Latest / Stories That Live In Us / These Are My Kinfolk: A Juneteenth Reunion (with Linda Epps Parker) | Episode 64

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These Are My Kinfolk: A Juneteenth Reunion (with Linda Epps Parker) | Episode 64 · Stories That Live In Us

• 0:00
  Linda Parker: When I think of Juneteenth now, I have a smile on my face because I think of what went before to get us to the point that we are now.
• 0:14
  Crista Cowan: Stories that Live In Us is a podcast that inspires you to form deep connections with your family, past, present and future.
• 0:22
  Crista Cowan: I'm Crista Cowan, known online as The Barefoot Genealogist.
• 0:26
  Crista Cowan: I've spent my whole life discovering the power of family history and I know that sharing the stories that live in you can change everything.
• 0:33
  Crista Cowan: Do you ever sit and have a conversation with someone that you just want to keep going and going?
• 0:42
  Crista Cowan: That is how I feel about today's guest.
• 0:45
  Crista Cowan: Her name is Linda Epps Parker, and she has a story that is so beautiful and so epic, but her perspective about the story is what drew me in the most.
• 1:00
  Crista Cowan: Now, before we dive into this story, there's a couple of things that you need to know.
• 1:04
  Crista Cowan: First, this year is the 160th anniversary of the end of the Civil War and of Juneteenth.
• 1:18
  Crista Cowan: Last year, on Juneteenth, I had, on episode 11, two guests, kelly and her mother, miss Marie, talking about their experience filming a documentary with Ancestry about a man named Hawkins Wilson.
• 1:32
  Crista Cowan: If you have not seen the Hawkins Wilson film, I would encourage you whether you're listening to this on your jog or walking your dog, or whether you're watching this on YouTube to hit pause, to go to the Ancestry YouTube channel and to watch the Hawkins-Wilson film.
• 1:51
  Crista Cowan: It's less than 30 minutes long and it is one of the most beautiful stories.
• 1:57
  Crista Cowan: My producer, lisa, had a hand in that.
• 2:00
  Crista Cowan: She was the one who found the Hawkins-Wilson letter during some research that we were doing for Ancestry, for some records we were putting online, and she spent about a year and a half of her life along with several other genealogists and researchers collaborating to figure out how to put together this story.
• 2:19
  Crista Cowan: And it's worth watching, not just because it's an amazing story, but because it'll help you understand the context of my conversation today with Linda.
• 2:29
  Crista Cowan: So hit pause, go find that over on the Ancestry YouTube channel, but then don't forget to come back, because you're going to want to hear the rest of my conversation with Linda about her experience making that film.
• 2:44
  Crista Cowan: Linda, thank you so much for joining me today.
• 2:47
  Crista Cowan: I'm excited to have this conversation with you.
• 2:49
  Crista Cowan: I would love to just get started by hearing a little bit about what stories you heard about your family while you were growing up.
• 2:59
  Linda Parker: My dad.
• 3:00
  Linda Parker: You know he talked about where he was born and raised and then his family moved to Newark, new Jersey.
• 3:12
  Linda Parker: But every summer he and his brothers would have to go back down to Virginia, to the family property there, and do farming chores, which you know they didn't like, because you know the hours were different from their normal hours when they were living in Newark.
• 3:36
  Linda Parker: They would have to get up like very early in the morning and do all of the family chores, you know, milking the cows, you cows, other things out in the field.
• 3:47
  Linda Parker: And by the time he said he was 18, he had decided he was done, he was not going back down South again and he didn't and so I never went down South.
• 4:04
  Linda Parker: We call that down south, but I never went to the south.
• 4:07
  Linda Parker: I never went to the family property there.
• 4:10
  Linda Parker: I never met any of my cousins that live down there or are kinfolk, but my father's immediate siblings they were all raised in North New Jersey, so I was very close to all of them and my mother too, my father's mother, so I grew up with her.
• 4:35
  Linda Parker: So it's just, it's very interesting and has been interesting to see the lineage that Ancestry had created and to see my grandmother's name there, along with my father and then my great-grandfather.
• 4:53
  Linda Parker: It was just awe-inspiring.
• 4:58
  Linda Parker: I just get lost for words as to how touched I was after I received the call from Lisa and it just really changed my perspective on everything and it sort of brought home a lot of the feelings that I had when I was growing up, that I felt there was something special in my dad's family, but I didn't know what that special was.
• 5:29
  Linda Parker: But I just always felt like there was something there and I needed to know more.
