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The Mysterious Unsolved Missing 411 Cases · The conspiracy

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Speaker 1: Crime, conspiracy, cults, serial killers, and murder. All things that
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Speaker 1: I love to consume and I know you do too,
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Speaker 1: you sick-minded beautiful freak. And today we are going to
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Speaker 1: be looking at some interesting murders that have all occurred
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Speaker 1: in the boundaries of the United States National Parks. Have
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Speaker 1: you ever heard of missing 411? Of course you have,
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Speaker 1: you're here. I know most of you probably have, but
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Speaker 1: for those of you who haven't, it is a series
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Speaker 1: of books written by former police officer, David Politis, big
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Speaker 1: fan by the way, about mysterious disappearances in the national parks.
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Speaker 1: And the name Missing 411 comes from a list of
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Speaker 1: 411 people missing from national parks. And it's also the
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Speaker 1: number you can call to report a missing person requiring investigation.
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Speaker 1: So in today's video, we are going to be covering
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Speaker 1: some of the most intriguing disappearances related to the 411.
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Speaker 1: And our first one is called Bigfoot steals children in
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Speaker 1: the woods. This is a story about Dennis Lloyd Martin
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Speaker 1: and Trenny Lynn Gibson. And we begin our search for
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Speaker 1: the missing in Appalachia. Yes, I say Appalachia because my
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Speaker 1: boyfriend is from Appalachia and they say Appalachia, not Appalachian.
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Speaker 1: Don't come at me. Specifically in the Smoky Mountains National Park,
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Speaker 1: nestled between Tennessee and North Carolina. Smoky Mountain National Park
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Speaker 1: might be one of the most beautiful places to visit
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Speaker 1: in the continental United States. It boasts gorgeous mountain ranges,
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Speaker 1: dense forests, flowing waterfalls, and miles and miles of hiking trails,
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Speaker 1: including the Appalachian Trail, or Appalachian, whatever you wanna say.
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Speaker 1: This means that millions of people visit every year. And
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Speaker 1: while most get to enjoy the park, some may never leave.
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Speaker 1: And our first case occurred on June 14th, 1969, At
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Speaker 1: Spence Field. The Martin family had spent the night on
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Speaker 1: the 13th at a cabin within the park. Dennis Martin,
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Speaker 1: along with his father, William Martin, his brother Douglas, and
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Speaker 1: his grandfather Clyde, had decided to go for a hike
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Speaker 1: and ended up going to Spencer Field. And this field
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Speaker 1: is high up on the mountain with plenty of tall
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Speaker 1: grass growing all around it and very thick vegetation surrounding
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Speaker 1: the area. It also crosses the border between North Carolina
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Speaker 1: and Tennessee. So William and Clyde would sit down and
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Speaker 1: allow the kids to play around once they reached their destination.
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Speaker 1: And while they were resting, another family would come by,
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Speaker 1: which coincidentally, they would have the same last name as
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Speaker 1: the Martins, Martin. And they would come up and ask
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Speaker 1: if their kids could play together. And of course, William
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Speaker 1: and Clyde obliged. And over the next few minutes, the
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Speaker 1: family's children would play in that tall grass and everything
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Speaker 1: would be fine. But that was when one of the
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Speaker 1: kids suggested that they play hide and seek. Don't play
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Speaker 1: hide and seek in the forest, in the woods, in Appalachian.
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Speaker 1: So when the game began, all the children would sprint
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Speaker 1: off into different directions, including Dennis Martin. And he was
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Speaker 1: seen about 50 feet from his dad on the edge
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Speaker 1: of the field on the Tennessee side. So roughly five
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Speaker 1: minutes would go by and all the children would eventually
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Speaker 1: come out, except for Dennis. And his father would naturally
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Speaker 1: become immediately concerned. When he saw Douglas's face, he knew
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Speaker 1: something was wrong. So everyone in the field obviously began
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Speaker 1: to search the immediate area. screaming his name and looking
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Speaker 1: behind every tree and bush. But Dennis was nowhere to
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Speaker 1: be found. And at the time of his disappearance, Dennis
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Speaker 1: was wearing a bright red shirt. He was roughly four
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Speaker 1: feet tall and weighed about 55 pounds. He is also
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Speaker 1: described as having brown hair and brown eyes. So the
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Speaker 1: authorities were naturally called and an extensive search began. But
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Speaker 1: as the search continued, they would find no trace of Dennis.
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Speaker 1: The park rangers began by asking people in the immediate
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Speaker 1: area if they saw Dennis or saw anything that was suspicious,
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Speaker 1: but everyone would reply that they had not seen the boy.
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Speaker 1: And around 5 p.m. on July 14th, Only a few
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Speaker 1: miles away from where Dennis went missing, the Key family
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Speaker 1: would begin a hike near Rowan's Creek in Cades Cove.
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Speaker 1: While on their hike, they heard, quote-unquote, an enormous, sickening scream.
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Speaker 1: And they would walk a few hundred yards in the
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Speaker 1: direction of the scream to see if something was wrong
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Speaker 1: and if they could help.
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Speaker 2: A man and his children, and they were trying to
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Speaker 2: photo the deer. They were following the deer up Rowan's Creek.
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Speaker 2: and they heard a child scream. The father ran up there,
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Speaker 2: and he saw a man dart into the woods, and
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Speaker 2: he described him as unkempt.
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Speaker 1: And Mr. Key would go on to investigate the scream
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Speaker 1: by himself just in case it was like a dangerous
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Speaker 1: situation for his family. But when he reached the area
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Speaker 1: where he thought the scream had come from, he would
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Speaker 1: see a man in the bushes who darted off into
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Speaker 1: the woods. So he quickly turned and left the area
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Speaker 1: thinking that that was extremely weird. And then he would
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Speaker 1: learn only a few hours later that a boy had
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Speaker 1: gone missing in that area hours before he saw the
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Speaker 1: man in the bushes. While this is incredibly strange, it
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Speaker 1: will be incredibly important later. Mr. Keys would even go
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Speaker 1: on to state, But it wasn't a bear, it was
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Speaker 1: a man hiding in the bushes. He was definitely trying
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Speaker 1: to hide from us. Which sounds suspicious as fuck. So
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Speaker 1: the search for Dennis would move on well into the night,
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Speaker 1: but be hindered by a very large rainstorm, causing the
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Speaker 1: search to stop for a night. And in the morning,
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Speaker 1: an extensive search party was planned to begin operating the
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Speaker 1: next day. And when June 15th came, one of the
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Speaker 1: largest manhunts for a missing person ever seen would form
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Speaker 1: in hopes of finding Dennis. In total, there were 30
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Speaker 1: Boy Scouts, 51 Ranger students, and three helicopters, including two
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Speaker 1: helicopters sent from the US Air Force. On top of
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Speaker 1: all that too, there was a group of Green Berets
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Speaker 1: that arrived from Fort Benning. And later that week, 40
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Speaker 1: more Green Berets would be on the case. It's completely
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Speaker 1: wild that the case ramped up to this degree in
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Speaker 1: less than 24 hours. So over the course of the
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Speaker 1: next few days, the search would grow immensely, like I said,
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Speaker 1: gaining hundreds of volunteers a day until the park service
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Speaker 1: had to literally tell people to stop showing up. Talk
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Speaker 1: about people coming together though, that's awesome. At its peak though,
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Speaker 1: there were 1400 searchers helping to try to find Dennis.
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Speaker 1: Even the FBI and the Coast Guard were called in
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Speaker 1: to help with the search. But one thing that was
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Speaker 1: odd was that in the official National Park Service report,
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Speaker 1: the reason that the FBI was called was not directly
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Speaker 1: stated because foul play had not been suspected yet. So
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Speaker 1: there was no need for them really to be involved
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Speaker 1: in this investigation unless the FBI and NPS knew something
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Speaker 1: William Martin didn't. But the FBI would later conclude that
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Speaker 1: Dennis was not abducted despite his father's adamantly telling him
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Speaker 1: that he believed without a doubt that foul play was suspected.
