Latest / Critically Acclaimed Network / We've Got Mail #190 | Was TV's 'The Critic' a Good Critic?

Transcript

We've Got Mail #190 | Was TV's 'The Critic' a Good Critic? · Critically Acclaimed Network

0:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Hello everybody and welcome back to We've got mail This is the podcast for you you yes you Trevor you control the conversation right here at the critically acclaimed network and everyone else as well.
0:21
[SPEAKER_01]: No, no one else just Trevor if any trevers We're listening just to blue their fucking minds man
0:28
[SPEAKER_01]: But now this is our email and letter is podcast my name is willing to be on him a film critic I write for the rap and everybody calls me bibs.
0:37
[SPEAKER_00]: My name is Whitney Sybel died to him a film critic I contribute to slash film and For the purposes of this particular podcast you may if you wish call me rock my stream a cool.
0:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Please do that's all we ask and how it works is very simple
0:52
[SPEAKER_01]: With the entire film critics, we do a lot of podcasts, we write a lot of stuff, we have learned a few things in our travels, and people email us or write us physical correspondence, and we answer your questions, we respond to your prompts, we defend ourselves, some of your criticism, and sometimes admit you were right.
1:10
[SPEAKER_01]: and if you just email us or email address not be grudgingly we listen yeah this is it's genuine it's insular I don't think any any serious critics should be open to criticism and sometimes we have fucked up I'm happy that it's not the norm if it was every day would be like maybe we're not good at this but like never what's in a while yet you you take us to school and we're very very happy for it so if any of those situations are true if you want to write in ask us a question
1:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Tell us your story, share something with a group, ask us for any advice, information about history, or the way the industry works, or just you want to shoot the shed.
1:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Our email address is letters at criticallyclamed.net.
1:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Whitney, what is?
1:54
[SPEAKER_00]: our PO box.
1:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, if you want to send us a postcard or a letter or whatever you like piece of physical mail, send it to the critically acclaims network PO box 641565, well, send it to this California at 9.00.
2:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Six.
2:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Four.
2:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
2:08
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to we're going to dive right the hell in because this is your podcast.
2:13
[SPEAKER_01]: And we.
2:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I appreciate it.
2:16
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm a little loopy tonight because I've been a wee bit sick since I came back from my travels And it's fine.
2:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I just I have having trouble sleeping through the night So I've been a little little
2:30
[SPEAKER_00]: I did some heavy drinking last night, so it was like five.
2:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Of course you did, that's pretty cool.
2:36
[SPEAKER_00]: My wife and I went to a really marvelous bespoke cocktail experience in downtown LA, called the Obscure.
2:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And sometimes we'll have a cocktail.
2:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, Jude the obscure.
2:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
2:48
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't make literary jokes too.
2:50
[SPEAKER_00]: They brew their own spirits and you've got it to taste a little bit And then you get to drink a cocktail and that they've mixed that spirit into and by the end of the night You've drunk maybe the equivalent of like three to four cocktails, so which is quite a lot for me Yeah, yeah
3:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I might have a cocktail with dinner.
3:08
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like three to four.
3:09
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm trashed at four feet.
3:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so Whitney is very hungover right now and I'm not very sleep deprived.
3:16
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not very hungover, but I am equally loopy.
3:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's a letter from Logan.
3:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Hi, Logan.
3:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Greetings, salutations gentlemen.
3:22
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope you're both doing well or as well as can be reasonable expected.
3:25
[SPEAKER_01]: As well can be reasonably safe.
3:26
[SPEAKER_00]: In this late stage capitalist Hellscape, we find ourselves in.
3:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that sucks.
3:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to Hellscape.
3:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Remember, go through life, open heart, upraised middle finger.
3:34
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm writing for a couple of reasons.
3:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Firstly, I need to thank you for recommending listers and glints into extreme bird watching on your best of the year podcast.
3:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Had it not been for your recommendation, I doubt of whatever you've even known about it.
3:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely wonderful.
3:48
[SPEAKER_00]: I also want to thank you for your discussion about YouTube cinema.
3:51
[SPEAKER_00]: and how it should absolutely be in the conversation when we talk about great films or movies or what have you.
3:55
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember when William put Jenny Nicholson's this particular failure of the Star Wars hotel on his best of list last year and I explained yes, slightly in my cars, I was listening because that was one of the best things I had seen all year.
4:09
[SPEAKER_00]: And now to the primary reason for my correspondence, I apologize for being so long-winded.
4:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, please everyone says that you're fine.
4:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we have a complaint.
4:16
[SPEAKER_00]: We just three hour podcasts.
4:18
[SPEAKER_01]: You're great.
4:20
[SPEAKER_01]: You're you're concise and very does no matter how long you think you're being.
4:24
[SPEAKER_00]: I would like to return the favor and recommend some absolute YouTube bangers for the both of you.
4:29
[SPEAKER_00]: I would recommend watching them in reverse order of release because the latest video deals with much more serious topics and is longer.
4:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, absolutely vital and important.
4:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Both videos are done by a person who goes by each bomber guy on YouTube.
4:42
[SPEAKER_00]: And all of his work is fantastic, but the first I'm choosing to highlight is plagiarism and YouTube.
4:46
[SPEAKER_00]: I think I started to see some of this one.
4:48
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like I'm going to remember this kind of little cycling through for a little bit.
4:51
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't want to spoil too much, but you can guess the main focus of the video by the title.
4:55
[SPEAKER_00]: It's very entertaining, very well constructed, and also insightful, heartbreaking, and in the end, hopeful.
4:59
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't guarantee many things in this like, but I can't guarantee that you would both love it.
5:04
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you want to see more after watching that, I would recommend the video by the same channel called Roblox.oof.
5:11
[SPEAKER_00]: This one is a lot more fun for lack of a better term.
5:13
[SPEAKER_00]: It starts as H Bomber Guy digging into the murky origins of a video game sound effect.
5:19
[SPEAKER_00]: It evolves into them falling down a rabbit hole, but I can only describe as, are you fucking kidding me?
5:23
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a zane of the lyrious spiral into incredulity that somehow keeps escalated to the point where you're left wondering how any of this could be real.
5:30
[SPEAKER_00]: If you end up watching and enjoying my recommendations, or have already seen them, I wouldn't get mad if we got some follow up in a future episode.
5:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, this email is already inseparably long, so I'll leave it at that.
5:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you both for everything you do.
5:41
[SPEAKER_00]: Your discussions always inspire comfort and I appreciate me my very best Logan.
5:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, thank you, Logan.
5:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you very much.
5:46
[SPEAKER_01]: I am really, really adamant.
5:50
[SPEAKER_01]: that I think there's the world of mainstream film criticism where people who are working for a lot of legacy outlets and publications like you and I were working for a decent degree.
6:03
[SPEAKER_01]: We have a set idea of what cinema is.
6:07
[SPEAKER_01]: It's films that are theatrical release.
6:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Oftentimes, we focus entirely in films that are eligible for the Academy Awards.
6:12
[SPEAKER_01]: For example, I think we're missing
6:16
[SPEAKER_01]: the forest or the trees on that or maybe the trees or the forest because that's not where new cinema is thriving.
6:26
[SPEAKER_01]: People aren't just throwing theatrically-release features that are truly like experimental and personal in the theaters the way that they use to.
6:34
[SPEAKER_01]: They're putting it on social media and you can find interesting cinema.
6:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Not always great cinema, but interesting cinema.
6:42
[SPEAKER_01]: where people can just throw it together really fast or where they are rewarded for doing something that you would normally never see in theaters like a very fascinating visual essay or a bizarre documentary about a topic that no one actually gives a shit about like bird watching and my no one I mean like mainstream like apparently you know you can't get that in the theater yet see it on YouTube.
7:05
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember when the conversation was started to be had
7:10
[SPEAKER_00]: in regards to streaming, a lot of streaming services were becoming bigger and bigger.
7:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Netflix was attracting bigger and bigger crowds.
7:19
[SPEAKER_00]: And this was about the time when they were moving from merely licensing other studios films to making their own original content.
7:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Now we know them as a little, they were going from being a video store to being a TV network.
7:34
[SPEAKER_00]: And that happened in like the late 2000s, I believe.
7:40
[SPEAKER_00]: old school filmmakers, Steven Spielberg, even chimed in on this and because he felt that Netflix films, however their quality might be, were of a different medium than cinema in his mind.
7:53
[SPEAKER_00]: He felt that film should still be released theatrically and a theater as he has always noted.
7:58
[SPEAKER_00]: And anything that was released directly to Netflix counts as a TV movie, he felt
8:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, whatever, but you know, but this is Steven Spielberg.
8:13
[SPEAKER_00]: This was his view of the thing.
8:14
[SPEAKER_00]: And some people, you know, pundits like us started to chime in.
8:18
[SPEAKER_00]: What is the definition of cinema really?
8:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, what Steven Spielberg is talking about was something that by the time he mentioned it was already dying.
8:26
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, this old world theatrical model and and we've said this plenty of times before these things were already happening when the pandemic hit and the pandemic just accelerated it all.
8:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it just pushed everything forward and I remember the the real turning point in my mind was the release of trolls world tour.
8:49
[SPEAKER_00]: It was an animated film that was slated for theatrical release, but was delayed because of COVID lockdowns.
8:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
8:56
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think after a couple of months, the story went that long.
8:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
8:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
9:00
[SPEAKER_00]: The studio got a little impatient.
9:01
[SPEAKER_00]: They said, we have these movies.
9:03
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to release it on streaming at a higher price point, $20, which was unheard of at the time.
9:10
[SPEAKER_00]: And a lot of families are going to pay that because what if you have like three kids at home?
9:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they're all like, we're home, we're scared.
9:18
[SPEAKER_01]: They're all home, they're all the scared and bored ones.
9:20
[SPEAKER_00]: And also, it's cheaper than taking all of those kids to the theater.
9:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and also, you can't go to the theater even if you want to.
9:27
[SPEAKER_01]: So at the time, that seemed, that was actually like,
9:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Not a bad idea and some other students were doing Disney was I think put down a lot for like $20 now and without ever going into a theater trolls world tour made over a hundred million dollars so
9:45
[SPEAKER_00]: We were done in my mind.
9:48
[SPEAKER_00]: That was kind of the end of it.
9:49
[SPEAKER_00]: We weren't gonna come back to Anything traditional that we had previously known prior to the pandemic and I still feel that way I think it was still fighting back the numbers are still lower.
10:00
[SPEAKER_01]: There's still lower, but there's a deal.
10:02
[SPEAKER_01]: I think when we
10:04
[SPEAKER_01]: came back.
10:06
[SPEAKER_01]: We thought they were going to be just catastrophically low when we're going to see the absolute end and that's not what's happening.
10:12
[SPEAKER_01]: It's lower than it was, but it's not.
10:15
[SPEAKER_00]: No, it's low.
10:16
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not lower than it was.
10:17
[SPEAKER_00]: It's lower than it was last year.
10:19
[SPEAKER_00]: I understand after we had already started back a little bit.
10:22
[SPEAKER_01]: First off, there's always fluctuation, but like, and we don't have the same tent poles.
10:27
[SPEAKER_01]: driving it anymore.
10:28
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to put in a mid zeitgeist, or between zeitgeist right now where where it was initially there would be like eight superhero movies a year and they don't all make their all hands.
10:40
[SPEAKER_01]: They all make 750 to a billion dollars and that was that's what a temple does.
10:44
[SPEAKER_01]: It keeps everything aloft and those are not reliable hits anymore and so that is a factor that I think we can't pretend isn't out there but regardless I think
10:56
[SPEAKER_01]: And I know at the time during the pandemic lockdown, when we were talking about this, I was totally on your side on this and I thought I'd read the writing was on the wall and I was ready to welcome our new insect overlords.
11:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, well, I wanted to get to those insect overlords, but finish it, but I'm just saying I think the rumors of its death have been somewhat exaggerated and I think there's a place for it And I think it's just going to do fine and some regards, but it's going to mutate and change regardless these other mediums and we were already concerned about television where we concerned about video games these other mediums for visual
11:36
[SPEAKER_01]: media and your payments communication are not going to get smaller.
11:43
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I think there's always going to be theories, they're always going to, a lot of them are going to do okay, but
11:49
[SPEAKER_01]: These other visual modes, they're going to persist.
11:53
[SPEAKER_01]: And they're going to get interesting over and over again, provided that we can avoid either A, the monetization rules of YouTube, forcing people to censor themselves and make their workloads interesting.
12:07
[SPEAKER_01]: And B, if they can avoid using AI.
12:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
12:12
[SPEAKER_00]: They're going to be able to avoid using AI.
12:13
[SPEAKER_00]: I predict AI will bust.
12:15
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll leave my words if I'm wrong.
12:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
12:18
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, it's the new insect overlords that I think are the interesting because that's where the interesting artist coming from you said we're in between zeitgeist Hollywood is still trying to lean on the things that are familiar to guys are rich they're making masters of the universe into a movie as if they can kind of just
12:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Keep recycling the same garbage to new generations over and over again.
12:39
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope it keeps on making money Masters of the universe.
12:41
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean granted the new She-ra cartoon was really good, but let's be fair here Masters of the universe is really fucking old 40 years old.
12:49
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like making a Masters of the universe movie now Was like making the Phantom in the 1990s.
12:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that doesn't mean it's a bad movie It just means that melodic people on the right demographic don't give a shit.
13:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it it's
13:02
[SPEAKER_00]: I knew what the Phantom was, but I was a weird kid, and I knew old comics like that.
13:07
[SPEAKER_01]: Most people are age in the 90s who were the target demographic from movies like the Phantom and who is like the Shadow.
13:13
[SPEAKER_01]: they didn't know that was characters.
13:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and those movies weren't big hits.
13:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
13:16
[SPEAKER_00]: The shadow I think was modest, but the venom bomb.
13:19
[SPEAKER_01]: I think there's a little bit more market penetration for he-man because they tried to have a couple animated reboots with some modest success, but like it's still not- But here's the thing.
13:26
[SPEAKER_01]: There's this new generation stuff.
13:27
[SPEAKER_00]: You just use the phrase, market penetration.
13:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I know, right.
13:30
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the way they're thinking.
13:31
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why they're trying to use IP to make- That's all they care about.
13:35
[SPEAKER_00]: That's all they care about.
13:36
[SPEAKER_00]: And they're not thinking about what that's actually connected.
13:38
[SPEAKER_00]: No, the kids don't give a shit.
13:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I'm so happy to have a 10-year-old in my home.
13:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's my son.
13:44
[SPEAKER_00]: And yes, so we're clear.
13:48
[SPEAKER_00]: And because he has no interest in my generation's media, in millennial media, he doesn't want to see the remake of Lilo and Stitch event, like that's too old for him.
13:59
[SPEAKER_00]: What does he want to see in movie theaters?
14:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Nothing.
14:01
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't want to see anything in movie theaters.
14:03
[SPEAKER_00]: He wants to see video game tutorials.
14:06
[SPEAKER_00]: I wrote an article, and I've talked about it before, about BFDI, Battle 4 Dream Island, this animated series that my son watches on YouTube.
14:13
[SPEAKER_00]: it's bypassed all traditional distribution models.
14:15
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just these guys making these cartoons putting on YouTube, getting millions of subscribers selling merch in their stores.
14:22
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the new model.
14:24
[SPEAKER_00]: It's straight.
14:25
[SPEAKER_00]: It's direct to consumer.
14:27
[SPEAKER_00]: And I feel like that's huge.
14:30
[SPEAKER_00]: It's huge.
14:30
[SPEAKER_00]: It's huge.
14:31
[SPEAKER_00]: It's huge.
14:31
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a big, big part of what's going on.
14:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Studios don't understand that.
14:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, Chris, who's those are standard, right?
14:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, a lot of critics already don't get that.
14:39
[SPEAKER_00]: the old models of cinema are old there they're moldy they're crumbling that doesn't mean that they have no value there's been in those place for them but yet they're fucking old I wrote something recently that they're they're just like
14:54
[SPEAKER_00]: a bunch of rotting out osmndius corpses and the new generations like picking pieces from their bones right and making more interesting art and we have to keep an eye out for them.
15:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Well and I just think that even if you want to look at an apparently market driven way which I don't think you should but even if you this was your concern yeah.
15:12
[SPEAKER_01]: You're also like a lot of people in our position in our industry are kind of willfully ignoring the very obvious signs that people are interested in different shit.
15:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Again, a lot of people in my industry didn't even bother to see demon slayer.
15:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you miss grossing your films of the year?
15:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you miss the year outgrow Superman?
15:33
[SPEAKER_01]: We posted a million articles about Superman and what Superman means and how important it is to reboot DC and a lot of the people in this country cared a lot more about demon slayer based on a show.
15:46
[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of people in my industry never even fucking heard of.
15:53
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of places that didn't even review the film because it seemed so niche.
15:59
[SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't niche.
16:00
[SPEAKER_01]: It's extremely mainstream.
16:02
[SPEAKER_01]: It's more mainstream than the stuff you think is mainstream and we are really behind on it.
16:08
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's true for YouTube stuff.
16:10
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's true for extremely true for anime and it has been we've been extremely slow in this country to acknowledge
16:18
[SPEAKER_01]: Just how people, I just want people who are invested in anime in this country.
16:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, it's huge It's still considered a cult phenomenon where it makes like
16:28
[SPEAKER_01]: It takes almost as much as porn, like it's a huge market, it is a huge fan base, it's extremely varied, like it's not just like, it's not even like, when like superhero comics kind of dominated the American comic book landscape, and yeah, it was different companies making it, but it was generally speaking, costume crime fighting, was ruling the entire industry, there's all this whole these different kinds of
16:52
[SPEAKER_01]: anime stories from serious dramas, wacky comedies, to sexy stuff, to stuff that's just for kids, to stuff that's like super hyper violent, to stuff that's like really high concept, and meta, like there's a million different varieties of this, and so many people aren't even, I mean, they just released, and granted it didn't do as well, some of the more recent anime movies, but they just released an anime feature film,
17:19
[SPEAKER_01]: based on the same late novel that Edge of Tomorrow was based on.
17:25
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, yeah, it's called All You Need Is Kill.
17:28
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the original novel, I didn't even see reviews for that.
17:34
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't get any publicity blitzes for it.
17:37
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't get an opportunity to see it at a press screening or anything.
17:41
[SPEAKER_01]: I wasn't even assigned it.
17:43
[SPEAKER_01]: That should be a bigger deal.
17:45
[SPEAKER_01]: We should be keeping an eye on this, shit.
17:48
[SPEAKER_01]: So I point at this and we should move on because we have other letters to read.
17:58
[SPEAKER_01]: relevance, and awareness, and just responsibility for keeping an eye on what's actually happening in film and the related art forms, we have to look outside the conventional models.
18:11
[SPEAKER_00]: And you have to, that's where it's all in, that's where it's all happening.
18:14
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and it's kind of embarrassing that we even have to say this because we should be on top of this stuff all right.
18:18
[SPEAKER_01]: There should, we should not, there's the issues.
18:20
[SPEAKER_01]: And you and I can be doing better at it, and we're trying.
18:22
[SPEAKER_00]: You're trying.
18:23
[SPEAKER_00]: But we're, we're, we're listeners to my attention.
18:25
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
18:25
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
18:26
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
18:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, let's move on to another level because that's an even bigger conversation we're going to be having a from this one comes from the Eleanor Gray Hey We haven't heard from B in quite some time a bit Dear award winning journalist willing to be on it and awards snubbed journalists Yeah, that was a little shit right there man.
18:47
[SPEAKER_01]: I got it.
18:47
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not true.
18:49
[SPEAKER_00]: They're not paying attention to me, it's the one and which is my problem.
18:52
[SPEAKER_00]: It's been over three years since my last letter.
18:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Holy shit, isn't really.
18:56
[SPEAKER_00]: It sounds like I'm not confessional.
18:57
[SPEAKER_00]: It's been three years since my last confession.
18:59
[SPEAKER_00]: And apologies in order because this one is a 2,000-word doozy.
19:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's go through all of them.
19:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, some folks remember me as the Peterson writer of a hundred letters to this podcast in 2020 and host of the screens margin podcast network in 2021 alongside such fantastic host as market We're hoik and with you, Simon.
19:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, we had a podcast called all about off it
19:22
[SPEAKER_00]: with all O's.
19:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like the most difficult thing in the world to Google, like you have let us make this completely insertable.
19:28
[SPEAKER_00]: And we just reviewed films on the streaming service avid just because we're both so fond of it.
19:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Look up avid.
19:35
[SPEAKER_00]: It's great.
19:37
[SPEAKER_00]: My name is now B. Eleanor Gray.
19:39
[SPEAKER_00]: She heard and I go by Eleanor.
19:42
[SPEAKER_00]: In my last letter, I introduced my partner, A Kirby, they them, who is now a gray because we got married.
19:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
19:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Note, Bibbs came to the reception.
19:51
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you again.
19:51
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a pleasure.
19:53
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't come to everyone's wedding.
19:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Just so we're clear.
19:57
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was a real honor.
19:58
[SPEAKER_00]: And Eleanor, I thank you for inviting.
20:00
[SPEAKER_00]: But I just, you know, life and having a family, and it was a little hard to do.
20:04
[SPEAKER_00]: It was at a state, you know?
20:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I was going to go to an estate.
20:07
[SPEAKER_00]: It was just difficult.
20:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Our collective name is still Abba, A-B-B-A, which we coined in the last letter.
20:17
[SPEAKER_00]: We spent a little time apart, that so little time apart, that Abba's often more convenient to use than our individual names.
20:24
[SPEAKER_00]: In our three and a quarter years since meeting, we've screened 690 films together, considerably more than that, actually, but that's the number of films that are on letter box, to not including 57 rewatches of various titles, an average of over 19 films a month.
20:37
[SPEAKER_00]: It's pretty good average.
20:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Very good.
20:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, we haven't just been watching movies, and I have done a lot of traveling, including touring Europe for a month by train.
20:45
[SPEAKER_00]: We moved across the Pacific Northwest a few times, raised up puppy and two kittens, completed a bachelor's degrees, and even fled to Vancouver, Canada for a bit while the Supreme Court decided whether or not to allow the invalidation of our ex-gendered passports.
20:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
21:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Ever since such a fucking mess, they did, and then international committee stepped in, so it looks like we're good for now, maybe.
21:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Hmm, look, we're in a fascist hellscape, we were working on it, it's, yeah, it's sorry.
21:15
[SPEAKER_00]: It was during this last thing that I realized I really wanted to go to grad school, and eventually teach which means that I have a long-term career goal for the first time since high school.
21:23
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm now waiting to hear back from seven different programs, hopefully at least one will listen to Bids and Mark's effusive letters of recommendation, and take a chance on me.
21:30
[SPEAKER_00]: If you're wondering why I didn't ask you for a letter, there's no, there's no, there's in truth, no good reason.
21:35
[SPEAKER_00]: You're just as much of a mentor to me, and I wouldn't be where I am today without you.
21:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh well, thank you.
21:39
[SPEAKER_00]: You only need so many you can't flood them with I do not feel snubbed I just hope it happens for you.
21:47
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope so and now with the life update out of the way the time has come to discuss a bone to pick with you Which can be summed up thusly?
21:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Please stop spoiling deep space.
21:57
[SPEAKER_00]: No
22:01
[SPEAKER_00]: We've been following along with your all-hour yesterday's podcast with my wife having never seen the show before.
22:06
[SPEAKER_00]: They are enjoying DS9 immensely, including its first season of the character of Dax in particular, and I hope also to convince them to write in and detail their many well-founded defenses.
22:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Suffice to say, they were not to please when you upon introducing Vedic win and barile, casually announced who would go on to be, when the race to become the next Chi multiple season later, through on top of that, the fate of Dax, the reason the dominion or significantly later, the Feringue Reformation,
22:30
[SPEAKER_00]: It's frankly a miracle that you haven't spoiled either, Garyx or Bashir's backstories and please don't.
22:36
[SPEAKER_00]: It's gotten to the point where A is sometimes unsure whether they want to keep listening to an episode despite enjoying your conversations for fear that more mystery and discovery of the show offers will be squandered.
22:47
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll understand how important contextualization is in discussing media like this.
22:51
[SPEAKER_00]: We just wish large revelations or plot developments that are meant to be surprising or sources of ongoing tension weren't so frequently and casually mentioned as if they were common knowledge.
22:59
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, in my defense, the show's 30 years old.
23:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Say it louder.
23:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, in my defense, the show is 30 years old.
23:08
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll talk about this in a minute, but let's say, let's say I want to finish her point.
23:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, ultimately, this letter would be incomplete without mentioning that we based on your idea, actually pulled off a Halloween themed all nighter.
23:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, this is something we did for Halloween.
23:20
[SPEAKER_00]: We came up with our own all nighters, complete with schedules.
