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Make Your Government Work For You · AccessCo Leaders Career Conversations

• Vinessa Gingrass: Welcome, Shaneka Odom. Thanks so much for being on AccessCo Leaders to speak into our students from Imhotep Institute Charter. So let's get into it. In one to two sentences, tell us what the Federal Highway Administration does and what your role is as Deputy Division Administrator. Shaneka Odom: my agency is responsible for ⁓ providing federal to all of the state DOTs, State Department Transportation's across the entire country. So my office is responsible for oversight. So all of the money that's distributed from the federal government, we make sure that that money is one used for the use for transportation projects and that it's used appropriately and we make sure that we don't waste our tax dollars. Vinessa Gingrass: Love it, love it. Okay, and so where are you based now and where did you grow up? Shaneka Odom: So I'm based now in Baltimore, Maryland, and that's actually where I'm from, born and raised in Baltimore. So I've actually moved around for the last 10 years with the federal government. So I've lived in three states. And with this new position as the deputy division administrator, it gave me the opportunity to move back home. Vinessa Gingrass: Okay, do you want to tell us a little bit about some of the other opportunities that working with this department has offered you? else you got to live? Yeah. Shaneka Odom: Yes. Yes. So I actually started off working in the state of Maryland and I was picked up by the federal government. in about 10 years ago, as I just mentioned. And the first place they moved me to was West Virginia, Charleston, West Virginia, a place I'd never been to, I'd never heard of. I thought that maybe it was like maybe an hour away because I've only been to the western portion of West Virginia. But come to find out, Charleston is five hours away from Baltimore. So that was my first with the federal government, and I was a traffic engineer with them. I was there for three years and then I got a position as a major projects engineer in Oregon. So I went from working on safety related programs to managing some of the biggest projects in the country. All of projects that I managed, excuse were over billion dollars. And I managed four projects that were over a billion dollars. Vinessa Gingrass: That's very exciting and coast to coast. That's cool. You get to travel and given those opportunities earlier on. So did always know you wanted to be an engineer? Shaneka Odom: Yes. not at all. So ⁓ I was younger, like around middle school aged, I was really into architecture and I was really fascinated with really old buildings. So I always would just design floor plans. I would like draw out houses that I wanted to my dream home and I would ⁓ get my mom to get me all of this software from from like Best Buy where you could like do your own floor plans. And so I was really fascinated with drawing buildings and ⁓ So that was like the first step towards kind of towards where I ended up, which was civil engineering and ended up as a designer. So of my teachers actually told me that instead of architecture, I should go into engineering because it's very similar, except you make more money. Now I've been in the industry. So now I've been in the industry a long time, it's nothing like architecture, not even close. Vinessa Gingrass: That's a nice tip there. okay. So a little bit of misinformation there, but ⁓ that latter part of the advice is working out for you. ⁓ Okay. Shaneka Odom: Yes, yeah, it worked out and it was definitely by design. Like I think it was meant for me to end up as an engineer. I feel like all of my dreams have been fulfilled by going into this field. A field that I never knew existed, mind you. So I went from wanting to draw buildings to designing roadways and then to providing safety implementation that improved that reduce fatalities at intersections. And then I went from that to managing really big bridge projects. And now I manage a whole office full of engineers and environmentalists and right away specialists. So now I get to run a whole team of engineers. Vinessa Gingrass: I love it. And I love how joyful and fulfilled ⁓ you are in your career. And that it kind of found you, but on the same token, you were designing, building structures from, you know, your younger, youngest years. that's really cool to see. ⁓ one question, more question as it relates to that. In middle school and high school, were you doing engineers STEM stuff as well, or what was keeping you busy? Shaneka Odom: No, so in middle school, I was more involved in more of the artsy type of things. I was a dancer. I was very much into dance programs. I always wanted to be in the school plays. So I was more focused on those things. But I was in the band. I played clarinet, and I played alto sax in middle school. those were the, I think I was leaning more into. to the artsy side of my brain versus the technical side. And once I made it to high school, I ended up going to an engineering focused high school. It's called the Baltimore Polytechnic Institute and it's a college prep school. And if you go to that school, you're basically you're in training to be a future engineer. And so I actually had to transfer halfway through high school. So