Latest / Low to Grow / Dr Mitch Abrams on Cultivating Coherence After Open-Heart Surgery and The New Paradigm In Healthcare

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Dr Mitch Abrams on Cultivating Coherence After Open-Heart Surgery and The New Paradigm In Healthcare · Low to Grow

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I required open heart surgery for this congenital heart
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condition and doctor became patient.
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That was a real turning point. Doctor Mitch Abrams, a
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radiologist fellow of the Royal College of Physicians and
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Surgeons of Canada. Our healthcare model is
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literally like a production factory.
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It's a very industrialized model.
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It's time that we take the best of the West, weave it with the
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ancient wisdom of the inner experience.
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The science of transformation are really beginning to
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understand this new chapter in medical science.
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We can call it proactive or preventative medicine with the
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science of well-being, there truly is a science of change how
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to tap into our peak potential. There is one word that I believe
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that could change people's lives and to really pivot the global
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trajectory it's. Quick note before we start, if
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you have enjoyed this podcast and want to support our
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incredible guests, please follow Low to Grow podcast on Instagram
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and TikTok. Welcome to Low to Grow, the
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podcast transforming life's toughest moments into
1:02
opportunity for growth. I'm Annie, a folks under 30
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technology founder who's entrepreneurship journey ran
1:09
parallel to a mental health awakening.
1:12
In every episode, I sit down with inspiring individuals and
1:16
delve into how they managed to turn their personal or
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professional challenges into opportunities for growth.
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If you're facing uncertainty in your life, feeling down, or
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simply need a kick of inspiration to keep moving
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forward, this is your space for the honest and uplifting
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Hit follow so you never miss an episode and let's dive in.
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Today's episode brings together wisdom, lived experience, and a
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powerful vision for what healthier lives and communities
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can look like. I am delighted to welcome Doctor
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Mitch Abrams, a Radiologist Fellow of the Royal College of
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Physicians and Surgeons of Canada and the founder of Next
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Gen. Health Now.
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Mitch's path took a profound turn early in his career when he
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was diagnosed with hypertrophic obstructive cardiomyopathy and
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underwent open heart surgery. That experience connected his
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work as a physician and patient, giving him a front row view of
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the disconnects that many of us can feel in the healthcare
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system, and ultimately motivated his mission to bring more heart
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into how we care for ourselves and knows each other.
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Through research, personal healing, and innovative
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initiatives like for RAD ART and also global heart sink projects,
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he is shaping A holistic approach to Wellness that a lot
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of young professionals can actually apply in their daily
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lives today. So, Mitch, it's a pleasure to
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have you on the latest group podcast.
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My pleasure to be with you, Annie.
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Who do you want to be listening to our conversation today?
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I think this content, this perspective, I think really
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speaks to people who are looking for change or experiencing
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change, experiencing questions about who they are and what they
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want out of life. And certainly to appreciate that
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in any given moment there we can change.
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And there is a science of transformation.
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So those who are looking for ways to shift perhaps their
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lives and looking for meaning in their life.
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Mitch, for you, where did your journey begin?
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Well, you know, in one sense I could say it, it started before
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I was born, but I would say for today, you know, we, we could
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say 2010 was a pivotal year in my life.
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I just started. In fact, I'm practicing
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independent medicine as a radiologist, been 15 years
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studying. And at that point I thought, you
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know, I was going to, I was on easy street and finished my
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exams and started to work. I was making, you know, a good
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wage and, and, you know, thought I from the outside looking in,
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it was the epitome of success. And yet very quickly after the
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excitement of finishing my exams, there was a sense of void
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within and I found myself a bit like on a hamster wheel and I
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didn't truly appreciate just how burned out I was at that time
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until further along in the journey.
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When I look back, I was kind of in a downward spiral.
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To top that off, I then found out I required open heart
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surgery for this, this congenital heart condition and
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doctor became patient. And that was a real turning
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point. It was at that moment of
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experiencing myself in a in a way of such vulnerability.
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Certainly the doctors prepared me for the physical perspective
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of what I was about to go through as a surgical patient,
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but nobody warned me of the emotional tool degree of change
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that I would experience in my mind.
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The stories that I was telling myself in that moment, it
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radically changed. And it really caused me to, I
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mean, not only step off the hamster wheel, but I was really
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thrown off that, that wheel. And it forced me to look within
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question my, my own sense of self, who I was, my, my purpose.
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And that sense of being so connected to that, that death,
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that mortality, being so close to it that it changed the way
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that I approached life. And in that moment, I would also
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begin to appreciate that our healthcare system was very
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limited in scope. It was, you know, it was missing
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something fundamental. And so this was all starting to
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happen as I came back to work, I was appointed the chief of our
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department. And so very quickly, from the
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bottom up and top down, experiencing our entire
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healthcare model. And it was at that point where I
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had a real difficult time just being with the status quo and
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being in a system that just didn't fit the values and
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knowing that there was something missing.
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It just so happened, you know, a few days before I found out I
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was going to need heart surgery, I had bought my very first
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guitar. I decided I was going to pick up
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a new hobby and music really opened up something within me.
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It was almost to say that music and my healing journey were
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really you know, they went they go hand in hand with the music
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It it really helped me find my heart.
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If we want to say the doctor is physically corrected my heart,
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it was the music that helped me connect with my energetic heart
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and it opened something within myself.
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And it was through that process that I really began to venture
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outside the box of conventional medicine.
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And it opened the path towards, you know, a deeper sense of
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healing, a deeper healing from within.
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Then that led me down a path of going to India and and starting
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to explore how other cultures approached health and Wellness.
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2010 was a real pivotal year for me.
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That kind of cracked, I guess, the shell that led to, you know,
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I guess here we are today. That is indeed a pivotal year,
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bitch. How would you describe yourself
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before 2010? And how do you feel that your
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experiences with open heart surgery and the whole shift in
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experience and mindset changed you afterwards?
