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The Invisible Climate Engineers Running Our Ocean · How To Protect The Ocean

• 0:00
  What if some of
• 0:00
  the most
• 0:00
  important climate
• 0:01
  solutions on
• 0:02
  Earth are
• 0:03
  invisible?
• 0:04
  Not whales, not
• 0:05
  coral reefs, not
• 0:06
  even forests,
• 0:07
  microbes.
• 0:09
  Tiny organisms
• 0:09
  smaller than a
• 0:10
  grain of sand
• 0:11
  regulate the
• 0:12
  planet's climate,
• 0:13
  produce a huge
• 0:14
  number of the
• 0:15
  oxygen we
• 0:15
  breathe, and move
• 0:16
  massive amounts
• 0:17
  of carbon through
• 0:18
  the ocean
• 0:19
  every single
• 0:20
  day. Scientists
• 0:21
  are now exploring
• 0:22
  how some of these
• 0:23
  organisms could
• 0:23
  even help us
• 0:24
  capture carbon
• 0:26
  dioxide and fight
• 0:27
  climate change.
• 0:28
  But today's
• 0:29
  conversation goes
• 0:29
  beyond micros and
• 0:30
  biotechnology
• 0:31
  because our guest
• 0:32
  is asking a much
• 0:34
  bigger question.
• 0:34
  If science
• 0:36
  understands
• 0:36
  life so well
• 0:37
  at the molecular
• 0:38
  level, why does
• 0:39
  it struggle to
• 0:40
  help us
• 0:40
  understand how we
• 0:41
  live? This
• 0:42
  is how to
• 0:43
  Protect the Ocean
• 0:43
  podcast, your
• 0:44
  weekday ocean
• 0:45
  conservation
• 0:45
  podcast. If you
• 0:46
  want to stay
• 0:47
  informed about
• 0:47
  ocean science,
• 0:48
  conservation, and
• 0:49
  the people
• 0:50
  working to
• 0:50
  protect our
• 0:51
  ocean planet,
• 0:52
  make sure you
• 0:52
  follow the
• 0:53
  podcast so you
• 0:53
  don't miss next
• 0:55
  week's episode.
• 0:56
  Today I'm
• 0:56
  speaking with Dr.
• 0:57
  Jose Angel
• 0:58
  Moreno-Cabezuelo,
• 0:59
  a synthetic
• 1:00
  biologist working
• 1:00
  in Oxford where
• 1:01
  he leads research
• 1:02
  engineering sound
• 1:03
  of bacteria, some
• 1:04
  of the oldest
• 1:05
  organisms
• 1:05
  on Earth,
• 1:06
  to capture carbon
• 1:07
  dioxide using
• 1:08
  sunlight and
• 1:09
  biology. His work
• 1:10
  sits at the
• 1:11
  intersection of
• 1:12
  biology, climate
• 1:13
  solutions, and
• 1:13
  biotechnology,
• 1:15
  using
• 1:15
  microorganisms as
• 1:16
  light-powered
• 1:17
  living factories
• 1:17
  that can help us
• 1:19
  rethink how we
• 1:20
  produce materials
• 1:21
  and reduce
• 1:21
  emissions. But
• 1:22
  Dr. Moreno
• 1:23
  Cabezuelo is also exploring
• 1:24
  something deeper.
• 1:26
  After
• 1:27
  years inside
• 1:27
  the scientific
• 1:28
  systems,
• 1:29
  publishing
• 1:29
  papers, and
• 1:30
  presenting
• 1:30
  research around
• 1:31
  the
• 1:31
  world, he began
• 1:32
  asking difficult
• 1:33
  questions about
• 1:33
  how science
• 1:34
  communicates
• 1:34
  knowledge and why
• 1:35
  so much
• 1:36
  of it fails
• 1:37
  to connect with
• 1:37
  people it's meant
• 1:39
  to serve. That
• 1:40
  journey led him
• 1:41
  right to the
• 1:41
  book,
• 1:42
  Heartbeats of
• 1:42
  Consciousness, a
• 1:43
  story that blends
• 1:44
  neuroscience,
• 1:45
  biology,
• 1:46
  philosophy, and
• 1:47
  the human
• 1:47
  experience of
• 1:48
  understanding
• 1:49
  life. Today we're
• 1:50
  going to talk
• 1:50
  about microbes
• 1:51
  that help run the
• 1:52
  planet, the
• 1:53
  promise of
• 1:54
  biological
• 1:54
  climate
• 1:54
  solutions, and
• 1:55
  why science might
• 1:56
  need to rethink
• 1:57
  how it speaks to
• 1:58
  the world. Here's
• 1:59
  the interview
• 2:00
  with Jose and Joy
• 2:01
  and I'll talk to
• 2:02
  you after.
• 2:02
  Jose, welcome to
• 2:04
  the How to
• 2:04
  Protect the Ocean
• 2:05
  podcast. Are you
• 2:06
  ready to talk
• 2:06
  about microbes
• 2:07
  and
• 2:07
  cyanobacteria?
• 2:09
  Yes, ready and
• 2:10
  really excited
• 2:11
  for that. All
• 2:12
  right, I'm
• 2:13
  excited as well.
• 2:14
  You know, we
• 2:14
  don't get to talk
• 2:15
  about microbes a
• 2:16
  lot, but they're
• 2:16
  such an important
• 2:17
  part of the ocean
• 2:18
  that I think it's
• 2:19
  really important
• 2:19
  when you when you
• 2:20
  connect with me
• 2:21
  Jose. And you're
• 2:21
  like, Hey, this
• 2:22
  is what I do. I
• 2:23
  talk about
• 2:23
  cyanobacteria. I
• 2:24
  work with it. I
• 2:25
  do research on
• 2:25
  it. And I'm like,
• 2:26
  Okay, this is
• 2:27
  cool because we
• 2:28
  need to talk more
• 2:29
  about microbes,
• 2:30
  especially when
• 2:31
  we talk about
• 2:31
  climate change,
• 2:32
  cyanobacteria. There's so much we need to get into. So we're going to talk about your research in it, how you got into and how you got your PhDs, how you got your PhDs in it, how you got your PhDs, how you got your PhDs in it, how you got your PhDs in it, how you got your PhDs in it, how you got your PhDs in it.
• 2:33
  There's so much
• 2:33
  we need to
• 2:34
  get into.
• 2:35
  So we're gonna
• 2:35
  talk about your
• 2:36
  research in it,
• 2:37
  how you got into
• 2:38
  it, how you got
• 2:38
  your PhD
• 2:39
  and so forth,
• 2:40
  and where you are
• 2:41
  today and what
• 2:41
  you're
• 2:42
  doing with this.
• 2:43
  But before we do,
• 2:44
  let's talk a
• 2:44
  little bit about
• 2:45
  yourself
• 2:46
  and get to know
• 2:46
  you a little bit.
• 2:47
  Let's start off
• 2:48
  with who you are
• 2:49
  and what you do.
• 2:50
  Hi, Andrea.
• 2:51
  First of all,
• 2:52
  thank you for
• 2:52
  this opportunity.
• 2:54
  I am Jose Angel.
• 2:55
  I'm a molecular
• 2:55
  biologist based
• 2:56
  in Osfor, United
• 2:57
  Kingdom.
• 2:59
  I'm from nearly
• 3:00
  more than
• 3:00
  10 years.
• 3:01
  I have been
• 3:01
  working
• 3:02
  specifically with
• 3:04
  an organism
• 3:05
  called
• 3:05
  Cenobacteria,
• 3:06
  some of the most
• 3:07
  abundant
• 3:08
  photosynthetics
• 3:08
  organisms
• 3:09
  on Earth.
• 3:11
  So I did my PhD
• 3:12
  in Spain,
• 3:13
  studying how this
• 3:14
  organism regulate
• 3:16
  glucose uptake
• 3:17
  and metabolism in
• 3:18
  species like
• 3:19
  Cinecococcus,
• 3:20
  Plocococcus,
• 3:21
  which are
• 3:21
  organisms very
• 3:22
  interesting
• 3:23
  because it
• 3:24
  dominates much of
• 3:24
  the global ocean.
• 3:27
  And since then, I
• 3:29
  have been working
• 3:30
  in different
• 3:31
  countries,
• 3:33
  Spain, Portugal,
• 3:35
  now in the UK,
• 3:37
  including the
• 3:37
  development of
• 3:38
  fast-growing
• 3:39
  Cenobacteria
• 3:40
  strain
• 3:41
  as a renewable
• 3:42
  platform for
• 3:44
  carbon capture
• 3:44
  and sustainable
• 3:46
  bio-manufacturing.
• 3:48
  And today I am
• 3:49
  leading
• 3:49
  Cenobacteria
• 3:50
  research in a
• 3:51
  company called
• 3:52
  Cenocapture
• 3:53
  in Osfor
• 3:54
  in order to
• 3:55
  produce a wide
• 3:56
  range of
• 3:57
  compounds.
• 3:58
  Because you can
• 3:59
  use this
• 3:59
  Cenobacteria in
• 4:02
  order to produce
• 4:03
  like
• 4:03
  compounds like
• 4:03
  biomedical
• 4:04
  compounds,
• 4:05
  biofuel, and so
• 4:07
  many compounds
• 4:08
  that have a lot
• 4:10
  of applications.
• 4:13
  But the thing
• 4:14
  about the
• 4:15
  technical details
• 4:16
  and publication,
• 4:17
  the thing that
• 4:18
  most
• 4:18
  still amaze me
• 4:20
  is this. And it
• 4:22
  is this organism
• 4:22
  that I am
• 4:23
  studying every
• 4:24
  day in the
• 4:25
  laboratory,
• 4:27
  are responsible
• 4:27
  for around half
• 4:29
  of the oxygen
• 4:29
  that we breathe.
• 4:31
  So think
• 4:31
  about that.
• 4:32
  And most of the
• 4:33
  people don't even
• 4:35
  know that they
• 4:35
  exist because we
• 4:37
  tend to protect
• 4:38
  what we see,
• 4:40
  but it is what we
• 4:41
  don't see that
• 4:42
  keep us alive.
