Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Mark McManus about his choice of The Doctor’s Wife

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Talks to Mark McManus about his choice of The Doctor’s Wife · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

0:42
Welcome to hamster, blunt penknife the Doctor Who
0:44
conference you podcast. I'm Mark.
0:47
Oh, and I'm Joe. Sorry.
0:50
Hello to rehearse. That ya know, it's when people
0:54
come on and do this now and do an intro, they do terrible
0:57
impressions of me. I did detect a little bit of it
1:00
there. When you just did that little
1:01
bit it was entirely unconscious. If I was doing that, thank you
1:06
very much for having me back. It's been it's been too long so
1:09
it's great to be back. Last time you and I told you, I,
1:12
we faced such dangers as Placing Hoover attachments and Dreadful
1:19
floor patterns. Yes it was it was death to the
1:23
Daleks which which it was yeah. One of my all-time favorite
1:28
classic stories so yeah it's good to.
1:31
She's discuss that one. You know, that recording still a
1:33
sort of my favorite ever moments podcasting was when you stopped
1:38
me mid-sentence. Wait, excuse me, you know, these
1:41
are hardened Space Marines that you're talking about.
1:49
Yeah, I think comparing them To the Space Marines.
1:52
In Aliens were always be a long time multiplied.
1:55
Somebody else, who love death to the Daleks as much as me.
1:57
Go. What was that?
2:01
It was the first doctor VHS I had.
2:03
So it was the first pre McCoy dr.
2:05
Oh yeah, we covered that in the episode but yeah I was only
2:09
about 10 so that age when you can just watch things over and
2:11
over again and not get sick of them.
2:13
So well thank you very much. We've done an adequate
2:15
marketing. Now those people are going to
2:16
Scurry off on listen to that one.
2:19
So we're very excited. And happen, though between
2:22
recording that and recording this.
2:25
And, you know, that was we met in person?
2:28
I'm glad use real life. Not just some random thing that
2:31
happened in the last year we did.
2:36
Okay, we're all the way up to Newcastle.
2:39
We went to a Doctor Who convention and went to the most
2:43
phenomenal Doctor Who exhibition inside somebody's house in.
2:47
Let me see if I can get it right Allendale.
2:50
Yeah. So in the little village of
2:51
Allendale, which is halfway between where I live in Carlisle
2:54
and a Newcastle. Neil call has built the Museum
2:58
of classic science fiction in the basement of his house which
3:01
is an absolute Aladdin's Cave of Doctor Who props from the first
3:06
seven. Doctors.
3:07
It's absolutely phenomenal II. Try and mention it on trap one
3:11
as much as possible. I try and tell every Doctor Who
3:13
fan about it because it's such an amazing little place.
3:17
Well worth visiting, if you're in the north of England, if
3:20
you're looking to romance at are elliptical or a megarian, or
3:24
even missed, or from the 2011 They're all that honestly.
3:29
It's like a treasure Trove of Doctor Who props.
3:31
I've never seen anything like it since I went to the doctor who
3:34
experience but I thought the sort of the the ambience of the
3:41
one in Allendale and he's used some sort of sound effects and
3:44
luck, he lit the goddamn right? I'm telling you you were there
3:49
I'm telling everyone that he lit the gone from Terminus in the
3:54
most creepy way. That fucking costume works.
3:59
Like I think why the hell wasn't this guy light and Doctor?
4:02
Yeah. He's no, it was it wasn't.
4:06
It was amazing. Really amazing.
4:08
Everyone should just go and check it out.
4:09
If you can't get there, then support it somehow head online.
4:13
Have a look. It's an amazing place.
4:16
I think it's fantastic because you've got the, the new
4:18
exhibition, the worlds of Wonder at the moment that was in
4:21
Liverpool, as we record, it's in Edinburgh and they've got an
4:24
amazing array of props and costumes.
4:27
But in Ireland, there you've got the ones that, you know, would
4:29
never be in a big exhibition like that, like, the plasma tan
4:32
and even tiny little things like the ferrule cufflinks from
4:37
worries gate, which you know, somebody is satin crafted that
4:41
for that costume and they still exist and they've got their own
4:44
little plinth and everything. It's just yeah she's beautiful
4:46
to see all our turned a corner. Just as we were heading towards
4:49
the exit and there was this bloody terrifying heme of or
4:53
looming down at me scared, the bloody life.
4:55
And can you imagine what he tells a lie?
4:56
Lights out. I know it.
4:57
He's got a go around. Yeah, it's all right.
4:59
I think staring a honestly, not amazing place.
5:03
It was rich man. And it was incredible to meet
5:06
you as well and a lovely lovely day.
5:09
Yeah, it's great to meet you and Mark as well, which was yeah,
5:12
it's lovely after a podcasting together for a few years really,
5:14
really good to me in person. What are talking of podcasting
5:18
together, that's why we're here today.
5:20
Why don't you tell everybody, what choice assignment we have
5:24
today? We have one of my favorites.
5:29
Matt Smith Stories, the doctor's wife.
5:32
I think it's not only one of my favorite.
5:35
Matt Smith episodes, it is in my lady.
5:39
My top three new series episodes ice is a unique thing.
5:46
Can I confess? I do like from the off.
5:49
I might have given you a spoiler about as last weekend but this
5:52
is one of two episodes to that I can stomach from the Series 6.
5:59
So this is absolutely like a diamond in the rough for me but
6:04
it's almost like all the all the goodness sucked into the
6:09
doctor's wife. You know, are feeling you're a
6:11
lock, I know you love them off error.
6:13
So I've got a feeling you'll find her on the series Sixth and
6:16
I am I do. I love Series 6.
6:19
Yeah. Well, what is the one that you
6:20
can stomach? The God complex.
6:23
The God complex. Yeah, they'll start to belches
6:26
but yeah I do love the whole series yet.
6:28
So this is this is just another high point for me, in a strong
6:32
series but this apart from a few references the only water in the
6:39
forest is the river and a few a few touches like that.
6:44
There's no there's no Arc elements and it's at all is it?
6:47
And I think that's why I like this and that's why I like the
6:49
God complex is they are stand-alones man.
6:52
Anna, bloody good as well. Well this originally was going
6:56
to be in series 5, it was going to be the episode before the
7:00
pandorica opens and the the way that the Tardis talks about
7:04
things that going to happen, it was going to be warnings about
7:07
the Tardis being destroyed in the pandorica.
7:09
Opens, then for Budget reasons, it was held over 24 series 6.
7:13
So those those parts were that would change to that point.
7:15
So the like say the very minor Arc points are at the beginning.
7:21
I mean Rory talking about having seen the doctors death in The
7:25
Impossible Astronaut and then like, say the the little clue
7:29
about River song as well. Are you trying to tell me that
7:32
we could have had Vincent and the doctor, the doctor's wife
7:36
and then the pandorica opens back-to-back.
7:39
Yep. That was the original plan, only
7:43
way you could. I mean, I do like the larger a
7:45
lot, but that would have made season 5 in series 5 even
7:50
better. Yeah.
7:52
Under The Oaks a lodges are probably a lower budget episode,
7:54
isn't it? So I imagine that's why it was
7:55
slotted into into there and this one then you was going to cost
7:59
more. So it was held over for a year.
8:02
Before we press play on the episode.
8:04
I've got one very important question for you, because you
8:08
thought about digging on this. I mean, you've done a little bit
8:10
of research. Yeah.
8:13
Yeah. I like to read the complete
8:14
history. Yeah.
8:14
Before a podcast, about an episode, The people on you sound
8:19
this one, you know, so they're being very impressed by your
8:23
knowledge. But how much of this is Gaiman
8:28
and how much of this is Muffy all?
8:30
Do we not know that? It don't think we know, I don't
8:37
think that it's really, at least we've talked about, is it?
8:40
I don't think, I don't think Steven Moffat talks about the
8:42
amount that that he did. He rewrites anybody, or anything
8:46
like that. Reading the complete history.
8:48
I think a lot of the influences it because gaming is a massive
8:51
Doctor Who Family Classic Doctor, Who fan and there's a
8:54
lot of stuff in there which is influence from the classic
8:57
series. And he's called to the saying,
8:59
well, I took that from there. Like, the, the whole idea about
9:03
the corsairs, tattoo is based on Pertwee, having a tattoo in
9:07
spearhead from space. Oh wow.
