat down, they would be the most entertaining.
17:09
And so I would always give them different students
17:12
roles. And whenever they got to the quotation
17:14
marks, they would just act it out. And so it
17:16
just brought reading books to life rather than
17:18
just sitting there reading in a corner to ourselves,
17:21
which I allowed for that to like silent reading,
17:23
but just finding different ways and creative
17:25
ways to teach. And not every moment is meant
17:29
to go viral, right? Like, you know, you can still
17:32
engage kids and it doesn't have to be kind of
17:34
like this big show that you're putting on, right?
17:38
There's still ways to kind of connect with kids
17:40
using the strategies that are gonna help them
17:43
learn best, right? Yeah, absolutely. Actually,
17:47
most of what we did actually was not recorded.
17:51
If there were any amazing moments, I would record
17:54
it and upload it, but... Honestly, just being
17:56
in the class is connecting with students. Like,
17:59
everything you do should be connecting with students,
18:01
right? Just even from how you greet them at the
18:03
door, right? Are you sitting at your desk while
18:05
they're walking into your classroom? Are you
18:07
standing by the door calling them by name and
18:09
licking them in the eye? And so it's just being
18:12
intentional with everything that we do, realizing
18:14
that students aren't pawns to get good scores.
18:18
They're not... They're humans, they're humans
18:22
who have experiences well before they even walked
18:25
into our classroom, and even taking the time
18:27
to do those things like going to their homes
18:30
and doing home visits. It's going the extra mile
18:33
to realize that there's more than just, it's
18:37
more than just scores. The crazy thing is I didn't
18:39
even, it's not even like scores were my top focus,
18:43
but my students exceeded because I put them first.
18:46
And I would think, too, that relationship building
18:49
that you're doing, that rapport building at the
18:51
beginning, makes them feel even more comfortable
18:54
to share how they want to learn. Yeah. Actually,
18:59
before I started any classroom session, I actually
19:02
started with this thing called family meetings.
19:05
And so before we even started teaching, sometimes
19:08
I would take 30 minutes, sometimes I would take
19:10
even up to an hour with our family meetings.
19:12
And during those times, that was the time where
19:14
students could share with each other. That's
19:16
the time where if something was happening, sometimes
19:19
we would have shootings in our neighborhood.
19:21
I remember one time my principal, he showed us
19:23
a map of our school and they had all of the different
19:26
symbols that represented the different crimes.
19:29
And we couldn't find the school, but it was covered.
19:32
that area was covered with crimes. And so in
19:36
when crimes are happening, that sometimes is
19:38
their families being affected by it. Sometimes
19:41
it's their families doing it. And so taking the
19:43
time to just talk with them because they have
19:45
more on their minds than math. I remember one
19:50
of my students, he came into the class and he
19:52
was like so distraught and come to find out that
19:55
one of the murders that happened, and I don't
19:58
know if I can say this on the podcast, I'm sorry
20:00
for saying the M word, but one of those that
20:03
happened in the neighborhood, it was his grandpa.
20:05
And so a lot of times we see things happening
20:07
into a neighborhood or as educators, sometimes
20:09
we go into a neighborhood that we don't live
20:11
in to teach and then go back to our neighborhoods
20:13
not realizing that there's other. other things
20:16
happening around them that we have to be invested
20:18
in that we have to take the time to learn about
20:20
and we can't just jump into the day saying okay
20:23
take out your quick picks and start doing your
20:24
math work like like they have things that they
20:27
want to get out that they want to share and some
20:29
of them don't have a space even at home that
20:32
they can even share with. or people at home that
20:34
they can even share with. And so we have to be
20:36
very intentional about creating spaces. And when
20:39
we focus on students and we show them that we
20:41
care about them, like they will be more invested
20:44
in the learning process. So do you feel like
20:47
as a follow up question to that with all that's
20:51
going on and with any student, right? That nobody
20:55
truly knows sometimes the things that they might
20:57
have going on at home or the things that are
21:00
going on in the community and that spills over
21:02
into the school atmosphere so as that happens
21:06
do you feel like um and like with with giving
21:10
them i guess the keys right to the autonomy or
21:15
those to be able to make those choices do you
21:17
feel like it gives them back some control like
21:20
where they feel like i can decide how i want
21:23
to be educated is does that connect or am i Yeah,
21:29
it gives some control, but it also shows that
21:31
the teacher cares. Like just asking them that
21:34
simple question, how do you want to learn? It
21:37
shows that, wow, whenever I ask that question,
21:39
the kids would pause. you think that the kids
21:42
will just be jumping and just answering, they
21:44
would pause because they were like taken back,
21:46
like, wow, somebody is actually asking me that
21:49
question. I've never been asked that question
21:51
before. I even had a student say that. And so
21:53
just imagine like a world where people actually
21:58
care about how I want to learn, you know, right?