• 4:44
  And that's why I
• 4:45
  felt such a
• 4:46
  strong connection
• 4:47
  with your
• 4:47
  podcast, Andrew,
• 4:49
  because
• 4:49
  protecting the
• 4:50
  ocean, it is not
• 4:51
  just about
• 4:52
  protecting
• 4:52
  the water,
• 4:54
  it's about
• 4:54
  protecting the
• 4:55
  invisible system
• 4:56
  that sustains
• 4:57
  life
• 4:58
  itself. So today,
• 5:00
  Andrew, I want to
• 5:02
  start the podcast
• 5:03
  in a slightly
• 5:04
  different way.
• 5:05
  And this is a
• 5:05
  good exercise for
• 5:06
  the audience.
• 5:08
  So I want you and
• 5:09
  the audience to
• 5:10
  close your eyes
• 5:11
  for a moment.
• 5:13
  Just three
• 5:14
  seconds.
• 5:14
  Okay, done.
• 5:18
  And now, when you
• 5:20
  have them close,
• 5:21
  feel something
• 5:22
  happening right
• 5:23
  now without you
• 5:25
  having to do
• 5:26
  anything for it
• 5:27
  to happen.
• 5:30
  And your head is
• 5:31
  beating. So you
• 5:34
  cannot put your
• 5:34
  eyes and that
• 5:36
  head beats depend
• 5:38
  on oxygen.
• 5:41
  And a wrong half
• 5:41
  of that oxygen
• 5:42
  comes from
• 5:44
  microscopic
• 5:44
  marine organism,
• 5:46
  not from
• 5:47
  forest alone,
• 5:48
  from the ocean,
• 5:50
  because the ocean
• 5:51
  is not, you know,
• 5:53
  out there. It is
• 5:54
  circulating
• 5:54
  through you
• 5:55
  right now.
• 5:56
  When we think
• 5:57
  about the ocean,
• 5:58
  you know, most of
• 5:59
  the people we
• 6:00
  imagine, whales,
• 6:02
  coral reefs,
• 6:03
  sharks, wave
• 6:05
  crossings, a
• 6:06
  cliff. But the
• 6:08
  true engine in
• 6:08
  the true engine
• 6:09
  of this,
• 6:10
  the ocean is
• 6:11
  invisible. It's
• 6:12
  the
• 6:13
  phytoplactone.
• 6:14
  And among them
• 6:15
  cyanobacteria.
• 6:18
  They are
• 6:18
  microscopic.
• 6:19
  You can see them
• 6:20
  drifting in open
• 6:21
  water. And yet
• 6:23
  they regulated
• 6:24
  atmospheric
• 6:25
  chemistry,
• 6:26
  absorb carbon
• 6:27
  dioxide and
• 6:29
  products oxygen.
• 6:31
  And actually, let
• 6:32
  me show you
• 6:33
  something.
• 6:36
  So this may look
• 6:38
  nothing special,
• 6:40
  just a green
• 6:42
  liquid in a
• 6:44
  flask. But when
• 6:45
  you are looking
• 6:46
  at here,
• 6:47
  are billions of
• 6:48
  cyanobacteria
• 6:49
  cells performing
• 6:50
  photosynthesis
• 6:51
  right now. So
• 6:52
  they are
• 6:53
  absorbing light.
• 6:54
  They are fixing
• 6:55
  carbon dioxide.
• 6:56
  They are
• 6:57
  releasing the
• 6:58
  oxygen. So this
• 6:59
  is getting
• 6:59
  culture.
• 7:01
  We think about
• 7:02
  that. Multiply
• 7:03
  across the region
• 7:04
  of the ocean is
• 7:06
  what established
• 7:06
  our atmosphere.
• 7:08
  And what
• 7:09
  fascinated me is
• 7:10
  that something so
• 7:12
  visually and
• 7:13
  impressive is
• 7:15
  this biolike
• 7:17
  monumental. You
• 7:19
  don't need a
• 7:20
  whale to regulate
• 7:20
  climate.
• 7:22
  Sometimes you
• 7:23
  need just cells,
• 7:25
  tiny ones.
• 7:27
  So now, right,
• 7:29
  billions of them.
• 7:31
  Absolutely. Now
• 7:32
  here is something
• 7:33
  extraordinary.
• 7:35
  Because the king
• 7:35
  of organisms you
• 7:36
  just saw in that
• 7:37
  flask, one
• 7:39
  changed
• 7:40
  entire planet.
• 7:41
  Because around
• 7:42
  2.5 billion years
• 7:44
  ago, the
• 7:45
  unsinsane
• 7:46
  bacteria began
• 7:47
  releasing oxygen
• 7:49
  as a bioproduct
• 7:50
  of
• 7:50
  photosynthesis.
• 7:52
  And at the time,
• 7:53
  Earth's
• 7:53
  atmosphere
• 7:54
  contained almost
• 7:55
  no free oxygen.
• 7:58
  Life was mostly
• 7:59
  anaerobic.
• 8:01
  So oxygen was in
• 8:02
  fact toxic to
• 8:04
  many organisms
• 8:05
  that they started
• 8:06
  to appear.
• 8:06
  But over a
• 8:08
  million years,
• 8:09
  oxygen
• 8:09
  accumulated in the atmosphere in
• 8:11
  Wagway, Nokal,
• 8:12
  the Great
• 8:13
  Oxidation
• 8:14
  Event. And that
• 8:15
  changed
• 8:16
  everything. It
• 8:17
  transformed the
• 8:18
  ocean chemistry,
• 8:20
  it received the
• 8:20
  atmosphere,
• 8:22
  it made complex
• 8:23
  life possible. So
• 8:25
  without that
• 8:25
  shift, there will
• 8:27
  be no
• 8:27
  animals, no forest,
• 8:29
  and we won't be
• 8:30
  here now having
• 8:31
  this
• 8:32
  conversation.
• 8:33
  The air, for
• 8:37
  example, that we
• 8:37
  bred today is in
• 8:40
  many ways the
• 8:41
  legacy of those
• 8:42
  microorganisms.
• 8:44
  And what
• 8:45
  fascinates me is
• 8:46
  this, it's the
• 8:47
  smallest organism
• 8:48
  in the ocean.
• 8:49
  One, recites the
• 8:50
  chemistry of the
• 8:51
  entire planet.
• 8:53
  Because we often
• 8:54
  think planetary
• 8:56
  chain requires,
• 8:57
  for example, something
• 8:58
  massive, for
• 9:00
  example, tectonic
• 9:03
  plates, volcanic
• 9:04
  eruption,
• 9:05
  asthetic impact.
• 9:07
  But sometimes
• 9:08
  planetary
• 9:09
  transformation
• 9:10
  comes from
• 9:11
  biology, from
• 9:12
  cells, from
• 9:14
  tiny ones.
• 9:16
  The historical
• 9:17
  purpose matters
• 9:18
  because it
• 9:19
  reminds us that
• 9:20
  the ocean is not
• 9:21
  a passive
• 9:22
  background.
• 9:23
  It's an effective
• 9:24
  regulatory system
• 9:26
  and it has saved
• 9:27
  Earth before and
• 9:29
  also it
• 9:29
  continues to
• 9:30
  to save it now.
• 9:33
  But, Andrew, here
• 9:35
  is the paradox.
• 9:36
  Because the same
• 9:37
  organism
• 9:37
  that once
• 9:38
  received the
• 9:38
  Earth as more
• 9:39
  fair and now
• 9:40
  living in an
• 9:41
  ocean that it is
• 9:42
  changing very,
• 9:44
  very fast.
• 9:45
  Because as you
• 9:45
  know, the ocean
• 9:47
  and the peritor
• 9:48
  are rising. The
• 9:50
  surface water are
• 9:51
  becoming
• 9:51
  more stratified,
• 9:53
  which limits
• 9:53
  nutrient mixing
• 9:55
  from deeper
• 9:56
  layers. The
• 9:57
  carbon dioxide
• 9:58
  dissolves
• 9:58
  into sea water
• 9:59
  and it's
• 10:01
  chemistry and
• 10:01
  contributing to
• 10:02
  one big problem
• 10:03
  that we have
• 10:04
  nowadays,
• 10:05
  that it is
• 10:05
  decidification.
• 10:08
  And at the
• 10:08
  microbial level,
• 10:09
  this changes of
• 10:10
  course matter.
• 10:12
  Because
• 10:12
  cyanobacteria
• 10:13
  are highly
• 10:14
  sensitive to
• 10:14
  light intensity,
• 10:16
  temperature
• 10:16
  range, nutrient
• 10:18
  availability,
• 10:19
  even a small sea
• 10:21
  can alter growth
• 10:22
  rates, community
• 10:23
  composition and
• 10:25
  metabolic
• 10:25
  balance.
• 10:27
  And because this
• 10:27
  organism sit at
• 10:30
  the base of the
• 10:31
  marine food
• 10:31
  waste, change at
• 10:32
  a level
• 10:33
  that don't
• 10:34
  stay microscopic.
• 10:36
  Because they
• 10:36
  propagate through
• 10:37
  the food waste,
• 10:39
  affecting primary
• 10:40
  productive,
• 10:42
  for example,
• 10:42
  carbon cycling
• 10:43
  and the dynamic
• 10:45
  of entire
• 10:45
  ecosystem.
• 10:47
  Because probably
• 10:48
  most of us,
• 10:49
  we have we have
• 10:50
  to say like we
• 10:51
  are warming the
• 10:52
  planet. But in
• 10:53
  reality, we are
• 10:54
  altering the
• 10:55
  operating
• 10:55
  condition of the
• 10:57
  very organism
• 10:58
  that made our
• 10:59
  system possible.
• 11:00
  And that
• 11:01
  should make
• 11:01
  us stop. But not
• 11:04
  of fear, but auto
• 11:06
  perpestive.
• 11:08
  Because when you
• 11:09
  tune out across
• 11:11
  billion
• 11:12
  of years of
• 11:13
  earth history,
• 11:15
  you release
• 11:15
  something very
• 11:16
  important.
