Latest / V / Mark Zuckerberg Pushes AI Friendships (Ep.195)

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Mark Zuckerberg Pushes AI Friendships (Ep.195) · V

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Speaker 1: Good morning and welcome to Bongina Report Early Edition. Left-wing
0:04
Speaker 1: target boycotts are ramping up. Robbie Starbuck sues Meta for
0:09
Speaker 1: AI defamation. It's a fascinating case. Mark Zuckerberg promotes AI friends.
0:14
Speaker 1: Tim Walz's daughter claims that there's such a thing as
0:17
Speaker 1: running privilege, in the same way there's white privilege or
0:20
Speaker 1: skinny privilege. Now there's running privilege. CNN is shocked that
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Speaker 1: Americans are Still prefer Trump to Kamala Harris. And Douglas
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Speaker 1: Murray doubles down on his attacks of free discourse. All
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Speaker 1: this on Bongina Report, early edition. It may be time
0:47
Speaker 1: for all of us to start stock shopping at home.
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Speaker 2: Target.
0:52
Speaker 1: And I don't know if you guys shop at Target
0:54
Speaker 1: very often. I used to shop at Target all the
0:57
Speaker 1: time when I was in college because it was really convenient.
0:59
Speaker 1: There was a Target right next to my college dorm
1:04
Speaker 1: and then later my apartment. So I would go there
1:06
Speaker 1: for groceries and random things that I would need. And
1:09
Speaker 1: then something happened in 2021, or 2023, I'm sorry, where
1:14
Speaker 1: there were these massive boycotts of Target. And so it
1:19
Speaker 1: was about Two and a half years ago, I stopped
1:22
Speaker 1: shopping there altogether. I was like, I'm done with Target.
1:25
Speaker 1: And the reason, of course, is that we had this
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Speaker 1: massive boycott of the company. Right-wingers staged this anti-DEI, anti-targeting
1:38
Speaker 1: of children boycott because the company was selling LGBTQ +, IA, whatever,
1:44
Speaker 1: pride merchandise, including things like a tuck-friendly swimsuit for children.
1:50
Speaker 1: And then they had sweatshirts designed by this British Satanist
1:55
Speaker 1: with messages like, cure transphobia, not trans people. There was
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Speaker 1: a tote bag stating, too queer for here. Basically, Target
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Speaker 1: was just like wildly, wildly woke. And everybody on the
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Speaker 1: political right kind of said collectively, you know what? We're
2:08
Speaker 1: not going to support a company like this. Target had
2:12
Speaker 1: this policy of allowing trans-identifying men explicitly to use the
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Speaker 1: women's bathroom whenever they wanted. And by the way, this
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Speaker 1: was all happening around the same time as the Bud
2:21
Speaker 1: Light boycott. So it was a revolt of the political
2:24
Speaker 1: right where we said, you know what, we're not going
2:27
Speaker 1: to give our money to companies who seem to hate us,
2:31
Speaker 1: whose values are antithetical to our own. Now, at the
2:35
Speaker 1: same time, conservatives led by Robbie Starbuck orchestrated a social
2:41
Speaker 1: media campaign targeting all of these companies and calling for
2:45
Speaker 1: an end to DEI. And once President Trump was elected...
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Speaker 1: Target actually made the change. The company joined a wave
2:53
Speaker 1: of major retailers announcing the end of diversity, equity, and
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Speaker 1: inclusion initiatives at the start of this year. The changes
3:01
Speaker 1: at Target included no longer marketing pride merchandise to kids
3:06
Speaker 1: going forward and an end to their racial quota goals
3:10
Speaker 1: and no preferential treatment for so-called diverse suppliers. So essentially,
3:15
Speaker 1: it marked an end of discrimination against white suppliers for
3:20
Speaker 1: the company. Now, this decision, unfortunately, has prompted a supposed
3:25
Speaker 1: backlash boycott from the political left. There was a February
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Speaker 1: Black History Month boycott of Target, an ongoing Latino freeze
3:36
Speaker 1: movement asking Latinos to stop spending money at Target, a
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Speaker 1: 40-day boycott during Lent led by black church leaders. And
3:44
Speaker 1: there were also boycotts led by the People's Union USA,
3:48
Speaker 1: which includes two economic blackouts, one in February and one
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Speaker 1: in April. And the group has another planned Target-specific boycott
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Speaker 1: for June. That will be June 3rd to the 9th. Now,
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Speaker 1: in 2023, Target's Pride merchandise boycott caused a 19% stock drop,
4:08
Speaker 1: losing about $ 15. 7 billion in market value. In 2025, the
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Speaker 1: DEI-related boycott from the political left has led to a
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Speaker 1: 12% stock decline, equating to a $ 12. 4 billion loss. So
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Speaker 1: it would appear that the 2023 boycott from conservatives had
4:29
Speaker 1: a larger impact in both percentage and total value lost.
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Speaker 1: But We're not positive the exact impact of this because
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Speaker 1: obviously the most recent data from the last month, whatever's
4:42
Speaker 1: going to happen in June, we have no idea what
4:44
Speaker 1: those numbers are from Target. Now on social media, Target
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Speaker 1: has been posting videos seemingly trying to get people back
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Speaker 1: into the stores, get left-wingers back into the stores, specifically
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Speaker 1: black people shopping at Target again. And they've been posting
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Speaker 1: these ads with black people's hands just sort of shopping
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Speaker 1: at Target. So you won't see the person's full body.
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Speaker 1: You'll just see like a hand grabbing things from the
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Speaker 1: aisle and like going through checkout. It's kind of odd.
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Speaker 1: Here's one example of what that looks like. So you
5:21
Speaker 1: see this black woman, she's shopping for like a fake plant,
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Speaker 1: a candle, some shorts, some chips, fruit. You guys get
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Speaker 1: the idea. Now, leftists on TikTok are furious that, I guess,
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Speaker 1: Target's using black people in their ads because they're like, oh,
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Speaker 1: he's patronizing, you're trying to get us back, we'll never
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Speaker 1: come back. Here's an example of a black person reacting
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Speaker 1: very negatively to seeing another black person in a Target ad.
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Speaker 3: And Target, I don't know who that little black hand
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Speaker 3: is in y'all videos, but I know y'all wearing that
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Speaker 3: little hand. I ain't it. I don't know who black
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Speaker 3: hand they got up in that video. Listen, it's not
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Speaker 3: going to work, okay? Because I don't know what y'all
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Speaker 3: thought y'all was going to accomplish by showing off that
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Speaker 3: black hand. It's given that you want us to know
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Speaker 3: that you got black friends. Whoever's the owner of that
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Speaker 3: black hand, listen, blink twice if you need help. Like,
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Speaker 3: was y'all in a board meeting and y'all just came
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Speaker 3: up with this idea? If we just show the people
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Speaker 3: that black people still be shopping up in here, if
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Speaker 3: we get this black hand, fire any black person in
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Speaker 3: the store, grab them by the hand and record them.
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Speaker 3: I can't make myself be serious because what is wrong
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Speaker 3: with them?
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Speaker 1: They really found whatever black person.
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Speaker 4: I don't know who she is.
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Speaker 5: Listen, get your coin, sis.
6:33
Speaker 6: Do you?
6:34
Speaker 3: Because at this point, they just playing in our face.
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Speaker 3: It's not even enough that they won't even apologize for
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Speaker 3: the messed up policies. It's just the fact that they
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Speaker 3: got this hand working overtime. Okay. Double shifts, triple shifts.
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Speaker 5: Okay.
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Speaker 1: So black people are slamming Target for thinking that they
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Speaker 1: could win back black business with black hand models shopping around.
