Latest / Founder Unfiltered - What Founders Think But Never Say / Unlocking the Power of Email Marketing with Cole VanDeWoestyne

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Unlocking the Power of Email Marketing with Cole VanDeWoestyne · Founder Unfiltered - What Founders Think But Never Say

0:00
Welcome to another episode of 6 Figure Secrets for Fractional
0:03
Experts. My name is Bradley Jacobs.
0:05
I'm your host and the founder and CEO of Mylance.
0:08
Today I'm joined by Cole Vandy. Cole is the Co founder of
0:13
Inboxing Engine. The leading firm specializes in
0:16
e-mail marketing and consulting for experts, coaches and
0:19
consultants, course creators and anyone really scaling past
0:23
$3,000,000 that does some sort of direct response marketing.
0:27
Cole, welcome to the show. Hey, thank you for having me
0:30
man, I'm really excited for this.
0:32
Awesome, so elaborate on my intro.
0:34
Like what should our audience know more about what you do?
0:37
Yeah. I mean, Simply put, what we
0:39
really do is we jump into somebody that has like a killer
0:42
offer of some sort and it it could be really in any space.
0:45
We've worked with coaching, consulting companies, big name
0:49
gurus, brand new gurus. We've worked with supplement
0:52
companies that are crushing in multiple categories.
0:55
We worked with pet companies as well.
0:56
So it doesn't necessarily matter as long as there's direct
0:58
response elements to it. And we just help them scale by
1:02
plugging in a tried and true e-mail algorithm model.
1:06
And it's not like a software or anything like that.
1:08
It's a manual model we use and we just take all the data we
1:12
pump out way more revenue out of the e-mail list.
1:14
And it helps kind of shrink the cash collection cycle from the
1:18
moment that you run an ad and generate a lead to someone
1:21
buying something from you. So kind of lowers CPA and
1:25
increases AOV and LTV pretty quickly.
1:29
And it just helps scale like in in simple terms.
1:33
Why e-mail? Why is e-mail the 1:00 you got?
1:38
Yeah, that's, that's, that's a great question.
1:40
It's really simple. I think, One, not many people
1:44
are doing e-mail and doing it well.
1:47
And two, there's so much immediate data available that it
1:52
doesn't matter what the offer is, doesn't matter what the
1:54
niche is, doesn't matter. Like the only thing that truly
1:58
matters is that you can read the data, the open rates, the
2:00
clicks, the earnings per click, the sales, and then you can make
2:04
adjustments immediately to the next e-mail that goes out.
2:07
And you're just willing to play that game every single day.
2:10
And I saw no one was really doing it.
2:12
And it's just an untapped gold mine that most people are just
2:16
not appreciating like they could be.
2:18
So it's really easy when really easy to pull a small lever and
2:22
get big results for it. And you can make a lot of money
2:26
doing it so. And just to be clear, we're not
2:28
talking about outbound cold e-mail where with all the
2:31
domains this is like someone has opted in, whether it be an ad or
2:35
lead magnet or whatever it is and then I'm monetizing.
2:38
Exactly. Yeah, this is warm e-mail list.
2:40
So like someone's paying for advertising to get somebody to
2:44
download something or to register for a training or to
2:47
give up their e-mail address and in exchange for something.
2:50
And then we're emailing that person that gave up that e-mail
2:53
address willingly. And we are giving them value
2:57
content and and also promoting offers and products and stuff
3:00
like that. Cool.
3:01
So I'm a business, I have my lands, we collect emails, we
3:05
have our own lead magnet. And what is the difference
3:09
between someone who's doing this really well and as you said,
3:12
kind of capitalizing on on the opportunity and probably most
3:16
companies out there that are not like what is the biggest
3:18
difference? There, there's two pieces that
3:21
that question really unlocks. I want to make sure I touch on
3:24
both of them. The first piece is that most
3:27
entrepreneurs, most business owners, regardless of what scale
3:30
they're at, for the most part, majority of them are focused on
3:33
client acquisition. And so e-mail comes second to
3:37
them because it's like, well, I've already acquired clients.
3:40
And then the rest of those leads like the funnel will just pick
3:43
it up. That's the thought process.
3:44
So I'm going to continue to focus on the main thing, which
3:47
is acquiring more clients. And logically it makes a lot of
3:50
sense. So the the second thing is like,
3:53
they're probably have some sort of automations, they're probably
3:56
sending out some sort of offers. They have a promo coming up or
3:59
they have a live event or a webinar, whatever, a launch.
4:03
And so they're doing e-mail. OK.
4:04
And so from like a, if you wanted like a dollar amount
4:08
difference took on a client in 2021 is my longest running
4:11
client that I'd had and they were doing e-mail really well.
4:15
So they were doing about 8 million a year, 250,000 a month
4:19
was coming from e-mail. So about 3 million a year from
4:21
from e-mail. That's all that's like in
4:24
comparison to most companies out there.
4:27
That's a very large amount of revenue coming from e-mail.
4:30
So they were doing really good, much, much higher than the
4:33
industry standard. When we came in, we took them
4:36
from 250,000 a month to over 1.2 million a month just by focusing
4:41
on the day-to-day management of the e-mail list, what offers to
4:45
send to the right people at the right time, the segmentation,
4:48
making sure we're in boxing and just really paying attention to
4:51
it. So like the difference between
4:53
someone doing e-mail really good and someone coming in and only
4:57
doing e-mail and doing it better than anyone else is about
5:00
$1,000,000 a month in an 8 figure company.
5:03
And is it the same offer that you're selling like that that
5:06
company was selling from the 250 K to the 1.2?
5:10
Yep, the exact same offer, the exact same funnel, the exact
5:13
same pages, the exact same VS LS, the exact same webinars.
5:16
The only thing that changed was our approach to e-mail.
5:20
What can you share about the approach?
