Latest / Pod Therapy / #415: Wife No Longer Wants Children, Weightloss Shame Spiral

Transcript

#415: Wife No Longer Wants Children, Weightloss Shame Spiral · Pod Therapy

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: With a children's accounts, Like, what.
• 0:02
  Speaker 2: The fuck you said?
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: It came up in the main suggestions. It was like featured,
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: Like I didn't fucking search for it.
• 0:08
  Speaker 3: I swear I didn't search for it. It just pops up.
• 0:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Las Vegas. No, this is pod therapy, real people,
• 0:16
  Speaker 4: real problems, and real therapists. You can your questions anonymously
• 0:20
  Speaker 4: pod therapy dot nets or email us at pod therapy
• 0:22
  Speaker 4: guys at.
• 0:23
  Speaker 3: Gmail dot com.
• 0:24
  Speaker 4: And now broadcasting from the studio that's unnamed. You can
• 0:27
  Speaker 4: name the studio feature in dot com studios that's Jim.
• 0:30
  Speaker 4: That's when I'm next time for some pod therapy.
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: We are closing in on the season eight finale. Our
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: minions are hard at work in our discord. You can
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: join them at Patreon dot com slash therapy. They are
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: designing our trivia challenge, and we are still debating amongst
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: ourselves what skin in the game we will all be
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: throwing in because we're recording this one in the past.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: But we are excited. We're excited for our gift exchange
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: at the end of the year. I already know what
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: I'm getting you guys. Okay, I've already found the thing
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: I like.
• 0:59
  Speaker 4: Gifts have been ordered. Oh I'm hoping they arrive on time.
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: All right, we got some time, You got some time.
• 1:05
  Speaker 4: You're honestly, here's the thing they're from.
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: They are illegal in thirteen count They're being out of
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: Taiwan right now.
• 1:15
  Speaker 4: It is not learn my lessons, but these are our
• 1:20
  Speaker 4: special team made And I was honestly expecting an email
• 1:25
  Speaker 4: from the company at some point, Oh wow, to be
• 1:27
  Speaker 4: like sir, we can't we can't be.
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: This is not your order has shipped.
• 1:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I haven't heard from them yet.
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: So end of the year is coming. We always do
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: our season finale show where we take a break from
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: answering the questions. We do a gift exchange, we do
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: some trivia, champions are crowned, and we just have a
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: really good time. It's our office party. It's how we
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: finish out the year. You can definitely be a part
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: of that and enjoy it with us. And this is
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: also the time of year, since we're talking about giving
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: and we're reflecting on another season in the books that
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: we just encourage you. If you are part of the
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: main show, you're not joining us at patreon dot com
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: slash therapy. Our show is people Powered it has made
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: us exist every week doing these ninety minutes on the
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: main feed, two hours on the Patreon feed, shows fifty
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: two shows a year, eight years in a row. We
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: are wrapping it up and we have been just doing
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: a you know, I think a unique program, a unique project,
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: a unique service. And if you're out there, you listen
• 2:23
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• 2:25
  Speaker 1: We're not good at getting everything on Instagram or doing
• 2:28
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• 2:30
  Speaker 1: We are just word of mouth, or people just bump
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: into us. They do a search, they're looking for a podcast,
• 2:35
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• 2:38
  Speaker 1: if that's you and you just found our show and
• 2:40
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• 2:42
  Speaker 1: you get it and you're with it, man, it would
• 2:44
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• 2:51
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• 2:54
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• 2:56
  Speaker 1: so we're looking for that money.
• 2:58
  Speaker 4: There is an amount of money that you can give
• 3:00
  Speaker 4: us that we will stop this medium.
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: Oh good point.
• 3:03
  Speaker 3: There's a patriot to make us. Yes.
• 3:05
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: If you're on the other side of the line and
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: you're like, Okay, I keep listening to this because I
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: haven't figured out how to unsubscribe. But I would love
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  Speaker 1: to just pay to make this stop.
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: We call it to buy your way out.
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's the deal with Patreon.
• 3:17
  Speaker 4: Once you're in, you can't get out your way out now,
• 3:22
  Speaker 4: that's obviously obviously times are tough. So if you cannot contribute,
• 3:27
  Speaker 4: you can always leave a five star review. Oh that
• 3:30
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• 3:33
  Speaker 1: You don't even have to write anything but dropping five
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  Speaker 1: star reviews on Spotify. Yeah, we'll write it. Yeah, ask
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: us what we want you template? Oh yeah, a thing
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: that people could copy, that's right. Yeah, that's a great idea.
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: Actually I should totally do that. Just one hundred thousand
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: reviews are all the same, that'd be great. Yeah, at all,
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: very worthy. The reviews go such a long way. Like
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• 4:34
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• 4:37
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• 4:58
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• 5:00
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• 5:07
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• 5:09
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• 5:10
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• 5:14
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• 5:16
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• 5:20
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• 5:36
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• 5:37
  Speaker 3: It go that wrong way.
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: I don't like to toot our own horn, dude, but
• 5:42
  Speaker 4: I will say that I.
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: Jacoble to any guy's horns for the right amount of mine.
• 5:50
  Speaker 4: Tariffs have hit us hard, but we have not passed
• 5:52
  Speaker 4: that on to the consumer. We're eating the cost of
• 5:55
  Speaker 4: the tariffs, the podcasting tariffs. Yes, that's true.
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so that's that's just true. Also, we have not
• 6:01
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• 6:04
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• 6:07
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• 6:08
  Speaker 3: You should not himply shouldn't.
• 6:10
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• 6:15
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• 6:16
  Speaker 3: We Patriot supporters for real.
• 6:18
  Speaker 4: If you are at the dollar a month level, you
• 6:22
  Speaker 4: are just giving money to Patriot.
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: Upgraded, upgraded. Please go to two dollars, come up to
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: the fives. It would mean a lot. Will we change it, No,
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: we don't know how. But you know what, we are
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: just a people powered show. We've we've you know, from
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: time to time experienced you know, the whole sponsorship thing
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: and commercial stuff. It's never suited us. We just really
• 6:42
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• 6:44
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• 6:47
  Speaker 1: us to stay true to the original design of the show.
• 6:49
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• 6:51
  Speaker 1: the discord gets it and is part of that kind
• 6:54
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• 6:56
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• 6:59
  Speaker 1: So come be a part of Man. It means the
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: world to us. As we get to the end of
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: the year, we just want to thank you for that,
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: and we also want to promote some things.
• 7:05
  Speaker 4: Nick.
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: You've got your your starting the new year, right, tell
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: us about the program and how to join.
• 7:11
  Speaker 4: The Uh, we're doing the Fitness Challenge again this year.
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: It just challenges your.
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: Which I mean dot com. I mean like, let's sucking
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: buy that. I mean, just get a hyperlink that goes
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: straight to the place people want to land.
• 7:26
  Speaker 4: If you go to mentalfit personal training dot com slash
• 7:29
  Speaker 4: pod therapy. Uh, that's where you go to sign up.
• 7:32
  Speaker 4: And so the challenge and this is here's the slash
• 7:35
  Speaker 4: pot therapy matters. It does because you can't find it
• 7:38
  Speaker 4: if you just go to my website. You got to
• 7:39
  Speaker 4: type in the whole thing. This is not meant for
• 7:43
  Speaker 4: people who are in shape, right. This is a program
• 7:47
  Speaker 4: meant for people who have not exercised in a while
• 7:50
  Speaker 4: and maybe want to get into it. So no matter what, Nick,
• 7:53
  Speaker 4: go fuck yourself. If you look like Jim, bring that
• 7:55
  Speaker 4: sweet money over.
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: So this is this is.
• 7:59
  Speaker 4: UH level stuff and everything can be modified. So actually
• 8:03
  Speaker 4: last year what I did is I created two versions
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: of the work. So there is the body weight version,
• 8:09
  Speaker 4: which you don't need any equipment, and then the other
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  Speaker 4: one if you want and you've got some exercise bands
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  Speaker 4: at home, there are some exercise band workouts you can do.
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  Speaker 3: So this does not require a gym membership.
• 8:21
  Speaker 4: It does not. This is stuff you can do at home.
• 8:24
  Speaker 4: You can do it anywhere pretty much. And then this year,
• 8:28
  Speaker 4: the thing that is new is I've partnered with Adeline,
• 8:34
  Speaker 4: registered Dietitian, Nutritions Dietitian, registered Dietitian.
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: Food person, professional food professional.
• 8:43
  Speaker 4: Yes, and she's got she's got an online business that
• 8:48
  Speaker 4: she basically operates here in Las Vegas but works with
• 8:53
  Speaker 4: people all over all over the world. She's going to
• 8:55
  Speaker 4: contribute this year. So she's going to have some videos,
• 8:59
  Speaker 4: she's going to write up some blogs and stuff, and
• 9:01
  Speaker 4: so she's going to be able to bring that component,
• 9:04
  Speaker 4: which in Nevada I can do, Like I can kind
• 9:08
  Speaker 4: of do some nutrition coaching stuff. I just don't, yeah,
• 9:11
  Speaker 4: because I feel like, even though it's okay in Nevada,
• 9:13
  Speaker 4: I feel like I just don't have that.
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: Sure you want to rely on my thing?
• 9:17
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And she is an expert on that stuff, so
• 9:20
  Speaker 4: she's going to be able to take the reins on that,
• 9:21
  Speaker 4: which is really cool.
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: So it's really leveling it up. What's the website again,
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: Mentalfitpersonal training dot Com, slash Pod therapy. It's going to
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: be good and and you know, so my practice is
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: also going to be rolling out a whole new service
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: and we're going to be really launching it in the
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: new year. But as you're hearing this, I'm going to
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: have some surveys available on the discord for people that
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: already support the show, where they're going to be able
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: to give some feedback of like topics they would want
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: to have in a non clinical support and education group
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: that is going to still be led by a therapist,
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: by a licensed professional. I've got these intern therapists. They are,
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: you know, postgraduates, They're wonderful, and they need to get
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: so servius hours, they need to get some programs going.
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: And so I am going to be launching this project
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: through my practice and all the details are going to
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: be coming out. But if that's something you want to
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: get in on, get into the Patreon. I'm going to
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: start the surveys there to kind of collect data about
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: what people want to see, what they're looking for, and
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: then in the new year, I'll bring out the information
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: about how to join these and and you could be
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: a part of them. So that's something you're interested in,
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: keep an ear out for that. It's gonna be really
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: fun too.
• 10:23
  Speaker 4: Whitney, do you have anything you want to talk?
• 10:25
  Speaker 5: I was just like, wow, I've been flocking this year.
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: I'm chilling.
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So Whitney's got a new OnlyFans account and we
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: really want you to go check that out. It's at
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: patreon dot com.
• 10:35
  Speaker 3: I do not want that.
• 10:36
  Speaker 4: No, no, because that's gonna make us look bad like
• 10:39
  Speaker 4: we've been doing this ship for eight yeah, fucking years. Yeah,
• 10:43
  Speaker 4: she's gonna do that for ten minutes. Oh yeah, oh yeah.
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: I don't try this.
• 10:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: And also that's going to cut into our selling Whitney's
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: feet picks business that we've been doing very well.
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: Well, keep on.
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, she's not doing what a business woman she under stands.
• 11:02
  Speaker 4: At Jacob Smith for zero one at symbol Jacob Smith
• 11:06
  Speaker 4: for zero one. That is my PayPal you can get
• 11:11
  Speaker 4: Whitney picks zero one. I will send you pictures of
• 11:17
  Speaker 4: Whitney's feet that he's on a correct amount of money,
• 11:20
  Speaker 4: and I get it they might look like Jacob's feet.
