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DDH - The First American Civil War · Plausibly Live - The Dave Bowman Show Podcast

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I gave way to your own past if you wish I'd Austin's trouble
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soon being and peoples natural rights as Englishmen and fully
0:16
restore. Sorry, the parents never taste a
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good luck. And it won't give us what we
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would like to. It's our three of a Tuesday
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Morning, the seventh day of February 20 23, glad you're
0:40
along for this final hour Bill Nick live Dave Bowman with us
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with Dave does history, he's from Silverdale Washington and
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gets up bright and early to take us on a trek through history
0:50
that hopefully won't be F van. Leyden least, I don't expect so
0:55
Dave, good morning, how are you buddy?
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You do know that I'm a sailor, right?
1:00
Yeah, that's true. I'd forgotten about that.
1:01
Yeah, it was so it. Anything is possible.
1:04
We'll just leave it with that. By the way, was listening to
1:06
your podcast that I didn't get a catch up with over the weekend.
1:09
And and I heard you in Rod talking about Flag Football Pro
1:14
Bowl, right? I didn't get a watch it because
1:17
I was traveling. We were flying back, but I would
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have for the first time in the last 20 years because the Pro
1:24
Bowl is always sucked it when they moved it out of Hawaii.
1:28
There was no reason to watch the Pro Bowl.
1:29
And I would think the flag football would show more skills,
1:34
more passing more more good stuff than the foe football game
1:39
that they played for the previous couple of decades.
1:42
Anyway, I too did not get to watch it, but that was by choice
1:47
because I thought it was stupid and I just chose not to well
1:52
disagree a little bit. I would like to see what the
1:54
flag football would have done. I wonder did they put on the the
1:58
balloon like helmets that the kids we're playing out like big
2:01
titties but I did watch the highlights in it, ended
2:03
controversially and apparently Peyton Manning is seriously
2:07
ticked off really Little brother Eli beat him.
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You did. Oh well, that would be y then I
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would suppose. All right, Dave, I'm distracted
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you enough from the business at hand today.
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You always take us to an interesting point in history and
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make some comparisons. We can learn about what do you
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got for us today? As we all know Civil Wars can be
2:28
very destructive, very very deadly and the Fallout from a
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civil war goes on for Generations.
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I mean, we still have people to Today, who will prattle on if
2:42
you allow them to about how the south is gonna rise again?
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But I'll be making fun of my hillbilly accent.
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Come on, the bottom line is there have been two civil wars
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in American history. This the one we're all familiar
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with 1861 to 1865 but really the American Revolutionary War was
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as many people refer to it. The first American Civil War, We
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say this because the nation was totally divided into 3 Parts,
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basically. Most historians will tell you
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that a third of the country was Patriot, a third of the country
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was Tory or loyal to the British Loyalists and a third of the
3:26
country just didn't either care or didn't want to get involved.
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They might have cared but they just didn't want to.
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They didn't want to take those risks.
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And these three groups, the two groups in particular, the
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Patriots and the Loyalists hated each other.
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And when I say hated bill, Take all the American Civil War from
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1861, to 65 hatred that you've heard ever heard about. and,
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Probably triple that. These two groups absolutely
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hated each other. Now there was an issue with it
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though. That is unusual in the northern
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states, the Loyalists tended to move, when the war started to
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the big cities, Boston, New York, whatever, where they could
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be protected by the British. But in the South there was
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really no place to go and so they just stayed where they
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were. And it eventually ended up
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shooting each other quite regularly in a quite violent
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manner. The hatreds were huge, they were
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big and they were long lasting, and they would reach well, into
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the next Century before things. Finally started to calm down
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just a little bit. And we'll be back in 60 seconds
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with more to. That story might have been
4:56
better if the pajama G commercial would have aired
4:59
before. I had the invitation to sex in
5:01
the last hour, but that's just a different story.
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Dave Bowman with us with Dave does history, the first American
5:07
Civil War Dave, So, let's go back to during the war state of
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Georgia. Is, you know, one of the
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thirteen colonies that's rebelling and they need supplies
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to fight the British, the Loyalists more than the British.
