Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Did evil boyfriend slit teen's throat before throwing her down mine shaft?

Transcript

Did evil boyfriend slit teen's throat before throwing her down mine shaft? · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, Lewis and Otis and wore
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: kneeling and Riley was standing facing Bomb with his hands
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: tied behind his back. Riley asked if he could kiss
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: his girlfriend, and then Greezy said, Nolan, she started crying,
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: you're hearing our friends at ABC four. That is Marcus Ortiz.
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: What we know now is a Utah man forty one
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: accused of fatally stabbing two teams and dumping their bodies
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: in a mine, admitting he made one of them watch
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: as the other suffered. Listen. Then she says Bomb appeared
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: to be attacking Powell as they were standing next to
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: each other. Harry Riley say, I'm dying and he was gurgling,
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: and that's when I realized that he wasn't hitting Riley,
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: he was stabbing Riley. It was the most horrible sound
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: I've ever heard. Then it was Adison's turn, as Bob
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: walked behind her. Thought she remained tied up and it
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: seemed like he had his arms around her, but I'm
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: not sure. And he said it's okay, darling, and he
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: went to her, and then I felt warms on my leg. Okay,
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: And what did you perceive at that point it was
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: her bud. Lewis says she saw Bomb Tosspowa's body into
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: the mine. Austin was next, but her life was spared.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: He's got this huge grin on his face like he's
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: enjoying himself, and he was. He did later he laughed
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: about it. He said that was like lambs to the sladder.
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: They didn't even fight. Lewis says she felt threatened that
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: she too would be murdered by Bomb if she told police,
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: but later on she felt guilt and wanted closure for
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: the families. I mean, I see grace. This is crime Stories.
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us. To Robin Willinski, crime
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: online dot Com investigative reporter, author of Beautiful Life, the
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: CSI behind the Case, he hath any trial, Robin, what happened? Well,
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: this is beyond belief that actually this guy, Gerard Baum,
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: the forty one year old, they say that he's a Nazi.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: He has this large swastika that is visible on his
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: check when you look at him, Nancy, straight on, kind
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: of in the nape of your neck where you would
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: wear a necklace. He's got a tattoo of a swastika,
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: and then he's got a smaller one on his face,
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: on his face, And isn't this what the Nazis did
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: in Nazi Germany, you know, shooting Jews and some Christians
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: and just throwing them into their graves. That's what it's
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: reminiscent of to me. And that's what went down here
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: with these two teens, seventeen and eighteen years old. And
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: there was a report that the girl, the seventeen year old,
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: may have even been pregnant and still kills her and
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: throws her into the mind too, all in front of
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: his girlfriend who did nothing. I'm talking about suspect Jared Baum,
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: the victim's Braylon Addison, seventeen, and her teen boyfriend Riley Powell.
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: To doctor Michelle Dupree, South Carolina Medical examine or author
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: of Homicide Investigation Field Guide, Doctor Dupree, how would we
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: know if Morgan was in fact pregnant at the time
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: of her murder? Yes, ask you, well, as you know,
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: we would do an autopsy because of the nature of death,
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: and in doing that autopsy could do a complete autopsy.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: So we would investigate whether or not she was actually
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: pregnant and make that determination and include that finding in
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: the autopsy report. Well, what we know now is that
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: two teens dead. And did you say, Robin Lensky that
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: hit their bodies were thrown down a mine. Yes, if
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: you can believe this that he pushed after he killed
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: both of them, Allegedly he pushed both of them down
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: a mind and they were found a hundred feet down.
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: This is in Utah, where there are many minds, deep
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: minds like this. They were missing for ninety I don't
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: understand to aske you Wolcott joining me jeven I'll judge lawyer,
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: you can find her, asked Wolcott dot com. How the
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: girlfriend managed to stay quiet and not say anything? You know,
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: That's what's astounding to me. This one just two teens.
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: I can't even imagine how a even if she fears
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: her life, why wouldn't she try to get involved before
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: he actually kills them instead of fearing her life and
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: going along with it. B Once she realizes I'm not
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: going to be killed? How do you sit quiet on that?
