Latest / Simply Bitcoin / Michael Saylor Just EXPOSED His End Game In New Interview | EP 1095

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Michael Saylor Just EXPOSED His End Game In New Interview | EP 1095 · Simply Bitcoin

• 0:00
  Yo, Michael Saylor expose his end game in new interview with a
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  $725 billion asset manager called Bernstein.
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  Now, there's been a bunch of Saylor interviews.
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  He's probably done about 1000 by now, but he's never actually
• 0:16
  revealed what the MicroStrategy end game is until now.
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  And he recently spoke at a Bernstein Klein event.
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  And what he said might surprise you, whether you've been in
• 0:25
  Bitcoin for a long time or you're new to Bitcoin, you might
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  want to because banking seems to be changed forever and you just
• 0:34
  love to see it. This is probably the move that
• 0:37
  we should have seen from a lot of big figures.
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  But Sailor just out here making moves and it's going to be very
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  interesting to see this play out.
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  So before we get into it, guys, let me bring in our guests.
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  We got Joseph Volvo, who is the author of Pay Attention to
• 0:50
  Bitcoin. Thank you for showing up.
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  And of course, we got our boy Chris Alemo here the, you know,
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  your friendly neighborhood Bitcoiner.
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  So let's just jump into the story guys.
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  We're going to come and we'll give you guys all the all the
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  sauce here. So we got an interview.
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  It was actually like a client event.
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  It was kind of like a mini conference at Bernstein.
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  And again, guys, they have $725 billion under management.
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  They're they're a pretty big company and sailors just
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  dropping sauce here. So this broke on theblock.co and
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  here is the headline. MicroStrategy eyes trillion
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  dollar valuation in Bitcoin bank and game, Michael Saylor tells
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  Bernstein. So going down to this article,
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  there's a lot of sauce here. So I am going to kind of read a
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  little bit guys. Michael Saylor told analysts at
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  Bernstein that Microstrategy's end game is to be the leading
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  Bitcoin bank, ultimately growing to become a trillion dollar
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  company. Rather than lending out funds
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  like traditional banks, MicroStrategy seeks to borrow
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  money at low rates, offer slightly higher rates to
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  lenders, and invest those funds into Bitcoin, with a base case
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  estimated average annual return of 29%.
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  So getting into this, in a recent interview with analysts
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  at Bernstein, Saylor, founder and executive chairman of
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  MicroStrategy, again said his end game is to be the leading
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  Bitcoin bank. Of course, everyone knows micro
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  strategy and Michael Saylor just been acquiring Bitcoin
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  aggressively since 2020, leveraging debt and equity to
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  maximize returns and outperform many traditional investment.
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  They've bought in about 7420 Bitcoin and obviously they
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  continue to buy more last month and they have a holdings now of
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  about 252,220 Bitcoin currently valued at about $15 billion
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  against a total cost of around $9.9 billion and $4 billion
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  worth of debt. That's the equivalent of a
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  course 1.2% of the bitcoins total supply.
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  And Michael Saylor's thesis argues that Bitcoin is the top
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  performing asset of the 21st century.
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  We talk about that constantly. We played so many Sailor clips
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  trying to expose new people to these ideas.
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  And of course, he sees it as a revolutionary form of digital
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  capital offering a powerful hedge against inflation and a
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  superior tool for long term value storage.
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  And of course under Sailors leadership in the last couple of
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  years, MicroStrategy is literally outperforming
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  basically everything on the SP500.
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  So now Sailor sees MicroStrategy as a Bitcoin bank in the core
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  business of creating Bitcoin capital market instruments
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  across equity, convertibles, fixed income and preferred
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  shares. And here's a quote.
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  This is the most valuable asset as a sailor in regards to
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  Bitcoin. This is the most valuable asset
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  in the world. The end game is to be the
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  leading Bitcoin bank or merchant bank or you could call it a
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  Bitcoin finance company company. If we end up with 20 billion of
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  convert, 20 billion of preferred stock, 10 billion of debt and
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  say 15 billion of some kind of debt instrument and structures
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  instrument will have 100 to $100 billion of Bitcoin.
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  The company trades at a 50% premium with more volatility in
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  ARR. We can build a company that has
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  a 100% premium to $115 billion worth of Bitcoin and build a 300
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  to $400 billion company with the biggest options market, the
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  biggest equity market. And then we basically start to
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  chew into the fixed income markets and we just keep buying
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  more Bitcoin. Bitcoin is going to the millions
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  of coin, you know, and then we create a trillion dollar
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  company. The firm strategy is based of
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  course, on its long term belief in Bitcoin as the best
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  deflationary money. Currently, Bitcoin makes up
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  point 1% of global financial capital and Michael Saylor
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  predicts this will rise to 7%, implying a $13 million price per
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  Bitcoin by 2045. If you have capital markets,
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  allow MicroStrategy to raise funds through debt, equity and
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  other instruments. It will happily scale an
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  arbitrage between USD capital markets and Bitcoin, which
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  Sailor expects to grow by 29% annually.
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  And his base case scenario, ask how scalable the firm's debt
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  strategy was. He says Sailor, of course, I
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  think it's infinitely scalable. I don't have any problem seeing
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  how we could raise $100 billion more capital and then 200
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  billion after that. It's a trillion dollar asset
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  class going to 10 trillion and then going to 100 trillion.
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  The risk is very simple. It's Bitcoin.
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  You either believe Bitcoin is something or you believe it's
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  nothing. And I think This is why banking
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  is going to fundamentally shift and why this is such a
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  revolutionary idea. It's this headline right here.
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  A Bitcoin bank that borrows and not lend so Chagani, sorry bro.
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  Also noted sailors view that bitcoins underlying average
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  annual growth yield was attractive enough to continue
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  making money on capital markets arbitrage and not lend out
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  Bitcoin like a traditional banking model.
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  Again, guys, we expose banking all the time here.
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  It's not your money. Once you put it into a bank,
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  they take that money, they lend it out and that's why they give
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  you returns. Well, sailors, flipping this
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  completely on its head, he's not going to lend out Bitcoin, he's
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  going to borrow Fiat to buy more Bitcoin and that's where you get
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  the outsize returns. And here's again, Sailor, my
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  view is that it's much more intelligent to borrow a billion
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  dollars from the fixed income market and lend it to to the
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  Bitcoin at 50% AR with no counterparty risk, then to
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  reverse that and find someone willing to pay me 12 or instead
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  of reverse percent and find someone willing to pay me 12 to
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  14%. And here's another quote that I
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  think is interesting. Instead, we think it's a better
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  idea to borrow $10 billion from people who would be eager to
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  lend and give them a hundred basis points more yield and then
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  lend to Bitcoin for 30% to 50% interest with no counterparty
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  risk. Again, by lend to Bitcoin, he's
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  basically just saying buy more Bitcoin once you get past the
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  volatility and learn to manage it.
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  The bare case scenario I foresee is Bitcoin increasing by only
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  22% a year over the next next decade.
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  Who would pay you 22% interest? And of course, they go into this
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  article about why other companies can't replicate
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  MicroStrategy. Well, it's basically, you know,
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  there are other companies trying to replicate this process, but
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  Saylor and MicroStrategy just had such a huge head start.
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  I, I think it's going to be extremely impossible for people
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  to get, you know, 1% of the Bitcoin supply unless they have
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  an incredible amount of capital. But there is other companies
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  following suit. And there's a little interesting
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  note at the bottom. Bernstein and its affiliates may
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  receive compensation for investment banking services for
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  MicroStrategy. Again, Bernstein is a $725
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  billion investment manager. And sailors out here just orange
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  pulling them and showing them the future, which is a Bitcoin
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  only Bank, of course, buying Bitcoin, borrowing Fiat to buy
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  Bitcoin and then lending or rather paying the interest.
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  And that's where the return comes versus the opposite in
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  banking, which is you lend out all the money coming in and then
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  the potential for exploding out there on the on the market,
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  which we've seen a lot of banks do.
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  And that's the status quo of all banking.
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  So of course, this is just the beginning and Sailor, I'm, I'm
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  sure this is where he's working, but now we know where the end
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  game is for Sailor. We've been talking about Sailor
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  a lot on this show because he's basically, you know, the the
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  genius leading avant-garde on this.
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  He's the vanguard when it comes to what someone should be doing
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  on the corporate level with Bitcoin.
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  And now we're seeing what the end game is.
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  It looks like micro strategy is going to become a leading
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  financial institution, a Bitcoin bank in the future.
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  And there's a lot of sauce in there.
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  If you if you really break down some of those numbers, you know,
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  29% annually returned, which is the base case, which is, you
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  know, I'll maybe maybe argue a little bearish considering that
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  historically Bitcoin has increased.
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  I think it's somewhere between like 40 and 50% year on year.
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  Excuse me. It's just very interesting that
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  this is Sailor's move. It's just keep borrowing Fiat to
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  buy more Bitcoin And that's where the interest comes from
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  with the opposite being the status quo being, you know, lend
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  out the Fiat money and potentially losing that money.
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  And so this is a big news coming out of Sailor and MicroStrategy.
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  We've been wondering what his end game is.
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  We've heard him talk about it constantly that like, oh, you
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  know, he's just going to keep buying Bitcoin, never going to
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  sell it. And everyone's like, what's the
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  use of that, bro? Like, Like you can't be just
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  accumulating all of the Bitcoin, Sailor.
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  You got to leave some for the market.
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  But now we see that he is thinking in the future and
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  being, I think this is where the future is going.
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  And I, when I was setting up this show this morning, I, I
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  find it kind of ironic that like you have sailor doing this and
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  you know, we've, we've been seeing what Trump's been doing.
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  He's starting his own shit coin now.
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  And I was like, this is the move that Trump should have done.
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  If he was really serious about changing banking and really
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  helping out the little guy, You shouldn't have started a shit
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  coin defy project. It should have been what Sailor
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  did with this Bitcoin bank. And now we're seeing what the
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  end game is. So it's going to be very
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  interesting to see this play out, but you've heard the 65 IQ
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  version for me. So let's get Chris''s take on
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  this. Chris, what's your thoughts on
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  Sailors Bitcoin bank plan and of course, changing micro strategy
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  into a $1 trillion company? Yeah.
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  Well, I think I'll, I'll answer the second part first.
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  So get transforming MicroStrategy into a trillion
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  dollar company. As many people right know right
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  now, obviously his plan has been to accumulate as much Bitcoin as
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  possible. But what people don't realize is
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  right now he's evaluate at like 33 billion.
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  I was just looking at it this morning.
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  MicroStrategy that is, and they've got about $15 billion of
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  Bitcoin on their balance sheet. So obviously I'd say it's
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  overvalued relative to the Bitcoin on their balance sheet.
