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SICK STAB SPREE IN AMC MOVIE: 4 GIRLS ATTACKED · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:00
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
0:06
Speaker 2: Breaking us tonight a sickening stab spree and a local
0:11
Speaker 2: AMC theater matinee. Four girls inside the theater, all stabbed
0:16
Speaker 2: by a male purp wearing what was thought to be
0:19
Speaker 2: a flowing, long platinum blonde wig, who was quote laughing
0:25
Speaker 2: the whole time. One hour later, two stabbed at a
0:29
Speaker 2: nearby McDonald's, as another dead body turns up in an
0:33
Speaker 2: apartment building. Good evening, I'm Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories.
0:38
Speaker 2: Thank you for being with us.
0:39
Speaker 3: Four young girls had to an AMC in their hometown
0:42
Speaker 3: of Braintree, Massachusetts. It's a Saturday matinee showing of the
0:46
Speaker 3: movie If. The four girls, ages nine to seventeen, hunt
0:50
Speaker 3: the theater all to themselves, but just minutes into the movie,
0:53
Speaker 3: an unknown assailant, a man wearing a trench coat and
0:56
Speaker 3: sporting long blonde hair, approaches in the dark in theater.
1:00
Speaker 3: He walks into the aisle behind the girls, and without
1:02
Speaker 3: saying a word, begins a bloody stabbing spree, knifing all
1:06
Speaker 3: four girls.
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Speaker 2: My stars, do you know how many times I've gone
1:11
Speaker 2: to a matinee, especially in the summertime with the twins
1:14
Speaker 2: and it'll just be US three and the whole theater
1:17
Speaker 2: joining me and all star panel to make sense of
1:20
Speaker 2: what we know right now, including Susan Raff, investigative reporter
1:24
Speaker 2: of w FSBTV Connecticut.
1:27
Speaker 1: But first I want to go.
1:29
Speaker 2: I need a shrink to doctor Gary Burcato joining US,
1:32
Speaker 2: forensic psychologist, co creator of the Columbia mass Murder Database
1:38
Speaker 2: and author of the New Evil, Understanding the Emergence of
1:42
Speaker 2: Modern violent crime. Doctor Bricado, thank you for being with us.
1:46
Speaker 2: I have long said and I have not seen any study,
1:49
Speaker 2: a thesis, a doctoral summary, nothing on the psychopathy behind
1:54
Speaker 2: stabbing versus shooting or strangulation or any other mode of homicide.
2:01
Speaker 2: But stabbing, in my mind, and I don't know how
2:04
Speaker 2: to verbalize a doctor, is a whole another layer of evil.
2:09
Speaker 2: You have to It's like a sweetheart murdering. You're very
2:12
Speaker 2: intimate with your victim. You are violently attacking them and
2:18
Speaker 2: actually witnessing the blood, the life's blood, float out of
2:21
Speaker 2: their body.
2:23
Speaker 1: So that's a lot different.
2:24
Speaker 2: From say a sniper shooting at a distance right where
2:26
Speaker 2: there's no contact with the victim, or a vehicular homicide.
2:31
Speaker 1: It's just very different.
2:32
Speaker 2: Psychopathy and on four little girls trying to watch a matinee.
2:39
Speaker 4: Did the Columbia Murdered database.
2:42
Speaker 5: One of the things that we consider it specifically was
2:44
Speaker 5: the method that was You just now, this attack that
2:47
Speaker 5: occurred across Massachusetts and Connecticut would technically be considered a
2:52
Speaker 5: spree stabbing. It could have become a mass you know,
2:57
Speaker 5: a spree killing, but there weren't an people who expired
3:01
Speaker 5: to meet criteria for that. But it certainly was an
3:04
Speaker 5: attempted spree stabbing. And one of the things we learned
3:08
Speaker 5: about people who perpetrate these actions is that the choice
3:12
Speaker 5: of weapon is very telling in terms of the psychology
3:16
Speaker 5: of the individual. For example, an individual that uses a firearm,
3:20
Speaker 5: probably because of the accessibility of them, is far less
3:24
Speaker 5: likely to have bonafide serious mental illness.
3:27
Speaker 4: We do have to think about.
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Speaker 5: That when you are talking about somebody who picks up
3:30
Speaker 5: something around the house and goes on a spree. But
3:34
Speaker 5: it is interesting because the people who use blades specifically
3:37
Speaker 5: do seem to divide up into people who are very
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Speaker 5: disturbed and people who use them because of a more perverse,
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Speaker 5: fantasy oriented wish to have an intimacy with the victims.
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Speaker 5: For example, in the Coburger case, there's the use of
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Speaker 5: a blade and that is technically an accused mass murder there.
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Speaker 5: I think it was selected more for the intimacy and
3:58
Speaker 5: the pain it would have inflicted. So we have to
4:01
Speaker 5: think about what kind of two types we're dealing with
4:04
Speaker 5: when a blade is used.
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Speaker 2: Wow, that's a lot for me to take in. Remember
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Speaker 2: I'm just a trial lawyer. You're the shrink. But I
4:11
Speaker 2: hear you and your comparisons are amazing. Specifically as it
4:15
Speaker 2: goes to Coburger, what happened in this case? Imagine sitting
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Speaker 2: in a dark and matinee basically by yourself, four little
4:24
Speaker 2: girls straight out to Susan Raff joining US investigative reporter WFSBTV.
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Speaker 1: Susan, thanks for being with us.
4:31
Speaker 2: Susan, I want you to hear what the mom says,
4:35
Speaker 2: and this is from our friends at Boston t WBTSCD.
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Speaker 6: My oldest was leaned over, she got something. He got
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Speaker 6: her in the back, and then my other daughter in
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Speaker 6: the top chest, and then my last daughter across her arm,
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Speaker 6: laughing the whole time.
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Speaker 1: Susan, what happened?
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Speaker 7: Well, I mean this is a terrible situation. I mean,
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Speaker 7: you have four young girls in a movie theater one.
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Speaker 7: I think the younger was only nine years old, and
5:02
Speaker 7: it came in the dark. He stabbed those four girls.
5:06
Speaker 7: This was terrifying for a lot of people, and especially
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Speaker 7: the mother of those girls. I think there were only
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Speaker 7: four girls in that movie theater at the time.
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Speaker 2: What more do we know about the theater stabbing a
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Speaker 2: four little girls?
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Speaker 1: Listen?
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Speaker 3: When the man with long blonde hair approaches the young
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Speaker 3: girl closest to him, she is bent down in her
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Speaker 3: seat reaching for something. He stabs her in the back,
5:26
Speaker 3: then stabs the girl next to her in the chest.
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Speaker 3: He slashes the third across her arm, and stabs the
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Speaker 3: fourth in an unspecified location. The attacker then runs from
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Speaker 3: the theater while never uttering a word, he laughs throughout
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Speaker 3: the attack. All four girls sustain serious injuries.
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Speaker 2: Back to Susan Raff joining US WFSBTV. Susan, how did
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Speaker 2: the attacker get into the theater unnoticed? Did he pay?
