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Jeff Gordon Talks His Rivalry With Dale Earnhardt + Rainbow Warrior NASCAR “Villain” | Racin' · Bussin' With The Boys

• 0:19
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• 1:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: So look, man, we want to just start off with
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: the Rainbow Warrior era like and.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: Then for people to know we we were sitting with
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: the man that's changed Nascar.
• 1:31
  Speaker 3: I mean we changed, I mean changed it. Obviously. I'm
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: a Californian kid.
• 1:37
  Speaker 4: Growing up watching Where are you from California?
• 1:39
  Speaker 5: From Los Angeles?
• 1:40
  Speaker 4: Okay?
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, but I actually lived in San Francisco too,
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: because you know I played for the forty nine ers.
• 1:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: He loves we played for the nine ers too. Everywhere
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: we go, He's like, hey, you.
• 1:53
  Speaker 5: Got to be proud of the California right.
• 1:55
  Speaker 4: Heck yeah no, I'm a big forty nine fan.
• 1:57
  Speaker 5: Yeah yeah, we know you come from Baleo, Californi.
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: So you know when we talk about the Rainbow Warrior,
• 2:04
  Speaker 3: you know that's what I remember. You're saying, a California
• 2:06
  Speaker 3: kid with a young face come in with the attitude,
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: and because you know, at this time they was saying
• 2:12
  Speaker 3: that the sport was more like a regional, southern regional sport,
• 2:16
  Speaker 3: you got a Californian kid coming in wearing the colorful uniforms.
• 2:19
  Speaker 5: Tell us about the.
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: Rainbow era, a Rainbow Warrior area, and what did that
• 2:23
  Speaker 3: mean to you?
• 2:23
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, listen, I was kind of sprung into
• 2:28
  Speaker 6: NASCAR when I didn't expect it. I mean, I just
• 2:32
  Speaker 6: I grew up in California, and I liked all forms
• 2:35
  Speaker 6: of racing, but I was really more open wheel racing,
• 2:38
  Speaker 6: you know, sprint cars and dirt tracks and Indy five
• 2:42
  Speaker 6: hundred and things like that. Of course, I knew who
• 2:45
  Speaker 6: Dell Learner was, I knew who Richard Petty was, but
• 2:49
  Speaker 6: it wasn't until I moved to the Midwest, to Indiana
• 2:52
  Speaker 6: and the racing started just taking off to the next
• 2:55
  Speaker 6: level that I really just started looking at NASCAR and
• 2:59
  Speaker 6: going right, this seems to fit way better for me,
• 3:02
  Speaker 6: an Oval Trak guy, far.
• 3:04
  Speaker 4: More than Indy cars and even the Indy five hundred.
• 3:07
  Speaker 6: And got you a lucky break to come down here
• 3:10
  Speaker 6: to to Charlotte and and take like a racing course.
• 3:16
  Speaker 6: And then and then I got an offer to go
• 3:19
  Speaker 6: run a few races. That was in nineteen ninety and
• 3:23
  Speaker 6: next thing I know, a year and a half later,
• 3:26
  Speaker 6: I'm meeting Rick Hendrick signing up with Hendrick Motorsports and
• 3:29
  Speaker 6: going Cup racing for Hendrick Motorsports, and our sponsor was
• 3:33
  Speaker 6: DuPont and they're like, hey, listen, we're a paint and
• 3:37
  Speaker 6: refinished company. We're going to just splash colors all over
• 3:42
  Speaker 6: this car and boom, you know, and the Rainbow paint
• 3:45
  Speaker 6: scheme came about, and then the success came in ninety
• 3:49
  Speaker 6: four ninety five, our first championship. We go up against
• 3:52
  Speaker 6: Earnhardt in ninety five and win that championship and that's
• 3:55
  Speaker 6: that's when the Rainbow Warriors were truly born. And you know,
• 4:00
  Speaker 6: it was just a crazy time for me because it
• 4:04
  Speaker 6: was if you look at it that way, it was
• 4:06
  Speaker 6: five years from the time that I got introduced to
• 4:09
  Speaker 6: NASCAR to being a NASCAR champion, and so it was
• 4:13
  Speaker 6: pretty overwhelming, and you know, becoming arrival of Dale Earnhardt
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  Speaker 6: and everything else, and then the fan base and the
• 4:21
  Speaker 6: sports blowing up and going, you know, now now we're
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  Speaker 6: not just in the Southeast. We're going to Indianapolis, We're
• 4:29
  Speaker 6: going up you know, into Boston area. We're going more
• 4:34
  Speaker 6: in the midwest, southern California. They were already racing in
• 4:37
  Speaker 6: Sonoma area. But it just seemed like everywhere we went
• 4:42
  Speaker 6: they couldn't put enough grandstands in just packed houses, one
• 4:47
  Speaker 6: hundred plus thousand every single weekend. TV ratings are getting,
• 4:51
  Speaker 6: you know, bigger and better. The sponsors were getting bigger,
• 4:54
  Speaker 6: and it's an amazing time, amazing time to be a
• 4:57
  Speaker 6: part of the sport. And if you look at I mean,
• 5:00
  Speaker 6: you could kind of take ninety four when I won
• 5:02
  Speaker 6: my first race here in Charlotte. The second race was
• 5:05
  Speaker 6: at the Brickyard four hundred. You know, that inaugural event.
• 5:08
  Speaker 6: Event was so huge, and really the sport was already
• 5:13
  Speaker 6: in a good place, but that Indianapolis race, I think
• 5:16
  Speaker 6: just took it to another level. And so being the
• 5:18
  Speaker 6: winner of that was amazing. But just that time to
• 5:24
  Speaker 6: be a part of NASCAR's growth and be on top
• 5:28
  Speaker 6: of it because we won I don't even know how
• 5:31
  Speaker 6: many races we won from that May of ninety four
• 5:35
  Speaker 6: all the way through the end of ninety eight, even
• 5:36
  Speaker 6: into ninety nine, we were averaging about ten races, ten
• 5:40
  Speaker 6: race wins every year.
• 5:41
  Speaker 4: So a huge piece of my.
• 5:47
  Speaker 6: Ninety three wins happened in like a five year period
• 5:50
  Speaker 6: of time where we were just totally dominating.
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: I mean that was the era. And not only was
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: that the era, you were the polarizing figure, good bad,
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: had all of it. Like you were the guy, like
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: you mentioned earlier, Like going back to the word overwhelming,
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: what was it like for you being the California kid
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: going against like this old guard Nascar, being the polarizing figure,
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: having the colorful race car. Like when you say overwhelming,
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: what things are you thinking about back in that time
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: when you're kind of carrying the weight of being this
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  Speaker 1: guy who's kind of against old Nascar.
• 6:23
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean I had had plenty of success in racing.
• 6:26
  Speaker 6: I mean along the way, I was fortunate that, you know,
• 6:31
  Speaker 6: I had fast race cars and won races, and even
• 6:34
  Speaker 6: when I got into sprint car racing, I was so
• 6:37
  Speaker 6: young that I was sort of the young kid, you know,
• 6:40
  Speaker 6: being thrown into this at that time. I didn't have
• 6:43
  Speaker 6: as much success in that as I did in NASCAR,
• 6:46
  Speaker 6: so so to be the young guy wasn't a big
• 6:49
  Speaker 6: deal to me. I was kind of used to that,
• 6:51
  Speaker 6: to have that much success that quickly against these you know,
• 6:55
  Speaker 6: legends in the sport and then get introduced to what
• 7:01
  Speaker 6: it was like to have And I never thought of
• 7:04
  Speaker 6: it as me and Dale as rivals, or me and
• 7:06
  Speaker 6: Rusty as rivals.
• 7:07
  Speaker 4: It was really our fans were rivals.
• 7:09
  Speaker 6: You know, the grand stands they spoke and and the
• 7:14
  Speaker 6: fans they made it very clear who who their allegiance
• 7:18
  Speaker 6: was to, you know, whether it was Ford Chevy, whether
• 7:20
  Speaker 6: it was Ernhard Gordon, whatever it was. And so I'm
• 7:24
  Speaker 6: I feel like I'm doing everything right. You know, We're
• 7:26
  Speaker 6: winning races, we're winning championships, and yet the booze kept
• 7:29
  Speaker 6: getting louder and louder and louder, and I'm like, man.
• 7:33
  Speaker 4: What did I do wrong?
• 7:35
  Speaker 6: And it took me a while to embrace that or
• 7:37
  Speaker 6: understand that, a long time, actually, you know, ten years
• 7:41
  Speaker 6: probably before I appreciated it. So so being young, having
• 7:47
  Speaker 6: the success that quickly. Obviously, you know, the money was
• 7:51
  Speaker 6: coming in like it had never come in before too,
• 7:53
  Speaker 6: so you're you're also trying to manage that. Luckily, I
• 7:56
  Speaker 6: you know, I had a great foundation with my parents,
• 7:59
  Speaker 6: my stepdad, and that helped me manage that well. But
• 8:01
  Speaker 6: I still, you know, I was young, maybe plenty of mistakes.
• 8:05
  Speaker 6: I got married young at that time, moved down to Florida,
• 8:09
  Speaker 6: and that was that was you know, a whole nother
• 8:13
  Speaker 6: level of craziness, and you know, got my own airplane
• 8:18
  Speaker 6: and the sports thriving and we're thriving within it. And yeah,
• 8:22
  Speaker 6: I mean, honestly, I look back, it was just a blur.
• 8:25
  Speaker 6: It's just an absolute blur. Things were happening as quick
• 8:29
  Speaker 6: as they were, and we were going to the racetrack,
• 8:31
  Speaker 6: especially in ninety eight. I mean that year was just
• 8:34
  Speaker 6: lights out insane. I think we the entire season we
• 8:39
  Speaker 6: averaged like fifth or sixth place finish. I mean, we
• 8:44
  Speaker 6: just it just was nuts. And so at that time
• 8:48
  Speaker 6: you're overwhelmed by how is this happening?
• 8:51
  Speaker 4: Is this real?