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  But the thing that's also very interesting, MicroStrategy
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  basically hits all the requirements to be included in
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  the S&P 500. Many people have argued they
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  should have been included probably in 2021, definitely in
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  2022. The main reason that they
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  weren't included because of the FAS B or you know the FAS B or
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  GAP accounting rules that are required for digital assets that
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  was updated in December of 2023 and then that will be included
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  January 1 of 2025. I forget when the review is it's
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  once 1/4 that companies are allowed to be added or removed
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  from the S&P 500. I don't know if it's November or
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  December of this year that's coming up that they could
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  potentially be included in the S&P 500 in early Q1 or if not
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  after Q1 when they account the fast be accounting rules for
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  MicroStrategy and maybe Q2. So with that being said, all
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  that being said is if micro Shetty gets included into the
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  S&P 500, that means that people that are investing in, you know,
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  Vanguard, Black Rock, Fidelity index funds are going to be
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  large, even larger flows into the stock than there already
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  are, Meaning that like basically as people passively invest in
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  the S&P 500, obviously, you know, on the show, we advocate
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  buying Bitcoin and taking it into self custody, you know, non
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  KYC if if you can or possible. But it's definitely going to be
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  a way to bootstrap and give them a large tailwind to help boost
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  Microstrategy's evaluation as a stock.
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  So I definitely think in the long term that they will
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  eventually become a trillion dollar company just based on the
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  amount of Bitcoin on their balance sheet and what price
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  would think they're going to go to.
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  But getting passive flows from the S&P 500 is going to be a
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  huge help to them as well, turning MicroStrategy into a
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  banking company. I'm kind of, I don't know, I'm
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  torn by this one. So I know my Michael Sara's been
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  talking about getting a 5% return on your Bitcoin.
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  Any Bitcoin that you lend to any third party individual or
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  another person entity company is a risk.
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  You know, any Bitcoin you're lending out is not your Bitcoin.
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  It is subject to the market, meaning that if bitcoin's price
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  rips or dumps, you can potentially lose that Bitcoin
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  and anything that's not in self custody.
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  So while I commend him for trying something new and trying
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  to become the world's biggest Bitcoin bank, there's a large
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  risk to it. Personally, in my opinion, I
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  just stay humble. Stack SAT bring in cold storage
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  and I wouldn't fiddle with that myself.
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  As we saw with Celsius block by Voyager, you know, all these
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  various companies that went defunct in 2022 and 2021 because
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  of being offsides and lending to FTX.
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  That's not a business that I want to be in.
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  That's not a business I want to invest in.
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  That's not something that I want to do to get return on my
• 13:02
  Bitcoin. But that's just my two sets.
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  I mean, I would totally agree with you.
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  I look, my, my cousin hit me up yesterday and for some reason we
• 13:11
  started talking about stonks and I'm like, you know, if anyone
• 13:14
  has claims, I mean, actually it started because there's a new,
• 13:17
  there's a new Opti scammer out there.
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  And so, you know, I'm never going to DM you about your
• 13:21
  stonks and your investments and stuff.
• 13:23
  And I was trolling him kind of. And I'm like, yeah, dude, if
• 13:26
  anyone asks you, you know, with the the idea that they're Opti
• 13:30
  asking you about buying stonks, you know, it's not me because
• 13:33
  I'm all in on Bitcoin. But watching this master stock
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  price the last couple of weeks, it's like it's tempting.
• 13:39
  You're almost like, man, can it keep going up forever?
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  Like, jeez, this is crazy what they're doing right now with
• 13:45
  that master stock or micro strategy stocks.
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  But yeah, hey, if it does go to a trillion dollar market cap, I
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  guess maybe there is a lot of up, you know, a lot of room to
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  grow with the micro strategy stock.
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  And it's like, yeah, I don't know, I'm I'm just stay humble
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  and buy Bitcoin kind of guy, but it the itch is there and I see
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  why a lot of bitcoiners are investing in MicroStrategy
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  stock. I'll.
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  I'll add one more thing before tossing over to Joe Yeah, I
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  mean, the last thing was there was an opportunity if you're a
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  true. I wouldn't say I don't want to
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  caveat everyone into true Bitcoiner because like I said,
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  you know, buying sats, you know, stacking, staying humble and
• 14:22
  stacking sats is the true Bitcoiner way, especially if
• 14:24
  it's non KYC. But there was an opportunity
• 14:27
  when if you truly value Bitcoin and you say that's going to
• 14:30
  become the global reserve currency, when micro strategy
• 14:32
  was trading below what their market cap was for the Bitcoin
• 14:36
  they held. Obviously that was because the
• 14:37
  accounting rules, they couldn't gap up basically.
• 14:41
  Basically, they had to write off a loss as Bitcoin fell to 15.5
• 14:45
  K, You know, they weren't allowed to, you know, and their
• 14:48
  entry point was around I think 33 K on average.
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  So that means that they had to write on their income statement
• 14:53
  that they were taking a loss essentially, even though that
• 14:55
  was on there. So there was an opportunity in
• 14:57
  2021 or 2022 that MicroStrategy was trading below the value of
• 15:02
  the Bitcoin on their balance sheet.
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  Like I said, you know, there's a lot of other risks that come
• 15:06
  with owning MicroStrategy stock. You know, one's an execution
• 15:09
  risk. One is if you know something,
• 15:11
  God forbid, I, you know, I don't want anything happen to Michael
• 15:13
  Saylor. But, you know, if Coinbase gets
• 15:16
  funky and like, you know, doesn't pay them or doesn't give
• 15:18
  them their Bitcoin. So there's a lot of risk.
• 15:20
  But there was an opportunity, if you're looking at it, that their
• 15:23
  stock was valued way below what their Bitcoin was on their
• 15:25
  balance sheet. So I think that opportunity is
• 15:27
  kind of gone. I'm not saying it's not going to
• 15:29
  go up because, you know, stocks only go up according to Dave
• 15:32
  Portnoy. But yeah, I mean, I definitely
• 15:35
  think that there was a huge opportunity when it was much
• 15:37
  lower in price for sure. Yeah, yeah.
• 15:39
  I already feel like I've missed a boat.
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  You know how we always say, like you're still early to Bitcoin?
• 15:45
  Well, on the flip side, with MicroStrategy stock, I'm like,
• 15:47
  no, I'm late. I'm staying out of this.
• 15:49
  I don't want to buy the top of MicroStrategy like I'm just
• 15:52
  going to stack Bitcoin anyway. Joseph, what's your thoughts on
• 15:55
  this? You know, Michael's a goat.
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  I think he got interested in Bitcoin in 2020 or something
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  like that and he's been at a rapid ascent, you know, in
• 16:03
  leading, leading the way. You can just kick back and
• 16:06
  stream YouTube videos and just listen to the Giga chat, just
• 16:09
  unload for hours and hours. If you haven't checked out his
• 16:11
  Breedlove podcast, that's like 7 hours of great content.
• 16:15
  And then it's always been where he's wanted to go.
• 16:17
  You know, he's always been interested in the
• 16:18
  financialization of Bitcoin and bringing Bitcoin to effectively
• 16:23
  to corporate America. And that's, you know, it takes a
• 16:26
  many headed hydra in order for this Bitcoin octopus to expand
• 16:31
  its dendrals into the global and worldwide consciousness of the
• 16:36
  monetary system. And Michael's doing his part.
• 16:39
  I think most recently, if you caught his, I wouldn't call it
• 16:42
  an argument, but we could just say a little bit of friction
• 16:44
  with safety. And they were basically bumping
• 16:47
  heads about what do you do with Bitcoin?
• 16:49
  You don't just sit on it for your whole life.
• 16:51
  At some point you want to get a return, turn on it and safe was
• 16:54
  taking the position that well, you know, you can just we don't
• 16:56
  need to lend out Bitcoin. We don't need lending because
• 16:59
  people can just buy equity in someone's project.
• 17:02
  And that's a really great work around and it is a great work
• 17:04
  around. But Michael's point is you got
• 17:06
  to have lending because you're always going to have someone
• 17:08
  who's 65 plus that wants to retire, kick back and earn 5% a
• 17:11
  year. And you're going to have someone
• 17:12
  who's 19 years old that wants to start a car wash.
• 17:15
  And as long as those two types of economies exist, you need
• 17:17
  someone who has money to lend money to someone who wants it,
• 17:21
  who has a business idea that can make more money and pay off that
• 17:23
  loan so that the 65 year old can kick back on a beach and drink a
• 17:26
  Mai Tai. And so Michael is trying to do
• 17:30
  that. He, you know, it's basically the
• 17:32
  apotheosis of, of fucking part of my friendship.
• 17:35
  MicroStrategy is to become a Bitcoin bank.
• 17:39
  And I I imagine that if and when they do over the next 5 to 10
• 17:43
  years, they might actually be worth a trillion dollars.
• 17:46
  Yeah, totally. And, and it's I think this year
• 17:51
  you can, you can kind of pick out a few different themes.
• 17:53
  One, obviously you're seeing that Bitcoin is hitting the
• 17:56
  mainstream. It's it's hitting the, you know,
• 17:58
  politics has landed on our door. We've seen what the US federal
• 18:02
  government has done the SEC of trying to clamp down on Bitcoin,
• 18:06
  AKA operation choke point 2.0. But on the flip side, you see
• 18:10
  that we have matured, We have entered, entered the the
• 18:14
  financial landscape. You know, Bitcoin has matured.
• 18:16
  It does have that quote, UN quote legitimacy from the suits
• 18:20
  now. And this here seems like one of
• 18:22
  those years where we're just laying the bricks down for like,
• 18:24
  as you said, Joseph of Bitcoin actually entering into, or
• 18:29
  rather being financialized. And I know that word is kind of
• 18:32
  a dirty word in Bitcoin because, hey, you know, I grew up, I I
• 18:36
  became an adult during the 2008 financial crisis.
• 18:38
  And so I am fundamentally weary of all the financial trickery we
• 18:43
  see. But I think we've seen this and
• 18:45
  even like how Finney said this like a week after Bitcoin was
• 18:48
  released, that we will be seeing Bitcoin banks in the future.
• 18:51
  Some, of course, will be fractional reserve banking and
• 18:53
  some well, and the market will figure out the risk and where
• 18:56
  they want to put their money. But it is very interesting to
• 18:59
  see that Sailor is going to basically do the micro strategy
• 19:02
  playbook of just borrowing a bunch of cheap Fiat money and
• 19:07
  continue to acquire more Bitcoin.
• 19:08
  So it's going to be very interesting next year or maybe,
• 19:11
  yeah, we probably won't see it by the end of this year, but
• 19:13
  it's going to be very interesting to see next year
• 19:15
  whether the big banks are like, you know, outside of the Bitcoin
• 19:19
  space are also going to follow suit, whether they're going to
• 19:21
  be holding Bitcoin on their balance sheets and all that
• 19:23
  stuff. So Bitcoin is growing up.
• 19:26
  I know there's a lot of pushback in the Bitcoin space by
• 19:28
  Bitcoiners, but hey, we knew this was coming and we just got
• 19:31
  to ensure that that these basic Bitcoin principles first, first,
• 19:36
  what's that first principles are being followed because we don't
• 19:41
  want to just like cheerlead Sailor out here and then people
• 19:44
  get wrecked. But it looks like Sailor is a is
• 19:46
  a full blown maxi And and like you said, he's he's opening this
• 19:50
  up for the corporate world. Sailor seems to be like the
• 19:53
  cheerleader for the corporate Bitcoin adoption.
• 19:55
  And now we're seeing he's moving into the banking sector, which I
• 19:58
  think is going to be very interesting to watch moving
• 20:01
  forward. All right, guys, before we move
• 20:03
  on, though, we do have to pay the bills.
• 20:05
  But of course, like, share, subscribe, comment, all that
• 20:08
  good stuff if you like what we're doing here on the show.
