Latest / New Worlder / Episode #102: Olivier Bur

Transcript

Episode #102: Olivier Bur · New Worlder

• 0:00
  This is the New Worlder podcast and I am one of your hosts,
• 0:04
  Nicholas Gill.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_02: Co-host Juliana Duque will be joining shortly.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_02: Today we are speaking with Olivier Burr.
• 0:11
  He is the chef and owner of the restaurant Casare in the city
• 0:15
  of Santo Domingo in
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_02: the Dominican Republic.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_02: Casare is unlike any other restaurant I've heard of in the Caribbean.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_02: It's a fine dining restaurant,
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_02: at least in the sense that it serves 7 to 10 courses and a pairing,
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_02: even though it does it in a casual way.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_02: There are,
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_02: of course,
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_02: many other fine dining restaurants in the Caribbean,
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_02: but unlike all the others,
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_02: Casseret is defined by its limitations as much as it is abundant.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_02: They don't use flour,
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_02: milk,
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_02: or eggs,
• 0:47
  and instead find alternatives within the natural environment of
• 0:51
  the Dominican Republic.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_02: They don't serve wine in the pairing,
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_02: as it isn't produced on the island,
• 0:56
  and instead make different distillations like mamawana and
• 1:00
  source clarine in unaged
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_02: sugarcane rum from Haiti.
• 1:05
  which needs to be bottled in Europe for it to be legally sold
• 1:09
  in the DR.
• 1:10
  It's a crazy story.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_02: They also cook on a rustic wood fire,
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_02: as is done in the countryside,
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_02: shunning most modern cooking equipment.
• 1:19
  It's a really fascinating approach in a region that really
• 1:23
  needs some disruption.
• 1:24
  Olivier was born and raised in Switzerland with his Dominican
• 1:29
  mother making typical
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_02: Dominican foods for him every day.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_02: Still,
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_02: he felt disconnected from the island and life there,
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_02: but as he became a professional cook,
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_02: working in kitchens around Europe and Latin America,
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_02: which include Pujol and Noma,
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_02: Mexico,
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: he gradually gravitated more and more to the island.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_02: After a few pop-ups and research trips,
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_02: he moved there permanently,
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_02: and in Santo Domingo began creating a network of collaborators.
• 1:59
  Not just suppliers and culinary friends,
• 2:01
  but artisan craftsmen of every sort.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_02: Craftsmen and women.
• 2:06
  Casare is a restaurant that tells the story of and immerses you
• 2:11
  in Dominican
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_02: culture in a really profound way.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_02: And as you will hear in this interview,
• 2:16
  I think he has the right temperament and patience for it to
• 2:21
  actually work.
• 2:23
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• 2:25
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• 2:29
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• 2:30
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• 2:34
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• 2:37
  Also,
• 2:37
  look for my books,
• 2:38
  such as the Latin American Cookbook,
• 2:41
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• 2:42
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• 2:44
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• 3:00
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• 3:15
  SPEAKER_02: Enjoy the show.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: Music
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_02: Hey, Olivier.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_02: How's it going?
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: Super good.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: Super good.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: How are you?
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_02: Good.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_02: Good.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_02: Nice.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_01: Hi, Olivier.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: Hi, Juliana.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_00: Nice to meet you.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: Nice to meet you, too.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_02: So you're in Santo Domingo now.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_02: You're at like a coffee shop or a restaurant?
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_02: Where are you?
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I went, like I had to do some stuff in the business district.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm here now.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: And the place where I used to,
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: or where I thought I'm going to have to call with you,
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: really bad internet.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I had to move.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_02: We'll make do.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_02: I can hear some noises every once in a while, but it's fine.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_02: I think it adds atmosphere.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_02: Nice.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_02: So...
• 4:47
  So the DR,
• 4:48
  let's talk about the DR.
• 4:49
  You're the first person we've had from the DR,
• 4:52
  I think.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, definitely, on the podcast.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_02: It's probably the place that's Latin American, I guess.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_02: You would call the DR Latin American, right?
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, true.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_02: It's the place in Latin America I probably know the least about.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_02: My,
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_02: my experience,
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_02: my one experience there was at a resort,
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_02: like,
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_02: and my wife wanted to go to this kind of like all inclusive resort.
• 5:26
  um for like our vacation for like years and i was like no we
• 5:30
  need to you know drive
• 5:31
  around for six hours every day and go through like out of the
• 5:33
  way restaurants for
• 5:35
  for a week and then at like some point she was like yeah but i
• 5:38
  just want to relax
• 5:39
  and i don't want to think about anything and here's this place
• 5:42
  on the beach and it
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_02: looks nice and it wasn't expensive and
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, fine, let's, you know, let's just, let's just go.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_02: And then you can finally see what an all-inclusive is.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_02: And so we went and stayed at this all-inclusive chain resort.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_02: It was in La Romana.
• 5:56
  Like we flew into Santo Domingo and just like rent a car,
• 6:00
  went straight to La Romana.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_02: And the beach was nice.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_02: It was beautiful.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_02: But like,
• 6:04
  I hated the kind of all-inclusive atmosphere and like the hotel
• 6:09
  and like the food
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_02: was like ridiculous.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_02: And
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_02: so I didn't really get to experience anything of the DR at all.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_02: And,
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_02: I'd probably experienced more of it just like in New York city going to,
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_02: like Dominican restaurants,
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_02: which,
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_02: there's,
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_02: there's a bunch kind of scattered around town,
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_02: but they're,
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_02: they're more like cafe,
• 6:32
  at least the ones I've been to are more like cafeteria style
• 6:35
  places where,
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_02: you just like scoop out rice and beans and plantains and,
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_02: something onto a plate and, you know, get it to go.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_02: It's never something like, it's just something that's there.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_02: At least these ones.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_02: And like, so that's probably my experience with it.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_02: But,
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_02: but I know from traveling elsewhere in the Caribbean that the food,
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_02: the landscapes,
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_02: the culture of the DR is unbelievably rich.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_02: And it seems like it's just always kind of been overlooked.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think what you're saying is super accurate.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_00: And for a big amount,
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_00: most of the time,
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  SPEAKER_00: what's been promoted here is exactly what you experienced.
• 7:25
  You want to go to the beach,
• 7:27
  you want to read a book,
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  you don't want to worry about anything.
• 7:30
  Maybe food and drinks and the whole hospitality and cultural
• 7:35
  aspect is not the most
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_00: important thing on this trip,
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_00: but you just want to do nothing and be lazy for a week.
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  SPEAKER_00: And that's what's promoted.
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  SPEAKER_00: The beach is beautiful and that's it.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: As you say,
• 7:51
  there is like Dominican Republic or the island that Dominican
• 7:56
  Republic shares with Haiti.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: That's crazy biodiversity.
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  SPEAKER_00: So many microclimates with
• 8:05
  the Pico Duarte that is three and a half thousand meters high
• 8:09
  and then we have the
• 8:10
  biggest hypersalene lake that looks a little bit apocalyptic
• 8:15
  when you're there
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  SPEAKER_00: because everything is derived from salt,
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_00: like the trees and everything.
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  And then you have a desert,
• 8:25
  you have tropical mountains,
• 8:27
  you have pine forests.
• 8:28
  So often people that visit me now are surprised when we go to
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  the mountains and
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  SPEAKER_00: they see how the landscape changes.
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  SPEAKER_00: Like,
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  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: in other countries they also do,
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  but here I feel it's like you drive 50 kilometers and you go
• 8:45
  through five microplains.
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  SPEAKER_00: That's crazy.
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  SPEAKER_00: And for me, when I started cooking, it was always like
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_00: I have no clue about Dominican food,
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_00: as you say,
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  SPEAKER_00: there's rice and beans and el sancocho,
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  that is like a soup with different vegetables and meat and
• 9:04
  chicken inside.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_00: But I was like,
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_00: somehow I cannot imagine that the food landscape is this,
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_00: if there are so many different plants here in the country.