9:09
So he does he does. He knows his onions about Doctor
9:12
Who I think one of the things that it's urgent completely
9:15
stories Originally, it was more about house and less about
9:20
Idris, right? And the Tardis wasn't of
9:23
decanted into Idris and about halfway through the episode, I'm
9:27
offered said, well, that's kind of what it's about.
9:29
You need to do that in the pre-title sequence because
9:31
that's kind of the heart of the story, which is obviously a
9:33
really sound kind of advice because that is the, that's the
9:38
heart and sold the story, isn't it?
9:39
I remember Moffat sale, she wasn't a confidential by
9:43
vividly. Remember him saying about the
9:46
titles? Of episodes and how it's
9:48
important hook people in with the top of the episodes.
9:52
So you know you might you could probably call this all those
9:54
heart of tardis or something like that but the doctor's wife,
9:58
you know, that's like a gossip column heading, isn't it?
10:01
Yeah, well, it's it was originally called bigger on the
10:06
inside all the way through shooting and it was only in
10:09
post-production that they changed the name to the doctor's
10:12
wife, which is a reference to the John nathan-turner thing,
10:15
isn't it? When he was trying to NG to
10:17
figure out who was leaking from the production office to the
10:20
fanzines. He put a fake story title on his
10:24
on his white board, or whatever. If I wasn't white board in the
10:27
80s was it. But yeah, you people at the
10:29
Doctor's Wife by Robert Holmes to see who had been in the
10:32
office and then how quickly it sort of leak into a fanzine to
10:35
try and try and see who the other paranoia on another level.
10:40
Yeah, we've had the doctor's daughter, hadn't.
10:44
We're gonna have The wedding of River Song and all of this the
10:48
husbands are River Song. You know, all these tiles that
10:52
often. The dots wife is a sound tile,
10:55
okay? Said we'll never know, really I
10:58
mean imagine if maybe 50/50 the rumor of hers and it is just a
11:03
rumor is that Moffat did a lottery right in here and then
11:07
game and got a lot of the accolades.
11:10
And then when it came here in silver, he was all fine.
11:14
You're on your own now. I mean it didn't work out quite
11:19
as well, do it? It didn't.
11:22
It's not a popular as popular and episode.
11:24
Is it a nightmare in silver? And I've seen these are very
11:28
gentle way of putting it. Yes.
11:30
Yeah. I seen interviews with Neil
11:32
Gaiman where he puts it down to not having been involved as
11:37
much. Like he wasn't at the tone
11:39
meetings and that kind of thing to steer it in the way that that
11:43
he wanted to. It's the rarest.
11:45
I think that I think Shirley directed new series episode and
11:49
that is ghetto death for the new clothes.
11:54
Yeah, definitely quite rare. Yeah, well, oh, Mark.
11:56
We should probably press play on this thing.
11:59
I'm excited to stay alive. When I watch this fact, the
12:02
imagery in this thing that that decaying graveyard of
12:07
spaceships. I remember first watching this
12:11
guy, we're in a whole nother ball game.
12:12
You know, ball game now, baby. It looks amazing.
12:16
It's gorgeous, isn't it? Or let you count as income on?
12:19
Let's go. Let's do it.
12:21
Okay. So pressing play in 3, 2 1 and
12:28
we've still got the sound on good grief. so, coming in, you
12:34
were telling me off mic about gaming Style, Sort of.
12:40
Yeah. So so what do you think about
12:42
it? He's got a very sort of quirky
12:47
Quirky style doesn't have dialogue and everything like
12:50
that. Which I know some people find a
12:51
little bit jarring or could be too much.
12:55
I think quite like every single Watch.
12:57
The Sandman series is quite late coming to it on Netflix, which
13:00
is not updation of his graphic novels.
13:03
Okay. And I think that probably is
13:07
kind of a, you know, a good example of his work and you
13:10
know, kind of strikes, the balance just just right.
13:12
I think that's a really, really good series because it's quite
13:16
dark. Dark and everything.
13:17
But you need the little bits of sort of quirky humor, as well.
13:20
To balance that I said to you about Stardust.
13:25
I really love them. And I read the book of Stardust
13:28
as well, and I can see the influence of that in this as
13:33
well. This sort of very imaginative
13:36
world, the sort of weird steampunk technology, you know,
13:41
things sort of Cobble together the the magic element as well.
13:46
Yeah, yeah, I love I've read. All of his books are read
13:50
American Gods and a Nancy boys, which I think American Gods is
13:54
now TV series, but I've never seen it.
13:56
I'm think it's on Amazon things that Lovejoy in it, but she's
14:01
usually the Nancy boys. It's called Anna.
14:04
See boys. So I Nancy is the god of spiders
14:08
or something like that. I think.
14:09
And I can't remember which theology it's in.
14:11
But it's I suppose it's that supposed to play on that.
14:14
Isn't it a Nancy boys? How cute is this with this Cube?
14:19
Coming into the Tardis. It's brilliant, isn't it?
14:22
And again, this is something that is something that that Neil
14:27
Gaiman remembered from the classic series.
14:29
I think he's setting a few interviews that the war games is
14:33
a really, really memorable episode for human and always
14:36
kind of shaped him in terms of his imagination, his writing and
14:39
things. So he wanted something from the
14:41
war games and I said that's the the telepathic Cubes at the
14:44
doctor summons, the Time Lord. Odds with at the end of that I
14:49
just love Matt Smith's it's close up on his face.
14:52
Eric, I've got mail. Yeah, this is the first time
15:00
that there's any reference to time Lords being able to
15:02
regenerate between genders as well when he talks about.
15:05
Yes, I know is that? Yeah.
15:08
So obviously that's going to come in important in the future.
15:11
You know, it might do might do one day.
15:16
I'll have the reference here. You have the, the guard change
15:20
in hell-bent, don't you? Yeah, we have Missy before that.
15:24
Don't we in series 8? But I suppose the thing with the
15:28
master is that, you know, you've seen the master as a body
15:31
snatcher a few times as well, because he took over tree Moss,
15:34
his body and then Bruce's Body in the TV movie.
15:37
So, I suppose even then, even with Missy turning up its
15:40
ambiguous about whether it's a regeneration or or kind of
15:44
body-snatching. So, yeah, this kind of
15:47
definitively says that, you know, regeneration can can
15:50
switch three male and female something happened after twice
15:54
upon a time? I can't remember, but it was
15:56
something to do with the same thing.
15:58
Is it rings a bell actually. Yeah, something like that.
16:00
Is nice. So, again, this where this would
16:04
have taken place in series 5 whether dr.
16:07
Lee You say, it talks about leaving the universe into this
16:10
little kind of pocket bubble Universe.
16:12
It would have been originally through one of the cracks in the
16:15
universe. That would be the theme running
16:18
through Series 5 and house was going to been this sort of like
16:21
single-cell creature that that slipped through a crack and
16:26
ended up in this bubble Universe where it grew and became more
16:29
powerful and and fed on anything else that sort of slipped
16:32
through into that universe as well.
16:35
So yeah, it's quite interesting entire is that does sound
16:37
really? Exciting.
16:38
And I can see why that would work.
16:41
I really love this as a standalone, though.
16:42
I think it has more re-watch ability as a standalone.
16:47
Yeah, I don't think those elements would have been a big
16:49
part of it, but yeah, it was just how it would have fit into
16:53
two serious Vibe, but it, because I think a lot of souffle
16:55
maybe towards the end with them, finding the crack, or seeing the
16:57
crack somewhere. So, suppose it just have been
16:59
the doctor saying. Oh, that must have been how that
17:03
arrived. So, this first scene here, where
17:06
they arrive at the TARDIS, That Vision that spaceship
17:09
overhanging the Tardis, it's gorgeous, isn't it on a previous
17:13
podcast we talked about arrival from Cybertron, didn't we?
17:18
The the autobot spaceship that crashes into the side of that
17:22
either mountain or volcano where it's crashed like that and you
17:26
can just see the back of it with the, for kind of Rocket things.