• 5:37
  Linda Parker: But my dad wasn't a real talker and so I couldn't get a lot out of him.
• 5:45
  Linda Parker: But I, you know, I knew of some of the aunts that my dad grew up with and my grandmother's sisters who still live down there.
• 5:58
  Linda Parker: I never met any of them.
• 5:59
  Linda Parker: I only know, you know, my really my dad's siblings, but not my grandmother's kinfolk.
• 6:08
  Crista Cowan: You mentioned that you grew up with your grandmother.
• 6:10
  Crista Cowan: Was she alive for most of your childhood or when did she pass?
• 6:15
  Linda Parker: She passed away when I was 14.
• 6:18
  Crista Cowan: Okay, so you had a lot of time with her.
• 6:20
  Crista Cowan: You've had a lot of time with her.
• 6:22
  Linda Parker: Oh yes, oh yes.
• 6:23
  Linda Parker: A lot of time with her, which again is just when I see her name and, you know, right there with my dad it's like, oh my gosh.
• 6:33
  Linda Parker: You know, like I know this woman, I grew up with her, and so it's very heartwarming.
• 6:44
  Crista Cowan: Yeah, you mentioned.
• 6:45
  Crista Cowan: Your dad wasn't much of a talker, but was your grandmother a storyteller at all?
• 6:49
  Linda Parker: I can't remember any of the stories that she might have told.
• 6:53
  Linda Parker: You know, I just remember my dad talking about his folks that lived down south and my aunt and uncles they would talk about.
• 7:06
  Linda Parker: You know the family too, but they were just stories about them.
• 7:11
  Linda Parker: You know their experience.
• 7:12
  Linda Parker: It was their names and you know and how they lived, but it wasn't anything quite tangible that I could like say, oh, you know, we sat around and we talked about this person and that person.
• 7:26
  Linda Parker: It wasn't like that at all.
• 7:28
  Crista Cowan: You mentioned that you know most of your dad's family was in New Jersey.
• 7:32
  Crista Cowan: Did anybody from the South that lived there ever come visit you?
• 7:36
  Crista Cowan: Not that I recall so the way that the family sometimes just gets kind of separated because of that distance or that location or the choices that people make.
• 7:46
  Crista Cowan: So as a child, knowing you had family there, you know I imagine there was some kind of a longing for a connection to them and to what was happening in the family.
• 7:58
  Linda Parker: I wish I could have gone down there to meet them, could have gone down there to meet them.
• 8:10
  Linda Parker: I think that, you know that would have helped me to understand where this feeling that I had about my kinfolk that lived there, but I didn't.
• 8:18
  Linda Parker: My cousin Valerie.
• 8:20
  Linda Parker: She did go down to the family property there and she, you know, told me about her experience there, but she just went, you know, I think maybe once or twice, but she had an experience and an experience that I didn't have, and none of my siblings went down there either.
• 8:44
  Crista Cowan: And where exactly is that property?
• 8:48
  Linda Parker: All I know is in Mecklenburg County, but exactly where I don't know.
• 8:56
  Crista Cowan: So you mentioned going with Ancestry as part of this experience for this documentary and going to the church and meeting Kelly and Miss Marie, and Kelly has been on the podcast and has shared her perspective and her side of the story.
• 9:11
  Crista Cowan: I'd love to hear a little bit about your experience when you first heard about this story and as you went through that journey of meeting them and having this information unfold.
• 9:24
  Crista Cowan: Oh wow, do I need to break that down, was that?
• 9:32
  Linda Parker: too many questions.
• 9:32
  Linda Parker: No, no, no, it wasn't.
• 9:33
  Linda Parker: Wow, getting the call from Lisa was life-changing for me.
• 9:43
  Linda Parker: Alexa was life-changing for me because she first, of course, wanted to know who I am and a little bit about my dad and his family and names, and so she gave me a name and I'm like, yeah, I know that name, you know that's my grandmother.
• 10:25
  Linda Parker: And so just having that connection of somebody this is me, you know what's going on, and she explained to me, you know, like why she was contacting me and what she anticipated happening, and I'm like, oh, my goodness, like I'm going to meet cousins that I didn't even know existed, that are connected, you know, to my dad in a very, very different way.
• 10:52
  Linda Parker: You know, from what I thought, I'm thinking, you know my cousin's on the form, but Kelly and Marie they are distant, but then it was.
• 11:06
  Linda Parker: You know the whole story of Hawkins Wilson and bringing him to life for me through Kelly and Marie, and then being able to go down to Virginia and meet with them and meet with them, it just, I don't know it gave me such a wonderful feeling.
