Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Caught on Video: Did Evil Auntie Push Tot, 3, Into Lake Michigan to Die?

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Caught on Video: Did Evil Auntie Push Tot, 3, Into Lake Michigan to Die? · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. It started out as a
0:16
Speaker 1: beautiful day, but it ended in tragedy for a three
0:22
Speaker 1: year old little boy. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories.
0:28
Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation
0:31
Speaker 1: in series M one eleven. First of all, take a
0:34
Speaker 1: listen to our friends at Fox thirty two. A beautiful
0:37
Speaker 1: day on the lake took a terrifying turn around one
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Speaker 1: this afternoon when a young boy ended up in the water,
0:44
Speaker 1: unable to stay afloat, and we ask that you keep
0:47
Speaker 1: the family in your thoughts. Chicago fire and police officials
0:51
Speaker 1: responded to the north side of Navy Pier, with divers
0:54
Speaker 1: jumping in to rescue the three year old. According to
0:57
Speaker 1: the Fire Department, the child had gone into cardiac arrest.
1:01
Speaker 1: Child was rushed to Laurie Children's Hospital and is currently
1:04
Speaker 1: undergoing treatment. And more from our friends at WGNI, he
1:10
Speaker 1: was on his back, it says the distress cold first
1:14
Speaker 1: came shortly after one that afternoon, but it was Ashton
1:17
Speaker 1: King who dial at nine one one. Her friend Ali
1:20
Speaker 1: was in Chicago from out of town. They'd just been
1:22
Speaker 1: on a bush and we're on the north side of
1:24
Speaker 1: the pier as we were walking. My girlfriend said, did
1:27
Speaker 1: you hear that splash? And I was like no. Then
1:30
Speaker 1: they spotted a woman looking into the water. Obviously we
1:34
Speaker 1: were curious, what are you looking at? We did not
1:37
Speaker 1: expect to look down and see a little boy. Can
1:39
Speaker 1: you imagine that moment you see people looking down in
1:44
Speaker 1: the water and you look down and see what you
1:49
Speaker 1: certainly did not expect a little boy in the water.
1:53
Speaker 1: It goes on, take a listen to Bernac, to Malty
1:56
Speaker 1: and panic set in. It turned to her and I said,
1:59
Speaker 1: do you know him? How did he fall in? Were
2:00
Speaker 1: you here and he fell in? Are you with him? Mike?
2:05
Speaker 1: And she never gave me a clear concise answer. I
2:07
Speaker 1: called nine one one and nine on one, you know, frantic,
2:11
Speaker 1: I'm like, there's there's a child in the water. As
2:13
Speaker 1: King was on the phone, she remembered seeing something further back.
2:16
Speaker 1: I remember seeing a big red case that holds the
2:20
Speaker 1: life donut preserver and I remember thinking, oh my gosh,
2:25
Speaker 1: go round, go get that, go get that Azali round
2:27
Speaker 1: to get dashed. The little boy went under and more
2:30
Speaker 1: from our friends at Fox at thirty two. Ashton King,
2:34
Speaker 1: a mother of three, still can't shake what she saw here.
2:37
Speaker 1: At Navy Pierre Monday afternoon, my friend said, oh, I
2:41
Speaker 1: just heard a splash. That splash turned out to be
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Speaker 1: a three year old boy police was pushed into Lake
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Speaker 1: Michigan by his own aunt. Thirty four year old Victoria Moreno.
2:51
Speaker 1: King was visiting the area from the suburbs. Her best friend,
2:54
Speaker 1: a train diver, wasn't town you're again. We're hearing our
2:56
Speaker 1: friend Tia Ewing from Fox thirty two, who is joining
3:01
Speaker 1: us right now. But before I go to Fox thirty two,
3:04
Speaker 1: superstar to you Ewing, I want to go to another
3:08
Speaker 1: special guest joining us, Ashton King, a mother of three
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Speaker 1: who not only call nine one one, but ran to
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Speaker 1: a live preserver and threw it in to try and
3:22
Speaker 1: save three year old Josiah Brown. Ashton, thank you for
3:27
Speaker 1: being with us. Thank you for having me. Ashton. What
3:31
Speaker 1: happened that day? Where did it all start? Well, as
3:35
Speaker 1: you've heard in the story, my best friend was in
3:37
Speaker 1: from out of town. She had been in the weekend
3:41
Speaker 1: then was her last day here and I thought we
3:43
Speaker 1: should do something a little tourist see in Chicago. So
3:46
Speaker 1: we decided let's go down to Navy Pier. We're going
3:48
Speaker 1: to do a boat tour down the Chicago River. It
3:52
Speaker 1: takes off from Navy Pier so at eleven forty five.
3:55
Speaker 1: That's when our tour took off. We got off the
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Speaker 1: boat about one pm, a little after one, and decided
4:01
Speaker 1: that we wanted to go to the north end of
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Speaker 1: the pier. Hey, Ashton, hold on on second. For those
4:06
Speaker 1: of you that didn't hear it from our friend Tia
4:11
Speaker 1: Ewing at Fox thirty two, Chicago, it's not just a
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Speaker 1: child falling in the water. Right there at the end
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Speaker 1: you hear pushed into the water. And with me right now,
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Speaker 1: Ashton King the witness that call nine one one and
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Speaker 1: ran to a live preserver to throw to a little
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Speaker 1: three year old Josiah. So you're out on this tour,
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Speaker 1: a boat tour, right and then what happened? So then
4:38
Speaker 1: we get off the tour and we decided there is
4:42
Speaker 1: an actually there's a rooftop restaurant and bar on the
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Speaker 1: north side of the pier. I had gone before for
4:48
Speaker 1: previous years ago for a friend's birthday, and I thought
4:50
Speaker 1: it would be very nice scenery to overlook the water.