17:30
That's what that really, really reminds me of every time I watch
17:32
this, I thought he was going to tag you read from the complete
17:35
history there. That's how he described it in
17:36
the script. Just like them.
17:41
But come on, like, like in our wildest dreams in the classic
17:44
series, we would never have a visual as Imperial even in
17:49
stuff, you know, when they don't like Matt shots and things in
17:51
Frontiers and things like that. Yeah, the same sort of thing,
17:55
but it just looks that cinematically good.
17:59
It is, it is, it's yeah, it looks absolutely amazing.
18:03
And I think the in the inspiration for this as well is
18:07
You know that the TARDIS landing in a junkyard, in the story
18:11
where it becomes sentient is a reference.
18:13
To the first time we ever see the Tardis being in a junkyard,
18:15
I think one of the working titles was that the junkyard, at
18:18
the end of the universe or something like that, I was
18:21
talking the other day with sigh ha, and he was saying about how
18:27
we kind of missed the doctor that sort of knock things
18:31
together our gubbins at the, you know, this sort of eccentric and
18:34
motoko improvises all the time. And instead we've gone into the
18:38
sort of lonely God and it happens with David 10 and a half
18:41
hours with Matt Smith and his son, Absalom, Peter Capaldi, you
18:43
know. Trying to make them Mythic and
18:45
huge but I think in this episode he Taps back into that so
18:50
brilliantly and that's later in the episode but it's such a up.
18:53
The soir thing is one of the best Matt Smith over sizes in
18:56
terms of characterization for so many reasons but that's one of
18:59
them. Yeah no definitely and I really
19:03
like the way he's so flummoxed by Idris here as well because
19:07
she's she's just saying things out of order.
19:10
She's saying lines that would come later in the story.
19:14
And, you know, the thing about the little boxes will make you
19:16
sad and that kind of thing, I'm his face is just brilliant in
19:20
these things. I think so clever dialogue.
19:23
Like that pressing do, it means you can go back and re-watch it
19:26
again and take more from it. Initially, I was just like how
19:30
she was this mad woman gone on about it.
19:34
Oh, Mark, it's a nude. Yeah, it's always good to see
19:38
the you doesn't it? They look great.
19:40
It's gonna be a nerd. That feels like a might be a
19:43
budget thing because I got the costume.
19:45
It was, it was a budget thing. Steven, Moffat said to Neil
19:49
Gaiman, you can use any alien from, you know, that we've
19:52
already got a costume for. And apparently, he immediately
19:54
said, dude, because I had, they're so cool, but they and
19:58
then if it's what you need here, is it something that looks a bit
20:00
mysterious but also Sinister as well.
20:04
I think it has the most Gross food moment ever where they
20:10
cleared the tendrils and you can hear a joke.
20:13
Oh yeah, it's just horrible. When it's dark in the Tardis and
20:17
their yeah, Amy's trying to feel away in there.
20:19
Yeah, you know a part of the visual palette I love in.
20:23
This is the lighting one of the best lip.
20:27
Like especially I could forgive me but that Dreadful glass and
20:31
chrome Tardis that he goes around.
20:33
Didn't through his first two and a half Seasons, I can't bear it.
20:36
It. But when they turn the lights
20:37
down and it's suddenly hugely atmospheric and so certain
20:41
console as well, later on. Yeah.
20:44
And he said green theme throughout his like the Terrance
20:46
dicks thing, isn't it? Of green is the color of
20:48
monsters and it's all whole story, suffused with kind of
20:52
green light. I'm going we got action figures
20:59
in the I just remember in this we got action figures of Uncle,
21:02
didn't we? And Idris and the and the kind
21:06
of junkyard Tardis console, the doctors going to build later on
21:09
so don't be too surprised. I did action figures of Grandma
21:12
Colony commonly from the idiots lantern with no face.
21:17
Hey Davis. That feels like when it was in
21:19
its absolutes of peak popularity, where's this?
21:22
I'd forgot. They were still making obscure
21:24
characters. This must be the last season,
21:26
where you are getting that kind of one-off supporting character
21:30
action, figure. Wasn't it, can you remember the
21:33
nerve of them? Bringing out destroyed
21:35
Cassandra. Yeah.
21:38
Well, I was a panel at a convention.
21:40
It was of what convention in Manchester and they had a couple
21:44
from character options. There was a really interesting
21:46
panel and somebody asked about that and it was because
21:50
Woolworths had asked for some exclusive figures so that where
21:55
they were only on sale Awards. It's obviously.
21:58
Yeah. Tell you how long ago.
22:00
It was because they closed in what 2009 or something like
22:04
that. I think I'm I think destroy
22:05
Cassandra. My bad side.
22:08
Probably dead. Probably brought them down so
22:11
because they think they just had a, you know, a fairly short time
22:13
to pull these things together. So they did with that was that
22:18
was how the destroyed Cassandra came about.
22:20
And I have a lock, there were wolves because I don't know if
22:23
you remember back in the day when they brought out the vhss
22:26
and it was exclusive Woolworths VHS and what did they choose?
22:31
The twin dilemma I do. I mean I'm surprised at that
22:35
point. I remember in the TV movie came
22:39
out, they had the exclusive glow-in-the-dark cover for that
22:42
as well. What of the twins ulema?
22:45
No, of the TV movie. Oh yeah, I remember going down
22:51
after six form on the day of release to see if they had it in
22:54
and it wasn't out on the shelves and I was like, no.
22:57
So, I went and asked and they're like, oh yeah, we got some big
22:59
Ideas, get it. Like it's something like 10 days
23:02
before the broadcast but the boys anyway, the winter watch
23:06
them. You know, the screen and the
23:08
midnight. Whatever that's going to knows
23:10
the DVD coming out. I'm gonna do the VHS.
23:13
It was coming out at midnight and they went down the town to
23:16
get it, right? Joking.
23:18
Lastly, I mean I probably would have done that but I do what the
23:21
world would try live. Definitely weren't opening at
23:24
midnight for every doctor. I think the only had two copies
23:26
in OG you know, there are some people out there that will
23:29
consider you and me talking about 20 Island where the TV
23:32
movie, whilst we're watching the doctor's wife and I yeah, And I
23:37
can, I ask you about the whole lot of the time those things
23:40
because it's something I find very synonymous with tenants
23:43
doctor because it was such a big thing during those three
23:46
seasons, but I actually think it works.
23:49
That's what of whole. I'm the last of the time Lords
23:51
Heath really thinks he's going to see a Time Lord here, doesn't
23:55
he? And then that whole scene where
23:57
they open the thing and all the boxes that was not wonderful as
24:00
terrified and they're all screaming, help me help me, you
24:03
know? It's yeah, it's a really Old
24:07
insane, isn't it? I can't remember when I first
24:09
watched it whether I was kind of thinking are we going to see
24:11
time Lords? Because that would've been
24:12
amazing. I guess we would have kind of
24:15
thought. Well, if there are they're
24:17
probably not going to survive this this story.
24:21
But yeah, it would have been great to see some more time laws
24:23
at this point. I think, and it much Miss just
24:25
plays it brilliantly, doesn't because that optimism.
24:28
It's really well explained as well as soon as no time, I was
24:30
left in the universe but this isn't in the universe or there
24:33
might be these sort of conclave of them that are hidden away.
24:37
Here. So imagine if it opened the
24:38
doors loads of people and the big collars and you know the
24:42
fans are there with their usual list is surrounding it.
24:45
So yeah, you know it's as my owner older carnation.
24:53
Oh my God. Sorry, I was about to ask, get
24:55
excited about all that green gas going around the Tardis.
24:57
I just love the imagery in this. Yeah, it's great.
25:00
And you could Michael Sheen as the voice of house in this as
25:04
well. I think, because he had a
25:05
connection with Neil Gaiman that there were, there were friends.
25:08
So he asked to do this as well. It's such a creepy good kind of
25:15
villainous voice. Isn't he really puts everything
25:17
into it? It's both like fantastic because
25:20
I think it's a memorable performance.
25:23
And it really irritates me because I think Sheen is such a,
25:27
like, a memorable physical actor, but I would love to see
25:31
him in amazed. He's still good because he's
25:33
just a voice saying, you know? So it's yeah, that's it.