5:21
Right? Like I know it's all your secret
5:23
sauce, but like what can you share with us?
5:24
Everyone says that my, my belief is there, there is no such thing
5:29
as secret sauce, right? There's no magic bullet, no
5:32
silver, you know, like it's what we do is really plainly put.
5:36
And I, I have, I, I've broken this all down on other shows.
5:39
I don't want to like spend an hour explaining all the
5:41
intricacies. But the 30,000 foot view is we
5:44
take about 3 weeks and we send them nothing but nurture and
5:47
value. We don't offer him anything.
5:50
We don't, we don't pitch him anything.
5:52
We're just training them to open emails and Click to continue to
5:55
get more information. That's really what we're doing
5:57
for three weeks in a row. How we determine what content to
6:01
send out comes from the sales team.
6:03
So the sales team tells us what the number one objection is for
6:07
the month before. So here's the objections, here's
6:09
the exact language that's happening on the phones.
6:11
Here's the exact language people are sending into our support
6:14
desk to ask for refunds. Here's this, here's this, here's
6:17
this. So we take all of this and then
6:19
we have the face of the company, or if there isn't a face, we
6:22
create a face or whatever it may be.
6:24
And then we curate content to help lower the intensity of
6:28
those objections, right? So if it's like I've met like
6:31
these people never spent $10,000 before, it's like, OK, so now
6:35
I'm going to pull quotes from Warren Buffett or Mark Cuban or
6:38
whatever. And I'm going to talk about how
6:40
they stretched beyond their means when they first got
6:42
started and how they came up with 10,015 thousand $20,000.
6:47
And, and I really want to get them in that groove.
6:49
And then that, that next week. So three weeks of that and then
6:52
a week of just straight promoting the offer.
6:55
And so we run it through a four or three phase system with that.
7:00
The first one is just getting clicks to the page.
7:02
Nothing new there. I didn't invent this.
7:04
So it's just like kind of click baity.
7:06
You still want to be congruent, but you want to get people on
7:08
the offer page. So the offer page does all the
7:10
work. And then the next part of that
7:12
sequence is very much going to be emotional.
7:14
So you want to get people really, you know, hooked into an
7:17
emotion of some sort. Usually it's going to be pain of
7:20
not having the thing and the cost or price that they pay for
7:24
not having it or the prices other people are paying for them
7:27
not having it. So if you're selling and make
7:29
money online, offer the prices their kids are paying, the
7:32
prices their families paying, whatever it may be.
7:35
And then the third part of that is just urgency and FOMO, right?
7:38
Urgency. Like there's a deadline, we will
7:40
take this offer away and then FOMO, other people are going to
7:44
succeed and you're going to watch them do it because you
7:46
didn't take action kind of thing.
7:48
And with the urgency, like we actually take the offer down.
7:51
Like it, it goes to a closed page until we reopen the offer.
7:56
So that like with an e-mail list is incredibly important because
7:59
if I mail you in May about an offer and then tell you that the
8:03
offers going away and then the offer doesn't go away in June,
8:07
that's a problem, right? They're they're now they're not
8:09
trusting of us. And the whole part is like, no,
8:12
like and trust. So that's exactly how we do it.
8:16
I I share this anywhere and everywhere and with anyone that
8:19
will listen, but so few will actually spend the time to do
8:22
this. So that's I have no problem
8:24
sharing the the secret sauce to how we make it work.
8:27
Yeah, no, I I love, I love that you're willing to share 'cause I
8:30
have the same philosophy. Not everyone does, but I used to
8:33
think that my content was proprietary and it was something
8:37
that I should kind of hide. And it was like, no, at the end
8:40
of the day, I can share everything.
8:42
I'm going to teach you, let's say how to be a consultant,
8:45
successful thought leader, whatever.
8:47
You're still not going to do it. I I can literally give you the
8:50
whole playbook as a lead magnet. You're not going to do it.
8:53
You're still going to pay me to coach you, to support you in it.
8:56
Yeah. And, and the ones that end up
8:58
taking action, this is from my personal experience, the
9:01
majority of people that end up taking action think that they
9:03
can do it better. So they end up changing it
9:06
anyways. And what I felt like what we do
9:09
today and what I just shared just now, like I've sent
9:12
hundreds of millions, if not a billion emails at this point,
9:16
every single one of those had data that came back to me that
9:18
made me adjust it to get to the point where I'm at now, right?
9:21
And so if you think you're going to like make a decision based
9:24
off zero data to make it better, to me, that's crazy.
9:28
So like, more power to you guys and I hope it works.
9:31
But I'm telling you like the simplicity of this thing works
9:34
really well and it works at scale.
9:35
Yeah, It's like, good luck, make it better.
9:37
Go for it. Like I invite you to make it
9:39
better. Let me know how it goes right?
9:40
Exactly. Yeah.
9:41
Let me know what you find out because this is the furthest
9:43
I've been able to get it so far. So I'm fascinated by a few
9:47
things. One of them is when someone
9:51
signs up for something weed magnet or you know, even
9:54
responds to an ad, in my mind, that's the highest intent
9:58
they're ever going to be, right? And yet what I'm hearing from
10:01
you is 3 weeks. Nothing but nurture.
10:04
Help me reconcile those two. Yeah, Yeah, yeah.
10:06
No, that's, that's a, that's a great catch there.
10:10
So for full clarity, someone OPS in there, I usually have them in
10:15
some sort of pressure cooker and then so that's through
10:17
automations. So I let the funnel do the
10:19
funnel thing for the first three days, five days, seven days, 10
10:23
days, depending on the offer, depending on the data we have.
10:25
So it'll run through and like push them like it, you know,
10:28
it's a lead magnet PDF for example.
10:30
We're pushing them to get to the, to the webinar, right?