• 9:18
  i did what you said you wanted to do in this on this trip you
• 9:22
  know i came here in
• 9:23
  2014 for the first time and stayed here for three months with
• 9:29
  the idea to like work
• 9:31
  in different restaurants at this moment in the city there was
• 9:35
  not really a
• 9:38
  restaurant that was working the way i imagined this cuisine
• 9:44
  here i'd say and i
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_00: realized that
• 9:47
  And where I found it most interesting is the most remote place
• 9:52
  on the countryside.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_00: And there I got to know,
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_00: because it's so remote,
• 9:58
  you still today at some places don't have internet connection
• 10:03
  and phone connection.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: So people there have to live with what the land gives you.
• 10:11
  There's where I got to know a lot of interesting ingredients
• 10:15
  and techniques that I
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_00: feel like work.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and also understanding how this region works.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: I think I was first a little bit like,
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_00: ah shit,
• 10:27
  we have this podcast now and I have to sit on the street in
• 10:30
  front of a restaurant
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: and this car fast drives by selling used things and
• 10:40
  Somehow all these things that like triggered me a little bit
• 10:46
  during these trips,
• 10:48
  it's not as I maybe am used to it from Switzerland or how my
• 10:55
  perception is of
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: something that is professional.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: But like when we started building the restaurant,
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_00: we were thinking like,
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_00: okay,
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_00: we want to have a menu.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_00: We want to have like,
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: We want to take this freedom to choose for the guests,
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: which I'm also not so fan of normally,
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_00: but most of the ingredients we use,
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: guests don't know.
• 11:20
  Also,
• 11:21
  locals are not used to the ingredients that we cook with and
• 11:25
  with the techniques mostly.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: So we had to choose to offer what we have.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_00: And also because there's so many unpredictable
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_00: points in the daily life here, we change the menu basically every day.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_00: And we kind of found a way to speak about it.
• 11:57
  And it's like we think that collaborations and improvisation
• 12:02
  are like key elements
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: of our restaurant.
• 12:06
  And I feel like it's key elements to do things the way we want
• 12:11
  to do it here in the Caribbean,
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: because,
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_00: we're an island.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: There is a lot of infrastructure that has to be imported.
• 12:21
  And we want to use only ingredients and things from local
• 12:26
  farmers and producers,
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_00: but also all the handcrafts,
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_00: the plates,
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: the spoons,
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: everything is made locally.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_00: But you always have to be ready that things can turn out different.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: A rain can make that an ingredient doesn't arrive this week,
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: but in two weeks,
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_00: then you try to get it from seven different families.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: And then when the rain stops, all of them send you citrus like last week.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: And we get like seven bags of different citrus.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_00: And now we're like drowning in citrus, but it's
• 13:02
  there we have to be like flexible and learn how to how to do it
• 13:07
  that's why also the
• 13:08
  size of the restaurant is living so i think i made a little
• 13:10
  chaos now as well with
• 13:12
  everything that i talked about so what do you do when you get
• 13:16
  that much citrus when
• 13:17
  you have just like an overwhelming surplus of citrus and you've
• 13:22
  already promised
• 13:23
  ever have you promised everyone that you're gonna buy whatever
• 13:26
  yeah sure yeah
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_00: mostly
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_00: mostly with the people and families that we work with.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's like not huge amounts that they can produce anyways.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_00: So with the citrus and with wild mushrooms,
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_00: we tell the families that we work with whatever they can sell,
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_00: we buy it.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: And if we have too much, then that's our problem a little bit.
• 13:52
  We're trying to work also with bars and restaurants here where
• 13:56
  we can like
• 13:57
  give them or like sell them fruits and ingredients that are too
• 14:02
  much for us.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_00: But we also preserve things like salted lemons,
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: et cetera,
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: or like mostly we're not using lemons,
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: but like Mandarina Lima,
• 14:14
  that is an old variety that is not used anymore or like other
• 14:18
  different ones.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_00: And we preserve them, we use them in many dishes.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_00: We do the cocktails with it.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_00: We don't have a wine pairing.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_00: We don't serve wine,
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_00: so we only serve cocktails that we do based on sugarcane,
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: destilates,
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_00: how do you say this?
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: Like rum and clerenc from Haiti.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: So we just try to use as much as we can and the rest we kind of...
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_00: um, give it or sell it to other places.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_00: And, uh, yeah, that's a bit how we work.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_02: So it's seven to 10 courses, right?
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_00: Something like that.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_02: And no, no wine pairing, no wines whatsoever.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_00: It's all, we don't have space for wine.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_02: So it's all, all distillations.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_02: Like what are these exactly?
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: So, um, we work with, uh,
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: or we try to focus on clearin.
• 15:19
  This is also clearin is like rum from Haiti that is made mostly
• 15:27
  based on fermented
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: sugar cane juice.
• 15:32
  But it can also be like sugar cane syrups that you like reduce
• 15:35
  the sugar cane juice
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_00: before you ferment it.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_00: Why we are focusing on this is
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: First of all,
• 15:45
  because we want to talk about the political situation between
• 15:49
  Dominican Republic
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_00: and Haiti in the restaurant,
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: because thinking about this geography at the border doesn't make sense,
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: because we need to know what's on the island and what's produced here.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: But then there's so many political issues and also this specific spirit
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_00: is illegal in Dominican Republic.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: So you're not allowed to sell it in Dominican Republic.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_00: You're not allowed to import it from Haiti directly.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_00: And it's also illegal to produce it here.
• 16:28
  So the only way we can get this spirit legally to Dominican
• 16:36
  Republic from Haiti is
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_00: via a company that they bottle in Italy.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: So they
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: We ship it from Haiti to Italy in 1,000 litre stainless steel tanks,
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_00: bottle it there,
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_00: distribute it via a company in France.
• 16:57
  And then we buy it either in Switzerland or in New York and
• 17:04
  bring it in our
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: suitcase and in all our friends' suitcases,
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_00: two bottles by two bottles to the Dominican Republic.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_00: because then we don't need to register it as a spirit here,
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_00: and it's the legal amount you can pass the border.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: That's collaboration right there.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_01: I was going to ask you about examples of collaboration.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's one, exactly.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's crazy that we have to do this,
• 17:36
  but also moonshines in Dominican Republic that are very
• 17:41
  dangerous to drink.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: often it's like very bad distillations,
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_00: but also sometimes it's like alcoholes alterados,
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_00: how do you say this?
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah?
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_00: They are called cleren here too,
• 17:57
  but that's just a name that in the 60s came up during the
• 18:01
  dictatorship of Trujillo,
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: and this misconception never really got worked or talked about.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's like a taboo topic.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_00: So...
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_00: That's why we work a lot with glittering as much as we can,
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_00: because sometimes we don't have so much.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um,
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_00: and then we work with different drums,
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_00: uh,
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: that are local here and,
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: um,
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: yeah,
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: like H rum and white rum,
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: et cetera.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_00: But, uh, yeah, that's a little bit what our base is on alcohol.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: And then the rest we make like mesurations with the fruits.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: Then there's the topic of mama Juana.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_00: that is kind of spiced rum with different roots,
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_00: bark of trees,
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_00: spices,
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_00: et cetera,
• 18:51
  where we also make big batches and we use these things as bases
• 18:57
  for our drinks.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_03: Mm-hmm.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_01: You don't use chickens and eggs, right?
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_01: Or does this change?
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_00: No, we don't.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_00: Also,
• 19:11
  this thinking about how it makes sense for us to build a dinner
• 19:19
  that somehow
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_00: reflects what we think about in the Caribbean as a team.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: We've had chicken, pork, meat, somehow...
• 19:31
  The way it's farmed here often,
• 19:34
  there is farms that work in a really nice way.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_00: And you can always find like chicken that are running around happily.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_00: But never, I mean, we cook for 18 people per day.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_00: And that's already difficult to get it in this amount.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_00: But then we felt like we could take the challenge to work without it.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_00: So we have to find new ways how to build a dinner without it.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: And that's why the base of our menu is basically vegan.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: We don't use any milk products.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: We don't use eggs.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: We don't use meat and chicken or poultry.
• 20:15
  But we do use seafood because we want to have a relationship
• 20:18
  with the sea as an island.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's why we took this.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: And the challenge to try to cook without those ingredients,
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_01: it's because of it's the default diet.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 20:38
  it's an effort to explore diversity there and not go to the
• 20:44
  default consumption
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_01: habit or something.
