Latest / Rusty's Garage / Wayne Gardner (Part 2)

Transcript

Wayne Gardner (Part 2) · Rusty's Garage

• 0:02
  A listener production.
• 0:20
  G'day everybody, Rusty here, all set for part two of my pod with WG, Wayne Gardner, the Wollongong whiz.
• 0:27
  If you haven't heard part one, make sure you head back to the library and give it a listen.
• 0:31
  From humble family beginnings, finding a wrecked bike for a few bucks that started the dream, to his early days, motorcycle racing in Australia, and the big decision to have a crack at taking on the world.
• 0:44
  It's all there right now.
• 0:46
  We begin part two with the reaction to his success back down under and how it would change life forever.
• 0:56
  Yeah, it kind of just snowballed, to be honest.
• 1:00
  You know, this was before... Well, this was just when TV was churning in and with SBS and Channel 9 and so on.
• 1:06
  So the sport here in Australia was very unknown and probably the greatest thing that...
• 1:18
  that Nick Hartgrink, the journalist from Wollongong here, and myself did, was I employed Nick part-time while he worked at the Illawar Mercury, was to go out and I said to Nick, when I was knocking on doors and sponsors, everyone would go, Wayne who?
• 1:36
  Or road racing?
• 1:37
  What's that?
• 1:38
  And no one knew anything about it.
• 1:39
  So I said to Nick, I want to change the...
• 1:44
  the public perception of what this is about.
• 1:48
  Because when you say motorbikes, they think of bikies.
• 1:50
  And it's nothing that.
• 1:51
  It's colourful and bright and beautiful to watch.
• 1:53
  And it's like ballet, you know, to music, watching road racing.
• 1:58
  It's gorgeous, you know.
• 1:59
  And it's thrilling and it's exciting for the spectators and it's great TV.
• 2:04
  So we then I said, Nick, I want you not to get into the revs or the motorcycle news magazines.
• 2:09
  I don't care about that because that'll happen naturally.
• 2:12
  I said, I want you to go and get in all the men's magazines, the women's magazines, the This Is Your Life or whatever it is, you know, everything but motorcycle magazines because that will take care of itself.
• 2:23
  So we did and then, of course, once we started getting into the HQ mags, et cetera, et cetera, yeah.
• 2:31
  we started getting a whole lot of interest in the sport.
• 2:35
  And then the sponsors, like the beer companies, started coming and knocking on my door.
• 2:40
  Wow, we want to be involved in this.
• 2:42
  And so I went, that's better.
• 2:43
  That's how it should be, you know.
• 2:45
  So we changed the image here in Australia, Nick and I, of what the sport is about.
• 2:50
  And once TV came in and good commentary, you know, by Barry and everyone else around and yourself.
• 2:58
  And it all kind of just rolled on from there.
• 3:00
  And then, of course, I was going getting the results in the World Championship and riding it.
• 3:06
  the highest level there is for motorcycle racing.
• 3:08
  And media started to grow.
• 3:12
  And, yeah, look at certainly in Australia, I changed the face of the sport in this country.
• 3:18
  And Phillip Island Circuit turned up because of my career.
• 3:21
  And Eastern Creek, that was made because of my career.
• 3:25
  So without...
• 3:27
  Without my career happening in the beginning, the whole sport wouldn't be what it is now in this country.
• 3:32
  We wouldn't have a Doohan.
• 3:34
  We wouldn't have had a Casey Stoner and Bayliss and all the rest of them.
• 3:38
  So it's amazing how it all evolved around just a few key points as it's gone along.
• 3:44
  And as I said, now looking back, it looks like it was just meant to happen.
• 3:47
  It's certainly not planned.
• 3:49
  You've kept the 87 bike, which I love.
• 3:52
  It's here in the country.
• 3:54
  Wonderful for the boys, wonderful legacy for Australian motorcycle racing in this country.
• 3:58
  No doubt there were some good conversations with Mr. Aguma from Honda in relation to that.
• 4:05
  Often the Japanese back then and even earlier didn't like riders and drivers to keep the car or the bike.
• 4:12
  They preferred to kind of get rid of them.
• 4:13
  Was that a difficult conversation?
• 4:14
  How hard was it to convince them to let you keep that?
• 4:16
  Well, that was a point when that mentality or that way of thinking by Honda was, and all the manufacturers, was to destroy all the bikes after it.
• 4:27
  Which is a crime to us, mate, isn't it?
• 4:28
  Yes, it is a crime.
• 4:30
  It is a crime.
• 4:32
  And they weren't thinking about keeping them and putting them in museums.
• 4:36
  So as the history of the sport, they just wanted to safeguard their secrets and the brand name and safeguard everything.
• 4:45
  So everything was pulled apart and either destroyed or melted down or whatever.
• 4:50
  So it was a long case of, you know, please, please, you can't destroy this stuff.
• 4:57
  It's priceless, you know.
• 4:59
  And so then their mentality has changed and then, of course, then they started helping the riders and giving bikes and so on from there.
• 5:05
  But that took a lot of years to get across and it's a pity because I would have loved to have, you know, one of every bike of every year like my leathers here, you know.
• 5:13
  So, but anyway, I don't.
• 5:15
  I've still got, obviously, I've still got many, many bikes, but now I'm collecting them all and putting my own private museum together, you know, so it's good.
• 5:23
  That's terrific.
• 5:24
  I'm glad you bring up Phillip Island because the whole inertia behind that off the back of the 87 title win, it must have gone crazy.
• 5:30
  When did you first get the sense of, okay, this project that is being undertaken, you were heavily involved in it.
• 5:37
  When did that kind of really start to click into gear?
• 5:40
  I mean, 89, we saw the end result of all that wonderful hard work.
• 5:45
  The fact that you were able to win the race was the crowning glory, but so much went into it, WG.
• 5:51
  Yeah, well, a guy called Bob Barnard contacted me and just said, look, we've got, I think it was about an 87, 86, 87, 87, 88 maybe.
• 6:00
  And he just said 87.
• 6:02
  He said, look, you know...
• 6:09
  Everyone knows you.
• 6:10
  Everyone knows the sport.
• 6:11
  You've done a great job.
• 6:12
  TV's up now.
• 6:15
  All the magazines are following the sport now.
• 6:18
  Sponsors are coming in, et cetera, et cetera.