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Well, I guess in one word, I could say I was very
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unconscious, was chasing ideas. What I defined as success was
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something very external, and I was very, I guess, more of an
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individualistic frame of mind. When I look back now, I
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recognize that a lot of things that I was filling in my life
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were attempts to fill a void. And this was radically changed
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after the heart surgery. And certainly music helped me
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identify that void. I was catapulted on a journey of
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of research and exploration to fill that void.
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So, yeah, that I would say, you know, kind of that that
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unconscious person that really didn't appreciate who they truly
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were and that, you know, it, it's a process that took time
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for me to to recognize, you know, it perhaps a deeper truth
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that not only shifted, I guess my my own identity, but my
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understanding of my relationships with others.
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My relationship was something much greater than myself.
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I think that the awakening that you described there being from
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living life unconsciously, almost blindfolded, to then
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having an event that really stimulates that awakening in
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you. That's something that quite a
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few of the people that I have interviewed on as podcast have
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mentioned what you were mentioning earlier about being
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on that hamster wheel. So going through your medical
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exams, you're going through the motions of building your career
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in medicine and becoming a radiologist, which has a really
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well defined career path. I feel like a lot of the young
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professionals, you know, my friends included, kind of always
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almost all have to go through that process in their life.
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So from leaving university to then starting out from that
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first career. I wanted to ask you because for
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you having open heart surgery, that obviously had a profound
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impact on you physically, but also on your spiritual path as
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well. What was it about having open
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heart surgery that actually stimulated you into becoming
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awake and into wanting to explore more?
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That's a great question. It felt like a reset, like a
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reboot to my system. And it when I think about it
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intellectually, being put under anesthesia and having your heart
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literally stop, you're essentially experiencing death
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and you are dependent upon a machine, external devices to
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keep the tissues in a sense alive and nourished, but yet
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there's no consciousness. You are essentially dead.
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That experience for me as I came out of it and as I began to like
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appreciate what just happened and at the end of the time
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immediately afterwards, like feeling the body in a way that I
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never experienced before. Being so vulnerable and
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experiencing compassion from others at such a deep level
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where I could really feel it. There wasn't any exterior
10:25
barriers because there just was none.
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There was no capacity for my mind or my body to create any
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sort of barrier. So to feel Peeper in a much
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deeper way, it just made me feel myself in a much deeper way.
10:39
The sense of going back to work and starting to realize that our
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system like how our healthcare model is, is literally like a
10:49
production, you know, factory. It's a very industrialized
10:52
model. And when I thought about how
10:54
patients and, and the way that we were analyzing the efficiency
10:58
of our own department, looking at numbers and not really
11:02
appreciating the patients and, and you know the why, why would
11:06
some numbers be from one month to the next?
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Like if we were not efficient enough, not take into account,
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well, maybe there's some really difficult patients that were
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coming through that required more care.
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None of that was integrated into the system to appreciate the
11:20
quality. It was all quantity, just as a,
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you know, an interesting story that when I was the chief of our
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department, I was sent to a conference in Boston around
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quality management and, and healthcare.
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And we were talking a lot about Toyota, the automobile industry,
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how you can extrapolate lean quality management into
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healthcare. And I, you know, it really kind
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of hit hard to say that we're not, you know, people are not
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cars, We're not in that in eminent objects.
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We are the vibe, you know, thriving organisms.
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Certainly the science is telling us just how important compassion
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is for the process of healing. There is just such a disconnect
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that internally really spoke to me that experience and certainly
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the healing process that in a way, I still feel I'm healing.
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I mean, there's, it's a continuous growth and once you
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begin to experience your heart is such a level, you start to
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appreciate that the heart is constantly receiving, is
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constantly growing. And for us to be able to take
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that time to tune it in, tune it into our conscious awareness,
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learn to respect the heart, the intelligence of the heart and
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how it can help you self regulate, how it can help you
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connect to something much greater than yourself so that
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you can receive the messages, you can receive information.
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And certainly the quantum physics of today is telling us
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that we are all deeply connected to something much greater than
12:50
ourselves and an informational level.
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And then I believe that's the heart that allows us to tap into
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this divine experience. And for me, I felt like that was
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the missing one of the large missing pieces within our
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healthcare paradigm. And I couldn't just sit idle by
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and not share this with colleagues, not share this with
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health practitioners to to say, look, we can do better.
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And in fact, here's the science. It's starting to catch up with
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this ancient wisdom. It's time that we take the best
13:22
of the West and weave it with the ancient, you know, wisdom of
13:26
the inner experience, the science of transformation.
13:30
We're really beginning to understand this new chapter in
13:34
medical science. You know, we can call it
13:37
proactive or preventative medicine or the science of
13:41
well-being, but you know, there, there truly is a science of
13:44
change, how to navigate change, how to tap into our peak
13:49
potential. And you know, if there is one
13:52
word that I believe that could change people's lives and to
13:56
really pivot the global trajectory, it's it's coherence
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and help people truly understand what coherence means to
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themselves, to their own health and Wellness, to their
14:05
relationships, and ultimately to the world.
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For someone who might not be aware, what does coherence mean
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and how does it apply to them and their experience of the
14:15
world? There, there are many
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definitions that you can look at it, you know, different lenses,
14:20
but from a very scientific perspective, coherence is when
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you have two systems that get In Sync with each other and they
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can, you know, begin to feed into each other and it creates a
14:32
very strong efficient system. Now, when it applies to our own
14:38
health and Wellness, we can think of coherence in the
14:41
nervous system. So if you look at the two arms
14:44
of the autonomic nervous system, your sympathetic arm and your
14:48
parasympathetic arm, these are the two arms that will balance
14:53
your fight or flight or your stress response and your rest
14:57
and digest relaxation response. And when you're in a nice state
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of coherence, these two arms are in perfect balance.