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Because there aren't a lot of British troops down south but
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they need to equip their militia.
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Well, how do you do that? The state sends out
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Commissioners, who are authorized to spend the state's
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money, To buy military supplies to provide the troops from
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Georgia with their supplies make sense.
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But keep in mind that all 13 colonies were basically doing
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this right now. So it's hard to find stuff.
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It's hard to get stuff. It's hard to make these deals.
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But the Georgia Commissioners crossed the state line into
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South Carolina. And they find a man there by the
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name of Robert Farquhar who just happens to have the supplies
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that they need, they Fork over. Now this is you know Seventeen
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seventy six dollars a hundred and sixty nine thousand dollars
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of Georgia's. Muddy to get these supplies
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except that they don't pay him they say okay we We will pay you
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a hundred sixty nine thousand dollars upon delivery because
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supplies are in short supply. What happens if he takes the
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money and run while we can't do that?
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So you deliver the stuff will give you the money, right?
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Make sense like a drug deal, I guess.
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Yeah, mr. Farquhar agrees to this because
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he figures you know this is a hundred sixty nine thousand
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dollars in 1776 money. This is going to be worth
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something to me. And so he delivers the supplies
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to the state of Georgia, Georgia, gets their supplies,
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there is absolutely no dispute about this fact, that Georgia
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gets their supplies and then says, hey come, see us on
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Tuesday. Will have your money.
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I'll gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today, right?
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Which, of course, they never do. They just keep pushing them off.
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Pushing them off, pushing them off, and they never actually pay
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him. When the war ended, he Farquhar
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still had not been paid and as All Greek tragedies go well mr.
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Farr choir dies. And never gets paid, but it's
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not really where the story ends because there's there's an
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Executor to his will who decides?
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No, no, no. You don't get to you don't get
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too stiff. My guy and I'm going to continue
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to pursue this and so he does his name is Chase home and he
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continues to Hound Georgia. In the era before, you know,
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bill collectors and that kind of stuff.
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He he says well I'll continue to do this stuff.
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Well it doesn't go well, he's not making any Headway and this
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just goes on and on and on for years.
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Now in the meantime the rest of the country has kind of moved on
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a little bit, right? The war's over, we've got the
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treaty in 1783, we have six years of relative peace, the
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kind of you know the curtain Federation isn't working, let's
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have a constitutional convention.
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Let's let's change our government.
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Let's change the laws of the land as it were And mr.
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Chisolm is sitting down there watching all this going, huh?
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I wonder what they will come up with in this change to the whole
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situation because right now and all the while he's still trying
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to get his money, but it ain't coming.
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It ain't coming. Georgie ain't pandas.
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And the reason they're not paying this, by the way, is it
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mr. Farquhar.
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The get the Dead Guy. It was a British Loyalists and
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so their attitude, unlike the north with a loyalist all left
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that you know in the South they're still there but George
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is attitude is like well we won. Tough bananas.
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Screw you are not paying you because you were a traitor.
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which you know, on the surface of it, you kind of get away with
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but in in the real world is that how things are supposed to work?
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I mean, if your state is stiffing people for the supplies
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that they got, for a war that they won, how does that make you
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look? You know, if they have been
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going to college, it would have been unacceptable practice,
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right, but mr. Chisolm cannot sue.
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The state of Georgia for this because of a situation, a legal
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precedent known as state sovereignty.
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In which a state. Then this comes from English.
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Common law, but the state cannot be sued unless it agrees to be
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sued in the state of Georgia. Courts does not agree to be sued
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in this matter. They look at it as oh, no, no
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no, no. We're not playing your game.
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We got our supplies, we want our war, you lost your representing
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an English, loyalist. So you know what?
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We're not going to. We're not going.
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Gonna do this with you. And at the end of the day, mr.
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Choose home is frustrated by this, but as 1787 rolls into
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1788 1789 and the Constitution gets ratified.