• 6:21
  So he said the sport's got a big...
• 6:24
  It's very interesting and the people love it.
• 6:26
  And he said, I'm involved in the Adelaide F1, but I think that you've got yourself and I can see Mick's coming as well.
• 6:34
  So it must have been about 88.
• 6:37
  And he said, I've got a...
• 6:42
  I want to have a GP in Australia.
• 6:44
  I need your help, your support with the government.
• 6:48
  I've got to find the right track.
• 6:50
  I think I know the right one, et cetera, et cetera.
• 6:54
  I need you to go out and, you know, give me, support me vocally with the media and, you know, that we're going to build a circuit.
• 7:04
  This is my idea.
• 7:05
  And I said, okay.
• 7:06
  I said, where do you think out?
• 7:07
  He said, I've got an idea down at Phillip Island.
• 7:09
  It's a dirt track.
• 7:11
  and, well, it's a broken down track, but I think it's going to be amazing.
• 7:14
  And I went, oh, yeah, I don't think so.
• 7:16
  And he goes, yeah, yeah, yeah, come and have a look.
• 7:18
  So I zoomed down there and had a look and I looked and I went, there's all sheep wandering across it.
• 7:22
  And I said, mate, you're not going to have a race here.
• 7:24
  It's all broken up tarmac, you know, and dirt.
• 7:28
  And I said, I think you're dreaming.
• 7:30
  He said, yeah, I'm going to have it ready for next year for 89.
• 7:33
  So it must have been 88.
• 7:35
  And I said, no chance.
• 7:38
  It's not going to happen.
• 7:38
  He goes, yeah, I will, I will, I will.
• 7:41
  Oh, great.
• 7:41
  Well, he said, well, you sort of bought me.
• 7:43
  I went, okay, all right.
• 7:45
  So he had me talking to government representatives and pushing the wheelbarrow on financial side and helping him and I did running around to all the radio stations around Australia and newspapers and magazines, et cetera, et cetera.
• 8:02
  spinning the good news.
• 8:03
  And, yeah, and then he made it and the first time I rode it, I went, oh, my God, this is amazing.
• 8:10
  This is an amazing track, Bob.
• 8:12
  And he goes, really?
• 8:12
  I said, yeah, so fast.
• 8:15
  And it's sliding.
• 8:16
  It's like dirt track but on the bitumen.
• 8:18
  I said, this is great.
• 8:20
  I love it, you know.
• 8:21
  So then I couldn't wait to obviously go racing.
• 8:25
  He had still a few things to do.
• 8:26
  And then, of course, the first event was coming up.
• 8:29
  And then I felt like I'd...
• 8:31
  spoken about it so much and talked about the track so much and praised Bob and praised the event and tried to get as many people in attendance as we could.
• 8:43
  And we had 100,000 spectators in 89 and it was just packed.
• 8:47
  And then, of course, there was a lot of pressure on me then and I didn't think I had the bike
• 8:53
  to do it because it was quite hard to ride.
• 8:55
  But I went in there going, well, I don't know if I'm going to do this.
• 8:58
  And I think I had someone crashed in front of me, Rudroff crashed in the practice in front of me and I fell over.
• 9:07
  But the bike was okay and I wasn't hurt luckily.
• 9:09
  And then, of course, the race started and I think Schwanz was in pole position, I think.
• 9:15
  He was fast around there.
• 9:17
  And on the first lap, first lap, I think, or second lap, he high-sided right in front of me and I went, because I was a bit tender in the first few laps.
• 9:25
  But as I started seeing him fall over, I went, hmm, I've got a chance here.
• 9:30
  And then I just started pacing myself out and caught up to the leaders.
• 9:33
  And then I think the lead changed like 18 times or 19 times during the race.
• 9:40
  and there was five guys fighting for the lead.
• 9:43
  And, yeah, I just kept fighting hard, never giving up, and I pushed hard, as hard as I could, and I could hear the people and I could see the 100,000 people in peripheral vision, you know, as I'm going around the track, and I could see them, yeah, screaming.
• 10:00
  I could hear the roar of the people and, of course, trying to keep everything, you know, millimetre perfect,
• 10:08
  and I went on to a great victory, only by not a lot, just a little bit.
• 10:14
  So obviously I came across the line and I went, oh, my God, I've done it.
• 10:18
  There was a lot of pressure on me and all that hard work that I put in because I remember before I went out, I said, Donna, I don't have the energy to do this because I've just travelled around Australia for three months
• 10:31
  praising the event and to get everybody to go there.
• 10:33
  And of course, I didn't have the energy to do it, but she says, come on, you can do it, you can do it, you just forget about it.
• 10:38
  Think of the fans.
• 10:40
  Think how proud they're going to be.
• 10:41
  And, okay, so National Pride came in and kicked in during the race and I could see them, as I said, in the peripheral vision and pushed me on, pushed myself, pushed my limits, pushed the bike's limits.
• 10:53
  two went on to a hard-fought victory and what an emotional moment that was.
• 10:58
  And then all the crowd poured onto the track and came up and then I went up to the podium and Bob was up there and I'm spraying the champagne on Bob and filling him in with champagne and drinking it and, yeah, it was an amazing moment, amazing moment in my life and in the sports career and, yeah,
• 11:18
  And, you know, luckily I've got thousands of photos here to relive that and videos as well.
• 11:23
  And so, yeah, amazing, amazing time in my life, amazing time.
• 11:29
  You know, I'd been world champion by then and then to go out and win my home Grand Prix and then win it again the following year was just amazing.
• 11:38
  an amazing moment in my life, and particularly on home soil.
• 11:42
  It's like winning in your own backyard.
• 11:43
  That's pretty special because the support of the people and then the sport.
• 11:48
  And I remember leaving the track on Monday and then there was big signs up on the roads and over the bridge going off the ball and Scott, Wayne for PM.
• 11:56
  And I'm thinking, this is going to be interesting.
• 12:00
  So I thought one day I might end up in Parliament, you know, as the PM.
• 12:04
  But I don't want that job.
• 12:07
  But it was a nice recognition of what happened on the weekend and everyone just loved it and, you know, and it etched my name in stone forever, you know, in that moment.
• 12:17
  So a pretty special moment.
