Latest / Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections / Networking Unleashed: An Interview with Dusten Hendrickson and Michael A Forman, Professional Speaker

Transcript

Networking Unleashed: An Interview with Dusten Hendrickson and Michael A Forman, Professional Speaker · Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections

0:14
Welcome to Networking Unleashed, Building Profitable
0:17
Connections. I'm your host, Michael Foreman,
0:21
and this is the show where relationships meet
0:24
real results. Today's guest works at the intersection
0:28
of money, housing, and long -term security. We're
0:32
talking about solving the affordable crisis,
0:35
building wealth through hands -off real estate,
0:38
and creating a future where retirement comes
0:41
sooner. without cutting back the life you've
0:44
worked so hard to build. This conversation goes
0:47
beyond property and numbers. It's about access,
0:50
trust, and the right relationships that open
0:54
doors most people never see. If you care about
0:58
freedom, stability, and making smart moves with
1:02
the right people around you, you're in the right
1:04
place. I'd like to welcome to the podcast today,
1:08
Dustin. He has an incredible background. Would
1:12
you mind just telling my audience who you are,
1:16
how you got here today, and that's how we're
1:18
going to start. Hey, thanks for having me, Michael.
1:21
Yeah, my name is Dustin Hendrickson. I am the
1:24
founder of Mailbox Money Real Estate, and we
1:28
raise private equity to develop multifamily housing,
1:33
workforce housing for professionals. And I've
1:37
been doing it since 2003. My mom wanted to build
1:42
a duplex. And so we started, that's how I started.
1:46
And then I slowly scaled up. But in about 2018,
1:51
2017, 2018, we started flatlining on our growth
1:56
or on our profitability. Actually, we felt that
1:59
we were still growing, but we were not as profitable
2:02
or just flat on profits, even though we were
2:05
busier than we ever had been. And that was actually
2:08
because of a lack of connections. So we discovered
2:11
syndication, the LPGP structure, and it was all
2:18
about networking and connections. And from there,
2:22
we started networking more. I met another partner
2:25
that taught me how to do the syndication process
2:28
in Nashville at a networking conference all about
2:32
syndication. And yeah, from there, from all the
2:36
connections we started building and the networking,
2:38
we started being able to scale and expand. Great.
2:43
That's great. So you found out that I feel that
2:47
networking is the lifeblood of business. And
2:51
we can't seem to get away from that. All the
2:54
AI talk and everything else, it's the person
2:57
-to -person networking. Okay, so let's do this
3:00
by the numbers. When it comes to real estate
3:03
and housing solutions, how often does success
3:06
come down to you when it comes down to who you
3:12
know before what you know? 99 % of the time.
3:18
Yeah. You want to expand a little bit on that?
3:21
Yeah. So in our business, it's all about buying
3:25
land. So we have to first purchase the land.
3:28
Then we have to raise the money from... a bunch
3:31
of investors and we have to know bankers and
3:35
each each person that we meet it's about trust
3:38
if the land owner doesn't trust you to close
3:41
on the land they're not even going to talk to
3:43
you they're they might talk to you but they're
3:45
not going to take you seriously so that you have
3:47
to build a relationship with them they have to
3:50
trust you then you go talk to the bankers the
3:52
bankers obviously have to trust you and the more
3:55
bankers that you know the better it is because
3:57
the better terms you'll get and then The investors,
4:02
it's 100 % trust. Most investors don't even really
4:06
look or study the deal. They more, they like
4:10
the location and then they like you. So the trust
4:14
that you build with the investors is extremely
4:16
important. And then you have to have partners
4:20
and employees that also you have good relationships
4:23
with that work with you to do all the. to get
4:26
all the details done so every single aspect of
4:30
it is relationship based and the higher up you
4:33
go the more relationship based it is the less
4:37
about the work the less about doing the work
4:39
and the more about who you know yeah i i go all
4:44
over the country and i teach workshops and i
4:47
do breakout sessions keynotes and things like
4:49
that and i have a hard time telling the 20 -somethings
4:54
and 30 -somethings about networking, about the
4:58
person -to -person, because they're always behind
5:00
a computer screen or their cell phones. They
5:03
forgot or they were never taught how to network
5:07
and how important it truly is. Yeah, so maybe
5:11
one way that you could break through that cycle
5:17
with a young crowd is to let them know if...