I spent my first two years at that school and then I transferred to a trade school and my trade, I'm sorry, somebody's making a lot of noise. So my trade ended up being architectural drafting. So I still wound up, you know, kind of connecting with that love of architecture, but that also kind of steered me into engineering because we were physically drawing out engineering plans in high school. And so those things were my first introductions to like pre-engineering. Vinessa Gingrass: Wow. That's amazing that ninth grade you were already kind of career focused in something that you're still enjoying, feeling fulfilled by decades later. That's really cool. And that's what we're kind of tapping into here on AccessCo Leaders with the students on today. Torrel Brown: So what are some things that people might overlook when it comes to like, I don't know how explain it, like what are some technologies that are in the road that people don't see or overlook or don't think about? that's what like, you know, something that's really like, don't know, technically advanced about a road, because people don't really, it's like a road like. Shaneka Odom: yes, it is. It is. So it depends on how old the intersection is. ⁓ let's next time you are in car with your family and you ⁓ approach a traffic signal, if you look at the if you look at the ground, you might like these lines in the street. And it's like really fine. It looks like this like black lines that are in the road where the car actually sits. So those are sensors. Those are traffic signal signals, signals, ⁓ So when your car hits that, it triggers signal that it's someone sitting there. So then it'll change the signal so that you can turn. And the advanced signals, you'll see a camera above the intersection that's attached to the pole. Those are the newest technology that we use. And it actually uses radar to actually calculate where the cars are. It also calculates how many cars there are. And it will adjust the signal time in depending on how many cars are sitting at the intersection. Vinessa Gingrass: Already getting into the nitty gritty, the details. And yeah, I've seen squares. I always thought that they were weights. So like, sometimes if a light is taking really long, I'll back forward and back to try to make it think I'm multiple cards to get to it going. ⁓ Shaneka Odom: Good And I have to, yeah, and I also have to tell my family, you're supposed to actually drive on it because if you drive past it, it'll think that no, it won't register your vehicle anymore. So you actually have to sit on it for quite some time so that it can recognize that it's a car there. Vinessa Gingrass: Okay, yeah, thanks for those tricks of the trade there. Torrie-Ann Brown: My question is, what is the biggest challenges that you face while overseeing a team of engineers? Shaneka Odom: So the biggest thing is managing, funny enough, is managing personalities. It's like you have a group of 10 folks, for example, and they all have different personalities. They're coming from different backgrounds, different perspectives, and you have to figure out a way to get all of these folks who are so different to work together. So I find that the biggest challenge is one, trying to get everybody on the same page and moving in the same direction, but also trying to recognize that everybody does have a voice and everybody should be heard and everybody's thoughts do matter and should be incorporated. So trying to manage that is definitely a skill. that in school they don't tell you about these things. They tell you to be really good at math, be really good at a certain topic. But actually working with people and working on teams is probably the biggest you can bring. Vinessa Gingrass: Okay, can you give the students some advice because that is something that will come up daily and for the rest of their careers. So how can they step into that? Shaneka Odom: That's the one thing I will definitely say is get used to working on teams. Get used to talking to people in person, up the phone and calling. That is very uncomfortable even for me. I consider myself a hybrid. I'm millennial, but I think I'm a Gen Z hybrid a little bit. So I prefer text. I prefer to not. actually have to talk to someone, but I find that I cannot get anything accomplished without actually talking to people. It's a really big deal. And get used to, like I said, get used to working on teams, get used to to help folks who might be struggling in a group, because we always have that one person that might fall a little short when we work on teams, but making sure that we bring everybody along and making sure that everybody, you know, ⁓ playing their part. Torrel Brown: not if you were really good at math or ⁓ naturally or you learned how to do math like where some stuff that you do to be more proficient in math. Shaneka Odom: All right, so, and this is the one thing, I wanna break this down because most people think to be an engineer you have to be great at math, you have to be great at science. was not good at either one. I really love math, but I struggled making careless mistakes. So I struggled quite a bit in math. And I didn't have a ⁓ and I didn't, I was the first person in my family to graduate from college. So I didn't have someone to guide me or to show me the way. I had to kind of figure it