22:02
And so. So yes, it gives them a little bit of
22:07
control over the classroom. Actually, one of
22:09
the students, I remember one year, the student
22:10
said that they want to teach the lesson that
22:13
they didn't want me to teach that they wanted
22:14
to teach. And so that year, it took me a long
22:17
time to do lesson plans, but I actually created
22:19
scripted lesson plans for the students to go
22:22
and teach certain subjects, not everything. but
22:25
I created scripted lesson plans for them to go
22:27
and I just interjected. And it was crazy because
22:30
the students paid way more attention to their
22:32
peers than to me. And I also made it fun. So
22:34
if their last name was like Williams, the students
22:36
had to call them Mrs. Williams while they were
22:39
up there. And so I made it fun where they actually
22:41
had to teach it, treat and respect the student
22:45
as if they were me. while I was up there and
22:48
so just like if they would get marked if they
22:50
were being disrespectful to me they also got
22:52
marked if they are being disrespectful to their
22:54
peers and they would come into my classroom during
22:56
their lunch breaks so that I could brief them
22:59
on the lesson and so like they absolutely loved
23:01
it and so there there's there's so much opportunity
23:06
and education but it just really requires us
23:09
just really thinking out of the box and doing
23:11
things in ways that they haven't been done and
23:14
bringing in bringing in the students' voices,
23:17
they will give us the best ideas. We don't even
23:19
have to be the sole visionaries. The students
23:21
are visionaries, and they will be able to give
23:23
us ideas on what they want. Yeah, and part of
23:26
that, too, is you mentioned being part of Minecraft
23:31
education. With that, students really get to
23:35
showcase a lot of their own ingenuity or the
23:37
things that they want to design. Can you tell
23:40
us how you got into the whole Minecraft space?
23:44
You saw some other school doing it or how did
23:47
that happen where you got involved with Minecraft?
23:50
Yes. Actually, our Chief Information Officer
23:54
in Duval County Public Schools at the time, he
23:57
wanted to build this Minecraft lab. And he actually
24:00
had this vision on like what he wanted it to
24:03
be. And they brought me in to execute this vision.
24:05
And so I realized that the main reason why he
24:10
wanted to do this was because he realized that
24:12
there weren't a lot of people going into the
24:13
cybersecurity fields. There was a huge shortage
24:16
of cyber professionals, not just here in Jacksonville,
24:19
but globally. And so he was like, wait, how can
24:22
we build a pipeline starting from elementary,
24:24
giving students access to some of these concepts
24:27
through Minecraft education. And so we didn't
24:30
just focus on cybersecurity, but that was one
24:32
of our big focus was on cybersecurity and computer
24:35
science, but also teacher selected science or
24:38
math or reading, whatever lesson they selected,
24:41
I was able to modify some of the lessons and
24:44
execute it. And so they would do. uh go on field
24:47
trips to this Minecraft lab and I would lead
24:50
live lessons for the students and then I would
24:53
show teachers how they could continue this in
24:57
their classrooms and so we went from uh from
25:01
trying to figure out how to get people into the
25:03
lab to being booked out in like two days. We
25:06
would release it and filters for the entire school
25:09
year would be booked out. And so we saw that
25:11
there was a need. Like teachers were just looking
25:12
for different ways to teach. They just didn't
25:15
really know it. And so eventually like Minecraft
25:18
came down and they did a case study on the work
25:20
that we were doing here in Duval County Public
25:22
Schools. And eventually I started working for
25:26
them as their global education community manager.