• 11:24
  Speaker 4: They yeah, they're not trust us.
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: No, we're just as repulse by Whitmills as you will
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: be a certificate aboutation. Oh yeah, and you can't lie
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: on that. That's the Internet. Yeah, absolutely not. Look we
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: need some money, friend. I don't know how to tell you, guys.
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: Christmas is here. We have presents to buy Jesus Christ. Anyway,
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: thank you guys for all the support you've given us
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: for riding along with our show as we get to
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: the end of season eight. It is a journey man.
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: We love what we do. It's it's a passion project.
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: None of us are getting rich off this. It's just
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: something we believe in and we can't do it without
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: folks that love us enough to poured us through it,
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: that root for us, that make it fun for us
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: to do. And y'all have done that. So if you'd
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: like to join our community and get more engaged patroon
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: dot com slash therapy. It just means the world to
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: us if you.
• 12:10
  Speaker 4: Are not a Patreon. So if you don't get the
• 12:12
  Speaker 4: show early, what day of the week does this show?
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: Thursday? There's publicly.
• 12:16
  Speaker 4: Thursday comes out publicly on December eighteenth, which is the Thursday.
• 12:19
  Speaker 4: Yeah yeah at Jacob Smith yes or zero one.
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: It is my birthday today.
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: There you go. That's fair. Get our boy a coffee,
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: Get him a bottle of crystall whatever's in your budget.
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: Take care of the man, the myth, the legend, the doctor,
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: and the life coach.
• 12:40
  Speaker 4: You know what, do something different for the first time ever.
• 12:44
  Speaker 4: Send him your feet piss.
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, j that's right.
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: It's gonna be a lot of donations that say like
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: feet emoji, camera emoji. You know what these are for? Yes,
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: she's gonna see his PayPal Go. What the fuck is
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: going on?
• 13:01
  Speaker 4: If you think pays idiot attention to my internet anything,
• 13:05
  Speaker 4: my internet everything is the weirdest ship.
• 13:07
  Speaker 3: You've ever seen.
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: I want to see.
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: This wouldn't even be on the radar, No, not at all.
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: She looking at this like, Hey, when did you start
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: the feet pick action? Not cutting mama in the camera. Baby,
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: I'm proud of you.
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: What did we do when you're at ice cream social?
• 13:25
  Speaker 5: We did.
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: I don't remember what the what did.
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: We call it it was?
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: But people were just sending us pictures of their genitals.
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: Oh Jesus Christ, remember that, and like, oh, what was
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: the deal?
• 13:38
  Speaker 4: Somebody somebody out there, somebody streaming at me right now? U. Yeah,
• 13:42
  Speaker 4: like people would would U because they would make like dioramas,
• 13:51
  Speaker 4: they call it. People of every type of genitals that
• 13:55
  Speaker 4: you could imagine sending all these in and yeah, we
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: just got pictures of people's genitals for.
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: Like two years.
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: Oh my god God. So just to be clear, that
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: was for ice cream social he really doesn't need that.
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: We're good.
• 14:07
  Speaker 4: We have a different model at Jacob Smith zero one.
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: You'll look at it if you send the money, I mean,
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: they'll open it. It's gonna be fine. Well, we've got
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: some great questions for today's show, and we're leading off
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: the order with I think a really interesting, really complex one.
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: My wife changed her mind on having children, Hey Whitney,
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: Colonel Jim Nick, and doctor Jacob at least for a
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: little while longer. When my now wife and I were
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: first dating, we wanted to make sure no one was
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: wasting time, so we were very upfront about what we
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: wanted regarding kids. We both said we wanted at least
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: one kid and maybe two. Fast forward thirteen years, eight
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: of those years married, and things have shifted.
• 14:54
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I.
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: In your one. So fast forward thirty years of the relationship,
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: eight of those years married, and things have shifted. My
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: wife has gone from I'm not sure I want kids too,
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: I don't want kids, but maybe I'll change my mind.
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: I always thought I wanted to be a father. I'm
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: wondering if that's what I wanted because that's what's been expected.
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: Society and my own family may have influenced me. But
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: now I don't know what to do. I love my wife,
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: and waiting to see if she changes her mind seems unrealistic,
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: but I don't want to split up with her either.
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: This has really thrown me for a loop, and I
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: don't know what to do. Any advice would be appreciated. Anonymous.
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: My pronouns are he and him.
• 15:41
  Speaker 3: Steal a kid?
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: Okay, okay, like a trial kid. Is this like a
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: demo involved of it?
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: Okay?
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 15:50
  Speaker 4: Well it's like the puppies, you know, like everybody gets
• 15:52
  Speaker 4: a puppy for Christmas, they turned the puppy back in
• 15:55
  Speaker 4: because they realize, Like, uh, I didn't realize puppies were
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: going to be work.
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that is like food and piss all over the place.
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I get do the same way they do.
• 16:06
  Speaker 5: I might have shared this one here before, but I
• 16:08
  Speaker 5: had kind of a little bit of flipped experience, but
• 16:11
  Speaker 5: similar where when Peter and I first started dating, uh,
• 16:16
  Speaker 5: he told me I don't want to get married, and
• 16:17
  Speaker 5: I don't want to have kids. Obviously he changed his
• 16:20
  Speaker 5: mind on one of those.
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: It's nice.
• 16:22
  Speaker 4: I'm sure he wasn't influenced at all.
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: You get him drunk enough and you put a gun
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: on his back, man will do anything.
• 16:28
  Speaker 4: You don't even need the drunk part.
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, just peruisive.
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: I have my ways.
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: Say yes to Elvis, I do.
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: Now sign here in blood, like but no.
• 16:42
  Speaker 5: A few months after that, you know, we were really young.
• 16:44
  Speaker 5: I was twenty it just turned twenty one we started dating.
• 16:47
  Speaker 5: So I was like, well, at first, I said, yeah,
• 16:49
  Speaker 5: no problem. I don't want to have kids and I
• 16:51
  Speaker 5: don't want to get married. I was like, I guess
• 16:53
  Speaker 5: it doesn't matter. It's just a piece of paper. A
• 16:55
  Speaker 5: few months later, it's like, you know what, I do
• 16:56
  Speaker 5: want to be married, but not anytime soon, Like, way
• 16:59
  Speaker 5: too young for that shit. So we dated and over time,
• 17:03
  Speaker 5: kind of the ongoing discussion was, you know, before we
• 17:08
  Speaker 5: get married, what's the what's the deal with kids?
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: Speaks like a last check in?
• 17:13
  Speaker 5: Yeah, check ins, and this is I guess. It just
• 17:16
  Speaker 5: doesn't help the writer a lot. But when you're dating someone,
• 17:19
  Speaker 5: I do encourage to continue those check ins and talk
• 17:21
  Speaker 5: about these nuanced topics. And I feel for the writer
• 17:24
  Speaker 5: a little bit because I think it's easier to say
• 17:27
  Speaker 5: I don't want kids and then talk about what if
• 17:29
  Speaker 5: I change my mind versus I want kids, and then
• 17:32
  Speaker 5: that right changes, Like I.
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: I've married you with that agreement in mind. That was
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: the arrangement. Like, right, that's a big thing.
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: So fast forward.
• 17:41
  Speaker 5: Let's say son, like five years later, we still weren't
• 17:46
  Speaker 5: married yet, and so we were talking.
• 17:49
  Speaker 3: About this like we or as Peter calls them, the
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: golden days.
• 17:53
  Speaker 5: I hadn't forced him yet, but no, the topic came
• 17:57
  Speaker 5: up again. I was, you know, twenty six, and every
• 18:00
  Speaker 5: he was like, when you hit thirty, you're gonna want kids.
• 18:02
  Speaker 5: When you hit thirty, you're gonna change your mind. Your
• 18:04
  Speaker 5: uterus is gonna scream at you. You're gonna want kids.
• 18:07
  Speaker 5: And I was like, well, what if that happens? Because
• 18:10
  Speaker 5: I don't want a divorce. That's like, I don't want that.
• 18:13
  Speaker 5: That's why we've dated for so long. I want to
• 18:15
  Speaker 5: make extra extra sh like I don't want divorce, and
• 18:18
  Speaker 5: so what do you do?
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 18:20
  Speaker 5: And so we kind of had like an ongoing over
• 18:23
  Speaker 5: days conversation about this, and eventually he was like, well,
• 18:26
  Speaker 5: if you tell me you want kids like that changes
• 18:30
  Speaker 5: and you really want them. He's like, I'm open to that.
• 18:32
  Speaker 5: Whatever that means, I don't know, we'd have to rediscuss
• 18:35
  Speaker 5: or whatever.
• 18:35
  Speaker 3: But I'm not.
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: Saying no one equivocally.
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: He's saying, we'll have that conversation.
• 18:39
  Speaker 5: I'm open to the conversation. We can like talk through
• 18:41
  Speaker 5: what that means, what are you feeling?
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: Which is honestly just a sidebar here with the gentleman.
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: A smart move because if you say no to something,
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: then now she kind of wants it. But if you're like,
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: I mean, if that's what you want, babe, that's fine.
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: Like if she's like, do you think you want to
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: go to McDonald's, Like yeah, if you want me to
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: all go, I don't think I want you to go,
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: all right, ya, that's fine. But if you're like, no,
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: I'm not going, then she's like, I.
• 18:59
  Speaker 3: Can at a big Max so bad.
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: This is a smooth move on his part to be
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: like I will, Yeah, it's cool with it. Whatever you decide, sweetie.
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: You ain't gonna decide anything.
• 19:08
  Speaker 4: In the last two episodes recording, I've really learned a
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: lot of Jim and his manipulation tax.
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, dark side of Jim. Yeah Jim. Okay, Jim, Jim
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: knows how to do you know.
• 19:19
  Speaker 4: How to wield your power? Thought that Jim thought about
• 19:23
  Speaker 4: anything before talking, I'd be concerned.
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: A Yeah, I'm the theory of Star Wars that jar
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: Jar Binks is secretly a sith Lord. That's that's the
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: theory about Therapy's like, wait a minute.
• 19:35
  Speaker 4: Even that theory doesn't hold up because it doesn't theory.
• 19:38
  Speaker 4: You're saying that you think jar Jar Binks was smarter
• 19:41
  Speaker 4: than people thought he was.
• 19:42
  Speaker 3: That's right.
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you do not say it taking it face value. Yeah,
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: I'm on your side.
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: You're going to have those thoughts before talking. It doesn't
• 19:50
  Speaker 3: matter if you have those.
• 19:52
  Speaker 4: You're more like Binks with a grenade.
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: Okay, I don't know what's gonna happen. It's not gonna
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: be good. That grenade's going off. Zero ways. This works
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: out where nobody fucking regrets it.
• 20:04
  Speaker 5: Go on, So full transparency. This is an ongoing discussion.
• 20:09
  Speaker 5: Even after thirty hit, I did not feel an urge,
• 20:12
  Speaker 5: you know, thirty five hits still didn't feel an urge,
• 20:14
  Speaker 5: and it was down to even on Veterans Day, we were,
• 20:17
  Speaker 5: you know, out in the park, we went on a
• 20:18
  Speaker 5: walk and had a picnic because we're.
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: Now that you're forty five, are we all imagining that
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: Whitney's just holding a hand on her uterus and just
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: like there, wait is it there? No? Nope, nope, I
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: don't feel it.