4:53
Speaker 1: I said, let's go have you know, we'll have a cocktail,
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Speaker 1: we'll have some lunch, and then we'll end the day.
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Speaker 1: You know. So as you were walking to the location, Um,
5:04
Speaker 1: my friend and I were just casually talking and she
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Speaker 1: said she heard a splash, and they said, I didn't
5:09
Speaker 1: hear the splash. We kept walking. Oh gosh, Ashton, when
5:14
Speaker 1: you say I heard the splash, your your friend heard
5:17
Speaker 1: the splash, and you did not hear the splash, and
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Speaker 1: then you kept walking. Yeah, I'm just thinking the splash
5:28
Speaker 1: and then one Mississippi, two Mississippi, three Mississippi. As you're walking,
5:38
Speaker 1: we all on the panel right now, know what that
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Speaker 1: splash was. It was three year old Josiah, and I'm
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Speaker 1: thinking of you and your friend, you know, just walking
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Speaker 1: toward the rooftop lunch. And you know, however, many feet away,
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Speaker 1: jes Saiah has just gone into that cold water, and
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Speaker 1: nobody realizes yet what had happened. Go ahead, yeah, nobody.
6:02
Speaker 1: I would like to just mention that it was a
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Speaker 1: Monday in the middle of September, so you don't really
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Speaker 1: have many tourists in the area, you know. I mean,
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Speaker 1: it was very very quiet, especially on that side of
6:12
Speaker 1: the fire. There were many people around. So as we
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Speaker 1: walk ahead, I see a woman kind of bent over
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Speaker 1: looking into the water, I mean staring into the water,
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Speaker 1: which seems peculiar to us. Um I guess I thought
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Speaker 1: maybe she was looking at I don't know, of some wildlife.
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Speaker 1: There was a I didn't know at that point, but
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Speaker 1: she was the only one around. So we stopped where
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Speaker 1: she stopped. And like I tell you, when I listened
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Speaker 1: to that water, I did not expect to see a
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Speaker 1: little boy floating on his back. I m I immediately
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Speaker 1: went into panic mode and just spirated the lady now
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Speaker 1: that we know as the aunt, with questions what happened?
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Speaker 1: How did this happen? And she did not give me
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Speaker 1: any answer. Guys, you're hearing the voice of Ashton King
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Speaker 1: that jumped into action when she sees a little boy.
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Speaker 1: Now you heard Ashton King, the good Samaritan, state that
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Speaker 1: the boy was on his bat like floating. But remember
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Speaker 1: this is rough water. It's hard. It's hard to keep
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Speaker 1: floating or treading water in that kind of body of water.
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Speaker 1: He was floating then, but it didn't last long. Take
7:32
Speaker 1: a listen to our friends at wb BM and again
7:36
Speaker 1: Fox thirty two. The three year old is on a
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Speaker 1: ventilator here at Larry Children's Hospital. He has swelling and
7:42
Speaker 1: his brain. His lungs have been bleeding and he's gone
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Speaker 1: into cardiac arrest a number of times. His injuries are
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Speaker 1: severely life threatening. He just was looking straight up at
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Speaker 1: this guy, just terrified. The three year old boy was
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Speaker 1: found at the bottom of the lake and isn't likely
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Speaker 1: to survive his injuries. Ashton King with me, mother of three.
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Speaker 1: He called nine one one and tries to throw does
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Speaker 1: throw a life preserver out to the boy. He was
8:12
Speaker 1: looking up at the sky. That's what you remember. Ashton, Yes,
8:16
Speaker 1: floating on his back, and I just remember thinking. My
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Speaker 1: first thought was, oh my gosh, I'm so proud of him,
8:23
Speaker 1: because I'm a mother, So I was like, I'm so
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Speaker 1: proud that there's such a good job floating. I'm soon.
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Speaker 1: We're trying to talk calmly to him, My girlfriend was.
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Speaker 1: I was back and forth on the phone with nine
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Speaker 1: one one. Bit We're trying to, you know, talk to him.
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Speaker 1: But anything that we were trying to do to provide
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Speaker 1: or render aid to him kind of to help him
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Speaker 1: self preserve it just wasn't. He just wasn't responding to us.
8:52
Speaker 1: To Robert Farley, former detective County Sheriff's Police Department and
8:59
Speaker 1: Deputy US Marshall, commanding Officer of the Child Exportation Unit
9:05
Speaker 1: and consultant in Crimes against Children. Uh. It's Farley International
9:11
Speaker 1: r F. Farley dot com. Familiar with the dot Robert,
9:14
Speaker 1: thank you for being with us. How far is it
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Speaker 1: down into the water. It's good morning. It's approximately six
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Speaker 1: feet of from the actual pier down into the water
9:27
Speaker 1: for the for your listeners to I guess give your
9:29
Speaker 1: perspective that Maybe Pier is on Lake Michigan, one of
9:34
Speaker 1: the five Great lake. Uh. It's just east of what's
9:38
Speaker 1: called the Streetville neighborhood, which is where the high end residences,
9:43
Speaker 1: stores and things like that. It goes out into the
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Speaker 1: lake about I don't know, maybe thirty five hundred feet.
