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What we’re hearing: Post-deadline outlook on the Cubs’ offseason plans · North Side Territory: A Chicago Cubs Podcast

0:05
Speaker 1: Welcome into Northside Territory. FIUL Territory Networks Cubs Podcast. I'm
0:09
Speaker 1: Saddam Charma with my partner Patrick Mooney. We are your
0:12
Speaker 1: Cubs beat writers over at the Athletic and Patrick, the
0:16
Speaker 1: Cubs continue to roll, take two out of.
0:19
Speaker 2: Three in Kansas City.
0:22
Speaker 1: We talked about Kevin Gosman's first start with the Cubs
0:27
Speaker 1: really strong after a little shaky at first, but you know,
0:31
Speaker 1: he quickly righted this ship and then gave them seven
0:35
Speaker 1: strong innings. Clay Holmes definitely shaky, like very much looked
0:40
Speaker 1: like a guy making his first start after a long rehab,
0:43
Speaker 1: and he didn't. It wasn't terrible, but it was like,
0:47
Speaker 1: this is a sinkerballer who was leaving his sinker up
0:50
Speaker 1: and it was getting hit hard. Does not feel like
0:53
Speaker 1: something to have a ton of concern about, because once
0:56
Speaker 1: he started finding this sinker like, there was so many
0:59
Speaker 1: ground I think it was nine ground ball outs to
1:04
Speaker 1: zero flyball outs. So if they were getting the ball
1:06
Speaker 1: in the air, they were hitting it hard is essentially
1:08
Speaker 1: what was happening to him. Not a terrible outing, not
1:12
Speaker 1: a great outing. And then the finale, Patrick, It's like
1:18
Speaker 1: it for me, maybe at least, this feels like the
1:21
Speaker 1: most overlooked story right now. Is Matthew Boyd just kind
1:24
Speaker 1: of cruising since he came back from injury. I've already forgotten.
1:30
Speaker 1: I was just looking up the numbers. His last seven starts,
1:33
Speaker 1: is it? He's gone at least six, yes, seven, and
1:37
Speaker 1: then three of the last last four he's made an
1:39
Speaker 1: out in the seventh and three of the last four
1:41
Speaker 1: he's completed seven just looking great to forty three era
1:48
Speaker 1: since he returned from the Hilic.
1:51
Speaker 2: This is a guy that I.
1:52
Speaker 1: Mean, they have a few of these options, but the
1:54
Speaker 1: way he's looking right.
1:55
Speaker 2: Now, there is a guy that can start a playoff
1:56
Speaker 2: series for you.
1:59
Speaker 3: Yeah, towards the beginning of that run in Baltimore, he
2:03
Speaker 3: had a real nice start, and you and I rarely
2:06
Speaker 3: sort of like, uh, you pick a pregame angle and
2:11
Speaker 3: like say, all right, let's just write about the starting
2:14
Speaker 3: picture because it usually blows up on you. And Boyd
2:18
Speaker 3: was really good that night. It was exactly kind of
2:21
Speaker 3: the angle that I wanted. But he just like has
2:24
Speaker 3: kept doing it to the point where like he's a
2:27
Speaker 3: great guy to talk to, like off to the side
2:30
Speaker 3: one on one. But these like post start you know,
2:33
Speaker 3: sessions with the group, asked about his performance, like it's
2:37
Speaker 3: kind of just running out of stuff to like it
2:39
Speaker 3: happened in Saint Louis, Like I just to like say
2:42
Speaker 3: something in the council. I was like, you know, he
2:44
Speaker 3: with boy just continues so I don't even know I
2:47
Speaker 3: finished it and counts like yeah, he can just stay
2:50
Speaker 3: right here, don't worry, we don't need more, like just
2:52
Speaker 3: to stay right here. He just it's just been like automatic.
2:55
Speaker 3: These starts have just been piling up in a really
2:58
Speaker 3: encouraging way. And you're right, we focused a lot on
3:00
Speaker 3: what the pitching staff has not had or what they've
3:02
Speaker 3: been missing or what they needed to go get, and
3:05
Speaker 3: Boyd has just been superb. Yeah.
3:08
Speaker 1: I can't remember if I've said this on on the show,
3:12
Speaker 1: but there it's ridiculous how good the pitching staff has been.