• 8:52
  Speaker 6: Because you know, I just got here and and so
• 8:57
  Speaker 6: it was a lot of fun, amazing time in my life,
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  Speaker 6: but also you know, a huge learning curve of growing
• 9:05
  Speaker 6: up and not just racing. The racing thing was kind
• 9:08
  Speaker 6: of taking care of itself. It was all the life
• 9:10
  Speaker 6: lessons that were happening behind the scenes.
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: Just like you said in the early nineties, you know,
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: you rose to your championship really fast, right, just you
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: winning all these races in a small period of time.
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: Was it difficult feeling like a villain or in a
• 9:23
  Speaker 3: traditional fan base?
• 9:26
  Speaker 6: Again, you know, the Booze were sort of at first.
• 9:30
  Speaker 6: So I'll go back in ninety four. I'm pretty sure
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  Speaker 6: it was ninety four. We were in Sonoma and road course,
• 9:39
  Speaker 6: and you back then driver introductions, they would basically put
• 9:43
  Speaker 6: you with another driver in the back of a vehicle
• 9:46
  Speaker 6: or a truck, introduce your cross stage, put you in
• 9:48
  Speaker 6: the vehicle, and then you ride around the track and
• 9:50
  Speaker 6: wave at the fans. And in ninety four, I was
• 9:53
  Speaker 6: riding with Earnhardt around the Snowma Racetrack for the intros,
• 9:58
  Speaker 6: and you know me, I'm I'm just just a punk kid,
• 10:02
  Speaker 6: just got here a year ago. You know, yeah, I
• 10:04
  Speaker 6: think I by that time, I probably had won one race,
• 10:07
  Speaker 6: but I still was was. You know, I'm sitting with
• 10:09
  Speaker 6: the legend Earnhart and so one on a sponge of information,
• 10:14
  Speaker 6: just intimidated by him. Not just because he was the intimidator,
• 10:17
  Speaker 6: but just because I.
• 10:18
  Speaker 4: Wanted to be like him. I wanted to emulate him.
• 10:21
  Speaker 6: In so many ways and have the success that he had,
• 10:23
  Speaker 6: even though I knew our personalities were different and our
• 10:27
  Speaker 6: upbringings and all those things. So We're going around this
• 10:30
  Speaker 6: track and I'm seeing signs with a three and a
• 10:34
  Speaker 6: you know, a circle and a line through it.
• 10:36
  Speaker 4: And they're booming, and I'm like, I'm like, what is
• 10:40
  Speaker 4: going on?
• 10:41
  Speaker 6: I expected it just everybody to be unanimous. It's earned
• 10:46
  Speaker 6: heart and we're cheer for him, and so I said,
• 10:49
  Speaker 6: I'm like, man, what's up with that? And He's like, kid,
• 10:52
  Speaker 6: as long as they're making noise, and they're making a
• 10:55
  Speaker 6: lot of noise, you know whether it's good orbout And
• 10:56
  Speaker 6: so that always stuck with me. So a coupany on
• 10:59
  Speaker 6: now a year or two later, and the booze are
• 11:02
  Speaker 6: growing for me, and I always just in the back
• 11:04
  Speaker 6: of my head long as they're making noise. Longs they're
• 11:07
  Speaker 6: making noise, but it's hard for that noise not to
• 11:10
  Speaker 6: get the best of you on on certain days, you
• 11:12
  Speaker 6: know where.
• 11:13
  Speaker 4: You're just like man, really like like.
• 11:17
  Speaker 6: I thought, I did everything right to this point, and
• 11:20
  Speaker 6: the booze are getting louder and and and now I
• 11:23
  Speaker 6: look back on and go thank God for that. Like
• 11:26
  Speaker 6: I you know, we all talk about rivalries and sports
• 11:28
  Speaker 6: and and you want people to have somebody to cheer
• 11:32
  Speaker 6: for and somebody to cheer against. You want those people
• 11:36
  Speaker 6: to be in the grand stands. I was just a
• 11:40
  Speaker 6: World Cup. I went to World Cup final on Sunday,
• 11:42
  Speaker 6: and you know, to see those two fan bases just
• 11:46
  Speaker 6: you know, going back and forth and how how much
• 11:49
  Speaker 6: passion there was. And that's what I realized is our
• 11:52
  Speaker 6: fan base was just so passionate back then, and so
• 11:55
  Speaker 6: it was it was it was exciting and and and
• 11:58
  Speaker 6: cool and fun and you know, to be a part
• 12:00
  Speaker 6: of that. And and I look back. I was actually
• 12:02
  Speaker 6: on the phone with ray Evernham, who was, you know,
• 12:04
  Speaker 6: my crew chief through all that that time and success
• 12:07
  Speaker 6: just earlier today, and and you know, we always laugh
• 12:10
  Speaker 6: and joke about how those that time that that from
• 12:15
  Speaker 6: a racing standpoint from we got together at the end
• 12:18
  Speaker 6: of ninety two and then he left at the end
• 12:21
  Speaker 6: of ninety nine. That period of time, I think either
• 12:24
  Speaker 6: one of us in our lives will ever be able
• 12:26
  Speaker 6: to duplicate it, right, It was just the best time
• 12:29
  Speaker 6: in our lives from a from a racing standpoint, performance,
• 12:33
  Speaker 6: winning the money, you know, the fan base, Hendrick Motorsports,
• 12:37
  Speaker 6: you know, he had our friendship and the team aspect.
• 12:41
  Speaker 6: It just it's just nothing's ever going to top that,
• 12:44
  Speaker 6: you know, and you hate to say that, but it's true.
• 12:47
  Speaker 6: It's just nothing will ever compare to that. That period
• 12:50
  Speaker 6: of time in our lives.
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: How much was the rivalry with you and Dale real
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: versus manufactured like to where the fan base is obviously
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: loved going at each each other, but how was it
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: for you personally with Dale?
• 13:03
  Speaker 6: So so, you know, we lost Dale right in two
• 13:06
  Speaker 6: thousand and one, and and I had built enough of
• 13:09
  Speaker 6: a friendship. I don't want to call it a friendship.
• 13:12
  Speaker 6: We had a mutual agreement. I guess this is what
• 13:16
  Speaker 6: you can say. I mean, he was really good to
• 13:18
  Speaker 6: me off the racetrack. You know, he really appreciated the business.
• 13:22
  Speaker 6: He saw the sport growing, and you know, he was
• 13:26
  Speaker 6: very focused on the things that could just help that continue.
• 13:31
  Speaker 6: And I think he saw something to me that was like, Okay,
• 13:34
  Speaker 6: you know, I don't want to race him on the racetrack,
• 13:36
  Speaker 6: but off the track he can be helpful. So he
• 13:40
  Speaker 6: was really good to me in that standpoint. On the racetrack,
• 13:44
  Speaker 6: total opposite. You know, it's like you would go through
• 13:47
  Speaker 6: this driver introductions and you know, you feel like you
• 13:50
  Speaker 6: got a moment you kind of bonded, and you go
• 13:53
  Speaker 6: down the first turn and he just bocel and it
• 13:56
  Speaker 6: didn't matter if if it ended your day or if
• 13:58
  Speaker 6: it was just a little love tap or whatever it was.
• 14:00
  Speaker 6: And and and you come to realize when you race
• 14:04
  Speaker 6: against Dale as much as as I did, and like
• 14:07
  Speaker 6: Rusty and those other guys, that he was just grinning
• 14:10
  Speaker 6: from ear to ear inside that car when he did
• 14:12
  Speaker 6: stuff like that. And I never met anybody like that before,
• 14:15
  Speaker 6: you know, I've never raced against anyone like that. So
• 14:20
  Speaker 6: so but I didn't get it. I you know, I
• 14:23
  Speaker 6: was again, I was young, and I was just so
• 14:26
  Speaker 6: focused on I want, you know, our team to win
• 14:30
  Speaker 6: races and win championships. I don't want to get involved
• 14:33
  Speaker 6: in all the politics and the noise and and I
• 14:36
  Speaker 6: don't care about rivalries. I just care about winning. And
• 14:39
  Speaker 6: yet Dale was was thinking that way and focus on that.
• 14:43
  Speaker 6: So the one or you know, one of the regrets
• 14:47
  Speaker 6: that I had is that I never got into a
• 14:49
  Speaker 6: position to ask him that question. And I and I
• 14:53
  Speaker 6: think about that often of if I, you know, if
• 14:56
  Speaker 6: I had time with him again before we lost him,
• 15:00
  Speaker 6: what would I have said to him? What would I
• 15:02
  Speaker 6: have asked him? And I definitely would have said, hey,
• 15:05
  Speaker 6: you know, ninety five when we were going for the championship,
• 15:07
  Speaker 6: how much of.
• 15:08
  Speaker 4: That was just total bullshit?
• 15:10
  Speaker 6: Because because like it was getting under my skin, right,
• 15:13
  Speaker 6: I mean I would do an interview and they go, well, hey,
• 15:17
  Speaker 6: we were just talking to Dale, and Dale said, well,
• 15:19
  Speaker 6: you know, you know Rainbow Warrior, you know, wonder Boy,
• 15:24
  Speaker 6: and just all these nicknames he had for me. What
• 15:27
  Speaker 6: are they going to if he wins the championship? He
• 15:28
  Speaker 6: can't win the championship, where are they going to serve
• 15:31
  Speaker 6: milk at the championship?
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 15:32
  Speaker 4: I mean, like it was just a constant, and.
• 15:37
  Speaker 6: You know, again, I didn't want to get involved in that,
• 15:40
  Speaker 6: and I kind of wish I had a little bit
• 15:42
  Speaker 6: more because I do think he you know, he was
• 15:46
  Speaker 6: doing it because he knew it was working, not just
• 15:49
  Speaker 6: to get under my skin, but it was working for
• 15:51
  Speaker 6: the media. I was working for NASCAR and the growth
• 15:55
  Speaker 6: and the fans. And of course he could get away
• 15:58
  Speaker 6: with a lot more than most people could too, because
• 16:00
  Speaker 6: they've forgiven me.
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: He said.
• 16:02
  Speaker 6: But yeah, so I think that, you know, that's what
• 16:06
  Speaker 6: I loved to know is how much of it was manufactured.
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you could just take it out on Junior.
• 16:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you know.