5:21
AI can take your job, which if you're working
5:23
behind a computer or a phone or just doing the
5:27
work, AI can take your job. If AI can take your
5:30
job, your security is not really there. So your
5:32
security comes from all the relationships you
5:36
build and being able to get something done through
5:40
those relationships and not actually doing the
5:43
work. So that's really how you scale up. And
5:45
AI can never take my job. I've tried to have
5:48
AI help me, and AI does not help me. It tells
5:51
me to get some of the little tasks done, but
5:53
it cannot do what I do. No, I use AI as a tool,
5:58
and that's all. Because you don't have the emotional
6:02
support when you use AI. It takes all that out
6:07
of it. So you have to bring the human element
6:10
into it. fix that, AI really isn't going to replace
6:15
what I do, but I use it as a tool. Yes. The affordable
6:21
housing crisis isn't something one person fixes
6:24
alone. What types of relationships have mattered
6:28
most in making real progress here? Relationships
6:34
with the municipalities. So if you can convince
6:38
a municipality that you have the solution. for
6:41
their problem what we find is that most cities
6:44
that's the top three on their problems top three
6:48
issues is affordable housing sometimes it's number
6:51
one sometimes it's two sometimes it's three but
6:55
it's always in the top three no matter where
6:57
you go and if affordable housing is not an issue
7:01
that means they got way more issues to deal with
7:03
but yeah affordable housing is almost always
7:05
top three everywhere we go and if it's not top
7:09
three then that's a really good community and
7:11
they've got everything figured out, which is
7:13
very rare. Very rare. Real estate investing involves
7:18
large financial commitments. Does trust get built
7:23
inside investor networks and how do you spot
7:26
it early? Yeah, it's all about trust. Investors,
7:31
if they don't trust you, they will not invest.
7:33
It's way too much money. There's way too much
7:36
money at play for there not to be trust there.
7:40
So, and then how do you, how does that come into,
7:43
what'd you say about it? Or how does it come
7:46
in early? Yeah. How do you spot it early? I don't
7:50
know. How do you spot trust early? I don't know.
7:56
There's a mantra in networking. I don't mean
8:01
to, but there's a mantra in networking. It's
8:05
if they know you, if they like you, if they trust
8:07
you, then they'll do business with you. And to
8:10
know you, you know everybody. So that's not a
8:13
problem. But like you, that narrows the scope
8:16
down just a bit. Because listen, as good as you
8:19
and I are, everybody isn't going to like us.
8:22
But then you get to the trust factor. And the
8:25
trust factor is so important that nothing can
8:28
be built if you don't go past that point. And
8:32
it really I find it just takes experience to
8:37
you can see if somebody is truly telling you
8:41
the truth or if he's just that good of a con
8:43
artist. You've got it. You spot that early because
8:46
you can tell whether somebody is not right. Yeah,
8:51
I guess. So when I it's easier for me to see
8:55
if someone is trustworthy than to see if. than
8:59
for me to notice if they trust me. Probably if
9:03
they take your advice, if they want to get on
9:05
the phone with you, those things. Maybe that's
9:08
just a like though. Maybe that's when they like
9:11
you and they're answering your phone call. I
9:13
know as soon as they invest with you, they trust
9:16
you. That's for sure. I think they really don't
9:18
have a choice, yeah? Because they've given you
9:20
the money and so they have to put some sort of
9:23
trust in what you're doing. Yeah. Okay, so. Many
9:28
people want hands -off real estate opportunities,
9:31
but never see them. How does being in the right
9:35
circles change what opinions, I'm sorry, change
9:39
what options even become visible? Knowing all
9:46
the right people will put you in front of all
9:49
the opportunities as well. So as you start to
9:53
network, as you start to introduce yourself to
9:56
different groups. More and more of these opportunities
9:59
will come up. And at first, when you first start
10:03
investing, there are no passive opportunities.