25:36
Yeah, and there's people who've been in, even in the new series
25:39
more than one now, isn't it more than once?
25:40
So yeah, they should definitely try and get him in it.
25:44
Be good if they got him in the specials, actually, the upcoming
25:47
60th anniversary specials because she's got that
25:50
connection with David Tennant from Lumens per good Omens yet
25:56
which countries is Neil Gaiman. Yeah, it was sweet.
25:58
A practice as well as temperatures.
26:00
One of my all-time favorite. Although I could have failed.
26:03
What I watch? Soccer field, Neil Gaiman.
26:04
Scrubby fingertips all over it. Ya like, it was like a good
26:08
Fusion of the two. Yeah, it's yeah.
26:11
I love that guy. I love the book.
26:12
I think it's probably the first first game and all Pratchett.
26:15
That I wrote, they have a red and yeah, it's a book.
26:18
I've read a few times over the years.
26:19
I've really loved it I thought was at those really good
26:21
adaptation so I know They did that staged as well, didn't they
26:25
tenant and my hands. Well, so detention one of those
26:30
I think she was yet these two characters helmet but I forgot
26:39
their names. Well, the names until Uncle,
26:42
thank you. So simple, not together like,
26:44
oh, I should remember that one of things.
26:48
I love about this as well. Is it they're a bit ghoulish?
26:50
Aren't they? Because they're made out of old
26:52
bits of the bit like morbius? It's yeah, people.
26:56
Yeah, I guess probably an influence as well.
26:58
Isn't it obvious ones to or even?
27:02
I was a henchman called in that where he's got I think opiates
27:10
and know he's arms been used as an it for the for the movies
27:13
wants to us or our condo condo. Yeah, I loved it.
27:19
Smith's line there and house you don't think as you got to let
27:23
me. Yeah and that hand he's got that
27:27
massive hand. Doesn't she yeah?
27:30
Yes or no action figure for unti just for uncle's bit sexist,
27:34
that's sexist and he's got. I just think that looks like the
27:38
ear. It looks like The Destroyer,
27:40
doesn't it already maybe a Draconian or something is about.
27:43
I love is just like it's an old fashioned like a Napoleonic
27:46
suit. He's wearing, it's okay, it's a
27:51
great kind of mishmash. And then just just before this,
27:53
I love the Tardis calling the doctor.
27:55
Her Thief such a good idea of how how she would think of him.
28:00
Absolutely brilliant. Well, there is an exchange
28:03
later. I'm going to spoil it now.
28:06
I mean this is a lot nicer than but where she Has to him.
28:10
He goes, what are you never took me where I wanted to go.
28:14
And she says, I always took you where you needed to go, and it's
28:17
one of the most perfect, two lines in the show.
28:20
It is, isn't it? It's great because it is
28:23
explains the previous 50 years of Doctor Who?
28:27
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.
28:29
Why does something happened? Every time I arrive, somewhere,
28:32
wiser, always, aliens there or something.
28:34
I used to count it. When I was a kid, I used to have
28:36
kind of an idea when I was reading the target books.
28:39
That. Because the doctor install, the
28:42
Tardis that that she was trying to kill him and by taking him
28:48
into dangerous places, it's just kind of like a weird bit of
28:52
headcanon that I had when I really like that.
28:54
Why are they always, you know, kind of Landing somewhere where
28:57
there's life or their situations?
28:59
And I kind of had this idea that yes, she was deliberately trying
29:01
to kill him because he's stolen a.
29:03
I'm surprised they didn't go well, but yeah you Cal back.
29:07
You took me to a dress on. I had a miserable time.
29:09
I'm you know, I died at that time.
29:14
Now it's that is such a great exchange.
29:17
Yeah, it's nice of him. Even like the, you know, kind of
29:20
edge of Destruction, everything like that, it ties into all that
29:23
right from the beginning of the series, doesn't it that the
29:25
Thai? This does have an element of
29:27
sentience and the fact that the Tardis and the doctor have been
29:33
the two constants throughout the entire show?
29:35
He has always said or sort of from Pertwee on with I said,
29:39
I'll go, you know, and so the fact that this story has taken
29:44
this long to happen is actually quite surprising.
29:48
Yeah, definitely. And you could only, you can only
29:51
have this where the, the essence of the TARDIS is put into a
29:54
woman really, as. Well, kind of a lonely kind of
29:55
makes sense because it's always like to say it's always old girl
29:59
and referred to as a. She I'll tell you.
30:02
This is like the opposite of Journey to the Centre of the
30:06
TARDIS. I think the doctor's wife and
30:07
Genesis like they're both got big ideas.
30:09
Is that their heart ones were meeting the Tardis for the first
30:11
time we're going to talk to a one is we're going to explore
30:13
the Tardis. One works like gangbusters and
30:18
is visually arresting. Yeah the other one is Journey to
30:21
the Centre of the TARDIS. Yeah but I'm saying it's not a
30:25
guarantee that this sort of thing will work.
30:28
No definitely. Yeah.
30:30
And it one of the things that will give anything it wanted to
30:32
do was to see a bit more of the TARDIS because this is the first
30:35
time other than the Wardrobe room.
30:38
I think in a Christmas Invasion. It's the first time we've seen
30:41
beyond the console room as now. I think in the new series, what
30:44
we see here works better because you get a weird spatial
30:47
disorientation, don't you? It's like the corridors going
30:50
off in every direction. Up down left, right?
30:54
It's yeah, it is really cool. And then seeing the old the
30:59
tenant era control room as well. It's brilliant.
31:03
And this was a specific thing that the game had asked for the.
31:07
I think based I think inspired by the line from time crash
31:11
about the the desktop themes. So the idea that would be
31:14
archived somewhere so they kept the tenant era One open and
31:19
people are asking about it because they had to keep it all
31:21
through Series. 5 people are. Asking why it was still there
31:24
and it was all kind of a big secret stuff that it was going
31:26
to be. They literally asked for it to
31:28
be kept up. That's as I understand it.
31:30
Yeah. From yeah.
31:32
From what I've read and that's suppose, that, that would be
31:33
when I went to dr. Experience after that, I guess I
31:37
really love the fact as well that the and he does it a lot in
31:41
the new series because he does it with Clara couple times.
31:44
He certainly does it arose in the partner?
31:45
Why is he does it with Amy? And Rory.
31:47
Here, he sends him back to safety or what he perceives to
31:50
be safety. Yeah.
31:52
Realize he I sent them into the most terrible Danger.
31:57
The the yeah, it's, yeah, but backfired completely doesn't it.
32:02
And Oh, now he's realized. So yeah, the then the he's going
32:16
to put together this this makeshift console room.
32:19
Here again, a deleted scene. I think budget-wise that they
32:22
couldn't do was, he was going to survive activate, the Sonic
32:25
Screwdriver and then all these bits and pieces around the the
32:30
the junkyard we're going to be tardises.
32:33
The the Chameleon Circuit was working so they were all going
32:36
to sort of Shimmer. And so it's going to be like,
32:39
you know, kind of done all cars and things like that, they're
32:41
all just then going to turn into the Tardis.
32:43
You know that the smooth white kind of default, settings are
32:47
thing, which would have been a really lovely scene.
32:49
I think I didn't have the money for it.
32:52
Yeah, I think. Yeah, I want two things.
32:53
They had to they had to pull back on.
32:55
It is worth remembering that you know a man, I got a decent
32:59
budget. It is not Unlimited in the new
33:01
Syria know that and what they achieve what they have.
33:07
Is pretty rare. Absolutely.
33:09
Because even the Tardis is flying through the vortex, all
33:12
that is, you know, kind of new effect.
33:14
So they had to create asthma. Aha, bring up a bit of a phony
33:17
subject now. Okay.
33:20
So, and it's to do with The Arc of the first half of this
33:24
series. Well, that's not Amy Pond, is
33:27
it? No, it isn't.
33:30
That's right. Yeah, I'd forgotten about.
33:32
Yeah, where that? Where this lies?
33:35
Yeah. And I'll talk no, I don't know
33:38
why but it's not a problem for me in this episode.
