Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Mark Dodyk about his choice of Fury from the Deep (2/6)

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Talks to Mark Dodyk about his choice of Fury from the Deep (2/6) · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

0:40
To and stir with a blunt penknife the Doctor Who
0:44
commentary podcast. Not the only commentary podcast.
0:48
There are probably Superior ones, but this is one of them,
0:52
I'm here today with charming handsome.
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The charismatic, the intelligence, Mark datuk.
1:00
I think General. I think most people now think
1:02
you've got the sexiest voice of the entire hand fan.
1:09
You know, I don't know what to do with.
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Compliments will acknowledge that some a.
1:13
All right. Who do I meet Edwards even
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Fraser Gregory? You know, he was the previous
1:24
Crown owner of first sexiest voice on this thing.
1:27
Even he's relent it now fair enough.
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I am no King of the North the okay if you know even as on this
1:34
now you know Mark, McManus Fraser your good self, Dave
1:40
Rennie, mmm and all good. Slowly slowly slowly spreading
1:45
across the Lambs. So all those rumors about Doctor
1:48
Who fans only being Southerners is nonsense.
1:51
Yes. Oh my corner as well.
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He's often Wales, is that Celtic, maybe you're finding
1:58
lots of Celts. Anyway, we are here to talk
2:03
about episode 2 of the theory, from the deep, which last we
2:08
have both said, we are a little bit on the fence with the story.
2:12
Actually. We found quite a few positive
2:13
things to say about part 1. Yeah, I think there's more to
2:18
come. It's quite there's definitely a
2:21
lot of Moments in this story that are really.
2:26
I just I think there there there I think there's a reason why
2:29
this story is still so highly regarded, even though we don't
2:32
have it. So to speak, we've got an
2:34
animated version and still ranks.
2:36
Pretty highly. We did you know I got a question
2:40
for you though. Before we go in just come as an
2:42
incredible surprise to you and why do old of the animated
2:48
characters have massive arms like mr.
2:50
Tickle Maybe whatever. Mr. Tickles got his catching.
2:56
Did you notice it there's some of the bits later on when there
3:00
are some wonderful flailing. I'm not fine watches.
3:03
What's the fellows name Harris? Yes, when he's prostrating that
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it's got these enormous arms, I've gone Keri Russell.
3:11
Surely, you must have noticed that we're not in, the rash is
3:14
back, they're disproportionately large.
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I must say, I will say, because we have been quite kind about
3:20
the animation and it is very good.
3:23
Laughs. I really like as well that some
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of the backdrops are sort of photo realistic.
3:27
I don't know if they've used photographic backgrounds, but I
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think I think it looks quite effective.
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Gary Russell, says in the episode 2 commentary that you
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cannot with a budget that they had, and the sort of amount of
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frames they could do that, in no way.
3:46
Could you portray an act of performance in anime because Was
3:53
watching real-life footage so much is done through body
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language. Yeah.
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And you can't do that in animation because you're
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effectively seeing a still person, that's just moving a
4:02
little bit, you know. So what they did was instead is
4:06
they, they suggest movement through camera angles that were
4:10
there in the original. So you're seeing them short from
4:13
different directions, which makes it feel a bit more sort of
4:16
mobile, which is, which is so clever, and that's using a
4:21
medium to its full. Fact, isn't it?
4:23
It's trying to get your the benefit of using a different
4:26
medium and getting the best out of it with the animations.
4:31
I know that some people don't really engage with them very
4:34
much or haven't been very enthusiastic about them, but I
4:40
think it brings a whole new life to some stories.
4:44
And interestingly, I think different Productions that have
4:48
been done. Things have been learned from
4:49
them. So, the original when we did the
4:51
first pair of The Daleks Charles Norton.
4:56
He knew that it had been rushed. I am and to meet the deadlines
5:00
they'd had to make compromises. And a lot of people said, oh,
5:02
well, the animations really stilted, it's not very good.
5:04
It's rubbish. And the fact that he was given
5:07
the opportunity to go back and revisit it, the differences
5:11
though they are a minut actually in live and seeing as how does
5:15
the fluidity of the Doric movement and their the
5:19
characters moving. You can tell They just added
5:21
extra frames because it all This feels so much more fluid than it
5:25
did before and it's simple stuff.