10:08
So everything seems to be that you have to go
10:13
and do the work yourself, except for stocks and
10:15
bonds. But those don't really pay that well because
10:19
everyone has access to them. So you got to find
10:21
the passive deals that the wealthy have access
10:24
to. And the more... that you get into that ecosystem,
10:30
the more you'll see different deals open up to
10:33
you. There's many different real estate deals
10:36
you could do. You could start getting in with
10:38
some developers that are local. And a lot of
10:41
these deals are closed off and they don't go
10:43
public ever. So you have to get within the ecosystem
10:47
to find those deals. But talking to the wealthy
10:53
people, that's where all the deals are. This
10:55
is why it helps to have... At least one rich
10:58
friend. You have one rich friend and that rich
11:00
friend will start introducing you to other rich
11:03
friends or more opportunities. I just watched
11:06
something the other day that said a rich person
11:10
will mentor you and help you and show you. That
11:13
makes rich people feel really good is when they
11:17
can help somebody climb the ranks, whereas poor
11:20
people just want to pull you back down and crabs
11:23
in the bucket type mentality. try to upgrade
11:27
your network. What they say, your network is
11:30
your net worth. You take the five people you're
11:32
closest to, average up all the salary, and that's
11:34
probably what you're going to be, the salary
11:36
you're going to be making. That's great. As a
11:40
matter of fact, on my website are digital courses
11:43
that I've written. And my number one biggest
11:47
seller is network to net worth. And that is what
11:53
it's all about. What role? Have warm introductions
11:57
played in opening doors to deals, partnerships,
12:00
or capital that would have been unreachable otherwise?
12:07
I met my partner, Omar, down at the first syndication
12:12
conference I went to. And so then he taught me
12:15
all about how the LPGP structure works and then
12:19
getting that knowledge and being able to talk.
12:24
the way he talks has opened up a lot of doors
12:26
for me. Bankers tend to open up a lot of doors
12:30
for you to get relationships with those guys.
12:35
I don't know. I guess it's, I don't look at just
12:38
one thing. I guess it's all just seems to compound
12:41
so rapidly once you start growing. It's definitely,
12:48
it's the warm introductions that can lead to
12:51
other introductions. And it goes all the way
12:54
back down to that trust factor. So that if the
12:57
warm introduction to a person, and if they trust
13:02
you, then they'll introduce you to somebody else.
13:05
If they're not going to trust you, then they
13:08
will never introduce you. Yeah. Yep. I guess
13:12
I feel like I just, I do the work. I'll get an
13:16
introduction and then I'll do what I say I did.
13:19
I do what I'll say I'm going to do. And then
13:21
I'll add value first. And then by adding the
13:24
value and not really seeking anything in return,
13:27
the return comes back to you. And then that's
13:29
how you get introductions. You get brought onto
13:31
the team. So they'll bring you onto a team. And
13:34
then on that team, there's a bunch of other people
13:36
and you'll start working with those people. What
13:39
you just said is the key to networking. You always
13:43
bring value to the relationship before you do
13:46
an ask, right? I firmly believe in having a servant's
13:51
heart. You go there and you do what you say you're
13:54
going to do. You do it for other people. And
13:56
when you do enough, they're going to turn around.
13:59
They're going to say, wait a second. You know,
14:00
Dustin did all this. Let me listen a little bit
14:03
closer or let me do something for him. And it
14:07
starts that symbiotic relationship. When someone
14:11
is focused on not outliving their money, how
14:15
should they think about building relationships
14:17
differently than someone chasing short -term
14:20
goals? Long -term relationships. It's hard for
14:28
me to put myself in the shoes of someone chasing
14:31
short -term anything. So I don't really understand
14:34
what... they would be doing as opposed to the
14:39
long -term people. This just comes down to just
14:42
putting in the years, just do what you say you're
14:45
going to do. Trust takes many years to build
14:48
and just a few moments to destroy. So you put
14:52
20 years into building trust and then you do
14:54
one shady thing and then now all that trust is
14:59
eroded. So short term, I don't know, I guess
15:02
the short term to me, short term thinker would
15:04
be just trying to get something for themselves,
15:08
being very selfish, which doesn't work in the
15:11
long term at all. So short term thinking, I don't
15:14
really understand how they even operate because
15:17
it seems like a very low mentality to be a short
15:20
term thinker. You just reminded me of something.
