Latest / 4-Freedom Podcast / 192. The Jake Carlisle Story

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192. The Jake Carlisle Story · 4-Freedom Podcast

0:00
Welcome back, dear listener, to the Four Freedom Podcast.
0:04
What a blessing it is to be back with you today, man.
0:08
We have a great interview line that for you today.
0:11
A great interview with a good friend of mine.
0:14
I've been to Israel with him. I've been in Bible college with
0:18
him and we have been through lots of life together and I'm
0:23
excited about that story coming up in just a little bit.
0:26
Until then, I want to welcome you to the show, give you a
0:30
couple of housekeeping things coming up.
0:33
We have our. Israel trip right around the.
0:36
Corner We are so excited about our Israel trip and January 30th
0:41
through February 7th. We only have maybe 5 spots left.
0:46
If you're interested, please, please go to the IO website that
0:51
is in our I think it's in our show notes.
0:53
It's also on our website social media.
0:56
You can find it multiple different locations and go and
0:59
check that out so that you can join us.
1:02
It is going to be a wonderful time.
1:04
You're not going to find a more affordable trip, much less a
1:09
trip that is going to be more of God honoring man.
1:12
We're going to go to sites that Jesus was at, he walked on.
1:17
We are going to do some teaching while we're there.
1:21
You're going to fully get immersed into a biblical
1:25
narrative of Scripture while we're there.
1:27
What what a great time it's going to be.
1:29
And we hope you come and join me and Brett as we partake in this
1:33
wonderful journey and this trip together.
1:35
You're going to love it. I want to give a quick plug if
1:38
you haven't went and purchased my newest book, From Brokenness
1:41
to Freedom. It is out on Amazon and it's
1:45
affordable on paperback hardback if you want a copy of that.
1:49
And we just talked through what it's like to leave a spiritually
1:53
abusive legalistic environment, how you can have hope and
1:56
healing from that, and how you can begin your journey through
2:01
leaving that environment. We talked through the stages of
2:04
disillusionment, grief, anger, questioning, leaving ultimately
2:09
the fork in the road of bitterness or healing, and then
2:13
how you can begin to help others.
2:15
We have received such great feedback from this, and I'm just
2:19
thankful that it's been a blessing.
2:20
I never imagined in a million years that I would write a book
2:24
and that people would buy that book.
2:26
And so I'm thankful that the Lord has given me this
2:29
opportunity to go on and write this book with John and his
2:35
help. And so I hope you enjoy that.
2:39
Please go and support the ministry in that way.
2:42
Speaking of John, if you'll be praying for this, John is going
2:44
to be in my church next week preaching A revival and excited
2:48
about him coming out here to North Carolina next Monday,
2:51
Tuesday, and Wednesday. Speaking on Restore Revival, the
2:55
fall Restore Revival that we're having here at our church.
2:58
And I'm just excited about spending some time with him, but
3:01
also been a blessing to our church community and the growth
3:04
that it has there. Speaking of church, I hope that
3:07
you are in a local church somewhere in your area.
3:10
If not, please reach out to us. I've got friends all across the
3:13
nation and good Bible believing, friendly people who love the
3:17
Lord and want to see your spiritual growth as well.
3:21
And so please be in a church somewhere on the Lord's day.
3:25
Last but not least, if you haven't partaked in our if you
3:30
are a fellow brother or sister that enjoys cigars, if you have
3:33
not enjoyed looking improving through our website, I would
3:37
encourage you to go be a blessing to our ministry by
3:42
supporting us. These are the the only ads that
3:44
we give in our podcast are right here at the beginning during our
3:48
banter and I want you to enjoy yourself avail yourself to the
3:53
cigars there at 4 Freedom Cigar Company and we have.
3:57
Received so many good things from that as far as good
4:01
feedback and just the support that we get from the ministry.
4:05
A little bit of revenue that we do get from that.
4:07
It doesn't go a long way in the quality of what we produce and
4:11
the ability to do this. Just this last week I was at a
4:14
festival and the the amount of people that I talked to that
4:19
were able to be a blessing to just by sharing the book and the
4:23
cigar with different people was a blessing.
4:26
Do know that our experience box, it is a limited supply.
4:31
I think we've said this before, but we only have a limited
4:34
supply of the coffee and the soap.
4:36
And so if you're wanting to get one of those, please go and buy
4:39
that immediately. As we draw closer to Christmas
4:43
time and we get closer to the holiday season, they will sell
4:47
out and we've already seen many people buy from those and we
4:51
thank you for that. But it's a great little gift
4:54
basket that you can give to a father or brother for a holiday
4:57
gift right now. Like I think I said earlier,
5:00
it's discounted by about 45 or $50.00 right now.
5:03
And so it's at a very affordable rate.
5:05
You can get the four cigars, a bag of coffee and a bar of soap.
5:09
And I know that if I were to get this gift, I would be over the
5:13
moon. And so if you're looking for
5:15
something for the holidays, now is the time to do that.
5:18
Again, we only have a limited supply of those that said boxes.
5:22
And so today we've got an interview with Jake Carlisle.
5:25
Jake Carlisle's a good friend of mine and we went to college for
5:29
a couple years together. And he also went to Israel with
5:32
us. And I've I've went to up to his
5:35
house. We went to Branson together and
5:38
we've spent some extended period of time together various
5:40
different times. And so thankful for him, his
5:43
friendship, the many times where I've called him or he's called
5:46
me and just been able to share life together.
5:50
And that's I hope you enjoy this today.
5:52
Me and Brett sit down with him and talk about his time at West
5:55
Coast Baptist Bible College. Also his time with several other
5:58
colleges that he was at. I think he said he went to four
6:02
total colleges, Champion Shawnee West Coast and the Crown College
6:07
of the Bible. So you get a first hand
6:09
experience of couple of those colleges.
6:11
We hope you enjoy today's episode and buckle up tight for
6:15
a great day. For freedom, you set me free.