5:27
But so effective. So having watched the first
5:29
edition of that story, I definitely I could see where
5:32
people are coming from and then watching it again that animation
5:36
is fantastic and I think Fury is one of the better ones.
5:40
Yeah, released as well because they're probably coming on in
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Leaps and Bounds. There's things that they've
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learned from each occasion and I think, Patrick troughton space
5:48
is quite well animated. They've got a good likeness for
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Jimmy and Victoria. Is adorable.
5:53
She's a wee button of a feast. It's a last for macro.
5:57
Tara, Galaxy for Theory, from the deep abdominals home in
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awful. Oh no.
6:02
An evil of the Daleks with us five.
6:04
They were all really strong. I think in lot in different
6:07
ways. The worst one was what I see
6:09
what we've got a quick fit down the road, right.
6:12
Hmm, where the hell am I going with this?
6:13
I hear you ask what? At well outside quick fit.
6:17
There's this sort of blow up, man.
6:19
Okay? And you sort of wobbles about a
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bit like this? Yeah.
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Ha ha. I can see where you're going.
6:25
You know, I'll go with this and every time I see that wobbly Man
6:28
In The Wind it reminds me of the animation of the web of fear.
6:32
Yeah. A fuck was that all about?
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Ah, it's I don't want to be too hard on them for that because it
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was, they were using new animation techniques.
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And the thing is with, with More Money, More Time, more research
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that technique will get better. However, tell me you found that
6:52
At distracting because I like I did yes it does.
6:55
It does feel like that first attempt?
7:00
Well, you know, you know, it's like when you bow to somebody I
7:02
kept thinking why they keep bowing to each other.
7:04
There's no forward and backwards.
7:06
It was very odd. Okay.
7:09
I'll stop slacking off the animation.
7:10
I'll be, I'm sure we can't have so, too.
7:13
I think we should. Yes, you can't sing cuz I
7:16
intrude. All right, then, in five, four
7:20
three. Are you near the play button to
7:23
One. Honestly, you absolutely have to
7:27
press my buttons. You really do.
7:28
Well, that's good from a distance.
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Jesus, architect that I won't go there.
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Do you know anything about the the script history of this
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story? Yes, about Madden, but matter
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what about Pemberton? Ryan his script and then showing
7:55
coming in and rewrite his script.
7:57
Yeah. And it's there's quite a history
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to it because they're always even before that, there's the
8:02
fact that think this story or a sub, one very much, like it
8:08
Pemberton submitted to the production team while David
8:10
Whittaker was still script editor.
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Okay. But at that point the doctor
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being on Earth in contentment contemporary England or near
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contemporary England was an Goal for the production team.
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So it was very much just thrown out, so you repurposed it, I
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needed the radio, play the slide.
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That's right. And that was commissioned by.
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I think Peter Bryant who they moved onto TV Doctor Who who
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voted pick Victor Pemberton to be assisted script editor and
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then the commission came from this.
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So it wasn't all accounts show in did the rewrite and Pemberton
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was so appalled. He was like I'm going to take my
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name with sure. We had to play a piece in dries
8:53
off, didn't they? Yeah.
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I don't think any writer from that era that worked with him as
8:58
a positive thing to say, to be honest.
9:00
So the oldest not are those said anything but is Robert Holmes
9:03
because Sherwin collaborated with him on the spacebar of but
9:06
hello result. Exactly.
9:09
Yeah, it's a kind of appreciate Derek Sharon's ideas for Doctor
9:15
Who because when you see your vision?
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Yeah, I think that's one of the best.
9:22
She is fantastic and he oversaw the war games as well.
9:26
So he's got some really good stories there, but I don't think
9:29
he was, it obviously wasn't very good at communicating his vision
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to other people, he just took stuff and went.
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Well, I'm not happy with this. I'm gonna do what I want with it
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and put people's backs up asshole.
9:41
Have you heard him on the documentaries?
9:43
Have you heard him on the commentaries?
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He is an arrogant. I think only Krista phrase, bid
9:48
Meade, has an ego that is larger than Derek show.
9:52
Daily Show is on the wall game saying oh we know Pat route was
9:55
coming up to me saying, well I'm going to quit and I said we'll
9:58
go on in fuck off quit you know, do it.
10:00
I don't care. Yeah.