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: It doesn't make sense to me. It happens more frequently
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: with horrific crimes than I'd like to believe. It doesn't
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: make sense. But on the other hand, Nancy, thank gosh,
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: she came forward, so we know what happened. Dude, Robert
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: will Lensky, what do we know about a potential motive
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: in the case. Yeah, that's the interesting part. When you
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: hear something that's horrendous, you know what set him off? Well,
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: the investigation shows Nancy that the girlfriend, Morgan Lewis, apparently
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: had these two over the house and they were allegedly
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: to smoking some weed, smoking some pots, and he was
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: apparently a very controlling personality and didn't want her smoking
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: pot or not smoking pot with these two, didn't want
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: her talking to other men. So Riley who's eighteen, and
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: then you had Breezy who's seventeen, and he doesn't want
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: them in the house, doesn't want them smoking pot. But
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: does that mean you go and kill them? Well, what
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: about asking them to leave? What about that possibility? Ashley
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: Wilcot judge lawyer Ashley Wilcot dot com. What about it?
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: Why not just say hey, guys, you gotta go home. Well,
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: that's attributing rational thought to someone and that's exactly what
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: should have happened. That's what happens probably ninety nine percent
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: of the time. But then you have someone like this
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: who's going to engage in this level of criminal activity.
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: He's got a screw loose. My word, nobody else's, but
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: he should never ever see the light of day again.
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: Right now, this is all unfolding in a preliminary hearing
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: in court. Take a listen to what the family members
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: are learning in court for the very first time. This
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: is the first time Breezie and Riley's family heard Lewis
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: recount those moments in details behind what what happened to Riley,
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: I know that was that was a hard foe to swallow,
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: and what happened to Riley, it just looks to me
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: like he was in some sort of fit of rage
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: or whatever. Again when she said, he was smiling and
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: like he enjoyed it. At this point, they say this
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: isn't about closure in the death of the two teens.
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: They just hope for justice. We know that him being
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: tried and hopefully the death penalty coming that it's not
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: going to be it's not never going to give us
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: a piece that we're looking for, but at least it
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: gives validation that we're going to fight and we're going
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: to fight for the kids, and it's that's all we
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: can do at this point, is fighting there on. Our
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: bomb faces eight charges in the deaths of Brezie and Riley,
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: including aggravated murder and aggravated kidnapping. You're hearing our friend
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: with Box thirteen Utah reporter Larrence Steinbrecker terrible, terrible to
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: hear this playing out in a court of law. Now,
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: for me, Ashley, I would never have wanted, if I
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: were the defense, a preliminary hearing, because all of this
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: gets out into the public and juries here about it.
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: They'll later be put on the actual jury. But if
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: you do a preliminary hearing, you remember the one in O. J.
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: Simpson about jumping over the fence and doing the search
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: of the home, You, the defense, get a chance to
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: cross examin the state's witness before there's ever a jury trial,
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: because a state bears the burden at a preliminary hearing.
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: A preliminary is just really, is there enough evidence for
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: this to go forward to a felony jury? That's right, Nancy.
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: So the whole reason is a defense attorney. I've never
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: been a defense attorney, but I'm very close with many
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: who are. I've done lots of trial coverage. Is exactly
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: what you said, if its defense, you want to quote
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: unquote free look at the evidence to see exactly what
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: they're going to present a preliminary and an opportunity across
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: just like you said, that's exactly why the defense is
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: going to do it. I believe they did it in
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: this case because they want to They want to force
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: the prosecution to show their hand. The biggest witness of
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: the afternoon was Morgan Lewis, and this is the first
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: time that the public was hearing directly from her what
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: happened that night that Breezy and Riley died. As the
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: prosecution laid out their evidence against Jared Baumb, they called
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: up family members, detectives in the case, and a medical
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: examiner who explained the pair died of blunt force trauma
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: and stab wounds, including right across the neck. Then Bomb's
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: girlfriend explained what unfolded after midnight on December thirtieth, twenty seventeen.