6:19
Not for change, not for guilt, not for Pharisee.
6:22
Grace lit the flame. Now I'm puffing peace, cigars
6:25
and victory. Justified.
6:27
Released. Welcome to the For Freedom
6:30
podcast. This podcast exists to bring the
6:34
freedom of the gospel for everyday Christians with
6:37
everyday issues. I ain't.
6:39
Saved by dress codes, not about what I eat.
6:41
I'm covered in the righteousness, washed from head
6:43
to feet. No tally of tradition.
6:45
No man made code. Blood bought my freedom.
6:48
Now I ride that road. They clutch pearls when they see
6:51
smoke rings rise. But my praise still ascends past
6:54
the legalist cries. Christ plus nothing.
6:56
That's the real math. So miss me with your fence laws
6:59
and your extra path. He sat with sinners, I'm sitting
7:02
with Saints, sipping grace from the bottle.
7:04
No room for face. I like one for liberty.
7:07
Toast to the king. Every ash of sermon.
7:10
Death has lost its sting. For freedom He set me free, Not
7:14
for change, not for guilt, not for Pharisee.
7:17
Grace lit the flame now. I'm puffing peace, cigars and
7:20
victory, justified, released. For freedom, He set me free, not
7:24
for change, not for guilt, not for Pharisee.
7:27
Grace lit the flame now. Puffing peace, cigars and
7:30
victory justified, released. Let grace begin For freedom He
7:36
let me free, not for change, not for guilt, not for Pharisee.
7:39
Grace lit the flame Now. Down here, your host, James
7:43
Seyfried and Brett Martin. All right, we're excited to have
7:47
on here today. Jacob Carlisle, a good friend of
7:50
mine. We went to college together,
7:52
went to Israel together, possibly going back to Israel
7:55
with us in January. If you haven't signed up, now's
7:57
the time to sign up and you get to go with us and have a great
8:02
time while we're there. Jake, welcome to the podcast.
8:04
Tell us who you are, where you're from, what you're doing,
8:07
age, kids, Social Security number, anything else we need to
8:10
know. Absolutely, man IA joy to be
8:14
here. My name is Victoria Carlisle and
8:17
I'm in Jefferson City, MO, currently serving at Concord
8:21
Baptist Church as the young adults pastor here and been in
8:25
ministry, you know, off and on since really about the last 20
8:34
years. And so whether it was lay
8:37
ministry or part time or full time or or promise time, however
8:42
you want to look at that, but and done youth pastors.
8:47
I've been a youth pastor, interim youth pastor, young
8:52
adults pastor. And so I've been married to my
8:56
wife for, for 12 years and I have a, I have a 7 year old
9:02
about to be 8 year old son and a nine year old about to be 10
9:06
year old daughter. And so we are, we are as busy as
9:09
busy can be and sports and school and all kinds of stuff.
9:14
And so we just excited to be here, excited to to connect with
9:20
James and Brett and and talk over some college stuff.
9:25
Absolutely. Well, Jake is, he's a
9:28
professional when it comes to college.
9:30
Yeah, he has been to many of the colleges that we've talked
9:33
about. And as we just recently talked
9:35
about West Coast there, Paul Chapels College, we're going to
9:39
start there and talk about your time at West Coast.
9:42
Tell us about how you first heard about West Coast.
9:47
It was your third college, or was it your 4th college you went
9:49
to? It was it was my 4th and and
9:52
last college and. Last All right, so you, you
9:54
graduated from West Coast. Let's do the the years you were
9:58
there and why you chose to transfer from champion out to
10:02
West Coast. We'll start there.
10:04
Well, I transferred from Shawnee, so it's all right.
10:08
It's easy to get confused because there's, there's lots of
10:10
them to pick from there. But yeah, no, I went, let's see,
10:14
I would have been out there the fall semester, 2010, and I would
10:21
have finished in December of 2012.
10:25
I skipped a semester in there for work and interning
10:29
somewhere, but it finished in December, but then walked in May
10:35
of 2013. How did I hear about it?
10:39
Yeah, I originally heard about it when I was in high school.
10:45
There was a my basketball coach in high school.
10:49
His grandson was going out there.
10:51
And I mean, that would have been that have been like 2004, 2005.
10:56
And so being in Missouri had had not heard a whole lot about West
11:01
Coast. So I knew that it existed.
11:03
And then my buddy that I actually ended up going to Crown
11:05
with my freshman year was he was deciding he's either going to go
11:11
to Crown or West Coast. That was his.
11:13
So I've kind of heard about it from then.
11:15
But as you'll hear my story a little bit more later on about
11:17
the different colleges, kind of what what kind of how I ended up
11:23
out there. So, but yeah, I ended up out
11:27
there in 2010. So so you, you've been to
11:30
several colleges at this point. You get to West Coast.
11:35
And my question is, what are your first impressions like when
11:38
you walk on campus and you see the teachers and whatnot?
11:42
How does it compare to the others?
11:44
And then once you talk about that, walk us through like a
11:46
day-to-day in the life of a West Coast student.
11:51
Yeah. You know, I mean, when I got
11:52
there in #1 it's in the middle of nowhere.
11:58
Like, I mean, it's, it's, it's on the edge of Lancaster.
12:01
But like Lancaster and Palmdale, they're in the high desert.
12:05
So, and the time that I was out there, they were on the edge
12:12
almost like a mile out from Lancaster.
12:15
So like literally in the middle of nowhere, but also like they
12:20
had kept up their grounds really nice.
12:22
And so like you know, it's as far as some of the other
12:26
colleges that I went to, the facilities were probably the
12:31
nicest of all the colleges that I had went to.
