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I Hate Talking Before Processing · I Hate Talking

• 0:29
  I Hate Talking: This is episode 8.
• 0:31
  I Hate Talking: Hi.
• 0:32
  I Hate Talking: So right before we started recording, you asked a question.
• 0:37
  I Hate Talking: I said, what are we talking about tonight?
• 0:40
  I Hate Talking: It's a very good question.
• 0:42
  I Hate Talking: So would you care to answer?
• 0:43
  I Hate Talking: I don't know what we're talking about.
• 0:46
  I Hate Talking: Well, we always start with a word or phrase of the episode.
• 0:51
  I Hate Talking: So that is one of the things that we're going to be talking about in this episode, and today's word or phrase of the episode is elastic, elastic.
• 1:02
  I Hate Talking: -- Oh -- no, OK.
• 1:04
  I Hate Talking: So when you hear the word elastic, do you think of the noun first?
• 1:08
  I Hate Talking: Well, the reason I laughed was cause I was thinking.
• 1:12
  I Hate Talking: Of my elastic pants.
• 1:14
  I Hate Talking: So in that case, pants is the noun and elastic is the adjective that describes the pants.
• 1:23
  I Hate Talking: So I guess technically you are thinking of the adjective that describes the pants, but the pants are only elastic because of a certain attribute that they have.
• 1:34
  I Hate Talking: I love that attribute.
• 1:36
  I Hate Talking: It's very helpful right now.
• 1:39
  I Hate Talking: Exactly, so that attribute is actually because it contains elastic, which would be the noun, a cord, tape, or fabric woven with strips of rubber which returns to its original length or shape after being stretched.
• 1:54
  I Hate Talking: As in elastic pants.
• 1:57
  I Hate Talking: Great.
• 1:58
  I Hate Talking: So which were you version were you thinking of?
• 2:01
  I Hate Talking: I think I would actually think of the adjective first.
• 2:05
  I Hate Talking: So I would actually think of it describing a material that's what I did.
• 2:13
  I Hate Talking: Yes, that's, that is very true.
• 2:15
  I Hate Talking: It is you are describing the material that returns to its original shape when it's stretched.
• 2:22
  I Hate Talking: There's a nuance there though, in fact, because there's a physical object that is actually the elastic band within the pants that makes it be described as elastic pants.
• 2:35
  I Hate Talking: Right.
• 2:36
  I Hate Talking: So we are actually going to be talking in a moment about how elasticity.
• 2:44
  I Hate Talking: Is actually potentially applicable to people.
• 2:48
  I Hate Talking: Clever, I see that.
• 2:50
  I Hate Talking: That is it.
• 2:51
  I Hate Talking: So that is the word or phrase of the episode.
• 2:56
  I Hate Talking: We have the noun as well as the adjective elastic, able to resume its normal shape spontaneously after contraction.
• 3:05
  I Hate Talking: dilation or distortion.
• 3:09
  I Hate Talking: So before we get into the discussion about elasticity, oh, that's a hard word, elasticity, elasticity elasticity.
• 3:19
  I Hate Talking: Um, this is a tangent, but all I can think of right now after we started this conversation, our kids started, um, martial arts, and when they're preschool, like toddlers, their belts are not your typical belt.
• 3:38
  I Hate Talking: It's made out of Velcro.
• 3:41
  I Hate Talking: So that way the parents don't have to untie and re tie the belt properly every time.
• 3:46
  I Hate Talking: And so when the instructor informed the whole class that my son was getting this, he very proudly announced.
• 3:54
  I Hate Talking: Velcro is my favorite material, very straightforward, very matter of fact.
• 4:01
  I Hate Talking: And I know we're talking about elastic.
• 4:04
  I Hate Talking: That's all I can think of is like elastic is my favorite material for pants.
• 4:08
  I Hate Talking: And there you have it.
• 4:09
  I Hate Talking: So, one of the topics that we started talking about in some previous episodes was verbal processing.
• 4:18
  I Hate Talking: Versus nonverbal processing and one of the questions that we asked ourselves and didn't or actually arrive at an answer uh because we moved on to other subjects was if there was even a particular word related to a nonverbal processor that described that attribute other than just it being the antithesis of the verbal processor.
• 4:44
  I Hate Talking: So I've actually done a little bit of research on that and have not found a particular word that aptly describes a nonverbal processor.