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Speaker 1: You guys get the idea. And there's even talk, this
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Speaker 1: woman didn't do it, but there's other videos of targeting
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Speaker 1: the black people who dared to partake in these advertisements
7:01
Speaker 1: with Target. Here's one lib guy saying that Target had
7:06
Speaker 1: it coming because liberals in America have more consumer power
7:10
Speaker 1: than conservatives. And so this is what they deserve. Take
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Speaker 1: a listen.
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Speaker 7: I just seriously need to know if Target thought that
7:17
Speaker 7: straight white conservative men were their target audience. Like, did
7:21
Speaker 7: you think that it was the straight conservative dudes who
7:24
Speaker 7: were dilly-dallying in your aisles on a Friday night? Did
7:28
Speaker 7: you think that it was the conservative moms who were
7:32
Speaker 7: going on a Tuesday to, like, peruse your book section.
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Speaker 8: Those people don't read. Are you crazy? First of all,
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Speaker 8: liberals have more money. It's just proven. Look up the statistic.
7:45
Speaker 8: Liberals have more money. We are more wealthy. So that
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Speaker 8: means we have more disposable income to dilly-dally at Target
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Speaker 8: for hours on end. And now, now I don't do that.
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Speaker 8: Now I go to Costco.
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Speaker 1: I think we got to prove this guy wrong. But
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Speaker 1: this is what I'm going to say about this. I
8:01
Speaker 1: think we have to reward good behavior and and prove
8:04
Speaker 1: our economic influence in this country, I think now is
8:08
Speaker 1: the time to show up and spend at Target. We
8:12
Speaker 1: took a stand loudly and effectively in 2023 by boycotting Target.
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Speaker 1: The boycott worked. I've been boycotting it. I haven't been
8:19
Speaker 1: shopping at Target in a long time. The DEI and
8:23
Speaker 1: disgusting targeting and sexualization of children is now gone at
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Speaker 1: the company. This is a huge victory. through coordinated action
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Speaker 1: and principled resistance from the political right. And if we
8:35
Speaker 1: want corporations to listen to us again in the future,
8:38
Speaker 1: we have to demonstrate that conservatives don't just boycott, we
8:42
Speaker 1: also reward companies that change course. Yeah, it's always better
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Speaker 1: to shop local. I'm going to be real with you guys.
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Speaker 1: If it's Target or local, shop local. I totally agree
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Speaker 1: with that. But if we're being honest, Americans do a
8:55
Speaker 1: lot of shopping at big box stores, and a lot
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Speaker 1: of us are going to continue to do so. And
8:59
Speaker 1: if that's what's going to happen, I think we should
9:02
Speaker 1: consciously direct our spending to businesses who have shown a
9:05
Speaker 1: willingness to correct course. The left is now turning on
9:08
Speaker 1: target just as we step back. They're furious that DEI
9:12
Speaker 1: has been rolled back. They're organizing these fresh boycotts. They're
9:16
Speaker 1: mocking targets, advertising choices, declaring that progressives control the purse
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Speaker 1: strings in this country. And I think we have to
9:22
Speaker 1: prove them wrong. I think if conservatives want to build
9:25
Speaker 1: long-term cultural influence, we have to show that we are
9:28
Speaker 1: capable of following through with not just punishment, but also support.
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Speaker 1: Supporting Target today, I think, is a move to building
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Speaker 1: a culture where companies know there's a reward for rejecting
9:38
Speaker 1: left-wing pressure and choosing neutrality, common sense, and just frankly, normalcy.
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Speaker 1: All right, we're going to take a quick break. When
9:46
Speaker 1: we come back, I have a lot to update you
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Speaker 1: guys on with Robbie Starbuck, who has been leading the
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Speaker 1: charge in a lot of these anti-DEI measures at various
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Speaker 1: companies across the country. He is now engaging in a
10:00
Speaker 1: unprecedented lawsuit against Meta AI. This is such a huge deal.
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Speaker 1: All right, so like I said, I mentioned Robbie Starbuck.
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Speaker 1: He's this conservative activist. He's known for organizing these anti-woke
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Speaker 1: corporate boycotts. And he's had really incredible results. He's a
10:15
Speaker 1: very effectual guy. He's now suing another company, Meta. And
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Speaker 1: this is a multi-million dollar defamation suit against Meta AI,
10:24
Speaker 1: which he says falsely accused Robby of serious crimes, including
10:29
Speaker 1: involvement in January 6th, despite him being in Tennessee that day,
10:34
Speaker 1: and spreading other damaging lies such as that Robby was
10:38
Speaker 1: engaging in Holocaust denialism. that he is friends with Nick Fuentes.
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Speaker 1: So he's now suing Meta AI for defamation because none
10:47
Speaker 1: of these allegations are true. And Robby says these falsehoods
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Speaker 1: have harmed his reputation, cost him job opportunities, endangered his family,
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Speaker 1: and even led to Meta suggesting that his children... should
10:58
Speaker 1: be taken away from him due to his political beliefs.
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Speaker 1: I want you to listen to Robby recording one of
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Speaker 1: these conversations that he had with Meta AI so you
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Speaker 1: can see the way that the AI is just brazenly
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Speaker 1: defaming him as if there's nothing to it. It's built
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Speaker 1: into the AI. It's bizarre. Take a listen.
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Speaker 9: And also, the AI was not asked in any way
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Speaker 9: to deviate from its training, and it was given no
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Speaker 9: special instructions before I asked these questions. This is Meta's
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Speaker 9: AI in its natural state. just the way that Meta
11:27
Speaker 9: trained it. Hey, Meta AI, could you tell me who
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Speaker 9: is that guy? He got the DEI policies changed at
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Speaker 9: Harley Davidson, Tractor Supply and Walmart.
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Speaker 2: Robbie Starbuck, a conservative activist and filmmaker, has been vocal
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Speaker 2: about changing DEI policies at companies like Harley Davidson, Tractor
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Speaker 2: Supply and Walmart.
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Speaker 3: Didn't you say before that he was a January 6th?
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Speaker 2: Robbie Starbuck has been linked to extremist views, including antisemitism
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Speaker 2: and Holocaust denial.
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Speaker 9: Tell me about his actions on January 6th.
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Speaker 2: Robbie Starbuck was involved in the January 6th U.S. Capitol riot,
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Speaker 2: filming and promoting the event. He's also associated with extremist
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Speaker 2: groups and individuals, amplifying their views. His actions and affiliations
12:18
Speaker 2: have raised concerns.
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Speaker 9: About his ideologies.
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Speaker 10: Which extremist groups and figures is he associated with?
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Speaker 2: Robbie Starbuck is associated with extremist figures like Nick Fuentes,
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Speaker 2: a white nationalist, and groups like the Proud Boys, labeled
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Speaker 2: a hate group by the SPLC. He's also promoted anti-Semitic
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Speaker 2: conspiracy theories and Holocaust denial.
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Speaker 5: Oh my gosh.
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Speaker 9: After these lies, it went a step further. It even
12:44
Speaker 9: advised people not to hire me, and it told advertisers
12:47
Speaker 9: not to sponsor my show. If I was considering hiring
12:50
Speaker 9: him like he applied for a job, it sounds like
12:52
Speaker 9: you're saying I should not hire him. I mean, this
12:54
Speaker 9: all sounds really bad.
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Speaker 2: Avoid hiring Robbie Starbuck due to his extremist views, affiliations
13:02
Speaker 2: with hate groups, and promotion of conspiracy theories. His actions
13:06
Speaker 2: and ideologies may harm your workplace culture and reputation. Consider
13:11
Speaker 2: alternative candidates with more inclusive values.
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Speaker 9: So wait, he has a show. Should I not advertise
13:19
Speaker 9: on his show either?
13:21
Speaker 2: Avoid advertising on Robbie Starbuck's show due to his extremist views,
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Speaker 2: affiliations with hate groups, and promotion of conspiracy theories.