10:01
But like, he was not a did not suffer fools gladly it by all
10:05
accounts. Peter Bryant was propping up the
10:07
bar because he had a drink or two.
10:09
And I think he did a bit of marginal work and Sherwin was
10:12
sort of with his bare hands keeping dump together and props
10:16
to him because he did a good job.
10:18
Oh absolutely. But that don't mean, he's a nice
10:21
guy don't look if no. And I think the Saving Grace of
10:24
this era is the fact that Terrance dicks was there behind
10:28
the scenes, as assistants script editor because he came in and
10:31
did the final rewrites with pemberton's agreement.
10:36
But again, Pemberton was never invited back.
10:39
So, it makes me wonder did Terrance dicks.
10:41
Not enjoy the experience of working with a to neither.
10:44
I mean, this was his first was his first terrorist attacks.
10:48
Yeah, he wasn't involved in with her fear.
10:50
Was a, I think he just joined And laterally so it really had
10:54
very little in her element in it.
10:57
Yes, I think he was he was still quite Junior because I think
10:59
like when he commissioned Robert Holmes to write the quote, I was
11:04
like a backup. These Dreadful ideas like prison
11:07
in space were being developed. It's almost like he knew of has
11:13
never gonna fly like all of this one going.
11:15
That's her as I stood there and I think it was sort of finding
11:19
his voice. Hmm.
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But it is interesting that Pemberton ever wrote again, and
11:25
then David Whittaker wrote once more.
11:28
Didn't he after this? But it was showing again, during
11:33
ambassador's of death, but basically polish him off.
11:35
And they said, you know, they paid him off and said, you know,
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we can't get another rewrite out of him.
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So so he effectively polished off, David whisker Mervyn and
11:47
haseman. Never wrote for the show.
11:48
Again after the Dom a is yeah and it is I think the fact that
11:54
he had such poor relations with these writers was to the series
11:59
detriment in a way because there is the feeling that they're
12:02
developing a bit of internal continuity in the series for the
12:05
first time that they're dipping into these worlds.
12:08
You know, you're coming back and you're meeting Professor
12:09
Travers. Again, in the way the fear and
12:13
notionally he was going to be one of the leads in The Invasion
12:17
but because of the Fallout with, he's been, he's been in Lincoln,
12:20
they couldn't then use the character because they decide,
12:22
you know. Really upset them will get.
12:24
We can probably sit on something to get them.
12:26
Give them some money used the Brigadier but program really
12:29
pushing our luck will Travers. I would be nice.
12:31
I would have really provided some continuity across that
12:35
whole middle time here. Although I've been asked to give
12:38
Edward Burnham anything because I think he's a great actor as
12:41
Professor walk-ins he's terrific.
12:44
I kind of makes me wonder how different season 6 and even
12:48
potentially season 7, and apparently 0, we'd have been if
12:52
perhaps and travelers had been very encouraged her.
12:56
And she could have been a leash or can she ask us?
13:00
He's an old butt needed Leisure, he's and Travers in Albany.
13:03
Really. That's the template, my job
13:05
still of the opinion. That Zoe could have played that
13:08
role in season 7. Yeah, and I would, I would have
13:11
been totally up for that because when d-pad re a Zoe, you cannot
13:16
fight. She's one of those companions
13:18
that I don't think you can fault.
13:20
Performance-wise. She absolutely gives it 100%
13:24
every time. What does he/she is comedy gold.
13:27
Every time I see her one, these conventions by the last couple
13:30
she Make it so she stayed in France.
13:32
Yeah, they had a beam in on a big screen.
13:35
Yeah. And she's playing up the old
13:37
woman Rogen. Is he on?
13:39
Is it working? She knows exactly what she's
13:42
doing. She's, they're ripping into
13:43
Fraser hands the whole time even when she's not there.
13:46
Brilliant. Oh yeah.
13:47
I think. Yeah, she's one of these people.
13:49
I think I can understand why younger Mark was so taken with
13:55
his always a companion thing. And I can imagine a lot of kids
13:59
wear, Why wouldn't she was the companion?
14:01
She's a nicely made, she's just a that's like she's a kid with a
14:06
brain. I was a kid.
14:07
We were broke so, but you didn't did you are Bubble.
14:10
Wrap only private fair enough, let me go surfing.