• 4:54
  I Hate Talking: Verbal processor is uh something that is, I think, well documented and well established within some of the current research, uh, but it is typically referred to as a non-verbal processor for the opposite end of the spectrum.
• 5:11
  I Hate Talking: There's a few.
• 5:13
  I Hate Talking: Uh, websites or research out there that describes it as internal versus external processing.
• 5:22
  I Hate Talking: So whereas the verbal processor is going to be the external processor and the non-verbal processor is going to be the internal processor and then even saw one website that described it as the talker versus the thinker.
• 5:40
  I Hate Talking: Hm, I don't like that.
• 5:42
  I Hate Talking: And I agree.
• 5:43
  I Hate Talking: I think that is a overgeneralization because certainly talkers will think and must think and thinkers.
• 5:53
  I Hate Talking: Will often talk unless they hate talking.
• 5:58
  I Hate Talking: Um, I like that you looked it up and that you even said the word that came to my mind, which would be internal processing.
• 6:07
  I Hate Talking: I feel like you'd, that's a positive spin, a different way to word nonverbal.
• 6:13
  I Hate Talking: Yep, that was uh cited as that particular phrase on a number of places that I looked at the external processor, uh, which is typically going to be associated with the verbal processor and then the internal processor, which is going to be typically associated with the nonverbal processor, but I do think that it is a more apt description of what we're talking about in terms of the external processor is going to use words or Even writing or maybe some of those aspects of narrative that we talked about in terms of painting or sculpture or other outputs of art in order to express themselves and not only express themselves, but come to an understanding in terms of what they are experiencing.
• 7:01
  I Hate Talking: And I hesitate even saying this because we've discussed.
• 7:05
  I Hate Talking: Your hate for narrative or your dislike for narrative, but it When I have to think about something, uh, and work something out in my brain, whether it's a math problem or Uh, relationship problem.
• 7:24
  I Hate Talking: I have to, um, Talk it out loud whether it's to somebody else or even to myself just saying the words out loud.
• 7:32
  I Hate Talking: Helps me come to a conclusion.
• 7:36
  I Hate Talking: And you're the opposite, where if you and I are discussing something and you bring it up.
• 7:43
  I Hate Talking: Your mind is mostly made up.
• 7:45
  I Hate Talking: I mean, you are open to reason, and you're open to my opinions, but generally, by the time you speak something, you've thought it through for long enough that this is your conclusion.
• 8:01
  I Hate Talking: Exactly.
• 8:02
  I Hate Talking: So in terms of how I maybe am processing the experience that I'm having, or even in a conversation that I'm having.
• 8:11
  I Hate Talking: I'm definitely going to be thinking about how I respond to that or I'm going to internalize even what conclusions and beliefs that I have before I speak.
• 8:24
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, that's something that we personally haven't had to work on over the years, is in the beginning of our marriage, we didn't understand that when I bring something up, It's the initial maybe seeds that I'm thinking of, I need to talk it out.
• 8:41
  I Hate Talking: Where when you come, bring something up, it's pretty much your, you've decided something.
• 8:48
  I Hate Talking: And so it was different because if you brought something up, I'd want to start spitballing ideas, and you'd like, no, this is what I think is right.
• 9:00
  I Hate Talking: And then maybe get frustrated that I don't see, maybe that I'm pushing back on your ideas.
• 9:08
  I Hate Talking: And on the other side, I'd get frustrated because you may not, wouldn't give me any anything when I'd start spitballing.
• 9:17
  I Hate Talking: Or you'd come to, OK, well, we're gonna do this.
• 9:21
  I Hate Talking: I'm like, well, no way, let's discuss this, let's go back and forth that give and take and come to a conclusion.
• 9:27
  I Hate Talking: And I do think that is something that we have developed in our relationship over the years that we have when it comes to a big decision, maybe that quiet time in between where we talk about it initially and then have that separation so that I do have time to think and then come back and discuss it more because if we are trying to get to a conclusion from that quote unquote spitballing session that I may be feeling hurried to come to a conclusion because I perceive that.
• 9:58
  I Hate Talking: As needing to come to a final conclusion during that discussion rather than being able to entertain it as a variety of options that we are discussing.
• 10:09
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, I mean, this is not a marriage podcast.
• 10:12
  I Hate Talking: We're not trying to give advice to change people's lives, but that is something that's been super helpful for us, is saying, if there's something that's a disagreement or something that's even just an idea, me throwing the thought out there.