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: I just don't.
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: I just don't have it.
• 20:28
  Speaker 5: But we're laying there and Peter checked and again he's like,
• 20:31
  Speaker 5: you're sure, because you know, I'm thirty nine, gym not
• 20:33
  Speaker 5: for the only person here who's still knit the east.
• 20:36
  Speaker 4: Oh, just a child's youthful blow.
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: I know, only for a few minutes you crossed that terrible,
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: yawning gap.
• 20:45
  Speaker 5: But he's like, are you sure you don't want kids?
• 20:48
  Speaker 5: And I was like, this is kind of a weird question.
• 20:50
  Speaker 5: That kind of caught me off guard. And I was like, yeah, no,
• 20:53
  Speaker 5: I'm and I still don't have that urge.
• 20:54
  Speaker 4: I'm good.
• 20:55
  Speaker 5: And he's like, Okay, I just didn't want to rob
• 20:57
  Speaker 5: you of like an experience, because that's really what we
• 21:01
  Speaker 5: discuss on goingly, is that having kids. And this kind
• 21:03
  Speaker 5: of speaks to what the writers saying, like where where
• 21:05
  Speaker 5: does that urge? Come from everyone's different. So I'm not
• 21:08
  Speaker 5: saying that you feel this or not right. I think
• 21:11
  Speaker 5: that there is an experience that has had by having children,
• 21:16
  Speaker 5: and you're kind of deciding am I out or am
• 21:19
  Speaker 5: I in? And there's not really a better answer on
• 21:25
  Speaker 5: both sides. You will just be experiencing, like right, the opposite.
• 21:29
  Speaker 5: I'm not going to experience not having children. I'm not
• 21:31
  Speaker 5: going to experience having children if you decide not to
• 21:34
  Speaker 5: have them. But as far as like talking it through
• 21:37
  Speaker 5: with your spouse, we can talk about that in a second,
• 21:39
  Speaker 5: but I just want to mention that no, but.
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: I'm glad that you shared that because I think it's
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: the opposite side of this, but it's this relatable thing
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: of like we kept checking in on this, yes, and
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: it could have gone the other way, and nearly has
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: several times where I've said, hey, I kind of want
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: to keep the option on the contract, right, like I
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: want to have this as an option. Are you cool
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: with that? And your spouse was like, yeah, yeah, I'll
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: leave the option there. But you know, obviously we would
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: need to talk about it, and it's it's a whole
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: ass life decision. I have had patience. I had a
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: couple come in. This is a very long time ago,
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: so I'm comfortable talking about it where this exact scenario
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: happened where they had been married for I think five
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: years at this point, and originally the agreement was we
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: are going to have children, and these are the milestones
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: we're going to accomplish on our way to that. Right,
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: so we have some financial milestones, some professional milestones, We're
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: going to get a home, things like that, and then
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: we get to this mark and wife lets husband know
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: I have thought about it, and I've chosen I do
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: not want this. And husband is in this terrible position
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: because he is like he was very committed to the
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: idea of having children. Yeah, he was like, I've been
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: preparing to be a father. That's always been on a
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: plan all along these last five years. We have both
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: been on the same page. She has drastically.
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: We discussed that. It was that disagreement. We figured out
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: that we're going to do.
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: It's a foundational constitution to this relationship. And so she
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: sort of had this policy of like, I understand if
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: you need to leave me, I understand. And he was like,
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: but this is not fair because I am in love
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: with you. I don't want to leave. Yeah, it isn't
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: just I want babies and I'm willing to just go
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: impregnate anybody. That could also be a horrible experience. I
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: vetted you, I chose you. I thought you were a
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: good person, I thought you'd be a great mother, And
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: for the last five years that's the way we talk
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: and think. And now that's changing. And here I am
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: as a therapist trying to work with that couple, and
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: it was really a catch twenty two because I don't
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: want her painted as the bad guy. I don't want
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: this to be Oh, you renigged on an agreement. It's
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: her fucking body, it's the rest of her life. Okay,
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: A point, A point we should explore thoroughly. God's a
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: point we should. But here in Gilead, I don't know.
• 23:59
  Speaker 4: I see that a lot though, too, and it becomes
• 24:01
  Speaker 4: really easy to kind of go back on that, I mean,
• 24:06
  Speaker 4: and to like blame the person, like, wait a minute,
• 24:08
  Speaker 4: we had an agreement, but like, in no way is
• 24:11
  Speaker 4: it realistic to be able to make that agreement in
• 24:14
  Speaker 4: the first place, Like I can't. I don't know in
• 24:17
  Speaker 4: five years what I'm going to be wanting to do,
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: And I just I can only commit to where I
• 24:23
  Speaker 4: am right now.
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: Now.
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: The best ones are the ones where one spouse says,
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: after you've had children for five years, says I don't
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: think I want to be a parent anymore. They're like, wait,
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: what the fuck? Oh you already have.
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: It harder to writ.
• 24:36
  Speaker 4: Good luck everybody. I'm gonna go get some milk, going
• 24:40
  Speaker 4: out for cigarette.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: No.
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: I that is really tough.
• 24:45
  Speaker 5: I had someone tell me once though, when we were younger,
• 24:50
  Speaker 5: and you know, Peter's like, I don't I don't want kids,
• 24:52
  Speaker 5: and I was still like, I don't know if I'll
• 24:53
  Speaker 5: change my mind. They kind of a friend mentioned to me,
• 24:56
  Speaker 5: they said, do you kind of have to decide. And
• 24:58
  Speaker 5: this is again just therapi onion, but it sat with me.
• 25:01
  Speaker 5: Is your are you more in love with your partner
• 25:04
  Speaker 5: than like your future child that you've imagined. And that's
• 25:08
  Speaker 5: where I said, it's kind of an expectation because sometimes
• 25:10
  Speaker 5: I think, once you say I want children, you are
• 25:13
  Speaker 5: now you're creating a whole story in your mind. Now
• 25:17
  Speaker 5: I will be a father and this is what I
• 25:19
  Speaker 5: will do, and this is what we're working toward. It's
• 25:21
  Speaker 5: like you've created that narrative. Of who you are now,
• 25:24
  Speaker 5: and it's hard to detach from that. And that was
• 25:27
  Speaker 5: because that was the expectation that was set and agreed
• 25:29
  Speaker 5: upon what you thought, you know, when when you made
• 25:32
  Speaker 5: the agreement, when you first started dating or got married.
• 25:35
  Speaker 5: So that's where I kind of dig into, like, writer,
• 25:39
  Speaker 5: what is your what's the story you've told yourself? Is
• 25:42
  Speaker 5: that just a story? Or is this an internal desire
• 25:45
  Speaker 5: for you? And then secondly, God, it sounds like a
• 25:48
  Speaker 5: shitty question, but I thought it was still.
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: Helpful, like do you.
• 25:52
  Speaker 5: Love your partner not love your partner more? Is that
• 25:55
  Speaker 5: more important than the idea?
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: It's also an impossible hypothetical because like most people that
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: have kids will say, before I had my child, I
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: thought my spouse was the most I could ever experience
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: love as a human being. And I remember thinking this.
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: Ryan Reynolds, I think, has a famous joke about this
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: where he's interviewed about he's married to Blake Lively and
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: he talks about how him and Blake used to talk
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: about before children that if there was ever anything, you know,
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: in danger, he couldn't live without her. He would, you know,
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: protect her. She was everything. And then the moment his
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: daughter was born. He realized that if there was an
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: active shooter, he would throw Blake in front of the
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: bullets and run with that child. Yeah, I would let
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: you die very quickly. Yeah, to save this kid. And
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: like there is a deep genetic connection to that. Evolution
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: wants us to be pretty able to forsake our spouse
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: and protect the baby. And like, I remember feeling that
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: way to my wife and I used to talk like,
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: oh my god, before the baby. We were married for
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: like four years before we had a kid, and we
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: used to like think to ourselves, if the baby thing
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: doesn't work out because you have these morbid, scary thoughts,
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: would be okay, And it's like, yeah, sure, just make
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: another one, you know, Like yeah, it seemed that way
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: to us, Like yeah, sure, as long as you have
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: the right partner, then we'll figure out the kids thing.
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: And then whenever our son was born, there was just
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: this fundamental shift of realizing, like I couldn't have possibly
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: conceived how much more I would love this child than
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: anybody else in the world. And it's just like it's
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: outside of your control.
• 27:18
  Speaker 5: Yeah that is, but I don't know that, right, So
• 27:21
  Speaker 5: I'm ignorant to that, and I'm my ignorance is bliss.
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: Exactly exact people that are the opposite after they.
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: Have kids that I love on.
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: That Okay, that probably happened. I know, I know people.
• 27:34
  Speaker 4: I've had that conversation with people. I have people that
• 27:36
  Speaker 4: I am like close friends with, Okay, and they're not
• 27:39
  Speaker 4: giving the kids away or anything, but they're they're like.
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: They're honest what they're feelings about.
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: I've had the dog longer than the kid's been alive.
• 27:46
  Speaker 3: I really love that dog.
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, yeah, so it's it's hard to pro an asshole, right,
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: little three year old, yeah, throwing around these hot wheels
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: are all over the place and stepping on legos. I
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: have had a couple once where a couple got married
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: with the intention to have or well said no to babies,
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: and a couple did not want to get married, so
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: very similar to you, where husband had said I don't
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: want to get married, I don't want babies, and she
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: worked him down to okay, fine, I'll get married. It
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: means a lot to you. We'll do this. They get married.
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: Now that they're married, she says, I will divorce you
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: if we do not have babies, like I want a baby.
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: He's like I will give you one baby and like
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: you know, ultimately does that. And they had to go
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: through like procedures and stuff to get this done and
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: so like you see, like how much goes into this.
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: But wife was very serious. That's like I have decided
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: all of a sudden that I want this, even though
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: we had all these agreements and said I don't want this,
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: and that was the agreement and the constitution of our marriage.
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: I've switched over and like. And it was tough because
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: in that scenario, In the scenario I had counseling the
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: other couple. It's the goal of therapy is not to
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: find a winner and loser, and the goal isn't necessary
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: to negotiate.
• 28:53
  Speaker 3: But it's not the goal, right, And it's.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: Also not necessarily to negotiate. It's to create an opportunity
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: to encounter each other free of the resentment, to take
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: an earnest and understanding approach. And like, as a therapist,
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: you have no idea which way that's going to go,
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: because it may land on. Look, you've got to make
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: a hard decision. You're gonna have to choose to let
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: go of a thirteen year relationship writer and and go
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: you know, find a new partner for the sake of
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: having a child or not. And there's no I don't
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: know how to quantify that choice mortally. I don't know
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: how to quantify that choice philosophically. I don't know what's
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: right for you. And I don't see a path where
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: you do not have some amount of pain.
• 29:31
  Speaker 5: Oh I'm sure, yes, But isn't that all serious? But
• 29:35
  Speaker 5: in that part of human life?
• 29:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah, sure, there's no there's no escaping pain. You get
• 29:40
  Speaker 4: to choose what pain you want to deal with.
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: Suffering is inevitable.
• 29:43
  Speaker 5: And I will tell you you don't want to be
• 29:45
  Speaker 5: single parenting with your partner.
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: I've watched my friends do that.
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: You don't want to do that interesting without figuring it out.
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: One of the most famous guests we ever had on
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: pod therapy was the author of that book. Okay, second
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: most famous guest we've ever had I'm about therapy who
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: wrote that book? Maybe you should talk to remind me
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: who that author was. Man, all of a sudden, my
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: mind is blanking on you.
