Latest / CattleUSA Daily / 240: How to Rebuild Without Going Broke: Heifers, Genetics, and Data with Emma Coffman

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240: How to Rebuild Without Going Broke: Heifers, Genetics, and Data with Emma Coffman · CattleUSA Daily

0:00
Today on the podcast, we are once again bringing back Emma
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Kaufman and she is here to talk about heifers on our operation
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heifer retention, what decisions we need to make when it comes to
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heifers. And we put a large emphasis in
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this podcast on strategic decision making and the finances
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as well. Before we hop into today's
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episode, if you're watching on YouTube, make sure you take a
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second to subscribe to our channel.
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And like this episode. If you're on any of our other
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podcast platforms, make sure you go take a second to rate and
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review it as well. Without further ado, let's go
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ahead and here from Emma. Welcome to the Cattle USA Daily
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podcast, your go to source for the latest livestock markets,
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industry insights and the updates shaping agriculture
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today. I'm your host, Lauren Moylan, a
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passionate advocate for agriculture, here to keep you
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informed and connected. Now let's dive into today's
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episode. Emma, welcome back to the
0:59
podcast. How was your New Year's and did
1:03
you do an exciting anything exciting over New Year's Eve?
1:05
Happy New Year, it's another year I'm super excited for.
1:09
I think it's really funny that it's the year of the horse too.
1:11
So like all the Cowboys, companies and people like
1:15
posting about it. So big fan of that.
1:17
But yeah, we just nothing crazy, you know, went up to the
1:21
stockyards a little bit, but then I was home by like 10.
1:24
So nothing, nothing crazy for me.
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How about? You Lauren.
1:28
I was in bed by like 8 or 9 and asleep shortly after that I read
1:33
a nice book, did not stay up anywhere close to midnight so it
1:39
was the perfect night. Were you ever a partier for New
1:44
Year's Eve? Because I've never been like a
1:45
big New Year's like woo Hoo. So, Oh no, we were you.
1:51
When I was in college, yeah. We wasn't at.
1:54
Not since I graduated. When I was in college, yes.
2:01
Before college, yeah, all of those times.
2:05
Yes. Since I've graduated college,
2:07
No, I am not. I think since I graduated
2:10
college and moved to a small town for my corporate job a few
2:14
years ago, after that, I was like, yeah, no.
2:17
And then I met my husband and we got married and I was like,
2:19
yeah, absolutely not. And none of her friends were
2:21
doing anything or hosting anything.
2:22
And I was like, actually, this is great.
2:23
We watched a movie and my husband really tried to get me
2:27
to stay up a little bit later. And I was like, no, man, I'm I'm
2:29
going to bed. Got my book out.
2:31
And it was the best way to spend New Year's Eve, in my opinion,
2:35
Ever so. Well, dose of good sleep.
2:39
Maybe you're only ones for the year.
2:41
Exactly. Hey I do not mess around with
2:44
sleep in this household 8 or 9 hours every night.
2:48
My husband and I are start so we were very active.
2:51
We work out already but we've been working out independently
2:54
for the past few months and before that we used to work out
2:57
together and it was really fun. And I told him I was like we
3:00
should start working out together again because I'm
3:02
training for my half marathon and I need to do 2 days of
3:04
strength training a week. And he was like OK awesome.
3:08
So when I get home from work in the evenings, I really have no
3:11
energy left to go work out, so I really need to do it before I
3:14
leave for work. And he leaves for work at 6:00
3:17
AM in the morning. So we are going to the gym at
3:22
4:30, at the gym by 5, working out until 6, which is awesome
3:27
twice a week. But Emma, when I say I don't
3:29
mess around with my 8 hours of sleep, I am in bed by 7 on those
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nights, which is insane behavior.
3:37
I don't know how that's going to be very sustainable in the
3:39
summer months. But right now it's dark, so I'm
3:44
in bed at 7:00 PM. We'll have to.