3:17
Speaker 1: They had I want to say, they were twenty eighth
3:21
Speaker 1: in ERA for the month of May, just an awful
3:25
Speaker 1: and awful, awful May. Since then, since June one, they
3:33
Speaker 1: are fourth in starting pitcher ERA with three sixty five,
3:38
Speaker 1: fourth in all of baseball, second in the NL. Just
3:43
Speaker 1: like I get it, they like we all agree they
3:46
Speaker 1: needed pitching. But it's kind of funny that that's that's
3:49
Speaker 1: how good they bit. Uh, there's some guys that you
3:52
Speaker 1: just kind of knew, like you like, may not keep
3:54
Speaker 1: it up type things, or you needed to fill some
3:57
Speaker 1: holes or just like bracing against iny. So it made
4:00
Speaker 1: complete sense to add bigger names. You also, you also
4:05
Speaker 1: have to know that, like two three months in the
4:07
Speaker 1: regular season looked different than you know, going all out
4:11
Speaker 1: in the postseason. So absolutely the right call in adding
4:16
Speaker 1: to that part of the team. I don't think anybody
4:20
Speaker 1: really disagrees with that. But what a job this group
4:24
Speaker 1: has done, like the group that already was around, just
4:27
Speaker 1: to get to this point, to kind of keep them,
4:29
Speaker 1: to kind of keep them afloat fight through all the injuries.
4:32
Speaker 1: When we talked to Tommy Hotbaby about a week ago
4:35
Speaker 1: now at Wrigley Field, I guess it was Thursday. This
4:39
Speaker 1: this road trip I was talking with some other writers
4:41
Speaker 1: feels extraordinarily long.
4:43
Speaker 2: I don't know.
4:43
Speaker 1: Why we all feel that way, but this it feels
4:47
Speaker 1: like I've been out on the road for more than
4:49
Speaker 1: a week. When we talked to Tommy Ottavey last Thursday,
4:53
Speaker 1: he was saying how it was kind of fun to
4:56
Speaker 1: piece it all together. He's like, yeah, you don't want
4:58
Speaker 1: to deal with injuries, but but they.
5:00
Speaker 2: Were having fun, like how do we get through this?
5:02
Speaker 2: How do we do this? How?
5:04
Speaker 1: And like kind of putting everything together and it worked
5:07
Speaker 1: and somehow they they did a really good job there
5:10
Speaker 1: now on a six in one run I believe is right.
5:15
Speaker 1: They won five in a row, lost one and then yeah,
5:17
Speaker 1: so six and one really nice run right now, and
5:21
Speaker 1: they're you know, they're about to I'm curious to see
5:24
Speaker 1: how they do against an offense that traded a couple
5:27
Speaker 1: of big you know, bigger bats but still is one
5:29
Speaker 1: of the better offenses in baseball. Uh, you know, the
5:33
Speaker 1: Nationals aren't a great team or anything, but this is
5:35
Speaker 1: this is a nice mini test, let's say, for for
5:39
Speaker 1: the for the pitching staff. At least, I should I
5:43
Speaker 1: should double check just how good they've been since the
5:45
Speaker 1: trade deadline.
5:46
Speaker 2: But there's some there's some scary.
5:47
Speaker 1: Bats in this Nats lineup, and despite them not being
5:51
Speaker 1: like some powerhouse team, it's it's good. It's a good
5:53
Speaker 1: group and a nice it'll be fun to watch and
5:57
Speaker 1: see how everyone kind of does on the staff.
6:02
Speaker 3: Well, if hottave has fun piecing it together. He'll have
6:07
Speaker 3: a blast rebuilding almost the entire pitching staff. Yeah, this
6:11
Speaker 3: coming off season, you know, working before and after the
6:16
Speaker 3: lockout of you know, I would think with all of
6:20
Speaker 3: these pitchers, the Cubs would have a decent chance of
6:24
Speaker 3: bringing back whomever they'd like. I'm sure they would like
6:27
Speaker 3: some fresh blood, some younger arms as well. But look,
6:35
Speaker 3: Boyd had tremendous promise as a young pitcher. Has shown flashes,
6:42
Speaker 3: injuries wiped out you know, big portion of his career,
6:46
Speaker 3: and he's been this perfect, you know, not just a
6:49
Speaker 3: steadying force, but really has helped level up this team
6:53
Speaker 3: during his time in Chicago. You know, with Shoda in Monaga,
7:01
Speaker 3: it's interesting we can ask, you know, should they have
7:03
Speaker 3: just picked up the three year option that they held
7:05
Speaker 3: after last season. I don't think they really regret that one,
7:09
Speaker 3: but showed us pitching at a level where, you know,
7:12
Speaker 3: you certainly could have justified that. We're assuming Clay Holmes
7:19
Speaker 3: will use that player option and become a free agent,
7:22
Speaker 3: and Kevin Gosman is at the end of his contract.
7:26
Speaker 3: Look the way they talk about the defense here and
7:31
Speaker 3: they'll get to see, you know, Wrigley Field in a
7:35
Speaker 3: playoff atmosphere. I think all of that would be pretty compelling.
7:39
Speaker 3: And you cubs have a lot of money coming off
7:41
Speaker 3: the books. They have these huge holes and rotations. I mean,
7:45
Speaker 3: we'll see what Ben Brown and Justin Steele do by
7:48
Speaker 3: the end of the season. Kate Horton made an appearance
7:52
Speaker 3: at Wrigley recently. I didn't get a chance to talk
7:54
Speaker 3: to him. I think he was, you know, kind of
7:58
Speaker 3: more behind the scenes. We don't know exactly what he'll
8:01
Speaker 3: be next year. So when you kind of add all
8:05
Speaker 3: that up, they're they're going to pour all their resources
8:09
Speaker 3: into rebuilding this pitching group.
8:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, they've They've shown us how much they value depth
8:16
Speaker 1: in that area. So I think Colin Ray has a
8:19
Speaker 1: team option. We'll see if they if that's the type
8:22
Speaker 1: of if they want to keep them as depth. You know,
8:25
Speaker 1: it's maybe I would say right now like it, but
8:30
Speaker 1: maybe they feel they can replace that production uh in
8:34
Speaker 1: a different way.
8:35
Speaker 2: Uh.
8:36
Speaker 1: But absolutely there's a lot of question marks with the
8:38
Speaker 1: starting staff, and and that is where they're going to
8:42
Speaker 1: invest their money, their resources, whether it's money or prospect capital.
8:47
Speaker 1: I'm sure they'll revisit some trade talks. Uh.
8:50
Speaker 2: They kind of did that last offseason, right, they set
8:53
Speaker 2: the groundwork for some Edward Cabrera talks.
8:57
Speaker 1: And then and then ended up executing the deal. And
9:00
Speaker 1: and I'm not saying they're gonna acquire read debtmers or
9:03
Speaker 1: someone from the Mariners, but that's there.
9:07
Speaker 2: They'll surely revisit those.
9:09
Speaker 1: Talks to see who's available and see if they can
9:12
Speaker 1: get something done. In the winter, they'll likely spend there.
9:17
Speaker 1: Of course, there's a lockout coming. We don't know exactly
9:19
Speaker 1: what everything will look like, but they're still gonna that
9:23
Speaker 1: that's gonna be their factor, their factor. Uh, I'm reading
9:28
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9:30
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9:33
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10:40
Speaker 1: So, like we just said, the investment is going to
10:45
Speaker 1: be on the pitching staff, but that doesn't mean that
10:49
Speaker 1: there aren't holes to fill on the position players side.
10:53
Speaker 1: The Cubs have a really nice group locked up.
10:55
Speaker 2: Obviously.
10:56
Speaker 1: They're infield, third, short, second, and first locked up center
11:01
Speaker 1: field with Pete locked up corner outfield spots. Saya Suzuki
11:06
Speaker 1: and Ian Happ are pending free agents.
11:10
Speaker 2: Patrick. I don't know if you've looked at this free agent.
11:12
Speaker 1: Class, but if it is not pretty, it is not
11:17
Speaker 1: looking good. So that that that's twofold one. It's going
11:21
Speaker 1: to be hard to replace that production via free agency.
11:27
Speaker 2: And two, it is likely that Saya.
11:31
Speaker 1: Suzuki, with the season he's having, is is going to
11:34
Speaker 1: be priced out of the Cubs, like at least what
11:38
Speaker 1: the Cubs want to do, not like the It's not
11:40
Speaker 1: like the Cubs can't afford him. But again, where they
11:43
Speaker 1: want to invest is going to be pitching.
11:45
Speaker 2: Pitching, pitching.
11:47
Speaker 1: Uh. Saya Suzuki is having a really good season yet again. Uh,
11:53
Speaker 1: And he's going to be sought after to the cut like,
11:58
Speaker 1: he's probably someone's going to give him like a if
12:02
Speaker 1: someone gives him a five year deal.
12:03
Speaker 2: There's no way the Cubs invest in a five.
12:07
Speaker 1: Year deal for someone who's who will be entering their
12:10
Speaker 1: age thirty two season next year. It's just not how
12:12
Speaker 1: the Cubs do things. You know, if the market's more
12:16
Speaker 1: suppressed than that, if something with the CBA changes the
12:19
Speaker 1: way teams behave, it's a different discussion. But right now,
12:25
Speaker 1: I just do not like I would assume that say
12:27
Speaker 1: Suzuki isn't coming back, and that like is kind of
12:30
Speaker 1: how the Cubs are operating as they think about the offseason.
12:35
Speaker 1: Let's make this clear, They're not like obsessing about the
12:38
Speaker 1: off season right now, because they have bigger goals. But
12:41
Speaker 1: the front offices are always thinking about these things they
12:43
Speaker 1: have to and while they're still thinking about how how
12:49
Speaker 1: to get you know, through October, there there's also part
12:53
Speaker 1: of their minds are thinking about the future as well.
