Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / #1096 - Age-Based Consent Conversations

Transcript

#1096 - Age-Based Consent Conversations · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: It's the Happy Family's podcast.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: It's the podcast for the time poor parent who just
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: once answers.
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: Now Today on the Happy Family Podcast, Kylie, we've got
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: a big conversation.
• 0:17
  Speaker 2: Hang on, hang on, don't hang on. Today is a
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: bit of a big deal.
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: Yes, he's nearly fifty.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: You turn fifty.
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: No, no, I'll be fifty.
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: Lovely way to bring it up.
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: We'll play doctor Justin Coulson. I knew you were going
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: to say something. I didn't expect it straight away, but
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: I knew you were going to say something. It's your birthday,
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: but I'm not turning fifty.
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: Well you're close.
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: I am close, but I'm not very very close. All right,
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: let's move on with the podcast. Thanks so much for
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: doing that forty nine today. As I was saying before,
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: I was so rudely interrupted by this whipper snapper over
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: here in the corner. Today, I'm happy on this podcasts.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: It's my birthday, I mean sorry, not today, and they
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: have your family podcasts. We're having a conversation about consent
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: for a couple of reasons. Number one, the Australian Government's
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: new campaign Consent Can't Wait, is out and about. You
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: can find the website, which we will link to in
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: the show notes literally consent dot gov dot AU. I'm
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: an ambassador for the Consent Can't Wait campaign, and I've
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: recorded a whole bunch of commercials that you've seen around
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: the place, Consent Can't Wait. It's a really important conversation.
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: Most people agree that consent is key to healthy sexual experiences,
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: but a lot of people struggle to understand what consent means.
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: I know, we think we know what's going on, but
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: there's much more to consent than what most people know.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: So today a conversation about the nuances of consent and
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: specifically how we can raise these important issues with our children,
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: with the kids and teenagers in our lives. And we're
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: going to go through a stage by stage, Kylie, So
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: you guide us from stage to stage, and I'll add
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: the main ideas. And I'm sure you'll have plenty to
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: say because you've helped me to raise in fact, primarily
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: you've raised our six daughters. What do you want to start?
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: I guess at the beginning, well, let's start with zero
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: to five. This is in my mind, this is a
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: little bit of a gray area when it comes to consent.
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: What do you mean by gray Area.
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: I think that there is definitely a wide perception that
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: as young children that it's okay to kiss and cuddle
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: and all of those things because they're gorgeous, right, pinch
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: their cheeks.
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, not just that. But if you listen to the
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: old folks talk back radio, what you'll often hear is
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: people getting upset when conversations around this come up. They're like,
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: they're my grandkids. I'll kiss them and cuddle them if
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: I want.
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: So, I guess the easiest way that I would talk
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: about this is consent starts at the beginning with conversations
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: around body safety and what consent is and boundaries. The
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: other one that always gets people upset is the whole
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: nappy changing thing or the tickling kids or rough housing
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: with kids, that sort of thing. So let's go through
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: each of those. First off, I want to start with
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: tickling and rough housing. This one really gets people up
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: in arms. If the kids are saying stop or don't,
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: then just say okay and stop. And what happens, of course,
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: is that the children, about three seconds later, as long
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: as the tickling and rough housing was appropriate, about half
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: a second lad of to say again again again, like
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: they love it, but sometimes it's just too much. And
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: when we let them know that if they ask us
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: to stop, that we will stop. We're literally teaching them
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: that their voice matters, that they have agency, they have power,
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: and they can choose for themselves what activities they're involved in,
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: what activities they're not involved in. That's the whole idea
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: of teaching consents children aged zero to five. It's not
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: that you're the same with changing an happy right, the
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: idea that you're supposed to ask your child if you
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: can change their nappy. I don't think that that's useful,
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: especially if your child is pre verbal.
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: I was about to say three months, six months.
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: That's right. But what you can do is you can
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: describe what you're doing and why you're doing it and
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: help them to understand that. It's the same with bathtime. Right,
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: even before consent became a major issue, I always said
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: to the kids, because I used to love bath time.
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: I used to love bathing the kids. I loved scrubbing
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: them with the I was going to say the scourer,
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: that's with the loofer, Sorry, love the loof of their
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: back and all that sort of thing. But when it
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: came to their private parts. I'd always say, do you
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: want to wash your private parts or do you want
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: me to and give them the opportunity to have a
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: voice and have a choice from the age of like
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: two or three or whatever it was. Well, because I'm
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: their dad, and I just don't feel like i'm even
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: though it's appropriate that they be washed there, I think
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: I always thought they needed to have a voice. And
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: that's the idea of this.