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So the tones of each arm are activated in a nice sequence as
15:11
opposed to being incoherent where your nervous system is
15:14
completely irregular and erratic.
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So if you look at the tone of both sympathetic and
15:19
parasympathetic, it becomes very irregular and erratic.
15:22
And what's fascinating is that the heart is really can be
15:26
measured in a way that reflects the internal balance of the
15:29
autonomic nervous system. When you cultivate that state of
15:33
coherence, we can measure it in the heart rhythms like a muscle.
15:38
The mind really does function similar to the muscles in our
15:41
body. So that the more that we
15:43
practice certain techniques, cultivate this physiologic
15:47
energetic state, the more that we practice, the easier it is to
15:52
cultivate, the more effective the results.
15:55
You know, there's a famous Harvard cardiologist, Dr.
15:58
Herbert Benson. He called it the relaxation
16:01
effect. And he was studying, he was one
16:03
of the first physicians to study Buddhist monks with a variety of
16:08
different technology to recognize the fact that we each
16:12
have this conscious ability to tap into a higher level of
16:18
awareness, which then, you know, puts us into a state of optimal
16:23
Physiology. You were to think about the
16:25
fight or fight response and the stress and what that does to the
16:28
body and how chronic stress literally is, you know, it, it
16:31
destroys the body and manifests in disease.
16:35
The relaxation effect is not just putting you back at a zero
16:38
point. It's putting you into, you know,
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a positive energetic state that literally up levels your biology
16:47
or Physiology, but also it expands your mental awareness,
16:50
your consciousness. Coherence is something that is a
16:55
radical game changer. And you know many ways again,
16:58
that you can look at it. But when we are in coherence
17:01
individually, we can also support the coherence for other
17:05
people. And again, we can measure that
17:07
collective coherence. We can measure that Co
17:11
regulation, as they call it in in the literature.
17:13
And there is a degree of synchronization of our nervous
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systems and our hearts when we experience deep connection and
17:22
compassion with others. The implication in medicine is
17:26
profound. The implication is social
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well-being is profound. And when we are together in a
17:34
state of coherence, we are literally unlocking potential on
17:37
a both individual and in a collective level.
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Tony OSFED How would you measure coherence, either for an
17:44
individual or for a group? So on an individual level, we're
17:48
measuring it through heart rate variability.
17:51
So heart monitors can measure the interbeat intervals.
17:55
So it's not heart rate per SE, but if you were to zoom into an
17:59
electrocardiograph and you start measuring every individual beat
18:04
interval and you plotted that out, you'd see a curve that
18:09
emerges. And that is information that
18:12
reflects your emotional state, your thoughts, and, and your
18:15
emotions. And so the heart rate
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variability is a fantastic metric that not only explains or
18:23
at least encodes information of your emotions and how you're
18:26
experiencing life, but overall it also speaks to your
18:31
physiologic what health, your cellular health, and how much
18:35
flexibility does your biology and Physiology have.
18:39
So as we get older, heart rate variability decreases and so
18:43
it's harder to respond to external stimuli, hence we're
18:47
more vulnerable. If you don't have flexibility in
18:50
your heart, then you're more much more susceptible to a heart
18:52
attack because you don't have that ability to be fluid at the
18:56
moment. So high rate variability is a
18:59
key factor for an individual. And we can also measure that
19:04
heart rate synchronization between people.
19:07
So you can measure collective coherence.
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There's another level of coherence that's also being
19:12
measured. It's called the Global Conscious
19:14
Project. It started by Doctor Rodger
19:17
Nelson and Princeton back in the late 80s, and Doctor Nelson has
19:21
recently retired and he's handed the baton to Doctor Roland
19:25
Mccrady at the Heart Math Institute.
19:28
They are using random number generators that basically can
19:33
measure the quantum field. And years and years ago, it was
19:38
understood that, you know, scientists realized that when
19:41
people are focused with intention on these little
19:44
computers, these little random number generators like little
19:47
electronic coin flippers, that individual thoughts, people
19:51
focusing on them, could actually shift and create a statistically
19:55
significant shift in the output of the information from these
19:59
random number generators. So they started to plant random
20:04
number generators all around this planet and collecting the
20:08
information into a central database.
20:11
So now you're looking at a global network of information
20:15
from random number generators. And the research has shown that
20:18
when large groups of people together at the same time with
20:21
an emotional charge are connected at the same time, that
20:25
there's a statistically significant non random event
20:29
that emerges from that global network.
20:32
There's a sense of coherence in the data.
20:35
So now imagine all the coins just now become heads.
20:40
And this again is occurring as a result of many people focused
20:46
with emotion at the same time. So it's starting to show that
20:50
when we are coherent and when we are connected that that
20:56
emotional energy on a collective level can add more coherence
21:01
into the global field network. And it's so it's showing that
21:05
our thoughts actually does affect the physical world and
21:09
it's powerful. I think you shared the link with
21:12
me before and I've looked a bit into it and I've read around
21:16
some of the debates surrounding it as well.
21:18
What are some of the misconceptions that you think
21:20
people have of that particular project?
21:23
You think, think people have a hard time appreciating that
21:27
there is a sense of connection. So they, they see this as woo
21:30
woo, you know, And the easiest way, I mean, look, as a, as a
21:37
radiologist, I mean, think about what I do.
21:40
I literally will read an MRI scan of someone's brain.
21:45
And we are extracting information from the light of
21:48
your atoms. You are an energetic being.
21:52
We are all beings of light. We're all spiritual beings
21:55
having a human experience. And the Nobel Prize of 2022 in
22:00
physics was awarded to three gentlemen that experimentally,
22:05
not theoretically, but experimentally prove that yes,
22:08
we are all in a quantum entangled non local universe.
