Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Hospital Bosses Won't Believe 'Nice' Nurse Lucy Letby is Prolific 'Baby Killer'

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Hospital Bosses Won't Believe 'Nice' Nurse Lucy Letby is Prolific 'Baby Killer' · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Greece.
0:15
Speaker 2: One baby after the next dies, one tiny knee born,
0:23
Speaker 2: then the next, then the next, then the next, all
0:28
Speaker 2: of natural causes. Wow, that's quite the coincidence, is it not?
0:35
Speaker 2: But as I often say, there is no coincidence in
0:40
Speaker 2: criminal law. Interesting many of the infants that die are twins, triplets.
0:52
Speaker 2: And note this is not happening at some horrible foster
0:56
Speaker 2: home we read about, not some orphanage far far away.
1:02
Speaker 2: This is in a renowned hospital. I mean to see grace.
1:08
Speaker 2: This is crime Stories. Thank you for being with us
1:10
Speaker 2: here at Vaccination in Serious XEM one eleven. First of all,
1:15
Speaker 2: take a listen to our friend Rita Chawickerbardi.
1:17
Speaker 3: They thought their son was in safe hands with nurse
1:20
Speaker 3: let Be, but a short time later they were told
1:23
Speaker 3: he was dangerously ill and they rushed back to find
1:26
Speaker 3: doctors trying to save him.
1:28
Speaker 4: We were taken in and we were told to talk
1:31
Speaker 4: to him and hold his hand. And then the conversation
1:37
Speaker 4: with the consultant and she said, you know, we're going
1:41
Speaker 4: to stop.
1:42
Speaker 2: It's not helping.
1:44
Speaker 5: We want diye in.
1:46
Speaker 2: Your arms and more from Rita Chakrabarti.
1:50
Speaker 3: These are the parents of twin boys born prematurely. Their
1:54
Speaker 3: mum was taking milk to them when she heard one
1:56
Speaker 3: of her sons crying loudly.
1:58
Speaker 4: They have brought rand his mouth and Lucy was there,
2:02
Speaker 4: what flashing about, not really not doing anything. Lucy, don't worry.
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Speaker 4: The registrub was coming and she told me to.
2:12
Speaker 2: Go back to the ward.
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Speaker 3: The baby's mument left him in this intensive care area
2:17
Speaker 3: and went to call her husband to crying.
2:21
Speaker 4: I've never heard anything like it since it was screaming.
2:26
Speaker 4: It was screaming, and I was like, what's the matter
2:30
Speaker 4: with them?
2:31
Speaker 3: Legally we can't identify the families in this case. The
2:35
Speaker 3: stories are distressing.
2:37
Speaker 2: Even the babies don't have names. This is the mom
2:40
Speaker 2: and dad of babies E and F from our friends
2:44
Speaker 2: at BBC. I'm just trying to get my head around
2:49
Speaker 2: what I'm hearing. Hearing your child screaming and not understanding
2:56
Speaker 2: what was wrong. You know, Alexis Tereschuk joining me, investigative
3:02
Speaker 2: reporter with Crime Online dot Com. Alexis, you and I
3:06
Speaker 2: both went through a lot to give birth right and.
3:11
Speaker 6: You were by my side the whole time.
3:13
Speaker 2: That's right. Don't made me start crying because now we
3:17
Speaker 2: have this beautiful boy. That's amazing. I'm thinking back to
3:22
Speaker 2: these when we were in neonatal nick cut neonatal intensive care, well,
3:29
Speaker 2: the children were and I was in intensive care, but
3:34
Speaker 2: I was just thinking about when I would sit with
3:38
Speaker 2: them all day long until I was told I had
3:44
Speaker 2: to leave. Leaving them there and hearing them cry, it
3:51
Speaker 2: was just there's something something about it. Never bothered me
3:55
Speaker 2: this way before I had twin, had the children, But now,
3:59
Speaker 2: even now, fifteen years later, when I hear a baby scream,
4:04
Speaker 2: it just, uh, it just turns me inside out. Did
4:08
Speaker 2: that happen to you? And I hear a baby scream,
4:11
Speaker 2: the impulse to run to the baby. I never had
4:15
Speaker 2: that before. I mean, I felt bad for the child.
4:18
Speaker 2: I was wondering what was wrong. But once you have
4:21
Speaker 2: a child, is it something instinctive? Is it physical? What
4:26
Speaker 2: is that?
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Speaker 6: And even it is, it's a difference when you hear
4:30
Speaker 6: a cry of I'm hungry, I have a wet diaper,
4:33
Speaker 6: but when a child is in pain, you feel it
4:36
Speaker 6: so much more. I have since having my son, and
4:39
Speaker 6: I know with you and how much you spent all
4:43
Speaker 6: of your time with them because they were so tiny
4:45
Speaker 6: and so little when they were born, You're.
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Speaker 2: Right, Alexis Terraschuk. Karen Stark joining us a renowned psychologist
4:53
Speaker 2: in Manhattan, TV radio trauma expert consultant, and you can
4:57
Speaker 2: find her Karenstark dot com Karen with a C if
5:01
Speaker 2: you're trying to find her, Karen, is it physical because
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Speaker 2: I never had that reaction before. I mean, there were
5:08
Speaker 2: times in the district Attorney's office when a child was
5:11
Speaker 2: a victim. I would cry secretly, not front of the jury,
5:15
Speaker 2: about what happened to the child. But when you hear
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Speaker 2: a baby screaming now, and for me, it didn't matter
5:22
Speaker 2: if it was a wet diepee or they were hungry.