out on my own. ⁓ So one thing I had was determination and I was determined I was going to be an engineer and I was going to keep going no matter what. So if let's say I didn't do well in a class and I might have got a D, I might have gotten an F. thing I never gave up. And I had to seek out different ways to teach myself how to learn those difficult topics. You all are lucky you have YouTube University to help you. Like I didn't have that luxury. I would have to go and talk to my teachers and constantly sit in their office for hours. Like, please teach me this. And a lot of times it was repetition. Like if I if you do it over and over again, you'll get good at you'll get better at it. And then once you know your foundation, anything that builds on that becomes a lot easier. But with you all like YouTube, like if I don't know how to do a calculus problem, I don't know how to approach it, there's 20 different ways that you can teach yourself how to do these things now. So I think that's a huge benefit that you all could use. But yes, you do not have to be good at math or science. Just be very determined to keep going and not give up. Vinessa Gingrass: I Okay, great information there. I think that's probably a misconception about into engineering. So thanks for speaking to that. And also ⁓ strengths and your weaknesses too, and how when you're on a mission, ⁓ have to dig into those weaknesses and put in the extra time yourself to overcome those. And you found a way to do that Torrie-Ann Brown: How do you or your team collect accurate data to push towards your decision making? Shaneka Odom: All right, so since I work for the federal government, a lot of our data is provided by the states where we sit. So we use data from the state of Maryland to make the decisions. But when I worked for the state of Maryland, I was responsible for coming up with data. one thing is we have a lot of... and documents, have a lot of methods, have books and manuals that kind of define how we collect data. And so Data feeds into everything we do and every decision we make. Like, I can't go out and put a traffic signal at an intersection if I don't have data to support it. Or if I can't go out and say I want speed bumps in this neighborhood if I didn't go out and do an engineering study to make sure that the data supports putting a speed bump in a certain neighborhood or putting in a safety feature. It's like, do I have data to show that? there's a lot of crashes in this area or if it's I have data to show that it's unsafe for pedestrians. So a lot of our data also comes from the police department. So let's say we need to do a safety project in a particular area we have to rely on the police department to collect information through police reports or through incidents they've had to report to and we use that information to determine what type of needs what type of features we need to add to a particular area to make it safer. data is a really big part of what we do and accurate data is a really important part ⁓ the process. And the data isn't accurate. So ⁓ a of times, because offices don't really interact with the engineering side of things, they don't know that when they fill out those police reports, if they don't fill it out complete, or if it's some... they might have a mild point wrong or they might have the intersection written down incorrectly, that can contribute to bad data. So it's like, it's kind of like we all have to work together and we kind of, we educate the law enforcement on why this information is important. we kind of, it's a circular thing. So data ⁓ very important in what we do. Vinessa Gingrass: Okay, so what I'm hearing is your job is like equally designed and building as it is dealing with people and the research component kind of all interplaying together. Would you say that one like is the research more the top priority or something you're spending more time on? Shaneka Odom: No, and our office is more of the implementation of it. So way our office is set up, because ⁓ at the federal level, don't, we aren't the people who are like deciding what projects happen. We support the state ⁓ give them and provide funds so that they can get those projects done. So we don't really play a big role in the data itself, but we put a lot of A lot of the responsibility falls on the state make sure that their information is accurate when they present it to us, because we'll use their data to justify the funds that we're providing them. Ilyne Deliquina: Shaneka, I love ⁓ that you shared that you were born and raised in Baltimore and now that back in green room, you shared that you've been doing this kind of this line of work for over 20 years now, which is amazing. Thank you ⁓ for our roads safe and up to date and up to code. I do have a question about some of the time that you were moving around. Like you shared about West Virginia and then Oregon. I'd love to how you continued to... get settled and make those moves and find a community to help you continue to progress professionally and personally. Shaneka Odom: Community is very important. bug hit me, the travel bug hit me when I went to, was, I'm a graduate of Morgan State University. So think was my senior year. I was lucky enough to be selected for an internship that sent me to ⁓ Japan. to work for the Army Corps of Engineers. And Morgan State