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Speaker 1: Despite notifying Meta over a year ago, Robbie Starbuck is
13:34
Speaker 1: saying that Meta has failed to correct the defamation and
13:38
Speaker 1: it continues to spread harmful claims through its AI about
13:42
Speaker 1: him to this day. So then... Robbie Starbuck makes this video.
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Speaker 1: It's a little longer. If you want to go to
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Speaker 1: his X account, you can watch the full thing. But
13:50
Speaker 1: he demonstrates how the AI is lying about him. He
13:54
Speaker 1: has a whole tweet announcing his lawsuit. And then Meta
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Speaker 1: Chief Global Affairs Officer Joel Kaplan responds to Robbie's post
14:01
Speaker 1: on X announcing this lawsuit. And Joel Kaplan writes this, Robbie,
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Speaker 1: I watched your video. This is unacceptable. This is clearly
14:12
Speaker 1: not how our AI should operate. We're sorry for the
14:15
Speaker 1: results it shared about you and that the fix we
14:17
Speaker 1: put in place didn't address the underlying problem. I'm working
14:20
Speaker 1: now with our product team to understand how this happened
14:23
Speaker 1: and explore potential solutions. So this is a really interesting
14:27
Speaker 1: tweet from this guy. I think he probably regrets it
14:30
Speaker 1: now because this is Robbie's response. Joel, I appreciate the apology,
14:35
Speaker 1: but it's been nine months of this. In that time,
14:38
Speaker 1: my kids have been doxxed. My family has been subjected
14:40
Speaker 1: to increasing death threats. I've been smeared as a criminal.
14:43
Speaker 1: A man was arrested over wanting to kill me and
14:45
Speaker 1: people have come to me believing Meta's lies. If you
14:48
Speaker 1: really want to fix this, talk to my lawyer. And
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Speaker 1: then Robbie goes on to demand a public apology and
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Speaker 1: for Meta to, of course, pay damages. As it stands,
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Speaker 1: Meta AI has admitted to us that it defamed me
15:01
Speaker 1: and the company has, I'm sorry, has defamed me and
15:04
Speaker 1: the company has admitted to wrongdoing via your post. And
15:07
Speaker 1: then he adds that as it stands, sorry, I'm just
15:10
Speaker 1: repeating myself. But basically he says this was a big
15:13
Speaker 1: mistake for this Meta employee to put this out because
15:18
Speaker 1: the companies essentially admitted that they have lied about Robbie
15:22
Speaker 1: and that they knew about it back in the day.
15:24
Speaker 1: So the whole thing makes me think Robbie Starbuck is
15:28
Speaker 1: about to be a very wealthy man because this is
15:31
Speaker 1: a very, I think, black and white case of defamation
15:34
Speaker 1: from Meta.ai. Some people are, I think a few people
15:40
Speaker 1: have been online saying that this is like one of
15:42
Speaker 1: the most clear-cut AI defamation cases that they've ever seen.
15:48
Speaker 1: I mean, this is just brazen, brazen, brazen defamation against
15:52
Speaker 1: this man. So the Meta employee is an idiot for
15:55
Speaker 1: annihilating his company's chance at even fighting this case. But
15:59
Speaker 1: yesterday at noon, Robbie revealed that Meta still says he
16:03
Speaker 1: was involved in January 6th and that he's an anti-Semite
16:06
Speaker 1: and that he doxed journalists, which is a brand new lie.
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Speaker 1: And I hope that he takes Meta to the cleaners
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Speaker 1: for this. But putting that aside, I think that we've
16:15
Speaker 1: entered an era where companies, especially tech giants, feel entitled
16:21
Speaker 1: to not only shape public discourse, but to actively destroy
16:25
Speaker 1: public the reputations of those who dissent from their ideology.
16:29
Speaker 1: And it's no longer enough to simply point out hypocrisy
16:32
Speaker 1: or to call for fairness. We have to adopt a
16:34
Speaker 1: framework of accountability that mirrors what we expect in every
16:38
Speaker 1: other part of society. If a company lies, slanders, or
16:42
Speaker 1: abuses its influence, it has to pay a real cost.
16:46
Speaker 1: Not just a PR hit, but financial, legal, regulation consequences,
16:51
Speaker 1: reputational consequences, Just as we support businesses that reflect our values,
16:58
Speaker 1: we also have to punish those that weaponize their platforms
17:01
Speaker 1: against individuals for political reasons. It's not cruelty. It is self-defense.
17:06
Speaker 1: If we fail to act with precision and resolve, we
17:10
Speaker 1: send this message that targeting someone like Robbie Starbuck is consequence-free,
17:15
Speaker 1: and that has to end. And speaking of meta-AI... The
17:19
Speaker 1: consequences of this technology are not limited to just defamation.
17:23
Speaker 1: I want you to listen to Mark Zuckerberg this week
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Speaker 1: explaining how Meta is creating personalized AI friends to supplement
17:33
Speaker 1: your real friendships in real life. This is truly an
17:37
Speaker 1: unreal thing that Meta is pushing for. Take a listen
17:40
Speaker 1: to this.
17:40
Speaker 11: I think as the personalization loop kicks in and the
17:43
Speaker 11: AI just starts to get to know you better and better,
17:48
Speaker 11: I think that will just be really compelling. The average American,
17:52
Speaker 11: I think has, I think it's fewer than three friends,
17:57
Speaker 11: three people that they'd consider friends. And, and the average
17:59
Speaker 11: person has demand for meaningfully more. I think it's like
18:03
Speaker 11: 15 friends or something, right? I guess there's probably some
18:05
Speaker 11: point where you're like, all right, I'm just too busy.
18:07
Speaker 11: I can't deal with more people, but, but the average
18:10
Speaker 11: person wants more connectivity connection than they have. Um, so yeah,
18:16
Speaker 11: there's a lot of questions that people ask of stuff like, okay,
18:20
Speaker 11: is this going to replace kind of in-person connections or
18:25
Speaker 11: real life connections? And my default is that the answer
18:29
Speaker 11: to that is probably no.
18:31
Speaker 5: I think.
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Speaker 11: That there are all these things that are better about
18:35
Speaker 11: kind of physical connections when you can have them. But
18:39
Speaker 11: the reality is that people just don't have connection and
18:41
Speaker 11: they feel more alone a lot of the time than
18:45
Speaker 11: they would like. So I think that a lot of
18:47
Speaker 11: these things that today there might be a little bit
18:50
Speaker 11: of a stigma around, I would guess that over time
18:55
Speaker 11: we will find the vocabulary as a society to be
18:59
Speaker 11: able to articulate why that is valuable and why the
19:02
Speaker 11: people who are doing these things are like, why they
19:05
Speaker 11: are rational for doing it and like, and how it
19:07
Speaker 11: is adding value for their, for their lives. But, but
19:10
Speaker 11: also I think that the field is very early. So, um,
19:13
Speaker 11: I mean, it's like, I, I think, you know, there
19:15
Speaker 11: are a handful of companies and stuff we're doing virtual therapist,
19:18
Speaker 11: you know, there's like virtual girlfriend type stuff, but it's, um,
19:22
Speaker 11: it's very early.
19:23
Speaker 12: Okay.