• 12:19
  And the fact that we now have this classic but world-class venue that motorcycle racers around the world love coming to, it's probably hard to...
• 12:29
  to pinpoint one.
• 12:31
  I mean, you had your first GP win in Spain, you won the world title as you recounted in 87, but is that win on home soil in 89, is that the one that in your mind is just that, you know, that just set apart from the rest?
• 12:45
  From exposure and from a special moment and it's etched in everyone's minds, including mine, yes, because there was a lot of hard work that went into it.
• 12:57
  Between Bob and myself, I mean, we made that track, you know, and I was talking it through with him in the corners and whatever.
• 13:05
  But as I said, when I wrote it, I went, wow, this is amazing.
• 13:08
  And I said to Bob, you're not going to finish this in time.
• 13:11
  He said, you'll see, we will.
• 13:12
  They worked all night.
• 13:14
  many nights, you know.
• 13:15
  So he did.
• 13:16
  He pulled it off and I pulled it off.
• 13:18
  And so it was a great partnership at that point.
• 13:22
  And then, of course, the following year in 90, I won again.
• 13:28
  You know, that 89 was a special moment in Australian history and in my history.
• 13:34
  But the following year in 90 was probably one of the most personal gratifying moments of my life because I won with a broken wrist.
• 13:45
  As you can see, the scar on my wrist there, I had a screw put in my skateboard on the Monday after I won the race.
• 13:53
  The fairing was hanging off it.
• 13:55
  I was not in good shape because I broke it.
• 13:58
  one week or two weeks before in Bruno, and I raced with a broken wrist and got second.
• 14:03
  And my plan was to only go out and do five laps and come in because I can't – the vibration was killing my fingers and my wrist.
• 14:14
  But I don't know.
• 14:15
  When Mick was in the lead in 89 –
• 14:18
  A 90, sorry.
• 14:19
  I went, I can't have this.
• 14:21
  I can't have another Australian winning my race.
• 14:25
  So I don't know.
• 14:26
  I found something special inside me that came out.
• 14:30
  I exercised my fingers down the straight at 330 kilometres an hour.
• 14:34
  for a few laps.
• 14:35
  I lost five seconds on Mick and then I went, I'm going to give it one last shot here, you know, and see if I can catch him.
• 14:42
  And I did.
• 14:43
  I caught up and passed Mick and went on to win by about half a second.
• 14:47
  So that was personally a very, very satisfying moment because...
• 14:54
  I had to fight the pain.
• 14:55
  I was in excruciating pain.
• 14:57
  I had pain injections in my wrist, but that didn't do much after about five laps.
• 15:02
  I had the fairing hanging off, and it wouldn't go down in a straight line because it was trying to push off to the left because the fairing was dropping down.
• 15:10
  The flag masters were trying to black flag me because the fairing was on the ground, and luckily they didn't.
• 15:15
  They just kept...
• 15:16
  I didn't even know how bad it was, but I know that I couldn't keep the bike straight, and I was having to ride it crossed up down the straight,
• 15:23
  because they're going so fast, the front wheel's virtually in the air, so it was really hard to hold it in a straight line.
• 15:30
  And on top of that, every time I went for the break, they carried 2G.
• 15:33
  In other words, two times your body weight is on your wrist.
• 15:36
  So it was excruciating.
• 15:37
  I kept saying, deal with the pain after, deal with the pain after, deal with the pain after.
• 15:41
  And so I took myself mentally out of the pain.
• 15:45
  and into just concentrating and thinking and dealing because I allocated time after the race to deal with the issue then and it changed my mentality during the race and I could ride through that pain barrier and ignore the pain and went on to win with the fairing hanging off and a victory that I don't even know how I did it.
• 16:08
  I have no idea.
• 16:08
  I had one of those special moments when I was riding when I kind of had an out-of-body experience
• 16:13
  experience and everything went on autopilot.
• 16:16
  I was just riding but I was there but I wasn't, it was just all happening without me knowing, you know what I mean?
• 16:22
  And, you know, I've heard of this happening before and I had it there just for half a lap or a lap.
• 16:28
  I went, wow, this is spooky.
• 16:30
  I could actually come up above it and see myself.
• 16:33
  It was the most amazing experience I've ever had.
• 16:36
  But everything kind of went on autopilot because it was mind over presence, if that makes sense.
• 16:44
  And I haven't told too many people all that in the past, but it was true, you know.
• 16:48
  And then...
• 16:51
  I knew the situation, I got plus or minuses, I knew Mick was behind me, but I tried to make it really accurate and just deal with the pain and not make one single mistake on the last lap.
• 17:01
  I had about half a second over Mick on the last lap and went on to that victory.
• 17:06
  So that was probably one of my greatest personal moments was that, beating the mighty Mick and even with the broken wrist and the ferry hanging off the bike.
• 17:15
  That was a special moment.
• 17:17
  And then, of course, the next day, Didier, there was Wayne for PM all around on the bridges again.
• 17:24
  And then I flew back to Sydney on the Monday and then Didier de Rodriguez, my mate, he rang me and he said, oh, how's your wrist?
• 17:31
  I said, oh, it's sore.
• 17:32
  today and really saw and he said uh if i was you um i'd go and get an x-ray because he said you know mine i had the similar thing in it you can lose the use of your wrist i went oh that's bullshit and he goes yeah no no do it so i went when i was in sydney when i arrived i went straight over the north shore hospital and i had an x-ray and i even remember the doctor dr tonkin
• 17:53
  And I visited him and took an x-ray and he said, wow, that's in really bad shape.
• 17:58
  I said, oh really?
• 17:58
  He said, yeah, your scaphoid bone is fractured through the middle and it's eroding away and you're going to lose the use of your wrist if I don't fix this now.
• 18:08
  And I went, wow.
• 18:09
  And he said, get into bed now.
• 18:11
  So we're operating tonight.
• 18:13
  So they opened my wrist up and they opened me up on my hip ear
• 18:19
  Yeah.
• 18:19
  See here?
• 18:20
  Left hip?
• 18:21
  Yeah, they opened me up and they hammered off some bone off my pelvis and they then packed it in here and then put a thing called a herbert screw in it and screwed it in with left and right thread.
• 18:34
  And they pulled it all together and so on.
• 18:35
  And I woke up in the morning with like, oh...
• 18:38
  Which truck hit me, you know, during the night.