3:46
We'll have to do some check insurance around like May, June,
3:50
July be like, OK, what is the status of the Lauren at 4:00 AM
3:55
working out progress report, progress report, that's what it
3:58
is. The progress report, yes, yes,
4:02
absolutely. So yeah, we'll, we'll follow
4:05
back up in May and we can we can check on how that is going It's
4:09
great now until about 2:00 PM comes around and then I'm like,
4:12
actually the other day it was about 10:00 AM, which worked out
4:15
great for me because Alani came out with a new energy drink
4:18
flavor. And so I ran over to the local
4:19
gas station and went and got myself a little energy drink and
4:22
I was like, it's my reward for being up at 4:00 in the morning
4:25
because darn it, it is 1030 and I have been up for six hours
4:28
already, so it. Feels wrong that you have those
4:32
these options and I'm in a town much, much larger than your.
4:35
I wouldn't say much much, but I mean like something good, good
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handful and a half bigger and I don't have those anyway.
4:41
Maybe that will be my little Easter egg hunt I'll do today or
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sometime this week. I want to try that because it
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looks. There you go.
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It was really good. It was really good.
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It's my little reward for my 4:00 AM wake up.
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So I get to have a Aulani on those days.
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I feel like it's very validated. So.
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Oh, I love it. Well, enough of us yapping.
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Let's talk heifers. Emma, would you like to
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introduce our topic for today? We're talking about heifers.
5:06
Yeah. Tell me about heifers.
5:07
We're talking about great things of the market is still going
5:11
strong despite some newer updates of the screwworm being
5:15
again closer. I think that's going to be a
5:18
when, not an if type of situation.
5:20
But we'll cross that bridge when we get there.
5:21
Despite a recent positive announcement out of Texas this
5:26
week about a positive case of anthrax, despite really a lot of
5:31
political changes, the beef market is still strong.
5:35
Calf prices have her prices, cow prices, bulls, steers, feeders,
5:40
they're all still really high. But when we're talking about
5:43
rebuilding our herd, which we've been getting a lot of pressure,
5:47
right? We've talked about on this
5:48
podcast before, you hear it on almost every podcast.
5:51
Facebook Pose reeled with been a big top of conversation because
5:55
we can't be sustainable off of the number ahead that we have.
6:01
Producers are getting paid handsomely for it, as they
6:04
should. It's a great product compared to
6:06
other countries. So go you go us, go USA.
6:10
But if you are wanting to rebuild your herd, say that you
6:14
got some of the great summer rains that happened in 2025.
6:18
You want to start growing and expanding your operation.
6:21
Maybe you have some new opportunities coming down that
6:23
you want to add some numbers. We got to look at the finances
6:27
and it's so easy to let some cents drop through the cracks
6:33
here and there until those cents become dollars.
6:35
And when those dollars start adding up, like really what is
6:38
your true break even right from a we bought heifers or maybe
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they're home grown. Like what does that home grown
6:46
calf cost you to keep? What does a bred heifer cost
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you? What if it's registered
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commercial? Maybe you're doing some embryo
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programs, even the purchase of semen for AI.
6:58
All of this has a price tag on it, and I think that we see
7:02
really commonly in the AG space, it's difficult to track that
7:06
dollar because there's so many different moving pieces in
7:09
agriculture. This is not just a expense
7:11
report that you submit your receipts to your accountant with
7:15
your company at the end of every month and then your expense
7:18
report gets kicked back because you didn't categorize it
7:20
correctly. You got to do it all over again.
7:22
There's so many different levels and areas of where finances can
7:26
be funneled into that trying to figure out what is strategically
7:30
and financially the best option for you, for you and your
7:33
operation. It has to pencil out on the end
7:36
for it to be a sustainable company, a meaning your cattle
7:40
operation, but it also needs to follow with your goals.
7:44
If you are just turning burning, then yeah, buying that heavy
7:48
bread cow at the auction, bring her home, letting your calve
7:51
out, getting up to weaning and then shipping off the cow and
7:55
keeping that calf in until it gets to a feeder age and then
7:57
selling it out as a group like a load.
8:01
That might be your business model.
8:02
If your business model is that, that's fine.