• 20:11
  But we got a shout out bitcoinwell.com, the best place
• 20:15
  to buy your Bitcoin it's self custody by default, which
• 20:18
  literally means you need to have a Bitcoin wallet to buy Bitcoin
• 20:22
  from them. They never hold your Bitcoin.
• 20:24
  This is to ensure that you get your SAT make sure you're
• 20:27
  supporting Bitcoin only companies.
• 20:30
  And of course, if you use the promo code simply BTC, you can
• 20:33
  get some 3 tosses into the Bitcoin wishing well.
• 20:37
  And what is the Bitcoin wishing well Well, of course, when you
• 20:40
  get into your dashboard, you go in here in the Bitcoin wishing
• 20:42
  well, you redeem, you throw a coin in and you can redeem some
• 20:45
  sats a little gamified, you know, fun, fun action over here.
• 20:48
  You have a chance to win up to 1,000,000 SAT.
• 20:50
  So pull out your lightning wallets and you can win.
• 20:53
  Let's see where we at today, 500 SAT.
• 20:56
  So first come first serve again, go to bitcoinwell.com.
• 21:00
  They're on the mission to enable independence and use the promo
• 21:02
  code Simply BTC and you get some tosses into the wishing well.
• 21:07
  All right, guys, let's get into the show.
• 21:17
  Of course, also, guys, make sure you are not leaving your seed
• 21:21
  phrase on a piece of paper and it gets absolutely devastated
• 21:24
  because of hurricanes coming into your area and you lose your
• 21:28
  seed phrase because the oil runs on the piece of paper or your
• 21:31
  dog eats your generational wealth.
• 21:33
  Go to stampse-ed.com. Use the promo code simply and
• 21:37
  you can get 15% off their titanium get yourself a stamp
• 21:41
  seed kit hammer time hammer your seed phrase into some something
• 21:44
  like titanium indestructible so that you can ensure that your
• 21:48
  seed phrase is going to withstand the test of time.
• 21:52
  All right guys let's get into the dashboard let's get into the
• 21:55
  numbers here. Of course I'm over here on Clark
• 21:57
  Moody's dashboard. Oops.
• 21:59
  And of course, I, I've, I have nuke most of the numbers here.
• 22:03
  I, I, I picked just the numbers that you like.
• 22:05
  Actually, it was interesting after yesterday's show, I was
• 22:08
  kind of trolling that. Oh, it looks like we're back at
• 22:09
  58 K forever. Well, it looks like we kissed
• 22:12
  it. And now the Bitcoin price is
• 22:13
  currently at $62,410 per Bitcoin and the SAT per dollar, AKA how
• 22:19
  much your dollar is worth in Bitcoin, AKA how much Bitcoin
• 22:22
  you can buy for a single dollar. It's currently at 1602 SAT or
• 22:26
  160 bits for the bits maxi in the back that have been very
• 22:29
  quiet lately. We're not hearing that debate
• 22:31
  yet. I'm sure we'll hear that debate
• 22:32
  once we cross 6 figures. The current block height is
• 22:35
  865,198. The market cap in Fiat terms is
• 22:40
  $1.23 trillion. And the Bitcoin versus gold
• 22:44
  market cap, it's inching up a little bit.
• 22:45
  We're at 6.62%. We're not even at 10% of gold
• 22:49
  market cap. And remember what Sailor just
• 22:51
  said? He's like, you know, the Bitcoin
• 22:52
  market, the market cap in Bitcoin is only a trillion
• 22:55
  dollars. It's going to go to 10.
• 22:56
  It'll eventually go to 100 trillion.
• 22:58
  We might argue that it's, it's going to eventually go to that.
• 23:01
  What? Where are we at right now,
• 23:02
  Chris? Like $900 trillion of global
• 23:05
  assets in the world. There's still a lot of room to
• 23:07
  run here in the Bitcoin price. The total percentage of Bitcoin
• 23:10
  that will ever be issued is currently at 94.12%, which means
• 23:14
  there's 19,766,027.36 BTC circulating.
• 23:21
  And as Chris told us, When were you here, Chris?
• 23:23
  Tuesday. Yeah, we'll get to 99% of all
• 23:27
  the Bitcoin that will ever be released, 2035.
• 23:30
  So you might want to get some just in case it catches on.
• 23:33
  All right, guys, for today's numbers, we got this clip.
• 23:37
  I'm, I'm not gonna play the whole video, but Tucker Carlson
• 23:40
  did an interview with. I'm gonna, I'm gonna butcher
• 23:43
  your last name, my bro. But Ryan Salami Salameh.
• 23:48
  Salameh. Yeah, Ryan Salameh, he was an
• 23:51
  executive FTX. And you can tell Tucker here in
• 23:54
  this framing, he's, you know, he's he's making it political,
• 23:57
  obviously, but that's not what we're going to be talking about.
• 23:59
  There was a point here where Ryan Salameh is kind of orange
• 24:04
  peeling Tucker. Now, you may have your views on
• 24:07
  Tucker, but of course he's one of the biggest broadcasters in
• 24:11
  the world. So I think having these
• 24:12
  conversations are very important.
• 24:14
  But he says something that we say here all the time on the
• 24:18
  show, that no one should have a monopoly on money.
• 24:21
  There shouldn't be a small cabal of bankers out there that
• 24:23
  control the money. This is not only bad economics,
• 24:26
  but they cause more harm than they do good.
• 24:29
  And it's also kind of interesting in this
• 24:31
  conversation, they do almost hint on what happened in Canada
• 24:35
  in the Tucker protest. And maybe Tucker is not aware of
• 24:39
  all that. But anyway, let's watch this
• 24:40
  clip and then we'll respond to it.
• 24:42
  Opposition to the current regime in the United States.
• 24:45
  There's no Oregon. A lot of Trump voters, but
• 24:47
  they're not organized and they never will be organized because
• 24:50
  the people in charge prevent them from being organized.
• 24:52
  They tried on January 6th. A lot of them are still in jail.
• 24:55
  So will crypto solve for that? Will you ever be able to fund a
• 25:01
  protest movement that can't be defunded by the people the
• 25:04
  protest movement challenges? Well, I mean, so the you can't
• 25:09
  stop the transactions from occurring and so that's, you
• 25:14
  know, a bank can stop a transaction from close your
• 25:16
  account or things of that sense. You can't close someone's
• 25:19
  Bitcoin account and there's tons of different crypto currencies.
• 25:22
  So we're generalizing here a lot.
• 25:24
  But you can't close someone's Bitcoin account.
• 25:27
  So you there that account, yes you could use it to fund a
• 25:31
  protest that couldn't be stopped.
• 25:32
  Now once you have the Bitcoin, if you want to turn it into cash
• 25:35
  that could be prevented. Or if they flag your wallet as
• 25:39
  being as like extremely high risk wallet or associated with
• 25:43
  something nefarious, a lot of other people won't interact with
• 25:45
  it or won't want to receive from it.
• 25:48
  This doesn't completely solve government control, but it takes
• 25:53
  things out of centralized institutions and puts them in
• 25:56
  your own pocket, which is enticing for a lot of people.
• 26:00
  I think we're going to a border economy.
• 26:03
  I just, I just think it's really important that the people in
• 26:07
  charge not have a monopoly on the money because when they do,
• 26:11
  they will defund any effort to challenge their authority.
• 26:15
  Yeah, it's anti American. I mean the whole principle
• 26:17
  completely anti doing here. That's right, but I don't.
• 26:20
  Know a lot of people don't share that view.
• 26:23
  Well, I just want to wish you truly Godspeed and thank you for
• 26:27
  explaining all of this and anyone who's made it to the end
• 26:29
  of this interview I think will have a completely different as I
• 26:31
  do. So as you can see, I don't know
• 26:35
  necessarily what Tucker's view is on Bitcoin.
• 26:38
  I know he was, you know, he's been reaching out to the Bitcoin
• 26:40
  space, so maybe he's going down the rabbit hole.
• 26:43
  But he did hit on the crux of the problem here, that no one
• 26:47
  should have the monopoly on money.
• 26:49
  And that's where we are right now.
• 26:50
  That's the status quo. This is what Bitcoin
• 26:52
  disintermediates. But it is interesting this clip
• 26:55
  right here, at least his post individually got 2 million
• 26:58
  views. So that's 2,000,000 more people
• 27:01
  potentially being exposed to this idea that there should not
• 27:05
  be one cabal that controls all of the money.
• 27:09
  There shouldn't be, you know, central banks and and the Fed
• 27:12
  out there, they, they shouldn't be able to manipulate the money
• 27:15
  supply because this is all they're doing.
• 27:17
  They're all playing financial trickery with the money supply.
• 27:20
  It's all making us brokers, making our lives harder.
• 27:24
  And this is what Bitcoin disrupts.
• 27:25
  And this is the importance of Bitcoin is taking the power of
• 27:28
  money out of the powers that be and as Tucker hit on, you know
• 27:33
  very, very specifically the very people that are in control of
• 27:37
  the money supply, the the powers that be.
• 27:39
  They will ensure that you do not actually create a movement
• 27:43
  against it. Hence why we're seeing so much
• 27:45
  stuff in regards to choke .2 point O of trying to stop the
• 27:48
  adoption of Bitcoin. So much fun in regards to
• 27:51
  Bitcoin is because they know what we know, the power comes
• 27:54
  from the money. Just follow the money, pinpoint
• 27:55
  the money and that's where all the power comes from.
• 27:58
  And now we actually have of a tool to fight back against.
• 28:02
  Now before I pass this over, there was a very interesting
• 28:07
  development on this. So this post was dropped.
• 28:11
  The interview was dropped two days ago.
• 28:13
  Let me double check. This post was dropped October
• 28:17
  9th. So that's Wednesday.
• 28:19
  And then yesterday we got this post here from Ryan Solomon,
• 28:24
  which is kind of funny, but also former FTX executive Ryan
• 28:28
  Solomon is heading to prison and he updated his LinkedIn and he
• 28:32
  goes, I'm happy to share that I'm starting a new position as
• 28:34
  inmate at FCI Cumberland. So it's he's trolling this, but
• 28:39
  it is interesting that he got this interview released from
• 28:41
  Tucker and then a day later he winds up in jail because of this
• 28:45
  a whole FTX debacle. Just absolute.
• 28:48
  I mean, you know me, I'm not I'm not a fan of the FTX stuff.
• 28:51
  But yeah, I I think it's funny. He's even trolling that on on
• 28:55
  his LinkedIn. But Jeff in Chris?
• 28:58
  Yeah, so I actually watched the whole interview last night.
• 29:00
  It was actually really, really good and really informative.
• 29:03
  I haven't had a chance to read Michael Lewis's book.
• 29:05
  I've kind of seen a lot of people talking about it online,
• 29:08
  but I think he drew like, really weird.
• 29:11
  You know, he's basically praising Sam Bankvid Freed and
• 29:14
  like, oh, it wasn't a fraud and all that.
• 29:16
  I think Ryan did. Ryan was no, no, no.
• 29:19
  Talking about Michael Lewis in the book.
• 29:20
  That he wrote a book. Yeah.
• 29:22
  So Ryan was working at FTX. He started there in I believe
• 29:26
  2019 or 2020. He was like really getting
• 29:29
  burned out in 2021. They, they tried to keep keeping
• 29:32
  him around. He eventually started a new
• 29:34
  position, you know, moved down to the Bahamas and then everyone
• 29:37
  else was basically in Hong Kong and he was in the Bahamas doing
• 29:40
  like international sales for FTX.
