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ZONE 7 : Danger, Duty, and the Badge: Detective Tom Smith’s Story · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:08
Speaker 1: Y'all, this is a special Zone seven. We are going
0:11
Speaker 1: to talk to somebody that the heroes look up to.
0:17
Speaker 1: You don't have to look any further than the National
0:20
Speaker 1: Law Enforcement Hall of Fame that honors officers that have
0:24
Speaker 1: gone above and beyond the call of duty. And tonight
0:28
Speaker 1: we have Tom Smith. He is a part of my
0:31
Speaker 1: Zone seven. He is a part of my table fifteen,
0:34
Speaker 1: and we're going to talk about that. But I welcome
0:37
Speaker 1: him humbly. I know his background, I know his track record,
0:44
Speaker 1: I know his career.
0:46
Speaker 2: Sir, how are you?
0:47
Speaker 3: I am great, and you just made my day even
0:51
Speaker 3: better being here. It's always a privilege and an honor
0:55
Speaker 3: no matter where we are, as long as we're together,
0:59
Speaker 3: and doing a show like this makes it even more special.
1:02
Speaker 2: You know, let's just start from the beginning.
1:05
Speaker 1: You selected, of all the departments in the world, of
1:08
Speaker 1: all the levels, state, local, and federal, the New York
1:13
Speaker 1: City Police Department.
1:15
Speaker 2: Why in YPD.
1:17
Speaker 3: My dad was an NYPD detective for twenty six years
1:20
Speaker 3: from nineteen fifty to nineteen seventy six, So that's all
1:25
Speaker 3: I knew. I knew one department in this world, and
1:29
Speaker 3: it was the NYPD. I grew up idolizing my dad
1:33
Speaker 3: and wanting to be like him, just like every little
1:35
Speaker 3: boy you know in the world growing up and looking
1:39
Speaker 3: at this six foot three, two twenty you know, pound
1:44
Speaker 3: irishman who controlled his world in law enforcement and was
1:52
Speaker 3: respected like crazy. And that's what I wanted. That's what
1:56
Speaker 3: I wanted to be, just like him, to steal his
2:01
Speaker 3: shield when he came home from work and put it
2:04
Speaker 3: on my belt, that run around and chase my sisters.
2:08
Speaker 3: So that was you know, growing up, I was I
2:11
Speaker 3: was doing one or two things, Charlotte, I was playing baseball,
2:14
Speaker 3: or it was gonna be a cop, and there was
2:17
Speaker 3: no thought of anywhere else. It was going to be
2:21
Speaker 3: the NYPD, and that was it. So when you have
2:24
Speaker 3: that drive of wanting to be like your dad and
2:28
Speaker 3: wanting to serve in the best police department in the world,
2:32
Speaker 3: you do it one thousand and one hundred miles an hour.
2:35
Speaker 1: And that's what I did better than anybody, I'm gonna
2:39
Speaker 1: tell you. But you know, I think about your dad.
2:41
Speaker 2: Too, from the fifties to the sixties.
2:45
Speaker 1: You want to talk about decades being a stark difference,
2:51
Speaker 1: and then rolling into the seventies, I mean, honey, he's
2:54
Speaker 1: got some stories.
2:56
Speaker 3: Oh it was. It was when I was with him
2:59
Speaker 3: and go into a Yankee game. That was a history
3:03
Speaker 3: lesson anytime we went into the city, whether we went
3:06
Speaker 3: to my sister's house, you know, apartment who lived on
3:09
Speaker 3: the East Side, or we would go to a Yankee game.
3:11
Speaker 3: Because part of the day wasn't just going to Yankee Stadium.
3:15
Speaker 3: We would stop at the four four and go up
3:18
Speaker 3: to the squad. We'd go to the four to one
3:21
Speaker 3: for Apache and go to the squad and see all
3:24
Speaker 3: his friends and his partners that he worked with, you know. Uh,
3:29
Speaker 3: And that was part of it. So that's what I
3:31
Speaker 3: mean by it was. It was surrounding me, and it wasn't.
3:37
Speaker 2: A lift.
3:38
Speaker 3: It was yeah, we're going here, We're going here, and
3:41
Speaker 3: standing in a room with a bunch of just the
3:45
Speaker 3: best there was at that time, and then driving around
3:49
Speaker 3: the streets and having him point out, oh, yeah, that
3:52
Speaker 3: happened here, that double homicide happened over here, and we
3:56
Speaker 3: chase that guy down that alleyway. It was just all
4:00
Speaker 3: the time and talk about getting ready for a career
4:05
Speaker 3: when you were young. That's what that's what I got,
4:09
Speaker 3: and I loved every second of it. Me and my dad.
4:12
Speaker 3: I mean, think about this. Part of and you know
4:15
Speaker 3: this because we're from the same generation. Part of your
4:18
Speaker 3: night or our night was sitting down together and watching
4:23
Speaker 3: the six o'clock news. That was like a TV show.
4:26
Speaker 3: It wasn't the news. It was like, Okay, at six o'clock,
4:28
Speaker 3: let's see what's going on in the world. And we
4:32
Speaker 3: would sit there and if there was a story about
4:34
Speaker 3: a homicide that was on the news, I would talk
4:37
Speaker 3: to him about it, like, Hey, how would you do this?
4:40
Speaker 3: How would you do that? Where would you start? Who
4:42
Speaker 3: would you talk to? And that was the conversation during
4:45
Speaker 3: the news we would have if there was a story
4:48
Speaker 3: that was a crime story. And that's what I was
4:51
Speaker 3: so interested in, you know, growing up, and it just
4:55
Speaker 3: led to what I became.
4:57
Speaker 1: And you know, the world is a small place sometimes.
5:00
Speaker 1: And I interviewed somebody on Zone seven, detective Ralph, remember who? Yes,
5:08
Speaker 1: And it was so incredible because you texted me and said, Hey,
5:12
Speaker 1: do you have a phone number for him?
5:14
Speaker 2: I think he knew my dad.
5:16
Speaker 1: Will you tell us just a little bit about that
5:19
Speaker 1: when you reconnected with him?