8:04
But maybe you're looking at maybe expanding into from a
8:09
registered herd into maybe doing some also partial commercial
8:12
because prices are so high right now.
8:14
So we're talking about finances. We really got to be careful on
8:19
what we're choosing to keep or introduce to our herd and also
8:23
the genetic threshold if that is part of your operations.
8:26
Goals. Oh, absolutely.
8:28
You laid it out perfectly, Emma. It is one of those things that
8:31
you really have to step back and you have to make this strategic
8:34
decision that is best for you. And your operation of if you are
8:38
running 100 Mama cows and you're like, well, I've got this really
8:43
great heifer crop, I'm going to keep, I'm going to retain like
8:46
15, right? And you make that decision,
8:49
you're like, you're, I really want my genetics, all of these
8:52
things. That's great.
8:53
But there is a price tag that comes along with that.
8:55
Retaining that heifer means that she's not going to be in
8:58
production for a while and you are going to have to eat that
9:00
cost of raising her until production age.
9:03
Or are you going to make the strategic decision to sell her
9:06
because the market is good and then purchase red heifers.
9:11
What does that look like for you and your operation?
9:13
And every single operation is different.
9:15
What works for one will not work for the other.
9:17
What works for your neighbor is not going to work for you.
9:19
But it is extremely, extremely important that you step back and
9:23
you look at the financials of it, that you actually make the
9:26
strategic decision, not the emotional decision, because we
9:29
are in a very unique cattle market and this is going to
9:33
prove to be a very unique year. A lot of people have started
9:36
talking about just predictions for the year and kind of where
9:39
we're going and what we're seeing.
9:40
And based off of our market reactions from last year, what
9:43
does that mean for 2026 and all of these things?
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And so it is more vital well than ever that we make strategic
9:50
business decisions as we go forward so that we can be a
9:53
sustainable cattle industry and continue on the growth pattern
9:56
that we're in and hopefully rebuilding our US cattle numbers
9:59
again. Yeah, absolutely.
10:01
And you think about like competitive spaces, right?
10:04
So the leases that we've been seeing, we're consistently
10:08
experiencing a dwindling amount of resources when it comes to
10:11
land, whether it's for purchase or for lease.
10:14
And we're also seeing a consistent increase in the cost
10:17
of operations. And so that feed is not going to
10:21
come down. You know, I the, the years of
10:25
maybe $200 corn, she ain't coming back.
10:30
You know, so and, and even we're talking about complete feeds
10:33
too. So if you do and I used to be a
10:35
nutrition. So we're even with the products
10:38
that I used to sell with the company that I was with, they're
10:41
pushing five, $600 a ton now granted it's, it's, it was that
10:45
particular products a liquid, but it used to be 325 then it
10:50
got up to four people started going on and you had to justify
10:55
the means for you to introduce that product into your operation
10:58
and making sure that it financially pencils out.
11:00
Right now it does pencil out. Like I said, the cattle market
11:03
is fantastic if you're selling. But when we are talking about
11:07
whether you are a new producer coming in and you're looking at
11:10
different options and who do you buy, what do you buy, you really
11:14
got to figure out what your business goals are and those can
11:17
change. Those can definitely change.
11:19
Just because you have an idea or a set of goals doesn't mean
11:24
that's in stone. You can change it.
11:25
Maybe something drastically happens in your family or maybe
11:28
a new opportunity comes up. Maybe it's a relocation and you
11:31
need to change something. That's fine because this is not
11:34
like a written law. I'm obviously with whoever
11:36
lending company that you're with, you need to make sure that
11:40
that passes with them. We're talking about retaining
11:45
ownership. Like you said, it can be kind of
11:47
an emotional process, especially if you have a smaller number,
11:50
number of cattle. And if that's your hobby and
11:52
that's like your side gig, again, you don't have to listen
11:57
to what I'm saying or what everybody else is saying.
11:59
If that's your side gig and you want that or that's your
12:02
grandpa's genetics and you just can't bear the thought to part
12:06
with that, that's fine. But there's a difference between
12:09
that being a hobby side gig and a full time operation.