25:30
What is the thing that you feel like you, what's
25:34
your biggest takeaway from that time being involved
25:37
with Minecraft education? What did you really
25:39
take away and how did that impact you? The biggest
25:43
takeaway that I guess there's a lot of big takeaways,
25:48
but just rethinking how we're teaching students.
25:52
A lot of times it's just easy just to teach.
25:55
Just using whatever methods that we've always
25:58
used but when I saw students in this Minecraft
26:01
game I remember there's so many different instances
26:04
there was one time I remember Students coming
26:08
like coming into a lab and there was one student
26:11
who was in a wheelchair and she was running around
26:14
in this game playing with all of the other students
26:17
and I was like Oh my gosh, like it's just certain
26:21
moments. And I remember there was another time
26:23
when there was an educator and she could not,
26:27
she like really struggled teaching her students
26:29
how to code using Python. And they use Minecraft
26:34
to learn how to code. And they were like thriving
26:37
within it. And she's like, wait, I try to teach
26:39
them how to code and they wouldn't listen or
26:41
whatever. And now they're in this game and now
26:44
they're coding and they're doing all of this,
26:46
like how? But it's just rethinking not necessarily
26:49
what we're teaching. And it goes back to even
26:53
my earlier methods that I spoke about, but how
26:55
we're teaching students. And so I know sometimes
26:58
some of the things that we teach students, we're
27:00
like, oh my gosh, why is this even in the curriculum?
27:05
But if we rethink how we're teaching, I believe
27:08
every single student can learn. I have a daughter
27:10
who's diagnosed with autism. I believe that she
27:15
can learn too right and so I work with her on
27:18
so many different things work with her in so
27:20
many different ways and she just started thriving
27:22
however in certain environments she just was
27:25
struggling. She was struggling because many times
27:27
she was getting pushed to the side because people
27:29
just felt like she couldn't learn. But the way
27:31
that she learns was just different. And she just
27:34
needed somebody who believed in her to work.
27:35
Now she's like multiplying and dividing and doing
27:37
all these amazing things. And she's only in the
27:40
second grade. And at one point she really struggled
27:42
to add. But it wasn't because she couldn't learn.
27:44
It was just because somebody didn't take the
27:46
time to really get to know how she learned. And
27:51
so every student can learn. Every single student,
27:53
no matter who they are, can learn. I had students
27:55
who came into my classroom who sometimes didn't
27:58
speak English, and I found ways to teach them.
28:02
Like I had students in my classroom who were
28:04
like four years behind, but I found ways to teach
28:07
them. And so it's so important to realize that
28:09
all students can learn, but we have to rethink
28:11
how we're teaching. And it may be using games
28:13
like Minecraft and finding other unconventional
28:16
methods to educate students. And one of the things
28:21
that I saw too, you're working on an app, building
28:24
an app to help students like your daughter. Do
28:26
you want to describe what you've got going on
28:29
there? Yeah. And so one of the things that I
28:32
realized with my daughter is that I just had
28:34
to be intentional and realize that other things
28:37
that my nieces and nephews that were around her
28:39
age that they organically picked up, I had to
28:42
be a little bit more explicit in teaching her
28:44
certain things. And so I started to do language
28:48
use, like language development cards, like taking
28:50
pictures of different scenarios and just talking
28:53
with her about what was in those pictures. At
28:55
first she was like nonverbal. She would point
28:58
and then eventually she started using one word.
28:59
and then phrases, and then now she's going back
29:04
and forth in conversations with me. And so I...