5:21
Speaker 3: Yeah. I had known about Ralph last year and then
5:26
Speaker 3: just schedules and life kind of gets in a way
5:29
Speaker 3: of getting in touch with him, and I lost touch
5:32
Speaker 3: with him, and I actually don't know what happened to
5:34
Speaker 3: his contact that I had. And then I saw that
5:36
Speaker 3: you had him on and reached right out to him.
5:39
Speaker 3: He remembered me, and I actually had the opportunity to
5:42
Speaker 3: go to his house and see all the medals and
5:46
Speaker 3: everything he had. And he's the most decorated NYPD detective
5:51
Speaker 3: in its history. I mean, a man is an absolute
5:54
Speaker 3: walking legend. But even better was talking to him about
6:00
Speaker 3: stories I knew and I had heard from my dad
6:05
Speaker 3: and they actually worked in the four to one and
6:07
Speaker 3: FOURID apache at the same time, he vaguely remembered my
6:11
Speaker 3: dad showed him a couple of pictures of him and
6:14
Speaker 3: he did. So, you know, like you said, big world,
6:19
Speaker 3: but small world, especially in our world, which shrinks tremendously
6:24
Speaker 3: when we start talking and throwing names around. It doesn't
6:29
Speaker 3: matter where you are on this coast or the West coast.
6:32
Speaker 3: If you talk enough to a cop, you're going to
6:34
Speaker 3: find someone in common that you have.
6:36
Speaker 1: Yes, Yes, And I just thought that reunion was amazing,
6:40
Speaker 1: and the pictures of the two of y'all in his
6:42
Speaker 1: house with all of those medals and.
6:44
Speaker 2: Plaques and commendations. It was just it got to me
6:49
Speaker 2: because I know your dad would have loved that.
6:52
Speaker 3: Oh God, it would have been He would have went
6:54
Speaker 3: with me. Are you kidding me? If I had said
6:58
Speaker 3: to him, if he was still alive, and I said, hey,
7:00
Speaker 3: I'm going to see Ralph, you know, he'd be like,
7:02
Speaker 3: all right, let's go love it. He would have let
7:06
Speaker 3: me go by myself.
7:08
Speaker 2: Tell me your toughest night there was one.
7:12
Speaker 3: And it's funny you bring that up, because I'll go
7:16
Speaker 3: down and speak in in the NYPD Academy quite often,
7:20
Speaker 3: either at the CIC course, which is the Coronel investigation
7:23
Speaker 3: course with new detectives, and I'll go and talk to them,
7:26
Speaker 3: or once in a while I'll get to speak to
7:28
Speaker 3: the recruits and in even colleges that I go and
7:32
Speaker 3: speak at, and I tell him about this one night,
7:35
Speaker 3: and God's honest true that this was the night. I'm
7:39
Speaker 3: going to try to remember it. My partner and I
7:42
Speaker 3: we were in uniform, and we start off the night
7:47
Speaker 3: assisting narcotics who was chasing this guy down the street.
7:50
Speaker 3: So we get in a foot pursuit into a park,
7:52
Speaker 3: roll around in the park, lock him up, rip my shirt.
7:55
Speaker 3: Have to go back to the priest and get a
7:57
Speaker 3: new shirt. Later on that night, four people get shot
8:02
Speaker 3: on the corner of one four nine in Broadway. Have
8:05
Speaker 3: to assist them and go to that scene, and anti
8:09
Speaker 3: crime ended locking the guy up who did the shooting.
8:12
Speaker 3: So we're assisting running around with that with four people shot.
8:16
Speaker 3: A little time later, a sixteen year old girl wanted
8:20
Speaker 3: to jump off a twenty story building and me and
8:24
Speaker 3: my partner got up to the roof in time, grabbed her,
8:27
Speaker 3: flipped their back over the fence, and got her out
8:31
Speaker 3: of that situation. A couple of hours later, we get
8:35
Speaker 3: a call of an eight day old baby that's not breathing.
8:39
Speaker 3: We run up to the apartment, grab the baby that
8:44
Speaker 3: is totally unresponsive and not breathing, run down the stairs,
8:48
Speaker 3: jump in the car I'm driving. My partner has the
8:50
Speaker 3: baby on his lap. We're doing one hundred miles an
8:54
Speaker 3: hour up riverside drive to Columbia Presbyterian Hospital, and the
8:57
Speaker 3: other cops in my command and the Northern command and
9:01
Speaker 3: the three four shutting the streets down as we're going.
9:05
Speaker 3: We're doing CPR in the front seat of the car
9:08
Speaker 3: on an eight day old baby and get to the
9:12
Speaker 3: emergency room and kind of slide sideways into the emergency
9:16
Speaker 3: port and as soon as we did that, the baby
9:18
Speaker 3: started crying. And then about an hour or two later,
9:23
Speaker 3: we get a call that there's a cop shot in
9:25
Speaker 3: the four to four preestinct, which is in the Bronx,
9:28
Speaker 3: and they're coming over to Columbia Press because just in
9:31
Speaker 3: the area of the Bronx they were. It was the
9:33
Speaker 3: closest hospital in Manhattan, and they're flying over there and
9:37
Speaker 3: we're flying up to the hospital to start shut some
9:40
Speaker 3: streets down or whatever, and they pull into the emergency room.
9:44
Speaker 3: We were just at with a great event that happened
9:47
Speaker 3: a couple hours earlier, saving a baby, and now we
9:50
Speaker 3: have a cop that shot pulling into the same area
9:54
Speaker 3: and get in the back seat and get him out
9:57
Speaker 3: of the car and up on a stretcher and into
9:59
Speaker 3: the emergency room and unfortunately ended up dying from multiple
10:05
Speaker 3: gunshot wounds. That was one night, that was one four
10:12
Speaker 3: to twelve tour that I won't forget, and it's thirty
10:19
Speaker 3: probably thirty two years ago, and I just rattled it
10:22
Speaker 3: off the way I did because that's the kind of
10:24
Speaker 3: night that was.
10:25
Speaker 1: It's burned in that memory. How about your most memorable arrest?
