Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / NT Police Association President Paul McCue is concerned police could be tied up, "babysitting" youths when the age of criminal responsibility is raised to 12

Transcript

NT Police Association President Paul McCue is concerned police could be tied up, "babysitting" youths when the age of criminal responsibility is raised to 12 · 360 with Katie Woolf

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Let's head across right now and speak more about well,
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: the impact that having those police in Alice Springs is having.
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: We've just heard from the Mayor of Alice. It's obviously
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: a really positive thing for the community of Alice Springs.
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: Last week we heard from the Police Association though that
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: the move may mean that we're robbing Peter to pay Paul. Now,
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: yesterday in Parliament there was an issue that was raised
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: by the Opposition and we spoke to Leafanochiaro about this.
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: Just a short time ago. They questioned the Police Minister
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: about the closure of remote police stations in order for
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  Speaker 1: this surge to happen. Joining me on the line is
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  Speaker 1: the president of the Police Association, Paul McHugh.
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  Speaker 2: Good morning, Paul, Good morning Katie.
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  Speaker 1: How are you not too bad now, Paul? Have remote
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  Speaker 1: stations closed in order to surge police into Alice.
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, look, I believe you know, certainly our information is
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  Speaker 2: you know, Hearts Range has been mentioned as one station
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  Speaker 2: that's closed, but I know, you know, other stations, including
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: some other remote stations may be impacted as well by
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: being provided or providing resources into Alice Springs to help
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  Speaker 2: with this surge. So you know, we can't really confirm
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  Speaker 2: what other stations might be closed, but certainly it's having
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: an impact across the board, there's no question about that.
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: So when you talk about Hearts Range, I know that
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  Speaker 1: the opposition later had mentioned that it services a number
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: of communities. How big an area are we talking about
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  Speaker 1: here that there are no police now.
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  Speaker 2: Well, it's a significant area community. They're out at Hearts
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  Speaker 2: Range and of course you know it's an accessible location
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  Speaker 2: for many many people in that area, so they obviously
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  Speaker 2: expect police there. But of course you can't. You can't
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  Speaker 2: take forty police and a lot of them into our
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  Speaker 2: springs without it having an impact in many other locations.
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  Speaker 2: And that's just one of many that are now impacted,
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  Speaker 2: you know, right across the territory because of this surge
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  Speaker 2: requirement down there in Alice Springs. So you know, it
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  Speaker 2: is impacting across the board. We know our members have
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: already provided feedback that, you know, whilst it's great to
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: see now there analysis and obviously it's amazing what you
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: can do with sufficient boots on the ground, isn't it
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  Speaker 2: to actually proactively police and show that presence in the
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  Speaker 2: community there, it impacts in other locations quite significantly, Paul.
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: When you talk about surging the police, we keep hearing
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  Speaker 1: there are more police than there's ever been before. The
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: government keeps trotting out that line and also saying that
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: there's greater investment than ever before. So why are we
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: in a situation where we can't surge up without impacting
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  Speaker 1: other communities.
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  Speaker 2: I think it's really a combination of a lot of things,
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  Speaker 2: you know, O Katie. Obviously has been a fair change
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: in policy legislation over the last few years in terms
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: of alcohol consumption and liquor and the ability for police
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: to work in that space, and that's really impacted of
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: course on police numbers. But obviously there's been a surge
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: in youth crime, there's been an increase in domestic and
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: family violence, and of course our significly hi attrition rate
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: has meant you know, as somebody walks out the door,
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: it takes really twelve months to get someone else in
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: to replace that person, and obviously that recruiting is struggling
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: to keep up. So it's really impacting across the board.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: Now. I know there'll be people listening this morning and
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: thinking to themselves, how are we able to surge up
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: for operations like the arrival of biking gangs, but we
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  Speaker 1: can't sort of do it for other things like what
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: we're saying in Alice.
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, look, it's a million dollar question really. I mean,
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  Speaker 2: obviously it's challenging when you're talking about a surge capacity,
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: say in the Greater Darwin area, where you can draw
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: on resources that are already in the Darwen area, versus Alice,
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: for example, where you've got to essentially fly people in
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: and accommodate them and put them in put them to
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: work down there. And of course we've seen some great results.
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: You know, we've obviously seen the figures and that's having
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: a good impact down there at the moment, but it's
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: not sustainable, and I know we do keep hearing the government.
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: So we've got additional we've got better budget than ever before,
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: we've got more numbers never before. But what's their comparative
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: figure if we're talking ten years ago, It's been ten
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: years since we've really reviewed what police are required to do.
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  Speaker 2: So how do we know those numbers are our right
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  Speaker 2: and that funding is actually correct as we certainly don't
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  Speaker 2: think it is now, Paul.
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: One of the other big things that's happened, of course,
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  Speaker 1: overnight the raising of the age of criminal responsibility. There