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Speaker 1: But despite the NPS and FBI suspecting that foul play
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Speaker 1: did not occur, they would conduct numerous interviews with people
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Speaker 1: in the surrounding area. including Harold Key. What's even more
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Speaker 1: strange is Harold's interview and the circumstances surrounding it. According
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Speaker 1: to the FBI, when they reached out to Harold, he
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Speaker 1: agreed to meet with investigators at the park. But when
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Speaker 1: the time for the interview arrived, he never showed up
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Speaker 1: to the park. Instead, the FBI's would run into him
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Speaker 1: outside the park and continue the interview there. And during
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Speaker 1: this interview, Harold once again claimed that he had no
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Speaker 1: idea of the boy's recent disappearance, but called the authorities
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Speaker 1: anyway because of the strange man and the scream he
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Speaker 1: and his family had heard. Furthermore, Harold's son would later
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Speaker 1: tell newspapers that he had seen a bear or someone
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Speaker 1: running through the trees in the same area where his
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Speaker 1: father saw the man in the bush. But despite all
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Speaker 1: the evidence that was presented to the NPS and the FBI,
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Speaker 1: they concluded that Harold's sighting and Dennis's disappearance was in
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Speaker 1: no way connected. So much so that they didn't even
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Speaker 1: bother to investigate the area where Harold had that sighting.
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Speaker 1: which is so stupid. NSP Ranger Dwight McCarter, who was
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Speaker 1: well-respected and NSP's best searcher at Great Smoky National Park,
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Speaker 1: stated that it was possible for a man to carry
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Speaker 1: a small child from where Dennis was located to where
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Speaker 1: Harold spotted the man in the bushes, which is extremely prevalent.
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Speaker 1: Even other people within the NSP, such as Harold Sherman,
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Speaker 1: a research associate of the Experienced Services Program, a branch
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Speaker 1: for older NSP employees, wrote literal letters to his superiors
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Speaker 1: and news outlets of his beliefs that Dennis was, in fact, abducted, stating,
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Speaker 1: I am impelled to ask you if you know whether
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Speaker 1: or not there have been or are any questionable characters
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Speaker 1: in this region. Camping out in the wild in this area,
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Speaker 1: like hermits, squatters, such an individual may not be connected
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Speaker 1: with the boy's disappearance at all, but I feel that
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Speaker 1: a- Maniac, so-called, does exist in the vicinity and could
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Speaker 1: have trailed the body. I hesitate to write anymore as
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Speaker 1: my conscious mind is trying to reject such a feeling.
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Speaker 1: I see something red and something being carried or dragged.
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Speaker 1: Are there any caves in the vicinity? A stream may
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Speaker 1: even run through it or part of it. I am
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Speaker 1: always tormented when impressions come to my conscious mind trying
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Speaker 1: to tell me that they couldn't possibly be true, but
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Speaker 1: I get a feeling of sudden panic on the part
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Speaker 1: of Dennis. What happened to him occurred suddenly, unexpectedly, and
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Speaker 1: he could not or did not cry out. He seems
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Speaker 1: to be struck down by something. The area is rugged.
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Speaker 1: I don't know why I gave him that accent, but
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Speaker 1: I feel like it's right. It's right, and I agree
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Speaker 1: with him. I agree with him. Go look! I don't
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Speaker 1: know why I turned into Jerry Seinfeld. Also, I'm sorry,
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Speaker 1: I gotta put on my glasses. I can't, I can't see.
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Speaker 1: Chris reads screens or whatever. Gather round because now it's
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Speaker 1: Chris reads screens! And things continued to be weird, to
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Speaker 1: say the least, as the searches concluded. And the case
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Speaker 1: would unfortunately go cold. First, both the NPS and the
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Speaker 1: FBI kept Dennis's father, William, in the dark about Harold
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Speaker 1: Key's sightings. It also seems like they kept the general
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Speaker 1: public in the dark about this as well. William didn't
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Speaker 1: actually learn until the Key family sightings, until the NPS
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Speaker 1: went public, which is f * * * ed up.
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Speaker 1: They also didn't inform him of the FBI interview that
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Speaker 1: took place after they told him his son's disappearances had
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Speaker 1: no foul play in Furthermore, many people have requested an FOIA,
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Speaker 1: which is a Freedom of Information Act, request on the
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Speaker 1: Dennis case from the FBI. And this request has conveniently
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Speaker 1: been rejected, including David Politis. Shout out You're awesome. What's
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Speaker 1: even more odd is that despite publicly stating the sighting,
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Speaker 1: the NPS never created an official report about it. So
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Speaker 1: the only way to know about it is through the newspapers.
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Speaker 1: There were also numerous psychics called to cover the case.
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Speaker 1: And some were even saying that he was alive and
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Speaker 1: to check the trees for the body. But what's next
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Speaker 1: might be the most damning information of it all. In 2011,
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Speaker 1: David Polaitis drove to interview William Martin and Dwight McCarter
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Speaker 1: to see if they had any unreleased information on the case.
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Speaker 1: And from William's interview, we learned this. When Dennis disappeared,
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Speaker 1: he was literally within 50 feet or less of William.
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Speaker 1: His brother Douglas also never saw anything strange in the woods.
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Speaker 1: William and an NPS fire prevention officer hiked from the
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Speaker 1: Spence Field to the area where Harold saw the man
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Speaker 1: in the bushes in 90 minutes flat, confirming that someone
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Speaker 1: could have carried Dennis down the path. They also saw
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Speaker 1: no caves and no evidence of anybody living there. Mr.
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Speaker 1: Martin actually spoke with Harold and learned that he and
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Speaker 1: his family saw a man carrying somebody over their shoulder
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Speaker 1: along a nearby ridge at the time of Dennis's disappearance.
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Speaker 3: What?
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Speaker 1: And he also learned that the local newspaper purposely omitted
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Speaker 1: and changed this information to say that they saw a bear. Mr.
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Speaker 1: Martin would state that the head of the park services
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Speaker 1: was merely just a figurehead and receiving orders from someone
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Speaker 1: else explaining why so much information was neglected and hidden. Furthermore,
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Speaker 1: the lead FBI agent Jim Reich on the case took
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Speaker 1: his own life only four years after Dennis's disappearance. Lastly,
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Speaker 1: William firmly believes that his son was kidnapped by somebody
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Speaker 1: waiting in the woods. He stated, And based on this interview,
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Speaker 1: it became Extremely clear that the FBI and NPS were
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Speaker 1: working closer together than people had thought. They both withheld information,
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Speaker 1: and the people assigned to each case by the agency
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Speaker 1: had odd events or information surrounding them. Like, to not
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Speaker 1: tell the family of a missing child that a man
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Speaker 1: was seen carrying someone over their shoulder is extremely odd,
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Speaker 1: to say the least. It was almost as if they
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Speaker 1: knew that Harold Key had seen something he shouldn't have
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Speaker 1: and that they wanted to investigate it privately or something.
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Speaker 1: I love conspiracies, but it's just, I like, I can't
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Speaker 1: even imagine as the family of Dennis, just not having
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Speaker 1: any answers and knowing that you have been kept in
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Speaker 1: the dark. Like, how could you not think of the
12:48
Speaker 1: most up things, you know? And that theory would be
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Speaker 1: further backed up by Dwight's interview. And here's what we
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Speaker 1: learned about that. Dennis still believed that a man could
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Speaker 1: have easily carried Dennis away from Spencefield and through Rowan's
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Speaker 1: Creek with ease. And when asked about why the FBI
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Speaker 1: and NPS were downplaying Mr. Key's sightings, Dwight states that
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Speaker 1: the FBI wouldn't have any knowledge of the woods. So
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Speaker 1: dismissing the idea that a man could have trekked from
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Speaker 1: Spencefield up to Rowan's Creek is not that crazy. The NPS, however,
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Speaker 1: Dwight reaffirms that he has walked that area numerous times
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Speaker 1: and knows for a fact that it is 100% possible.
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Speaker 1: And Dwight stated that it was odd to have the
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Speaker 1: Green Berets come and set up and enter the woods
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Speaker 1: In the 1970s, even NPS Rangers were not armed. And
13:38
Speaker 1: previous instances when the National Guard got involved, they were
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Speaker 1: usually unarmed as well. Additionally, in the case of Dennis Martin,
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Speaker 1: the Green Berets didn't even interact with the NPS Rangers.
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Speaker 1: And Mr. McCarter confirms that there were wild men who
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Speaker 1: live within the park. which is terrifying, and that they
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Speaker 1: purposely did so to avoid human contact. So when Mr.
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Speaker 1: Keyes saw a man in the bush, it was technically
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Speaker 1: possible for him to see a wild man just hiding
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Speaker 1: in the bushes. He also stated though that he didn't
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Speaker 1: believe that a wild man would have taken Dennis. as
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Speaker 1: the only wild man that he knew of resided on
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Speaker 1: the opposite side of the park from where Dennis disappeared.