10:33
We're going to beat them to death until they get to the
10:35
webinar. So we'll send them 5 or 6 emails
10:37
a day kind of thing to get them to the webinar.
10:39
And then if they don't sign up for the webinar, then we kind of
10:42
kick them out as like lower value, if you will, or not as
10:46
interested or time isn't right or whatever, right.
10:49
And if they do do register and then don't attend, like there's
10:52
a couple of different phases that these people go through,
10:54
but that, yeah, that first pressure cooker sequence is the
10:57
most important. Once they make it through that,
10:59
either as a customer or not as a customer, that's when that three
11:03
weeks of nurture, one week of promo happens.
11:07
And the only people we would remove out of that sequence
11:10
altogether would be people that have bought everything.
11:13
So if you haven't bought everything, then I'm going to
11:15
send you to the core offer that's going to sell you
11:17
everything. And so that process works really
11:20
well. But yes, that that initial like
11:22
opt in goes through a pressure cooker sequence of some sort,
11:25
depending on the offer, depending on everything else, it
11:27
should never probably be more than 10 to 15 days long in in my
11:31
world. And the companies that I've
11:33
helped scale like tremendously. 3 days is usually the the
11:37
window. I'm sure people listening to
11:39
this think when they hear pressure cooker, they hear 5 to
11:43
6 emails a day. This is your world, right?
11:45
This, that's no, that's not that rolls off your tongue no
11:48
problem. The people that listening to
11:50
this might be like, holy shit, like that is a lot.
11:53
And there's such a mindset around I'm bothering people.
11:59
Good. I'm sure that's not your
12:01
mindset. So what?
12:02
What? Yeah, you said good.
12:03
I know I'm bothering people I like I, I grew up in sales,
12:08
right? So I, I, my mom was a
12:10
salesperson, my dad was a salesperson and I ended, I was
12:12
in sales for many years before I got into marketing.
12:16
If I wasn't bothering people on the phone with something, then I
12:21
wasn't making money as that was just the reality of it.
12:24
And the, the piece of this that made me whole with it and made
12:28
me like love that part of it was when I heard something from, I
12:33
think it was I, I honestly believe it was Grant Cardone.
12:35
It was a long time ago. Not saying I agree fully or
12:38
anyone should blindly go in that direction, but my first sales
12:42
training more than a decade ago was Cardone University.
12:44
And one of the 1800 videos that I watched was something along
12:49
the lines of you can't bother somebody if you believe in the
12:51
product. Like if you truly believe in
12:54
what you're selling and you believe it's actually going to
12:55
help people, then you can't be bothered by it.
12:58
This was cemented in me during the sales process when I
13:00
remember I called somebody, it was working at a car dealership
13:03
in Iowa when I was 19 and I called every single day, twice a
13:09
day, the same person because I knew they were going to buy like
13:12
they needed a car, their car was going to break down.
13:14
They had to get their kids to school.
13:16
They're just stuck in this world of I don't know how to make it
13:18
happen. And after like 3 or 4 weeks of
13:20
calling them twice a day, imagine a car salesman calling
13:23
you twice a day. Like the epitome of like, stop
13:26
calling me. I will call the police, right?
13:29
They finally pick up the phone and they're like, you win.
13:31
Like let like our car broke down this morning.
13:35
We need a car. And because I followed up with
13:38
them for three weeks, I let my manager know every single detail
13:41
about everything that was going on.
13:43
We were going to help these people get into a car.
13:45
And by the end of the entire process, they're in tears
13:48
because they had bad credit. They had a car they owed money
13:50
on that broke down. It wasn't worth any money.
13:52
Like it was just this terrible scenario and they felt like
13:55
every other dealership they had been to had given up on them.
13:57
But I just kept calling them because I knew I could help
14:00
them. Like I knew deep down I could.
14:02
And then doesn't matter what offer I've been a part of
14:05
throughout the years, no matter what it was, I would get
14:08
screenshots from a support team or from a VA or from a sales
14:12
team or whatever it may be. Just like a screenshot.
14:14
Like, Oh my God, you guys have been emailing me for a year, two
14:17
years or six months or three, like every day.
14:19
And like, you know, it's just a bad time or this or that.
14:22
But like you guys are the only ones that seem to care enough
14:25
about me to make sure I could have an opportunity to take
14:28
advantage of whatever this thing was.
14:31
You can't possibly be bothering somebody if your product, your
14:35
service or your offer actually help someone and you know for
14:39
certain that you're targeting the right people.
14:43
Meaning like the ads are going and getting placed in front of
14:46
people and then knowing that they took the time out of the
14:48
day to give up their e-mail address and then to get in this
14:51
part of the and now they're opening emails, right?
14:53
It's like they want what you have.
14:55
It's just they're, they're either fighting it or it's not a
14:58
good time or like something happened.
15:00
So like the more you can get in front of them, the more pleasant
15:03
they're going to be about it. Now you're going to, you're
15:05
going to make some people mad and that's OK, right?
15:08
That's part of that process. But yeah, if I if I'm not
15:11
bothering people or annoying people and then I'm doing
15:15
something wrong is how I look at it.
15:17
Yeah, well, I had an old entrepreneur friend who told me
15:21
that she, if they sign up for something as you said, right,
15:24
like weed magnet, whatever it is, they're opting in.
15:27
She either wants them to buy or unsubscribe.
15:30
Yeah. Right.
15:31
Pick one or the other, because you hanging out on my e-mail
15:34
list is not what either of us wants.
15:37
No, right? It's a lose lose there.
15:40
Yeah, and, and I, we even have in a lot of our pressure cooker
15:44
sequences, we even have emails dedicated to kicking people off
15:48
the e-mail list. Like literally set up like like
15:51
we'll set up a subject line that's like, get off my list,
15:55
right? And then I'll be like, listen,
15:56
at this point we either need to get divorced or get married.