• 30:12
  Speaker 4: We're gonna have to fix this somebody.
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: Look there it is. And Laurie Gottlieb in her book,
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: Maybe you should talk to somebody tells her story of
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: how she, as a single woman, decided and I think
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: her forties, I want a child. I'm not going to
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: go wait and do the run around of guy after
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: draftter guy. She went to a sperm bay, she got
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: she chose her donor, and she had her son, and
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: then she decided, I'm going to be a mom no
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: matter what. I choose this for myself and then I
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: am going to go, you know, find a partner who
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: wants to be with me. And I believe Whitney, and
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: I don't. I want to be careful how far I
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: tell the story, because it's come up in other context.
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: I think that you've seen the reverse of that. You've
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: seen a situation where a gentleman wanted to have a
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: child and made arrangements to have a surrogate and have
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: a child, and he wasn't partnered, And it's because he
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: decided to be a dad, and then he went out
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: looking for partners after that that liked having him and
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: his child, Right, that's the story, is yep?
• 31:04
  Speaker 5: It is? Yeah, yeah, No, my friend was their surrogate.
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: So I just love.
• 31:09
  Speaker 3: The idea of that so much.
• 31:11
  Speaker 4: I have no idea if that works in life.
• 31:14
  Speaker 5: I love that I had genius move his girlfriend showed
• 31:17
  Speaker 5: up at the hospital where.
• 31:18
  Speaker 3: I don't think it's necessarily the right thing for the writer.
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: This is just a complete tangent.
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: But it would be such a power move if writer
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: did that and didn't consult with wife, Just like, Okay,
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: you don't want a baby, no problem, hunt, don't even worry.
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: I've got one.
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm gonna go have one baby.
• 31:30
  Speaker 4: You don't have to do anything. I've already I've got it,
• 31:33
  Speaker 4: I've already paid, it's.
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: Gonna be done. It's like having a dog, like I'm
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: adopting the dog. This is I mean, it's gonna live here.
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: But like, you don't have to get up.
• 31:42
  Speaker 4: I've got a on your run.
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, lot of power move.
• 31:48
  Speaker 5: When I saw others, I'm like, oh yeah, my friend
• 31:50
  Speaker 5: was a surrogate and it was a single dad and
• 31:52
  Speaker 5: I this sounds horrible, but I do say this.
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: I'm like, he's a single straight mail or.
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: Whatever they're gonna ask you.
• 31:58
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and they're like what and so shocked, like what
• 32:01
  Speaker 5: they're not gay? I'm like, no, they just wanted didn't
• 32:04
  Speaker 5: want to be an old dac because they're already forty
• 32:06
  Speaker 5: five and Yeah, they didn't want to be too old,
• 32:08
  Speaker 5: and they're like going into this, like, by the time
• 32:11
  Speaker 5: I find someone, see if they want kids, figure all
• 32:13
  Speaker 5: that out. I mean time is of the essence, right,
• 32:17
  Speaker 5: So yeah, they just did it, and yeah, his newer relationship,
• 32:20
  Speaker 5: I think he was going through the circus he process
• 32:22
  Speaker 5: that started during that and she was showed up at
• 32:24
  Speaker 5: the hospital with him.
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, yeah, I think it's a profound thing,
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: and it's a writer. I guess when we come down
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: to practical advice for you, at a minimum, I do
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: not want it. And I think this is very tempting.
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: It depends on who you are personality wise. But for
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: a lot of people, men and women in this scenario,
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: but I think especially men, because we can feel like
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: the baby thing is just the woman's choice and we're
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: just additional to that. Yeah, and like, I don't want
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: you to feel that way. I want to live in
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: an egalitarian world where your desire to be a father
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: is something that we also have to honor needs to
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: be taken just as seriously as her bodily autonomy. And
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: that means having a very serious conversation with her in
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: couple's therapy where this is a topic we're going to
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: talk through. We're going to work through either until we
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: reach a conclusion on this or until we feel we've
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: said all the things that need to be said. Because
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: if you just swallow your opinion and go, well, it's
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: not my call and just keep kicking the can down
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: the road to see if she changes her mind down
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: the road, that could foster an enormous amount of resentment.
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: If your original blueprint for your life included fatherhood, you'll
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: feel like somebody took something from you that cannot be replaced.
• 33:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, two words secret family.
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: Oh, going back to the fifties, ever got hot?
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: Option has entered the chest family? Going with the bing Crosby.
• 33:41
  Speaker 4: Probably a lot easier to do in the fifties.
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: Social media ruined.
• 33:46
  Speaker 4: I mean away was a long way away.
• 33:51
  Speaker 5: I wanted to say too when the writer kind of asked,
• 33:55
  Speaker 5: you know, I'm not sure or they said, I don't
• 33:58
  Speaker 5: know if I just want kids because that's what society
• 34:00
  Speaker 5: tells me, or if it's an internal drive. I think,
• 34:04
  Speaker 5: looking back, when did you start wanting kids? And I
• 34:06
  Speaker 5: don't know if it's the same for men or not,
• 34:08
  Speaker 5: But like Jim, when you were young, were you like
• 34:10
  Speaker 5: I want. I'm for sure want to be a father
• 34:12
  Speaker 5: one day.
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: Like I never a teenager.
• 34:14
  Speaker 5: I never see and that's the thing, Like I looked
• 34:16
  Speaker 5: back and you know, like the little girls play baby
• 34:18
  Speaker 5: doll or house and all. I'm like, I guess I
• 34:19
  Speaker 5: never really did that, Like there are things I didn't
• 34:21
  Speaker 5: think about actively till other women were saying like these
• 34:24
  Speaker 5: are things that I used to play or pretend or
• 34:26
  Speaker 5: always wanted to be a mom. My friends always wanted
• 34:28
  Speaker 5: to be a mom, And I'm like, oh, I didn't
• 34:29
  Speaker 5: really have that experience. So I think trying to dig
• 34:32
  Speaker 5: in there because Jim's coming from a perspective that I respect,
• 34:36
  Speaker 5: where he's like, oh, I just I knew I wanted
• 34:38
  Speaker 5: to have kids, and that is going to be important
• 34:41
  Speaker 5: to what he was saying, Like this is something you
• 34:44
  Speaker 5: might feel a lot of regret and potentially resentment towards
• 34:47
  Speaker 5: your partner if it's something you've been wanting for a
• 34:49
  Speaker 5: long time and there you feel they are like taking
• 34:52
  Speaker 5: that away from you, right.
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because it could be something you never get back.
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: You could also go with the Elon Musk model, you know,
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: which is just have as many as you can everywhere
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: that you can.
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: You're doing society.
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: We need your genetics, that's right there, that's right. Yeah,
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: we need Elon.
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: Musks, I mean, Dewey.
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: This wealth is getting spread, redistributing wealth, that's right, that's right.
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: Trickle down the sperm, Jesus Christ. So yeah, you know, Writer,
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: next album, sperm, trickle down sex economy. I love it.
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: So Writer, At a minimum, I really encourage that. It
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: sounds like you and your spouse been together for a
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: long time, sounds like there's generally been a lot of
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: open honesty. I want that conversation to continue. I would
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: strongly encourage that to continue in couples therapy, where hopefully
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: that therapist does a great job of remaining neutral, being
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: sensitive to both sides, creating opportunity for discussion, not creating
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: opportunity for decision, not pushing you toward decision, not biasing,
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: not not villainizing, but just humanizing both of you and
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: allowing both of you to truly explore how you feel
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: where these things come from. Like you ask, Writer, I
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: wonder about myself. Am I you know? Am I influenced
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: by these things? Could I be happy without children? Why
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: do I attach so much importance to this? But also
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: I want to be careful with that because sometimes we
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: can say, oh, society gave you that idea and it's
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: not something you genuinely feel. And sometimes I want to
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: remember that we are attached to society, like marriage is
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: a social careers and society has that ideas because people
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: have that idea.
• 36:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah right, there is a common idea.
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: It arrives organically, right, and so like, I just want
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: to be mindful of that. But I don't want either
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: of you to feel like you're not allowed to bring
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: this up because it's selfish, or that you're you're gonna
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: have simmering resentments and you don't want to hurt the marriage.
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: I think call it out, like the elephant in the
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: room needs to be discussed. Yeah, So at a minimum, writer,
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: I strongly encourage that. I really think it's going to
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: be great to have that conversation. And yeah, I just
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: love the honesty man, So lean in on that. Have
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: that conversation. Do not punt on it. Don't take an
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: approach of wait and see when it's been announced. I
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: do not want kids, but we'll see in the future.
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: Time is a resource that has to be respected here. Yeah,
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: and so you know, yes, you could just Milton Burrow
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: this ship and have kids, Like, who is it a
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: Robert de Niro? You can just keep having kids till
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: you're like eighties.
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: I was like, can have however along just but if
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: you want.
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: To like enjoy fatherhood, you know, like that could be
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: a thing too, because you don't want to be like
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: the dad who's like, you know, can't keep up with
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: a kid or whatever. Like I get it, Like that's
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: that's it's a calculation. It matters too, right, So you know,
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: I think that all this is part of it.
• 37:36
  Speaker 4: If if I tried to change my mind today about
• 37:38
  Speaker 4: having kids, like I'm I'm forty four, Like I'll be
• 37:42
  Speaker 4: you know, best case scenario, I'll be forty five, forty
• 37:45
  Speaker 4: six when the when a kid is born. Yeah at
• 37:47
  Speaker 4: this point, like that would make me an older parent.
• 37:50
  Speaker 4: Yeah what like forget about the forget about my wife,
• 37:52
  Speaker 4: forget about any of that. Like that would just for me.
• 37:54
  Speaker 4: That would just be old.
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: Trying to run around at kid's soccer.
• 37:57
  Speaker 4: Game or trying to relate to the parent on the plate.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: Oh fuck, especially the ones.
• 38:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah, like the parent of the other kid could be
• 38:11
  Speaker 3: your child.
• 38:12
  Speaker 4: If you had had children in a age like that's that's
• 38:14
  Speaker 4: a rough time.
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: Well, and I've heard stories where the older dad shows
• 38:18
  Speaker 1: up and you know, it's it's tricky because they're like,
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: oh you the grandpa, you know, or things like that.
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: And and that's not to say that anything's wrong with that.
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: It's it's totally you know, a style.
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: It's fine, it's more normal all the time.
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it does. Yeah, that's actually true. Yeah, the the
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: date of having the first child is later and later,
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: so but don't put it off. It will lead to
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: secret resentment. It will lead to a simmering sense of
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: something was taken that I didn't you know, consent to,
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: and it will feel like you the contract was renigged on.
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: Take that to couple's therapy. There's not they're hopefully if
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: they do their job. I'm not looking for a winter
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: or loser. They're looking for deeper connection, understanding, and unfortunately,
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: you may find yourself. It's very possible in a situation
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: where you say I authentically land on a decision that
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: I've decided I want children, and she is saying that
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: she wants no part of it. Now, where does that
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: leave us? And there's creative solutions to that, I mean,
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: there are also women out there that would like to
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: have a child and just have a co parenting relationship
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: with the dad and not necessarily be you know, under
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: the same roof. There's all sorts of creative things in
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty five that could exist, So you know, you
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: got to you gotta think that through. But anyway, writer,
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: great question, Thanks for sending that our way. Give us
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: a lot to chew on. We are going to take
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: a quick break and when we come back, we're going
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: to talk about weight loss, shame spirals. You're listening to
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: pod therapy.