12:57
Speaker 3: But this is also a natural point to to sort
13:00
Speaker 3: of reflect on what the Cubs gave up and what
13:03
Speaker 3: they did not surrender in that flurry of deals before
13:07
Speaker 3: the deadline. And so yes, maybe Jefferson Rojas winds up
13:11
Speaker 3: being a really nice third basement or second basement for
13:16
Speaker 3: the Mets for a long time. Maybe Moistist by Asteros
13:22
Speaker 3: becomes you know, an everyday dh for the Angels. Maybe
13:27
Speaker 3: he catches occasionally. But neither one of them had the
13:30
Speaker 3: clearest path to regular playing time at Wrigley Field, so
13:34
Speaker 3: obviously that made it easier for them to give up
13:38
Speaker 3: two really well regarded young players. But who they retained
13:43
Speaker 3: matters as well, And it sounds like Pedro Ramirez was
13:48
Speaker 3: constantly getting asked about Matt Shaw is still injured, which
13:53
Speaker 3: I know he could still get traded while injured, but
13:55
Speaker 3: that seemed to really just take a dent out of
13:58
Speaker 3: his present value. If you needed a right handed bat
14:03
Speaker 3: or some defensive versatility right away, and you know, you
14:10
Speaker 3: start to look at these holes. The massive amount of
14:14
Speaker 3: work that has to be done on the pitching staff
14:17
Speaker 3: made me wonder, like, do the Cubs have next year's
14:19
Speaker 3: corner outfielders already in the organization. It's not. Maybe the
14:23
Speaker 3: guys who are currently manning those positions.
14:27
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, look, I think they they love Pedro Ramirez.
14:32
Speaker 1: They didn't want to give him up right like, like
14:33
Speaker 1: you said he was. He was asked about quite a bit,
14:37
Speaker 1: one of the hotter names. It sounds like, asked about
14:41
Speaker 1: it at the deadline. Uh and and I think you
14:46
Speaker 1: see why anybody that's watched him play he is. He
14:51
Speaker 1: doesn't look overmatched at the plate, doesn't look over doesn't.
14:54
Speaker 2: Look overwhelmed by the moment.
14:57
Speaker 1: I think all the off the field stuff is exactly
15:00
Speaker 1: what you're looking for. The in between game stuff is
15:02
Speaker 1: exactly what you're looking for from a players. He's mature
15:07
Speaker 1: beyond his years in that way, and he's performing really well.
15:12
Speaker 1: He can hit, he doesn't strike out a lot, he
15:16
Speaker 1: takes his walks, he makes quality contact down the line regularly.
15:21
Speaker 2: Can he play in the outfield? I guess is the question.
15:23
Speaker 1: We've seen him play a hell of a third base already.
15:28
Speaker 1: I think the Cubs wouldn't be completely against throwing that
15:33
Speaker 1: shot and Pedro Ramirez into the corner outfield spots to
15:37
Speaker 1: set to start next year. Like I said, like say,
15:40
Speaker 1: a Suzuki probably isn't coming back. I think they understand
15:44
Speaker 1: that unless something weird happens. I don't think they're ruling
15:47
Speaker 1: out a reunion with the unhaf. My understanding is, you
15:51
Speaker 1: know that's possible. He needs to have a solid end
15:54
Speaker 1: to the season, but also you don't want him to
15:57
Speaker 1: price himself out there. So it's kind of like a
16:01
Speaker 1: give and take. But you know, before Saturday you would
16:05
Speaker 1: have said you need to see more from me and Half,
16:07
Speaker 1: and then Saturday happens, Sunday happens, and it's like, is
16:11
Speaker 1: this one of those runs that we always talk about
16:13
Speaker 1: where you know, you talk about like what's wrong with
16:16
Speaker 1: this player, this player is a mess, and then they
16:20
Speaker 1: just turn it on.
16:21
Speaker 2: There's no sign.
16:21
Speaker 1: There was no sign of this turning for Ian Half,
16:25
Speaker 1: by the way, like it was one of those things
16:27
Speaker 1: where after like a few games, I was like, Okay,
16:30
Speaker 1: this has gone on long enough that he looks.
16:33
Speaker 2: Really bad out there, and you know he.
16:37
Speaker 1: Sat against lefties now or not playing as much against lefties,
16:42
Speaker 1: and now he you know, I think he's got like
16:44
Speaker 1: five or six hits in his last two games, multiple
16:48
Speaker 1: like homers and doubles.
16:50
Speaker 2: Like he's just doing everything. He looks. He looks like
16:52
Speaker 2: a much.
16:52
Speaker 1: Better player, which is typical Ian Hap right, Like he
16:56
Speaker 1: gets on these hot streaks and can carry a team.
16:58
Speaker 1: He already carried them for a little bit earlier this season.
17:02
Speaker 1: I wouldn't rule out a reunion with you and Half.
17:04
Speaker 1: I think Half is the type who would be happy
17:08
Speaker 1: to stay in Chicago. He loves he loves the organization,
17:12
Speaker 1: he loves the city. He's very happy here.
17:14
Speaker 2: I think he'd love to stay and I don't think
17:17
Speaker 2: the Cubs have ruled that out a reunion.
17:19
Speaker 1: So the concern with a Shaw Ramirez outfield corner outfield
17:25
Speaker 1: is power. I think those guys can develop it, especially Shaw.