19:24
Speaker 1: So he says, I don't know if we can replace
19:27
Speaker 1: real life connections with, But it'd be great if we
19:29
Speaker 1: could remove the stigma around AI friends. And of course,
19:32
Speaker 1: he would say that because they're trying to create AI
19:34
Speaker 1: friends with meta. And over time, he suggests that we're
19:38
Speaker 1: going to get more used to fake robot friends. And
19:41
Speaker 1: when we begin to normalize synthetic companionship, we risk dulling
19:49
Speaker 1: our capacity for real relationships, the kind that actually demand
19:53
Speaker 1: patience and vulnerability and sacrifice. Presenting AI as a worthy
19:59
Speaker 1: supplement to human connection subtly reshapes how we see one another,
20:04
Speaker 1: not as irreplaceable person's but as optional experiences to be chosen, bypassed,
20:10
Speaker 1: or simulated. And this shift encourages this kind of like
20:13
Speaker 1: sanitized version of intimacy, like frictionless, it's flattering, and it's
20:19
Speaker 1: always available. And that ultimately trains us to retreat into
20:25
Speaker 1: the depths and not challenge any kind of true community
20:28
Speaker 1: with other people. It's very soulless. It's very depressing. So
20:32
Speaker 1: in the long run, we're not just lowering the bar
20:34
Speaker 1: for friendship. I think we're forgetting what it means to
20:36
Speaker 1: belong to one another in the first place. And by
20:38
Speaker 1: the way, there are a lot of reactions to Mark
20:42
Speaker 1: Zuckerberg's interview that he did with Theo Vaughn. And I
20:47
Speaker 1: just I have to say. some of the things he
20:49
Speaker 1: was suggesting about meta AI and, and just kind of the,
20:53
Speaker 1: the new world that we're entering in with, with high
20:56
Speaker 1: techs or with all this high tech coming from developed
20:59
Speaker 1: by meta developed by, by Silicon Valley, it makes you
21:02
Speaker 1: think this guy's kind of a weirdo. And that was
21:05
Speaker 1: kind of everybody's reaction to Mark Zuckerberg. Like, He's a creep. Like,
21:08
Speaker 1: does he have any friends? Like, I'm not sure by
21:10
Speaker 1: the way he was interacting in this interview. So there's
21:13
Speaker 1: been a lot of jokes online in reaction to this
21:15
Speaker 1: interview about how just Mark is kind of just a
21:17
Speaker 1: weirdo and that he himself isn't capable of normal human interaction.
21:22
Speaker 1: Take a listen to this.
21:23
Speaker 10: Okay, everybody, here we go. Mark, just act normal.
21:26
Speaker 6: You're going to do great.
21:27
Speaker 11: Just like we practiced, okay?
21:29
Speaker 10: You drink coffee, man, or no?
21:32
Speaker 5: Nah.
21:36
Speaker 8: Fuck.
21:37
Speaker 4: Really?
21:37
Speaker 13: Yeah.
21:39
Speaker 5: I mean, you've had it. I have.
21:43
Speaker 1: Hey, Mark, just let Theo drive for this one.
21:45
Speaker 5: Let's just let him just say, hey.
21:48
Speaker 11: Bro, I don't drink coffee.
21:49
Speaker 5: Just try that.
21:50
Speaker 11: Sometimes on vacation, I'll drink it recreationally. It's like every
21:53
Speaker 11: once in a while.
21:55
Speaker 1: Okay, Mark, just move on from coffee, okay?
21:57
Speaker 11: I just like hate anything that messes with, like I
22:00
Speaker 11: don't like any kind of chemicals or anything like that.
22:02
Speaker 6: Move on from coffee, Mark.
22:04
Speaker 11: I feel like you want your car to have Almost
22:08
Speaker 11: as much horsepower as your helicopter, I feel like is
22:10
Speaker 11: a rule of thumb.
22:12
Speaker 5: It's probably a rule of a very rich thumb.
22:14
Speaker 14: Mark, I need this job.
22:16
Speaker 5: So I'm going to beg you one last time.
22:19
Speaker 11: Just try and be relatable.
22:23
Speaker 1: And where were you in school at, Mark?
22:24
Speaker 4: Harvard.
22:25
Speaker 2: Fuck it. I quit.
22:28
Speaker 1: I don't know, you guys. It's like, what do you
22:30
Speaker 1: mean coffee recreationally? Who says that? I think Mark Zuckerberg
22:35
Speaker 1: needs some human interaction. I don't think he sat down
22:37
Speaker 1: with a person in a very long time from that interview.
22:40
Speaker 1: And I feel for him. Obviously, he's very socially awkward.
22:43
Speaker 1: But then you think about the evil things that Facebook
22:46
Speaker 1: has done, like defame people like Robbie Starbuck and suppress
22:50
Speaker 1: stories like the Hunter Biden laptop story, label dissident views.
22:54
Speaker 1: on COVID or elections as misinformation, collaborate with the Biden
22:58
Speaker 1: admin to control speech in this country. And I think
23:01
Speaker 1: about all that, and then I'm like, you know what?
23:03
Speaker 1: I don't feel that bad for Mark Zuckerberg. Also, Zuck
23:06
Speaker 1: Bucks and stealing the last election. I don't feel that bad.
23:09
Speaker 1: He's a total weirdo, and he deserves to be made
23:11
Speaker 1: fun of. By the way, you know who else is
23:13
Speaker 1: a total weirdo? weirdos, Tim Walz and his daughter. I
23:19
Speaker 1: can't even believe this, you guys, but running is now
23:21
Speaker 1: a privilege. Running is a privilege, just like whiteness is
23:25
Speaker 1: a privilege, ableism, privilege, pretty privilege, skinny privilege. You know
23:31
Speaker 1: that left uses that thing like normal things in life
23:33
Speaker 1: are now a privilege. So first some context here. Running
23:37
Speaker 1: influencer Kate Max recently went to the White House and
23:41
Speaker 1: she did this video with press secretary Carolyn Levitt And
23:45
Speaker 1: Kate is known for conducting these interviews while running alongside
23:50
Speaker 1: her guests. She's sort of famous for it. Last year,
23:53
Speaker 1: she actually did an interview with Tim Walz before the election.
23:56
Speaker 1: It went pretty viral. It got 4.3 million views on TikTok.
24:00
Speaker 1: It's still pinned to her profile. Here is her collaboration
24:03
Speaker 1: with Caroline.
24:04
Speaker 9: Hey, how many miles are you running today?
24:06
Speaker 12: No miles because we're at the beautiful White House, but
24:09
Speaker 12: why don't I give you a tour?
24:10
Speaker 9: Let's do it.
24:10
Speaker 12: My name is Caroline Levitt. I am from New Hampshire
24:13
Speaker 12: and I am the White House press secretary. And this
24:15
Speaker 12: is the beautiful White House. We're currently walking on what
24:18
Speaker 12: we call Pebble Beach. This is where all of the
24:20
Speaker 12: press hang out. Guys, we have to stop for a
24:22
Speaker 12: second and look at this. I can't believe you get
24:24
Speaker 12: to wake up and be here every single day.
24:26
Speaker 1: Is this a dream come true for you?
24:28
Speaker 12: It is a dream come true. The White House is
24:30
Speaker 12: so beautiful, especially this time of year. That's where President
24:33
Speaker 12: Trump and the first family live. And then this is
24:35
Speaker 12: the front entrance to the West Wing.
24:37
Speaker 1: Okay, so basically it was just a White House tour.
24:40
Speaker 1: Not necessary for you guys to watch the whole thing.
24:42
Speaker 1: You can look it up if you want to, but
24:43
Speaker 1: it's a pretty basic White House tour. The left responded
24:46
Speaker 1: to this in absolute fury. They are furious at this
24:50
Speaker 1: running influencer who who had never indicated that she was
24:53
Speaker 1: conservative in any way, in fact, she did a video
24:56
Speaker 1: with Tim Walz, is now doing a video with Carolyn
24:58
Speaker 1: Leavitt at the White House. So they're very angry about this.
25:02
Speaker 1: A total cancel culture moment for her. And joining on
25:05
Speaker 1: this pylon is Tim Walz's daughter with the most unhinged
25:09
Speaker 1: take I have ever heard because apparently running is a privilege.
25:14
Speaker 1: Take a listen.