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Speaker 1: So the disappearance of Dennis Lloyd Martin is one of
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Speaker 1: the most puzzling disappearances to ever occur. Like how could
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Speaker 1: a little boy avoid over 1400 searchers, highly trained Green
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Speaker 1: Berets and experienced park rangers who know every nook and
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Speaker 1: cranny of the park. Additionally, it seems like the military, FBI,
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Speaker 1: and NPS knew something that everyone else didn't. What's new, though?
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Speaker 1: And it's not crazy to believe that the FBI would
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Speaker 1: get involved, as foul play would have to be ruled out.
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Speaker 1: But why would they purposely dismiss Keyes' sightings? And why
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Speaker 1: would the newspaper alter what Keyes' family saw? Also, why
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Speaker 1: did the Green Berets go into the woods armed? Maybe
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Speaker 1: they were tracking some killer in the area, and when
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Speaker 1: Dennis went missing, they pulled all of their efforts into
15:03
Speaker 1: scrubbing the area. It would also explain why there was
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Speaker 1: such a significant response from military branches and investigative agencies. Or...
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Speaker 1: Maybe they knew something was in the woods and were
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Speaker 1: scared to encounter it. But let's look at similar disappearances
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Speaker 1: that have occurred in the same area. Our next story
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Speaker 1: details the disappearance of Trenny Lynn Gibson. So on October 8th, 1976,
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Speaker 1: in Great Smoky National Park, only six years after Dennis
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Speaker 1: Martin's disappearance, Trenny Lynn Gibson vanished from hiking on a trail.
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Speaker 1: 16-year-old Trenny was hiking to Clingmans Dome with her high
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Speaker 1: school class, starting from Andrews Bald on the North Carolina side.
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Speaker 1: She hiked with Robert Simpson and a group to Andrews Bald,
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Speaker 1: but then turned around to walk back to the bus.
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Speaker 1: And at 3 p.m., about three quarters of a mile
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Speaker 1: from their final destination, Trenny would vanish. And in the
15:55
Speaker 1: area of her disappearance, the trail was marked and she
15:59
Speaker 1: was in full view of other hikers. And following her disappearance,
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Speaker 1: the NPS began a search for the missing girl and
16:05
Speaker 1: started doing interviews of the students to see if they
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Speaker 1: had any information to offer. It is safe to say
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Speaker 1: that what occurred before Trenny's disappearance was odd, to say
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Speaker 1: the least. In multiple interviews, Trenny was last seen on
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Speaker 1: the trail bending over, looking at something, and turning right
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Speaker 1: off the trail right before vanishing. Further Furthermore, a fellow student,
16:25
Speaker 1: Anita Rounds, claimed that she had vanished from the trail completely.
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Speaker 1: And it's important to note that the surrounding area was
16:31
Speaker 1: miles and miles of thick vegetation and forest. And next
16:35
Speaker 1: to the trail was a small stream and a slight
16:38
Speaker 1: rocky slope. Anita Bounds would say in an interview, She
16:41
Speaker 1: was on the trail when I last saw her. I
16:42
Speaker 1: looked away and when I looked back, Trini was nowhere
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Speaker 1: in sight. I should have been able to see her
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Speaker 1: if she went up the trail. I checked the area
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Speaker 1: where Trini was last seen. No trail leading off. And
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Speaker 1: the search would begin on the 8th, but was hindered
16:59
Speaker 1: by weather, which is very strange because that happened to
17:01
Speaker 1: Dennis as well. Not that that's all, but it's very weird.
17:04
Speaker 1: It's very convenient weather. And following the day that Trenny disappeared,
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Speaker 1: the NPS really didn't do much to aid in the search.
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Speaker 1: We already hate him at this point. It became such
17:13
Speaker 1: a problem that a Swain County Civil Air Patrol commander,
17:17
Speaker 1: John Maddox, had to call the NPS and complain about
17:21
Speaker 1: how he had people on standby and couldn't move forward
17:25
Speaker 1: unless they gave him the okay. And unfortunately, the NPS,
17:28
Speaker 1: would you know it, wouldn't respond to Maddox and his
17:31
Speaker 1: crew of over 40 searchers. Two doctors, 14 pilots, and
17:37
Speaker 1: five planes all waiting to help search for Trenny had
17:40
Speaker 1: to be completely called off. And the search for Trenny
17:43
Speaker 1: lasted from the 8th of October through to the 22nd,
17:47
Speaker 1: during which time 300 volunteer searchers just combed the hills
17:51
Speaker 1: of the Smoky Mountains. The Army and US Marine Corps,
17:55
Speaker 1: along with helicopters and tracker dogs, all got involved and
17:59
Speaker 1: they produced some evidence. Search dogs had found her scent
18:02
Speaker 1: at Andrews Bald and headed toward the Forney Creek Trail. Furthermore,
18:07
Speaker 1: investigators would find shoe prints matching in size and style
18:11
Speaker 1: of the shoes that she wore on that day she disappeared.
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Speaker 1: And they would find those footprints at Double Springs Shelter,
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Speaker 1: which is about four and a half miles away from
18:20
Speaker 1: Andrews Bald by the trail. and about a two hour
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Speaker 1: hike away. And even more strange, according to some sources,
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Speaker 1: search dogs found her scent at Clingman's Dome and then
18:30
Speaker 1: Collins Gap, which was in the opposite direction of where
18:33
Speaker 1: she was last seen and far east of Double Spring Shelter.
18:37
Speaker 1: And the FBI would briefly get involved, but like Dennis's case,
18:42
Speaker 1: they aligned with the opinion of the NPS Sorry. And
18:45
Speaker 1: said that there was no suspected foul play. And a
18:48
Speaker 1: psychic would eventually be brought into this investigation as well
18:52
Speaker 1: and would say that they saw, quote unquote, Trenny sitting
18:55
Speaker 1: in a hollow in what might be a bear den
18:59
Speaker 1: or something. Rocky area. Not a lot of undergrowth. several
19:03
Speaker 1: very large trees, lots of acorns on the ground. I
19:07
Speaker 1: don't know if that's what they sound like. I don't
19:09
Speaker 1: have a name or anything to go off of, but
19:10
Speaker 1: that's what I picture, you know? And in April, her
19:13
Speaker 1: father would ask for another search by the NPS, but
19:16
Speaker 1: was told that only 25 people would be allowed to
19:19
Speaker 1: conduct a small survey of the area, meaning that the
19:22
Speaker 1: final search for his daughter would be small and non-intensive. NPS.
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Speaker 1: So how was it possible that Trani was able to
19:31
Speaker 1: walk 10 plus miles through rugged, thick, vegetative forest and
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Speaker 1: mountainous terrain to each location without being seen at all,
19:42
Speaker 1: by the way? We could even say that after she
19:44
Speaker 1: turned off the trail where her friends last saw her,
19:47
Speaker 1: she could have found another trail and hiked to the destination.
19:50
Speaker 1: where the evidence was found. But another question would then
19:53
Speaker 1: be brought up. How would she remain undetected despite being
19:56
Speaker 1: on extremely popular trails? Like I said in the beginning,
19:59
Speaker 1: Hundreds of people walk through these trails daily. Surely one
20:02
Speaker 1: of them would have realized that a girl who had
20:05
Speaker 1: just walked past them was the one that went missing. Furthermore,
20:08
Speaker 1: she would have been torn up and dirty, which would
20:11
Speaker 1: have caused much more attention to be on her by onlookers.
20:14
Speaker 1: Another question that remains in the case as well is
20:17
Speaker 1: what did Trini see in the woods that would cause
20:19
Speaker 1: her to go off trail? And why she would choose
20:22
Speaker 1: to go off trail instead of running to her friends
20:25
Speaker 1: if it was something dangerous or I don't know, you know?
20:29
Speaker 1: Like did she see someone that she knew? Skinwalker. Or
20:33
Speaker 1: did something in the woods coax her off trails? I
20:38
Speaker 1: think it's a skinwalker, honestly. I'm just, I'm scared. You
20:41
Speaker 1: won't catch me. You won't catch me in them woods,
20:44
Speaker 1: all right? And luckily for you, there are theories for both.