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: Jared told me to get in the car, and I
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: felt I was scared and I listened to him. Morgan Lewis,
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: formerly Morgan Henderson, testified for three hours. She said Bomb
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: came home to find Riley and Breezy had visited Lewis,
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: which made him mad. I knew that something bad was happening,
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: it just didn't feel it was in a normal situation.
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: Lewis explained, Bomb drove them to a mine near Eureka.
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: Breezy and Riley tied up with duct tape over their mouths.
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: She said, Bomb started to hit Riley near the open mine.
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: I heard Riley say I'm dying, and he was gurgling,
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: and that's when I realized that he wasn't hitting Riley.
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: He was stabbing Riley. He knelt down behind Breezy and
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: he took her in his arms and he said, it's okay, Darlin,
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: and he looked like he was rocking her. Bluish says
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: at that moment, Bomb killed Breezy, then threw both bodies
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: in the mind, I almost feel sick. I remember this
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: feeling from court when I'm good be trying cases or
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: investigating cases. The level of cruelty, of depravity, it's just
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: overwhelming to me sometimes. And I remember that often in
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: the trial when we would the jury would want a break,
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: I would of course never ask for a break, but
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: if the jury took a break, I would go into
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: the lighties bathroom far away from the courtroom. I'd even
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: go to a different floor. I'd go in the furthest
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: stall and just cry. And I remember during jury trials,
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: I couldn't eat a thing ever, I would be so
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: upset to my stomach that I just these details are
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: so upsetting. We are in the middle of a preliminary
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: hearing regarding suspect Jared J. E. R R O. D.
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: Bomb be as a brother au M and the victims
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: are teens. There's just a couple of years older than
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: my children that are my world. And to hear them
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: slaughtered like this, and Bomb laughs about how they quote
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: didn't even fight back like lambs to the slaughter. I
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: mean doctor Bethany Marshall. Now we're hearing he's got the
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: tattoo the swastika on his chest and another one on
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: his face. It just I'm just overwhelmed, Bey and Nancy.
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: One detail is that he cradled the teenage girl and
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: called her sweetheart as he was slitting her throat. It
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: reminds me of what we read about sociopathy in the literature,
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: that there is a charming, a superficial, charming exterior that
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: hides a cold, calculated interior. And I think what may
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: have happened here is that bomb is one of these
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: men who just wanted to kill. He probably had been
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: thinking about it for a long long time. He fits
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: the profile of somebody who wants to do what we
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: call a thrill kill, meaning just the thrill of slitting
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: somebody's throat is something that excites him and captivates him.
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: And he comes home and these two teenagers are hanging
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: out with his girlfriend, smoking pot, and there it was.
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: There was this opportunity, Nancy. They could have been coming
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: in and out of his house for a long long
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: time while he plotted and planned. I don't think of
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: this as simply that he was jealous that they were
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: hanging out with his girlfriend. I think he was thinking
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: about this for a long time, and finally he had
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: his chance, you know, To Robin Wilenski, who is covering
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: the case with me, doctor Michelle Dupree, South Carolina medical examiner,
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: doctor Bethany Marshall, PSYCHOALIS out of California, Karen Smith, forensics expert,
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: Ashley Wilcott, judge lawyer at Ashley Wilcott dot com, and
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: Robin Wilensky crime on Line reporter to Karen Smith, forensics
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: expert throwing the bodies down a mine. Now my question
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: do you would be how do you get forensics off
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: a body that has been down a mine? Now this
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: is in Utah, so I don't know that there was
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: water in the bottom of the mine at all. I
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: assume that it was dry. I don't know. And you
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: know what my mind has been spinning with that question.
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: You know, my job description includes flying in helicopters, shore
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: going out in boats. Sure we do that too, but
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: you know, splunking down a mine shaft was not in
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: my job description. And I really don't know where I
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: would begin with something like this. How do you take photographs?
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: How do you collect evidence when you're in a harness?