17:30
Speaker 1: We just haven't seen it yet. So this is not
17:33
Speaker 1: a team rebuilding and giving kids a chance to play
17:37
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty seven. But they do have to be
17:39
Speaker 1: thoughtful about how they build a team and where they
17:43
Speaker 1: expend their resources.
17:45
Speaker 2: And like I'm going to keep hammering this.
17:47
Speaker 1: We said it like kind of all of last year
17:50
Speaker 1: and then at this deadline. Pitching pitching, pitching is going
17:53
Speaker 1: to be their focus, but you can't ignore the rest
17:56
Speaker 1: of the team, and so it's going to be interesting
17:59
Speaker 1: to see how they how they fill that out. You know,
18:02
Speaker 1: these guys are already a part of twenty six and
18:05
Speaker 1: making an impact, obviously Shaw with the injury, but it
18:09
Speaker 1: twenty seven matters, and how they think about it and
18:12
Speaker 1: how they fill fill things out, It's going to be interesting.
18:16
Speaker 3: It could be really interest. I mean, that's a lot
18:17
Speaker 3: of youth and athleticism and potential upside. If you're looking
18:22
Speaker 3: at kind of Ramirez, Pete and Shaw left to right.
18:27
Speaker 3: However it pops up, I'm with you. I know we
18:31
Speaker 3: all know ianapp loves Chicago and really values the Wrigley experience.
18:38
Speaker 3: I'm just looking at that list of re agent hitters though,
18:41
Speaker 3: like if Stay is number one, might be like number
18:45
Speaker 3: three or four in terms of everyday players. I know
18:48
Speaker 3: Cups fans are the segment of Cup fans that are
18:51
Speaker 3: tired of Ianhapps streakiness would disagree with that, but he's
18:55
Speaker 3: been a consistent year over year producer obviously big market, tested,
19:03
Speaker 3: good reputation within you know, clubhouses, within the game, so
19:11
Speaker 3: I think he could be additive in those areas as
19:14
Speaker 3: well for some of those teams looking to take the
19:17
Speaker 3: next step or kind of maintain where they are. And
19:21
Speaker 3: I think with Saya, like why did we hear these
19:23
Speaker 3: sort of like say a trade rumors last offseason even
19:26
Speaker 3: this summer is because right handed impact right handed hitters
19:31
Speaker 3: are really hard to find and Saya is certainly that.
19:38
Speaker 3: And just after watching him in last year's playoffs and
19:41
Speaker 3: seeing how he hits elite pitching, like, I wouldn't be
19:45
Speaker 3: surprised if he just goes off in October and that whatever,
19:50
Speaker 3: you know, maybe price the Cubs could deal with, or
19:54
Speaker 3: would hope the range he'd fall toward, like that's out
19:58
Speaker 3: the window if Saya has a great playoffs. So yeah,
20:03
Speaker 3: I mean, I just think it's it's and I think
20:06
Speaker 3: it might be time too with some of this stuff,
20:08
Speaker 3: like not talking about them individually as much as like
20:11
Speaker 3: just kind of I know, it's great to have a
20:14
Speaker 3: stable nucleus of position players, but you know they're gonna
20:21
Speaker 3: have some over thirty infielders, you're probably gonna need Shaw
20:27
Speaker 3: and Ramirez to spell them occasionally, if not indefinitely. You know,
20:32
Speaker 3: if something happens and that maybe maybe you just find
20:36
Speaker 3: a different sort of position player to plug in there
20:40
Speaker 3: to get some of that power. You still be built
20:44
Speaker 3: around run prevention, go big on the pitching staff, but
20:47
Speaker 3: maybe there is a Michael Conforto type.
20:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, that.
20:53
Speaker 3: He was just augment the group.
20:55
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was thinking to say, maybe bring in better
20:57
Speaker 1: in competition. Yeahifying offer always makes sense, Like it does
21:02
Speaker 1: that Like if you do that for Halp, does that
21:06
Speaker 1: hamper his, uh, his free agency enough that either he
21:11
Speaker 1: like either he chooses to accept it or or it
21:14
Speaker 1: hampers his free agency and he decides, like I'll take
21:17
Speaker 1: a two year deal with the Cubs or a three
21:18
Speaker 1: year deal with the Cubs.
21:19
Speaker 2: That's a little bit less than what I was hoping for.
21:24
Speaker 1: And I wouldn't rule out like that type of thing
21:26
Speaker 1: with half, Like he does love this play so much
21:29
Speaker 1: that hometown discount quote unquote.
21:31
Speaker 2: Maybe like it's not like he'll seek.
21:33
Speaker 1: It out probably, you know, but I think he'd be
21:36
Speaker 1: willing to take he'd be more willing to take it
21:38
Speaker 1: than you know, we'd normally say heading into free agency.