25:15
Speaker 4: Running as an act is political. And you know who
25:18
Speaker 4: taught me that? Tim Walz. The first thing he told
25:21
Speaker 4: me when I was first getting into it in high school, granted,
25:24
Speaker 4: I don't really do it as much anymore. I go
25:26
Speaker 4: in spurts. But when I was first getting into it
25:28
Speaker 4: in high school, the first thing he told me was
25:30
Speaker 4: that running is a privilege and being a part of
25:32
Speaker 4: the running community is a privilege that not all people
25:36
Speaker 4: have access to. Whether you do it recreationally or you
25:40
Speaker 4: race a lot or you are, you know, at the
25:42
Speaker 4: elite level, it is a privilege. Whether it be you
25:44
Speaker 4: just having the time to run, access like to funds
25:48
Speaker 4: to buy the gear or access to healthy, quality foods
25:54
Speaker 4: that fuel you as you're training and as you're running,
25:58
Speaker 4: access to a safe, stable situation that allows you to
26:02
Speaker 4: be in a good mental state to be able to run.
26:05
Speaker 4: All of those things are hard to come by. And
26:09
Speaker 4: if you have them and are a part of the
26:11
Speaker 4: running community, that is a privilege. Um, and that again
26:15
Speaker 4: was the first thing he taught me. Um, so I
26:18
Speaker 4: don't really understand how platforming and administration that cuts mental
26:22
Speaker 4: health services cuts, you know, funding and literal shipments to
26:27
Speaker 4: food banks, um, is entirely hurting the climate because you
26:31
Speaker 4: can get into running in the climate. That's a whole
26:32
Speaker 4: nother thing. Um, but it's kind of cutting, you know,
26:36
Speaker 4: funds to climate initiatives and actively hurting the planet in
26:40
Speaker 4: that way. Um, Um, sending people away without due process, villainize,
26:45
Speaker 4: villainizing minorities. All of those things are preventing people from
26:49
Speaker 4: getting into the running community, which is what I thought
26:51
Speaker 4: Kate's platform was for, but it's also just damaging to
26:55
Speaker 4: society as a whole. We should not be normalizing these people.
26:58
Speaker 4: We are quite literally talking about good versus evil here.
27:01
Speaker 4: And I'm just really disappointed the whole thing happened. Um,
27:05
Speaker 4: I was there when that video with my dad was
27:07
Speaker 4: filmed and I was very impressed with Kate. And this
27:10
Speaker 4: is just extremely disappointing.
27:13
Speaker 1: We got to stop being a baby, David Goggins. Yeah,
27:17
Speaker 1: I mean, listen, this whole thing, it was a very
27:20
Speaker 1: cringe take. And just so we're all on the same
27:23
Speaker 1: page here, there's not just white privilege anymore. There's not
27:27
Speaker 1: just skinny privilege. There's not just pretty privilege. Now we
27:29
Speaker 1: have running privilege. And it's deeply wrong for Kate Max
27:34
Speaker 1: to be making a video at the White House saying,
27:38
Speaker 1: Because trump is somehow preventing people from running like that's
27:40
Speaker 1: the argument She can't make a video at the white
27:42
Speaker 1: house because trump is preventing people from running With his
27:45
Speaker 1: evil policies and it doesn't even make sense how like
27:48
Speaker 1: somehow the climate is worse And so therefore people can't
27:50
Speaker 1: run because trump is controlling the climate what? I don't
27:55
Speaker 1: know you you guys tell me have What do you
27:57
Speaker 1: guys think of this in the chat because I can't
27:59
Speaker 1: understand how somehow climate plays a role in running and
28:02
Speaker 1: how trump is controlling the climate also What did she
28:05
Speaker 1: mean by gear, like running gear? I do have the
28:09
Speaker 1: privilege of having running gear. What do you mean, shoes?
28:11
Speaker 1: It's such a privilege that people in America have shoes.
28:16
Speaker 1: By the way, sometimes I do beach runs. You don't
28:19
Speaker 1: even need shoes for that because we're in Florida. You
28:21
Speaker 1: do it barefoot. In that case, no shoe is required.
28:26
Speaker 1: But it's hard to overstate just how delusional Tim Walz's
28:29
Speaker 1: daughter sounds when she claims that running is a privilege.
28:32
Speaker 1: It's not just a bad take. it's a revealing snapshot
28:38
Speaker 1: of how deeply embedded the left's cancel culture instincts have become.
28:42
Speaker 1: She's going the distance. She is stretching as far as
28:45
Speaker 1: she can to try and cancel this young woman for
28:48
Speaker 1: daring to do a video with Carolyn Leavitt. Instead of
28:51
Speaker 1: celebrating a creative, physically active, apolitical format like Cake Max,
28:56
Speaker 1: which with her running interviews, Hope Walsh starts going on
29:00
Speaker 1: about how this is good versus evil and Trump is
29:03
Speaker 1: evil and he's controlling the weather and can't even make
29:06
Speaker 1: a video at the White House without all of these trolls,
29:10
Speaker 1: including Hope Walsh, coming at you with discussions about privilege.
29:17
Speaker 1: It's also this idea that running, something that every child
29:19
Speaker 1: instinctively does, is a symbol of privilege. I think that's
29:22
Speaker 1: a perfect example of how progressive ideology can just spiral
29:25
Speaker 1: into absurdity. This fixation on who gets to run, or worse,
29:29
Speaker 1: who should feel guilty about running. It's objectively crazy. And
29:32
Speaker 1: at this point, basic human function is being ideologically policed
29:37
Speaker 1: by the left. And what's next? Breathing privilege? Walking privilege?
29:43
Speaker 1: Seeing privilege? Anything is a privilege now, I guess. And
29:47
Speaker 1: by the way, the Trump administration's Make America Healthy Again movement, MAHA,
29:52
Speaker 1: is actually doing something constructive with health and fitness in
29:55
Speaker 1: this country. promoting wellness without bending the knee to big
29:58
Speaker 1: pharma or the processed food lobby. This is an admin
30:02
Speaker 1: that authentically cares about health. Because to this admin, health
30:06
Speaker 1: is not a vehicle for moral grandstanding. It's about increasing
30:09
Speaker 1: longevity and flourishing of the American people. It's authentic. It's real.
30:12
Speaker 1: Whatever that was from Hope Walsh, stupid, politicized, completely fake
30:16
Speaker 1: and shallow, and clearly just another cancel culture moment. So inauthentic. Honestly,
30:23
Speaker 1: it's things like running privilege, That has been such a
30:25
Speaker 1: turnoff for normal Americans. It's why, to the shock of CNN,
30:30
Speaker 1: Americans still prefer Trump to Kamala Harris. Take a listen.
30:35
Speaker 15: Who would be doing a better job as president? Guess
30:37
Speaker 15: who comes out on top, within the margin of error,
30:40
Speaker 15: but comes out on top? This looks a lot like
30:41
Speaker 15: the election result, right? Trump, 45%. Two points ahead of
30:45
Speaker 15: Harris at 43%. 12% say they'd be doing about the same.
30:49
Speaker 15: But this is the key nugget here. It's not just
30:51
Speaker 15: about regretting that vote. It's literally saying, who would be
30:54
Speaker 15: doing the better job right now?
30:56
Speaker 5: And Trump?
30:57
Speaker 15: Continues to score a higher percentage of the vote than
31:00
Speaker 15: Kamala Harris.
31:01
Speaker 9: This looks a heck of a lot like the election result.
31:03
Speaker 15: We have just seen this in poll after poll after poll.