• 11:17
  Because we are
• 11:18
  not outside of
• 11:20
  the
• 11:20
  system. We are
• 11:22
  modifying the
• 11:23
  same biological
• 11:24
  engine that
• 11:24
  sustain us. And
• 11:27
  one of the most
• 11:29
  interesting
• 11:29
  aspects of this
• 11:30
  issue isn't, I
• 11:31
  think that isn't
• 11:33
  biological. It's
• 11:34
  psychological.
• 11:36
  Because Andrew, our
• 11:38
  nervous system
• 11:40
  able to respond,
• 11:41
  immediate, you
• 11:42
  know, visible
• 11:43
  threat, a
• 11:44
  predator, for
• 11:44
  example,
• 11:45
  running through
• 11:46
  through us, fire,
• 11:48
  a sudden storm or
• 11:51
  stress response
• 11:52
  activate when
• 11:52
  something is
• 11:53
  fast, loud
• 11:54
  and deadly
• 11:55
  threatenings. But
• 11:57
  you know, you ask
• 11:58
  yourself, like
• 11:59
  gradual ocean
• 12:00
  warming,
• 12:01
  microscopy
• 12:02
  safe in
• 12:03
  phytoplactone
• 12:03
  productivity,
• 12:05
  training carbon
• 12:06
  chemistry happen
• 12:07
  over decades, or
• 12:09
  biology, I think
• 12:10
  that doesn't
• 12:11
  register those as
• 12:12
  something like
• 12:13
  urgent, you know,
• 12:14
  because they are
• 12:15
  too slow, like
• 12:16
  too astral, too
• 12:17
  invisible.
• 12:19
  And the most
• 12:20
  interesting thing
• 12:20
  is like we tend
• 12:21
  to protect what
• 12:23
  we see. But
• 12:24
  marine
• 12:24
  microorganism,
• 12:25
  you know,
• 12:26
  the real engine
• 12:26
  of the most
• 12:27
  failed regulation
• 12:28
  are invisible.
• 12:30
  And invisibility
• 12:31
  weakens emotional
• 12:32
  urgency. Because
• 12:34
  when I first
• 12:35
  understood that
• 12:36
  nearly half of
• 12:37
  the oxygen that
• 12:39
  we breathe
• 12:40
  comes from the
• 12:41
  organism most
• 12:41
  people never see,
• 12:43
  it generally
• 12:44
  change the way I
• 12:46
  thought about
• 12:46
  connection.
• 12:47
  It made me
• 12:48
  realize how much
• 12:51
  of survival
• 12:51
  depends on
• 12:52
  processes
• 12:52
  happening beyond
• 12:54
  our own
• 12:55
  perception.
• 12:56
  Because that idea
• 12:57
  stay with me.
• 13:01
  Because when you,
• 13:03
  you know, when
• 13:04
  once you are
• 13:05
  understanding
• 13:06
  that invisible
• 13:06
  system sustain
• 13:08
  visible life, you
• 13:10
  start asking
• 13:11
  different
• 13:12
  questions
• 13:13
  about
• 13:13
  responsibility,
• 13:15
  about
• 13:15
  interdependence,
• 13:17
  about what is
• 13:19
  what it means to
• 13:20
  live inside an
• 13:21
  assistant you
• 13:21
  barely notice.
• 13:24
  And Andrew, when
• 13:26
  you spend years,
• 13:28
  because has been
• 13:29
  more than 10
• 13:29
  years studied,
• 13:30
  you know, this
• 13:30
  microorganism,
• 13:32
  you begin to see
• 13:34
  patterns, because
• 13:36
  I'm going to tell
• 13:37
  you something
• 13:37
  very exciting.
• 13:38
  And most of the
• 13:39
  people probably
• 13:39
  won't know. In
• 13:41
  biology, we talk
• 13:42
  a lot about
• 13:44
  one word called
• 13:45
  omeostasis. You
• 13:48
  know, the ability
• 13:49
  of a system to
• 13:50
  regulate itself
• 13:51
  to
• 13:51
  maintain balance
• 13:52
  despite standard
• 13:53
  fluctuation. And
• 13:55
  you know, for
• 13:56
  example, the
• 13:57
  human body does
• 13:58
  this constantly,
• 13:59
  for example,
• 14:00
  temperature
• 14:01
  regulation, pH
• 14:02
  balance, oxygen
• 14:04
  level glucose
• 14:07
  concentration.
• 14:09
  It is like
• 14:10
  not one organ
• 14:10
  acting alone.
• 14:12
  It's a network,
• 14:13
  you know, as a
• 14:15
  society of cells,
• 14:17
  each cell
• 14:17
  operating with
• 14:19
  within limits,
• 14:20
  each cell
• 14:21
  contributing to
• 14:22
  equilibrium. For
• 14:24
  example, if one
• 14:24
  cell in another
• 14:25
  system and adds
• 14:27
  only for itself,
• 14:28
  we call with the
• 14:30
  thing like we we
• 14:31
  call the cancer,
• 14:33
  because the
• 14:33
  planet got in a
• 14:34
  similar
• 14:34
  way. The ocean
• 14:36
  regulate the
• 14:37
  temperature is
• 14:38
  absorbing the
• 14:39
  carbon dioxide is
• 14:41
  distributing
• 14:42
  nutrient
• 14:42
  energy is
• 14:44
  established the
• 14:45
  atmospheric
• 14:46
  chemistry. And it
• 14:48
  is not just
• 14:49
  water, it's a
• 14:50
  regulatory
• 14:51
  system.
• 14:52
  And understanding
• 14:53
  that sieve is
• 14:59
  produce something
• 15:00
  very deep in me,
• 15:01
  because when I
• 15:02
  was younger, I
• 15:04
  had a very simple
• 15:05
  image of how
• 15:07
  life works.
• 15:08
  I thought, you
• 15:09
  know, like most
• 15:10
  of the people of
• 15:10
  trees as the
• 15:12
  lungs of the
• 15:13
  planet. And in
• 15:14
  fact, when I was
• 15:15
  a kid, once I
• 15:16
  got a test, say
• 15:17
  photosynthesis in
• 15:18
  a big way with a
• 15:20
  big sun and green
• 15:21
  leaves on it. And
• 15:23
  that was my
• 15:23
  mental model. And
• 15:24
  then with the
• 15:25
  passage of the
• 15:25
  year, I
• 15:27
  discovered that
• 15:27
  nearly half of
• 15:28
  the oxygen we
• 15:29
  breathe comes
• 15:29
  from the ocean,
• 15:30
  you know,
• 15:31
  from this
• 15:32
  microscopic
• 15:32
  marine life. So
• 15:34
  that moment
• 15:34
  forced me to
• 15:35
  expand my
• 15:36
  understanding of
• 15:37
  interdependence.
• 15:38
  It was no longer
• 15:39
  just trees. It
• 15:41
  was the invisible
• 15:41
  microorganism
• 15:43
  that sustained
• 15:44
  the visible life,
• 15:45
  you know, that
• 15:45
  reflection that
• 15:46
  eventually became
• 15:48
  one of the
• 15:49
  foundations of
• 15:51
  my book that I
• 15:52
  wrote, I call
• 15:53
  "Herbit of
• 15:55
  Consciousness".
• 15:56
  And in that book,
• 15:57
  Andriou, I
• 15:58
  explore
• 15:58
  the bridge
• 16:00
  between what
• 16:01
  science explains,
• 16:02
  you know, for
• 16:02
  example, neurons,
• 16:04
  cell metabolism,
• 16:05
  regulatory
• 16:06
  system, and what
• 16:07
  the conscience
• 16:08
  asks of us as
• 16:09
  human beings.
• 16:11
  Because once that
• 16:12
  you understand
• 16:12
  that you are
• 16:13
  literally
• 16:13
  breathing
• 16:14
  molecules
• 16:15
  processed by
• 16:17
  marrying
• 16:17
  microorganisms,
• 16:19
  the ocean stopped
• 16:21
  being an
• 16:23
  inventory, you
• 16:24
  know, an
• 16:25
  environmental
• 16:26
  issue, is because
• 16:27
  it's become like
• 16:28
  a personal one. And that
• 16:30
  connection
• 16:31
  between science
• 16:31
  and awareness,
• 16:33
  for me started in
• 16:35
  the laboratory,
• 16:36
  we say no
• 16:36
  bacteria. And now
• 16:38
  all of these may
• 16:40
  sound a bit
• 16:41
  heavy. But here
• 16:42
  is the part that
• 16:43
  gives me hope.
• 16:44
  Because the ocean
• 16:45
  is not delicate.
• 16:47
  It's like a
• 16:48
  dynamic entity,
• 16:49
  you know,
• 16:51
  microbiology,
• 16:52
  community,
• 16:54
  Canada, you know,
• 16:54
  like ecosystem
• 16:55
  can reorganize,
• 16:57
  life has been
• 16:58
  responded to
• 16:58
  change for
• 16:59
  billions
• 16:59
  of years.
• 17:01
  So you know,
• 17:01
  bacteria survive
• 17:02
  for mass
• 17:02
  extinction, they
• 17:04
  survive for
• 17:05
  atmospheric
• 17:05
  collapse, they
• 17:06
  survive the
• 17:07
  condition
• 17:07
  radically
• 17:08
  different from
• 17:09
  today. And the
• 17:10
  question is
• 17:12
  not whether
• 17:13
  we allow the
• 17:17
  system enough
• 17:18
  stability to
• 17:18
  adapt. And in the
• 17:20
  laboratory and
• 17:20
  the we, when we
• 17:24
  study cell
• 17:25
  bacteria, we look
• 17:27
  to different
• 17:28
  parameters, for
• 17:29
  example, how like
• 17:30
  intensity, you
• 17:32
  know, carbon
• 17:33
  electricity, and
• 17:33
  environmental
• 17:34
  stress, affect,
• 17:36
  grow and
• 17:37
  metabolism. And
• 17:39
  we don't do this
• 17:40
  just out of
• 17:41
  curiosity, we do
• 17:42
  this to
• 17:43
  understanding the
• 17:44
  resilience,
• 17:45
  because solution
• 17:46
  to climate change
• 17:48
  will not come
• 17:49
  from panic. They
• 17:51
  will come from
• 17:52
  understanding how
• 17:53
  biological
• 17:54
  systems regulate
• 17:57
  and aligning all
• 17:58
  technologies and
• 17:59
  policy with those
• 18:00
  principles.