5:53
Speaker 2: Did he stake in a side door? And how did
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Speaker 2: he make a getaway?
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Speaker 7: I'm not exactly sure how he was able to get
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Speaker 7: into the theater. Those are all things that are we're
6:02
Speaker 7: looking into. How did he get into that theater? How
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Speaker 7: did he get in and manage to get a knife
6:08
Speaker 7: and stab those four young girls. Then obviously he left
6:12
Speaker 7: the theater. But we're all very concerned as to what
6:14
Speaker 7: exactly happened. How did he get into that theater? Did
6:17
Speaker 7: he buy a ticket to that theater? At this point,
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Speaker 7: we really don't know, guys.
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Speaker 2: We've been told he did not buy a ticket. So
6:26
Speaker 2: what is a security situation at this theater? How did
6:30
Speaker 2: he just get in? And I don't know if you've noticed,
6:34
Speaker 2: but a lot of theaters have changed their admittance after COVID.
6:40
Speaker 2: Has the admitts to this theater been changed? We know
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Speaker 2: he didn't get a ticket, so how did he end
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Speaker 2: up and a practically isolated theater with four little girls?
6:52
Speaker 2: Still under investigation, But that's not the end of the story.
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Speaker 3: Listen, a man driving a black porschemackin argues with the Plymouth,
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Speaker 3: Massachusetts McDonald's employee, insisting the employee double check his order.
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Speaker 3: The driver tries to snatch the bag of food without paying,
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Speaker 3: but the twenty eight year old mail employee refuses to
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Speaker 3: let go. The driver stabs the employee in the arms
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Speaker 3: several times, then perks his car and enters the restaurant.
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Speaker 3: A twenty one year old female employee screams stop, you
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Speaker 3: don't have to do this, as the driver stabs her
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Speaker 3: in the arms as well. A third employee chases the
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Speaker 3: driver back to his car. He laughs and shows the
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Speaker 3: okay symbol before pulling off in the Porsche, laughs.
7:30
Speaker 1: And shows the O K symbol.
7:33
Speaker 2: Remember at McDonald's they are covered as surveillance cameras.
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Speaker 1: You know that's going to be tough to beat.
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Speaker 2: Eric fattis joining Menow trial lawyer, TV legal analyst and
7:45
Speaker 2: founding partner of Varner Fattus Elite Legal, former felony prosecutor.
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Speaker 2: Eric there's no way now at dark in theater, that's
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Speaker 2: one thing you're.
7:55
Speaker 1: Not going to get very good video out of that.
7:58
Speaker 2: But the lobby to the theater, if in fact went
8:01
Speaker 2: through the lobby, and at McDonald's, the drive through the
8:04
Speaker 2: interior of the cash register, they're all covered with surveillance video.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, no question, Nancy.
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Speaker 8: And I'm sure law enforcement is sort of retracing the
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Speaker 8: steps of the suspect and finding every piece of surveillance
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Speaker 8: video they can. It's my understanding that the vehicle may
8:19
Speaker 8: have been on surveillance video, that the license plate may
8:22
Speaker 8: have been on surveillance video. These are all pieces that
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Speaker 8: law enforcement is going to put together in this gruesome
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Speaker 8: puzzle that happened in Massachusetts and potentially Connecticut.
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Speaker 1: And another thing.
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Speaker 2: Eric fattis renowned trial lawyer. Think about it. How many
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Speaker 2: men are wearing what was first thought to be a
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Speaker 2: long platinum blonde wig. Really, how's he going to say?
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Speaker 2: How's he going to use the sad some other dude
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Speaker 2: did at defense? How many people are in and out
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Speaker 2: of theaters and McDonald's men wearing a long blonde flowing wig.
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Speaker 8: Eric, it's a distinguishing characteristic, no question, and it's going
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Speaker 8: to be difficult for his defense team to try to
9:06
Speaker 8: argue alternative suspect.
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Speaker 1: Or something along those lines.
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Speaker 8: We also know that the suspect had a pretty nice car,
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Speaker 8: a Portia SUV that's black, and so there are all
9:16
Speaker 8: of these factors that prosecution is going to tie directly
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Speaker 8: to this suspect into no one else.
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Speaker 1: Guys.
9:23
Speaker 2: In the last days, we discover a man wearing a
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Speaker 2: long apparently wearing a long flowing blonde wig, somehow sneaks
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Speaker 2: into a dark and AMC theater.
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Speaker 1: Only a few.
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Speaker 2: Little girls, four little girls in this theater for the matinee.
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Speaker 2: They've got the whole place to themselves. Little did they
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Speaker 2: know waiting in the wings was a guy with a
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Speaker 2: knife joining me. Doctor Eric Aeson, a board certified forensic
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Speaker 2: pathologist consultant Doctor Athon.
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Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us, doctor Athon.
9:58
Speaker 2: How often naratively do you see stabbing homicides versus bludgeoning,
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Speaker 2: want trauma, strangulation or asphyxiation and shootings?
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Speaker 9: Well, it depends on where you live. I mean, I've
10:12
Speaker 9: worked in Georgia, I've worked in Chicago, and I currently
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Speaker 9: now work in Florida. And you know, Chicago was the
10:20
Speaker 9: place where we saw a lot of gunshot wing cases.
10:22
Speaker 9: Atlanta actually had quite a few stab wound cases when
10:25
Speaker 9: I was there. As far as bludgeonings, those are pretty
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Speaker 9: rare compared to the other two types. And what was
10:32
Speaker 9: the other one that you mentioned, bludgeoning stab wounds association,
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Speaker 9: I mean like asphyxiation strength strangulation. I've had a few
10:38
Speaker 9: cases like that too, but those are pretty rare as well.
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Speaker 9: It's very tough to actually strangle an adult male, and
10:45
Speaker 9: so that kind of eliminates half the population right there.
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Speaker 9: It's very, very tough to kill someone an adult male
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Speaker 9: by strangulation. So yeah, stab wounds probably number two on
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Speaker 9: my list for everywhere that I've worked for homicides.
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Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
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Speaker 2: Guys, four little girls stabbed in the AMC matinee, But again,
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Speaker 2: that's not the end.
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Speaker 1: Listen.
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Speaker 3: Plymouth p D uses surveillance footage and witness statements to
11:23
Speaker 3: identify the black porschemackin from the drive through as registered
11:26
Speaker 3: to Jared Revisa. State police officers spot the Porsche and
11:30
Speaker 3: flip on blue lights, but Revisa takes off, leading to
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Speaker 3: an erratic chase in the nearby town of Sandwich. Revisa
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Speaker 3: crashes the car, which explodes into flames.
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Speaker 10: An intense police chase ends in a fiery crash for
11:43
Speaker 10: Revisa's expensive Porsche. Jared Revisa is attained only moments later
11:48
Speaker 10: and now faces multiple counts of assault with intent to
11:51
Speaker 10: murder and battery charges.
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Speaker 2: But that wasn't the end of his stabbing spree. Who
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Speaker 2: is this guy?