• 39:34
  Speaker 4: Today's episode is brought to you by Robert Ronnie Junior,
• 39:37
  Speaker 4: Men's Kayla Lansbury, Kevin Chamberlin, Beni Stanley, Adam Passaway, Dan Martin, Lynn,
• 39:42
  Speaker 4: Hey Yo, Andrew Lang, meet Chad Meg and Tika le Prince.
• 39:46
  Speaker 4: Would you like to sponsor.
• 39:47
  Speaker 3: The show to become a therapy user?
• 39:48
  Speaker 4: Patuon dot com slash therapy That time a year again, Yes,
• 39:53
  Speaker 4: Holiday trivia?
• 39:54
  Speaker 3: Hell yeah?
• 39:54
  Speaker 4: All right, okay, this one a holiday traditions. O.
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 40:00
  Speaker 4: I'm just curious of Jim could answer a single quansa
• 40:03
  Speaker 4: trivia question, because I bet he couldn't. Uh, Jim, what's kwanza.
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: How about that it's black honkkah.
• 40:11
  Speaker 4: Okay, all right.
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: All right, you're intolerant. I don't know enough to know
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: he's wrong. It's come out confident, all right, same thing
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: with different candles, all right? Is it two from the hip?
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: One for options?
• 40:24
  Speaker 4: Yep? Okay, Jacob to are with you? In one Eastern
• 40:27
  Speaker 4: European Christmas tradition? What unusual good luck decoration might you
• 40:32
  Speaker 4: find hidden in a Christmas tree? I actually remember this
• 40:35
  Speaker 4: one because this trivia is from Emma. I had the
• 40:38
  Speaker 4: same question last year, so I remember the answer. But
• 40:42
  Speaker 4: do you want to take a shot?
• 40:43
  Speaker 3: Oh?
• 40:44
  Speaker 4: Eastern European Christmas tradition?
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: Oh, I feel like I remember this too.
• 40:48
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think I know it.
• 40:50
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 40:51
  Speaker 4: So here's the thing I don't remember because I have
• 40:53
  Speaker 4: an answer, okay, and I don't remember if that was
• 40:55
  Speaker 4: the answer to this question or if it's just like
• 40:58
  Speaker 4: a random answer with like a good luck thing and
• 41:01
  Speaker 4: a Christmas tree that's in my.
• 41:02
  Speaker 3: Head for another reason.
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: You're get to shoot from the hip.
• 41:04
  Speaker 4: So my answer is armadillo, ohay, which is clearly not
• 41:09
  Speaker 4: the answer based on Nick's Yeah.
• 41:10
  Speaker 3: Basically, fuck I suck at this?
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you no face?
• 41:14
  Speaker 4: My man. Okay, so you want options, I'm gonna want
• 41:16
  Speaker 4: option there it is tiny umbrellas, miniature loaves of bread,
• 41:21
  Speaker 4: spiders and spider webs, or little paper shoes.
• 41:25
  Speaker 1: Well I was gonna say fish. So none of those
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: right in there. That's right up there with the mackerel
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: or something.
• 41:31
  Speaker 3: Let's say shoes, say the tiny shoes.
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: That feels right. No, is it going to Whitney? Is
• 41:37
  Speaker 1: it going to me?
• 41:37
  Speaker 4: Going to Whitney? All right?
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: Brellas, spiders and spider webs and.
• 41:41
  Speaker 4: What was the miniature loaves of bread?
• 41:44
  Speaker 2: Loaves of bread?
• 41:45
  Speaker 4: No?
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: Oh, ship, he's about to get five points. I'm gonna
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: go man, I want it to be the spider.
• 41:51
  Speaker 3: I think it's not.
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: The spider's going to be. It's gotta be like good luck.
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: Look there's a spider in here. Yeah that sounds give
• 41:57
  Speaker 1: me spiders. Yeah, trying to throw you're trying to throw
• 42:03
  Speaker 1: me down.
• 42:05
  Speaker 4: Geography. Can you name the country?
• 42:07
  Speaker 1: Oh ship, not not America?
• 42:09
  Speaker 4: Correct?
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: Yes, in Ukraine.
• 42:12
  Speaker 4: It's in Ukraine. I remember that one from the last one.
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: I do not.
• 42:16
  Speaker 3: That's what America?
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: Not a country gym with a point coming off with
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: the start.
• 42:19
  Speaker 4: Right, Uh? Whitney in Japan. What fast food meal has
• 42:23
  Speaker 4: become so closely tied to Christmas that millions of families
• 42:27
  Speaker 4: pre order it for December twenty fourth. I remember this
• 42:30
  Speaker 4: one too.
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: I just know that. Oh wow, a shooter. You want to.
• 42:35
  Speaker 4: Yeah, okay, buckets of KFC Fried Chicken, extra large, Domino's pizzas,
• 42:42
  Speaker 4: McDonald's Big Mac party sets, or sushi platters from convenience stores.
• 42:48
  Speaker 4: Nothing better than.
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: Three, just American fast food options that's associated with Christmas.
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: We have ruined this fucking holiday.
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: It's hard to be the worst.
• 43:00
  Speaker 5: Pizza and chicken wings. Okay, I'm gonna go with Domino's pizza.
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: No, So okay, the off the backboard has to be KFC.
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: But I thought that was a China thing.
• 43:11
  Speaker 5: I did to That's what I was going to say,
• 43:14
  Speaker 5: And I was like, oh, he.
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: Feel like it's a red herring. But I can see
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: this being ordered in advance. Give me KFC.
• 43:22
  Speaker 4: It is.
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: Got the dose.
• 43:26
  Speaker 4: Yes, Kentucky for Christmas was the campaign.
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: He started, Smart moved killing it.
• 43:34
  Speaker 4: Hey, Jim, you're yeah, this is question. Some Norwegian households
• 43:40
  Speaker 4: still follow a folklore based Christmas Eve habit of hiding
• 43:44
  Speaker 4: their brooms. The original idea was too blank.
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: Oh Jesus, give me options.
• 43:50
  Speaker 3: Not know where their brooms are? The have hidden brooms?
• 43:57
  Speaker 4: Keep kids from having to do chores on Chris Mus,
• 44:01
  Speaker 4: save the brooms for uh for New Year's cleaning, prevent
• 44:05
  Speaker 4: witches and evil spirits from stealing them to ride, or
• 44:09
  Speaker 4: make room for gifts under the tree.
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: Give me the witches and evil spirits.
• 44:15
  Speaker 3: Yes, witches culture culture.
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: I have no geography understanding, but cultural culturally.
• 44:27
  Speaker 4: They might steal the brooms and fly them on Christmas Eve,
• 44:29
  Speaker 4: so people would hide their brooms.
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: Wow, those witches.
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: Man, was that a problem that they were having?
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: No because they hid the brooms?
• 44:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they stayed ahead of Yeah, clearly I was Next
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: question weight loss, shame, spiral, high pod cuts, We're going
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: to evening, We're gonna fuck. I love this show A plus.
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: Good job, Oky Doki Smokies. Here we go. I thirty
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: one years old, pronouns or. She and her have been
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: moderately overweight to very obese, mostly the latter for all
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: of my adult years and some of my kid years.
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: Not formally diagnosed, but I took every box for binge
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: eating disorder. I tried everything to lose weight for over
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: twenty years, and I think I definitely developed some other
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: fun additional disordered eating patterns. I was extremely obsessive about
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: food and weight loss. There is deep, deep, deep self
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: hatred and shame I developed along the way. I avoided
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: going out to events I wanted to go to because
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: like minded people would be there and I'd think they're cool,
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: and I didn't want them to see me being fat.
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: I wanted to wait until I was acceptable to be seen.
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: So I missed out on most of my teens and
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: my twenties, just constant hiding and hating. I definitely have
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: a lot of anti fat bias when it comes to myself.
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: Between November twenty twenty three and March twenty twenty four,
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: was diagnosed with and medicated for ADHD. My doctor prescribed
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: me Vivance. I know it's an appetite suppressant as well,
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: but I still ate a lot. I just suddenly had
• 46:11
  Speaker 1: control in stomach brain connection. I remember the first day
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: realizing I wasn't stressing about what I'd eat next, I
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: could identify feeling full before the point of sickness. I
• 46:22
  Speaker 1: felt like I had fucking superpowers. My highest documented weight
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: was two hundred and forty five pounds. I'm currently at
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: about one hundred and sixty. I recently moved back to
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: my home city, having all the weight loss happen while
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: I was living away. I bump into folks I know
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: fairly often, Most recently, someone I haven't seen since my
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: two hundred and forty days saw me and she said
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: I was looking good, which sent me down a confusing
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: little spiral which happens often validation and positive recognition that
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: I've lost weight. Then I feel deep shame and embarrassment
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: because folks know I know, they know how terribly I
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: used to eat before. Then I feel new shame for
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: my lasting anti fat self hatred because I'm no longer
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: a victim in that. Now I'm just an average sized
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: woman who hates her body's fatness, like I'm a class trader.
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: I feel like there's no good way to feel. It
• 47:25
  Speaker 1: all comes back to shame and embarrassment and hoping no
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: one sees me, but with a new fun added layer
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: of really wanting to be seen because I know I'm
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: more conventionally attractive. That's a shitty way to think. That
• 47:41
  Speaker 1: reinforces my self hatred, but from a positive angle. Now
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: Now I'm worthy of being seen. I'm acceptable Now. It
• 47:50
  Speaker 1: is often very tiring in my head. How do I
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: calm this down? Can I feel pleased with my body
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: despite the fact the joy that comes from not having
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: a fatter body. How do I heal the hurt pat
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: parts of my heart that, in writing this out I
• 48:10
  Speaker 1: see are badly aching. I wish I could go back
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: in time fifteen years and just hold teenage me. Okay,
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: thank you all pugs and kisses. Don't talk to me
• 48:22
  Speaker 1: till I've had my vivance anonymous.
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: Oh man, Yeah, there's a lot in there. Don't talk to.
• 48:29
  Speaker 4: Me because I remember you talked Jim talking about this
• 48:34
  Speaker 4: when you lost weight and yeah, hearing compliments and how
• 48:37
  Speaker 4: it was just not as.
• 48:39
  Speaker 1: Fire related for you.
• 48:41
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 48:41
  Speaker 1: So I'll kick us off by just relating, right, because
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: I've lived this so unlike writer. As a teen I
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: had the teenage boy metabolism where you're growing right, and
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: so you're getting all these inches of height, and so
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: you're overeating and you develop all these styles of overeating totally,
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: but you're you're generally seen as average. But I was
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: never like slender. I was never like, you know, a
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: fit person. But you know it was. It was never
• 49:09
  Speaker 1: I was never seen as like, I don't know, heavy,
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: but I always felt a little bit heavy. Like I
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: knew that I was. I just I wore it well
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: and so it wasn't very obvious. I think I have
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: like a long torso or something that would like balance
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: it all out, and so, like I relate to the
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: writer later in life, So once I got into my twenties,
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: I got married at twenty, and as soon as I
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: got married, I just started gaining weight. And I think
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: a lot of it was because up to that point,
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: I was just a single dude hanging out with other dudes,
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: and you just don't eat, like you just like you
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: want to play Halo, like and then it's too much work,
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: you know, or you're like, oh, do you want to
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: go down to Wendy's or whatever, and you do and
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: you get a couple burgers, so like the only time
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: you ate that day. You're just busy, you know. And
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: then you partner and a lot of your relationship is
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: the love chub.