• 29:43
  Long story short, basically a lot of guys started moving to
• 29:46
  FTX from FTX from Hong Kong to the Bahamas.
• 29:50
  And he was like, he was part of like the on the ground footage
• 29:53
  or on the ground team of basically getting people
• 29:55
  housing, you know, getting them housing, getting them set up,
• 29:59
  getting the offices set up. And by June of 2022, he actually
• 30:02
  left the company. And then obviously the company
• 30:05
  collapsed, FTX collapsed or to file bankruptcy in early
• 30:08
  November of 2022. So he was already gone for four
• 30:11
  months at that time. In the early in the beginning of
• 30:14
  the interview, he basically talks about that he was, you
• 30:17
  know, obviously part of when all of this went defunct.
• 30:20
  Basically he was charged with campaign finance violations.
• 30:23
  So Long story short, basically his lawyers at FTX didn't want
• 30:27
  him to sell his tokens. He had a bunch of different
• 30:29
  crypto assets, Bitcoin, Ethereum, you know, the gambit
• 30:32
  of them, the FTT token. And so instead of selling them
• 30:36
  and paying the taxes and then paying, you know, whatever the
• 30:38
  cash that you have on hand to pay for contributions for, he
• 30:41
  donate to the Republican Party. A lot of people at FTX donated
• 30:44
  to the Democratic Party. And he actually confirmed or he
• 30:47
  said that Sam actually was donating to Republicans on a
• 30:50
  much smaller scale, but also donate to them to be more
• 30:53
  favorable to crypto and Bitcoin at large.
• 30:55
  And he, I felt he actually humanized Sam in a way that was
• 30:58
  didn't come off across in anything else.
• 31:00
  He's like, yes, Sam and I didn't see eye to eye on a lot.
• 31:02
  Obviously he's like, I'm conservative.
• 31:04
  I was donating to Republican candidates and Sam and his
• 31:06
  family were definitely more liberal and all of that.
• 31:09
  But he said that he actually wanted to go on the stand and
• 31:12
  actually defend Sam saying that and go on the defense and
• 31:15
  basically say like he was completely more misportrayed in
• 31:18
  in the case, which I thought was really interesting.
• 31:21
  I'd never heard anyone say that before, maybe except for the
• 31:23
  Michael Lewis book of it all. So basically getting to my point
• 31:26
  is that he wanted to do that and actually stand up and stick by
• 31:30
  SBF and his lawyers. And a lot of the lawyers are
• 31:32
  like, Oh no, like if you do that, you'll they'll throw the
• 31:35
  book at you. So Long story short, he's he's
• 31:37
  like, in the event that he lost, they were trying to work a plea
• 31:40
  deal. So his lawyers were saying that
• 31:42
  they were recommending Ryan get 18 months in jail and then the
• 31:45
  prosecutors recommended five to seven years.
• 31:47
  The judge actually threw the book at him and went above what
• 31:50
  the prosecutor said. So he they could have went up to
• 31:53
  10 years. And the judge claimed like all
• 31:55
  these things that like, you know, when it's taken, things
• 31:57
  are taken out of context. They're like, oh, you were
• 31:59
  talking about taking a loan against your Bitcoin he or
• 32:02
  against your assets. He's like, yeah, all the wealthy
• 32:05
  people do that. And he's like, well, it looked
• 32:06
  like you were like defrauding investors.
• 32:08
  And like he's they were also saying like, oh, you sold some
• 32:11
  of your things on the platform. He's like, yeah, because I left
• 32:13
  in June and I needed money and I wanted to live my life.
• 32:15
  It's like, oh, you knew it was going to collapse, so you got
• 32:17
  your money out. And he was like, no, I really
• 32:19
  don't think that's the case. And he was kind of out laying
• 32:21
  it. Obviously there's two sides
• 32:22
  every story or three sides, two stories and the truth.
• 32:25
  But you know, he seemed very honest in what he was saying.
• 32:27
  So Long story short, he was actually sentenced in May to go
• 32:30
  to jail for 7 1/2 years, even though the prosecutors only
• 32:33
  recommended five to seven years, which is kind of shocked.
• 32:35
  It's normally not done. It's either, you know, it's if
• 32:38
  the defense wants 18 months, the prosecutors want five to seven.
• 32:41
  Normally a judge would come in and basically say someone in the
• 32:44
  middle. So he might have gotten 3 to
• 32:45
  basically 4 1/2 years. But for the the judge is
• 32:48
  basically like you were you, you were basically committing
• 32:51
  campaign finance violations, which SPF and all the other
• 32:55
  people were not charged for. They were donating to Democrats.
• 32:57
  I like I said, I'm not trying to make this political one way
• 32:59
  idea, but Ryan did take a loan against his assets like many
• 33:03
  rich people do, donated to Republican.
• 33:05
  He would not have been able to been hit with this if he just
• 33:08
  sold his assets and then made those donations differently than
• 33:11
  taking a loan against them and then making donations because it
• 33:13
  looks like they're commingled in this conspiracy of FTX falling
• 33:17
  apart where if you sell the assets and you make them real,
• 33:19
  it's money that Ryan would have had that he could have donated.
• 33:22
  So it was very interesting. I really highly recommend people
• 33:24
  listen to this interview. And I think he gave a good
• 33:26
  perspective on like, because Tucker asked like, why did you
• 33:29
  follow SPF? You obviously worked with this
• 33:31
  guy for three years, like, And he was like, yeah, like he.
• 33:34
  And he basically straight up says he's like, Sam has autism,
• 33:37
  if you couldn't tell that didn't come across.
• 33:40
  But he's like, so emotions are very difficult for him, but it's
• 33:43
  like this guy works very hard. He's very smart.
• 33:45
  And I, I thought it was a very balanced interview.
• 33:47
  He's like, I'm not a victim for myself.
• 33:49
  I, I do have to report to jail in the coming, coming days.
• 33:52
  So obviously this interview was shot, you know, a few like not
• 33:55
  too long ago. But he knew he was sentenced in
• 33:57
  May. He took a plea deal, basically
• 34:00
  he was sentenced and basically he took a plea deal and, and
• 34:03
  sentencing, they actually went, they could have gone up to 10
• 34:05
  years. They went further than what the
• 34:06
  prosecutors were recommending. And on top of that, they're now
• 34:09
  persecuting. A part of the reason he took the
• 34:11
  deal is the mother of his kids. He, they were going to, they
• 34:13
  were the FBI and a lot of people were starting to investigate
• 34:16
  her. And he's like, I will take this
• 34:17
  deal and not prosecute her, but just showing that bitcoins a
• 34:20
  fair and just system like, you know, it's just money.
• 34:22
  It's just numbers and code where the justice system went over.
• 34:26
  And even though he took the plea deal, they're now investigating
• 34:28
  her and they're trying to attract her in the FTX of it
• 34:30
  all. So I think Bitcoin brings about,
• 34:32
  you know, fix the money, fix the world.
• 34:33
  I hope that when the world gets fixed or on a Bitcoin standard,
• 34:36
  that we help fix a lot of things like the courts and like things
• 34:38
  that seem very unjust. At least that's the way I see it
• 34:41
  with the way that they're like person getting Ryan and then him
• 34:43
  taking a deal. And then basically it seems like
• 34:45
  the Southern District of New York as well as the FBI are
• 34:47
  prosecuting him and breaking their agreement in this
• 34:50
  contract. I mean, he took the jail time.
• 34:52
  It sucks. He's like, I'm not a victim.
• 34:53
  Like I get like, you know how this happened, but like they
• 34:56
  basically they're backing down on their deal and like I'll just
• 34:58
  kind of leave it at that. Interesting, interesting context
• 35:01
  there, Chris, and it is it is kind of going back to this whole
• 35:06
  idea and I'm we will touch about touch on this a little bit in
• 35:09
  the news following right now of just how the Bitcoin industry or
• 35:14
  the crypto industry at large has been targeted this year.
• 35:16
  And it seems like the judge is kind of doing something similar.
• 35:20
  And also the the more larger trend outside of Bitcoin of the
• 35:24
  law fair that goes on. If you don't follow, you know,
• 35:28
  the the party lines of the powers that be.
• 35:30
  So again, Bitcoin fixes this. The powers that be shouldn't
• 35:34
  have a monopoly on the money. And this is the future we're
• 35:37
  going towards where, like Chris was saying, hopefully it's a
• 35:39
  more fair system. And it was funny.
• 35:41
  So when the investigation broke, obviously the witnesses are not
• 35:44
  allowed to talk. So he's like, I haven't talked
• 35:46
  to SPF or Carolyn or Gary or any of the other people.
• 35:49
  Because if you do, you can get hit with conspiracy charges of
• 35:52
  like trying to sway your stories and stuff like that.
• 35:54
  So it becomes very silent. It's you and your lawyers and
• 35:56
  the prosecutors. So normally your lawyers talk to
• 35:58
  the prosecutors and then and he, the prosecutors basically send
• 36:01
  questions and you, you're either a cooperating witness or you're
• 36:03
  not. And he felt like he was
• 36:04
  cooperating and he was telling what he thought was the truth,
• 36:07
  but they were trying to stretch and pin him on different things.
• 36:10
  So he like, could have like went against or I wouldn't say lied,
• 36:14
  but like basically said like, oh, it appears like this.
• 36:17
  Can you confirm or deny that? And he's like, no, that's not
• 36:19
  the case at all. And so it does seem like he
• 36:21
  didn't play ball with the government and the regulators.
• 36:23
  So they kind of threw the book out with him.
• 36:24
  You know, whether you want to say because he donated to the
• 36:26
  Republican Party, that's another, you know, twist in the
• 36:29
  tail as well. Well.
• 36:30
  Yeah, totally, totally. OK, Joseph, what's your thoughts
• 36:32
  on all this? Maybe start with Tucker Carlson
• 36:35
  hitting the nail on the head. There shouldn't be a monopoly on
• 36:38
  the money. And then maybe you can add a
• 36:40
  little, a little commentary to what Chris just said.
• 36:42
  Well, just to invert that, one of my favorite comments that
• 36:45
  I've got, when I told someone I wrote a Bitcoin book, it was one
• 36:51
  of my friend's parents and she said, didn't he go to jail?
• 36:57
  So there's that. So we have SPF to thanks for the
• 37:00
  branding problem. But as far as picking a top
• 37:02
  signal, you know, when Tom Brady throws a football at the moon
• 37:06
  and Larry David does a Super Bowl commercial, you know, you
• 37:08
  might want to it might be a bit frothy in the market.
• 37:13
  And you know, that sort of moves to this idea of like, let's talk
• 37:17
  about Tucker and what he's saying.
• 37:18
  And like all politics aside, legitimately the ethos of
• 37:23
  American is freedom of speech, you know, and Bitcoin as a form
• 37:28
  of speech or a form of transferring money.
• 37:31
  Freedom of transaction is is a part of the core fabric.
• 37:36
  Democrat, Republican, independent, non political,
• 37:39
  apolitical. We deserve to be able to speak
• 37:42
  and transact freely and when, whenever that is oppressed in
• 37:46
  any nation or government, it needs to be looked at and and
• 37:52
  really combat it in the most peaceful and legally forth
• 37:58
  forthright way. We saw that in Canada when the
• 38:01
  accounts of the trucker protests were shut down.