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He is reading the new Constitution and he's going to
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notice something that well other people did notice.
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But they didn't pay as close attention to, as he does maybe
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they didn't have as much on the line.
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Maybe a hundred sixty nine thousand dollars a lot of money.
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Yeah, absolutely. Even even today.
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For most of us. Anyway, I could and with us Dave
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does history will see where this all LED and where its leading
11:16
his after that it is a Tuesday on Bill make live.
11:19
Dave does history every Tuesday with us?
11:22
And the 8:00 hour. Glad you're Along on 92.7.
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FM W MB. We're back in moments.
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Nationwide contest. Good luck enter the keyword at
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wmba m.com. Dave Bowman with us on a Tuesday
12:23
morning with Dave does history and we're talking the first
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American Civil War. It's taken us to a battle
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between a retailer Of military supplies and the state of
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Georgia that's passed on to a successor because the original
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retailer died. And this successor is taking a
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look at the US Constitution. And saying there could be
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something here, that would give me my money from the state of
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Georgia. What is it, Dave?
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So as the Constitution gets ratified and we go through the
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ratification debates, the Anti-Federalists have a lot of
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problems with the proposed Constitution. but one other
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stiffest objections to it, is that the article 3 courts as
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outlined are way way too powerful that they see the
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courts as potentially just destroying The state government
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and more importantly, State sovereignty.
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Now remember State sovereignty, one of the elements of State
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sovereignty is this idea that they can't be sued unless they
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agree to be. And this again, this has been
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since English common law from time immemorial and the
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Anti-Federalists are convinced that this constitution is going
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to destroy State sovereignty. What what's got them convinced
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that well, the plain language of the Constitution article 3
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section. 2 Clause 1 says, the judicial power shall extend to
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all cases in law and Equity. It's what we're talking about
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here, a hundred sixty nine thousand dollars.
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Hmm, arising under this constitution, the laws of the
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United States treaties or which shall be made under their
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Authority, then it says this to controversies between two or
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more states. Make sense between a state.
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State and citizens of another state.
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Wait, what between citizens of different states between
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citizens of the same States, claiming lands under grants of
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different states and between a state and citizens.
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There are other foreign States citizens and subjects to go back
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to this between a state and citizens of another state.
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Well, sovereign immunity says, they can't do that.
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Sovereign immunity says, we can't be sued unless we agreed
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to But as you read that right there on the page, what does it
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say? That under this new
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constitution. They can't.
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And, and this federal court shall have jurisdiction there
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up, Bingo. Now the Anti-Federalists, see
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this as destructive to State sovereignty But Mr. Chiz home
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representing, mr. Farquhar sees the rezzie's.
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The ratification of the Constitution says, you know,
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what I should do now? Because it says citizens between
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citizens of different states and state, the state and citizens of
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another state. I'll just seu Jorge.
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And now in federal court, and he runs to Philadelphia
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Pennsylvania. The court of original
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jurisdiction and files his lawsuit, she was home versus the
15:37
state of Georgia. They owe us a hundred, sixty
15:39
nine thousand dollars and we want that money.
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We'll see what happens in 30 seconds on Bill Mick live.
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So mr. Chisholm in pursuit of this debt
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that's owed by the state of Georgia and it like you said,
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there's no debate. They said we're going to pay you
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for these, give us the items and then we'll pay you.
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They never paid. He's assumed the death that mr.
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Farquhar had said. Okay, we'll do it that way.
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And now he goes to Philadelphia and files a lawsuit.
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Dave, he files a lawsuit and the state of Georgia laughs.
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They like, no, because They still believed State sovereignty
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means a state, can't be sued unless it agrees to be sued.
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Again, this comes from English, common law but under English
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common law, you couldn't sue the government.
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But there were legal procedures for redress that were already in
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place. Now, for just an aside here,
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Where is redress of grievances found in our constitution, in
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the first amendment? Has that been passed yet?
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Nope. So there is no procedure for
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redress here and go. So he files his suit.