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Speaker 2: When I heard that scream, it literally would send chills
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Speaker 2: all over me and I would have to just run
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Speaker 2: to find out what was wrong and try to fix it.
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Speaker 7: It's a hormone that exists between mothers and babies. And
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Speaker 7: there are stories that perhaps you can relate to this
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Speaker 7: where a mother gets up in the middle of the
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Speaker 7: night and as soon as she opens her eyes, the
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Speaker 7: baby starts to cry and it says though the baby
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Speaker 7: had communicated that, And that's the hormone that you have
5:54
Speaker 7: when you attached to a child.
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Speaker 2: I cannot imagine why I still have a fifty years on.
6:01
Speaker 2: But that said, I'm just thinking about these parents that
6:03
Speaker 2: are told there's something wrong with the baby, and the
6:06
Speaker 2: baby is screaming, and they leave the baby. They're told
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Speaker 2: to leave the baby with the nurse, and the baby dies.
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Speaker 2: Not just one, not just two, but then another and
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Speaker 2: another and another. Take a listen to our friends at
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Speaker 2: Channel four.
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Speaker 8: They twin boys known as Babies L and M. We're
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Speaker 8: just a day old. They both survived, but it took
6:31
Speaker 8: almost thirty minutes to restart Babym's heart. Experts say the
6:36
Speaker 8: crash was likely caused by air being injected into his bloodstream.
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Speaker 8: His brother was poisoned with insulin that their parents weren't
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Speaker 8: told that for two years.
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Speaker 6: We didn't know anything even afterwards, until the police came knocking.
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Speaker 2: Air being injected into the bloodstream. Now I could understand
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Speaker 2: one mistake, but when one twin has air being injected
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Speaker 2: into their bloodstream and the other twin is poisoned with insulin,
7:10
Speaker 2: that is no mistake. For two babies, twins to be
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Speaker 2: injected with potentially lethal substances. Joining me right now, two
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Speaker 2: renowned experts, Kat Thornton and our friend doctor Kendall Crowns
7:31
Speaker 2: doctor Kendall Crown's Chief Medical Examiner, Terrance County. That's fort
7:35
Speaker 2: Worth Lecturer, University Texas and Texas Christian University Medical School,
7:40
Speaker 2: Kat Thornton. She's got so many initials by her name,
7:43
Speaker 2: BSN R N. I know what that one means, EMT.
7:47
Speaker 2: I know that one means Neo Natal Nursing Expert, Registered nurse,
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Speaker 2: Forensic nurse expert with Goodoy Medical Forensics. Kat. Thank you
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Speaker 2: so much for being with us. Kat. I'm just remembering
8:01
Speaker 2: all the weeks, actually months that John, David and Lucy
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Speaker 2: Lucy the longest were in neonatal Intensive care unit and
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Speaker 2: that was fifteen years ago. And do you know, Kat,
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Speaker 2: I am still in touch with the nurses, some of
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Speaker 2: them that took care of the twins. They. I remember
8:23
Speaker 2: one day I was in IC at the other end
8:25
Speaker 2: of the hospital. They were in Nick You, and I
8:29
Speaker 2: pretty sure I put on a pair of tights before
8:32
Speaker 2: I took off. I still had on the gown that's
8:34
Speaker 2: opening the back. Yes, I did definitely put on tights
8:37
Speaker 2: before I made my way all through the secuitous route
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Speaker 2: of the hospital to get to Nick You. And I
8:42
Speaker 2: was attached to one of the what do you say,
8:46
Speaker 2: kat a drip bag on a roller like a close hagar?
8:52
Speaker 2: Is that really tall?
8:53
Speaker 7: Yeah?
8:53
Speaker 2: And Ivy pump that yes. Listen. They didn't teach se
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Speaker 2: any of that in law school all the way over there.
9:00
Speaker 2: And ultimately found out that I had set off the
9:02
Speaker 2: alarms by going through the wrong door leaving ICU. Okay,
9:07
Speaker 2: so I had ultimately had a trail of hospital police
9:12
Speaker 2: trying to find out how the alarm went off. But
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Speaker 2: those neonatal nurses were amazing, incredible, and I really believe
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Speaker 2: no offense. Doctor Kendle crowns that I owe the twins'
9:27
Speaker 2: lives to the neonatal nurses at Northside Hospital in Atlanta.
9:32
Speaker 2: I had been going to sign I in New York,
9:35
Speaker 2: but came home to visit my parents on a weekend
9:38
Speaker 2: and wouldn't you know, emergency CEA section And they I
9:44
Speaker 2: trusted them when I couldn't be there. It's a huge
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Speaker 2: burden for a neonatal nurse.
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Speaker 9: It is a burden and a huge responsibility and also
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Speaker 9: a privilege to be able to care for these children
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Speaker 9: at their mostvulnerable states, and these families in their most
10:02
Speaker 9: vulnerable states. Many many of them have gone through all
10:07
Speaker 9: kinds of toil and trouble just trying to get pregnant,
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Speaker 9: and then to deliver early or to have complications during delivery.
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Speaker 6: It's just heart.