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Speaker 1: Listen?
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Speaker 3: Jared Revisa is raised by his parents, Jason and Kim Revisa,
12:04
Speaker 3: in Agawam, Massachusetts. Revisa attends classes at the University of
12:08
Speaker 3: Massachusetts for one semester, but quickly abandons further studies to
12:12
Speaker 3: start a digital marketing and social media management agency. Revisa
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Speaker 3: claims his self named business, Revisa Jones Productions, has offices
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Speaker 3: in Manhattan, Beverly Hills, Paris, and Naples. Revisa describes himself
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Speaker 3: as an artist, professional model, skier and social entrepreneur.
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Speaker 2: Okay, I'm always suspicious when someone just says they're an entrepreneur.
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Speaker 1: Off what who is this guy?
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Speaker 2: Apparently he's had a very very privileged pass as friends
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Speaker 2: and former co worker's way in on who he is to.
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Speaker 1: Sais and Raft of the FSBTV. Who is he?
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Speaker 7: Well, he, I understand grew up in Martha's Vineyard. He
12:54
Speaker 7: was living there. He does come from a life of privilege.
12:56
Speaker 7: I mean to drive a Porsche SUV like that. He
13:00
Speaker 7: clearly comes from money. He was renting a house in
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Speaker 7: Deep River, Connecticut for about two months, so that can't
13:07
Speaker 7: be inexpensive. It's a very expensive home. He was renting
13:11
Speaker 7: a home in Deep River for two months. His social
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Speaker 7: media accounts are very you know, you can see for yourself.
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Speaker 7: He was experimenting with a lot of things and he
13:22
Speaker 7: definitely comes from money.
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Speaker 2: From what I can glean, regarding his background, he is
13:28
Speaker 2: a former u at Mass University of Massachusetts student who
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Speaker 2: claims to run and I'm quoting a legal a leading
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Speaker 2: global digital marketing and social media management agency.
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Speaker 1: That's a mouthful. What's he doing on the beach if.
13:47
Speaker 2: He's running a global digital marketing and social media management agency?
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Speaker 1: Okay? He claims he's got offices.
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Speaker 2: In Manhattan, Beverly Hills, Paris, and Naples.
14:02
Speaker 1: Talk about a con man joining me.
14:06
Speaker 2: Forensic psychologist who was the co creator of the Columbia
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Speaker 2: mass murder database, doctor Gary Bricado, Doctor Bricado. In some
14:18
Speaker 2: cases I would classify this as swagger i ate lies,
14:23
Speaker 2: but this is over the top, Doctor Briccado, a leading
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Speaker 2: global digital marketing and social media management agency with officers
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Speaker 2: in Manhattan, Beverly Hills, Paris and neighbor and Naples.
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Speaker 1: He's a bsir right.
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Speaker 5: Well, when we when we created the database, one of
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Speaker 5: the things we learned about people, whatever mechanism it is
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Speaker 5: they used to attempt a mass murderer to commit one,
14:50
Speaker 5: is that there tends to be, as a general rule,
14:53
Speaker 5: with these individuals, a precipitating event that is like the
14:59
Speaker 5: match that goes to straw that sets them off.
15:02
Speaker 4: But underlying that.
15:03
Speaker 5: Moment, you have a kind of a person with a
15:06
Speaker 5: personality where identity is very, very murky. They're very angry,
15:10
Speaker 5: and they're very lost in the world. And with people
15:12
Speaker 5: like that tend to do is toyed with their identity.
15:15
Speaker 5: We know, for example, that before the offense, the individual
15:19
Speaker 5: began to wonder, for example, of better gender identity and
15:23
Speaker 5: began identifying as a sheet. He took on the personality
15:27
Speaker 5: of somebody that worked out constantly and became muscular and
15:30
Speaker 5: got very close to his father from the time of
15:32
Speaker 5: COVID almost like obsessed was doing that. He clearly was
15:37
Speaker 5: obsessed with the socioeconomic status of the family and feeling
15:42
Speaker 5: valid within that. And I think the ultimate proof of it,
15:45
Speaker 5: and the precipitating event comes in April that we're seeing
15:49
Speaker 5: today in the papers, when he inveigels himself like he did,
15:53
Speaker 5: into the movie theater into a photo shoot of a
15:56
Speaker 5: model and basically tells her that he's going to marry
15:59
Speaker 5: her and have her children. Terrifies her and is rejected,
16:02
Speaker 5: is rebuffed by him. And this story is very classic
16:05
Speaker 5: for the kind of people that go out and do
16:07
Speaker 5: these things because you have a person who's trying to
16:09
Speaker 5: look physically very beautiful and attractive and is rejected. And then,
16:14
Speaker 5: of course who that that's targeted in the attack, young
16:18
Speaker 5: cute kid females that he might have experienced the kind
16:21
Speaker 5: of envy toward you have a person who's beginning to
16:24
Speaker 5: identify as female and is preoccupied with physical beauty and youth,
16:29
Speaker 5: and so I think you have as an expression of
16:31
Speaker 5: anger that exploded in a person who's head identity was
16:34
Speaker 5: wrapped up around those things.
16:37
Speaker 1: Well.
16:37
Speaker 2: While he claims from a leading global digital marketing and
16:41
Speaker 2: social media management agency in Manhattan, Beverly Hills, Paris Enables,
16:45
Speaker 2: his friends from his former college say they remember him
16:51
Speaker 2: as simply being odd. They claim he only went to
16:55
Speaker 2: school for a semester then disappeared. He claimed to be
17:00
Speaker 2: a social media influencer back then in college, but according
17:05
Speaker 2: to college friends or associates, they thought that was a joke,
17:11
Speaker 2: that he was considered just to be odd. Back to
17:14
Speaker 2: Susan Raft w FSB, I understand he lived on at
17:18
Speaker 2: an island home which was the home to politicians and
17:23
Speaker 2: celebrities for years, and I assume that the.
17:27
Speaker 1: Reports are referring to Martha's vineyard.
17:30
Speaker 7: That's correct, he was living on Martha's vineyard. I think
17:32
Speaker 7: he's from Martha's Vineyard, but most recently I believe he
17:36
Speaker 7: was living in Agawam, Massachusetts, which is outside of Springfield.
17:40
Speaker 2: The stabbing spree at the AMC Theater followed by a
17:45
Speaker 2: stabbing spree at a local McDonald's was not the end
17:49
Speaker 2: of the story.
17:50
Speaker 1: But I'm curious about the McDonald's spree.
17:52
Speaker 2: Back to Susan raft, what if anything tipped off? What
17:56
Speaker 2: was the genesis of the McDonald's stabbing, because there was
17:59
Speaker 2: no genesis at the AMC.
18:01
Speaker 1: What about the McDonald's. Did they get the order wrong
18:04
Speaker 1: or what?