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Well, both Hamilton and Madison make it clear in The Federalist
16:58
Papers responding to the Anti-Federalists that this this
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idea that state sovereignty is going to be eliminated is
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completely false. In fact, T'.
17:06
They are they are so convinced that it's false that they don't
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even have, they don't even understand where this is coming
17:11
from. Do they have an argument that
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they base this on? They have a foundation for their
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rebuttal, that it's not true But it's one that it's not true
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because because State sovereignty is always been a
17:26
thing and and the the Anti-Federalists keep coming
17:29
back to it if it's not true. Then why did you write between a
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state and citizens of another state?
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Why why did you write, why does the plain language of the
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Constitution say that you can Ratification proceeds as I said
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it's ratified chisolm files his suit Georgia doesn't even show
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up. They refused to even participate
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in this. They are saying we're going to
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enforce the state sovereignty, whether the Constitution will or
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not, we're not playing in your silly little game.
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Exactly the Supreme Court which at this point has five people
18:06
agrees to hear the case because There's that plain language.
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You know, what do we do here? And so, they sit down and they
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hear the case. And they come to a decision that
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will stun, the nation pretty quickly.
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Mmm. Now, when you go to a Supreme
18:29
Court decision, today you sit in the gallery today, the person,
18:35
the, the justice that wrote the decision.
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The majority decision reads the Decision from the bench, usually
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that's what normally happens. And then if there's a dissenter
18:45
who wants to read theirs, they can but you get the ruling first
18:51
that was not always the case. And in fact, when the Supreme
18:54
Court issues this case, when they issue their decision inches
18:58
home versus Georgia, only one Justice even bothers to show up
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the day that it's red. His Name is Earl Dale and he
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Descends from the, from the, from the majority and he's the
19:12
only one that reads his case. So if you just happen to be
19:15
sitting there, And you didn't read the majority ruling.
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You would think, oh, the court found one way.
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But in fact, the court found another way and what they end
19:27
up, either Supremes didn't think it was important enough to even
19:30
be there, they really didn't, they?
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It's hard to explain to people, you know, was a different world.
19:36
Travel was much different, it's very possible that, you know,
19:40
they made the decision and then left town, which of course, is a
19:43
different world from today. I mean, you leave town for a day
19:45
here. It's no big deal, but Well,
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those justices traveled some to, didn't they did they rode
19:50
circuit so it's very possible that they were out of town
19:53
riding circuit. Whatever they whatever they want
19:55
to do, they wrote their they wrote the ruling John Jay.
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The Chief Justice will write the ruling but they will stun
20:03
everybody with this ruling in a four-to-one ruling.
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And again, the only one that got red was the was The Descent
20:09
saying, no, the state sovereignty is a thing.
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The other four justices said, nope.
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Plain language of the Constitution, guess what?
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As John Jay will argue the citizens.
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Not the state governments are sovereign under the US
20:26
Constitution. Now again, this is 1793
20:30
different language and that since a state could sue an
20:33
individual or another state it follows then logically.
20:37
That individuals can also Sue States under article 3 section 2
20:43
of The Constitution, And this boy, does this make people how
20:48
he also goes on to say that? Hey, you ratified this, you can
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read the plain language right there.
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So, when you ratified this, you literally kissed, State
20:58
sovereignty, adios goodbye, cure out of here.
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You agreed to this, and we'll be back with more with Dave Bowman.
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Dave, does history of Bill make live?
21:07
We let you in at three, two, one, seven, six, eight twelve
21:10
forty, we continue on wmm, be Our McNugget is a one minute
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Make sure you catch a bear, or you can pick it up like all
22:01
three hours of the show and our call of the day in the bill make
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live, I heart radio channel or the podcast section at Bill
22:08
mc.com. Ramping up our Tuesday with Dave
22:11
Bowman and Dave does history So this thing, Dave has gone all
22:15
the way to the Supreme Court and the decision.
22:18
If you were there for the reading of it, you would think
22:21
well, the state's Oneness and are no, the state's lost this.