• 16:18
  Speaker 7: You can't though, you know, like Junior is just a
• 16:22
  Speaker 7: good guy, never runs into anybody, you know, and and
• 16:28
  Speaker 7: and his fan base probably bigger than what his dad's
• 16:32
  Speaker 7: fan base was, so you definitely don't didn't want to
• 16:34
  Speaker 7: mess with the fan base.
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: To be an asshole.
• 16:37
  Speaker 6: I know, I know, oh man, when you know he
• 16:40
  Speaker 6: became my teammate and you know we we weren't tight,
• 16:45
  Speaker 6: but but you get close when when your your teammates
• 16:48
  Speaker 6: and uh, you know everybody knew in the sport, like
• 16:52
  Speaker 6: whatever you do, don't wreck him, don't don't move him
• 16:55
  Speaker 6: out of the way, because you're not getting out of
• 16:57
  Speaker 6: the racetrack alive. But but the thing is, though, you
• 17:01
  Speaker 6: never wanted to race him like that because he didn't
• 17:03
  Speaker 6: race that way. You know, he totally different in that
• 17:05
  Speaker 6: aspect as his dad. You know, he would race you hard,
• 17:08
  Speaker 6: race you clean, just had such respect for competitors, for
• 17:13
  Speaker 6: the race, for the history. Still does, right, So you
• 17:18
  Speaker 6: know it, he didn't give you a reason to want
• 17:22
  Speaker 6: to race him the way his dad did.
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: Right. His dad made like his dad made it easy.
• 17:27
  Speaker 6: Now you you you were just so pissed at him
• 17:30
  Speaker 6: all the time because he just ran into you, erect.
• 17:33
  Speaker 4: You did whatever, noise on the mind, yeah, all that stuff, right, So.
• 17:36
  Speaker 6: You're like, oh, I'm going to run into him the
• 17:39
  Speaker 6: next chance I get, and then you go, hang on.
• 17:42
  Speaker 6: If I run into him, he's going to run into
• 17:44
  Speaker 6: me every five laps, or he's going to take me
• 17:47
  Speaker 6: out of the next five races. I'll never win a championship.
• 17:50
  Speaker 6: So that's why nobody ever retaliated against him, because because
• 17:55
  Speaker 6: whatever you gave, he was going to give it back tenfold.
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: He's out there playing. He was art of war.
• 18:00
  Speaker 4: Yeah, totally. Yeah.
• 18:03
  Speaker 3: Do you guys have do y'all all going there and
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: knowing like, Okay, we're gonna have like a silent and
• 18:08
  Speaker 3: knowledgement of and we're not gonna hit each other. We're
• 18:10
  Speaker 3: gonna race this clean or is it whatever goes soon
• 18:13
  Speaker 3: as the cars the guns go off, We're going it's
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: it's whatever goes?
• 18:18
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean you, I'm sure it's a lot like
• 18:20
  Speaker 6: you know on the field, right is you? You kind
• 18:24
  Speaker 6: of play the game. Everybody has their own style, and
• 18:28
  Speaker 6: so you approach it with that style and then if
• 18:31
  Speaker 6: somebody changes that up or get you mad or whatever,
• 18:35
  Speaker 6: then you switch right and and sometimes you can control
• 18:39
  Speaker 6: the emotions and sometimes you can't. But I always wonder.
• 18:43
  Speaker 6: I always say I'm gonna race my competitors the way
• 18:46
  Speaker 6: they race me. Mark Martin, right, he's known for point
• 18:51
  Speaker 6: his finger and go on by lift, get back in
• 18:54
  Speaker 6: behind you. I'm gonna I'm gonna see at the end
• 18:56
  Speaker 6: of the race hopefully or the next race or something.
• 18:58
  Speaker 6: And and so you know you never raced Mark dirty
• 19:04
  Speaker 6: because of that. And then there are other guys like Rusty.
• 19:07
  Speaker 6: You know, Rusty was a guy I knew he was
• 19:09
  Speaker 6: similar to Earnhart and away where he's gonna he's gonna
• 19:11
  Speaker 6: put the bumper to you. So I just knew I'd
• 19:13
  Speaker 6: just be the first one. I'll just give it to
• 19:15
  Speaker 6: him first.
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: I like that. Uh during the run, you brought up
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: Ray earlier and how he left in ninety nine. How
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: did all of that go down? Because we were sitting
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: with Jimmy and he was talking about it was Chuck, right, Chad.
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: He was talking about.
• 19:31
  Speaker 6: Chad about je forever calling him Chuck, thank you for that.
• 19:38
  Speaker 7: But Ray was chucking out seven times, Chad.
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: But Ray was uh Ray was your now even he's
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: the name is Chuck. Ray was your Chad?
• 19:50
  Speaker 4: Yes?
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: What went down when he left in ninety nine?
• 19:52
  Speaker 6: So uh Ray was approached by Dodge. So Dodge was
• 19:57
  Speaker 6: coming into NASCAR, they hadn't been a NASCAR from many years,
• 20:01
  Speaker 6: and they were coming with, you know, a really big program,
• 20:04
  Speaker 6: and so they went to Ray, and you know, Ray
• 20:09
  Speaker 6: was at that point we were both in this point
• 20:11
  Speaker 6: in our career where we kind of both were like, hey,
• 20:15
  Speaker 6: you know, I've contributed this, and he was like, I
• 20:17
  Speaker 6: contributed this. And so there we were butting heads a
• 20:21
  Speaker 6: little bit at that time because we weren't we weren't
• 20:23
  Speaker 6: battling for the championship. Came off of ninety eight, just
• 20:27
  Speaker 6: right crazy ninety nine. There's no way you're ever going
• 20:30
  Speaker 6: to do what you did in ninety eight because it
• 20:32
  Speaker 6: was just one of those once in a lifetime seasons.
• 20:35
  Speaker 6: And so we were having a solid season, not in
• 20:37
  Speaker 6: it for the championship, and we started butting This is
• 20:40
  Speaker 6: where I talk about the life lesson, right, and I
• 20:42
  Speaker 6: think for him too, where you know, you're who's getting
• 20:47
  Speaker 6: the contribution or the who's being known for the contribution
• 20:54
  Speaker 6: of the success and as a driver, right, you're getting
• 20:57
  Speaker 6: a lot of the credit and and Ray was getting
• 21:00
  Speaker 6: a lot of the credit too. But when we weren't winning,
• 21:03
  Speaker 6: it was a little bit of a finger pointing that
• 21:05
  Speaker 6: was taking place when we were winning. You know, I
• 21:10
  Speaker 6: think Ray was probably wanting to get a little bit
• 21:12
  Speaker 6: more of the of the credit. And and so we
• 21:17
  Speaker 6: were we were in this place where if we just
• 21:19
  Speaker 6: made it through that year, I think we win more championships.
• 21:24
  Speaker 6: We just needed to maybe communicate a little bit more,
• 21:26
  Speaker 6: just recognize it's how tight we truly were. Because today,
• 21:31
  Speaker 6: I mean, we do that all the time now and
• 21:34
  Speaker 6: talk about it. But anyway, I didn't listen. I didn't
• 21:37
  Speaker 6: blame him at all, because he was the right guy
• 21:40
  Speaker 6: to take Dodge and get them up to speed and
• 21:43
  Speaker 6: be successful in NASCAR.
• 21:45
  Speaker 4: And he did.
• 21:45
  Speaker 6: He did all those things. But it meant that he
• 21:48
  Speaker 6: had to make a decision, you know, to to leave
• 21:50
  Speaker 6: Hendrick and and and he did, and I had to
• 21:54
  Speaker 6: make a decision do I go with him or do
• 21:57
  Speaker 6: I stay? And so I I you know, Rick Kendrick,
• 22:01
  Speaker 6: you know, and I mean everything that he had done
• 22:04
  Speaker 6: for me and you know, gave me that opportunity, and
• 22:08
  Speaker 6: I just felt loyal. And not that Ray didn't feel loyal,
• 22:11
  Speaker 6: it was I know, it wasn't an easy decision for Ray,
• 22:13
  Speaker 6: But for me, the decision was, you know, I'm gonna
• 22:17
  Speaker 6: stay at Hendrick and I and I went and met
• 22:19
  Speaker 6: with Rick, and so a lot of where I am today,
• 22:22
  Speaker 6: you know, what I'm doing today is through some of
• 22:25
  Speaker 6: that time in ninety nine where where you know, Rick
• 22:29
  Speaker 6: and I had those those tough conversations about what the
• 22:31
  Speaker 6: future looks like. It turned into a lifetime contract, It
• 22:34
  Speaker 6: turned into equity in the company, and it you know,
• 22:38
  Speaker 6: turned into an amazing career or continues continuation of the
• 22:43
  Speaker 6: career and being vice chairman you know today. So I'm
• 22:46
  Speaker 6: grateful for that, but it did take me and Ray apart,
• 22:48
  Speaker 6: and I think we would have had more success that
• 22:50
  Speaker 6: we stayed together.
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: It feels like a Brady Belichick. Yeah, when they started
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: talking about credit who's responsible for the Super Bowls?
• 22:58
  Speaker 6: Going back to whe and neither one of us went
• 23:00
  Speaker 6: and won a super Bowl after that.
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: Going back to that moment, what was it like? Was
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: it was it pretentious? Was it? When he's decided to leave,
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: was like, all right, go ahead and go don't need you?
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: Was it? Because then it sounded like there was a
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: moment where you might have left with him.
• 23:18
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean we talked about it and contemplated it.
• 23:22
  Speaker 6: I don't I don't think it ever really got serious
• 23:25
  Speaker 6: for me that that that was the right move for
• 23:27
  Speaker 6: me because there were so many unknowns. Right Like Ray,
• 23:30
  Speaker 6: I mean, he he you know, was so good at
• 23:33
  Speaker 6: what he did. He built the twenty four team at
• 23:35
  Speaker 6: Hendrick Motorsports in so many ways, right, took the resources
• 23:38
  Speaker 6: that were there, and he brought the people in and
• 23:40
  Speaker 6: he kind of built that team up. So he wasn't
• 23:42
  Speaker 6: afraid to go do that again and believed it that
• 23:46
  Speaker 6: he could, and he did it.