• 20:49
  I mean,
• 20:50
  instead of using gelatines,
• 20:53
  we can use like seaweeds to thicken things.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: We can use starch from guayiga, for example, to thicken things.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_00: Then we use a lot of nuts to emulsify things,
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_00: et cetera,
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: that we would use eggs maybe in another way.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I was reading your story about guayiga and it's so...
• 21:17
  interesting it it reminds me of cassava in colombia that is
• 21:21
  made of yuca it's not
• 21:23
  the same plant but the process is very similar maybe the
• 21:27
  texture and the result is
• 21:28
  different but i think it's they share some things and i never
• 21:34
  heard about this
• 21:34
  plant before so interesting and it's used a lot in like
• 21:40
  landscaping because it's
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_00: very resistant to like weather um
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_00: And the difference between casabe or like how you extract,
• 21:49
  like how the processes of casabe and of the guayiga bread is
• 21:54
  that when you press
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_00: the yuca or the casabe normally,
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_00: you leave the starchy water,
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: you discard it or you ferment it.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_00: I think this, I read from you Nick, this tucupi or what is it called?
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah,
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_02: tucupi,
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_02: it's like the extracted juice,
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_02: and yeah,
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_02: you can ferment it and boil it,
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_02: ferment it,
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_02: and later reduce it if you want.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, there's a lot of things you can do with it.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_02: So do they do anything with the water?
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_00: No,
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_00: but in the case of guayiga,
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_00: the whole mess,
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_00: the fibers of the plant are poisonous,
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_00: and you only use the starch to make the bread.
• 22:36
  So you kind of cook the starch with water and then you add
• 22:40
  fresh ground coconut to
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_00: it and it ferments like super fast,
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: gets a little bit fluffy.
• 22:49
  And then you wrap it in banana,
• 22:50
  almond or beech grape leaves and then you bake it like this.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, super cool.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_02: Like, yeah, it's like you never hear about those things from
• 23:05
  from the DR you know it's like it sounds amazing and I'm sure
• 23:08
  that you've over the
• 23:09
  last few years you've been finding all kinds of things like
• 23:12
  that yeah when we it
• 23:16
  was like exactly one year ago when we had conversations at my
• 23:20
  place with what's now
• 23:22
  the team of the restaurant about all these things that we want
• 23:28
  to have involved in
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_00: the restaurant and we made a map and mapped out all the
• 23:35
  All the ingredients that we know,
• 23:36
  we don't get it from any local providers or suppliers.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_00: We cannot buy it on the market or in supermarkets.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_00: We need to build the logistics.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_00: And so when we mapped this out,
• 23:51
  it was so many things that we got stressed because one is all
• 23:56
  the ingredients and
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_00: one is all the artisans that built furniture or tableware for us.
• 24:05
  And we really got,
• 24:06
  I got anxieties thinking about how to organize all these informations.
• 24:11
  And then,
• 24:12
  uh,
• 24:13
  we decided to focus always on five topics,
• 24:16
  uh,
• 24:16
  in the restaurant.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the five topics that we built.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like we cook and make drinks,
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_00: um,
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_00: focusing on these five topics,
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_00: but also,
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: um,
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_00: one day a week,
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: the team works on research together.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: And then we kind of want to build an archive of all these things.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_00: So we visit different families that make, for example, Guayaga bread.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_00: And we invite photographers with us to take pictures,
• 24:49
  but also the whole team is writing about these experiences when
• 24:53
  we visit people.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_00: Then we have pictures, we have videos sometimes, texts.
• 25:01
  And then we try to also cook these ingredients in different
• 25:06
  ways and archive the recipes.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_00: So when we kind of go through a topic,
• 25:12
  we want to learn as much as we can about it and then move to
• 25:18
  the next one probably.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, this is how we're trying to get organized.
• 25:29
  And the way you're cooking in the restaurant,
• 25:33
  it's,
• 25:34
  it's quite different as well,
• 25:35
  right?
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_02: Like the cooking areas, it's very rustic.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_02: It's not like it.
• 25:41
  I mean,
• 25:41
  what kind of like modern kitchen equipment do you have and what
• 25:44
  don't you have?
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um,
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_00: so we have on the countryside,
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: you cook with,
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_00: uh,
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: the most rustic way is like three stones and just put a pot on top.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_00: And, um,
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_00: In the 60s as well, an architect designed Lorena.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_00: That's like a stove.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_00: made with lodo and arena, which is like sand and clay.
• 26:12
  And this is kind of a way how you have the fire inside of your
• 26:18
  table and the heat
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: only goes like focused on more concentrated on two spots or three.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_00: And we have, we built, we kind of designed this with a, with a friend.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's not super designing, but we just tried to make it like work.
• 26:34
  and that's basically how we cook we have this uh clay stuff in
• 26:39
  the in the middle of
• 26:40
  the kitchen and we cook with coconut charcoal um and then the
• 26:48
  rest is like there's
• 26:49
  a lot of things that is like raw or um yeah not super cooked we
• 26:55
  also work a lot
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: with mortars um
• 26:59
  that's it we basically cook with fire then we have two
• 27:03
  inductions that we use for
• 27:05
  for prep when we need to um do things but during the service we
• 27:09
  only have this
• 27:10
  stuff okay and when people come in i imagine at least so far
• 27:16
  it's been mostly
• 27:18
  locals where is the mixed okay no it's mostly locals yeah okay
• 27:23
  so what what do the
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_02: what has been the reaction um
• 27:27
  yeah so we had it's now is a very funny moment for us because
• 27:32
  uh when we started
• 27:35
  communicating about the restaurant we started for me it was
• 27:39
  always we want to
• 27:41
  communicate on social media and outside of the restaurant we
• 27:45
  want to communicate
• 27:46
  what we do outside the restaurant so we want to communicate
• 27:49
  more about the research
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_00: we do the trips and what we
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_00: take as inspiration for what we work.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_00: And that's like the normal life of Dominican Republic.
• 28:02
  That's Colmados,
• 28:03
  the small corner supermarkets that we have here everywhere.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_00: That's hangouts with friends and families, etc.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: So and just random things that you see on the street.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_00: So it's not so common here or it's a little bit disruptive to communicate
• 28:27
  I don't want to say it's fancy,
• 28:28
  but probably it's like expensive,
• 28:30
  you know,
• 28:31
  the restaurant.
• 28:32
  So an expensive restaurant doesn't communicate with pictures of
• 28:36
  plastic chairs on the beach.
• 28:38
  And so first it was like,
• 28:41
  luckily,
• 28:42
  some people already have had dinner at projects of mine.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: But I think it was very different than other places.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: But then we also have
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_00: you kind of prepay when you book.
• 29:01
  So,
• 29:01
  when you come to the restaurant,
• 29:03
  you don't have to...
• 29:03
  Like through talk.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly, yeah.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: That was also crazy because we're the only restaurant here that has talk,
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_00: so we had to convince talk that we can use it here,
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_00: etc.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_00: But,
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: so you pay on talk and when you come to the restaurant,
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: you don't need to bring your wallet.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_00: Like, we cannot upsell.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_00: But,
• 29:26
  So people arrive at a certain time and then we have like 20
• 29:30
  minutes with the guests
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_00: where we receive them in our version of a colmado,
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: which is our dry storage or our pantry,
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_00: where we talk about everything that we kind of have in the pantry,
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_00: our research,
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_00: the menu,
• 29:45
  explain a little bit why the whole menu is hidden with a spoon
• 29:49
  and with your hands.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_00: and have like also a little bit of time to get to know the guests.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_00: And then we,
• 30:00
  and this moment is very important for us and also for the
• 30:04
  experience with the guests,
• 30:05
  because otherwise you sit down and maybe you're stressed from
• 30:08
  your day or anything.
• 30:10
  And then you sit down and then comes like broth with wild
• 30:15
  mushrooms and seaweed and
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: roots of herbs.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_00: You're like, what is this?
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_00: But if you have a little bit of context,
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_00: and we have the chance to give a little intro.