• 18:41
  I couldn't walk, obviously, and I had this in a sling.
• 18:44
  Anyway, yeah, so if they didn't operate, I would have lost the use of my wrist and I wouldn't be able to go road racing anymore.
• 18:51
  So it was a necessary thing.
• 18:53
  But basically I shouldn't have been doing so much.
• 18:55
  I should have had my hand in a cast, but I just refused to because I wanted to win Phillip Island.
• 19:00
  So, yeah, no, it was a – personally, it was one of the greatest moments, you know, of my life.
• 19:07
  It was winning that against all the odds and the challenges along the way, you know, and to all the greatest riders are with me.
• 19:14
  So, you know, that kind of told me that I had a little bit more left up my sleeve, you know, if I need to.
• 19:19
  Thank you, mate.
• 19:19
  Very vivid recollection there.
• 19:21
  I love it.
• 19:22
  NSR 500.
• 19:25
  You know, in motorcycle racing, I mean, this is probably a two-part question.
• 19:29
  Firstly, you've touched on the fact there were some unbelievable names that you were competing against, beating during that period.
• 19:36
  It was a great period for the sport.
• 19:38
  And the bike is held in such sort of folklore.
• 19:42
  But a bike that took a lot of taming, development, and really at the end of your time, you know, it was arguably at, you know, maybe at a zenith at that stage or something.
• 19:55
  Yeah, when I left the sport in the end of 92, the Honda had gone through a complete evolution.
• 20:03
  Different chassis, different engine.
• 20:05
  We had the Big Bang engine.
• 20:10
  We copied Suzuki's theory of lifting the engine up and bringing the centre of gravity up because Honda always had this idea it had to be like an F1 car with the centre of gravity down.
• 20:20
  And once we did that, I mean, that was done when we were...
• 20:25
  My motorhome had mirrored windows in my motorhome.
• 20:28
  It's a good story, this.
• 20:29
  Yes, it is.
• 20:30
  And it's a true story.
• 20:31
  And I kept complaining about our bike had massive understeer, massive understeer.
• 20:36
  Take away the understeer and easy win, you know.
• 20:39
  And they go, no, no, no, no, no.
• 20:41
  And then they change the rotation of the crankshaft forward, backwards.
• 20:45
  And they go, no, it didn't change anything.
• 20:47
  You know, it's not changing.
• 20:49
  and then they put counterbalance wheels inside the engine and we went through all these changes and I'm going, no, no, that's not it.
• 20:57
  And one day at the Le Mans GP, Suzuki's, Schwanz's bike van was next to us and they had their awning.
• 21:04
  That was when they had awnings off the side.
• 21:06
  And it was a really hot day, you know, like 40-degree day and I had the big motorhome with mirrored windows in it and you couldn't see in and we could look out.
• 21:15
  And here it is, this bike's all undressed up on the bench.
• 21:19
  And I went, wow, look at that.
• 21:20
  That's amazing.
• 21:22
  So I went out and got, I think it was Mr. Tonota, one of the bosses of Honda HRC.
• 21:26
  And I said, come here, come and have a look at this.
• 21:29
  I said, we're having, still got the same bike, the same problem.
• 21:32
  And we're not fixing it.
• 21:33
  We're not getting anywhere.
• 21:34
  So I went and got him and they're coming in.
• 21:36
  He went, oh, very interesting.
• 21:38
  Yeah.
• 21:39
  Oh, just a minute.
• 21:40
  And he runs back and he gets a camera and he come and sat down at my table, my motorhome, and just sat there and photographed that bike all day.
• 21:48
  He had about 10 rolls.
• 21:49
  And I came back after and I said, how did you get on?
• 21:52
  Oh, he had 10 rolls of film.
• 21:56
  And I went, oh, this is, Honda don't like this story, by the way.
• 22:01
  And they went, oh, so he took it back.
• 22:04
  And then so about two or three weeks later, I said, oh, did you have a look?
• 22:10
  Yeah, very interesting, Wayne's son.
• 22:13
  I said, oh, why?
• 22:15
  Oh, different theory than we have.
• 22:17
  Our idea is always down low weight.
• 22:19
  I said, yes, that's right.
• 22:21
  And I said, and that makes understeer.
• 22:23
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 22:25
  So, okay.
• 22:26
  He said, but very interesting.
• 22:27
  This is up high like a motocross bike, you know, and big rear fork angle for grip and fork out.
• 22:33
  And we have 21 degree fork angle then, which is ridiculously too sharp.
• 22:38
  I'm trying to make this thing turn.
• 22:40
  And, oh, big difference.
• 22:42
  I said, okay, well, what are you going to do about it?
• 22:44
  Oh, nothing.
• 22:45
  And I went, no, no, no, you're going to do something about it because there's something dramatically wrong with our chassis.
• 22:52
  No, no, no, no, nothing.
• 22:53
  Our bike, you can still win.
• 22:55
  I said, no, I'm riding my nuts off, mate.
• 22:57
  You know, I can't do this anymore.
• 22:59
  I'm like, I'm on the edge.
• 23:00
  Mm-hmm.
• 23:02
  um of you know not coming home and he goes oh no no you can do it you can do it i said no no no no no no i want changes oh okay okay okay you want to change i said yes okay i said why can't you cut and change the chassis and push it out and lift it up and uh rear fork down more etc etc oh we don't want to i said i want you to
• 23:25
  oh, okay, okay, okay.
• 23:27
  So then they went away and they got one of my chassis and they cut the steering head out and put it out and they lifted the thing up and they modified it as a hack job, you know, and just to see what they got.
• 23:37
  And I went and rode it one day and he said, oh, look, this one's up.
• 23:40
  It's up 30 millimetre higher.
• 23:42
  It's rear fork angles now, you know.
• 23:46
  Our forks were 11 degrees, but now we've got like 13-degree fork angle now or 14 or 15 or something, and I went...
• 23:55
  Okay.
• 23:55
  And, oh, now front fog is now 24 degrees.
• 23:58
  Now before 21.
• 23:59
  I went, and?
• 24:01
  Let me try it.
• 24:02
  And they went, oh, okay, okay.
• 24:03
  I rode around and I come back and I said, mate, this is unbelievable.
• 24:07
  And they went, really?
• 24:08
  I said, yes, this is incredible.