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: I have no idea. Apparently, according to the the reports, they
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: were about one hundred feet down on a ledge. I
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: don't know what that means. I don't know what it
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: looked like. And our job is forensic investigators, is to
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: collect everything in its most Christine manner possible, especially for
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: the medical examiner to do their their findings. I don't
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: know how I would do something like that, Nancy, that's crazy, Yeah,
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: it's And if you don't know, I don't know who
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: would know. And doctor Michelle Dupree, South Carolina medical examiner,
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: author of Homicide Investigation Field Guide. I guess they sent
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: CSI Crimes and investigators down with harnesses to get the bodies,
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: decomposing bodies and bring them up after Bob's girlfriend, Morgan
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: Lewis finally comes clean and tells cops what happened. How
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: do you go about putting all those bones back together,
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: doctor Dupree? And trying to get physical lotus, And keep
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: in mind that this guy Jared Baum said that quote
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: he felt bad because he never had to kill an
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: innocent before. I want you to percolate on that, Bethany Marshall.
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: He never had to kill an innocent before number one,
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: suggesting there were other people he had to kill that
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: were not innocence, and his compulsion that he had to
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: do it why because they were over to his home uninvited.
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: Back to you, doctor Dupree, while doctor Bethany Marshall percolates
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: on that question, Doctor Dupree, how do you put all
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: those bones back together again? Actually, Nancy, as a medical examiner,
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: we do go to the scene of the crime. We
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: would be the ones in the harness going down that
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: ravine or going down in that well to Colessa Evidence
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: and collecsa body. It is difficult. I have propelled down
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: the sides of cliffs and mountains and things like that
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: to retrieve bodies before. And yes, we take a clean bag,
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: we take a clean sheet, and we try to collect
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: as much evidence that as surrounding the body as possible
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: to get it back up to a place where we
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: can then examine it and collect the evidence. As far
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: as putting the bones back together, we simply laid them
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: out on the table and you'd be surprised. It's not
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: that difficult, especially when you have a body that has
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: been tossed over a cliff and not dismembered, so to speak. Well,
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: doctor j pretty not difficult for you, difficult for me
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: to even think about it, Doctor Duprey. I was thinking
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: back on Kelly Anthony and how they were searching for
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: all of her bones and they worked around the clock
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: under a tent under bright lights at night. There are
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: two hundred how many bones are in the body, and
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: you certainly rattle that off the tip of your tongue.
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: I'm just thinking about how detectives sound out about this. Apparently,
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: Robin Willinski, they found a Facebook conversation between Riley and Henderson,
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: and that led them to be suspicious. You know, down
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: to doctor Bethanie Marshall, is that Lewis Morgan Lewis, the
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: girlfriend of this Nazi freak, got pulled over speeding and
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: just like spilled her guts. That's how they found everything out. Nancy,
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: she sat on this for a long time. She did
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: not go to the police. Apparently became despondent, suicidal. She
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: was in her car with an axe, I think a
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: knife rope. Apparently she was going to go to the desert,
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: take mushrooms and kill herself. I don't know if I
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: believe that story or she was simply speeding, but she
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: was pulled over and then she yeah, she spilled her guts,
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: told the police that she was tired of listening to that.
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: The families kept searching for these teenagers unsuccessfully. You know, Nancy,
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: I think Gerald Jared Baumb is just a serial killer
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: in the making. I think you talked about that. He
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: said that they were innocence. We talked about like sheep
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: to the slaughter. What kind of pattern do we see
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: with serial killers? Often they pick young couples lovers is
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: usually a sadistic, heinous quality to the crime. When about
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: sociopathy and serial killers that they commit acts of cruelty
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: to enhance their sexual arousal. It's a part of his
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: sexual offending pattern. And I think we can dressed the
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: story up as oh, he came home, he was jealous,
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: he found other people in his house. Yeah, I guess happen.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: We have a serial killer who was lying in wait
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: and these two quote unquote innocence were in his house
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: and they were just the low hanging fruit. And thank
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: god he's at trial now because I think he's one
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: of those people who could be quite prolific, and there
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: could have been other victims if he wasn't stopped. Well,
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: it's already qualifies as mass murder. More than one body
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: equals mass murder. To Robin will Lensky, Bomb's defense team
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: is going to reportedly challenge the girlfriend, Morgan Lewis's testimony,
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: climbing she's not credible. Do you believe her testimony will
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: hold up? I mean, you got to think about it.