33:43
Yeah yeah it's easy to forget isn't it unless you're watching
33:47
the series in order? Yeah.
33:49
That she's she's a flesh Avatar, isn't she?
33:53
Hmm. Yes, hello.
33:57
I mean I do quite like that idea.
33:59
I think it, I think it is a, it is such a cool idea that All
34:04
through the first half of the series that you've had this,
34:08
this this fake company and in places, I've done discussing
34:12
this to death and I think, you know, I think, you know, we
34:16
ain't going to be in a course. I want to be super positive on
34:22
this world. You always call me sexy when
34:26
we're alone. Yeah.
34:28
Because that's that's Matt. Smith says that at the end of
34:32
the 11th Hour doesn't he when he He's when the first time he sees
34:37
the new Tardis control room, when he walks in, I think it
34:40
says you sexy thing or something like that.
34:42
What I just said envisage like Hartnell clutching his lapels
34:45
while everyone's out and going. Hmm, 6E trout, and going sexy
34:51
thing. You see.
34:57
You complete this doctor. Yeah, I think so, but yeah, you
35:01
never know, you never know. We write about this this room
35:06
looking so good. In the green lighting, it's so
35:09
much more atmospheric, isn't it? Well, but, a lot of the, they
35:12
all look better in lower lighting, you know, when the
35:15
enlightenment. Yeah.
35:18
When they, when they do that, sort of a sort of orange light
35:21
in that one, isn't it? It looks gorgeous.
35:24
Doesn't it is Choice when it's all covered in ice.
35:31
Remember that and it's for blue light.
35:34
It looks great. Yeah.
35:38
Look, I know it sticks in my mind is Gary, Gary gillette's
35:42
description of this. This particular interior, the he
35:46
says it looks like the inside of migraine and that always sticks
35:51
in my mind. What are the trouble is?
35:53
I think Mafia era goes from the worst console, to the very best
35:59
console in succession. Yeah.
36:03
Yeah. It is Michael pick world comes
36:05
in. Isn't it that the design, the
36:07
next, One. And yeah, I absolutely love it.
36:09
And then when when Capaldi's sort of changes it up again and
36:12
have the bookshelves looks, absolutely beautiful.
36:15
Well, he's pick woad came in during Christmas Carol and they
36:20
are, you know, I love serious. Father, I am wrong, but I think
36:23
visually there is a shift in Series 6.
36:27
You know, Impossible Astronaut day of the Moon, looks fantastic
36:32
first. A black spot.
36:33
Regardless of what it is that the script is quite atmospheric
36:36
Lili and it looks great. Eight revelational, most people.
36:40
I mean, they were very dark story.
36:41
I think this half season is very dark.
36:44
Mmm, but, you know, equals atmosphere generally Definitely,
36:52
I'll try to build a motorbike in your bedroom.
36:57
This dog is gold in it. And then this this console of
37:02
putting together is it was a blue Peter competition, okay?
37:06
So the the actual controls and everything on it, I think it was
37:11
a little girl that that they came up with it and then they
37:14
got a visit to the set and all that kind of stuff.
37:18
What did you do that again? So now, faster and Jenny and
37:26
Strax when they all kind of various devices, share like a
37:32
Sonic hat pin or something. Like they they're all kind of
37:34
designed in a blue Peter competition as well.
37:36
I think it's going to be a bit more of that again, you know,
37:38
now, Rusty those as back and not forgetting, of course, the
37:41
meteoric, success of the absorber love.
37:45
Yes, yeah. No, I was going to ask you, what
37:49
do you think about the relationship then between the
37:53
doctor and Idris what works? So well about it?
37:57
I think it is gold. Yeah, I think it's the dialogue,
38:03
isn't it? It's It's yeah, it's the doctor.
38:07
You know, just can't believe he's, you know, he's, he's
38:10
constant companion. It's the, you know, the one
38:13
being that's been with him forever is combined means of
38:16
come and gone and then yeah, you can't quite believe that he's
38:18
getting to to speak to her. And but yeah, it's they've also
38:23
got like, is when the doctor meets himself?
38:25
They've also got slightly fractured relationship, all the
38:27
stuff about, you know, it says pull to open and you always push
38:30
the door and her and all that kind of stuff.
38:33
Yeah, it's just so brilliant but it is very A movie.
38:35
A particular the end. It's very, very moving as well.
38:38
I think it allows Matt Smith to show every shade of his
38:42
character from being utterly, exhausted related to being very
38:45
angry. You know, typical hugely comical
38:49
and then he breaks your heart of the end as well.
38:52
Hmm. As there are many scenes in Matt
38:56
Smith's home that really get me in the heart, but the end of the
39:00
doctor's wife gets me every single time.
39:04
Yeah. Yeah, I agree.
39:06
It's yeah, it's brilliantly acted and we talked about our
39:11
off mic but we haven't actually talked about it with in the
39:13
episode that saran Jones's performance idiosyncratic as it
39:19
is. Is unforgettably good?
39:23
Yeah I think it's great and and what was sort of saying earlier
39:26
it's nice for her to do something.
39:27
A bit different to these of a TV dramas that she's the, she
39:31
normally does kind of week in week out, isn't it?
39:33
I read. Nothing is in the complete
39:35
history as first time she'd ever done green screen.
39:38
So, you know, it's kind of a slightly different kind of
39:41
discipline for and everything. I think I'll send you off mic
39:44
about how you hear these stories about actors.
39:48
I think, happiness, patrols full of it.
39:49
Full of actors are done. Dreary soaps and things their
39:53
whole lives and then take you to Terror Alpha.
39:56
Now, put some makeup on your face and you get to miss.
39:59
Well, this is another great example of that.
40:01
If she's always doing, you know, they saw procedural, dramas and
40:04
things like that suddenly, no, we want you to be the living
40:06
embodiment of a time of the spacecraft, you know.
40:10
Okay. So what's my motivation then?
40:15
yeah, I think all through doctor, you can see why they,
40:19
you know, the actor's voice, queued up to be on it, it's
40:22
easy, the Kudos from the kids or the grandkids or let's say just
40:25
a chance to do something completely different and that
40:29
you say, it's the costumes and the makeup and the Make-Believe
40:33
But you know, so this is no guarantee there that the
40:37
chemistry between the two of them, it's going to work why
40:39
verse around Jones and Matt Smith.
40:41
And they struck Lucky in this definitely, it's an important
40:46
one as well. It's the doctor in the Tardis,
40:48
you know, it has 21 and it does. Yeah, you were gonna say, then,
40:54
The yes, it was like, foreshadowing, doesn't it seeing
40:57
the old Rory? And he says, you know, you left
41:00
me, it feels like a bit. Like I don't know how far it had
41:05
this stuff as planned, but in time, The Angels Take Manhattan,
41:09
isn't it? Where you've got old Rory who's
41:12
been kind of left alone in that hotel for for his whole life?
41:16
And he's an old man with the, the angels kind of feeding off
41:23
his energy and everything. So this this bit where the the
41:27
junkyard control room is just a console, really?
41:31
He's flying around. Apparently was inspired by
41:36
Inferno where the doctor takes, the Tardis console on its own
41:41
into the other Universe. Wow, gamer was really paying
41:44
attention Willy. It really feels like it.
41:46
Yeah, when you, when you read completely Street, he's yeah,
41:49
he's really kind of mug pied or lot of stuff from his childhood
41:52
which really really stuck with him.
41:55
So, yeah, and it's great because it's all these memorable things
41:59
that, you know, come together in one episode to make a really
42:02
memorable cool episode. I think I was going to say that
42:05
line there where she says, oh my beautiful widgets, you had what
42:10
you have always had and then she kissing and touches the thing.
42:13
And she's got our eyes glowing like that is enough to justify
42:16
the episode for me, just let alone anything else.
42:20
And this bit here, we've all sort of died.
42:22
A me kill way me screwed. All over the wall that is
42:26
terrifying. It's Grim, isn't it?
42:28
Yeah. It's like The Shining isn't it?
42:30
When you knows, their Jack Torrance, has written the same
42:34
thing over and over again. I think Moffat, don't mind the
42:37
show going very dark, you know. Definitely.