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Speaker 9: Wrenching for these families to not be able to go
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Speaker 9: through a natural birth process and take your child home
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Speaker 9: with you. But just as you said, Nancy, to leave
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Speaker 9: them in the care of others who you really don't know,
10:28
Speaker 9: but you have to trust them. And the nic nurses
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Speaker 9: are a very special special breed, the physicians, the nurses,
10:36
Speaker 9: all those that care for those babies. So you had
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Speaker 9: obviously a very good experience with the staff that cared
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Speaker 9: for your twins.
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Speaker 2: I really did, And you know, doctor Kendall Crowns, I
10:48
Speaker 2: do remember that these parents were told by a consultant
10:52
Speaker 2: that they should leave, but I felt that I would be.
10:56
Speaker 2: Lucy was in a lot worse shape than John David was.
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Speaker 2: Although they were in really bad shape, Lucy only weighed
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Speaker 2: two pounds Doctor Kendall Crowns, and I remember they thought
11:07
Speaker 2: she was going to be blind and there was a
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Speaker 2: procedure where they actually had to put a needle into
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Speaker 2: her eye and a doctor and my husband said, do
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Speaker 2: you want to leave? Because they obviously thought I couldn't
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Speaker 2: take it. I didn't think I could take it either,
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Speaker 2: but I didn't think I could leave Lucy there to
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Speaker 2: face that without her mother, even though she really didn't
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Speaker 2: know me yet. It's so emotional. Doctor, just have you
11:36
Speaker 2: had that experience during your rotation or when you deal
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Speaker 2: with child victims. It's just gut wrenching for the parents.
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Speaker 2: I think more than anything, well, I always.
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Speaker 10: Think it's unfortunate when a child dies, and I think
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Speaker 10: as a parent myself, it's hard to see when a
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Speaker 10: life that has potential and so much hope associated with
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Speaker 10: it is kind of tragically snuffed out at an early age.
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Speaker 10: To me, king cases are the worst cases, especially in
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Speaker 10: a child abuse where you know someone else could have
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Speaker 10: raised their child, loved that child, adopted them and taking
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Speaker 10: care of them. And in situations where any any child
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Speaker 10: is murdered.
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Speaker 2: It's just horrible the toll it takes on parents and
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Speaker 2: they second guess every single thing, every move they made.
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Speaker 2: Would it have changed the outcome? Would my baby, my twins,
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Speaker 2: my triplets be alive today. Take a listener. Friends at BBC.
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Speaker 3: On the unit, there were typically up to three deaths
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Speaker 3: a year, but they have that number in the month
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Speaker 3: of June alone, and the pattern continued with babies dying
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Speaker 3: or coming close to death.
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Speaker 11: No one suspected any foul play. After several unexpected and
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Speaker 11: near deaths in just over half a year, a second
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Speaker 11: review was ordered, with inspectors issuing concerns about staffing levels
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Speaker 11: that summer. Hospital bosses described reaching a tipping point after
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Speaker 11: the deaths of siblings Baby O and.
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Speaker 2: P O, P hold on A B C D E
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Speaker 2: F G H I J K L M N O
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Speaker 2: P Q seventeen babies. Because the babies are their names
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Speaker 2: aren't public, so they've been assigned letters and we've got
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Speaker 2: a baby.
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Speaker 1: Q Prime stories with Nancy Greasee.
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Speaker 2: You know Kat Thornton joining me, highly respected nenatal nursing expert.
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Speaker 2: I guess in the NICKU neonatal Intensive care unit, the
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Speaker 2: children are already at such a high risk. Like I said, Lucy,
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Speaker 2: My little Lucy was two pounds and we knew it
14:04
Speaker 2: was a long shot. But north Side and the nick
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Speaker 2: You nurses and doctors saved her and John David's lives.
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Speaker 2: So when you have death, I guess that's expected, not happy,
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Speaker 2: but expected. In the NIKKI would you agree with that.
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Speaker 9: Kat, Well, we never like to say it's expected, but
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Speaker 9: some of these children are in such severe physiological Oh gosh,
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Speaker 9: that's not right. Some of these premature babies are so
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Speaker 9: sick their little organs are not developed in us to
14:45
Speaker 9: be functioning outside the womb yet, and we are basically
14:50
Speaker 9: assisting them by artificial means. So we do see death
14:55
Speaker 9: in the NICU. We see a lot of children who
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Speaker 9: have who have issues with their lungs, with their heart,
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Speaker 9: with their vision. Kind of what you said. So, any
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Speaker 9: any instance where something happens that is unexpected, we're going
15:17
Speaker 9: to watch and try and see what happened, what we
15:20
Speaker 9: can do to fix that situation, what medications we can
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Speaker 9: insist them with and try to help them just to
15:28
Speaker 9: continue to grow as if they were inside the mother's womb.
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Speaker 2: I've never heard it peel like that. That's fascinating to me.
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Speaker 2: So I guess to you, doctor Kendall, Crown's in a
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Speaker 2: hospital setting, you expect, you don't want it, but you
15:44
Speaker 2: know a likely outcome with very ill children, very premature children,
15:51
Speaker 2: They could die. And I doubt pretty seriously that anyone
15:57
Speaker 2: suspects foul play under those conditions. How would you find out,
16:03
Speaker 2: say a baby dies, an infant, a kneeborn, a twin,
16:07
Speaker 2: how would you find out that someone had injected in air?