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Speaker 7: I you know, I don't think so. I spoke actually
18:07
Speaker 7: with one of the employees who was stabbed, a female
18:11
Speaker 7: who worked there. First, It's believed that he drove to
18:14
Speaker 7: the drive through he got upset about an order, but
18:18
Speaker 7: he lunged through the drive through window and stabbed a
18:21
Speaker 7: male employee at that McDonald several times, then parked his
18:25
Speaker 7: Porsche and went inside the McDonald's and stabbed a female
18:29
Speaker 7: employee several times in the arms. The employee that I
18:31
Speaker 7: spoke to, who works at that McDonald's, said she was terrified,
18:35
Speaker 7: and now she's afraid to go to work. She doesn't
18:39
Speaker 7: really know what to do, and she can't use her
18:41
Speaker 7: arms right now because they're all bandaged. So why he
18:44
Speaker 7: just suddenly, you know, went off like that inside the McDonald's.
18:48
Speaker 7: We just don't know, you know, we just don't know.
18:52
Speaker 7: But he obviously scared those poor employees who were working
18:55
Speaker 7: that day, and they probably won't come back to work.
18:58
Speaker 1: Well more do we know about this guy?
18:59
Speaker 11: List?
19:00
Speaker 3: In early twenty twenty, Jared Revisa disappears entirely from social media.
19:04
Speaker 3: When Revisa returns to Instagram two years later, he's nearly unrecognizable. Revisa,
19:10
Speaker 3: who usually wears an all American look, now sports a
19:13
Speaker 3: dark spray tan and long bleached hair. Reversa changes his
19:17
Speaker 3: pronouns on Instagram to she her and his legal name
19:20
Speaker 3: to Jared love Jones. Most of his posts are now
19:23
Speaker 3: selfie's photos of his artwork and fitness videos.
19:26
Speaker 2: Okay, I'm getting a pretty good picture of who he is,
19:29
Speaker 2: and he's reminding me of somebody else. He's reminding me
19:33
Speaker 2: of a guy named Sam Haskell. Does the name Sam
19:38
Speaker 2: Haskell ring a bell to anybody?
19:41
Speaker 1: Haskell was the son of a.
19:43
Speaker 2: Famous Hollywood agent, and I mean when I say famous,
19:47
Speaker 2: I mean represented Dolly Parton, Whiopie Goldberg, so many others.
19:53
Speaker 2: And he had a spoiled brat kid turned into a
19:56
Speaker 2: spoiled brat man.
19:59
Speaker 1: Listen.
20:00
Speaker 12: Sam Haskell the Fourth is the thirty five year old
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Speaker 12: son of Sam Haskell the Third, an Emmy Award winning producer.
20:06
Speaker 12: Haskell the Fourth list himself as a director and posted
20:09
Speaker 12: several clips online of low budget videos he wrote and filmed.
20:13
Speaker 12: Former Real Housewives of Beverly hillstar Brandy Glanville appears in
20:16
Speaker 12: one of the clips for a movie which appears to
20:18
Speaker 12: be a high school teen drama. Sam Haskell the Fourth
20:22
Speaker 12: lives in a six bedroom home in Tarzana with his wife,
20:24
Speaker 12: may Lee Haskell, their three young sons, and Maylee's parents,
20:29
Speaker 12: Gashawn Lee, seventy two and sixty four year old Yang
20:32
Speaker 12: Zai Wang. Authorities say may and both of her parents
20:36
Speaker 12: are missing.
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Speaker 1: Like my resume says unhappy, bitter, resentful, and like really
20:44
Speaker 1: good out of ordering off the menu bratt.
20:48
Speaker 2: He's talking about ordering off the menu his wife and
20:50
Speaker 2: in laws, who lived with him and his wife to
20:54
Speaker 2: raise his children since he was so absentee.
20:57
Speaker 1: They're dead. May's tours so has been found in a dumpster.
21:02
Speaker 2: They're not missing, and both the parents were murdered, their
21:06
Speaker 2: bodies haven't been found.
21:08
Speaker 1: This is a guy who was given.
21:10
Speaker 2: Everything on a silver platter on top of a Christmas tree,
21:15
Speaker 2: all that money, a three million dollar home, a wife
21:19
Speaker 2: who was paying the mortgage for him, beautiful children now
21:23
Speaker 2: believed to have been at home when mom May was murdered.
21:28
Speaker 2: Given everything, but still turns into a killer.
21:32
Speaker 1: That's Sam Haskell. I don't know if it's.
21:35
Speaker 2: The tan, the workout regimen, the long blonde hair, or.
21:42
Speaker 1: Just being a grown brat. I gotta have a shrink.
21:48
Speaker 2: But first to Eric fattis, high profile trial lawyer, former prosecutor,
21:52
Speaker 2: a guy like this sitting in front of a jury
21:55
Speaker 2: will set every jarar's teeth on edge because most of
22:01
Speaker 2: us had to work, had to work and have responsibilities
22:06
Speaker 2: that we have to uphold. Okay, but when you see
22:09
Speaker 2: somebody like this guy, the AMC stabber, stabbing little girls
22:14
Speaker 2: and a matinee, then going on to employees and a McDonald's,
22:19
Speaker 2: all of them either weaker or less cunning or less
22:24
Speaker 2: money than he has.
22:26
Speaker 1: That's who he's picking on. Eric Fattis.
22:29
Speaker 2: I just hope he comes into a jury deliberations at
22:33
Speaker 2: the point of jury deliberations, having sat with this attitude
22:37
Speaker 2: in front of a jury the whole trial.
22:39
Speaker 8: Yeah, Nancy, it's very cringeworthy to just hear these people talk,
22:43
Speaker 8: and you know, they don't come from adversity or struggle
22:47
Speaker 8: or some sort of understandably difficult circumstances.
22:50
Speaker 1: They come from privilege. They're given.
22:51
Speaker 8: Look, he's got a picture of him with the Porsche
22:53
Speaker 8: in which he allegedly committed these crimes, and so I
22:57
Speaker 8: think it could be infuriating for a jury to be
22:59
Speaker 8: exposed to the two someone who's this entitled, this spoiled,
23:03
Speaker 8: this cavalier about the gravity of these serious stabbing allegations.
23:09
Speaker 13: Visa goes on stabbing spree. Roommate and Dogg later found it.
23:13
Speaker 13: Revisa allegedly stabbed for girls at ages nine through seventeen
23:18
Speaker 13: Saturday evening at an AMC theater in Massachusetts. Revisa allegedly
23:23
Speaker 13: finished off his spree at a McDonald's rest plaza, where
23:27
Speaker 13: he publicly urinated at the drive through before stabbing two
23:30
Speaker 13: employees in fleeing.
23:32
Speaker 2: Did I hear her say he publicly urinated at the
23:35
Speaker 2: drive through, Susan Raft, did.
23:37
Speaker 1: I hear that?
23:38
Speaker 7: Absolutely? Did? He did? He urinated at that McDonald's.
23:43
Speaker 2: I worked at a restaurant in law school and there
23:45
Speaker 2: was a drive through. It's a sandwich shop. I can
23:47
Speaker 2: only imagine what McDonald's workers go through every day. But
23:51
Speaker 2: to see this guy pull out his urinate, I think
23:54
Speaker 2: that's way above and beyond the call of the job.