• 24:10
  Goes around a corner.
• 24:11
  It has no understeer.
• 24:14
  Oh, but I said it needs a bit more of this and a bit more back.
• 24:16
  Oh, yeah, we can cut it further back.
• 24:18
  Okay, cut it further back.
• 24:19
  And they pulled it back further and tilted it out more, fork angle up more and engine up higher.
• 24:25
  And then I rode it again.
• 24:26
  I went, mate, this is incredible.
• 24:28
  It's getting better.
• 24:29
  Keep going.
• 24:30
  Oh, okay.
• 24:30
  We did it again and again and again.
• 24:32
  And then, and then.
• 24:34
  I said, but we're still spinning the wheel a little bit too much.
• 24:37
  Oh, let us think about it.
• 24:38
  So then they came up then with a plan with a big bang engine.
• 24:41
  Instead of having all different four cylinders firing at 90 degree, they then put two together, you know, a big bang core engine.
• 24:51
  And then we tested it at Phillip Island with the new chassis.
• 24:54
  They made some new chassis.
• 24:55
  uh for the year in uh 92 and um and then we tested the bing bang and i i wanted the big bang i loved it because it was looking after the rear tire and mick didn't like it and uh and they're going oh and i said no i love it it feels like it's slow but look at the lap time it's unbelievable even with old tires look at the lap time we're faster
• 25:18
  Oh, yeah, but, you know, Mick's gone, no, I want that.
• 25:21
  And I went, oh, no, I want Big Bang.
• 25:23
  So luckily I got my way with Honda and they went down this Big Bang way, but we kept breaking crank cases because the firing impulse was hard on the crank.
• 25:33
  So they had to web up the crank a bit more and modify that and eventually we got it going on.
• 25:38
  really good and oh shit it was so good in 92 that bike it was unbelievable you know it was just way better than everybody else had you know other manufacturers so it was the way and from that moment from that year on the Honda never changed much from then on for many many years and when I ride the MotoGP bikes this day I can still feel the same DNA in the bike I still feel it yep I know it feels like I know this bike so well it's the same through that
• 26:07
  modification of the chassis and changing the theory of it all to, you know, engine up and even though they've got four strokes, I can feel that bike.
• 26:16
  It's like my brother, you know.
• 26:17
  Yeah, it's incredible.
• 26:18
  So that's what happened and that's how Honda evolved now to be front runners in MotoGP because of the modifications through changing their theory.
• 26:27
  And then I said, how did it end up in 88 with white?
• 26:30
  It was 30 millimetre lower.
• 26:32
  I went, oh, Formula One guy came here.
• 26:35
  and engineered it this year.
• 26:36
  And I said, but he's had no experience in bikes.
• 26:38
  Yeah, but he's from Formula One.
• 26:39
  We thought it was good.
• 26:40
  And I went, uh-uh, big mistake.
• 26:42
  And that's why I lost the World Championship in 1988.
• 26:45
  So disappointing, but we didn't know that until midway through the year.
• 26:50
  And then Gerry and I went and did our own mods and lifted the bike up 30 mil.
• 26:54
  And then I started winning.
• 26:55
  I won like four or five races in a row.
• 26:57
  And I needed to win at Paul Ricard to win the World Championship.
• 27:02
  and thing broke down on the last lap with four corners to go.
• 27:05
  I had a two-second lead.
• 27:07
  So, yeah, I lost the world title that year.
• 27:09
  So, you know, Honda didn't help me.
• 27:11
  That was a mechanical failure by Honda.
• 27:23
  I don't think there's enough 1980s-inspired mullets poking out the back of helmets these days.
• 27:30
  Let's bring that back.
• 27:31
  I'll set the navigation to the closest barber.
• 27:35
  Did you ever get tempted to go elsewhere?
• 27:37
  Because when we think of you and bike racing, we think of Wayne Gardner and Honda.
• 27:41
  But at the pinnacle, you're a world champion, you're winning races.
• 27:45
  Were there attractive offers from Yamaha?
• 27:47
  Did you contemplate going to Suzuki?
• 27:50
  Yes, I did.
• 27:52
  I was always asked to go and join other manufacturers, but I was always very loyal, you know, to Honda.
• 28:00
  However, in 89, yeah, end of 89, that was when Eddie joined, I think.
• 28:11
  Eddie joined?
• 28:12
  89?
• 28:12
  Yeah, Eddie joined.
• 28:13
  And when Eddie joined, Kenny came to me.
• 28:16
  In 89, Kenny came to me and said, I want to hire you for five years, five-year contract with Mulberry Yamaha.
• 28:23
  And I went, they, Marlboro wanted me, and Kenny.
• 28:28
  And I went, oh, I'm going to stay with Honda.
• 28:30
  He goes, oh, well.
• 28:31
  And then I heard that Eddie was, then I heard Eddie might ride for Honda.
• 28:35
  So I called Honda and I said, oh, look, I hear Eddie's coming to join us.
• 28:40
  If he is, it's okay, but I'll go to Yamaha.
• 28:44
  And they went, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, Eddie's not joining.
• 28:50
  And I went, oh, well, if he's joining, I'm happy to go.
• 28:53
  It's no problem because I've got a five-year deal worth many, many, many, many millions of dollars.
• 28:57
  So I said, I'll go to Yamaha with Kenny.
• 29:00
  It's cool.
• 29:00
  I'm not angry.
• 29:02
  And I said, you can have Eddie and I'll trade places.
• 29:05
  And they went, no, no, no, no, no.
• 29:06
  We want you to stay.
• 29:08
  Okay, so all right, so I decided to stay and then I came home here and then I heard that so I signed a contract with Honda for less money, may I say, because I didn't win the world championship in 88 and it was their mistake.
• 29:20
  And so I kind of felt, you know, a bit betrayed by Honda.
• 29:25
  And next minute I got news that Eddie'd signed up with Honda by Honda America.
• 29:30
  So I called him and I just said, I thought you said he wasn't joining.
• 29:34
  Oh, but that's Honda America.
• 29:35
  And I said, you lying bastards, you know.
• 29:39
  So I was stuck to a contract.
• 29:41
  I wanted to get out.
• 29:42
  They wouldn't let me.
• 29:43
  So I had to then race with Honda, which was disappointing.