15:25
I'm an old Air Force vet and. When I was in Desert
15:29
Storm and when I was in McGuire Air Force Base
15:32
in New Jersey, the commander would, I'd say,
15:36
would give you an attaboy. You did a great job.
15:39
You did this great. You did this good and everything
15:41
else. And you can get 100 attaboys, but you have
15:45
one all crap, one negative all crap that wipes
15:48
the 100 away. So you have to always follow through
15:53
with what you say you're going to do as a minimum.
15:56
Then if you want to go above and beyond, that's
15:58
different. But what you said was key because
16:01
if you do what you say you're going to do, that's
16:06
80 % better than your competition. For those
16:10
who want freedom sooner without cutting back
16:14
their lifestyle, how do relationships accelerate
16:17
that timeline? I don't know if you can get freedom
16:20
sooner without cutting back. Because the reason
16:24
why you're probably in the position you're in
16:26
without the freedom is because you're overextending
16:29
yourself somehow. Yeah, I don't know. I don't
16:33
know. You have to cut back somewhere. Because
16:36
if you're doing everything right, then you already
16:40
have the freedom. So I would say you have to
16:44
examine where your money's going. You have a
16:49
bunch of loans and a bunch of debt. You have
16:51
a bunch of debt on depreciating assets. So I
16:54
would say you have to start thinking long -term
16:58
again, and you have to put money into things
17:01
that don't necessarily pay you immediately that
17:03
aren't liquid. You have to buy long -term assets.
17:07
You have to buy assets that reduce your taxable
17:11
liability. So I guess that's one thing you could
17:14
do. Maybe you don't have to cut back, but instead
17:16
of paying Uncle Sam. With your taxes, you start
17:18
investing in real estate. But the thing is that
17:21
inherently makes you have to cut back for the
17:24
first year because you have to invest the money.
17:27
You don't necessarily get the tax benefits till
17:30
the following year or the following two years.
17:32
So all the money you're paying Uncle Sam, so
17:36
you have these high earners and they're paying
17:37
50 % to Uncle Sam, 40 to 50%. That can all go
17:42
into investments and then you can get your taxable
17:45
income to zero. So instead of paying Uncle Sam
17:48
$200 ,000 to $500 ,000 a year, put that money
17:51
into investments. Five years from now, you're
17:53
going to have some really good passive income
17:56
and your regular ordinary income should be very
18:00
similar. So that's what I'd say. Replace all
18:03
the money that you're paying in taxes and put
18:05
that into investments, real estate investments
18:08
that reduce your taxable income. Okay, I'll go
18:11
with that. I'll go with that. Not every group
18:14
is worth joining. What signals tell you a network
18:18
will help you grow instead of draining your time
18:21
or money? I go off intuition. So if this resonates
18:28
really well with me and I feel like I've got
18:31
some aha moments right off the bat and I want
18:34
to learn from it, then I'll go into it. But doing
18:39
the program is really the only way you can tell
18:41
if it's a waste of time or not. cut the program
18:44
off once you realize you're not really learning
18:47
that much anymore. But you also have to put yourself,
18:51
you have to do the program, right? You can't
18:53
just go in and then not do the work and then
18:55
quit. But if even if you find yourself not doing
18:58
the work, it's probably not for you. You're probably
19:00
not inspired enough. Doesn't necessarily mean
19:02
it's the wrong program. It might just be the
19:04
wrong time. You might need some more knowledge
19:06
upfront before you join that program. But I say
19:09
intuition, if it aligns with you, if everything,
19:14
Looks like it's going to work for what you want
19:16
to do in the future. I'd say join it. Give it
19:19
a try. You're never going to... Some people are
19:24
like, oh, if you go do that, you're going to
19:26
get ripped off. Oh, don't do that. You're going
19:27
to get ripped off. And then they end up doing
19:29
nothing. So pay a little bit of money. See what
19:33
you feel about the course. And if it's a bad
19:36
course, that's fine. Quit the course and move
19:38
and do another course or get into another group.