10:32
Speaker 3: Most memorable arrest was probably the shooting we were in.
10:38
Speaker 3: I was involved in a shooting in nineteen ninety three,
10:42
Speaker 3: a month after I got married. So Ange loved that.
10:49
Speaker 1: With her, and she is so lovely and she is
10:52
Speaker 1: so supportive and she is just I mean, I don't
10:55
Speaker 1: have enough wonderful things to say about her.
10:59
Speaker 3: But the time and of that a month literally it
11:04
Speaker 3: ended up by the time we got back from our honeymoon.
11:06
Speaker 3: It was probably, yeah, about two or three weeks later,
11:11
Speaker 3: we get in a shooting with three individuals who robbed
11:13
Speaker 3: the supermarket. One of the cops I was with got
11:18
Speaker 3: shot during the exchange of gunfire. He got shot in
11:21
Speaker 3: the leg. He was okay, he survived, but ended up
11:24
Speaker 3: getting off the job. But we have this this shooting
11:27
Speaker 3: with three individuals. Ralph was at my wedding. The couple
11:32
Speaker 3: got shot. My partner who I was with that day,
11:35
Speaker 3: was at my wedding. So we were all friends, not
11:37
Speaker 3: just you know, partners, working, and we ended up getting
11:44
Speaker 3: all three of them. We shot two of them. We
11:47
Speaker 3: end up arresting all three and all three did about
11:51
Speaker 3: one hundred years in jail. They're still in jail, which
11:55
Speaker 3: is the best part. But that was, you know, it
11:59
Speaker 3: was personal because of obviously them trying to kill us
12:02
Speaker 3: in them shooting Ralph. So that was probably the one
12:06
Speaker 3: that certainly stands out.
12:08
Speaker 1: Now, you've already mentioned being in shootouts, in different situations
12:13
Speaker 1: that were clearly dangerous, being on bridges. What was the
12:18
Speaker 1: most dangerous situation in your thirty five years?
12:23
Speaker 3: Probably when I went to Afghanistan for three months as
12:27
Speaker 3: part of the Joint Tyrorism Task Force. We were sent
12:31
Speaker 3: over there on a kidnapping case, and there were numerous
12:38
Speaker 3: things that we ran into over there. Unfortunately, can't get
12:41
Speaker 3: into the specifics of them, but think about just being
12:48
Speaker 3: an NYPD cop and dealing with New York City or
12:52
Speaker 3: the Bronx or Brooklyn wherever you might be, and now
12:54
Speaker 3: being in the middle of a war zone and playing
12:58
Speaker 3: by their rules, which there are aren't any, you know,
13:02
Speaker 3: so having to deal with that and got out of,
13:05
Speaker 3: you know, a couple of tough situations that we were in,
13:09
Speaker 3: and the reason for getting out of them was not
13:11
Speaker 3: being you know, tough for anything. It was pure experience
13:16
Speaker 3: in not panicking and not overreacting to one or two
13:21
Speaker 3: things and having a great partner at the time and
13:25
Speaker 3: keeping our heads on and just you know, methodically kind
13:29
Speaker 3: of working with each other to get out of a
13:32
Speaker 3: couple of tough situations. But that was probably you know,
13:37
Speaker 3: even afterwards, Cheryl, we you know, my partner after getting
13:40
Speaker 3: out of one situation, looks at me and yells, hey,
13:43
Speaker 3: I guess we're not in the Bronx anymore.
13:47
Speaker 1: And hey, y'all, it wasn't like y'all were working in
13:50
Speaker 1: you know, Disneyland. No, I mean y'all had a pretty
13:55
Speaker 1: rough environment. Y'all were working in every day.
13:58
Speaker 3: Yeah, every day, every single And when you got back
14:01
Speaker 3: to Embassy compound, you know, you took a deep breath
14:05
Speaker 3: that you got back, you know, and you were thankful
14:08
Speaker 3: for it because it was you know, if you were
14:11
Speaker 3: the passenger in the car driving around, that was your job.
14:15
Speaker 3: You had to watch everyone walking, every car driving, every
14:18
Speaker 3: double parked car, every you know, everything going on around
14:22
Speaker 3: you because the driver was just driving. So it was
14:26
Speaker 3: very stressful being out on the street when you had
14:28
Speaker 3: to go and do wherever, or you had to drive
14:31
Speaker 3: up to Bogram or wherever we had to go. So
14:35
Speaker 3: when the day was done, and you were very thankful
14:37
Speaker 3: you were back home.
14:41
Speaker 1: When you sign up for the NYPD at eighteen, nineteen,
14:46
Speaker 1: twenty twenty one, Afghanistan is not crossing your mind. And
14:50
Speaker 1: I bet you there's a lot of people listening right
14:53
Speaker 1: now that don't even realize that a police officer is
14:56
Speaker 1: going to be sent into a war zone on a kidnapping.
14:59
Speaker 3: Case, right and and that's kind of that was the
15:02
Speaker 3: family you know. Here, here's the tough part, Sheryl. During
15:07
Speaker 3: the time, you know, we're we're bound by you know,
15:10
Speaker 3: classification and top secret clearances and all that when we're working.
15:15
Speaker 3: So think about this. To even add more to that,
15:18
Speaker 3: my family knew I was going to Afghanistan, but had
15:22
Speaker 3: no idea why because I couldn't tell them why. So
15:27
Speaker 3: I mean think about that, you know, thinking of their
15:30
Speaker 3: stress level of you know, dad and your husband's going
15:34
Speaker 3: to a war zone and you're an NYPD detective first
15:36
Speaker 3: of all, why wow, so yep, and then not being
15:40
Speaker 3: able to explain it, and then staying there for three months,
15:44
Speaker 3: not a week, not a few days, three months of
15:49
Speaker 3: not knowing why I was there. So you know, there's
15:52
Speaker 3: things that happened in a career, and I tell you know,
15:56
Speaker 3: I just mentioned being at the CIC course. When I
15:59
Speaker 3: go there and talk to you young detectives, I tell them,
16:02
Speaker 3: and it happened to me. You have to be prepared
16:06
Speaker 3: for your entire world and career changing in one minute.