20:47
Speaker 1: So let's get into those. First theory is that she
20:50
Speaker 1: was being stalked and was kidnapped off the trail. A
20:53
Speaker 1: man by the name of Kelvin Bowman, what a stupid name,
20:57
Speaker 1: was shot in the foot of Trani's yard after being
20:59
Speaker 1: caught creeping near her house. And later on, student testimony
21:04
Speaker 1: claimed that his car had been seen tailing the bus
21:06
Speaker 1: on the way to the hiking trail. Another possibility is
21:10
Speaker 1: that a classmate on the hike along with her lured
21:12
Speaker 1: her off the trail. As we mentioned earlier, Trenny was
21:15
Speaker 1: walking with Robert Simpson before turning around, and the two
21:18
Speaker 1: of them had been known to hang out outside of school,
21:21
Speaker 1: and when she disappeared, she was wearing his brown jacket.
21:24
Speaker 1: And when he was questioned about her disappearance, he said
21:26
Speaker 1: that after she left, he himself had gone off trail
21:30
Speaker 1: tracking a bear. Okay, I just don't believe anybody at
21:32
Speaker 1: this point. Furthermore, after she disappeared, Trini's hairbrush would be
21:36
Speaker 1: found in his car. And after other students' testimonies, it
21:40
Speaker 1: was found that it would be extremely unlikely for her
21:42
Speaker 1: to leave her hairbrush behind because she always had it
21:45
Speaker 1: in her pocket. Which like, You could say that they
21:48
Speaker 1: hung out and stuff and that she would just leave
21:50
Speaker 1: her stuff in his car. I feel like that's just very,
21:53
Speaker 1: you know, coincidental. It's not like that big of a thing,
21:56
Speaker 1: but you know, still suspicious, all right? Still suspicious. But
22:00
Speaker 1: in addition to all that, there were two recorded instances
22:04
Speaker 1: of Robert saying pretty heinous things to Trenny's sister, quote unquote.
22:08
Speaker 1: If Calvin Bowman has Trenny, he will kill her. If
22:11
Speaker 1: he doesn't have her, I think she might have run
22:14
Speaker 1: off with some horny hitchhiker. Like, who the f *
22:17
Speaker 1: * * says that about their good friend that just
22:19
Speaker 1: went missing and can't be found? Like, that's so f
22:23
Speaker 1: * * * ed up. There's too many theories in
22:24
Speaker 1: my head. Let's go on to other ones. So the
22:26
Speaker 1: final theory is where Dennis and Trenny's stories potentially match up.
22:31
Speaker 1: Both stories obviously involved something going wrong in the woods
22:34
Speaker 1: that is heavily suspected to be kidnappings. Dennis was hiding
22:38
Speaker 1: in the woods and disappeared later in an area just
22:41
Speaker 1: below where he was last seen. a man spots another
22:44
Speaker 1: man with something over his shoulder running along the ridgeline.
22:47
Speaker 1: And Trenny was last seen bending over looking at something
22:50
Speaker 1: in the woods and then strangely went off trail. And
22:53
Speaker 1: while searching for Trenny, the dogs would pick up her
22:55
Speaker 1: scent in areas miles apart and only accessible through trails
23:00
Speaker 1: or dense, dense forests. Both children had also obviously never
23:04
Speaker 1: been found. The closest thing to being found was a
23:07
Speaker 1: footprint in the Double Springs shelter. But other than that, nothing.
23:11
Speaker 1: Both involved the FBI and the NPS, claiming that foul
23:15
Speaker 1: play was not a factor. Yet both agencies stuck around
23:19
Speaker 1: to continue a private investigation. Furthermore, two divisions of the
23:23
Speaker 1: US Special Forces were involved in the search. And we
23:27
Speaker 1: know that the Green Berets were armed during the search
23:29
Speaker 1: as well, but it is unknown if the Marines had firearms. Finally,
23:32
Speaker 1: both disappearances occurred within a very short period of time
23:36
Speaker 1: within each other and were in very close proximity to
23:39
Speaker 1: each other as well. And in the search log, searchers
23:41
Speaker 1: wrote that they were searching Cades Cove, which, if you recall,
23:45
Speaker 1: is the exact area where Harold Key saw the man
23:49
Speaker 1: in the bushes shortly after seeing the man running on
23:52
Speaker 1: the ridge. So looking at the evidence presented in each case,
23:55
Speaker 1: it looks like the disappearances could have been caused by
23:58
Speaker 1: the same thing. Many people have theorized that both disappearances
24:01
Speaker 1: are because of Bigfoot or wild men. Despite Dwight McCarter
24:05
Speaker 1: stating that it wasn't likely a wild man that took Dennis,
24:08
Speaker 1: all evidence points to someone being in the woods and
24:11
Speaker 1: running off with him. And same for Trenny. There was
24:13
Speaker 1: no way a 16 year old girl who had just
24:16
Speaker 1: been bust in, knew her way around the woods enough
24:20
Speaker 1: to follow the path that she did. It had to
24:22
Speaker 1: be something or someone that led her or carried her
24:26
Speaker 1: through the woods, which is terrifying to think about. It
24:28
Speaker 1: would also explain why Trenny was lured into the woods,
24:32
Speaker 1: while special forces were called and armed in both cases,
24:36
Speaker 1: and why the FBI and NPS both did private investigations
24:40
Speaker 1: withholding and changing information released to the public. It's because
24:44
Speaker 1: there is something in the woods at Great Smoky National Park.
24:48
Speaker 1: And whether it is a man or a beast, it
24:51
Speaker 1: has a propensity for stealing children. And while the idea
24:54
Speaker 1: of Bigfoot is crazy, many believe that the Smoky Mountains
24:58
Speaker 1: are home to the creature. Even David Politis himself is
25:02
Speaker 1: a big believer and plans to appear at numerous Bigfoot
25:05
Speaker 1: conferences and talks. But it is tough to say what
25:08
Speaker 1: happened to both victims. But one thing is for sure,
25:12
Speaker 1: there was some shady shit occurring in the woods and
25:15
Speaker 1: in this investigation. But alas, my heart goes out to
25:18
Speaker 1: the families involved in this. And I hope that one
25:22
Speaker 1: day these kids can be found because it's absolutely heartbreaking
25:26
Speaker 1: and the conspiracies around it are also heartbreaking to hear about.
25:29
Speaker 1: But until then, be safe and be vigilant. And that
25:32
Speaker 1: brings us to our next stories. So as we know,
25:35
Speaker 1: David Politist investigates many cases of missing persons from seemingly
25:40
Speaker 1: all areas of American history. and he takes a particular
25:43
Speaker 1: interest in those that offer no clear answers. Like many,
25:46
Speaker 1: he entertains the idea that perhaps there are answers beyond
25:49
Speaker 1: the scope of what science as we know it can explain.
25:53
Speaker 1: He explains why some people go missing and are never found,
25:56
Speaker 1: and some of the very strange ways that people are recovered,
25:58
Speaker 1: whether before or after they succumb to the elements, or
26:02
Speaker 1: the unknown. Some of these fascinating cases involve people who
26:05
Speaker 1: have gone missing and are found after their location is
26:09
Speaker 1: revealed to a family member in a dream. This concept
26:13
Speaker 1: is bizarre, I know, but how far-fetched is it really?
26:16
Speaker 1: Because I know I've had some dreams that were kind
26:18
Speaker 1: of like premonition-y and I've scared myself, so who knows? But!
26:22
Speaker 1: Without further ado, we are going to look into some
26:25
Speaker 1: of these cases that David Politis has detailed, and we
26:28
Speaker 1: can come to our own conclusions. First up, we have
26:31
Speaker 1: Gustav Dill. Nestled quietly along the banks of Susquehanna River, Duncannon, Pennsylvania,
26:42
Speaker 1: is a small town where time seems to flow a
26:44
Speaker 1: little slower. The kind of place where the air is
26:47
Speaker 1: thick with the scent of pine from the surrounding forests.
26:49
Speaker 1: And in the early 20th century, Duncannon was little more
26:52
Speaker 1: than just a dot on the map. Though its community
26:55
Speaker 1: was living and breathing apart from the rapidly industrialized world outside,
26:59
Speaker 1: every face here was familiar. and the steady pace of
27:02
Speaker 1: the river and the railroad marked the rhythms of daily life.
27:06
Speaker 1: With under 1500 people as of the 2020 census, this
27:10
Speaker 1: sleepy little town still feels like it's suspended in time.