12:13
If you are doing this for a business that you want this to
12:16
be your livelihood, you want something to pass down to your
12:18
children as a full time operation, you have to be
12:22
financially strategic. And that's not just in a tax
12:26
sense and it's not in just a oh, how do we file our business
12:30
taxes or what's a write off and what's not sense.
12:32
This is a hey, if those cows do not conceive, she needs to go.
12:39
If those heifers do not breed within the that first cycle, you
12:44
need to make a decision if you're going to keep her or not
12:47
because we're looking at anywhere between 150 to $200
12:50
advantage just by getting in that first breeding window.
12:55
And when you're looking at cat or heifers that are anywhere
12:58
between the low, low to, I don't know, like was it yesterday's
13:03
numbers was what, 417 to 4:45 that's in.
13:07
That's a lot of money to leave on the table just because you,
13:10
your wife thinks that that calf is really cute because she has a
13:12
heart-shaped little birthmark right above her left eyeball.
13:15
So you just need to sit down, really kind of think about what
13:19
your operational capacity is. Also, don't just bring in cattle
13:22
because you can make sure that your, your forage can take it,
13:26
your stocking capacity can take it.
13:28
And it's a lot easier to or it's a lot better to under stock than
13:32
to overstock because once you over graze and you take away
13:35
those quote, UN quote solar panels of the forge on the
13:38
ground, it's very difficult to get that back.
13:40
You can always bring in more and then turn around, maybe
13:45
diversify your, your portfolio in terms of livestock, But not
13:49
that anybody's really, to my knowledge, just buying chunks of
13:52
cattle because cattle are real bargain right now.
13:54
But if you're looking at what you're going to keep in this
13:58
next year and breeding cycle, I, you know, I think digging even a
14:04
genomic test is worth it. Seeing what is under the hood,
14:08
seeing what the capacity is and. If the good call.
14:12
Out that lower third or lower 10%, even 5% continuously trying
14:19
to improve. And then, you know, like I said,
14:22
there's a lot of other things that go into paddled and just
14:26
being alive and selling. Is she feed efficient?
14:29
Is she continuously having to get doctored?
14:32
Is she just does she not throw good calves out and they just
14:35
kind of seem to lag behind everybody else.
14:38
Right now is a really good time to do a deep clean and get
14:40
financially paid out for it because you're not going to.
14:44
We've been saying we don't know how long this market's going to
14:46
last and we really don't. So it right now strike while the
14:49
iron's hot. Yeah, absolutely.
14:52
I think that you made a really good point as far as really
14:55
looking at the numbers of your cattle and the genomics and the
14:59
like. Feed efficiency and everything
15:01
like that goes is extremely important as we continue to grow
15:04
our cattle herd because we are extremely efficient as US
15:07
producers and we make a really wonderful product.
15:11
The only way for us to continue to do that is to continue to
15:13
push the normal and continue to maintain that high end stock on
15:19
our operations and pulling that bottom 10%.
15:22
Like Emma said, we've got a market right now that thankfully
15:25
is on the side of people that are selling.
15:28
So if you were in a position to be able to sell and you have
15:31
some coal cows that are ready to go to town, now is the time to
15:35
start looking at that. Whether it be coal cows or just
15:37
that bottom 10% that you're like their genomics and genetics just
15:41
are not performing and the way that they need to on my
15:45
operation anymore. And I pray that everyone looks
15:48
at their operation that way of saying how can I continuously
15:51
improve my genetics every single year to grow and evolve and
15:56
build and diversify and really bring in the best possible
16:00
product that I can continue to produce for the US cattle
16:04
industry. Yeah, and that's exactly what
16:07
you're talking about for your coal cows too, I think.
16:10
Bubba Rutherford, if y'all don't follow him, he's he's he.
16:14
He's got a lot of great content out there, but one of the most
16:16
recent posts he made was talking about, hey, just because she's a
16:19
smooth mouth cow doesn't and she's popping up calves, she is
16:23
more beneficial to your operation than the three-year
16:27
old who didn't, didn't put out a calf this year.