• 18:02
  Because ocean
• 18:03
  protection is not
• 18:04
  only
• 18:04
  technological,
• 18:06
  it's perceptual.
• 18:07
  It's beginning
• 18:07
  when we see from
• 18:09
  seeing the ocean
• 18:10
  as a backdrop to
• 18:13
  seeing it as an
• 18:14
  infrastructure,
• 18:15
  like a living
• 18:16
  infrastructure
• 18:17
  that regulate the
• 18:18
  air, the climate
• 18:20
  and the condition
• 18:21
  that make us
• 18:22
  complete life
• 18:23
  possible.
• 18:24
  And that's if in
• 18:25
  precision is
• 18:26
  powerful, because
• 18:27
  once you
• 18:28
  understand that
• 18:30
  your next breath
• 18:31
  depends on marine
• 18:33
  microorganism,
• 18:35
  the conversation
• 18:36
  completely
• 18:36
  changed. It
• 18:38
  because less
• 18:38
  about ideology
• 18:39
  and more about
• 18:41
  biology.
• 18:43
  And, Andrew,
• 18:46
  let's return to
• 18:47
  something simple,
• 18:48
  your breath.
• 18:50
  Right now, as you
• 18:50
  listen to this,
• 18:52
  oxygen is the
• 18:52
  first into your
• 18:54
  bloodstream, is
• 18:56
  traveling through
• 18:56
  your circulatory
• 18:57
  system, is
• 18:58
  entering billions
• 18:59
  of cells, is
• 19:01
  powering the
• 19:01
  neurons that
• 19:02
  allow to think,
• 19:04
  to reflect, to
• 19:05
  even question
• 19:06
  what I'm saying.
• 19:08
  And a wrong
• 19:09
  hallow that
• 19:09
  oxygen trace back
• 19:10
  to marine
• 19:11
  microorganism, no
• 19:12
  metaphorically,
• 19:13
  literally. So the
• 19:15
  ocean is not out
• 19:16
  there circulating
• 19:17
  through you. When
• 19:18
  I grow a
• 19:19
  heartbeat of
• 19:19
  consciousness,
• 19:20
  one of the
• 19:21
  central ideas I
• 19:22
  explore was that
• 19:26
  sign and the
• 19:26
  constant are not
• 19:27
  like a separate
• 19:28
  path.
• 19:29
  Understanding how
• 19:29
  life works, so
• 19:31
  change how we live within it.
• 19:32
  And for me,
• 19:34
  studying, you
• 19:35
  know, what area
• 19:36
  was not just
• 19:37
  research. It was
• 19:39
  like perp-stiff.
• 19:41
  It revealed that
• 19:42
  we are not a
• 19:43
  server of the
• 19:44
  planet. We are a
• 19:45
  participant in
• 19:46
  its regulatory
• 19:46
  system, because
• 19:48
  protecting the
• 19:48
  ocean is not
• 19:49
  environmental
• 19:51
  activity. It's
• 19:52
  biological
• 19:53
  realism.
• 19:54
  It is the
• 19:55
  recognition that
• 19:56
  we are integrated
• 19:57
  into the very
• 20:00
  system that we
• 20:01
  are modifying.
• 20:02
  And perhaps when
• 20:03
  we feel that not
• 20:04
  just
• 20:05
  intellectually,
• 20:06
  but deeply, it's
• 20:07
  something as
• 20:08
  simple as
• 20:09
  a breath.
• 20:11
  The way we relate
• 20:12
  the ocean will
• 20:13
  begin to change,
• 20:14
  because in the
• 20:16
  end, it is not
• 20:17
  just about saving
• 20:18
  the water. I
• 20:19
  think it is about
• 20:21
  understanding
• 20:22
  the life.
• 20:25
  Yeah, it's such
• 20:25
  an important
• 20:26
  aspect that we
• 20:29
  don't think
• 20:29
  about. As you
• 20:30
  eloquently
• 20:32
  explain to us, in
• 20:34
  terms of this
• 20:37
  process that
• 20:40
  plays such a big
• 20:41
  role in our
• 20:43
  lives, that we
• 20:44
  don't even
• 20:45
  realize because
• 20:46
  we don't see this
• 20:47
  happening.
• 20:48
  You know, we look
• 20:49
  at roles of how
• 20:50
  oxygen is
• 20:51
  produced. We look
• 20:53
  at role of how
• 20:54
  carbon is
• 20:55
  sequestered in
• 20:57
  the ocean deep
• 20:58
  through the
• 20:58
  biological carbon
• 21:00
  pump. And it's
• 21:02
  such an important
• 21:03
  aspect. And we've
• 21:04
  talked about it
• 21:05
  this week with
• 21:06
  each and every
• 21:08
  episode.
• 21:09
  Take me through,
• 21:10
  Jose, your
• 21:11
  research in
• 21:12
  synthetic
• 21:13
  biology. First,
• 21:14
  just kind of
• 21:14
  explain what
• 21:15
  synthetic biology
• 21:16
  is to the
• 21:17
  audience and how
• 21:18
  you're working
• 21:19
  with
• 21:20
  cyanobacteria,
• 21:22
  just in general
• 21:23
  in your research.
• 21:24
  So I am going to
• 21:26
  explain this in a
• 21:27
  way that most of
• 21:28
  the people can
• 21:29
  understand. So
• 21:29
  synthetic
• 21:30
  biology, so my
• 21:31
  work, for
• 21:31
  example, so
• 21:33
  imagine life, for
• 21:34
  example, we have
• 21:34
  a car and we want
• 21:36
  to modify this
• 21:37
  car to do this
• 21:38
  faster, you know,
• 21:39
  like to do
• 21:40
  it better.
• 21:41
  So basically, the
• 21:42
  thing that I do
• 21:43
  in the lab is
• 21:44
  like, for
• 21:44
  example, I am not
• 21:45
  like a kind of
• 21:46
  mechanic. So I
• 21:48
  had this, for
• 21:49
  example, I
• 21:50
  remember that I
• 21:51
  saw this
• 21:52
  cyanobacteria. I
• 21:54
  take this
• 21:54
  organism and I
• 21:55
  say, okay, I am
• 21:57
  going to find a
• 21:57
  way to integrate
• 21:59
  a protein and I'm
• 22:01
  going to start in
• 22:03
  a way that I can,
• 22:04
  for example, to
• 22:05
  put something
• 22:06
  inside of the
• 22:07
  cell that allow
• 22:08
  like this, this
• 22:10
  product
• 22:10
  that I have.
• 22:11
  I want to
• 22:11
  express, starting
• 22:13
  to produce in the
• 22:14
  cell in a way
• 22:15
  that just in a we
• 22:20
  see a two and in
• 22:24
  a media, you
• 22:25
  know, neutering
• 22:25
  with carbon and
• 22:27
  sunlight, we will
• 22:28
  be able like in
• 22:30
  the meantime that
• 22:31
  the cell are
• 22:31
  growing, we are
• 22:33
  producing this
• 22:33
  compound and we
• 22:34
  can take this
• 22:35
  compound and we
• 22:36
  can take
• 22:36
  advantage
• 22:37
  about that.
• 22:38
  So basically, my
• 22:39
  word is this. And
• 22:40
  for example,
• 22:40
  imagine that
• 22:41
  there is in this
• 22:42
  cyanobacteria,
• 22:43
  there are some
• 22:44
  toxin and we want
• 22:45
  to produce
• 22:45
  something like
• 22:46
  food grade or
• 22:47
  something. So I
• 22:48
  can take this
• 22:49
  thing and I say,
• 22:50
  okay, I need to
• 22:51
  remove this and I
• 22:52
  can do some
• 22:53
  process in the
• 22:54
  cell that I can
• 22:54
  interrupt this
• 22:55
  gene in order to
• 22:57
  create, you know,
• 22:58
  like all the
• 22:59
  modification that
• 22:59
  we can think
• 23:00
  about, like, for
• 23:01
  example, imagine
• 23:02
  that we can we
• 23:04
  want to do a
• 23:05
  faster, a strange way.
• 23:06
  I can have a lot
• 23:07
  to the genes that
• 23:08
  are more relating
• 23:09
  to producing like
• 23:10
  some compound
• 23:11
  that can make the
• 23:13
  cell grow faster
• 23:13
  and over express
• 23:14
  this to produce
• 23:15
  more copies.
• 23:18
  It's really
• 23:18
  exciting because
• 23:19
  it's something
• 23:19
  that changed the
• 23:20
  world because we
• 23:22
  are literally
• 23:22
  using a compound
• 23:24
  that it is CO2
• 23:25
  that the planet
• 23:26
  is like, you
• 23:27
  know, we know the
• 23:27
  situation in the
• 23:28
  planet with the
• 23:28
  CO2 and
• 23:30
  transforming this
• 23:31
  CO2 in something
• 23:31
  by by valuable
• 23:33
  life, for
• 23:33
  example, like
• 23:34
  biofuel, for
• 23:35
  example, another thing that we can do is to make it more effective.
• 23:36
  So the one
• 23:36
  compound we are,
• 23:39
  for example,
• 23:40
  under most the
• 23:40
  most interesting
• 23:41
  thing for the
• 23:42
  first time, we
• 23:45
  are starting to
• 23:46
  produce insulin
• 23:47
  in cyanobacteria
• 23:47
  that we just to
• 23:49
  release that. So
• 23:50
  thinking about
• 23:51
  the impact of
• 23:51
  about this.