• 23:48
  Speaker 4: For me.
• 23:48
  Speaker 6: I was like, man, we got such a good thing
• 23:50
  Speaker 6: here and it's Hendrick Motorsports. How are we How are
• 23:54
  Speaker 6: we going to go compete against Hendrick Motorsports? And so
• 23:57
  Speaker 6: to me, the risk was was the and and and
• 24:03
  Speaker 6: obviously it was the right decision. But I'm sorry, what
• 24:06
  Speaker 6: was the first part of.
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: The It was basically curious, how are the your guys
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: relationship goes from Okay, he's going you guys are both
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: kind of doing the you know, who's going to have
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: more credit? It seemed underappreciated, wanted a little bit more
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: of the credit.
• 24:22
  Speaker 6: It started getting a little bit at one another on
• 24:24
  Speaker 6: the radio a few times, you know, and and so
• 24:27
  Speaker 6: you could feel the tension growing. We actually Ray and
• 24:30
  Speaker 6: I at that time also owned our own what is
• 24:33
  Speaker 6: now the O'Riley Series, but back then it's called the
• 24:35
  Speaker 6: Bush Ground National Series. PEPSI was a sponsor and they
• 24:40
  Speaker 6: wanted a little more presence in the sport, and and
• 24:44
  Speaker 6: DuPont had all all the races, so so they were
• 24:47
  Speaker 6: the primary sponsor.
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: And you and Ray owned that together.
• 24:50
  Speaker 6: So PEPs trying to put this in context. So PEPSI
• 24:54
  Speaker 6: was an associate on the cup car with with Hendrick
• 24:57
  Speaker 6: and Ray, and I decided, hey, let's own a bush
• 25:00
  Speaker 6: Grand National team and we'll make PEPSI the primary and
• 25:03
  Speaker 6: so so PEPSI came on board and so we own
• 25:05
  Speaker 6: this team together. I drove like six races a year.
• 25:09
  Speaker 6: Ray and I owned it, but he did all the work,
• 25:11
  Speaker 6: let's be honest.
• 25:12
  Speaker 4: I just did the drive, and I.
• 25:14
  Speaker 6: Think he got a taste of that and he liked.
• 25:16
  Speaker 6: He's like, he's like, yeah, I like being in control
• 25:18
  Speaker 6: and building something, you know. And we had a little success.
• 25:22
  Speaker 6: We won a race each year we did it. I
• 25:24
  Speaker 6: think we did it in ninety eight and ninety nine
• 25:26
  Speaker 6: or ninety nine, two thousand, can't remember exactly what it was. Well,
• 25:31
  Speaker 6: it became time where it was evident he's leaving and
• 25:34
  Speaker 6: I've got to get a new crew chief.
• 25:36
  Speaker 4: And then there's what we call.
• 25:39
  Speaker 6: Team proprietary content. Right, if your guy is working on
• 25:44
  Speaker 6: that and he's going to start a new team with
• 25:46
  Speaker 6: a new manufacturer, how much of this content or information
• 25:50
  Speaker 6: is going to be valuable he takes with him. So
• 25:52
  Speaker 6: then there started becoming those kinds of conversations internally, and
• 25:56
  Speaker 6: so I had to go to Ray one day at
• 25:59
  Speaker 6: the end of I think it was in the ninety nine,
• 26:01
  Speaker 6: if I'm not mistaken, and just said, Hey, I think
• 26:05
  Speaker 6: we're probably going to have to in the Bush Groand
• 26:09
  Speaker 6: National Series team and we're not gonna be able to
• 26:13
  Speaker 6: light have information on the Cup side. And he took
• 26:17
  Speaker 6: offense to that. He was he was pretty upset about that.
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: Another life lesson definitely owning the team together. Hey we're
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: gonna split up on the main we got this one
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: over here.
• 26:27
  Speaker 6: Yeah. And the main life lesson was, and I've done this.
• 26:30
  Speaker 6: You know a handful of times in my life that
• 26:33
  Speaker 6: I could go back and say the same thing is
• 26:34
  Speaker 6: it's not it's not what was done. It was how
• 26:37
  Speaker 6: it was done, and I could have handled it better,
• 26:42
  Speaker 6: and and I think it could have gone smoother. We
• 26:45
  Speaker 6: could have, you know, come to a better place. But anyway,
• 26:47
  Speaker 6: so that was you know, a contentious time in our
• 26:52
  Speaker 6: lives for the next two three years and and then
• 26:56
  Speaker 6: you know today we're I mean like he's my best friend.
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: That did you guys talk back and laugh about a
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: lot of those situation. Oh yeah, do not envy being
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: in your guys are spot back in ninety nine though, Yeah,
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: that's tough. That is tough.
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: But do you see, like a crew chief, how successful
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: can you be with the right crew chief? Is that
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: the main piece is having the top of the line
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: crew chief.
• 27:18
  Speaker 6: I think it's a big piece of them, the crew
• 27:20
  Speaker 6: chief's job. I don't envy a crew chief, not back then,
• 27:24
  Speaker 6: not today. It is they have it all on their shoulders,
• 27:27
  Speaker 6: right everybody when things go right, Oh man, the driver
• 27:31
  Speaker 6: drove a great race. Pick crew and all. They don't go, hey,
• 27:35
  Speaker 6: the crew chief did all this, you know, work with
• 27:38
  Speaker 6: the engineering group to put the perfect setup underneath that
• 27:41
  Speaker 6: car and call the race this way.
• 27:43
  Speaker 7: You know.
• 27:43
  Speaker 6: They just they don't get enough credit in that in
• 27:46
  Speaker 6: that position or in that moment of really what's weighing
• 27:49
  Speaker 6: on them? And I mean they're managing people, they're managing engineering,
• 27:54
  Speaker 6: they're executing the race, calling the strategy, and and you know,
• 27:58
  Speaker 6: keeping the driver calm when he it's excited, whatever it is.
• 28:01
  Speaker 6: I mean, they have kind of all of it on
• 28:04
  Speaker 6: top of their shoulders.
• 28:05
  Speaker 4: And so I do.
• 28:06
  Speaker 6: Believe the crew chief is is the number one critical piece.
• 28:10
  Speaker 6: Now I love this because you go and talk to
• 28:13
  Speaker 6: Chuck and and I'll tell you it's like, Nope, you
• 28:20
  Speaker 6: got to have a great race guard. Driver starts with
• 28:22
  Speaker 6: a great race card driver. Then you know crew chief,
• 28:24
  Speaker 6: pit crew, engineer, and all that stuff. In all fairness,
• 28:28
  Speaker 6: it's just like every other sport. It takes the whole
• 28:30
  Speaker 6: team takes all of it. But there are a few
• 28:33
  Speaker 6: key individuals that that that and that combination of driver
• 28:36
  Speaker 6: crew chief because you know, the way that they handle
• 28:41
  Speaker 6: stressful situations, the way they communicate, the way that they
• 28:45
  Speaker 6: lift one another up. You know, when one's having a
• 28:47
  Speaker 6: good day, you know somebody's got to be there and
• 28:49
  Speaker 6: support them. You know, the leaders of the team play
• 28:53
  Speaker 6: a big role in that. And it's the driver and.
• 28:56
  Speaker 4: The crew chief. But the crew chief, I would I
• 28:58
  Speaker 4: would even put him. He's the head coach. It's a
• 29:00
  Speaker 4: quarterback head coach kind of situation.
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: How many in your mind? Looking back? How many do
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: you think you're winning of race days?
• 29:09
  Speaker 6: I mean, I definitely, Well, listen, we want to get
• 29:12
  Speaker 6: into a debate. We could talk about the NASCAR points system,
• 29:16
  Speaker 6: you know, and whether or not it should have stayed
• 29:18
  Speaker 6: the way it was, and whether or not we would
• 29:20
  Speaker 6: have won more championships seven eight. I don't know, so
• 29:25
  Speaker 6: that was maybe the first thought that popped in my
• 29:28
  Speaker 6: mind when you said it. But I think Ray and
• 29:30
  Speaker 6: I stay together. I definitely think we win at least
• 29:33
  Speaker 6: two more championships, So that would have taken us to six.
• 29:37
  Speaker 6: If you ask Ray, he probably thinks we could have
• 29:38
  Speaker 6: got seven or eight. I think Ray stays and the
• 29:43
  Speaker 6: points stay the same.
• 29:44
  Speaker 4: Who knows? I mean that that could be a big number.
• 29:47
  Speaker 5: Why did the system change if it was so it was?
• 29:50
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Nascar? Why?
• 29:55
  Speaker 6: I mean this again, the sport's growing and everybody's trying
• 30:00
  Speaker 6: to grow with it. And you've got METEA rights partners,
• 30:04
  Speaker 6: you've got sponsorship, tracks, fans, teams, right, you've got the
• 30:09
  Speaker 6: sanctioning body. Everybody is trying to figure out what's the
• 30:13
  Speaker 6: right move, what's the next move, and how do we
• 30:16
  Speaker 6: stay relevant? And you know, at that time, I mean,
• 30:21
  Speaker 6: really it was NASCAR was sort of top three in
• 30:27
  Speaker 6: many ways, right, I mean it was NFL. It has
• 30:30
  Speaker 6: always been NFL. But you start looking at MLB and
• 30:35
  Speaker 6: you know, basketball, NBA, hockey. I mean, NASCAR was just
• 30:42
  Speaker 6: knocking it out of the park weekend, and so I
• 30:46
  Speaker 6: think it was, hey, how do we how do we
• 30:48
  Speaker 6: keep this going? And if you looked at all the
• 30:51
  Speaker 6: other major sports, there was a playoff system, and so
• 30:55
  Speaker 6: there wasn't just this whole season all year long, not
• 30:58
  Speaker 6: to mention ninety eight, we had that thing wrapped up
• 31:01
  Speaker 6: with like two three races to go, and that wasn't
• 31:03
  Speaker 6: the only time it happened. There was a couple of
• 31:05
  Speaker 6: other drivers that just had a dominant season, and then
• 31:08
  Speaker 6: it didn't come down to the final race. And then
• 31:10
  Speaker 6: you look at tracks trying to sell tickets to the
• 31:12
  Speaker 6: final race of building this up. Hey come see the
• 31:16
  Speaker 6: championship battle and the last race of the season. Then
• 31:18
  Speaker 6: oh sorry, yeah, the championship was decided two weeks ago
• 31:21
  Speaker 6: or last week. So there are all of those things
• 31:24
  Speaker 6: and then some of decision making that came into let's
• 31:28
  Speaker 6: create a playoff system.