15:59
But this whole dating phase thing isn't working for us.
16:03
So click here and unsubscribe if you don't want XXXXX or if you
16:09
do want this thing, then click here and do the thing that you
16:11
need to do in order to do this. The reason that we do that and
16:15
why that's so important is because one, yeah, like my goal
16:18
isn't to build a 10 million person e-mail list.
16:21
My goal is to serve the people that want the thing that that we
16:24
have. So that's, that's the process
16:27
that we take people through. And yes, it's annoying.
16:30
We bother people, we upset people, we piss people off,
16:33
people get angry, people unsubscribe.
16:37
Good. That's part of the process.
16:39
Not everyone's going to like you, not everyone's going to
16:41
like your offer. But the ones that do will thank
16:43
you for it, I promise you. The people that cringe at like
16:50
getting that response, like F off or leave me alone or
16:54
whatever it is, it's normal, right?
16:56
There's a lot of either people pleasing tendencies.
16:59
We don't like disappointing people.
17:01
What do you say to those people to help them manage that
17:05
internal reaction they have? At the end of the day, I, I
17:09
truly believe and, and this might and I want to make sure
17:13
that this comes across with as much love as I can.
17:16
But like, if I'm holding back someone's opportunity to better
17:21
their life because of how I feel, I'm being incredibly
17:24
selfish, right? Like if I have the if I have the
17:27
cure for cancer, like I'll burn neighborhoods down to get people
17:31
out of their house so I can tell them about it, right?
17:34
Like I'll do anything in my power to make that happen.
17:37
And so, so many people get in their own way of success.
17:41
Like, it doesn't matter which entrepreneur you listen to talk
17:45
about their story. Damon, John, it could be Jesse
17:48
Itzler, could be any of these guys.
17:51
And anybody you want to pick any single one of them, they will
17:53
tell you a day in which they just pounded phones, bothered
17:57
people, got in their own way, made sure the entire world knew
18:02
about everything that they're doing.
18:03
I remember Jesse is there was on stage talking about how he
18:06
started and got his first clients from Marquee Jet.
18:09
He saw he was at this big country big conference with all
18:12
these like suit like the Ted conference in San Francisco.
18:15
And he saw, like, all these guys at the conference were like
18:19
coming in with coffee cups and bagels before the conference.
18:23
And he didn't have a ticket to get in, so we couldn't network
18:24
with these guys. So we went to the coffee shop
18:27
that sold these bagels and he bought all the bagels.
18:31
Like, imagine how mad you would be that a salesperson bought all
18:36
the bagels that you were expecting that next day, right?
18:39
Just so we can have a conversation with you.
18:41
And so doing what it takes is is, is part of it.
18:45
And getting out of your own way is a is a big part of success.
18:49
And not just in that realm, but in like every realm of being an
18:52
entrepreneur is like, get out of your own way.
18:54
It's not about you. It's about serving the people
18:59
for the. Fractional executives.
19:00
For the consultants listening to this, I just want to talk
19:02
tangibly for a second if they want to mimic something of what
19:06
you're talking about. Some have an e-mail list, a lot
19:09
don't. What would you recommend for how
19:13
they get started in creating an e-mail list?
19:16
Growing an e-mail list using a lead map?
19:18
I don't know, like what would you say?
19:20
I think a, a better question to ask is like what, what's the one
19:24
action that I can take to, to grow?
19:27
And when you're new or you know, you have a couple clients and,
19:32
and you're wanting more or you want more safety cushion or
19:36
whatever it may be the the answer to that is talk to people
19:41
like however you can do it. Like doesn't matter if if it's
19:46
picking up the phone and cold calling people, if it's D Ming
19:48
people on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook, if it's if it's
19:53
starting an e-mail list, if it's if it's bothering podcast host
19:57
to be on their podcast, like whatever it is like just you
20:01
have to talk to human beings. There's no way to do this
20:03
without talking to humans. And sometimes talking to humans
20:06
looks like emailing them. If you're going to grow a
20:08
business, you have to communicate with human beings.
20:11
And so doing that at scale, and a lot of it is incredibly
20:15
important. Yeah.
20:16
Do you want to tell everyone how you ended up on this podcast?
20:19
I have no idea. I have a team.
20:22
I have a team that that bothers people to get me on their
20:25
podcast. And I don't know what those
20:27
messages even look like, to be honest with you.
20:29
I don't know how many messages they send to get a response
20:33
back, but I know that I know that they make sure that I get
20:38
on podcasts and I haven't had anybody upset about the process
20:41
yet. So yeah, but I'm sure they, they
20:44
reached out in some way, shape or form and, and, and pitch, you
20:49
know, having me as a guest on your, on your show.
20:52
And here I am, right. And the reason that they work
20:56
with me to help me get on stages and to book podcast is because
21:00
I've been bothering the owner of this thing for like over a year
21:05
now. Like, hey, man, I want to be on
21:06
stage. I want to be on stage.
21:07
I want to get on podcast shows. I want to do this.
21:09
I want to do that. I just kept bothering him for
21:11
quite a while. His name's Elliot.
21:13
He's a incredible human being and love him to death.
21:18
And, and he finally he we're at an event and he's like, hey,
21:22
man, just so you know, like we're starting this the speaker
21:25
Bureau thing and you're going to, we're going to get you on
21:28
some stages and on some podcasts, like, yes, like, thank
21:31
you. You know, after, after about a
21:33
year, just like, hey, man, just letting you know, this is what I
21:36
want. This is what I want, this is
21:37
what I want. So.
21:39
Yeah. Yeah, it's a simple e-mail for
21:42
me that I received and said they introduce themselves.
21:46
It must. It's an, it looks like an
21:47
agency. Really.
21:49
And they just introduced you that you'd be a good guest.
21:52
Here's the reason why you'd be a good guest.