27:13
Speaker 1: It's still surrounded by the wilds. With state parks nearby
27:17
Speaker 1: and game lands for hunting, to the northwest and south,
27:21
Speaker 1: and the river to the east. Residents even have access
27:23
Speaker 1: to the Appalachian Trail nearby. One can only imagine what
27:26
Speaker 1: it must have been like to live in this region
27:28
Speaker 1: in the early 1900s, before four-lane highways cut their way
27:32
Speaker 1: through the terrain like long, ugly scars. In this very place,
27:36
Speaker 1: on a November day in 1916, Gustav Dill, a man
27:41
Speaker 1: of modest means but strong character, went out on the
27:44
Speaker 1: river for the last time. He and his buddies went
27:46
Speaker 1: on a hunting trip with the goal of crossing the Susquehanna.
27:49
Speaker 1: Sorry if I'm saying that wrong. But plans would go
27:51
Speaker 1: awry when the boat flipped, and its occupants would be
27:54
Speaker 1: tossed into the river. Gustav would be pulled beneath the water,
27:58
Speaker 1: and unfortunately, Gustav did not know how to swim. and
28:01
Speaker 1: his friends would not be able to save him. Despite
28:03
Speaker 1: the best efforts of rivermen dragging the river for days
28:07
Speaker 1: with grappling hooks in hopes of recovering Gustav, there was
28:10
Speaker 1: unfortunately no luck. And the week or so after efforts
28:13
Speaker 1: had concluded and the hopes of finding Gustav had waned,
28:16
Speaker 1: his wife, would have a dream in which every detail
28:19
Speaker 1: of his location was revealed and even witness his funeral.
28:23
Speaker 1: So she would implore people to help her pick up
28:25
Speaker 1: the search again, but to no avail. It was only
28:27
Speaker 1: when a couple of old rivermen who took pity on her,
28:30
Speaker 1: skeptical of her claims to say the least, agreed to
28:33
Speaker 1: take up the search again 10 days after the boat accident.
28:36
Speaker 1: And within five minutes of casting their grappling hooks into
28:40
Speaker 1: the river for the first time, where Gustav's wife indicated,
28:43
Speaker 1: Gustav's body was found. And this story seems like the
28:47
Speaker 1: kind of tale that would make national news or at
28:49
Speaker 1: the very least the front page, right? A woman had
28:52
Speaker 1: a vision of where her husband's body could be found
28:55
Speaker 1: after his boat overturned. Like what? That seems like a
28:58
Speaker 1: really big deal. But the only reference we could find
29:03
Speaker 1: of this was a small block from the third page
29:06
Speaker 1: of a newspaper The Atlanta Georgian. And it says this.
29:10
Speaker 1: A dream of his widow led to the finding of
29:12
Speaker 1: the body of Gustav Dill, a Duncannon who was drowned
29:15
Speaker 1: in the Susquehanna River there when his boat was overturned.
29:18
Speaker 1: Experienced rivermen had dragged the stream missing, so they believed
29:21
Speaker 1: no current or eddy in which the body might have
29:24
Speaker 1: been lodged. Efforts were discontinued ten days ago. Several nights ago,
29:27
Speaker 1: in a dream, Mrs. Dill saw every circumstance of the
29:30
Speaker 1: finding of the body and later the funeral of the
29:32
Speaker 1: drowned man. She was unable at first to prevail upon
29:35
Speaker 1: any person to search for the body. Finally, two old rivermen,
29:38
Speaker 1: incredulous but full of pity, agreed to take upon the
29:43
Speaker 1: search again. Within five minutes after the man had thrown
29:45
Speaker 1: in the grappling irons, the body was hooked and brought
29:48
Speaker 1: to the surface at the place indicated by Mrs. Dill.
29:51
Speaker 1: No interview, no nothing, like this woman, literally a miracle
29:55
Speaker 1: happened and that's it? That's it? Anyway, I think that's
29:59
Speaker 1: amazing and very interesting. And this happens more than you think.
30:03
Speaker 1: Let's get into the next one. Alice Mae Mathers. Another
30:06
Speaker 1: city would also have the quiet serenity of its streets
30:09
Speaker 1: disturbed in 1963 when 12-year-old girl by the name of
30:13
Speaker 1: Alice Mae Mathers went missing. Mission is a city that
30:16
Speaker 1: is carved out of a place amidst the forests and
30:19
Speaker 1: the forest cover mountains in British Columbia. Also, I can
30:23
Speaker 1: say this now because I live in Texas. That's where
30:25
Speaker 1: I lived. That's where I lived. I lived in Abbotsford,
30:27
Speaker 1: but I actually just, I was living in Mission and
30:29
Speaker 1: I love it. I literally lived in the woods and
30:31
Speaker 1: it was awesome. And I miss it, but I love,
30:34
Speaker 1: I love Texas as well.
30:36
Speaker 3: It's great.
30:36
Speaker 1: Anyway, it falls southeast of Vancouver and north of the
30:40
Speaker 1: Fraser River and neighbors the Golden Ears Mountain, which I've
30:43
Speaker 1: climbed on many occasions. Alice May Mathers was a 12-year-old
30:46
Speaker 1: girl who lived with her family on the outskirts of Mission,
30:49
Speaker 1: British Columbia, Canada. And on June 9th, 1963, she disappeared
30:53
Speaker 1: under circumstances that would later reveal a chilling crime. Alice
30:57
Speaker 1: had spent the day visiting her married sister, who lived
30:59
Speaker 1: about a mile from the Mathers' home. That day, she
31:02
Speaker 1: borrowed an electric mixer from her sister and planned to
31:04
Speaker 1: use it for baking when she returned home. However, Alice
31:07
Speaker 1: never made it back. When she didn't arrive home as expected,
31:10
Speaker 1: her father traced her steps back, but... found no sign
31:13
Speaker 1: of her. The Mathers family and friends and neighbors began
31:16
Speaker 1: searching for her immediately and soon after the RCMP or
31:20
Speaker 1: Royal Canadian Mounted Police and there would also be an
31:23
Speaker 1: additional hundred volunteers helping to search for Alice. And the
31:26
Speaker 1: primary search area would be the dense woods surrounding the
31:30
Speaker 1: Mathers property and obviously the route that Alice would have
31:32
Speaker 1: taken to get home. And early in the search, dogs
31:35
Speaker 1: would be brought in to pick up Alice's scent. And
31:37
Speaker 1: the dogs would trace her trail from her sister's house
31:40
Speaker 1: to the nearby Lougheed Highway, where the smell would abruptly end.
31:44
Speaker 1: And this discovery raised the possibility that Alice could have
31:48
Speaker 1: been abducted. And the Mathers family would grow increasingly desperate
31:52
Speaker 1: as the days passed. with no sign of Alice. And
31:55
Speaker 1: two weeks after Alice's disappearance on June 23rd, 1963, her
32:00
Speaker 1: mother would have a vivid dream. In this dream, she
32:03
Speaker 1: saw Alice lying in a gully or a pit, lifeless
32:07
Speaker 1: on a rock. The dream was so absolute and unsettling
32:11
Speaker 1: that she shared it with her husband the following day.
32:13
Speaker 1: And unable to shake the image, Mrs. Mathers insisted that
32:17
Speaker 1: they search this place. So the Mathers sought help from
32:19
Speaker 1: a friend who was very familiar with this area.
32:22
Speaker 3: Mrs.
32:23
Speaker 1: Mathers would describe the area from her dream, and together
32:26
Speaker 1: they would travel to a gravel pit about 14 miles
32:29
Speaker 1: from their home. And they would begin searching opposite sides.
32:32
Speaker 1: And it wasn't long before one of them found a
32:34
Speaker 1: small figure lying on a rock, just as Mrs. Mathers
32:38
Speaker 1: had described. The figure was... severely beaten and unrecognizable. But
32:43
Speaker 1: the clothing and pair of new shoes was identified as Alice's.
32:47
Speaker 1: And this was no accident and there was no mystery here.
32:50
Speaker 1: Alice was murdered. And an inquiry into another case that
32:54
Speaker 1: tied in with the Mathers case turned up two suspects,
32:57
Speaker 1: a pair of brothers, 30-year-old Kenneth Lloyd Meeker and 35-year-old
33:02
Speaker 1: James Leonard Meeker. They'd kidnapped her along her walk home,
33:06
Speaker 1: grabbing her from... Lougheed Highway. And fibers recovered from under
33:10
Speaker 1: Alice's fingernails matched those in a jacket and trousers recovered
33:15
Speaker 1: from the home of Kenneth. And hair on Alice's body
33:18
Speaker 1: was also similar to that recovered from a blanket at
33:21
Speaker 1: the house. And neither brother spoke, asked if they had
33:24
Speaker 1: anything to say for themselves, because they're pieces of shit,
33:27
Speaker 1: but both would be charged with capital murder. Though Kenneth
33:30
Speaker 1: was the one who had done all the killing. In
33:32
Speaker 1: a document containing the names of those sentenced to death
33:35
Speaker 1: in Canada between 1867 in 1976, Kenneth's name appears on
33:40
Speaker 1: page 217, though the result of his trial was life imprisonment.