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  Speaker 1: has been sort of some further detail I guess you
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  Speaker 1: would say provided we spoke to the opposition about this
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: a short time ago. Now sorry, the government have issued
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: in their statement from last night, the Attorney General has
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: said that Northern Territory Police will continue to investigate offenses
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: and victims of crime will continue to receive assistance through
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: financial compensation and free counseling, as well as home security
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  Speaker 1: assessments and emergency resecure services. But can you talk us
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  Speaker 1: through operationally how exactly the Northern Territory Police will continue
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: to investigate offenses for those under the age of t well,
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  Speaker 1: if they're not able to be held criminally responsible for
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  Speaker 1: their actions.
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I guess. Ultimately, police's role is to respond
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  Speaker 2: to crime, whether it's proactively or reactively, and until such
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  Speaker 2: time as they you know, they obviously need to find
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  Speaker 2: out who committed that crime, how it was committed, and
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  Speaker 2: then ultimately if it turns out to be a child
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  Speaker 2: under the age of twelve. Now, ultimately there's very little
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  Speaker 2: in terms of prosecution that police will be able to do,
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  Speaker 2: but the role is still going to be to investigate
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  Speaker 2: that crime. So it will no doubt continue to tie
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: up resources. But I guess from a victim's perspective, you know,
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  Speaker 2: they deserve the right to have that crime investigated now
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  Speaker 2: that the law will be changing, you know, that's very
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  Speaker 2: much out of the hands of police. But what we
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  Speaker 2: obviously the major concern from our perspective, is having police
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: tied up essentially doing babysitting these young people without other
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  Speaker 2: departments and NGO stepping in to actually take up the slack,
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  Speaker 2: because the last thing we need is police tied up
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  Speaker 2: on these sorts of matters when ultimately there's nothing they
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: can do about it.
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: Yes, So, like let's say that you know that a
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  Speaker 1: ten and eleven year old are involved in the theft
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  Speaker 1: of a vehicle, and you know we've heard it on
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  Speaker 1: this show before where there's been the eleven year and
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: eleven year old behind the wheel of a stolen car.
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: So let's say there's a situation like that. The Northern
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: Territory Police obviously apprehend those young people. Then what do
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  Speaker 1: they have to do just are they able to you know,
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  Speaker 1: to apprehend them, and what do they have to do
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  Speaker 1: with them after that point? If you know, if the
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  Speaker 1: age has.
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: Changed, well, Ultimately, that's why we were supportive. Obviously, the Commissioner,
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: I believe you know, was trying to push back the
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: implementation of any changes in this legislation for some time.
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: We were supportive of, you know, making sure there's as
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: long as leading time as possible, because ultimately the police
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: will need to understand their role. They'll need to understand
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: what protections they have, because ultimately they have a right
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: as a police office to take action if there's a
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: crime being committed before them. We've seen many vehicles recently
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: being used as deadly weapons, attacking other vehicles and being
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: driven towards people. Police have the right to take that
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  Speaker 2: relevant action. And then ultimately we need to understand and
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: the police will need to understand, which we don't just yet,
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: what that means for them in terms of the action
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  Speaker 2: they can take with those young individuals, because ultimately, until
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: you apprehend that person and actually ascertain their age, you know,
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: things will be exactly the same as they are now.
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: But so at this point in time, it sounds like
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  Speaker 1: there's still a lot of operational questions that the police
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  Speaker 1: don't actually know the answers to.
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: Absolutely, and from our perspective, our members have the right
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: to be protected in their actions and in the workplace.
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  Speaker 2: So you know, we need to make sure and we
• 7:50
  Speaker 2: need to be comfortable on behalf of our members that
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: all of these operational matters work through. And I know
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  Speaker 2: that the commissioners very alive to this, and you know
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: there's got to be significant leading time to allow that
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  Speaker 2: process to be played out through the sixteen hundred DoD
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  Speaker 2: police we have in.
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  Speaker 1: The end, Well, our officers annoyed that this has been
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: pushed through as quickly as it has without those discussions
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  Speaker 1: happening prior.
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, look, obviously we know we're on behalf of the
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  Speaker 2: members made a submission in relation to this and really
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: wanted this legislation held back until all of the ducks
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: were in a row, and obviously the government weren't supportive
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: of that. They wanted to push this legislation through. I
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: guess essentially saying we won't really kick it off or
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: gazette it until such time as everything's in place. We
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: would have liked to have actually seen it all in place,
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  Speaker 2: everyone understand what this is going to mean, and then
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: by all means push ahead. But you know that's not
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: what the government have done.
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  Speaker 1: Well, Police Association President Paul Mcue. We always appreciate your time.
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: Thanks so much for speaking with me this morning.
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: Thanks Katie, thank you.