21:42
Speaker 1: There's there's one more big free agent on the position
21:45
Speaker 1: player side. Let's take a break talk a little bit
21:47
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22:53
Speaker 1: Patrick Carson Kelly has been a hell of a free
22:57
Speaker 1: agent psych for for Jed Hoyer the Cubs. Heading into
23:02
Speaker 1: that offseason, it was twenty or heading into Yeah, heading
23:06
Speaker 1: into that offseason, it was the off season before the
23:09
Speaker 1: twenty twenty five season. Catcher was a huge priority. J
23:13
Speaker 1: had tried to address it trying to acquire a younger
23:16
Speaker 1: catcher by trade, tried to get Logan o'happy, which probably
23:19
Speaker 1: which he's probably lucky it didn't pull that trade off
23:23
Speaker 1: because that was like Logan o'hoppy's peak, you know, price
23:28
Speaker 1: right there, and now OHAPI was kind of like a
23:32
Speaker 1: dump at a little before the deadline. This past July,
23:38
Speaker 1: Carson Kelly. They went with the veteran signed Carson Kelly.
23:42
Speaker 1: He had an awesome twenty five. He's having a really
23:45
Speaker 1: good twenty six, and he's paired with Miguel Amaya, who
23:51
Speaker 1: is having a really strong season, whose defense has stepped up.
23:55
Speaker 1: He's catching based runners at the highest rate of his career.
23:58
Speaker 1: He's framing really well, talk to pictures and they they're
24:02
Speaker 1: happy with them. One of those part of the catching,
24:08
Speaker 1: part of the importance of catching is is just being
24:10
Speaker 1: there in between games, showing up for those meetings and
24:14
Speaker 1: being engaged in those meetings and having unique ideas and
24:19
Speaker 1: being willing to speak up, paying attention like these are
24:23
Speaker 1: the things that they look for for a catcher. And
24:27
Speaker 1: then you you hope, as you become a veteran or
24:29
Speaker 1: you become more experienced, you're you're really bringing some insightful
24:32
Speaker 1: things into the meetings or during games and helping a
24:35
Speaker 1: picture through difficult moments.
24:37
Speaker 2: Uh.
24:37
Speaker 1: Sounds like a Maya's on that path. Uh, and and
24:41
Speaker 1: doing really well there. And he's and he's hitting and
24:44
Speaker 1: it's it's hard when you're a part time catcher to hit.
24:47
Speaker 2: It's hard to get in a rhythm. And he's producing.
24:50
Speaker 1: They're both above average producers offensively.
24:53
Speaker 2: But Carson Kelly's a free agent.
24:56
Speaker 1: I think there's some mutual option those types of things
24:59
Speaker 1: like it someone's going to turn it down.
25:01
Speaker 2: He's a free agent.
25:03
Speaker 1: The question becomes, you know, it looks like they feel
25:07
Speaker 1: comfortable going forward.
25:08
Speaker 2: With the Maya at catcher.
25:13
Speaker 1: Whether he's the like full time starter, whether you partner
25:15
Speaker 1: him with a youngster, like what happens after Carson Kelly,
25:20
Speaker 1: I guess is what they're they're probably the number three
25:25
Speaker 1: on their list, or you know, to be or however.
25:28
Speaker 2: You want to look at it. As far as the
25:30
Speaker 2: off season goes.
25:33
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was thinking out loud the other day. I
25:37
Speaker 3: was when, like, but they actually give Carson Kelly the
25:39
Speaker 3: qualifying offer? I think probably not. That's a lot of money.
25:43
Speaker 3: You're talking twenty two to twenty three million dollars for
25:47
Speaker 3: one season, but that's pretty much what he delivered last year.
25:53
Speaker 3: He's gonna wind up probably between fifteen and twenty million
25:58
Speaker 3: in terms of like I'm looking at the grafts dollars metric,
26:01
Speaker 3: he's going to be around that this year. He's had
26:06
Speaker 3: stretches earlier in his career where he's been like an
26:08
Speaker 3: eighteen million dollar player. He loves it here. You know,
26:14
Speaker 3: he's had a great experience. He would certainly be opening
26:18
Speaker 3: open to continuing that. I just don't know, like how
26:21
Speaker 3: many qualifying offers can you kind of throw out there,
26:23
Speaker 3: Like if if two of the three take them all
26:26
Speaker 3: of a sudden, maybe that's a little uncomfortable. But that's
26:30
Speaker 3: how well he's played. To your point of like, there
26:32
Speaker 3: was this kind of group of this bin of catchers
26:35
Speaker 3: that that offseason, the kind of Danny Janssen's, and there
26:38
Speaker 3: was a couple others. I kind of went off the
26:40
Speaker 3: board before the Cubs signed Kelly as a guy, what
26:44
Speaker 3: are they going to do? You know, you were obsessed
26:49
Speaker 3: there one of those GM meetings, just asking around about catchers.