16:11
Speaker 3: And that happened to me. You know, I would have
16:13
Speaker 3: been absolutely the happiest detective in New York City if
16:18
Speaker 3: I ended up on a homicide squad in the Bronx.
16:20
Speaker 3: That was my goal. That's where I wanted to be.
16:23
Speaker 3: That was it. That was the top of the line
16:26
Speaker 3: that I thought in the NYPDA, And then nine to
16:30
Speaker 3: eleven happens, and one hundred and two minutes later, I'm
16:34
Speaker 3: assigned to the Terrorism Taskforce and around the world. So
16:37
Speaker 3: that's what I tell them. You know, it's great to
16:39
Speaker 3: have a plan, but you have to be ready to
16:42
Speaker 3: adapt to something else, because the world is what it
16:45
Speaker 3: is today.
16:46
Speaker 1: And you know, you go home and you're literally packing
16:51
Speaker 1: and you tell Angie, Hey, you know, I don't know
16:54
Speaker 1: how long I'm going to be gone. I can't tell
16:55
Speaker 1: you what I'm doing. I can't take exactly I can
16:57
Speaker 1: tell you Afghanistan, but I can't take exactly anything else.
17:01
Speaker 1: You know, Feya and she and she just has to
17:05
Speaker 1: be smiling and supportive. I'm gonna tell you right now,
17:09
Speaker 1: if I did not have the job that I have
17:11
Speaker 1: and did not have the understanding that I do, I
17:14
Speaker 1: wish Walt McCollum would walk in here and tell me, Hey,
17:17
Speaker 1: I'm packing. I got to go, and I can't tell
17:19
Speaker 1: you where, I can't tell you with who, and I
17:20
Speaker 1: can't tell you for how long. You ain't gonna make
17:22
Speaker 1: it to the door, sugar. I'm telling you so.
17:26
Speaker 2: It takes a to me. She deserves part of your award.
17:32
Speaker 3: Oh God. And I said it that night.
17:33
Speaker 1: You did, You did it, and you said it beautifully
17:36
Speaker 1: and it was true.
17:37
Speaker 3: Though it was true because you know, spouses don't get
17:42
Speaker 3: enough credit militarily and in law enforcement or first responders
17:49
Speaker 3: as much as they should, because we know what we're doing,
17:53
Speaker 3: we know where we're at, we know the situations where
17:57
Speaker 3: we're in, and we're trained to handle them. They're sick
18:00
Speaker 3: X amount of miles away not knowing where we are,
18:05
Speaker 3: and to do that, I mean, think of you know,
18:08
Speaker 3: my wife, think about that for thirty years, not a
18:13
Speaker 3: couple of weeks, thirty years of that thought in your
18:17
Speaker 3: head of God. I really hope you come home tonight,
18:22
Speaker 3: you know, and living with that, and then not just
18:27
Speaker 3: taking care of yourself, but then taking care of three
18:29
Speaker 3: kids on top of that.
18:31
Speaker 1: Well, I will say this publicly again for the rookies
18:36
Speaker 1: that are listening, for the young people going into this career,
18:39
Speaker 1: pick your partner.
18:42
Speaker 2: Take some time.
18:44
Speaker 1: I'm just telling you, it will make all the difference
18:47
Speaker 1: in your life. I mean, Tom, you had an impossible
18:51
Speaker 1: job to go to a war zone when you had
18:54
Speaker 1: not been in the military. Correct and Angie could have
18:58
Speaker 1: been crying and carrying and throwing stuff and having a fit,
19:02
Speaker 1: and the kids could be all out of control, and
19:05
Speaker 1: that would have made your job impossible. But that's not
19:08
Speaker 1: what you had at home. And I just want people
19:11
Speaker 1: to hear that, because if you've got somebody that's jealous,
19:15
Speaker 1: if you've got somebody that doesn't have your back, if
19:17
Speaker 1: you're with somebody that doesn't really want the best for you, you.
19:22
Speaker 2: Might want to think about that relationship.
19:24
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's you know, I'm listening. I say it
19:27
Speaker 3: all the time, and me and you have had this discussion,
19:30
Speaker 3: not only you know, the night of the induction, but
19:34
Speaker 3: you know after that that I'm lucky. You know, I'm
19:39
Speaker 3: one of the fortunate ones, because so many marriages don't work,
19:44
Speaker 3: and so many things go wrong in relationships with police officers,
19:49
Speaker 3: and I'm one of the lucky ones. To be with
19:52
Speaker 3: the same woman for thirty five years is not the norm.
19:57
Speaker 3: And and that's sad to say, you know, that's and
20:00
Speaker 3: I've said it so many times. I hate the reaction
20:03
Speaker 3: I get when I'm out somewhere speaking and I say,
20:08
Speaker 3: you know, I've been with the same woman for thirty
20:10
Speaker 3: five years, and people look at me, Oh my god, really,
20:14
Speaker 3: and that shouldn't be And that's sad that that's the reaction,
20:17
Speaker 3: but it's the reality of it.
20:19
Speaker 1: Especially in our world. Most of the people we know
20:22
Speaker 1: are on their second or third marriage. Yes, absolutely, So again,
20:27
Speaker 1: take your time picking, take your time speaking of good partners.
20:32
Speaker 1: Tell us about being paired up with somebody and you're
20:35
Speaker 1: working twelve hours if not more in a car.
20:39
Speaker 3: It is one of the most important decisions you can
20:42
Speaker 3: make in the nypday. And you know, this goes back,
20:46
Speaker 3: and it's a funny story, but this goes back to
20:50
Speaker 3: watching my dad and watching him with his partners. I mean,
20:55
Speaker 3: I still to this day speak to quite often. And
21:00
Speaker 3: Joe actually just just passed away a couple of years ago,
21:03
Speaker 3: one of my dad's partners and his family that's from
21:07
Speaker 3: fifty some odds sixty years ago that they worked together,
21:11
Speaker 3: and I still am in touch with his entire family.