paid for my flight. They paid to get me there and they connected me with the federal agency that hosted my internship. having that ability to travel that young, I had never been on a plane before. I had never been out of the country. I had never been away from home. And so... Getting used to that, and remind you, I was homesick the first few months. The food was different. It was weird to me. was like everything was completely new. But by the end of that summer, I did not want to come home. And so once that happened, I was determined that I was going to travel everywhere as often as I could, as long as I could. So I think that was like the first step, getting comfortable with being an uncomfortable place. Ilyne Deliquina: You Shaneka Odom: So by the time it was time for me to graduate, I wanted to get a job out of state. It didn't work out that way. I wound up working, getting a job for the state of Maryland, but that travel bug was still in me. So the whole time I was working for the state of Maryland, I said, I don't know what to tell you all, but I'm going to work for the federal government and I'm going to travel. That was something I was very determined to do. And so I guess that first step in college is kind of what pushed me into pushing myself out of my comfort zone. And I'm a bit of a loner. So I have no issue with traveling by myself. I've done it quite a few times. I enjoy it. So I think those things kind of led me to it. Hopefully I answered your question. Ilyne Deliquina: You did, thank you. ⁓ And for our listeners, Torrie-Ann had this giant smile on their face and I'll let the students explain why they're excited to hear you travel to Japan. Torrie-Ann Brown: Recently, ⁓ Program at Imhotep Charter Institute Charter High School. We traveled Japan earlier in February. It February the 2nd, we actually traveled to Japan where we had to, where we were able get like an insight of the different technologies and how their infrastructures are and how they operate as like a society. While also collecting our own research to bring back to our STEM team, so that we're able to sustainable solutions to our team. And also recently we created a bill for a city council where we presented to city council of our solutions that gathered while we were in Japan and that bill got approved. So we will be doing a environmental STEM Waste Innovation Act program here in Philly. Shaneka Odom: That's amazing! Which part of Japan did you all visit? Vinessa Gingrass: Incredible. Torrel Brown: We went to LAO since we were in Shinjuku. Where else we went? We went to Kyoto Tower and also some other places. We went to Oya Crossing. We went there too. Shaneka Odom: facts. Torrie-Ann Brown: to that. went to the Environmental Center in Cyberdyne. as well. Vinessa Gingrass: Beautiful. and all that inspiration and motivation that you guys got to bring back with you and then presenting to in a department like Shaneka. That's Shaneka, can you speak to how they've already accomplished so much in the 11th grade? do you think of that opportunity and how can they build on that? Shaneka Odom: First of all, I think that is amazing. I think every young person should travel and to get this opportunity in high school is just, not a lot of people lucky enough to have that opportunity because I feel like this is like the stepping stone to your futures. It's like, now that you've been to Japan, don't you want to travel more? Don't you want to go to other places too? It's like, see, it sparks something in you and then you start to realize that the world isn't as big or spread apart as we once thought. It's actually a lot smaller. And then one thing I did realize traveling much as I do is that there's someone just like me in France. There's someone just like me in There's just like me in the Caribbean. and you realize there's a lot more similarities than differences the more you travel. Vinessa Gingrass: I love that our interconnectedness, our humanity. Shaneka Odom: Yes. That's part the reason why I decided to be a traffic engineer because I wanted to be the person to explain to my family members. One, how all of this works and how they could advocate and how we could advocate for our communities to make them safer. It's like a lot of this is really easy. It's like you could, all you have to do is call up your local department of transportation if you want your neighborhood to be safer. But a lot of people really don't have access to that information. And I find that communities where we, where folks look like me, they are, one informs us on how. one, to make our neighborhoods safer, how we can teach each other about how you can use your government to work for you, and how you can hold your elected officials accountable to make sure that these projects and the infrastructure ends up in your neighborhood. So there are some projects, a few projects across the country, and you can actually Google them, but a few of them, The design of a lot of our highways across the country were built through. black and brown neighborhoods ⁓ they call economically depressed neighborhoods. And typically we were adversely impacted the most by those projects. One in Baltimore in particular, we call it the road to nowhere. It's like stretch of road that basically took out blocks and blocks and thousands and thousands of homes in Baltimore