12:34
And they seem to do things in a more first class way then then I
12:43
had been used to. The other thing about it was,
12:47
you know, I'm from the Midwest and so like this was out in
12:50
California. So just some of the cosmetics of
12:54
things were, were different the way that they things were kind
13:00
of updated. If you would like everybody had
13:02
a, a key card to, to get into their dorms and to sign in to
13:07
Chapel and, and I know the other colleges that already gotten to
13:11
that point, but I not the really the ones that I have been to
13:15
yet. And there was some of that
13:18
coming on. Technology's changed a lot since
13:20
then. But so when I first got there
13:21
and then as far as the professors and the classes were
13:26
like, things just seem to be pretty well organized and I kind
13:32
of felt out of place. It was the larger than any of
13:34
the the colleges that I've been to before.
13:37
I'm kind of a, you know, I grew up on a farm, kind of a hometown
13:40
type person. So I was a little kind of
13:42
intimidated at the same time. And I'd already been, this is
13:46
this would been my fifth year at a, a college.
13:49
So I kind of already knew just what, how college life went.
13:57
But everything it was a little larger and a little bit nicer.
14:01
And so it's a good first impression at the same time
14:04
because of how I got there. And when I decided to go there,
14:09
it was kind of a last minute decision that in the summer of
14:13
2010. And, and so I just, I just went,
14:19
I just drove out there, you know, I, I registered, drove out
14:23
there, got there and it was just like, all right, well, here I
14:24
am. I didn't even know anybody out
14:26
there. Come to find out, once I got
14:28
there, there were some few, a few people that I knew and was
14:31
able to connect with. But I mean, I was overall, I was
14:34
just kind of ready for a good fresh start and wanted to finish
14:39
my college career. Absolutely.
14:41
You were there about the time that a friend of mine that I
14:44
went to school grew up with was there.
14:46
And I understand that Paul Chappell was in this process of
14:51
going more balanced in his approach of sort of trying to
14:57
get away from the ISB, becoming unaffiliated, lost some
15:00
students, but then sort of bounce back a little bit.
15:03
What would you describe while you were there?
15:05
The spirit and the culture of the school and the church while
15:10
you were there. I feel like it was pretty
15:12
balanced as far as where I was at in life and my journey and
15:19
the IFBI feel like they were more balanced than than most.
15:22
Obviously you have, you know, your students who are more
15:25
radical and more like wanting to be legalistic and, you know,
15:33
performance based. Make sure that they, you know,
15:36
really honestly, like, you know, the butt kissers, you know, I
15:38
just trying to brown those and that kind of thing.
15:41
You have those everywhere, but I felt like it was a little bit
15:46
more balanced. I really appreciated, you know,
15:48
a few of the professors and on staff and and looked up to them.
15:53
And then there is always the, the ones that are kind of, I
16:00
wouldn't call them the Unicorn, but just the, the ones that I
16:05
don't know, the peculiar ones, you know, the ones that are
16:09
going to, they're just themselves.
16:11
They're kind of, you know, in their own category.
16:16
But I feel like I got along with everybody pretty good.
16:18
I felt like it was pretty balanced the, the unaffiliated.
16:24
That was a little bit right after I left that, that that
16:27
came around. So when I was there, I don't
16:31
know if it was ever really fully disclosed what happened, but I
16:35
know Paul Chappell took a kind of a sabbatical for a while
16:39
while I was there. And so that was, that was a
16:42
little bit different cuz we didn't really know what was
16:44
going on and why he was absent. But yeah, I don't know if I
16:49
don't know if I answered any of your questions with that answer.
16:51
You're good. Yeah.
16:52
No, I was, I was down at at West Coast during that time when he
16:55
took that sabbatical and had that mental breakdown of just
16:59
exhaustion of the ministry growing in him having to figure
17:02
out how to how to do. That so yeah, I was there.
17:05
Brett, wait, what's your thoughts?
17:06
So, you know, one of the things that we're curious about is from
17:11
your experiences while you were there, what was something that
17:15
sticks out in your mind that like you appreciated the most
17:19
about your time there? And on the other end of that
17:22
spectrum, what was the thing that like disappointed you or
17:26
was the most difficult while you were there?
17:29
The thing that I really appreciated that I mean
17:32
everybody and you know, for better, for worse, I don't know
17:37
all the insurance and outs, but everybody seemed to be pretty
17:39
committed and dedicated to to their job and to their like, you
17:46
know, some of the other colleges that I had went to, you know,
17:49
they were, it was pastors that were coming in and teaching like
17:52
the this one at West Coast. It was more like these men and
17:56
women were seem to be more educated and more trained than
18:02
anywhere else that I had went instead of just some pastor
18:05
being thrown into something teaching a class that he may or
18:08
may not have had any idea how to teach.
18:11
And they were if you wanted to get to know them, like if you
18:14
wanted, you know, they would have you over to their house.
18:16
They would you would see them, They would they cared about you.
18:21
You know, you would give a prayer request and they would,
18:24
they would ask you in the hallway how things were going.
18:26
And that was something I really appreciated.
18:30
And they also just seem to be, you know, well, what like I
18:36
said, well educated. The other thing that I really, I
18:38
think loved about West Coast was like they were now it didn't end
18:46
up working out very well for me and we can get into that later,
18:48
but they were very intentional about making sure that their
18:52
graduates were placed and so that they had a job, they had a,
18:57
they had a ministry that they were going.
18:59
And the other thing that I really appreciated about the
19:03
ministry, those that were getting a pastoral or going to
19:09
be in church ministries is you have to pass an oral examination
19:12
in order to get your diploma. And it's not really, I hated it
19:16
when I was there because I was like, it freaked me out.
19:19
I was stressed out about it, but like, but it really sets you up
19:23
for like getting ordained and being prepared for ministry and,
19:26
and knowing for sure that you believed what you said that you
19:30
believed and you knew that the Bible, what the Bible said about
19:33
our doctrines and beliefs. And so I really appreciate that.