• 30:26
  Guests are super interested and every night is very different
• 30:33
  because depending on
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_00: the guests,
• 30:35
  it can be like a very focused group that really is like hard to
• 30:42
  read for us sometimes.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_00: And then with the desserts, they start like
• 30:48
  expressing more how not because of the desserts but at the
• 30:52
  desserts they start
• 30:52
  expressing more like how many of the things they maybe didn't
• 30:56
  know and like often
• 31:00
  people are really enjoying that that we make this whole
• 31:05
  experience only using local
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: ingredients farmers producers and it's
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_00: the people that dare to come, they're like getting super excited.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_00: And we also have a lot of people that already became regulars.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and
• 31:29
  yeah it's uh and now we're also starting to do a little bit fun
• 31:33
  stuff like tonight
• 31:34
  we have a pop-up where we will cook which is a fried dough that
• 31:40
  you eat at the
• 31:40
  beach while you wait for fish and we cook this at a bar from a
• 31:45
  friend with with
• 31:47
  some topics and just things that we wouldn't because we also
• 31:52
  don't use flour in the
• 31:53
  restaurant like wheat flour but at pop-ups we can expand a
• 31:58
  little bit and do
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: So you have a pretty calm energy for being a chef.
• 32:10
  I wonder if you have been told this before and if this is the
• 32:14
  Swiss element or it's
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_01: just your character or what is it?
• 32:19
  And how does that show in the kitchen or if it changed when
• 32:24
  you're in a working mode?
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's funny.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's funny that you say this.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_00: Well,
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_00: I think,
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_00: I worked in a lot of restaurants that are more,
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: yeah,
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_00: what you maybe say now,
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_00: like this different,
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_00: let's just leave it at different.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 32:49
  But somehow I always felt working at places like this,
• 32:55
  that when you're like,
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_00: when you're insecure already with what you're working,
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_00: and then you're also scared that you're,
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_00: uh,
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_00: that you're scared of making mistakes.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_00: I think then you try to hide stuff.
• 33:13
  And for me,
• 33:18
  it was,
• 33:19
  or it is important that we have an environment because I'm
• 33:23
  working
• 33:24
  when we work like we work four days a week for service and then
• 33:28
  we have one day per
• 33:29
  week that we do research and I I mean I want to do it as good
• 33:36
  as we can but just as
• 33:38
  good as we can like I we are not a we are not a restaurant with
• 33:44
  50 chefs or
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_00: something like this and we will never be and for me just
• 33:52
  doesn't make sense that we don't have a nice time when we're
• 33:54
  working but lately
• 33:58
  also from the team we have had like conversations with the team
• 34:02
  where the team was
• 34:02
  like fuck you need to be can't you be a little bit more like
• 34:07
  bossy and like you
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_00: know push us more and stuff like this and I was like I mean we can have
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_00: conversations about how we can do things different but
• 34:18
  if you know you want to do things like different then let's
• 34:22
  just find a way how we
• 34:23
  can do it different but i don't think that you need me
• 34:27
  screaming around and going
• 34:29
  going wild in the space sadly it's a little bit maybe unusual
• 34:33
  but it's also for me
• 34:35
  finding finding the right way of organizing the space because
• 34:39
  we still have to
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_00: perform somehow you know but i feel that
• 34:47
  um building this energy from fun curiosity and like more from
• 34:56
  an intrinsic way is
• 34:58
  like much nicer than from fear so that's why we have one one
• 35:06
  day per week where we
• 35:07
  go with the team and we go visit farmers and producers and when
• 35:12
  we see how the
• 35:15
  Argentina,
• 35:16
  which is a lady that she opens the almonds for us,
• 35:20
  the wild almonds.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_00: And when you see that, she has a stone and then a hammer.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_00: And that's how she opens one by one almond.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_00: And we use like easily one and a half kilos per week.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_00: So she's opening a lot of almonds and like her family is involved.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_00: And also from all her neighbors, we buy like
• 35:46
  everything that they open but when you see how she does it and
• 35:50
  you get to know her
• 35:52
  i think then you have like a different relationship with the
• 35:54
  product and also you
• 35:56
  enjoy these trips and then these things become i think more
• 36:02
  important for everyone
• 36:05
  involved and if you care about what you do then i think you do
• 36:12
  it with a different
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know, sensibility.
• 36:19
  And it was thought like this when we were calculating the
• 36:24
  restaurant and when we
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_00: were thinking,
• 36:28
  SPEAKER_00: how do we want to work?
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_00: We said we're going to it's going to be a five days week.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_00: Often you have six days weeks here in Dominican Republic.
• 36:38
  And from these five days,
• 36:39
  one day is going to be for research and for like
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_00: We invite sometimes artists,
• 36:46
  researchers and friends to have conversations with us where we
• 36:53
  just sit for one
• 36:55
  hour and we have a conversation with this person talking about
• 36:58
  how this person
• 36:58
  works to learn or we do foraging trips where we go to the north
• 37:06
  and go to the beach
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_00: and pick mushrooms the whole day.
• 37:13
  But I feel like from there you can build a different
• 37:19
  understanding and also then
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_00: you don't need to.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's exhausting to be in this like,
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: we have pressure,
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_00: we are stressed sometimes,
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_00: obviously,
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_00: and not everything is only love and peace and flowers all the time,
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_00: but we
• 37:45
  we tried to do things the way it makes sense for us and the way
• 37:49
  we would like.
• 37:50
  I never wanted to stay for super long at the restaurant because
• 37:55
  I felt like,
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_00: you don't really have a life around it.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_00: And I always, I like to go to nature and to visit producers, et cetera.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_00: So this had to be part of the job for everyone.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_00: That's living how we,
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_02: This kind of calm demeanor,
• 38:20
  I think it helps in particular in what you're doing when just
• 38:29
  kind of setting up
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_02: this atmosphere for people to come into the restaurant.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_02: And it's going to be a lot of information.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_02: And if you're this egotistical person
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_02: Dick bag,
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_02: like in,
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_02: pushing all this information onto somebody,
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_02: it's going to be a fucking turnoff and they're going to,
• 38:53
  SPEAKER_02: it's just going to be uncomfortable.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_02: But if you're,
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_02: if it's presented in this kind of more relaxed way,
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_02: and I'm sure it's not quite as relaxed as,
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_02: the way we're talking now,
• 39:05
  SPEAKER_02: but if it's presented in a way that it feels comfortable to digest,
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_02: I think it can go a lot further.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_02: You know,
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_02: people are going to have a much better time than when it's just like,
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 39:20
  you have this kind of debrief for 20 minutes with a little bit
• 39:23
  of alcohol at the beginning.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_02: And they kind of,
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 39:28
  they just get to know you and feel comfortable rather than you
• 39:31
  sit down and,
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_02: this plate with 40 things on it comes and everything has a fucking story.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_02: And it's just like you're sitting there and you're just...
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_02: just bombarded with facts and information.
• 39:49
  And I experienced that quite a bit at some restaurants,
• 39:52
  and it can be overwhelming,
• 39:55
  I think.
• 39:58
  And you're probably the first person to do anything remotely
• 40:02
  like this in the DR,
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_02: so it's like you have to have some kind of patience,
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_02: and it has to be this...
• 40:08
  kind of gradual inter introduction that you know happens
• 40:12
  throughout the meal but
• 40:13
  you can't i'm sure you can't tell them everything you want to
• 40:17
  tell them you have to
• 40:18
  like you have to learn to to pace it yeah sure but also yeah i
• 40:27
  think what's what's
• 40:29
  cool is that we can we can give you more if you want more you
• 40:34
  know like information
• 40:35
  SPEAKER_00: because everything
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_00: has something behind it.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um,
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_00: but also with this,
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_00: with this moment in the beginning where we have like this,
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_00: where we talk about the research,
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_00: um,
• 40:49
  it's always interesting because guests also get to know each
• 40:52
  other and say,
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_00: Oh,
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_00: where are you from?
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like, or they know each other.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_00: And then the table is, is like a kitchen counter or something like this.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: So you also sit next to people that you don't know.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_00: And,
• 41:07
  You start having conversations and then we're on the other side
• 41:10
  of the table and we
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_00: also get to know the guests and we also have a conversation.