21:14
Speaker 3: And that's how that's what I grew up watching of
21:18
Speaker 3: what partners were like and the relationship of families, and
21:23
Speaker 3: not just you know, partners in the job, but family
21:28
Speaker 3: relationships and them coming down to our house down the
21:31
Speaker 3: Jersey Shore, and like I said this day, still reaching
21:36
Speaker 3: out to them and seeing how they're doing, what's going on,
21:39
Speaker 3: how are things all that, And that's what I grew
21:42
Speaker 3: up watching. So that and here's here's the fun the
21:45
Speaker 3: funny part of it, as silly as it's going to sound.
21:49
Speaker 3: My favorite TV show growing up with Starsking Hodge and.
21:53
Speaker 2: Parts a good one.
21:54
Speaker 3: Part start right. Part of Star Skin Hodge was them
21:58
Speaker 3: as partners and the way they were together, and I
22:02
Speaker 3: as a young kid, going, I want that. That's the
22:05
Speaker 3: partner I want and took that into the job and
22:10
Speaker 3: I was lucky as anything to have some of the
22:14
Speaker 3: most reliable, smart, tactical friends that were partners and each
22:21
Speaker 3: of them had a different role in my career. You know,
22:24
Speaker 3: when I was on patrol, George Faguero was my partner
22:28
Speaker 3: and we were I mean, we did it right. We
22:31
Speaker 3: knew each other. We had codes for certain things and
22:36
Speaker 3: keywords for you know, you know, when one of them
22:39
Speaker 3: got us out of a bad situation. One night, if
22:42
Speaker 3: you want to hit just real quick, we pull a
22:45
Speaker 3: car over, and we had a deal. We had we
22:48
Speaker 3: had a system that if we called each other by
22:51
Speaker 3: a different name, something was wrong. And we pulled a
22:55
Speaker 3: car over one night on St. Nicholas Avenue, right off
22:58
Speaker 3: of one four one hundred and forty five Street, and
23:01
Speaker 3: I'm at the passenger I'm at the driver window and
23:04
Speaker 3: figures at the passenger window. He didn't have a passenger,
23:07
Speaker 3: solo driver and I'm looking around. I'm talking to him,
23:13
Speaker 3: and Figure goes, hey, mikey okay. I go yep, I'm
23:17
Speaker 3: all good. And with that didn't even ask open the door,
23:20
Speaker 3: grab the guy out of the car, pulled him out
23:21
Speaker 3: of the car, cuffed him on St. Nicholas Avenue, right,
23:25
Speaker 3: you know, in the middle of the street. Cuff him on,
23:28
Speaker 3: like what's up. And he goes in the back seat
23:30
Speaker 3: and pulls a shotgun out of under the seat of
23:34
Speaker 3: the driver's side seat. He saw the barrel sticking out,
23:40
Speaker 3: grab it. We end up running him and he was
23:42
Speaker 3: wanted for three bank robberies down in North Carolina.
23:45
Speaker 2: But he's just that trust.
23:47
Speaker 1: Like you said, you didn't question it, you didn't go
23:49
Speaker 1: huh yeah, oh my gosh, just pure action because you
23:55
Speaker 1: know he's got you mm hm.
23:57
Speaker 3: And that was a lot of trust. So you know,
23:59
Speaker 3: do that on patrol with him, and then you know,
24:02
Speaker 3: call us Perez, my partner in narcotics and in the
24:06
Speaker 3: robbery squad, you know, and call us what I tell
24:09
Speaker 3: him all the time. You know, he's the guy who
24:10
Speaker 3: taught me how to be a detective, and just his
24:13
Speaker 3: mindset of, hey, think outside the box, don't get caught
24:17
Speaker 3: in that box. You know, let's let's think outside this,
24:20
Speaker 3: how we get this, how do we get that? And
24:21
Speaker 3: don't ever stop until we get the bad guys. You know,
24:25
Speaker 3: he had a saying when we were in narcotics, just
24:28
Speaker 3: get the bad guys. We'll figure everything else out later.
24:31
Speaker 3: And I still use I use that my whole career.
24:35
Speaker 3: Just get the bad guys. Everything else we'll figure out.
24:37
Speaker 1: Well, there's brilliance in that My partner, Leslie Saunders. You know,
24:42
Speaker 1: she's much older than me. She's probably gonna listen to
24:45
Speaker 1: this episode, so I think she's eighty eighty one. But anyway, Wow,
24:56
Speaker 1: But you know that trust, that understanding. You know, we
25:00
Speaker 1: had that thing. Leslie can take anything, she can take
25:03
Speaker 1: being called anything. You can be as vulgar and as
25:06
Speaker 1: rude and as profane as you want, but if you
25:10
Speaker 1: call her stupid, we have a situation. I don't know why.
25:14
Speaker 1: I've never really known, because she's not stupid. She's one
25:17
Speaker 1: of the brightest people that I know, but something about
25:20
Speaker 1: somebody calling her that. So you you know, understanding your partner,
25:26
Speaker 1: you can save that person getting in trouble.
25:29
Speaker 2: You know, you take over the.
25:30
Speaker 1: Person that's being you know, loud and you know, trying
25:35
Speaker 1: to degrade you and you know, cuse at you, so
25:38
Speaker 1: that your partner doesn't take a swing or doesn't you know,
25:41
Speaker 1: get caught on camera. You know, you got to have
25:44
Speaker 1: that understanding. And I always felt like part of my
25:49
Speaker 1: job wasn't just to make sure we were saved, but
25:51
Speaker 1: to make sure, you know, she looked good and you
25:54
Speaker 1: know we did the right thing.
25:56
Speaker 3: Sure, and you know, There was one time quick you'll
25:59
Speaker 3: love this if I.
26:01
Speaker 2: Can, Honey, it is your show. You talk about what
26:04
Speaker 2: you want.
26:05
Speaker 3: There was one time that Carlos actually got mad at me.