19:37
The thing that was probably more disappointing, honestly, it was
19:43
so far away from home for me and it was so difficult to get a job
19:48
over there. And I think that had more to do
19:51
with just California. And I didn't really know
19:54
anybody, you know, I mean, all the other colleges I went to
19:57
were either in the South or the Midwest and like you could go
20:00
and shake somebody's hand and say to me, look, I can come help
20:02
with with construction or something.
20:03
It was really hard to get a job out there.
20:05
I know that's not necessarily specifically about the school
20:08
itself. And the other thing that would.
20:16
Been disappointing. We may come back to that later
20:21
on in the podcast. I I don't I'm sure there were
20:23
some other things, but I'm I'm trying to draw in a blank a
20:25
little bit there. You got to also remember this
20:27
was a how long ago was this now? Like 12?
20:30
13 years ago. Man, OK.
20:32
Yeah. Well, I'm thinking about on that
20:35
because I do know that that's one thing that I always heard
20:38
when I was out there was Paul Chapel would say we've got 97%
20:41
of our graduates placed or that was one year that was like 100%.
20:45
Every single graduate had been placed somewhere.
20:49
My buddy had told me about the oral exams and and all that.
20:54
You didn't get placed. What did that look like?
20:57
How did that process go? How did they go about with
20:59
interviewing and and processing to get people into the specific
21:03
ministries or jobs or what did that look like?
21:07
Well, I don't know if I'm the greatest person to ask that
21:10
question to because I, I was an, I was a knucklehead and I, I was
21:17
planning on coming back and working at my home church.
21:20
And, and so, and I, I had had that on just word on just by
21:28
somebody's word. And and so I put down on so they
21:32
have like a senior Chapel, a couple of those.
21:36
And on the your senior year, you would fill out a card like, do
21:41
you know where you're going to be?
21:42
Do you know where you're going to be working?
21:45
And if you said no, like they would actively try to help place
21:48
you. They had interview days.
21:50
They had lots of pastors and school administrators come and
21:55
interview on those days. I didn't interview.
21:58
I think I interviewed with one person, but I already felt like
22:02
I knew where I was going to go. Now the reason why that fell
22:05
apart for me is just because I had assumed that I was just
22:09
going to be placed at my home church and ended up coming back
22:16
in and eventually working at my home church.
22:18
It just wasn't as immediate as like on the piece of paper.
22:22
It's probably silly because I've never called West Coast and
22:24
changed it. So if you called West Coast
22:27
right now, it would probably say the thing that I put on that
22:29
senior Chapel, which was like, man, I was so naive, right?
22:33
It was like I put like children's director, bus
22:36
director, soul winning director, you know, youth pastor.
22:40
I was like, man, I'm all in. These are all the things that I
22:44
knew, all the things that my home church needed.
22:46
And I mean, I was going to go home and fill that void.
22:49
And so I just put all those things on there.
22:51
I still never called West Coast and told him that I'm not there.
22:55
So it would probably still say that I'm doing all those things
23:00
at Bible Baptist Church in Jefferson City, MO.
23:02
And so as far as I, so I, so I wasn't really a part of the full
23:12
blown placement process because I was, I had communicated to the
23:16
college that I was already placed, but I know that there
23:20
were buddies of mine that that had went through the process and
23:28
did get placed. So I feel like it went well as
23:31
far as from my angle. I, I haven't, I haven't heard
23:34
any horror stories with that, but I'm, and I'm sure they
23:36
exist, you know. And so, yeah, you know, I I
23:42
sympathize with you a little bit because I I started out of the
23:45
house, Anderson, and then I transferred to tri-state to be a
23:50
little closer to home. And there were some other
23:51
reasons in there. So, I mean, I went to one more
23:54
than one Bible college as well. But you you also attended Crown
23:58
Champion Shawnee. Anything you can tell us about
24:02
what led to those transitions, man?
24:06
No. Yeah, absolutely.
24:08
And, you know, honestly, it's interesting kind of how we've
24:11
talked about it so far, because usually it when I tell any sort
24:15
of my college stories, if West Coast is where it ends, not
24:20
where it begins. And so, yeah, I can kind of walk
24:25
through all of those if if that would be.
24:28
Absolutely go right ahead. Yeah.
24:30
So really, as I was graduating high school, I was going to my,
24:39
my dad, you know, I mean, I grew up in a on a farm, but my
24:42
parents, you know, they love me, care for me, but they were like,
24:45
you know, as soon as I got a job, they're like, all right,
24:48
you're going to, you're going to have to take care of yourself
24:51
and, and pay your bills and those types of things.
24:53
And my parents would help me out with things.
24:55
And no doubt, you know, they helped me out with my college
24:58
bill here and there for sure. But it was never a situation
25:02
where it's like my college is going to be paid for.
25:05
I just had to choose which one to go to.
25:08
And so whenever I felt called, the ministry was going to go to
25:10
Bible college. My parents were OK with that.
25:14
My dad came and asked me a very wise question, as I can see now.
25:18
But I, I really was frustrated at with it at the time.
25:21
And he said, son, you know, ministry is not something people
25:26
go into in order to feed their families.
25:30
Like it's that usually doesn't pay very well.
25:33
And so like, what's your fall back?
25:35
What are you going to do on the side if you need to, you know,
25:37
pay the bills or provide for your family?
25:39
And the ministry is not bringing in enough funds.
25:42
And my my ultra wise response to that time was, well, you know,
25:48
Dad, you know, God's called me to ministry and he'll take care
25:51
of me, you know, and so. Oh, right.
25:55
And so, yeah, who are you? You know, I honestly looked at
25:58
it as a thought that this was a test, you know, from God or a
26:03
distraction from the enemy. And then I wasn't going to fall
26:06
for that, right. So my dad actually said, Hey,
26:10
why don't you go to college here for two years and get your
26:13
business, business associate's degree.
26:17
And he goes, as long as your grades are good, I'll pay for
26:20
your schooling. So I mean, that was like, what?
