Latest / Magic Divorce Club Podcast / Ep 4: Healing heartbreak and emotional exhaustion in Divorce

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Ep 4: Healing heartbreak and emotional exhaustion in Divorce · Magic Divorce Club Podcast

0:01
SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Magic Divorce Club podcast.
0:05
This is your space to successfully navigate your divorce with
0:10
confidence and create
0:11
SPEAKER_00: a roadmap to the life of your dreams.
0:15
SPEAKER_00: I'm your host Hannah Harvey.
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I'm the author of How to Divorce Sober and I have helped
0:20
thousands of women to
0:21
SPEAKER_00: process the trauma of divorce and step into an exciting future.
0:27
Please like and subscribe because this really helps my little
0:31
podcast to grow and
0:33
if you would like more from me you can subscribe at
0:36
magicdivorceclub.substack.com
0:40
SPEAKER_00: for a host of other support tools.
0:45
SPEAKER_00: Hello and welcome to the Magic Divorce Club podcast.
0:50
SPEAKER_00: I'm Hannah and today I would like to talk about
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emotional side of divorce so how do we heal from something that
1:02
is so traumatic
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like it is the hardest thing I have ever had to be through to
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go through and
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continues to be you know there are things that come up even now
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where I'm like
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SPEAKER_00: it's a reminder, you know, that was a lot.
1:21
SPEAKER_00: So I've had,
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I've been asking you guys for your questions and thank you so
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much for sending them
1:27
SPEAKER_00: in.
1:27
SPEAKER_00: Uh,
1:28
SPEAKER_00: um,
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kind of one of the main themes that I've really noticed is this
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whole thing around,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
1:39
SPEAKER_00: the heartbreak of it all.
1:41
SPEAKER_00: Uh, because whether you chose to leave or you were left, uh,
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um it's still a really big thing to go through especially when
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you've got kids in
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SPEAKER_00: the mix um like it's just so much change so much uncertainty um
2:05
SPEAKER_00: A lot of,
2:06
SPEAKER_00: like,
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SPEAKER_00: grown-up stuff that,
2:09
SPEAKER_00: you know,
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before we got married maybe weren't something that we ever
2:12
really thought about.
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SPEAKER_00: And now we have to think about it.
2:15
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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SPEAKER_00: Like, it's not fun.
2:18
So one of the questions that you guys have asked is...
2:21
I mean,
2:23
this is sad.
2:24
But it's,
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like,
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how do you stop your heart from breaking,
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like,
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all over again?
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SPEAKER_00: And I can really connect to this because...
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SPEAKER_00: Like,
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SPEAKER_00: during the first...
2:40
SPEAKER_00: Well,
2:41
SPEAKER_00: quite a few years,
2:41
SPEAKER_00: actually,
2:42
SPEAKER_00: of,
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SPEAKER_00: like,
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SPEAKER_00: the whole divorce process my divorce took about.
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SPEAKER_00: It was getting on for two...
2:49
SPEAKER_00: Three years,
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SPEAKER_00: sorry,
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SPEAKER_00: by the time we finally got all the paperwork through.
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SPEAKER_00: And, um... Yeah, it was, like, a really sad process because I...
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SPEAKER_00: I left because,
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SPEAKER_00: and this is not a secret,
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SPEAKER_00: it's in the book,
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SPEAKER_00: in my book,
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SPEAKER_00: How to Divorce Sober,
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I left because there were issues with drugs and alcohol within
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our relationship and
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SPEAKER_00: I got to the point where I'm like,
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SPEAKER_00: okay,
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we have tried everything like therapy um laying down the law
3:28
leaving and coming
3:29
back like all of these different things and it felt like we
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were in this cycle that
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just we kept doing the loop kept going around the track and I
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had to break the
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SPEAKER_00: cycle and
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SPEAKER_00: And the hope was that by kind of saying,
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SPEAKER_00: no,
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SPEAKER_00: we're done,
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that would be enough for my ex to go away and get sober and
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then come back to me.
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SPEAKER_00: That was the plan when I left.
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SPEAKER_00: And, of course, that didn't work out.
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SPEAKER_00: And, you know, it's the best for both of us.
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SPEAKER_00: And he's moved on.
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SPEAKER_00: He's married now.
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SPEAKER_00: And you can know logically that that is...