21:55
Let us know. And I responded right away.
21:57
I looked at your bio. I was like, yeah, I agree.
22:00
Here's the link to book. And that was it.
22:02
So, yeah, simple, right. But it's, it's simple and I
22:05
think so many people don't do it because it's, it's just scary.
22:10
It's perceived to be scary. At least I'm just reach out and
22:12
say, hey, I want to do this. What's the worst that happens?
22:17
Right. You get ignored, they tell you
22:19
no. They, I mean, it comes for me.
22:23
I I'm very fortunate. Like I grew up not having more
22:27
than what we needed, right? I had the clothes on my back,
22:29
food on the table, roof over my head, heat in there like that.
22:33
You know, I had the the basic essentials of like a lower
22:37
middle class kind of growing up and which was great.
22:41
But if I wanted anything in addition to that, I had to ask
22:44
for it. And then I had to find a way to
22:46
make it happen. And so I got told no a lot, like
22:51
a lot a lot. And then when I went into sales,
22:53
I got told no so much all the time.
22:58
In fact, I remember getting told no probably like 100 times in
23:02
one day and feeling completely defeated of like like 100 people
23:08
told me no today. This is crazy.
23:10
Like am I going to make money this month?
23:11
Like, you know, and then, but you know, pulling yourself up by
23:16
your bootstraps and, and just going, you know what the next
23:19
one's going to be a yes. And just having that like crazy
23:22
delusional belief that like the past 100 Nos don't count right.
23:26
And it and it doesn't say anything about me.
23:29
It just says everything about them and that it's just a hard
23:32
place to be in without experience, I think.
23:34
Yeah, so. We had a guest here maybe two or
23:38
three weeks ago and she said if your dream life was on the other
23:43
side of 3000 Nos, how quickly would you get them?
23:48
Yeah, like today I would get in the next 30 minutes.
23:50
Exactly. You're like, I will do whatever
23:52
it takes, right? And so it's like kind of that
23:55
mentality of like, I'm just willing to be told no over and
23:59
over and over and over and over again.
24:00
But similar. I actually didn't have really
24:03
that experience growing up. I didn't have the practice.
24:07
And my first job was setting up like research interviews for
24:10
primary research for a consulting firm.
24:13
And it was hitting the phones and I had a long list and oh,
24:16
man, it was a wake up call like nothing I'd ever experienced my
24:21
life. And I'm now so thankful for it.
24:23
I hated it at the top. Yeah, I, I hated it, but.
24:27
And I'm thankful for it because, yeah, when someone tells me no,
24:29
I don't like it, I'm not going to tell you I like getting told
24:31
no. But I'm used to it and I know
24:33
it's part of the process where. Yeah.
24:35
It really just holds a lot of people back.
24:37
I'd I'd say for me, like a majority of time, I really love
24:40
being told no because it gives me two things.
24:43
One, I need to improve something, right?
24:47
My ego needs a check, my assumptions need a check.
24:51
Or maybe I'm just targeting the wrong person or it's the wrong
24:54
thing for me. Like it's it's such a good
24:56
feedback loop for me to get better and to get what I
25:00
actually want. Then it would be if they would
25:02
just say yes and do the thing anyways.
25:05
And so that's why I love it. But that definitely is a very
25:09
challenging pivot to make until you've been through it, like
25:13
getting told no enough and then analyzing like, OK, well, if
25:16
they would have said yes, then like all these other things
25:20
probably wouldn't have happened or I wouldn't have been, it
25:22
wouldn't have been what it could have been kind of thing if I
25:24
would have just waited. And so that's why I, I love
25:27
gnome. But yeah, I mean, I don't it's
25:28
such like a weird concept to like share, but I think like a
25:31
lot of people should go do door to door sales for like DIRECTV
25:35
or pest control or or whatever for six months.
25:39
Like just go knock doors with 18 year old kids for, for six
25:42
months for 16 hours a day and and have people yell at you and
25:47
and everything else just to get it through, like just to get
25:50
over it. And then in business, you're
25:51
going to be great because you have no problem asking for
25:54
things anymore and you're not afraid of a no.
25:56
And I'd say dating as well, or, or just like anything, right?
26:00
Like so many men are terrified of approaching women these days.
26:03
And it's like what? You just get used to the no,
26:06
then you're fearless. Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
26:09
There was a there was, I don't know if you've seen this on
26:12
Instagram. It's been a little while because
26:14
I deleted it off my phone because I have a problem
26:16
scrolling. But eventually I found this guy.
26:18
And it's like the this guy that is like beating social anxiety.
26:24
And so he like wears this like camera on his chest and he's
26:27
just like walking through New York and he's just like saying
26:29
hi to everybody. Hey, man, hope you have a great
26:31
day. Hey, this, Hey, that.
26:33
And then someone, someone look at him funny or be like, don't
26:35
talk to me or like just like that negative response we're
26:39
looking for. He's like, all right.
26:41
He's like, all right, that says, you know, he's having a bad day.
26:43
It's all good. I'm going to say hi to the next
26:45
person, right? And he's just like talking out
26:46
loud to himself in front of all these people.
26:49
And whether he struggles with it or doesn't struggle with it, the
26:51
content I think is still really good because at the end of the
26:54
day, most people don't care about you as much as you think
26:59
they do. And they're not paying attention
27:01
to you as much as you think they are.
27:04
And they would actually genuinely enjoy you starting a
27:07
conversation with them because they are just as scared, if not
27:10
more scared of making that first interaction, whether it be in a
27:15
dating environment or just human beings in general, they're
27:19
afraid too. So just say, hey, how are you?
27:22
How's your day going? Or I really like your shirt or
27:24
your shoes look really awesome today.
27:26
And the worst thing that they're going to do is be like, don't
27:30
talk to me. And you just gave them a
27:32
compliment. Like, there's nothing wrong with
27:34
that. Yeah.