26:09
Speaker 3: It maned relatively mad. So we're in a robbery squad
26:14
Speaker 3: and you know, you go back to when you when
26:15
Speaker 3: you ask for you know, your best arrest. I contemplated
26:19
Speaker 3: telling you this story, but the shooting was was went
26:22
Speaker 3: above it, but this one was really close. We get
26:26
Speaker 3: called into the lieutenant's office and he says, hey, you know,
26:29
Speaker 3: we got this pattern. You know of these two shootings
26:33
Speaker 3: and these four robberies we think are connected. What do
26:37
Speaker 3: we got on it? Do we have anyone? You know,
26:39
Speaker 3: I'm doing the chief's office at one o'clock and he's
26:43
Speaker 3: going to rip me a new one for this thing
26:44
Speaker 3: being open. What do we have? And we're like, well,
26:48
Speaker 3: we don't have really anything, boss. We got. All we
26:51
Speaker 3: had was a male black named Jerome with gold teeth
26:56
Speaker 3: in the bronx. That's all we had. So so, being
27:00
Speaker 3: the wise ass that I was at the time, I
27:02
Speaker 3: looked at him and I go, what time's your meeting?
27:05
Speaker 3: He goes one o'clock. Now it's like nine thirty ten,
27:08
Speaker 3: o'clock in the morning. So I go, all right, we'll
27:10
Speaker 3: have it by one o'clock and he goes, get out
27:13
Speaker 3: of my office. I'm like, we'll have him by one o'clock.
27:17
Speaker 3: We walk out of his office. Carlos looks and me.
27:19
Speaker 3: He goes, what are you doing. I'm like, he goes,
27:22
Speaker 3: what are you way to your mind? I go, come on,
27:24
Speaker 3: let's go. He goes, Tommy, we have Jerome in the Bronx.
27:29
Speaker 3: I'm like, yeah, I know, let's go. So we go
27:32
Speaker 3: out and he's looking at me like, I mean, he
27:34
Speaker 3: literally wanted to knock my head off because I did this.
27:37
Speaker 3: So I go, come on, let's go. We go out.
27:40
Speaker 3: He's like where we go? And he said, let's go
27:42
Speaker 3: the first location of the shooting up on the Grand Concourse.
27:45
Speaker 3: Walking across the street towards the building, and this kid's
27:49
Speaker 3: walking across towards us, and he kind of looks at
27:52
Speaker 3: us a little funny. So I stopped. I said, listen,
27:55
Speaker 3: if he turns around, we're going to go grab and
27:56
Speaker 3: talk to him. So the kid turns around, looks at us.
27:59
Speaker 3: We run back across the street were grabbing him, like hey,
28:01
Speaker 3: what's going on? And they start asking about the shooting.
28:04
Speaker 3: He goes, I don't know who did it. I don't
28:06
Speaker 3: know his name, but I know where his sister lives. Okay,
28:09
Speaker 3: where's his sister lives? He gives us the address, so
28:12
Speaker 3: we go over there and we're sitting in front of,
28:15
Speaker 3: you know, on this block. We have no idea where
28:17
Speaker 3: on the street this possible sister lives. And we're sitting
28:22
Speaker 3: there and this kid's walking down the street and he's
28:24
Speaker 3: got a brown paper bag in his hand, having a drink.
28:29
Speaker 3: So Carlos is in the passenger seat. Who can talk
28:32
Speaker 3: to anybody. Carlos could talk to the devil, I mean,
28:35
Speaker 3: with no issue whatsoever. And he calls him over and
28:39
Speaker 3: he starts talking to him, and I look over and
28:43
Speaker 3: the kid's not opening his mouth. So he said, Carlos,
28:46
Speaker 3: make him laugh, just stay, just tell a joke, make
28:50
Speaker 3: him laugh, and the kid laughs. He's got gold teeth.
28:53
Speaker 3: So we get out of the car and we're like, hey, bro, listen,
28:57
Speaker 3: you can't have an open beer, can you know? Everyone
29:00
Speaker 3: sees us talking to you. We got to give you
29:02
Speaker 3: a summons or some if you have your license. He goes, no,
29:05
Speaker 3: I don't like. What's your name? He's like, you know.
29:07
Speaker 3: He comes up with his Kevin or something. So we're like,
29:10
Speaker 3: all right, oh, Mikey, I'm sorry, said Michael. He says,
29:14
Speaker 3: Michael's my name. We're like, all right, listen, where's your license?
29:17
Speaker 3: Hits up in my sister's apartment. Okay, let's go upstairs
29:21
Speaker 3: with his sister's apartment and get your get your license.
29:24
Speaker 3: We go inside. He opens the door and his assist
29:28
Speaker 3: and he goes, hey, the police are here. They gonna
29:30
Speaker 3: give me a summons for an open container. The sister
29:33
Speaker 3: yells out, Jerome, why are you always getting in trouble?
29:36
Speaker 3: We grab him, throw him in the hallway, get him
29:40
Speaker 3: on the ground, cuff him, go back to the precinct.
29:44
Speaker 3: Twelve forty five.
29:46
Speaker 2: Tom Smith, twelve forty five.
29:53
Speaker 3: I call, We get to the office. I call the
29:56
Speaker 3: chief's office and I asked for the Lieutenant's like, what
30:00
Speaker 3: do you want? I said, we got him? He goes,
30:02
Speaker 3: what I go, we got him? I said, you want
30:05
Speaker 3: us to deliver them to you? You want to come
30:06
Speaker 3: see him? He goes, I'll be right there. He walked
30:10
Speaker 3: in and couldn't believe it.
30:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's why you're a legend right there. So let's
30:15
Speaker 1: talk about when you got the call about the Hall
30:18
Speaker 1: of Fame.
30:19
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, we had nominated Kimber Gest to be
30:24
Speaker 3: in a Hall of fame. Who is Oh my god,
30:27
Speaker 3: I mean if she didn't get in a Hall of fame,
30:31
Speaker 3: there shouldn't be a Hall of Fame. Basically, you know,
30:34
Speaker 3: that's why someone like her, who got shot eight times
30:38
Speaker 3: and survived, is why the Hall of Fame was developed.