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Speaker 1: It's been around since the twenties. Part of the reason
9:54
Speaker 1: it's called Maybe Piers Around World War two of the
10:00
Speaker 1: naval aviators used to practice flattop aircraft can carry your
10:05
Speaker 1: landings at Nybe Pier and ficked former President George Bush
10:10
Speaker 1: the father actually trained there how to land is a
10:13
Speaker 1: plane on an aircraft carrier. So I guess that would
10:17
Speaker 1: be where the scene of this crime would be. Now.
10:21
Speaker 1: I asked him that a pretty good job of describing
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Speaker 1: the north end of the pier. But for your listeners,
10:27
Speaker 1: it's the pier goes directly east from the street or
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Speaker 1: Belle neighborhood, and then you have water on the north
10:35
Speaker 1: side of the pier, and you have water on the
10:37
Speaker 1: south side of the pier. The north side of the pier,
10:40
Speaker 1: what's kind of interesting, and Askedon briefly described it is
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Speaker 1: kind of secluded. You have a rooftop restaurant, but mostly
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Speaker 1: you have the entrances for the parking lots, the entrances
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Speaker 1: for the many frants. The boats that she talked about
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Speaker 1: are pretty much more on the south side of the pier.
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Speaker 1: In fact, as I had told your producer, I said,
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Speaker 1: strangely enough, I had been on a dinner cruise off
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Speaker 1: a navy pier a week ago. So a week ago Thursday,
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Speaker 1: I had been on a dinner cruise there. So that
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Speaker 1: kind of gives you an idea at least what the
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Speaker 1: pier looks like. The water. It's cold, I mean it's
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Speaker 1: really cold people. I mean many cases, if you're out there,
11:25
Speaker 1: you're going out there in west two. Yeah. I was
11:27
Speaker 1: just thinking that because I know out of the Santa
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Speaker 1: Cruz pier. We take the children there a lot to
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Speaker 1: see the sea lions people. Even though it's sunny California,
11:39
Speaker 1: people are in full wetsuits out there to surf because
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Speaker 1: the water is so cold. The low that day, September
11:46
Speaker 1: nineteen was estimated at fifty five, which makes me wonder
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Speaker 1: how cold that water was. Time Stories with Nancy Grace
12:11
Speaker 1: straight out to tia Ewing joining us from Fox thirty
12:15
Speaker 1: to Chicago. You can find her on Facebook, TV News
12:18
Speaker 1: Star and tia Ewing dot com. Ta thanks for being
12:24
Speaker 1: with us. So the water on Lake Michigan is very choppy, right,
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Speaker 1: It can be very choppy, that is true. And for
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Speaker 1: a three year old boy to even be able to
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Speaker 1: float in it is astounding because we've covered stories over
12:41
Speaker 1: the years and even this year, even the summer where
12:44
Speaker 1: people end up in the water and they don't make it. Yeah,
12:46
Speaker 1: it's a lot because if it's fifty five degrees in
12:50
Speaker 1: the air, the water is going to be much colder,
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Speaker 1: much colder, and then the shop being pushed off and
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Speaker 1: least six foot pier and going under and then trying
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Speaker 1: to stay to float. And I'm just thinking about what
13:07
Speaker 1: Ashton King said to you and about she looked out
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Speaker 1: and not expecting to see what she saw and then
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Speaker 1: sees a little boy's face staring up at the sky.
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Speaker 1: Shocking is very shocking, you know, and to learn more
13:27
Speaker 1: about the details of how this even happened is even
13:31
Speaker 1: more shocking. So their surveillance video that has not been
13:35
Speaker 1: released to the public because this is still an active investigation,
13:38
Speaker 1: but police did put out information about what they saw
13:42
Speaker 1: when they looked at that surveillance video. And when they
13:45
Speaker 1: looked at that surveillance video, they say that they saw
13:49
Speaker 1: Victoria Moreno, you know, basically allowing this child to go
13:54
Speaker 1: underneath what they have there, which is it's a very
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Speaker 1: thin like chance. It's nothing that would really keep you
14:02
Speaker 1: back from the water. And when people were looking, she would,
14:06
Speaker 1: according to a police at least keep him back from
14:08
Speaker 1: the water. But when people were not looking, that is
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Speaker 1: when they say, yeah, you straddled him and pushed him
14:15
Speaker 1: into the water, okay. Or of Miller, I know you're hearing,
14:18
Speaker 1: TIAU and you know you got your work cut out
14:21
Speaker 1: for you. Or Miller high profile criminal defense attorney with
14:24
Speaker 1: the Miller Farm and legal analyst. It's Chicago wbb MTV,
14:29
Speaker 1: tia or I want you to take a listen to
14:33
Speaker 1: our friend Casey Cronus, Fox thirty two. Still, exactly how
14:38
Speaker 1: this happened is unclear. Police tell us the boy was
14:41
Speaker 1: not on a boat. Instead, he was walking with a
14:44
Speaker 1: guardian when he fell into the water. Detectives stayed on
14:48
Speaker 1: scene for hours investigating. It's very early in this investigation
14:53
Speaker 1: and the area three detectives are reviewing everything and exploring
14:58
Speaker 1: all the circumstances. And we're told that adults who was
15:01
Speaker 1: with the little boy at the time was being interviewed
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Speaker 1: by police earlier this afternoon. That's right, being interviewed to
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Speaker 1: find out exactly what happened. Witness number one, Good Samaritan
15:14
Speaker 1: Ashton King, was there had immediately jumped into action, directing
15:20
Speaker 1: that nine o one be call. Trying to throw a
15:22
Speaker 1: life preserver out to the little boy, listen to. Tara
15:28
Speaker 1: Molina Moreno grabbed his foot and pulled him from the
15:31
Speaker 1: edge while looking around waiting for people to leave, and
15:34
Speaker 1: when no one was around, she allowed him to crawl
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Speaker 1: back under the barrier, eventually going over it herself. Looking
15:40
Speaker 1: around again. Crouching down straddling the three year old, she
15:45
Speaker 1: pushed him into Lake Michigan. They say, she sat down
15:48
Speaker 1: and stared into the water where the little boy was struggling,
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Speaker 1: saying and doing nothing. All of this caught on surveillance cameras.