16:30
Just because she's young doesn't mean she's financially
16:33
contributing to your operation. So obviously I think that can be
16:38
kind of a stretch, right? Because older cows usually
16:41
higher maintenance, these are less, less feet efficient,
16:43
usually harder to keep body condition score, which we've
16:45
talked about before on this podcast, how important it is to
16:48
be calving out at, at that 6 body score frame.
16:53
Really don't want her below A5 like at all.
16:55
If we can help it. When you get older, obviously
16:57
it's a little harder to take maintain that body condition.
17:00
But really, I mean, that's where data and record keeping is
17:04
critically important. If the best time to have taken
17:09
records was yesterday, If it's not, do it today.
17:11
The next best is the day. Start writing things down.
17:15
Monitor these these numbers because you have no idea that
17:20
your house is on fire until you turn around and there it is all
17:23
in ash and smoke. And you wonder, well, I, I
17:25
didn't know how to get, how did we get here?
17:28
Well, you got there because you weren't keeping track of
17:30
anything. Same thing with finances.
17:32
You know, that hay cost something.
17:33
Whether you're feeding your own hay or not, it still cost you
17:36
something that lease, it cost you something.
17:39
Every pound of weight gained, every pound of weight lost,
17:42
every calf that hits the ground, every calf that is lost, that
17:46
cost you something. And I know it's easier said than
17:49
done. I know some listeners might say,
17:51
well, it's really easy for you to say that as y'all are yapping
17:53
on a on a podcast. But I cannot tell you how
17:56
critically important it is to start recording that data and to
18:00
really keep track of which girls are adding to your operations
18:04
and who's stealing from it, really.
18:07
Absolutely. I think we can all look back on
18:09
the previous calving season and remember which Mama cows were
18:12
the absolute wrenches and our operation that she would not let
18:17
that baby latch. And like all of these things,
18:20
she was the worst half forever. Like she about ran me halfway to
18:24
Timbuktu and all these things. Like we all remember that, but
18:27
do we actually remember every single calf we had to pull?
18:31
Do we have records of, of every single animal and how they
18:36
performed what their if you are on a registered operation, you
18:39
have those calving weights, you have those weaning weights and
18:42
all of those things because you have to have them for your
18:44
registration paperwork. But even if you're not, are you
18:47
logging what you can, where you can to get that data?
18:52
And data is everything from observant data of that cow was a
18:56
wrench and she ran me off to $10 too.
18:59
And she was terrible to her calf and all of these things to the
19:03
actual data-driven ones like birth weight, like different
19:07
just like body condition scores or things like that, that you
19:10
can actually put a number to. I made a really, you just made a
19:13
really good point about what is that data and making those data
19:17
backs decisions to help you continue to move that operation
19:22
forward as you go into that decision making time.
19:25
Because sometimes it's really hard to look at your operation
19:28
and figure out what that bottom 10% is and what you need to do
19:32
to either call that bottom 10% or improve that bottom 10%.
19:36
Because not everything that's in the bottom 10% needs to be cold.
19:39
Like you could have a smooth mouth cow that she is still
19:42
spitting out babies and they are the same size as her by the time
19:46
they get to weaning. And she's still a really great
19:49
cow in that aspect. Then she technically could be
19:52
considered part of part of your bottom 10% as a standalone cow,
19:56
but is she actually producing the bottom 10%?
19:59
It's all of those different questions that you need to ask
20:02
yourself that the more data you have, the more record keeping
20:06
you have on how calving season went, how weaning went.
20:09
All of those different things makes you able to come to the
20:12
table when those decisions need to be made and actually come
20:16
confidently, rather than kind of skating by by the seat of your
20:19
pants. Yeah, and you made a really,
20:22
really good point that I want to touch on is talking about just
20:25
the labor. You know, you talked about
20:26
pulling, you talked about, well, a female running you off and you
20:31
got to look at that as money to your day hands.