• 41:15
  So this moment in the beginning also helps a lot to break the
• 41:20
  ice and make people
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_00: feel comfortable and that it's not a school or something like this.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's not a test.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's not a test.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_00: You're just going to have a nice time.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_00: And talking to a friend here that is working on a luxury hotel project,
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_00: she was saying to me,
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_00: like when I told her about the restaurant,
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_00: she was asking me,
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_00: but what kind of restaurant will it be?
• 41:46
  Will it be a restaurant where I have to sit with my back
• 41:49
  straight or can I relax?
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's a very good reference.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_01: So Mario, yeah.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_02: You were born...
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_02: And raised in Switzerland.
• 42:01
  SPEAKER_02: But your parents are Dominican, right?
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_02: My mom.
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_02: My dad is Swiss.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_02: What was your connection to the food growing up?
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_02: Was there much?
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, my mom also worked.
• 42:18
  But it was very important for her that we eat lunch and dinner
• 42:21
  together at home.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_00: So she would start like five,
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_00: six in the morning,
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_00: latest,
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_00: mostly five because the stews take a while to cook.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I hated it.
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_02: But this was like traditional Dominican things?
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, often.
• 42:39
  SPEAKER_00: So for me,
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_00: I have this romantic story,
• 42:45
  but I hated it at the moment because I woke up often when I had
• 42:50
  to go to school and
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_00: I woke up with the smell of like garlic,
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_00: onions,
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_00: oregano,
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_00: cilantro,
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_00: like cooking.
• 42:59
  SPEAKER_00: And I would wake up and be like, fuck, why?
• 43:03
  SPEAKER_00: And then my day was already destroyed and I didn't really like beans.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_00: So when it was rice and beans, it was horror for me anyways.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_00: And so I often came late to school because I didn't like to eat.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_00: So my mom was like, no, you don't stand up until you finish your plate.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_00: And I came late to school because of that.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_00: So it was a strange relationship with Dominican food for most of,
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_00: my really early childhood.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_00: But now I really appreciate it.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I see like, fuck, who does this?
• 43:47
  You know,
• 43:47
  like waking up five in the morning to cook fresh stews from
• 43:52
  scratch to have lunch.
• 43:55
  with your family and that everyone came home from their jobs to
• 44:00
  just have lunch one
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_00: hour and then go back to work is something very nice.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's sometimes hard to appreciate it in the moment, I guess.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_01: Were you raised in the French side of Switzerland or?
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_00: In the German side.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_00: In Zurich.
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_00: And
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_00: but because I didn't like it so much at this moment,
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_00: I never really knew much about Dominican food.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_00: And then when I started cooking and traveling in Europe a bit first,
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_00: people always ask me,
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_00: where are you from?
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_00: Can you cook something from where you're from?
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I didn't know much.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_00: So that's when I was like, I find things interesting everywhere I go.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_00: I must like,
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_00: there must be things in Dominican Republic and I love rice and beans and,
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_00: uh,
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_00: and these two's,
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_00: um,
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_00: today.
• 45:03
  Uh,
• 45:04
  but I was always curious what else exists and that's live it
• 45:08
  where all this start.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_02: So you,
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_02: you,
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_02: you had,
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_02: you were working in a lot of restaurants,
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_02: Switzerland and where else you traveled around quite a bit,
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 45:20
  yeah mostly in switzerland um then i went to spain also to san
• 45:27
  sebastian and i
• 45:29
  worked at my i wanted to work at uh but i i just went there and
• 45:36
  didn't have space
• 45:37
  but then i were worked at two different uh pincho places for a
• 45:41
  while then went back
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_00: to zurich then i worked in um well it took a year to like
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_00: travel and work in Latin America and worked a bit in Argentina,
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_00: Peru,
• 45:55
  Colombia and in Mexico mostly and then also here in Dominican
• 46:03
  Republic but it was
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_00: always a mix between
• 46:08
  a lady that sells anticuchos in Cusco that I asked her like if
• 46:13
  I can join her
• 46:14
  making the sauce with guacatay and then I worked one day with
• 46:20
  her and then I worked
• 46:23
  at Lamar for some days but then I also worked at a normal
• 46:29
  cevicheria for some days
• 46:32
  SPEAKER_00: so it was always like
• 46:35
  trying to mix up a little bit and get to know different
• 46:37
  contexts as well.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_02: And this was, what, like maybe like 10 years ago-ish?
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly 10 years ago.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 46:44
  So,
• 46:44
  and then,
• 46:45
  you know,
• 46:45
  all these things happening everywhere else in Latin America.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_02: You know, all these exciting restaurants opening.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_02: And is that when you started to think about the DR more?
• 46:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 47:00
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, the trip started three months in the DR. Okay.
• 47:05
  And then I went to Argentina and traveled all the way up and
• 47:08
  took in different places.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_00: But it, the trip ended at Fuyol in, uh, in Mexico city.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_00: And there it was like,
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_00: this place really shaped me a lot because it's so nice how like design,
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_00: contemporary art,
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_00: um,
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_00: and,
• 47:31
  light and music,
• 47:33
  like everything feels that it makes sense to where you are.
• 47:37
  And I know that this exists in a lot of places in Europe where
• 47:44
  I was used to it,
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_00: but a lot of references in Mexico,
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_00: I was like,
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_00: oh,
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_00: but this also somehow exists in some way in the Caribbean.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_00: And then from there I was like,
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_00: but something like this could,
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_00: not like Puyol,
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_00: but you know,
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_00: like you could work with someone local that makes chairs.
• 48:08
  And there I was like,
• 48:09
  okay,
• 48:09
  it's not only about the ingredients,
• 48:13
  but it's about like everything.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_00: And then I got invited to cook at a gallery in Santo Domingo.
• 48:23
  And there I connected with the curators that were working at
• 48:28
  this gallery.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_00: And,
• 48:30
  We did trips together and then during these trips here in
• 48:34
  Dominican Republic,
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_00: we would visit the family or a colmado or something.
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I would see like,
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_00: wow,
• 48:42
  this chocolate is so interesting because they make it in a
• 48:46
  mortar and I haven't
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_00: seen this technique.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_00: But for someone else,
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_00: it was like,
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_00: wow,
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_00: so interesting that they used two different kind of woods,
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_00: one for the stick and one for the...
• 48:59
  And everyone saw something different that we were looking at
• 49:01
  the same thing.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_00: And then I think that helped me a lot also to connect with other fields.
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_00: Also,
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_00: you,
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_00: Nick,
• 49:09
  told me one time that maybe I should get to know people that
• 49:16
  are interested in
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_00: similar things,
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_00: but not necessarily in...
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_00: in the same way.
• 49:23
  SPEAKER_02: It sounds like great advice.
• 49:27
  SPEAKER_02: I don't remember saying that.
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_02: It sounds great.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_00: No,
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_00: yeah,
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_00: it was because I was like,
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know,
• 49:33
  there's not really books or people that I knew at this moment
• 49:39
  that are interested
• 49:40
  SPEAKER_00: in what I'm interested in.
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_00: And then I was a little bit frustrated and we had a call and
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_00: I was saying, like, it's a little bit difficult to connect.
• 49:57
  SPEAKER_00: And then you're like, yeah, but maybe it's not in gastronomy.
• 50:01
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe it's in music.
• 50:03
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe it's in art.
• 50:04
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe,
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_00: and there,
• 50:08
  I think I also got to question a lot of things that are normal
• 50:13
  in gastronomy.
• 50:15
  SPEAKER_00: And that's why
• 50:18
  SPEAKER_00: we build the restaurant around improvisation and collaboration.
• 50:23
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_01: Where did you guys meet?
• 50:27
  SPEAKER_02: It's funny.
• 50:27
  SPEAKER_02: I was about to, just about to add that.
• 50:30
  SPEAKER_02: So I met, I met him in Mexico at Alfonsina, the restaurant in Oaxaca.
• 50:40
  SPEAKER_02: And I was, I just met Jorge.
• 50:42
  SPEAKER_02: Somebody recommended, I was going to Oaxaca for, for something.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_02: And, uh, somebody recommended like, Oh, um,
• 50:47
  SPEAKER_02: Jorge, who used to work at Pujol, is opening this place with his mother.
• 50:52
  SPEAKER_02: So then I connected with him and the place wasn't really even open yet.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_02: It was just kind of like,
• 50:58
  they just had the idea of a restaurant and I think a sign was
• 51:04
  on its way or something.