• 10:28
  I Hate Talking: And then giving you time, like, we'll discuss this tonight at 7.
• 10:33
  I Hate Talking: Or something like that, gives you the time to think about it.
• 10:37
  I Hate Talking: And then gives us the time to come back and discuss it later.
• 10:45
  I Hate Talking: And it is true, this is not specifically a marriage podcast.
• 10:49
  I Hate Talking: However, it is a podcast where we encourage people to begin that journey to understanding through talking.
• 10:57
  I Hate Talking: Talking to your spouse, talking to your friends.
• 11:02
  I Hate Talking: Exactly.
• 11:03
  I Hate Talking: So when it comes to verbal processing and nonverbal processing, I think this is yet another particular.
• 11:12
  I Hate Talking: Thing that we need to be aware of when we do partake in conversation, not only if the person is an introvert or extrovert or highly sensitive or not or enjoys a loud environment or a quiet environment, but also how they even are able to process what they are thinking themselves either through verbal processing or as we said, the external processing or the more nonverbal processing or as we said.
• 11:41
  I Hate Talking: Internal processing.
• 11:43
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, and something that the past couple of years I've um learned from somebody and tried to implement it better is um when I, especially when I meet new people or um have very beginning stages of a friendship.
• 11:59
  I Hate Talking: I used to ask a lot of questions, and if I didn't get an answer right away, I would take it almost personally, like, oh, they must not want to talk to me.
• 12:09
  I Hate Talking: Like I'm being nosy.
• 12:11
  I Hate Talking: They don't want to share their private information with me.
• 12:14
  I Hate Talking: And I kind of just shut down and assume that friendship was no good.
• 12:19
  I Hate Talking: But learning that, like, giving them the time to answer.
• 12:24
  I Hate Talking: Or even pushing a little bit more sometimes, depending on it being like, oh, well, tell me more about that.
• 12:30
  I Hate Talking: And cause I'll just instantly start talking, and maybe some people need a little bit more of an encouragement, like, I want to hear what you're saying.
• 12:39
  I Hate Talking: So tell me more about that.
• 12:41
  I Hate Talking: We're knowing that maybe we can circle back to this topic later if they need to think about it more, versus it being like, oh, they don't like me personally.
• 12:51
  I Hate Talking: Exactly.
• 12:52
  I Hate Talking: And that goes even back to some of the very earlier episodes that, you know, if we hate talking to people or enjoy talking to people, is it because of our own intrinsic motivation or because of motivation to hear and understand the person on the other side of the conversation?
• 13:10
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, I was thinking about that.
• 13:13
  I Hate Talking: I don't want to veer off too far, but they were saying, I remember this conversation with somebody I had a couple of years ago.
• 13:19
  I Hate Talking: There's a group of women, and the majority of them all agreed that after we leave this event, they'd always, on the ride home, think about everything they said.
• 13:31
  I Hate Talking: And nitpick it and just feel so much shame.
• 13:36
  I Hate Talking: And it's not, there were, we weren't saying bad things.
• 13:39
  I Hate Talking: It was a good group.
• 13:41
  I Hate Talking: But it was interesting to me because.
• 13:44
  I Hate Talking: I spoke up at that moment and said, I don't think those things about you guys.
• 13:49
  I Hate Talking: When I'm driving home, I'm thinking, oh, I was a great conversation.
• 13:53
  I Hate Talking: That was so much fun.
• 13:55
  I Hate Talking: Were they're thinking about every nuance that might have been said.
• 14:00
  I Hate Talking: A very astute observation and I think that does relate back to perhaps the internal processor versus external processor.
• 14:09
  I Hate Talking: So it is interesting to note that there may be another thing to explore here because it seems that since they were talking this out loud.
• 14:19
  I Hate Talking: That there is still some aspect of verbal processing going on here, even though the perspectives on the actual events that transpired are so different.
• 14:31
  I Hate Talking: -- Are -- you saying because they spoke those things initially to begin with or that they were sharing with me that they afterwards feel uncomfortable?
• 14:40
  I Hate Talking: So it depends I guess we would need to know whether they were thinking these things in their mind either at the time of the event itself or were reflecting on it.
• 14:50
  I Hate Talking: And then decided to share it or if they were sharing these things in the verbal processing way of just talking them out in order to come to their own particular understanding.