29:10
A lot of people ask me, like, wait, what are
29:12
you doing with her? Like, what methods have you
29:14
used with her? And it was hard for me to put
29:17
all of it into words. And so what I did was I
29:20
tried to put it all into an app. I tried to put
29:22
it all into an app called Free Indeed so that
29:25
other parents who, or educators who may have
29:29
kids who are diagnosed with autism, and they're
29:32
trying to figure out ways to even track their
29:35
growth in their development, they have a way
29:38
to do that. And they can kind of see how they're
29:42
progressing over time, where sometimes we don't
29:44
necessarily notice the changes that are happening
29:47
over time, but this makes it where you can kind
29:49
of see, wow, she went from using one word and
29:53
now she's using phrases with pronouns. And so
29:56
just... how they develop over time and then also
29:59
having like different activities that um and
30:02
it's mainly dedicated toward parents but it has
30:04
like activities that parents can also use with
30:07
their kids at home so that they don't necessarily
30:09
feel like uh the only time their kids can get
30:12
supports is when they take them to different
30:14
therapies there's things that you can do at home
30:16
as a parent to support your kids and don't you
30:20
think too that it it helps the parents see that
30:22
growth and then they start to have a little shift
30:25
in their own mindset of what their student is
30:28
capable of, and maybe start to set some expectations
30:31
that is just going to even foster greater growth.
30:34
Yeah, and it gives parents hope as well. Yeah.
30:37
And so I know like when sometimes when parents
30:41
have kids who are diagnosed with disability,
30:43
sometimes you can feel hopeless and helpless.
30:47
And even me as an educator, that's how I felt
30:49
at first. And then afterwards, I'm like, Wake
30:52
up, BD. What are you doing? You are an educator.
30:55
And not only that, you're an amazing educator.
30:58
You see skills that you've been using to support
31:01
and help other kids with your own child. And
31:03
I also taught students who were in ESC programs,
31:07
who were diagnosed with disabilities. And so
31:09
I realized that I had everything that I needed.
31:12
And this was just a new context for me to work
31:14
with my own child. And so the same way that I
31:18
had to kind of encourage myself I hope that this
31:22
app will also encourage other parents as well.
31:26
Yeah, that's great. And I have a nephew who's
31:29
also autistic and kind of maybe shared some of
31:32
the similar experiences, was nonverbal for a
31:34
very long time, you know, until he was finally
31:38
diagnosed and he started getting some of the
31:40
supports that he needed. And I think for my brother
31:43
and his wife, just knowing that those supports
31:46
were available to them, you know, but also, you
31:51
know, the ability, I think, to be able to take
31:56
what my nephew has been able to do. He's now
31:58
heading into eighth grade and is looking forward
32:01
to going to school. You know, they started maybe
32:04
back about a week ago just because he gets to
32:07
connect with some of the same adults and kids
32:11
that, you know, for the summer he didn't get
32:13
to see and he's just happy to go back. And I
32:17
just know it's because of things like what you're
32:21
doing to help bring supports to those families
32:23
and those schools. So thank you very much for
32:25
what you've put into that. Thank you. So Nadine,
32:30
can you talk to us a little bit about you, the
32:33
involvement with you got that the presidential
32:36
leadership scholar and what that was like? Can
32:40
you tell us about what that is and the importance
32:44
of that project and what it means to you for
32:45
getting that award? Yes, and so this year I was
32:51
selected as one of 60 National Presidential Leadership
32:54
Scholars, and this is a program that's in collaboration
32:58
with four different presidential centers. And
33:01
so you have both of the President Bush's. and
33:04
also President Clinton and also President LBJ.