42:42
Yeah, obviously it gets darker than this.
42:44
Doesn't it sounds even the capella Tiara, but don't cremate
42:47
me. Mark, don't cremate me.
42:53
So this was a budget thing as well here with the, with the
42:56
telepathic controls, as a way of getting through to Rory, because
43:00
originally they were going to be firing those timelord message
43:03
cubes from one task to the other messages as well.
43:09
But this works really well because she goes, oh, pretty
43:11
wobbly because yeah, but you know you saying, like thank you
43:20
for saying because I don't know what's sort of budgetary on nor
43:24
none of it shows in the as I was watching it, I didn't feel I was
43:28
watching like a scaled-back version of what we could have
43:32
had No, definitely. I think it, I think is a higher
43:35
budget than normal and it was part of his weight is held over.
43:39
But yeah. I think given gay man's
43:41
imagination and you know, they did have to scale back from that
43:44
because obviously a very imaginative writer.
43:47
And if you see the Sandman on Netflix knows, it's create this,
43:51
the dream of the dreaming. I think it's goal, which is the
43:52
world that he lives in and it's absolutely extraordinary directs
43:57
this. This is Richard Clarke and as it
44:01
does, he directs any others, Yeah, he directed a few before
44:06
this one and I'll tell you need directed curse of the black
44:09
spot. You know, he could have done, I
44:11
think he did gridlock. If memory serves, did he that's
44:17
another visually visually stunning episode?
44:21
Yeah, I actually think I actually think he is from near
44:25
where I live as well. I think he's from Cumbria.
44:28
I think he's following on Twitter.
44:32
Hey, I think. Definitely cancel a black spot
44:34
as well. And I was just about to say you
44:36
know you never know. Is Potluck with these scripts on
44:38
it. Like yeah I'll do any doctor
44:42
right. We've got this fabulous one
44:44
here. About Pirates.
44:47
Yeah. This is one that you'd want.
44:49
You'd want a safe Pair of Hands for isn't it's one that you
44:51
want. Yeah, kind of very, very
44:55
visually inventive director as well for what I think.
44:58
There's there's a lot happening in six.
45:02
But I think this is probably like the showpiece episode.
45:06
Yeah, definitely. And just give them a gay man's
45:10
name on it as well. I think this is something but
45:13
you know any website or something at the time you talked
45:15
about, you know, you like the idea that he was bringing new
45:18
people to Doctor Who like helping new people to discover
45:20
it who were just kind of fans of his writing.
45:22
That, that we're going to come aboard.
45:24
You know what? That sounds so exciting that
45:26
this time, though. Richard Curtis, Simon, I and
45:30
even better, you know, His choice, I think is great.
45:33
So is Vincent and the doctor sews this Yeah, definitely.
45:39
So so just found this Richard Clarke previously directed
45:44
gridlock and the Lazarus experiment.
45:47
I'll just those two. Yeah, they need to but it
45:50
mentions because the black spot is Is before after this before
45:58
before. It isn't.
45:59
It's a story before directly before, isn't it?
46:00
Yeah, of course. It is.
46:01
It. How will they go?
46:02
Sorry, folks. See, I told you they can come
46:04
rehearsed. I'll make it out now.
46:08
Oh, this is clever. Isn't it all the different
46:10
things that she mentioned earlier in the episode is what
46:12
gets them into their concert. Yeah, and that it's it's not
46:16
just spoken thing. They've got to feel it and think
46:19
it. Yeah, it's Simon breathing a
46:21
sigh of relief when I saw this console guide.
46:23
Oh yes. Yes.
46:24
Can it not come back? I just want to take a moment to
46:30
talk about Karen Gillan, just very quickly because I am not
46:34
the most complimentary person when it comes to Amy Pond.
46:38
But I do think Karen Gillan is a terrific actress and part of my
46:42
problem is is sometimes she's too good.
46:45
And there are some very harrowing scenes that Amy goes
46:48
through and I'm in that sort of disadvantageous position of
46:52
going. Is this too much?
46:53
Because she is Is really selling the fact that she's about to
46:57
give birth in this tube and all these terrible.
47:01
But boy, oh boy, does she sell those things in the Tardis?
47:05
Where she's around horrified, and, and, and Rory's coming at
47:09
her and Yeah, I think I think I think it's better to sell it
47:14
then I'll for sure. I don't know if you should go
47:17
there in the first place. That's part of my problem.
47:19
All right? Sue mean, ya know, like, I think
47:22
doctors should be scary. I think, you know, it's it
47:25
should be sort of unsettling and scary and you know that was, you
47:29
know, when I was a kid, you know, it's kind of out made me
47:30
feel, I think. And I personally don't think
47:33
that's a problem. You won't be disappointed with
47:35
the second episode. We're going to watch tonight,
47:36
then. I remember that sequence with a
47:42
console lands in the tenant are, this was in the trailer.
47:46
Yes, yeah, Kyle its tenants consult with the tractor.
47:50
Yeah. Yeah.
47:52
I think I think people thought 10 it was going to come back for
47:54
an episode of Sunday and that line when, when they realized
48:00
that the the Ood that nephew has been vaporized by the the
48:05
console materializing. And the doctor just goes another
48:10
Udo. I failed to save, it's quite a
48:12
dark line but he delivers it quite kind of eccentrically as
48:16
well. That's the difference between
48:19
Matt Smith and pick Capaldi again, the second episode we're
48:22
going to watch. He has some similar lines.
48:24
Yeah. Yeah that's true.
48:26
Actually here when he says they're your breathing him in.
48:28
Yeah. That is yeah.
48:29
Similar to align in the next one.
48:31
Definitely. Look at the all that console is
48:34
so gorgeous. So, lonely here as well.
48:40
Yeah, I like that. I like the way it's late here.
48:42
Like the easy. It emphasizes more, the light
48:44
that comes off. The panel's doesn't it, which is
48:46
actually really nice. Also, like the fact that we're
48:49
never any doubt that interest is only going to be in this episode
48:52
from almost a second. The Tardis is inside the woman
48:56
we're told she's only got a sort of a finite lifespan.
49:02
Yeah it does you know we're heading the tragedy at some
49:05
point. Aunt.
49:06
Yeah, yeah. She's not going to become a
49:08
companion or anything like that. Yeah.
49:11
Now we rather needed to get us from A to B, though, you know.
49:14
Mmm. Yeah.
49:18
So there's another thing that that Neil Gaiman wanted to put
49:22
in it called again, Gardens complete.
49:23
History was a bit of a Chase through the Tardis for a me
49:28
which would have included having to swim through the Tardis
49:30
swimming pool like in like in the Invasion of Time.
49:35
Which is another kind of a touchstone for this.
49:39
But apparently the set of all Karen, Gillan can't swim.
49:41
So we can't do that. And again, I think it's also a
49:43
budget to thing but it's going to play into the resolution
49:46
because at the start to get to the other Universe.
49:49
The doctor said he's got to burn up some rooms like he does in
49:51
logopolis, and he says, are there, goes the swimming pool.
49:55
And then when she turns up and she's wet, he realizes that the
49:59
swimming pools back and it's like a quiet one, but it's some
50:04
to do played into the resolution.
50:05
Way that house, did we stored these rooms?
50:07
So, there's that extra power they could use or something
50:09
along those lines. Anyway, nevermind para, the
50:12
doctor cherry picking every single part of class Neil
50:16
Gaiman. Got there first, definitely,
50:19
definitely with this one. Yeah.
50:20
Oh, you know, we haven't actually because we can't hear
50:23
it. Oh, I can't anyway.
50:24
The music, which is again, amazingly, but this bit here
50:29
where Yugi goes. Goodbye address, goodbye doctor.
50:32
And then there's this like this piano playing as we cut to the
50:35
Exterior. The Tardis you're like, okay,
50:37
how the hell are they going to get out of this?
50:40
It's really effective. Mark.
50:45
Oh, I think this sequence in a second in a episode, which is
50:49
packed full of memorable scenes. This scene in a second is one of
50:54
the best moments in Doctor Who where she at the Tardis leaves
50:58
Idris and start flying around the console room and he's like,
51:03
are and what he's saying? Now, I'm going to quote some of
51:05
it when it comes, it just fills you with like, optimism and hope
51:09
it's exciting. Yeah, it's amazing.