14:16
Okay, I'm gonna ask you about Maggie Harris.
14:18
Yes, well because this is an unusual thing to have this
14:23
interpersonal relationship. This soap opera element
14:26
occurring in the middle of a doctor who story where she's
14:30
feeling a bit faint. She's having a bit of a bad day,
14:32
isn't she? She's such a seaweed and she's
14:33
come over a bit funny and he's less concerned about his work on
14:37
the oil rigs where people are dying and more than naturally
14:40
more concerned with his domestic setup.
14:44
Along just like this just doesn't fit when I could talk to
14:47
some people, it's odd, isn't it? But I think sometimes Doctor Who
14:52
has to do things that are a bit out there, not out of the norm,
14:56
and it fits. It's normal for him because this
14:59
is near, contemporary are Earth story, which I think what you
15:03
had the faceless ones before now, and the war machines, it's
15:07
still a really novel, it's sort of a setting for the series so
15:13
it's quite It interesting. And I like the fact that there
15:16
are domestic scenes. It's not something that the
15:19
classic series touches on much at all, but when it does, I
15:23
always find it quite heartening. I enjoy it.
15:25
This is what would happen in Rusty.
15:26
Davis was Ron, a classic doctors, isn't it?
15:30
Yeah, I think you're right. And it is it is a bit of a weird
15:33
anomaly but it does. I think it kind of adds to the
15:36
naturalism of this story again like all these stories in the
15:40
series 5 are sort of Is ice Warriors in the Antarctica.
15:45
It's yetis in the Himalayas. That's called a big bowl, weird
15:50
settings. Hmm.
15:52
And this just feels very real. It's a very realistic workplace
15:56
with realistic characters having realistic relationships.
16:00
Yeah. And I think it's informed by a
16:02
lot of TV shows of the time, but also like, so you've got things
16:09
up. What's it called?
16:11
That was really popular at the time.
16:13
I'm gross gross. Hmm.
16:16
No, not Crossroads but that probably had an influence as
16:18
well because much of the writing staff had come from Crossroads.
16:22
So there may be bringing so piggish elements to the whole
16:25
dynamic. But there's also oh I forgot the
16:28
name of the drama, but it was Peter Bryant and no in its Lloyd
16:32
was really obsessed with it. I do not not the one wants it in
16:35
the magazine place. Is it that one?
16:37
No, not compact. Oh okay, I'm gonna go for a mall
16:40
now. Yeah we're going to end up going
16:42
round the houses. Okay?
16:43
What You figure it out between episodes to and free and will
16:46
let people know them? Yeah, exactly.
16:48
But anyway, whatever that series is that I'm thinking of it.
16:51
Informed. A lot of the stuff that went on
16:53
in this series, not only in the casting that the storytelling,
16:56
because there was a lot of stuff in set in boardrooms and
17:00
high-flying managers and directors, arguing and bouncing
17:04
off one another and he's not used to Ryan Doctor Who, but
17:07
probably very used to Ryan that kind of stuff laughter.
17:10
He's gonna bring all that with him.
17:12
Absolutely. And I think he's seen, you know,
17:14
he's taking that as an influence base.
17:18
Also clearly taken quatermass as an influence.
17:20
Oh well, most people do, I think anybody especially sort of, at
17:26
this point in Doctor Who, history, sort of Seasons, five,
17:29
six and seven. A lot of the Contemporary era
17:31
stories are influenced by quatermass is undeniable and I
17:35
think I've ever seen it I know now about to a podcast with Toby
17:43
hey talk about it, I better watch it.
17:44
Yeah I think you need to put that right.
17:46
But there's a lot of things I should have said I've been
17:50
seeing secret army. I've had people tell me that's
17:51
fantastic too. Oh that's good.
17:53
Yeah, I hadn't seen I put off seeing that for quite a long
17:56
time and then I finally got the box set and actually some of the
17:59
episodes give you more great grilling drama.
18:03
But, you know, I think this is why I feel like these sequences
18:06
here with Oaken quill cross a line because this has been a
18:10
Published as a recognizable workplace, a recognizable home
18:15
with a recognizable relationship in there.
18:17
So, these are normal people. This is like your mother, you
18:20
know, is in the other room, making you tea and these two
18:26
creepy perverse men coming home. Stop grinning maniacally.