16:12
Speaker 2: And I wanted to say an air bubble, But how
16:14
Speaker 2: do you find out? How do you figure out that
16:18
Speaker 2: air has been injected into a baby and killed it?
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Speaker 2: And how does it kill the baby?
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Speaker 10: So injection of air in the hospital setting, you have
16:26
Speaker 10: to have an idea that someone maybe up to something
16:30
Speaker 10: to catch it. Sometimes the physicians or the nurses are
16:35
Speaker 10: suspicious when a child or even adult dies unexpectedly and
16:41
Speaker 10: there's no reason. The problem is that you can get
16:45
Speaker 10: away with it for a period of time because hospital
16:48
Speaker 10: deaths aren't necessarily brought to a medical examiner's office, and
16:52
Speaker 10: they're not necessarily autopsy. So usually it's a pattern where
16:56
Speaker 10: they see this a number of times and then they
16:59
Speaker 10: start getting suspect and then autopsies you don't so add autopsy.
17:03
Speaker 10: How you spot an air emblass is if there's a
17:07
Speaker 10: suspicion of it when you do the X ray, you
17:10
Speaker 10: can spot air.
17:11
Speaker 2: An air emblass. What is an enblass?
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Speaker 10: First of all, an embolas is a large clot basically,
17:18
Speaker 10: so an emblass of air is a clock of air
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Speaker 10: in the bass cardiovascar system. An X ray you can
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Speaker 10: spot it. It's kind of like a black area in
17:29
Speaker 10: the heart, usually in the right ventricle as well, where
17:32
Speaker 10: we'll see it. So at autopsy, when you're doing the autopsy,
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Speaker 10: you actually open the pair of cardial sack, which is
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Speaker 10: a sack around the heart. You fill it with water
17:42
Speaker 10: and then you coke the right ventricle and bubbles will
17:46
Speaker 10: come out, air bubbles, and when you see those, you
17:49
Speaker 10: know you're dealing with an air emblass. Again, it's easily
17:53
Speaker 10: easily missed at autopsy unless you have a suspicious suspicion
17:57
Speaker 10: for it, so you have to have the X ray is,
18:00
Speaker 10: and what the X ray is when you do the
18:02
Speaker 10: proper autopsy techniques catch it. So air embolism is one
18:06
Speaker 10: of those hard ones to spot at autopsy.
18:08
Speaker 2: Trying to take in everything you're saying, and I know
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Speaker 2: it's by wrote for you because you've done so many
18:15
Speaker 2: autopsies thousands, but for me to think of a newborn
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Speaker 2: baby lying on one of those cold autopsy tables being
18:25
Speaker 2: sliced open, and you're filling up the pair of cardium
18:30
Speaker 2: sack which goes around the heart and trying to figure
18:34
Speaker 2: out was air injected into this baby. It's very upsetting
18:41
Speaker 2: for us regular people, doctor Kendall Crowns. But I thank
18:48
Speaker 2: God for you and other doctors across the country like you,
18:53
Speaker 2: because from what I can tell, this may be the
18:58
Speaker 2: single most prolific child killer in the world. One baby
19:06
Speaker 2: after the next, after the next, after the next dies.
19:12
Speaker 2: What is the common denominator one thing, Lucy let Be.
19:22
Speaker 2: Take a listen to doctor John Gibbs, who worked with
19:26
Speaker 2: Lucy let Be on ITV.
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Speaker 5: There was nothing about her behavior or her attitude that
19:32
Speaker 5: worried me at all. The problem with lucy let Be
19:36
Speaker 5: was that she was consistently associated with an increasing number
19:40
Speaker 5: of unusual collapses and deaths were happening on the unit.
19:43
Speaker 5: That's where the.
19:44
Speaker 2: Worry was and more from doctor Stephen Breery.
19:48
Speaker 12: Lucy let Be was there, she was sitting next to me.
19:51
Speaker 12: I spoke to her and said, how tired and upset
19:56
Speaker 12: she must be after two days of this, and hope
19:59
Speaker 12: that she was and have a rest for a weekend.
20:01
Speaker 12: And she turned to me and said, no, I'm back
20:03
Speaker 12: on shift tomorrow. The other staff were very traumatized by
20:08
Speaker 12: all of this, but you were crumbling before your eyes almost,
20:12
Speaker 12: and she was quite happy and confident to come into work.
20:15
Speaker 2: Okay, Greg Algren is joining me international lawyer with Diaz Ruis.
20:23
Speaker 2: They practice all over the United States and beyond. Greg Algren, Yes,
20:31
Speaker 2: she was there when all of these babies were found dead,
20:36
Speaker 2: when they were dying, when they were screaming with blood
20:38
Speaker 2: on their mouth, as you heard the one father describe.
20:42
Speaker 2: But that is entirely and yes, I've proven a case
20:46
Speaker 2: on circumstantial evidence alone. But you've got to have more.
20:50
Speaker 2: You've got to have more than just well, she was
20:52
Speaker 2: there whenever the babies would die. She never seemed tired.
20:56
Speaker 2: She couldn't wait to get back to the ward and
20:58
Speaker 2: work around more babies. That's not enough to prove a case, Greg,
21:03
Speaker 2: But I think.