• 15:02
  I Hate Talking: So was the point of them sharing to actually share information with those that they were talking to, or was the point of talking to be able to verbally process what they themselves needed to understand?
• 15:19
  I Hate Talking: Are you asking me?
• 15:22
  I Hate Talking: Well, I wasn't there, so I guess I am.
• 15:24
  I Hate Talking: I felt like it when I took it.
• 15:28
  I Hate Talking: As they were saying it, and even reflecting back, it was more of like a shame, like, Man, I'm gonna go home and.
• 15:36
  I Hate Talking: Analyze every moment of this conversation.
• 15:40
  I Hate Talking: Well, there you go.
• 15:42
  I Hate Talking: It sounds like based on that comment, that this was their initial sharing of this in order to process it and that because you said that they are going to further reflect on it, that they are verbal processors.
• 15:57
  I Hate Talking: OK.
• 15:59
  I Hate Talking: Even though they're not talking later on about it.
• 16:03
  I Hate Talking: If they do the initial talk with somebody, and then the rest of the talk is with themselves.
• 16:08
  I Hate Talking: OK, how does your brain work?
• 16:10
  I Hate Talking: So my brain would in this scenario.
• 16:13
  I Hate Talking: Never ever share a shameful event.
• 16:18
  I Hate Talking: Unless I am particularly prompted to or it's in a very safe space with a trusted person.
• 16:26
  I Hate Talking: I, as a nonverbal processor, if I have an embarrassing moment or a shameful thing that happened to me based on either the society or culture or people around me that did not approve of a particular action, even though it may not have been wrong, uh, that.
• 16:50
  I Hate Talking: I'm going to internalize that.
• 16:53
  I Hate Talking: I can think of specific times from decades ago, just right now that I still remember to this day and I sometimes reminded in my mind that this happened, don't ever do this again, and I've never shared those things with people because I am not a verbal processor.
• 17:12
  I Hate Talking: OK, but I will be asking you about them when we turn this off.
• 17:16
  I Hate Talking: And perhaps maybe we'll even get some fan mail that we'll ask about it as well.
• 17:21
  I Hate Talking: Ah fan mail.
• 17:23
  I Hate Talking: As Adam his deep dark secrets.
• 17:25
  I Hate Talking: So I think what we have concluded then is that this scenario that you are describing was actually people verbally processing their experience in order to come to an understanding on what happened.
• 17:41
  I Hate Talking: I mean, you're persuading me.
• 17:43
  I Hate Talking: I'm understanding, I came to a different conclusion initially.
• 17:47
  I Hate Talking: You are, I'm open to changing that.
• 17:51
  I Hate Talking: To your side.
• 17:53
  I Hate Talking: Is there any middle ground then, cause it can't just all be black and white, right?
• 17:57
  I Hate Talking: Like, is there a middle ground between verbal processor and internal processing?
• 18:04
  I Hate Talking: Because, OK, uh, to give you an example, I can't No, I, I mean, I can.
• 18:11
  I Hate Talking: Successfully, I literally say the words out loud.
• 18:16
  I Hate Talking: Before I make a decision.
• 18:19
  I Hate Talking: If they're like stuck in my head, I have a hard time even just having this conversation with myself back and forth.
• 18:26
  I Hate Talking: But if I'm speaking words to myself, I look maybe unhinged at the grocery store talking to myself, like, which cereal should I buy?
• 18:36
  I Hate Talking: Oh, this one's a little cheaper.
• 18:38
  I Hate Talking: OK, this is a better deal, I'll get this one.
• 18:41
  I Hate Talking: that's how I would go.
• 18:42
  I Hate Talking: So that's definitely what I think of as external processor, and your internal where everything is within yourself.
• 18:48
  I Hate Talking: What about when you do both?
• 18:50
  I Hate Talking: Extern talk it out loud and then think about it yourself.
• 18:55
  I Hate Talking: So I think perhaps this is an experiment that you or any of our verbal processors or external processors or as we said, talkers can try is do not have that initial conversation and see if you can get to that internal step first.
• 19:18
  I Hate Talking: Because that is the difference, because as a nonverbal processor or a internal processor or as we have said a thinker, in my experience, think about those things before we feel ready.
• 19:37
  I Hate Talking: To discuss it with anyone, or perhaps we will hate talking about it and never share it.
• 19:44
  I Hate Talking: I love that.