• 49:50
  Speaker 4: You know.
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: It's like, oh, what do you want to do for breakfast?
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: Oh let's eatreakfast? You know, what do you want to
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: do for dinner. Yeah, it just feels like that's what
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: you do. You punctuate your relationship and your day with eating.
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: And so suddenly I was eating a lot and all
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: the time, and like so like I was diagnosed with
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: ADHD as a kid. It's not something to bring up
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: a lot on the show because I don't feel like
• 50:08
  Speaker 1: I really have signs of it. But like.
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: What I was like, do not he's got the way
• 50:14
  Speaker 2: I looked at me.
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: Wait a minute, you guys can tell you you have?
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: Are you guys right now?
• 50:23
  Speaker 4: You hide it? Well?
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: I function just fucking what what is.
• 50:29
  Speaker 3: What does it look like when you're not actively hiding?
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: Because I want to see.
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: I really do want to try it, Like I really
• 50:38
  Speaker 1: do want to try. My mom wouldn't let me take
• 50:40
  Speaker 1: riddle in her adderall as a kid because she was scared.
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: So I've never tried it. No, and I never was
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: into like, you know, party drawers. I've never even tried it,
• 50:47
  Speaker 1: you know, like it's easy to find friends that have it,
• 50:51
  Speaker 1: but like I've never tried it because I'm too anxious.
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: I'm too scared because I'm like, well, no, no doctor
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: gave this to me, So I don't want to take
• 50:56
  Speaker 1: a Paul, I don't know what it will do, but
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: Jacob's after you take it, right, and a pharmacist.
• 51:03
  Speaker 4: You're not good at holding things in your brain and
• 51:06
  Speaker 4: focusing on.
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: That at all, So go ahead and take it. Yeah,
• 51:09
  Speaker 3: and after a few minutes you're not gonna be worried about.
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: It anymore, right, So, yeah, I grew up with that,
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: and there is I think a connection. I think I've
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: felt that in my life. I think other people have
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: felt that, especially with like and I don't consider myself
• 51:21
  Speaker 1: neurodivergent or anything, but like with adhders, like especially, I
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: think you can and a lot of humans. I think
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: it's just a normal thing you do develop, like this
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: connection to food where you're mindless about it, and like
• 51:34
  Speaker 1: I was always mindless about it, and to this day,
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: like my weight loss journey involved intermittent fasting, and one
• 51:40
  Speaker 1: of the ways that I was able to do that
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: is for whatever reason, and this is just Jim's biochemistry,
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: I do not feel full and I also do not
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: feel hunger, so I kind of have this deafness in
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: my body where like intuitive eating doesn't work for me.
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: If we all sat down and ordered sushi at the
• 51:58
  Speaker 1: like a certain amount of roles. I would notice my
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: friends or other people that I eat with and they
• 52:02
  Speaker 1: would be like, I'm full, I'm done, and I'd be like,
• 52:05
  Speaker 1: I don't know, I want to try this one, you know,
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: like I can get another one, and so like I
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: could just eat a box of cookies or whatever, or
• 52:12
  Speaker 1: I'll go back for thirds or fourths of whatever meal
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: just because I'm like, oh, I liked that taste. Cool.
• 52:18
  Speaker 1: I don't have a bio signal that says, oh no, man,
• 52:20
  Speaker 1: you're done. This hurts now, you know, Like, don't do that,
• 52:23
  Speaker 1: so it never feel satiation. And like in my twenties
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: and thirties, and I think parenting and all the other
• 52:29
  Speaker 1: things that.
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: Contribute to their distractions.
• 52:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know, I just I gained and gained
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: and gained, so like I really relate to the writer
• 52:36
  Speaker 1: with a lot of that, and then like the spiraling
• 52:38
  Speaker 1: and the shame, like you know, being overweight. I'm still overweight,
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: but like at my worst, I was about at my
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: very very worst. I think it was two sixty and
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: a year and a half ago. Whenever I started my
• 52:48
  Speaker 1: weight last year, I was at two fifty and now
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: I'm at about two o five and I got down
• 52:52
  Speaker 1: to about one ninety and and so like you know,
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: then I when I stopped my program, and I kind
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: of allowed myself to sort of find my new baseline.
• 53:01
  Speaker 1: I came back up to a little above two hundred,
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: and like my intention is to get back down again,
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: but I took time off because I was getting to
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: a place of diminishing returns. My system wasn't working anymore,
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: and I just wanted to also see if I could
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: maintain it, you know, like can I keep it off?
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: And it was really a profound experience for me to
• 53:17
  Speaker 1: go through intermittent fasting because it really caused me to
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: have to challenge a lot of this stuff inside of me,
• 53:24
  Speaker 1: you know, like the shame spiral is such a big thing.
• 53:27
  Speaker 1: And then like when I was overweight, I was overweight
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: most of my life. Again, I am still overweight. I
• 53:31
  Speaker 1: don't want to pretend like I'm on the promised Land,
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: but like there's this defensiveness that comes up where you're like, look,
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: I'm just a good guy. Fuck you, you know, like
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: I don't need you to attracted me. I don't need
• 53:41
  Speaker 1: you to want to fuck me. I'm partnered. It's cool.
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: Can I just be your friend and be a nice
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: guy that you enjoy hanging out with. I have a
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: good sense of humor. I've accomplished a lot in my life.
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: Why does my weight have to fucking matter at all
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: to anybody?
• 53:54
  Speaker 3: But it does.
• 53:55
  Speaker 1: People bring it up, they talk about it. There's little
• 53:57
  Speaker 1: jokes about it. Nobody means to be hurtful. You laugh along,
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: but like it fucking sucks. And for a lot of
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: us in the weight loss community, there's a lot of
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: chat rooms and stuff, and we'll say to each other,
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: what thing are you most looking forward to? And a
• 54:10
  Speaker 1: lot of women will say things like, oh my god,
• 54:11
  Speaker 1: I have this outfit, I have like a whole Pinterest
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: board that I want, And a lot of the guys
• 54:14
  Speaker 1: will say, I'm looking forward to never fucking talking about
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: it again. Yeah, for nobody to ever give a shit,
• 54:20
  Speaker 1: for me not to be noticed, to just walk through
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: a room and nobody care.
• 54:24
  Speaker 3: For it to not be the focal point of view.
• 54:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And that's actually one of the interesting things about
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: the weight loss is like a lot of people when
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: when you're a dude and you lose weight, I think
• 54:32
  Speaker 1: people just don't really say much. And like I think
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: for women it's quick, like they'll talk about it with
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: each other. So when I was losing a lot of
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: weight over that course of that year, it was interesting
• 54:42
  Speaker 1: because family would see me the most off and I'd
• 54:45
  Speaker 1: see my in laws. My brother in laws would get together,
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: you know, for all these episodes of things, and every
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: time they saw me, I hadn't seen me in two
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: or three weeks, and I'd drop some pounds and they'd
• 54:53
  Speaker 1: always say, like, holy shit, just notice the difference. I
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: noticed the difference, and I hated it. I hated it.
• 54:59
  Speaker 1: I never wanted to anybody to say anything because they
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: were proud of me.
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: It's like, you're good.
• 55:05
  Speaker 1: It was a compliment, you're doing great, and it was like,
• 55:10
  Speaker 1: thank you. I know that you're cheering me on. It's
• 55:13
  Speaker 1: a race I'm running, so I know your heart is
• 55:16
  Speaker 1: and I know you loved me at every stage. I
• 55:18
  Speaker 1: know you do not care, But like the compliments feel
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: hurtful because when people because what people will usually say,
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: thank you, Jacob. You've always been very consistent in that policy.
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: When I was fat, you didn't do it. When I'm
• 55:32
  Speaker 1: less fat, you don't. Yeah, no, no, no, You've You've been
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: very consistent. But I criticize you for who you are
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: on the inside. I know you do, buddy. You've never
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: seen weight, You've always seen inadequacy, always.
• 55:43
  Speaker 5: Passion about people noticing. Does it make a difference if
• 55:47
  Speaker 5: someone is saying, wow, great job, or like you look
• 55:50
  Speaker 5: great versus wow, Jim, I noticed you've lost weight.
• 55:53
  Speaker 2: Do those feel different?
• 55:53
  Speaker 1: Of those, they all feel different, But like so, like
• 55:56
  Speaker 1: I would, the most common thing people would say is
• 55:59
  Speaker 1: you look good good.
• 56:01
  Speaker 4: Which in a way is almost kind of like I
• 56:03
  Speaker 4: think how I might feel when someone says I'm praying
• 56:06
  Speaker 4: for you, right.
• 56:08
  Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, And it's tricky, right, and like you it
• 56:15
  Speaker 6: takes a because you're not insulted, you're flattered.
• 56:18
  Speaker 3: It means because it's coming.
• 56:20
  Speaker 1: Because I prospered, I suffered a lot to look different.
• 56:23
  Speaker 1: I clearly would like to look different.
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: And it was a purposeful thing. So like, oh, he's
• 56:27
  Speaker 2: trying want.
• 56:28
  Speaker 3: And people know that.
• 56:29
  Speaker 1: And like it's also tough on the community because you're
• 56:31
  Speaker 1: damned if you do and damned if you don't. If
• 56:33
  Speaker 1: you don't acknowledge it at all, I'm kind of hurt,
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: like because it does you didn't notice at all. I
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: remember Whitney was the first one in this room to
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: ever say anything about it. I told you you're the
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: only one who's ever seen.
• 56:45
  Speaker 4: I just I just don't do it right. I don't comment.
• 56:49
  Speaker 4: I work really hard to not comments.
• 56:51
  Speaker 1: You just yeah, you're you're both you and Jacob are
• 56:53
  Speaker 1: both very consistent with this. But I genuinely didn't notice. Yeah,
• 56:57
  Speaker 1: Jacob notice until I got brought up like that is
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: that is part of who I am. Yeah, people change
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: hair colors, people, you know, change You walk right past it.
• 57:06
  Speaker 3: I don't notice, no clue.
• 57:08
  Speaker 4: Jacob really only sees outlines.
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: That's right.
• 57:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yea, yea, yeah, yeah, you know what he is blind.
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's true. That's true. But I remember it
• 57:17
  Speaker 1: was Whitney who we had done the special guest appearance
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: at the university, and I was dressed differently than I
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: usually dressed in the studio. We're usually all shot up
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: in fucking pajamas and shit, and I was dressed in
• 57:25
  Speaker 1: fitting clothes and Whitney was like, Jim, you have definitely
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: lost weight. And I was like, I have. I've lost
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: fifty pounds and you see me every single week, you know,
• 57:33
  Speaker 1: And she was like, how do I not notice? I
• 57:35
  Speaker 1: was like, I wear baggy shit, you know. Like, and yeah,
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: today I'm not well.
• 57:38
  Speaker 5: I felt like I had kind of noticed before, but
• 57:40
  Speaker 5: that was the first time I could see such a
• 57:42
  Speaker 5: big difference.
• 57:43
  Speaker 2: I was like, whoa, okay.
• 57:44
  Speaker 1: And you know, and it's flattering. It meant a lot.