33:09
And so we go to different cities and states throughout
33:13
the nation, and then we learn at the different
33:16
presidential centers and other spaces that are
33:19
selected. And we all do our own personal leadership
33:24
project. And so the goal is they're investing
33:26
time and pouring into us. The goal is for us
33:31
to pour back into our communities. And so although
33:33
we're in various professions, doctors, lawyers,
33:36
educators, people in tech, right? Although we're
33:39
in various professions, the goal is for us to
33:42
find ways to pour back into our community. So
33:44
we all have a project. And so my project is called
33:47
The Ripple Effect. Effect spelt A -I -FF -E -C
33:51
-T. It took me a long time to learn. But The
33:55
Ripple Effect, and the goal was and is to train
33:59
college students to then go into the community
34:03
to cause a ripple effect when it comes to AI
34:05
literacy. And so I realized that these tech companies
34:09
are not stopping and they're certainly not slowing
34:12
down. And so as these companies are competing
34:15
against one another, trying to figure out who
34:17
can come up with the next invention first, who
34:20
can reach AGI, artificial general intelligence,
34:24
or even... reaching this point of super intelligence,
34:29
right? It's not slowing down. And so it was so
34:31
important for me to make sure that our communities
34:34
were not feeling left behind. And it started
34:36
in a conversation with my mom and she would send
34:40
me all of these videos and I would say, this
34:41
is not real. Like this is clearly not real. They
34:44
are not, this two -year -old baby is not singing
34:47
on America's Got Talent. And so she would send
34:49
me all of these videos and my dad started to
34:51
do it. And my husband's dad starts to send me
34:53
all these videos. And I remember sitting with
34:56
my mom and showing her like how these videos
35:01
can even be generated. I started to show her
35:05
how I could easily use a common tool to clone
35:09
my niece's voice. like to do like different scams
35:14
that these scammers are doing. I actually had
35:16
to stop and show her how these things are done
35:18
so that she can know like oh my gosh because
35:20
she was getting scammed. There were pastors calling
35:23
her from other countries asking her for offerings
35:25
and she's like this is their voice I know it.
35:28
And so, but I couldn't blame her because she
35:31
came from the, I'll believe it when I see it
35:33
generation. And so now we can't believe everything
35:36
that we see, but they're still stuck in the mindset.
35:38
I see a video, it has to be real. And if they
35:41
don't fully understand that. how technologies
35:45
are evolving, it's not going to make sense. And
35:48
so for the ripple effect, we go out into the
35:51
community. It's like a community -based program
35:53
where I train college students. I partnered with
35:56
the University of North Florida to train college
35:58
students to then go out into the community to
36:02
train and work with older adults, to work with
36:06
students, to go to community events, and so that
36:09
the community doesn't feel like they're getting
36:11
left behind. And I know we can do this in school
36:13
systems and stuff like that, but like I prefer
36:16
to do, like in doing this in tandem, like community
36:21
-based methods because there's less restrictions
36:24
and I could impact more people at a faster pace
36:29
rather than having to go through whatever's going
36:32
on in a lot of these school systems, right? So
36:35
it has been like. So, so rewarding. Just working
36:41
with adults. I remember we did a session two
36:43
weeks ago with older adults and they were like,
36:46
oh my gosh, I didn't know this was out there.
36:48
I didn't even know technology could even do some
36:50
of these things. And this, if it's just like
36:53
one more person who, who is not getting scanned
36:56
or one more person who understands these tools,
36:59
one more person who doesn't feel like they're
37:00
getting left behind as technology companies are
37:03
competing and pushing forward with innovation
37:06
faster that faster than they're actually bringing
37:08
us along, then it feels like it's worth it. But
37:11
also I also encourage them after you learn these
37:15
things, after you learn how to use these tools,
37:17
after you learn and you build like a little bit
37:21
of AI literacy skills that you'll then go out
37:23
and teach your families. And so that it will
37:26
then cause a ripple effect so that as technology
37:30
companies are pushing forward that the community
37:33
that they're serving, especially older adults,
37:36
don't feel like they're getting left behind.
37:39
Yeah. And then actually, it made me think a lot
37:41
about my own experience last year, because so
37:46
often I'm working with teachers on AI. I mean,
37:50
training on AI, professional development. Jeremy
37:53
and I do a session together on AI literacy as
37:56
well. But it's always typically directed towards
37:58
teachers or tech integrationists, right? Um,
38:01
and so I really like that, uh, where you're,
38:04
you're bridging the gap because, uh, last year
38:07
I had something similar happen where I had in
38:09
our area, the adult community center reached
38:13
out to me as well. And you know, these are all
38:16
retirees and stuff, and they're like, just trying
38:19
to figure out what, what this whole AI thing
38:21
is about. And so they asked me to come in and
38:24
do a presentation for them. And it was very similar.