23:58
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, but it tells me. Susan Raff guys.
24:02
Speaker 2: Susan Raff is an investigative reporter WFSB.
24:07
Speaker 1: She has seen every.
24:08
Speaker 2: Sort of crime that comes along. But you know what
24:11
Speaker 2: I hate. I mean, I hate all crime, violent crime,
24:15
Speaker 2: but someone that is so disdainful of other people that
24:20
Speaker 2: it's okay for him to whip out his and urinate
24:23
Speaker 2: in front of the McDonald's employees. You know, a lot
24:26
Speaker 2: of them are just kids, really, you know, in their teens,
24:29
Speaker 2: getting a job, and they've got to see that number one.
24:33
Speaker 2: Of course, that takes a back seat to a mass stabbing.
24:38
Speaker 2: But that said, this guy has been given everything his
24:42
Speaker 2: whole life, and who does he pick on children and
24:48
Speaker 2: a matinee and the people working at a McDonald's for
24:54
Speaker 2: minimum wage.
24:55
Speaker 1: That is who he literally pissays, And of course we
25:01
Speaker 1: don't allow the P word at our house. But that's
25:04
Speaker 1: what this guy did.
25:06
Speaker 2: Who does he think he is And don't tune up
25:12
Speaker 2: with me, Bricado, that he is legally insane. If he
25:16
Speaker 2: were legally insane, he would not have run from the scene.
25:21
Speaker 1: He knew what he did was wrong.
25:24
Speaker 2: And that is the legal test, the litmus test, the
25:27
Speaker 2: only test in the United States. It's the old McNaughton rule,
25:31
Speaker 2: as I've said before, brought over to our country from
25:35
Speaker 2: the Brits our common law. If you know right from
25:38
Speaker 2: wrong at the time of the incident, you are not insane.
25:42
Speaker 2: At the time of the incident, he got in his
25:45
Speaker 2: car and took off. He led police on a wild chase.
25:49
Speaker 2: He knew what he did was wrong. He takes advantage
25:53
Speaker 2: of people that are weaker, less powerful, and less cunning
25:58
Speaker 2: than he is, and he guarantee you, has gotten away
26:01
Speaker 2: with it.
26:02
Speaker 1: For his whole life.
26:03
Speaker 5: Well, Nancy, it's very interesting because the suspect's father happens
26:07
Speaker 5: to be a mental health professional with about thirty five
26:10
Speaker 5: years of experience, and the father is fill the press
26:13
Speaker 5: that he believed that his son had some kind of
26:16
Speaker 5: mental breakdown, I think was the phrase. I think what
26:19
Speaker 5: I'm seeing evidence of it. Of course I haven't examined him,
26:22
Speaker 5: but what I'm seeing evidence of it, what's available publicly,
26:25
Speaker 5: is the kind of rageful, inadequate personality that under stress
26:31
Speaker 5: and a sense of envy and anger exploded and certainly
26:35
Speaker 5: would be described as a peculiar person.
26:37
Speaker 2: Wait, you're going so fast, I can't take it all in.
26:42
Speaker 2: Did you say he's got stress? What stress? He doesn't
26:45
Speaker 2: have to work, His daddy gave him a Porsche. He's
26:50
Speaker 2: living at a quote holiday home, which means vacation rental
26:54
Speaker 2: that he's had for weeks. You heard Susan Raff. I've
26:58
Speaker 2: never known her to be wrong on a fact so far. Okay,
27:01
Speaker 2: maybe I missed something, but he's been bunking out at
27:05
Speaker 2: Martha's Vineyard and various other vacation spots.
27:09
Speaker 1: What stress.
27:10
Speaker 5: Well, it's very interesting because, like a lot of people
27:13
Speaker 5: who commit these offenses, he might have everything in the world,
27:16
Speaker 5: but what he's missing probably is a kind of social
27:19
Speaker 5: acceptance and beauty, which he might feel are essential things
27:23
Speaker 5: that money can't buy. Really, and I think that if
27:26
Speaker 5: you look at the offenses that are laid out. The
27:29
Speaker 5: order of them is very telling, The arc of them
27:31
Speaker 5: is very telling, because I think what you had was
27:34
Speaker 5: an expression of envy towards these attractive, perhaps shoot young
27:38
Speaker 5: kids that are in the geter, having the family together,
27:42
Speaker 5: having positive time together.
27:44
Speaker 2: You're telling me a grown man driving a Porsche with
27:48
Speaker 2: anything he wants, is envious of how young was the
27:52
Speaker 2: youngest one, Susan nine, a nine year old little girl.
27:56
Speaker 1: That he stabbed nine years.
27:58
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, Briccatto, I'm not by any of what you're saying.
28:02
Speaker 2: They may hire you for the defense jealous.
28:05
Speaker 5: I think that when you compare what occurred in the
28:08
Speaker 5: theater to what happened to the McDonald's, the McDonald's is
28:11
Speaker 5: a very clear attempt to use privilege to compensate for
28:16
Speaker 5: the insecurity by going to a place where you might
28:18
Speaker 5: associate people with lower sex urinate you drive in with
28:22
Speaker 5: your course the whole thing. So I think what you
28:25
Speaker 5: see there is the whole arc of what Thissgui's personality
28:28
Speaker 5: is about. You compensate for the inadequacy shown in the
28:31
Speaker 5: first part of the crime by using your privilege and
28:34
Speaker 5: so forth to condescend to people. And I think that's
28:38
Speaker 5: the whole idea is is that at the center of
28:40
Speaker 5: this individual, it's a sense of being weird, odd, rejected,
28:45
Speaker 5: not good.
28:45
Speaker 4: Enough for the matter how much he compensated.
28:47
Speaker 5: And I think that's the stress that lit the fuse,
28:50
Speaker 5: the rejection by the model.
28:52
Speaker 4: Who knows what went on in the dynamic with the father.
28:54
Speaker 2: Wait wait, okay, you know you're going to have to
28:58
Speaker 2: crystallize that and consolidate that if you're speaking to a jury,
29:04
Speaker 2: because I'm making notes as fast as i can. I've
29:06
Speaker 2: got one note. Insecurity, Eric Fattus trial lawyer, can I
29:10
Speaker 2: talk to you about insecurity and everything that doctor Gary
29:14
Speaker 2: Bricado just said.
29:15
Speaker 1: And I'm not saying he's.
29:16
Speaker 2: Wrong, but if you try that on a jury, that
29:21
Speaker 2: this guy w obviously comes from a wealthy family and
29:24
Speaker 2: is rolling in money, is insecure, that's not going to work. Well.
29:30
Speaker 1: I mean, he's caught on.
29:31
Speaker 2: Video, Fattest, what do you do with that? He's driving
29:36
Speaker 2: a Porsche. How many Porsches have you seen today? I've
29:39
Speaker 2: seen zero Porsches. It's him, There's no question that is him.