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the best thing for everybody but that doesn't mean that your
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body has caught up if
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you know what i mean so sometimes you do have to do things with
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your head because
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your heart is so entangled and enmeshed in um maybe cycles and
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patterns that aren't
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SPEAKER_00: on
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serving you anymore so at some point my head had to step in and
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go no if you're not
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careful this is gonna really not end well for you um so in
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order to kind of well
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SPEAKER_00: this it's twofold so
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To stop my heart from breaking over and over again when he got
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a new partner and
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SPEAKER_00: all that kind of stuff,
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SPEAKER_00: some of it you do have to just,
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SPEAKER_00: it's like the bear hunt thing,
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SPEAKER_00: like you can't go over it,
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SPEAKER_00: you can't go under it,
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SPEAKER_00: we have to go through it.
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So not brushing things under the carpet is very important with
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heartbreak.
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And I did hear something the other day which I really liked
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from Leonie Dawson and
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SPEAKER_00: she said like hearts are a muscle so they don't break,
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SPEAKER_00: they're not a bone,
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SPEAKER_00: they tear and when you tear a muscle it rebuilds stronger.
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SPEAKER_00: So rather than thinking of it like your heart's breaking it,
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SPEAKER_00: think of it as being like,
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SPEAKER_00: okay,
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SPEAKER_00: this is painful.
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SPEAKER_00: We're building this muscle.
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And I'm going to bear witness to that and really honor how I'm
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feeling and not
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SPEAKER_00: shame myself for feeling like shit.
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actually I'm going to hold myself like a little baby chick and
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comfort myself and
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and let myself cry and be sad and maybe write down all the
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things that I'm really
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sad about and and burn them I don't know like I think that is
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one of the things is
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SPEAKER_00: you can't
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SPEAKER_00: I'm not going to try and stop my heart from breaking.
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SPEAKER_00: I'm going to be there and hold it.
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SPEAKER_00: You know,
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SPEAKER_00: the part of me that is able to,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: be the mom and look after people,
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that part of me is going to hold the part of me that is so sad
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and so broken and
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SPEAKER_00: keep reassuring myself.
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So that is part one to the how do I stop my heart breaking all
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over again.
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SPEAKER_00: But part two is you can do protection work.
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So energetically,
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when you have to deal with your ex,
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you can do two things.
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SPEAKER_00: One is you can do a cutting the cord meditation.
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SPEAKER_00: So if you've got a copy of my book,
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SPEAKER_00: there's a bonus that goes with the book,
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SPEAKER_00: which is this meditation.
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SPEAKER_00: So you can, if you buy the book, you then get the meditation for free.
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SPEAKER_00: Like it's all within the bonus section of the book.
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SPEAKER_00: So it's a cutting the cord meditation where you visualize.
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SPEAKER_00: I take you through like really gently through this meditation.
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SPEAKER_00: Call in your support.
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SPEAKER_00: And then you visualize the cord between you and your ex.
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SPEAKER_00: And you can cut it.
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SPEAKER_00: And then you call in all this great energy.
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SPEAKER_00: Help healing you and them.
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SPEAKER_00: But you're no longer energetically tied to each other.
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SPEAKER_00: So you can do that.
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SPEAKER_00: And...
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The thing is,
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because you're constantly dealing with them,
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you may have to do it on repeat.
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SPEAKER_00: So you deal with them,
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SPEAKER_00: you get some of their stuff,
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SPEAKER_00: you may need to do it again,
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SPEAKER_00: like I had to do it just the other week.
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SPEAKER_00: It's an ongoing process,
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SPEAKER_00: but it does allow you to kind of go,
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SPEAKER_00: okay,
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SPEAKER_00: this is my stuff,
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SPEAKER_00: that's their stuff,
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SPEAKER_00: we're not connected,
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SPEAKER_00: I don't have to hold...
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their stuff in my body anymore or be energetically connected to
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them you can also
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do protection work as you're going in to some of this stuff so
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for example i'm
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running a course in a few weeks time called mediation and going
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to court and it is
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SPEAKER_00: the energetics of how you hold yourself through this
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emotionally charged situation where like I don't know about you
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but I had this real
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fear that I was going to get told off or found out or like I
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don't know like I was
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SPEAKER_00: doing something really really wrong
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SPEAKER_00: And I wasn't.
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SPEAKER_00: I was just standing up for my needs and my kids' future.
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SPEAKER_00: Like, that's perfectly acceptable.
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So therefore,
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I needed to do a lot of work around holding myself safe within
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this space.