38:26
And, uh, quite honestly, it was like, um, some
38:30
of the most interesting conversations that I
38:32
had had. I'd been talking to teachers so much
38:34
and it was really great to hear their perspective
38:37
and some of the things that they're seeing out
38:39
there and to be able to talk to them about like,
38:41
yeah, that those things are fake. Like this is
38:44
how this is done. You know, when people are creating
38:46
these images and news headlines and audio video,
38:50
all these different things. So do you feel like
38:54
you've had or I guess what would be like your
38:57
biggest most interesting story from those experiences
39:01
through that project with the ripple effect?
39:06
I would say one story that I was listening to,
39:15
they were telling me how their parent was falling
39:20
in love with Mick Jagger and how he was communicating
39:24
with them all the time and I think she was around
39:26
maybe 80 or 90. And I started to hear like real
39:29
life stories. So like when I started, it's like
39:32
based on research, our research kind of like
39:34
what's going on and different scans that are
39:37
happening and things like that. But when you're
39:40
sitting in a room and people start telling you
39:42
real life stories of things that they've encountered
39:45
or when I'm sharing a story and they're like,
39:47
actually this happened to me as well. Or when
39:50
they start giving me like. even new examples
39:53
of ways that I didn't even know AI was even being
39:57
used. Like, it's rewarding. It's rewarding, but
40:02
it also makes me know like, okay, I'm doing this
40:04
work. After our last session, they reached back
40:08
out and said, can we do a series? We need an
40:11
entire series so we can bring our family and
40:13
our friends just so that... They can also learn,
40:18
so that they can also be in spaces where they
40:20
can learn. And a lot of times people feel like
40:23
older adults don't care about technology, they're
40:25
not interested, but they absolutely are. They
40:29
absolutely are. They just need more people who
40:31
will take the time to teach them. So I'm grateful
40:34
that you also took the time to go into certain
40:37
senior centers to work with them because we cannot
40:41
let any group get left behind as these advancements
40:46
are happening. Yeah. And I wanted to ask you,
40:50
too, because, you know, like looking through
40:51
your website, I noticed that you had a picture
40:56
with I think it was President Bush and President
40:59
Clinton, right? What was that like meeting them?
41:03
Yeah, it was amazing. I met them through the
41:05
Presidential Leadership Scholars Program. And
41:07
so we got to learn from them. We got to take
41:09
pictures with them. We even got to eat lunch
41:11
with them and meet a lot of people who even worked
41:15
with and for them. And so it was just nice hearing
41:18
from like former leaders of our nation and just
41:22
hearing some of the and obviously nobody is perfect
41:25
no leader is perfect right but learning from
41:28
the things that they did right the things that
41:31
um they they wish they would have done better
41:33
and so it's i got to learn certain like leadership
41:36
skills from them like how to even lead fearlessly
41:40
and also um how to how to even uh advocate for
41:48
different communities who aren't in spaces or
41:51
whose voices aren't being listened to, how to
41:54
even advocate for different communities. And
41:56
so as we went to these different centers, as
41:59
we went to Arkansas to learn from President Clinton,
42:01
as we went to Texas to learn from President Bush,
42:05
as we went to these different spaces, I just
42:07
brought my notebook and just took down so many
42:10
notes on the challenges that they had, how they
42:13
overcame them, things that they learned. so that
42:17
I don't repeat certain mistakes, you know? But
42:20
it was just really, it was very humbling meeting
42:23
a U .S. president. Sounds like you got like a
42:27
really firsthand master class kind of experience.