19:42
How long would you suggest somebody stay in a
19:46
course or a networking group or something else
19:48
before they can really truly find out? I don't
19:54
know, a month, two months, three months. It just
19:57
all depends on you and how much effort you're
19:59
putting in. You'll know when you're done with
20:01
the group. That's what I always say. And most
20:04
people. Probably keeps, they stay with the group
20:08
because it's familiar, it's comfortable. But
20:10
once you get to that point, you should probably
20:11
move on to another group and put yourself in
20:14
a more uncomfortable position where you're learning.
20:17
I like to learn though. I'm always the one who,
20:20
because everybody asks me. where I am and what
20:25
because I have a networking group I meet weekly
20:28
with about 17 or 20 businesses and we discuss
20:31
the networking and everything else and they ask
20:34
me they have a thousand other networking groups
20:36
and they always ask me a time frame like when
20:40
do you know when you find out if it's good for
20:43
you or not and have a round term I always say
20:46
three three months give it three months And if
20:49
you don't, because the first month, everything
20:51
is new and you're really unsure. The second month,
20:55
you're getting your footing. And the third month,
20:57
you're going to really, truly understand what
21:00
you're doing, why you're there and everything
21:02
else. So I always give it to three months. Okay.
21:06
So in real estate, people often guard information.
21:12
What happens when professionals choose shared
21:16
progress instead of secrecy? I think it's similar.
21:22
I think it's similar with every industry. I think
21:26
people are inherently scared of giving away the
21:29
secret sauce and someone coming in and stealing
21:33
all their info and doing what they do. I found
21:36
that nobody is going to take your info. Very
21:40
rarely is someone going to take your info and
21:42
copy you. I put it all out there, put everything
21:47
out there. what we're doing. And then that actually
21:49
builds trust with people. And now they want to
21:52
come in and invest because when they see how
21:55
much at work it takes to do what you're doing
21:57
there, they just say, ah, that's way too much
21:59
work. I'll just, if I can just join him instead
22:02
of trying to do all that work, that'll be much
22:05
better. So it builds a, when you share all of
22:08
your information, it builds a huge level of trust
22:11
with people in the public. And then it also,
22:13
it signals that you're not scared so you have
22:18
an abundance mindset versus a scarcity mindset
22:20
and a scarcity mindset will not do you any good
22:23
it's never going to do you any good and even
22:26
if you have a scarcity mindset people can still
22:28
come in and steal all your ideas it's not that
22:30
hard i'll go with that let's bring this podcast
22:35
full circle and looking back was there a single
22:41
relationship or introduction that shifted your
22:44
entire path And what lessons should listeners
22:48
take from that story? I would say no, because
22:52
it happens to me all the time. I'll get introduced
22:55
to someone and then that shifts my entire path.
22:58
And then I'll get introduced to another someone
23:00
and that shifts my entire path. So I constantly
23:03
look for that one relationship. But let's see,
23:07
my partner, Caleb, meeting my partner, Caleb.
23:14
has really shifted because I realized that I
23:17
could put all the general contracting work onto
23:20
him. So I was a general contractor. I did all
23:23
my own building and all my own development and
23:25
all my own asset management, property management,
23:28
all of that. And I always assumed that if you
23:32
didn't build, how could you create the equity
23:36
you needed to create to develop these projects?