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: It was like, thank you for noticing. Actually, like, because
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: you know, I see y'all every single week and none
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: of you have said anything. I wasn't sure if it's
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: because you didn't notice, or if it was because you
• 57:54
  Speaker 1: all have and you're not saying anything as you don't know,
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: and so like it. But there's no right answer. So
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: I relate to the writer just to kind of wrap
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: up my piece here, like I relate because there's no
• 58:03
  Speaker 1: right answer because you have so much internalized, you know,
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: stuff about how your size was, and even though you're
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: quote unquote looking better, there's a lot of shame in
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: the sense that, on one hand, I want you to
• 58:15
  Speaker 1: see it. I want to be seen as more attractive,
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: I want to feel healthier, and I'm glad that my
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: people that like me acknowledge that I did something hard
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: and they're they're approving of it. But on the other hand,
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: your approval implicitly implies that maybe you didn't like me before.
• 58:29
  Speaker 1: And there's something about that that hurts my feelings because
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: old me was fat for a long time and I
• 58:34
  Speaker 1: was defensive about it, you know, So like I really
• 58:37
  Speaker 1: and then there's a part of me that's like, when
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: I see somebody heavy, I'm not judging them at all.
• 58:41
  Speaker 1: I was in your body, fuck the world, you know.
• 58:43
  Speaker 1: But then like there's another part of me that knows.
• 58:45
  Speaker 3: There it is.
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: I was in your body less. Yeah, bath and body Works.
• 58:51
  Speaker 1: I love Bath and body Works. It's my favorite. But yeah,
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: like you know, so I just anyway, I just relate
• 58:57
  Speaker 1: to the writer. It is a very complex relation we
• 59:00
  Speaker 1: have with our bodies. And like even when you're going
• 59:03
  Speaker 1: through weight loss, and like even whenever you've achieved it,
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: there's just a lot of trauma that's related to it
• 59:09
  Speaker 1: that the world gave us, that we gave to ourselves
• 59:12
  Speaker 1: ways that we had to learn how to cope without
• 59:14
  Speaker 1: that drug. Like for me, I felt like food was
• 59:16
  Speaker 1: a drug to me. Not only did I have stomach deafness,
• 59:19
  Speaker 1: it was my first drug. It was the thing I
• 59:21
  Speaker 1: became addicted to, is the sugar and the carbs and
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: all the things. It was how I rewarded myself for
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: a hard work today. It was how I grieved. I would,
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: you know, eat, it was how I killed time, It's
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: how I watched TV. I was just always eating and
• 59:34
  Speaker 1: I didn't have a breaking system, and so I just accumulated.
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: You know, there's the calories turned into fat, the fat
• 59:39
  Speaker 1: turned into body, and that was it. And so like
• 59:41
  Speaker 1: for me, it was a huge departure from my entire
• 59:44
  Speaker 1: life normal to lose that weight, and it really caused
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: me to sit down and like have to go through
• 59:48
  Speaker 1: a lot of like deep emotional mental health reflection. I
• 59:52
  Speaker 1: still go through it, you know, and like I've now
• 59:55
  Speaker 1: dropped the weight for over a year, and like there's
• 59:58
  Speaker 1: still the sense of like I'll look in the mirror
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: and I'm not used to my body image. So i
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 1: think I look a certain way, and then I'll look
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: in the mirror and I'll go, oh, it's not as
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 1: bad as I thought, and it's so strange. Or I'll
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 1: think clothes won't fit me, and then I'll go put
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 1: them ono, go holy shit, this fits. That's so weird.
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 1: I'm not used to it.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 4: I still have that the body image issue because I
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 4: still see myself as I saw myself in the eighth grade.
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 1: Okay wow, which was just as with the mulletyah and
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 1: the mullet and the rip jeans.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I wish I could grow them all at it,
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 4: I know, but it would just make my receiving hairline
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 4: look terrible. No, but like I still see myself as
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 4: this scrawny little kid, you know, the weighs, you know,
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 4: ninety pounds, soaking wet. Like I still see myself that way.
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 4: And it's funny. I told this story once before, like
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 4: after spending a lot of time in the gym and
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 4: kind of adding some muscle mass and then getting back
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 4: into playing hockey. You know, I was practicing with one
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 4: of my teammates, you know, and I having some challenges,
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 4: and so he was kind of showing me, like, you know,
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 4: some things I could do as far as like stick
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 4: handling whatnot. And he's like, and I was trying to
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 4: do these things and he's like, why are you doing that.
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 4: He's like, that's not who you are. He's like, you're
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 4: you're one of the bigger guys in the league. Just
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 4: push through people. And then I was like, like that
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 4: just didn't register. He's like, what the fuck are you
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 4: talking about? You know, and I just because I just
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 4: I can't see myself that way. But yeah, I mean
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 4: I think the other thing too, is like I've since
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 4: starting the mental fit thing, I've really changed. I want
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 4: to compliment people. I want you know, you're you're making
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 4: excellent progress. But what I'll do is I'll try to
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 4: find ways that I can compliment that isn't focused on
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 4: the way you look, right, you know, Like if I see,
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 4: you know, some of my former clients in the gym,
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 4: you know, and they're doing really well, I want to compliment, like, Hey,
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 4: I see you in here a lot, you guys are
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 4: doing great efforts. I see you guys working really hard,
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 4: good for I'm really proud of you, you know, and
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 4: not necessarily talk about.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: You look the way that they were.
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 4: But yeah, but it's like it's hard to do that because,
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 4: you know, it is it's very vision to lose lose
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 4: situation because like, from your perspective and the writer's perspective,
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 4: the way you look, you've you've you've that has meaning
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 4: to you, right like, And I think that's one of
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 4: the things that people need to do, is to be
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 4: able to break that meaning. Like just the way you
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 4: look doesn't mean all of these things that you have
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 4: associated with it. But sometimes by me complimenting you when
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 4: you're making progress, I'm only reinforcing that link, sure, when
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 4: really we should be you know, severing that link.
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, obviously the writer said they're thirty one
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 5: and being a female growing up in the nineties and
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 5: early two thousands, I mean joking about heroin chic earlier.
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 5: That was a real thing, the real thing. It was
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 5: for real. And I talk about this a lot with well,
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 5: some with clients, and before I forget, I wanted to
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 5: touch on the ADHD thing that you mentioned, Jim a
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 5: lot of times with food and ADHD, we'll see like
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 5: kind of that dopamine seeking behaviors can come in the
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 5: form of food because there are like those those happy chemicals.
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 2: Being released when we eat.
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 5: And you know that that goes back to what you're
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 5: saying about emotional like ups and downs being associated with
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 5: food as well.
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 2: I definitely can relate to that.
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 4: Well.
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 5: I joke with Peter now like I had a really
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 5: long day the other day. I was like, I'm going
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 5: to eat I don't know what it was, something bad,
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 5: like a piece of pie or something, And it was
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 5: like because I've had a long day and I'm like
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 5: literally eating him. Like, but I'm gonna say it out loud.
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 5: This is my my acknowledging. Huh. I'm acknowledging that this
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 5: is an emotional eating moment here.
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 2: Let me just throw that out there.
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 4: So I had this exact conversation with Adeline Sage White,
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 4: the nutritionists that dietitian I was talking about. I'll just
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 4: plug her website real quick, Adeline age Nutrition dot com
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 4: A d A L Y N. So in this interview,
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 4: we we got to talking about like dopamine and just
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 4: like that idea of she used the example of like
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 4: you put the kids to bed, and you want time
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 4: to yourself, and it's time, your time to wind down,
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 4: and like I'm going to reward myself, so I'm going
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 4: to eat you know, this bag of oreos or whatever.
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 4: The thing is, right, and just not only it's kind
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 4: of a it's a double whemy because you have the
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 4: dopamine and that effect that you get from eating something
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 4: like the sugar that you're taking in has a biological effect,
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 4: but then you're also there is a learned behavior that
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 4: goes with it, which is that anything that you do
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 4: in that time period. That's positive. Remember, neurons that fire
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 4: together get wired together. So just you having some quiet
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 4: time alone gets paired with the oreos. So when you
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 4: have one, you expect the outcome.
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 2: This is my time.
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and so it it And I like I can
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 4: relate to that too, Like I My classic example is
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 4: like going to the movies. Like if I go to
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 4: the movies, to go to the movies and not have
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 4: snack food, Oh my god, that's so weird.
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 3: You don't get Yeah, what do I do with my
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 3: I'm so happy I've never been a snacks during a
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 3: movie person.
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 1: Oh really, if I go to a movie like like
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 1: a Psychopaths.
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 3: I don't need it. Well, I'm fine without it. Yeah,
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 3: you sounds like somebody the ones in Vegas that have
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 3: you know a bar is connected. Yeah, that's a different thing.
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 1: Jacob sounds like somebody at the bar. Jacob sounds like
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 1: somebody who's maybe been traumatized by the popcorn bucket with
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 1: a hole in it. So maybe.
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 3: I've been on a quest to.
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 5: Find But I feel like the nineties and early two thousands,
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 5: what I remember a ton of was there pushing fat
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 5: free this and definitely our body image was just like
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 5: thrown in our face all the time. And at the
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 5: time it was focused mainly on women and men were
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 5: like pushed to the side, I think, and there was
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 5: no barely any if any acknowledgment to what men or
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 5: young boys might be going through with their own body image.
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 5: But for the writer, I think, yeah, we really are
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 5: between everything we see online now on the back in
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 5: the day beyond TV, but now online on social media,
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 5: things that are pop culture references. It's bodies are being
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 5: evaluated all the time. And then ozempic popped up now
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 5: and like it's even more of a topic. Everyone wants
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 5: to talk about Kim Kardashian losing enough weight to fit
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 5: in Marilyn Monroe's dress or whatever. Like there's all kinds
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 5: of things popping up that's like, oh, people are I
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 5: notice people are noticing bodies. So people are definitely noticing
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 5: my body, right, And it kind of feels like that
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 5: spotlight is there as far as like what to do
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 5: with that a strategy that can be somewhat helpful.
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 2: It's not a magic pill.
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 5: This is not something that just like works automatically, but
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 5: that is helpful that I have found is really trying
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 5: to find things about my body that I do like
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 5: so when it comes to like I get I can
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 5: go up and downstairs. That sounds stupid because I'm right,
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 5: but like my body got me around today just great.
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 5: And I didn't hurt my back jumping in waves in Portugal.
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 1: So God dig safe.
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 4: Yeah that's uh yeah, I mean, since Peter doesn't have
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 4: a podcast, what are you? What are you gonna do?
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 2: Peo podcast?
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 3: Good luck?
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 4: But this is a great point because, like my fitness
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 4: goals have changed over the last couple of years. And
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 4: I think I've talked about this because with a lot
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 4: of the people that I work with, I tend to
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 4: get the people referred to me for my in person
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 4: personal training tend to be in their fifties and sixties,
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 4: so I work with a lot of people in their
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 4: fifties and sixties. And having done that, my goals are
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 4: all about longevity. Now, like I'm no longer, I'm forty four,
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 4: I don't.
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 2: Need you don't look a day over forty.
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 4: Three, thank you fifty Yeah, but like I don't need
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 4: this body image, Like I want functionality and longevity. I
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 4: want to be able to golf when I'm sixty five.
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 4: I'm going to be able to bend down and put
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 4: a tea in the ground. I want to be able
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 4: to pull something down from a shelf, you know, like
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 4: I want, Like that's what I want, and so I
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 4: think that's a good way to look at it too.
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 4: Is this, you know, just like is your body serving
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 4: its purpose? And can it serve its purpose for the
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 4: long run? Just about how you're doing today. I've added
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 4: more squats to my regular just like regular workouts and stuff,
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 4: because I've just been reading about how much better older
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 4: people do in in later life if they've just been
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 4: keeping that lower body and just basically.
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 2: Just doing squats does save lives.
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 1: That's it, yep, damn.