• 38:04
  If banks of any nation state can weaponize your money against
• 38:09
  your ability to transact freely and therefore, you know, moving
• 38:14
  into your your right to assemble, to get together, to
• 38:16
  have opinions, to learn, to talk, to grow, to associate.
• 38:20
  If this can be combated by the financial overlords, well, then
• 38:23
  we're losing the very fabric of what it means to be democratic.
• 38:26
  Again. All politics aside, and whomever
• 38:29
  people to vote for, we can all get behind this wagon.
• 38:33
  Totally, totally. Chris, you want to jump in
• 38:35
  again? Yeah, so, and one last point.
• 38:37
  So Tucker and obviously Ryan were talking about Bitcoin.
• 38:40
  They kept going back to the Bitcoin point.
• 38:41
  Tucker says he likes Bitcoin or so you know, he's he likes
• 38:45
  Michael Saylor. He said he's been to a many of
• 38:47
  the conferences. So and he said like he's like, I
• 38:49
  think they're very smart. I think they're doing a very
• 38:51
  noble thing and I think they're doing something to protect the
• 38:53
  rights and civil liberties of people.
• 38:55
  So he's kind of behind us. The one thing that came up that
• 38:57
  Ryan really didn't have a good answer for is obviously Tucker
• 39:00
  was talking about the privacy of it all.
• 39:02
  And Ryan's like, yeah, if you want to be more private, using
• 39:04
  cash is definitely a better thing.
• 39:06
  And then Tucker kind of goes into saying, well, obviously
• 39:08
  they want to get rid of cash. They want to create a CBDC or
• 39:11
  something of the ilk. I think the one point that was
• 39:13
  kind of missed the forest from the trees.
• 39:15
  And this is kind of one of my gripes with Tucker, even though
• 39:17
  I like him, is that like, obviously he was kind of
• 39:19
  slandering Signal because when he was trying to book the Putin
• 39:22
  interview two years ago, he was saying that there was a back
• 39:25
  door in it, that it was leaked, but then was promoting the
• 39:27
  Telegram founder. And now information is coming
• 39:29
  out. But since 2018, if you you
• 39:31
  weren't using the encrypted feature that basically, you
• 39:34
  know, I mean, you're using Telegram servers.
• 39:36
  They could have leaked it and they have leaked it and then
• 39:38
  even now it seems they're updating their terms and
• 39:40
  services to say that like, hey, we can leak your information.
• 39:43
  And it seems I, I don't want to speculate that they're putting a
• 39:45
  back door, but many people have speculated that Telegram is kind
• 39:48
  of like a, a honeypot of it all. The last point I wanted to add
• 39:52
  with the privacy of it all is obviously Bitcoin's privacy has
• 39:54
  gone down in at least the last year.
• 39:56
  And I say that on the back of basically a lot of Lightning
• 40:00
  companies pulling out of the space or at least out of the
• 40:02
  States, whether it was Phoenix Wallet or even.
• 40:07
  Ibex had pulled out of the United States.
• 40:09
  On top of that, we have wasabi turning down their coin joint
• 40:12
  coordinator as well as the two samurai developers are in, you
• 40:16
  know, in custody right now and obviously they're not running
• 40:19
  the Whirlpool coordinator for coin joints.
• 40:21
  So coin joints have taken a really big hit and that is a way
• 40:24
  to protect the privacy of your Bitcoin.
• 40:25
  Obviously there are ways that you can buy Bitcoin non KYC,
• 40:28
  which is beneficial, but a lot of the tools that were used by I
• 40:32
  I wouldn't even say criminals. They were used by everyday
• 40:34
  people. I mean, the Human Rights
• 40:35
  Foundation was talking about now when protesters collect Bitcoin,
• 40:39
  you know, they have to worry because they don't have forward
• 40:41
  privacy with using coin joint tools.
• 40:43
  So there was, I forget what the name of the tool, but it was
• 40:46
  just basically a fork of Samurai Whirlpool and it is a new coin
• 40:50
  joint coordinator that came out just a few weeks ago.
• 40:53
  So while Tucker was hammering home on the privacy of it all, I
• 40:56
  definitely think, you know, this is a worthy battle.
• 40:58
  You know, P2BP2B rights.org is obviously a group run or
• 41:04
  donation pool run by BPI, the Bitcoin Policy Institute to try
• 41:08
  and collect funds to protect, you know, the, the samurai
• 41:11
  developers as well as you know, Whirlpool or not just Whirlpool
• 41:15
  Tornado fog and the Tornado cash and the Bitcoin fog cases.
• 41:19
  So if you have any sats you can donate that way.
• 41:21
  That would be a huge help. Great, great context.
• 41:24
  And yeah, we are, we are literally going to talk about
• 41:25
  right now the double standard we're seeing from the
• 41:28
  traditional financial world and Bitcoiners and how they're
• 41:31
  treating the Bitcoin industry at large.
• 41:33
  But I do want to add that it is interesting that Tucker Carlson
• 41:37
  is kind of like at the tip of the rabbit hole.
• 41:40
  You know, he's been kind of interacting with bitcoiners.
• 41:43
  There was that viral clip that kind of went around a couple
• 41:46
  weeks ago about him saying that the CIA created Bitcoin.
• 41:50
  But it does seem like he's leaning into Bitcoin.
• 41:53
  And I think this is a solid development.
• 41:55
  Of course, as Bitcoiners are like we, we don't care about
• 41:58
  what, you know, the talking heads say about Bitcoin.
• 42:00
  It's about doing your own research and understanding it
• 42:02
  for yourself, for your own personal responsibility.
• 42:05
  But for the masses out there, having big influential people
• 42:08
  embrace Bitcoin is obviously a good thing moving forward.
• 42:12
  All right, guys, let's get into the news because we got a solid
• 42:16
  news story. Sorry about this double
• 42:17
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  simply and you get a discount. All right, guys, let's get into
• 44:30
  this news story. Actually, let's get some context
• 44:33
  here. We've been covering it all year.
• 44:35
  Just the, how do you even put it?
• 44:38
  Just the absolute attacks on the Bitcoin industry, the double
• 44:41
  standards we've been seeing coming out against the Bitcoin
• 44:45
  industry, and of course the historical lenience in regards
• 44:48
  to bankers. As the meme goes, the heuristic
• 44:51
  goes, when bankers do stuff bad, no one ever goes to jail.
• 44:55
  I think in 2008 financial crisis when they basically destroyed
• 44:59
  the world, one low level executive, I don't even know if
• 45:02
  he was an executive, I'd have to Fact Check that went to jail.
• 45:05
  So it's very interesting that they are locking up Bitcoiners
• 45:08
  for doing stuff that they don't like.
• 45:11
  And on the flip side, they're basically getting slaps on the
• 45:14
  wrist. And what am I talking about?
• 45:16
  If you didn't hear about this guy's, this new story dropped
• 45:18
  yesterday. Here's a tweet from the US
• 45:20
  Department of Justice. TD Bank pleads guilty to Bank
• 45:24
  Secrecy Act and money laundering conspiracy violations in $1.8
• 45:29
  billion resolution. So you might be thinking, oh,
• 45:32
  they pay, you know, $1.8 billion, like, you know, that
• 45:35
  that's, that's a hefty fine. Maybe, maybe, maybe it's, you
• 45:39
  know, the right cost for that. Well, let's break it down a
• 45:42
  little bit. Let's see what's going on and
• 45:44
  then we'll see how much $1.8 billion actually is in regards
• 45:49
  to the profits that TD Bank makes.
• 45:51
  Anyways, here's a title from the Department of Justice.
• 45:54
  TD Bank pleads guilty to Bank Secrecy Act and money laundering
• 45:57
  conspiracy violations and $1.8 billion resolution.
• 46:00
  I'm going to read a little bit guys so you guys can get the
• 46:02
  sauce. So TD Bank NA or TDBNA, the 10th
• 46:06
  largest bank in the United States and his parent company TD
• 46:08
  Bank US Holding Company AKA TD Bush together with TD Bank.
• 46:14
  TD Bank pleaded guilty today and agreed to pay over $1.8 billion
• 46:17
  in penalties to resolve the Justice Department's
• 46:20
  investigation into violations of the Bank Secrecy Act and money
• 46:24
  laundering. TD Bank and A pleaded guilty to
• 46:27
  conspiring to fail to maintain an anti money laundering program
• 46:30
  that complies with the Bank Secrecy Act, failed to file
• 46:34
  accurate currency transaction reports and launder money.
• 46:37
  TD Bank US Holding Company pleaded guilty to causing TD
• 46:40
  Bank and A to fail to maintain an AML program that complies
• 46:44
  with the BSA and to fail to file accurate CTRS.
• 46:48
  TD banks guilty pleas are part of a coordinated resolution with
• 46:51
  the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve, the Treasury
• 46:53
  Department, office of the Comptroller, and FinCEN by
• 46:56
  making its services here's a quote by making its services
• 46:59
  convenient for criminals, TD Bank became one this is, of
• 47:03
  course, attorney general Merrick Garland today.
• 47:05
  TD Bank also became the largest bank in U.S. history to plead
• 47:08
  guilty to Bank Secrecy Act program failures and the first
• 47:12
  US bank in history to plead guilty to conspiracy to commit
• 47:15
  money laundering. TD Bank chose profits over
• 47:17
  compliance with the law, a decision that is now costing the
• 47:20
  bank billions of dollars in penalties.
• 47:22
  Let me be clear, our investigation continues and no
• 47:25
  individual involved in TD Bank's illegal conduct is off limits.
• 47:29
  Again, another quote. For years, TD Bank starved its
• 47:32
  compliance program of the resources needed to obey the
• 47:35
  law. Today's historic guilty plea,
• 47:37
  including the largest penalty ever imposed under the Bank
• 47:40
  Secrecy Act, offers an unmistakable an unmistakable
• 47:43
  lesson. Crime doesn't pay, and neither
• 47:45
  does flouting compliance. Every bank compliance official
• 47:48
  in America should be reviewing today's charges as a case study
• 47:52
  of what not to do. And every bank CEO and board
• 47:54
  members should be doing the same.
• 47:56
  Because if the business case for compliance wasn't clear before,
• 47:59
  it should be now. And here's a little little more
• 48:02
  sauce here, and then I'll show you.
• 48:04
  You know how big of a hit did they actually get with this fine
• 48:08
  quote? For nearly a decade, TD Bank
• 48:10
  failed to update its anti money laundering compliance program to
• 48:14
  address known risk. As bank employees acknowledge in
• 48:17
  internal communications, these failures made the bank and quote
• 48:20
  easy target for the quote bad guys.
• 48:22
  These failures also allowed corrupt bank employees to
• 48:25
  facilitate a criminal networks laundering of 10s of millions of
• 48:28
  dollars. U.S. financial institutions are
• 48:30
  the first line of defense against money laundering and
• 48:33
  illicit finance. When they participate in crime,
• 48:35
  rather than prevent it, we will not hesitate to hold accountable
• 48:39
  to the fullest extent of the law.
• 48:41
  Again, if you guys want to read the whole thing, you, you can
• 48:43
  get more context at justice.gov. But it is interesting how
• 48:46
  they're framing this like pat themselves on the back.
• 48:49
  We got the bad guys, you know, follow the laws.