• 51:07
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah,
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_02: you were there with two other friends from Switzerland,
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_02: two other cooks,
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_02: and you guys were
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_02: traveling around, right?
• 51:15
  SPEAKER_02: Mexico for a little bit or?
• 51:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
• 51:17
  we were staying at his place for like three nights or something
• 51:22
  like this because
• 51:25
  SPEAKER_00: they haven't been,
• 51:26
  SPEAKER_00: Patrick and Pascal haven't been to Mexico then.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I wanted to do a taco pop-up then in Zurich.
• 51:36
  SPEAKER_00: So we just traveled around and
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_00: Got to go a little bit, and yeah, there we met.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_02: Okay,
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_02: yeah,
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_02: and it was like Dia de los Muertos,
• 51:44
  SPEAKER_02: so it's like all these,
• 51:45
  SPEAKER_02: there's all kinds of fun things going on around town,
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_02: and yeah,
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_02: and then I,
• 51:54
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 51:55
  SPEAKER_02: that Alfonsina experience was like,
• 51:59
  SPEAKER_02: for me,
• 51:59
  SPEAKER_02: it was really like a wow moment,
• 52:01
  SPEAKER_02: just because I had never seen anything quite like that,
• 52:06
  SPEAKER_02: done in that way,
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_02: and I don't just mean like,
• 52:10
  SPEAKER_02: the way they're making traditional recipes,
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_02: but it was like the,
• 52:13
  the approach Jorge had to like precision of these traditional
• 52:18
  recipes and like with the,
• 52:21
  SPEAKER_02: the moles,
• 52:21
  SPEAKER_02: the,
• 52:22
  SPEAKER_02: and the masa and like,
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_02: it was,
• 52:25
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 52:27
  SPEAKER_02: I like totally blew me away.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_02: And like, I'm still blown away by Jorge and his mother.
• 52:31
  And you know,
• 52:33
  every time I talk to that,
• 52:35
  I still talk to them kind of regularly,
• 52:37
  regularly.
• 52:38
  SPEAKER_02: And,
• 52:40
  SPEAKER_02: it's like, they're amazing people, but like, you knew him from Pujol.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_02: What was Jorge like at Pujol?
• 52:48
  SPEAKER_02: Because he's this, he's kind of this quiet figure.
• 52:50
  SPEAKER_02: You don't really get much out of him.
• 52:52
  SPEAKER_02: I'm curious what he was like in that setting.
• 52:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 52:55
  SPEAKER_00: Mostly, mostly he was this white figure.
• 53:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, he was in charge of, uh, I mean, his nickname is Moles.
• 53:05
  SPEAKER_00: So he was in charge of the Moles, but, um,
• 53:11
  SPEAKER_00: And also of all the all the sauce, all the sauces, basically.
• 53:15
  SPEAKER_00: OK.
• 53:15
  SPEAKER_00: And.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he was like, if you.
• 53:24
  He's super like has a huge heart and he's such a nice person
• 53:28
  and he's like not not
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_00: someone that would be like looking for a conflict anywhere.
• 53:35
  SPEAKER_00: But if you.
• 53:39
  SPEAKER_00: As you say, he respects the way things have to be done a lot.
• 53:45
  So if you would make something and you would not roast the
• 53:50
  tomatoes enough that
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_00: they develop this charred flavor,
• 53:56
  SPEAKER_00: he would take it personal and not get pissed,
• 53:59
  SPEAKER_00: but he would just be sad and be like,
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_00: you don't care about this.
• 54:05
  SPEAKER_01: We are broken.
• 54:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, and he would just be sad and ignore you for like a while.
• 54:10
  SPEAKER_00: I can see that, yeah.
• 54:12
  SPEAKER_02: He really feels the cuisine in a way like I've never met anyone else.
• 54:19
  But also from what I understand,
• 54:20
  he was at Pujol at like 3 in the morning every day.
• 54:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 54:26
  SPEAKER_02: So he was like a ghost there.
• 54:28
  SPEAKER_02: His presence was felt, but not everyone always saw him.
• 54:33
  SPEAKER_00: He didn't like the service kitchen, so he was only mostly in prep.
• 54:39
  SPEAKER_00: I think the first two days I was picking herbs as normal stagia,
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_00: and then I asked,
• 54:45
  SPEAKER_00: because I was only there for a month or one and a half,
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_00: and I asked the head chef,
• 54:51
  SPEAKER_00: I was like,
• 54:51
  SPEAKER_00: hey,
• 54:52
  SPEAKER_00: I don't want to do herbs for like a week.
• 54:54
  SPEAKER_00: Can I do something else?
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_00: In normal kitchens, you don't maybe ask this, and I don't know, but
• 55:02
  SPEAKER_00: He was like, but what do you want to do?
• 55:04
  SPEAKER_00: And then he was like,
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_00: yeah,
• 55:06
  SPEAKER_00: I want to do sauces,
• 55:08
  SPEAKER_00: the moles and all these things,
• 55:09
  SPEAKER_00: like mostly everyone,
• 55:11
  SPEAKER_00: I guess.
• 55:12
  SPEAKER_00: And instead of having two or two helping hands for or four helping hands,
• 55:20
  SPEAKER_00: two people for moles,
• 55:23
  SPEAKER_00: they just put me with him and like with that,
• 55:26
  SPEAKER_00: let's drown.
• 55:28
  SPEAKER_00: But we connected and
• 55:32
  It was crazy busy,
• 55:34
  but we kind of did the sauces together,
• 55:37
  running around like crazy.
• 55:39
  SPEAKER_00: But then the moles,
• 55:42
  when we had to do the big mole production of the black mole or
• 55:45
  something like this,
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_00: he would be like,
• 55:48
  SPEAKER_00: yeah,
• 55:48
  SPEAKER_00: you know what?
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_00: What time do we start tomorrow?
• 55:52
  SPEAKER_00: And he's like four.
• 55:54
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, for what?
• 55:56
  SPEAKER_00: It's like four in the morning.
• 55:59
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, but
• 56:00
  SPEAKER_00: Really?
• 56:01
  SPEAKER_00: Four in the morning?
• 56:01
  SPEAKER_00: It was like, yeah, let's meet up at four.
• 56:06
  SPEAKER_00: So,
• 56:06
  SPEAKER_00: uh,
• 56:07
  so we can do all the things before everyone comes because you
• 56:11
  need to use the
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_00: Molino and you need to char all these chilies and et cetera,
• 56:16
  SPEAKER_00: et cetera.
• 56:18
  SPEAKER_00: So I get there at four.
• 56:23
  SPEAKER_00: but the thing was already almost done.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_00: So he was there since one or something.
• 56:29
  SPEAKER_00: I have no clue.
• 56:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I never made it to be there earlier than him.
• 56:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I really like came early, but I mean, it's the same at Alfonsina.
• 56:39
  SPEAKER_00: You feel like they're always cooking.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_00: I made it one time to,
• 56:46
  be up when they make the masa when they mill the masa and it's
• 56:50
  like 4 in the
• 56:51
  morning but you need to cook the corn and like they cooked the
• 56:56
  corn before but you
• 56:57
  need to wash it and like yeah and then when you we went to
• 57:02
  restaurants in Oaxaca in
• 57:04
  the city and when we come back they're like peeling beans and
• 57:08
  we're like damn no
• 57:10
  SPEAKER_02: yeah it's just not like the worth ethic is just unreal and it like
• 57:17
  SPEAKER_00: But I think for him it's more than work ethic, it's just life.
• 57:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 57:22
  SPEAKER_02: No, it's the way it should be done.
• 57:24
  It's the best way to extract flavor from these products and
• 57:29
  it's the way you have to do it.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_02: But it's incredible.
• 57:34
  SPEAKER_00: But then he's also really good salsa dancers.
• 57:37
  SPEAKER_00: He also enjoys going out sometimes.
• 57:40
  SPEAKER_00: That's nice.
• 57:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, I've heard that.
• 57:45
  SPEAKER_02: So what else is going on in the DR?
• 57:49
  SPEAKER_01: Sounds so institutional.
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry?
• 57:53
  Sounds so institutional every time I hear the DR.