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Speaker 13: There's a I think there's a certain pattern in practice
21:06
Speaker 13: that starts to emerge, and that is the question of
21:10
Speaker 13: the lack of supervision. Apart from the criminal liability, I mean,
21:16
Speaker 13: there's there's the civil issue. There's the lack of supervision,
21:20
Speaker 13: and I mean perhaps even the concept of corporate manslaughter,
21:27
Speaker 13: the failure to adequately participate in the controls that are
21:32
Speaker 13: necessary to ensure that things are being done the right way.
21:37
Speaker 2: You know all that is absolutely correct. I don't think
21:41
Speaker 2: that's any consolation to these parents, one after the next
21:45
Speaker 2: after the next, who suffered the loss of their child.
21:48
Speaker 2: But Greg Algrin, of course, is completely correct. Robert Crispin
21:54
Speaker 2: joining me, high profile private investigator, former Federal Task Force
21:58
Speaker 2: officer for the US Department of Justice with the DEEA
22:02
Speaker 2: and the Miami Field Division, former homicide and Crimes on
22:06
Speaker 2: Children investigator, and you can find them at Crispininvestigations dot com. Robert,
22:11
Speaker 2: thank you for being with us. If you were handed this,
22:16
Speaker 2: let me just say, Rubik's cube, one baby after the
22:19
Speaker 2: next is dying on this ward. Lucy let be, is
22:24
Speaker 2: there every time one of these babies dies and you
22:29
Speaker 2: hear about the baby screaming. They didn't just fall off
22:32
Speaker 2: to sleep with too much bitadrill, which is bad enough
22:35
Speaker 2: in itself. They were screaming. What would you do? You
22:39
Speaker 2: got to have more than that. Now I find air
22:43
Speaker 2: injected into a baby to be damning, but I know
22:47
Speaker 2: I need more. What would you do to prove this case? Robert?
22:52
Speaker 14: Well, shadly this case because of who we are dealing with,
22:56
Speaker 14: because the access to the kids, and because we spoke
22:59
Speaker 14: about it. Unfortunately, death very final. You're expected that it's
23:04
Speaker 14: okay if someone dies in hostitle that's where they're supposed
23:07
Speaker 14: to die.
23:07
Speaker 2: Oh, you just gave me a thought. It reminds me
23:10
Speaker 2: of arson cases, which it took me years to develop
23:13
Speaker 2: an expertise improving arson, because first you have to prove
23:16
Speaker 2: a crime even happened, and then once you prove a
23:19
Speaker 2: crime happened, you got to figure out who did it
23:22
Speaker 2: and really why. Like this, you expect babies in a
23:26
Speaker 2: high risk neonatal unit, some of them, God help them,
23:32
Speaker 2: are going to die. So a lot of people don't
23:37
Speaker 2: think it's anything unusual when a baby dies in the
23:39
Speaker 2: neonatal unit.
23:40
Speaker 14: That's why she got away with it for so long.
23:43
Speaker 14: For so long, she got away with it. By the
23:44
Speaker 14: time it got to law enforcement is when this thing accelerated,
23:48
Speaker 14: until the administrators got together and they started to compare
23:53
Speaker 14: the facts and compare the charts and compare the employees
23:55
Speaker 14: and the behavior. And then it went to law enforcement
23:58
Speaker 14: after it was first not to go to law enforcement,
24:01
Speaker 14: and the employees were told, if you do anything about it,
24:04
Speaker 14: there will be reach percussion.
24:06
Speaker 2: You're making my stomach hurt right now. Is this true?
24:10
Speaker 2: Aleis to rest Chuck with US Crime online dot Com
24:12
Speaker 2: investigative reporter that all these desks were flagged and employees
24:18
Speaker 2: were begging for help, and they were told, don't you
24:21
Speaker 2: dare say a word. Did that happen?
24:24
Speaker 6: It did? It was not only it was the nurses
24:26
Speaker 6: and the doctors who worked with her. They all first
24:29
Speaker 6: time it was a tragedy. But immediately the way that
24:32
Speaker 6: she reacted was a red flag.
24:35
Speaker 2: She will how does she react?
24:37
Speaker 6: Well, she wanted to come back to work immediately. She said, well,
24:41
Speaker 6: you know, I just have to be there immediately. I
24:43
Speaker 6: don't need any time to gree that's the best thing
24:45
Speaker 6: to do. Well, while everybody else was devastated and crushed
24:48
Speaker 6: by this and thought she was. But each time a
24:51
Speaker 6: child died, each time a baby died, and she was there,
24:54
Speaker 6: she wanted to come back to work and insisted on
24:57
Speaker 6: and as you said, remember many of them were twins
24:59
Speaker 6: or she wanted to work with the other sibling immediately,
25:04
Speaker 6: and people and that really raised their red lights of
25:06
Speaker 6: the doctors and the nurses really started a file and
25:10
Speaker 6: tried and complained about her and said this is really
25:13
Speaker 6: very very suspicious.
25:14
Speaker 2: Okay, somebody is going to have their pants suit off.
25:18
Speaker 14: To add insult to injury, they had to write her
25:21
Speaker 14: an apology.
25:22
Speaker 2: Whoa okay, what who's this is this Chrispin?
25:25
Speaker 14: Or all great, that's Kristin.
25:26
Speaker 2: What did you just say?