22:13
And so the implications involved in understanding what this
22:18
science is telling us with you're still looking at the
22:22
world through a lens of an Isaac Newtonian perspective of
22:25
separation, where your atoms and your little bits are separate
22:28
from my bits. That's only part of the story.
22:31
When you continue down the science, you begin to
22:34
appreciate, wow, we are so deeply connected and each and
22:37
every one of us is connected to something much greater than
22:40
ourselves. And so when you look at that,
22:44
when you look at the science, even if you just think about,
22:46
well, just think about how an MRI machine can non invasively
22:50
dissect the human body like a loaf of bread without a scalpel.
22:53
It's because there is an energy field where all vibrational
22:57
beings and from that lens, it makes very inherent sense, like
23:03
why that global consciousness can be measured.
23:06
And I encourage people to look into the science, look at Doctor
23:12
Rodger Nelson's work, because when you start to see over the
23:15
decades of data, and that's a lot, there's so much data, it
23:19
shows that there's no doubt that we have created like an
23:25
electroencephalograph that can measure the brain waves from
23:29
someone's head, which is the result of the billions of action
23:33
potentials. The little neurons in our brain
23:35
collectively communicating in a somewhat of a coherent fashion,
23:40
creating waves of energy from the brain.
23:43
We are individually functioning like the little brain cells on a
23:46
global ecosystem level. And we are now measuring that.
23:51
I urge people to pay attention, TuneIn, because the implications
23:56
for their own well-being, because everybody is in their
24:00
own right, so inherently powerful.
24:02
We can claim our inner agency by understanding connection, how to
24:06
connect to our own hearts, and through that we connect with
24:09
others. And again, this is measurable on
24:11
an individual and as a global collective level.
24:15
And how does this link to your global heart sync project?
24:20
So the Global Heart Sync is a not-for-profit platform and it's
24:24
a way that we can gamify the science of heart.
24:27
When individuals sign up, they receive a toolkit.
24:30
They learn how to tune into their heart and cultivate the
24:34
state of coherence through this, what we call the Laser protocol.
24:38
You also receive a free phone app that you can download that
24:42
turns your phone into a real time biofeedback tool.
24:48
How does that work? It uses your camera to read the
24:52
pulsations and the capillaries in your fingertip.
24:55
So you literally just hold your camera, the phone on your finger
24:58
and it will begin to trace the pulsations, which in turn allows
25:03
the app to measure your heart rate variability.
25:07
And what's unique about this is that there are many product on
25:10
the market like the Aura Ring or the Apple Watch that reads heart
25:14
rate variability. But what's unique about this app
25:17
is that it shows you in real time.
25:19
It's not a snapshot of the past. It's what's happening in your
25:23
heart in the moment. So now you can watch how your
25:26
thoughts and emotions will affect your heart rhythms.
25:29
And so when you learn, you know, like the laser protocol, as you
25:32
get laser focused, you can begin to see how your heart rhythms
25:36
respond and you can cultivate coherence.
25:38
You can measure it. And now you can begin to track
25:41
your progress over time. You get the tools to maximize
25:46
your own practices for well-being.
25:48
But at the same time, depending upon how long you use the app
25:52
and your coherence levels, you will earn points.
25:56
At this early iteration of the app.
25:58
What happens is that your points is being collected into a global
26:02
pool and when we collectively reach milestones, it will unlock
26:07
corporate sponsorships that will support mental health and
26:10
resilience programs for communities in need and in
26:13
schools and for research. So this again is a way that we
26:18
can gamify the science of heart. It helps people appreciate that
26:23
self-care can now create real world social impact.
26:29
And through this platform, people will begin to recognize
26:32
this emerging global heart stream through our understanding
26:36
of our our own hearts and how we are part of a collective
26:40
identity. I think it's so interesting that
26:43
you can see your individual data for kind of like HRV, heart rate
26:47
variability and also their collective.
26:50
I'm curious what kind of sponsorships would the
26:52
collective points unlock? Those points really represent
26:56
your dedication to self-care and for this recognition, this love
27:02
of common humanity. So we're beginning to approach
27:06
corporations to say, look, you have a corporate social
27:08
responsibility program, you've got lots of dollars.
27:12
You can exchange dollars for these points, and you can help
27:17
us celebrate our wins individually and collectively.
27:21
And what's interesting about this is that if you could
27:24
imagine a big corporation that will support this growing
27:29
community, the programs that would be then delivered, let's
27:34
say to a certain community and not-for-profit community that
27:37
the corporation is already supporting or let's say some of
27:41
their local schools, They'll learn about the size of heart.
27:45
They'll get tapped into the global coherent community.
27:50
And the same organizations also have the opportunity to have
27:55
organizational health programs to teach their employees how to
27:59
tune into their hearts. Now it creates a bridge where
28:03
the organization and employees, as they practice their own
28:06
health and well-being and the organization will benefit
28:09
because that tasked them into greater innovation and
28:12
creativity. But they can also do it in
28:15
community with the community that they are just supported in
28:20
this initiative. So now imagine having
28:22
opportunities to synchronize hearts with the schools, with
28:25
the communities that they've just supported.
28:28
What brand, what corporation would not want an opportunity to
28:32
connect with the communities that they serve at such a deep
28:36
energetic level? And just to say that the
28:40
research shows us that when you have this deep physiologic
28:44
synchronization of rhythms, you cultivate a deep sense of
28:49
empathy and connection. You cultivate communities,
28:52
really the science of connection.
28:54
So from a corporate, you know, mindset, this is a great
28:57
opportunity where you combine your organizational health, you
29:01
combine corporate social responsibility, and then there's
29:05
a whole other level of marketing around it because now they're
29:08
being associated and associating themselves with an initiative
29:11
that's all about the science of compassion.
29:14
Insurance companies will love this because the data shows that
29:17
if you get people practicing this technique, cultivating
29:21
coherence, they have better health outcomes.
29:24
That's a huge ROI in the mind of healthcare executives.