• 57:57
  The DR,
• 57:58
  yeah,
• 57:58
  I'm sorry.
• 58:00
  SPEAKER_02: Like North Korea.
• 58:03
  SPEAKER_02: Bam.
• 58:04
  SPEAKER_02: Democratic, Republican, Dominican something.
• 58:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's very... It's interesting.
• 58:12
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 58:12
  SPEAKER_00: It's...
• 58:14
  it's getting easier to travel because of social media and you
• 58:22
  get to know other stuff.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_00: But I think for a very long time,
• 58:25
  SPEAKER_00: it was difficult to,
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_00: you have like Santo Domingo,
• 58:29
  SPEAKER_00: which is kind of the business capital of the Caribbean.
• 58:33
  SPEAKER_00: I feel at least it seems like this.
• 58:38
  SPEAKER_00: And then you have Punta Cana and La Romana that are like,
• 58:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 58:44
  SPEAKER_00: Read a book and enjoy the nice beach areas.
• 58:48
  And there is like a lot of restaurants popping up here at the
• 58:54
  moment that have like
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_00: crazy investments.
• 59:02
  SPEAKER_00: But then the supply chain is so difficult.
• 59:05
  SPEAKER_00: So, but I feel like locals and
• 59:12
  SPEAKER_00: It seems to me like also it's starting to be a topic that also for,
• 59:20
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 59:21
  SPEAKER_00: local development,
• 59:22
  SPEAKER_00: but also for tourism and also just for the culture as it is,
• 59:27
  it's important to understand more about food and everything
• 59:32
  that has to do with hospitality.
• 59:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah,
• 59:36
  SPEAKER_02: no,
• 59:36
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's an important part that,
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_02: just has gotten overlooked for many years as part of this,
• 59:43
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 59:43
  SPEAKER_02: this Caribbean trend of giving,
• 59:48
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 59:49
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 59:50
  SPEAKER_02: fat white Americans what they,
• 59:51
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 59:51
  SPEAKER_02: just like the standard American menu and,
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 59:56
  SPEAKER_02: just focusing on that and,
• 59:57
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 59:58
  SPEAKER_02: nothing,
• 1:00:00
  SPEAKER_02: nothing local is needed,
• 1:00:02
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 1:00:02
  SPEAKER_02: you just don't even care about it.
• 1:00:05
  SPEAKER_02: I think they do now.
• 1:00:06
  SPEAKER_02: And,
• 1:00:07
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 1:00:07
  SPEAKER_02: not just the fat white Americans,
• 1:00:09
  SPEAKER_02: but everyone traveling,
• 1:00:11
  SPEAKER_02: I think,
• 1:00:12
  SPEAKER_02: is more,
• 1:00:13
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 1:00:13
  SPEAKER_02: aware of what they're eating and they want to experience something local.
• 1:00:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:00:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:00:20
  SPEAKER_02: And like I've seen a few other chefs and
• 1:00:24
  SPEAKER_02: on the island who are making names for themselves.
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_02: I haven't been in any of these places, but what's her name?
• 1:00:33
  SPEAKER_02: Chef Tita, I think, seems to be doing a lot of interesting things.
• 1:00:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there's a lot of chefs and people that do things here.
• 1:00:47
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it's very interesting
• 1:00:50
  mixes of cultures then there is a small scene of like very
• 1:01:00
  small projects like
• 1:01:04
  there is a friend of mine Ruth she has a project where she
• 1:01:08
  makes like vegan cheese
• 1:01:11
  with local nuts and she does like misos with local ingredients
• 1:01:18
  and ferments like
• 1:01:20
  SPEAKER_00: everything.
• 1:01:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and that's super cool.
• 1:01:26
  SPEAKER_00: Then there is some people that do interesting beverages.
• 1:01:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and, and we're starting to mix it all up a little bit.
• 1:01:35
  SPEAKER_00: So we also like,
• 1:01:37
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's nice that we start,
• 1:01:39
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 1:01:40
  SPEAKER_00: maybe it's me starting to join the conversations,
• 1:01:43
  SPEAKER_00: but I feel like there is like conversations going on that,
• 1:01:46
  SPEAKER_00: uh,
• 1:01:47
  SPEAKER_00: that try to,
• 1:01:50
  SPEAKER_00: yeah, do things together and, uh, and use resources from one another.
• 1:01:56
  SPEAKER_00: And then there's also like huge restaurants here,
• 1:02:00
  SPEAKER_00: um,
• 1:02:01
  SPEAKER_00: that have crazy volumes and start implementing like local stuff.
• 1:02:09
  SPEAKER_00: That's also nice.
• 1:02:10
  SPEAKER_00: And, uh, yeah, I feel like some things are coming together slowly.
• 1:02:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um,
• 1:02:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's a little bit,
• 1:02:23
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 1:02:24
  SPEAKER_00: we're good with the local audience,
• 1:02:26
  but I think it would be interesting to understand how we can
• 1:02:35
  make people outside of
• 1:02:37
  SPEAKER_00: the city or the country know a little bit about what we're doing.
• 1:02:42
  SPEAKER_00: But I think patience and time will tell if, yeah.
• 1:02:49
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like there's a lot of people visiting the country,
• 1:02:53
  so I feel like that's also something that will become
• 1:03:00
  interesting and just see how
• 1:03:03
  SPEAKER_00: everything develops.
• 1:03:05
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 1:03:07
  But I feel like there is a big interest from the restaurant
• 1:03:12
  community in working
• 1:03:15
  SPEAKER_00: more with local ingredients,
• 1:03:16
  SPEAKER_00: but sometimes
• 1:03:18
  SPEAKER_00: It's true.
• 1:03:19
  SPEAKER_00: It's just a lot more easy to get dried porcinis from somewhere.
• 1:03:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's easier than to get wild mushrooms from here.
• 1:03:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's true.
• 1:03:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:03:31
  SPEAKER_02: But it's, I mean, it just happens slow.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 1:03:35
  the important thing is just to have the conversations and then
• 1:03:38
  little by little,
• 1:03:39
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 1:03:41
  i think just people just start chipping in in different ways
• 1:03:44
  and it kind of i think
• 1:03:45
  it just kind of snowballs and happens out of nowhere yeah i
• 1:03:49
  mean at least that's
• 1:03:50
  what i've seen kind of over the last 20 years kind of
• 1:03:53
  everywhere in latin america
• 1:03:54
  SPEAKER_02: at this point it's just yeah yeah i mean having those how the world is
• 1:04:01
  SPEAKER_00: At the moment,
• 1:04:02
  SPEAKER_00: and it's important that you know what grows in your geography,
• 1:04:08
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 1:04:08
  SPEAKER_00: like what plants can you eat?
• 1:04:11
  Why does it make sense to protect the forest as a forest and
• 1:04:15
  not like just plant?
• 1:04:18
  SPEAKER_00: palm trees in straight rows or something like this.
• 1:04:22
  SPEAKER_00: I think not only because food is nice and in fashion,
• 1:04:28
  SPEAKER_00: but also like the way we consume food makes the landscape in nature,
• 1:04:35
  SPEAKER_00: but also in trash,
• 1:04:38
  SPEAKER_00: like everything that is packed in certain ways and everything.
• 1:04:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think
• 1:04:46
  it's also a bigger conversation than just the restaurants that
• 1:04:50
  is important to have
• 1:04:51
  SPEAKER_00: on an island.
• 1:04:57
  SPEAKER_02: All right, man.
• 1:04:58
  SPEAKER_02: Julie, any last questions?
• 1:05:01
  SPEAKER_01: I keep,
• 1:05:02
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know,
• 1:05:02
  SPEAKER_01: I keep thinking about this approach,
• 1:05:05
  calmness and kindness and how it brings a sense of normality to
• 1:05:12
  the industry,
• 1:05:13
  SPEAKER_01: to hospitality,
• 1:05:16
  SPEAKER_01: and it's refreshing.
• 1:05:17
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't know,
• 1:05:18
  SPEAKER_01: it makes me think that the dynamic in restaurants can be different,
• 1:05:24
  SPEAKER_01: which,
• 1:05:25
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 1:05:25
  SPEAKER_01: I
• 1:05:28
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 1:05:28
  SPEAKER_01: as I admire them and the work that everyone does,
• 1:05:31
  SPEAKER_01: because it's really hard work,
• 1:05:33
  SPEAKER_01: amazing.