26:23
That sounds awesome. Well, long longer story shorter,
26:27
I said no. And ended up going to Crown
26:32
College of the Bible there in Knoxville, TN.
26:35
And I went there with, with my really my buddy Josh went there.
26:43
We went there together and we went and checked the college out
26:46
in April. Felt like that was where I was
26:48
going to go. And the main reason why I
26:50
decided to go there because I was planning on going to
26:52
champions. The main reason I went to Crown
26:55
is because the church, my home church that I grew up in had a
26:59
pretty prominent deaf ministry And, and it's Crown College of
27:05
the Bible. They were also, they had started
27:08
a program where you could get your ASL interpreting license in
27:15
addition to all of your ministerial degree.
27:20
So I was like, oh, well, there's my answer.
27:22
Like because you can start anywhere.
27:24
I think at that time was like $57 starting as a sign language
27:28
interpreter. And I was like, that'll be what
27:30
that that'll be my fall back, right?
27:32
But Dad wants me to have a fall back.
27:34
That's my fall back, you know, So I went to Crown.
27:38
Honestly, it was, it was way more high church than anything
27:43
that I've been a part of the spirit there.
27:45
I, I didn't really enjoy it. I loved the ministry aspect of
27:49
every college that I went to, honestly.
27:52
Also, something that needs to be said, I think I'm probably about
27:55
one of the worst students that there is.
27:57
I just said I'm not good in the classroom.
27:59
I'm not good. I want to be around people and I
28:02
want to like do ministry. I don't want to sit somewhere
28:04
and read a book and, you know, unless it's the Bible.
28:07
Amen. But, and so, so, so crown was a
28:12
struggle for me. I didn't really get along with a
28:16
lot of the professors or, or, or the assignments and those types
28:20
of things. And now I was, I was immature.
28:22
I, I, I was just not a good student.
28:27
I ended up going back home that summer and working on a farm
28:32
and, and then I was going to go back to crown, even though I
28:35
didn't want to and I just didn't have a, a good, I just, it was
28:39
my spirit wasn't right. And I just kind of kept praying
28:42
and, and asking the Lord what did he want me to do?
28:44
And I'd always originally wanted to go to Champion because they
28:48
actually in most of the Bible colleges at this time just had
28:52
pastoral degrees. They didn't have like a degree
28:55
set up specifically for like a youth pastors.
28:57
And I wanted to be a youth pastor.
28:59
And so Champion had one of those.
29:02
And Reno Lykins was the the Dean of youth ministries there.
29:06
And, and I had had known brother Reno for a little bit at the end
29:10
of my high school years going to camp and conferences.
29:13
And I really respected him. And so I ended up calling
29:18
Champion one week before it before college started.
29:24
And I knew that they were going to be full because champion was
29:26
booming at the time and, and they had they were really
29:30
picking up speed. And I'm like, y'all right, Lord,
29:31
I'm going to call champion If they, if they have availability,
29:35
then I'll go answers. They answer the phone.
29:39
Oh, we'd love to have you. Boom.
29:41
I packed up my stuff. I went down to champion.
29:43
I was there for two years, really got involved in a lot of
29:46
ministries there, bus captain and and did the first grade
29:52
junior church and and just really enjoyed a champion quite
29:57
a bit. Brother Reno came to me at the
30:00
end of those my 4th semester there and he said I, I need, I
30:05
would like to chat with you, but I got to wait till school's out.
30:07
There's some things in the works, but I can't talk about
30:10
him right now. I didn't quite know what that
30:11
meant. He just said, I want you to be
30:12
praying and asking the Lord to just to prepare your heart for
30:17
whatever he wants. I mean, OK, so if someone you
30:20
respect and, and, and look up to says that, I mean, that's what
30:24
you do, right? And so, so he came and saw me
30:27
after school was over and he was letting me know that he was
30:29
going to be going back to Shawnee and that the champion,
30:34
they were making some leadership changes and didn't quite know
30:38
what was in store and thought it might be a good idea to to move
30:43
along. And I had two more semesters
30:45
left in his program. So I mean, it just made sense to
30:48
me, you know, the, the person, the reason why I was there comes
30:53
to me and says, Hey, I want you to consider this.
30:56
So I was just kind of like, and I mean, I was told at the time
31:00
by someone that I respected, Hey, this place is changing and
31:04
they're they're possibly going to be compromising.
31:07
And he didn't say it that way, but I mean, you got the general
31:09
idea by how he was speaking. And I mean, you know, when
31:12
you're in the IFB and you hear someone's compromising man, you
31:15
don't touch that with a 10 foot pole, you know.
31:17
And so, and the way that you follow men and over the Lord
31:21
there, you know, so I just followed Brother Reno to
31:25
Shawnee. And then when I was at Shawnee,
31:27
I was there for a year. I mean that, that that college
31:30
was dying when I was there. And, and after a year there, I'd
31:35
finished the program with Brother Reno and, and that was
31:42
pretty cool. I drove for him while I was
31:43
there to some of his meetings. And I went to the September, I
31:47
went to the graduation in September.
31:50
He was the keynote speaker at the graduation, Ohio's Anderson.
31:54
And I drove, I drove him up there and got the set in the
31:57
that was, that was an experience that was, that was wild.
32:02
And anyway, after being there a year, I came home and I, I felt
32:08
like I had two decisions. I thought I had a decision I had
32:11
to make. I was kind of a crossroads.
32:13
I didn't want it. I didn't really want a diploma
32:15
from Shawnee. I knew that they were probably
32:18
not going to be around much longer.
32:19
And I didn't want a degree from a place that wasn't going to
32:22
exist anymore. And there were some other things
32:26
that were going on there, but I needed to get out of that, that
32:30
spot. And and so while I was there
32:35
that Shawnee was the transition, the pastoral transition from
32:40
brother Mattingly to to the Delaine to Pastor Delaney.
32:45
And so that was that was an interesting thing to be able to
32:48
be there and see and and how that took place.