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: My grandmother would say, you lay down with a dog,
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: you wake up with a lee. Birds of a feather
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: flock together. So why should I believe anything? She says,
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: I agree with Grandma, and I do believe she's credible.
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: I watched her entire testimony. I believe everything she says,
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: including one statement that he said that after he kicked
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: Riley the boy's body into the shaft, he said, goodbye, Riley,
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: you piece of sh I mean, you can't make that up. No,
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: you really can't. And the fact that she says the details,
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: that's what I look for, Ashley Willcott, when I'm trying
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: a case and I'm trying to determine credibility. Is is
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: their story rich in detail? For her to say they
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: were kneeling down on their knees and he said it'll
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: be okay, darling and slid her throat. That's not That's
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: not the stuff you just make up. No, it's not.
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: And she added additional details. For instance, she said, after
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: that happened, she felt something warm. She looked down. It
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: was the blood. She details the entire specific conversations between
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: the boyfriend and the girlfriend before the boyfriend was so,
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: I agree with you. Those are signs of credibility. Now,
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: the next piece that the prosecution has is, I promise
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: you she's made more than one statement. I promise She's
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: been interviewed more than once. And I know as well
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: as you do that that's another measure of credibility. Does
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: the story remain the same or does it change? And
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: if it remains the same, no reason in my mind
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: to doubt what she's saying. And you know what. You
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: pull up beside this guy at a red light. He
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: looks like everybody else, except for, of course, the swastika
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: tattooed on his face. Jared baumb This is step one
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: preliminary hearing God Willing you will rot in Hell Crime
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: Stories with Nancy Grace. Police and e Sat Louis are
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: investigating a preschool where children were allegedly told to strip
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: naked and stand in a closet. She didn't learn us anywhere.
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: This is what she tried and felt like it would
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: calm the children down by doing this, But it's obviously
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: it's a no teaching manual anywhere. It's inappropriate and actually
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: against the law to do this. The police chief says
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: they moved swiftly once they heard of those allegations. Within
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: a couple of hours, the teacher and her assistant were
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: removed from the classroom of twenty kids. It's believed four
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: of those children were victims of the punishment and were
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: told to strip naked and stand in a closet for
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: up to five to ten minutes as punishment. The chief
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: does not believe the children were physically or sexually harmed. Okay,
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: if you say so. Forcing little children, preschoolers to strip
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: naked and stand in a dark closet as punishment, and
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: that was to quote, calm the children down. I wonder
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: how that preschool teacher would feel we stripped her down
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: naked it for its artists, stand in a dark closet.
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: You think it would calm her down? Because it would
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: not call me down. It would make me krayz angry, Imancy, Grace,
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: this is crime stories. Thank you for being with us.
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: I guarantee you this much. I guarantee the parents of
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: those preschoolers had no idea that that was the punishment.
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: I can guarantee you that a teacher forcing a four
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: year four year old preschoolers to strip naked and stand
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: in a dark closet as punishment, and not only did
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: she do that, another teacher stood by and watched and
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: did nothing with me an all star panel, Doctor William Moroney,
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: renowned medical examiner, author of America narcan on Amazon, psychologist
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: Karen Stark at Karen dot com joining us from Manhattan
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: with me. Robin will Lensky joining me. Crime online dot
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: Com investigative reporter, author of Beautiful Life, the CSI behind
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: the Casey Anthony Trial, and Kathleen Murphy, North Carolina family
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: lawyer Kathleen Murphy. Before I get into the facts, what
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: do you make of this? You're the family lawyer. You
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: ever heard this from one of your cases that children
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: are forced to strip naked and stand in a dark closet. Never?
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: And Nancy, you have the best listeners in the world,
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: the best. We need to find out who we should
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: call to make sure ay these teachers are named and
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: be their prosecutor. Yeah. To Robert Willinsky, crime online dot
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: Com investigative reporter and author of Beautiful Life. Robin Willinski,
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: how come the teachers aren't being named? I don't get it.