26:52
Speaker 3: That the catcher because that's what that's what the front
26:55
Speaker 3: office was looking at, like do we have to solve this,
26:58
Speaker 3: you know by via you know, kind of a an
27:01
Speaker 3: interesting trade angle, and they just threw money at it
27:06
Speaker 3: and it's worked out really well. I'm glad you pointed
27:09
Speaker 3: out in my iden and wrote about him for the
27:12
Speaker 3: Athletic ause I've he's felt like someone that should be spotlighted.
27:16
Speaker 3: Just how they've been able to keep things on track
27:21
Speaker 3: pitching wise. That's a credit to Kelly and Amaya in
27:28
Speaker 3: in large part. And you know, he's been he's been
27:34
Speaker 3: the highly regarded prospect. He's gone through so many injuries,
27:38
Speaker 3: he missed big chunks of development, and he's really kind
27:42
Speaker 3: of come into his own as a really nice piece
27:46
Speaker 3: on a playoff contending team, and he still has several
27:51
Speaker 3: more years of club control and could become an even
27:55
Speaker 3: bigger part. And then it comes out another prospect kind
27:58
Speaker 3: of waiting in the wings. As you wrote on the Athletic.
28:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is the thing with catching prospects. They can
28:04
Speaker 1: sometimes come out of nowhere. Owen Ayers is a highly
28:08
Speaker 1: thought of prospect within the Cubs organization. Sounds like he also,
28:11
Speaker 1: like Peedro Ramirez, was asked about a lot at the
28:14
Speaker 1: trade deadline. You're not going to see him on top
28:18
Speaker 1: one hundred list. I haven't seen him at least yet.
28:21
Speaker 1: Maybe he's on the back end of some by now.
28:25
Speaker 1: But he's twenty five, and I think people get a
28:28
Speaker 1: little scared off by age and catchers just sometimes they
28:32
Speaker 1: develop later, Like often they developed later. They come around
28:37
Speaker 1: to catching later in life, later in their careers. When
28:41
Speaker 1: I say later, like early twenties, he's you know, it's
28:44
Speaker 1: just it sometimes doesn't like a lot of times pro
28:47
Speaker 1: organizations convert guys and things like that. So he's twenty five.
28:52
Speaker 1: He kind of broke out, like, came onto the scene
28:54
Speaker 1: late last year and then he had this awesome AFL
28:57
Speaker 1: and people started talking about him and they were like.
29:01
Speaker 2: Is he is it?
29:02
Speaker 1: Legit is the question, and he's just torn apart the
29:05
Speaker 1: minors this year across three levels, very like, very productive, offensively.
29:11
Speaker 2: A triple A.
29:12
Speaker 1: The power isn't fully there, but he's still doing really
29:16
Speaker 1: well and all the metrics line up, all the underlying
29:20
Speaker 1: things are positive. He's not striking out, he's walking, looks
29:26
Speaker 1: like a really good prospect, and he's a great defender.
29:30
Speaker 2: My understanding is the Cubs are considering, or.
29:32
Speaker 1: At least they're thinking about having him be called up
29:38
Speaker 1: in September, be one of the September call ups because
29:41
Speaker 1: it expands to twenty eight.
29:43
Speaker 2: I'm remembering correctly, right, it.
29:45
Speaker 1: Expands to twenty eight, so you get one pitcher, one
29:49
Speaker 1: one beat. He'd have to be added to the forty
29:51
Speaker 1: man He's not Rule five eligible.
29:54
Speaker 2: I don't think they really care.
29:56
Speaker 1: I think they see him as part of the twenty
29:58
Speaker 1: twenty seven team, and the Cubs really believe in like
30:03
Speaker 1: like fans get so mad about this, why are you
30:05
Speaker 1: calling up a prospect and I'm playing, And they think
30:08
Speaker 1: there's a ton of value for a young guy who
30:11
Speaker 1: they see like, maybe this guy has a future with us.
30:13
Speaker 1: Come up, spend ten days here September, there's not any
30:17
Speaker 1: minor league baseball, so it just doesn't matter, like he
30:19
Speaker 1: can come up and like and he's I think that's
30:23
Speaker 1: still true about Triple A right, there's no minor league
30:25
Speaker 1: baseball in September. I'm not sure if the season goes
30:27
Speaker 1: long or whatever. Either way, either way, they like the
30:31
Speaker 1: idea of having guys come up and learn from veterans,
30:35
Speaker 1: see what they're doing, see how they go about business,
30:38
Speaker 1: see how they prepare for a game, see how they
30:40
Speaker 1: prepare for the stretch run and the playoff run. And
30:44
Speaker 1: then catchers especially, there's a ton of value of being
30:47
Speaker 1: in those meetings, Those pitcher catcher meetings, the game planning
30:51
Speaker 1: meetings incredibly important. It's just what we were talking about
30:55
Speaker 1: with the Maaya get a jump start on that for
30:58
Speaker 1: ayers and kind of see what it's like on a
31:01
Speaker 1: day to day basis to be catching a big league staff.