city. And the went into decline and that the construction of that roadway had a lot to do with it. the infrastructure is now crumbling. And now the city actually got a grant from the federal government under the Biden administration. They got a grant to the community that was disconnected by the construction of that road. When I was in Oregon, there was another project, the construction I-5 separated. the black community and displaced a lot of the residents there. And so now they have a project called the I-5 Rose Quarter Project where they're going to put a cap over the highway to one, reconnect that community, it will allow ⁓ for construction of homes and buildings ⁓ that structure to try to bring folks back to the neighborhood that were displaced. So it's lots of projects. Reconnecting Rondo is another project that I've been lucky enough to learn about where it's a very similar situation where they built a lot of the roadways through our neighborhoods. there was an effort to reconnect those communities through grants. Vinessa Gingrass: ⁓ Great question. Thank you for bringing that up Sister Ayinde and Shaneka. Thank you ⁓ speaking to the impact of what you do give them a direct one or two things they can do when they're noticing this stuff around Shaneka Odom: So more this, I feel like this exists in almost every state, but there should be a website that connects you to your Department of Transportation and there should be a traffic department or a connection to the Department of Transportation, either for the city or the state. Because that's another key thing. You have to know who maintains the road where you're having these issues. Because a lot of folks really don't know. They'll think, oh, the city is responsible for this and come to find out it might be the state or the county. So one, have to figure out, and your city should be able to help you with this as well. you have intersection or area that is unsafe or you feel it's unsafe or you feel like there should be a traffic signal or there should be a stop sign or there should be. better pedestrian features in a particular neighborhood, you would submit a request or request through your Department of Transportation. Like here in Baltimore, they have an online portal that you can request a study be done for the city and for the state. You can just submit it online. So I'm sure in Philadelphia, they have a similar process where you can go online and submit a request. someone, they'll typically send an engineer out depending on what you're asking for. And we'll do a whole, typically we would do a whole engineering study determine what we can do here to make things safer or to slow people down or just to help congestion, you name it. Vinessa Gingrass: Beautiful. Thank you. let's get you in here. As you know, Torrell is interested in engineering. So we're really, really excited to have you on to speak to him. Torrel Brown: So been a part of the STEM program since my ninth grade year. I a lead last year. So this is my like full like year leading a group, a team. This team has like 30 people responsible for, you know, deadlines and make sure everybody's on test and stuff. This year we worked on our water filters they're done now. So we have one project that's done and ⁓ now we going to finish working our machine that turns plastic water bottles into 3D printing filament. that's ⁓ almost done. We waiting on this Amazon list for this final part for it. and also the prosthetic leg. And so what happened was that one of our three printers broke. That was like one of the big ones that can like print, you know, bigger stuff. And it was broken. So now this week we're going to go to UPenn to like meet with their engineering team and use their 3D printers. And that's about it. Vinessa Gingrass: You are leading a huge team, project managing already, all the moving parts you're bringing together. then as Sister Ayinde said, know, he'll be already having as associate. So can you speak a little bit about your education and stepping into that or some things he can consider? Torrel Brown: I am looking at, ⁓ you know, MIT, ⁓ UPenn, know, Penn NCAT, and some schools too. Shaneka Odom: So I'm going to ask what type of, what field of engineering would you like to go into? Torrel Brown: Right now, botanical or like hardware engineer. Shaneka Odom: All right. So I know quite a few mechanical engineers. I had the benefit of meeting quite a few out west. So there's a big industry for mechanical engineers on the west coast. So just keep that in the back of your head for the future. me, started, went to Morgan State University. So I started out in a four year college. However, if I had to do it again, because I had to pay for college myself, I did not have a trust fund or anything waiting for me. I had some scholarships that I was lucky enough to get my 11th and 12th grade year ⁓ that I used to help pay for my first semester. But for the most part, I had to take student loans. So if I had to do it again, I would have started at. at a community college and got a lot of my main, call them main campus courses, your basic maths, humanities, types of classes. If I had to do it again, I would have did those at a junior college and then transferred it over to a four year college. I went to HBCU, so I'm always gonna throw a plug out there for HBCU. I highly