18:33
And then vomiting gasps in a face, they come into our
18:36
bedroom. I mean, aha, it is a bit on the
18:39
nose. Yeah.
18:40
Yeah, there's completely. I mean it's not even like the
18:42
knock on the door. There's no concern whatsoever.
18:44
So it's quite a man. It's the fact that we've got
18:48
that clip and in the walk very stat, it's mmm.
18:53
It's very much like what she sees him in the mirror, doesn't
18:56
show you and it just play. And you know what I think is the
19:01
scariest thing of all I think Dudley Simpsons in on this and
19:05
he put it in this very playful music.
19:08
So it's kind of really fucking He and comedic at the same time
19:13
is right? Because it I think he's
19:16
referencing the sort of Laurel and Hardy theme in that little
19:20
incidental music. It's quite a canny, little thing
19:24
to do, really. So they're here because they're
19:28
what they're already Servants of the weed.
19:31
Yes, they are here together on the side.
19:34
Yeah. They're just doing their up to
19:37
no. Good behind the scenes.
19:39
All a pretty much. Everything that goes wrong in
19:41
the story. That's inexplicable.
19:43
He's probably they're doing because they've been working
19:46
discreetly in the background for a while.
19:48
I'll in the animation in episode 1 when all the hustle and bustle
19:51
is going on, you can see them, you know, moving pipes and
19:55
things like that young turning wheels and things.
19:57
Yeah, they're sort of ever-present and I wonder if
20:01
their presence is felt more in the original if we were able to
20:05
see it because apparently, the audience really took To the
20:10
characters, really? I and Pemberton even joked
20:14
laterally that he could have gotten a spin-off out of it and
20:16
you think watching the animation?
20:18
Is that right? But I wonder Perhaps there was
20:22
much more to it than we are leaving our mr.
20:26
Oak and mr. Quill going to overpower this
20:28
week. Yeah, exactly.
20:29
Yeah. I see you next week.
20:31
Yeah, Mollie sugden in. I think, in the animation, they
20:38
do more with the. We don't they?
20:39
So you just have the foam out on the patio and the weeds tendrils
20:43
coming out. I think in the original, it was
20:44
just the phone. Yeah, dog.
20:46
That I think they only had the one.
20:51
Seaweed costume that basically Peter days inside flailing about
20:54
in. But I think these sieve that as
20:56
much as possible for a latter part of the story.
20:59
I've got to be honest, I've also come down in the morning and
21:02
there was all this foam pressing up against the door.
21:04
I would be quite scared. Yeah.
21:07
Uh-huh. It would be a certainly stranger
21:09
things woken up to but saying a word, oh yeah, here it is.
21:16
And this is, this is Gary. Russell says, this is one of the
21:18
few sequences where he said shop for sure.
21:21
I want this to be like it is in the exist, our footage.
21:28
They just added the gas effect, which is quite nice.
21:31
Yeah, I think it was a bit more clarity what's going on.
21:35
Would you know what, the way it sure would then rocking and
21:38
their mouths open. It's like they're laughing and
21:40
that's really scary as well. Aha, it's kind of, I've never
21:45
actually just sort of had a bit of a realization.
21:48
The working title that Victor Pemberton had was colony of
21:50
devils and I've never really been able to quite make sense of
21:53
it. But when you think about it,
21:55
that's quite demonic really visual Or horrible God I'm
22:00
sorry, it's arms are absolutely massive clearly arms.
22:05
Maybe they only employed people I'm going to give it a reason
22:08
here with huge arms so they could reach all the dials and
22:12
levers on that massive Bank of controls.
22:14
Some of them, do look to be very high up.
22:18
No ladders, no ladders, not even a little step.
22:21
Give us our bunk up, obviously. This is the stuff off on a bit.
22:26
And you know what, Is. It is Rob's.
22:29
It isn't officer. Hobson is the moon base.
22:32
Rob, says they're even shoot them even got similar names for
22:35
folks. Say huh?
22:37
We're obviously is so like against everybody, isn't it?
22:43
Time it gets a bit wearying. Yeah and I think having a year
22:48
of belligerent controllers and captains and all sorts with the
22:53
series it it probably did get a bit wearing after a while
22:56
because you've still got the real and space to to go and it's
22:59
the same scenario and it's something that is replicated in
23:03
other stories through the history of Doctor Who it doesn't
23:06
go away. But never when they seem not in
23:08
the frequency of pretty much every story for a year to 18
23:12
months. Yes, it was interesting.