• 48:51
  This this isn't how the banking system's supposed to work.
• 48:55
  You know, if you, if you break the law, you're going to get
• 48:58
  punished. And then you kind of look into
• 49:01
  the profits that TD Bank is making.
• 49:03
  And of course, the whole thing we've been showing you this year
• 49:05
  is the double standard we get in the Bitcoin space.
• 49:08
  They're locking up developers, they're making companies leave.
• 49:11
  They literally unalived a few Bitcoin friendly banks out here.
• 49:16
  And in regards to the traditional financial system,
• 49:19
  they're like, hey, man, you broke the law, just give us a
• 49:22
  fine. And it really goes to the
• 49:24
  heuristic that if you have enough money, laws don't apply
• 49:27
  to you. And it seems like we're seeing
• 49:28
  another example of this. So again, I've been using
• 49:31
  perplexity dot AI a lot less lately.
• 49:34
  Highly recommend. It's a AI search algorithm or
• 49:37
  search engine. And so I just did a quick little
• 49:39
  search here. What are TD banks profits the
• 49:42
  last 10 years? Because they said that they
• 49:44
  skirted AML and the Bank Secrecy Act for the last 10 years.
• 49:48
  Well perplexity only really gave me 5 years and they only gave it
• 49:52
  to me in Canadian dollars. But anyways, the net income
• 49:56
  profit overview for the last five years in 20/23/10 point
• 50:00
  seven $8 billion Canadian dollars, 2020 two 17.4 billion
• 50:05
  Canadian dollars, 2020 one 14.2 billion, 2020 11.8 2019 $11.6
• 50:12
  billion and again in Canadian dollars and this is profits.
• 50:15
  So I just did a little quick search.
• 50:17
  Can you just convert their lowest gross profit, which would
• 50:21
  be 2023 from Canadian dollars to U.S. dollars?
• 50:25
  Because you know, I'm 65 IQ over here and I, I can't do the
• 50:28
  conversion rates here. So converting 10.7 billion
• 50:31
  Canadian dollars to USD equals roughly $7.9 billion that was in
• 50:38
  profits last year. And that was just one year and
• 50:41
  they skirted this for 10 years. So you can argue that they had a
• 50:45
  hundreds of billion or at least in the $50 billion in profit, if
• 50:50
  not hundreds of billion dollars in profits and they got hit with
• 50:54
  a $1.8 billion fine. So again, the heuristic of if
• 50:58
  you have enough money, just pay the fine and you can break all
• 51:01
  the laws. And this is what we see coming
• 51:03
  out of the traditional banking system.
• 51:05
  It is interesting when you read that press release, they're like
• 51:08
  really patting themselves on the back like we caught the
• 51:10
  criminals, we caught the bad guys.
• 51:12
  And again, if you're kind of going down the Whitney Webb,
• 51:15
  Mark Goodwin rabbit hole, you might argue that this is the
• 51:18
  status quo of the banks out there, that the banks and the
• 51:21
  powers that be are intertwined with the criminal syndicates.
• 51:25
  But hey, I'm, I'm not, I'm not putting on my tinfoil hat here.
• 51:28
  I'm just trying to lay out the facts here.
• 51:30
  And anyway, why do we really even care about the banks?
• 51:33
  We all know the banking system's a fraud.
• 51:35
  We could even argue that the justice system is broken.
• 51:38
  But as Nick Carter said, in case you're wondering whether this is
• 51:42
  a double standard when compared with CZ and finance, it totally
• 51:46
  is. Of course, finance also got hit
• 51:48
  with some violations of Bank Secrecy Act and money
• 51:50
  laundering. CZ went to jail.
• 51:52
  Obviously I had to pay a fine. And over here, you know, TD
• 51:56
  Bank, 10th largest bank in the world, They're just kind of like
• 51:58
  here, you know, slapped on the wrist, give us 1.8 billion.
• 52:01
  It's almost sounds like an extortion charge.
• 52:03
  But again, I'm not, I'm not I'm not trying to be a tinfoil hat
• 52:05
  guy here, but let's not forget what they did to Bitcoin banks
• 52:10
  for Bitcoin friendly or crypto friendly banks this year as
• 52:12
  well. And Caitlin Long was on the
• 52:14
  front lines as well as Nick Carter.
• 52:16
  This idea that after we got this Silvergate court filing, the
• 52:21
  bombshell that came out of it, that essentially Elizabeth
• 52:24
  Warren and the Biden administration targeted Bitcoin
• 52:26
  and crypto friendly banks, basically ran them out of
• 52:29
  business. And we had the fallout of this.
• 52:33
  And this is where we are right now, where the banking system,
• 52:37
  the traditional banking system can essentially do whatever they
• 52:39
  want as long as they pay the bill, pay the fine.
• 52:42
  And all of us Bitcoiners over here where the real criminals
• 52:45
  are rather quote, UN quote the real criminals, they're locking
• 52:48
  us up in jail. They don't even really give us
• 52:50
  the opportunity to pay the fine here.
• 52:52
  They don't even give us the clear Rd. of what the compliance
• 52:54
  is. They're just like, you're bad.
• 52:56
  We don't want you here, which really goes into what we talk
• 52:59
  about here constantly on the show that the powers that be
• 53:02
  understand what the game is. And also we didn't even bring
• 53:05
  up, there was a clip coming out of I think it was CNBC or MSNBC
• 53:10
  corporate press, where one of the SEC commissioners also
• 53:14
  basically said what we've been saying on the show for a long
• 53:16
  time, that the SEC see's rulings and how they've been treating
• 53:20
  the Bitcoin industry has hurt the industry at large.
• 53:23
  And we've had these conversations on the show a long
• 53:26
  time that there is active attacks on Bitcoin, whether it's
• 53:29
  Operation Choke .2 Point O, whether it's Gary Gensler's view
• 53:32
  on the Bitcoin industry. There's been a lot of attacks in
• 53:37
  the shadow to try to stop the adoption of Bitcoin, to try to
• 53:39
  scare us out of custody our Bitcoin, which just goes to show
• 53:43
  guys, Bitcoin is a threat to the power structures.
• 53:46
  You need to take Bitcoin into custody.
• 53:48
  Do not leave Bitcoin on exchanges.
• 53:50
  I would argue, do not even try to get exposure to the ETFs
• 53:53
  unless of course your money is captured in the financial
• 53:55
  system. The the real true revolutionary
• 53:58
  act is acquiring Bitcoin and taking it into custody.
• 54:02
  But the double standard here is incredible.
• 54:04
  And are we surprised by this? Not at all.
• 54:07
  We've been covering this for a long time.
• 54:09
  We have historical examples of this, again, all a 2008
• 54:12
  financial crisis. But it is just interesting, you
• 54:15
  know, TD Bank, it's a slap on the wrist and they lock up
• 54:18
  Bitcoiners and they run us out of business.
• 54:20
  So again, we know the game here. I've been saying for a while
• 54:24
  that we haven't seen an active attack on Bitcoin like a full
• 54:27
  frontal attack yet. We've just been seeing these
• 54:29
  attacks on on the outskirts. Of course, we know the attack
• 54:32
  vectors is on and off ramps. And so this is where we are
• 54:36
  right now. They don't want Bitcoin to
• 54:38
  proliferate. They're trying to do whatever
• 54:39
  they can to stop Bitcoin adoption.
• 54:41
  But the hypocrisy is absolutely incredible.
• 54:45
  And as a Bitcoiner, we just, we constantly have to highlight
• 54:48
  this stuff because it still seems like people are unaware
• 54:50
  that this hypocrisy, this double standard is playing out in the
• 54:53
  world. And as Bitcoiners, we will
• 54:56
  expose this and Bitcoin exposes this anyways.
• 54:58
  Chris give the 120 IQ view of this.
• 55:02
  I appreciate it, Opti. Now I also saw, I think it was
• 55:05
  1.8 million or 1.8 billion was the fine that they got.
• 55:09
  I was seeing 3 billion somewhere else.
• 55:11
  So I don't know if there's, I don't know if that was the
• 55:13
  conversion of Canadian dollars to US.
• 55:14
  Dollars. I don't know.
• 55:15
  I saw that too. And I was kind of thinking like,
• 55:18
  did did they hit him with three billion and then it got lowered
• 55:22
  or was it Canadian? I don't know.
• 55:24
  I don't know either. But yeah, that was interesting.
• 55:26
  Well, but I guess adding to that, so let's just assume 1.8
• 55:29
  billion is the confirmed note total.
• 55:31
  But I was doing some just quick math on the last five years, you
• 55:34
  know, kind of taking the lowest and it was kind of like an
• 55:37
  average or a midpoint of what you did in perplexity.
• 55:40
  AII mean they basically made 50 billion in profit and they only
• 55:43
  got hit with a $1.8 billion fine.
• 55:46
  I know JP Morgan Chase was hit in 2021 or 2022 with
• 55:50
  manipulating metals markets, the gold markets and they were hit
• 55:53
  with a $900 million fine, but they literally said in that,
• 55:56
  that they basically profited 4.1 billion.
• 55:59
  So you know, basically they had an incentive of $3.2 billion to
• 56:03
  in order to manipulate gold markets.
• 56:04
  If they're only going to like it's cost of doing business at
• 56:07
  this point. To your point, Opti, it's like
• 56:10
  there's rules for thee but not for me, you know, And I was
• 56:14
  reading some stats here. So obviously TD Bank is the 10th
• 56:16
  largest bank at this moment. Basically they had six years, I
• 56:20
  think it was they, they were rounding up to a decade, about a
• 56:22
  decade. They had six years totalling.
• 56:24
  13.2. Trillion dollars was transacted
• 56:27
  through that organization and basically they were only hit
• 56:30
  with a fine of 1.8 when they were making profits over the
• 56:34
  last five years of about 50 billion.
• 56:36
  So it's just, yeah, just really, really insane for me and
• 56:40
  basically rules for thee and not for me.
• 56:42
  Yeah, totally, 100%. And hey Chris, I think you want
• 56:46
  to pop back in. You're you're getting a little
• 56:47
  pop on your, your, your audio. So just refresh the browser and
• 56:51
  pop back in. But Joseph, what's your thoughts
• 56:53
  on this? Are you surprised?
• 56:55
  Like I, I think at this point as a bitcoiner, you can see through
• 56:59
  the veil and you're just like, OK, you know, here's my shocked
• 57:02
  face. Of course this is what's going
• 57:04
  to happen. But anyways, what's the thoughts
• 57:05
  on this Joseph it? Reminds me of that scene in the
• 57:12
  Zuckerberg Facebook movie where he's just like chilling at the
• 57:16
  table next to that Lady at the end of it.
• 57:19
  And you know, like the winklebeer, like suing in for
• 57:24
  for going in that direction. And, and she just looks at him.
• 57:27
  She's like at the end, just pay the guys at the end.
• 57:30
  It's just a speeding ticket. 100.
• 57:33
  Percent. And that's what we're dealing
• 57:35
  with. We're dealing with, well, it's
• 57:38
  not even my language too big to fail banks, you know, the big 5
• 57:44
  or however people want to chunk out that pie.