15:56
Speaker 1: You know, Ashton King joining me the witness. We're all
16:01
Speaker 1: talking about the Good Samaritan. Ashton, I was just thinking
16:06
Speaker 1: about that impulse that you know when you see other
16:09
Speaker 1: people looking up. We all look up, go what of
16:12
Speaker 1: what is it? People will look down and you look
16:15
Speaker 1: down after you earlier heard the splash and see the
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Speaker 1: little boy. What kind of shot? Went through your mind?
16:22
Speaker 1: As a mother of three, you know, at first, first second,
16:27
Speaker 1: I couldn't believe that this was real. I couldn't believe
16:30
Speaker 1: that I was seeing what I was seeing. That was
16:33
Speaker 1: my first instinct. And you know, in that moment, you
16:39
Speaker 1: you don't eat. There's nothing in this world that can
16:41
Speaker 1: prepare you for being put in a situation like that.
16:45
Speaker 1: But I knew, I knew I had to do something
16:48
Speaker 1: I had but I had to be I had to
16:50
Speaker 1: be calculated in in my thinking and in that moment.
16:53
Speaker 1: So I knew nine when one was my first, my
16:56
Speaker 1: first line of action. And while I'm on the phone
17:01
Speaker 1: with nine one one, it was very important to have
17:03
Speaker 1: Ali stay Alie with my friend who was there with me,
17:07
Speaker 1: stay with the child. She tried to direct him off
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Speaker 1: float towards the boat that was parked, maybe he could
17:14
Speaker 1: get up, she ran. I directed her to go run
17:17
Speaker 1: and get the life preserver. I made sure that I
17:22
Speaker 1: stay as calm as I could on the phone with
17:24
Speaker 1: nine one to make sure that I could give them
17:26
Speaker 1: the most precise location of where we were and where
17:29
Speaker 1: the child was in the water, from landmarks to parking
17:33
Speaker 1: garages to anything I could possibly give them to pinpoint
17:40
Speaker 1: them to the exact location where he was. Ashton, do
17:44
Speaker 1: you remember did you teach your children how to swim?
17:47
Speaker 1: So that was a big thing for me. We did
17:49
Speaker 1: start swimming lessons. Actually they've been in for about a
17:54
Speaker 1: year now. And my first thought was, all this, maybe
18:00
Speaker 1: maybe he learned like that that that's like preserving kind
18:06
Speaker 1: of float floating on their back. I mean, I was,
18:08
Speaker 1: I was. I was so um impressed, uh that he
18:15
Speaker 1: was doing that um at the moment, and I thought, maybe,
18:20
Speaker 1: you know, he had kind of been taught the same
18:25
Speaker 1: things that my kids have been taught. Because when did
18:27
Speaker 1: you realize that something was very very wrong? Aston The
18:31
Speaker 1: first thing I realized was that, Um, he had vomited
18:35
Speaker 1: once in the water. UM. And so I I as
18:37
Speaker 1: an onfluence nine one one, I said, please, please, he
18:40
Speaker 1: just vomited in the water. Um. You know, I'm going
18:44
Speaker 1: back and forth with them, UM. And that that was
18:47
Speaker 1: the moment that I knew that this is this is
18:50
Speaker 1: not going well. UM. Not that it would go well, right,
18:54
Speaker 1: but this is just this is just not this is
18:57
Speaker 1: it happened? It was progressing so fastly. And I want
19:02
Speaker 1: it to be known that obviously, any mother's first instinct
19:05
Speaker 1: is to jump in and saves a child. But I
19:11
Speaker 1: was very fortunate to have a friend who is training
19:16
Speaker 1: to be a dive master and who had just taken
19:19
Speaker 1: a dive safety class. And there are a lot of
19:22
Speaker 1: factors that went into our decision to not immediately jump
19:26
Speaker 1: in after the boy. I want to talk about the
19:28
Speaker 1: little boy vomiting. Josiah joining me is doctor free and
19:33
Speaker 1: Hass pediatriction. Of course, the specialty is pediatric emergency medicine.
19:39
Speaker 1: She is the founder of pedmom dot com, peed imom
19:46
Speaker 1: dot com. Doctor Hass, thank you for being with us.
19:48
Speaker 1: Why was the boy vomiting so? Um? There are very
19:51
Speaker 1: distinct stages to drowning that we know quite well six
19:55
Speaker 1: stages of drowning. And once they reached the stage where
20:00
Speaker 1: they're sort of ending their struggle, they're not really able
20:03
Speaker 1: to keep themselves aslope very much. They start to actually
20:07
Speaker 1: swallow water, so part of that they will swallow, part
20:10
Speaker 1: of that they will start to aspirate, and oftentimes the
20:13
Speaker 1: water that they're swallowing causes them to vomit, so that
20:16
Speaker 1: means that they've already entered the stage where they're aspirating
20:20
Speaker 1: water and they're past the point of being able to
20:22
Speaker 1: struggle much longer. Dodger has it is a horrible, horrible feeling.