29:28
So you can begin to see why corporations are going to want
29:31
to support this community that recognizes that it's not just
29:36
you versus me. This is an US.
29:39
This is the new era, new level of consciousness, and we are in
29:43
a moment of great transformation.
29:45
This is an opportunity for corporations to be seen as
29:49
supporting, you know, a higher level of awareness for
29:53
individuals and our communities. How would someone know if they
29:57
have activated their heart? Well, it's a good question.
30:01
You know, I think everybody is on a journey.
30:04
Everyone's on a path. You know, some people describe
30:08
moments where they have an experience where their heart
30:11
feels like it's exploding. It feels like it's exploding
30:15
with light and love. Some people feel like there's
30:18
just a moment where there is a time of recognition that created
30:25
a sense of intention, of real change and intention to pivot at
30:32
their own trajectory and realize that there's something more to
30:35
life. There's something more to their
30:38
story than what they can just see and feel in this moment.
30:43
And you know, it's, it's a great question, Annie.
30:46
I think everybody is on a journey.
30:48
Everybody has their own story. And I think when people begin to
30:54
appreciate that there's a new story emerging, a story of the
30:58
heart, which not only helps make better sense of each individual
31:05
story and the narratives that we tell ourselves, there's going to
31:08
be a radical shift that empowers the individual.
31:12
It will empower people when people TuneIn and be like, Oh
31:15
my, like, really? That's what the body can do.
31:18
When you learn how to align the mind and the body and emotion,
31:24
that energy. I, I believe that it inspires
31:29
people to say, I want to learn more.
31:32
I want to walk down this path. And if we can say, hey, if you
31:34
just pay attention over here, there's a new door, There's a
31:38
new chapter emerging. Here's here's our hand, you
31:40
know, here's opportunities like the global heart sinks for you
31:44
to walk through that door. But ultimately we can only
31:47
access this information through the experience.
31:51
There's no pill, there's no external device.
31:54
This is our inner, this is our birthright.
31:57
It's within us to experience from the inside out.
32:01
People, when they begin to have that curiosity and that
32:04
intention, they find themselves on this path and then eventually
32:08
they really feel something inside that shifts.
32:11
There's millions of people now experiencing that they're,
32:14
they're talking about and, and to say look, and just to share
32:17
that, that the physics is showing us that we're part of a
32:20
very holographic perspective of reality of information that
32:25
we're an expression of. And the fact that we're having
32:27
this conversation, the fact that there are millions of people
32:30
describing these moments of transformation and change, you
32:34
know, it means that there are many, many more people
32:37
experiencing this. It's it's rising to a level of
32:40
consciousness because we're inherently connected.
32:44
And certainly now the Internet and and some of the movies that
32:47
we're watching is opening our minds to broader perspectives of
32:51
reality that we just didn't appreciate decades ago.
32:57
Earlier you mentioned how your journey to India and so how
33:01
music and especially playing the guitar was tools that helped you
33:05
to start activating your own heart and reaching that high
33:08
level of consciousness. How did you develop the
33:12
methodology behind the Global Heart Sync project?
33:15
It was a journey. What was it like the beginning?
33:18
Because I guess the end of the 20 tens, this is still a really
33:21
new concept. And for you, as someone who has
33:24
trained in Western medicine in a particular scientific framework,
33:28
how do people react to it when you first started talking about
33:31
it? Well, I think first came the,
33:34
the inner awareness, the inner development phase.
33:39
And that really came about, like I said, music started the
33:43
process, open something up within.
33:46
And then there is a moment of experience, you know, and the
33:49
best way to to really describe is, you know, I experienced
33:51
something that transcended base and time and something that has
33:55
just never left my body is something that's never left my
33:58
mind. This happened before I went to
34:01
India. As I started to dive deeper into
34:05
that experience, I started to witness changing, you know, the
34:09
change in my mind, the change in my experience.
34:12
And eventually I had opportunity to go to India.
34:17
And it was in India where I realized that there was a
34:19
discipline of science that was describing what I was
34:23
experiencing. And it wasn't until later I real
34:27
that I found out that particularly in India, they,
34:29
they say, look, music and spirituality are not 2 separate
34:33
things. They're really one thing.
34:35
And when you listen to music, when you create music, it can
34:39
create a expansion of inner spaciousness, of inner space.
34:44
And that spaciousness, if you could think of it like, like
34:47
consciousness level of experience and awareness.
34:51
And as I continue to spend time in India and learn from a
34:56
variety of different practitioners and spending time
34:59
with communities, diving into a variety of different
35:02
experimental practices and looking to see what, what are
35:07
these, what, what does this ancient scripture say?
35:11
That learning process from an intellectual, but also from the
35:14
experiential really cultivated this new understanding of
35:19
myself, my relationships to the world.
35:22
You know, keep in mind, my, my quantum physics perspective, my
35:26
radiology brain really helped me understand that the energy that
35:33
was being discussed in ancient times is the same energy that
35:36
we're using in modern science and constitutes all of us in the
35:40
world that we're living in. It created such AI guess a
35:45
change. Eventually there is a moment
35:49
where I'm a visual thinker from so from very, you know, day, I
35:53
started to put together slideshows and images to help me
35:58
describe. I can't even have the words for
36:00
it, but I was able to find images to put together the
36:04
stories that I was experiencing. And through years, I was able to
36:09
refine and refine what I was learning in the Far East and
36:13
what I understood from the West, like how to bring these two
36:17
worlds together, to say no, no, these, you know, science and
36:19
spirituality, they're not 2 ends of the spectrum.
36:21
It's one circle. We just have to take a moment to
36:23
step back far enough and you'll begin to experience it.
36:26
You can recognize it as a whole. Before I even started giving
36:30
talks, I designed this image, this I guess, artistic
36:34
expression of modern science and ancient wisdom.