• 29:46
  So I wanted to go with Kenny because Kenny goes, mate,
• 29:49
  you've got five more world titles in you.
• 29:51
  He said, and we can win for the next five years with your talent and Marlborough and myself.
• 29:57
  And he said, it'll be a powerhouse, you know.
• 30:00
  But I said no to it.
• 30:01
  But then I ran back and said, oh, how about I join now?
• 30:03
  And he goes, oh, I'm sorry, but I've taken Rainy, I think it was then at the time.
• 30:07
  So unfortunately I miss that and I regret that to this day.
• 30:13
  Tell me about the fact that you...
• 30:15
  were at the pinnacle of the game for a decade when you eventually stopped two-wheel racing.
• 30:21
  How difficult was that decision to come to terms with and things like that?
• 30:26
  Well, I thought that, you know, it was a...
• 30:30
  It was a hard decision to make because I'd broken my leg in 92 at Suzuka in the rain.
• 30:40
  Unlucky accident, but it was one of those great rides where I fell off on the first or second lap or something in the wet and feeling too confident on that bike.
• 30:51
  I told you it was unreal.
• 30:53
  And then I picked it up and I got going again.
• 30:54
  I came from last and I got up into third place, I think, or third or fourth place.
• 30:58
  And I was catching Randy and then I pushed a bit too hard on the last couple of laps and lost the front and went into the fence and my leg went between the cushions and hit the barrier and broke my tibia and fibula.
• 31:11
  So I was pretty distraught then because I...
• 31:15
  had my second fractured leg.
• 31:18
  I always said to myself I wanted to get out of the sport with minimal injuries.
• 31:23
  I never wanted to end up seriously injured like a wheelchair or anything bad because I realised that there's still a long life left after bike racing.
• 31:34
  And then after that big shunt, I came back and I came back and started winning bike races and Suzuki 8-hour race and so on.
• 31:43
  And I don't know, I just got this feeling that then it had worn me out, all the visits to hospital and the sport was a bit dangerous and I didn't want to get hurt anymore.
• 31:53
  And then I was looking around.
• 31:55
  I remember at the French Grand Prix that year in 92 looking around and I was chasing Rainy and I finished second and I was looking at all the people going...
• 32:03
  Wow, I hope I don't hit that wall.
• 32:05
  And, wow, this is pretty scary, isn't it?
• 32:07
  You know, and I kind of had a presence of mind, a change.
• 32:10
  And I went, you know what, here I am looking around at spectators and in those grandstands and, you know, I'm being distracted really easily.
• 32:18
  Why is this?
• 32:18
  Maybe this is the time, you know, this is the time to say goodbye.
• 32:22
  And then I realised if I'm going to be distracted, it's dangerous.
• 32:24
  Okay.
• 32:25
  So I thought, okay, I'm going to announce my retirement.
• 32:27
  I just didn't know when I was going to do that.
• 32:29
  And then I went to Suzuka and we won the eight-hour race.
• 32:32
  I think I was with Mick that year and we won the eight-hour race together.
• 32:36
  And then I was really tired after it.
• 32:38
  And then I just went back to Donington and I went – I said, I remember telling Aguma after the race, I said, oh, that was my last win, my last time I'm coming.
• 32:49
  Yeah, yeah, Wayne, son, you just want more money.
• 32:51
  I said, no, no, I've had enough.
• 32:53
  I said, oh, yeah, yeah, Wayne Son, you just want more money next year.
• 32:57
  You know, you're just tired.
• 32:58
  I said, no, I'm not.
• 33:00
  And he goes, he didn't believe me.
• 33:01
  So I went to Donington and then I decided that I'd announce it in England, my retirement, because I owe it to the Brits because my career started there.
• 33:10
  You know, my international career started there.
• 33:12
  And I felt like I'm British because I spent so much time there and the Brits gave me the chance to go on, fulfill my dream.
• 33:22
  So I announced my retirement then and it was hard.
• 33:27
  I wanted to retire for my safety's sake but my heart wanted to keep racing and I still loved it.
• 33:33
  It was a really hard moment for me and I was in tears obviously at the announcement because I was losing something.
• 33:41
  Something.
• 33:41
  And, yeah, so I went on to win that race.
• 33:46
  I thought, I'm not going to give in.
• 33:47
  I need to go out in style here.
• 33:49
  So I went and won the race with Irv in 92.
• 33:53
  And then I went to South Africa after there and I got second to Kaczynski and the lap record.
• 34:00
  So and then I got off it and I went, okay, that's it.
• 34:02
  It was pretty sad.
• 34:04
  And then Freddie rode my bike the next day and he goes, oh, my God, that thing's unbelievable.
• 34:07
  I said, yeah, I know, I know.
• 34:09
  That was the new bike that we made.
• 34:11
  So Honda, as I said, haven't changed too much since then and used the same theory to go forward.
• 34:17
  But then I came home after there and I thought, you know, what am I going to do?
• 34:21
  I don't know what I'm going to do.
• 34:22
  I came out of the air and then I was sitting on the beach down in Manly, had a house in Manly, and I went, okay.
• 34:29
  I'm going to drink beer on the beach with my mates.
• 34:32
  So I bought a six-pack of beer and an Eskew beer and I go down to the beach to drink beer with my mates and I'm calling everybody, come and join me.
• 34:40
  And they went, no, we're all at work.
• 34:41
  And I went, oh, everyone's still at work.
• 34:44
  I'd be tired in my whole life at 32 years of age and they're all still working.
• 34:49
  I said, come and play with me.
• 34:50
  And they went, no, we're working.
• 34:52
  We need to get money to live.
• 34:53
  And I went...
• 34:54
  Oh, yeah, that's right.
• 34:55
  I forgot about that.
• 34:56
  So I had no one to play with.
• 34:57
  And I went, and then Graham Moore called me and said, would you like to go and try some car racing?
• 35:02
  And I went, who lived locally?
• 35:04
  Graham.
• 35:04
  And I went, well, yeah, I've always watched Bathurst.
• 35:07
  I thought that was pretty cool.
• 35:08
  You know, maybe I would like to try it.
• 35:09
  So then I went and tried it out and then I was fast.
• 35:13
  you know, straight away and I went, oh, this is cool.
• 35:15
  Oh, this will distract me from going back to bikes.