27:35
So. Yeah, Earlier you talked about
27:38
if your offer is something that genuinely helps people, you, you
27:42
can't bother someone. And so for the consultants
27:45
listening, their offers is a service, right?
27:48
It's really what they've experienced, what their skill
27:50
set is, what they bring to the table.
27:52
There's a lot of people that are asking me is there a market for
27:56
this type of, you know, offer right is their service and like,
28:02
of course there is. So you learned it from somewhere
28:04
a company paid you for it there. I don't know, I don't know the
28:07
specifics of, you know, fintech product what it doesn't matter.
28:11
The answer is yes. I think what really they're
28:13
asking is how should I pick of the different things that I've
28:18
done in my career? How do I pick what I really what
28:22
I really offer? And I know you've talked about
28:24
kind of like where you're a genius and where you're the
28:27
best, right? Like how if I'm this, everyone
28:32
thinks they're a Jack of all trades, right?
28:33
Like I've done all these different things in my career.
28:35
How do I start narrowing in on what I should quote UN quote,
28:39
pitch to clients based on either what I love?
28:42
Like how do I get to that place where I know my?
28:43
Offer that's great. Do you know Dane Maxwell?
28:47
He's there in Austin as well. He started the foundation good
28:52
friend of mine incredible human being.
28:55
He he's mentored guys like Sam Evans and and other very
29:00
successful entrepreneurs. This he's an incredible human
29:03
being. He leads from the heart.
29:04
And this is how I approach any conversation with pretty much
29:09
anyone is I don't try to tell them what they need.
29:13
I just ask them questions. So like, it would be like, hey,
29:17
Bradley, are you a business owner?
29:19
And you'd probably be like, yeah, I'd be like, great.
29:22
What's the number one problem you're looking to solve in your
29:25
Business Today? And you'd probably say something
29:28
like, I don't know, getting more clients or charging double what
29:31
I currently charge, or you'd throw out some or, you know, my
29:34
fulfillment system is all jacked up or man my accounting or
29:37
whatever. OK, And on a scale of one to 10,
29:40
how painful is that for you? Means 8 or 9 or 10, right?
29:43
And you just walk them through questions and then by the end of
29:46
it, you know what their biggest problem is.
29:48
You'll ask them what is your dream solution for that?
29:52
And then by the end of it, you're like, OK, I know what the
29:54
problem is. I know what the dream solution
29:55
is for it. I know how painful it is.
29:57
I know what their business impact would be if they actually
29:59
ended up doing it. So if I can do that thing, then
30:03
I would be like, hey, so I can actually help with that.
30:06
Here's how. And if I can't help with that
30:09
thing, then I may go, you know what?
30:11
I'm not the person that can help you solve that exact problem.
30:14
I typically help solve this problem and then they, there may
30:18
be a conversation there. And if there's not like I may
30:21
know someone that can help solve this problem.
30:23
Would you like me to reach out to my network and see if I can
30:25
help you with that? And that ends up being the best
30:30
approach. It's not I'm going to help your
30:33
company do X or I'm going to help your company do Y.
30:35
It's what do you need help with? And so yes, do I do e-mail?
30:41
Absolutely. Am I, you know, really great at
30:44
getting emails into the inbox? Yes.
30:46
Am I really great at pulling money out of e-mail list?
30:48
Yes. Someone may come to me and go,
30:50
you know, they're my biggest problem right now is my ads are
30:54
too expensive. It's like, OK, they may not link
30:59
e-mail and ads being the same thing, right?
31:02
They may go, I need a better media buyer.
31:03
I need a copywriter, I need a creative or whatever, right?
31:07
And they go, OK, well, can we, you know, and we'll find a way
31:10
to put a deal together and where it makes sense.
31:12
And I may be able to introduce them to a media buying agency
31:15
that can also help them on the ad side.
31:18
So I, I like to, especially if you're going to be a consultant,
31:21
like if you're a consultant, your number one goal is to ask
31:25
questions and listen so that you can help them solve the problem
31:28
rather than come in and go. These are all the things that I
31:30
think are wrong with your company, even though I've never
31:31
worked here, never been in this company, don't know how you grew
31:34
it, don't know what your team knows, you know, like, so I'm
31:38
very consult consultative when it comes to any part of trying
31:44
to solve someone's problems, answering, asking questions and,
31:48
and letting them answer truthfully.
31:49
And I'm not trying to guide them to answer the question the way I
31:52
want them to answer it so I can sell them something.
31:55
Trying to get them to answer the question honestly so that way I
31:58
know what's top of mind for them and what they're most willing to
32:00
buy right now. I love the emails that come in
32:03
that are like, Hi Bradley, I am XYZ and Ioffer video production,
32:08
video editing, social media. Like they go this long list of
32:11
all the things that they can offer and I'm like, that's
32:14
great. I'm really happy for you.
32:17
Yeah, yeah. Thanks for thanks for emailing
32:20
me your business card. Yeah, it has nothing to do with
32:23
me, but. And, and sometimes, sometimes
32:26
I'll say that that stuff works really well, right?
32:29
That would be an incredibly sophisticated audience.
32:32
That's incredibly problem aware, that's incredibly solution aware
32:37
that's ready to make a buying decision, right.
32:39
And that stuff will work. I've I've bought some YouTube
32:42
editing services and stuff like that from people have done that
32:44
for me and usually I get lower quality work from them than if I
32:50
hired someone else. My personal experience is ask
32:53
questions, get to know what the actual problem is and then if
32:57
you can solve it just hey, I think I have a solution for
33:00
this. Can I walk you through it?
33:03
And if and if and if you don't recommend someone in your
33:06
network that you know for sure that can solve that problem.