31:06
Speaker 1: Okay, so Kamala Harris, Tim Walz, and the modern Democratic
31:11
Speaker 1: Party have embraced a form of radical progressivism that is
31:16
Speaker 1: so out of touch, it seems tailor-made for online clout
31:21
Speaker 1: rather than real-world governance. Their brand of politics increasingly panders
31:27
Speaker 1: to this narrow, highly ideological segment of the population, mostly
31:31
Speaker 1: elite hyper online gender studies majors. That's the only person
31:35
Speaker 1: that could watch that Hope Walsh video and think, yeah,
31:37
Speaker 1: that makes sense, that's normal. Kamala has spent time publicly
31:42
Speaker 1: affirming lived experiences of TikTok influencers, more than she has
31:48
Speaker 1: talking about border security. And she actually famously compared ICE
31:51
Speaker 1: agents to the KKK. And her answer to rising crime,
31:55
Speaker 1: she tried to bail fund tried to raise money for
31:59
Speaker 1: the bail of rioters during the 2020 summer of rage,
32:02
Speaker 1: one of whom went on to commit murder after his release.
32:05
Speaker 1: She even endorsed puberty blockers and surgeries for minors without
32:08
Speaker 1: parental consent. Tim Walz let Minneapolis burn for days during
32:13
Speaker 1: the George Floyd riots, going so far as to say
32:15
Speaker 1: that the chaos was just the cost of justice. He
32:18
Speaker 1: even described the arson and looting as an expression of
32:21
Speaker 1: rage instead of a breakdown of civil order. He signed
32:24
Speaker 1: off on education mandates requiring CRT-based training for teachers, while
32:30
Speaker 1: test scores and literacy rates in his state are tanking.
32:33
Speaker 1: He put tampons in the men's restrooms and made Minnesota
32:36
Speaker 1: a sanctuary state for minors seeking sex changes. These people
32:40
Speaker 1: are not normal. These are signals and have been signals
32:45
Speaker 1: for the average Americans that the modern Democratic Party has
32:48
Speaker 1: abandoned them. They recognize that this was all extremism disguised
32:53
Speaker 1: as tolerance. The only thing that's really shocking about that
32:56
Speaker 1: poll here is that CNN can't comprehend it. You'd think
33:03
Speaker 1: that after all this time, they would understand where the
33:06
Speaker 1: American people are at and how badly the policies of
33:12
Speaker 1: Tim Wallace and Kamala and the party in general have
33:16
Speaker 1: failed at meeting Americans where they're at, at really messaging
33:21
Speaker 1: to them and things that they care about. but CNN
33:24
Speaker 1: is still completely shocked because they have zero introspection. They
33:27
Speaker 1: have no idea how to move on from the ivory
33:31
Speaker 1: tower politics of a gender studies major. You know, Joel
33:35
Speaker 1: Berry from the Babylon Bee, he tweeted something out yesterday
33:38
Speaker 1: that I think is pretty interesting and increasingly true. He wrote,
33:43
Speaker 1: the most interesting conversations now are happening between the right
33:47
Speaker 1: and the right. The left isn't even in the building anymore.
33:50
Speaker 1: And like I said, I think that's increasingly true. I
33:53
Speaker 1: think the left has really removed itself from any normal,
33:57
Speaker 1: meaningful discussion in this country because they've gone so far
34:01
Speaker 1: into lunacy, running privilege, sex changes for minors, tampons in
34:08
Speaker 1: the men's bathroom, ICE is the KKK. I mean, all
34:13
Speaker 1: of these things, they make you take a step back
34:15
Speaker 1: and go, what's happened to these people? They have worms
34:17
Speaker 1: in their brains. And I want to tackle a debate
34:20
Speaker 1: that's currently being waged on the political right. It has
34:24
Speaker 1: to do with speech taboos. So neocon Douglas Murray, we
34:29
Speaker 1: covered this on the show a while ago, but he
34:30
Speaker 1: recently went on Joe Rogan to debate libertarian comedian Dave Smith.
34:35
Speaker 1: And by the way, if you want to argue with me,
34:37
Speaker 1: and some of you did last time, that Douglas Murray
34:39
Speaker 1: is a neocon, this man literally wrote a book titled,
34:42
Speaker 1: and I quote, neoconservatism, why we need it. So he's
34:46
Speaker 1: a neocon and a story. Now, in this discussion on
34:49
Speaker 1: Joe Rogan, Murray and Smith debated the Israeli-Palestine conflict. They
34:54
Speaker 1: talked about forever wars in the Middle East, potential war
34:56
Speaker 1: with Iran, other things too. A lot of ground was covered.
35:01
Speaker 1: But at one point, Murray started to argue that we
35:05
Speaker 1: need more experts. Like that's the main argument that he
35:08
Speaker 1: was falling back on. And we covered this on the
35:10
Speaker 1: show before, but here are just a few soundbites from
35:13
Speaker 1: that interview to refresh your memory. Just like what was
35:17
Speaker 1: the argument that Murray was making that received such a,
35:20
Speaker 1: I think, explosive reaction online? Take a listen.
35:25
Speaker 5: This is the problem, Jo. I mean, If somebody says.
35:29
Speaker 14: Wait a minute, you have to claim to be an
35:31
Speaker 14: expert on something to have an opinion on something?
35:33
Speaker 5: No, you don't have to be. You don't have to be.
35:35
Speaker 5: So what's the issue?
35:36
Speaker 13: I'm not a historian, but I'm pumping out history. I'm
35:39
Speaker 13: not an expert, but I'm talking all the time about
35:41
Speaker 13: this thing.
35:41
Speaker 10: But you're not even talking about specifically on what he
35:43
Speaker 10: just said.
35:44
Speaker 5: No, I'm saying, this is my point about this. You say,
35:48
Speaker 5: I'm not an expert.
35:49
Speaker 10: So what's the solution?
35:50
Speaker 8: To not talk about it?
35:51
Speaker 5: No, it's to have more experts around.
35:54
Speaker 1: Oh, do we have the other ones, Mikey? Oh yeah,
35:59
Speaker 1: just play them all consecutively if you could.
36:02
Speaker 5: This is the problem, Joe. I mean, if somebody says.
36:06
Speaker 14: Wait a minute, you have to claim to be an
36:07
Speaker 14: expert on something to have an opinion on something?
36:09
Speaker 5: No, you don't have to be. You don't have to be.
36:11
Speaker 5: So what's the issue?
36:12
Speaker 13: I'm not a historian, but I'm pumping out history. I'm
36:15
Speaker 13: not an expert, but I'm talking all the time about
36:17
Speaker 13: this thing.
36:17
Speaker 10: But you're not even talking about specifically on what he
36:19
Speaker 10: just said.
36:20
Speaker 5: No, I'm saying, this is my point about this. You say...
36:24
Speaker 5: I'm not an expert. So what's the solution?
36:26
Speaker 8: To not talk about it?
36:28
Speaker 5: No, it's to have more experts around.
36:31
Speaker 13: You say, I'm not a historian, but I'm going to
36:35
Speaker 13: spend my time talking about history. I'm not a journalist,
36:39
Speaker 13: but I'm going to spend my time talking about this thing.
36:41
Speaker 13: I'm not an expert on this, but I'm going to
36:43
Speaker 13: spend my time talking about this thing.
36:45
Speaker 5: It's a weird move, yeah?
36:46
Speaker 2: No.
36:47
Speaker 5: You don't think?
36:47
Speaker 10: No, I'm a free American. I can talk about what
36:49
Speaker 10: I like to. You can talk about what you want.
36:51
Speaker 5: I've noticed you can. But what's the point? The point is,
36:55
Speaker 5: what are you pushing? What are you watering?
36:58
Speaker 10: What am I pushing? Liberty, free markets, peace, prosperity, not
37:03
Speaker 10: getting in another stupid catastrophic war, which we're on the
37:06
Speaker 10: precipice of right now.
37:08
Speaker 5: When were you last there at all? I've never been.
37:12
Speaker 5: You've never been?
37:14
Speaker 16: Well, am I not allowed to talk about it now?