recommend it. Because there's nothing like having a school full of professors who are going to make sure you succeed and they aren't going to let you give up. times you're struggling in those math classes, ⁓ like talking to an uncle or an aunt. They will not let you give up on yourself. And if anything, they'll into you and provide you more resources to make sure you make it through. Because they want to more folks that look like us in this field. want to see more folks that look like us because go into a lot of rooms and I'm the only person. I'm the only black person. I'm the only woman sometimes. And want to change that. ⁓ I want that to change. Also, I went back to school and got my master's degree. So I have a master's in science and transportation and infrastructure studies. I went back to Morgan State University because I love free money. They paid for me to go back to grad school. That's another thing. Never pay for grad school. Someone is always going to pay for it for you. There's always money out there that can pay for grad school for you. Morgan State gave me money because I went for undergrad. So they gave me money every year to come back for grad school. In addition to that, my job paid for, reimbursed me for grad school as well. So. It's not required in a lot of fields for you to get a master's degree or a doctorate. That's really a personal choice. But I found that it helped me to stand out because it's very competitive. This field is very competitive even though it's not a, the numbers aren't very high, but it is very competitive. So I figured I needed to stay 10 steps ahead of everybody else. So when folks were focusing on undergrad, I said, I'm definitely going to grad school. Some people get their engineers license. all is that's a personal choice as well. It depends on what field you go into that determines if that's really necessary. I didn't have to get one, but if you would like to get one, I definitely think you should. It's always awesome to have a PE behind your name. Vinessa Gingrass: Mm-hmm, great advice. And I had chills. Thank you for sharing your story. So incredible. I'm glad it's to be heard more widespread. So, Torrell, what question did you have about everything she shared? Torrel Brown: So when I was talking about colleges to one of my ⁓ teachers and I said some you know, smaller schools and like she was like looking at me crazy. like she's like ⁓ saying like I gotta like she's like basically on the side of like you gotta go like an elite school like you know that's known for like you know hard rig, riggy rushing up. curriculums and stuff like so what's your opinion on like like ⁓ to like What call it like prestigious schools over maybe like a closer smaller school? ⁓ Shaneka Odom: think that smaller schools are better and you don't need name recognition. Trust me. All they care for instance for me, all they care about is the fact that it says bachelor's of science in civil engineering. And as long as your school is accredited, it's no different than an MIT or any other school. Now, I noticed that folks will go for the name recognition if they want to do research, if they want to get into, if they want to get their doctorate and they want to get into some deep level of research on a particular topic or a subject or in a particular field. But if you know you want to be a mechanical engineer and you want to work for Daimler out west or you want to work for Intel, no. You go where you can afford to go and where you know that you know where the school is going to take care of you and not look at you as a number. Yeah, they used to do that too. It's like I'm going to share a little quick story. It's like folks used to do that around here. It's like, you went to Morgan. That's the 13th grade. Absolutely not. Morgan State graduates the most black engineers. Vinessa Gingrass: where you'll be supported. Shaneka Odom: or I don't know if the number is still true, but when I was there, the most black engineers in the country. So, yeah, no. highly recommend that you go to a school that's going to suit you well and look out for you. Vinessa Gingrass: Torrell, is that got your wheels turning? Torrel Brown: Yep. Shaneka Odom: Don't let them do to you. Don't give up. It's hard, but you'll make it through. We all did. You make friends in school. You have study groups. It is a group effort. We all got each other out of school. was definitely wasn't a solo act. Torrel Brown: So what was the, you know, so was planning on asking this question first. During like your, during your project management, like, has there like anything that's going like wrong or you know, somebody probably put like a speed bump where it shouldn't have went or like messed up in like any way. And how did you like, ⁓ you know, deal with that problem. Shaneka Odom: All right, so as a project manager, you're always going to encounter issues like your projects, the timelines might fall behind. It's like the whole thing they like to push in, especially on my side, on the civil engineering side is having your project be completed on time and on budget. A lot of times that does not happen. Sometimes problems happen. There's delays. There's delays with getting materials. There's always a problem to solve. If you want to be an engineer, you're always solving problems. So the key is once you encounter