20:26
Speaker 1: I remember before the twins were born, John, David and Lacy,
20:30
Speaker 1: when I still dived a lot. I was on the
20:34
Speaker 1: other side of the world diving and I had gone
20:37
Speaker 1: way down further than I really should have gone at
20:40
Speaker 1: that time and breathe in to my spider and it
20:45
Speaker 1: didn't work, and I sucked in water and immediately very
20:51
Speaker 1: far down under the surface started vomiting up water. And
20:56
Speaker 1: when you're doing that and you're underwater, you then catch
21:01
Speaker 1: your breath. You can't breathe back in. It's a horrible
21:04
Speaker 1: almost claustrophobic feeling. Yeah, it's a very I mean, the
21:10
Speaker 1: whole entire situation is terrible. Why I do want to
21:13
Speaker 1: just say for those listening to that, unfortunately, drowning is
21:16
Speaker 1: being number one cause of accidental death and children from
21:19
Speaker 1: ages one to four, we see massive, massive numbers of this. Obviously,
21:24
Speaker 1: this is a little bit of a different situation because
21:26
Speaker 1: it wasn't just an accidental drowning. But that's unfortunately, why
21:31
Speaker 1: we know so much about drowning and how it occurs
21:34
Speaker 1: in the stages of drowning is because it's so common.
21:36
Speaker 1: But of course, as doctor has is pointing out, this
21:41
Speaker 1: was no accident. Take a listen. See this photo from
21:45
Speaker 1: Ashton King. She was on the pier and saw the
21:47
Speaker 1: three year old in the water, immediately jumping into action
21:50
Speaker 1: while she said she watched moreno do the exact opposite.
21:54
Speaker 1: This is her standing by police and the dive team
21:57
Speaker 1: who rescued the little boy. The red flags were there.
22:00
Speaker 1: She was acting very weird. I did end up telling
22:03
Speaker 1: the officer, I said, listen, I said, she was the
22:06
Speaker 1: only one here and we got here. She's just been
22:08
Speaker 1: acting off weird, like I don't know if she I
22:11
Speaker 1: just don't know if she's all something is not right,
22:13
Speaker 1: acting odd, acting weird. You're hearing our friends at WBB
22:18
Speaker 1: and but there's more take a list of our friend,
22:21
Speaker 1: Tia at Fox thirty two. Moreno stole the family car
22:25
Speaker 1: and drove into the city and Navy Pier surveillance video
22:28
Speaker 1: shows she waited for people to leave the area, then
22:30
Speaker 1: allow the three year old to crawl underneath the chain
22:33
Speaker 1: barrier separating the walkway in the water. When no one
22:36
Speaker 1: was looking, they claimed, Moreno straddled the boy and pushed
22:39
Speaker 1: him over into Lake Michigan, which is a six and
22:42
Speaker 1: a half foot drop. I said, please, can you question
22:44
Speaker 1: her again. I'm just letting you know, like this is
22:46
Speaker 1: not sitting right with me. She was the only one here.
22:50
Speaker 1: She's not acting right. Okay, back to you, Tia. You
22:54
Speaker 1: you and joining us Fox thirty two. Tia, I know
22:57
Speaker 1: it's a six and a half foot drop, But how
22:59
Speaker 1: deep is like Michigan, it's very very deep. It depends
23:03
Speaker 1: on it on different parts of the lake of how
23:06
Speaker 1: deep it can be. But I mean it's a clear
23:09
Speaker 1: indication of how deep it is that the actual dive
23:12
Speaker 1: crews found this little boy at the bottom of the
23:15
Speaker 1: water unconscious. I mean that tells you everything you need
23:18
Speaker 1: to know. Had to bring in a dive crew to
23:22
Speaker 1: find the boy unconscious at the bottom of the water.
23:27
Speaker 1: Robert Farley joining us from our detective County Sheriff's Police Department,
23:31
Speaker 1: is so much more. How deep would you say that is?
23:33
Speaker 1: Probably right there it's around twenty five feet deep. I
23:38
Speaker 1: mean it gets as you go further the route, it's
23:40
Speaker 1: about eight hundred feet deep. But right there, just to
23:45
Speaker 1: the north, this is basically a little inlet on the
23:49
Speaker 1: north side of Navy Pier. Just to the north is
23:51
Speaker 1: the water filtration plant for the city of Chicago where
23:56
Speaker 1: they sucking water from lakes to distribute it. So the
24:01
Speaker 1: pipes go out to what are called cribs out in
24:03
Speaker 1: the lake where they suck in the water. So probably
24:06
Speaker 1: there are twenty five thirty feet. I mean I've been
24:08
Speaker 1: in boats out there and looking at the depth meters
24:12
Speaker 1: just there. Maybe thirty feet. But as was said, as
24:16
Speaker 1: was said by Tea, I mean it gets significantly deeper
24:19
Speaker 1: as you go fire the route. Yeah, you and joining
24:21
Speaker 1: us far to what was going on above ground? Is
24:25
Speaker 1: it like a pier where they are rides and restaurants
24:28
Speaker 1: and photo boots and all that it is. But on
24:31
Speaker 1: a Monday, that is not the case. On a Monday,
24:34
Speaker 1: it is the equivalent to probably like a park, you
24:37
Speaker 1: have a few stragglers that are strolling through, observing the lake,
24:41
Speaker 1: taking pictures. It's not, you know, this huge tourist attraction
24:46
Speaker 1: during the week, especially not that early on in the week.
24:49
Speaker 1: So I would imagine not very many people are out there.