25:28
Speaker 14: It had gotten to administration. Administration shut down the people
25:31
Speaker 14: that were bringing this forward and we're not going to
25:34
Speaker 14: do anything further and there'll be consequences. And then Lucy
25:38
Speaker 14: filed a complaint and the doctors had to do a
25:43
Speaker 14: written apology to Lucy. I'm sorry, we're all stressed out,
25:48
Speaker 14: we're all under a lot of pressure. That's how this
25:51
Speaker 14: all started. And then another death, that's when administrators caught on.
25:56
Speaker 14: That's when they decided to call law enforcement. And then
25:58
Speaker 14: that's when this case got some traction and it took off,
26:02
Speaker 14: and it's where it is today.
26:05
Speaker 9: And Nancy, I think, and this is kat I think.
26:07
Speaker 9: Another most interesting fact about her behavior was she reached
26:14
Speaker 9: out to these parents, multiple different parents of the deceased children,
26:19
Speaker 9: and searched for them on social media and watched their
26:22
Speaker 9: response to their grief and was almost relishing their grief,
26:29
Speaker 9: and she sent them notes. She said she was apologetic
26:33
Speaker 9: that she couldn't make it to the funerals. It's really
26:36
Speaker 9: very distressing to look at someone with such narcissistic behavior
26:41
Speaker 9: and attention seeking behavior. It's just horrifying.
26:45
Speaker 2: Oh man, oh man, she is going straight to hell.
26:49
Speaker 2: Did you know that also after the deaths of these
26:54
Speaker 2: tiny babies, she would help the parents prepare the baby for.
26:59
Speaker 9: The few Yes, that did mention in the evidence that
27:02
Speaker 9: she helped to prepare memento boxes and gather footprints and
27:08
Speaker 9: handprints and locks of hair, which is a very common practice.
27:12
Speaker 9: And I see you after a child passes away because
27:16
Speaker 9: maybe a photograph prior to the death, and these mementos
27:20
Speaker 9: are the only thing that these parents have to remember
27:23
Speaker 9: the short life that they had with their child.
27:26
Speaker 2: Who was jumping in was that you, Karen start, Yes.
27:28
Speaker 13: It was.
27:29
Speaker 7: I wanted to say that in addition to her own cases,
27:33
Speaker 7: they would also find her involved in cases that were
27:37
Speaker 7: not hers, where she was told not to be there,
27:40
Speaker 7: and she would get involved with these supposedly babies that
27:44
Speaker 7: were so sick and dying, which of.
27:47
Speaker 2: Course she was causing, so she wasn't just her patience.
27:51
Speaker 2: She would seek out other babies.
27:53
Speaker 7: And she relished taking care of the babies once they died.
27:57
Speaker 7: She dave them and found closed for them. She became very,
28:02
Speaker 7: very involved in the aftercare as well.
28:05
Speaker 2: Okay, I'm sure you've got a diagnostic name for that.
28:08
Speaker 2: Jackie is waiving a note to me that one of
28:12
Speaker 2: their babies was actually buried and a gown provided by
28:17
Speaker 2: Lucy let Be. Guys, take a listen our friends at BBC.
28:21
Speaker 3: Lucy let Be was eventually moved to a clerical role.
28:25
Speaker 3: The doctors kept trying to get managers to investigate the
28:28
Speaker 3: suspicious deaths and her connection to them, even though consultants
28:33
Speaker 3: here repeatedly made loud warnings to senior management. They say
28:37
Speaker 3: they were ignored. Even after Lucy let Be came off
28:40
Speaker 3: duty on the neonatal unit, executives tried to draw a
28:44
Speaker 3: line under the case. Dr Stephen Breery led the team
28:47
Speaker 3: of seven consultants on the unit who shared joint concerns.
28:51
Speaker 12: It's something that nobody really wants to consider that a
28:56
Speaker 12: member of staff might be harming the babies and your.
29:01
Speaker 3: Things came to a head when two out of three
29:03
Speaker 3: healthy triplets died within twenty four hours of each other.
29:07
Speaker 2: Oh cool, two out of three triplets. Karen Stark, you're
29:12
Speaker 2: the shrink. We're just a mere mortals. What is There's
29:17
Speaker 2: got to be a name for the hatred of babies,
29:22
Speaker 2: the desire to kill infants.
29:24
Speaker 7: Well, usually when that happens, it's stillicide. It's a parent
29:28
Speaker 7: who's killing the baby. Unfortunately, in this case, you're talking
29:34
Speaker 7: about a cold and I mean cold blooded killer, the
29:37
Speaker 7: definition of a psychopath. She was sadistic. She enjoyed and
29:44
Speaker 7: I know this is hard for people to take in,
29:46
Speaker 7: but she actually enjoyed watching not just the baby suffer,
29:51
Speaker 7: but the parents suffer.
29:52
Speaker 2: Now, there's pedophobia, which is a fear of babies, but
29:59
Speaker 2: the hatred of babies. They desire to kill babies, not
30:06
Speaker 2: anybody else, just helpless infants.
30:10
Speaker 7: But that's part of it, Nancy, is that they're helpless
30:13
Speaker 7: and they're innocent, and that's extremely appealing to killers, as
30:18
Speaker 7: we know, and all the natural instincts that you would
30:22
Speaker 7: assume somebody would have when it comes to babies. A killer,
30:27
Speaker 7: a cold blooded killer like this just the opposite. She's
30:31
Speaker 7: in her environment. She relishes the fact that this is happening.