42:31
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they are very wise. They
42:33
are very wise, like just they're extremely wise
42:37
and it was it was a blessing being able to learn
42:39
from them. So how do you take some of these things
42:42
that you've been able to experience? I think
42:45
both with meeting world leaders, but also students
42:50
in the classroom. And you bring these different
42:52
parts together for your own consulting business
42:56
that you have every education. How do you bring
42:59
those things together? What's the focus? What's
43:01
the mission of your organization? Yeah, and so
43:06
the ultimate mission of every education is just
43:09
to really go into the community, go into schools,
43:13
go into these spaces to build just technological
43:17
skills to support our educational system and
43:20
also to build AI literacy in ways that that keeps
43:24
a human. at the center keeps our problem -solving
43:29
skills and all of these beautiful things that
43:31
make us human at the center where we don't feel
43:34
like we're losing ourselves to technology. We've
43:37
all experienced it where we've seen emails and
43:40
we're like... feels like I'm just talking to
43:42
a robot. It feels like robots talking back and
43:44
forth to each other, right? Like we never wanna
43:46
lose our voice. Our voice, like I would prefer,
43:49
at this point, I would prefer to see an email
43:51
with grammatical errors rather than to see a
43:55
completely AI generated email where it just feels
43:59
like I'm talking to a robot. And we're in a space
44:03
where, and we've just... touch the surface. As
44:06
technology is advancing, we haven't even seen
44:10
where things are going to go. But we've come
44:12
to a point where people are just, they need the
44:14
human touch. They need the human touch in the
44:17
classroom. The computers will never replace a
44:19
teacher. AI will never replace a teacher. even
44:24
these instructional methods, AI can be used to
44:27
support how we're teaching, but it cannot replace
44:29
us. And so, but sometimes it takes somebody just
44:32
really supporting school systems to show them,
44:36
hey, here's how it can be done. I know you're
44:38
being pushed to use these tools. And so you probably
44:41
feel forced to use these in a way that. doesn't
44:44
feel natural to you, but here are some more ways
44:48
that it can be done. Here's how it's being done
44:50
in other spaces as well, and even providing spaces
44:52
where educational leaders can even collaborate
44:55
so that they can even learn from each other,
44:59
so that they can push this work ahead without
45:01
losing ourselves in the middle of it, where it
45:04
doesn't feel like a rat race, where everybody's
45:06
trying to be the most innovative, but we forget
45:10
about. the humans and human judgment and humans
45:13
in the loop. Mm hmm. Yeah. And I really like
45:17
that the humans in the loop. One thing that I
45:19
heard recently, too, that my brain is starting
45:21
to go to is we need humans not just in the loop,
45:23
but humans in the lead, you know, humans asking
45:26
the questions. If I can offer some assistance,
45:29
that's great. If if I can get that help that
45:32
I need from another human, that's even better.
45:35
But I don't know, I'm starting to transition
45:38
my my mind a little bit. Yes. Yeah. You know,
45:44
Nadine, time has gone by here so fast. And we're
45:47
kind of coming up near the end of our time together.
45:50
And I want to get us going into the lightning
45:52
round. So we've got a series of questions here.
45:56
I'm actually going to skip the first one, because
45:57
I think we touched on that one a lot in a previous
46:00
section. But we kind of alternate these. You
46:03
can give short responses, long responses, whatever
46:05
it takes for you to get your idea across. But
46:10
I'm going to kick off with the first one here.
46:13
Who's the most interesting person that you have
46:15
met? And I'm kind of curious if it's a president
46:18
or if it's something totally different. Actually,
46:21
no, it's actually my mom. My mom is the most
46:25
interesting individual I have ever met in my
46:28
life. She was also an educator. She primarily
46:30
taught. Um, she actually taught everything, uh,
46:33
but she primarily taught students who are diagnosed
46:35
with different, uh, with varying ability. She
46:38
also taught in the prison. She was just an interesting
46:41
teacher. And actually, when I got kicked out
46:43
of school, she had me just sit in the classroom.
46:45
I don't know if this was even allowed at that
46:46
time, but I sat in the classroom with her and
46:49
just watched her teach and which is unconventional.
46:52
She would be perming students' hair in the middle
46:55
of her class, like, perming her students' hair.