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So doing meditations where you are fully protecting yourself
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and calling in all the
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SPEAKER_00: support before you have to deal with
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SPEAKER_00: your ex,
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SPEAKER_00: your lawyers,
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SPEAKER_00: whatever it is,
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SPEAKER_00: like,
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SPEAKER_00: those are the things that then protect your heart,
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SPEAKER_00: okay,
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SPEAKER_00: so,
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SPEAKER_00: um,
9:39
SPEAKER_00: yeah,
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SPEAKER_00: if you want to hear about that course,
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SPEAKER_00: I'll put it in the short show notes,
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SPEAKER_00: because that will be kind of,
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SPEAKER_00: I'm on holiday next week,
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SPEAKER_00: and then,
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SPEAKER_00: um,
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SPEAKER_00: we'll be launching it the week after that,
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SPEAKER_00: and doing some,
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SPEAKER_00: like,
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workshops in preparation for that for anybody who wants to come
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and take part,
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SPEAKER_00: but that'll be really beautiful,
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um so yeah somebody else had asked how do you manage heartbreak
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grief and emotional
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exhaustion and I think it is that piece again of like allowing
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yourself to feel the
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feelings so I'm not talking like all day every day but giving
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yourself permission
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SPEAKER_00: to
10:25
SPEAKER_00: Have a little look.
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Shine a little torch on some of these shadows and see what is
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really going on.
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SPEAKER_00: What is it your heart feels?
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SPEAKER_00: What are you grieving right now?
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Because there's like,
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you know,
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this isn't...
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Nobody's died,
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but your relationship has died.
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SPEAKER_00: The life that you knew, your identity as a wife, all of that has gone.
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SPEAKER_00: So that deserves...
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a level of compassion and understanding from the rational side
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of your you know
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your soul your spirit to acknowledge that there's a bit of you
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that's really
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struggling with that because there's so much change going on on
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top of the
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SPEAKER_00: emotional turmoil of
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um holding your kids through divorce and worrying about their
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future and what's
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going to happen next there might be changes in school there
11:27
might be changes in
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where they're living all of this um all of this is a lot like
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it's a lot for you
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and then you're also holding these little souls outside of your
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your body in this
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SPEAKER_00: like that is
11:48
a lot to hold and so therefore you cannot squash that down
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because the chances are
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you'll just end up having a breakdown it really takes a lot of
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courage to give
12:04
SPEAKER_00: yourself space to grieve and um
12:09
SPEAKER_00: to feel the heartbreak and knowing that it's safe to do that.
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SPEAKER_00: Because a lot of times when you start thinking,
12:15
SPEAKER_00: all right,
12:15
SPEAKER_00: I'm going to go into therapy or I'm going to go into some kind of like,
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SPEAKER_00: even body work,
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SPEAKER_00: like knowing that you're going to go and do some poking around and
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SPEAKER_00: In your body,
12:30
in your brain to see where some of the things that are coming
12:34
up now have come
12:35
SPEAKER_00: from.
12:36
SPEAKER_00: That's really scary stuff.
12:39
SPEAKER_00: And you can feel like, God, if I go in there, I might never come out.
12:47
SPEAKER_00: But you will.
12:48
SPEAKER_00: You will, I promise.
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I was diagnosed with PTSD and I had to do some therapy where we
12:54
had to relive.
12:57
SPEAKER_00: The events that caused it.
12:59
SPEAKER_00: Like literally.
13:01
SPEAKER_00: He asked me questions.
13:03
SPEAKER_00: And we walked through the events.
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SPEAKER_00: That led to me having post-traumatic stress.
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SPEAKER_00: Like he was there with me.
13:16
SPEAKER_00: And then I had to re-listen to them.
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SPEAKER_00: It was called like reliving.
13:23
SPEAKER_00: And instead of.