• 23:52
  So so many people
• 23:53
  having diabetes
• 23:54
  and now the
• 23:56
  platform to
• 23:56
  produce this is
• 23:57
  in equalize. So
• 23:58
  imagine that now
• 23:59
  you can produce
• 24:00
  exactly the same
• 24:00
  with an organism
• 24:02
  that in a green
• 24:04
  way that you see
• 24:06
  you choose
• 24:06
  sunlight, you
• 24:07
  produce something
• 24:08
  like a bio, a
• 24:09
  biomedical
• 24:09
  compound that is
• 24:10
  helping the life
• 24:11
  of so
• 24:12
  many people.
• 24:13
  And also at the
• 24:13
  same time, you
• 24:15
  are helping the
• 24:15
  planet. So that's
• 24:16
  to me like that.
• 24:17
  I think when I
• 24:17
  start to say I
• 24:18
  start maybe the
• 24:19
  interview in
• 24:20
  2016. And when I
• 24:22
  see this, like
• 24:23
  this organism
• 24:23
  could change the
• 24:25
  world is like
• 24:25
  something that is
• 24:28
  something like it
• 24:30
  just resonate
• 24:31
  with me and has
• 24:33
  been more
• 24:33
  than 10 years.
• 24:34
  And here I am
• 24:35
  because I always
• 24:36
  have been, you
• 24:37
  know, like
• 24:37
  helping the
• 24:38
  planet and it's
• 24:39
  something
• 24:39
  fascinating. The
• 24:40
  thing that we can
• 24:41
  do with this
• 24:42
  organizing and
• 24:42
  also the
• 24:43
  importance of
• 24:43
  understanding how
• 24:44
  you go and the
• 24:45
  impact in the in
• 24:46
  the real world.
• 24:47
  That's amazing. I
• 24:48
  love it. Take me
• 24:50
  back to your PhD.
• 24:52
  You know, how did
• 24:53
  you discover, you
• 24:56
  know, in terms of
• 24:58
  working with with
• 24:59
  cyanobacteria?
• 25:00
  Why
• 25:00
  cyanobacteria?
• 25:01
  Like, obviously,
• 25:01
  you said that it
• 25:02
  makes such a difference.
• 25:03
  But how did you
• 25:04
  come up with that
• 25:05
  thesis of working
• 25:07
  with
• 25:07
  cyanobacteria in
• 25:09
  synthetic
• 25:09
  biology? Like,
• 25:10
  where did it come
• 25:11
  from? Because,
• 25:11
  you know, it's
• 25:12
  not talked about
• 25:13
  a lot. I'm sure
• 25:13
  it's talked a lot
• 25:14
  in molecular
• 25:15
  biology. But did
• 25:16
  you see it in
• 25:17
  your undergrad or
• 25:18
  through your
• 25:18
  masters? Or how
• 25:19
  did you discover
• 25:20
  that working with
• 25:21
  cyanobacteria
• 25:22
  would be so
• 25:23
  important?
• 25:25
  So I started
• 25:27
  working in the
• 25:27
  lab during my
• 25:28
  master. I was
• 25:30
  studying
• 25:30
  different
• 25:31
  organisms, like
• 25:31
  organisms that
• 25:32
  are associated
• 25:32
  with plants, like
• 25:33
  rhizobia
• 25:34
  bacteria. There
• 25:35
  are some bacteria
• 25:36
  that can
• 25:36
  associate same
• 25:38
  biopsy
• 25:38
  with plants.
• 25:39
  And I started
• 25:41
  doing synthetic
• 25:42
  biology with this
• 25:43
  organization over
• 25:44
  expressions on
• 25:44
  genes and the
• 25:45
  things when I
• 25:47
  finished this,
• 25:48
  you know, all of
• 25:50
  the people has
• 25:50
  this
• 25:51
  philosophical
• 25:51
  question, like
• 25:52
  what is the next
• 25:53
  what what is the
• 25:54
  thing that we
• 25:54
  should do?
• 25:55
  And I was having
• 25:56
  a look at the
• 25:58
  different PhD
• 25:58
  topics and the
• 25:59
  things. And there
• 26:01
  was a group in in
• 26:03
  Cordoba in the
• 26:04
  south of Spain,
• 26:05
  then there is
• 26:05
  like one of the
• 26:06
  few in the world
• 26:08
  that they are
• 26:08
  studying
• 26:08
  cyanobacteria
• 26:10
  like different
• 26:10
  type of cyanobacteria.
• 26:11
  And there was a
• 26:12
  project like
• 26:13
  very, very
• 26:13
  exciting because
• 26:14
  they was the end
• 26:16
  of that. It was
• 26:16
  understanding the
• 26:17
  metabolism, how
• 26:18
  this organism one
• 26:19
  how because one
• 26:22
  interesting
• 26:22
  things is like,
• 26:23
  you know, like
• 26:24
  this organism can
• 26:26
  use like I
• 26:28
  mentioned, like
• 26:28
  CO2 in order to
• 26:31
  grow, to survive.
• 26:34
  But most
• 26:35
  interesting thing
• 26:36
  is like they just
• 26:36
  discovered that
• 26:38
  this
• 26:38
  cyanobacteria has
• 26:40
  inside of the
• 26:41
  cell some
• 26:42
  transport like
• 26:44
  from glucose and
• 26:45
  difference carbon
• 26:49
  transport.
• 26:50
  And the thing
• 26:51
  that they
• 26:51
  discovered is
• 26:52
  like really,
• 26:53
  really amazing
• 26:53
  because this
• 26:55
  organism when
• 26:57
  they are
• 26:57
  available, when
• 26:58
  they have life,
• 26:59
  for example, in
• 26:59
  the in the ocean
• 27:00
  that they have
• 27:01
  available carbon.
• 27:03
  So like, for
• 27:03
  example, glucose
• 27:04
  that they are in
• 27:04
  the animal range
• 27:05
  in the ocean,
• 27:07
  they can take it
• 27:08
  from the, you
• 27:09
  know, from the
• 27:09
  from the
• 27:10
  environment.
• 27:11
  And it is like a
• 27:11
  metabolic
• 27:12
  advantage because
• 27:13
  they are like
• 27:13
  this organism and
• 27:15
  they are working
• 27:16
  in order to be
• 27:17
  very, very
• 27:18
  efficient. You
• 27:19
  know, it's like
• 27:19
  even like with
• 27:21
  the with the
• 27:21
  centuries, like
• 27:22
  with the 1000 of
• 27:23
  the year, they
• 27:24
  are always
• 27:25
  compacting the,
• 27:26
  you know, like
• 27:26
  they are very,
• 27:27
  very
• 27:27
  small genome.
• 27:28
  And every time is
• 27:29
  like, okay, how
• 27:30
  can I be more
• 27:30
  efficiently and
• 27:32
  understanding all
• 27:33
  of that thing,
• 27:34
  you know, but my
• 27:35
  main thing is
• 27:36
  like, this
• 27:37
  organism, like
• 27:38
  when I see like
• 27:39
  because in the in
• 27:40
  their website,
• 27:40
  they have, you
• 27:41
  know, like, that
• 27:42
  they organize and
• 27:43
  like produce
• 27:44
  oxygen that they
• 27:45
  they was like a
• 27:46
  lot of thing that
• 27:48
  they can do in
• 27:49
  order to save the
• 27:50
  planet, say,
• 27:51
  okay, I think
• 27:51
  this is my field,
• 27:53
  because it's like
• 27:53
  a way that I can
• 27:54
  use in order to
• 27:55
  have my planet
• 27:55
  and this blow my
• 27:56
  mind, you know, and we can do that.
• 27:57
  You know, and
• 27:58
  with the passing
• 27:58
  of the time, I
• 27:59
  studied, you
• 28:00
  know, different
• 28:01
  strain because we
• 28:02
  have a strain
• 28:03
  that grows slow,
• 28:05
  grow fast, one of
• 28:06
  them are using
• 28:07
  from
• 28:08
  biotechnology
• 28:08
  perspective that
• 28:09
  are like the now
• 28:10
  that we are going
• 28:11
  in that there are
• 28:12
  fast
• 28:12
  growing strain.
• 28:13
  And to me, when I
• 28:15
  find this is
• 28:17
  something that
• 28:18
  say this is like,
• 28:19
  you know, one of
• 28:20
  the main reasons
• 28:21
  that I am hearing
• 28:21
  this word is from
• 28:23
  this. And with
• 28:25
  the passing of
• 28:25
  dying, Andrew,
• 28:27
  and I was like,
• 28:28
  especially with
• 28:30
  this organism,
• 28:30
  because for
• 28:31
  example, when I
• 28:31
  finished my PhD,
• 28:34
  you need to you
• 28:35
  want to continue
• 28:35
  in sign, you need
• 28:36
  a you need to do
• 28:37
  something called
• 28:38
  postdoctoral research.
• 28:39
  So I moved to the
• 28:43
  University of
• 28:44
  Anglia Norwich,
• 28:46
  UK also, in order
• 28:48
  because it was
• 28:50
  published a paper
• 28:51
  that they was in,
• 28:53
  they were trying
• 28:54
  to, to create
• 28:55
  like a toolbox in
• 28:56
  order to modify
• 28:57
  the fast growing
• 28:58
  strain in order
• 29:00
  that they want
• 29:00
  that we can use
• 29:01
  for
• 29:01
  biotechnology.
• 29:02
  And I studied, I
• 29:05
  spent two years
• 29:06
  developing these
• 29:07
  tools in order to
• 29:08
  modify the
• 29:09
  strains in order
• 29:11
  to produce
• 29:11
  compound and the
• 29:12
  thing that's the
• 29:14
  most exciting to
• 29:15
  me because it's
• 29:16
  like has been,
• 29:16
  you know, has
• 29:17
  been like always
• 29:18
  helping with
• 29:19
  synovatry, but
• 29:20
  it's like has
• 29:20
  been aligning
• 29:21
  more, you know,
• 29:22
  in order to what
• 29:24
  it can I do to
• 29:25
  help this in a in
• 29:26
  a better way.