24:54
Speaker 1: And you know, that is why when you heard from Ashton,
24:57
Speaker 1: she said that, you know, there weren't a lot of
24:59
Speaker 1: people out there, or she did tell me when I
25:01
Speaker 1: interviewed her that some people stopped they asked what was
25:04
Speaker 1: going on, and they kept going, Oh my stars. Yes,
25:07
Speaker 1: nobody said going with a three year old boy out
25:11
Speaker 1: in twenty five deep water, Ashton. Is that true? Yes,
25:15
Speaker 1: that is completely true. There were two people that helped,
25:19
Speaker 1: and that was my friend and I. Anybody else that
25:22
Speaker 1: stopped only stopped because they were curious while we were
25:27
Speaker 1: staring at the water and you know, trying to move
25:29
Speaker 1: this life preserver around the water. What happened? What happened?
25:33
Speaker 1: I said, you know, frantically, there's a little boy in
25:36
Speaker 1: the water. There's a little boy in the water. Oh
25:38
Speaker 1: oh okay, okay, how did that happen? I don't know.
25:41
Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know it. Oh okay, okay,
25:43
Speaker 1: and then walked on by Time Stories with Nancy Grace.
25:58
Speaker 1: Doctor Bethany Marshall joining us. A boy down it a
26:00
Speaker 1: shrink right now, Psychoanalyst to the Stars, joining us from
26:04
Speaker 1: Beverly Hills. She's a doctor Bethany Marshall dot Com and
26:08
Speaker 1: Starvenee Netflix series Bling Empire. Doctor Bethany, what is wrong
26:13
Speaker 1: with people? I mean, even if you're not a great swimmer,
26:17
Speaker 1: you want to still stand by and see if there's
26:19
Speaker 1: anything you can do rather than jump in and you
26:22
Speaker 1: both go to the bottom. But can you throw them
26:25
Speaker 1: a rope? Can you, like Ashton King, try to throw
26:29
Speaker 1: him the life preserver? Call and I we want to
26:31
Speaker 1: do something. Don't just keep on walking by, Nancy. The
26:35
Speaker 1: human condition is so complex? Why did these people walk by?
26:39
Speaker 1: You know, for some of them it may not have
26:40
Speaker 1: seemed real. They may have made it unreal in their minds,
26:45
Speaker 1: Doctor Bethany. Weren't your parents' missionaries? Yes? They were? Okay,
26:50
Speaker 1: I don't know if you've ever heard the phrase or
26:52
Speaker 1: the story, it's not a phrase, it's a story, it's
26:56
Speaker 1: a parable. The good Samaritan is that ringing a belle
26:59
Speaker 1: somewhere that at the time reach way back and remember
27:07
Speaker 1: to just keeping Nancy. It's so inexplicable. There's a three
27:12
Speaker 1: year old in the water said they thought it wasn't real.
27:16
Speaker 1: What are you saying they thought it wasn't real. I
27:18
Speaker 1: think people can make things unreal in their minds, so
27:22
Speaker 1: that that's not real. That's just a little boy. He'll swim,
27:24
Speaker 1: he'll come back to the pier. People have all kinds
27:27
Speaker 1: of narratives in their mind to explain the world around them,
27:31
Speaker 1: and sometimes the narratives are inaccurate. Sometimes they're simply callous.
27:37
Speaker 1: Some people feel they're getting drawn into a hoax, that
27:39
Speaker 1: there's drama around them. They don't want to get hold on,
27:43
Speaker 1: hold on. I don't like anything you're saying. And I'm
27:47
Speaker 1: going to tell you what I think about this alternate
27:51
Speaker 1: universe you're creating For these people that you say, don't
27:55
Speaker 1: think it's real. They say it, they hear it, they
28:00
Speaker 1: feel the cold air, they see Ashton King, they're screaming,
28:04
Speaker 1: trying to call nine one one, trying to help. I
28:07
Speaker 1: think that if they don't think it's real. I think
28:10
Speaker 1: that equals they're doing what's comfortable for them. They're doing
28:14
Speaker 1: the easy thing, not the right thing. Well, Nancy, I'm
28:18
Speaker 1: going to compress this with something in Yosemite Park here
28:21
Speaker 1: in California, hundreds of people die each year trying to
28:25
Speaker 1: rescue other people. You know, maybe somebody who's taking a
28:29
Speaker 1: picture on the ledge and that person falls over, and
28:32
Speaker 1: so somebody else grabs them, and then a person grabs
28:36
Speaker 1: the rescuer and a whole chain of people go over.
28:38
Speaker 1: So I've witnessed the opposite in our national parks, which
28:42
Speaker 1: I think is so interesting. Out in nature, people are
28:46
Speaker 1: more likely to rescue others, even in very dangerous situations.
28:52
Speaker 1: And then you have this pier where they're quite callous
28:55
Speaker 1: and they walk the other way. I'm not saying for
28:58
Speaker 1: them to all jump in and around them else. I mean,
29:01
Speaker 1: you see Ashton King, she called nine one one. She
29:03
Speaker 1: tried to get the life pers are originating. The point
29:06
Speaker 1: she was trying to give directions, hurry, hurry, hurry, this
29:08
Speaker 1: is where we are. He did not want to get it. Bothers.
29:10
Speaker 1: They didn't even stand there, They did nothing. They just
29:14
Speaker 1: kept going. I mean you're really really airbrushing a bad situation.