23:39
So that's how I did it. I was the builder. And
23:42
so I would use that equity in each project. Then
23:47
I met Caleb and I just, one day I just, I think
23:51
I hurt my back on the job site. And I said, I'm
23:53
done. I'm done with all this heavy lifting and
23:56
stuff. I'm too old. I've already put in all my
23:58
time. And I'll never be able to expand to where
24:01
I want to expand if I keep doing all the general
24:04
contracting. So I ended up giving Caleb all the
24:08
general contracting work. And then that's when
24:10
I really realized that I didn't even like general
24:12
contracting. I would rather do the design and
24:16
the marketing and the capital raising and the
24:18
land acquisition. That really helped me. But
24:22
then I did the same thing with property management.
24:24
Someone told me one time. you can't find a property
24:28
manager. It's because of you. You're not the
24:31
best property manager in the world. You just
24:34
need to trust. You need to trust and you need
24:37
to find a really good property manager. He said,
24:39
look at all these buildings down here. These
24:41
buildings are better than any building you own
24:44
and someone else is property managing it, not
24:46
you. So get that idea out of your head that you're
24:49
the only one that can property manage because
24:51
it's not true. And he said, you'll never be able
24:54
to scale. That was one of the first where I realized
24:58
that I have to trust other people much more than
25:02
I was. And then the general contracting was another
25:04
step. And then you meet people that help you
25:07
capital raise. I don't know. Once you get that
25:11
one connection, you're going to find the next
25:14
connection and you just have to keep doing the
25:15
same thing because you have to constantly scale.
25:19
Good, good. Dustin, this was a great podcast.
25:24
I love what you had to say. It really made me
25:27
think about my investments. If somebody wanted
25:31
to contact you, they wanted your help or to have
25:35
you consult, where can they find you? Mailboxmoneyre
25:39
.com. Mailboxmoneyre, as in realestate .com.
25:45
That's great. That's great. So that was an eye
25:48
-opening conversation. What stood out most is
25:52
how much progress comes down to relationships,
25:55
the right introductions, the right partners,
25:57
and the right rooms. If this episode gave you
26:01
a new way to think about money, housing, or your
26:04
own timeline to freedom, pass it along to someone
26:07
who needs to hear it. Thanks for spending time
26:09
with me on Networking Unleashed, Building Profitable
26:11
Connections. I'm Michael Foreman. Keep building
26:14
strong relationships. Keep those thinking long
26:18
term and keep moving towards the life you want.
26:21
So until next time, I bid you adieu. Dustin,
26:25
thank you again for coming on my podcast. Hey,
26:29
thanks for having me, Michael. It was a good
26:30
time. Well, hold on, folks. Don't go anywhere.
26:37
Let's hear from our sponsors. David Neal, co
26:40
-founder Revved Up Kids. Revved Up Kids is on
26:44
a mission to protect children and teens from
26:47
sexual abuse, exploitation, and trafficking.
26:50
They provide prevention training programs for
26:53
children, teens, and adults. To learn more, go
26:57
to revvedupkids .org. Henry Kaplan, Century 21.
27:02
When it comes to making the biggest financial
27:04
decision of your life, leave it in the hands
27:07
of a proven professional, Henry Kaplan. Henry
27:10
is a global real estate agent with Century 21,
27:13
celebrating his 41st year in business. No matter
27:17
where you're moving, Henry has the right connections
27:20
for you. You can contact Henry at 561 -427 -4888.
27:28
A huge thank you to our guests for sharing such
27:31
insights today. And of course, a big shout out
27:35
to you, our amazing listeners, for tuning in
27:38
and spending your time with us. If you're interested
27:41
in my digital courses, being coached or having
27:44
me come and talk to your company, just go to
27:47
Michael and fill out the request form. Remember,
27:51
networking isn't about being perfect. It's about
27:54
being present. So take what you've learned today,
27:57
get out there and make some meaningful connections.
28:01
If you've enjoyed this episode, please don't
28:03
forget to subscribe. Leave us a review and share
28:07
it with someone who could use a little networking
28:09
inspiration. Let's keep the conversation going.
28:12
You can find me on Apple, Spotify, Pandora, YouTube,
28:17
or my website, foreman .com slash podcasts.