• 35:17
  So I started doing that and then that built into my own team and everything else has grown from there.
• 35:22
  So, you know, I had a big career and a very successful career in cars.
• 35:27
  You know, I went, you know, I did some races in Germany.
• 35:31
  I did them in some of the UK touring cars.
• 35:35
  I did some Bathurst in the production car, the Dogbone Honda.
• 35:42
  I've done NASCAR.
• 35:44
  I finished on the podium there.
• 35:46
  So, you know, I...
• 35:48
  I had my own team.
• 35:49
  The only thing we had held back with our team from winning was just we couldn't access Bridgestone tyres and we had to take whatever was available and we just didn't have the grip to suit, you know, to fix that.
• 36:01
  But the odd race or two I won here in Australia and then I got asked to go to Japan and I started racing for TRD.
• 36:09
  I sold the team up I think in about 96 years
• 36:15
  I sold it to some people in Sydney, the race team, because Coca-Cola stopped the sponsorship because they were putting the budget into the Olympics.
• 36:26
  So I figured it was... And then I got asked at the same time by Toyota if I'd want to come and test one of their GT sports cars over there.
• 36:35
  And I went, okay, try that.
• 36:36
  I went over there and broke the lap record in it.
• 36:38
  And they went, oh, wow, I'm...
• 36:40
  because they wanted me to bring sponsorship.
• 36:41
  And once I broke that record, they went, oh, we want to sign you up.
• 36:44
  Don't worry about the sponsorship.
• 36:47
  So I ended up signing up with Toyota for the next five years, racing GT sports cars for TRD, their racing department.
• 36:54
  I raced for the various teams and finished up with Tom's.
• 36:59
  Tom's the factory works team.
• 37:00
  So yeah, I won races.
• 37:03
  We never won a championship, but it was a really hard car to drive then.
• 37:07
  It was the Toyota Supra.
• 37:09
  But, you know, compare the GT car to the V8, it's like a go-kart.
• 37:15
  And it's probably 15 seconds a lap faster than the current V8s here.
• 37:21
  It's that much faster around corners.
• 37:23
  It had a huge amount of aero support too.
• 37:25
  And you could motor that thing around Suzuka quicker than a GP bike, I think, couldn't you?
• 37:30
  They were pretty... Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 37:32
  It...
• 37:34
  I went around there in one minute, I think it was one minute 45, and the MotoGP bikes were doing two minutes five, two minutes six.
• 37:47
  So it's 20 seconds a lap faster than a MotoGP bike.
• 37:52
  And believe me, I had to put the hose clamp on my nuts to get it round there because it's so scary going into that first corner.
• 38:00
  You don't back off and go to fourth on a bike.
• 38:02
  You go in there wide open in sixth gear at over 300 and you brake at the second part of the corner.
• 38:08
  You just shift at one and just nail it.
• 38:11
  And it's really scary doing it off the back straight.
• 38:18
  In a bike, you take it at fourth gear, down two, off the back straight and then up to the chicane.
• 38:23
  It's taken flat in sixth and you have to use all the kerb because it's an aero car.
• 38:29
  And, mate, it's really hard to not lift on the throttle because the Japs would tell me, Wayne, son, you have to keep the pedal on the metal here, you know, fine.
• 38:36
  I'm going, I can't do it.
• 38:37
  Oh, your teammate does it.
• 38:38
  And he's a little bit faster than you.
• 38:40
  Okay.
• 38:41
  It was scary.
• 38:42
  But I did do it, yeah.
• 38:43
  But I eventually got there.
• 38:44
  But you've got to build up to those aero cars because, I mean, they've only got like a 20-mil ride height on the road.
• 38:50
  So, you know, the faster you go, it sucks to the road like an F1 car.
• 38:56
  And those cars are insanely fast around corners or braking distance, you know.
• 39:01
  At one point, those GT cars had ABS as well as ground effects.
• 39:05
  And oh my God, you'd break it like the 50 board mark where bikes you'd be going at 200 or 250.
• 39:12
  It's insane.
• 39:14
  A Formula One car was only 15, about 12 to 15 seconds faster than the GT car at Suzuka.
• 39:22
  And they do one minute 30s around there.
• 39:24
  So it's insane how fast these cars are, you know.
• 39:29
  In wrapping up the bike chapter, it's probably worth asking you about the fact that it is such an addictive thing for you guys.
• 39:35
  It's such a significant part of your life as well.
• 39:40
  Replacing that is never easy, and I'm glad you went car racing.
• 39:44
  But were there moments when you'd ventured into cars where you thought, oh, I miss Europe, I miss bikes?
• 39:50
  Did you contemplate going back?
• 39:53
  Without a doubt, yes.
• 39:56
  Yes, I did many times.
• 39:57
  In particular, when I wasn't winning in touring cars and I couldn't get the right equipment, the right tyres under the car or the right engine builder or the right engineers.
• 40:07
  Because driving the car for me has always been quite easy and it's come naturally.
• 40:13
  Mm-hmm.
• 40:14
  And in fact, I got asked to do a movie the other day for a company in Europe because they did some research and I'm the only person who's won in cars and bikes in endurance racing in the world.
• 40:28
  Wow.
• 40:29
  Yeah, yeah.
• 40:29
  I just found that out recently and they paid me to do some interviews for this movie.
• 40:35
  And they said, you know, we've done a lot of research and you're the only person that exists for that.
• 40:39
  And I went...
• 40:40
  Wow, I didn't know that.
• 40:42
  So that's a pretty... Feather.
• 40:44
  Yeah, a real feather in my cap because, yeah, I was very fast in the cars, even in the GT cars and on bikes, and I still love it.
• 40:53
  I love being competitive.
• 40:55
  I like to fight for the wins and I think my way around it.
• 40:59
  How do I do this, you know?
• 41:01
  So that's never a real problem.
• 41:03
  A lot of other guys and ex-riders have failed in the cars, you know, and haven't been competitive, but, no, it's come naturally to me.
• 41:11
  So I – probably the worst thing – the mistake I made was when I got asked to own a team or Holden wanted me to own HRT at one point, you know, and I had a big fight with Tom Walkinshaw because they said I was mutinising, but it wasn't.
• 41:25
  It was Holden asking me, please take over the HRT team and turn into winning because it wasn't at that point.