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: You think we can take it to the extreme.
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I do. I do, And I think that's why
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: when people do take it to extremes. I think that's
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: why the talk back radio lines light up and all
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: the grandparents get on and say this is ridiculous and
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: what's the world coming to? And back in my day,
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: that's where it becomes unhelpful. But when we have a
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: really sensible approach to it, and that is I'm going
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: to explain to my child what's going on, or to
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: the extent that they can choose, I'm going to give
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: them every opportunity to use their voice, and I'll honor that.
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: It's the same with hugging and kissing. This came up
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: with your parents just recently with with our youngest who
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: is now ten and she just said, I love hugs.
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: I love hugging man, like she was really she was
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: so enthusiastic about it. She was so excited about it.
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: But your mum, and I'm really impressed by this. Your
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: mum has started saying, is it okay if I give
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: you a hug? Like she started asking, And it's not
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: hard to do it. When you look at your grandkids
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: and you say would you like a hug and they
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: come running into your arms, you get a pretty clear
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: signal that they're okay with a hug. And that's the
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: idea of consent. It's about letting kids know that they
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: have a voice and that their preferences matter, they should
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: be considered. I actually think that it's the height, the
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: height of arrogance, the height of rudeness, and the height
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: of entitlement when a grandparent says, I don't care if
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: you want a hug or not, you're giving me a
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: hug like that's inappropriate. And I'm not trying to sound
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: like a wowsy here, just by every measure of what
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: consent is about, that's simply inappropriate. And so the people
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: who are doing this on the talkback radio stations and
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: getting upset about it, if they just pause and consider
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: how if someone puts their arms around them without consent,
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: it feels pretty icky. It feels pretty gross.
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: I know growing up it wasn't just me and my family,
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: but I was raised in a you be respectful of adults,
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: and everyone in our circles was deemed family. If they
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: were close friends, they were an auntie or an uncle,
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: because that was a respectful way to talk to them
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: and acknowledge them.
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: A lot of that comes from that kin based traditional
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: New Zealand Maori heritage, right, I mean, that's the way
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: family is. Everyone is an auntie or an uncle or
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: a cousin, and let's face it, they probably are, and
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: when you see them, you're supposed to embrace them and
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: kiss them and do all of those traditional things. That's
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: how it always has been.
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: But the challenge for me as a young child was
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: most of those people I'd never seen before or I
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: see once a year, and so the idea of bringing
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: them into my personal space, even as a five year old, out.
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: Wrong, Like it didn't really confronting.
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: I didn't feel comfortable. I didn't You're not my mom,
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: you're not my dad, You're not someone I trust. This
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: is a really tricky space. So for us, as we've
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: raised our children, it has always been an acknowledgement no
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: one is an auntie and uncle unless they're an auntie
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: or uncle for starters. But they've never been forced in
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: any way, shape or form to acknowledge them with a
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: hugener kiss if it's not what they want to do.
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: So if we move forward from our zero to five,
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: we're looking at six to maybe thirteen to our early teens.
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, primary school, primary school age kids, So this is
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: where the consent. I mean, you'll know that with young kids,
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: we're not having conversations about consent and intimacy. Yeah, we're
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: simply teaching respect and body bround reason. If someone says no,
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: it means no, and that kind of thing. It's really
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: basic stuff. I don't think there's anything controversial or provocative
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: about this. Again, I don't understand why people get that
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: upset about it. In terms of primary school, the conversation
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: shifts a little bit, primarily because social networks expanded, so
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: kids are gonna they're going to know more people. But
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: there's also the possibility that's going to be conflict. But
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: I want to do this. My friend wants to do that,
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: and we've got this conflict here, and consent becomes more
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: about social relationships and activity based conversations and that kind
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: of thing, healthy friendships and how to just engage respectfully
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: with other people. I think at this point we can
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: start to teach our kids about verbal and nonverbal communication.
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: This is a really powerful way to help kids to
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: communicate consent. I like this, I don't like this. Body
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: language gives us that insight into how someone's feeling, and
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: if we can help kids to tune into what other
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: people are showing, that can be really profoundly useful. I
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: remember speaking with a colleague of mine some years ago
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: who said that when she was about fifteen or sixteen,
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: she was on a bus. She was the only person
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: on the bus, and a guy got on who was
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: probably a young adult, and saw her sitting there, just
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: a girl on her own on the bus and literally
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: went and sat on the seat beside her, which is
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: such a such a power.