22:23
And what are you going to think? You would think that the state's
22:27
want it because ER, they all agreed State sovereignty is a
22:30
thing. But the other four justices
22:31
said, no. The plain language of the
22:32
Constitution is that States can be sued by citizens because
22:36
citizens are sovereign QED. Georgia you need to pay up.
22:42
Well, George is respond to. That is oh heck no only, they
22:46
didn't say. Heck, you know.
22:47
Yeah. Like you know absolutely not
22:50
we're not paying this traitor. Because the money that we admit
22:54
that we owe him. The states realize that this is
22:59
a huge problem but they to start reading the new Constitution and
23:03
they come across this thing. It says, hey wait, we can amend
23:07
the Constitution. and so a year later, they proposed an
23:13
amendment to the Constitution United States which Is ratified
23:18
in less than a year on February 7th today. 1795 they ratify the
23:22
eleventh amendment which basically says The judicial
23:26
authority of the United States shall not be construed.
23:31
As to, you know, destroying State sovereignty.
23:35
I'm paraphrasing there. But that's what it says, no
23:38
Supreme Court, you got it wrong. Will change the Constitution
23:44
Madison and Hamilton notwithstanding and we'll tell
23:46
you exactly what it means and overturn your court decision and
23:53
make it so that no. Mr. Mr. Chisolm is wrong, which
23:58
of course, is ratified very quickly by the states, like I
24:01
said, it took less than a year to ratify it.
24:04
And at that point, guess what Georgia does.
24:08
No clue. They stand up.
24:10
They List. Look at mr.
24:11
Chisolm, and they say, see we told you, we were right.
24:16
State sovereignty is a thing, you cannot sue us, but by the
24:19
way, since we've won twice now, here's your money and they pay
24:24
mr. Chisolm his hundred sixty-nine
24:26
thousand dollar toy, eventually they get the money.
24:28
He eventually does get the money and the court gets overturned.
24:34
And the process is shown to actually work look, this is the
24:38
lesson here is, this is how it's supposed to work.
24:40
This happened today, you'd get an executive order.
24:43
You'd get a law from Congress. Nobody would say to themselves.
24:47
Hey we just need to amend the Constitution to change how it
24:49
works which is the way it's supposed to work.
24:52
Let's do this and that's what they did and they did it right
24:56
now. All that said today, Can a
25:01
person, sue a state without the state's permission?
25:08
I would say yeah, no wait a minute.
25:09
Go back and listen to all your news stories.
25:11
This morning you had at least 4 news stories today about people
25:15
suing various States. None of which mentioned the
25:19
state said, hey, we agree to be sued.
25:22
We're giving you permission. Yeah.
25:24
So how does that happen? And we have it happened.
25:27
It seems like with every law that is controversial.
25:30
We're seeing lawsuits in some special interest group.
25:34
This is wrong, this is wrong. This is wrong, which is really
25:37
the whole purpose of State sovereignty.
25:38
Bill because if you can, if you can do that, if you can just
25:41
Sue, has a government, any government at any level
25:45
willy-nilly for anything you would literally Early just tie
25:48
that government up in knots and you can stop anything just by
25:52
filing lawsuits. So it's counterproductive State
25:56
sovereignty, kind of, you know, stops that from happening and
26:00
the eleventh amendment says, you can't, you can't do that.
26:04
But like I said today, you had at least four new stories that I
26:07
counted. We're, that's exactly what
26:09
happened. How did that happen?
26:13
And we're back to find out in just 60 seconds on Bill.
26:16
Make lat State sovereignty and front of us.
26:19
Dave does history on Bill make live Dave Bowman with us.
26:22
Three, two, one, seven, six, eight, twelve forty.
26:26
So what are we thinking, Dave? It's almost more Constitution
26:29
Thursday than Dave does history. Yeah, a little bit.
26:32
Kind of the way it works. It just happens to be February
26:34
7th and fascinated by the stuff. We could have gone Bill.