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: You know, that's a great question, and I don't know
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: the answer. Normally, in cases like this, we hear the
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: names and we can find out the names. But in
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: this case, Nancy, they are not releasing the names of
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: this twenty six year old teacher. She'd worked at the
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: school for three years. And then the other lady is
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: forty one, the one who knew about it, looked on
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: and did nothing. And I have to tell you, I
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: agree with you. This was done allegedly to keep the
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: kids calm, and this was their punishment for trouble. It
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: doesn't keep a kid calm. This creates anxiety, I guess.
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: So think about it, Robin, do you want to get
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: stripped down and forced to go stand in a closet
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: with a bunch of other people Because I don't absolutely not.
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: That would absolutely have the opposite effect on me. I
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: would imagine that these children, Nancy, were far from calm
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: when they came out of the closet. This is the
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: kind of thing that creates terrible dreams and night terrors
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: and something you never get over for the rest of
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: your life. To doctor William Maroney, medical examine or author
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: of American Narcan, doctor Maroney, not only are you an
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: MD a doctor, but you're also a dad. I can't
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: imagine anything that would be make your heart race more
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: than a running one hundred yard dash. Is forcing a
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: child to take off all their clothes and stand in
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: a dark closet with other naked children. I mean their
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: pulses were racing. I think the important thing about safety
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: here is children can fall down. You lock them in
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: a dark closet, they can get hurt. You take off
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: their clothes, they can get hurt. That's the physical damage.
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: But your previous guest just said damaged for life. These
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: are adverse childhood events that lead you to distrust people.
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: It can lead you into drug addiction, it can lead
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: you into separation, anxiety. There is so much trauma from
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: this little event that somebody would say, oh, well, you know,
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: we were just trying to calm them down. This doesn't
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: calm people down. This damages their spirits for life and unhealthy.
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: It's terribly unhealthy and I'm gonna shriek, but I know
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: that much. And Karen Stark talk about lifelong damage. Karen
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: Stark joining us at a Manhattan psychologist. You can find
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: her at Karen Stark dot com. Karen, as much as
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: we try to tell children, oh, your body is healthy,
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: it's nothing to be ashamed of. Sure, you're great, you're beautiful,
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: you're perfect, and then as punishment you make them take
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: their clothes off. That's punishment to be naked. That's not
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: good it's awful, Nancy. There's something that's very sado masochistic
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: about what they did. This was more about the people
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: in charge getting off in some way. I hate to
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: say this, but it's true on this punishment than it
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: was about calming the children down. For the children, this
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: is something that will absolutely stay with them because they
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: do know about their bodies, and they know that their
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: bodies should be closed, and so they deal with shame
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: and humiliation and something they can't possibly understand. Can you
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: even imagine how mad I would be. I would chew
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: a nail in half if somebody did this to John
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: David and Lucy. You were not kidding. Take a listen
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: to our friend at NBC two. This is Sarah Mocky.
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: They're in East Saint Louis. Is a letter that administrators
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: sent to parents late last week outlining a complaint here
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: at the SIU Edwardsville Headstart, housed inside the Jackie Joyner
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: Kersey Center. Investigators say that four students were subjected to
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: inappropriate discipline, force to take off their clothes and stand
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: alone inside a closet. Michelle Mitchell leaves the Jackie Joyner
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: Kersey Center her two sons by her side as they
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: always are. I can't do a daycare ever again. Mitchell
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: says she's had problems with daycare centers in the past,
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: so she stays home now to take care of her kids.
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: It's not worth it to me. I want my keys
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: to grow up and have a full life without anything
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: like this traumatizing. SIU. Edwardsville Police Chief Kevin Schmall says
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: his department started to investigate staff when a student told
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: their parents about the discipline. They have now identified four
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: victims and one young witness, but it is possible there
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: will be more kids involved. I want to emphasize how
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: brave these little kids have been coming forward and talking
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: to us about these incidents. People always look at me
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: like I'm overreacting, my overprotective with my keys. I don't
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: care what they say. No more, I don't and don't
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: make a difference because look at all stuff that happen
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: in the news today. Because this case involves so many kids,
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: the chief says that they're going to partner with child
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: interview experts when they sit down and talk with the
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: kids next month, and at that time there could be
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: criminal charges in this case. Southern Illinois University at Edwardsville
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: is in charge of several head start centers across the area,
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: including one right here at the Jackie Joyner Kersey Center.