13:28
sorry it's a like you know you process this stuff but sometimes
13:33
I forget like how
13:34
much it was but the point is that in all by going back in and
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looking at it with
13:41
fresh eyes that weren't like high on drugs or drunk or whatever
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else during that
13:45
traumatic experience being able to go back in and look at it
13:50
with my sober fresh
13:54
SPEAKER_00: eyes and
13:56
all it did was demonstrate to me that there actually wasn't any
14:01
shame there and i
14:03
was able to see the truth so rather than being afraid of what
14:12
is in there and what
14:14
is making you feel so sad the chances are you'll actually get
14:19
some really deep
14:21
SPEAKER_00: moments of understanding
14:23
and clarity and you will make yourself feel seen sometimes for
14:29
the first time you
14:32
know we're all surrounded by people who were doing their best
14:36
but that doesn't mean
14:36
that you weren't traumatized in the process okay so yes another
14:43
question that i had
14:45
SPEAKER_00: was how long does it take to feel okay about divorce
14:50
like how long is a piece of string I think this is so personal
14:56
it's such like I can
14:58
say five years on I feel fine about my divorce but every now
15:03
and again something's
15:03
going to come up which kind of pulls me off course again and I
15:06
have to use the
15:07
tools I you know I share with all you guys to get bring me back
15:10
to my center and
15:12
SPEAKER_00: remind myself of how good it is now
15:19
So you could be a week into being separated and be like,
15:23
God,
15:23
I feel great.
15:24
SPEAKER_00: This feels great.
15:25
SPEAKER_00: I remember feeling that like, I feel free.
15:28
SPEAKER_00: I feel liberated and free and I've got time to myself.
15:31
SPEAKER_00: And there's all this stuff that I'm going to do now.
15:36
SPEAKER_00: And then a week later, I'm like hit by a bus and can't get out of bed.
15:41
SPEAKER_00: So it's cyclical.
15:44
SPEAKER_00: It's what I'm trying to say.
15:45
SPEAKER_00: It's not a linear straight line.
15:47
SPEAKER_00: We're out of this.
15:49
SPEAKER_00: In three weeks time, you're going to feel great.
15:53
It's in 10 years time,
15:56
something might happen,
15:57
which makes you feel sad about your divorce.
16:01
SPEAKER_00: You know,
16:01
SPEAKER_00: the big events,
16:03
SPEAKER_00: the first time you have a birthday and you're not married,
16:06
SPEAKER_00: the first Christmas,
16:07
the first time you go to a wedding or there's a family wedding
16:10
that you're no
16:11
SPEAKER_00: longer invited to.
16:15
SPEAKER_00: It's going to potentially be something that you feel.
16:20
SPEAKER_00: Not all the time, but occasionally for a long time.
16:26
SPEAKER_00: And that's okay.
16:27
SPEAKER_00: And it's also okay to feel okay about your divorce right now.
16:33
SPEAKER_00: To be like... To hold both sides of the equation.
16:37
SPEAKER_00: Like, on the one hand, this is shit.
16:40
SPEAKER_00: I'm not enjoying it.
16:41
SPEAKER_00: But on the other hand...
16:45
SPEAKER_00: I now have full autonomy over my life and that's amazing.
16:49
SPEAKER_00: You know,
16:50
SPEAKER_00: so somebody wrote,
16:52
SPEAKER_00: in fact,
16:52
SPEAKER_00: it kind of links into this,
16:54
but like somebody asked about when is it okay to feel happy
16:58
again and not feel
16:59
SPEAKER_00: judged or guilty?
17:00
SPEAKER_00: And I'd say like immediately, that is a choice, isn't it?
17:07
We can all sit down one day and make the choice to be like,
17:10
okay,
17:11
I'm going to be happy now.
17:13
SPEAKER_00: And we really cannot worry about what other people are thinking.
17:20
SPEAKER_00: If they're on your team, they'll be happy for you.
17:24
SPEAKER_00: If they're not on your team and they're judging you,
17:26
SPEAKER_00: then I give you full permission and queen energy vibes to be like,
17:30
SPEAKER_00: you're not my person,
17:31
SPEAKER_00: so I'm going to protect myself from you.
17:35
SPEAKER_00: In whatever way I deem necessary.
17:38
SPEAKER_00: Whether that's blocking them on all of your social medias.
17:43
Or energetically cutting the cord with people that you know do
17:46
not have your best
17:47
SPEAKER_00: interests at heart.
17:49
SPEAKER_00: Like, it's okay to feel happy and not guilty right now.
17:55
SPEAKER_00: Okay?
17:56
SPEAKER_00: This is your life.
17:58
SPEAKER_00: The only people you need to hold responsible for.
18:04
SPEAKER_00: That's not a sentence.
18:05
The only people you need to be responsible for is yourself and
18:08
your children.
18:11
You don't need to worry about what anybody else is thinking or
18:14
feeling about you
18:14
SPEAKER_00: because it's none of their business.