32:52
But it in in moving, the decision was basically go back
32:57
to champion or go to West Coast is kind of was, was the
33:01
decisions that I had to make. And and that's kind of where
33:07
the, you know, the house Anderson really wasn't on the
33:10
table. Heartland really wasn't on the
33:12
table. And then Golden State, I didn't
33:14
know enough about it. And I knew some stuff about West
33:16
Coast. I'd heard some good things.
33:18
And and so anyway, that's where I decided to go because I, I, I
33:22
still knew that champion was was moving in a different direction.
33:26
And just, and also there was a part of me, there was some pride
33:32
in me that was like, I didn't want to leave Champion to go to
33:35
Shawnee and then come back a year later.
33:36
It's like, oh, OK, yeah, you changed your mind.
33:38
Like, I don't know. There was just something in me
33:40
that I didn't want to have to deal with that and you would.
33:43
Have been able to graduate with me and so you know, just your
33:46
loss, your loss, no big deal. Well, who knows?
33:49
I mean when you look at my my track record of pass fails and
33:53
classes, who knows when I would have actually graduated so.
33:57
So looking at those, those three colleges that you just
34:00
mentioned, crown champion Shawnee, give us like Cliff note
34:06
version, one sentence of each pros and cons of each college
34:11
that you went to. You know, I know there's some
34:13
people who really enjoyed Crown. I don't, I don't know a whole
34:17
lot of pros that I can say about Crown College when I was there,
34:20
except for, I mean, I've made some friends that I still have
34:24
to this day and I I love Scott Pauley.
34:32
When I was there and you know, I've there was it was my first
34:40
college experience and the dorms being the guys dorms being out
34:47
on Mount Moriah, that was kind of neat.
34:49
It's in the middle of the 10:00. It's at it's on the east side of
34:53
Tennessee. It's a beautiful country and you
35:00
know, I feel bad because like in my, my buddy Josh, who I went
35:04
there with, he graduated from there and he has good things,
35:07
you know, to say about it. But as far as cons, I mean, you
35:14
know, from my experience, there's just a lot of appearance
35:18
based stuff that went on there. You know, it's it's what do
35:21
things look like and and just a lot of just as long as
35:26
everything looks OK in the outward like that seemed seemed
35:30
to be pretty, pretty high on their agenda and standard.
35:36
So cons man, that seems like that seems like a lifetime ago
35:44
that I was there honestly. And yeah.
35:49
It was a lifetime. You said you went in O 6.
35:52
Yeah, yeah. I mean, that's like all you're
35:54
coming up on. 20 years ago you were at Crown, so that's a long
35:57
time to think back. It is.
36:00
It is all right. We're moving on to the next one.
36:04
Champion Pros Champion. And you know, I'm going to tell
36:08
you the truth, I love champion and I met my wife at champion.
36:11
So I mean the pros, the champion, I mean there has a lot
36:15
of pros, you know. Me, John.
36:18
Well, I mean, I wasn't even going to go there.
36:20
That's like, that's like a bonus on top of the pro, you know.
36:25
You know, the atmosphere at Champion was electric.
36:28
It just was. And now things weren't perfect
36:31
by no means, but like there was an excitement there.
36:35
Now you got brother Eric. So I mean, brother Eric's going
36:37
to bring the electric anyway. And you know, when Brother Eric
36:42
tells you that he loves you, like you believe it, man.
36:46
Like I remember, I remember seeing Brother Eric and on the
36:54
sidewalk, like he was walking in me from the church to the
36:56
college building. And it's my first semester
36:59
there. And I was like, hey, Brother
37:01
Eric. I was like, you know, I know you
37:05
don't know who I am. He's like, what?
37:08
Yeah, you're Jake Carlisle. And like, and I'm like, what?
37:11
Like I'd I'd never met this man in my.
37:13
I had never met this man in my life.
37:16
And I was coming up to formally introduce myself to him.
37:20
He knew who, I don't know how he knew who I was, but he knew who
37:23
I was. And like, when I got done with
37:25
that conversation, I thought, I thought I was the most important
37:28
person on campus. And.
37:29
And I didn't even thought that. I didn't think I'd ever even met
37:32
the man. Right.
37:32
And so like, you know, there was just the way that they did
37:38
ministry, I felt like was all in, you know, now some people
37:44
would probably say, and I may even say looking back, like it
37:47
was out of balance, but I know that they went and specifically
37:54
some people would say cherry picked, you know, to to get
37:57
their staff. And I think they did a good job
38:00
and picking the right people for the So I don't know, I mean, I
38:04
just felt like everything was was right and that could have
38:07
been maybe just me and and kind of where I was in life.
38:11
Cons at champion. They did things whether they
38:15
were ready for them or not, you know, whether that was like
38:19
bringing on too many people or bringing on staff they couldn't
38:22
necessarily pay. And I don't really know about
38:26
those the details of those stories.
38:28
I just know that those things did happen.
38:30
And so like, I'm, no, I'm not going to say like, man, this is
38:35
what they should have done or shouldn't have done, but like, I
38:36
know, I know brother Eric's heart.
38:41
He really just wants to, to love people and, and change the world
38:46
for Christ, you know, and I just don't know if that if he, if
38:51
everything got they went about everything in the best way.
38:56
So the cons would have been the way that they went about doing
39:01
things I think caused a lot of the fallout that they saw.
39:07
Johnny. Johnny.
39:09
One year there. Bro, Well, I'll tell you this,
39:13
one of the pros of Shawnee is it was, it was so small.
39:16
Like, I mean, you were family. I mean everybody whether you
39:21
liked people or not, like you saw everybody in the college all
39:27
the time. And then, you know, I would say
39:31
that the staff there was my worst pros and cons.
39:35
You know, there are some people that they were done.
39:37
They didn't really want to be there.