23:25
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, I arranged 13 films, 7 features, and 6 shorts, and edited them into a single 12 hour and 45 second video file that included 4th, 4664, excuse me, 466 second breaks.
23:41
[SPEAKER_00]: six six six second breaks.
23:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's cute.
23:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, why did that take me a second?
23:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
23:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I think it's private.
23:50
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
23:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, but the breaks.
23:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
23:54
[SPEAKER_00]: You're good.
23:54
[SPEAKER_00]: It took some time to put it together.
23:56
[SPEAKER_00]: So I ended up screening it in December.
23:57
[SPEAKER_00]: All the features were first time watches for A as most as were most of the shorts.
24:01
[SPEAKER_00]: And the program was kept a secret from them with the exception of its final installments.
24:06
[SPEAKER_00]: These were the films, which I themed around the concept of
24:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Descent descends like as in descending down a staircase.
24:14
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, okay, because that's that's a homophilm.
24:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, yeah, okay 645 p.m.
24:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Lights out 2013 David Sandberg two minutes the short not the film oh the short.
24:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's cool.
24:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah 647 p.m. Molignin James Roy 839 the first 666 second break
24:31
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, for the record just in speeds and going into it since Eleanor isn't going to any detail on this Lights out great short film about like a creature that can only move like when the lights are out Yeah, I'm flicking the lights on it.
24:42
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm flicking the lights on you Flip a light switch.
24:44
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like jumping toward you, and if you haven't seen the legment So delightful.
24:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's a really great creepy weird ridiculous film
24:56
[SPEAKER_00]: A 50 p.m. Long Farono, or Ninth Farono, 1911.
25:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Just said Piedilongorna and Al 66 minutes.
25:05
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, Ninth Farono.
25:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like I might learn Farono, but I don't want to make an asset of myself to get her out.
25:12
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... and i appreciate silence and i'm a good choice uh... nine fifty six p.m. permissions following an evil deed nineteen ninety five david lynch one minute short ice uh... and that followed by uh... nine fifty seven p.m. twin peaks the return part eight the eight episode of twin peaks the return of the line why uh... i'm especially proud of this pic of this is elinarian uh... as i managed to sign up our viewing with this episode with my wife's first watch thrift twin peaks after the second program weeks in advance
25:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, 10 55 p.m. Another 66, 666 second break.
25:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
25:47
[SPEAKER_00]: 11-06 p.m. Doodlebug.
25:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Christopher Nolan, three minutes, the short.
25:51
[SPEAKER_00]: I've never seen that.
25:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Follow to the 11-09 p.m. mad god.
25:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, mad god.
25:58
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, mad god.
25:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, as time-pat, this is Eleanor again.
26:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, as time-passes mad god is the film that stood out.
26:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Both to us is the film that defined our night, even if we may have enjoyed other ones more.
26:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Truly ecstatic filmmaking.
26:10
[SPEAKER_01]: you like it more than I do.
26:12
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's incredible visually.
26:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I find it's narrative construction which I can understand.
26:17
[SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of token but I do find it historically not great but you.
26:20
[SPEAKER_00]: So you and your screenplay style.
26:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Now let's someone's got to stick up for the screenplay.
26:26
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a screenplay.
26:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Who needs a screenplay?
26:28
[SPEAKER_00]: 12.33 a.m.
26:30
[SPEAKER_00]: The demon in 1972.
26:32
[SPEAKER_00]: Kichachiro Kawamoto.
26:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Seven minutes, a short.
26:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
26:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Whitney may remember that we covered the works of Kichachiro Kawamoto and our oven TV podcast.
26:42
[SPEAKER_00]: He specialized in stop motion, kabuki tails.
26:45
[SPEAKER_00]: That's all.
26:46
[SPEAKER_00]: We did.
26:46
[SPEAKER_00]: We did watch those short ones.
26:48
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... twelve forty uh... a.m. another six six six second break followed at twelve fifty one a.m. by let the corpses tan yeah twenty seventeen uh... usually the least thematic entry but needed a shot of adrenaline six hours into this madness yeah that's that's what you put the weird one of the corpses tan is more of like a western it's more of like it's it's like a
27:06
[SPEAKER_01]: dickierlessly art house, euro's sleeves, crime western, shootout movie, and if you want to see some of the A, some of them was gorgeous, shots you'll ever see in any movie, but also some of them was exhilarating editing you'll ever see in any movie.
27:22
[SPEAKER_01]: You gotta see a lot of the corpses tan.
27:24
[SPEAKER_01]: It's exquisite.
27:26
[SPEAKER_01]: It's so fucking god.
27:27
[SPEAKER_01]: I wish I had made a bigger splash when I came out.
27:29
[SPEAKER_01]: It's amazing.
27:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, to, now we're at 224 AM.
27:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Perfect blue 97 such a thing on 346 a.m. Another 666 second break 357 a.m.
27:40
[SPEAKER_00]: The sitters 2024.
27:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Hannah Franklin 3 minutes.
27:45
[SPEAKER_00]: You likely haven't heard of this one.
27:46
[SPEAKER_00]: It's an animated short about an L Twitch cat demon that feeds on cat sitters.
27:51
[SPEAKER_00]: It's adorable and also a documentary on cat behavior.
27:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that sounds great.
27:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Great.
27:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, 4 AM, thing goo, 2012, Lee Hard Castle, a two minute short, you might not know this one, either.
28:01
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a stop-motion remake of John Carpenter's, the thing, using the cast of the Children's TV show, bingo, a thing nice.
28:10
[SPEAKER_00]: I think I've seen a bit of this, like it floats around on social media.
28:13
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
28:13
[SPEAKER_01]: For O2AM, castration movie anthology too, the best of both worlds, starting at the end of the intermission, you've already seen the first half 2025, a 164 minute section of it, because that's like a long, like a five hour movie, and it's extremely sprawling, but in the second half, it's all brilliant, but in the second half, it gets like really intense and kind of frightening in a way that I think you probably weren't quite expecting, and a way that's just truly amazing,
28:42
[SPEAKER_00]: And I am I am remiss.
28:44
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like I did something really cool.
28:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Very poor as a critic by not watching restoration movie on theology.
28:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, um, Elinore, 402 am and that's when you drop in the 164-minute film.
28:57
[SPEAKER_00]: You got to get it to the 88-minute ones.
28:59
[SPEAKER_00]: That's just speed through the steam through those suckers.
29:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
29:02
[SPEAKER_00]: And then 645 am and 45 seconds the end.
29:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Time for a walk around our frost covered
29:08
[SPEAKER_00]: As the sun comes up, and we process that wall up of a finisher castration movie literally made us both physically ill from its camera work alone.
29:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'll do it.
29:16
[SPEAKER_00]: That sounds amazing.
29:17
[SPEAKER_00]: And finally, the portion of the letter that I've been trying to figure out how to write for years, I've long wondered about the nuances of withholding oneself from reviewing a film in the name of professional courtesy.
29:27
[SPEAKER_00]: To be clear, what I'm not talking about is a legal financial reason for not discussing a film.
29:31
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll allow Whitney's job at the New Beverly, meaning you can't talk about Tarantino films.
29:35
[SPEAKER_00]: By the way, I've been meaning to ask, do you still work there if not, does that mean you can talk about his films again?
29:39
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't work there.
29:40
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not on the payroll any longer.
29:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And you can finally... And I have been...
29:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Think your mind.
29:44
[SPEAKER_00]: I haven't laid, like, laid into any Tarantino movies, positive or negative, but I can talk about it.
29:50
[SPEAKER_01]: If you've been listening lately, you might notice that when the subject of Tarantino comes up, Whitney is no longer tight-lipped.
29:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I don't, I don't step away.
29:57
[SPEAKER_00]: I cannot, like actually say a few things.
29:59
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not talking about personal courtesy where a critic is close with a filmmaker with holds a review in the interest of maintaining the relationship.
30:06
[SPEAKER_00]: What I mean is when a critic has or had, as had, some form of relationship with someone involved in the film and the review won't affect set relationship one way or the other.
30:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Why not simply be up in front about disclosing the relationship and the review, still be as honest as you can, in,
30:22
[SPEAKER_00]: As you can be in your assessment of the film and let the audience decide whether that affects their estimation of your estimation I'm thinking of the occasions like Bibs and the guests a film Bibs often lot it until he stopped recommending it because he became friends with one of the stars for a Non-the-Gast related season of the show the Shmodown It's a couple of seasons.
30:41
[SPEAKER_00]: It's really hard to be fair, but yeah
30:44
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll let them finish.
30:47
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to describe three relevant experiences I've had as a local film critic to further illustrate my confusion.
30:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Number one, LaGrand, the city of 13,000 people where I live and which my wife grew up, hosted annual Film Festival, the centerpiece of the 2024 Festival was a film called Breakup Season.
31:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Which had been shot in and around the grand before I moved there as it happens.
31:06
[SPEAKER_00]: My father-in-law has a scene in the film opposite James or Baniac, which Fun fact makes us three degrees removed from Christopher Nolan's Steven Spielberg and Richard Blinklayer.
31:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey Additionally the head of the festival who might have been closely acquainted with while covering the festival for the local paper served as producer
31:22
[SPEAKER_00]: I still wrote and published a review of the film I had both strong praise for break-up season for its scripting for performances, as well as problems with it, namely the underlying politics of its representation of the grant.
31:33
[SPEAKER_00]: In the review I clearly disclose my living in the grant, but not my relationship with people behind the film something I did at the request of my wife and the producer respectively.
31:41
[SPEAKER_00]: I still feel weird about this.
31:42
[SPEAKER_00]: I was new at the gig and it was complicated, such as the nature of this topic I suppose.
31:47
[SPEAKER_00]: The director ultimately thanked me for my review despite the criticisms and we went on to work together on the festival's board the following year.
31:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
31:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Two regarding the 2025 Eastern Oregon Film Festival, I again was confronted by the issue while serving on the program committee.
32:00
[SPEAKER_00]: I repeatedly found myself in conflict with the other members of the committee who wanted to select films because they knew who had made them.
32:07
[SPEAKER_00]: And or want it to network with local filmmakers.
32:09
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a little sketchy.
32:11
[SPEAKER_01]: We can talk about that first, but that's not good.
32:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, frankly, I don't give a rip-who made a movie if it wasn't a good in my estimation.
32:17
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't care if none of the filmmakers of an international submission would come because all I wanted to screen was the best films.
32:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, I recognize that I was the lone critic on the committee, the rest being community members, who had no obligation to follow myself and post-standards.
32:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, well, that's understandable, but still, it was often a frustrating time, a mentally proud of the final program, by the way, and even if I didn't get to experience it myself, I was in Vancouver during the festival.
32:43
[SPEAKER_00]: And then there's castration moving.
32:45
[SPEAKER_00]: After seeing the first installment of the queer ethic, I'd backed the continuing production on Kickstarter.
32:50
[SPEAKER_00]: First and only time, I've done such a thing because it was engrossed by the first part, and wanted to see such a revolutionary trans creation finish.
32:58
[SPEAKER_00]: A couple of months later, I interviewed, I invited writer, director, Star Louise Weird, and producer, composer, star, EFA, Josie Clemens,
33:07
[SPEAKER_00]: to come to a grand and screen the film as part of the build up to the festival and they said yes.
33:11
[SPEAKER_00]: We ended up spending a long weekend together discussing films and politics to top it all off.
33:15
[SPEAKER_00]: They stayed in communication with us while we were in Vancouver where they live, helping us find a way around town.
33:21
[SPEAKER_00]: It's amazing.
33:22
[SPEAKER_00]: I haven't published any of my very mixed to very positive thoughts on the second part of concentration movie, and I'll unsure about how to proceed when the third and fourth parts are released.
33:31
[SPEAKER_00]: I still believe my perspective is slash will continue to be valid, and even important as a trans critic, but I can't really review something when my name is literally in the credits.
33:43
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess in detailing all of this, I've sort of answered my own questions.
33:47
[SPEAKER_00]: It's so much easier not to review a thing when you know someone involved.
33:50
[SPEAKER_00]: All the same, I find myself as a reader invariably wanting to hear their redacted reviews of critics, I admire to spite any supposed conflict of interest because I still value what they have to say about art.
33:59
[SPEAKER_00]: And as a writer, I want my voice to be a part of the conversation about art, I care about.
34:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Then again, I'm still new at all this, I don't know any better.
34:06
[SPEAKER_00]: This has been a gauntlet.
34:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much for your time, be on our gray.
34:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I want to get to that last part, last because that's a big old can of worms and there's a lot of people have different, very respectable people are different opinions about some of that stuff and we'll talk about that in a second.
34:22
[SPEAKER_01]: First off, and if you've listened to our Star Trek podcast, you know we have already addressed this email.
34:31
[SPEAKER_01]: but we got wind of the concern we got wind of the concern okay so we have a for those of you who may not know we have a Star Trek podcast on our patreon patreon dot com slash critically claim network where we're reviewing every single episode of Star Trek we may stop it in the microphone sorry we're viewing every single episode of Star Trek in the order in which they were released and we recently started season two of Star Trek Deep Space 9 which unlike
34:58
[SPEAKER_01]: previous Star Trek series to that time had a lot more serialization and ongoing storylines and mysteries and while discussing each new episode we were discussing the ways in which those setups would pay off later.
35:13
[SPEAKER_01]: It was our sort of implicit, I always understand it because clearly we were wrong, but I guess, guess that the majority of people who were listening to us talked about a 30 year old show were probably already familiar with it.
35:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we were wrong.
35:27
[SPEAKER_01]: And there are people who are watching along with us who maybe weren't familiar with that particular series and everyone starts right before.
35:34
[SPEAKER_01]: And we jumped ahead a little more than we realized.
35:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Now on some level,
35:41
[SPEAKER_01]: We could just say we're like, like if we're doing a commentary track, we expect you to already know this stuff.
35:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
35:46
[SPEAKER_01]: On the other hand, this project is going to take multiple years.
35:50
[SPEAKER_01]: And we want to be respectful of that.
35:51
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're going to be a little bit more coy about stuff like that, but we will still point out this will be important later maybe.
36:00
[SPEAKER_01]: But we'll be a lot less cavalier about actual plot points later on in the way things play out.
36:07
[SPEAKER_01]: Or the very least will give you a spoiler warning until you do jump ahead a little bit, but we will be respectful of that.
36:12
[SPEAKER_01]: That is a fair fair fair critique of the way we have been reviewing that show, and we will do better.
36:18
[SPEAKER_01]: As for first off, and your Halloween, all-nighter is great.
36:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Don't know that.
36:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
36:25
[SPEAKER_00]: My only criticism is you put the long long last, and that's...
36:28
[SPEAKER_00]: It's going to be difficult to get through.
36:30
[SPEAKER_01]: Having seen that film and knowing how it ends, I see what you did it because it is a fitting end to a milliliter marathon.
36:38
[SPEAKER_01]: But at the same time, you're winning his point.
36:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, regarding the last thing, what we are talking about for those who may not understand conflict of interest.
36:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we may not understand how this works.
36:49
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a thing called a conflict of interest.
36:52
[SPEAKER_01]: It exists in a lot of different industries, but in the film criticism industry,
36:56
[SPEAKER_01]: uh... this happens where film critics who are responsible for giving an honest opinion about a movie uh... will often recuse themselves from reviewing or discussing in great detail their thoughts on a particular work if the people who made that work are friends family bosses bosses that's made by a company that we work for uh...
37:21
[SPEAKER_01]: These could be considered a conflict of interest and may lead whether whether reasonably or otherwise even if the critic is giving their full-throated honest Even holding negative opinion To the audience it may look like our opinion is compromised and as a result it may as well be compromised Yeah, because we want to make sure you can always trust what we say and so a lot of us not all but a lot of us believe that in that situation It is best just
37:50
[SPEAKER_00]: not to review it just to step out which I did um when once upon a time in Hollywood is released I was still projecting it at the new Beverly and we had to have a special guest I believe it was Liz Chen and Miller who came in.
38:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, he was yeah, we came here to um did a great job Once upon a time and in Hollywood and I stepped away from the mic.
38:08
[SPEAKER_00]: I was not part of that conversation
38:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, didn't say anything about the movie.
38:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep, couldn't because the man who made it signs my paychecks.
38:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
38:16
[SPEAKER_01]: So, uh, so nothing.
38:17
[SPEAKER_01]: Even if you were being completely honest to the outside observer, it could be seen as suspect if you either remotely praised it.
38:25
[SPEAKER_01]: And if you, or even if you decried it, it could be seen as always got a grudge against his boss.
38:29
[SPEAKER_00]: So you just run into that grudge against my boss or it's going the other way.
38:34
[SPEAKER_00]: If I line past the film, my boss catches wind of that.
38:37
[SPEAKER_00]: It could affect my employment.
38:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Which is why it's a conflict venture.
38:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, because it's a conflict venture.
38:41
[SPEAKER_01]: To be honest about it could jeopardize not just a relationship, but a business relationship.
38:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, I remember Roger Ebert was asked about this because he was actually high school friends
38:54
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... who is on mash and many of the other things is a huge he had a huge long prolific career and somebody wrote in uh... how do you justify writing reviews of films with david auged and stairs and he's like
39:10
[SPEAKER_00]: He's not a personal friend.
39:11
[SPEAKER_00]: I owe him nothing, and when I see him on the screen, I just say, oh, look Dave Stears, and then I just watch the movie.
39:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
39:19
[SPEAKER_00]: He was actually very sort of pragmatic about it.
39:22
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
39:22
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think if you know somebody in a movie, or you know somebody who worked on a movie,
39:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, and you can, you should disclose that, say I know this person, but, uh, and here's my honest opinion.
39:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
39:38
[SPEAKER_00]: If that is acceptable.
39:39
[SPEAKER_00]: That is acceptable.
39:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And all of the people like this, if, if it's just sort of like a friend of yours.
39:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, or casual acquaintance or someone that you've like or you know somebody you like to work below the line Yeah, yeah, yeah, or if you knew them years ago But the point is is that your relationship isn't close enough with them that to the outside observer It may seem as though your opinion is comprehensive Yeah, like if you're dating somebody or you're married to somebody or if they're like your brother-in-law or something like that You just that then it could look sus so you don't want it
40:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Where's the line?
40:09
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess you have to use your judgment.
40:11
[SPEAKER_00]: How well do you know that person?
40:13
[SPEAKER_00]: How much do you disclose?
40:15
[SPEAKER_00]: You disclose?
40:17
[SPEAKER_00]: You just say in your view full disclosure.
40:18
[SPEAKER_00]: I've spent some time with this person.
40:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Generally speaking for me, I think it is more...
40:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, I know a lot of people who know other filmmakers and maybe spent, for example, you mentioned that you have not only worked with Louie's Weir is like an interview or whatever like that, but you've been in some touch with them.
40:38
[SPEAKER_01]: But I don't think that means that you're necessarily compromising position there.
40:43
[SPEAKER_01]: But you may want to disclose that before you do and I think that case you're probably fine A lot of people would say you are but for me personally I try to avoid it whenever possible.
40:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I have had the occasional There are a lot of people I've interviewed in this industry and know well enough to say hello Yeah, and maybe they would send me like a DM about a review I wrote once in a while, but I do not consider that a relationship.
41:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that is
41:06
[SPEAKER_01]: That's an acquaintance at most, anything beyond acquaintance, that's where I go, okay, no, if I've hung out at their house, yeah, I'm not comfortable.
41:17
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, there's, you know, Kevin Feigey knows me, like I can wave at him on the street and he would go, hey, yeah, guy, I like, I've been to meet him enough time.
41:26
[SPEAKER_01]: I owe him fucking nothing.
41:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
41:29
[SPEAKER_01]: And he's probably not very happy with the feeling he knew from being perfectly frank.
41:32
[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't care, he's made some crap, move his lately.
41:36
[SPEAKER_00]: He needs to hire me to do that motor mouth film.
41:38
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what that's good for him.
41:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I need a squirrel girl movie and a cat wolf movie, stat.
41:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, getting the weight of the intro, but back.
41:45
[SPEAKER_01]: She knows what to do.
41:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
41:47
[SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
41:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, the point is, there's two general schools of thought on this thing.
41:54
[SPEAKER_01]: The general rule of thumb that I think we can all agree on, hopefully, is that if you have a close relationship with someone, if you're related, you're very good friends,
42:02
[SPEAKER_01]: any sort of business relationship or this actual, especially with this actual money involved, do not review.
42:09
[SPEAKER_00]: If you're in the credits, do not review.
42:12
[SPEAKER_00]: That means you're part of the film, you're reviewing your own movie technically.
42:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, exactly.
42:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I think from the film festival example that you used, those other people are not in the industry, they didn't have appreciation of these fineries and they're doing it wrong and you're doing it right, fair enough.
42:26
[SPEAKER_01]: When it comes time
42:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Your name is in the credits, but I'd be surprised if you invested more than
42:34
[SPEAKER_01]: like 50 hundred bucks.
42:36
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I don't think that's necessarily a thing.
42:38
[SPEAKER_01]: And I would argue that in the case of castration movie, which again, you were worth them at a film festival.
42:46
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, like that's that's a very casual business relationship.
42:51
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think you're in a lot of trouble there.
42:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I think you should disclose that you're a patreon backer or Kickstarter backer or definitely do that.
42:59
[SPEAKER_00]: But if it was the result of a Kickstarter
43:04
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to the first example you gave on.
43:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought that one was really interesting.
43:07
[SPEAKER_01]: You're talking about a small film shot in your hometown with like a scene or a cameo or something from someone who was related to you.
43:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Theoretically, no, you shouldn't be doing that.
43:17
[SPEAKER_01]: However, there is a gray area here and the gray area would be,
43:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Who the fuck else is talking about a gray area.
43:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I know, but like seriously, who wants us talking about it?
43:26
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I was going to say this.
43:29
[SPEAKER_01]: This is where you might be as long as you're in full disclosure mode.
43:33
[SPEAKER_01]: Hmm, I think you'd be okay.
43:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think if it's a film festival that was featured only films film in a small town.
43:40
[SPEAKER_00]: yeah they're all about the small town they'll star the locals and the people at this film festival are the locals who are in that film it's sort of celebrating the town yeah so why don't it what else could you do and if you write a film in that or write a film review in that context and the readers of that review are also just those people in that small community
43:58
[SPEAKER_00]: then I think we are in kind of a a kind of comfortably light gray.
44:04
[SPEAKER_01]: I think you're in the spirit of the thing and I think that we're again we're talking about people celebrating small town art and artisans and I think that's that's a little different.
44:13
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll say this provided your review.
44:17
[SPEAKER_00]: is also in the spirit of that thing, and that this is how this film glorifies this community.
44:23
[SPEAKER_00]: This is why this is good for our community.
44:26
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, even in that context, it has sort of like a civic duty, rather than necessarily an artistic one.
44:32
[SPEAKER_00]: That would definitely help.
44:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, let me say for it.
44:34
[SPEAKER_01]: But I will say this, I will say this.
44:36
[SPEAKER_01]: If you're in this industry long enough, you're gonna run into situations like this where sometimes it's clear-cut and sometimes it's not, and you're gonna do your best.
44:44
[SPEAKER_01]: As long as you're doing your best to be ethical, even if you mess up a little bit, you'll probably be forgiven as long as you don't make a point of it.
44:55
[SPEAKER_01]: So just do your absolute best to be ethical, to disclose when it's relevant, to I would always err on the side of caution in that regard, and if you don't follow my way of thinking which is to even if it's unnecessary, always recuse for the sake of it.
45:14
[SPEAKER_01]: go full disclosure and just people will be people appreciate the honesty because you're being honest.
45:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
45:21
[SPEAKER_01]: You have as long as you're being forthright, you should be okay even if some people would go, I wouldn't have reviewed that.
45:27
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
45:28
[SPEAKER_01]: But I know a lot of critics have absolutely respect who do that exact thing.
45:32
[SPEAKER_01]: I know this person, they were reasonably good friends, they've like spoken at a class that I teach at a college or whatever, but I still feel comfortable reviewing their movie.
45:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Fair enough, you've told me what I need to know, and if that makes me take your opinion with a grand assault, I have the information necessary to do that.
45:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
45:50
[SPEAKER_01]: So you're going to do your best, and if you'll learn to buy a lesson along the way.
45:55
[SPEAKER_01]: that's a lesson learned.
45:56
[SPEAKER_01]: But always do your best to try to be ethical.
45:58
[SPEAKER_01]: That's all I can say.
46:00
[SPEAKER_01]: That was a big one.
46:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Big one, very inside baseball, perhaps.
46:03
[SPEAKER_01]: But regardless, I'm glad you asked.
46:06
[SPEAKER_01]: And we all, we're all doing our best.
46:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I hope.
46:10
[SPEAKER_01]: To be frank, some people aren't.