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: It's a believe this is where the incidents happened last week. Now.
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: The chief of the Siue Police, Kevin Schmall, told me
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: they moved swiftly once they heard of the allegations, within
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: a couple of hours to teach her, nor assistant or
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: removed from the classroom of twenty kids. It's believed for
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: the children are victims the unusual punishment. There could be
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: other victims, though the investigation is far from over. The
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: chief does believe there are no other suspects at this time.
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: The teachers a twenty six year old woman. Her assistant
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: is a forty one year old female. Neither is new
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: to the program. The chief does not believe the children
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: were physically or sexually harmed, he said. The teacher admitted
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: to the punishment. He credits a young boy for coming
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: forward and revealing what was going on. Very hard, especially
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: it's your teacher. You know, you have a lot of
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: pitrust far and everything, and to especially go up against
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: your teacher and say something about what was going on.
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: But it was the right thing for that little boy
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: to do. He's very brave by coming forward and telling
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: his mother what happened. Now, Siue just send a letter
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: two parents of the kids involved in this program, and
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: they said the safety and well being of the children
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: as their top concerned. They say, no, under no circumstances
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: does a program condone or tolerate inappropriate treatment towards children,
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: families or staff. You're hearing our friends at Fox to
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: Saint Louis. That was reporter Rocky Madden talking. So one
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: little boy comes forward in the whole thing cracks wide open.
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: This is the Jackie Joiner Cursey Headstart program. Now, for
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: those of you that don't know, head Start is a
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: program here within the US in the Department of Health
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: and Human Services that gives early childhood education at very
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: young ages. It gives health and nutrition, It feeds the children.
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: And this is for low income children and their families.
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: Trying to give them a quote head Start to foster
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: family relationships, help the children's physical and emotional well being,
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: develop a strong cognitive skill set, to help them get
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: into preschool and elementary school learning things they may not
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: have the opportunity to learn at home. This is for
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: low income families. So we know that these children are
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: coming from homes where they don't have much. They're trying
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: to give them a leg up to get them on
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: equal footing with other children they'll be in school with
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: later on. And this is what happens to these children
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: who are already at a disadvantage in life. They get
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: treated like this. I'm so mad, I could you a
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: nail and a half Robert Wilensky. Not only that I
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: understand that these horrible people are put on leave with pay.
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: I mean, how outrageous is this? You know they call
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: it the head start program, Nancy. This is a false start,
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: an absolute false start for these children that they will
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: never get over. And you know what I want to know.
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: I want to know what happened to the other sixteen kids.
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: There's a total of twenty in the class. For that
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: they know how to strip and be in the closet,
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: and what about the other sixteen? And I'd like to see,
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: you know, if they would install a camera in this classroom.
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: What else has gone on? I mean, who thought of this?
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: Who comes up with such a horrendous you know, tell
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: the kids quiet down now, put some nice comming music
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: on and go sit in the time out corner with
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: your clothes on, not in the closet naked, to strip
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: and humiliate you. To Kathleen Murphy, I wonder about the
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: other children two, but I've never heard of anything like
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: this before. Making the children's strip naked and go stand
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: in a dark closet to calm them down. It is
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: criminal and it is so mentally sick of these teachers
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: who may even be parents. Let's see what kind of
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: parents they really are at home too, Nancy. If that
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: happened to one of my children or one of the
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: little lads in my neighborhood, I would be up in arms,
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: and your listeners need to be up in arms. Well,
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: I mean, think about it, Kathleen. Why would we treat
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: this with child victims differently than we would adults. What
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: if somebody got you stripped, it made you stripped naked?
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: Is humiliation, probably in front of the whole class and
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: walk naked into the closet and being a dark punishment,
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: maybe prosecuted dart right, they would be. So why is
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: this different because their child victims? And as far as
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: these two headstart teachers a not having their names public,
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: they're still getting paid. Listen to our friend at CBS four.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: Gilma evalis an investigation underway after police say preschoolers were
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: forced to strip naked and stand in a closet as
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: part of punishment for misbehaving. Children would misbehave in the class,
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: This teacher would have them disrobe and make them stand
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: inside of a closet for about five or ten minutes.