• 11:40
  Linda Parker: You know that I could like actually meet descendants of someone who was a slave, and it was in my family.
• 11:53
  Linda Parker: You know that this was happening, so it wasn't like it was, you know, so distant.
• 12:01
  Linda Parker: It just became so real in terms of my grandmother, my dad and his siblings.
• 12:09
  Linda Parker: And then, you know, looking at the names and hearing the names and hearing, you know what transpired, it just touched me.
• 12:23
  Linda Parker: I'm sorry.
• 12:24
  Linda Parker: I'm sorry, no, I get emotional too.
• 12:28
  Linda Parker: I get a little emotional about it and you know I just cannot thank Kelly and Marie enough for doing all of the research that they did and having that desire to you know, learn where they came from, and then for me to be a product of their research, you know.
• 12:55
  Linda Parker: And then Lisa just bringing us all together, it just was so overwhelming, so inspiring that I still get emotional, as you can tell, when I talk about it and I imagine you grew up with Valerie right.
• 13:20
  Crista Cowan: Oh gosh, yes.
• 13:21
  Crista Cowan: So being there with her and being able to have that experience together, I imagine, was also just additive to that experience.
• 13:28
  Crista Cowan: Oh, it, I imagine, was also just additive to that experience.
• 13:30
  Linda Parker: Oh, it did.
• 13:31
  Linda Parker: Valerie and I have always been very close and we remain very close, and so I couldn't think of a better person to go on that journey with me.
• 13:43
  Linda Parker: Valerie is very much into ancestry and she helped teach me about it, so it was like a full circle to have that journey with her and to see and be, you know, in that area where our ancestors were and we talk about it often.
• 14:11
  Crista Cowan: I would love to just know more about, like, since that experience of meeting Kelly and Marie and going on that journey with Valerie and learning more about Hawkins Wilson and his family, what else you have learned about your grandmother and her family and that path that connects you to them and to that story?
• 14:31
  Linda Parker: My immediate family has always been about family.
• 14:35
  Linda Parker: You know.
• 14:36
  Linda Parker: We always had get-togethers and we had fun and we enjoyed each other.
• 14:41
  Linda Parker: Every summer, you know, we would get together either at Valerie's parents' home or somewhere else.
• 14:49
  Linda Parker: It was always family gatherings.
• 14:53
  Linda Parker: So when I found out about Hawkins Wilson and his journey, you know, and the fact that he was taken away from his family and it took him all of his life to search for the family that he was taken away from, that again touches me because it's like he was never able to reconnect with the family that he was taken away from.
• 15:27
  Linda Parker: But through Kelly and Marie, through their research, we were able to connect and that is like a coming together that we will always, always cherish.
• 15:46
  Linda Parker: When I got together with Kelly and Marie, there was such a locked connection when we were brought together and it's like, wow, you know, these are my kinfolk and they had this longing to know where they came from, the same as Valerie and I did.
• 16:14
  Linda Parker: And then knowing where you come from the people that you know came before you and they're actually your relatives just makes a real big difference.
• 16:23
  Linda Parker: Relatives just makes a real big difference.
• 16:30
  Linda Parker: Like I know who I am, I know, you know where my people come from.
• 16:35
  Linda Parker: I know a lot of who I am just from learning about Hawkins Wilson and learning from Kelly and Marie about their family.
• 16:47
  Linda Parker: You know, it's like you can just touch these people Right.
• 16:56
  Linda Parker: You know, I hope I'm explaining myself right.
• 17:01
  Crista Cowan: You have articulated, I think, what a lot of us feel but can't put into words, and I think you've done it beautifully.
• 17:07
  Crista Cowan: So thank you, oh, thank you, thank you.
• 17:10
  Linda Parker: Like I can't thank Ancestry enough for connecting the dots, and all of the connections then led to me, and so when I think back on how these dots became connected, I'm like this is too much.
• 17:32
  Crista Cowan: Well, maybe a little bit inspired or guided from the other side, right?
• 17:37
  Crista Cowan: I believe that it was.
• 17:39
  Linda Parker: Yeah, I do too.
• 17:40
  Linda Parker: Absolutely I believe that it was, and that makes it so much better.
• 17:47
  Crista Cowan: I understand from the story of Hawkins and how things kind of unfolded, that there's another dot that connects you to Hawkins Wilson, which is something to do with the date of his letter.