46:57
This is when perming your hair was a thing. Now,
46:59
like, you know we like our natural here um but
47:02
uh she would like bring food like she would cook
47:06
curry chicken and jerk chicken and bring food
47:08
for the kids um her like her classroom also had
47:11
like a shower in there and so when students came
47:14
and they were like musky and she would have like
47:17
deodorant and like she'll like send them in to
47:19
go take a shower so that they wouldn't get made
47:21
fun of by other students but she was just a very
47:25
unconventional human being and I think that's
47:27
what I got my uh like my mindset on like even
47:32
how to become a teacher I didn't have to fit
47:34
into what I saw but um I went earlier when I
47:40
said I wanted to be the teacher that I never
47:42
had I never had that teacher but I was able to
47:44
see that teacher through my mom. Nadine what
47:49
is one word you would want associated with your
47:51
name in the education space? Transformational.
47:55
I want to be known as somebody who walks into
47:57
any space, any space that I'm in and transform
48:01
it, transforms it so that it's better than when
48:04
I came in. And I think you mentioned you're in
48:08
the Jacksonville area, correct? Yeah. So what's
48:11
the best spot to eat right now in the Jacksonville
48:13
area? You know, I've actually recently somebody
48:18
put me on to this place called Midtown Table.
48:21
I'm actually more of a home cooked male person,
48:23
but. I've been giving up my home cooked meals
48:26
probably like once every few weeks to go there
48:29
because the food is just so good. So good. All
48:36
right. What is one thing in education that's
48:38
missing right now? I would say visionary leaders,
48:50
transformational leaders who are willing to put
48:55
in the time and energy and even get some backlash
48:58
to transform systems. So Nadine, David and I
49:05
are giving a conference we're hosting it and
49:08
there's going to be a room full of educators
49:10
waiting for you to come out on stage. What's
49:13
going to be that keynote walk -up song that you
49:15
want to use to pump the crowd up and get them
49:17
ready? So my keynote walk -up song would be toast
49:21
by coffee and so my parents are from Jamaica
49:25
So this actually a Jamaican song but the gist
49:27
of it if you listen to it, you probably won't
49:29
understand anything They're saying she's speaking
49:30
English, but you probably won't understand it
49:32
but she's essentially just saying like as I go
49:35
through this journey and I do all of these things.
49:39
I always give things to God. All right. Well,
49:45
just so you know, they get they get added to
49:46
our integrate this guest playlist on Spotify.
49:49
So all of our guests are on our integrate this
49:54
playlist. So that'll get added on there. So next
49:58
week, just real quick, we're going to go through
49:59
our this or that and see if there's a rapid fire,
50:01
see if they can only choose one or the other.
50:03
So it might be preference or something like that.
50:06
So music or podcast music, flight or road trip,
50:12
road trip, work with one school for an entire
50:16
year. or speak a keynote in front of thousands?
50:20
One school for an entire year. Relationships.
50:24
It's key. Okay. And then build an app or teach
50:27
someone how to build an app? Build an app. Okay.
50:33
Beach or mountains? Beach. Call or text? Call,
50:39
unless it could be a text, just like it could
50:41
have been an email. Okay. And then last one,
50:44
workshop for teachers or live lessons for students?
50:48
workshop for teachers that impact students. Yep.
50:52
All right. Nadine, we're really glad that you
50:55
could join us for the podcast. Is there anything
50:57
you want to plug quick that you have going on
51:00
where people can follow you? Obviously the website.
51:03
What do you want to share there? Yes. So if you
51:06
would like to follow me, I mean, I'm not super
51:09
active on social media, but I am on LinkedIn.
51:11
So you can just search for Nadine Ebre on LinkedIn
51:14
and just to follow my journey. And if you want
51:17
to connect or even collaborate, I am very open
51:19
to that. Awesome. And we'll make sure we include
51:23
the website and things in the show notes for
51:25
those of you that are watching or listening on
51:27
the podcast. So Nadine, thanks again for joining
51:30
us. It was great having you. Thank you. Thanks
51:35
for listening to Integrate This. Want to take
51:38
your learning further? Head over to our YouTube
51:40
channel for quick tutorials, deep dives, and
51:43
more ed tech tips you can use right away. Don't
51:47
forget to subscribe and catch new podcast episodes
51:50
every Thursday on Apple, Spotify, or wherever
51:53
you get your podcasts. Until next time, keep
51:57
exploring, keep innovating, and keep integrating
52:00
this.