23:15
You talk about the wave in the space often.
23:17
That's another unusual Doctor Who story and that there is a
23:21
lot of interpersonal relationships in that as well.
23:23
It's me your dear Ryan and Tanya you got Gemma and the base
23:26
commander That's an honest David Whittaker and he was really good
23:31
at injecting sort of carrots, Winterfell wondering if
23:33
terrorist links as well. Brought some of that out a
23:35
little bit under? Yeah, because I I think it's a,
23:40
it's of it's fairly unique, two seasons, five and they are
23:44
really part of season six. That you've got a lot of this
23:46
interpersonal stuff going on. And I wonder if part of that,
23:50
might be Victor pemberton's influence as well because he was
23:53
assistant script editor for much of that period and you've got
23:58
lovely seat. Has, he was promoted to the main
24:01
script editor of Tomb of the Cybermen and you've got lovely
24:04
scene with Victoria and the doctor if we threw that story.
24:07
And you've got the interpersonal goings-on between a pain Lee and
24:14
the Clint. Oh.
24:14
And the that was his name's not store my thinking of the secatur
24:21
is. Yeah.
24:22
Single store, isn't it? Yeah.
24:24
So there's there's a lot of Dynamics and characterization
24:30
that Vic that the series pretty much just gets rid of and is
24:34
still but, you know, there's not a lot of interpersonal stuff
24:37
from this point on 4 of season latter half of season 6 onwards
24:41
for a very very, very long time. I am and I think it's a lot more
24:46
I'm going to contradict you now. I'm so sorry.
24:49
That's funny because I think when dicks gets the show, yeah,
24:52
when the show is he is from The Silo Resort laughing silurians
24:55
and basses are deaf and Inferno half tastic character work in
25:00
here, Miss Dawson. And Peter Mars is character
25:04
Reagan and Carrington and oh my God, what several chapters
25:10
character? He's brilliant as well in a bar.
25:11
Yeah, I wonder elements of that. You've got matcalc.
25:16
He is responsible for a lot of that as well and he's somebody
25:20
who injects a lot into his characters in these stories, you
25:23
know, there's real depth in them in a way that a lot Of other
25:26
stories and writers of that period.
25:28
Don't deliver because there's one bit when Hulk wrote the
25:33
novelization for the cave monsters and he has what's the
25:37
point? What's this?
25:38
The lady character inside Miss Dawson.
25:42
There's a bit in the story where it says something along the
25:47
lines of She'd crossed the point in our life of not of Wayne.
25:54
Would she meet mr. Right into?
25:56
Why didn't she meet mr. Right.
25:58
Fuck, what realization to make, that's a great guy.
26:02
And that's, you know, that's that's enough, isn't
26:04
novelisation. Ostensibly aimed at kids and
26:07
it's got something quite that's I mean, how golf a date?
26:12
I'd Liars. It is no way.
26:15
The Doomsday weapon is an angry book and it.
26:19
Yeah. It's I think he's somebody that
26:23
really doesn't get enough praise for the things he accomplished
26:26
on the ceiling. I think after your, all right,
26:29
after seven, I think the character stuff then it becomes
26:32
moments of charm with immediate family.
26:34
That'll kind of basically the character work you get after
26:36
that is those bits whether all together, and they're bantering.
26:39
And Thought character work. So I agree to agree with you.
26:45
Mostly that's fine. Yes, I think we've found, we've
26:48
found common ground and say it we often.
26:51
Do you see that poster of Roger Delgado on the wall?
26:53
There says, what is it? That's great.
26:56
That's pretty good. I love the little Easter eggs in
26:58
this story. There's a few bits and pieces.
27:01
I don't know if we've seen the bit, where the focuses in on the
27:04
loudspeakers and it's got the international Electra, Mattox
27:08
local. And I know there's a production
27:10
of a class somewhere the motto. There's a production code for
27:15
the episodes on one of the one of the pipes.
27:19
I think it's on a beaker or something.
27:22
You go back to the Tardis. Oh yeah, yeah the doctor holds
27:27
up and it says I are are 200 because it's this production of
27:30
story production called and the episode number.