30:42
Speaker 3: So we had nominated her right after we interviewed her
30:47
Speaker 3: on the show. And one morning I'm here and Adam,
30:54
Speaker 3: Megan and Danny facetimeed me. And that wasn't unusual. We
30:58
Speaker 3: had talked before, you know, about whatever whatever trip coming
31:02
Speaker 3: up or whatever it might have been. So them calling
31:05
Speaker 3: on a face wasn't unusual. So Meghan starts going, Hey,
31:10
Speaker 3: I just want to let you know Kimber got in.
31:13
Speaker 3: So I'm like, oh my god, you just made my year,
31:15
Speaker 3: you just made everything. I'm happy as hell great. I'm
31:20
Speaker 3: thinking about Kimber. And while I'm thinking about Kimber, Meghan
31:26
Speaker 3: says my name and I go, why did you just
31:29
Speaker 3: say my name? So Megan goes, did you hear anything
31:32
Speaker 3: I just said to you? For the last like forty seconds,
31:35
Speaker 3: I'm like, no, what'd you say? She's like. Then I
31:39
Speaker 3: look at her, I'm like, why are you crying?
31:43
Speaker 2: Yeah?
31:43
Speaker 3: And she's like, yeah, you And then she told me
31:46
Speaker 3: that I got in and I was getting the Lifetime
31:48
Speaker 3: Achievement Award and I just went wait, what, Like, what
31:52
Speaker 3: are you talking about? I'm happy for Kimber. We're talking
31:54
Speaker 3: about her. She's like, no, you got and then she
31:57
Speaker 3: starts telling me that I got going to be inducted.
32:02
Speaker 3: It took about ten seconds and I had to hang
32:05
Speaker 3: up and I'm like, listen, I can't. I got to
32:08
Speaker 3: call you guys back, because thirty years of emotions and
32:15
Speaker 3: what you did and how you did it all came
32:18
Speaker 3: rushing into my head in one shot. And it was
32:24
Speaker 3: an extremely proud moment. And obviously the first person I
32:28
Speaker 3: think of was my dad, wishing he was still here,
32:32
Speaker 3: that I could have called him and told him that,
32:35
Speaker 3: you know, and everything he instilled in me and taught me,
32:39
Speaker 3: and how do you do this and why you're doing it?
32:42
Speaker 3: You know, all that came out, so you can imagine,
32:45
Speaker 3: you know, what I was feeling at that time, and
32:48
Speaker 3: then having the opportunity to tell my family and then
32:51
Speaker 3: about an hour later, I got to call him back,
32:56
Speaker 3: but it was, you know, something so oh incredibly unexpected,
33:03
Speaker 3: because we don't and I said it that night, Cheryl,
33:06
Speaker 3: we don't go into this job to get things like this.
33:10
Speaker 3: We don't. It's not on a checklist, it's not on
33:13
Speaker 3: a to do list. You know. I want to be
33:15
Speaker 3: a copy and get in the National Law Enforcements's Hall
33:17
Speaker 3: of Fame. That's not even thought about, and that's not
33:20
Speaker 3: why we get into law enforcement. So when you're thought
33:25
Speaker 3: of like that and able to be inducted into such
33:30
Speaker 3: an organization like this, it's a tremendous honor that I
33:36
Speaker 3: just cherish all the time.
33:43
Speaker 1: Let's talk a little bit about Table fifteen. Yes, because
33:50
Speaker 1: for most people, this type of night is elegant, it's formal,
33:55
Speaker 1: it's beautiful, it's a once in a lifetime. It's probably
34:01
Speaker 1: just the pinnacle of your career. I mean, there is
34:04
Speaker 1: nothing any higher, right.
34:07
Speaker 2: But not our table hunt.
34:11
Speaker 3: Well, you made sure of that because and you were
34:16
Speaker 3: right in saying it. Listen, we have to there's too
34:19
Speaker 3: much seriousness that goes into our job and our profession
34:24
Speaker 3: because most of the time we have to be a
34:26
Speaker 3: certain way and carry ourselves a certain way. But when
34:29
Speaker 3: you have the opportunity to just enjoy something with every
34:35
Speaker 3: breath you have. And we laughed and joked and cried
34:40
Speaker 3: and had the best time. You know, when you have
34:44
Speaker 3: you know, twenty five tables staring at us and looking
34:48
Speaker 3: over us because because we're laughing so much.
34:53
Speaker 2: Night the Cool Kids Table, Thank you. Listen. We have
34:58
Speaker 2: Kimber and herr nuggets in the.
35:02
Speaker 1: We had Kimber and her mom, You and your lovely bride,
35:06
Speaker 1: Dan and his lovely bride, and Walt and I And
35:10
Speaker 1: let me tell you, we laughed a lot. But I
35:11
Speaker 1: want everybody to hear me when I tell y'all when
35:15
Speaker 1: Dan Murphy turns and says, you want to know the
35:19
Speaker 1: best practical joke I ever pulled, the night is going
35:23
Speaker 1: to take a turn, okay, And then Kimber follows up
35:27
Speaker 1: with hers and then Tom Smith says, well, this may
35:32
Speaker 1: or may.
35:32
Speaker 2: Not have happened.
35:34
Speaker 1: Well, at that point, I just thought, man, if this
35:38
Speaker 1: table had a recording show, it could be its own show.
35:44
Speaker 1: And everything we talked about was true. Every story I told,
35:48
Speaker 1: every story y'all told, absolutely true. But honey, it would
35:51
Speaker 1: probably get us in a little bit of trouble with
35:53
Speaker 1: some folks, because oh.
35:54
Speaker 3: My god, it we told her from practical jokes to
35:58
Speaker 3: you know, situations all in on the street and things
36:02
Speaker 3: we did. Was it was just you know, it was
36:06
Speaker 3: a special night to begin with, but then it was
36:10
Speaker 3: just extra that was like it was just an like
36:12
Speaker 3: extra endings of a ballgame of what it was. And
36:17
Speaker 3: we deserve that, you know. I say this all the time,
36:20
Speaker 3: shar and you do too, that it's okay for cops
36:25
Speaker 3: to feel that they deserve something, you know, a good
36:29
Speaker 3: night like that. It's okay to feel that and to
36:32
Speaker 3: understand that and to cherish those because we don't get
36:36
Speaker 3: a lot of them, you know, and when we do,
36:40
Speaker 3: we have to enjoy it because we just go through
36:44
Speaker 3: way too much that ninety nine percent of the people
36:48
Speaker 3: in this country would never even think of doing. And
36:52
Speaker 3: when you have a chance to just laugh and joke
36:54
Speaker 3: around with people who are now part of your family
36:57
Speaker 3: and love and respect, it makes that night so much
37:02
Speaker 3: more special. And Table fifteen is gonna pop up again
37:06
Speaker 3: in April of twenty twenty six, for sure.