29:46
Speaker 2: He's driving the same Porsche when he leads cops on
29:49
Speaker 2: a high speed chase, and of.
29:50
Speaker 1: Course crashes the Porsche. Don't worry, Daddy'll probably pay for that.
29:54
Speaker 2: Another thing, the father and I really do not blame
29:58
Speaker 2: parents for the sins of their children. But on the
30:01
Speaker 2: father's website at cross Point Clinical, it says, Revisa Senior
30:08
Speaker 2: helps quote unlock each person's full potential as a human being.
30:14
Speaker 1: What does that mean?
30:17
Speaker 2: Okay, call me old school, but my parents gave me
30:20
Speaker 2: one word of advice. Either you go get a really
30:23
Speaker 2: good education or you can to live on this red
30:25
Speaker 2: dirt road the rest of your life.
30:27
Speaker 1: Not in those exact words, but unlock each person's full
30:31
Speaker 1: potential as a human being.
30:34
Speaker 2: I'm not blaming the father, but I'm telling you something.
30:37
Speaker 2: As a defense lawyer, you better come up with something
30:40
Speaker 2: and quick fattest.
30:41
Speaker 8: Yeah, Nancy, you know it is an eerie statement in
30:43
Speaker 8: light of what happened. But we've got to remember is that,
30:45
Speaker 8: you know, everyone's a human being, and everyone's experienced trauma,
30:49
Speaker 8: and that trauma affects different people in different ways, especially
30:52
Speaker 8: if they are predisposed to react.
30:54
Speaker 2: Everybody experiences trauma, you mean, like the four little girls
30:58
Speaker 2: that got stabbed in the sea and the McDonald's workers.
31:01
Speaker 2: And I'm not even through I got another dead body
31:04
Speaker 2: to get you, Fattus.
31:05
Speaker 8: That's extreme trauma, no question. But what we're talking about
31:08
Speaker 8: from a legal standpoint is how this came to be,
31:12
Speaker 8: What was going on inside of this person that resulted
31:16
Speaker 8: in these heinous acts And wasn't simply that he's a bs.
31:20
Speaker 1: Why are you saying this? What's going on and deep
31:23
Speaker 1: inside of him? Who cares? Unless he's legally insane?
31:29
Speaker 2: Don't care? Don't think me, harsh. I care more about
31:33
Speaker 2: the four little girls.
31:34
Speaker 1: I tell you what.
31:35
Speaker 2: Somebody comes in and tries to assault my daughter in
31:38
Speaker 2: a darkened theater, All hell's gonna break loose, Fattest, And
31:41
Speaker 2: you're talking to me about his feelings on the inside.
31:45
Speaker 2: Day with this feelings on the inside, what are.
31:48
Speaker 8: You saying, sir nanthy and that that could be the
31:50
Speaker 8: initial impression of the jury that the same as you.
31:53
Speaker 8: But what we've got to look into is whether he
31:56
Speaker 8: knew right from wrong. And when you look at some
31:58
Speaker 8: of the statements to police allegedly, you know, he says
32:01
Speaker 8: that he founded this country with John Adams. That right
32:05
Speaker 8: there raises eyebrows as to whether this dude really knew
32:08
Speaker 8: what reality was or not.
32:17
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
32:23
Speaker 2: Guys joining me is Susan Raft WFSBATV, and she has
32:29
Speaker 2: been dying to tell us. And she's right. We're not
32:33
Speaker 2: even done with the body count. Here there's another stabbing victim.
32:39
Speaker 1: Listen.
32:39
Speaker 3: Connecticut police confirmed seventy year old Bruce Feldman of West
32:43
Speaker 3: Hartford was found dead Saturday in a Deep River holiday home.
32:46
Speaker 3: Feldman's family devastated by the news of his sudden death.
32:50
Speaker 3: Feldman's longtime love Julie Feldman of West Hartford and tears, stating,
32:55
Speaker 3: the whole thing's really shocking. We were together a very,
32:58
Speaker 3: very long time.
32:59
Speaker 2: Okay, I've got to figure out who is the next victim.
33:03
Speaker 1: Susan, who is this guy?
33:05
Speaker 7: Who is this guy? This is Bruce Feldman. He was
33:08
Speaker 7: seventy years old. We are told that he was recently divorced.
33:13
Speaker 7: He didn't have a lot going on. We're not quite
33:15
Speaker 7: sure what the relationship was with the suspect, but they
33:20
Speaker 7: were staying at that home in Deep River, now Bruce Feldman.
33:23
Speaker 7: They had two dogs there. One was a poodle and
33:26
Speaker 7: another large dog, and Bruce used to walk the dog
33:29
Speaker 7: in that neighborhood. They had been renting the home for
33:31
Speaker 7: probably about two weeks. A lot of the neighbors say
33:34
Speaker 7: that he didn't have the dogs on the leash, that
33:36
Speaker 7: they were walking around. He had some kind of altercation
33:40
Speaker 7: where he sat on someone's property, Bruce Feldman, and that
33:43
Speaker 7: may have sparked some tension, and it's believed that the
33:48
Speaker 7: suspect then went to that house, took a shovel and
33:51
Speaker 7: smashed the window.
33:53
Speaker 1: And that's why.
33:54
Speaker 7: Police went to that neighborhood because of the complaint from
33:57
Speaker 7: the woman who lived on the street.
33:59
Speaker 2: Okay, wait, this is getting very convoluted. Hold on, So
34:03
Speaker 2: we think suspect smashed a neighbor's window in that neighborhood.
34:08
Speaker 2: He was bumped up with the now dead filman. So
34:13
Speaker 2: cobs show up on the smashed window. Then they find
34:19
Speaker 2: a dead body. You were saying something about the two dogs.
34:24
Speaker 7: Right, He had two dogs, and we believe that those
34:26
Speaker 7: dogs were also killed inside that home.
34:29
Speaker 1: Let me understand something.
34:30
Speaker 2: So we've got the victim, seventy year old Felman, Bruce Feldman,
34:35
Speaker 2: and he had allowed suspect to live with him. He
34:41
Speaker 2: allowed him to move in and now he's found dead.
34:46
Speaker 2: Let me get stabbed to death and the two dogs
34:50
Speaker 2: are killed as well.
34:51
Speaker 1: Felman's two dogs were murdered, right.
34:54
Speaker 7: And what's really interesting about this is that the neighbors
34:56
Speaker 7: say they saw Bruce Felman all the time in that neighborhood,
34:59
Speaker 7: walking the poodle that you see in that photo around
35:02
Speaker 7: the neighborhood, but they never saw the suspect. They only
35:05
Speaker 7: saw Bruce Felman. At one point a neighbor said, you know,
35:08
Speaker 7: we don't even believe that there's someone else there, but
35:11
Speaker 7: they did see the Porsche there, so and that was
35:14
Speaker 7: very critical for a police in this investigation. That Porsche
35:17
Speaker 7: that you're looking at was parked in the driveway of
35:20
Speaker 7: that home and was also the car that was in Massachusetts.