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: I was about to say that big power play.
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: Big power play. But if we have the capacity to
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: read other people's body language, like she shrank, she moved
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: as close to the window as she could, I mean,
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: and he sort of what is it when a man.
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: Spread he clearly he clearly didn't care what.
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: She mean totally totally. But the idea is if we
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: can teach people to read one another better and have
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: some empathy around that, not just the skill of reading
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: other people, but the empathy that accompanies that, then we
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: can help them to understand the nonverbal elements of consent
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: as well. Oh, this person's stiffening up, this person's moving away,
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: this person's not making eye contact, this person's looking worried.
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: This person and voice is saying yes, but everything about
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: their body is screaming no, right.
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: And I think that's really what we're looking at here.
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: How can we communicate boundaries effectively? Teaching kids to develop
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: their identity, to develop a voice, to be willing to
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: say no, to think critically out what they see online,
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: think about who they're talking to, and to engage respectfully.
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: That that's for me, the primary school age sort of stuff.
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: So this is a really tricky space, this idea of
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: giving our children a voice. For a lot of parents,
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: we just want compliance, right, We want them to do
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: what we ask when we ask them to do it,
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: because that makes our life easy. And I know that
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: that was the kind of home I was raised in.
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So when our children reach school age and they
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: started having opinions about things, my parents really were taken
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: back by that.
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: Are you going to stamp that air?
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: Because that's not how I was raised. And yes, it
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: causes some conflict and contention in your home as you
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: try to navigate the challenge of your children having a
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: voice and telling you they don't want to do something
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: you clearly know number one is good for them and
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: number two needs to be done in order for the
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: family to function whatever it is. But I think there
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: is so much power. Think about just that friend of
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: yours and being on the bus, What a difference it
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: would have made to her if she knew that she
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: was well within her rights to either ask him to
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: move or to stand up, stand up with a way.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, go sit right next to the bus driver, that
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: kind of thing.
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: And so for me, as a mum of girls, that's
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: what I'm trying to achieve. I'm trying to help my
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: girls recognize and know that their voice matters number one
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: and number two. If they have absolute clarity on who
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: they are and who they want to be, then they
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: will have confidence in their ability to speak that when
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: the time comes.
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: So that's a pretty good segue to move into the
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: adolescence and secondary school age group. Let's talk about teenagers.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: I've spoken just too many girls. I've spoken to too
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: many girls who have told me that they've acquiesced that
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: they've gone long when a boy that they've been with
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: has put pressure on them to engage in any kind
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: of intimacy because they felt like they had to. They
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: felt like they couldn't say no, They felt like this
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: was how they proved that they loved him.
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: The devastation in this, though, is the girl's walk away
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: feeling guilty.
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the girls. The girls are the ones that walk
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: away and they feel like they're dirty or unworthy or
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: that or.
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: I said yes, so therefore I deserved what I got
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: right right. It's a devastating place to be.
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: So if we transition into these adolescent years, we start
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: to talk about romantic relationships. This is I think this
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: is the most important zone. But it works best if
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: we've built a foundation where kids already know that their
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: voice matters and that they're allowed to say no critical things.
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: Here around consent number one, you can say yes and
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: then change your mind if you withdraw consent, then there
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: is no consent. Consent is gone. And these are the
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: things that we've got to talk about kids about. We've
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: got to talk to them about how if there's any
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: alcohol or other drugs involved and therefore or that any
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: kind of impairment, or a person doesn't have the capacity,
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: then they can't consent. If they don't have the maturity,
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: if they're not old enough, they can't consent. Navigating consent
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: is sometimes just so much more complicated than do I
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: have permission? In fact permission. The example that I use
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: here when I'm talking to parents about this stuff is
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: the kids now and then we'll come to me and say, hey, Dad,
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: can I have fifty dollars so that I can go
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: and watch a movie and get some grilled at burger
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: and some chips. And I don't want to give the
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: kids fifty bucks, like that's a really expensive night out,
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: but that's how much it costs for a burger and
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: chips and a movie at the local cinema. But eventually
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: I roll my eyes and say, sure, take the fifty bucks.
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: Now.
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: Is that consent really? Like it's a pretty low bar.