• 57:46
  But that are you know, they get they're just paying speeding
• 57:52
  tickets it when there's no when you can't fail because you'll be
• 57:56
  bailed out like in 2008. And even if you run afoul of the
• 58:03
  law, you're only paying what would that be from the numbers
• 58:07
  you threw out like a tenth of your annual gross profit back to
• 58:12
  the regulators. What is the disincentive you
• 58:15
  know for foul play? And is the only disincentive in
• 58:21
  the biggest F them that anyone can do?
• 58:26
  The most incendiary act of rebellion is to simply purchase
• 58:32
  and self custody Bitcoin. Totally.
• 58:36
  Yeah, I mean, it's, it's absolutely incredible that it's,
• 58:41
  it's exactly like you said, it's just a speeding ticket.
• 58:43
  And I think if you are at the highest levels, you're obviously
• 58:47
  incentivized to just be like, hey, look, we don't have to do
• 58:51
  this compliance stuff. We can just pay off the fine.
• 58:54
  Like it doesn't really matter. Like we can just buy our way
• 58:57
  through. And this is where we are right
• 58:58
  now. And it's just incredible that
• 59:01
  most people don't understand this.
• 59:02
  Like I always say this and I and I do want to move on into the
• 59:05
  culture and talk about your book paying attention to Bitcoin.
• 59:07
  But I always, I always seemingly, it seems like a joke
• 59:11
  to most people, but like their trust in the legitimacy of the
• 59:14
  system is absolutely incredible to me when there's so many
• 59:19
  examples of this going on that there is just a very corrupt
• 59:23
  nature to the to legacy system that we are part of.
• 59:26
  And we as big corners would argue it's because of the
• 59:28
  incentives of Fiat money. It's because of the incentives
• 59:31
  that we just explained to you that like literally they can
• 59:35
  just pay the laws and they're gonna you know what, what was
• 59:38
  it, Chris? Pay 1% of their profits and it's
• 59:41
  just like, OK, this is the cost of business, whatever.
• 59:44
  Like we can get away with anything.
• 59:46
  This, this is the too big to fail system that we are in.
• 59:49
  And it's absolutely corrupt from from the from the core of it,
• 59:52
  which is of course, the Fiat money.
• 59:55
  But enough of that. I'm sure we can keep talking
• 59:56
  about this forever because this is right up Bitcoin's alley.
• 59:59
  I do want to talk with Joseph about his book, paying Attention
• 1:00:03
  to Bitcoin. So let's get into the culture.
• 1:00:17
  All right, boys and girls, mainly boys, but some girls.
• 1:00:21
  Make sure you go to orangepelap.com stack friends
• 1:00:23
  who stacks at as we constantly show you, not only is Bitcoin
• 1:00:27
  going to take over the financial world, but you as a Bitcoiner
• 1:00:31
  out there will be ushering in the Bitcoin standard and you
• 1:00:35
  want to be around like minded individuals.
• 1:00:37
  You want to build a strong community of Bitcoiners around
• 1:00:40
  you. This is how we succeed on the
• 1:00:42
  grassroots level. So if you are the sole crazy
• 1:00:45
  Bitcoiner in your area, if your family doesn't want to hear you
• 1:00:48
  rant about Bitcoin anymore and their eyes gloss over, get on
• 1:00:51
  orange pill app.com. Maybe there's other bit corners
• 1:00:54
  in your area. If not created Bitcoin of that
• 1:00:57
  and try to get in touch with other bitcoiners because we are
• 1:00:59
  ushering in the Bitcoin standard and you need individuals on the
• 1:01:05
  ground anyways, let's get into your book Joseph.
• 1:01:09
  So you wrote this book? Yes, Sir.
• 1:01:13
  Yes, Sir. I will drop it in the chat.
• 1:01:15
  Sorry, he's hitting me up. Joseph, you wrote this book
• 1:01:17
  paying attention to Bitcoin, the rise of digital gold and its
• 1:01:21
  place in the evolution of money. And you know, just reading this
• 1:01:24
  quote, money is an instrument that people agree to pay
• 1:01:26
  attention to. So let's start with, I know, I
• 1:01:30
  know you want to hit on the importance of the title, but
• 1:01:32
  let's start on what was the genesis of creating this book?
• 1:01:35
  Like what sparked you to write a book on Bitcoin?
• 1:01:40
  Yeah, I was always interested in alternate currencies and
• 1:01:43
  economies when I was doing my graduate work at SCI, was
• 1:01:46
  studying and wrote a paper about like Berkshire bucks and which
• 1:01:50
  was just like this, this form of local currency in Massachusetts
• 1:01:54
  where people would go to farmers markets and use the same money
• 1:01:59
  that wasn't extractive. And the thing that I liked about
• 1:02:02
  it and that later on became why I got interested in Bitcoin is
• 1:02:05
  what was so cool. It's like when we use credit
• 1:02:06
  cards and stuff, that money's extracted out of our local area.
• 1:02:10
  The value doesn't stay locally. And then what I realized after
• 1:02:13
  listening to a Breedlove podcast, I believe it was the
• 1:02:16
  one where he touched spoke with Lex Friedman and who's a bit
• 1:02:19
  more of a mainstream podcaster. And that was like perked up my
• 1:02:22
  ears. And he talked about Bitcoin
• 1:02:24
  being this, this, right, that everybody has and that it can't
• 1:02:29
  be taken from you or inflated away from you.
• 1:02:31
  And that resonated with this idea of credit card extraction
• 1:02:35
  where it's like, OK, we're going to continue to pull wealth out
• 1:02:38
  of these different areas. And I was like, oh, interesting.
• 1:02:40
  What is this Bitcoin thing and how it's almost like a local
• 1:02:46
  currency that's also worldwide. And like, that was a hell of a
• 1:02:50
  paradox. And then I was like, all right,
• 1:02:51
  let's dig in. And now it's been, you know,
• 1:02:54
  10,000 hours, thousands of podcasts and dozens of books
• 1:02:57
  later, and I decided to write something.
• 1:02:59
  Yeah, the, the standard, standard rabbit hole where
• 1:03:02
  you're like, this is interesting.
• 1:03:04
  And then you just completely become obsessed with it and you
• 1:03:06
  devote your life to it. Yeah, you know, it's very
• 1:03:08
  normal, very normal here. But yeah, Joseph, let's talk
• 1:03:12
  about what, what does the title mean?
• 1:03:13
  What? What do you mean by pay
• 1:03:14
  attention to Bitcoin? There's a couple ways to tack
• 1:03:17
  it. Like when you first hear the
• 1:03:18
  title, it's like, well, first of all, it's a command, which I
• 1:03:21
  think is, which I thought was kind of clever or at the very
• 1:03:24
  least fun, which is if someone's like, what's the book called?
• 1:03:26
  And they're like, hey, pay attention to Bitcoin.
• 1:03:29
  So it's like you're telling someone something then like the
• 1:03:31
  first level of it is just like another way to think of that
• 1:03:34
  title is like, hey, check out Bitcoin, you know, take a look.
• 1:03:39
  It might be interesting learn about it.
• 1:03:42
  But I was having coffee with somebody that hit me up in the
• 1:03:45
  local area here through a friend of a friend and was telling me
• 1:03:49
  about the book. And he was kind of like, what
• 1:03:51
  First I thought the book was just saying, hey, take a look at
• 1:03:54
  this subject. But then it gets into the point
• 1:03:56
  of the book is really that when we, when I say pay attention to
• 1:04:00
  Bitcoin, the idea is, is that group mass attention actually
• 1:04:05
  delivers the value of what we think money is.
• 1:04:09
  And a really simple way to understand that is that, well,
• 1:04:15
  we see it all over social media. If you're an influencer, the
• 1:04:18
  more eyeballs you get, the more money you make.
• 1:04:20
  So where attention goes, value accrues.
• 1:04:23
  And then we also see this really at that, at the base layer of,
• 1:04:26
  of money. Money has evolved, you know,
• 1:04:29
  over the centuries and the millennia.
• 1:04:31
  First it was this and then it was that, and then it was the
• 1:04:33
  next thing and then it hopped to the next one.
• 1:04:35
  And those are pockets of attention that are progressing
• 1:04:39
  across time. And one of the most fascinating
• 1:04:44
  things about Bitcoin that demonstrates how attention is
• 1:04:49
  really this like social layer where all the value is actually
• 1:04:52
  decided was the Black Horse. So forked out, they forked and
• 1:04:58
  you had Bitcoin cash and Bitcoin, two kinds of Bitcoin.
• 1:05:00
  Well, which one's Bitcoin? Well, which Bitcoin do people
• 1:05:03
  pay attention to? OK, that's where the value
• 1:05:06
  accrued. And it ended up being the
• 1:05:07
  parent, Shane, not the fork. Now on the other end with the
• 1:05:11
  theory. And when they had that Dow hack,
• 1:05:13
  they also were like, oh shit, we can't let this hack or have all
• 1:05:16
  this money. Let's fork this and like do our
• 1:05:18
  thing on this other blockchain over here.
• 1:05:20
  This is the real Ethereum, not Ethereum classic.
• 1:05:23
  So now it wasn't the parent chain, it was the second chain.
• 1:05:26
  Where did all the attention go? It went on the new boat.
• 1:05:29
  OK, That's where all the value accrued.
• 1:05:31
  So in each instance you had a different outcome and what
• 1:05:33
  delivered and charged the value? The value was what we decided to
• 1:05:37
  pay attention to. And so my book explores that on
• 1:05:39
  a social and philosophical level.
• 1:05:41
  It's not very technical. It's written more as a punchy
• 1:05:44
  primer with a bit of comedy. And if you guys want to check it
• 1:05:47
  out, just type Pay attention to Bitcoin into Amazon.
• 1:05:50
  You can find it. Love it, Love it.
• 1:05:53
  Absolutely love it. Yeah.
• 1:05:54
  One of the things that's most interesting to me as well is not
• 1:05:56
  so much the technicals. I think at first you got to
• 1:06:00
  understand Bitcoin on a technical level, but once you
• 1:06:03
  like get it, the social psychological philosophical
• 1:06:08
  impacts of Bitcoin is the stuff that gets me the most excited.
• 1:06:10
  It's like, well, man, what is Bitcoin going to do to human
• 1:06:14
  behavior? And will this be a good or a bad
• 1:06:17
  thing? And obviously it's a Bitcoin
• 1:06:19
  that we're like, we're all in. This is going to be great for
• 1:06:21
  humanity and the future generation.
• 1:06:23
  But Joseph, I do kind of want to hit on this, this quote you have
• 1:06:27
  on your website right here and it very interesting.
• 1:06:30
  And I kind of want you to break it down a little bit because I
• 1:06:32
  think I know what you're saying. But for the people out there
• 1:06:36
  that that aren't as well versed in the Bitcoin sphere as we are,
• 1:06:39
  quote from you, Joseph, in a world where very little meant
• 1:06:42
  very much, where very few had obtained very little and very
• 1:06:46
  little was understood of what had been obtained.
• 1:06:49
  Can you break this down for the people?
• 1:06:51
  You'd be happy to. So it's a three-part.
• 1:06:54
  Could you pull it back up on the screen though?
• 1:06:56
  Yes, Sir. Because I think it's it helps me
• 1:06:58
  think of it linguistically. It's a three-part kind of Co on
• 1:07:02
  if you will, or like, that's just to say like it's like a
• 1:07:05
  Riddle or like a puzzle anyway. So the first Part 1 of the
• 1:07:09
  puzzle is in a world where very little meant very much.