35:25
Speaker 7: But Bruce Feldman was seen as a very social guy,
35:29
Speaker 7: very friendly with the neighbors. He tried to have a
35:31
Speaker 7: playdate with one of the neighbors dogs. But for some reason,
35:36
Speaker 7: something happened in that house and when police got there,
35:39
Speaker 7: I believe that they found Bruce Felman's body outside and
35:43
Speaker 7: he was dead.
35:44
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness.
35:46
Speaker 2: So you think the mode of death on Bruce Felman
35:49
Speaker 2: was also stabbing.
35:50
Speaker 7: I don't know if he was stabbed or he might
35:52
Speaker 7: have been killed with a shovel. The investigation hasn't released
35:56
Speaker 7: the cause of death. He may have been killed with
35:58
Speaker 7: a shovel, and then at that point he obviously left
36:00
Speaker 7: the scene.
36:01
Speaker 2: I want to think this through, and this is how
36:03
Speaker 2: I'd argue it to a jury once I finally got
36:05
Speaker 2: to what It's not necessarily chronological, but we're discussing Felma
36:10
Speaker 2: last because he was found dead last, along with his
36:13
Speaker 2: pet dogs.
36:14
Speaker 1: I would definitely argue to a jury.
36:17
Speaker 2: Fattest joining me, Eric Fattest, trial lawyer and TV legal analyst.
36:22
Speaker 1: Think about it. Think about picking up a shovel.
36:27
Speaker 2: I mean, when you see a pet dog, what is
36:29
Speaker 2: your natural instinct minus to try to pet it and
36:34
Speaker 2: baby talk to it and love on it. Me too,
36:36
Speaker 2: think about picking up a shovel and swinging it with
36:40
Speaker 2: such force, the act of beating someone dead with a
36:46
Speaker 2: shovel and then killing the two dogs. Did he cut
36:52
Speaker 2: them across the throat with a shovel? Did he bludgeon
36:55
Speaker 2: them dead with the shovel? That's what happened to Film
36:59
Speaker 2: and his two dogs. I submit at the hands of
37:04
Speaker 2: this guy.
37:05
Speaker 1: Well, you know, I hear you, Nancy.
37:06
Speaker 8: But the defense perspective is, is this guy some heartless
37:10
Speaker 8: chiller or is a completely office rocker. Think about it.
37:13
Speaker 8: Why kill the dogs? If he has some beef with Feldman,
37:16
Speaker 8: why take the additional step to kill two innocent dogs.
37:20
Speaker 8: You know, that could be evidence in fact that he
37:23
Speaker 8: didn't know right from wrong and he was just acting
37:26
Speaker 8: like a crazy person in that.
37:28
Speaker 2: Why did he run Fattus? If he didn't know right
37:30
Speaker 2: from wrong, why did he run? He ran from the
37:33
Speaker 2: movie theater, He took off and ran from the McDonald's.
37:37
Speaker 2: He in fact led police on a high speed chase.
37:42
Speaker 1: He reminds me of another spoiled brat killer. Listen.
37:46
Speaker 12: The attorney for New York City's sidewalk shover At Lauren Ponzienza,
37:50
Speaker 12: claims the spoiled socialite was a drunk and high mess
37:54
Speaker 12: the night she allegedly pushed legendary Broadway singing coach Barbara Augustn,
37:59
Speaker 12: causing the eighties seven year old to fall and later
38:01
Speaker 12: die from her injuries. Posienza is facing charges of manslaughter
38:05
Speaker 12: and assault for the unprovoked attack on Gustern. After Posienza
38:09
Speaker 12: allegedly shoved her, the eighty seven year old legend fell
38:11
Speaker 12: and hit her head. She died five days later from
38:14
Speaker 12: those injuries.
38:14
Speaker 1: That defendant, the so called cesspool princess.
38:18
Speaker 2: Her dad was a millionaire multi million is a multimillionaire
38:22
Speaker 2: from building cesspools.
38:25
Speaker 1: For rich people.
38:26
Speaker 2: Gets drunk and shoves a little old lady who then dies,
38:32
Speaker 2: and then ran off and deleted all of her social media,
38:36
Speaker 2: tried to hide out, tried to delete everything on her phone.
38:39
Speaker 1: She knew darn well what she had done.
38:42
Speaker 2: And miss Gustern died and let me remind everybody.
38:48
Speaker 1: Of Heather Mac, another spoiled brat.
38:52
Speaker 11: I don't regret killing my mother, And as evil as
38:54
Speaker 11: that may sound, that's my reality, in my heart, in
38:59
Speaker 11: my mind, my soul and my blood and the oxygen
39:04
Speaker 11: running through my body, that I wanted to.
39:08
Speaker 1: Kill my mother.
39:09
Speaker 12: Sheilav On Weismac takes her spoiled nineteen year old daughter,
39:12
Speaker 12: Heather Mack, to Bally for a luxury vacation to repair
39:15
Speaker 12: their mom daughter relationship and put distance between Heather and
39:18
Speaker 12: her twenty one year old boyfriend, Tommy Schaeffer. Heather has
39:21
Speaker 12: different plans, uses mom's money to sneak Tommy to Bally,
39:24
Speaker 12: where they kill Sheila Mac, fold her body in a suitcase,
39:27
Speaker 12: and take a taxi to a cheap hotel leaving the hotel,
39:30
Speaker 12: They forget the luggage and hotel security opens it up
39:32
Speaker 12: to find sheilav On weismac Ethan Couch was just sixteen
39:39
Speaker 12: when he killed four people and wounded nine others while
39:41
Speaker 12: he was drunk on drugs and speeding. His attorney said
39:44
Speaker 12: it was his parent's fault for never telling the boy no,
39:47
Speaker 12: never having any consequences for his actions. It was called affluenza,
39:51
Speaker 12: and the judge bought it. Couch has sentenced to an
39:53
Speaker 12: unspecified rehab facility at his parents' expense. The time he
39:57
Speaker 12: had to stay also unspecified for killing four people and
40:01
Speaker 12: he still didn't follow the rules.
40:03
Speaker 1: Guys.
40:03
Speaker 2: In the last hours, we are learning more about a
40:05
Speaker 2: suspect who eludes police capture, taking them on a wild
40:11
Speaker 2: goose chase a high speed pursuit after stabbing four little
40:16
Speaker 2: girls in an AMC theater, stabbing McDonald's employees not far away,
40:21
Speaker 2: and now suspected the stabbing death of his roommate and
40:25
Speaker 2: the roommate's two dogs. Bruce Feldman, I'm not sure that
40:30
Speaker 2: we really even know all of his victims. What is
40:34
Speaker 2: even more shocking is that he's from an affluent family
40:37
Speaker 2: and has been given everything on a silver platter, Susan RAFTFSB.
40:43
Speaker 1: You were in court, what did you see?
40:46
Speaker 7: He appeared in court. He was evaluated by a forensic
40:51
Speaker 7: psychologist for about two hours, and we waited for that.