• 29:28
  Like the, the
• 29:29
  topic of my
• 29:29
  research, like in
• 29:30
  order to modify
• 29:31
  this strain to
• 29:33
  produce something
• 29:34
  that we can help
• 29:35
  the planet and
• 29:35
  the same time
• 29:36
  that we are
• 29:37
  producing
• 29:37
  different wide
• 29:38
  range of
• 29:39
  compound.
• 29:40
  Yeah, no, that's,
• 29:41
  it's super
• 29:42
  exciting.
• 29:43
  When we talk
• 29:45
  about sound of
• 29:47
  bacteria and
• 29:48
  their, their role
• 29:51
  in climate
• 29:52
  change, right,
• 29:54
  you know,
• 29:55
  bringing it back
• 29:55
  to the people,
• 29:57
  you know,
• 29:57
  obviously there's
• 29:58
  a lot of medical,
• 29:59
  there's a lot of
• 29:59
  medical, I guess,
• 30:03
  practicalities
• 30:04
  that you can that
• 30:05
  you can use for people.
• 30:06
  So that's, that's
• 30:07
  really great.
• 30:08
  From a climate
• 30:09
  change
• 30:09
  perspective, you
• 30:10
  know, they
• 30:11
  obviously play a
• 30:11
  very important
• 30:12
  role. Are there
• 30:14
  any, is there any
• 30:15
  research out
• 30:16
  there trying to
• 30:17
  get cyanobacteria
• 30:18
  more involved in
• 30:20
  sort of, you
• 30:23
  know, absorbing
• 30:24
  more CO2 from the atmosphere?
• 30:25
  Is it possible to
• 30:28
  do that? I know
• 30:29
  there's like
• 30:29
  fertilization
• 30:29
  research out
• 30:31
  there to try and
• 30:32
  fertilize that
• 30:32
  the, the, the
• 30:34
  ocean with iron,
• 30:35
  which, you know,
• 30:35
  people aren't
• 30:36
  loving with
• 30:37
  cyanobacteria. Is
• 30:38
  there any
• 30:38
  research with
• 30:39
  climate change to
• 30:41
  help reduce
• 30:42
  climate change or
• 30:43
  help basically
• 30:44
  absorb a lot of
• 30:46
  the CO2 through,
• 30:47
  through the
• 30:47
  atmosphere?
• 30:48
  So I am going to
• 30:49
  tell you
• 30:49
  something really
• 30:50
  exciting. After I
• 30:52
  finished this
• 30:53
  postdoctoral
• 30:53
  research, I was
• 30:54
  also before to
• 30:56
  take in the
• 30:56
  decision to take
• 30:57
  the lead to move
• 30:57
  to industry. I
• 30:59
  contact with one,
• 31:01
  with one
• 31:02
  researcher in the
• 31:03
  University of
• 31:04
  Illinois in
• 31:04
  California.
• 31:07
  They, they think
• 31:09
  that it was
• 31:10
  really
• 31:10
  interesting to
• 31:11
  me. They were
• 31:11
  collaborating
• 31:12
  with the NASA in
• 31:15
  order to, to
• 31:17
  create like, they
• 31:19
  think it was,
• 31:20
  they think that
• 31:21
  they were doing
• 31:21
  like, was really,
• 31:22
  really
• 31:22
  interesting
• 31:22
  because they was
• 31:23
  doing ocean
• 31:25
  glories around
• 31:26
  the world in
• 31:28
  order to
• 31:28
  measuring the
• 31:29
  population of
• 31:30
  cyanobacteria,
• 31:31
  most of the, you
• 31:31
  know,
• 31:32
  phytoplactone,
• 31:32
  you know,
• 31:33
  different
• 31:33
  organisms that
• 31:34
  are part of that.
• 31:36
  And in order,
• 31:36
  like, if they can
• 31:37
  quantify like in
• 31:38
  every part of the
• 31:39
  ocean, what are
• 31:41
  the, the, for
• 31:42
  example, how many
• 31:43
  like percentage
• 31:43
  of the organism,
• 31:45
  they could create
• 31:46
  like a plants in
• 31:47
  order to create a
• 31:49
  plants for
• 31:50
  climate change.
• 31:52
  But it's
• 31:53
  something that it
• 31:53
  is like a
• 31:54
  currently in
• 31:54
  studying.
• 31:57
  For example, in
• 31:57
  the ocean, there
• 31:58
  are like, you
• 31:59
  know, if I
• 32:00
  mentioned that
• 32:00
  are like so many
• 32:01
  phytoplactone is
• 32:02
  about like just
• 32:03
  not by
• 32:03
  cyanobacteria,
• 32:04
  cyanobacteria is
• 32:05
  most important.
• 32:05
  There are part
• 32:06
  of, for example,
• 32:07
  diatomins and so
• 32:08
  many organisms.
• 32:10
  But most of the,
• 32:10
  the organisms
• 32:11
  that produce most
• 32:12
  of the oxygen of
• 32:13
  the world is
• 32:14
  called
• 32:14
  plocorococcus.
• 32:15
  It's like a very,
• 32:16
  very tiny cell.
• 32:19
  And yeah, we need
• 32:20
  to the main thing
• 32:22
  that this, this
• 32:23
  is this specific
• 32:24
  strain is like
• 32:25
  very, very
• 32:26
  sensitive because
• 32:27
  small chain in
• 32:29
  the temperature
• 32:29
  could affect to
• 32:31
  the to the
• 32:33
  population.
• 32:34
  So now it's start
• 32:35
  to to the claim
• 32:36
  in to decrease
• 32:37
  the population of
• 32:38
  a bit of this.
• 32:39
  But in order to
• 32:40
  do something, you
• 32:41
  know, at a global
• 32:42
  scale is
• 32:43
  something that is
• 32:45
  not anything.
• 32:46
  And also, I don't
• 32:46
  know if you heard
• 32:47
  about that. But
• 32:48
  there was some
• 32:49
  there was a
• 32:50
  paper. It was
• 32:51
  from probably
• 32:52
  five or seven
• 32:53
  years ago, that
• 32:55
  they, okay, there
• 32:57
  are some
• 32:57
  researchers that
• 32:58
  they want to, to,
• 33:00
  you know, like
• 33:00
  say, we, for
• 33:01
  example, having
• 33:02
  more iron to the
• 33:03
  ocean, you know,
• 33:04
  we will be in
• 33:05
  also in
• 33:05
  enhancing, you
• 33:06
  know, like the
• 33:07
  increasing of
• 33:08
  this
• 33:08
  microorganism.
• 33:09
  But there is
• 33:10
  another response
• 33:11
  to that, that
• 33:12
  there is there is
• 33:12
  something very, very
• 33:13
  controversial
• 33:14
  because when you
• 33:15
  do that, you
• 33:16
  change the
• 33:16
  completely state
• 33:18
  of all of the all
• 33:20
  of the ecosystem
• 33:20
  that they are
• 33:21
  living together.
• 33:22
  And it is
• 33:23
  something that I
• 33:24
  think that the
• 33:25
  main thing that
• 33:25
  we need to do is
• 33:26
  taking care of
• 33:26
  the thing that we
• 33:28
  have. And yeah,
• 33:31
  because it's just
• 33:32
  a small chain
• 33:33
  could make a like
• 33:35
  a drafty list if
• 33:36
  in all of the
• 33:37
  population.
• 33:38
  For people who
• 33:39
  are listening in
• 33:39
  the audience, who
• 33:41
  are like, look,
• 33:41
  these microbes,
• 33:42
  obviously, they
• 33:43
  have some
• 33:43
  importance to
• 33:44
  them. You know,
• 33:47
  but but they're
• 33:47
  just like, we
• 33:48
  don't see these
• 33:48
  things all the
• 33:49
  time. And every
• 33:50
  time, you know,
• 33:50
  they focus on
• 33:51
  algae, you know,
• 33:53
  they think of bad
• 33:54
  things associated
• 33:55
  with algae.
• 33:57
  How can we get
• 33:58
  people to think
• 33:59
  more positively
• 34:01
  about things like
• 34:03
  cyanobacteria or
• 34:04
  algae in general?
• 34:07
  Yes, I see this
• 34:08
  point. And also,
• 34:08
  actually, I
• 34:10
  remember in my
• 34:10
  last year when I
• 34:11
  was studying in
• 34:12
  Cordoba, people
• 34:13
  say, oh, you
• 34:14
  know, I am very,
• 34:16
  I'm feeling, you
• 34:17
  know, very bad
• 34:18
  because I have a
• 34:19
  lake in my town.
• 34:21
  And you know,
• 34:21
  this town, they
• 34:22
  have like a song,
• 34:24
  cyanobacteria
• 34:25
  that they are
• 34:25
  toxic. And we
• 34:27
  cannot, you know,
• 34:28
  like go to get
• 34:29
  like a swimming
• 34:29
  in the in, you
• 34:31
  know, during
• 34:33
  the salmon.
• 34:34
  But it is like
• 34:34
  happening, like
• 34:35
  not in a very
• 34:36
  globally way
• 34:37
  there is a of
• 34:38
  course there are
• 34:38
  some
• 34:39
  cyanobacteria
• 34:40
  that has and also
• 34:41
  some microalgae
• 34:42
  that has inside
• 34:43
  of the genome
• 34:44
  some I won't I
• 34:46
  won't be like
• 34:46
  here like very,
• 34:47
  very centrifugal
• 34:48
  way but has some
• 34:49
  genes inside that
• 34:50
  they will be able
• 34:52
  to produce some
• 34:53
  toxin normally in
• 34:55
  a very low, low
• 34:56
  concentration.
• 34:58
  But we say that
• 35:00
  we don't see this
• 35:01
  this organism.
• 35:02
  But for example,
• 35:03
  I'm going to tell
• 35:04
  you two years
• 35:04
  ago, I was in
• 35:07
  Thailand, and it
• 35:08
  was a night and I
• 35:09
  was in a boat.
• 35:11
  And I see this
• 35:12
  organism glow,
• 35:14
  because there are
• 35:14
  some of them that
• 35:16
  has inside or
• 35:17
  then some genes
• 35:19
  that they can
• 35:20
  that they will be
• 35:21
  able to produce
• 35:22
  by Lumi sense.