• 19:47
  I Hate Talking: Can you give me an example in your head then, how do you go about making a decision?
• 19:52
  I Hate Talking: It could be any decision.
• 19:55
  I Hate Talking: So I just came to a decision on what I'm going to say.
• 20:00
  I Hate Talking: But before I started talking, I have a particular list of things that I want to address that I'm going to talk about and I am not really thinking as I'm speaking, but I'm actually pre-thinking all the words that are coming out of my mouth right now.
• 20:17
  I Hate Talking: So it's like when you type it and it's a delayed.
• 20:21
  I Hate Talking: Text on the screen.
• 20:23
  I Hate Talking: Yes, so I think one of the things that I have taken to doing when I give the perception to others that I'm thinking on my feet is that I'm actually to some degree parallel processing within my mind, within my brain that I'm thinking in one stream of my thought process and I am delaying what my mouth is saying because I am.
• 20:51
  I Hate Talking: Giving those commands to.
• 20:53
  I Hate Talking: My mouth and tongue after I've already thought the words that I'm going to say.
• 20:58
  I Hate Talking: OK, so a later discussion, we need to have another episode, would be how you can possibly do that and listen to other people.
• 21:06
  I Hate Talking: Um, would be interesting to talk about talking and listening, how they coexist, but I love what you just said, and I can just picture this visual in my head of your typing on a computer, if your brain's the screen.
• 21:23
  I Hate Talking: You're typing And then the words appear.
• 21:28
  I Hate Talking: And then mine's the opposite, right, where I'm OK, I'm typing and then I'm reading the words on the screen.
• 21:36
  I Hate Talking: As they're coming out.
• 21:37
  I Hate Talking: They're already there and I'm reading.
• 21:40
  I Hate Talking: Where you would already have the words written.
• 21:43
  I Hate Talking: So I think that.
• 21:45
  I Hate Talking: The Verbal processor is.
• 21:50
  I Hate Talking: Somebody that is going to -- be -- amazing.
• 21:54
  I Hate Talking: Be amazing and think.
• 21:57
  I Hate Talking: Perhaps more about what they're saying after they say it because they need to say it in order to think about it.
• 22:03
  I Hate Talking: Whereas somebody that is an internal processor and a nonverbal processor are going to think.
• 22:11
  I Hate Talking: Before they speak because that is the only way that they feel comfortable speaking.
• 22:16
  I Hate Talking: And you and I, um.
• 22:19
  I Hate Talking: Probably are pretty extreme on both ends of the spectrum.
• 22:25
  I Hate Talking: But again, is there others in the middle that do both?
• 22:29
  I Hate Talking: So I think the human experience and the human psyche is multifaceted with many, many, many different things that need to be considered and the way that you process your own internal monologue is going to be one of those aspects, but also, Introvert versus extrovert, the sensitivity level that one has, even the gender that one has.
• 23:00
  I Hate Talking: Even different Nurture versus nature aspects of your upbringing.
• 23:07
  I Hate Talking: Are going to impact that and give a very different unique experience to everyone.
• 23:13
  I Hate Talking: But that in some form or fashion that you will fall in either one or the other.
• 23:21
  I Hate Talking: For this particular attribute, but we know that not only pants can be elastic, but that people can be elastic and that when you have this journey to understanding, not only will you understand people that you're talking to better but also potentially understand yourself better and when you are elastic.
• 23:49
  I Hate Talking: You will be able to be.
• 23:52
  I Hate Talking: Better within these situations that either call on Those things to be either more verbally processed or internally processed, and I think that's maybe also what you're getting at is that while your default state may be one or the other, that there is some degree of elasticity where you can.
• 24:16
  I Hate Talking: Either Have the additional capacity to.
• 24:22
  I Hate Talking: Act like the other one for the time being.
• 24:26
  I Hate Talking: It may take more energy, it may be uncomfortable.
• 24:30
  I Hate Talking: It may even also be to some degree faking it, but that you will be able to act in this other representation of the spectrum from your natural state.
• 24:43
  I Hate Talking: So I think we've been able to learn a lot and hopefully you have seen that we are already on the journey to understanding.
• 24:52
  I Hate Talking: And hopefully some of these things that we've discussed are insightful to not only those people that you talk to, but also to yourself.
• 25:00
  I Hate Talking: So, from your friends at IHTalking until next time, remember, it is only through talking that we begin the journey to understanding.