33:45
Speaker 1: These deaths are undoubtedly horrifically tragic, but there is an
33:49
Speaker 1: air of mystery around them. What happened to Gustav wasn't
33:52
Speaker 1: a mystery. People saw what happened. And what happened to
33:55
Speaker 1: Alice had been a mystery, but the mystery was solved.
33:58
Speaker 1: The mystery is how both of these people had women
34:00
Speaker 1: in their lives that had dreams, that revealed where their
34:04
Speaker 1: bodies were. Gustav's wife and Alice's mother. Like, how does
34:09
Speaker 1: that happen? Is it just a wild coincidence or is
34:13
Speaker 1: it supernatural? We'll never really know. But subconscious perception could
34:17
Speaker 1: be the answer. Both women may have subconsciously absorbed information
34:21
Speaker 1: from their surroundings or conversations that they consciously processed. The
34:25
Speaker 1: human brain is constantly taking in vast amount of sensory data,
34:30
Speaker 1: much of which we don't actively notice. It's possible that
34:33
Speaker 1: during their waking hours, they observed subtle clues such as landscape,
34:38
Speaker 1: weather patterns, or even patterns in the search efforts that
34:42
Speaker 1: their conscious minds just overlooked. And in their dreams, these
34:45
Speaker 1: pieces of information could have been synthesized into a coherent
34:49
Speaker 1: message or image, which then manifested into a dream, which
34:52
Speaker 1: guided them to the bodies. And many people boast about
34:55
Speaker 1: the power of the subconscious mind and its ability to
34:58
Speaker 1: translate input from all senses and multitask when the conscious
35:03
Speaker 1: mind is focusing on one thing at a time. And
35:05
Speaker 1: one other interesting potential answer is a scientific concept that, well,
35:11
Speaker 1: kind of crazy, has become an accepted fact. Quantum entanglement.
35:15
Speaker 1: Quantum entanglement is a newer idea. Definitely to me. I've
35:19
Speaker 1: not heard of it. much just looking into it like
35:22
Speaker 1: for this case with examples being yin and yang or
35:26
Speaker 1: protons and electrons. Essentially when two things are subject to
35:30
Speaker 1: quantum entanglement when you do something to one it affects
35:33
Speaker 1: the other. As said before this happens with protons and
35:36
Speaker 1: electrons and the idea of yin and yang is also
35:39
Speaker 1: similar to this. In fact when the wave functions of
35:42
Speaker 1: entangled photons was visualized it appears very reminiscent of yin
35:46
Speaker 1: and yang. So can people be linked in such a way?
35:49
Speaker 1: Who knows? I'm not a scientist, nor do I pretend
35:52
Speaker 1: to be, okay? I got A's in science in high
35:54
Speaker 1: school and whatnot, but that doesn't, that does not make
35:57
Speaker 1: me a quantum entanglement professor of sorts. But it does
36:01
Speaker 1: feel almost like when they say two twins are physically
36:04
Speaker 1: linked and when one is hurt, the other feels it,
36:07
Speaker 1: you know? It makes me think a lot, you know?
36:09
Speaker 1: I think a lot, go outside of myself and everything.
36:11
Speaker 1: It's very interesting, but I think it's really awesome that
36:14
Speaker 1: these women were able to find their loved ones and
36:17
Speaker 1: kind of have that closure that the other cases didn't.
36:21
Speaker 1: Which brings us to our next case, the Oz Effect.
36:27
Speaker 1: So on March 14th, 2014, a man by the name
36:31
Speaker 1: of Dr. James McGrogan would disappear outside Vail, Colorado on
36:36
Speaker 1: a hiking trip. He and three other of his friends
36:39
Speaker 1: went on this hike. And after some strange things happened,
36:42
Speaker 1: he disappeared. Dr. James McGrogan was a man in Excellent shape.
36:47
Speaker 1: He was a 39-year-old physician and someone very familiar with
36:50
Speaker 1: the outdoors and hiking. With his three friends, as I said,
36:53
Speaker 1: he decided to go on a hiking trip and do
36:55
Speaker 1: some skiing. They gathered some supplies at a store nearby,
36:58
Speaker 1: and they would also rent equipment at a place called
37:01
Speaker 1: Confluence Kayaks, where they took gear and began their long
37:04
Speaker 1: hike into the Holy Cross wilderness. The route started from
37:07
Speaker 1: the town of Vail to the Iceman Hut, the path
37:10
Speaker 1: being about six to eight miles long. However, the elevation
37:14
Speaker 1: of this hut was around 11,000 feet due to it
37:17
Speaker 1: being up a mountain, which is a lot, okay? I
37:20
Speaker 1: come from the mountainous Rocky Mountains up in BC, all right?
37:23
Speaker 1: I know, elevation, all right? That's really high. And it's
37:26
Speaker 1: a popular area for hikers nearby since it's very scenic
37:30
Speaker 1: and nature-oriented. And in the right weather, it's perfect for skiing,
37:33
Speaker 1: which was the point of the group's hike. and they
37:35
Speaker 1: carried supplies such as a split snowboard, a blanket, a GPS,
37:40
Speaker 1: a cell phone with an extra battery, a shovel, and
37:43
Speaker 1: medical supplies with some additional gear as well just to
37:46
Speaker 1: ensure that everything went smoothly on the hike and that
37:48
Speaker 1: they were prepared for anything that might happen. So during
37:51
Speaker 1: the hike at around 10 a.m the group decided to
37:54
Speaker 1: take a rest at one of the stops due to
37:55
Speaker 1: their lack of experience compared to McGrogan. McGrogan would state
37:59
Speaker 1: that he still had energy and told the group he
38:02
Speaker 1: would meet them at the next rest stop. To which
38:04
Speaker 1: the group agreed, because he was experienced and he knew
38:07
Speaker 1: what he was doing. So there was no worries of
38:09
Speaker 1: him really needing help. So after the group rested, they
38:12
Speaker 1: got all their gear packed up and they began to
38:14
Speaker 1: make their way to the next rest stop to meet him.
38:16
Speaker 1: As soon as they got there, they would realize that
38:18
Speaker 1: McGrogan was not there. Confused, they thought that he may
38:22
Speaker 1: have gone further just being impatient waiting for the group.
38:25
Speaker 1: So they continued yet again. And after hours passed and
38:28
Speaker 1: around 5.30 PM, after searching all day, they realized something
38:33
Speaker 1: was very wrong. So one member of the group decided
38:36
Speaker 1: to hike all the way back down to notify the
38:38
Speaker 1: Eagle County Sheriff's office. Which then, in turn, led to
38:41
Speaker 1: a five-day search trying to find McGrogan. And what confused
38:46
Speaker 1: the searching party and his friends was that McGrogan was
38:49
Speaker 1: extremely experienced. How could he have just disappeared out of nowhere? Sure,
38:53
Speaker 1: there was snow on the ground, but it was packed.
38:56
Speaker 1: But it was packed so firmly that it was impossible
38:59
Speaker 1: to lose sight of where you needed to go. Especially
39:01
Speaker 1: for a skilled hiker and skier. And no phone calls
39:04
Speaker 1: were exchanged, according to David Politis. But according to a
39:08
Speaker 1: Facebook post that we found, it says, But these are
39:17
Speaker 1: conflicting reports, so I will leave it to the expert,
39:19
Speaker 1: David Politis. So a search team and three helicopters were
39:23
Speaker 1: sent over the 1800 square mile area to try to
39:26
Speaker 1: find James McGrogan. But still, there was no evidence as
39:29
Speaker 1: to where he had gone. Strangely enough, footprints should have
39:32
Speaker 1: led the search to find him. Only like light flurries
39:36
Speaker 1: were falling from the sky and there was absolutely no
39:38
Speaker 1: way the tracks could have disappeared entirely. But after five
39:40
Speaker 1: days of searching, he was nowhere to be found. So unfortunately,
39:44
Speaker 1: they would call off the search. But during the search,
39:46
Speaker 1: there were reports of eerie silences in the area, tied
39:50
Speaker 1: to the phenomenon that they called the Oz Effect, which
39:54
Speaker 1: involves a complete silence in an area, like almost unnatural.