46:12
[SPEAKER_01]: And they're like people like I'm like TikTok and other like streaming mediums who do the work of film criticism and review a film and then say they're brought to you by that film.
46:20
[SPEAKER_01]: No.
46:22
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, and this is another kind of worms, but I'll just mention it briefly.
46:25
[SPEAKER_00]: The idea of the influencer with you, the people who are, um, kept separate from critics.
46:32
[SPEAKER_00]: In fact, influencers now are given, um, advanced screenings, advanced of critics, even.
46:37
[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes, yeah.
46:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Because, and they're typically given a lot of merch by the studio.
46:41
[SPEAKER_00]: They're kind of winding and dying by the studio a little bit.
46:44
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... they're given the special screenings under the hopes that they'll just say what a fun time I had yeah and they're under no obligation because they're not professional critics necessarily or knowing or are they holding themselves so that's standard yeah they're not they're not reviewing the film they're just sort of
47:02
[SPEAKER_00]: They're, they are.
47:02
[SPEAKER_00]: They're doing the job of it.
47:03
[SPEAKER_00]: They're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're
47:17
[SPEAKER_00]: And that has kind of muddy the water is a little bit because they do have a conflict of interest, but really they don't.
47:25
[SPEAKER_00]: They're just being paid to give a positive review.
47:27
[SPEAKER_00]: And that makes us that reflects poorly on us as a couple.
47:31
[SPEAKER_01]: We used to be accused of shit like that all the time.
47:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, they're just watching.
47:34
[SPEAKER_01]: We're not even accused of that.
47:35
[SPEAKER_01]: And that means we can't trust your opinions and then we're going to go and watch all these and not all not every influencer does this.
47:41
[SPEAKER_01]: There's some people who are doing it ethically, but
47:46
[SPEAKER_01]: there are people who are just doing it outright and just getting away with it and I disagree with that I don't think that's ethical and I think if you're providing the service of making people aware of cinema and speaking about the quality of that cinema and the content of that cinema and the context of that cinema then even if you don't think you're a critic you're taking a job away from one because that's the service people go to a film critic for
48:14
[SPEAKER_01]: So if you're not holding yourself to the standard of that occupation, all you're doing is lowering the standard for that occupation.
48:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
48:20
[SPEAKER_01]: And just marching it, and no one's certain terms.
48:23
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't agree with that.
48:24
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, there are some people who are doing it right.
48:26
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
48:27
[SPEAKER_01]: I know they are.
48:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not painting everybody with this brush, but I do know there are too many people who are doing it wrong.
48:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And that pisses me off.
48:35
[SPEAKER_01]: So I appreciate anyone who is trying to do it the right way.
48:38
[SPEAKER_01]: And when you're just getting started, you may make a mistake or two.
48:41
[SPEAKER_01]: But if you're trying to be ethical at the whole time, you'll be okay.
48:45
[SPEAKER_00]: But Elinore, thanks for writing in and thank all of that and for a little life catch up and everything.
48:50
[SPEAKER_00]: And also for trying, for trying to actually aware of that.
48:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you have more awareness of what you're doing than a lot of critics and influencers.
48:58
[SPEAKER_01]: If that kind of moral and ethical stuff was easy, we wouldn't need to talk about.
49:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
49:03
[SPEAKER_01]: But it can sometimes be a little tricky and you're doing a good job, because you're thinking about it and you're doing a best.
49:09
[SPEAKER_00]: It's tricky to rock a rhyme, to rock a rhyme that's right on time.
49:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
49:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Finally, you know, it's not always me doing shit like everyone's I go take a drink with William does a bad fucking time Like or weird fucking reference.
49:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, good job.
49:25
[SPEAKER_00]: I too.
49:25
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm capable of bathos.
49:27
[SPEAKER_00]: This next letter comes from Blair Hello there.
49:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Good morning.
49:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Fine, sirs of the internet podcast world from the Tundra known as Regina Saskatchewan Yeah, no, where we currently have freezing rain.
49:37
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you could spend some some my way that would be more than greatly appreciated
49:42
[SPEAKER_00]: I've rambled on enough, so let's get to my questions.
49:45
[SPEAKER_00]: One, do you have any movie member of Billia in your home at the present time?
49:49
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you do, what props or items do you have?
49:52
[SPEAKER_00]: And two, my second question is this, if you could pick any piece of movie history to place in your home on top of the fireplace mantle, what piece would it be, what movie would it be from, and why did you choose it?
50:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you for taking the time to read my little letter until next week, time we chat, Blair.
50:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, that's a great question.
50:08
[SPEAKER_01]: I would love a lot more movie memorabilia.
50:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I do have one piece that's sort of inherited by the family But I need to actually find it.
50:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, and I don't want to say which one we have because it's actually pretty cool And I would like to maybe one day if it is genuine and I can find it I would like to donate it to museum someday, but um, no, I don't really have
50:31
[SPEAKER_01]: any like actual like this was used like a problem I do have there's one of my most prize possessions however is I was supposed to interview one of my favorite filmmakers at the Toronto International Film Festival years ago Mamaro Hussoda who had just released the film that was very near and dear to me called the Boyne the Beast.
50:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, which came out shortly after my dad died and it's all about The population shit, but also but also like flying whales and learning how to read and martial arts dads and shit.
51:02
[SPEAKER_01]: It's all kind of weird But um, it was wonderful movie I was supposed to stand in view and It's a film festival everyone's moving around a lot of movie parts and it didn't work out and that happens all the time And I didn't think anything of it But out of the fucking blue he drew me a sketch of the beast
51:23
[SPEAKER_01]: and he gave it to me is like, sorry, we couldn't make the interview work and I was like, oh, I'm keeping this for fucking ever.
51:30
[SPEAKER_01]: So I have that framed on my wall.
51:31
[SPEAKER_01]: Nice.
51:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
51:32
[SPEAKER_01]: That's that's probably the closest thing I got.
51:34
[SPEAKER_00]: I've like sketches and autographs.
51:36
[SPEAKER_00]: I went to a Comic-Con once and talked to Ron Lim.
51:40
[SPEAKER_00]: He's one of my favorite Marvel Comics artists.
51:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Great artist.
51:43
[SPEAKER_00]: He drew a picture of Adam Warlock for me.
51:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Which is pretty cool.
51:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Excuse me.
51:48
[SPEAKER_00]: I got to meet Stan Freeberg before he passed at a convention and he signed a record which my mom has framed on her wall.
51:56
[SPEAKER_00]: The only movie prop I think I own.
51:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Never actually appeared in the movie.
52:02
[SPEAKER_00]: It was from the Lords of Salem.
52:04
[SPEAKER_00]: There was a scene in the film that was ultimately cut from the movie where a bunch of characters go and attends like a midnight movie festival.
52:13
[SPEAKER_00]: I was filmed with the movie theater where I was working at the time.
52:15
[SPEAKER_00]: The new art theater and here in Los Angeles.
52:17
[SPEAKER_00]: And Rob Zombie was there and he was charging around and he was directing the movie and he was bringing cameras and I as a Employee of the theater had to be there just to make sure everything was copacetic.
52:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and they were decorating up But in that Rob Zombie sort of a way In fact, one of like the publicists was there with a bunch of plastic skulls drawing little scars on them herself Yeah, which we're gonna be hung up on the walls just as background decorations for this theater scene.
52:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Sure
52:45
[SPEAKER_00]: And everybody cleared out and my manager started throwing away all of the decorations because Rob was obviously didn't want to keep them and I was allowed to keep one of the skulls.
52:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Yay!
52:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And I still hang it outside my door every Halloween.
52:56
[SPEAKER_00]: It's Halloween decoration.
52:57
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a good one.
52:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
52:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Now in a perfect world.
53:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
53:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's say you could have one prop from a movie, real screen used prop from a movie.
53:07
[SPEAKER_01]: Not a TV show.
53:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
53:08
[SPEAKER_01]: You can't just pick any old Star Trek.
53:10
[SPEAKER_01]: It has to be from a Star Trek movie.
53:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Enterprise D from generations the whole thing Well, what is this thing right here just like it's like a 30-foot model.
53:18
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean that be cool But like you don't have a living room anymore.
53:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh gosh Like it would have to fit in my apartment Reasonably sized house like if you moved, but like yeah, you don't have like a museum showroom You have to yeah, yeah, it's to be in your house.
53:33
[UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm
53:35
[SPEAKER_01]: You can pick a car and that's okay.
53:37
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't have a garage.
53:39
[SPEAKER_01]: If you have a house, I imagine you can pick a garage.
53:42
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll let it slide.
53:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Any screen used Godzilla.
53:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Musk.
53:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Look at Godzilla Head.
53:49
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a really good one.
53:50
[SPEAKER_00]: I would want to Godzilla Head.
53:51
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a really good one.
53:52
[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't matter which one it was.
53:54
[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't matter.
53:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Even if it's from a Godzilla from my head.
53:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
53:57
[SPEAKER_00]: Just not the American one.
53:58
[SPEAKER_00]: Not the American one.
53:58
[SPEAKER_00]: Not the American one.
53:59
[SPEAKER_00]: None of the American ones.
54:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Any other than the Japanese.
54:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
54:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Godzilla things.
54:02
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a good one.
54:03
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a really good one.
54:04
[SPEAKER_00]: I knew we were like a mac-ket used in like King Kong or something.
54:11
[SPEAKER_00]: King Kong or just any any of my favorite song motion moves like just even then I remember for Christmas I know that's a bit of a cliche.
54:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, be great.
54:17
[SPEAKER_01]: I love a little Jack Skellington one of the skeletons from Jason and the Argonauts There we go.
54:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, for me the the two things that always come to mind when I think about this excuse me I'm still
54:29
[SPEAKER_01]: So getting over like I'm not sick anymore, but like I really not the hell out of my throats, so it's still a little raw and you see to get the adgetated.
54:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, the two things I always think about.
54:44
[SPEAKER_01]: One in a go-man toy is sword from the princess bride.
54:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, there you go.
54:48
[SPEAKER_01]: That prop was gorgeous.
54:50
[SPEAKER_01]: That fucking hillt is astoundingly gorgeous.
54:54
[SPEAKER_01]: What a beautiful work of art it is.
54:57
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's always one of the first things to come to mind.
54:59
[SPEAKER_01]: And the other thing, and this feels like a cliche, but how fucking cool would it be?
55:05
[SPEAKER_00]: rosebud of course rose the slamming the fuck on how well that's not allowed that's to a that's two obvious you're not allowed to pick rosebud and I love to be grossed I will fuck me oh you know what I would want the the wiggling half cat from reanimator
55:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that thing.
55:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, like, no, that thing.
55:26
[SPEAKER_00]: It's so like disturbing.
55:27
[SPEAKER_01]: Probably decrepating.
55:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I'm sure it's all wrong the way.
55:29
[SPEAKER_00]: They took probably through it a way years ago.
55:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
55:32
[SPEAKER_00]: There are plenty of, like, little monsters I'd love to have.
55:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Any of the, uh, the Gremlin props used in Gremlin's two.
55:37
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
55:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Even if it's just like a severed arm, I'd want something like that.
55:40
[SPEAKER_01]: I would love, uh,
55:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Blade from one of the early reanimator movies Oh, yeah, oh that thing would scare like you imagine having Kevin Kevin that can hear house if you had kids.
55:50
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a puppet mask Yeah, yeah, like you had kids and you had that thing your house.
55:54
[SPEAKER_01]: They would never sleep It was like that play can't sleep play believe me
55:58
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think they show off those puppets that like can make full moon.
56:02
[SPEAKER_01]: They made a whole bunch of them.
56:04
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm one of the originals of that.
56:05
[SPEAKER_00]: I think they might still have some, well, probably not.
56:07
[SPEAKER_00]: I'd serve someone, that's it.
56:09
[SPEAKER_01]: That'd be a fun one.
56:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, oh, God.
56:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Any necronomicon, any of the pages, any of those things would be fucking tight.
56:20
[SPEAKER_01]: That'd be great.
56:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Try to do something a little bit less.
56:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, oh, you know, it would be a good one.
56:27
[SPEAKER_01]: The black box from sneakers.
56:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, the answering machine.
56:32
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, absolutely.
56:32
[SPEAKER_00]: That'd be cute to say exactly.
56:34
[SPEAKER_01]: You probably get that.
56:35
[SPEAKER_01]: I imagine that's a real answer.
56:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but I want the one that's, yeah, you want the real one.
56:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you want to get it signed by like, filled and robots and something.
56:42
[SPEAKER_01]: That would be a good one.