26:37
We could have gone to the 13th Amendment today because this was
26:41
the day in the 2,000 think it was 2013.
26:45
It might be a little bit later than that that the state of
26:48
Mississippi. Finally, ratified the 13th
26:52
Amendment. Just think about that for a
26:55
minute. I mean, it's like, well, nice of
26:57
them to come to the party. Even if they were late, well,
26:59
they actually did it in 1995, which is still kind of, you
27:03
know, hinky, but they didn't file the paperwork.
27:07
So I took him another tell year. It's we got to do that somebody
27:10
send this to DC, which is necessarily but that's another
27:14
story altogether. These stories of our history and
27:17
how it affected, our Constitution are amazing.
27:20
The the second American Civil War Ended with the
27:24
Reconstruction amendments. The 13th Amendment which banned
27:26
slavery and particularly the 14th Amendment which at the time
27:31
it was proposed and passed was very controversial.
27:36
I mean the state of California refused to ratify the 14th
27:42
Amendment until 1950. Most of the state's looked at
27:47
this and went. This is messed up, dude.
27:49
You're taking away our state sovereignty.
27:52
You're just Another way and really the only reason that the
27:56
14th Amendment gets ratified is because congress makes it a
28:00
requirement for states to beat for confederate states, to be
28:03
readmitted to the union. You have to, you have to ratify
28:06
the 14th Amendment, the Union States, they don't like this at
28:10
all, the 14th Amendment contains something called remedial powers
28:15
and it's those remedial powers that Congress can use to pass
28:20
laws to abrogate. Gate, State's immunity from
28:24
lawsuits. So in the same vein, they do it
28:27
to the federal government, they set conditions, okay?
28:29
If your lawsuit is about this this this or this, you can go
28:33
ahead and sue us we give you blanket permission to do that in
28:36
advance. And under the fourteenth,
28:39
amendments, incorporation concept.
28:42
They literally do the same thing to the states and that's why you
28:46
pick up the phone, your pick up the newspaper today and you see
28:48
a bunch of States being sued by citizens without their
28:52
permission. The result of the second
28:55
American Civil War. Interesting, let's get to the
28:58
phones, Dave line, one your up on Bill, make live, good
29:01
morning. Good morning Bill.
29:04
Hey go right ahead. This is that in Melbourne, you
29:07
but uh my condolences to you and your family.
29:10
Thank you. I'd like to offer this today
29:15
Bowman. He does a great job doing
29:18
history? Yeah he is probably going to
29:21
write a book. And I'll buy the first to call.
29:27
We will prod, Dave, in that direction, Ed and see what he
29:31
brings out. That I would love to see that
29:33
because Dave is just a wealth of information.
29:37
He does a great job. Hey Ed, thank you, I appreciate
29:40
it. Good to have you along.
29:41
We moved align to your own bill make live.
29:43
Good morning. Hey Phil.
29:44
Good morning morning in most municipalities in this country.
29:50
It's a police officer is in Pursuit and he smashes his car
29:54
into another car and kill somebody.
29:58
It's up to the police department whether they want to, well, let
30:02
people sell them. Did you know that I don't
30:05
believe that's accurate. Maybe it is Dave you have a
30:07
thought on it. It's true.
30:09
We have many times in Baltimore. I know it.
30:11
I know for a fact it may be in Baltimore.
30:14
Dave any thoughts? This is called qualified
30:16
immunity and this is what we're talking about with remedial
30:18
Powers one of the exceptions to remedial powers that Congress
30:22
hasn't passed laws. About is what's known as
30:24
qualified immunity? This is a very controversial
30:27
thing today, because it does as the caller said Shields law
30:33
enforcement agencies, From being held accountable for their
30:35
actions. The general idea is if you hurt
30:39
or kill someone or cause property damage in the
30:42
performance of your duties, you are exempt from being sued, but
30:48
the problem, vigil, ER, is your government at the individually
30:51
and as a government entity agency, never had that in play
30:54
When I was a cop. In West Virginia, we were always
30:56
cautioned exactly the opposite that you are going to lose
30:59
everything you had. It's very possible that West
31:01
Virginia doesn't have this, but I can guarantee a cow Colorado,
31:04
California does and I would bet. I don't know, but I would bet
31:08
Florida does many, many jurisdictions do because again,
31:14
if you, if you have a situation where a police officer does
31:17
something that causes damage and you can sue them without
31:20
permission. Can you imagine what would be
31:23
happening to law enforcement everyday?