• 18:03
  Linda Parker: Oh my gosh, in Virginia at the church and Lisa presented me with Hawkins' letter to read, the first thing that I noticed was the date on his letter was May 11th it's my dad's birthday.
• 18:29
  Linda Parker: And I made that Valerie and I made that connection and we both were like, oh my gosh, you know, may 11, 18, whatever I'm like, that's my dad's birthday and it's again one of those connecting the dot type of things that it's.
• 18:45
  Linda Parker: It was meant to be, it just was meant to be, it just was meant to be.
• 18:51
  Linda Parker: And that made me feel like I just wanted to hug.
• 18:59
  Linda Parker: I just wanted to hug somebody.
• 19:03
  Linda Parker: You know, I hugged Valerie.
• 19:06
  Crista Cowan: Well, there you go.
• 19:06
  Crista Cowan: I love that.
• 19:07
  Crista Cowan: That's amazing.
• 19:08
  Crista Cowan: I don't think I've ever heard that piece of the story before.
• 19:11
  Crista Cowan: Thank you for sharing that, Linda.
• 19:12
  Crista Cowan: When did your dad pass?
• 19:14
  Crista Cowan: In September 2003.
• 19:16
  Crista Cowan: And so as you went on this journey, you know, and especially as you figured out that the letter had the same date as his birthday, you know, we talked a little bit about them being with us.
• 19:34
  Crista Cowan: What do you think about the relationship with your dad and your grandma and how they would have thought about this journey?
• 19:36
  Crista Cowan: Oh my gosh.
• 19:38
  Linda Parker: I think about that often.
• 19:39
  Linda Parker: You know, from conversations that I've had with Valerie, like we both know my dad and if we had told him this story he would have nodded his head, he would have smiled a very broad smile and he was is that right?
• 19:59
  Crista Cowan: Is that right?
• 20:00
  Linda Parker: Okay, okay, like I said, Valerie calls my dad the quiet man, you know, a man of few words, but he would have just been like, okay, okay, you know, and we would take away from that right pops, you know, like this is your family, this is where you come from, and he would have been happy.
• 20:28
  Linda Parker: And he would have been happy, he would have been.
• 20:30
  Linda Parker: And I'm just, you know, sad sometimes, not sad sad, but I just wish that he had been alive to have known that this was, um, was happening well, maybe the coincidence of those dates was a little nod or wink to that.
• 20:49
  Linda Parker: I think so.
• 20:49
  Linda Parker: I like to believe that it is.
• 20:53
  Linda Parker: And you know, when his birthday comes around, May 11th, I have a different way of celebrating him, because now I can welcome Borkins-Wilson into our lives, you know, by that date connection.
• 21:10
  Crista Cowan: The beautiful, like symmetry though, of the relationship and the connection that Hawkins had with his family in that time and in that place, and then the fact that you and Kelly and Marie and Valerie were then able to reconnect in that time.
• 21:23
  Crista Cowan: Now, right, like there's just something really lovely about that.
• 21:27
  Crista Cowan: As you've learned about Hawkins Wilson and about his life and his connection particularly to Juneteenth, I'm curious to know if that has changed your perspective about Juneteenth or how you commemorate that in your own life or with your own family.
• 21:43
  Linda Parker: It's interesting because growing up in New Jersey I didn't know anything about Juneteenth.
• 21:49
  Linda Parker: But my husband and I had an opportunity to move to Dallas in 86.
• 21:56
  Linda Parker: And that was the first time that I knew anything about Juneteenth, because the people had come together in Dallas and they were having a festival and they called it a Juneteenth festival.
• 22:10
  Linda Parker: And I'm like, juneteenth, what is that, you know?
• 22:14
  Linda Parker: And so my husband and I, you know, we kind of looked it up, talked to people like what is Juneteenth?
• 22:21
  Linda Parker: And then when they told us you know how it came about, I'm like, oh my gosh, like I didn't know, like how could I live all of these years and not know about Juneteenth?
• 22:33
  Linda Parker: And so that was kind of again one of those ironic moments.
• 22:38
  Linda Parker: When I found out about Hawkins-Wilson and, you know, and I'm thinking, okay, houston, that's where, you know, juneteenth happened.
• 22:48
  Linda Parker: In Houston, that's where Kelly and Marie lived, that's where Hopkins was taken to Again, that's where those connectors come into play.
• 22:59
  Linda Parker: And I'm thinking, okay, there's something with these dot connections and it just, and it just again made me feel like I am who I am because of them no-transcript, and it just came full circle, so to speak.