39:38
They, they, but then, you know, like there were people there
39:45
that wanted to be there. And I don't, I mean that I
39:47
don't, I wasn't there long enough to know all of the behind
39:50
the scenes stuff that was going on.
39:51
And they'd had a big pastoral transition while I was there.
39:54
So there were so many moving parts.
39:57
I'd say that, you know, honestly, a con was like, they
40:00
didn't seem to have a whole lot of control or a handle on.
40:05
Like, we could honestly do whatever we wanted there, not
40:10
because they allowed it, but because we were able to.
40:12
I don't know. And at the time I was in Bible
40:17
college, you know, like now I'm a.
40:20
I'm a young adult pastor and I deal with college students all
40:22
the time. And, you know, the fact that we
40:24
had a curfew and we had to sign in and sign out and all that
40:27
stuff like that's they sent that sounds insane to, to a normal
40:31
college student at a different kind of a college, you know, So
40:36
I don't know, I, I like, I want to give Shawnee some grace just
40:39
because they're kind of where they were at in the, in the
40:41
phase of of their college. But pros were the people, good
40:48
people. And, and, and I, I was kind of
40:52
checked out of college when I was at Shawnee.
40:54
So, so maybe I was the con, maybe I was the con at, at
40:59
Shawnee. You know, I don't know it, it
41:02
just, I, I couldn't see growing or flourishing there.
41:05
And so, so anyway, well, all right, so here's the question.
41:10
If you could go back and attend one of those schools again,
41:14
which one would it be and why? Well, I would not go back and
41:18
attend any of the colleges. You had to if you had to go
41:22
back. If I had.
41:24
You had to go back. Well, I would go to champion
41:27
because they're not the IFB anymore, so and.
41:32
Let me caveat on that. If you had to go back to the way
41:35
the college was while you were there during your two years at
41:41
or one year at Crown, two years at Champion, one year at
41:45
Shawnee, two years at West Coast during that time periods, which
41:50
one would you go back to? I mean, I I'd say I'd probably
41:53
go back to champions, OK. Why?
41:57
I don't know, man. It was just, it was just, I
42:00
don't know. You mean you felt, you felt
42:01
cared for there. I felt cared for there.
42:06
I mean, there were some things that you're going to have ups
42:09
and downs and good and bad everywhere.
42:11
I don't know. I just had my best experience,
42:13
you know, at that college and I met my wife there.
42:19
We didn't start dating till we till I was at West Coast and she
42:22
was done with college. But you know, so I don't know.
42:30
There was just yeah, there's a lot of connections for me there
42:32
was closest, it was closest to home.
42:38
So yeah, I had AI, probably had my some of my best ministry
42:43
experiences there too. Yeah.
42:45
All right. Well, we're going to wrap up
42:47
with the last couple questions here, sort of rapid fire. 3.
42:50
Questions. First one, what's one thing
42:53
getting back to our West Coast experience?
42:55
I wrapped up moment. What is one thing that you were
42:58
the most thankful for while you were at West Coast?
43:01
Most thing I was thankful for. I mean, they had a lot of a lot
43:04
of good preachers at Chapel, the Chapel every day and all of it
43:10
was fresh to me. I didn't know any of these
43:12
people like that was, you know, IFB being so fractured and in
43:16
circles and all that stuff. I didn't really, they didn't
43:18
know me. They didn't know my circle out
43:20
there a whole lot and I didn't know them.
43:22
So, so that was, that was really good.
43:25
And again, I think the the oral examination that we had to go
43:31
through, although I hated it at the time, I think it really
43:34
prepared me in a lot of ways that I didn't know it was doing.
43:37
That was one thing about Paul Chappell that, you know, he
43:40
brought in guys from like the Northeastern Illinois, you know,
43:45
Getz Rasmussen, some of those guys.
43:47
I've never heard of it a day in my life.
43:49
And I was born and raised in the IFM.
43:51
The whole time. So that was when I was out of
43:53
the West Coast. Even though these weren't West
43:55
Coast guys, they were, like you said, they were a circle of IFP
43:58
that I've never even heard of. They felt more balanced really
44:03
as I was there. But again, you hear some of them
44:07
and it's like, man, they were hardcore on certain issues and
44:09
there wasn't a lot of balance. But I think Paul tried to have
44:12
that balance. Brett, next question?
44:15
Second rapid fire question, when it comes to West Coast, what's
44:18
one thing you wish had been different?
44:21
OK, one thing that I wish was different.
44:23
I wish I didn't have to wear a suit and a tie every single day
44:26
of my life. I mean, it just seems so
44:29
unrealistic and out of place to like the reality of life, unless
44:34
you're, like, working it, you know, in an office in, you know,
44:39
LA or Manhattan. That just doesn't make any sense
44:41
to me, even to this day. Yeah.
44:44
All right. Last question for you.
44:47
I know you've had a lot of breaks if you've never met Jake
44:49
before. Jake is a is a thinker.
44:51
He's an over thinker on everything he does.
44:54
And so, Jake, how has all four of these colleges, specifically
44:59
West Coast, that's where you graduated from, how is it
45:02
influenced your faith as you've left the IFB, you no longer part
45:04
of the IFB, you're an SPC pastor and how is it influenced that?
45:09
And how so? How is your current outlook on
45:11
ministry? And so how is it sort of shaped
45:14
all that right now? Man, I would say I feel like
45:19
West Coast did the best job that they knew how to do to give an
45:26
education that would prepare you for ministry.
45:32
They actually, you know, instead of being like some other IFP
45:37
colleges that are completely anti intellectual, I felt like
45:40
that they tried to to actually get into some extra biblical
45:46
resources and history and just practical things.
45:52
Also just practical side of ministry that I was able to kind
45:57
of get out of my own thoughts and my own bubbles of being a
46:02
pond for somebody. You know, whether that I
46:06
received all those things, I don't think that I did or knew
46:11
how. I feel like they tried to do it,
46:15
try to get people, get people as best rounded as possible.