39:58
Speaker 1: No signs of wildlife, no signs of moving brush or trees,
40:03
Speaker 1: just complete silence, which is horrible. horrifying. And this feeling
40:07
Speaker 1: can also bring on a sense of being watched or
40:11
Speaker 1: a detachment from reality. And researchers claimed that the silence
40:14
Speaker 1: was extremely eerie. The supernatural silence gives the body the
40:18
Speaker 1: feeling that something is very wrong. But after 20 days
40:22
Speaker 1: after his disappearance, his body would be found four and
40:26
Speaker 1: a half miles away through two gullies over a 12,000
40:30
Speaker 1: foot mountain in an area where they completely didn't expect
40:35
Speaker 1: to find him. And he would be found by three
40:37
Speaker 1: hikers at 9,950 feet in elevation in Boot Falls, where
40:43
Speaker 1: search and rescue would later recover his body. It was
40:46
Speaker 1: on an ice sheet, so the surrounding area would be
40:48
Speaker 1: completely frozen compared to its flowing water in the image here.
40:52
Speaker 4: We're at Boot Creek Falls, 9,950 feet in elevation. That's
40:56
Speaker 4: Booth Creek behind me, and this is the location where
40:59
Speaker 4: in April, 20 days after his disappearance, Dr. McGrogan was
41:02
Speaker 4: found on an ice sheet. And that's what it would
41:06
Speaker 4: have been. This would have been solid ice back in April.
41:09
Speaker 4: He was found wearing black leggings, a shirt, an undershirt,
41:14
Speaker 4: gray socks, no coat, no gloves, and no boots.
41:17
Speaker 1: And the jacket, along with the GPS, was found unused
41:21
Speaker 1: and packed away in his backpack for some odd reason. However, again,
41:26
Speaker 1: the phone was not used. And conflicting reports state that
41:29
Speaker 1: he would have had service around this location as well.
41:32
Speaker 1: But we can really never know. But according to David Politis,
41:35
Speaker 1: there were two bars of reception from the location where
41:38
Speaker 1: he died.
41:39
Speaker 4: The interesting part behind the phone is that the phone
41:41
Speaker 4: had a backup battery, and when the coroner took the phone,
41:46
Speaker 4: he turned it on and it worked. Now, where we're
41:50
Speaker 4: at right now, I have two bars in active service
41:54
Speaker 4: on my phone. And if you look at the mountain
41:56
Speaker 4: over here to my right, you'll notice that it's huge.
42:00
Speaker 4: It only makes sense that the further you went up
42:03
Speaker 4: and did that mountain, you would still have phone service
42:05
Speaker 4: like I do now.
42:06
Speaker 1: And they also found his snowboard where it was later returned.
42:10
Speaker 1: He was also wearing a helmet and underneath the helmet,
42:13
Speaker 1: they had noticed he had severe head injuries and trauma
42:17
Speaker 1: to the left side of his chest and a broken femur.
42:20
Speaker 1: And what makes it strange is the complete disappearance of
42:24
Speaker 1: his boots. And we have seen this before in many
42:26
Speaker 1: 411 disappearance cases, and especially in the Dyatlov Pass case,
42:31
Speaker 1: where for some reason shoes and boots were removed during
42:33
Speaker 1: these times, which I believe is due to hypothermia, because
42:37
Speaker 1: it is very, very common for people experiencing hypothermia to
42:41
Speaker 1: get very, very hot and take off their clothes. So
42:44
Speaker 1: that could be a factor. And it would kind of
42:46
Speaker 1: make sense because his coat wasn't found on him either.
42:49
Speaker 1: So he had been almost like shedding layers. So that
42:52
Speaker 1: could be a possibility. So not only did he have
42:54
Speaker 1: a GPS and a phone and the path wasn't too
42:57
Speaker 1: confusing to get off of, especially for an experienced skier
43:01
Speaker 1: and hiker, how did James McGrogan get lost and die
43:04
Speaker 1: in such a tragic way? It's essentially completely unexplainable. David
43:08
Speaker 1: Politis went back to Confluence Kayaks, the place where all
43:12
Speaker 1: the stuff was rented, and would ask Brian some questions.
43:15
Speaker 1: He was the one that was there when James rented
43:17
Speaker 1: the equipment and the specific supplies. A split board, skins
43:21
Speaker 1: for it, a probe, a beacon, a shovel, and a helmet.
43:25
Speaker 1: Only the probe and the helmet were never returned. And
43:28
Speaker 1: he never questioned why the helmet wasn't returned, due to
43:30
Speaker 1: the understanding that anyone that dies with equipment that they
43:33
Speaker 1: wear and is lost in the wilderness for 30 days
43:36
Speaker 1: made sense. However, he was kind of unbothered by the probes.
43:39
Speaker 1: And when asking Brian what would ever cause someone to
43:42
Speaker 1: take that specific route that James McGrogan took, he says
43:45
Speaker 1: it's basically unexplainable. That route was not normal, and it
43:49
Speaker 1: was an extremely difficult route, even for training, let alone fun.
43:53
Speaker 1: And the exact journey isn't factual, but they allege that
43:57
Speaker 1: it went something like this. He would have had to
43:59
Speaker 1: climb up 1296 feet to then a thousand feet down
44:04
Speaker 1: towards the creek, then up another 1100 feet again to
44:09
Speaker 1: get to the peak of Bald Mountain, which is about 12,000 feet.
44:13
Speaker 1: That's a lot. Then he descended to a lower summit
44:17
Speaker 1: and then another 1,130 feet down again. The end of
44:21
Speaker 1: his journey where his body was found was another far
44:24
Speaker 1: drop leading to his resting place. And what doesn't make
44:27
Speaker 1: sense is through this entire journey, it's estimated he never
44:31
Speaker 1: used the skis for going down the mountain since they
44:34
Speaker 1: were found attached to his pack when his corpse was found.
44:37
Speaker 1: And that's around a four and a half mile long
44:40
Speaker 1: trip just going in a straight line. So it would
44:43
Speaker 1: actually be 12 to 16 miles long due to the
44:47
Speaker 1: zigzag down up steep cliffs and whatnot. And all of
44:51
Speaker 1: this is what James McGrogan allegedly traveled all on his
44:55
Speaker 1: own with loose snow that could have been an avalanche.
44:58
Speaker 1: So completely unsafe, basically. So why would an experienced hiker
45:02
Speaker 1: put himself through this. So it's really unfortunate because it's
45:06
Speaker 1: so unexplainable and the phenomenon of the Oz effect and
45:10
Speaker 1: its eerie undertones really make that place seem haunted or
45:13
Speaker 1: paranormal possibly. There's really no explanation. Did James see something
45:18
Speaker 1: that caused him to walk off the path or was
45:21
Speaker 1: he dealing with something behind the scenes that people didn't
45:23
Speaker 1: know about or was he really not in his right
45:26
Speaker 1: mind and something caused him to act so strangely that
45:29
Speaker 1: still to this day can't be explained? I don't know.
45:32
Speaker 1: All I know is that it is a truly depressing,
45:35
Speaker 1: horrible tale in what was meant to be a very
45:38
Speaker 1: fun boys trip ended in death. And in the last
45:42
Speaker 1: case of our crazy conspiratorial disappearances, we have Tom Messick.
45:49
Speaker 1: On November 15th, 2015, an 82 year old man went
45:53
Speaker 1: missing while on a hunting trip with his friends near
45:56
Speaker 1: Lily Pond located in the Adirondack Mountains in New York
46:00
Speaker 1: at around 10 a.m. in the morning. He was a
46:02
Speaker 1: very experienced hunter and outdoorsman, and he had extensive experience
46:06
Speaker 1: with rifles due to his background as an ex-paratrooper for
46:09
Speaker 1: the 82nd Airborne Division and the hunter safety classes he taught.
46:14
Speaker 1: He was known to be reliable and independent, so there
46:16
Speaker 1: was no question that he knew exactly what he was doing. However,
46:19
Speaker 1: at 82 years of age, an accident that left him
46:22
Speaker 1: blind in one eye when he was in his 20s
46:25
Speaker 1: was catching up to him. So the group he was
46:27
Speaker 1: with had walkie-talkies, but this was the first time they
46:30
Speaker 1: had hunted in this particular area before, so they made
46:32
Speaker 1: sure to stay close and keep in contact. However, a
46:35
Speaker 1: plan in scaring the deers towards each other was made
46:38
Speaker 1: to draw the wildlife into the area that they were in.