33:08
Because now you look like 1,000,000 bucks to this person
33:11
who knows other people you know, and it's easier to pull
33:14
referrals that way. One thing you mentioned, and I
33:17
think it was one of your Instagram videos, but it talked
33:19
about if you're here and you want to get there, there's a
33:24
method you like to use, like planning the night before.
33:28
Like tell me more about when you think about just like putting a
33:30
plan in place. I I learned this from a mixture
33:34
of people and Alex Sharpen was one of my my first bigger
33:38
clients. Him and Tai Lopez were like my
33:40
first two big clients and working with Alex, I learned a
33:44
lot about like how to build momentum and how to move
33:49
businesses forward, how to move entrepreneurship forward.
33:52
And so, yeah, like if you feel stuck or if you're not making
33:56
the like, if you're not growing at 15 to 20% a year in a
34:00
business from a from a data standpoint, like you're doing
34:03
something wrong. It's not because there's an
34:06
election, It's not because Facebook ads cost more.
34:09
It's not because fulfillment cost, like it's not because of
34:12
those things. It's because you're just not
34:14
being strategic about what you're doing.
34:16
And so mapping out, you can use a lot of different methods to do
34:21
it and it doesn't to me, it doesn't matter which one.
34:23
It could be the 12 week year, it could be the one thing from Mr.
34:28
Keller, it could be literally any of them.
34:31
Doesn't matter. And you just walk it backwards,
34:34
OK, This is the goal I'll achieve by this date, OK, And
34:37
then walk it back. What's the highest?
34:39
What's the thing that must happen first in order for the
34:41
next thing to happen? Like what if you're setting up
34:44
Domino's, right? And you want to make sure all
34:46
the Domino's get knocked down so that way it finishes right,
34:51
Which Domino's 1st? And so setting that up and then
34:56
you have the night before plan. You know, it's Tuesday as we're
34:59
recording this. I don't know when you'll end up
35:01
releasing it, but it's Tuesday, right?
35:03
So tonight, Tuesday night, I'm going to plan out what I'm going
35:06
to do Wednesday. Wednesday night I'm going to
35:08
plan out Thursday and Thursday night I want to plan out Friday.
35:11
And then on Saturday, I'm probably not going to think
35:14
about what I'm going to do on Sunday and then Sunday night or
35:18
Sunday during the day, could be Sunday morning.
35:20
I'm going to plan out, OK, what is going to get me closest to
35:23
achieving my goal by the end date or sooner this week?
35:28
And then let me prioritize that by level of importance, not
35:33
necessarily urgent, but importance.
35:35
This is the most important stuff that needs to get done.
35:38
And then I'm going to all right, so I'm going to plan for this on
35:40
Monday, this on Tuesday, this on Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, and
35:43
then I'm going to check in. So Monday I'm going to try to
35:45
get as much as I can done. And then Monday night I'm going
35:48
to check in. All right, how much did I get
35:49
done? OK, I'm going to plan on Tuesday
35:52
to get the things done I didn't get done on Monday, get those
35:54
done 1st and then Tuesday. And that kind of allows me to
35:57
hold myself accountable as far as accomplishing things that are
36:00
moving the mission forward, right?
36:02
Because it's really easy. The biggest mistake most
36:05
entrepreneurs make, and especially myself, is like, we
36:09
get more efficient with our time and then we fill all of that
36:12
additional free time with low priority, low quality, low
36:17
productivity tasks that make us feel busy.
36:20
And that just simply doesn't move the mission forward.
36:26
It just it's, that's the difference between why Elon Musk
36:29
can accomplish things in three weeks that most companies
36:31
couldn't accomplish in six years.
36:34
It's just his ability to fill time with the most important
36:37
tasks possible. Yeah, and I find not, not just
36:40
filling my time like that with busy tasks, but they're, they're
36:44
like feel good tasks. Like there are things that I'm
36:47
good at that I like doing. And then I'll step back and be,
36:51
Oh my God, this doesn't move the needle forward at all, right.
36:54
And you know, it's funny for consultants, they are, you know,
36:58
they're all trying to get more clients pretty much the number
37:00
one thing, right? And so they're working on logos
37:03
and they're working on their website and they're working on
37:05
the business model and they're working on offers and pricing.
37:08
And I'm like, guys, don't do any of that shit.
37:12
None of that really matters. And when when it does, you'll
37:14
figure it out pretty quickly. Like as you said, go talk to
37:18
people. Same thing with getting a job.
37:20
People like, how do I get a job? I'm applying to all this stuff.
37:23
I'm closing up and finishing up my resume.
37:25
I was like, go talk to 100 people in the next 30 days.
37:27
Yeah, that's it. Just go talk.
37:29
Like you will be swimming in offers.
37:31
I would almost guarantee it. Yeah, 100%.
37:34
I love that you said like logos and wet, like the number one.
37:37
I mean, in the Internet marketing world, logos and
37:40
funnels are like the for like if someone's like, I want to launch
37:44
an offer logo and a funnel, I'm like, you don't need those two
37:47
things to launch an offer. I did, I, I held a copywriting
37:50
workshop last year in Newport Beach, $2000 a head for this
37:55
thing. I didn't have a funnel, I didn't
37:57
have a video. I don't have a sales pitch and I
37:59
did not take one single sales call.
38:01
I just wrote an offer up in a Google Doc and I manually sent
38:04
it to people. I made a a post on Facebook.
38:07
If I held a copywriting workshop, would you attend?
38:09
I messaged every single person that commented and just sent
38:12
them the Google Doc link and then they sent me money and that
38:15
was it. I did like $30,000 on a 2K offer
38:19
and I did that in 72 hours. Like it was incredibly fast,
38:22
incredibly easy. No funnels, no automations, no
38:25
Zapier, no e-mail, no phone call.
38:28
Like, I had an offer. I wanted to ship it.
38:32
That was the fastest way to ship it.