29:20
Speaker 1: I mean, Ashton King. Let me go back to the
29:23
Speaker 1: woman standing there. You said something was off. What happened, Well,
29:30
Speaker 1: at first I got to tell you. The entire time,
29:33
Speaker 1: she just stood. She stood behind like TiO was mentioning
29:38
Speaker 1: the little chain that was that kind of separated the
29:43
Speaker 1: water or you know, your little barrier. She stood. She
29:47
Speaker 1: backed away as soon as we got there and we
29:49
Speaker 1: were starting to question her around her. As soon as
29:51
Speaker 1: we started to Francis called one one and running around
29:53
Speaker 1: the pier, she backed away. She stayed exactly where she
29:57
Speaker 1: was the entire time, did not and or anything clear
30:01
Speaker 1: or concise for me, kept kind of mumbling and saying,
30:03
Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't know, I don't know. And
30:06
Speaker 1: so of course when police are on the scene, they're
30:09
Speaker 1: gonna go ahead and they're gonna take down our information
30:11
Speaker 1: because they you know, in kids, they need to contact
30:12
Speaker 1: us later. The entire time, even when she was talking
30:17
Speaker 1: to the police, she just something was off, something was
30:21
Speaker 1: not right. But what did she look like? She kind
30:24
Speaker 1: of just looked not emotionless. Yeah, sooic, but not emotion
30:31
Speaker 1: not one hundred percent emotionless, but not as to have
30:35
Speaker 1: been expected. Now, for example, this little boy, I had
30:40
Speaker 1: no relation to this little boy. And I'm going to
30:42
Speaker 1: tell you I was panic. I was sobbing. I was
30:44
Speaker 1: running around like a crazy person on this pier, trying
30:47
Speaker 1: to make sure that first responders got to where we
30:49
Speaker 1: needed to be. And I that was just a normal
30:51
Speaker 1: reaction that I had right away as soon as I've
30:53
Speaker 1: seen him in the water. Now to see how she
30:56
Speaker 1: was reacted while she was just staring at him struggling
30:59
Speaker 1: in the water, was red slag number one. But then too,
31:02
Speaker 1: I've eventually learned that that was her nephew. That was
31:05
Speaker 1: red slag number two. And I told please, As they
31:10
Speaker 1: were questioning her, I thought to myself, does anybody else
31:14
Speaker 1: not see what I am seeing here? Does anybody not
31:17
Speaker 1: see that this is something is not right? And I
31:20
Speaker 1: told the office, I said, please, please question her, please,
31:24
Speaker 1: something is not right here. She was the only one
31:28
Speaker 1: here when he was in or at least when he
31:31
Speaker 1: was struggling in the water. And speaking of being the
31:35
Speaker 1: only one there, Tia you and joining us Fox thirty two.
31:38
Speaker 1: As a matter of fact, they surveillance video from there
31:42
Speaker 1: on the pier shows her pushing the boy yet pushing
31:45
Speaker 1: the buoy in absolutely, But the surveillorans video also shows
31:49
Speaker 1: some other things that I think are important as well,
31:52
Speaker 1: which I think kind of relates to the entire situation.
31:55
Speaker 1: The surveyorans video also shows that the little boy was
31:59
Speaker 1: walking out one point in the roadway and was nearly
32:01
Speaker 1: struck by a car right before this happened. So the
32:05
Speaker 1: same place where they where they were, um, there's a
32:08
Speaker 1: little stretch of that of that pier where cars can
32:12
Speaker 1: drive through and park in the parking garage, according to police.
32:15
Speaker 1: On the surveillance video, you do see her allow the
32:19
Speaker 1: little boy to walk right in the middle of the
32:22
Speaker 1: walk of the roadway and is dearly hit by a
32:25
Speaker 1: car before we even got to this point of him
32:29
Speaker 1: being pushed into the water. So it kind of gives
32:31
Speaker 1: you a glimpse of, you know, the care how he
32:34
Speaker 1: was being looked after during the time that he was
32:38
Speaker 1: with his own family member. IRV Miller joining me, high
32:42
Speaker 1: profile criminal defense attorney with the Miller Firm, also illegal
32:46
Speaker 1: analyst CBS to Chicago w bb MTV or thank you
32:51
Speaker 1: for being with us. You know what, I know where
32:54
Speaker 1: you're going to go. If this hadn't been caught on video.
32:58
Speaker 1: You would say video, you would say, she didn't push him,
33:02
Speaker 1: push him. He fell. He tripped over that chain plastic
33:07
Speaker 1: chain barrier. That's what happened. He was playing on the
33:10
Speaker 1: edge and he fell. Okay, but since there is video
33:17
Speaker 1: row of her pushing him, I've had it happened in
33:20
Speaker 1: rape cases and every other case there is goes something
33:23
Speaker 1: like this. He's never seen her in his life. Oh okay.
33:29
Speaker 1: So they were supposed to meet at the bar. Yes,
33:33
Speaker 1: that was casual. They didn't know each other. Then the
33:36
Speaker 1: bar surveillance video shows up and it's them sitting there
33:39
Speaker 1: having dinner. Oh her, Oh yeah, I know her. We
33:43
Speaker 1: had dinner one night. That's it. Then it shows them
33:48
Speaker 1: walking down deep alleyway leaving the restaurant. Oh yeah, well
33:54
Speaker 1: he's such a gentleman. He walked her to her car
33:57
Speaker 1: and oh wait, he got in the car. Yeah, he
34:00
Speaker 1: got in the cart. But she asked him to do that,
34:03
Speaker 1: to drive to the X of the parking garage. And
34:06
Speaker 1: then she asked for consensual set. Wait, no, no sex whatsoever.