30:36
Speaker 2: Guys, take us to our friends over at ap.
30:39
Speaker 15: Lucie let Be was entrusted to protect some of the
30:42
Speaker 15: most vulnerable babies little did those working alongside her know
30:47
Speaker 15: that there was a murderer in their midst. She did
30:50
Speaker 15: her utmost to conceal her crimes by varying the ways
30:54
Speaker 15: in which she repeatedly harmed babies in her care in
30:58
Speaker 15: her homes. In not cure substances like air milk or
31:03
Speaker 15: medication like insulin would become lethal. She berhted her learning
31:09
Speaker 15: and weaponized her craft to inflict harm, grief and death.
31:29
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Greece.
31:32
Speaker 2: Just thinking about this. In her hands, innocuous substances like air,
31:37
Speaker 2: milk or medication would become lethal. Then there's Baby E.
31:43
Speaker 2: The mom arrived to give the baby breast milk and
31:47
Speaker 2: she found the baby with blood around his mouth before
31:50
Speaker 2: he died from a fatal bleed which we now believed
31:54
Speaker 2: be caused by let Be interfering with a naso gastric tube.
32:01
Speaker 2: The mom actually walked in on her with the baby. Guys,
32:07
Speaker 2: take a listen to this.
32:08
Speaker 11: It was in June and when Lucy let Be murdered
32:10
Speaker 11: the first newborn, who we can only call BABYA, by
32:14
Speaker 11: injecting air into his bloodstream. The following month, after the
32:17
Speaker 11: deaths of BABYC and Baby D, the head of the
32:21
Speaker 11: Neoonotal Award ordered an internal review and found that let
32:25
Speaker 11: Be had been the only nurse on shift for each death.
32:28
Speaker 11: By October, baby and Baby I had also died, and
32:32
Speaker 11: consultants warned senior management that let Be was present each time.
32:36
Speaker 2: That was Sean Fletcher, Good Morning Britain. Baby Baby I
32:43
Speaker 2: also died and senior management was warned Lucy let Be
32:48
Speaker 2: was present each time. Greg Algrin, why in the world
32:53
Speaker 2: when a hospital tried to suppress the knowledge that babies
32:58
Speaker 2: were dying of Lucy let Be's watch, not by accident,
33:01
Speaker 2: not by normal or natural causes, but by injections of
33:05
Speaker 2: air or insulin or interference with a naso gastral tube.
33:11
Speaker 2: Why would they suppress that and actually warn the doctors
33:15
Speaker 2: and nurses of repercussions if they continued to investigate and
33:20
Speaker 2: force the doctors, as Robert Crispin pointed out, to apologize
33:23
Speaker 2: to Lucy let Be the killer right.
33:25
Speaker 13: It's disgusting, It's inconceivable, and I think we only conclude
33:30
Speaker 13: that this institution was trying to protect itself. There's no
33:35
Speaker 13: excuse for it, and there have to be other investigations
33:41
Speaker 13: and hopefully prosecutions that come out of this because the
33:46
Speaker 13: organizational manager those exhibited here is completely unexcusable. Inexcusable, I
33:52
Speaker 13: mean it can be allowed to repeat itself in the future.
33:55
Speaker 2: Take a listen now to Janet more to.
33:58
Speaker 16: Lose a baby as a hall breaking experience, but no
34:01
Speaker 16: pair and should ever have to go through or to
34:04
Speaker 16: lose a baby, or to have a baby harmed and
34:06
Speaker 16: these particular circumstances is unimaginable. Over the past seven to
34:10
Speaker 16: eight years, we've had to go through a long, tortuous
34:13
Speaker 16: and emotional journey from losing our precious newborns and grieving
34:17
Speaker 16: their loss, seeing our children who survived, some of whom
34:20
Speaker 16: are still suffering today, to being told years later that
34:24
Speaker 16: their death all collapse might be suspicious. Nothing could prepare
34:27
Speaker 16: you for that news.
34:28
Speaker 2: I'm just trying to get my head around it. To
34:31
Speaker 2: you or like sis Tereschak and joining us from crime online.
34:34
Speaker 2: The murderers of all these babies occurred over the space
34:38
Speaker 2: of one year. Why did it take eight years to
34:43
Speaker 2: bring her to justice?
34:44
Speaker 6: Concern raised by doctors and nurses, and they had the
34:48
Speaker 6: hospital started an investigation into it, and because she was
34:53
Speaker 6: so forthcoming, she was a nurse, they just never suspected
34:57
Speaker 6: that this would happen. Nothing found. However, when they decided
35:02
Speaker 6: that they did, they did a survey. They did and
35:04
Speaker 6: they saw that she was the only nurse on duty
35:08
Speaker 6: in the room with these children for every single death
35:11
Speaker 6: and every single attempted you know where there were children
35:15
Speaker 6: that were assaulted by her that did not die, but
35:18
Speaker 6: that were treated in the same way. And then they
35:20
Speaker 6: realized that something happened. She then filed a complaint against
35:26
Speaker 6: the hospital and said, you are targeting me. I am
35:29
Speaker 6: not doing anything wrong. And because it appears that they
35:32
Speaker 6: were afraid to be they were afraid that she would
35:34
Speaker 6: sue them more than just file a complaint, they backed
35:37
Speaker 6: down on this and it took years for them to
35:40
Speaker 6: finally contact the police, and many of the doctors there
35:43
Speaker 6: have said that the hospital dragged their feet on this
35:46
Speaker 6: and that they should have contacted the police immediately.