51:12
So I know I'm using a few superlatives here but it is
51:16
gorgeous, isn't it? And the light changes as the,
51:18
the Tardis reasserts are so that I remember that line being in
51:21
the trailer, the doctor just said a moment ago, when, when he
51:27
says fear me, I've killed hundreds of time Lords and the
51:30
doctor goes, fear me. The I've killed all of them.
51:33
I remembered that one being a trailer and it's a great line as
51:35
well. And it's yeah.
51:37
Like you say it's if Capaldi had delivered a moving very, very
51:41
dark and threatening, wouldn't it?
51:43
What if tenant who you know, is my favorite new series Doctor,
51:45
Who would have been agonizing, it would have been all teeth and
51:48
yeah, yeah, yeah. I says, here you took her from
51:53
her home. And now she's a box again and
51:58
she's free. I just love this and it's like
52:03
the Regeneration energy isn't it?
52:04
The golden light is like the Regeneration enemy which energy,
52:08
which kind of makes sense of that thing.
52:10
Even in the first regeneration that the doctor says, all, the
52:13
Tardis is healed me, or the account quite one, which said,
52:17
you know, the Tardis. I can't survive a tardis or
52:19
something and then, obviously, so many re Generations have
52:21
taken place inside the Tardis. Probably most of them thinking
52:24
probably right in saying, so That kind of same kind of energy
52:28
flying around, makes sense knows.
52:30
Well, that line. There it goes.
52:32
What is it? Sighs?
52:33
Our size of a planet, but you are just so.
52:36
So, ah, and Joe, and I'm not the most praiseworthy about, Matt
52:41
Smith's anger acting. And I've had lots of people tell
52:46
me that I'm wrong about that many debates.
52:51
But he Nails it here, but not as much as he now see.
52:55
Emotion. Now, yeah, I think it's really
52:58
interesting that Matt Smith's post Doctor Who career.
53:03
He always memorable roles have been villains.
53:05
Then if you seen last night in SoHo nice, I've seen a
53:08
communist. I saw him as Philip in the
53:12
crown, right? I haven't seen that basically
53:15
have a load in that I was horrible, right.
53:20
Last night. So it really, really good
53:21
performance. And then most recently in the
53:24
Game of Thrones, so pretty. The series House of dragon as
53:27
well. He's he's really good in that
53:31
really, you know, I loved him as a doctor but it does seem now
53:34
like he's he's main thing is going to be playing villains
53:38
because that hasn't seen it but the film morbius I think he's a
53:41
vampire or something in that. I hear it's a terrible movie and
53:44
he's like the best thing in it. Yeah I can imagine that but I
53:48
get the question. He's a villain in that as well.
53:50
So it does seem like that that you know I haven't played the
53:54
doctor really early in his career.
53:56
That's not how a bit of an outlier playing the plainly, the
54:00
claimant could guy. Yeah, I mean, I've had people
54:04
say this is a bit much. This thing I think is very
54:06
restraining. Their saw trying to hold back
54:09
the tears and and I love it that the word that she's trying to
54:13
find his hello as well. Yeah, because it's that whole
54:18
thing of her speaking in the wrong order in time.
54:21
So this is the first thing that she would have said to him.
54:24
It's the last thing. It's did you say right in the
54:28
beginning? What is that word?
54:30
Yeah. That I love a shot of the TARDIS
54:34
just floating through space, like that as well.
54:36
Like that kind of hacked back to the the classic series doesn't
54:38
it was a model on a string or something.
54:41
I just adore him underneath the Tardis and that harness with
54:45
those goggles on piglet. I mean, that's just a doctor in
54:48
a team in when Jodie Whittaker at all.
54:49
Those bits hanging out the tile this and Shadow got ya.
54:52
It just screams of the doctor there.
54:55
Yeah. Piglet about with wires Yeah,
54:59
it's great reminds me of Pertwee as well when they had the, you
55:02
know, the the console out of the out of the TARDIS shell for all
55:06
those stories, just kind of tinkering with it.
55:07
Working on it, great. We don't want war in the forest
55:13
is the river. Don't get me started.
55:15
Alright, do not get me started. What species are they are she
55:21
telling you the twist of a good man?
55:22
Goes to war coming up. Yeah and I love that.
55:26
There's one thing I love well middle of those things about
55:28
Moffat writing but that thing of hiding things in plain sight or
55:31
hiding it as a joke or a clue and then it becoming you know,
55:36
kind of really important like the the thing in the Asylum of
55:39
the Daleks about the souffle you know where do The eggs.
55:42
It's Kind of a Funny line because not the sort of thing
55:45
you would not be questioned in a science fiction show, but then
55:47
it becomes absolutely crucial that she would be able to get
55:50
eggs in it and a lot of it was real.
55:51
It's humiliating to do Asylum of the Daleks, you know.
55:54
Then you can tell me why I'm wrong about that one definitely.
55:58
Yeah, I'd like that. We're deep breath for me.
56:00
I had a very ill opinion of that, and then I talked about it
56:02
with you for an hour and a half. And now, I really like it.
56:07
You're just too Charming. I can't disagree with you love
56:10
deep breath as well. Are there any good curiosity?
56:21
Are there. The site saying?
56:23
Are there any you don't like our curiosity?
56:27
Oh yeah, plenty, yeah, we'll talk Kathy goes up top of my
56:33
head now. Yes.
56:36
But the caretakers not favorite seems like, which is I love
56:40
series 8. Yeah.
56:42
Okay, caretaker isn't really favorite, I like just dead on
56:44
its thing about the bunk beds there, that the doctors kind of
56:47
so innocent that he says it's probably him in Rory in a room
56:50
with bunk beds. I think he's thanks called.
56:52
There's too much hanky-panky going on and that's how it is at
56:54
the moment. Yeah.
56:55
Jay and he's turning in his grave right now.
56:59
Well, it doesn't stop them as it because that was the whole thing
57:02
about why River has has Time Lord Add properties because she
57:07
was conceived in the Tardis wasn't sure.
57:10
That was the, yeah, you know, I'll see you in a commentary on
57:15
the ROM has recently, right? And I was talking about mom
57:17
being chased around the palace by Nero and I said, yeah, you
57:21
wouldn't have that these days. Would you, you would have Amy
57:23
Pond being chased around by a sex Pest and my guess we're know
57:27
she'd be the one doing the chasing.
57:28
Yeah and it's true but that is the difference with the new
57:33
series, isn't it? Definitely Oh, Julie welcomed
57:36
sight, right? We just had the most Exquisite
57:39
time. They're talking about that,
57:40
absolutely classic episode and had to go and bung a trailer for
57:44
The Rebel flesh on at the end. Oh yeah.
57:46
That's what I'm not keen on. Yeah, a bit of say yeah, the the
57:49
gang. A two-parter ball away again, it
57:52
looks who 6. But, yeah, that's, that's not
57:55
favorite. Well, that Mark.
57:57
I mean, we have just wax lyrical about a doctor's wife there for
58:01
an hour, but now, we've got to find three reasons of peace.
58:05
This, I know it's been a year, but you still know you got to do
58:08
this, right? Yep.
58:10
Okay. Will not come back and forth
58:12
start with you. So yeah.
58:16
I think surround Jones is yeah. She's perfect casting in this as
58:22
it dries. I think we've talked about this
58:25
before. Remember the time somebody
58:27
described as a pound shop Helena Bonham.
58:30
Carter. It was American who wasn't
58:32
familiar with with its punch lands.
58:34
His work. But I think that's, that's a bit
58:37
cool. I don't think that is the case.
58:41
Yeah, I can't think of anybody else.
58:43
Who would have played that part as well really?
58:45
That, you know, it was kind of around at that time.
58:47
And if you want to see how diverse is an actress, she is so
58:50
go and watch our playing the Mona Lisa in the Sarah, Jane
58:53
Adventures, is this a world from each risk?
58:58
It is and she's I think probably even since then she's become
59:01
much higher profile actress in the UK.