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: And so when I and we probably need to talk
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: about kids again about this Becau's been a while. These
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: are not one and done conversations. But if the person
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: that you're with is not going to be excited about
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: what happened tomorrow, then I think that's not consent. I
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: like drawing two circles of end diagram, you know where
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: they're two overlapping circles, yep, And in one circle you've
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: got the words what I want, and in another circle you've
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: got the words what they want, and the bit where
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: they overlap is what we want, and that's consent. And
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: if you start to push into another zone, then that
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: ceases to be consent. I just think this is such
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: an important conversation, especially when teenagers are engaged in sending
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: images to one another or going to parties and there's
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: all those sorts of pressure. So I just I mean,
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: there's so much more we could talk about. This is
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: not a paid advertisement, but I want to refer people
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: to Consent dot gov, dot AU. Like I said, I
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: am an ambassador for it, and the work that they're
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: doing is really good, it's really smart work. Myself. Chanel
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: Kontos is also an ambassador Dan Prince Pay, who speaks
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: about pornography in schools all around the country. He's also
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: an ambassador and chantel Otten is also an ambassador. So
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: it's a pretty powerpatch forsome who are really trying to
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: push this consent conversation and matters consent dot gov dot AU.
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: So what about families in my minority situations.
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Actually, there's a bunch of resources that they've got
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: there as well, and I think it's really great. There's
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: some stuff First Nations families, which is brilliant if English
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: is not your first language. There's some really good resources
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: for people who just need stuff super simple, and they've
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: done a really smart job of that. And there's also
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: some resources for lgbt Q plus populations as well. Interestingly,
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: consent is in some circumstances it's navigated brilliantly, and other
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: circumstances it's absolutely atrocious, and so there's really great resources
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: for all of those as well. Let's wrap this up
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: with some final tips, Kylie. Have the conversations from the start,
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: folks on ethics and empathy and rights and bodily autonomy.
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: I mean, that's the very crux of it. And if
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: we start those conversations at the very beginning, our kids
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: at least know and understand what we're talking about here.
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: Give your kids a voice, Give them a voice. Yeah,
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: from the beginning.
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: If you've got daughters, given that we've got six of them,
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: teaching them that they do not owe anything to anybody,
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: especially once they get into adolescents and start to have
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: an interest in boyfriends, girlfriends, partners, whatever. They need to know,
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: you just you don't owe them anything. You don't have
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: to say yes to anything. There's no obligation. Just because
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: they bought you dinner, or just because they bought your milkshake,
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: or just because they bought you a two dollars slurpy
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: from seven to eleven doesn't mean that you owe them
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: anything at all. You're welcome to say no every single
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: day until you're ready to start say yes.
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: And their whole just because they're them, Like they're not
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: waiting for Prince Charming to come and sweep them off
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: their feet. They are whole and worthy right now. Yeah,
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: as themselves.
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: And the last thing I'd say is this education and
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: conversations about consent are not going to stop the sexual
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: violence challenges that we have in Australia all on its own.
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: We do need more than that. So we need to
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: have these conversations around are the areas like alcohol and
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: other drugs, and if you're raising boys, it really I mean,
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: girls are the break boys are the accelerator, and we've
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: got to teach them that that's the way it's always
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: been and it shouldn't always be that way. That they're
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: not to be the accelerator. And if they are going
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: to be the accelerator, they're not allowed to. The whole
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: idea is you don't just put the pedal to the metal.
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: It's not about flooring it. It's about having a really
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: really healthy kind of control and sticking to the speed
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: limit metaphorically speaking, letting them know as well that the
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: pain of regret as a perpetrator will probably be pretty substantial.
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: Imagine what it's going to be like when you've got daughters,
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: how you're going to feel, how protective you'll feel, And
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: how would you feel if your daughter was dating a
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: guy like you. Would you be excited because you know
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: they're going to be safe, or would be terrified because
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: you know what you're like. So I think those kinds
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: of conversations matter. I'm not calling boys perpetrators, by the way,
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: and I'm not calling girls victims, but I think that
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: if we can have these conversations, we're going to have
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: fewer perpetrators and fewer victims, and that's a good thing
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: all round. So that's a conversation. Bit of a long one,
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: bit of a heavy one. More details at consent dot
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: gov dot a you. The Happy Families podcast is produced
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: by Justin Rowland from Bridge Media. All the details that
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: you need for more on this topic or at consent
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: dot gov dot au. And if you'd like more information
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: about making your family happier, visit us at happy families
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: dot com dot au.