37:09
Speaker 1: For sure, And I'll tell you know what they've done
37:12
Speaker 1: with this Hall of fame.
37:14
Speaker 2: You said it that night, and it is the truth.
37:17
Speaker 2: It is a family.
37:18
Speaker 3: It is it's just, and it's a special family because
37:22
Speaker 3: of what it represents. It's it's these stories and these
37:27
Speaker 3: situations that people go through and get acknowledged. And Megan
37:34
Speaker 3: and Adam do God's work because without them, no one
37:39
Speaker 3: knows about these stories. No one knows about Kimber guests
37:42
Speaker 3: who got shot eight times, you know, and survived, you know.
37:46
Speaker 3: No one knows those stories of others who won awards
37:50
Speaker 3: at night, the Canaan Awards, you know, you know, all
37:54
Speaker 3: those and it gives everyone an opportunity to not just
38:01
Speaker 3: the stories, but see the people who live through them.
38:05
Speaker 3: And that's even more of an impact. When these people
38:09
Speaker 3: are standing up on a stage and telling the story
38:12
Speaker 3: of their induction and they're real, their flesh and blood,
38:18
Speaker 3: their humans. They cry, they fail, and it all comes
38:23
Speaker 3: to a head that night. Thanks to Megan and Adam's
38:27
Speaker 3: hard work throughout a year. I mean, they start twenty
38:31
Speaker 3: twenty five, happened in March, Megan started twenty twenty six
38:36
Speaker 3: the following week.
38:37
Speaker 1: Right, And let me just tell you, Megan and Adam
38:41
Speaker 1: both they live it, they feel it, they believe in it.
38:45
Speaker 1: They cry, they they feel every inductee and want to
38:53
Speaker 1: make sure that they are honored in a way that
38:56
Speaker 1: their families are going to be proud of. Is it
38:59
Speaker 1: in just a hey, congratulations, you know you did a
39:01
Speaker 1: great job this one night. That's not it all year long.
39:05
Speaker 1: They reach out all year long. They're like, hey, everything good,
39:09
Speaker 1: Happy birthday, happy anniversary. Make sure you've already blocked out
39:13
Speaker 1: the date for April. Like they want this family to
39:16
Speaker 1: come back together year after year.
39:19
Speaker 3: Yeah, no doubt. That's a great point because the night
39:22
Speaker 3: is put together for all the families and the pop
39:25
Speaker 3: and circumstance and the stuff on tables and the speakers
39:30
Speaker 3: and the extra things that they have going on before
39:33
Speaker 3: the induction night, This ceremony is all for families because
39:39
Speaker 3: Megan and Adam understand that law enforcement is not a
39:44
Speaker 3: singular entity. It's a family that goes through. Every single
39:49
Speaker 3: thing that that cop goes through, the heartache, the pain,
39:54
Speaker 3: the failures, the injuries, all of that is a family thing.
40:01
Speaker 3: And they understand that, and that's why those nights are special.
40:05
Speaker 1: And you know, Tom and I started a tradition sort
40:09
Speaker 1: of sub level. Not everybody knows about it, but it's
40:12
Speaker 1: something that's going to continue and it's one of those things.
40:15
Speaker 1: It's almost like a secret code and that means the
40:18
Speaker 1: world to me. So I cannot wait for this April
40:22
Speaker 1: to watch you continue this tradition, sir.
40:24
Speaker 3: Yes, and the only reason, and just to let you know,
40:28
Speaker 3: we didn't do it last year because I wasn't going
40:31
Speaker 3: to do it without you being there. So you know
40:35
Speaker 3: that's why it wasn't done last year. So we're both
40:39
Speaker 3: going to be there this year to continue that. And
40:42
Speaker 3: you know that's I get through a speech that was,
40:46
Speaker 3: you know, emotional, and I got through it and then
40:48
Speaker 3: you throw your part in. I was like, really, you know,
40:52
Speaker 3: I got through this and now you're going to throw
40:54
Speaker 3: this at me. But it was and it's still where
40:59
Speaker 3: I put it that and it's going to be removed
41:02
Speaker 3: in April and it's going to be in someone else's hands.
41:06
Speaker 3: So I can't wait for that.
41:08
Speaker 1: Love it well, Tom Smith, I love you, I adore you,
41:12
Speaker 1: I respect you. I am so proud that you were
41:16
Speaker 1: the first guest for the National Law Enforcement Hall of
41:20
Speaker 1: Fame Highlight Own Zone seven.
41:22
Speaker 3: Well, I couldn't be more honored. And you know how
41:26
Speaker 3: I feel about you talk about clicking with someone and
41:30
Speaker 3: just an immediate connection was what me and you are
41:35
Speaker 3: and continue to be. You know, for everyone listening to this,
41:39
Speaker 3: we talk well at least once a week just to
41:43
Speaker 3: say hi, because the respect level of our industry can
41:49
Speaker 3: get mired in nonsense a lot. And when you fall
41:54
Speaker 3: in love with true people who just have a admiration
41:58
Speaker 3: and respect for it makes life so much better. And
42:04
Speaker 3: you go through heartaches in his job and a lot
42:08
Speaker 3: of bad stuff, but then when you get to where
42:10
Speaker 3: we are now, it's all worth it because you're in
42:14
Speaker 3: my family and I love you dearly and everything you
42:18
Speaker 3: do and to have you be part of my life
42:22
Speaker 3: is a blessing.
42:23
Speaker 2: I'm Cheryl McCollum and this is his own seven