20:34
They cost money. Say that rogue cow, she breaks
20:38
an arm of one of your employees. Well, that's not only time lost,
20:41
but now you have to pay for that person's arm, especially if
20:45
they're on payroll or depending on how your financial structure
20:48
is set up for compensation. Sorry, day workers may not get
20:51
that same kind of luck, but it still costs you something.
20:54
And I am may say something a little controversial here, but
20:58
if a female is trying to run me over, I don't want her.
21:03
She is not worth. I don't care how great of a calf
21:06
she throws. If I have continuously worry
21:08
about her breaking equipment, jumping over shoots, trying to
21:12
just tag everybody around her. I don't want her that that plays
21:18
because her calves and be raised the exact same way.
21:21
Same thing with if you have to consist continuously have to
21:25
pull calves. Look, if you're a stock show guy
21:27
and like that's your thing and that is your like prize deal and
21:30
you're not worried about labor. OK, cool, but you're selling
21:33
your calves for a lot different type of market than your
21:35
commercial producers or beef product pushing producers.
21:41
And so if you have to pull a calf, what if you can't get out
21:45
there? What if you get stuck in the
21:46
mud? What if you get stuck in the
21:48
snow? What if you get there too late?
21:50
What if talking about the whole like wolf issue that certain
21:54
states are having to deal with? What if natural predators get to
21:57
her first? Now you've lost a cow and a calf
21:59
when you could have sold her and made some money.
22:02
And now you're in the may not be in the hole, but now you're down
22:05
a cow and a calf. So yes, you really actually did
22:08
lose money that year. So I think you have to look at
22:13
all sides of what is quote UN quote costing you or adding to
22:16
your production. I cannot make that judgement for
22:19
you. Me or Lauren cannot sit there
22:21
and tell you what to do based off of this podcast because your
22:24
goals are going to be different. Every single person is going to
22:27
have a different set of goals and what is important to you.
22:30
If again, a cow calf guy is going to look at production a
22:33
lot differently or commercial cow calf guy is going to look
22:36
something differently than a registered registered a producer
22:40
just to look differently than a stock show producer.
22:43
So we all have different in the guys up in Montana, vastly
22:48
different than the types of breeds we're dealing down in
22:50
South Florida. So everyone's a little
22:52
different. I think it's just you need to be
22:54
very analytical as things are costing more money right now.
22:58
You have a great, great, great advantage of making a good
23:02
amount of money off of maybe your lower ends that you need to
23:06
go ahead and get rid of because they are taking away from your
23:09
operation then versus adding to it.
23:11
So I, I just wanted to hit and re emphasize what you said
23:14
there, Lauren, because that's, I mean, again, labor's cost,
23:18
vehicle repairs cost and then of course injury and Lord forbid if
23:22
you, you know, pull calves and the natural predator gets to it
23:27
first. I mean, what we even have
23:29
Mexican eagles down here in Texas and those things are
23:32
aggressive and those things you can't exactly put all, even with
23:35
all the barbed wire fencing in the world is not going to
23:38
prevent a bird from flying down and get in your calves.
23:41
So it's, it's a crazy world we live in, but you got to manage
23:46
the chaos. And the best way to do that is
23:49
with maybe not pencil and paper records, but to at least start
23:53
recording that data down. There's a lot of different
23:55
programs, a lot of different algorithms out there that can
23:57
help you figure that out. Absolutely.
23:59
I could not have said it better, Emma.
24:02
There is a lot of different opportunities out there, whether
24:05
it is a platform or whether it's really well put together excel
24:10
sheet. Like I do not care how you do
24:12
it, just start doing it. And there is, like you said
24:15
earlier in the podcast, Emma, there is no better time to start
24:17
getting your records straight than today and to start getting
24:20
more detailed records. So when those decision times do
24:23
inevitably come, you have that data to be able to say, hey,
24:26
this is my bottom 10% do I need to be making as we're in regards
24:31
to all of that, Emma, as always, thank you for your time, your
24:35
insight, your thoughts, your opinions, all of the things on
24:37
the podcast today. To all of our listeners, thanks
24:39
for tuning into another episode of the Cattle USA Daily Podcast.
24:43
We will see you all next time. Have a good one y'all.