31:26
It would be sued every day. There's some argument in favor
31:29
of qualified immunity but the problem is, it probably goes to
31:34
Far because police officers as we know and again, it's the bad
31:38
ones that make the news, some police officers, do things that
31:42
are careless or even Bill intentional that cause damage,
31:47
whatever and they're protected under this qualified immunity
31:49
thing. And if you go to the lower
31:51
courts, particularly the district courts, you will find
31:55
dozens of cases every week that are just qualified immunity
31:59
cases. Does this case qualify as
32:01
qualified immunity or not and the court has to make make that
32:04
decision and you include intentional acts in that.
32:07
Yes, intentional violations of law.
32:09
Well, but how do you prove that bill?
32:10
I mean, how do you prove that someone was intentionally trying
32:13
to do something that caused damage or death or injury?
32:17
You've got to show, you've got to speak to motivation at that
32:19
point unless you have Rodney King.
32:21
I'm not so sure. That's a good example because I
32:24
thought a guy on PCP you cannot cause them harm, you cannot
32:28
cause them pain. Right?
32:30
So, should there have been qualified, immunity or not?
32:33
And that's really the first decision that had to be made
32:36
that on video. Yes, it does.
32:38
And politics is going to enter into that.
32:40
Uh-huh. But yeah, these are these are
32:43
things that come under the fourteenth, amendments remedial
32:45
powers and Congress has decided along the way that qualified
32:48
immunity has to be a thing because otherwise just like
32:51
State sovereignty. People would just be willing to
32:54
lie, suing be long before scored all the time, right?
32:57
And you don't want that. Takes too much time, takes too
33:00
much money and it keeps you from doing what you should be doing.
33:03
Because every time you're tearing a qualified immunity
33:05
suit, you're not hearing a suit at law and equity, which means
33:09
that mr. Farquhar's case might get pushed
33:12
to the bottom of the list behind, you know, nonsensical
33:15
stuff or maybe it is. Sensical, who knows qualified
33:18
immunity is a very controversial subject these days.
33:23
I'm I fall into the camp that it's too powerful.
33:27
It needs to be paired. Back.
33:29
But again, you're into motivations.
33:31
How do you tell somebody's motivation, well and and, and in
33:34
what way would you pair it? Back actual performance of their
33:39
Duty? Idle, people fraction something
33:43
that I think you apply the same. I think you apply the same
33:47
standards as everything else, which is, what would a
33:49
reasonable person can include would a reasonable person
33:52
conclude that Rodney King needed to be beaten like that.
33:59
And then you're into the evidence.
34:00
Well this reason he would this reason you wouldn't and then you
34:04
have to make that decision but right now you don't even have
34:07
that standard right now. You have the standard of very
34:09
simply. Is it qualified immunity or not?
34:12
Was it in the performance of Duty or not?
34:14
So and it causes problems just cause problems in Modesto bills.
34:18
Fresh, don't remember that. Uh-huh.
34:21
And thus lawyers have long and lucrative career.
34:25
Yes they do. And maybe I should have gone to
34:27
law school. Tomorrow, a wide open Wednesday
34:31
on Bill Mick live. Any topic you like, any time you
34:34
call us my intention, a good day for Florida today and some other
34:39
news to dig into and we'll share that with you as we have the
34:42
opportunity, plus anything you bring to the table, Dave, Bowman
34:45
brought us Dave does history for this hour.
34:47
Dave, thank you my friend. I'll see you next Tuesday.
34:50
Looking forward to it.