that issue or a problem that you need to solve, it's making sure you get all of the information. Make sure that you do your research. Make sure you check in with folks. And make sure you do your due diligence and do your research. And cover yourself to make sure that you make the best educated guess that you can to get things back on track. or to make adjustments. Like sometimes you have to make adjustments to your schedule. Sometimes you might have to slow some parts of your project down so that everything can catch up. happens. ⁓ always going to encounter an issue, especially being a project manager. It's basically it's how do you adapt and then how can you, how can like work with your team to work together to get things done and to get it back on track. Vinessa Gingrass: Exactly like you're doing going to UPenn to get that user 3D printer, Torrell. Already solving problems. All right, Torrie-Ann is also in 11th grade, they're twins, she's interested in psychology. She wants to be a counselor. Torrie-Ann, do want to jump in? Torrie-Ann Brown: Um, my name is Torrie-Ann I'm 17 years old. I'm 17 years old. attend Imhotep Institute Charter High School. I'm a part of the STEMbassador program, NHS, and I'm a dual enrollment student. I want to major in psychology and I want to go up until my PhD. Shaneka Odom: I was just gonna add a little funny. I find that I have to be a little bit of a psychologist like being in charge of big groups and large teams it's like a lot of times you have to make sure that you are considerate mindful of folks Feelings what's happening outside of work? Some how they manage stress how how you deal with stress and how you interact with others when you're stressed. How to bring folks out of a funk when they're in it sometimes. Sometimes you have to try to inspire people to get things done even they have a lot going on personally ⁓ or at work. Like sometimes there's conflicts amongst people on the teams and so I find that you have to have a little bit of... of psychology, like you have to have a bit of knowledge of psychology and understanding how people work to get things done. So even though like I'm on the technical side, that factors into a lot of my interactions with my team. I have to be very compassionate and empathetic. So you have any schools in mind that you're at? Torrie-Ann Brown: The schools that I have in mind that are top in psychology right now is Howard, Spellman, Princeton, and Yale. Those are kind of where I'm at right now, but I'm still looking at different schools and also Penn State. Shaneka Odom: I highly recommend that you both definitely go on a lot of tours, college tours, if you can. And I know of a few that are free if you're involved in like ⁓ STEM programs. Some of them, sponsor college tours. I know out west, I was a part of a group called Building Blocks for Success. And every year they take a college tour to a different area in the country to to expose kids. Vinessa Gingrass: Very cool. And yeah, can you tell her how did what best served you and to get to get through your ⁓ master's program successfully? Shaneka Odom: So for my masters, I did it while working full time. That was very difficult to do, it's difficult to manage having to go to work and then go to school in the evening and then have a lot of homework. I would suggest that one, you make time to, it's going to be a lot of paper, like writing papers a lot of research papers and endless amounts of papers. And you want to go for your doctorate, ⁓ you'll spend a lot of your masters trying to focus on your thesis. So coming up with a good thesis and figuring out like what you want your topic to be so that you can kind of add on to that when you go for your doctorate is key. sure that ⁓ you are in constant contact with your advisors and your professors and making sure that that you're in their office often ⁓ in grad school. ⁓ Vinessa Gingrass: Torrie-Ann, what did you pick up from today's session? Torrie-Ann Brown: I have picked up from today's session is advocate for the changes that you want ⁓ your community. Vinessa Gingrass: Beautiful. Shaneka Odom: thank you all for having me. I really, I get so much joy from this. Like, I love talking with students. I love to encourage and inspire more ⁓ students in to go into engineering. As in general, but going to college period, think most kids should if they can. I highly recommend it. The thing I will leave you all with is Explore like explore your options like don't just limit yourself to a particular area like branch out advantage of internships as often as you can in high school and in college I ⁓ say that the one thing that got me that got me a job offer two weeks before I graduated was the fact that I did internships every year It's important It gets your name out there. ⁓ you exposure. And it also kind of gives you ⁓ little peek into a particular field. And then you can decide if you like it, because you really should like what you're ⁓ doing. That's one thing I will say. ⁓ Definitely like you're doing, because this will feel like work if you don't. Vinessa Gingrass: What an inspiring and rewarding conversation. Thank you so much, Shaneka Odom, the deputy division administrator. And thank you to my co-hosts, Torrie-Ann, Torrell, Sister Ayinde, and Ilyne You've been listening to Access Co-Leaders. We'll see you next time.