27:33
So we're this is they were watching episode 199 of Doctor
27:36
Who right now, but the song also, a vote Saxon poster there
27:40
somewhere as and I didn't. Obviously, I'm just being
27:42
facetious. But it's not like they can do
27:45
that sort of thing, isn't it? I think is good to know.
27:48
And some of them the fact that they've appeared in other
27:50
stories as well. There's little hints in the evil
27:52
of the Daleks and N are the faceless ones.
27:54
I think the Masters poster pops up in that as well.
27:58
Can I say? I think that after praising to
28:00
the high heaven, is the Cliffhanger to episode one.
28:03
This episode has got such a boring cliffhanger.
28:07
I want I'm not sure sometimes I think the effectiveness is some
28:11
of the 60s Cliffhangers is the fact that you don't have the
28:15
Cliffhanger screen. And it probably is, you know,
28:18
when what they did was they would normally hold on a
28:21
character who were quite a close up and they would just see
28:25
something quite Stark. Like there's something waiting
28:28
in the pipes. And then the credits would rule.
28:32
I think that gets me that works for me.
28:35
What the thing is, we know that already though, maybe that was
28:37
the episode 1 Cliffhanger. We've already seen someone
28:40
coming out of the pipes. We know there's something in
28:42
there I suppose. So there is an awful lot of
28:44
debate about whether or not there is something in the pipes,
28:47
no thing. They decided until at least
28:49
steps, or two forwards it, maybe there's something there a bit.
28:51
Be is something in the paint. Let's tell you what to turn that
28:55
around, the Cliffhanger 2, episode 3.
28:57
When we get there, where she walks into the sea.
28:59
See, Seemingly to commit suicide.
29:02
That is terrifying. Yeah, that's a real.
29:05
It's it's a real mixed bag of Cliffhangers.
29:08
You've got this story that all I do think there's a lot of, it's
29:12
not, it's not shocks, it's quite, you know, it's ones that
29:16
make you suddenly you're thinking great what now what
29:20
does I feel the sequence where fan Merchants goes down the
29:24
impeller shaft and that's shot in sort of darkness in silk
29:29
there and That is instant doing like the piano score.
29:33
Hmm, it goes on for ages and you're just waiting for the
29:36
moment when that fucking we've whipped out of it and you have
29:40
sit down into the phone and the suspense t-bills.
29:44
I mean I think you look was just like I'm going to scare the fuck
29:46
out of him. July I was kids are going to be
29:48
sleeping tonight. Exactly.
29:50
And I bought year ago, did you say it plays in your very sexy
29:55
accent. Got something waiting in the
29:58
past. No, I've lost forgotten like. 90
30:01
horror of Corners. Little season.
30:02
Put me on the spot like that down there in the pipeline
30:07
waiting. We tiered.
30:10
Yes, very good. That's good.
30:12
It's one of the main thing about the a dummy doesn't happen on
30:17
brick box but on the DVD right in the list of anime is goes on
30:20
forever. They taught me to goes on for 10
30:22
years. It really does explain it when I
30:25
look at the time counter on the disk and it says, all this is
30:28
two and a half hours long, you think hold on?
30:30
The story is only about 220. The graders are a 10 minute
30:34
speech. Don't know what they think they
30:36
deserve their credit. They put in the world.
30:38
Oh absolutely yeah good on them because it's the obviously
30:42
they've got very tight deadlines and not great.
30:44
Big budgets and he accomplishes Miracles really do.
30:48
Why would accounts as well? There was like a base in Cardiff
30:51
was Gary Russell the animators were in China, there was a place
30:55
in London, you know, and they were all.
30:57
I think the fact that they managed to pull this thing
30:59
together, Other giving up your graphically was coming from
31:02
three places. Yeah.
31:04
Props to them, absolutely. Well done.
31:07
Well, look, we've talked about scares, we've talked about
31:10
regulars. We've talked about character
31:12
work. What the hell?
31:14
We're gonna talk about next. I don't know, we'll probably
31:18
just have to see what happens. It's usually a bit free In
31:21
freestyle with me. I think this is where it gets
31:23
super creepy and episode free. So, we held my hand.
31:28
From afar. Thank you very much.
31:30
That's like that.