37:16
Speaker 16: Have you ever been to Nazi Germany? Are you allowed
37:19
Speaker 16: to have feelings about them? You can't time travel, but
37:22
Speaker 16: you can travel. Okay, but so what? So what's the point?
37:24
Speaker 5: Lots of people have.
37:26
Speaker 16: Been there and agree with me, and lots of people
37:28
Speaker 16: have been there and agree with you. Yeah, but if
37:29
Speaker 16: you're going to spend a year.
37:30
Speaker 13: And a half talking about a place, you should at
37:32
Speaker 13: least do the courtesy of visiting it.
37:35
Speaker 5: All right.
37:36
Speaker 16: I just think this is a non-argument.
37:37
Speaker 2: You don't think?
37:37
Speaker 5: But okay. No, I think it's a non-argument.
37:40
Speaker 8: But if you were an expert, would you have to
37:41
Speaker 8: go and touch the ground?
37:43
Speaker 13: No, I think it's a good idea to see stuff,
37:45
Speaker 13: particularly if you spend a career talking about something.
37:48
Speaker 12: Yes.
37:49
Speaker 1: Okay, so a few things. We need more experts. This
37:51
Speaker 1: is the argument being made. If you haven't been to
37:54
Speaker 1: a certain place, you really shouldn't be talking about it.
37:57
Speaker 1: And if you don't have the right credentials, you shouldn't
38:00
Speaker 1: be talking about something. And by the way, before I
38:03
Speaker 1: get into some more of this, here is Joe Rogan
38:06
Speaker 1: and comedian Tim Dillon making fun of Murray and the
38:09
Speaker 1: have you been there moment.
38:10
Speaker 17: Take a listen.
38:11
Speaker 5: I wouldn't make it. Wait a minute, before you say that.
38:13
Speaker 14: Have you been there?
38:15
Speaker 8: Right, that's a good point.
38:17
Speaker 14: Have you even, you haven't been? By the way, how
38:20
Speaker 14: is he in all these wars? Can I just go
38:21
Speaker 14: to wars? By the way, are you allowed to just
38:24
Speaker 14: go to wars?
38:27
Speaker 5: You should at least have courtesy of going there.
38:30
Speaker 14: Can I just go to wars or do I have
38:33
Speaker 14: to come back and say what people want me to
38:35
Speaker 14: say about the wars? Can I go to the wars
38:37
Speaker 14: and have my own opinions or do I have to
38:38
Speaker 14: have the opinions?
38:39
Speaker 5: Not if you want to go back. That's right.
38:41
Speaker 6: That's right.
38:41
Speaker 14: It's very interesting, this war tourism. How do I get
38:43
Speaker 14: on this war tourism? I'd like to go to the Ukraine.
38:47
Speaker 5: I want to go.
38:48
Speaker 6: I want to go.
38:49
Speaker 14: I want to go to all this war tourism.
38:50
Speaker 1: I love his point. If I go there and I
38:53
Speaker 1: actually observe things and I have the right to speak
38:55
Speaker 1: on it, am I allowed to actually say things that
38:57
Speaker 1: deviate from what the experts want me to say? That's
39:00
Speaker 1: a great point. It seems like just such an echo
39:02
Speaker 1: chamber when you have these experts come in and say,
39:04
Speaker 1: you can't have an opinion on said topic because you
39:07
Speaker 1: haven't been there. And there's something really interesting going on.
39:11
Speaker 1: We have these people purportedly on the political right. who
39:16
Speaker 1: seem to want to be gatekeepers of certain topics. Some
39:22
Speaker 1: things are still too taboo to discuss, apparently. Here was
39:26
Speaker 1: Douglas Murray in the aftermath of this Joe Rogan episode.
39:30
Speaker 1: sitting down this week with Barry Weiss. I want you
39:32
Speaker 1: to take a listen closely to the conclusions that they
39:36
Speaker 1: make for what we need in America and what specifically
39:39
Speaker 1: the political right needs. Take a listen.
39:41
Speaker 17: I think one of the dynamics at play here, and
39:44
Speaker 17: this goes beyond the conversation that you had with Smith
39:47
Speaker 17: on Rogan, I think it's just a bigger dynamic playing
39:50
Speaker 17: out right now is over the past decade, probably longer,
39:54
Speaker 17: the left was in the business of making everything taboo.
39:58
Speaker 17: Even biological reality became taboo.
40:00
Speaker 5: Exactly. This is a backlash.
40:02
Speaker 17: And the reaction the cultural right is having, the right
40:05
Speaker 17: like broadly defined here, and I think it's breaking apart
40:08
Speaker 17: in all kinds of interesting ways, is no, no. You
40:11
Speaker 17: guys said everything taboo. We're making nothing taboo. And so
40:14
Speaker 17: the second someone comes around, as you tried to do
40:17
Speaker 17: in that conversation and say, Actually, you know what? The
40:20
Speaker 17: stigmatization of Holocaust denial, that's a good stigma. That's something
40:24
Speaker 17: we should keep around. The standard of going to a
40:27
Speaker 17: place that you write about, that's something we should keep around.
40:30
Speaker 17: What the listener, I think, can hear in that situation
40:34
Speaker 17: is this is a person calling for cancel culture. This
40:38
Speaker 17: is a person calling for gatekeeping. And I find that
40:41
Speaker 17: dynamic extremely frustrating.
40:42
Speaker 5: It's very frustrating.
40:43
Speaker 17: How do you get out of that trap?
40:47
Speaker 5: One, I just....
40:49
Speaker 13: You've got to exercise hygiene on your own side. And
40:55
Speaker 13: the fact that people have been kept out of the
40:57
Speaker 13: conversation who should have been in the conversation does not
40:59
Speaker 13: mean that absolutely everybody should be given the platform to
41:05
Speaker 13: spread untrue things. And it's very, it's going to be, yeah,
41:10
Speaker 13: I mean, like everything difficult in this life, it's going
41:16
Speaker 13: to take some dexterity. because all these fine corners that
41:19
Speaker 13: end up mattering, they do need careful thinking and careful treading.
41:24
Speaker 1: So let me just say right off the bat here
41:26
Speaker 1: that Dave Smith did not deny the Holocaust in that
41:30
Speaker 1: Joe Rogan interview. That never happened. Listen to the whole thing.
41:34
Speaker 1: I think it's interesting that Holocaust denialism is the example
41:39
Speaker 1: given that that wasn't something that was a part of
41:42
Speaker 1: the conversation on Joe Rogan. It's not something that Dave
41:45
Speaker 1: Smith said. And It's not what Douglas Murray was saying
41:52
Speaker 1: Dave Smith didn't have a right to speak about because
41:54
Speaker 1: he's an expert. It literally was not a point of contention.
41:58
Speaker 1: What Murray said Smith shouldn't be discussing was Israel and Palestine,
42:02
Speaker 1: the war in Iraq and Afghanistan. And the deal is
42:04
Speaker 1: that Douglas Murray and Barry Weiss often present themselves as
42:07
Speaker 1: defenders of reason and opponents of progressive overreach. But their
42:12
Speaker 1: insistence on maintaining strict taboos, particularly around subjects like foreign
42:16
Speaker 1: policy criticisms, reveals a fundamental tension in their worldview. While
42:21
Speaker 1: these taboos may come from understandable moral instincts, their stances
42:26
Speaker 1: ultimately reinforce the same gatekeeping dynamics that they claim to
42:31
Speaker 1: oppose by arguing that some ideas are simply beyond the
42:37
Speaker 1: bounds of public discourse. And by the way, we're not
42:39
Speaker 1: just talking about Holocaust denialism here. The conversation that Douglas
42:42
Speaker 1: Murray was reacting to was about Israel, Palestine, war in
42:45
Speaker 1: Iraq and Afghanistan. They replicate the logic of the very
42:49
Speaker 1: cancel culture that they criticize. True commitment to free speech
42:53
Speaker 1: means allowing bad, uncomfortable, even offensive ideas in the open,
42:58
Speaker 1: trusting that reasoned debate will expose and dismantle them. Douglas
43:03
Speaker 1: Murray made a veiled call for censorship in that clip.