• 23:27
  Linda Parker: When I think of Juneteenth now I have a smile on my face because I out about Hawkins Wilson and what happened to him, but learning more about Kelly, marie, valerie, my family, I don't have anger.
• 23:58
  Linda Parker: I just have a part of Hulken Wilson's family and we embrace the family because, you know Kelly and Marie, they have a close-knit family too.
• 24:24
  Linda Parker: And so when I look at my family and how we, they have a close-knit family too.
• 24:26
  Linda Parker: And so when I look at my family and how we grew up close-knit and I think that Hawkins you know his siblings and their relatives grew up close too and he was the one that was taken away.
• 24:44
  Crista Cowan: Close enough that years later, he remembered enough about them, right I?
• 24:50
  Linda Parker: know, he knew their names.
• 24:52
  Linda Parker: He, you know.
• 24:54
  Linda Parker: Yes, that was.
• 24:55
  Linda Parker: One of the amazing parts was that he knew all of their names and he knew where they lived.
• 25:01
  Linda Parker: And, you know, he just never, ever forgot his family.
• 25:06
  Linda Parker: He had this longing in his heart to find them, to reconnect with them, but that didn't stop him from making his own family where he was and making a life for himself.
• 25:22
  Crista Cowan: It's interesting that you mentioned the longing that he had, and I feel a little bit like it echoes the longing you expressed at the beginning of our conversation about wanting to know more, and maybe that's why you recognize that in him and that resonates with you so much.
• 25:37
  Linda Parker: It does.
• 25:38
  Linda Parker: It resonates a lot with me.
• 25:40
  Linda Parker: Feeling that connection is just wonderful feeling that connection is just wonderful.
• 25:50
  Crista Cowan: You are delightful.
• 25:51
  Crista Cowan: I love your energy.
• 25:51
  Crista Cowan: I love the way you share this story and your experience and I love the way that you view it.
• 25:54
  Crista Cowan: And for people who haven't engaged in family history before, who haven't stepped into that, you know, what would you say to them?
• 26:03
  Crista Cowan: I know some people are apprehensive, people are curious about their family.
• 26:07
  Crista Cowan: I think a lot of people feel that longing that you feel, but I think there's also some fear.
• 26:11
  Crista Cowan: You mentioned the anger that you experienced and had to process and go through learning about Hawkins.
• 26:17
  Crista Cowan: I think, particularly in the black community here in the United States, there's a lot of hesitation around exploring family history because they're going to have to face some of those emotions.
• 26:28
  Crista Cowan: And what would you say or what advice would you give?
• 26:33
  Linda Parker: I would say just take that leap of faith, Just do it.
• 26:39
  Linda Parker: I mean, we have the tools now to do a lot of the research and the capability to do the research that we weren't able to do, you know, years ago.
• 26:51
  Linda Parker: Ancestry provides a tool that people can go and they can do their research, and you can do it from the comfort of your home.
• 27:01
  Linda Parker: If you want to you to, you can process the information on your own.
• 27:07
  Linda Parker: But I think that if you want to know your history, you want to know about your relatives and maybe tap into where you came from.
• 27:19
  Linda Parker: Do it, Then you'll have a wealth of knowledge opened up to you as to how your family came to be where they are.
• 27:30
  Linda Parker: And I think the more curious we are about our past, the better we understand who we are.
• 27:40
  Crista Cowan: I think your perspective is so unique and the way that you talk about connecting the dots dots both now and in the past and the bridge between those two things I just think it's just really lovely and I think it's going to resonate with a lot of people as you think about kind of taking this information and the emotions and the knowledge that you've gained and the experience into the future.
• 28:04
  Crista Cowan: What is your hope for the future?
• 28:07
  Linda Parker: That's a good question.
• 28:09
  Linda Parker: My hope for the future is to just live in harmony, you know, accept people as they are and not try to make people be who you want them to be.
• 28:23
  Linda Parker: But accept them as they are and just be mindful that not everybody is going to resonate with you.
• 28:36
  Linda Parker: We're all different.
• 28:39
  Linda Parker: We are all different, but we all have a good heart and if you just talk to people, you will find that you have some commonality with them and you can talk to them.
• 28:55
  Linda Parker: And if they don't, if you don't click, that's okay too, but give it a try.
• 29:03
  Crista Cowan: That's lovely, lovely parting advice.
• 29:04
  Crista Cowan: Thank you so much for that and thank you for being here.
• 29:07
  Linda Parker: I do want to thank you for taking the time to reach out to me and have me be a part of your podcast.