46:19
I would say this is that, you know, again, I know I've said it
46:25
a bunch of times, but I'm thankful for the the oral
46:27
examination. I'm thankful for the other thing
46:31
that I really appreciate about West Coast is now that I'm a
46:33
part of their alumni, I still continually get emails and
46:37
sometimes even text messages from Doctor Gech.
46:40
I know they're mass text messages, but still it comes and
46:43
it says his name on it. It does say if you need
46:46
anything, reach out. I believe that that's true.
46:50
And, you know, I kind of really separated myself from a lot of
46:56
of those things. But I would say where I'm at in
47:00
my faith and ministry outlook currently is, you know, I'm
47:06
going to, I'm a completely different person.
47:08
I'm in a completely different place than I was then.
47:14
And, you know, I would say that no matter where you're planning
47:22
to go to college or, or what your plans are, what you're
47:25
trying to do, that it's not so much about where you are, it's
47:29
about who you are. And you know, I'm a, I'm a
47:34
transformed person because of my relationship with Christ.
47:39
And I would say if you're trying to go somewhere to impress
47:41
somebody or because your mom and dad told you to go there because
47:45
a pastor or some man wants you to go there, or you're trying to
47:48
please one of those, whether somebody asked you to go there
47:50
or not, you're still going to be miserable in the end.
47:52
Because at the end of the day, it's about our relationship with
47:55
Jesus Christ. It's about him living in, in
47:58
you. And, you know, if we believe in
48:00
the sovereignty of God like we say that we do, then we're all
48:03
exactly where God want, wants us to be right now.
48:06
And he is doing the sanctification work in US and so
48:09
like to be patient with with with the work that he's doing in
48:12
us to be diligent with spending time with him and being in the
48:15
word of being transformed by the word.
48:19
And so like, if you will use college, no matter which one you
48:23
go to as a tool to strengthen your relationship with Christ
48:27
and to strengthen the call that he's put on your life to do
48:30
ministry, then I think wherever you go is going to be
48:33
beneficial. But if you go for any other
48:35
reason, because you want it to be a status or because you want
48:37
to say that you got this piece of paper or, or you want to
48:40
impress some man or woman in your life, like you're still
48:43
going to end up in a place of, of wanting and, and a place
48:47
with, you know, emptiness. Just like, you know, if Solomon
48:51
tells us, you know, it's all is vanity, you know, unless you're
48:54
going to be living for Christ and doing, doing eternal work
48:58
in, in that aspect. And so, you know, as far as my
49:00
faith in my current outlook on ministry, it's all about him.
49:04
And so it's interesting because I plan on going back to school
49:09
and I've just been talking with some folks about where to go.
49:13
And I can tell you this, none of the places that we've talked
49:16
about are on the list. And so and so if you wanted to
49:21
get more into that, we could. But you know, I do believe that
49:26
God works it all out for good to those that love Him and recall
49:31
according to His purpose. And you know, I'm glad that He's
49:35
in charge and I'm not because I will mess it up every time.
49:40
And he had a plan and he's going to see it through.
49:43
And I'm grateful that I have a God that does that.
49:47
Amen, brother. I love it.
49:49
I thought you were going to say when you started out that model
49:52
that you were transformed by a relationship with James Safer.
49:55
I really thought that's what you're going to say is.
49:57
That is that not bread? Is that not what I said?
50:00
I thought I, I, we can, hey, we can always edit.
50:04
We will edit that production side of that.
50:08
Thanks, Jake, for coming on and sharing your story and your
50:11
time. Four colleges, six years.
50:15
Not many people can say that. I don't know many people that we
50:19
went to college with. One guy that crammed 4 years
50:21
into 8A4 year degree into 8, finally graduated a couple of
50:26
years ago and he's now married. I'm sure you know who I'm
50:29
talking about. But yeah, not many people can do
50:33
six years of college at four different colleges.
50:36
But Jake Carlisle did. And there's there's some good
50:39
things we can learn from that. And I appreciate you being
50:43
vulnerable and coming on and sharing your story.
50:45
I think it's the first time you've probably ever talked on a
50:47
podcast. You used to listen to us all the
50:48
time and now you don't. But it's it's really encouraging
50:52
for us to know that. Well, I don't listen to any
50:57
podcast really anymore. I mean, it's just I I'd love to
51:01
have the time to get back to it. And, you know, to say I don't
51:04
have the time is probably not true.
51:05
I just, you know, being a dad and a husband are they are so.
51:12
But I appreciate being on here and hopefully it was helpful in
51:17
some way. I kind of feel like I'm the
51:19
worst guy to ask these questions too, because college was a blur
51:22
and and I haven't thought too much about it since then,
51:26
especially since, you know, exiting the IFBII will tell you
51:31
this funny story we got. I got married in 20 in March of
51:37
2013. I had three classes, online
51:42
classes that that I had left and I think my wife wrote a paper
51:48
for one of them. And so I went and graduated in
51:51
May of 2013 and I got my diploma.
51:56
I got back in the car or whatever after the celebration
52:01
was over. And I told my wife, I said, you
52:04
know, I think I'm ready to, I think I'm finally ready to
52:07
learn. And, and she said, well, I'm not
52:12
going to college for you. So you're not, you're not going
52:14
to any college. So, so but now I think I'm I'm
52:18
I'm ready to get my master's possibly and and getting ready
52:22
to start seeing what that looks. Like, love it.
52:25
Well, yeah, thank you guys for listening today.
52:28
Thanks, Jake for coming on. Until next time, to God be the
52:31
glory. Great things he has done.
52:35
A new name found that good grace found that healing, and the
52:41
tears fell down my face when I found my beginning and has no
52:45
ending. I found that second chance,
52:46
found my best friend, found my forgiveness, found my happiness.
52:49
I've been singing ever since and by my freedom.
53:06
Thanks for listening to the Four Freedom Podcast.
53:09
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