• 35:23
  And it is
• 35:24
  something really,
• 35:24
  really exciting
• 35:25
  and recommend all
• 35:26
  the people that
• 35:26
  have the
• 35:27
  opportunity
• 35:28
  to see.
• 35:29
  But the message
• 35:30
  to this, like it
• 35:31
  is not like a
• 35:32
  organism that it
• 35:34
  is like a person
• 35:34
  an illness or it
• 35:36
  is not most of
• 35:37
  the strain of
• 35:38
  when I say in a
• 35:39
  strain, like I am
• 35:40
  telling like, we
• 35:42
  have like a
• 35:43
  different type of
• 35:44
  organism that you
• 35:45
  know, like me in
• 35:46
  this is like, one
• 35:48
  time we have
• 35:48
  another time, you
• 35:49
  know, like
• 35:49
  different
• 35:50
  general.
• 35:51
  But it's not
• 35:54
  something like
• 35:55
  that for the in
• 35:56
  the overall, but
• 35:56
  for the headlight
• 35:57
  in some cases, in
• 35:59
  a very specific
• 35:59
  circumstances,
• 36:00
  there are there
• 36:01
  could be like a
• 36:03
  circus like there
• 36:04
  is a bloom of
• 36:05
  this organism,
• 36:07
  but it is not
• 36:07
  something that
• 36:08
  happily like
• 36:09
  very, very
• 36:09
  frequently on a
• 36:10
  global scale that
• 36:12
  you for example,
• 36:12
  and in the ocean
• 36:13
  and say, Oh, no,
• 36:13
  you know, I need
• 36:14
  to be care
• 36:14
  about this.
• 36:16
  Organizing that
• 36:16
  I'm going to be,
• 36:18
  it's like a
• 36:18
  represent like a
• 36:19
  threat for that.
• 36:20
  But absolutely,
• 36:21
  you know, we need
• 36:22
  to recommend all
• 36:23
  other people to
• 36:24
  read more about
• 36:25
  this and think
• 36:26
  about this.
• 36:27
  Because most of
• 36:28
  the people under
• 36:29
  you think, Oh, we
• 36:29
  need to save the
• 36:32
  forest, you know,
• 36:33
  but let's think
• 36:34
  about the ocean
• 36:35
  because it's like
• 36:36
  the other land of
• 36:38
  the planet and be
• 36:39
  concerned
• 36:39
  about this.
• 36:41
  What is what is
• 36:42
  the thing that we
• 36:43
  can do in order
• 36:43
  to to help the
• 36:45
  ocean? Yeah, I
• 36:47
  think it's I
• 36:48
  think it's
• 36:48
  interesting
• 36:49
  because you know,
• 36:49
  we see we see a
• 36:51
  lot of people,
• 36:52
  you know, I see
• 36:53
  it now. One of
• 36:54
  the things I see
• 36:55
  right now is
• 36:55
  like, you know,
• 36:56
  sargasm is on the
• 36:57
  beaches in the
• 36:57
  Caribbean and
• 36:58
  people are
• 36:58
  freaking out
• 36:59
  because they see
• 36:59
  this and it's a
• 37:00
  climate change
• 37:01
  thing. It's
• 37:01
  increasing more because of climate change.
• 37:02
  But these the
• 37:04
  seaweed also
• 37:05
  helps, you know,
• 37:06
  sequester carbon.
• 37:08
  Same thing with
• 37:09
  with, you know,
• 37:10
  some of these
• 37:10
  microbes that we
• 37:11
  that we don't
• 37:12
  see. I guess and
• 37:14
  and there's
• 37:15
  there's such a
• 37:15
  knowledge gap in
• 37:17
  microbes, even
• 37:17
  for myself. And
• 37:18
  as I learn more
• 37:19
  and more, I start
• 37:20
  to get especially
• 37:20
  this week as I
• 37:21
  did research for
• 37:21
  the episodes this
• 37:22
  week and your
• 37:23
  episodes. I'm
• 37:24
  always impressed
• 37:25
  by what microbes
• 37:26
  are able to do in
• 37:27
  the ocean and for
• 37:28
  us as a as a
• 37:29
  planet. But if if
• 37:31
  there's, you know, if there's a lot of microbes in the ocean, you know, you know, you can do it.
• 37:32
  You know, there's
• 37:32
  still a knowledge
• 37:32
  gap. So if
• 37:33
  there's if
• 37:34
  there's one thing
• 37:35
  you wish people
• 37:36
  understood about
• 37:38
  microbes in the
• 37:39
  ocean, what would
• 37:41
  it be? That's a
• 37:41
  difficult
• 37:42
  question, Andrea.
• 37:44
  I will I will I
• 37:47
  will try to to
• 37:48
  understand this
• 37:49
  like, no, like,
• 37:51
  like a single,
• 37:51
  you know, like a
• 37:52
  single unit,
• 37:53
  understand
• 37:54
  everything, like
• 37:55
  a chain that all
• 37:56
  of us are a part
• 37:57
  of this
• 37:57
  ecosystem.
• 37:59
  And we are living
• 37:59
  from that we are
• 38:00
  like living
• 38:01
  together. And
• 38:04
  yeah, like, for
• 38:04
  example, like put
• 38:05
  or, you know,
• 38:07
  like, thinking
• 38:08
  about the thing
• 38:09
  that we can do in
• 38:10
  order to help the
• 38:10
  planet, you know,
• 38:11
  like, for
• 38:11
  example, we see
• 38:12
  like, when you
• 38:13
  see this, for
• 38:14
  example, the new,
• 38:15
  you see like the
• 38:16
  ocean, like
• 38:16
  people putting a
• 38:17
  lot of garbage on
• 38:18
  it is like, you
• 38:19
  know, like, for
• 38:19
  example, on some
• 38:20
  countries like
• 38:21
  India,
• 38:22
  Bangladesh, that
• 38:22
  you see, like the
• 38:23
  place around that
• 38:25
  you say how this
• 38:26
  can be possible.
• 38:27
  And for example,
• 38:28
  so many factories
• 38:29
  like we producing
• 38:32
  so many CO2 to
• 38:34
  the asthma fair
• 38:34
  about that. We
• 38:37
  need to think
• 38:37
  like this
• 38:38
  organism is
• 38:39
  helping to deal
• 38:40
  with problem, a
• 38:42
  problem, like
• 38:42
  very important
• 38:43
  problem that
• 38:44
  we're suffering
• 38:44
  nowadays are like
• 38:45
  the greenhouse
• 38:46
  effect, because
• 38:47
  as you mentioned,
• 38:49
  they are can
• 38:49
  capture this gas
• 38:51
  that this
• 38:52
  terrible gas that
• 38:53
  we are producing
• 38:54
  and we are
• 38:54
  posting in like
• 38:55
  the, the earth.
• 38:57
  Every year more,
• 38:58
  more, more, more,
• 38:59
  more, more. They
• 39:00
  have the ability,
• 39:02
  same thing that
• 39:03
  the planet even
• 39:03
  more efficiently
• 39:04
  to capture the
• 39:05
  CO2. And the same
• 39:07
  thing with it.
• 39:08
  Okay, we are
• 39:09
  taking the CO2
• 39:10
  and at the same
• 39:10
  time are
• 39:11
  releasing oxygen
• 39:12
  and the thing
• 39:13
  that they do in
• 39:13
  the life, like,
• 39:14
  exactly the same
• 39:14
  process.
• 39:15
  But at the end, I
• 39:16
  am releasing
• 39:16
  oxygen, but
• 39:17
  producing a
• 39:18
  compound, even
• 39:20
  like thing that
• 39:22
  you can even
• 39:22
  imagine, like
• 39:23
  everything that
• 39:23
  will change that
• 39:24
  you can think we
• 39:25
  can produce. So
• 39:26
  it is like
• 39:27
  something that I
• 39:29
  didn't start to
• 39:29
  communicate a lot about that.
• 39:30
  You know, like,
• 39:31
  for example,
• 39:31
  doing a lot of
• 39:32
  talking about
• 39:33
  this and most of
• 39:34
  the people and
• 39:34
  even when my book
• 39:35
  I start to, to
• 39:37
  talk also a bit
• 39:37
  about the sign of
• 39:39
  a theory and most
• 39:40
  of the people
• 39:40
  under you, I feel
• 39:41
  like they don't
• 39:42
  understand this
• 39:43
  and they don't
• 39:43
  have a idea about
• 39:45
  the thing that
• 39:47
  they are capable
• 39:47
  to do, because
• 39:48
  this is this, the
• 39:50
  problem is life
• 39:50
  from the
• 39:51
  secondary school
• 39:51
  that they teach,
• 39:52
  the same that I
• 39:53
  was telling, like
• 39:54
  the oxygen
• 39:55
  released by the
• 39:56
  forest, by the
• 39:57
  trees, but there
• 39:58
  is no mention in
• 39:59
  the book there's a lot of
• 40:00
  leads that I have
• 40:01
  seen in from this
• 40:02
  organism. And now
• 40:03
  I think that with
• 40:04
  the past, the
• 40:04
  time people will
• 40:05
  take a more
• 40:06
  constant and
• 40:07
  aware about this.
• 40:08
  But I think that
• 40:10
  the situation is
• 40:10
  starting to
• 40:12
  change because
• 40:12
  most of the
• 40:13
  people that I
• 40:14
  know with the
• 40:15
  past, you know,
• 40:15
  like when I are
• 40:17
  doing like event
• 40:18
  in order to
• 40:19
  communicate this
• 40:20
  more like people
• 40:21
  are trying to be
• 40:22
  more aware about
• 40:23
  this. Yeah. And
• 40:24
  it's interesting,
• 40:25
  you know, you
• 40:25
  talk about
• 40:26
  getting people
• 40:27
  more aware.