40:55
Speaker 7: Then they came back and now he is at Bridgewater
40:58
Speaker 7: Hospital in Massachusetts, where he's going to be for the
41:01
Speaker 7: next twenty days. This forensic psychologist said, yes, he does
41:05
Speaker 7: seem to understand some things you're pointing out. He knows
41:09
Speaker 7: right from wrong. He understood the process in the court.
41:13
Speaker 7: But she called him delusional, that he is somewhat psychotic,
41:19
Speaker 7: that he thinks his parents are involved in the mafia,
41:22
Speaker 7: that he believes he's being controlled by outside forces. So
41:28
Speaker 7: it appears that he does suffer from a lot of
41:31
Speaker 7: mental health issues. It was brought out by that same
41:34
Speaker 7: psychologist that for the past two years he's been suffering
41:38
Speaker 7: from that. So in the end in June seventeenth, when
41:43
Speaker 7: he goes.
41:43
Speaker 2: Okay, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute,
41:45
Speaker 2: hold on, Susan rapaon, he has delusions of grandeur. He
41:51
Speaker 2: may be histrionic. That is not going to rise to
41:57
Speaker 2: the level of insanity. So what exactly happened in court?
42:03
Speaker 7: Well, I think they have to determine that the judge
42:05
Speaker 7: wants to see in the next twenty days, he's being
42:07
Speaker 7: evaluated if he's able to work with his attorney to
42:11
Speaker 7: defend himself. So whether whatever they decide, that will determine
42:16
Speaker 7: what goes forward, whether he does go to trial or not.
42:22
Speaker 7: And that's very talent.
42:24
Speaker 1: To Eric Fattis joining us.
42:27
Speaker 2: Eric, there's a far cry between having a delusion of
42:32
Speaker 2: grandeur or being histrionic, or spinning yarns about yourself or
42:37
Speaker 2: your family, which you know you heard Dodger Bricado talking
42:41
Speaker 2: about a model that it just turned down and advances
42:45
Speaker 2: and a proposal by the suspect that's not going to
42:48
Speaker 2: rise to legal insanity.
42:50
Speaker 1: Now he could.
42:53
Speaker 2: Feign fake some sort of a delusion to be titled
42:59
Speaker 2: incompetent deci trial at this time, which doesn't mean you
43:03
Speaker 2: are insane.
43:04
Speaker 1: At the time of the act.
43:05
Speaker 2: It means you're not fit to help your lawyer try
43:08
Speaker 2: the case. And what they do is put you in
43:11
Speaker 2: a mental facility and give you the right therapy and
43:14
Speaker 2: medication until you are fit to stand trial. The murdyr
43:19
Speaker 2: Bruce Felman, the Dogs, the stabbings of four little girls,
43:22
Speaker 2: and the McDonald's employees.
43:25
Speaker 1: That's a crime spree.
43:27
Speaker 2: There has got to be just as fat as certainly,
43:30
Speaker 2: and that's what the community is calling for, and that that's.
43:32
Speaker 8: Obviously a reasonable position to take. But you know, in
43:35
Speaker 8: looking at it, his attorney's raised competency. There's been at
43:38
Speaker 8: least one court practitioner, a doctor who has said that
43:43
Speaker 8: he has very serious delusions, and so I think there
43:45
Speaker 8: are some real questions as to whether this is someone
43:48
Speaker 8: with mental illness who's just a really good manipulator and
43:51
Speaker 8: who is homicidal, or if it's someone who is so
43:54
Speaker 8: detached from reality that they cannot stand trial to face
43:57
Speaker 8: these charges and cannot be convicted of the two.
44:00
Speaker 2: Doctor Gary Riccato, clinical forensics psychologist, author of The New Evil,
44:06
Speaker 2: Understanding the Emergence of Modern Violent Crime.
44:09
Speaker 1: Where do you stand on this?
44:11
Speaker 2: I certainly do not want someone who is insane to
44:15
Speaker 2: go into GPA general population, But I don't think he
44:20
Speaker 2: was insane at the time of the stabbings.
44:22
Speaker 5: Well. First of all, the crossover between the psychotic illness
44:26
Speaker 5: and violence has been a specialty throughout my career, and
44:30
Speaker 5: I will tell you that part of the trouble is
44:32
Speaker 5: is that people think that psychotic disorders are like a
44:35
Speaker 5: light switch.
44:35
Speaker 4: You know it's on or it's off. You have it
44:37
Speaker 4: or you don't.
44:38
Speaker 5: The truth is there's a wide array of traits that
44:41
Speaker 5: can be psychotic, signs and symptoms that can be psychotic,
44:44
Speaker 5: And you can have an individual with that kind of core,
44:47
Speaker 5: but who knows precisely what he's doing and is motivated
44:50
Speaker 5: by ordinary human feelings and anger and so forth. But
44:54
Speaker 5: the core of the individual could still be peculiar whatever.
44:58
Speaker 5: It's not a justification because the individual specific motivation is
45:03
Speaker 5: not voices or something like that. It's something else, like
45:06
Speaker 5: being angry after an argument, or feeling slighted or so forth,
45:10
Speaker 5: So that.
45:10
Speaker 4: It doesn't become so much a defense as much as a.
45:13
Speaker 5: Kind of mitigating factor perhaps that you might want to
45:16
Speaker 5: tickets consideration when understanding the breadth of the offense and
45:20
Speaker 5: why it was so random and chaotic and so forth.
45:24
Speaker 5: But the original impetus, I'm not sure was psychotic in nature,
45:28
Speaker 5: based on what I'm hearing. And the other thing is,
45:30
Speaker 5: you're right, Nancy, there were steps taken that indicate a
45:33
Speaker 5: kind of concealment and a fleeing that you wouldn't really
45:36
Speaker 5: say at a person that didn't know what he was doing.
45:38
Speaker 5: I mean going in in the trench coat, for example,
45:41
Speaker 5: into the theater, going into a darkened place where people
45:44
Speaker 5: wouldn't know that they were about to be attacked, running
45:47
Speaker 5: from authorities, and so forth. There are signs there of
45:50
Speaker 5: somebody who knows the difference being right and wrong. And
45:52
Speaker 5: I think that is ultimately all anybody who's going to
45:54
Speaker 5: care about.
45:55
Speaker 2: Legally, we wait as just as unfolds, and as we wait,
46:00
Speaker 2: we stopped to remember an American hero, Sergeant Heather Glynn.
46:04
Speaker 2: Sergeant Glynn shot and killed in the line of duty
46:07
Speaker 2: till City, Indiana, Survived by broken hearted parents Bob and Jane,
46:13
Speaker 2: her brother Jason, and nephew Trace. American hero Sergeant Heather Glenn.
46:19
Speaker 2: Thank you to all of our guests coming together to
46:22
Speaker 2: make sense of what we know in this case. But
46:26
Speaker 2: thank you especially to you for being with us tonight
46:28
Speaker 2: and every night. Nancy Gray signing off, good night friend,