18:16
SPEAKER_00: And honestly, they're probably not really thinking about you.
18:19
SPEAKER_00: If they are,
18:20
it's because they're enjoying the drama of the situation and
18:24
maybe they're not your
18:25
SPEAKER_00: people anyway if that's the case.
18:28
SPEAKER_00: So protect yourself.
18:30
SPEAKER_00: Protect your heart,
18:31
protect your emotions and give yourself permission to not be
18:36
guilty anymore.
18:37
SPEAKER_00: You're allowed to live the very best life that you want.
18:41
SPEAKER_00: And in fact, I implore you to do that.
18:47
SPEAKER_00: I really want you to, you know, come and pick a new life.
18:53
SPEAKER_00: That's really exciting.
18:55
um yeah we've got a workshop coming up on the Substack
19:00
membership so the the place
19:03
where this podcast lives next month i can't quite remember the
19:07
date but i'll put it
19:07
in the show notes i'm running a workshop as part of the
19:11
membership for all of you
19:12
guys uh all about how to manifest the divorce you want and the
19:18
life that you want
19:18
SPEAKER_00: after your divorce
19:20
so that's going to be a really beautiful workshop where i will
19:24
physically take you
19:25
through the process of tapping into the vision like what is it
19:31
that you want to
19:32
call in and we're really going to see it feel it anchor to it
19:39
and start pulling it
19:40
in no guilt no shame anybody else that you feel like there is
19:47
some judgment going
19:48
SPEAKER_00: on we're just gonna
19:50
SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much, but can you stay over there?
19:52
SPEAKER_00: Thank you, bye-bye.
19:52
SPEAKER_00: Okay, what else have I got?
20:00
SPEAKER_00: Do you ever feel like a weirdo or different now that you're divorced?
20:05
SPEAKER_00: And yes, yeah, yeah, but in like a good way.
20:08
SPEAKER_00: I think to begin with when I was single, there was that feeling of,
20:19
SPEAKER_00: Maybe people weren't going to trust me around their men.
20:24
SPEAKER_00: But I only had that with one person.
20:26
SPEAKER_00: And she was having some difficulties of her own.
20:34
SPEAKER_00: So I think that was just a bit of a misunderstanding.
20:37
SPEAKER_00: And...
20:42
I think a lot of the times what we worry that other people are
20:47
thinking about us is
20:49
actually just our stuff so if you can hold yourself steady and
20:54
be like um I'm not
20:59
some divorcee predator who wants to get with any bloke to try
21:05
and make me feel
21:06
SPEAKER_00: better like you can hold yourself in whatever energy you want like
21:13
I just I don't I don't know I just don't think we need to worry
21:18
about that too much
21:20
just I think as long as you're not coming out of one
21:23
relationship and being like I
21:25
need a man to fix me like I heard someone saying that the other
21:28
day about somebody
21:29
she just needs a man I just wish she could find a man and I'm
21:32
like why that's only
21:35
SPEAKER_00: gonna work once you feel
21:39
comfortable and you've processed all of the heartbreak all of
21:44
the emotional healing
21:45
that we've been talking about and working out your new identity
21:49
I mean it's easy
21:50
for me to say now that I found somebody and there was a lot of
21:55
sabotaging behavior
21:56
that I carried out to begin with being like oh god I need to
21:59
find somebody
22:00
SPEAKER_00: otherwise I'm not a
22:04
But it just meant I kept repeating the same patterns so that
22:07
wasn't very helpful at
22:09
all and in the end I had to put myself in a full ban and be
22:13
like no you're not
22:13
SPEAKER_00: dating anybody anymore until you've got your shit together.
22:17
So you know we can choose the labels that we want for ourselves
22:22
and frankly
22:25
SPEAKER_00: Self-worth is everything.
22:28
SPEAKER_00: You cannot look to somebody else to fix you because they can't.
22:33
SPEAKER_00: And the chances are you'll,
22:34
until you have worked on your own self-worth stuff and filled
22:37
yourself up with love
22:39
SPEAKER_00: and let your heart tear and rebuild.
22:44
The chances are you'll just keep repeating the same patterns
22:47
that have not led to
22:50
SPEAKER_00: maybe the best outcomes.
22:53
SPEAKER_00: So doing that piece on rebuilding your self-worth is your job now.
23:01
SPEAKER_00: That's the job.
23:03
SPEAKER_00: And then...