36:38
I call it the medicinal modola and you know it it it
36:42
incorporates the vector equilibrium.
36:44
Know that what Buck Buckminster Fuller described as a system of
36:49
perfect balanced energy, that vector equilibrium is
36:52
superimposed on the Lotus flower, which is an ancient
36:55
symbol for thousands of years, always representing the science
36:58
of mind and interconnectedness. And you can see in the image
37:02
that the vector equilibrium representing modern science and
37:05
and and wisdom overlaid with the Lotus flower, how they flow into
37:09
each other. Through that piece of art, I was
37:11
able to begin describing, you know, this perspective.
37:17
I remember, I think it was in 2016, did a staff Wellness
37:22
program at the hospital because I recognize that burnout was
37:25
rampant and and our department was really struggling with
37:29
stress. I did a simple 45 minute little
37:32
lunch and learn. I shared with them this geometry
37:35
and then I gave them coloring tools.
37:38
So I had different mandalas now that they understood the science
37:42
behind it. I provided and I left all these
37:44
coloring tools in their lunch room.
37:47
And within two weeks, people were coloring these designs
37:51
because coloring it also puts the brain waves into a nice
37:55
therapeutic frequency. But also there is now meaning
37:58
and context behind what they were doing.
38:00
And the next thing I know, they started to decorate the halls of
38:04
our department with their mandalas.
38:07
And it just changed the vibe of our entire department, not just
38:10
amongst the staff, but you can imagine now patients are coming
38:13
in. They started asking questions.
38:15
They stirred, you know, the curiosity.
38:18
And it shifted the way that our department felt.
38:21
And within weeks, I was asked to start giving talks to different
38:24
departments in the hospital. And then occupational therapists
38:27
and physiotherapists started using the coloring again for
38:31
themselves, but also for their patients, patients who have had
38:34
close head injuries or strokes, that hand eye coordination and
38:38
that concentration, like there's multiple levels.
38:41
So that was therapeutic that this little simple exercise
38:45
created. I recognize just how infectious
38:49
this conversation was and how we could use art to describe this
38:54
fascinating intersection in this moment of transformation.
38:58
Now keep in mind as I continued this path and I was starting to
39:03
be offered to go to conferences and speak on this in a variety
39:07
of different venues. When I spoke to the physicians
39:11
within a fascinating that early on, I'd say there was a 5050
39:15
split. Some of the people in the room
39:17
were all in, they were totally, you know, engaged and they,
39:20
they, they really resonated. Whereas the other half, what do
39:25
you, you know, they were just, they couldn't grasp it.
39:28
They couldn't connect with it. And obviously over the years the
39:32
message has been continually refined.
39:34
There's new research to layer on top of this conversation.
39:37
But Fast forward to today where there is a hunger for it.
39:42
Now we have physicians that will come up and ask how can we be
39:45
involved? What research can you know, can
39:48
I get involved and how can we incorporate it for patients?
39:52
I think this appetite comes from the fact that doctors recognize
39:57
that they're dealing with a mental health epidemic.
39:59
And the research has shown some pretty significant statistics to
40:02
say, look, if suicide is the only cause of death higher
40:06
amongst doctors compared to the communities they serve, it's
40:09
time to tune in to our own collective well-being and our
40:13
own individual being as practitioners to be able to
40:16
serve our patients. That has really shifted the
40:19
conversation, but also the Nobel Prize in 2022.
40:23
I mean, and, and, and just to say, look, you know, a surgeon,
40:27
you know, they don't know how an MRI machine works.
40:29
They send all their patients to us.
40:31
Everybody's urgent. But the moment you start asking
40:34
them all to think about, just stop and think, what are we
40:37
doing in that department? You use a scalpel blade, but
40:40
what are we using in diagnostic imaging?
40:42
It now helps them realize, oh, maybe there's something that we
40:46
don't see in energy that we don't appreciate.
40:50
And it is there and it has significant impact to healing,
40:54
significant impact to their own health and well-being.
40:58
And so just to say, it's been a really interesting journey to
41:01
see how there's been a shift of the mindset of the healthcare
41:05
community, looking at how quantum physics is going to
41:08
change the paradigm in in medicine.
41:12
Do you think that there's a? Difference in how receptive
41:16
physicians are, whether they're a more western country or
41:20
whether they're coming from a more eastern country my.
41:24
Time in India, I, I spent time meeting physicians, visiting
41:28
hospitals, you know, and it's a very western focused medical
41:32
model as well. I mean, India certainly has
41:34
Ayurvedic stream that, you know, millions of people are invested
41:38
in, but there's still a westernized model of medicine
41:43
that exists. But what's interesting is that
41:46
kind of sprinkled into the Western model, there are aspects
41:49
of this understanding of connection and how to weave it
41:53
into their medical model. Now that being said, I've also
41:58
spent time, you know, a, for example, for those of you who
42:01
know the Pasana, you know, the 10 days silent retreats.
42:04
I went to my first 10 day retreat in India.
42:08
I was, I think one of two white people in this entire 10 day
42:12
retreat. And the conversations I was
42:14
having is that, you know, they were when they were surprised to
42:18
see somebody, you know, a foreigner there because they
42:21
themselves, they said, you know, this is very new to them, even
42:25
though that they grew up with the stories and the mysticism
42:30
and mythology of the stories. The science, the true science of
42:34
understanding the power of the mind and the power of
42:37
consciousness has almost as if been kind of left behind in a
42:42
way, as Western science took over for a period of time.
42:46
And certainly there's a resurgence.
42:48
There is a definite resurgence that's taking place is more
42:52
interest. And, you know, modern
42:54
researchers are studying biology in a context that they can now
43:00
get direction from, for instance, Chinese medical
43:04
doctors, Chinese medicine for Ayurvedic medicine.
43:07
There's now this fascinating time where research and ancient
43:12
wisdom, they're starting to now connect.