• 1:07:12
  And this is your your Kim Kardashian's, your artifice,
• 1:07:16
  your headlines, all of this stuff out there that's like
• 1:07:19
  supposedly so important. The newest pop song that's
• 1:07:21
  getting a lot of radio play, but it's really trash.
• 1:07:24
  This is the idea of like there's no nutrient value.
• 1:07:26
  What? It's what Philip K did called
• 1:07:28
  kipple, which is just like has no density.
• 1:07:31
  It's just like just paper just floating in the wind across a
• 1:07:34
  deserted barren, you know, like empty drive in movie theater,
• 1:07:39
  some shit like that. It's like in a world where
• 1:07:41
  there's not a lot of meaning in what people are conveying to
• 1:07:45
  each other, to throw in like a hippie tournament would be like
• 1:07:47
  man. And then the second component is
• 1:07:50
  like where very few had obtained very little.
• 1:07:53
  So in that first line, you know, the very little there is still
• 1:07:57
  nutrients, there's still signal, there's still Bitcoin, there's
• 1:08:00
  still, there's still, there's still mechanisms which we can
• 1:08:03
  deliver high intelligence and data packets to each other in a
• 1:08:07
  in a socio economic way. That's like super dope and
• 1:08:12
  enlivening. And so there is signal out
• 1:08:13
  there. And but of that signal, very few
• 1:08:17
  had obtained much of it. You know, there's not a lot of
• 1:08:20
  it going around at this point. I'm optimistic that it's
• 1:08:23
  growing. And then the final part is that
• 1:08:25
  even that stuff that we do get, and I think any bitcoiner worth
• 1:08:28
  their salt would attest to this, is that we don't even know what
• 1:08:31
  the fuck we're talking about. And that's like the most
• 1:08:34
  interesting component, which is like, it's this quote, which is
• 1:08:38
  like as your as this, as the size of the center of your
• 1:08:42
  understanding expands, the circumference of what you don't
• 1:08:46
  know also expands. So as you get deeper into what
• 1:08:51
  people like to refer to as, oh, I'm down the Bitcoin rabbit
• 1:08:54
  hole. I fell down this thing you did,
• 1:08:55
  but really what's going on? It's like you're improving your
• 1:08:57
  gnosis and you're increasing your knowledge.
• 1:08:59
  And as that happens, you realize that you don't know more than
• 1:09:03
  you then before. So that's what that quotes
• 1:09:05
  trying trying to express. I love it.
• 1:09:08
  Yeah. I, I, I think I've told this
• 1:09:10
  story before on, on the show. I, I actually got a, a degree in
• 1:09:14
  philosophy, you know, I, I'm, I'm not as, I'm not as dumb as I
• 1:09:18
  look over here. I do have a bachelor's, which I
• 1:09:20
  probably wouldn't recommend to other kids out there.
• 1:09:23
  But the, the reason I got a philosophy or bachelors in
• 1:09:26
  philosophy is because one simple quote I, I fell down the
• 1:09:30
  philosophical rabbit hole because when Socrates said, you
• 1:09:33
  know, I know that I know nothing.
• 1:09:35
  I'm like, that is me. This is exactly where I am.
• 1:09:38
  I'm trying to learn the truth here.
• 1:09:40
  And it is very interesting. How many people what's the Mark
• 1:09:43
  Twain quote from the Big Short? It's not what you know, it's not
• 1:09:48
  what you don't know, it's what you know that really isn't.
• 1:09:50
  Or something like that. That just states so.
• 1:09:52
  Yeah, exactly. And, and I, I see this happening
• 1:09:55
  a lot in the world where, you know, there is obviously very
• 1:09:59
  smart people, but they're they're Givens and their and
• 1:10:02
  their fundamentals are, I would argue, misplaced or misguided.
• 1:10:05
  And that's why we're seeing so much struggle in the world and,
• 1:10:08
  and so much, you know, waste and, and so much ridiculousness
• 1:10:12
  in the world is because their first principles are often as a
• 1:10:14
  bitcoiner, once you change that operating system, you're like,
• 1:10:17
  like, oh, wait, they're wrong. And I know why they're wrong.
• 1:10:21
  And This is why I'm a Bitcoiner. So I totally love it.
• 1:10:25
  And then you get. To evolve through the stage
• 1:10:27
  where you feel like you have to orange peel everyone or tell
• 1:10:30
  everyone about Bitcoin because there's there's really this this
• 1:10:35
  evolution. Yeah.
• 1:10:36
  This is the Twain quote. It ain't what you don't know
• 1:10:38
  that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that
• 1:10:40
  just ain't so. And that, you know, and then
• 1:10:44
  it's just this idea of like, OK, so when you're a level in on
• 1:10:47
  Bitcoin and you start to understand the power of of
• 1:10:51
  actually controlling your own capital, you know, at first it's
• 1:10:55
  very tempting to want to, you know, mess up Thanksgiving
• 1:10:59
  dinner and annoy your brother-in-law and like, and
• 1:11:02
  like tweeting all caps. But you got to grow through that
• 1:11:06
  shit because ultimately, like, it's more like Alexander
• 1:11:10
  Spetsky's philosophy. And I touch on this in the book.
• 1:11:13
  It's more about the remnant. It's more about those with ears
• 1:11:17
  to hear. It's more about you get more
• 1:11:20
  people with honey than flies. Wait for your like attracts like
• 1:11:24
  wait for someone to ask you the question and then be the
• 1:11:27
  deliverer of all of your dope knowledge about bear instruments
• 1:11:32
  and the Fed. But don't just don't just force
• 1:11:35
  feed it. So it's kind of like a stage of
• 1:11:37
  growth and they call that the remnant.
• 1:11:39
  And you know, the idea is, is that a smaller adoption curve
• 1:11:43
  with people that have higher signal is actually better for
• 1:11:46
  the network than a lot of people just buying Bitcoin and then
• 1:11:49
  text you the next day being like, why did it go down 10%?
• 1:11:52
  Why did it go up 5%? Because they're just going to
• 1:11:54
  paper hand the next bowling bear run.
• 1:11:56
  What we actually want is people to improve their, their data
• 1:11:59
  set, their knowledge, their, their, their, their
• 1:12:02
  interpretation of finance. And then those are the people
• 1:12:05
  that are going to be with us, you know, 5-10 years down the
• 1:12:08
  line when we have these ridiculous valuations and
• 1:12:11
  they'll be strong enough to know what they're holding.
• 1:12:14
  Totally agree. Totally agree, Joseph.
• 1:12:16
  All right, we are kind of getting towards the end of the
• 1:12:18
  show, but Joseph, I do want to give you the last words here.
• 1:12:24
  What would be your TLDR on the meme?
• 1:12:28
  Bitcoin fixes this? So if someone happens to watch
• 1:12:31
  this show, they're kind of new to Bitcoin, you know, you're
• 1:12:34
  kind of getting them interested in your book.
• 1:12:37
  What is the elevator pitch on how Bitcoin fixes this?
• 1:12:41
  Absolutely, and I'll drop that in short order.
• 1:12:43
  Just first thanks Chris and thanks Opti and you know for
• 1:12:47
  having me on and and thanks Nico, you know, for tapping in
• 1:12:51
  with me on the orange pill app and giving me a platform to tell
• 1:12:54
  people about pay attention to Bitcoin.
• 1:12:56
  I really appreciate this and the signal you put out everyday.
• 1:12:59
  It's tireless work and you do it with a smile on your face.
• 1:13:02
  So thank you both. OK, let's get to your question.
• 1:13:05
  How do you TLDR Bitcoin? You know what I would say to
• 1:13:10
  someone is I would be like Bitcoin is the ability to be
• 1:13:13
  your own bank. Like do you like how do you feel
• 1:13:16
  when you get overdraft fees? Like they're pretty, you know,
• 1:13:20
  how do you feel when when you can't access your funds?
• 1:13:24
  How do you feel when you need cash and it's Sunday?
• 1:13:28
  And I would just ask questions like how do you feel when you
• 1:13:31
  get charged 20% on a credit card?
• 1:13:33
  How do you feel when Western Union takes takes a major RIP
• 1:13:37
  out of the remittances you want to send to your family in
• 1:13:40
  Paraguay, Iroquois, El Salvador? Like how do you, and then just,
• 1:13:44
  it depends on who the audience is, but there's always a
• 1:13:46
  question. So you ask that question and
• 1:13:47
  then you say Bitcoin fixes this. Hold on, hold on, hold on.
• 1:13:54
  Let's go. Let's go.
• 1:13:56
  Well, Chris, you wanna, you wanna ask a question, chime in
• 1:13:59
  here commentary before we wrap up the show.
• 1:14:02
  I know I've been having you sit, sit back there chilling.
• 1:14:04
  So. No, I'm excited to get my hands
• 1:14:06
  on the book. Joe, thanks for coming on the
• 1:14:08
  show. Always appreciate the guests and
• 1:14:11
  now all the contributions. Thanks to everyone for watching
• 1:14:14
  the show. Appreciate you and all the
• 1:14:16
  bitcoiners. I'll just end with stay humble
• 1:14:18
  Stacks ads. Bars.
• 1:14:20
  Absolute bars. OK, I'll give you one, one last
• 1:14:23
  one last plug Chris and then we'll give Joseph plug.
• 1:14:27
  Of course, everyone knows Chris by now.
• 1:14:29
  He's he's off the bench, everyone's favorite nice guy
• 1:14:32
  bitcoiner out here. So Chris, plug your stuff and
• 1:14:35
  then we'll wrap the show up. Yeah, you can find me on Twitter
• 1:14:38
  at Chris Alemo, the number six and then also on Noster.
• 1:14:42
  Chris Alemo at B dot TC is my nip 5 identifier.
• 1:14:46
  I don't know how to do my end pub.
• 1:14:48
  I can't list the end pub off the top of my memory, but if you
• 1:14:50
  find me on there I'm I'm there. Let's go.
• 1:14:54
  All right. You as well, Joseph.
• 1:14:57
  If you want to send someone to the book, you can tell him to go
• 1:15:00
  to pay attention to pay attention to bitcoin.com or type
• 1:15:03
  pay attention to Bitcoin into Amazon.
• 1:15:05
  If you want to catch me on socials on my next, it's at
• 1:15:08
  Joseph Voble. Maybe Opti can drop it in the
• 1:15:11
  chat or put it in the show notes because it's a mouthful of
• 1:15:13
  spaghetti to spell. Appreciate the platform being on
• 1:15:16
  here guys. Appreciate, appreciate it bro.
• 1:15:19
  Have a have a good one. Thanks for coming on.
• 1:15:22
  All right guys, let me pull you off stream.
• 1:15:24
  All right, boys and girls, mainly boys and some girls, it's
• 1:15:29
  Friday. If you like this content like
• 1:15:32
  share subscribe, all that good stuff, we'll be back Monday with
• 1:15:35
  our normal scheduled show 1215 more like 12:20 PM Eastern.
• 1:15:40
  So don't yell at me about the the late, the late start time
• 1:15:44
  guys, if you're here often, you know we start around till 1220.
• 1:15:49
  All right guys, peace out. I will see you on the other
• 1:15:52
  side. Have a good weekend.
• 1:15:57
  You buy bitcoinwell.com, a Bitcoin only platform, on a
• 1:16:00
  mission to enable financial independence.