46:41
Speaker 1: But before separating, they agreed to meet up at the
46:43
Speaker 1: rendezvous point at around 2 p.m. So after the group separated,
46:47
Speaker 1: they began the hunt. And what was strange about this
46:50
Speaker 1: hunting trip so far is that they hadn't seen any
46:53
Speaker 1: deer where they were, let alone any wildlife at all.
46:57
Speaker 1: Red flags! Red flags. And after a while, while searching
47:00
Speaker 1: and realizing that there was no wildlife in the area,
47:03
Speaker 1: they decided to head towards the agreed upon meetup point.
47:07
Speaker 1: And Tom never initiated or responded on his radio. So
47:11
Speaker 1: the group became a bit worried at that point. A
47:13
Speaker 1: few of the members would stay behind, while the rest
47:16
Speaker 1: would go ahead and search for Tom, eventually going to
47:18
Speaker 1: the position that he was meant to be at. However,
47:20
Speaker 1: when the group arrived, Tom was nowhere to be seen.
47:23
Speaker 1: There was no clue or sign, nothing left behind, and
47:27
Speaker 1: all his gear was nowhere to be seen. The group
47:29
Speaker 1: was getting extremely worried at this point, given that there
47:32
Speaker 1: was no signs of an attack or any clue to
47:35
Speaker 1: lead the group to Tom's supposed disappearance. One member of
47:38
Speaker 1: the group would drive to find help while the rest
47:40
Speaker 1: of the group tried everything in their power to get
47:42
Speaker 1: Tom's attention. From shooting in the sky to screaming for him.
47:46
Speaker 1: And the search would continue for about four hours before
47:48
Speaker 1: the sun had finally gone down. Realizing that they needed
47:51
Speaker 1: to change their strategy since what they were doing wasn't working.
47:54
Speaker 1: So they headed towards their vehicles and began to drive
47:57
Speaker 1: along the roads with their high beams on honking their horns.
48:00
Speaker 1: And eventually rescue teams would also search for Tom and
48:04
Speaker 1: 13 professionals from park services were all looking for him
48:07
Speaker 1: as well. And over the next several weeks, 300 professionals
48:11
Speaker 1: and volunteers continued to search for Tom, even using dogs
48:14
Speaker 1: and separate helicopters to try to locate the missing vet.
48:18
Speaker 1: So 15 different agencies were looking for Tom at this point.
48:21
Speaker 1: forest rangers, police canine units, DAC police officers, the FBI
48:26
Speaker 1: quick response team, tactical teams, and search and rescue teams,
48:30
Speaker 1: and of course, the help of volunteers from different backgrounds,
48:33
Speaker 1: all for Tom. And they checked everywhere from the roads
48:37
Speaker 1: to the swamps and no stone was left unturned, supposedly.
48:41
Speaker 1: And the search teams would also notice the lack of
48:43
Speaker 1: wildlife in the area, which left an eerie aura throughout
48:48
Speaker 1: the coming weeks, similar to the case that we just
48:50
Speaker 1: talked about with like the Oz effect. And the search
48:53
Speaker 1: would be extremely difficult, not only because of the weather
48:56
Speaker 1: conditions and where it was, but also because... Tom was
49:00
Speaker 1: wearing camouflage, which is why the search dogs were so
49:03
Speaker 1: important in this case. Also, the area of the search
49:06
Speaker 1: was huge. The search area being around 3,000 acres or
49:10
Speaker 1: about 4.7 square miles big. Some people believe that Tom
49:14
Speaker 1: could have gotten lost or hurt over the rough terrain,
49:18
Speaker 1: such as the swamps and the hills. But Tom's family
49:20
Speaker 1: stated that he knew what he was capable of at
49:23
Speaker 1: his age and wouldn't put himself through any danger of
49:26
Speaker 1: any sort. danger, his common sense would have caused him
49:31
Speaker 1: to contact his friends via the radio, but yet he didn't.
49:34
Speaker 1: And multiple theories have sprouted up after his disappearance, questioning
49:39
Speaker 1: what had really happened to Tom Messick. According to a
49:41
Speaker 1: family member that was also on the hunting trip, the
49:44
Speaker 1: only sound that he heard was very strange, and he
49:48
Speaker 1: said it was definitely not normal. Like, almost like a
49:52
Speaker 1: trap door slamming closed, or some sort of door cracking noise,
49:56
Speaker 1: which is also terrifying to hear in a forest.
50:00
Speaker 3: What?
50:01
Speaker 1: And he stated that it wasn't an animal or any
50:03
Speaker 1: type of vehicle noise, but a door noise, specifically. It
50:07
Speaker 1: would obviously be brushed off by the cops, because, you know, cops.
50:11
Speaker 1: Just kidding. My brother's a cop. He's awesome. And what
50:14
Speaker 1: makes it more concerning, though, is our friendly neighborhood FBI
50:18
Speaker 1: was involved in the case. Because very rarely does the
50:21
Speaker 1: FBI investigate in a missing person search. The only time
50:25
Speaker 1: when they do is when they believe that foul play
50:27
Speaker 1: is involved. Yet, They were there. And Tom's wife, Beverly said,
50:32
Speaker 1: the FBI told me something isn't right with his case,
50:35
Speaker 1: but they don't know what. They won't share any theories
50:38
Speaker 1: if they have them. The FBI said until they make
50:41
Speaker 1: a discovery, they're never going to know. And even Sheriff Lamore,
50:44
Speaker 1: who was questioned by David Politis, talked about these FBI
50:48
Speaker 1: agents coming in, stating he was very unsure as to
50:51
Speaker 1: why they were there as well. So Tom was declared
50:54
Speaker 1: officially missing and is still to this day declared missing.
50:57
Speaker 1: And in 2023, an article was posted about Tom, stating
51:01
Speaker 1: that the eight years later, the search for Tom Messick
51:04
Speaker 1: continues on, hoping to find their father and friend. But
51:08
Speaker 1: to this day, no one knows what happened to him.
51:10
Speaker 1: Nothing at all has been found on Tom, his gun,
51:13
Speaker 1: his jacket, or any evidence of foul play or animal involvement.
51:17
Speaker 1: So what could it have been? He couldn't have gotten
51:20
Speaker 1: that far from his original position with his old age.
51:23
Speaker 1: Could the FBI know something we don't? probably, if I
51:26
Speaker 1: go missing, it's the FBI.
51:28
Speaker 3: Okay.
51:29
Speaker 1: Am I allowed to say that? No, I did. Because
51:31
Speaker 1: why else would they have gotten involved? And how could
51:33
Speaker 1: a man in his 80s just completely disappear and not
51:37
Speaker 1: a single piece of evidence be found? Why is there
51:40
Speaker 1: such an eerie lack of wildlife in this area as well?
51:44
Speaker 1: Similar to the James McGrogan case? Or is it possible
51:47
Speaker 1: that foul play was involved? But this is truly one
51:49
Speaker 1: of the strangest, missing, 411 cases because there was truly
51:53
Speaker 1: no logical explanation to give it. All I know is
51:56
Speaker 1: that it is just another very unfortunate disappearance of a
52:00
Speaker 1: very loved and respected man and his family still to
52:04
Speaker 1: this day does not have any leads or closure to
52:06
Speaker 1: Tom Messick's disappearance. So hopefully the search continues. I love
52:12
Speaker 1: making these kind of videos, kind of getting the word
52:14
Speaker 1: out back out there, especially on cold cases. I don't
52:17
Speaker 1: know if it's ever going to spark something. Hopefully it does.
52:20
Speaker 1: Hopefully it leaves you wary of your surroundings, you know,
52:24
Speaker 1: always buddy system, buddy system, buddy system.
52:26
Speaker 3: It's a scary world out there and there's some weird
52:29
Speaker 3: stuff going on. There's some weird, strange stuff going on.
52:32
Speaker 3: But I hope you liked this kind of video. If
52:34
Speaker 3: you do, please like the video. And also let me
52:37
Speaker 3: know what other cases you want to hear about down below.
52:39
Speaker 3: I very much enjoy telling the stories of these cases
52:42
Speaker 3: and bringing light to them.
52:43
Speaker 1: But until next time, I will see your beautiful face
52:46
Speaker 1: in the next video. And stay safe out there, alright? Bye!