56:42
[SPEAKER_00]: That would be really real.
56:45
[SPEAKER_00]: That would be great.
56:45
[SPEAKER_00]: That would be real real.
56:47
[SPEAKER_00]: One box.
56:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, my God.
56:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Or the rabbit puppet from Holy Grail.
56:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I want that.
56:53
[SPEAKER_00]: There's so many, I would want that.
56:55
[SPEAKER_01]: The scene from Searching for Bobby Fisher, where Ben Kingsley gets like a very special little diploma for him, not like the photocopy one he had earlier, but like the beautiful gilded one.
57:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I love how that framed on the wall.
57:10
[SPEAKER_01]: That would be really cool.
57:13
[SPEAKER_00]: We can dream.
57:13
[SPEAKER_00]: We can continue to dream.
57:15
[SPEAKER_00]: We can dream.
57:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, but yeah, if you're to give me a phaser from even one of the shittier start-up areas, like, of course, I'm telling you to share this project that would keep that forever.
57:25
[SPEAKER_01]: That'd be amazing, yeah.
57:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, um, we got you.
57:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you very much.
57:29
[SPEAKER_00]: And here's another letter.
57:30
[SPEAKER_00]: This one comes from Matt.
57:32
[SPEAKER_00]: Hello, gentlemen.
57:33
[SPEAKER_00]: I recently came across an arrow special edition.
57:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Arrow video is a...
57:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Tiffany Beam movie boutique that does blue race of evil Ed 95 Swedish American horror comedy made with a true string budget.
57:46
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a really awesome gory special effects Particularly good film, but it's obvious that the crew is making it was having the time of their lives I'm curious to hear if either you ever heard of or it's seen this movie and have thoughts or opinions
57:57
[SPEAKER_00]: After watching Evil Ed, I've been on the lookout for silly cult classics to watch, I'm not talking about the Rekhaire picture show or I'm raved darkness, I'd love to hear your recommendations of under-known silly fun horror classics that might be best enjoyed late at night with a nice strong beverage or other influence wink wink.
58:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you Matt.
58:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I've never seen Evil Ed.
58:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to see Evil Ed.
58:17
[SPEAKER_01]: It had one of those like VHS covers.
58:19
[SPEAKER_01]: They made it look really fun.
58:20
[SPEAKER_01]: I believe the title was inspired by the blonde guy from Evil Dead 2 whose name was Ed and he gets turned into a demon.
58:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I think the joke was that he was called Evil Ed.
58:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Evil Ed was also the character from Frightenight.
58:36
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, yes, I think those are both.
58:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Those are both.
58:39
[SPEAKER_00]: But the movie that has nothing to do with that.
58:41
[SPEAKER_01]: No, no, I was not going to do it either.
58:42
[SPEAKER_01]: I've never seen it.
58:43
[SPEAKER_01]: I always wanted to.
58:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, so I can't speak to that one.
58:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, now as for obscure, uh, like obscure cult movies, uh, you do your, uh, dear listener and, uh, and us, probably have a very different definition as to what constitutes obscure.
58:59
[SPEAKER_00]: That's probably true.
59:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's probably true.
59:01
[SPEAKER_00]: I get assignments a lot at my job at slash film.
59:06
[SPEAKER_00]: where they asked me to sort of point out, like, what are some underrated or unknown movies from the 1970s?
59:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
59:12
[SPEAKER_00]: And people will say, well, how about the Man who fell to Earth?
59:14
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, okay, the circles I run in, everyone's seeing the Man who fell to Earth.
59:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
59:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Pretty well known.
59:20
[SPEAKER_00]: A lot of people like the Man who fell to Earth that's not obscure or forgotten or related to Earth.
59:25
[SPEAKER_01]: These are relative to Earth to be fair.
59:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Whereas I would think a modern 16 year old, probably never heard of the Man who fell to Earth.
59:31
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, would be their mind would be blown.
59:33
[SPEAKER_00]: If you're 16 and you haven't seen the Manifold's worth, watch it.
59:36
[SPEAKER_00]: It's great.
59:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Marvelously cynical movie with David Bowie.
59:41
[SPEAKER_00]: So when we're talking about cult movies that are obscure, we're gonna dig it way down.
59:46
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a very, very, main season to do.
59:48
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm trying not to like,
59:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to be ridiculous about it.
59:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh no, be ridiculous about it.
59:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you know, I don't want to like, my point isn't trying to impress you.
59:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I just want you to have a good time.
1:00:02
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, try to figure it out.
1:00:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's what I saw recently that you might like.
1:00:05
[SPEAKER_00]: I actually have the Tiffany Blu-ray of this one.
1:00:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Hard Rock Zombies.
1:00:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, I saw a movie called Hard Rock Zombies recently.
1:00:14
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was really, really enjoyable.
1:00:16
[SPEAKER_00]: It has like,
1:00:17
[SPEAKER_00]: It does have like an actual um, it's made in like the mid-80s has a real rock band at the heart of it But it also seemed like pretty fun.
1:00:26
[SPEAKER_00]: Clearly very low budget like um monster effects.
1:00:29
[SPEAKER_00]: There's like this weird little puppet guy in it Oh, I'm looking it up who put out this one.
1:00:36
[SPEAKER_00]: It was always a cannon film.
1:00:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, go But yeah, it's about a metal band that is like out in the middle of nowhere and they're sort of
1:00:47
[SPEAKER_00]: big mansion, which is clearly they're just shooting at somebody's house, and it turns out the people who live there are like this anti-rock Nazi cult.
1:00:57
[SPEAKER_00]: And the cultists murder them, but then they're brought back to life to get revenge on the Nazis.
1:01:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you do?
1:01:02
[SPEAKER_00]: From like a necronomicon book.
1:01:05
[SPEAKER_01]: I said like you do.
1:01:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
1:01:07
[SPEAKER_00]: That one was really fun.
1:01:09
[SPEAKER_00]: There you go.
1:01:09
[SPEAKER_00]: It's stupid and cheap.
1:01:11
[SPEAKER_00]: But if you're, um, that's, that's part of the, that's part of the appeal under the influence of Orange Crush.
1:01:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Then yeah, you're going to be, uh, gonna have a good time.
1:01:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, uh, I'm going to recommend, uh, a movie that I think might have even been shot on video, but it was like reasonably well released, and I think it was, it was at least my shout factor.
1:01:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it was part of a double feature, uh, the video did.
1:01:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, video debt's great.
1:01:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Great if it's really, really, really fun.
1:01:36
[SPEAKER_01]: It says independent movie, cool stuff by people.
1:01:38
[SPEAKER_00]: They double package that with terror visions.
1:01:40
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's really good.
1:01:42
[SPEAKER_00]: So let me, well, I love terror.
1:01:44
[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of people about that for terror vision, which is a reasonably well-known cult or a movie.
1:01:48
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's wonderful.
1:01:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And you should see it if you haven't.
1:01:50
[SPEAKER_01]: But the video debt is the much more obscure version.
1:01:52
[SPEAKER_01]: And it says about these kids in the house that they get, like, have, like, a TV and their attic and zombies start crawling out of it.
1:01:58
[SPEAKER_01]: And it has so much wit.
1:02:00
[SPEAKER_01]: and has so many weird bizarre lines of dialogue that are delivered with such
1:02:06
[SPEAKER_01]: With such a plumb, it really does feel like it's the kind of self awareness that would be popularized many, many years later.
1:02:15
[SPEAKER_01]: But it is so glorious in that movie because it's very, very genuine.
1:02:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
1:02:20
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's another one I would throw out there.
1:02:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, there's so many of these things we could recommend.
1:02:27
[SPEAKER_01]: There's so many of them actually kind of stunlocked and I'm trying to like,
1:02:30
[SPEAKER_01]: jog my memory because I feel like because I feel like if we don't pull out some good ones then we really say oh blood beat You see like blood beat right
1:02:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Which one is blood-beed?
1:02:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Blood-beed is about like- Blood-beed is about a bunch of people who like come home to like the family home for Christmas.
1:02:49
[SPEAKER_01]: But they're like followed by like a ghost samurai and like mom has psychic powers.
1:02:54
[SPEAKER_01]: And this will protect them at Christmas from the ghost samurai.
1:02:57
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a weird one.
1:02:58
[SPEAKER_01]: That is a movie that I do not understand why this is not like mono's the hands of fate famous.
1:03:03
[SPEAKER_01]: It is so fucking terrible.
1:03:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Yet amazingly hypnotically fine.
1:03:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's one whenever I bring it up people say I've never heard of that movie and I've brought it up in front of you several times and you've said it multiple times okay it is a shoprothers film oh yeah from the early 80s called the boxers omen yes uh the boxers omen
1:03:24
[SPEAKER_00]: is so fucking gross.
1:03:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Because it's about a boxer who has to get magic powers and do battle against like Warlocks, but the way they cast spells are so revolting.
1:03:35
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a scene where we get to see the evil monks and how they, they have to like eat the inner子 of a crocodile and then puke them out onto something and then stuff somebody's body inside the, something like
1:03:51
[SPEAKER_00]: gore and goop, and then of course it all climaxes with this big weird Dragon Ball Z-esque fight sequence between like the there's all these like weird sparkly special effects the box is oh man the the box is oh man is pretty pretty wild yeah I think it might be too wild for most audiences because it's not proliferate and I think a lot of people should check that one out if you ever see night train to terror I've seen nitrin to Mundo Fene yeah this is and I guess it's better
1:04:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Night train to terror is this incredibly bizarre anthology horror movie about God and Satan on a train And in the adjacent car there's a rock band playing, but that's literally not important And God and Satan are having some big argument about God and Satan's done and in order to illustrate their argument They keep cutting back to these extremely bizarre ultra violent
1:04:45
[SPEAKER_01]: frankly, perversely cynical, like gory horror movies that the filmmaker never finished, so this is a tent of selfishness, and it's so fucking ridiculous and just, and frankly, disgusty, like this is a really gory shit in it, but it's just, it, it, this spirit of, we got to save this disaster, it's so strong with it, but you just can't even get mad.
1:05:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Have you ever seen
1:05:12
[SPEAKER_00]: You have never seen Spooky, you like certain things that Spooky's.
1:05:16
[SPEAKER_00]: That has a similar vibe like they had all these cool monster shorts that they kind of had to splice together and they ended up shooting additional endings and additional footage to kind of bind this film together.
1:05:25
[SPEAKER_00]: It feels really really loose.
1:05:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
1:05:28
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna go with an obvious one.
1:05:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, then I don't know if that counts then.
1:05:32
[SPEAKER_00]: It's obvious for us.
1:05:36
[SPEAKER_00]: I want to describe this as the die hard of being movies.
1:05:39
[SPEAKER_00]: This is Andy Sedaris hard to get to Hawaii.
1:05:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Armenia.
1:05:43
[SPEAKER_00]: If you haven't seen hard to get to Hawaii, then you have not experienced cinema.
1:05:48
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't know what it is yet.
1:05:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Hard to get to why is one of those gems.
1:05:53
[SPEAKER_00]: It's, yeah, Andy Cideris made this big long 12 film series that we're all interconnected about these spies who worked for the government, but they're all played by playboy playman's and penthouse pets, and of course he took as many opportunities as he could to get them like topless and hot tubs, of course.
1:06:11
[SPEAKER_00]: We do our best concentration when we're naked in a hot tub.
1:06:14
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's look at these diamonds that we got from this, the pots make no sense.
1:06:18
[SPEAKER_01]: the hot tub.
1:06:20
[SPEAKER_01]: We got to use the hot tub.
1:06:22
[SPEAKER_00]: The action sequences are completely absurd.
1:06:24
[SPEAKER_00]: A heart to get to why he has a bodybuilder torturing someone with none chucks.
1:06:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Somebody takes razor blades to a frisbee and throws it into someone's face.
1:06:32
[SPEAKER_00]: There's of course the blocked all sequence and a bazooka that same scene which is completely bizarre.
1:06:38
[SPEAKER_00]: It is
1:06:39
[SPEAKER_01]: one of the best action movies ever made and i mean that sincerely because that is so entertaining although i think we were trying to go for horror movies i think i'm going to pick a movie that i love and i haven't had chance to talk about in a while uh it's actually written and directed by dannel bannon who wrote screenplay for alien or at the least original draft
1:06:58
[SPEAKER_01]: uh... and uh... it's it's not really kooky actually takes itself pretty seriously but it's got a whizbanger of an ending uh... the resurrected with Chris sir and uh... oh yeah uh... based on the case of trial stexter ward bay HP lovecraft it's uh... stars uh... jack's dad from lost as a private detective who is hired to investigate a woman's husband who has been very very strange ever since he started doing
1:07:28
[SPEAKER_01]: like lockbox and he's starting to act very very strangely and it's pretty good it's, you know, maybe a little staunch or whatever but like the last half hour is fucking amazing what an ending, what a fucking climax, what a great monster towards the end of it, just oh totally worth it if you like even if you think the first like two thirds are just okay stick with it man
1:07:56
[SPEAKER_01]: I love that fucking show man.