43:14
You know, as Nikola Tesla said, the moment that scientists begin
43:18
to study the non physical, we are going to advance in our
43:22
knowledge more than we have in all decades and centuries in the
43:26
past. This is what's happening now.
43:29
Super interesting. Why is it that practitioners of
43:32
Western medicine are only now able to learn from those
43:37
practicing or Eastern methods of medicine one an important.
43:42
Aspect to appreciate is that in the Western model medicine there
43:46
was a very prominent, you know, perspective called the
43:49
biomedical model, which basically describes you as a
43:52
physical being physical. And we can add pills,
43:57
medication, we can take a scalpel blade and cut things
44:00
out. And we look at you as just in
44:02
the physical form, but it doesn't truly appreciate the
44:06
deeper level of emotion and connection.
44:09
So from the biomedical model, now we have what we call the
44:12
biopsychosocial model BPS. And biopsychosocial really is a
44:18
fancy way to say mind, body, and spirit.
44:22
With the lens of quantum. Physics.
44:24
When you look at the biopsychosocial model, you begin
44:27
to see the the depth involved and you begin to see that why
44:32
the sense of connection to self and to others so paramount to
44:37
healing. And it's not just the healing of
44:40
the individual and our ability to thrive, but it's the ability
44:42
of the collective to heal, the ability of the collective to
44:46
thrive. Because now the biopsychosocial,
44:49
it's well accepted and we have technology that we can begin to
44:54
measure these interstates. When functional MRI scans, we
44:57
can see how the brain reacts. When we cultivate coherence, we
45:02
can see like, wow, your HRV curve, your heart rhythms will
45:07
synchronize with your brain waves.
45:09
We can see this. And so when we begin to show the
45:12
science behind coherence, behind spirituality, doctors I think
45:18
now are ready and more willing to accept and to listen.
45:23
Now keep in mind when I, when I give talks, it's not uncommon.
45:27
I doctors, undoubtedly, they'll come up to me.
45:30
They thank me because like, it's like I gave them permission to
45:33
now have an open conversation of something that they felt for
45:36
quite some time, that spiritual energy within that they just
45:42
felt like they could not share with colleagues.
45:44
I can't share it, you know, with patients because it was too soft
45:48
to woo woo. There wasn't enough to see.
45:51
You can't see it. So now this new narrative helps
45:55
and it provides people the tools to, to discuss it in a more
45:59
serious way, in a very intellectual way.
46:02
But more importantly, you know, yes, intellect is, is great to
46:05
understand the science. But I tell them, look, you don't
46:07
have to understand this to experience it.
46:09
You don't know how your car works, but you can experience
46:12
the drive. You can experience driving.
46:15
You don't know how an MRI machine works, but you
46:17
experience the knowledge and patient care.
46:20
Just to say that now there's definitely an openness for
46:23
people to engage with this conversation and doctors are
46:27
really looking for new ways. I think they recognize as well
46:30
that the pendulum has swung so far towards big pharma and how
46:35
the system is, is literally hand feeding information and
46:39
knowledge and education to the medical community in a way that
46:44
is so one sided. It's created such an, you know,
46:47
it's so out of balance. And this science helps bring
46:50
that pendulum back to a point where we can say, OK, yes, in
46:54
certain scenarios, medication and things are very good.
46:59
But let's also begin to explore the interagency that each and
47:03
every one of us harbors from within.
47:06
If we can activate our own vagus nerve, which is really key in
47:10
activating that parasympathetic rest and digest, like you're
47:14
consciously activating your energetic system within the
47:17
body. Whereas big pharma is literally
47:20
taking needles, putting it into people's necks, and then
47:23
invasively activating that vagus nerve.
47:25
Well, you don't need a needle shoved in your neck.
47:29
You just need time to tune into your heart.
47:33
And so this is where I think, you know, modern science is
47:35
taking us and doctors are, there's a real openness.
47:38
Like I get emails now all the time randomly people from around
47:42
the world say, hey, this really speaks to me.
47:45
Like this is really exciting. I've known this.
47:48
All I'm doing is help put the dots together so now a new
47:51
narrative emerges so that all of this fascinating science in a
47:55
variety of different fields creates A narrative so that we
47:59
appreciate it's not necessarily all siloed.
48:02
There's an interconnectedness to all things, and we are part of
48:06
the story. We are the information, and we
48:09
are experiencing the whole, and the whole is experiencing itself
48:13
through US. Sounds like you are.
48:16
Weaving many idol shows together and I guess taking on board for
48:20
the current understanding of the human body.
48:22
And I was in mind as well. Absolutely.
48:25
And I can I just. Say mile just going back to
48:27
something that you asked early on what was I like prior and I
48:31
said very unconscious, but just to say this was none.
48:35
I was not this guy. I mean, I was happy go lucky.
48:39
Yes, I was very science minded, you know, going into medicine
48:42
and going into radiology. I was a science first type of
48:45
guy, but I was not interested in any of this.
48:49
This was, I mean, if you were to tell me then what that we're
48:53
going to have a conversation around consciousness and, and
48:56
I'd be like, what are you talking?
48:57
Like, what, what is that? Like?
48:58
What are you, you know, in meditation, I thought was a bit
49:01
of a, you know, was a joke. And, you know, so just to say
49:04
that the science of mind and transformation, all of these,
49:08
all of this stuff that we're talking about, yes, it's really
49:11
cool to understand. But once you experience and
49:14
internally, everybody's on their own, everyone's designed for a,
49:18
for a purpose and you know, have beautiful gifts to share with
49:22
the world. And so when you tune into your
49:25
hearts, that's when you can tap in and you can really learn to
49:29
how to flourish, how to blossom from the inside out so that you
49:32
can find purpose, understand purpose and find ways to share
49:37
it with the world. Because it's through your own
49:39
passion and purpose that we find success.
49:42
And success, you know, is inevitable when you are in
49:45
service of others through your passion and purpose.