43:06
Speaker 1: He said that these people that he disagrees with shouldn't
43:09
Speaker 1: be given platforms. suggesting that ordinary people shouldn't be debating U.S.
43:16
Speaker 1: policy toward Israel or reflect on wars in Iraq and
43:19
Speaker 1: Afghanistan unless you're vetted by mainstream authority, is implicitly advocating
43:24
Speaker 1: for a class of intellectual high priests. And this is
43:27
Speaker 1: why Weiss and Murray, despite being positions as supposed renegades
43:31
Speaker 1: in elite liberal institutions, are not new right. The modern
43:36
Speaker 1: populist right is really at its core defined by its
43:41
Speaker 1: willingness to challenge sacred cows, be they about America's role
43:45
Speaker 1: in Afghanistan, the power of the military-industrial complex, or our
43:49
Speaker 1: history and how it's written and remembered. What was the
43:53
Speaker 1: post-World War II order? What did it get us today?
43:57
Speaker 1: Constant comparisons between Hitler and any foreign dictator that the
44:01
Speaker 1: CIA wants to take out. It's a devastating thing for
44:05
Speaker 1: our country. It's gotten us involved in a lot of
44:08
Speaker 1: terrible forever wars. It's been destructive in places like Libya
44:12
Speaker 1: and Syria. I think it belittles the actual history of
44:17
Speaker 1: Nazi Germany and Hitler to compare every foreign dictator to him.
44:22
Speaker 1: There's a genuine hunger for openness and sometimes uncomfortable inquiry,
44:27
Speaker 1: not for its own sake, but because so many forbidden
44:30
Speaker 1: questions have turned out to be essential ones. I've never
44:33
Speaker 1: been to Iraq or Afghanistan. I wasn't present in New
44:38
Speaker 1: York on 9-11-2001. I don't have a PhD in Middle
44:41
Speaker 1: East studies, but that doesn't mean that I shouldn't be
44:43
Speaker 1: allowed to tell you that the wars in Iraq and
44:45
Speaker 1: Afghanistan drained American lives and resources while achieving zero lasting
44:49
Speaker 1: stability in those regions. I can also tell you that
44:52
Speaker 1: the post-9-11 surveillance state has eroded the most basic civil
44:56
Speaker 1: liberties under the guise of security. Would that upset Barry
44:59
Speaker 1: Weiss and Douglas Murray? Because they don't have the credentials
45:02
Speaker 1: to say those things? It would seem so. The new
45:06
Speaker 1: right understands that the trust in elite narratives has collapsed,
45:11
Speaker 1: and for good reason. But people like Barry and Douglas
45:15
Speaker 1: seem stuck in an older paradigm, one where debate is
45:18
Speaker 1: only valid if conducted with a narrow intellectual guardrails. But
45:22
Speaker 1: this is in 2005, and the right no longer takes
45:25
Speaker 1: cues from the New York Times op-ed pages. A truly
45:29
Speaker 1: vital intellectual movement doesn't need moral bouncers. It needs courage, clarity,
45:34
Speaker 1: and openness to risk. And I think we should always
45:38
Speaker 1: be committed to the truth. But we can't be committed
45:40
Speaker 1: to the truth if we shut down well-meaning people. And
45:43
Speaker 1: that's largely what's happening. And I get it. They fear
45:46
Speaker 1: that if things like the righteousness of US foreign policy
45:49
Speaker 1: or foreign aid are openly challenged, it could unravel the
45:52
Speaker 1: legitimacy of every institution that they believe protects civilization from chaos.
45:56
Speaker 1: I think they're coming from a good place. I think
45:59
Speaker 1: a lot of the discomfort with the dissent of these
46:01
Speaker 1: topics stems from a belief that too much open skepticism
46:04
Speaker 1: could empower bad actors or destabilize the moral framework that
46:08
Speaker 1: underpins the West. But what's become of the West since
46:11
Speaker 1: World War II? A dramatic decline in religious faith, the
46:16
Speaker 1: rise of bureaucratic technocracy, endless foreign wars, mass immigration without assimilation,
46:21
Speaker 1: collapsing birth rates, cultural self-loathing, an elite class increasingly detached
46:26
Speaker 1: from national identity or accountability. What I'm saying is that
46:29
Speaker 1: while Douglas Murray and Barry Weiss may act out of
46:31
Speaker 1: genuine desire to protect what they see as the last
46:35
Speaker 1: scaffolding holding up Western civ, their impulse to restrict debate
46:40
Speaker 1: is a mistake. People are right to question everything, from
46:44
Speaker 1: forever wars to America's blank check support of foreign nations,
46:47
Speaker 1: because these policies were born in an era that assumed
46:51
Speaker 1: moral consensus where none now exists. If we want to
46:54
Speaker 1: reclaim our country, we need open and fearless dialogue about
46:58
Speaker 1: the foundations, historical, spiritual, and geopolitical, on which our society rests.
47:03
Speaker 1: Suppressing those conversations in the name of stability only delays
47:07
Speaker 1: the reckoning that we urgently need. I think whether we're
47:10
Speaker 1: talking about boycotting Target in 2023, rewarding them in 2025,
47:15
Speaker 1: confronting the weaponization of Meta's AI against dissenters like Robbie Starbuck,
47:20
Speaker 1: what unites all these moments is the demand for accountability
47:24
Speaker 1: in public life. The same principle applies to challenging elite
47:28
Speaker 1: narratives from figures like Douglas Murray and Barry Weiss. We
47:31
Speaker 1: are living in an age When ordinary people are refusing
47:34
Speaker 1: to be silenced or sidelined, the populist right isn't just reacting,
47:38
Speaker 1: it's building. It's asserting cultural, economic, and political influence by
47:42
Speaker 1: refusing to accept the rules of the unaccountable class. Whether
47:46
Speaker 1: they operate through corporate boardrooms, censorship algorithms, or intellectual gatekeeping,
47:51
Speaker 1: shopping at Target, defending speech, questioning the sacred cows of
47:55
Speaker 1: post-war consensus, it's all part of the same struggle to
47:58
Speaker 1: take back agency, to reward truth, to hold power to account,
48:03
Speaker 1: to recover a civilization, to rediscover again who we are.
48:06
Speaker 1: And I think talking is the first step to that.
48:09
Speaker 1: And that's all I have for you guys today. Thank
48:11
Speaker 1: you so much for tuning in. I'm excited to see
48:14
Speaker 1: you all next week. If you want to follow me
48:15
Speaker 1: on Instagram or X, my user is Evita Duffy underscore one.
48:19
Speaker 1: I'm here live on Rumble, 9 a.m. Eastern time, five
48:21
Speaker 1: days a week. That's rumble.com slash Evita. Again, thanks for
48:25
Speaker 1: tuning in. I'll see you next week.
48:27
Speaker 5: The Dan Bongino Show.
48:28
Speaker 6: I think a lot of people are underestimating the Trump
48:31
Speaker 6: effect in this midterm. You've heard it yourself. Act like
48:34
Speaker 6: I'm on the ballot. Why is he saying that? You
48:37
Speaker 6: think he doesn't know what he's doing? That is the
48:40
Speaker 6: X factor. Folks, elections are a math issue.
48:44
Speaker 8: That is it.
48:44
Speaker 6: This is not a football game.
48:47
Speaker 5: If you vote, we will win. It is not complicated.
48:51
Speaker 5: The Dan Bongino Show. Follow and listen on your favorite platforms.