35:49
Speaker 2: I guess I didn't want the bad public relations that
35:53
Speaker 2: so many babies were dying Number one and partially the
35:56
Speaker 2: hands of a nurse. Listen to Justice, James.
36:00
Speaker 17: This was a cruel, calculated, and cynical campaign of child
36:07
Speaker 17: murder involving the smallest and most vulnerable of children. Knowing
36:12
Speaker 17: that your actions were causing significant physical suffering and would
36:18
Speaker 17: cause untold mental suffering. You created situations so that collapses
36:27
Speaker 17: or causes of collapses would not be obvious or associated
36:31
Speaker 17: with you. You removed and retained confidential records of events
36:37
Speaker 17: relating to your crimes, and checked up on bereaved parents.
36:43
Speaker 17: There was a deep malevolence bordering on sadism in your.
36:47
Speaker 2: Actions, Karen Start, I can't figure out if she delighted
36:49
Speaker 2: more in actually killing the babies or watching them die
36:55
Speaker 2: the act of killing them, standing by watching them die,
36:59
Speaker 2: or watching the parents grieve and actually enjoying the funeral preparations.
37:07
Speaker 2: It's I can't figure out what her motivation is.
37:11
Speaker 7: There doesn't need to be that. Everyone's trying to understand
37:15
Speaker 7: her motivation. And when we're talking about a psychopath, this
37:18
Speaker 7: is a person who has no feelings and the only
37:22
Speaker 7: motivation is for her to be able to see there
37:27
Speaker 7: distress that really turns her on. It's hard to conceive it,
37:32
Speaker 7: but it's true. And she had no price. Look how
37:36
Speaker 7: manipulative she was, which really goes along with being a psychopath.
37:40
Speaker 7: And she turned the tables and she said, you're harassing me,
37:46
Speaker 7: so that she could take the attention away from she's
37:50
Speaker 7: doing something wrong and put the attention on the fact
37:52
Speaker 7: that she's a victim.
37:54
Speaker 2: Kat Thornton joining US Neo natal Nursing expert. What precautions
37:58
Speaker 2: are in place and how spittles to make sure nurses
38:02
Speaker 2: are not killing infants, infants that of course have no
38:07
Speaker 2: voice for themselves.
38:08
Speaker 9: Well, Nancy, I think this is an excellent example of
38:11
Speaker 9: a situation where the surrounding support staff did not feel
38:17
Speaker 9: comfortable and they were also chastised.
38:20
Speaker 6: About bringing forth concerns.
38:22
Speaker 9: And I will say that I think most institutions do
38:26
Speaker 9: an excellent job of providing ongoing annual training. The compliance
38:32
Speaker 9: departments and regulatory departments develop really good education and affirmation
38:39
Speaker 9: to each employee at annual training.
38:42
Speaker 2: That is their responsibility, so continue training, Alexis Tereschuk joining US.
38:48
Speaker 2: So many of these parents probably thought that the potential
38:56
Speaker 2: deaths of their children were to be expected, and when
38:59
Speaker 2: a child passed away in the neonatal unit, they thought, well,
39:03
Speaker 2: she just didn't make it. What happened at sentencing is
39:08
Speaker 2: it shoe Lucy let Bey would not even come to
39:11
Speaker 2: sentencing where the parents were all there.
39:14
Speaker 6: That's one hundred percent true. She did not show up
39:17
Speaker 6: for her sentencing. She was not there when these parents
39:21
Speaker 6: gave their victim impact statements where they talked about how
39:25
Speaker 6: they completely trusted her and that they knew something was
39:29
Speaker 6: wrong because their child was screaming in the unit, and
39:32
Speaker 6: that they went in and the parents and it was
39:35
Speaker 6: there and she was the only one there. She was
39:38
Speaker 6: too much of a coward. She did not show up
39:40
Speaker 6: and her parents. She is an only child who was
39:43
Speaker 6: doated on her whole life. She was everything to her parents.
39:47
Speaker 6: When she graduated from college. They sent a picture of
39:49
Speaker 6: it to the local newspaper. They adored her, They gave
39:53
Speaker 6: her everything. They were so proud of her. They had
39:55
Speaker 6: been there every single day at the trial, but they
39:58
Speaker 6: also did not show up for the sentencing, so nobody
40:01
Speaker 6: was there to hear what these parents had to say
40:04
Speaker 6: after she had murdered their baby.
40:06
Speaker 2: So chilling that after one baby died, photos have emerged
40:12
Speaker 2: of Lucy Letbe with this huge smile on her face
40:16
Speaker 2: at a fundraiser. The baby had just died and she
40:20
Speaker 2: went to a fundraiser for neo natal patients and had
40:25
Speaker 2: this huge smile. She really had a great time at
40:27
Speaker 2: the party after just killing one of the babies, seven
40:32
Speaker 2: babies dead at her hands that we know of, attempts
40:37
Speaker 2: on the life of six other tiny infants. She is
40:44
Speaker 2: going to jail for the rest of her life. But
40:46
Speaker 2: all I can say is rot in hell. Goodbye friend.