1:07:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
1:08:00
[SPEAKER_00]: My wife and I had a practice for a while on Friday nights when we just sort of had a chance to chill out.
1:08:04
[SPEAKER_00]: We tune into night flight.
1:08:07
[SPEAKER_00]: That's one of our favorite streaming services, which is brought by the people who did that old USA up all night.
1:08:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Block of music videos back in the early 80s.
1:08:15
[SPEAKER_00]: It was called night flight.
1:08:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Then out of a streaming channel.
1:08:18
[SPEAKER_00]: and they also have licenses with like something weird video and vinegar syndrome and a lot of those be movie outlets so you can watch a lot of be movies on that service as well and we would tune in to night flight just find something really bizarre.
1:08:32
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes I heard a lot of good things about it then I watched the movie I thought what's the deal demon wind sucks
1:08:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, it does.
1:08:39
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought demon would be back.
1:08:41
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought demon wind like so many great things about how great demon wind is demon wind is It's terrible.
1:08:46
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like really hard to watch.
1:08:47
[SPEAKER_00]: You can't follow it.
1:08:48
[SPEAKER_00]: It's really slow the character suck.
1:08:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, no, it does not work I was one of those movies where like I want to be on this movie side.
1:08:55
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, this should be fun
1:08:57
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not a fun it's not a fun watch, but then we'll find something like hard rock zombies or or any other number of like hard rock Horror movies like rock tober blood is pretty good.
1:09:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's a good one Black roses is a really chocolate movie, and of course rock and roll nightmare of course rock and roll night
1:09:16
[SPEAKER_00]: We like to rock and roll late March so much when we saw a John Michael Thor record and he used record store We bought it just out of principle.
1:09:23
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like of course we're gonna own a Thor record.
1:09:25
[SPEAKER_00]: This is gonna be great.
1:09:26
[SPEAKER_01]: What are we what are we even doing here?
1:09:30
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's pretty good, I think it's, oh, you know what, I'll give you one more.
1:09:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
1:09:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Sorority babes on the slime ball bowl of Ramon.
1:09:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, it's a David, David Dakota.
1:09:42
[SPEAKER_01]: David Dakota, yeah.
1:09:43
[SPEAKER_01]: David Dakota, classic.
1:09:46
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's about one of his good movies.
1:09:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's about a sorority babes who decides to go to a slime ball bowl of Ramon at which point they accidentally unleashed an evil.
1:09:56
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like a gremlin, it's like a little monster, it starts killing them all.
1:10:01
[SPEAKER_01]: It's exactly the sleaze you think it is and it is kind of perfect.
1:10:06
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like the ultimate version of that movie.
1:10:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes you'll read a movie thinking it'll be that just good-natured, sleazey, terrible monster movie.
1:10:15
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it's not, maybe it's to me, maybe it's not sleazey enough, maybe it has no sense of humor.
1:10:22
[SPEAKER_01]: this is exactly that film.
1:10:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
1:10:24
[SPEAKER_01]: If you want to get high and watch something abysmal but very in in good fun.
1:10:31
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're already babies in the slime bottle all around you're welcome.
1:10:33
[SPEAKER_00]: David Dakota really like put his heart into some of those earlier.
1:10:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Really.
1:10:36
[SPEAKER_00]: It was only like a second.
1:10:37
[SPEAKER_01]: It was something to prove.
1:10:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
1:10:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, watch that one watch.
1:10:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Definitely watch Dr. Alien and definitely watch puppet master too.
1:10:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah,
1:10:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, um, here is a letter from Brandon.
1:10:51
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
1:10:51
[SPEAKER_00]: Hello, Brandon.
1:10:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, dear boobs and rock buster, greetings.
1:10:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Good morning.
1:10:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Hello and Aloha.
1:10:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Hi.
1:10:56
[SPEAKER_00]: I have a question for Bibs.
1:10:58
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh no.
1:10:58
[SPEAKER_00]: I just finished listening to the recent screen drafts episode.
1:11:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that Mr. Bibbiani was on, discussing the career of Paul W. S. Anderson.
1:11:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Tons of Underless Into.
1:11:07
[SPEAKER_00]: However, I'm curious if you made a list of your own personal rankings.
1:11:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Spoilers for the rankings of the episode, but you notoriously weren't as a big fan of event horizon as the other drafters.
1:11:16
[SPEAKER_00]: that film came in second.
1:11:18
[SPEAKER_00]: I believe you said that shopping, which was the number number one pick, was a pick, but it wouldn't have been your number one.
1:11:26
[SPEAKER_00]: It wouldn't have been my number one.
1:11:27
[SPEAKER_00]: You attempted to play place mortal combat lower on the list.
1:11:30
[SPEAKER_00]: I think 10th, which I'm guessing would have been the popular vote.
1:11:33
[SPEAKER_00]: So then I asked, would it have been your number one poll that was Anderson movie of all time?
1:11:37
[SPEAKER_00]: It's essentially
1:11:38
[SPEAKER_00]: possible you mentioned what your number one pick was at some points over the course of the nearly six hour long podcast I'm just not remembering apologies if that's the case.
1:11:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, is that the end of the what that's the end of the Okay, so yes, I was on a recent screen drafts episode where we ranked every single feature film directed by Paul double Sanders and including a TV movie he did
1:11:56
[SPEAKER_01]: In the year 2000 starring Andrew McCarthy called the site, which is one of those TV shows about if someone who turns out to be psychic in souls mysteries, and I wasn't bad actually.
1:12:04
[SPEAKER_01]: It ended up being at the bottom of the list because the person who got the bottom pick on the list thought that it shouldn't be there on a technicality, but I think that was unfair to the film.
1:12:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Regarding whether or not I had a ranked list, I did until my computer died, and then I lost everything I've done for the last two or three months.
1:12:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Most of it's salvageable or no great loss, but I did lose a few things like that.
1:12:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I can give you an approximate list right now though.
1:12:31
[SPEAKER_01]: This is wouldn't have been exactly what I had because I can't prove it, but this probably would have been pretty close to what my ranked list is, and I'll go from, I guess I'll go from back to front.
1:12:50
[SPEAKER_01]: monster hunter would have been right near the bottom.
1:12:53
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not very good.
1:12:54
[SPEAKER_00]: That's one of the ones I've been seeing.
1:12:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's it's I've seen too many of Paul.
1:12:59
[SPEAKER_01]: I've been a lot of people would probably agree that they have probably my bottom to would have been monster hunter and resident evil the final chapter, which I think is just this really joyless wrap up.
1:13:08
[SPEAKER_01]: It's got a good cast like they bring some new fun people in but they don't have anything fun to do in frankly.
1:13:12
[SPEAKER_01]: It's hard to look at So not a fan those would have been towards the bottom I probably would have moved on from there to I really want to like in the lost lands because it's really wild And it's actually about something but it just doesn't come together very well.
1:13:29
[SPEAKER_01]: It really bumps me out Yeah, then
1:13:36
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's all kind of a me as well if I'm being perfectly fragged.
1:13:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Most of them just kind of blend in together.
1:13:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, president will retribution would have been near the bottom.
1:13:43
[SPEAKER_01]: As much as I like, world combat and these are mostly after this movie said I like.
1:13:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, I don't know, I think Mortal Kombat has a lot of shabbyer that people give a credit for.
1:13:53
[SPEAKER_01]: I think Mortal Kombat is a movie that was good for when you were 10.
1:13:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and like, it's very, very fun if you were 10.
1:14:00
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a perfectly good kid's matinee, but it's an actual movie.
1:14:03
[SPEAKER_01]: It barely hangs together.
1:14:05
[SPEAKER_01]: It's got a couple of, got a couple of snazzy performances.
1:14:07
[SPEAKER_01]: Goro is a good visual effect, but it's kind of barely a film.
1:14:12
[SPEAKER_01]: And frankly, it's, and frankly, as fight tournament movies go, even at the time, it wasn't up arrest.
1:14:18
[SPEAKER_01]: So I would have ranked that lower the most, but I appreciate nostalgia and certainly it's not a it's on an unfun movie The site would have been somewhere in here.
1:14:26
[SPEAKER_01]: It's actually not a bad.
1:14:27
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a failed pilot for TV series It wasn't bad Death race would have been kind of low.
1:14:33
[SPEAKER_01]: It's fine.
1:14:34
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just kind of unremarked
1:14:36
[SPEAKER_01]: I've seen death for as 2000, but yeah, I never saw the remake.
1:14:39
[SPEAKER_01]: I remember liking Resident Evil Retribution when it came out, but then I re- because it's kind of wild and ridiculous.
1:14:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
1:14:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Non-sensical shit happens in it, but re-watching it barely holds together.
1:14:50
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, no, those movies are all absurd.
1:14:52
[SPEAKER_01]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
1:15:03
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not remarkable, but it's fine.
1:15:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Resident Evil after life actually holds together really well.
1:15:08
[SPEAKER_01]: It's actually like, it works with one.
1:15:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's like, it has like a little opening that kind of wraps up something from the last movie, but that's over very quick.
1:15:15
[SPEAKER_01]: And then we're trapped in a prison during the zombie apocalypse.
1:15:19
[SPEAKER_01]: How the hell do we get out of here and at all ends, and I'm not sensibly awesome fight on a boat.
1:15:23
[SPEAKER_01]: because that boat firework is like the dogs are opening up and backflips me that's not said it's great it's fun it's that's probably the best one of those except for Resident Evil extinction which Paul Tutt which Paul Douglas Anderson did direct
1:15:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Three Musketeers isn't good, but I don't have any animosity towards it.
1:15:43
[SPEAKER_01]: It just doesn't work.
1:15:44
[SPEAKER_01]: And then probably my number, and then event horizon, I don't like very much.
1:15:50
[SPEAKER_01]: It's got amazing production design.
1:15:52
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it's actually very scary.
1:15:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it understands what the emotion of fear is.
1:15:58
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's just sort of like, I think fear would be something like this.
1:16:01
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it's like, I mean, that's enough for a lot of people.
1:16:03
[SPEAKER_01]: And a lot of people, and a lot of people, and a lot of people, I saw it.
1:16:04
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought it was scary.
1:16:05
[SPEAKER_00]: A lot of you think it's really scary move.
1:16:07
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like a man for us a lot.
1:16:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm in this weird position where the venue arrives and where you're not.
1:16:12
[SPEAKER_01]: You don't hate it, but you don't hate it.
1:16:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't hate it, but I don't think it's good.
1:16:16
[SPEAKER_01]: It's right.
1:16:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Just try to resize it every time you talk about it.
1:16:18
[SPEAKER_01]: But when I'm already talking about it, it's like people are like, well listen, I think it's scary and how can you defy that?
1:16:23
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, man.
1:16:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I guess you're opinion counts more than mine when I'm supposed to do here.
1:16:27
[SPEAKER_01]: I just, I've watched it many times, and I don't think it's very good.
1:16:30
[SPEAKER_01]: So not a fan shopping is just okay.
1:16:33
[SPEAKER_01]: If I'm being perfectly honest, and I am because that's what I do, I think is best to film this Pompeii.
1:16:41
[SPEAKER_00]: Pompey sucks.
1:16:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
1:16:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Pompey sucks but in the best possible way.
1:16:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Pompey is glorious nonsensical romance novel trash.
1:16:51
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
1:16:51
[SPEAKER_01]: It is the absolute perfect apotheosis of we saw Titanic and we thought we could do that too.
1:16:59
[SPEAKER_01]: And
1:17:00
[SPEAKER_01]: You can, but you also could.
1:17:02
[SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of glorious.
1:17:04
[SPEAKER_01]: It's really fun.
1:17:05
[SPEAKER_01]: It's got a lot of ridiculous moments.
1:17:07
[SPEAKER_00]: It has the soul of like a really big junkie biblical thriller from the 1960s.
1:17:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but it's being done by Paul DeBusanderson, who only knows how to make these like ultra-technical
1:17:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Saturday Matt Nays from the 2000s right, but he's got he doesn't those things don't Don't want lock to go at all.