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: Its allegedly happened in Saint Louis at a Headstart program
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: operated by Southern Illinois University Edwardsville at the Jackie Join
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: or Kersey Center. Police say four students ages four and
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: five were disciplined in this way, and that this had
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: been going on since early February but was just reported
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: to them last week. The twenty six year old allegedly
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: behind this incident has been teaching at the school for
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: three years. A second teacher, a forty one year old
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: who has been with the program for five years, was
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: put on paid administrative leave for allegedly witnessing the punishment
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: and not reporting it. That's right, That is right. Two
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: preschool teachers are paid administrative leave. At a head Start
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: program located in Southern Illinois University, a twenty six year
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: old teacher punishing the students by making them strip down
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: and stand naked in a dark closet. She had been
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: working there for three years. A forty one year old
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: instructor given paid leave for witnessing it and doing nothing
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: about it. Then time passes, nobody said a word until
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: one of the little boys told Mommy, why are they
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: keeping these teachers names a secret? We don't know? And
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: a twenty six year old going on twenty seven and
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: a forty one year old teacher. I bet Jackie Joyner
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: Kersey has no idea that the head start named in
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: her honor is doing something like this. These children just
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: four and five years old. A parent complained after hearing
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: the story from her son, leading police to get involved.
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: Is it true, Robert Willinsky? There was a lag time
• 34:11
  Speaker 1: nobody would found out about it until the little boy
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: told his mom, well, that's right, Nancy. Here we are,
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: you know, in March, already past Saint Patrick's Day. And
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: this had allegedly been going on since the beginning of February.
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: And I bet when they get to the rest of
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: the interviews they have not his parents that is first
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: taking place. Some of these interviews scheduled for the month
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: of April, and I bet when they sit down in
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: the proper psychological setting with the medical professionals, you're going
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: to hear more unseemly details that have gone on in
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: that classroom. So to you, Kathleen Murphy, North Carolina trial lawyer,
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: what charges do you believe can be bought brought against
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: these teachers? Criminally misdemeanor child abuse? Unfortunately, it could be
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: sealony child abuse if there's a pattern of disbehavior or
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: repeated incidents of disbehavior. I'd love to see some salony
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: child abuse. It's mental abuse, it's physical abuse, and it
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: should be addressed appropriately by the prosecutor. And Jackie Joyner
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: Kersey should be outraged that our center in her name
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: is part of this. Take a listen to our friend
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: Russell kinseaul A k M. The two preschool teachers are
• 35:28
  Speaker 1: a paid administrative leave. They are teachers with the Headstart
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: program operated by Southern Illinois University Edwardsville, SIUE, and it
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: is housed here at the Jackie joined Kersey Center. Any
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: Saint Louis and I would be outraged. I would be
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: appalled and completely upset. People are expressing outrage when they
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: find out a Headstart teacher if that should have been
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: helping students learn, as accused of humiliating them instead of
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: protecting children. She's accused of child abuse. Children would misbehave
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: in the class. This teacher would have them disrobe, im
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: hey them stand inside of a closet for bof over
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: ten minutes. Police say four students, ages four and five
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: in the head Start program at the Jackie Joyner Kersey
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: Center were disciplined this way. As a mother myself, I
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: can't believe they will let something like this go on.
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: Police believe this had been going on since early February,
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: but only learned about it last week. We felt that
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: as very inappropriate and possibly there is some criminal actions
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: charges that could come as a result of this. Something
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: needs to be not at a teachers. They should be
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: disciplined as far as what's going on. The teacher accused
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: of disciplining students by forcing them to take their clothes
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: off is twenty six years old and has been teaching
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: at the preschool three years. A forty one year old
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: teacher who's been there five years was also put on
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: paid administrative leave for allegedly witnessing the children being humiliated,
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: but never reporting it. You send your kids off to
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: school or places. We wait as justice unfolds. Nancy Grace
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories, signing off, goodbye friend,