• 31:29
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• 32:00
  Speaker 1: If speaking talking and talking about life lessons, if you
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: go back and talk to yourself into two thousands, Uh,
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: to that guy who wasn't able to get that same
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: success taste all that same success that he had that
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: Jeff had in the nineties, what would you say to
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: that guy in the two thousands.
• 32:19
  Speaker 6: Well, in you know, the mid two Well, let's see,
• 32:22
  Speaker 6: Jimmy came along in two thousand and two. I think
• 32:26
  Speaker 6: his first championship was six, right, and so when I
• 32:30
  Speaker 6: looked at what Jimmy was doing with the same equipment,
• 32:33
  Speaker 6: right basically, I mean, yeah, different different team of people,
• 32:37
  Speaker 6: but the same equipment, same resources, and they were getting
• 32:41
  Speaker 6: more out of it, and I was. He was getting
• 32:44
  Speaker 6: more out of it than I was. And so so
• 32:46
  Speaker 6: I looked at at what Jimmy and he made me a.
• 32:49
  Speaker 4: Better race car driver.
• 32:50
  Speaker 6: He did because he was working so hard at studying
• 32:53
  Speaker 6: all the data, looking at other drivers and techniques, he
• 32:57
  Speaker 6: was able to adapt, you know, to different circumstances. His
• 33:01
  Speaker 6: physical fitness level was was you know, on another level.
• 33:05
  Speaker 6: I mean he and Chad were, I mean they were
• 33:07
  Speaker 6: even though they chucked sorry check, you know, they would
• 33:10
  Speaker 6: butt head from time to time, but they always worked
• 33:12
  Speaker 6: through it and they were just so good, you know together.
• 33:16
  Speaker 6: So what I would have done different is is, you know,
• 33:19
  Speaker 6: just some of those things right. And I'll be the
• 33:23
  Speaker 6: first to say it. When you come through the mid
• 33:26
  Speaker 6: nineties like we did with the twenty fourteen and you're
• 33:28
  Speaker 6: you win fifty races right during that time and we
• 33:33
  Speaker 6: won a championship, no one you know, I mean like
• 33:36
  Speaker 6: that's you know, one of the things. I guess that
• 33:38
  Speaker 6: was sort of my my Brady Belichick. You know, we
• 33:43
  Speaker 6: did get the championship. No one got about that and
• 33:46
  Speaker 6: day total five five Sorry Ray, but but.
• 33:50
  Speaker 4: No, I think that.
• 33:52
  Speaker 6: Uh, you know, there there was more effort that could.
• 33:57
  Speaker 6: I was living, you know, a very privileged, privileged lifestyle
• 34:02
  Speaker 6: because of the success. You know, like I said, I
• 34:05
  Speaker 6: moved to Florida and and you know, I've got my
• 34:08
  Speaker 6: own plane, and I've got big p s A deals
• 34:11
  Speaker 6: and you know, to me, I'm I'm getting invited to
• 34:13
  Speaker 6: red carpets and and you know, I'm taking the success.
• 34:19
  Speaker 6: H I means now and and and I'm enjoying life
• 34:22
  Speaker 6: and and I'm enjoying, you know, the success. And I
• 34:26
  Speaker 6: think the my focus on the track and with the
• 34:30
  Speaker 6: team suffered a little bit. I don't think I was
• 34:33
  Speaker 6: as committed. I know, I wasn't as committed as Jimmy.
• 34:35
  Speaker 6: When Jimmy came along, you know, he reminded me of
• 34:38
  Speaker 6: who I was when I came in this morning, and
• 34:41
  Speaker 6: he just was relentless with it and and I was like, Okay,
• 34:46
  Speaker 6: I want to see him have success. I'm happy for him.
• 34:48
  Speaker 6: He's at Hendrick. We're friends, and and man like it
• 34:52
  Speaker 6: better for Hendrick, better for me, right and and better
• 34:56
  Speaker 6: for all of us. And that's why we wanted him
• 34:59
  Speaker 6: to be the why we wanted that forty eight team,
• 35:02
  Speaker 6: you know, to be the fourth team at Hendrick. And
• 35:06
  Speaker 6: then it started to turn to dominance and I'm sitting
• 35:10
  Speaker 6: there going, wait a minute.
• 35:12
  Speaker 4: Don't I don't like this?
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: I don't.
• 35:13
  Speaker 4: I don't.
• 35:13
  Speaker 6: I don't like what it feels like to be getting beat,
• 35:17
  Speaker 6: you know, on a on a regular basis, and not
• 35:19
  Speaker 6: be the top team at Hendrick Motorsports.
• 35:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 35:22
  Speaker 6: So so yeah, if I could have done it over,
• 35:24
  Speaker 6: I think I would have. I would have kept that
• 35:28
  Speaker 6: that intensity level that I did the mid to late nineties.
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, then you don't. Didn't you own his card at
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: the time too.
• 35:35
  Speaker 4: So again it goes back to the equity. You know
• 35:38
  Speaker 4: that that I.
• 35:41
  Speaker 6: The right negotiation that I had, and the lifetime contract
• 35:45
  Speaker 6: came with with equity, and that equity was an LLC
• 35:49
  Speaker 6: that owned the twenty four team, and then the LLC
• 35:52
  Speaker 6: when Jimmy came along, fell under the same LLC, and
• 35:57
  Speaker 6: so it was basically the twenty four and the forty
• 35:59
  Speaker 6: eight team. So yes, when when when he was doing well,
• 36:04
  Speaker 6: I was doing well too. Yeah, trust me, it was
• 36:12
  Speaker 6: a lot better when I want.
• 36:15
  Speaker 4: I was a man. I'm happy for him. I'm much
• 36:18
  Speaker 4: happier when I went.
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: You got one.
• 36:23
  Speaker 3: I was going to ask you, do you think it's
• 36:24
  Speaker 3: more stressful being an owner or a driver.
• 36:29
  Speaker 4: It's a good question.
• 36:30
  Speaker 6: Good question because I don't think there's a greater stress
• 36:33
  Speaker 6: when it's a pick any race. But let's just take
• 36:37
  Speaker 6: the biggest race, Daytona, and and there's a late caution
• 36:41
  Speaker 6: and you're sitting, you know, in the top two rows
• 36:45
  Speaker 6: and it's three to go, and you've got to hit
• 36:48
  Speaker 6: the gears perfect, hit the restart, perfect block all the lanes,
• 36:52
  Speaker 6: make all the right decisions and moves, and there's no
• 36:54
  Speaker 6: more pit stops, you know, there's no more strategy. It's
• 36:57
  Speaker 6: just you in that car and what you do with it.
• 37:01
  Speaker 6: And and that's a tremendous amount of stress, but it's
• 37:04
  Speaker 6: also incredibly rewarding right when you get it right, incredibly
• 37:09
  Speaker 6: and disappointed when you don't. In this role, it's I
• 37:14
  Speaker 6: can only add and do so much that can control
• 37:19
  Speaker 6: any of those things, and really basically it's all out
• 37:21
  Speaker 6: of my control. But the relationships that I've built with
• 37:25
  Speaker 6: the teams and the people that help get them to
• 37:28
  Speaker 6: that place, that's what I get to thrive in and
• 37:31
  Speaker 6: enjoy and carry the stress along with it because you
• 37:35
  Speaker 6: want it so bad for them, for those people that
• 37:38
  Speaker 6: you know put their heart soul into it and got
• 37:41
  Speaker 6: themselves in that position. And if it doesn't go the
• 37:44
  Speaker 6: way you want to go for them, you're maybe not
• 37:47
  Speaker 6: as disappoint as they are, or not as disappoint as
• 37:50
  Speaker 6: you were when you were a driver, but you still
• 37:52
  Speaker 6: you carry a lot of that. And then on the
• 37:55
  Speaker 6: flip side, you know, I get to find the joy
• 37:58
  Speaker 6: in that success too. And when they when it all
• 38:01
  Speaker 6: comes together, the highs make me not as high as
• 38:04
  Speaker 6: when I was a driver, but it's the next next
• 38:06
  Speaker 6: best thing. So I'm I'm enjoying it far more than
• 38:09
  Speaker 6: I ever thought I would. And and I'm I'm just
• 38:12
  Speaker 6: you know, enjoying the grind of it, all the building
• 38:18
  Speaker 6: of it, and the behind the scenes things that nobody
• 38:20
  Speaker 6: really sees and talks about of what it takes to
• 38:24
  Speaker 6: you know, kind of see what Rick Hendrick's done for
• 38:26
  Speaker 6: all these years, which is just move all the puzzle
• 38:28
  Speaker 6: pieces around. See when people mesh and and work well
• 38:32
  Speaker 6: together when they don't, you know, trying to bring new
• 38:37
  Speaker 6: new partners into the sport or into the team that
• 38:40
  Speaker 6: might give us new resources or tools to go do
• 38:44
  Speaker 6: a better job. And and so it's it's a lot
• 38:47
  Speaker 6: of fun. It's a challenge, but it's a lot of
• 38:49
  Speaker 6: fun to be part of that that I'm enjoying more
• 38:51
  Speaker 6: than I ever thought of.
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: When you talk about people not understanding behind the scenes,
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: has there been a moment or an example you can
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: speak to to where you come across something behind the
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: scenes where it was like an aha moment or oh,
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: that's how that works, or even when you learned about
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: back in the day when you were a driver and
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: Hendricks wash was kind of moving pieces behind you.