• 1:05:34
  SPEAKER_01: It's just crushing to see that the energy has to be hectic and,
• 1:05:39
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 1:05:39
  SPEAKER_01: just stressful and mean.
• 1:05:44
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that's, yeah, it's kind of a treasure, I hope.
• 1:05:52
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 1:05:54
  hope it flourishes and expands and yeah yeah let's see i got i
• 1:06:01
  got a stock in that
• 1:06:02
  calmness for for for good you know for a good thing all right
• 1:06:11
  i'll highlight that
• 1:06:13
  SPEAKER_02: yeah thanks man it's good talking to you everyone check out
• 1:06:16
  SPEAKER_02: Casare, right?
• 1:06:18
  SPEAKER_02: What does Casare mean?
• 1:06:20
  SPEAKER_02: What does it mean?
• 1:06:22
  SPEAKER_00: Casare, first it was Casaret, which red is like net in Spanish.
• 1:06:31
  And so because we feel like we're just part of a big network of
• 1:06:35
  people and things,
• 1:06:40
  SPEAKER_00: we wanted to call it Casaret.
• 1:06:41
  SPEAKER_00: But then we exactly, now it's a good moment to have
• 1:06:46
  this explanation because Casa Red for an English speaking
• 1:06:52
  person would be Casa Red
• 1:06:54
  and then we would have the question now why the house is not
• 1:06:56
  red so we kind of
• 1:07:00
  wanted to write it the way you would pronounce it as a
• 1:07:03
  Dominican person that would
• 1:07:04
  be Casa Red you know I think isn't there a bank called Casa Red
• 1:07:10
  like Casa Red like
• 1:07:12
  SPEAKER_00: I
• 1:07:13
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like I've seen one maybe in Peru or somewhere.
• 1:07:15
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, I don't know.
• 1:07:16
  SPEAKER_02: ATMs or let's say.
• 1:07:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because mostly it's here in Dominican Republic, it's una red.
• 1:07:26
  And that's like the network of all the banks that can use the
• 1:07:31
  same ATMs because
• 1:07:32
  SPEAKER_00: it's again like the network.
• 1:07:34
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, that's maybe la red.
• 1:07:38
  SPEAKER_01: I do have a question about the trips you organize.
• 1:07:42
  One of your posts,
• 1:07:43
  it's with a chair and saying like,
• 1:07:46
  we are almost ready.
• 1:07:48
  SPEAKER_01: We have been waiting for.
• 1:07:49
  SPEAKER_01: So I wonder how that works.
• 1:07:51
  You just gather a group and you go from there or what is the
• 1:07:56
  goal and the idea with
• 1:07:58
  SPEAKER_01: those exploratory trips?
• 1:08:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um,
• 1:08:01
  SPEAKER_00: so one is that we as,
• 1:08:04
  SPEAKER_00: we as team from Casa Re,
• 1:08:05
  SPEAKER_00: we,
• 1:08:06
  SPEAKER_00: we go together to just to understand like where we get things from,
• 1:08:09
  SPEAKER_00: et cetera.
• 1:08:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um,
• 1:08:12
  but now people start asking if they can join us for trips to
• 1:08:16
  forage or to visit
• 1:08:17
  SPEAKER_00: some specific things.
• 1:08:20
  Um,
• 1:08:22
  and yeah,
• 1:08:23
  these trips,
• 1:08:25
  the goal of these trips is first to like,
• 1:08:27
  I mean,
• 1:08:30
  SPEAKER_00: For me, most of these people have become like close friends.
• 1:08:35
  So visit them,
• 1:08:37
  see how everything is,
• 1:08:38
  but also understand better what they do.
• 1:08:44
  Also,
• 1:08:44
  we try to invite the producers to our restaurants so they
• 1:08:48
  understand what we do.
• 1:08:52
  SPEAKER_00: But then, yeah, just exchange knowledge.
• 1:08:57
  Sometimes these trips are also to get the ingredients because
• 1:09:01
  we have to go and
• 1:09:02
  SPEAKER_00: visit them to buy it from them sometimes and document things as well,
• 1:09:09
  SPEAKER_00: like document with pictures,
• 1:09:13
  SPEAKER_00: how they do things and have conversations.
• 1:09:17
  Sometimes visiting people after four or five visits,
• 1:09:22
  you realize that they also do this and
• 1:09:27
  SPEAKER_00: Just, I don't know, staying in touch with the people.
• 1:09:33
  SPEAKER_00: And for other people that visit or join us for these trips now,
• 1:09:41
  SPEAKER_00: some things for us become normal.
• 1:09:44
  SPEAKER_00: And then somebody visiting is like, wow, that's so interesting.
• 1:09:49
  SPEAKER_00: Or why haven't you thought about doing this like this?
• 1:09:53
  SPEAKER_00: And it's always interesting to have these conversations.
• 1:09:57
  And also to not exactly not be always in the environment where
• 1:10:02
  in the end of the day,
• 1:10:03
  SPEAKER_00: you have to serve 18 people and a full menu.
• 1:10:07
  SPEAKER_00: It's like.
• 1:10:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:10:11
  SPEAKER_01: Gives perspective too.
• 1:10:16
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 1:10:17
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it was good speaking radio.
• 1:10:21
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
• 1:10:21
  SPEAKER_02: Sounds great.
• 1:10:23
  SPEAKER_02: I hope to get there soon.
• 1:10:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 1:10:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, please.
• 1:10:27
  SPEAKER_02: The weather would be nice.
• 1:10:29
  SPEAKER_02: I'm freezing right now.
• 1:10:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:10:33
  SPEAKER_02: I turn off the heat in my barn where I work.
• 1:10:37
  SPEAKER_02: I do these because it's not that loud, but it makes some noise.
• 1:10:41
  SPEAKER_02: So I turn it off and I'm like, I'm freezing.
• 1:10:45
  SPEAKER_01: Freezing for us.
• 1:10:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:10:47
  SPEAKER_00: Where are both of you?
• 1:10:48
  SPEAKER_00: You're upstate New York, Nick, right?
• 1:10:53
  SPEAKER_02: I wouldn't say upstate, but yeah, north of the city and Julie's in LA.
• 1:10:56
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 1:10:57
  SPEAKER_02: Safe.
• 1:10:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:10:58
  SPEAKER_02: Safe, thankfully.
• 1:11:00
  SPEAKER_02: Safe.
• 1:11:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:11:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:11:04
  SPEAKER_01: We are in opposite sides.
• 1:11:08
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 1:11:09
  SPEAKER_00: Cool.
• 1:11:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:11:10
  SPEAKER_00: Nice.
• 1:11:11
  But thank you so much for having me on the podcast and hope to
• 1:11:16
  have you here soon.
• 1:11:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:11:18
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 1:11:19
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks to you.
• 1:11:20
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 1:11:20
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 1:11:21
  SPEAKER_01: Have a great day there.
• 1:11:22
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 1:11:23
  SPEAKER_00: All the best.
• 1:11:24
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you everyone for listening.
• 1:11:26
  SPEAKER_02: I hope you enjoyed that interview with Casa Ray chef Olivier Burr,
• 1:11:32
  SPEAKER_02: the Swiss Dominican chef,
• 1:11:35
  SPEAKER_02: um,
• 1:11:36
  SPEAKER_02: in the Caribbean doing some interesting things.
• 1:11:39
  A big thank you to my friend Pat Buzzard for providing the
• 1:11:42
  music to the show.
• 1:11:43
  And again,
• 1:11:44
  sign up for our newsletter at neworder.com or neworder on Substack.
• 1:11:50
  SPEAKER_02: Also, please like us, share us, spread the word.
• 1:11:53
  SPEAKER_02: It really does help.
• 1:11:54
  SPEAKER_02: Just clicking that like,
• 1:11:56
  like really taking one second out of your day and just clicking
• 1:11:59
  like or share.
• 1:12:01
  SPEAKER_02: Whatever.
• 1:12:02
  SPEAKER_02: It's a big deal.
• 1:12:03
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you.