34:10
Speaker 1: Well we have DNA. Okay, that was consensual. That was consensual. Well,
34:16
Speaker 1: what about the bruises and the scrapes and the torn
34:18
Speaker 1: clothing that she liked it rough. That's how this thing
34:22
Speaker 1: is going to go down except for the video or Miller,
34:27
Speaker 1: and the video shows I guess your next backup will
34:30
Speaker 1: be what mental defect. Well, that's where this is probably
34:33
Speaker 1: going to go. And it's really the only thing that
34:36
Speaker 1: her lawyers even have a remote shot yet in trying
34:39
Speaker 1: to resolve this case. But I have to tell you,
34:43
Speaker 1: under Elinois law, this doesn't even come close to the
34:47
Speaker 1: requirements to meet the standards for insanity defense. It simply
34:52
Speaker 1: doesn't make sense for what the factual situation is to
34:57
Speaker 1: fit into the statute, which requires that to sustain in
35:01
Speaker 1: a sanity defense, the person lacked substantial capacity to appreciate
35:05
Speaker 1: the criminality of their conduct. Well, you know it hasn't
35:10
Speaker 1: come out yet, but in the proverb and apparently this so.
35:14
Speaker 1: Miss Marino took the victim and two other nieces to
35:18
Speaker 1: the same place on Navy Pierre a week ago without permission.
35:23
Speaker 1: On the day this happened, she stole the keys from
35:25
Speaker 1: the house, took the child without anybody knowing it, drove
35:29
Speaker 1: to Navy Pierre, didn't commit any traffic violations. She took
35:33
Speaker 1: the child to McDonald's, bought the child a happy meal,
35:37
Speaker 1: saw this accident that your last person was talking about
35:41
Speaker 1: possible car hitting the child. That she grabbed the child
35:45
Speaker 1: and moved it away from the car and then walked
35:48
Speaker 1: over to where this chain was next to the lake.
35:51
Speaker 1: She's looking around, and she waited till people walked away
35:54
Speaker 1: so they couldn't see what happened. Dad doesn't fit the
35:57
Speaker 1: definition of insanity in this particular case. No, I don't
36:01
Speaker 1: think it's gonna go insanity. I think it's going to
36:03
Speaker 1: be trying to get a plea deal out of the prosecutor.
36:06
Speaker 1: Can I tell please do It's a little like Andrea Yates.
36:08
Speaker 1: I mean she was schizophrenic, crazy, psychotic. She said that
36:12
Speaker 1: the devil made her drown her children. However, she waited
36:17
Speaker 1: till her husband Rusty went to work to drown them
36:20
Speaker 1: and lock the doors and took them one by one
36:23
Speaker 1: away and secret to the others wouldn't know what was happening,
36:25
Speaker 1: and then said I killed my children. And what tau
36:29
Speaker 1: And is telling us from Fox thirty two about the video,
36:33
Speaker 1: herv is right that she waited and looked around to
36:37
Speaker 1: make sure nobody was there, and then pushed the boy.
36:42
Speaker 1: I'm also looking at a photo of her, and she
36:45
Speaker 1: looks well kept, well groomed, in control of her faculties.
36:50
Speaker 1: It looks like she just did her hair outwardly. You
36:53
Speaker 1: know when you walk down the street and you see
36:56
Speaker 1: a person and you know they're mentally ill, and you
37:01
Speaker 1: either try to help him or give them money, or
37:04
Speaker 1: call community affairs, or you take your children try to
37:08
Speaker 1: get away. So that's not what I'm seeing when I
37:12
Speaker 1: look at her. Also, or Miller pointed out, and it's accurate.
37:16
Speaker 1: Just the week before, Victoria Moreno had snuck children, the
37:20
Speaker 1: children out of the home and took them to Navy
37:23
Speaker 1: Pier Again, was she going to try to drown all
37:26
Speaker 1: of them? There? All of them? What we know right
37:30
Speaker 1: now is a little boy is fighting for his life.
37:34
Speaker 1: Speaking of that previous incident, that adds fuel to the
37:39
Speaker 1: flame for prosecutors. Take a listen to our cut fourteen.
37:44
Speaker 1: This is CBS to Chicago. Da Mordeno in court this Wednesday,
37:49
Speaker 1: denied vond and charged with attempted first degree murder an
37:53
Speaker 1: aggravated battery to a child. Prosecutors say Mordeno took her nephew,
37:57
Speaker 1: three year old Josiah Brown, out of his whole Monday
38:00
Speaker 1: without the permission from his family. They say Morreno stopped
38:03
Speaker 1: at a McDonald's first to get a happy meal. Then,
38:06
Speaker 1: prosecutors say Mordno walked Assaiah to the road near the
38:10
Speaker 1: water behind Navy Pier. As he got near the edge
38:12
Speaker 1: of the pier, prosecutors say Mordna pushed him with both
38:16
Speaker 1: hands in the water. Ashton, King, now that you are
38:19
Speaker 1: hearing all of this, when you look back on this
38:23
Speaker 1: incident as the good Samaritan, what is running through your mind?
38:31
Speaker 1: Every thing? Just number one, I can't believe I was
38:35
Speaker 1: putting a situation that Number two, I'm glad I listened
38:39
Speaker 1: to my instincts right away. There's no rural book, there's
38:45
Speaker 1: no manual for these things. You're so right, Ashton, and
38:49
Speaker 1: you are setting an example to so many others that
38:52
Speaker 1: failed to act. We wait and pray for this boy
38:57
Speaker 1: to live. Nancy Grace comes are signing off goodbye to
39:05
Speaker 1: h