59:02
She's she's the star of lot of TV shows like vigil, she was the
59:08
main character in dr. Foster.
59:12
There's another one. Isn't there of everything
59:13
trailers for a? She like a highway woman or
59:15
something like that. Oh, I know the one you made, ya
59:19
know. She's knocked out.
59:21
A couple of very well-regarded TV shows and mirror that
59:25
gentleman jacket is called, isn't it?
59:27
I don't know if she's dressed like a woman in it.
59:32
She's having sex with a bunch of women are thinking that one.
59:35
That'd be all right. Okay, nothing.
59:39
Oh sorry. Well for my first one.
59:43
Yeah, when Y is minus 1. I am going to shock you and say,
59:51
Matt Smith. Who is going to shock you?
59:55
Do you think it's marvelous, but it's very rare for me to put it
59:58
in my favorite things in there. So it's just one of his best.
1:00:01
He's quintessential. Doctor, he's putting the unique
1:00:09
position, the only doctors got to speak to the Tardis and that
1:00:13
relationship doesn't disappoint. He gets a show every single
1:00:18
shade of his character. He's very funny in this at the
1:00:21
beginning, he's awesome. Use a stick and Tigger ish.
1:00:23
Like he normally is and then he gets to be really angry and then
1:00:28
he gets to have our fantastic confrontation with the villain
1:00:32
and then he gets to have a brilliant moment of optimism
1:00:35
when Idris heads back into the tireless.
1:00:37
And then he gets an emotional moment as well, like he is.
1:00:42
You know, if anyone wanted to disregard my argument that Matt
1:00:47
Smith is the worst doctor of all world and they can just, they
1:00:51
could just make me watch Watch the doctor's wife and I will be
1:00:54
wrong. Yeah, I think, I think game and
1:00:57
appreciates what a good actor is as well.
1:00:59
I think having because because of the way that this original
1:01:04
script was pushed back as soon as he had the opportunity to see
1:01:07
Matt Smith in action in series 5.
1:01:09
So then he could tailor a bit more to his performance and and
1:01:13
which has any a nightmare. And so, you talked about stories
1:01:15
are real, like nightmare in silver would be another one, but
1:01:19
I think he does try and make the most of Matt Smith by giving him
1:01:22
that Jewel role in nightmare in silver.
1:01:26
Which you know, it's got to kind of really stretch an actor I
1:01:29
would imagine, you know, kind of playing two characters at the
1:01:32
same time in one scene in one body and everything.
1:01:35
It's yeah. So he does he does play to Matt
1:01:39
Smith's abilities in our life. We're having such a lovely time
1:01:42
there. Why did you have to bring out
1:01:43
library and silver again? Oh, I'll wash your second mum.
1:01:49
It's just give me the look of the story hasn't.
1:01:51
It's just visually amazing all the way through.
1:01:55
Through there isn't there isn't any part of it.
1:01:57
It doesn't just look beautiful. Like say even the console room
1:02:00
which isn't a favorite looks way better than it normally does we
1:02:03
get to see Tardis corridors, which we have not seen in the
1:02:06
new series up to this point. The junkyard just looks
1:02:09
fantastic. It's yeah, it's a visually
1:02:12
stunning stunning story. My second one then is the
1:02:17
concept of the doctor and the Tardis building a tardis out of
1:02:22
dead tardises which is the sort of thing like that books used to
1:02:27
do. They used to have big Ideas like
1:02:29
that I never thought I'd say that sort of on-screen and and
1:02:33
the fact that I do it and it all looks like a massive cheek
1:02:36
lash-up like the classic series as well.
1:02:39
I just love it so that's my second thing.
1:02:42
Yeah that that is really good and yes.
1:02:44
In the books used to have those in the eighth doctor Adventures.
1:02:48
You had sentient. Tardis is, didn't you saw it?
1:02:50
Well, that's maybe an influence on that as well.
1:02:54
Yeah, you had the house he Compassion or so I can't quite
1:02:56
rare. Yes.
1:02:57
Action is the doctors Tardis for a bit?
1:02:59
Yeah. All right.
1:03:00
I enter, I don't want to go there.
1:03:02
I'm honest, it's the most things pulling Michael Sheen.
1:03:09
I think, you know, he's a huge name because even at this stage,
1:03:13
it's been a lot of He says, and if he was in Frost Nixon and
1:03:17
he's in the Underworld movies and that type of thing.
1:03:19
So is it is a big name and even as you see, you in those very
1:03:22
physical actor. His voice in this is silky and
1:03:27
menacing and yeah, it's just, it's a fantastic performance
1:03:32
just just through voice alone. But yeah, hopefully, one day
1:03:34
we'll see him in the series in the flesh as well.
1:03:38
My last thing again is very unconventional thing for me to
1:03:44
say, but it is the lack of ego of Steven Moffat bringing in
1:03:50
King Prestige writers to the show like Neil Gaiman and
1:03:55
Richard curtains and Simon My Writers so good.
1:03:58
They could possibly show him up a little bit.
1:04:02
Now, by all accounts that didn't happen here and he did have a
1:04:06
hand in this story. And maybe like the fusion of
1:04:11
Moffat and Gaiman is what makes is so good.
1:04:14
Because Steven Moffat is a genius, but just just the fact
1:04:19
that, you know, we cherry pick some of the best writers that
1:04:22
are out there to come in and work on this.
1:04:25
Forgive me, Tatty, science fiction, sugar, as just amazing.
1:04:31
It's amazing that it happens that they said, yes.
1:04:35
And you know, have you seen Vincent and the doctor The
1:04:38
doctor's wife, you know, and I think there are a few other
1:04:41
examples as well. So just just that choice to
1:04:44
turn. Basically to aim high rather.
1:04:46
Yeah. Wearing our, where Stephen
1:04:48
greenhorn, you know? And Chris chibnall.
1:04:51
Yeah, yeah no. Yeah, I completely agree and I
1:04:55
guess food food. Neil Gaiman.
1:04:57
Yeah, I probably should have mentioned is one of the best
1:05:02
major stage of his career that he was a supposed to write for
1:05:07
somebody else's sure. And B script edited and take
1:05:09
notes. I guess he probably was used to
1:05:12
a level of autonomy where, you know, he he probably had a lot
1:05:16
more say over his project. So again, in terms of like a
1:05:20
lack of ego, I guess that's, you know, that's to his credit as
1:05:23
well. But I mean, I think this is his,
1:05:27
I cannot miss out on this opportunity writing.
1:05:30
Yeah, you know, given all of those influences from those
1:05:34
classic stories that you were talking about.
1:05:37
This is clearly. We ingrained in this man.
1:05:39
The Doctor Who is the best thing since sliced bread?
1:05:42
So, yeah, because he'd written for Babylon 5.
1:05:45
I think he wrote in it. At least one piece of bubble.
1:05:47
How back against him? Mark.
1:05:48
Come on. Why?
1:05:51
I enjoy Babylon 5. I could I know you don't like me
1:05:54
to say this but I enjoyed it more than Star Trek.
1:06:02
Everyone's welcome here on hamster, you know, but yes, was
1:06:07
he did. Written for, you know, kind of
1:06:09
TV show like that before. But that's got to be a good like
1:06:12
20 years earlier in his career, you know, compared to where he
1:06:15
was at this stage. Well, that was marvelous, great
1:06:20
time doing it. But you and I have got an
1:06:23
appointment with a fantastic shrinking machine.
1:06:29
I believe we're going to be inserted into a Dalek, what you
1:06:33
tell everybody where we're going next?
1:06:37
We are going into the Dalek. I mean if people didn't get that
1:06:41
from what I just said I'll be. Yeah.
1:06:46
So we're skipping forward. What?
1:06:47
Two seasons. Yeah, that's right.
1:06:51
No, this is Series 6. So we're going to yeah, series 8
1:06:54
yet. So it's only two seasons, isn't
1:06:56
it? Yeah, you did deep breath.
1:06:57
Now, we're doing into the dolly if someone's doing season eight
1:07:00
and older. Okay.
1:07:01
Yeah. I'm gonna hear a lot of here on
1:07:02
that. Well, you ready to do that?
1:07:08
Absolutely, let's do it Josh. I'll cut it there.