23:05
SPEAKER_00: I'll help you manifest the love of your life when you feel ready.
23:09
SPEAKER_00: But I want you to be the love of your life until then.
23:12
And to really look after that little girl within you that is
23:18
fully heartbroken and
23:19
SPEAKER_00: wants to be rescued.
23:21
SPEAKER_00: Because you can rescue her yourself.
23:28
um i think that's it yeah the last question was about how do
23:32
you rebuild your
23:33
self-worth after the label of divorcee and i'm like i just i
23:40
think the times have
23:41
SPEAKER_00: changed haven't they i don't so many people go through this process that
23:52
And so many women,
23:53
it's like the making of them as well,
23:55
going through divorce.
23:57
SPEAKER_00: It's like, oh, I finally know who I am.
23:59
SPEAKER_00: Like certainly for me, best and worst thing that ever happened to me.
24:05
um so I'm happy to be a divorcee and and still acknowledge that
24:12
there's a part of
24:12
me that wishes it hadn't happened um but I wouldn't be I
24:17
wouldn't have this
24:19
self-worth that I have now without the process I don't think
24:23
maybe I would have
24:23
done I don't know but it's certainly been a really helpful
24:30
journey for me in my
24:31
SPEAKER_00: kind of
24:33
how I feel about myself and finally understanding what
24:36
compassion means and how I
24:38
show up as a mum um and how I model to my kids looking after
24:45
myself I just think
24:48
SPEAKER_00: it's it's something that
24:56
Yeah,
24:56
I just don't buy the whole thing that being labelled a divorcee
25:00
is a bad thing anymore.
25:02
It's a really big thing to go through and you need to hold
25:05
yourself really steady through it.
25:10
SPEAKER_00: But it's also okay to be like...
25:12
yay I'm free and loving life and I don't need to feel any guilt
25:17
and any shame that
25:18
I feel I'm going to hold really gently and inquire as to what
25:24
it is and get the
25:25
therapy that I need and just really lean into creating a
25:32
beautiful life for myself
25:33
SPEAKER_00: going forward
25:35
SPEAKER_00: Okay, here's to lots of emotional healing this week.
25:40
SPEAKER_00: I look forward to seeing you over in the Magic Divorce Club.
25:43
We've got,
25:44
I shared on Monday,
25:46
Magic Monday,
25:47
I shared a meditation that you can use.
25:50
It's like a breathing exercise that I do with my daughter every
25:53
night because she's
25:55
SPEAKER_00: quite emotionally sensitive and...
25:58
can struggle to settle at night time so I created this
26:02
meditation for her to help
26:04
her to co-regulate with me and it's really beautiful and I made
26:10
it into a recording
26:12
so I could share it with you guys and add music and now she
26:15
prefers that version to
26:16
SPEAKER_00: mine but it's quite nice because we just sort of like
26:22
I hold her hand and we play it and then she's settling down and
26:28
it's just a really
26:29
SPEAKER_00: nice little routine.
26:30
SPEAKER_00: It's only like eight minutes long.
26:32
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, I hope you enjoy it.
26:34
SPEAKER_00: And obviously you don't have to use that version.
26:36
You can recreate it yourself and just say it to your kids if
26:40
you think it will help.
26:43
But yes,
26:44
it can be a lot to hold these little souls going through all of
26:46
this.
26:47
But as long as you are looking after yourself and they see you
26:51
doing that,
26:52
SPEAKER_00: that will really help them to feel secure as well.
26:57
Because we don't want them worrying about us as well as all of
27:00
their stuff that they're doing.
27:02
SPEAKER_00: So, you know, full permission slip written out in calligraphy to...
27:10
lean into looking after yourself especially as we go into the
27:13
summer into the
27:14
summer holidays and all of that fiery energy i hope you have
27:18
the best one so yes
27:22
don't forget to keep sending in your questions i love to hear
27:26
them um and i'm happy
27:27
you know like there is no wrong question just ask away and yeah
27:33
okay sending loads
27:34
SPEAKER_00: of love
27:40
SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for listening.
27:41
SPEAKER_00: And if you could subscribe and leave a review, that would be amazing.
27:46
SPEAKER_00: For all of your tips and tools,
27:49
head over to magicdivorceclub.substack.com and you can find
27:57
everything that you
27:58
SPEAKER_00: need there.
28:00
SPEAKER_00: You've got this and I've got you.