• 39:10
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I think as a driver, and I think I
• 39:12
  Speaker 6: can speak for most guys. Some guys are a little
• 39:14
  Speaker 6: bit more uh involved in some of the mechanics of
• 39:18
  Speaker 6: the cars. But for the most part, the drivers, you know,
• 39:21
  Speaker 6: are in their their nucleus of of you know, a
• 39:24
  Speaker 6: tight knit group of uh you know, mechanics and engineers,
• 39:30
  Speaker 6: pit crew and crew chief and all that. And you're
• 39:32
  Speaker 6: really focused on that. You don't you don't need to
• 39:34
  Speaker 6: get too far outside of that. Just focus on doing
• 39:38
  Speaker 6: your job, doing your part, not be a weak link,
• 39:41
  Speaker 6: right and and if there is a week link, how
• 39:43
  Speaker 6: do you support them?
• 39:44
  Speaker 4: If you're the weak link, how do you get better?
• 39:46
  Speaker 6: And and so so, you know, this role is just
• 39:51
  Speaker 6: so much broader you know, there's just so many more
• 39:54
  Speaker 6: people that you're touching, you come and face to face with,
• 39:56
  Speaker 6: having more conversations about things that were going on before
• 40:00
  Speaker 6: when I was a driver that I knew about but
• 40:03
  Speaker 6: didn't know the level of it. You know, when they're
• 40:05
  Speaker 6: when they're in the engine shop and they're working through
• 40:08
  Speaker 6: a solution for you know, valve springs or finding more power,
• 40:13
  Speaker 6: like I would get to see the benefits of it,
• 40:16
  Speaker 6: you know, and I hear about it and like, hey,
• 40:19
  Speaker 6: engine is running great, thank you, you know, but I
• 40:21
  Speaker 6: wasn't there on the floor watching them actually work through,
• 40:24
  Speaker 6: which I get to spend more time with people.
• 40:26
  Speaker 4: That's one one example of that.
• 40:28
  Speaker 6: I just have a far greater appreciation for all the
• 40:31
  Speaker 6: people that are contributed to that. I was always thankful
• 40:35
  Speaker 6: of the team, but I was really focused on on
• 40:38
  Speaker 6: the that twenty fourteen for, you know, instead of Hendrick
• 40:43
  Speaker 6: Motorsports as a whole. And now now I get to
• 40:46
  Speaker 6: be a part of all of it, and I love it.
• 40:48
  Speaker 6: I mean this is Rick always says, this is a
• 40:50
  Speaker 6: people business, and and when you get to, you know,
• 40:54
  Speaker 6: know all the people far better and see what their
• 40:58
  Speaker 6: contribution is, it makes you really, really proud of what
• 41:02
  Speaker 6: what has been built over the years, being a part
• 41:05
  Speaker 6: of that and being a part of it today.
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: Dude, how hard was it driver broadcaster executive in the
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: broadcasting phase?
• 41:13
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: How hard was it going from being criticized and praised
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: to now being the one who's criticizing and praising.
• 41:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that it was tricky balancing.
• 41:22
  Speaker 6: And it's honestly why the TV thing was great and
• 41:27
  Speaker 6: I enjoyed it, and but why it lasted I think,
• 41:29
  Speaker 6: what six years and not longer because I couldn't do
• 41:34
  Speaker 6: I couldn't do both at the level that I wanted
• 41:37
  Speaker 6: to do it, you know, you kind of I'm sort
• 41:39
  Speaker 6: of maybe it's just me. I just got to pick one,
• 41:42
  Speaker 6: you know, like you got to pick one and really
• 41:45
  Speaker 6: focus on it.
• 41:45
  Speaker 4: And I can do a good job with that. But
• 41:47
  Speaker 4: it's a great experience.
• 41:48
  Speaker 6: I mean, I love that I got to do uh
• 41:51
  Speaker 6: TV and see it from that perspective. So yeah, one
• 41:55
  Speaker 6: is it was very hard to critique because and it
• 41:58
  Speaker 6: didn't matter if I'm taking my own team or I'm
• 42:02
  Speaker 6: critiquing someone else. There there's an incident at Darlington Chris
• 42:10
  Speaker 6: Busher I think was I don't know if he was
• 42:16
  Speaker 6: about to go lap down whatever. But I think Jimmy
• 42:18
  Speaker 6: was leading the race at Darlington. Anyway, they come off
• 42:21
  Speaker 6: a turn two and and Jimmy gets a little bit loose,
• 42:26
  Speaker 6: makes contact.
• 42:27
  Speaker 4: I don't know if they both wrecked.
• 42:28
  Speaker 6: I know Busher wrecked and I'm having to call this
• 42:32
  Speaker 6: and I and I got it wrong, you know, I
• 42:34
  Speaker 6: put it on Busher, you know, And and and then
• 42:37
  Speaker 6: I got home that night, I've seen all the different
• 42:39
  Speaker 6: angles and thinking about it more, and I was like, man,
• 42:42
  Speaker 6: I screwed up.
• 42:43
  Speaker 4: I got that one wrong.
• 42:44
  Speaker 6: I and so and then I'm looking at social media
• 42:47
  Speaker 6: and they're like, oh, you know that was not that
• 42:49
  Speaker 6: was totally Jimmy's fault, right, And they're like, Jeff such,
• 42:53
  Speaker 6: you know, he's so biased, he's so biased, right, And
• 42:56
  Speaker 6: I really, I really wanted to go into every broadcast
• 43:00
  Speaker 6: and not be biased. It's impossible not to be because
• 43:03
  Speaker 6: you have these relationships, but I really wanted to be
• 43:05
  Speaker 6: as neutral as possible. And I promise you that's what
• 43:08
  Speaker 6: I was trying to.
• 43:09
  Speaker 4: Do that day. But it didn't come across that way.
• 43:12
  Speaker 4: And I remember I.
• 43:14
  Speaker 6: Called bush Er. I texted Busher like like I still
• 43:17
  Speaker 6: think to this day, barely speaks.
• 43:21
  Speaker 4: That was a long time ago.
• 43:22
  Speaker 6: But the bigger challenge with that was that I was
• 43:27
  Speaker 6: coming into the race shop during the week, you know,
• 43:30
  Speaker 6: because because you know, even though I'm doing TV and
• 43:34
  Speaker 6: at that time, during that first half of the year
• 43:36
  Speaker 6: for Fox was my kind of primary focus, but I'm
• 43:39
  Speaker 6: still doing a lot with the with the race team
• 43:41
  Speaker 6: and coming in. So you come in and you know,
• 43:44
  Speaker 6: you're like hesitant to walk into a room or a
• 43:47
  Speaker 6: meeting if something happened in you and you called it
• 43:50
  Speaker 6: the way you really saw it. You know, I think
• 43:53
  Speaker 6: even those guys are thinking I should be biased.
• 43:58
  Speaker 4: So that was that was that was tough.
• 44:00
  Speaker 6: And then you know, the second half of the year,
• 44:01
  Speaker 6: I felt like I took that entire second half of
• 44:04
  Speaker 6: the year trying to make up for either not being
• 44:09
  Speaker 6: there as much because I'm doing TV, or having to
• 44:13
  Speaker 6: call some things the way that I saw it that
• 44:15
  Speaker 6: didn't align with maybe, you know, the guys at the shop,
• 44:20
  Speaker 6: the crew chiefs or drivers or whatever it may be.
• 44:22
  Speaker 6: And I just felt that there's just too much conflict there.
• 44:26
  Speaker 6: Just it just wasn't and I didn't think that I
• 44:29
  Speaker 6: was in tune with what was happening on a regular
• 44:32
  Speaker 6: basis with the race team at that by only doing
• 44:35
  Speaker 6: it kind of full time half a year too, So
• 44:37
  Speaker 6: about you know, year four or five, I realized, Okay,
• 44:42
  Speaker 6: I need to make a decision here. And it was
• 44:46
  Speaker 6: a pretty easy decision.
• 44:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, you know, I'm sitting here and I'm thinking
• 44:51
  Speaker 3: hearing you talk, and I'm thinking of an iconic moment.
• 44:53
  Speaker 3: I'm going back to twenty fourteen Texas. I know you
• 44:58
  Speaker 3: know where I'm going with this.
• 45:00
  Speaker 4: I'm just glad you didn't go back to Phoenix.
• 45:03
  Speaker 5: I had a few of them.
• 45:04
  Speaker 3: I said, I was gonna drop on you, but I
• 45:06
  Speaker 3: go back to that time and and I just remember you,
• 45:09
  Speaker 3: you know, getting out of.
• 45:10
  Speaker 5: The car, looking and your pit crew.
• 45:14
  Speaker 3: All I could the pit crew having your back, going
• 45:18
  Speaker 3: toe to toe with his pick.
• 45:20
  Speaker 4: Kevin Harvick must have had my back too, if you remember.
• 45:23
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, he pushed.
• 45:26
  Speaker 4: He's the one to push Brad in and I was.
• 45:29
  Speaker 5: Reaching reading he pushed him into you.
• 45:31
  Speaker 4: I'm like, thank you. Yeah.
• 45:33
  Speaker 3: Hold, but it was like iconic because I mean your
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: crew had your back, I mean to the tilt, no
• 45:40
  Speaker 3: matter what what it was, they had your back. What
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: was the conversation after that and how fucked up did
• 45:46
  Speaker 3: y'all get.
• 45:48
  Speaker 6: I mean, there is no greater feeling, right It's it's
• 45:52
  Speaker 6: the thing that if I miss anything today, that that
• 45:56
  Speaker 6: you just can't replace. It's how tight knit you get
• 46:00
  Speaker 6: as a group going into battle every single weekend and
• 46:03
  Speaker 6: you're either winning or losing together, but you're doing it together.
• 46:06
  Speaker 6: You're building relationships, and you're either on this climb to
• 46:10
  Speaker 6: get out of the hole or you're trying to stay
• 46:12
  Speaker 6: on top, you know. And and there's there's no closer
• 46:15
  Speaker 6: relationships that you get in racing than that. So in
• 46:19
  Speaker 6: that moment when you've been through that and then they
• 46:22
  Speaker 6: got your back, like I mean, you know, it just
• 46:25
  Speaker 6: sends chills up my spine just thinking about it right now.
• 46:29
  Speaker 4: So, yeah, that that was very cool.