• 41:31
  So I then went and got Coca-Cola sponsorship and it was meant to be the Coca-Cola HRT team.
• 41:38
  But Tom Walkinshaw and I didn't see eye to eye and I went, no, I'm not doing that.
• 41:43
  Sorry, no, I want to do a good job at this.
• 41:45
  So at the last minute I didn't have a car team and I had sponsorship and several million dollars' worth of sponsorship and...
• 41:55
  And I went, what am I going to do?
• 41:57
  So I talked to Cromley and we bought the Bob Forbes team.
• 42:02
  Correct.
• 42:02
  Yes, that's right.
• 42:04
  And quickly put together, I said, Cromley, you want to stay in this team or be with it?
• 42:08
  He goes, yeah.
• 42:08
  I said, okay, then let's do this together.
• 42:10
  So that's how we built the team up.
• 42:12
  On paper, you going from dizzy heights of 500cc racing to, yes, you went off and did Bathurst with Graham Moore, which was kind of a nice way to ease into racing at the mountain.
• 42:25
  And then to be in the factory Holden team was a dream for lots of people.
• 42:30
  That's almost 30 years ago now, right?
• 42:32
  So if you look back on it, what was the learning for you in all that?
• 42:36
  Would you have done stuff differently now that you look back on it in that small window where you were with them?
• 42:42
  Look, I regret not taking Kenny's offer with the bikes.
• 42:46
  Do you?
• 42:46
  Yeah, I regret that a lot now because I probably would have stayed another five years in the sport because I needed probably to be refreshed.
• 42:54
  That's what I should have done, but I didn't because I was terribly disillusioned.
• 42:59
  The talent was there and Kenny said you had five more titles in you.
• 43:03
  So I didn't do that.
• 43:03
  So I regret that one.
• 43:04
  The other thing I regret is...
• 43:08
  I got asked to drive for HRT I think in 93, which was good.
• 43:13
  Then they were underfunded so then I went and got sponsorship.
• 43:17
  But I had a big fallout with Tom Walkinshaw and John Crennan and then I went, oh, I'm going to go and do it myself.
• 43:24
  I regret doing it myself because, yes, because owning, driving the car was pretty easy for me and it kind of happens naturally.
• 43:35
  But owning a team and being a race driver, the two don't go together.
• 43:41
  Not many people can do that.
• 43:42
  Larry Perkins did a good job, but he has lots and lots of experience in it.
• 43:46
  I didn't have much experience in cars, but I was owning a team, trying to make decisions on the business point of view and managing 25 staff.
• 43:55
  And trying to be the driver as well.
• 43:58
  There's too many caps to wear in the team.
• 44:00
  Then I got involved, unfortunately, with politics with Holden and, you know, that was a nightmare.
• 44:07
  Then Holden pulled sponsorship out of me.
• 44:08
  Then Coca-Cola reduced the sponsorship towards and spend it on the Olympics and then trying to get sponsors.
• 44:15
  And Cromley, Neil Crompton and I, ran around trying to fill the gap all the time and it was just killing me.
• 44:22
  And...
• 44:23
  I just never had enough time to scratch my ass, you know.
• 44:26
  So I went, this is, I'm not enjoying this.
• 44:29
  And then when I got asked, did I want to sell the team?
• 44:31
  And I went, good idea.
• 44:33
  I had a purchaser to buy it.
• 44:35
  So, and then at the same time, Toyota said, I want you to come and drive GT cars.
• 44:39
  So I went out there and tested first before I made the decision.
• 44:42
  And then I got, wrote the lap record and they went, oh, we want to sign you.
• 44:45
  I went, pfft.
• 44:46
  I think that's the calling.
• 44:47
  So came back here, sold the team and just become a race driver again and went up there and had a great time, laughed and giggled, flew in, flew out from Australia at all these GT races.
• 45:00
  Got your helmet good to go.
• 45:01
  Got my helmet good, got Coca-Cola sponsorship in Japan and brought that into the car racing team and loved every minute of it, loved it.
• 45:10
  I was so happy.
• 45:11
  I was living back in Europe.
• 45:13
  Sold the team out of all the politics and the bullshit that was happening behind the scene, which I didn't like.
• 45:20
  Cromley went off and did TV commentary and some driving or whatever and I was out of this small-minded thinking in this country and the petty, you know, the petty...
• 45:33
  thinking of people saying, you know, teach me a lesson.
• 45:35
  And I was sick of getting shunted off by Dick Johnson and Scafie and all those.
• 45:40
  And I just, I liked the racing, but I didn't like to be, they were just like punning me off and pushing me.
• 45:46
  So it was a bit of vindictive.
• 45:48
  They were trying to teach me a lesson because I was just kind of like this cheeky boy came in from the bike world into cars.
• 45:56
  And I think I shocked how competitive I was and how fast I was.
• 46:00
  And
• 46:01
  and they were in better equipment on better tyres and they gave me a few uppercuts, you know, out there.
• 46:09
  So I kind of got sick a little bit of that and I got certainly very sick and tired of not being able to access good equipment, good tyres and engines and everything else.
• 46:19
  So I was always racing with that team with my arm tyre behind my back, you know.
• 46:23
  They were always trying to stop me from being competitive, which is...
• 46:27
  But that's another way of signifying that they know that I can do this, you know.
• 46:33
  But when I sold the team, I went, oh, good, get rid of that responsibility hat, the team owner, team manager hat, and jump back and go and do that and drive for Toyota.
• 46:46
  I had a great contract with them and living back in Monaco and living the good life again.
• 46:51
  I went, this is what I like.
• 46:52
  So that was all good up to, and then my kids, we had kids as well at that period.
• 46:58
  And then my kids then wanted to start, I bought a farm and then I started teaching my kids how to ride motorbikes.
• 47:03
  So it was kind of one thing after another.
• 47:10
  That's the end of part two of my podcast with 1987 500cc world motorcycle champion Wayne Gardner.
• 47:16
  But it's not the end of our chat.
• 47:19
  His four-wheel racing career post-bikes means we have lots more to cover.
• 47:24
  So in a rare break from the norm on Rusty's Garage, we have a part three for you.
• 47:29
  It's already in the library, so you can kickstart it right now.
• 47:33
  From family following in his footsteps, to letting go of the rain so son Remy can run his own race, to making movies and riding across Australia with mates.