31:06
Speaker 1: That's not to say that they're going to hand the
31:08
Speaker 1: backup job to him.
31:10
Speaker 2: They will explore other.
31:12
Speaker 1: Things, like you said, like is there a possibility of
31:14
Speaker 1: Kelly coming back? Is there another veteran that where Maya
31:18
Speaker 1: would get the bulk of the time, And it's a
31:20
Speaker 1: different veteran backing him up, and Airs is right there
31:22
Speaker 1: ready to call up. But I wouldn't rule out Airs
31:25
Speaker 1: coming up this year. I don't know if he'll get
31:28
Speaker 1: a ton of playing time. I don't know like that,
31:30
Speaker 1: that doesn't make a ton of sense him getting regular
31:32
Speaker 1: playing time because they're trying to catch the Brewers still.
31:36
Speaker 1: So but you know, I think it's fun and interesting
31:41
Speaker 1: to think about, and like, what I really think is
31:44
Speaker 1: funny is like two years ago, there was nobody in
31:46
Speaker 1: this system that you could talk about, and things just
31:48
Speaker 1: changed so quickly with catgers, like they come out of nowhere.
31:52
Speaker 1: I brought up in the I wrote a piece about this,
31:54
Speaker 1: and I brought up Dylan Dingler.
31:57
Speaker 2: I do not, look.
31:57
Speaker 1: I was pretty clear in what I wrote, like not
32:00
Speaker 1: compare him to Dylan Dingler. But Dingler didn't was never
32:04
Speaker 1: on top one hundred lists. And he debuted at twenty
32:08
Speaker 1: five in the big leagues, and then last.
32:12
Speaker 2: Season was his twenty six, aged twenty six season.
32:14
Speaker 1: He took a step forward, and he's taking a huge
32:16
Speaker 1: step forward in his age twenty seven season. It's kind
32:19
Speaker 1: of like catchers, so like that, I think Wilson was younger.
32:21
Speaker 1: Wilson Contreuris was younger, but also he came out of
32:25
Speaker 1: nowhere and was just like it's a great time, you know,
32:28
Speaker 1: Like I remember Jason McLeod telling us, hey, pay attention
32:30
Speaker 1: to this Wilson Contreer's guy. And sure enough, like he
32:34
Speaker 1: just popped and like that's like it happens a lot
32:37
Speaker 1: with Catchers in the miners.
32:41
Speaker 3: Yeah, I Wilson did have that really long journey in
32:44
Speaker 3: the miners and all of a sudden, the light light
32:46
Speaker 3: kind of went on there, and I think it's it's
32:49
Speaker 3: really interesting the idea of airs, not just for the
32:52
Speaker 3: future planning. But I don't know, you never know what
32:55
Speaker 3: happens in October, Like there's not like a catcher store
32:59
Speaker 3: to go to, Like maybe maybe he will factor in,
33:04
Speaker 3: you know somehow. You're right though on this, Like when
33:08
Speaker 3: Treanta's came up, Council made that point of like there
33:13
Speaker 3: is value, like he like James is not going to
33:16
Speaker 3: play a lot like Kevin got sent out. There was
33:19
Speaker 3: not playing time for him. There's not gonna be a
33:20
Speaker 3: lot of playing time for James. But now in certain cases,
33:24
Speaker 3: Pedro Amirez he just stayed up here the rest of
33:27
Speaker 3: the year that he made he had enough opportunity and
33:30
Speaker 3: made a good enough impression that he's just you know,
33:34
Speaker 3: cemented himself. But for everyone else it is kind of learning,
33:40
Speaker 3: you know, off the field stuff on the field stuff
33:44
Speaker 3: just getting used to, like the speed of the game
33:46
Speaker 3: and the speed at which you have to make uh
33:49
Speaker 3: decisions zooming out. It is interesting to see where the
33:54
Speaker 3: Cubs kind of go from here. They do have a
33:55
Speaker 3: lot of young talent, almost none of them are pitchers,
33:59
Speaker 3: but they have a lot of a lot of position
34:03
Speaker 3: players that are you know, either under club control for
34:08
Speaker 3: a long time and or you have taken steps forward
34:11
Speaker 3: this year, or you know, still have some untapped potential.
34:15
Speaker 3: Like it gives you a lot to work with, especially
34:20
Speaker 3: when you'll have a lot of time on your hands
34:22
Speaker 3: during the lockout.
34:24
Speaker 2: Great looking forward to it.
34:27
Speaker 1: All Right, that's it for this episode of North Side Territory.
34:31
Speaker 1: Thanks so much for listening. Make sure to rate, review, subscribe,
34:35
Speaker 1: subscribe to the YouTube channel, and subscribe to The Athletic
34:38
Speaker 1: where Patrick and Iron type of all things Cubs.
34:41
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening and watching. Everyone, Take care