• 46:32
  Speaker 6: Twenty fourteen. I'm trying to think where I was at
• 46:36
  Speaker 6: on on my partying. I think I think I had
• 46:41
  Speaker 6: toned down a little bit, you know, at that time,
• 46:44
  Speaker 6: So I don't I don't remember as getting after it
• 46:46
  Speaker 6: too much. I think I think we're still still feeling
• 46:50
  Speaker 6: the sting from really what that meant that day, right,
• 46:53
  Speaker 6: because we win that race. Even if we don't win
• 46:57
  Speaker 6: the race, even if we just finished top five, we're
• 47:00
  Speaker 6: gonna go race for a championship in Homestead, and and
• 47:06
  Speaker 6: we won Homestead.
• 47:08
  Speaker 4: I believe that.
• 47:09
  Speaker 6: Year, not anyway like to me, that was my real
• 47:13
  Speaker 6: last shot. Even though in fifteen, my final year, we
• 47:16
  Speaker 6: battled for the championship in the final race. Fourteen was
• 47:20
  Speaker 6: the year we had the I felt like the best team,
• 47:23
  Speaker 6: the best cars and and could could win it. And
• 47:26
  Speaker 6: I felt like that's that was a build up to
• 47:29
  Speaker 6: that sort of being ripped away from you and and listen,
• 47:32
  Speaker 6: I it wasn't totally fair to put all that on
• 47:35
  Speaker 6: Brad at that time. I think that, Yeah, I still
• 47:39
  Speaker 6: don't like the move that he made, but at the
• 47:40
  Speaker 6: same time, I can't knock him. I don't feel like
• 47:43
  Speaker 6: it was intentional. I don't feel like it was just
• 47:46
  Speaker 6: a blatant thing that was like, hey, I'm taking Jeff
• 47:48
  Speaker 6: Allis Racing championship.
• 47:50
  Speaker 4: So but at that moment, that's what it felt. Yeah,
• 47:53
  Speaker 4: that was when Scratchy had g.
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 47:58
  Speaker 4: Well so, so, first.
• 47:59
  Speaker 6: Of all, we can go all the way back to
• 48:00
  Speaker 6: the beginning of this interview. In Valleo, California. You grow
• 48:03
  Speaker 6: up in Valleto, California, you gotta fit for yourself and
• 48:06
  Speaker 6: and you know it bade me who I am today.
• 48:09
  Speaker 6: I'm really proud of it. But but you know, gotten
• 48:12
  Speaker 6: in a fight or two through those those early years,
• 48:16
  Speaker 6: and so you didn't see that come out very often
• 48:19
  Speaker 6: in me, you know, my racing career later.
• 48:22
  Speaker 4: But that was one of those one of those moments.
• 48:24
  Speaker 6: Honestly, I went up going I just like, I, yes,
• 48:27
  Speaker 6: I want to punch him right now, but I'm not
• 48:29
  Speaker 6: going to do that. I'm gonna try to have a conversation,
• 48:32
  Speaker 6: get some sense made out of it. And when he
• 48:36
  Speaker 6: turned his back against me and just wouldn't even look
• 48:38
  Speaker 6: at me, I'm like, dude, I'm not walking away from this.
• 48:43
  Speaker 6: And then he had his pit crew guys up there
• 48:45
  Speaker 6: right blocking me, and my guys are behind right and
• 48:49
  Speaker 6: it's getting big, the crowd's growing, and and that's when
• 48:53
  Speaker 6: I saw him getting closer to me because Kevin. I
• 48:56
  Speaker 6: didn't realize it was Kevin at the time. I just
• 48:58
  Speaker 6: knew that he was getting close to me, and I
• 49:01
  Speaker 6: just reached out and latched on and did not let go.
• 49:03
  Speaker 4: I did not go well. One one. I had a
• 49:06
  Speaker 4: stronger grip than I thought I had.
• 49:07
  Speaker 6: And also nomes does not it does not tear, so
• 49:11
  Speaker 6: I got a hold of the nomes and once I
• 49:13
  Speaker 6: had a hold of that, it was that because I
• 49:17
  Speaker 6: knew I actually did punch him. You don't really see
• 49:20
  Speaker 6: it in the.
• 49:21
  Speaker 4: Undercamp, but I actually did have a little Yeah, but
• 49:24
  Speaker 4: slipped one, Yeah, slipped one.
• 49:28
  Speaker 5: You never saw this clip?
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the video of him fighting the you're talking about,
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: is it Kaselowski? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, iconic.
• 49:35
  Speaker 5: I mean all you see is.
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: Him talking about it too, Like I wasn't thinking I'm
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: gonna go over here. I want to punch his too,
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: but I'm not going to. Once you have all the
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: people around you, all the boys, and then you feel
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: some holding back method's happening and shoving, you just can't
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: help it.
• 49:50
  Speaker 6: Just Yeah, So that aftermath of that is is I
• 49:55
  Speaker 6: hope we don't get suspended, you know, I hope, I
• 49:58
  Speaker 6: hope you know what's going to be the fine. So
• 50:00
  Speaker 6: it's hard to go into that going thanks for having
• 50:03
  Speaker 6: my back. Boys, we should have won that race and
• 50:07
  Speaker 6: let's go party.
• 50:11
  Speaker 4: It's more of a oh ship, what what just happened?
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 50:15
  Speaker 5: Was coming.
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: I feel like I feel like NASCAR could use a
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: couple more of those moments. Yeah, we're trying to build
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: the sport. Who who in your mind because you were
• 50:23
  Speaker 1: in such a obviously it was like it was like
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: lightning in the bottle when you sprung on the scene
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: to be this polarizing figure. Who do you feel like
• 50:30
  Speaker 1: has some of that potential in this generation of NASCAR?
• 50:36
  Speaker 6: Yeah, it's I wish it was an easy answer. It's tricky, right,
• 50:40
  Speaker 6: because the the evolution of aerodynamics and race cars is
• 50:46
  Speaker 6: making it harder for somebody to dominate. And I think
• 50:51
  Speaker 6: you've got to have the lightning in the bottle personality
• 50:55
  Speaker 6: or or you know, connection to a fan base that
• 50:58
  Speaker 6: that that kind of eats that, but you got to
• 51:01
  Speaker 6: back it up with the winning.
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: On the track.
• 51:03
  Speaker 6: And it's just I mean you right now, you've got
• 51:05
  Speaker 6: Denny Hamlin, right, He's he's I feel like, doing a
• 51:10
  Speaker 6: great job on the track. You know, he doesn't mind
• 51:13
  Speaker 6: speaking his mind, and so it definitely it's easy for
• 51:17
  Speaker 6: that to create some rivalries or to create a like
• 51:21
  Speaker 6: or dislike him either. You know, everybody respects him because
• 51:25
  Speaker 6: of his talent. But I think you know, what he
• 51:28
  Speaker 6: says off the track, you're either gonna love it or
• 51:30
  Speaker 6: hate it. And and I think I think Denny's adding
• 51:34
  Speaker 6: a lot of value to the sport right now, for sure.
• 51:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I see what you're saying.
• 51:38
  Speaker 4: That young guys.
• 51:39
  Speaker 6: I mean, I know everybody's focused on hosts of r and.
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: Buddy every time somebody comes on this show, in particular
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: Racing with the Boys, and we bring a post of
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: Bar's name, like it seems like he's not He doesn't
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: have a lot of allies.
• 51:49
  Speaker 5: In the club, off everyone everybody like he's beast.
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: It seems like he could be the cat that.
• 51:54
  Speaker 6: Yeah, but I want him to be successful. I want
• 51:56
  Speaker 6: him to win more because.
• 51:58
  Speaker 4: We need him.
• 51:59
  Speaker 6: We need that, we need if he's willing to put
• 52:01
  Speaker 6: himself out there like that, and listen, you know he was.
• 52:05
  Speaker 6: He was up at you know, met Gala, and I
• 52:08
  Speaker 6: think he was you know, in around the SP's like
• 52:12
  Speaker 6: he's doing all the right things and NASCAR is helping
• 52:15
  Speaker 6: to get him in the right places. But if he
• 52:19
  Speaker 6: doesn't have more wins, then then it's only gonna take
• 52:24
  Speaker 6: this yeh so far. So you know it's to me,
• 52:28
  Speaker 6: it's a combination of the Hamlets, the Chase, Elliots, the Larsons,
• 52:34
  Speaker 6: the hosts of ours. You know, like like you got
• 52:36
  Speaker 6: to have you got to have a handful of guys
• 52:39
  Speaker 6: that that are that that are that are bringing something
• 52:42
  Speaker 6: unique and special. And I think we got a good group.
• 52:43
  Speaker 6: We got some good momentum happening right now. But but
• 52:47
  Speaker 6: I think for hosts of art to really stand out,
• 52:49
  Speaker 6: he's got to win more.
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I see what you're saying too, when you
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: brought up earlier, when you were answering the question of
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: somebody dominating because aerodynamics and everything else, it is like
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: back in then, where you could potentially dominate, takeover and
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: have it all won by a couple of races out
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: and then you're just the man, and then your fan
• 53:09
  Speaker 1: base loves you, and then you could be on the
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: mic and say a couple of things like oh where
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: they gonna celebrate with milk? Or you can even say, oh,
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: I've had this thing wrapped up for a couple of
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: weeks now toward just strengthens your audience even more, or
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: brings in people who hate hearing you say that or
• 53:22
  Speaker 1: brag a little too early, because you can just dominate,
• 53:24
  Speaker 1: like knowing you get on the you get on the
• 53:26
  Speaker 1: track and everybody's thinking like, oh shit, this is this
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: is Jeff's track right here, just probably gonna win this
• 53:31
  Speaker 1: one exactly.
• 53:32
  Speaker 6: I mean you have one ability to back up what
• 53:35
  Speaker 6: you say, yeah, you know, by by action on the track.
• 53:38
  Speaker 6: And the other is that you've got a group of
• 53:43
  Speaker 6: very loyal fans and people surrounding you. They're gonna support
• 53:47
  Speaker 6: you no matter what you say. And so that feels good, right,
• 53:51
  Speaker 6: and it gives you confidence and you can just keep
• 53:54
  Speaker 6: going with that. But those other pieces have to be yeah.