• 40:30
  What do you think
• 40:33
  scientists should
• 40:34
  do differently if
• 40:35
  they want their
• 40:35
  work to actually
• 40:36
  reach an
• 40:37
  influenced
• 40:38
  society? Well, I
• 40:39
  think the main
• 40:40
  problem that we
• 40:41
  have is science
• 40:42
  and science
• 40:43
  sometimes we
• 40:45
  don't have enough
• 40:46
  visibility,
• 40:47
  because we
• 40:47
  produce like, for
• 40:48
  example, so many
• 40:50
  papers, you know,
• 40:50
  we publish a
• 40:51
  paper in nature
• 40:52
  or something like
• 40:52
  that, this like
• 40:53
  something like,
• 40:54
  yeah, very, very
• 40:55
  important.
• 40:56
  But for example,
• 40:57
  you will never
• 40:58
  see like on TV,
• 40:59
  oh, this kind,
• 41:00
  this group, this
• 41:01
  group has
• 41:01
  discovered in the
• 41:03
  ocean when make
• 41:03
  urbanism that,
• 41:04
  you know, we can
• 41:05
  do something for
• 41:06
  helping the
• 41:06
  planet because,
• 41:07
  you know, like, I
• 41:08
  think that there
• 41:08
  is like the
• 41:09
  message to that
• 41:09
  to the
• 41:10
  general people.
• 41:11
  For example, it
• 41:12
  is not like
• 41:13
  something that
• 41:16
  they are thinking
• 41:16
  that they are
• 41:17
  relevant or they
• 41:17
  can, you know,
• 41:18
  like, and more
• 41:19
  audience. But I
• 41:21
  think like the
• 41:21
  main thing that
• 41:21
  we need to do is
• 41:22
  like give more
• 41:23
  visibility to
• 41:25
  scientists,
• 41:26
  because even
• 41:27
  like, for
• 41:27
  example, when
• 41:28
  science want to
• 41:28
  communicate, for
• 41:29
  example, in the
• 41:29
  past, when I was
• 41:30
  working in the
• 41:31
  unity, in the
• 41:32
  university,
• 41:33
  sorry, the way
• 41:34
  that we do it,
• 41:35
  for example, we
• 41:35
  went to different
• 41:37
  high secondary
• 41:38
  school, you know,
• 41:39
  people was in the
• 41:39
  moment that they
• 41:40
  need to,
• 41:41
  that's very,
• 41:42
  very, I really
• 41:42
  like that when I
• 41:43
  was working in
• 41:43
  the unit, because
• 41:44
  we go to give
• 41:46
  talking, for
• 41:46
  example, I made
• 41:47
  that you are just
• 41:48
  finishing, you
• 41:48
  are doing
• 41:49
  science, you
• 41:49
  know, like
• 41:50
  starting, and
• 41:51
  you're starting
• 41:51
  to see and say,
• 41:52
  okay, what should
• 41:52
  they do?
• 41:54
  I am like
• 41:54
  something that I
• 41:56
  really feel like
• 41:57
  fulfillment, like
• 41:58
  with myself, for
• 41:59
  example, when you
• 42:00
  like, for
• 42:00
  example, give
• 42:01
  people, tell
• 42:02
  people, okay, we
• 42:03
  have this
• 42:03
  organization, we
• 42:04
  can do
• 42:04
  that, you know,
• 42:05
  it's a thing that
• 42:07
  people say
• 42:07
  starting to study
• 42:08
  in this as
• 42:09
  something that
• 42:10
  change, you know,
• 42:12
  like, see
• 42:12
  something that
• 42:13
  proves like a big
• 42:14
  chain and to
• 42:14
  that. But the
• 42:16
  thing is like,
• 42:16
  yes, I think that
• 42:17
  the main problem
• 42:17
  is like, we don't
• 42:18
  have visibility,
• 42:19
  we think like, we
• 42:21
  need to do
• 42:21
  something. But
• 42:22
  thanks to people
• 42:23
  like you, and
• 42:25
  another like
• 42:25
  entities like
• 42:26
  give visibility
• 42:29
  to science in
• 42:29
  this interview,
• 42:31
  for example, when
• 42:31
  I saw your
• 42:32
  pocket, I said
• 42:32
  like, this is
• 42:33
  like when this is
• 42:34
  something that
• 42:34
  should be like,
• 42:36
  you know, even on
• 42:37
  TV or something,
• 42:38
  why don't you
• 42:38
  know, the ocean
• 42:39
  is like, but I'm
• 42:40
  telling you,
• 42:41
  Andrew, like with
• 42:41
  the passion at
• 42:42
  the time, we will
• 42:42
  remember this
• 42:43
  word, because
• 42:43
  this will be like
• 42:44
  a massive impact.
• 42:46
  Because now, you
• 42:47
  know, like this
• 42:47
  thing that, for
• 42:48
  example, I was
• 42:48
  telling you about
• 42:49
  the insulin, it's
• 42:50
  something that we
• 42:50
  just discovered,
• 42:51
  and we will see,
• 42:53
  we have a
• 42:54
  schedule with the
• 42:55
  BBC in order to
• 42:56
  talk about this,
• 42:57
  you will see like
• 42:58
  when this
• 42:58
  happened,
• 43:00
  it's like when
• 43:00
  people will be,
• 43:01
  oh, they know
• 43:01
  this organism
• 43:02
  producing
• 43:03
  insulin, because
• 43:04
  I think we are
• 43:04
  going to finish
• 43:05
  with all of the
• 43:05
  resource. And we
• 43:06
  had this organism
• 43:07
  that using the
• 43:08
  CO2 on this and
• 43:09
  will be like the
• 43:10
  absolutely the
• 43:11
  game changer.
• 43:12
  I completely
• 43:12
  agree. Jose, this
• 43:14
  has been
• 43:14
  absolutely
• 43:15
  amazing to have
• 43:16
  you on the
• 43:16
  podcast and be
• 43:17
  able to talk
• 43:17
  about this talk
• 43:18
  about microbes,
• 43:18
  talk about your
• 43:19
  work with
• 43:20
  cyanobacteria, I
• 43:21
  think it's such
• 43:21
  an important
• 43:22
  aspect to to the
• 43:24
  work you do. And
• 43:25
  I'd love to
• 43:25
  invite you back
• 43:26
  on to talk more
• 43:27
  about some of the
• 43:27
  work you do in
• 43:28
  the future.
• 43:29
  And we would we'd
• 43:30
  love to hear more
• 43:31
  about microbes
• 43:31
  because we just
• 43:32
  don't know enough
• 43:33
  about microbes on
• 43:33
  this podcast and
• 43:34
  we need to know
• 43:35
  more. So again,
• 43:37
  Jose, thank you
• 43:37
  so much for
• 43:38
  joining us. We
• 43:38
  really appreciate
• 43:39
  it. And we'll
• 43:40
  talk to you soon.
• 43:41
  Absolutely. It
• 43:41
  was a pleasure.
• 43:42
  And thanks for
• 43:43
  this opportunity.
• 43:44
  And great job. And
• 43:45
  congratulations
• 43:46
  to you, Andrew,
• 43:47
  for being this
• 43:47
  really a work
• 43:49
  because thanks to
• 43:51
  boys like you,
• 43:52
  like we are like
• 43:53
  taking all of the
• 43:54
  books of the
• 43:54
  scientists and
• 43:55
  amplifying this
• 43:56
  is like the thing
• 43:57
  that we are doing
• 43:58
  the real
• 43:59
  difference.
• 43:59
  And the world. So
• 44:00
  thank you for
• 44:00
  this. You need to
• 44:02
  be proud of that.
• 44:02
  Well, thank you
• 44:03
  very much. I do
• 44:04
  appreciate it.
• 44:05
  It's it's a lot
• 44:05
  of hard work, as
• 44:06
  you know, and
• 44:07
  it's it, but it's
• 44:08
  it's the reward
• 44:09
  is worth it. And
• 44:10
  so really happy
• 44:11
  to say that,
• 44:13
  yeah, we're
• 44:13
  really happy that
• 44:14
  this this is this
• 44:16
  is being done. So
• 44:17
  we appreciate it.
• 44:18
  Thank you
• 44:18
  so much.
• 44:18
  Thank you. Was a
• 44:19
  pleasure.
• 44:20
  Thank you, Jose,
• 44:20
  for joining us on
• 44:21
  today's episode
• 44:22
  of the how to
• 44:22
  protect the ocean
• 44:23
  podcast. It was
• 44:23
  great to have you
• 44:24
  on. Learn so much
• 44:25
  today about and
• 44:26
  just this week
• 44:27
  about microbes,
• 44:28
  you know, this is
• 44:29
  a subject matter
• 44:30
  that I was not as
• 44:31
  familiar with.
• 44:32
  But I'm bringing
• 44:32
  it to you because
• 44:33
  I wanted to teach
• 44:35
  you something new
• 44:36
  because this is
• 44:36
  where you learn
• 44:37
  about the ocean.
• 44:37
  And it's
• 44:38
  something that I
• 44:38
  feel is important
• 44:39
  that we learn all
• 44:40
  aspects of the
• 44:41
  ocean, not just
• 44:42
  something that
• 44:42
  I'm familiar
• 44:43
  with. So going
• 44:44
  outside my
• 44:45
  comfort zone,
• 44:45
  learning
• 44:45
  something new,
• 44:46
  just trying to be
• 44:47
  curious and
• 44:48
  seeing what we
• 44:48
  can cover on this
• 44:50
  podcast.
• 44:50
  And Jose just
• 44:51
  summed it up
• 44:51
  nicely in terms
• 44:52
  of bringing what
• 44:53
  biotechnology is,
• 44:55
  how we can use
• 44:55
  microbes to help
• 44:56
  us in our climate
• 44:57
  solutions and
• 44:58
  other solutions
• 44:59
  and how important
• 44:59
  sound of bacteria
• 45:00
  is something that
• 45:01
  I didn't know
• 45:02
  when I first
• 45:02
  started.
• 45:03
  So it's great to
• 45:03
  be able to learn
• 45:04
  something new for
• 45:05
  myself. I hope
• 45:05
  you learn
• 45:06
  something new as
• 45:07
  well. And I'm
• 45:07
  going to put
• 45:07
  links to Jose so
• 45:09
  you can get
• 45:09
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