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 4: They were like, it keeps your knee, keep your knees good,
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 4: It keeps your your your hips good. You know, it
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 4: keeps your leg strong, and everything works on balance. Like
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 4: they were like, it just helps with a lot of stuff.
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 4: I was like, but I can, I can add three
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 4: minutes of doing your squats into into my regular stuff,
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 4: Like yeah, sure.
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 5: It's about like appreciating what is it that you are
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 5: proud of your body for doing, even if I mean, honestly,
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 5: even if it's just being able to like breathe still
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 5: to to for me go up and downstairs to do
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 5: five three minutes of squats, like hell yeah, you didn't.
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 5: And even if there is extra fat or less fat
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 5: or whatever, like none of that is is the point
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 5: where we're just pushing that to the side. Just like
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 5: we talked about highlighting and when other people highlight oh
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 5: you gained weight, you lost weight, we aren't even gonna
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 5: go there. We're gonna pull a Jacob and just not
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 5: acknowledge it. We're not acknowledging any of the other stuff.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 5: It's we're acknowledging the thing that don't have good or
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 5: bad associated with It's just is this is what my
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 5: body's doing.
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 4: Or just kind of like we're going to acknowledge the
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 4: things that actually were. It's not even the things that matter.
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 3: We're going to decide what matters and then acknowledge those things.
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 4: Right, So, like with me, I look at myself in
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 4: the mirror, get on a scale or whatever, and I
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 4: kind of have two switch.
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 3: I'm pretty binary with this.
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 4: Okay, Like I'm either I'm either looking fine yeah or
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 4: I'm not okay. And like if I'm not well, I
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 4: know and I may or may not work on that,
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 4: but like I got it, I'm on board with it,
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 4: like kind of radical accept radical acceptance.
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 1: A big part of this is my last thought on
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 1: this is like I think that whenever you've been in
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 1: a different sized body and you've had a lot of
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 1: emotion and a lot of pain associated with that, now
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 1: you're delivered from that, there is this survivor's guilt, this
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 1: sense of like, now I see other people, how do
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 1: I feel about them? How do I feel about self?
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 1: And then whenever I'm grateful that I'm not heavy anymore,
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 1: is that a betrayal of who I used to be?
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 1: And is that a betrayal of the others who are
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 1: still there? And the way that I've made piece writer
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 1: or the way that I've healed a little bit from
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 1: this is I've looked at it for me personally and
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 1: thought of my relationship with food and my relationship with
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 1: weight personally used to be self abusive and used to
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 1: be unhealthy and addictive and toxic, and that does not
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 1: in any way have anything to do with other people.
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 1: It's like whenever you stop drinking alcohol and then your
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 1: friends are like having a beer at the barbecue. They're
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 1: not bad people, and you don't look down on them
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 1: for that. You know that you abuse the privilege. I
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 1: shouldn't have alcohol. It's not a good fit for me,
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 1: but I don't mind that my friends do. It's fine.
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 1: And so that kind of disconnects you a little bit
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 1: from the judgment, because if you did judge your friends
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 1: and you were like, fuck them, Alcohol's the worst, and
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 1: then you're like, oh no, now I'm a bad judging person,
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 1: it's like, no, you're not disconnect that. See it as
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 1: a personal link. Your relationship with your previous body was
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 1: a size that you didn't feel was true to you.
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 1: You released that, your relationship with food was changed, And
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 1: if you can personalize that, I think there's also the
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 1: sense of acceptance in general mercy, Like I have kindness
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 1: and compassion for what I might call like fatter Jim.
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 1: He was a good guy. He is a good guy.
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 1: He ate his feelings for a long time and he survived.
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 1: He took care of kids and raised a family and
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 1: launched a practice in a podcast and wrote a fucking book.
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 1: Like he's a really good guy. He was jolly guy's
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 1: you know, but like he was just he had a
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 1: poor coping skill And I've worked to deliver future gym
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 1: from that.
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 4: We're going to take a quick he was almost feeling
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 4: good about it. Yeah, held me back up the ladder.
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 4: I will add that because that kind of reminds me
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 4: of something that the great philosopher iced t Oh yeah,
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 4: in an interview. He's talking about life in general, and
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 4: he's like, the best metaphor is the gym for the life,
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 4: because he's like, you go to the gym, He's like,
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 4: no matter where you go, there's always going to be
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 4: somebody who is bigger, stronger, more fit than you. And
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 4: if you look to your right, the you're gonna find
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 4: that person. But if you look to the left, you're
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 4: going to find somebody who would kill to have what
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 4: you have. Oh yeah, that's so like like you kind
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 4: of have to understand both perspectives of that.
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's actually something comes up a lot on the
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 1: theater mitten fasting reddits and stuff like that, and somebody
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 1: will be like, I've lost twenty pounds, it's nothing, And
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 1: there's other people that are like that is everything I
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 1: would kill to be.
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 4: Oh, Like, I've been losing weight for the last couple
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 4: of months. I've been like mindfully losing weight for the
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 4: last couple of months, haven't noticed fine, honestly down about
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 4: twenty pounds n and like looking at it, like, nah,
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 4: that's about normal like that, And it's not that I'm
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 4: beating myself up over it, but like, yeah, I do
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 4: look in the mirror and I don't see a difference,
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 4: and then I see twenty pounds on the scale, Like shit,
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 4: I'm down twenty pounds difference. Sure, wish I noticed it more. Yeah,
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 4: oh well, there's nothing new about it at that point either.
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 4: But like I mean, like you go to the I
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 4: have other options that I can do, of course, but yeah,
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 4: I don't.
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 1: Know fastest way to lose weight is just to amputate
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 1: an appendage.
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 2: It's true.
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 1: We're gonna take a quick story and when we come back,
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 1: we're wrapping up the show. You are listening to pod Therapy.
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 4: Today's episode is brought to you by Robert Proby, Junior Mins,
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 4: Kayla Lansberry, Kevin Chamberlain, and then Stanley, Adam Hathaway, Dan
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 4: Martin Glynn, Hey Yo, Andrew Langney, Chad meg and Econ Liprence.
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 4: You go xpose to the show therapy at Patreon dot
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 4: com so I leave.
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 1: The score is Jim is a fucking champion and you're
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 1: all scrubs. I think you and Whitney you're tied. Okay,
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 1: give or take, it's fine.
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 4: I'm Whitney always ties points.
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 1: I'll tell you that right now, Jacob.
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 4: Yes, Iceland doesn't just have one Santa type figure. It
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 4: has the Yule Lads. Which descriptions fits them best?
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 3: Oh so I know this one they are.
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 4: They are the itchy scratchy you're being you're being ridiculous.
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 3: There it is, you're being. Don't be silly, don't give
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 3: me options.
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 1: Oh wow, I really believe your confidence.
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 4: There.
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 1: I thought he had it.
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 4: A thirteen snowmen who melt if children misbehave, that's good
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 4: bid thirteen mischievous.
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 3: I love Christmas characters that have penalties.
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 1: Yea children? Yeah, Christmas Puss or whatever that terrifying fucking
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 1: goblin thing. What does that think called.
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 4: Christmas Puss was putting Christmas Christmas?
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 3: Are you thinking of?
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 6: Uh?
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 4: Yeah? Uh b thirteen mischievous troll like brothers who visit
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 4: children one by one in December. See a family of
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 4: elves who only deliver gifts to farmers. Now that one
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 4: d A single king who rides a reindeer named goofa
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 4: oh Man. That's just silly. It's clearly the second one.
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 4: It's clearly the large group of trolls. It's tying the
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 4: trolls into the Icelandic culture.
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 2: That's not it.
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 3: It's the troll one.
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 4: Iceland's thirteen Yule Lads are trollish brothers down from the mountains. One.
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 2: We just won our troll from Iceland on our tree.
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 2: And I don't know what it.
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 4: Is interesting, Okay, Whitney.
• 1:16:23
  Speaker 2: I was I was going to be my one.
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 3: I was all for the melting Snowmady Whitney.
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 4: In alpine regions like Austria, Good day Mite. Who is
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 4: Crampis in the traditional winter celebrations there?
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 1: It is he?
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 5: What did do I say? Wasn't that on the oh He?
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 5: Or is that a different I think.
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 3: It's a different characters. I think he did like a
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 3: Crampis type thing, but I don't.
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 5: Think it was based on some options because I think
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 5: I want to.
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 3: I might be wrong about that. By that might be
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 3: exactly what he was doing.
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 4: A a gift bringing angel who travels with Santa b
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 4: A horned creature who accompanies Saint Nicholas and punishes misbehaving children,
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 4: C the patron saint of gingerbread bakers, or D a
• 1:17:10
  Speaker 4: family goat who delivers firewood.
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah it is B.
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 2: I was children.
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 4: I thought for sure that it was B. I wanted
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 4: to I wanted it to be a helpful goat. It
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 4: turns out I was hoping that D was the grrect
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 4: answer wildly misrepresented this entire time.
• 1:17:30
  Speaker 2: That's right, I mean I'm winning.
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 4: I mean you're tied.
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 2: That was forgot with Jacob.
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 4: Okay, Jim, let's do it on the night before Epiphany. Uh.
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 4: In Italy, many children wait for.
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 3: Who is she?
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 4: Love A an no queen who freezes the bad toys?
• 1:18:03
  Speaker 4: A or B a kind witch like old woman who
• 1:18:06
  Speaker 4: flies on a broom and leaves gifts of gifts, or
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 4: coal ce a talking star who points to good children,
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 4: or D a fairy who only brings candy to grandparents.
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 3: Or E a helpful goat.
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 1: But then in the mix, all right, so I'm gonna
• 1:18:25
  Speaker 1: throw away the old woman one. I feel like the
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 1: which one's possible? I feel like the snow which one,
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 1: the the yes? The which one? Yeah? A and B?
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 1: One of them is the star? One one's a? Which
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 1: one's a star.
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 4: And one queen who freezes the bad toys.
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 1: Fuck you know what I'm gonna go with? That does
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 1: sound like a snow give me that one?
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 3: Give me.
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 1: In the question, give me snow queen, Elsa the snow queen.
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 3: I think I think as a minus five.
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 1: Okay, you may have any adderall that could really help me? Right?
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 4: You want a snow queen?
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 3: No, no, no kidding, a snow.
• 1:19:15
  Speaker 4: Queen toys that one? No ship, Jacob. Your options are
• 1:19:20
  Speaker 4: a kind, witch like old woman who flies on a
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 4: broom and leaves gifts or coal, a talking star who
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 4: points to good children, or a fairy who only brings
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 4: candy to grandparents talking star.
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 1: No, oh man, that would have been my backup. So
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 1: you're down to which who drops off presents or fairy
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 1: who gives candy to grandparents?
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh.
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 4: Keep in mind this is in Italyers together and shake
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 4: your which one?
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 1: Which one?
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 2: Which one?
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 4: Laboffana is a witch like woman Italian.
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 2: Verity.
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 1: There you go on January fifth, delivering garlic, knots and
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 1: marinera to all the good girls and boys. Well, as
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 1: we wrap up the show, we want to remind you
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  Speaker 1: all the wonderful people who enjoy our show and love
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  Speaker 1: announced Justine Okay cool. So this is the episode ode
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• 1:24:09
  Speaker 4: So when I copy in posts sometimes it changes it
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  Speaker 4: to wing dings. I guess the font thing, yeah, font
• 1:24:16
  Speaker 4: thing something is just fine.
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 5: Sorry, Okay sorry something, Jim and Manu, the offices of
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