49:49
Mitch for any of our. Listeners, after listening to
49:52
this, might really want to connect with the heart and find
49:55
that purpose. What are some of the actionable
49:58
things that they can do in order to stop that process internally
50:02
I would say. Coherence.
50:06
Find a way to bring coherence in your life.
50:08
And there are many ways. There are many ways.
50:10
I think the first thing to do is take 20 minutes and listen to
50:13
this Ted talk, Medicine of Frequencies.
50:15
What did Einstein mean? Because in that talk, not only
50:19
will it describe coherence, but you'll also begin to see the
50:22
geometry. You'll recognize not only
50:24
throughout Mother Nature, but you begin to recognize it within
50:27
yourself and you'll begin to appreciate this deep sense of
50:30
connection that can then bring you to the door.
50:34
Then you got to practice. The magic is in the experience.
50:39
So it can be for some people, taking a walk in nature, taking
50:43
time for self to contemplate on connection and just to listen.
50:48
Listen to how the body feels. Otherwise another opportunity.
50:53
And I say this, I provide free heart coherence meditations
50:58
Monday to Friday, every day, Monday to Friday, 6:00 PM
51:01
Eastern Time. And people are welcome to join.
51:04
And you literally come, you stay for as little or as long as you
51:08
like. And you practice coherence with
51:10
a growing community that are dedicated to their inner
51:14
transformation, inner growth, but also because we are
51:18
recognizing our common humanity. Now, when you do these
51:21
techniques, when you cultivate coherence, it's really important
51:25
to appreciate that you are creating an Interstate of
51:29
balance so that when you think about things that are happening
51:34
in your life that may be emotionally triggering or maybe
51:38
it's trauma that is residing within the body, the coherence
51:44
allows you to experience it. You can embody those emotions
51:48
without getting triggered. Much of the emotional trauma
51:52
that many people are harboring within their body, it gets stuck
51:55
in their nervous system and it creates cycles.
51:58
It's very unconscious and it keeps us in this elevated, hyper
52:03
stimulated state of, you know, sympathetic fight or flight.
52:06
Dr. Coherence allows us to dampen that system creates
52:12
almost like a buffer or stripping perhaps the paint from
52:16
the canvas so that you recognize that you are the pure potential
52:19
of canvas. And the paint is really just the
52:21
stories that we've been telling ourselves and the experiences of
52:25
the past. And we can begin to learn from
52:27
it. We can begin to observe it so
52:30
that we can witness the experience and the emotions
52:34
within the body. And by witnessing the emotions,
52:38
you are now allowing it to be released.
52:40
It transforms, it changes the narratives that we've held onto.
52:45
Those experiences and those sensations, they change.
52:49
Coherence is part of the process of becoming self compassionate
52:54
so that we can heal from the inside out.
52:57
How does this? Link to, I guess, psychotherapy,
53:00
because what you're describing, that sounds quite similar to
53:04
what Gestalt has said about the humans standing in a field and
53:09
over past trauma, you know, unfinished conversations with
53:12
people, unfinished business that can fight figures arising out of
53:15
that field around you that you need to deal with in order to
53:18
release fat Trauma 100. Percent, you know, psychotherapy
53:22
in my mind is really helping people give the tools and the
53:26
mindset, the way of understanding and thinking in
53:29
terms that puts you back into coherence with your true
53:32
authentic self, your true perspective and and your
53:36
connection to something greater than self.
53:38
Psychotherapy has many tools. Heart coherence is 1 tool that's
53:43
very valuable that can help people reach this authenticity
53:48
and deep connection. So a psychotherapy, I mean,
53:52
it's, it's, you know, as I like to think it's all interconnect
53:55
and it's all one for sure. Mitch, what is one thing that
54:00
you believe will allow more people to have better mental
54:03
health? Practice that.
54:06
The research shows even if you practice coherence 20 minutes a
54:08
day, it can structurally change your body, your mind.
54:12
If you look at, you know, some of the work that's coming out of
54:15
UC San Diego, as clear as day that you know, you practice
54:18
these techniques and you radically change, you become a
54:22
different person. I would have to say, look, take
54:26
time. Recognize that we are being
54:29
pulled in so many directions with social media and, and the
54:33
chaos of what's going on in the world.
54:35
There are many competing narratives.
54:37
And just to say that I, I believe it's my belief that, you
54:41
know, there are certain organizations that are, have
54:44
vested interests in capturing your, your consciousness.
54:47
Everyone's vying for your attention.
54:51
It can lead you down certain paths.
54:53
And I think that the most important path is your own path.
54:57
And I think the only way, the only way, particularly in this
55:00
day and age of no accountability and fake news and deep fakes and
55:03
all this, the craziness, is that you have to connect with your
55:08
heart. There is a deep elegance.
55:11
We can see it in the science, but certainly don't take my word
55:16
for it. You take the time and you will
55:19
learn a truth. You will experience a truth and
55:23
inner wisdom, but without practice, without experience,
55:28
you know, it's one going in one ear out the other, and it leaves
55:32
you susceptible to narratives that are not your own.
55:37
And it's narratives that are very manipulative and it feeds
55:41
conflict. It feeds, you know, a you versus
55:44
me narrative because to divide us to conquer.
55:48
So I, I really hope that people will first thing is just make
55:53
that true deep sense, you know, a sense of intention for change.
55:59
Well, Mitch, thank you. So much for sharing that and for
56:02
leading the work with the Global Heart Sync project.
56:05
And also thank you for sharing about your own individual
56:07
experiences of your journey and also the growth and also the
56:11
levels that you have unlocked within yourself as you have
56:14
spent more time to reach coherence.
56:17
So thank you very much. It was been a pleasure to have
56:19
you on the Load to Grow podcast. Thank you, Annie.
56:22
Pleasure sharing, thank you for listening.
56:26
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