• 53:59
  Speaker 5: Yeah, what does a contract look like for a driver?
• 54:02
  Speaker 5: And what do you consider a failure? And in driving
• 54:06
  Speaker 5: community like Driving Sports World.
• 54:10
  Speaker 4: Let's cover both of those.
• 54:11
  Speaker 6: So so like a driver contract, yeah, I mean they're
• 54:14
  Speaker 6: usually three years with a two year extension is typically
• 54:18
  Speaker 6: what they look like.
• 54:20
  Speaker 4: You know, there are there's.
• 54:21
  Speaker 6: Purse and and Metia writes money that's tied to the charter,
• 54:26
  Speaker 6: which is I don't want to call it a franchise
• 54:28
  Speaker 6: because it's not, but sort of like the franchise system
• 54:30
  Speaker 6: of NASCAR. And so there's there's in racing in general,
• 54:35
  Speaker 6: just racecar drivers, just not just NASCAR. There always is
• 54:39
  Speaker 6: a split of Hey, if we're earning money, if we're
• 54:42
  Speaker 6: bringing money in by winning or wherever we finish, then
• 54:46
  Speaker 6: there's a split of that of some percentage could be
• 54:51
  Speaker 6: goes to the driver and that still exists today in
• 54:56
  Speaker 6: some some form. And then there's a base salary, and
• 54:59
  Speaker 6: then there's performance bonuses. You know, you win the championship,
• 55:03
  Speaker 6: you know, you win certain races or a number of races,
• 55:07
  Speaker 6: and and there's bonuses. And listen, the guys are making
• 55:11
  Speaker 6: the top guys are now making great money. I mean,
• 55:14
  Speaker 6: you know, just sign a new media rights steal. What
• 55:17
  Speaker 6: two years ago this our believe our second year in
• 55:19
  Speaker 6: the new media rights deal, NASCAR did a great job,
• 55:22
  Speaker 6: is you know, very good money. And and when that
• 55:26
  Speaker 6: goes up, then then.
• 55:28
  Speaker 4: Salaries go up.
• 55:30
  Speaker 6: And you know, sponsorship is a unique thing in NASCAR
• 55:35
  Speaker 6: for the race teams.
• 55:36
  Speaker 4: It it plays a.
• 55:37
  Speaker 6: Big role in how we go racing. And while the
• 55:42
  Speaker 6: media rights numbers are probably at the top of that
• 55:45
  Speaker 6: they've ever been, the partner and the sponsorship numbers are
• 55:48
  Speaker 6: are are not what they were when Dale Junior, you know,
• 55:52
  Speaker 6: was there and and even in you know My Heyday
• 55:55
  Speaker 6: and Jimmy's Heyday, I mean those were some some big numbers.
• 55:58
  Speaker 6: Also the licensed merchandising, so that was that was huge
• 56:03
  Speaker 6: back then. I mean, that was the one thing going
• 56:05
  Speaker 6: back to Earnhart too is you know he he, he
• 56:08
  Speaker 6: was adamant when we were off the track talking business.
• 56:12
  Speaker 6: Get your rights, you know, get your likeness and your
• 56:15
  Speaker 6: rights to to your name and and control as much
• 56:19
  Speaker 6: of the licensed merchandise as you can. And and the
• 56:23
  Speaker 6: reason he was so adamant about that is because there
• 56:25
  Speaker 6: wasn't as much money coming in from meteor ites and
• 56:29
  Speaker 6: sponsorship at that time.
• 56:31
  Speaker 4: But that that that royalty check the thing was huge.
• 56:35
  Speaker 6: So so along the way, you know, probably mid two
• 56:38
  Speaker 6: thousands that started to cross over where where the media
• 56:42
  Speaker 6: rights deal started getting much much bigger and the sponsorship deals.
• 56:46
  Speaker 3: And do you play out people contract or can they
• 56:48
  Speaker 3: be fire? Is it a clause in the contract where
• 56:50
  Speaker 3: you can separate the contract?
• 56:53
  Speaker 4: Separate it?
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: I mean like like for us, it's like, hey, really, boy,
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: bring your iPads about. Yeah, I'm about to be let go.
• 57:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 57:08
  Speaker 6: Not if you're in the middle of the contract. If
• 57:11
  Speaker 6: you are coming up on a renewal like an extension, right,
• 57:18
  Speaker 6: it's it's the team has the option to to to
• 57:23
  Speaker 6: to make a change if you're in the middle of
• 57:25
  Speaker 6: a contract, unless they do something really really bad and
• 57:30
  Speaker 6: they want out of it too, you know, then maybe,
• 57:33
  Speaker 6: but I've rarely ever seen where we're in that situation
• 57:38
  Speaker 6: unless you buy them out. If if there's somebody out
• 57:41
  Speaker 6: there that's so attractive an advantage, you know, advantageous to
• 57:46
  Speaker 6: to bring in coming from a with a sponsor as well, uh,
• 57:51
  Speaker 6: in a level of performance that you're like, man, do
• 57:53
  Speaker 6: anything to get that driver, then then you would probably
• 57:58
  Speaker 6: go to the current driver and go, hey, I think
• 58:00
  Speaker 6: it'd be best, you know, if we part ways and
• 58:04
  Speaker 6: here's here's sort of the going away money that.
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: The compensation package. Yeah to eke it. Oh, we're seeing
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: we need a wrap I do have. Jimmy came on
• 58:16
  Speaker 1: and Jimmy gave his Mount Rushmore of drivers, all right,
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: I would love to know you're Mount Rushmore of NASCAR drivers.
• 58:25
  Speaker 4: Oh my gosh.
• 58:26
  Speaker 6: Well, you know, I think that I look at it
• 58:32
  Speaker 6: as combination of championships wins, right, because if you look
• 58:36
  Speaker 6: at Earnhart, Earnhart won seven championships, but seventy six races,
• 58:42
  Speaker 6: I believe, is what he won, and so so he
• 58:45
  Speaker 6: doesn't have the wins to go along with with the
• 58:50
  Speaker 6: number of championships, but yet he's he's still number one.
• 58:55
  Speaker 6: And Richard Petty's got two hundred wins and the seven championships.
• 58:59
  Speaker 6: You know, I didn't race against Richard, but you know
• 59:02
  Speaker 6: I would put him as his number two. Not that
• 59:05
  Speaker 6: we have to have it in order. We're just looking
• 59:06
  Speaker 6: for four to go up there. And then David Pearson
• 59:10
  Speaker 6: to me, he's second on all time win lists at
• 59:13
  Speaker 6: one hundred and five wins, and to me he's number three.
• 59:16
  Speaker 6: And then I'd put Jimmy number four, just because you know,
• 59:19
  Speaker 6: he said you got to have three seven times over
• 59:21
  Speaker 6: you like, put.
• 59:23
  Speaker 4: Myself up there, jim fifth up there. I put myself fifth.
• 59:31
  Speaker 5: See Jimmy put hisself forth, So he's.
• 59:33
  Speaker 1: Jimmy rattle all four. He didn't like a list, but
• 59:35
  Speaker 1: he did, right.
• 59:36
  Speaker 5: He rat four, and then he said hisself last at
• 59:39
  Speaker 5: the end.
• 59:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, who's winning it?
• 59:41
  Speaker 6: I mean, listen, if I'm Jimmy, be hard for me
• 59:44
  Speaker 6: not to put myself up there too, because he's you know,
• 59:47
  Speaker 6: like you have to have the three seven time champions
• 59:50
  Speaker 6: up there.
• 59:50
  Speaker 4: I mean that, that to me is just a given.
• 59:54
  Speaker 6: I think it really comes down to who's who's the fourth, right,
• 59:57
  Speaker 6: And and I would put Pearson just because I chased
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 6: his record my whole career. Well, you know, halfway through
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 6: my career when I thought, you know, you're not getting
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 6: to Richard Petty two hundred, but that one hundred and
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 6: five seemed attainable at one time, and you know I
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 6: got to ninety three. So so to me, Pearson was
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 6: always just and you look at his his percentage of wins,
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 6: and you know what he did because he didn't always
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 6: run a full season and you know, he didn't always
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 6: chase the championships when he probably could have been.
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 4: But man, that guy won. He won a lot, and
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 4: I respect that.
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 1: So Pearson, Petty, Earn Hart and Johnson. You you're at the
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 1: day of Tona five hundred, at the peak of your careers.
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 1: Who's winning the Daytona five hundred?
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 4: Oh? All of us?
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 6: Earn Hart, Yeah, No, he's the man. He's the man.
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 6: I mean, Earn Hart, nobody could. I mean, like I
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 6: watched him do things and I was fortunate enough to
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 6: learn from him and apply some of those later. But
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 6: now he did things at a super speedway. Even though
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 6: he only won one Daytona five hundred, the guy should
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 6: have won ten or fifteen of them. I mean he was,
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 6: you know, dominating races, leading more laps. You look what
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 6: he did at Talladega and it just for whatever reason,
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 6: the Daytona five hundred sort of just just you know,
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 6: was his kryptonite until ninety eight.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 4: But but he he was a master, absolute.
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 1: Master, who's winning on a course like Dover.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 4: Jimmy, Yeah, that was his track. I mean, that was that. Yeah,
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 4: what's of.
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: Course you're taking it? No questions asked, It shouldn't even
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 1: be asked.
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 6: Well, unfortunately, my my best track was also another one
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 6: of Jimmy's best tracks, which is Martinsville. I think we
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 6: both have nine wins, you know there. But if I
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 6: if I was going to say, of those guys, where
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 6: would I want to go? Where I take them? Sonoma?
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: Okay, okay, yeah, taken to the deep end of Sonoma.
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 4: Oh yeah, oh yeah. Yeah.
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 1: We gotta get Jimmie back in here so they can
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: settle these yeah. Hell yeah.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, we'll just.
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 1: Get them to one on one, like we'll go out
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 1: for a day.
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 6: Yeah, we might get in some stories that can't be
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 6: shown on television.
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 1: Jeff, Thank you many, thank you, Thank you so much
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 1: for sire, big Gugs, sidey Cases. Thank you for watching
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 1: Racing with the.
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