38:33
And it worked. Could I have done 40 grand if I
38:36
would have built funnels? Sure.
38:39
Would it have gotten done? Probably not.
38:41
Oh, I got to record a video now and I I don't feel good today,
38:45
or this or that or the lighting's not good.
38:48
My camera's not the just ship it.
38:51
Just ship it as quickly as you possibly can.
38:52
I you don't need a proper funnel and you don't need a proper logo
38:56
and you don't need, you don't need the proper stuff until
38:59
you're doing probably 80,000 a month, 100,000 a month.
39:04
And that's when you want to start throwing some stuff
39:06
together. But you're not the one doing it
39:07
now. Now you just pay someone.
39:09
I have a good friend of mine. She wants to launch a coaching
39:12
business and I asked her if she'd heard about Loveable or
39:15
anything like new AI tools. And she's like, no, I was like,
39:18
I could get a landing page, like a literally a properly coded
39:20
landing page for you in literally the next 3 minutes.
39:23
And she's like, what are you talking about?
39:25
So I did, I went in Loveable and I just like gave it her name in
39:27
one picture and it made this beautiful landing page.
39:30
I said, all you do is you're going to link a calendly link
39:32
here, schedule time, a free consultation with me.
39:34
Just send it out to pretty much your network and I would almost
39:37
guarantee you have your first coaching client in the next 30
39:39
days and she's like, you make it sound so easy.
39:42
Like. It could be What if we didn't
39:46
over think? It doesn't have to be that tech
39:48
advanced. I was I was coaching a
39:50
leadership group last year had a one of the students wanted.
39:55
She's like, my dream is to have a fitness coaching business.
39:58
So great. By the end of today, you will
40:00
have your offer done and your first client paying you.
40:03
There's no way like I promise you, so I can't build a funnel
40:07
that fast. You don't need a funnel.
40:09
You know, human beings that need what you have just talked to
40:12
them. And so she just pounded the
40:14
phone. She made like 30 phone calls.
40:16
She got like three or four people to pay her.
40:18
Wow. She has three or four clients in
40:19
her first day just picking up the phone and calling people.
40:21
She's got no experience. She's got no funnel.
40:23
She's got no website. She has no social presence.
40:25
She has no following. She has nothing.
40:28
All she does is pick up the phone and she even have a real
40:31
offer. She just, she was just telling
40:33
these people, hey, so like, you know how I do marathons, I like
40:35
to run all the time and I work out like, yeah, well, I'm going
40:38
to help people get healthier. And I'm so I'm doing that
40:41
through coaching. It's weekly.
40:43
It's only X amount of dollars. Do you want to pay with a card
40:46
or you want to like just give me cash when I see you in person
40:49
And like 3 or 4 people just gave her money?
40:53
Simple as that. It's.
40:55
Crazy. Yeah.
40:55
So simple. It's talking to humans is how
40:58
you grow a business. That's how it works.
41:00
I love. It if people want to find you a
41:03
minute to just self promote. I'm also curious what you
41:05
charge. I know you work with some bigger
41:06
companies, but how does it work with you and where can people
41:10
find you? Yeah.
41:12
So you can find me on social anywhere at Cole, Vandee Cole
41:18
and then VAND EE and and then our, you know, the company I run
41:23
is in boxing engine, so it's in boxingengine.com.
41:27
So you can check us out there. And yeah, I mean like how it
41:30
works with us when we're taking clients on, we don't take on a
41:33
lot at a time, but we are usually we can take on one or
41:40
two depending on obviously when someone listens to this.
41:43
But yeah, we work with companies that are doing at least three
41:45
million a year. And I say that very hesitantly.
41:50
If you're doing 3,000,000 a year, then you must be like
41:53
properly set up to actually scale to 10 million in the next
41:56
12 months. And what I mean by that is like
41:58
your offers dialed, your media buying is dialed, your
42:01
fulfilment is dialed, your sales process is dialed, you have
42:05
everything set up to scale. It's not that you just hit your
42:08
first $250,000 a month, it's that you've been here and you're
42:12
ready to scale. So typically clients that are
42:14
doing at least 10 million a year and looking to scale the 50 or
42:17
100 and yeah, we charge flat retainers.
42:20
So to start working with us, it's 10,000 a month.
42:23
And then depending on what's needed, it could be 20 or 30,000
42:26
a month. And then we take a small
42:28
percentage of any like JV promos or one off kind of big promos
42:33
that require more than what the day-to-day were required as far
42:37
as managing the e-mail list and sending out emails.
42:40
And we handle everything from the, for the e-mail list for
42:42
you. So we use their ESP.
42:45
So if you have your own, you know, Maripost account or get
42:48
response or whatever, we log into your account.
42:51
It's that way you own the asset. And then, yeah, we write all the
42:54
copy, we send all the emails, we extract all the data, we handle
42:58
all the deliverability, all the inboxing, we send weaker reports
43:03
and all that fun stuff. And then we even make
43:06
suggestions on like, hey, we think that, you know, this kind
43:09
of an offer would be great for this small section of the list.
43:12
If you guys, you know, see an opportunity to create something
43:14
like that or whatever it may be. Like at the end of the day, our
43:17
goal is to like really pump revenue into the business.
43:20
That way they have cash to operate from, especially when
43:24
economy is rough or, you know, media buying becomes more
43:27
expensive or it's an election, you know, like whatever is going
43:30
on, like we tend to be the the padding to keep companies
43:34
afloat, so. Amazing.
43:36
Cool. Well, thank you so much for your
43:38
time and sharing all of the all the insights.
43:41
I mean, I learned a lot from you today, so I really appreciate
43:44
it. Awesome.
43:45
And yeah, thank you for having me on.
43:46
I really love this. Yes, a lot of really great
43:48
questions. So I appreciate you having me,
43:50
man. Anytime.