1:17:24
[SPEAKER_01]: There's something about it.
1:17:25
[SPEAKER_01]: That's kind of perfect where he wants to do something more He kind of gets there because we can see what he's doing But he can't help himself.
1:17:33
[SPEAKER_01]: He's doing so much of a silly showman and I feel like that's kind of like just Everything he is he tries to do something big, but he can't help himself and he ended up making something that I think is just wonderfully glorious pulp romant's trash
1:17:47
[SPEAKER_01]: And for me, that's him in a nutshell.
1:17:51
[SPEAKER_01]: I really do think so.
1:17:52
[SPEAKER_01]: I love that movie.
1:17:53
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think I defended it very well on the show.
1:17:55
[SPEAKER_01]: And I definitely don't think I was able to explain my opinion.
1:18:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Because I had to keep bringing up event horizon.
1:18:02
[SPEAKER_01]: My pick got vetoed like four times because I kept trying to play it earlier in the episode.
1:18:07
[SPEAKER_01]: And every time I had to defend it, I was like, I made my case.
1:18:12
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just grassy and straws and I think I got a little
1:18:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, I think I will reductive towards the end and I wasn't at my film critic best, but, um,
1:18:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, anyway close enough.
1:18:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, and soldier is a little overrated actually.
1:18:24
[SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of just like soldier too.
1:18:26
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like it's okay.
1:18:27
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it's very good.
1:18:28
[SPEAKER_01]: And inverse predator is fine.
1:18:30
[SPEAKER_01]: I used to hate it, but now there's somebody worse alien and predator movie because I can't even be mad anymore.
1:18:34
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I think that one got a bummer, not just because people rather foolishly, I would say, expected a lot from it when really, all the other alien movies were at least ambitious.
1:18:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and this one felt very unambitious.
1:18:48
[SPEAKER_00]: It was unambitious, but it, as like a Saturday matinee, it actually functions perfectly fine.
1:18:53
[SPEAKER_01]: As long as you don't take those characters seriously, it's fine.
1:18:55
[SPEAKER_01]: But at the time, we did.
1:18:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
1:18:57
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think now that there have been worse movies in both franchises, it's easier to just go to two cares.
1:19:02
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
1:19:02
[SPEAKER_01]: This is just a silly statement.
1:19:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Guys, they've rubber suits, fighting each other, like the aliens.
1:19:08
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, one more the one more than we call it all right.
1:19:12
[SPEAKER_00]: Now this one comes from mint Oh mint mint deer bibs and a raw my Sturmic wool So I know I saw it spelled out help.
1:19:21
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm close.
1:19:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Hello a long time listener first time writer.
1:19:23
[SPEAKER_00]: I really like listening to your thoughts Your thought process is for the all nighter.
1:19:27
[SPEAKER_00]: This is another reference to our Halloween all nighter
1:19:30
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'd love for you to hear another episode for whatever topic you choose.
1:19:34
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm always astounded how many episodes you've edited to turn out.
1:19:37
[SPEAKER_00]: But I'm here to ask you a question.
1:19:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you think Jay Sherman is a good film critic?
1:19:44
[SPEAKER_00]: For those who don't know Jay Sherman is the protagonist of the animated sitcom from 1994 called The Critic.
1:19:48
[SPEAKER_00]: He stars in it.
1:19:48
[SPEAKER_00]: In the show, he starts in a critic show called Coming Attractions, most of the films he reviews are silly gags, filled with celebrity cameos, clipping about how much they stink.
1:19:56
[SPEAKER_00]: The only films he likes are, quote, pretentious foreign films.
1:20:00
[SPEAKER_00]: In Universe Reputation aside, does he do a good job critiquing movies?
1:20:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Personally, I think while he's a good guy off camera, he comes across his caustic, hitting 90% of cinema, then again, it isn't as fault that the films he sees really do stink.
1:20:13
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm eager to hear your thoughts on the matter.
1:20:14
[SPEAKER_00]: mint.
1:20:16
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, the film's Jay Sherman reviews.
1:20:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, if you've never seen the critic, by the way, a 1990s animated series tried to be like the next the Simpsons.
1:20:25
[SPEAKER_00]: It was from the same team that put together the Simpsons.
1:20:27
[SPEAKER_00]: I understand, but it was in writers.
1:20:28
[SPEAKER_01]: It was trying to play on that success, but it was basically what if a snobbish film critic was the Homer Simpson of the show and instead of being incredibly, you know, unintelligent, he was too intelligent for his own good and he had still did a lot of silly things.
1:20:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Not every episode is great.
1:20:45
[SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of got that faulty towers thing where the episodes that were amazing Making you forget that's not all of the work.
1:20:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Some of them were kind of mad, but um the one the one where he ends up like Doing ishtar and getting stuck in the middle east is unwatchable.
1:20:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah.
1:21:00
[SPEAKER_00]: It's there's they do not show that one anymore That one really that's pretty racist.
1:21:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Um In that 90s way where we we thought you're post-racist.
1:21:09
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, no, no, no, no
1:21:11
[SPEAKER_00]: I think the whole one of the big jokes of the critic is that Jay Sherman is is a good critic but he's trapped in a universe where the movies are even worse than what we have here.
1:21:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's the thing.
1:21:25
[SPEAKER_01]: He's doing stuff like the Disney didn't make the Lion King.
1:21:27
[SPEAKER_01]: They made the cockroach king with the voice of Howard Stern.
1:21:30
[SPEAKER_01]: Of course he hates that.
1:21:33
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
1:21:33
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the thing.
1:21:34
[SPEAKER_01]: The movies he likes tend to be real movies, like the Red Balloon.
1:21:38
[SPEAKER_01]: The movies he's forced to see for work are not even as bad as what we have.
1:21:42
[SPEAKER_01]: They're infinitely worse.
1:21:43
[SPEAKER_01]: So I would argue that in his universe, he's a great critic.
1:21:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
1:21:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Because he's not, he's not trashing something.
1:21:49
[SPEAKER_01]: He's actually meaningfully trashing the worst possible.
1:21:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Like the stuff that like the people who greenlit.
1:21:58
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm the emoji move.
1:22:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, imagine the people who green with the emoji move.
1:22:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Imagine the movies that that development team said sucked too much to make.
1:22:09
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what gets made in the universe of the critic.
1:22:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
1:22:11
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think in that universe, he's good.
1:22:13
[SPEAKER_00]: There's even a joke about that.
1:22:14
[SPEAKER_00]: It goes to, oh yeah.
1:22:15
[SPEAKER_00]: He's recruited to write Ghostbusters 3.
1:22:19
[SPEAKER_00]: They call it ghost chasers and in this universe and it's like why would I do that?
1:22:25
[SPEAKER_00]: I hated the first two movies like yeah, that's why we need you need to sort of like spruce it up And he like works really hard and he like things about it's like what can I really do?
1:22:34
[SPEAKER_00]: What's like a good story and actually comes up with something and he turns it in and the studio head is played by Billy Crystal Hansett Batcham is like no, we can't do that
1:22:41
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like what I worked really hard.
1:22:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's actually too good like any pulls open a drawer Here's all of the scripts that are too good to make.
1:22:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's a lesbian love story Here's something about somebody coming to terms with their fathers diseases.
1:22:52
[SPEAKER_00]: We can't make these movies Oh wait, what's this revenge of the nerds for what's that doing in here?
1:22:57
[SPEAKER_00]: He throws it at the window make this guys Just hear people.
1:23:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, outside
1:23:02
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the gag of the critic, is that the movie's Hollywood is so broken that it's exaggerated in the world of the critic, that everything is just unbearably bad.
1:23:12
[SPEAKER_00]: And he has some integrity as a critic, but he has to suffer through this garbage.
1:23:16
[SPEAKER_00]: So yes, does he come off as costic?
1:23:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course he does, because Hollywood makes trash.
1:23:22
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the only way he can survive.
1:23:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Now I would argue that if he were a real critic in the real world, he'd be kind of an ass, but you know what?
1:23:30
[SPEAKER_01]: isn't he's a cartoon exaggeration i'm gonna let it slide but yeah in reality someone who is so completely turned off by anything even remotely mainstream is probably missing out yeah on the fact that you can do mainstream well and that's not a thing on j himself is kind of a satire of critics because many critics some do of sort of fall into that most of the time armed white but um yeah
1:24:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but you know, there are other critics, you know, Rick's read Cisco and Ebert, you know, like they had their moments where they were kind of snuffing at the mainstream Just and it seemed like they were doing it for the sake of it, so they're kind of time satirizing that via the J Sherman a little bit.
1:24:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and listen to you and I Will they listen to our view of avatar ash fire and ash for example.
1:24:19
[SPEAKER_01]: That sounds like we're doing it
1:24:20
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't do that for everything.
1:24:23
[SPEAKER_01]: We reserve that for a movie actually deserves both barrels.
1:24:26
[SPEAKER_00]: And wouldn't you know it on my top 10 list?
1:24:29
[SPEAKER_00]: I had to pause and say I didn't believe it.
1:24:32
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, two Marvel movies came out this year that I really enjoyed.
1:24:35
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's like I like start my list that way.
1:24:38
[SPEAKER_00]: We have to be honest.
1:24:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I notoriously don't like that series.
1:24:42
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't like what it represents or how much it sort of pushed cinema in bad directions.
1:24:47
[SPEAKER_00]: But, dude, came out with two movies.
1:24:49
[SPEAKER_00]: I like to know what that is for.
1:24:51
[SPEAKER_00]: I like Thunderbolt a lot and then I had to say that.
1:24:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Those are those are movies that I felt were like, I don't know about something.
1:24:57
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, so yeah, we don't just hate the mainstream on principle.
1:25:00
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I kind of do, but uh, but I'm a jackster.
1:25:02
[SPEAKER_00]: That's my, that's my beat, man.
1:25:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I, I usually, I would argue that in some respects, I do hate it in principle, in principle, but in practice, not necessarily because really good people are, are doing that work.
1:25:14
[SPEAKER_01]: And sometimes you're doing it for the right reasons, sometimes you do it for the wrong reasons, sometimes it's a big mistake.
1:25:18
[SPEAKER_01]: But when you put that many talents of people together,
1:25:20
[SPEAKER_01]: it's not always going to be a wash.
1:25:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes they make something great and spider themselves, sometimes they make something great.
1:25:26
[SPEAKER_01]: It just happens to be the exception to the rule until the studio system can produce great stuff.
1:25:33
[SPEAKER_01]: But yes, I would, again, in the context of the show, he's not only a great critic.
1:25:38
[SPEAKER_01]: He might be the only great critic besides this Colony, but in that universe.
1:25:42
[SPEAKER_01]: And in reality, he'd be an insufferable snob.
1:25:46
[SPEAKER_01]: But also not wrong, probably just a little too extreme, a little too binary, black and white good or bad.
1:25:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, that is it for, we've got mail.
1:25:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
1:25:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for listening.
1:26:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you everybody who wrote in.
1:26:01
[SPEAKER_01]: If we didn't get to your email we apologize We get a lot of them.
1:26:04
[SPEAKER_01]: We're trying to do more of these more often feel free to send us an email if we Didn't get to yours or if you feel inspired to write another one if there's anything timely by all means Please like put an asterisk in the title like I want to talk about this before Valentine's Day or whatever
1:26:20
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1:26:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Whitney what is your PO Box?
1:26:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, it's a physical letter to the critically claimed network PO Box 641565 Los Angeles, California at 9W 64 and I think that's great.
1:26:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, we talked a bit about our Patreon on this episode, Patreon.com slash critically claimed network.
1:26:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, and if you're going to have forward to contribute to the program, we've got a lot of exclusive podcasts for you.
1:26:50
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1:26:53
[SPEAKER_01]: We've been doing more online hangouts, uh, with some of our tiers that had to take a back seat for a bit last year, but we're back doing those with a two this month.
1:27:02
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, and, uh, so be able to look out for announcements.
1:27:04
[SPEAKER_01]: And that regard, we have our Star Trek podcast, we have our Academy Awards podcast where you actually were able to, thanks to a very dedicated listener, track down some of the best international feature nominees we couldn't find before, so we're going to be able to move forward on our only the best international podcast where we're trying to review every movie every nominated for Best International Future at the Academy Awards, in addition to everyone
1:27:32
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1:27:35
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1:27:39
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1:27:46
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1:27:52
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's that.
1:27:54
[SPEAKER_01]: That's that.
1:27:55
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for listening.
1:27:56
[SPEAKER_01]: And,
1:27:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, sincerely yours bibs away.